Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: Legion on May 31, 2011, 06:25:41 AM
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According to a Matt McKendrick tweet, Houllier has left Villa.
Mutual consent.
"Gerard Houllier leaves #avfc by mutual consent. Read today's Birmingham Mail exclusive for full story"
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A bit of a shame, as i'd have liked to see what he could have done with a full pre-season and so on. Still, perhaps it's for the best, especially with his health issues.
I, for one, welcome our new Spanish overlord..... ;)
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A shame for Ged but his health / club dynamics have to come first.
At least the pool of talent available to take over will be much better now then last summer.
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sad news! the hunt begins and yet another summer with no manager and our top players on the brink
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Radio 5 are reporting it but only on the basis of the Mail story. After Benitez rejecting Athletico to stay in England I can only think its going to be him.
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sad news! the hunt begins and yet another summer with no manager and our top players on the brink
I have a strong suspicion that the new man will be on board before too long
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I hope Houllier is healthy and wish him all the best. I also hope this is really 'mutual consent' and that we won't end up seeing him at a Tribunal in the next year or so! I imagine they have given him some money (be surprised if less than £2 million) in exchange for not making us look bad by sacking a sick man.
Next few days could be interesting.
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Next few days could be interesting.
True but I'm glad the 'interesting' days are May / June and not August / September like last year.
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Shame as I think he did well to get us to 9th considering.
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Relief is the best way to describe the news. Haven't been happy with any of his reign.
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Not entirely surprising if this proves the case, but we have to await confirmation. Wasnt he due to see medical experts this week ?
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Radio 5 are reporting it but only on the basis of the Mail story. After Benitez rejecting Athletico to stay in England I can only think its going to be him.
Glad if Ged is gone by mutual consent but no thanks to Benitez.
Don't rate him or like him.
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Right decision, now we need to get the next one right.
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Link to article (http://www.birminghammail.net/news/birmingham-news/2011/05/31/birmingham-mail-exclusive-aston-villa-boss-gerard-houllier-to-leave-club-by-mutual-consent-97319-28792703/)
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I'm in two minds on this to be honest. On the one hand I can understand why the club would deem it too gret a risk to take, but we're now in a position where we are starting again with a new manager, new transfer targets, players that needed clearing out getting another chance, and another season of transition at best.
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double post
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It's been an odd tenure at best, but I hope he's well. Not too sure about Benitez but realistically there aren't too many better qualified managers who would want to come. Maybe Hiddinck prefers balti to jellied eels?
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its bit of a shame i was lookin forward to geting new players in the summer.
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Sad news both for houllier and the club given that we were both heading in the right direction towards the end of the season. I hope the board can make a decision of who to appoint and quickly. Let's also hope we don't have another season of transition.
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The timing is also about season ticket sales for me, a lot of people were having 2nd thoughts about renewing so a new 'big name' manager comes in before our deadlines.
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Another lesson for the board - Twitter is faster than newspaper exclusives scheduled 12 hours later.
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Well, bye Gerard. Best wishes for the future.
SkyBet showing the following as top bets:
Hughes (1/1), Benitez (11/8), Moyes (3/1), McClaren (7/1), Ancelotti (10/1), Jol (14/1), Allardyce (14/1), Macdonald (16/1), Zola (20/1)
No to Hughes, Benitez, Allardyce, Zola or sadly Kevin Mac from me.
My top choice would be Moyes, although Ancelotti or Jol wouldn't be bad news. Martinez as an outsider.
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If true, shame in some ways*, I would have liked to see what he could have achieved in the long term. All the best Gerrard.
* did not think this after the wolves game.
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The right decision, if true. The new man will have time and funds at his disposal to begin shaping a team that should get us back on track. There's no reason why we should expect a 'transitional season', especially when other clubs such as Liverpool and West Brom can get new managers in and have a dramatic reversal of fortune.
It's sad for Gerard, because I believe he is an honourable man and a likable one. I did not like the effect his management had on Aston Villa, however, and despite the strong finish, I don't think he had what it takes to get us where we need to be. He also had very little appreciation of what it means to be Villa manager, as the Anfield and Man City debacles revealed. Let's hope the new man understands us and gives Randy the return his investment deserves.
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The right decision all round. His health must come first. Regretably he will be remembered in my household for Liverpool away, Man City FA Cup and losing to all three of the neighbours including a Cup QF.
Get the right man in and back him. Hopefully not FSW but no doubt they will look for somebody who will utilse the strong youth set-up we have. Moyes has never held back the youngsters at Everton which I think would make him number 1 choice?
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Given that list from skybet I really hope we get ancelotti, I think he's the only one that will continue the route houllier was taking us towards better quality football. Some of the others might make us as successful but he's the only candidate that will do it with style (from the list). He's also the big name manager we've been wanting for a long time.
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Given that list from skybet I really hope we get ancelotti, I think he's the only one that will continue the route houllier was taking us towards better quality football. Some of the others might make us as successful but he's the only candidate that will do it with style (from the list). He's also the big name manager we've been wanting for a long time.
Can he do it from scratch though?
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Well, bye Gerard. Best wishes for the future.
SkyBet showing the following as top bets:
Hughes (1/1), Benitez (11/8), Moyes (3/1), McClaren (7/1), Ancelotti (10/1), Jol (14/1), Allardyce (14/1), Macdonald (16/1), Zola (20/1)
No to Hughes, Benitez, Allardyce, Zola or sadly Kevin Mac from me.
My top choice would be Moyes, although Ancelotti or Jol wouldn't be bad news. Martinez as an outsider.
At there are some decent options this time (Allardyce excluded)
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I don't like to say "I told you so" but... :)
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Given that list from skybet I really hope we get ancelotti, I think he's the only one that will continue the route houllier was taking us towards better quality football. Some of the others might make us as successful but he's the only candidate that will do it with style (from the list). He's also the big name manager we've been wanting for a long time.
i also think ancelotti would be the best option.
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From L'Equipe:
Gérard Houllier ne poursuivra pas sa mission à Aston Villa. Le Birmingham Mail annonce que l'entraîneur français et le club de Birmingham se séparent à l'amiable. Une annonce officielle sera faite mercredi. Âgé de 63 ans, l'ancien DTN tricolore s'est plié à l'avis des médecins qui considèrent qu'il est trop risqué pour lui de continuer ce métier. Jeudi, les analyses de ses tests de santé n'ont pas rassuré le corps médical. Gérard Houllier, ancien coach de Lyon et du PSG notamment, était arrivé chez les Villans en septembre dernier et avait signé un contrat de trois ans. Il avait été hospitalisé le 21 avril pour de nouveaux soucis cardiaques et était ressorti de l'hôpital une semaine plus tard. Rappelons qu'il avait déjà subi une opération cardiaque en 2001 lorsqu'il était sur le banc de Liverpool.
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The right decision by all parties.Still wonder if there may be a place on the board for him,in an none executive football based position
We're not exactly full at board level with footballing ideas/brains
I reckon It's Benitez,the Madrid lad who's turned down Athletic,any comment Jack!
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sad news! the hunt begins and yet another summer with no manager and our top players on the brink
I have a strong suspicion that the new man will be on board before too long
Don't be daft - this will drag on and on - if past experience is repeated. We'll get linked to all and sundry and end up with someone like Curbishley. Let's hope I'm wrong.
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I must say Ancelotti would be the one to make the football world sit up and take notice and he would attract the kind of players to make the club attractive. I just can't see it unfortunately.
I think they'll go for Hughes if they get the nod he'd walk out of Fulham.
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sad news! the hunt begins and yet another summer with no manager and our top players on the brink
I have a strong suspicion that the new man will be on board before too long
Don't be daft - this will drag on and on - if past experience is repeated. We'll get linked to all and sundry and end up with someone like Curbishley. Let's hope I'm wrong.
It's a completely different scenario. Last time was a shock to all concerned with few available candidates.
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Do you reckon they'll bother with the interview process this time?
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Do you reckon they'll bother with the interview process this time?
I'd certainly hope so.
Anyway, good luck to Houllier, hope he has a long and healthy retirement. I won't be sad to see him gone though.
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sky sports news are reporting that the rumours of houllier leaving by mutual consent this week are "premature"...
the plot, she does a thicken!
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Do you reckon they'll bother with the interview process this time?
I'd certainly hope so.
I hope not as no manager employed by another club, and no top class manager would likely agree to it. Do you think Moyes, for instance, would ask his Chairman for permission to attend a Villa interview then go back saying "well, I didn't get the job. Now... can I have a few million to buy a new defender please?". Everton would tell him to get stuffed.
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sky sports news are reporting that the rumours of houllier leaving by mutual consent this week are "premature"...
the plot, she does a thicken!
As the male presenter pointed out, "premature" is quite different to "wrong".
On a side issue, Ms Jackson is looking poontangtastic this morning.
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I wish GH all the best for the future now the hard work starts here getting the right manager on board I would like Ancelotti to get the job if I'm honest he has won the double with Chelsea and won honors with Milan so I would like him to be given the job let's hope it is sorted out sooner rather than later.
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I agree with Darren.
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The training facilities at Villa were given the twice over a couple of weeks back and were unexpectedly viewed more recently by someone who raised a few eyebrows.
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I'd like Ancelotti, but you can't make someone manage your club against their will no matter how many millions you might offer them.
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surely the club to need to make some sort of comment , i wish ged all the best if true and hope for a swift and excitring appointment along the lines of ancelotti or benitez, or moyes.
talksport saying villa have said houllier is still the manager and no decision has been taken yet.
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Does that mean GMac has gone too?
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Well, bye Gerard. Best wishes for the future.
SkyBet showing the following as top bets:
Hughes (1/1), Benitez (11/8), Moyes (3/1), McClaren (7/1), Ancelotti (10/1), Jol (14/1), Allardyce (14/1), Macdonald (16/1), Zola (20/1)
No to Hughes, Benitez, Allardyce, Zola or sadly Kevin Mac from me.
My top choice would be Moyes, although Ancelotti or Jol wouldn't be bad news. Martinez as an outsider.
Haven't Fulham recently been awarded a Europa League place? - would that not help Hughes to decide to stay, I wonder?
I suspect it'll be between the FSW and McLaren; dreams of GHou plus exciting young up-and-coming manager are receding.
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Well if Ancelotti was willing to manage West Ham surely he'd be worth approaching. Ok, we're not a London club but I doubt Mrs Ancelotti would fail to be enticed by the delights of the Bull Ring. The only problem is, like most Italians, he has a massive chip on his shoulder about Birmingham's canal network.
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This was the right decision for everyone concerned. Next season doesn't have to be one of transition, the new man will have time to get players in and ship players out. A big name could convince jittery players to stay.
Go get Moyes, Jol or Ancelotti. Make our first signing NRC....
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If Ancelotti wouid consider West Ham, then surely he'd consider us?
I'm aware of the fact West Ham is in London, but then again, he could be our manager and live pretty close to London in any case.
I can't help thinking, though, that the fact Rafa Benitez turned down Atletico Madrid yesterday and reiterated he wants to stay in England has some bearing on our position.
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The training facilities at Villa were given the twice over a couple of weeks back and were unexpectedly viewed more recently by someone who raised a few eyebrows.
Oh come on Jack, you can't keep us hanging like that...spill the beans.
Mind you......raised a few eyebrows.....someone is famous for that !
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I'm confused, Talksport are saying Aston Villa are denying reports in the midlands that houllier has gone.
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I'd like Ancelotti, but you can't make someone manage your club against their will no matter how many millions you might offer them.
I have a sneaky suspiscion he'll end up at QPR
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I'm confused, Talksport are saying Aston Villa are denying reports in the midlands that houllier has gone.
That's because he hasn't gone yet. He's still packing and is wondering where he left his spare Pires. Nobody has the heart to tell him that Dogtanian was released last week.
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Hughes has done a good job everywhere he's been IMO.
Ancelotti would be brilliant.
I'd be happy with Moyes.
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Well Houllier hasn't gone yet. The "exclusive" is that he will be leaving. So the club can say he hasn't gone, because as yet - he hasn't.
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I'm confused, Talksport are saying Aston Villa are denying reports in the midlands that houllier has gone.
I hope this doesn't turn out to be a bloody 'is he? isn't he?' type saga that drags on. I can't take any more of those.
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I think Ancellotti will wait for the Spurs job which will come available if not this summer, then certainly next.
He'll want to stay in London IMO.
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Club have also apparently said reports are "premature" thats a million miles away from wrong. I get the feeling the club have known for a while but wanted to keep it under wraps until a new man has signed on the dotted line. Personally think Benitez is nailed on, if not then Hughes. Would prefer Benitez over Hughes though.
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I'm confused, Talksport are saying Aston Villa are denying reports in the midlands that houllier has gone.
Talksport revealed last week that McLaren will be the new West ham manager, the day before he turned it down.
Their credibility is zero.
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Hughes has done a good job everywhere he's been IMO.
Ancelotti would be brilliant.
I'd be happy with Moyes.
Agree with that, wouldn't mind Jol either!
So 1) Ancelotti 2) Moyes 3) Jol 4) Hughes and then the rest (i.e. fat waiter)!
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I'm not sold on Hughes. Moyes, if approached, should jump at the chance. Everton and Villa are equivalent in size and history, but we'd give him the platform to get himself to the next level consistently. Ancelotti would be brilliant, he's got nothing to prove but I think the QPR brass will ditch Warnock and appoint him
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Daily Mail reporting that it could cost us £5 million to get rid of Houllier.
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If not Carlo, what about one of the 3 Dutchmen...
Van Gaal
Rijkaard
Jol
All available I believe.
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I know everybody is keen for news but Im glad this is being sorted out in a gradual and timed manner. If Houllier had been manager of Chelsea/Westham then Abramovich/Sullivan would have been kicking nurses out the way and pulling tubes out of him to tell him he was sacked weeks ago. Villa have a little bit more class.
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Maybe we are waiting for Mcleish to become available .
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Daily Mail reporting that it could cost us £5 million to get rid of Houllier.
That would be if he was fully healthy.
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of all the people I think we could attract I.d go for Moyes or Ancelotti. Maybe Mark Hughes. Not Rafa.
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Daily Mail reporting that it could cost us £5 million to get rid of Houllier.
That would be if he was fully healthy.
Dont all key employees have some sort of health insurance policy in place for them ? Then again, with his previous health history the premiums would be exhorbitant.
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the sooner Aladyce checks in at the Hammers the better,
then and only then will i breath more easily
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Sad to GH go as he is a very decent man and i liked the fact he had a plan in place to build a decent footballing team
Ancelloti - could he actually do it without the finances of Chelsea and the prestige of bringing players to London? Remember he spunked £50m on Torres whilst letting some one like Sturridge go?
Moyes - Too dour and boring for me - another MON mid table mediocrity is acceptable manager for me
Jol - been out of work for a while now - wonder why no one else has picked him up?
McClaren - even though he has some virtues (hungry to prove doubters wrong etc) i feel he is shot over here with the press and we would become a laughing stock
Hughes - never liked the cnut as a player and even less as a manager
Benitez - actually my least favoured of all of them
I actually would like to see Martinez from Wigan as i like the way his teams play football
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i wouldn't want Rafa either. He seems obsessed with tactics. Obviously tactical knowledge is important but I think the eleven players on the pitch are more important than any system. He seems a bit of a B.S merchant to me.
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Hookey, the Russian bought Torres behing Ancelotti's back. The Russian intrudes in all his manager's dealings.
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What's Bilic up to? Is he not being linked to the West Ham job? Or more importantly
ours when or if it becomes available?
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Not sold on Bilic. If we want to pay somebody £3 million a year just to do a lot of shouting, I'll happily do it.
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Surely, 'by mutual consent' means they have agreed a fair compromise on his pay-off. I wish him good health, but never rated him as manager. Moyes is my number one choice as replacement.
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The training facilities at Villa were given the twice over a couple of weeks back and were unexpectedly viewed more recently by someone who raised a few eyebrows.
Jack's comment, coupled with Pep Guardiola's recent comments about wanting a new challenge after Barcelona, means only one outcome, obviously....
On Houllier, I think Mat Kendrick has jumped the gun somewhat on Twitter and pre-empted the club's announcement, but I still think the story is correct. In some ways it is a shame - feels like a waste of a season - but down to circumstances beyond anyone's control.
I'm warming to the idea of Martinez.
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if it was hughes then i guess he would get the best out of warnock and ireland which could save a few million quid-lets hope for a quick and positive appointment this time.
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Not sure what is worse, the overly keen acceptance that a rumour is fact, how yet again the Villa management have been found wanting with their undies around their ankles or yet more uncertainty around the clubs manager.
Chelsea, Cardiff, Blackburn, even West Ham and most other clubs seem to be able to sort these matters far more efficiently.
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You know this is a bit of a watershed for the club. With the gap from the rest to the top 4 growing ever wider and players happy to jump ship as soon as the ££ signs start ringing, the club need to look at their strategy and what manager would best fit it.
We have a strong and successful youth development policy that is starting to bear some fruit and if it can be further nurtured with players that believe in Villa we could create a Barcelona style team with players used to each other and determined to play for the club that made them. In my opinion there is only one man that can develop a youth team to that extent and mould to what he wants and that is Louis Van Gaal.
We cannot compete on transfers, so let's try and compete by developing a team built from youth. Give it to Van Gaal and watch us flourish in the same way he develop AZ Alkmaar into champions.
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Stephen Ireland as player coach with SVC as first team coach with Sasa Curcic and Bosco Balaban.
Football is a mad world.
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Stephen Ireland as player coach with SVC as first team coach with Sasa Curcic and Bosco Balaban.
Football is a mad world.
Billy McNeill
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Not sure what is worse, the overly keen acceptance that a rumour is fact, how yet again the Villa management have been found wanting with their undies around their ankles or yet more uncertainty around the clubs manager.
Chelsea, Cardiff, Blackburn, even West Ham and most other clubs seem to be able to sort these matters far more efficiently.
Do tell us, oh wise one, what they've done wrong this time.
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By the sound of it we should have had someone waiting to take over from the second Houllier got ill to make Malcolm happy. Maybe the intended appointee could've hung around Gerard's hospital bed dressed as the Grim Reaper?
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doesn't hughes have a 'walk-away' clause with Fulham that is effective on 1st June ?
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Chelski, Caerdydd and Wet Spam don't have managers yet, do they? I don't think the Blackburn appointment would've thrilled many Villa fans if we'd unveiled him.
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doesn't hughes have a 'walk-away' clause with Fulham that is effective on 1st June ?
I hope not.
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I do feel sorry for GH. The signs of gradual improvement during a difficult season were there, and given another transfer window and a proper pre-season I for one was willing to give him a shot. If true - and Kendrick does seem certain (not the thing to joke about surely) - then it's a real shame for him because, as Wenger and Phil Thompson have pointed out, football is his entire life, and to not be able to ccarry on with it would be very tough indeed for him.
As far as new managers go, the idea of Martinez is an interesting one. He's very young, so the gamble would be there definitely, but he seems to have genuine abilities as a manager, making some good signings, steadfastly refusing to compromise his football principles and displaying good ability to motivate his players during that remarkable run-in Wigan had there. He does seem like a genuine talent and you get the feeling that, sooner or later, someone's going to take the gamble on him and get rewarded. It might as well be us.
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Chelsea, Cardiff, Blackburn, even West Ham and most other clubs seem to be able to sort these matters far more efficiently.
Efficiently is an interesting choice of word, there. I'd replace with 'brutally' or 'callously'. The way Ancelotti, Allardyce and Grant were all sacked was pretty shabby, IMO. Ancelotti and Grant effectively sacked in the tunnel immediately after games, if I recall. Nasty.
The situation with Houllier is a little more sensitive and needs to be handled accordingly. The season finished just over a week ago; I'd say Villa are acting fairly swiftly and decisively here.
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im sure i heard something about hughes having a get out clause on june 1st too, surely now the club need to bring forward any announcement and confirm this news as its being reported widely now.
im a bit sad we cant use gerard on the board to add a footballing input in the boardroom but i guess a clean break makes sense as no new manager would want someone looking over his shoulder.
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Sad to GH go as he is a very decent man and i liked the fact he had a plan in place to build a decent footballing team
Ancelloti - could he actually do it without the finances of Chelsea and the prestige of bringing players to London? Remember he spunked £50m on Torres whilst letting some one like Sturridge go?
Moyes - Too dour and boring for me - another MON mid table mediocrity is acceptable manager for me
Jol - been out of work for a while now - wonder why no one else has picked him up?
McClaren - even though he has some virtues (hungry to prove doubters wrong etc) i feel he is shot over here with the press and we would become a laughing stock
Hughes - never liked the cnut as a player and even less as a manager
Benitez - actually my least favoured of all of them
I actually would like to see Martinez from Wigan as i like the way his teams play football
Interesting Hookeysmith!
My first choice would be Moyes but he's always said he's not interested in Villa job, Hughes has got Euro stuff, Ancelotti to stay in London...but always secretly fancied Martinez (only in a wants to play good football kinda way!). Can only think he'd jump at the chance! Benitez, McLaren and Jol not in my book at all, the first 2 of those especially!!!
As someone else suggested, we need a good bloke and a 5 year plan so fans, players and everyone can see we mean business!
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Chelsea, Cardiff, Blackburn, even West Ham and most other clubs seem to be able to sort these matters far more efficiently.
Efficiently is an interesting choice of word, there. I'd replace with 'brutally' or 'callously'. The way Ancelotti, Allardyce and Grant were all sacked was pretty shabby, IMO. Ancelotti and Grant effectively sacked in the tunnel immediately after games, if I recall. Nasty.
The situation with Houllier is a little more sensitive and needs to be handled accordingly. The season finished just over a week ago; I'd say Villa are acting fairly swiftly and decisively here.
I would also guess they had disability discrimination legislation to contend with. Sacking someone for falling ill is a definite no-go.
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Not sure what is worse, the overly keen acceptance that a rumour is fact, how yet again the Villa management have been found wanting with their undies around their ankles or yet more uncertainty around the clubs manager.
Chelsea, Cardiff, Blackburn, even West Ham and most other clubs seem to be able to sort these matters far more efficiently.
cant believe what i'm reading here,
you have just compared Randy to that lot at Wast Ham, and found him wanting.
thats an absolute disgrace my man
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Chelsea, Cardiff, Blackburn, even West Ham and most other clubs seem to be able to sort these matters far more efficiently.
Chelsea and Westhams 'efficiency' you can shove where the sun dont shine. I refer the honourable gentleman to my previous comments.
If Houllier had been manager of Chelsea/Westham then Abramovich/Sullivan would have been kicking nurses out the way and pulling tubes out of him to tell him he was sacked weeks ago. Villa have a little bit more class.
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Not sure what is worse, the overly keen acceptance that a rumour is fact, how yet again the Villa management have been found wanting with their undies around their ankles or yet more uncertainty around the clubs manager.
Chelsea, Cardiff, Blackburn, even West Ham and most other clubs seem to be able to sort these matters far more efficiently.
Chelsea and Cardiff - sacking very good managers for doing very little wrong
Blackburn - sacking an effective manager and getting embroiled in a relegation battle
West Ham - publically humilating their manager in January by trying to replace him only to stick with him and get relegated.
How, in anyone's mind, are those four clubs examples of how to sort out uncertainty over their manager? Did you just pick the four clubs least likely to prove that you had a point?
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Not sure what is worse, the overly keen acceptance that a rumour is fact, how yet again the Villa management have been found wanting with their undies around their ankles or yet more uncertainty around the clubs manager.
Chelsea, Cardiff, Blackburn, even West Ham and most other clubs seem to be able to sort these matters far more efficiently.
cant believe what i'm reading here,
you have just compared Randy to that lot at Wast Ham, and found him wanting.
thats an absolute disgrace my man
Quite, this from a man who claimed on the General's thread yesterday to be a big defender of the board. Hypocrisy doesn't do this sort of duplicity justice.
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Not sold on Bilic. If we want to pay somebody £3 million a year just to do a lot of shouting, I'll happily do it.
Hahaha! Like it. If just shouting can get your team to beat Germany, Russia and England (home and away) then fair play.
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Chelsea, Cardiff, Blackburn, even West Ham and most other clubs seem to be able to sort these matters far more efficiently.
Efficiently is an interesting choice of word, there. I'd replace with 'brutally' or 'callously'. The way Ancelotti, Allardyce and Grant were all sacked was pretty shabby, IMO. Ancelotti and Grant effectively sacked in the tunnel immediately after games, if I recall. Nasty.
The situation with Houllier is a little more sensitive and needs to be handled accordingly. The season finished just over a week ago; I'd say Villa are acting fairly swiftly and decisively here.
Agree with all of this. Still loads of time to get the right man in. What's saying he hasn't already been consulting? (if it's Benitez for instance, nothing stopping him talking to Villa and advising) I personally think this decision was taken a good few days ago and work has been ongoing behind the scenes to get a replacement in. Will all be sorted by the end of the week
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what are you saying malcolm ? is your point that the story has been leaked by the press before the board released the news?
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They have 'acted. Then Merv ?
Looks to me they are still denying what many accept as fact and whilst I agree the way Chelsea and the others acted was not 'nice' or suited to the bleeding hearts club, it was decisive.
It is sad to see Ged go in such circumstances, but when he went into hospital his management became untenable or are there people who really feel he will remain as manager.
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Im not sure Id want Hughes seems to be pretty average to me and no to Benitez.
Not that fussed about Ancelloti would have to be Moyes for me and if not him quite fancy Martinez.
Owen Coyle is another i would like but as hes only been in the Bolton job 5 minutes not sure we would get done great job their though
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Looks to me they are still denying what many accept as fact and whilst I agree the way Chelsea and the others acted was not 'nice' or suited to the bleeding hearts club, it was decisive.
What are you, Gordon Gecko now? Alan Sugar? You sound like an executive from some evil multinational firing the 80-year-old company stalwart from a Michael Moore film.
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Chelsea, Cardiff, Blackburn, even West Ham and most other clubs seem to be able to sort these matters far more efficiently.
Efficiently is an interesting choice of word, there. I'd replace with 'brutally' or 'callously'. The way Ancelotti, Allardyce and Grant were all sacked was pretty shabby, IMO. Ancelotti and Grant effectively sacked in the tunnel immediately after games, if I recall. Nasty.
The situation with Houllier is a little more sensitive and needs to be handled accordingly. The season finished just over a week ago; I'd say Villa are acting fairly swiftly and decisively here.
I would also guess they had disability discrimination legislation to contend with. Sacking someone for falling ill is a definite no-go.
Bet it happens all the time in 2011 Britain at the other end of the job market though.
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edit
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No to Moyes he has hit the glass ceiling that MON hit, Hughes no cause he may want to keep Ireland. The stick we have given FSW no way. How about Martinez, young up and coming and can spot a player wh is not going to cost a bomb, good style of play too.
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So has he gone or not?
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Benitez or Ancelotti for me.
Am I reading too much into Jack's eyebrow comment?
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Just logged in to see this and am slightly shocked as I wasn't expecting anything today. A few thoughts:-
1. I hope his health holds up and he was a long and happy retirement.
2. I think the board handled things right by not having any knee-jerk reactions, waiting and then doing it with the doctor's advice and Gezza himself in agreement.
3. They now have a whole summer to find someone and none of the excuses of bad timing from last season can be used. Big challenge for the board.
4. It will be interesting to see which way they jump. Were they happy with the direction Gezza was taking us and will employ a similar coach, or will they get a Moyes/Hughes type, which is more of a return to MON's methods?
It'll be an interesting few days/weeks ahead!!
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No to Moyes he has hit the glass ceiling that MON hit, Hughes no cause he may want to keep Ireland. The stick we have given FSW no way. How about Martinez, young up and coming and can spot a player wh is not going to cost a bomb, good style of play too.
mon spent a fortune hitting that glass ceiling , moyes didnt have anything like that cash at everton.
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Let's ignore the troll and continue the discussion like adults.
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They have 'acted. Then Merv ?
Looks to me they are still denying what many accept as fact and whilst I agree the way Chelsea and the others acted was not 'nice' or suited to the bleeding hearts club, it was decisive.
It is sad to see Ged go in such circumstances, but when he went into hospital his management became untenable or are there people who really feel he will remain as manager.
You'll have to explain that top line - the opening five words - to me again. It doesn't make sense to me.
What are you actually arguing? That Villa haven't been decisive enough? I think we all accept that the decision has been made, it's a matter of the announcement being timed and a couple of extremely well-informed local journalists have got there first (as the media often do). I'm not sure now what your grumble is: that Villa should have done something when Houllier was in hospital?
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what are you saying malcolm ? is your point that the story has been leaked by the press before the board released the news?
Partly.
Yet again, as with Mon leaving, his tribunal, Houlliers illness, our club management has and is handling the media poorly.
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If all this does turn out to be true then it's a great shame that we'll never get to know what might have been, had GH had full pre-season and with some of his own choice of signings. At least his reign could then have been judged more fairly. Sadly we're now back to square one it seems.
Best wishes for the future Gerard.
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Sorry to see him go tbh. Never fully connected to him and had severe doubts after the Liverpool and Citeh issues, but I would have liked to see him have a full pre-season with a clear out and bringing in players to suit his style. But his heart problem would have been a sword of Damocles hanging over us all season so best for all that he moves on.
Whoever we get in it must be someone who can command the respect of the players from day one. I don't want to see more players whingeing about training too hard or not liking the style of play - as Fergie apparently said to Rooney during that game at the weekend - 'I'm the manager, just fucking do it'
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If the story is true, as it appears to be, then I think it is in the best interests of both Houllier and Aston Villa.
I was distinctly underwhelemed by his appointment at the time, as it was a backwards-looking move. It was said at the time, and still is, that he was the best candidate. That may or may not be the case; if he was, it was probably because we inexplicably limited our search to out of work managers. In any case, he hadn't been a club manager for a couple of years, hadn't been in the Premier League for longer than that, and hadn't been successful in the Premier League for even longer. His reputation rested largely on one golden season 10 years ago. Add to that the concern about his previous health problems and it seemed an appointment that had the potential to go very wrong.
Which it did. He was unfortunate in having to deal with horrendous injury problems but was fortunate, to a degree, in having plenty of very talented young players coming through at just the right time. He was unfortunate in having to deal with dreadful unprofessionalism from some of the players upon whom he should have been able to rely but probably tried to change too much too fast, which is bound to upset people; the collapse of a previously very strong defence is something he has to take some of the blame for. The misjudgments about his Liverpool comments and the capitulation in the FA Cup were all his own doing, upset the fans and were completely avoidable. And then his health failed him again which, while not inevitable, was always a possibility. Yes, we finished 9th but we were also relegation candidates with only 2 or 3 games to go and I think that's a truer reflection of our season.
So I think it's best for Gerard to forget about football, as far as that is possible for him, get better and enjoy retirement. He seems a throughly decent and intelligent man and I wish him well.
As for Villa, I reckon we need to do something we rarely do: appoint a manager with a truly top class track record. A manager whose arrival will surprise us, improve us and excite us as much as the arrival of Darren Bent did.
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GH has made a lot of bad moves such as trying to change things too quickly, Anfield and Citeh in the cup but I liked what I was hearing about him instilling discipline at the training ground, trying to play a more technique based game and some of the potential signings we've been linked with. I think it's a shame if we don't get to see what he could do with a squad with some of his own signings and fully behind him with a full pre season.
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what are you saying malcolm ? is your point that the story has been leaked by the press before the board released the news?
Partly.
Yet again, as with Mon leaving, his tribunal, Houlliers illness, our club management has and is handling the media poorly.
Are you for real?
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I personally think it's best all round. We finished in a healthy position in the league, and although the table dose'nt lie, it did'nt really tell the whole story of the season. We looked poor for most of it and while there were signs that his methods were going somewhere, it was always one step forward and two steps back, the Man City game being the main game in point.
If his time with us leaves behind a class act of a midfielder (time will tell) and many more Darren Bent goals, then i'm sure he goes with many people's thanks and welcomed back. Long term, it just was'nt to be.
My choice before GH got the job was Martin Jol, although Ancelotti and Wilkins would be fantastic.
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what are you saying malcolm ? is your point that the story has been leaked by the press before the board released the news?
Partly.
Yet again, as with Mon leaving, his tribunal, Houlliers illness, our club management has and is handling the media poorly.
Damn. I try my hardest to ignore most of your moronic outpourings but this one is quite spectacular even by your low, low standards. Care to explain?
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3. They now have a whole summer to find someone and none of the excuses of bad timing from last season can be used. Big challenge for the board.
They dont have the whole summer though. It is imperative that we get a new manager in quickly. If they act as slowly as they did last time, the new manager will have less time to make signings and the players at the club will grow more and more restless at the uncertainty.
No reason why we shouldnt have a new man in place by the 3rd week in June, assuming Houllier is leaving by tomorrow.
Ancelotti is certainly the glamour candidate, but I would have a nagging doubt about whether he could do it at Villa. I dont need to be told about the trophies he has won, but I cant help feeling that he has somewhat spoiled by the players he has had at his disposal at both Chelsea and AC Milan. Might he struggle to get the best out of a lower calibre team as he struggled to get the best out of Chelsea's superstars last season?
It's just a nagging doubt I have about him. If he was appointed I would be very happy to see what he could do.
I would also be happy with Moyes. He has brought Everton as far as he can unless they get a sudden investment. I think if he is given the funds at Villa he could take us to the new level.
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what are you saying malcolm ? is your point that the story has been leaked by the press before the board released the news?
Partly.
Yet again, as with Mon leaving, his tribunal, Houlliers illness, our club management has and is handling the media poorly.
Damn. I try my hardest to ignore most of your moronic outpourings but this one is quite spectacular even by your low, low standards. Care to explain?
Chris, please remember that this is Heroes and Villains, where even idiots are allowed their opinions.
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what are you saying malcolm ? is your point that the story has been leaked by the press before the board released the news?
Partly.
Yet again, as with Mon leaving, his tribunal, Houlliers illness, our club management has and is handling the media poorly.
I am sorry you find the running of AVFC slightly less than perfect in your terms. I think this is a case of we can always find lots of faults with our own club as that is the one we follow and take in every little bit of news, rumour, opinion etc. Compared with some of the absolutely crazy things done by crazy people at many other clubs over the years, I think in comparison we can hold up our club as nearly always being a model of proper efficiency, sensible decision making, and an ability to deal with PR and the media in a reasonable way.
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what are you saying malcolm ? is your point that the story has been leaked by the press before the board released the news?
Partly.
Yet again, as with Mon leaving, his tribunal, Houlliers illness, our club management has and is handling the media poorly.
Damn. I try my hardest to ignore most of your moronic outpourings but this one is quite spectacular even by your low, low standards. Care to explain?
Chris, please remember that this is Heroes and Villains, where even idiots are allowed their opinions.
I like cake.
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my choice would be martin jol...
out of work, a good manager who plays good football, knows how to play the media, has good european knowledge, got a pretty average spuds side to the brink of champs league and laid the foundations for redknobb to actually get there (albeit with the dip of ramos which made redknobb look better than he is), knows the english game, and i think would be a fantastic appointment...
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So has he gone or not?
Houllier or sfx412 ?
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what are you saying malcolm ? is your point that the story has been leaked by the press before the board released the news?
Partly.
Yet again, as with Mon leaving, his tribunal, Houlliers illness, our club management has and is handling the media poorly.
Are you for real?
Once again, attention seeking I feel.
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my choice would be martin jol...
out of work, a good manager who plays good football, knows how to play the media, has good european knowledge, got a pretty average spuds side to the brink of champs league and laid the foundations for redknobb to actually get there (albeit with the dip of ramos which made redknobb look better than he is), knows the english game, and i think would be a fantastic appointment...
Am i right in thinking he took Bent to Tottenham? That in itself would be a good start, not that any other manager coming in would kick him out the door. I think Jol would be a nice fit for us. If he brought in Chris Houghton to work with the defence, it could work very well.
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Chris, please remember that this is Heroes and Villains, where even idiots are allowed their opinions.
Of course, sorry Legion. It's a valuable service H&V offers in that it prevents people being bored shitless at bus stops, in chip shops etc by the incoherent ramblings of the local 'characters' and attention seekers.
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The training facilities at Villa were given the twice over a couple of weeks back and were unexpectedly viewed more recently by someone who raised a few eyebrows.
Roger Moore?
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Thanks for getting us through this period GH, good luck for the future and many healthy years.
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The training facilities at Villa were given the twice over a couple of weeks back and were unexpectedly viewed more recently by someone who raised a few eyebrows.
Roger Moore?
John Inman?
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my choice would be martin jol...
out of work, a good manager who plays good football, knows how to play the media, has good european knowledge, got a pretty average spuds side to the brink of champs league and laid the foundations for redknobb to actually get there (albeit with the dip of ramos which made redknobb look better than he is), knows the english game, and i think would be a fantastic appointment...
My first choice is David Moyes, but Jol was someone I thought we should have gone in heavily for when martin left and remains a good choice.
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my choice would be martin jol...
out of work, a good manager who plays good football, knows how to play the media, has good european knowledge, got a pretty average spuds side to the brink of champs league and laid the foundations for redknobb to actually get there (albeit with the dip of ramos which made redknobb look better than he is), knows the english game, and i think would be a fantastic appointment...
Am i right in thinking he took Bent to Tottenham? That in itself would be a good start, not that any other manager coming in would kick him out the door. I think Jol would be a nice fit for us. If he brought in Chris Houghton to work with the defence, it could work very well.
Good shout - Jol plus Hughton would do it for me
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The training facilities at Villa were given the twice over a couple of weeks back and were unexpectedly viewed more recently by someone who raised a few eyebrows.
Roger Moore?
John Inman?
Sir Dennis Healey?
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3. They now have a whole summer to find someone and none of the excuses of bad timing from last season can be used. Big challenge for the board.
They dont have the whole summer though. It is imperative that we get a new manager in quickly. If they act as slowly as they did last time, the new manager will have less time to make signings and the players at the club will grow more and more restless at the uncertainty.
Maybe.
But it's certainly a better time to go recruiting than 5 days before the start of the season. Could be wrong, but I believe they get back for pre-season on 7th July, so with most transfer deals not happening before then anyway I'm quite relaxed about it time wise. If they get back and no knew manager is in place then I think I'll start to panic!
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Not sure about Moyes
Everton just seem like groundhog day to me.
Start shit every season then have a run at then end and fail to get into Europe.
bring good kids through
A bit like us to an extent
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my choice would be martin jol...
out of work, a good manager who plays good football, knows how to play the media, has good european knowledge, got a pretty average spuds side to the brink of champs league and laid the foundations for redknobb to actually get there (albeit with the dip of ramos which made redknobb look better than he is), knows the english game, and i think would be a fantastic appointment...
Am i right in thinking he took Bent to Tottenham? That in itself would be a good start, not that any other manager coming in would kick him out the door. I think Jol would be a nice fit for us. If he brought in Chris Houghton to work with the defence, it could work very well.
interesting... i hadnt even thought of that...
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Lets get Carlo
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So has he gone or not?
Houllier or sfx412 ?
They are waiting for Deadly's rose garden to be free for the traditional walkabout.
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what are you saying malcolm ? is your point that the story has been leaked by the press before the board released the news?
Partly.
Yet again, as with Mon leaving, his tribunal, Houlliers illness, our club management has and is handling the media poorly.
Damn. I try my hardest to ignore most of your moronic outpourings but this one is quite spectacular even by your low, low standards. Care to explain?
Come on then Malcolm, back up your blatant bullshit and nonsense with some form of explanation. Go on, dare you, give it a go for once in your life.
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Disgraceful that Villa are dragging their heels on this: unfair to Houllier and unfair to the fans.
The medical results are obviously back. If they're not looking good, take the requisite action. If they're positive, confirm he's staying and let's get on with some business for next season.
It really is that fucking simple.
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Shame for him, hope his he manages a long and happy retirement.
Something puzzling and bothering me though, if they knew he was leaving, who has made the decision on the released players? I'd have thought they would be ary after Ireland.
I do think they'll happily go for someone in a job at theis stage of pre-season - I think it was the timing that prevented that loast year. I slo think had it happened a month earlier last year it would have been Hughes, so given the rumours about his clause that is where my money is. I think Moyes would also walk out for us now. Van Gaal would be the dream though!!
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jol with hughton as his number 2 would be a solid management team.
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Disgraceful that Villa are dragging their heels on this: unfair to Houllier and unfair to the fans.
The medical results are obviously back. If they're not looking good, take the requisite action. If they're positive, confirm he's staying and let's get on with some business for next season.
It really is that fucking simple.
That's what they are doing.
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might be an idea to merge all these threads on Houllier, new manager etc
For what its worth, Roberto Martinez is a nonsense suggestion. Finished a point behind Steve Kean this season, 3 ahead of Holloway with far more resources. Wigan play good football under him but he is responsible for having clowns like the Caldwell brothers in the team and in the past 2 seasons they have barely escaped relegation. Under Bruce they were pretty comfortable. Big no to him.
Jol was crap at Ajax. They won the league this season after he left, last season Steve McClaren with Twente beat them to the title. Another no from me.
We actually have far better candidates to choose from this time around. Out of work - Ancelotti, McClaren and Benitez. In work but gettable - Hughes and Moyes.
I get the feeling the appointment is in the bag, especially with Reo Coker leaving. Dont know how the club would agree to that without a new manager being given a say.
On Houllier, undoubtedly he had good ideas but like GT second time around, the challenge of managing players was too much for him. Hope he lives a long healthy life as I think he was a genuine sort but from day one he made the Villa job far more difficult than it was.
Benitez or Ancelotti would make the football world in Europe stand up and take notice. Id expect its between the two, just hope who ever gets it realises how lucky they are to be manager of a superb football club. Benitez seems as keen as mustard for it, might just swing it for me. I'll forget about his last season at Liverpool and he never seemed interested in Inter.
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Disgraceful that Villa are dragging their heels on this: unfair to Houllier and unfair to the fans.
The medical results are obviously back. If they're not looking good, take the requisite action. If they're positive, confirm he's staying and let's get on with some business for next season.
It really is that fucking simple.
I assume you're being ironic?!
Otherwise, I'd go and lie down for a while in a dark room if I were you. The sensitivity of a plank of wood and the subtlety of a Luftwaffe pilot over Coventry.
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I wish you would all stop making such sensible suggestions as to the merits or otherwise of the individual candidates. It makes it very difficult for one to make one's mind up!!!
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Disgraceful that Villa are dragging their heels on this: unfair to Houllier and unfair to the fans.
The medical results are obviously back. If they're not looking good, take the requisite action. If they're positive, confirm he's staying and let's get on with some business for next season.
It really is that fucking simple.
No, it fucking isn't.
They have to sort out the terms of his departure and decide the future of the rest of the coaching staff, they cannot make official statements until those issues are settled.
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if the cat has been let out of the bag it makes sense for the club to announce a press conference or release a statement rather than just saying its premature - if the decision has been made then lets have it official .
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Relief is the best way to describe the news. Haven't been happy with any of his reign.
Signing Darren Bent?
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jol with hughton as his number 2 would be a solid management team.
I agree, but I suspect Hughton would be in the market for a manager's job of his own now, having been linked with the West Ham job, to name but one
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Disgraceful that Villa are dragging their heels on this: unfair to Houllier and unfair to the fans.
The medical results are obviously back. If they're not looking good, take the requisite action. If they're positive, confirm he's staying and let's get on with some business for next season.
It really is that fucking simple.
Malcolm?
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I don't get why so many people are so negative about the bored. Why are they dragging there heels? They have done nothing wrong, except act quickly after the season to sort the problem out. They can't help that it has been leaked on that bloody annoying twitter thing first.
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I get the feeling the appointment is in the bag, especially with Reo Coker leaving. Dont know how the club would agree to that without a new manager being given a say.
On Houllier, undoubtedly he had good ideas but like GT second time around, the challenge of managing players was too much for him.
Re NRC, he was out of contract! Simple as. That's why he left at the end of the season - he was free to walk away, and did.
Re GHou, I don't think he failed the challenge of managing the players: I think he was halfway through the project wehn his heart gave out. This close-season would have seen the 'surgery' that the squad needed, with the inclusion of players more mentally equipped to work in the way that GHou wanted.
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if the cat has been let out of the bag it makes sense for the club to announce a press conference or release a statement rather than just saying its premature - if the decision has been made then lets have it official .
The cat was out of the bag at about 3am. Do you expect them to call a press conference in their pyjamas?
I'm sure they are working on getting the exact wording right for the statement, and maybe contacting relevant parties as well as making sure Houllier is given a dignified exit. They may also still be ironing out the details of his severance deal. Far better to do it now than to have it hanging over the club's head like O'Neill's tribunal did.
After the media assassination we got after O'Neill left, they may also be trying to ensure we get the best possible press out of this. Be patient!
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What about Salifou, Pires and Osbourne? (winky thing)
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Disgraceful that Villa are dragging their heels on this: unfair to Houllier and unfair to the fans.
The medical results are obviously back. If they're not looking good, take the requisite action. If they're positive, confirm he's staying and let's get on with some business for next season.
It really is that fucking simple.
Malcolm?
TeeHee - exactly what I thought at first when I saw this.
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3. They now have a whole summer to find someone and none of the excuses of bad timing from last season can be used. Big challenge for the board.
They dont have the whole summer though. It is imperative that we get a new manager in quickly. If they act as slowly as they did last time, the new manager will have less time to make signings and the players at the club will grow more and more restless at the uncertainty.
Ok so your sitting on a beach in the caribbean staying in a 5 star luxury hotel for the next 3 weeks with your family, its the end of May and a BACS transfer has just put £200k in your current account, a week after you get back another BACS transfer puts a further £200k in your account. I must admit, Im not very good sitting around on beaches for too long - I suggest a couple of good novels.
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one problem the club need to address is the number of times stories have been leaked to the press this season from someone inside the club-who is the mystery mole?
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one problem the club need to address is the number of times stories have been leaked to the press this season from someone inside the club-who is the mystery mole?
It's the same at every club. Most of them are lucky/informed guesses.
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I get the feeling the appointment is in the bag, especially with Reo Coker leaving. Dont know how the club would agree to that without a new manager being given a say.
On Houllier, undoubtedly he had good ideas but like GT second time around, the challenge of managing players was too much for him.
Re NRC, he was out of contract! Simple as. That's why he left at the end of the season - he was free to walk away, and did.
Re GHou, I don't think he failed the challenge of managing the players: I think he was halfway through the project wehn his heart gave out. This close-season would have seen the 'surgery' that the squad needed, with the inclusion of players more mentally equipped to work in the way that GHou wanted.
Letting go Reo Coker would be bizarre if Houllier was staying on as he was one of the few to give his all under his management. Still think it was strange to let him go anyway as if he really wanted out he would have signed a pre contract with someone else last Jan. For an extra 10k a week we would have had a player that we could have sold for maybe 5m next summer at the worst. Anyway I'll let that one go. I'll always have good time for him for giving his all considering the uncertainty about his future.
halfway to the championship was where we were going under Houllier imo, GMac for all his faults and there were many actually did alright and we picked up enough to points to stay up under him.
Too many good EPL players completely went to pieces under Houllier for it to be a coincidence. We were an absolute shambles under him, to say otherwise is revisionism. Maybe he tried to change things too soon. Bent and Walker were good signings but being a manager is more about bringing in players (Makoun and Pires werent as successful). Houllier wasnt up to managing players anymore and a change is best for all concerned.
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Assuming this is true, then this is the correct decision by the board in the ultimate interests of the football clubs fortunes on the pitch. That is one big challenging decision they have got right. The biggest challenge is yet to come. Unless the replacement has already been earmarked of course. I cannot believe that the board would be daft enough to appoint Benitez when the Gerard experiment pretty well backfired. It's not time for experimental appointments. It's time for a tried and tested name who has current experience of the Premier League. Therefore, the only three candidates are Ancellotti, Moyes and Hughes. My preference would be Mr Moyes.
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I hope Sid isn't let go in the clear-out!
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if the cat has been let out of the bag it makes sense for the club to announce a press conference or release a statement rather than just saying its premature - if the decision has been made then lets have it official .
The cat was out of the bag at about 3am. Do you expect them to call a press conference in their pyjamas?
I'm sure they are working on getting the exact wording right for the statement, and maybe contacting relevant parties as well as making sure Houllier is given a dignified exit. They may also still be ironing out the details of his severance deal. Far better to do it now than to have it hanging over the club's head like O'Neill's tribunal did.
After the media assassination we got after O'Neill left, they may also be trying to ensure we get the best possible press out of this. Be patient!
If I recall correctly, the General clearly said that any news would be communicated to the fans first, which is why I presume they have given the exclusive to local Birmingham newspaper.
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The thing that worries me about appointing Ancelotti, is that as a club we are just a bit below his level. By that, I mean I think he may go out and spunk loads of cash on new players, but that cash will probably not be enough. Then when it doesn't go immediately to plan, there'll be noises about the board not backing him enough and rifts and he'll do one to Juve or Inter and we'll be left footing the bill.
A big 'name' manager would be nice, if we had the funds to back one with. I just don't think we should be overstretching ourselves. It would be nice to have a crack, but the model of bringing the youngsters through, with the odd rare signing of someone of bent's quality now and again is the one that best suits a club of our current standing.
Seems done and dusted that Houllier is leaving now and probably best for all concerned given his health.
Judging by how we finished the season though, I'd have been fairly happy for McAllister to carry on in that caretaker type role with Houllier helping out from upstairs (in the stand!) and giving that a go for a season, or so.
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Ancelotti or Benitez please.
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one problem the club need to address is the number of times stories have been leaked to the press this season from someone inside the club-who is the mystery mole?
I don't see it as a problem. Sorry
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http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/13599979.stm (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/13599979.stm) Further from Pat Murphy.
A bit of a no brainer really, given his health and our last season's achievements. The final pay-off surely is that all that needs to be discussed? I'm not getting sentimental about it, I hope he enjoys his retirement, but in purely football terms it didn't work. Would be delighted with Moyes, Ancelotti or Jol.
Expect SSN/TalkShite will be in denial as it's not one of their "exclusives"
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I hope it's not Hughes. I'm not sure why he's a popular choice, he's not exactly pulled up any trees elsewhere, i think Fulham is the right size club for him. He made a bit of a mess at the Man City job once the money started coming in. Adebayor, Robinho, Bridge, Santa Cruz etc and he paid way over the odds for Lescott and Toure, although it could be argued he may not have known too much about those players coming in. I'd leave well alone.
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The thing that worries me about appointing Ancelotti, is that as a club we are just a bit below his level. By that, I mean I think he may go out and spunk loads of cash on new players, but that cash will probably not be enough. Then when it doesn't go immediately to plan, there'll be noises about the board not backing him enough and rifts and he'll do one to Juve or Inter and we'll be left footing the bill.
Good point. As soon as he started doing well we'd have speculation he'd be off for every available job.
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I hope Houllier is ok.
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But we can't appoint someone in the hope that they don't do well enough to attract the attention of the very top clubs can we?
We want someone who will do precisely that. And if / when that time comes, we'll deal with the situation then.
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http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/13599979.stm (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/13599979.stm) Further from Pat Murphy.
A bit of a no brainer really, given his health and our last season's achievements. The final pay-off surely is that all that needs to be discussed? I'm not getting sentimental about it, I hope he enjoys his retirement, but in purely football terms it didn't work. Would be delighted with Moyes, Ancelotti or Jol.
Expect SSN/TalkShite will be in denial as it's not one of their "exclusives"
I don't like Pat Murphy's quote about this being 'in the interests of Aston Villa, not Gerrard Houllier'. It's an insinuation that we don't give a rat's ass about his health & well being.
I can hear Oliver Holt, Henry Winter et al, sharpening their pens (knives) ready for another round of Lerner-bashing.
Callous Lerner ruthlessly forces Houllier out the door despite doctors giving him the all-clear etc etc etc
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I get the feeling the appointment is in the bag, especially with Reo Coker leaving. Dont know how the club would agree to that without a new manager being given a say.
On Houllier, undoubtedly he had good ideas but like GT second time around, the challenge of managing players was too much for him.
Re NRC, he was out of contract! Simple as. That's why he left at the end of the season - he was free to walk away, and did.
Re GHou, I don't think he failed the challenge of managing the players: I think he was halfway through the project wehn his heart gave out. This close-season would have seen the 'surgery' that the squad needed, with the inclusion of players more mentally equipped to work in the way that GHou wanted.
Letting go Reo Coker would be bizarre if Houllier was staying on as he was one of the few to give his all under his management. Still think it was strange to let him go anyway as if he really wanted out he would have signed a pre contract with someone else last Jan. For an extra 10k a week we would have had a player that we could have sold for maybe 5m next summer at the worst. Anyway I'll let that one go. I'll always have good time for him for giving his all considering the uncertainty about his future.
halfway to the championship was where we were going under Houllier imo, GMac for all his faults and there were many actually did alright and we picked up enough to points to stay up under him.
Too many good EPL players completely went to pieces under Houllier for it to be a coincidence. We were an absolute shambles under him, to say otherwise is revisionism. Maybe he tried to change things too soon. Bent and Walker were good signings but being a manager is more about bringing in players (Makoun and Pires werent as successful). Houllier wasnt up to managing players anymore and a change is best for all concerned.
I agree that NRC had more mileage for us - but between the club, the agent and the player it proved impossible to get a deal done and so he walked.
I guess there'll be a number of views on the brief GHou era. Mine is that he was in the process of dealing with a number of player-issues and gameplay challenges and needed the summer to complete the job.
Why a number of EPL players 'lost the plot' is a question with several possible answers: my view is that Dunne (forever unfit this last season), Collins, Warnock and probably Friedel did not see eye-to-eye with the new management team and their desired methods. The result of this (allied with the injuries we saw in the first half of the season) was a 4-5% decline in performance at the back and thus the leaking goals from set pieces and the failure to hold onto a winning position.
Whilst large parts of the season were a desert for us, there were a number of games where we played some scintillating football without always converting to unassailable positions.
I definitely am not trying to gild the lily here but there were latterly signs of progress finally being made ... but as I said above, there will be many interpretations of what happened during 2010-11.
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The thing that worries me about appointing Ancelotti, is that as a club we are just a bit below his level. By that, I mean I think he may go out and spunk loads of cash on new players, but that cash will probably not be enough. Then when it doesn't go immediately to plan, there'll be noises about the board not backing him enough and rifts and he'll do one to Juve or Inter and we'll be left footing the bill.
Good point. As soon as he started doing well we'd have speculation he'd be off for every available job.
I made a point on another thread that we might be better off with a manager who is not a Billy-Big-Bollox, but someone on the up and up from the lower divisions; who would regard our job as an honour and priviledge rather than as a stepping stone.
Problem is: I felt then - and still do - that this would only work if GHou stuck around as the senior partner and mentor.
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The thing that worries me about appointing Ancelotti, is that as a club we are just a bit below his level. By that, I mean I think he may go out and spunk loads of cash on new players, but that cash will probably not be enough. Then when it doesn't go immediately to plan, there'll be noises about the board not backing him enough and rifts and he'll do one to Juve or Inter and we'll be left footing the bill.
Good point. As soon as he started doing well we'd have speculation he'd be off for every available job.
We had that with O'Neill as well though. In the end, we still don't really know why he left, but it wasn't to go to a bigger club. Or any club for that matter.
I agree with Hilts here, we need to get someone in which will show ambition and convince the people we mean business. Whether we have the money, and whether or not they would come is a different matter, obv. What I can't understand is people calling for Martinez. Wigan have been poor for the entirety of his management, and narrowly avoided relegation, again, this season. I don't think he would improve us at all.
Who else said Louis van Gaal? We can dream mate.
Dave Jones it is :P
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The thing that worries me about appointing Ancelotti, is that as a club we are just a bit below his level. By that, I mean I think he may go out and spunk loads of cash on new players, but that cash will probably not be enough. Then when it doesn't go immediately to plan, there'll be noises about the board not backing him enough and rifts and he'll do one to Juve or Inter and we'll be left footing the bill.
Good point. As soon as he started doing well we'd have speculation he'd be off for every available job.
I made a point on another thread that we might be better off with a manager who is not a Billy-Big-Bollox, but someone on the up and up from the lower divisions; who would regard our job as an honour and priviledge rather than as a stepping stone.
Problem is: I felt then - and still do - that this would only work if GHou stuck around as the senior partner and mentor.
An untried manager at Prem level? That'd just cement what a lot of people already think: AV are also-rans, content to have the occassional run in the cups and europe, but don't think big enough to truly challenge. I'm fucking sick of it. If something like that happens, then it would just confirm the above for me as well.
And I'd still fucking go down to the match as well, the ******.
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I wpuld imagine that GH had already lined up new players to come in, what happens now? i am far away from the action but most of you tend to rubbish unquoted reports from the media, why is this one being taken as gospel?
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The thing that worries me about appointing Ancelotti, is that as a club we are just a bit below his level. By that, I mean I think he may go out and spunk loads of cash on new players, but that cash will probably not be enough. Then when it doesn't go immediately to plan, there'll be noises about the board not backing him enough and rifts and he'll do one to Juve or Inter and we'll be left footing the bill.
Good point. As soon as he started doing well we'd have speculation he'd be off for every available job.
that would be reservation about him , i dont think he would be long term,and would be off to a bigger club sooner rather than later.
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Sorry to sound like a broken record, but why is Van Gaal dreaming? I mean he’s currently out of work, has stated his desire to manage in England AND crucially given the circumstances is more than happy to slum it as long as he is given the correct control i.e. AZ.
We need to make a statement here and not go once more for the safe 'Villa' option. Get him in, be patient, build a lasting youth system and then reap the benefits.
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I can not believe there has been no talk about Sanchez Flores. Out of a job and a very good young and hungry manager. He is the man to turn our Barry into Xavi!
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Sorry to sound like a broken record, but why is Van Gaal dreaming? I mean he’s currently out of work, has stated his desire to manage in England AND crucially given the circumstances is more than happy to slum it as long as he is given the correct control i.e. AZ.
We need to make a statement here and not go once more for the safe 'Villa' option. Get him in, be patient, build a lasting youth system and then reap the benefits.
I fully agree with you, I wasn't taking the piss. I posted up here a few weeks ago that'd I'd like LVG in charge, but at the same time I reckon he'd want a bigger job at this stage in his career.
Reading what you have pointed out, then who knows? I'd like to think he's the calibre of manager we're looking at though.
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The thing that worries me about appointing Ancelotti, is that as a club we are just a bit below his level. By that, I mean I think he may go out and spunk loads of cash on new players, but that cash will probably not be enough. Then when it doesn't go immediately to plan, there'll be noises about the board not backing him enough and rifts and he'll do one to Juve or Inter and we'll be left footing the bill.
Good point. As soon as he started doing well we'd have speculation he'd be off for every available job.
I made a point on another thread that we might be better off with a manager who is not a Billy-Big-Bollox, but someone on the up and up from the lower divisions; who would regard our job as an honour and priviledge rather than as a stepping stone.
Problem is: I felt then - and still do - that this would only work if GHou stuck around as the senior partner and mentor.
An untried manager at Prem level? That'd just cement what a lot of people already think: AV are also-rans, content to have the occassional run in the cups and europe, but don't think big enough to truly challenge. I'm fucking sick of it. If something like that happens, then it would just confirm the above for me as well.
And I'd still fucking go down to the match as well, the c***s.
Maybe, Stu; maybe.
I'd still be going to the games, too.
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We need the best man available. And there quite a few good men who are and a few others who could become so. If Ancelotti used us as a stepping stone for a couple of years and improved us I'd be delighted. Otherwise, let's get Dave Jones in and be done with it.
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I see the neighbours are slating us for our poor treatment of GH (in a non-obsessed fashion of course).....
http://www.that lot.com/read.php?1,542454 (http://www.that lot.com/read.php?1,542454)
.....which I find a little hypocritical as they're doing their best to hound out their most successful manager ever.
Clowns :o
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I see the neighbours are slating us for our poor treatment of GH (in a non-obsessed fashion of course).....
http://www.that lot.com/read.php?1,542454 (http://www.that lot.com/read.php?1,542454)
.....which I find a little hypocritical as they're doing their best to hound out their most successful manager ever.
Clowns :o
Christ, they are really are thick as pigshit.
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I see the neighbours are slating us for our poor treatment of GH (in a non-obsessed fashion of course).....
http://www.that lot.com/read.php?1,542454 (http://www.that lot.com/read.php?1,542454)
.....which I find a little hypocritical as they're doing their best to hound out their most successful manager ever.
Clowns :o
They can do one. Those lot over there don't like having the piss ripped out of them, evidenced in their closing of the forum for a day or two after they got relegated. The bummers.
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I see the neighbours are slating us for our poor treatment of GH (in a non-obsessed fashion of course).....
http://www.that lot.com/read.php?1,542454 (http://www.that lot.com/read.php?1,542454)
.....which I find a little hypocritical as they're doing their best to hound out their most successful manager ever.
Clowns :o
They can't even work out whether to praise us or not.
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I love the bloke on the first page who is telling everyone how good we could be. Brilliant!
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Not particularly bad by their standards I didn't think. Calling us 'Vile' though... so hurtful! They love us really.
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The training facilities at Villa were given the twice over a couple of weeks back and were unexpectedly viewed more recently by someone who raised a few eyebrows.
Roger Moore?
John Inman?
It can't be Noel Gallagher as he's only got one.
Sir Roger gets my vote. Last I heard he was heading towards B6 after flying in to Heathrow. He's currently stuck at Chiswick roundabout.
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I see the neighbours are slating us for our poor treatment of GH (in a non-obsessed fashion of course).....
http://www.that lot.com/read.php?1,542454 (http://www.that lot.com/read.php?1,542454)
.....which I find a little hypocritical as they're doing their best to hound out their most successful manager ever.
Clowns :o
As far as I could see on that thread, only one person criticised the fans for putting too much pressure on him? have I missed something.
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The training facilities at Villa were given the twice over a couple of weeks back and were unexpectedly viewed more recently by someone who raised a few eyebrows.
Roger Moore?
John Inman?
It can't be Noel Gallagher as he's only got one.
Sir Roger gets my vote. Last I heard he was heading towards B6 after flying in to Heathrow. He's currently stuck at Chiswick roundabout.
"Hello, Alan"
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The thing that worries me about appointing Ancelotti, is that as a club we are just a bit below his level. By that, I mean I think he may go out and spunk loads of cash on new players, but that cash will probably not be enough. Then when it doesn't go immediately to plan, there'll be noises about the board not backing him enough and rifts and he'll do one to Juve or Inter and we'll be left footing the bill.
Good point. As soon as he started doing well we'd have speculation he'd be off for every available job.
My point was more that he'll want and will most likely be given, a lot of cash to spend on players and their wages; but if/when it doesn't work out - because whatever money we do have available will not be enough to compete with the top 4 or 5 clubs for more than a season - he's sufficiently high profile to be able to fvck us off pretty easily and go back to one of the big italian clubs.
In short, I just don't think we've got the money to have a proper go over a couple of seasons and we should be going down the steadily building road. I'd question whether the likes of Ancelotti would fit that model. Whereas someone with a reputation still to make for themselves might be better suited to that role and less of a gamble financially.
Ultimately i suppose over the next few years, the money a manager is allowed to spend will be a reflection on the size of a clubs turnover with the new UEFA rules coming in, so that could well have a bearing on who we'll be able to attract and who they appoint.
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I like how they get all confused between themselves as to who finished 5th and 6th out of us and Everton. Mind you, I don't suppose they pay much attention to the top of the league table. Bit like me and the top of League 1 say.
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Carlo Ancellotti-Wilkins please. That combination really excite me and i am sure everyone is concerned about Gerrards health but relieved for our club and his family that the right decision has been made ........
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I'm really not sure about Carlo. Managed Chelsea and Milan, two massive clubs already set up for success, and was able to pretty much walk into both clubs from day one with them in very strong positions. With all due respect to us, there's a lot more building to be done before we're genuine challengers again and I'm not sure Ancelotti's set up for that. It's not a challenge he's not faced before. He might be great at it, but then again... I have my doubts.
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Although I mentioned Hughes above as a genuine candidate he would be my least preferred choice. I do have a feeling it will be him however as his contract expires tomorrow with Fulham - no compensation needed when enough will have already been paid out.
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My choice would be Hughes or Ancelloti.
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If hughes came in and got warnock and ireland playing their best that alo ne would save the club several million and solve 2 of our position problems , not sure dunne would approve after hughes sold him at city - hughes not in my top 3 choices but i do see him as a solid choice and i think he would jump at it.
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Although I mentioned Hughes above as a genuine candidate he would be my least preferred choice. I do have a feeling it will be him however as his contract expires tomorrow with Fulham - no compensation needed when enough will have already been paid out.
No wonder Hughes is the favourite.
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We've got a new manager thread - can we keep to it please?
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Decision is in best interest of both club & Gerard Houllier -
As for who to bring in ............Moyes for me but can't imagine Randy messing with
Everton to get him so we will probably get a manager not under contract which could
mean Ancelloti who has a point to prove ?
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seems that hughes and all his coaching staff could walk away tomorrow for free as they have a clause they can activate-very interesting.
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oops sorry Dave -
ps happy retirement Gerard
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Moyes to Spurs after Chelsea nick Harry. Hughes to us. Wrist slapped accordingly.
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We've got a new manager thread - can we keep to it please?
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Good luck to Gerard Houllier, I liked him. I liked his personality and I liked what he tried to achieve here in extremely hard circumstances. It did not work out and we will never see if his long term plans would have been successful. He made errors, don't we all? Especially when new to a job.
All the best to him and his family.
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We've got a new manager thread - can we keep to it please?
could we not have the manager threads merged?
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I do hope that whoever takes over continues the groundwork that Houllier has begun - of course that will be more likely if GH stays on in some capacity.
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Good luck to Gerard Houllier, I liked him. I liked his personality and I liked what he tried to achieve here in extremely hard circumstances. It did not work out and we will never see if his long term plans would have been successful. He made errors, don't we all? Especially when new to a job.
All the best to him and his family.
100% agree with this.
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I do hope that whoever takes over continues the groundwork that Houllier has begun - of course that will be more likely if GH stays on in some capacity.
And I hope that whoever takes over speaks English as well as he does. I've never heard better grammar from a Villa manager.
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Would like to reiterate the points of others wishing Gerard all the best.
Good health and a happy retirement.
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Good luck to Gerard Houllier, I liked him. I liked his personality and I liked what he tried to achieve here in extremely hard circumstances. It did not work out and we will never see if his long term plans would have been successful. He made errors, don't we all? Especially when new to a job.
All the best to him and his family.
100% agree with this.
Yep, and me.
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Good health to Gerard and all the best to him and his family.
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Good luck to Gerard Houllier, I liked him. I liked his personality and I liked what he tried to achieve here in extremely hard circumstances. It did not work out and we will never see if his long term plans would have been successful. He made errors, don't we all? Especially when new to a job.
All the best to him and his family.
100% agree with this.
Yep, and me.
Me and all...
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assuming ged does leave , not expecting any transfers in until after players return for pre season traing as new mananger will want to see what players he has available
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I do hope that whoever takes over continues the groundwork that Houllier has begun - of course that will be more likely if GH stays on in some capacity.
No I don't want to turn this into a Gezza bashing thread, but what good work has he done? OK, results may have been better without the injuries, but he's been in charge for a very poor season performance wise and his new methods have either not taken effect yet or have and have failed. His transfer dealings were the only real plus I can see.
Still, what's past is past and let's hopr the guy has a long and happy retirement.
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I think that other than the signing of Bent, the reign of Houllier has been an unmitigated disaster. Rubbish football, rubbish PR, rubbish results, rubbish defending and all sorts of baffling player decisions. Again other than Bent, (and possibley Walker) I think all of his transfers have been crap as well.
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I think that other than the signing of Bent, the reign of Houllier has been an unmitigated disaster. Rubbish football, rubbish PR, rubbish results, rubbish defending and all sorts of baffling player decisions. Again other than Bent, (and possibley Walker) I think all of his transfers have been crap as well.
Except Robert (Kinsella) Pires.
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So apart from
getting rid of high earners Carew and co and cut wages bill.
upsetting Villa fans for Liverpool Away, and FA Cup selection against Man City
Bring in two coaching staff and a chief scout (Who left after couple of months) and promote Sid.
Signing two good players Bent and Jean Makoun permanetly and Bradley and Walker on loans
Carry on developing young players
Is there anything we don't know about ie changes in training ground, methods, recruitment, etc.
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RIP
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I see the neighbours are slating us for our poor treatment of GH (in a non-obsessed fashion of course).....
http://www.that lot.com/read.php?1,542454 (http://www.that lot.com/read.php?1,542454)
.....which I find a little hypocritical as they're doing their best to hound out their most successful manager ever.
Clowns :o
To be fair, there is nothing on there that has not already been said on these boards. Some reasonably well balanced comments. Must be one of the more erudite blues boards. Erudite blues board-is that an oxymoron.
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I see the neighbours are slating us for our poor treatment of GH (in a non-obsessed fashion of course).....
http://www.that lot.com/read.php?1,542454 (http://www.that lot.com/read.php?1,542454)
.....which I find a little hypocritical as they're doing their best to hound out their most successful manager ever.
Clowns :o
Christ, they are really are thick as pigshit.
Some of the comments they make would not look out of place on a forum from a psychiatric institution. I have realised i dont hate them anymore. They are just mentally ill ......
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It's for the best all round. Better for his health and better for the club. He had lost a lot of the fans (mainly due to the fact that a fair number were against him from the start) and a couple of bad results next season would have stirred it up again. Now we have sorted it out early we can appoint a new manager quickly and we have more options than last September. Also the new manager has a wage bill cleared of Shorey, Davies, Sidwell, Reo-coker and Carew and a number of decent youngsters who gained important experience last season.
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Part of me wonders what might have been if he had stayed (with full health etc) but I think the right decision was made in the end. Now we need someone who will stick around and build something special.
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So apart from
getting rid of high earners Carew and co and cut wages bill.
upsetting Villa fans for Liverpool Away, and FA Cup selection against Man City
Bring in two coaching staff and a chief scout (Who left after couple of months) and promote Sid.
Signing two good players Bent and Jean Makoun permanetly and Bradley and Walker on loans
Carry on developing young players
Is there anything we don't know about ie changes in training ground, methods, recruitment, etc.
getting rid of high earners Carew and co and cut wages bill.
This was as much to do with their contracts running down as anything.
upsetting Villa fans for Liverpool Away, and FA Cup selection against Man City
Sorry, is this supposed to be a good thing?
Bring in two coaching staff and a chief scout (Who left after couple of months) and promote Sid.
Again, that was necessary as Martin's staff also left with him. And can these apointments be classed as successes given the results?
Signing two good players Bent and Jean Makoun permanetly and Bradley and Walker on loans
Bent and Walker I give you, but with Makoun jury still out (why not play him at the end of thr season?) and Bradley has basically failed.
Carry on developing young players
A good thing, but was this choice or forced by injuries?
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Have i missed something? Has anything official been announced yet or is literally just a matter of time?
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Now we need someone who will stick around and build something special.
This is the main point for me, as hinted a bit earlier by someone, Ancelotti would maybe go back to Italy if a big club came in for him.
As much as we all have our own opinions on who should be boss, i would'nt like to be in Randy's shoes, it's a hell of a decision to make. As much as i like the idea of Ancelotti or Jol, i'm still undecided really.
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Makoun jury still out (why not play him at the end of thr season?)
To be fair he was injured and then on leave following his wife and child being in an accident.
Though I agree the jury is still very much out.
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On a slight tangent I presume the club will also have to pay McAllister off. Unless of course they're planning on keeping him (or worse still appointing him as new manager).
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Aston Villa boss Houllier faces final test over potential £5m pay-off
Daily Mail 22:12 Mon, 30 May 2011
Looking ominous ?
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Makoun jury still out (why not play him at the end of thr season?)
To be fair he was injured and then on leave following his wife and child being in an accident.
Though I agree the jury is still very much out.
Forgot about the family issue. Agree that doesn't mean the jury has delivered it's verdict, but wouldn't have brought it up if I had remembered that.
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Makoun jury still out (why not play him at the end of thr season?)
To be fair he was injured and then on leave following his wife and child being in an accident.
Though I agree the jury is still very much out.
Forgot about the family issue. Agree that doesn't mean the jury has delivered it's verdict, but wouldn't have brought it up if I had remembered that.
Good post John M. Respect ......
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Assuming GH is going, I wish him well. For all that he pissed me off, Man C in the cup, his comments at Wankfield, how I felt when I left VP after the Dingles game and was convinced we were going down, I couldn't help but like him.
I'd have liked to see what he could do given more time and shaping the squad into what he wanted, player wise and playing style wise. At the same time I won't be devastated if he isn't manager next season.
But it depends who we get to replace him.
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Come on then Malcolm, back up your blatant bullshit and nonsense with some form of explanation. Go on, dare you, give it a go for once in your life.
What bullshit ?
Simply I don't think the management are dealing with the media well. I don't think they handled the Mon departure well, the subsequent PR re the new choice of manager well, the subsequent visit to hospital of Houllier was better, but I'd have thought it obvious Houllier returning as was was impossible, so something should have been done and earlier.
I don't think the way the story has broke, no it hasn't yes it has, no it hasn't is, satisfactory and should have been handled better.
My apologies to all if this view is not the required one on here at the moment, as Norm Crandles found over his view on selling Young, as I found with my views on Mon, and in earlier times, Graham Taylor as manager, in time the required opinion often changes.
Whatever happens, whenever it happens, may I wish Houllier all the best in whatever choice he ultimately chooses, and that Randy makes a great choice. If of course Houllier does leave, sometime in the near future as many in the media seem confident he will, even if our PR seems to think he may not for a while.
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the thing is we have had a load of managers who have started of quite well, BFR, John Gregory, Brian Little etc even MON had a long honeymoon period,
then it all goes wobley given a bit of time.
and we start all over again
i'd rather have someone who works hard and even struggles a bit to get it right because anything where you have to go through a bit of pain is normaly longer lasting than that which comes to easy
now if your going to come in and completly change the way the team plays football, like Houllier did, then its going to take a rebuild, and a bit of time,
i think just looking at the 'horendous' season and not seeing what houllier was begining to build, ie a passing side of players more comfortable on the ball, witha more fluid style of play [ i know it wasnt always on display] is a bit short sighted
we'l never know how it would have turned out now, but i hope we can get someone in to carry it on,
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the thing is we have had a load of managers who have started of quite well, BFR, John Gregory, Brian Little etc even MON had a long honeymoon period,
then it all goes wobley given a bit of time.
and we start all over again
i'd rather have someone who works hard and even struggles a bit to get it right because anything where you have to go through a bit of pain is normaly longer lasting than that which comes to easy
now if your going to come in and completly change the way the team plays football, like Houllier did, then its going to take a rebuild, and a bit of time,
i think just looking at the 'horendous' season and not seeing what houllier was begining to build, ie a passing side of players more comfortable on the ball, witha more fluid style of play [ i know it wasnt always on display] is a bit short sighted
we'l never know how it would have turned out now, but i hope we can get someone in to carry it on,
Agree totally. The one of the biggest complaints about MON was that the football was boring to watch and ineffective against teams who came looking for a point. To change that, with half a season of not even being able to bring your own players in, isn't a quick fix. Houllier took on the challenge and at times there were clear signs that things were better. I think he would have pushed that further in the summer and we'd have seen a fitter side with much better movement off the ball as a result. As a fan who doesn't go to many games maybe it's easier to not be caught up in the emotion of days like the defeat to the dingles.
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I think that other than the signing of Bent, the reign of Houllier has been an unmitigated disaster. Rubbish football, rubbish PR, rubbish results, rubbish defending and all sorts of baffling player decisions. Again other than Bent, (and possibley Walker) I think all of his transfers have been crap as well.
have you cut and pasted this post,
because its very similar to the ones you've posted about the last 3 managers at least,
and i would gurantee that come 6 months time you'l be saying exactly the same thing no matter who we get as manager, and its not going according to your plan
you had money on Villa going down under Houillier, which i'm glad to say you lost,
but just goes to show how totaly misguided you were about what you were seeing as we finished 9th in the table that 'doesnt lie'as we kept being told by you and the rest of the doomongerers
you were all completely wrong on that one, so you might well think it was a total rubbish season, but there were some good reasons for that,
but short sighted quitters like yourself will never see it
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Houllier took on the challenge and at times there were clear signs that things were better.
My problem with that was for everything you could point to and say that was better, there was two or three things you could say were worse.
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Quitters never win and winners never quit.
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Would like to reiterate the points of others wishing Gerard all the best.
Good health and a happy retirement.
Same.
Can never honestly say I warmed to him, but I respected his past record. And by all accounts, he put in a lot of hours with us on a daily basis -which may or may not have contributed to the recurrence of his illness.
I must say I never seen these examples of the improvement in our style of play though. We looked laboured when we had the likes of NRC trying to stroke it about and play possession football and our best form -both at the beginning and at the end of the season- coincided with the time when we utilised our strengths.
That said, with the benefit of a pre season he might have been in a position to acquire players better suited to his plan. We might have tapped the free/ cheap market and found some gems, particularly with his knowledge of French football. He might have also addressed the most obvious concern (the backline). That alone would have gone some way to making us a better side. We'll never know.
My other concern is that Darren Bent was his signing and if he did nothing else (apart from signing him obv) he played him in a way that got the best out of him. You accept with Bent that he isn't necessarily going to play a huge part in the overall pattern of team play. His hold up play and close control (although improved) are probably average at best. He's there to finish, pure and simple.
A new manager might expect more from a forward (more than goals! What more is there?) and Bent seems to be a confidence player. Even if he's regularly starting, if he doesn't feel the manager has complete faith in him (see 'arry at Tottingham) it can affect his game.
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Come on then Malcolm, back up your blatant bullshit and nonsense with some form of explanation. Go on, dare you, give it a go for once in your life.
What bullshit ?
Simply I don't think the management are dealing with the media well. I don't think they handled the Mon departure well, the subsequent PR re the new choice of manager well, the subsequent visit to hospital of Houllier was better, but I'd have thought it obvious Houllier returning as was was impossible, so something should have been done and earlier.
I don't think the way the story has broke, no it hasn't yes it has, no it hasn't is, satisfactory and should have been handled better.
My apologies to all if this view is not the required one on here at the moment
I appreciate you are on some puerile wind-up pretty much all the time and of course anybody who happens to hold views that differ to some of your bonkers theories is some sort of playground bully in your strange world but whilst i'm no apologist for the board I really can't see how they could have handled the situation with O'Neill or Houllier any differently. From what little I know (and I suspect the press and even you) about the current situation the club are taking their time to assess the situation and do what is best for both parties.
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Come on then Malcolm, back up your blatant bullshit and nonsense with some form of explanation. Go on, dare you, give it a go for once in your life.
What bullshit ?
Simply I don't think the management are dealing with the media well. I don't think they handled the Mon departure well, the subsequent PR re the new choice of manager well, the subsequent visit to hospital of Houllier was better, but I'd have thought it obvious Houllier returning as was was impossible, so something should have been done and earlier.
I don't think the way the story has broke, no it hasn't yes it has, no it hasn't is, satisfactory and should have been handled better.
My apologies to all if this view is not the required one on here at the moment
I appreciate you are on some puerile wind-up pretty much all the time and of course anybody who happens to hold views that differ to some of your bonkers theories is some sort of playground bully in your strange world but whilst i'm no apologist for the board I really can't see how they could have handled the situation with O'Neill or Houllier any differently. From what little I know (and I suspect the press and even you) about the current situation the club are taking their time to assess the situation and do what is best for both parties.
Here bloody here. There are many things that the board have been accused of over the last 12 months, but on this they have handled themselves very well and with the best interest of the club and Gez at heart.
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I have no issue with Gerard - i think he has had to sort a hell of a lot of mess that was left for him. It didn't go right, but maybe it wasn't his fault, and I think if it wasn't for his health he would have got it right.
However, we just can't take the chance of this happening again, especially with the large squad overhaul that will take place - this needs someone who will definately be around for at least 4 or 5 years.
So Gerard goes with my best wishes, will certainly earn a clap from me if he attends, and with no malice.
I also thank him for Darren Bent !!!
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He did some good things and some bad things , I liked the style of pass and move football and given a pre season may have made more progress- good luck GED and enjoy your retirement with your family.
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Wonder where this leaves Makoun ?
I mean, lets face it, whoever comes in will want Bent, but Makoun ?
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Makoun has plenty of talent and will be a good player for us.
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I'm probably one of of a few who's a little sad to see Houllier go.
Yes, he didn't do as well as we expected, but he had to deal with many circumstances when he initially became manager.
Ever since the signing of Bent we've done really well bar 3 or 4 results.
Would of liked to see what Houllier could of done next season, but his health is the most important thing. Life goes on.
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Gone by Wednesday, says BBC 5 Live's Pat Murphy.
Not exactly earth-shattering, and Murphy is trying to sound like he was on top of this story all along, when we all know who broke the news first.
On vous salue, Monsieur Houllier. C'est pas trop tard de passer une longue vie active!
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I'm probably one of of a few who's a little sad to see Houllier go.
Yes, he didn't do as well as we expected, but he had to deal with many circumstances when he initially became manager.
Ever since the signing of Bent we've done really well bar 3 or 4 results.
Would of liked to see what Houllier could of done next season, but his health is the most important thing. Life goes on.
Ditto to that,didn't help himself at times,but took over in bad circumstances,with a squad stuck in the ways of the old regime.
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Will the french fitness coach leave or stay ?
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I think that other than the signing of Bent, the reign of Houllier has been an unmitigated disaster. Rubbish football, rubbish PR, rubbish results, rubbish defending and all sorts of baffling player decisions. Again other than Bent, (and possibley Walker) I think all of his transfers have been crap as well.
Unmitigated disaster? I'd like to know what your definition of that is, because for me, that sort of terminology should only be used for relegation, not an admittedly average season.
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Ger, come on kid, I actually like Gerard - but this season WAS a disaster.
We were two weeks from going out the league - with three games to go, we were one point out of the bottom three (and as it turned out, Wigan won their last two, so did Blackburn, and Wolves won one, and Blues and Blackpool both picked up points.
Therefore, it was the totally unexpected wins against Arsenal and Liverpool that kept us up - and as Gerard was in hospital at the time, I don't think even his greatest fan can say he helped to acheive those two results.
So, whatever the reasons, who-ever was at fault, there is no doubting, this season was a total disaster, and we are very lucky to get away with it !
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The wins against Arsenal and Liverpool didn't keep us up. We were on 42 points. Birmingham were relegated on 39 points
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How were we 2 weeks from being relegated?
42 points was always going to be enough. Even if we lost the last 2 games we weren't ever going down.
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Again, for me a disaster would be relegation. We weren't relegated so it wasn't a disaster. Does that mean that I think it was a good season? No.
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I thought beating good opposition is something to cheer about, not ignore because it's "unexpected" and as one of them was thanks to two goals by a player he signed, yes they were in part down to him.
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going into the last 4 games of the season we were one place and one point out of the bottom three.
Now, in the last 4 games, we managed to get clear. However, gerard Houllier was not at the club at this time.
So, no matter which way you look at it - with 4 games to go, we were very close to going down.
Put it this way - we were on 42 - Blues were 39 , Blues had a better goal difference.
If we had lost to either Liverpool or Arsenal - we were relegated.
9th - or 17th - that is how close it was !!! , and those who think otherwise are totally sticking their head in the sand.
EDIT as I forgot to actually put the point !
Basically it was an unexpected result against Arsenal that saved us - and as Gerard was not here , you can't give him credit for it. therefore his time at the club , no matter how you look at it, was a disaster ! (and we will never know - I bloody hate McAllister, but maybe it was him that saved us, who is to say if GH was there the day we went to emirates, we wouldn't have put the performance on that we did !
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houllier will not be leaving by mutal consent, because if that was the case then why did he try to provr himslf fit having having all these medical tests,
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going into the last 4 games of the season we were one place and one point out of the bottom three.
Now, in the last 4 games, we managed to get clear. However, gerard Houllier was not at the club at this time.
So, no matter which way you look at it - with 4 games to go, we were very close to going down.
Put it this way - we were on 42 - Blues were 39 , Blues had a better goal difference.
If we had lost to either Liverpool or Arsenal - we were relegated.
9th - or 17th - that is how close it was !!! , and those who think otherwise are totally sticking their head in the sand.
No, just no. We were never going down on 42 points.
We put the icing on the cake by beating Arsenal and Liverpool.
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Was it a good season on paper - no
Was it an acceptable season given the previous manager left days before the first game and took his entire staff with him, we had the worst injury crisis in years and just when things were going well had the manager admitted to hospital - probably
We weren't 2 weeks away from going down, that 2was crap at the time and it's even more crap now - We were 2 weeks away from going down IF the 4 of the 6 worst teams in the league suddenly decided to win their last 2 games whilst we got beaten heavily in both of ours. Even the most negative of fans must've realised it was going to take a completely unrealistic run of results for us to be in danger, that was the reality as soon as gabby scored against west ham.
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going into the last 4 games of the season we were one place and one point out of the bottom three.
Now, in the last 4 games, we managed to get clear. However, gerard Houllier was not at the club at this time.
So, no matter which way you look at it - with 4 games to go, we were very close to going down.
Put it this way - we were on 42 - Blues were 39 , Blues had a better goal difference.
If we had lost to either Liverpool or Arsenal - we were relegated.
9th - or 17th - that is how close it was !!! , and those who think otherwise are totally sticking their head in the sand.
EDIT as I forgot to actually put the point !
Basically it was an unexpected result against Arsenal that saved us - and as Gerard was not here , you can't give him credit for it. therefore his time at the club , no matter how you look at it, was a disaster ! (and we will never know - I bloody hate McAllister, but maybe it was him that saved us, who is to say if GH was there the day we went to emirates, we wouldn't have put the performance on that we did !
amazing,
if we had lost more games we would have gone down
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You dont get it do you ?
We finished on 42 points because we BEAT Liverpool and Arsenal - without those two wins we were on 36 points - even beating Liverpool and losing to Arsenal - which was expected, would have got us relegated !
Those two results kept us up !
And GH was nowhere to be seen in Birmingham at the time we got those results was he - the fact was when GH had his attack, we were in SERIOUS danger of being relegated.
GMAC for all I hate him, managed to get 7 points out of 12 in the last 4 games to see us safe - but that was not down to GH - who is to say we would have acheived these if GH was still in charge.
Listen - I like Gerard, I said many times, I think he would have got it right.
But if you think this season was anything other than an unmitigating disaster - you are sticking your blinking head in the sand !!!!
36 points with Arsenal away and Liverpool at home coming up - would you have bet your house we would have stayed up - WELL THEN !!
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going into the last 4 games of the season we were one place and one point out of the bottom three.
Now, in the last 4 games, we managed to get clear. However, gerard Houllier was not at the club at this time.
So, no matter which way you look at it - with 4 games to go, we were very close to going down.
Put it this way - we were on 42 - Blues were 39 , Blues had a better goal difference.
If we had lost to either Liverpool or Arsenal - we were relegated.
9th - or 17th - that is how close it was !!! , and those who think otherwise are totally sticking their head in the sand.
EDIT as I forgot to actually put the point !
Basically it was an unexpected result against Arsenal that saved us - and as Gerard was not here , you can't give him credit for it. therefore his time at the club , no matter how you look at it, was a disaster ! (and we will never know - I bloody hate McAllister, but maybe it was him that saved us, who is to say if GH was there the day we went to emirates, we wouldn't have put the performance on that we did !
No, if we lost the last two games we would have finished in 16th.
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You dont get it do you ?
We finished on 42 points because we BEAT Liverpool and Arsenal - without those two wins we were on 36 points - even beating Liverpool and losing to Arsenal - which was expected, would have got us relegated !
Those two results kept us up !
And GH was nowhere to be seen in Birmingham at the time we got those results was he - the fact was when GH had his attack, we were in SERIOUS danger of being relegated.
GMAC for all I hate him, managed to get 7 points out of 12 in the last 4 games to see us safe - but that was not down to GH - who is to say we would have acheived these if GH was still in charge.
Listen - I like Gerard, I said many times, I think he would have got it right.
But if you think this season was anything other than an unmitigating disaster - you are sticking your blinking head in the sand !!!!
36 points with Arsenal away and Liverpool at home coming up - would you have bet your house we would have stayed up - WELL THEN !!
We finished on 48 points. It'll sink in soon enough.
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You dont get it do you ?
We finished on 42 points because we BEAT Liverpool and Arsenal - without those two wins we were on 36 points - even beating Liverpool and losing to Arsenal - which was expected, would have got us relegated !
Those two results kept us up !
And GH was nowhere to be seen in Birmingham at the time we got those results was he - the fact was when GH had his attack, we were in SERIOUS danger of being relegated.
GMAC for all I hate him, managed to get 7 points out of 12 in the last 4 games to see us safe - but that was not down to GH - who is to say we would have acheived these if GH was still in charge.
Listen - I like Gerard, I said many times, I think he would have got it right.
But if you think this season was anything other than an unmitigating disaster - you are sticking your blinking head in the sand !!!!
36 points with Arsenal away and Liverpool at home coming up - would you have bet your house we would have stayed up - WELL THEN !!
You dont get it do you ?
We finished on 42 points because we BEAT Liverpool and Arsenal - without those two wins we were on 36 points - even beating Liverpool and losing to Arsenal - which was expected, would have got us relegated !
Those two results kept us up !
And GH was nowhere to be seen in Birmingham at the time we got those results was he - the fact was when GH had his attack, we were in SERIOUS danger of being relegated.
GMAC for all I hate him, managed to get 7 points out of 12 in the last 4 games to see us safe - but that was not down to GH - who is to say we would have acheived these if GH was still in charge.
Listen - I like Gerard, I said many times, I think he would have got it right.
But if you think this season was anything other than an unmitigating disaster - you are sticking your blinking head in the sand !!!!
36 points with Arsenal away and Liverpool at home coming up - would you have bet your house we would have stayed up - WELL THEN !!
what are you on about, we finished on 48 points,
FORTY EIGHT POINTS
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The last two results don't count because they were 'unexpected'.
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Perhaps he could stay and give English lessons to some of our players?
The pronunciation! The Wortschatz! Aah!
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You dont get it do you ?
We finished on 42 points because we BEAT Liverpool and Arsenal - without those two wins we were on 36 points - even beating Liverpool and losing to Arsenal - which was expected, would have got us relegated !
Those two results kept us up !
And GH was nowhere to be seen in Birmingham at the time we got those results was he - the fact was when GH had his attack, we were in SERIOUS danger of being relegated.
GMAC for all I hate him, managed to get 7 points out of 12 in the last 4 games to see us safe - but that was not down to GH - who is to say we would have acheived these if GH was still in charge.
Listen - I like Gerard, I said many times, I think he would have got it right.
But if you think this season was anything other than an unmitigating disaster - you are sticking your blinking head in the sand !!!!
36 points with Arsenal away and Liverpool at home coming up - would you have bet your house we would have stayed up - WELL THEN !!
^^^^^
Likes +1
or something similar.
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48, surely?
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The last two results don't count because they were 'unexpected'.
In fact so unexpected, they should be deducted twice.
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houllier will not be leaving by mutal consent, because if that was the case then why did he try to provr himslf fit having having all these medical tests,
They are saying Houllier is being asked to leave in the interests of the club not in the interests of Gerard Houllier, the only delay until Wednesday is the fact they have to work out an agreeable severance payment as he as 2 years left on his contract.
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That's just plain Ralph Wiggum stupid.
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Apologies, I meant 42 points before Ars and Liverpool not 36
Anyway, the point is the same, no matter what the points / teams etc...
The fact was with two games to go, we could have gone down - for a team that less than 12 months ago had gone to Wembley twice, and finished 6th and was a whisker from getting Champions League. For a team that started to fight each other, for a team whose players started to slag off the club, for a team who had to banish players to train with the youth side, for a team who had the worst injury crisis in years (but the players actual said before the crisis occurred that they did not feel the new regime was working) ,
Shall I carry on ?
The season was a total disaster.
Luckily, and you have to give him credit, McAllister rallied the team enough to see us safe, but no matter how you look at it - it was a disaster !
I haven't got the figures to hand, but I wouldn't mind betting we earned more points per game with both KMac and GMac in charge than GH
So please don't tell me GH's tenure was nothing but a disaster- because it was !
Now, if he had stayed, he could have turned it around, remember, GT's first year in Div 1 ended with us staying up on the last day, we went on to finish runners up the next year - GH may have done the same - but he will not now, and we will never know, so he goes down in history as being as bad as an appointment as Dr Jo, Graham Turner and Co !
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Apologies, I meant 42 points before Ars and Liverpool not 36
Anyway, the point is the same, no matter what the points / teams etc...
Wrong both ways?
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You dont get it do you ?
We finished on 42 points because we BEAT Liverpool and Arsenal - without those two wins we were on 36 points - even beating Liverpool and losing to Arsenal - which was expected, would have got us relegated !
Those two results kept us up !
And GH was nowhere to be seen in Birmingham at the time we got those results was he - the fact was when GH had his attack, we were in SERIOUS danger of being relegated.
GMAC for all I hate him, managed to get 7 points out of 12 in the last 4 games to see us safe - but that was not down to GH - who is to say we would have acheived these if GH was still in charge.
Listen - I like Gerard, I said many times, I think he would have got it right.
But if you think this season was anything other than an unmitigating disaster - you are sticking your blinking head in the sand !!!!
36 points with Arsenal away and Liverpool at home coming up - would you have bet your house we would have stayed up - WELL THEN !!
Look at the table - http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/eng_prem/table/default.stm (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/eng_prem/table/default.stm), read the column on the right hand side, then spot the obvious flaw in your argument.
Hindsight show we were already safe before getting 7 points from the last 4 games. They just gave us a cushion and added a few £m to the bank balance.
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Oh for fuck sake, WE WOULDN'T HAVE GONE DOWN ON 42. And it wasn't a disaster. And I think I'll take my opinion on it rather than someone who appears to be unable to add and subtract.
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We had enough points to stay up after the win at West Ham. It was only over excitable types on here who were panicking over the last few weeks.
We did it because we lost only 1 of our last 8 games not because of "unexpected results".
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Interesting theory. Are we to assume MON had nothing to do with results over his four years at Villa Park as he was never at Bodymoor Heath?
Come back Robertson and Walford, all is forgiven!
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honestly i'm laughing my head of at this,
its brilliant
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You dont get it do you ?
We finished on 42 points because we BEAT Liverpool and Arsenal - without those two wins we were on 36 points - even beating Liverpool and losing to Arsenal - which was expected, would have got us relegated !
Those two results kept us up !
And GH was nowhere to be seen in Birmingham at the time we got those results was he - the fact was when GH had his attack, we were in SERIOUS danger of being relegated.
GMAC for all I hate him, managed to get 7 points out of 12 in the last 4 games to see us safe - but that was not down to GH - who is to say we would have acheived these if GH was still in charge.
Listen - I like Gerard, I said many times, I think he would have got it right.
But if you think this season was anything other than an unmitigating disaster - you are sticking your blinking head in the sand !!!!
36 points with Arsenal away and Liverpool at home coming up - would you have bet your house we would have stayed up - WELL THEN !!
What?
So you're assuming Houllier would have got the same results against Stoke, Wigan and West Brom as McAllister? lol strong argument.
Only getting 2 points out of a possible 9 against the mentioned teams still would have seen us safe on 42 points.
We couldn't of been relegated on 42 points either way, the wins against Arsenal and Liverpool just meant finishing in the top half of the table.
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Good luck to Gerard Houllier, I liked him. I liked his personality and I liked what he tried to achieve here in extremely hard circumstances. It did not work out and we will never see if his long term plans would have been successful. He made errors, don't we all? Especially when new to a job.
All the best to him and his family.
100% agree with this.
Yep, and me.
Me and all...
and me!
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Good luck to Gerard Houllier, I liked him. I liked his personality and I liked what he tried to achieve here in extremely hard circumstances. It did not work out and we will never see if his long term plans would have been successful. He made errors, don't we all? Especially when new to a job.
All the best to him and his family.
100% agree with this.
Yep, and me.
Me and all...
and me!
Me too.
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Apologies, I meant 42 points before Ars and Liverpool not 36
Anyway, the point is the same, no matter what the points / teams etc...
The fact was with two games to go, we could have gone down - for a team that less than 12 months ago had gone to Wembley twice, and finished 6th and was a whisker from getting Champions League. For a team that started to fight each other, for a team whose players started to slag off the club, for a team who had to banish players to train with the youth side, for a team who had the worst injury crisis in years (but the players actual said before the crisis occurred that they did not feel the new regime was working) ,
Shall I carry on ?
The season was a total disaster.
Luckily, and you have to give him credit, McAllister rallied the team enough to see us safe, but no matter how you look at it - it was a disaster !
I haven't got the figures to hand, but I wouldn't mind betting we earned more points per game with both KMac and GMac in charge than GH
So please don't tell me GH's tenure was nothing but a disaster- because it was !
Now, if he had stayed, he could have turned it around, remember, GT's first year in Div 1 ended with us staying up on the last day, we went on to finish runners up the next year - GH may have done the same - but he will not now, and we will never know, so he goes down in history as being as bad as an appointment as Dr Jo, Graham Turner and Co !
Correct, We have endured absolute thrashings at the hands of some of the Premierships more average sides, with have had members of the squad outed in front of the press on anything to do with personal lives to weight problems to bulking up problems to players being played out of position perpetually, players being isolated and frozen out of the squad.
By a strange quirk of how this seasons Premiership has worked out 2 results got us into the top half from previously being relegation fodder just the week before.
Its been a crap season.
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Good luck to Gerard Houllier, I liked him. I liked his personality and I liked what he tried to achieve here in extremely hard circumstances. It did not work out and we will never see if his long term plans would have been successful. He made errors, don't we all? Especially when new to a job.
All the best to him and his family.
100% agree with this.
Yep, and me.
Me and all...
and me!
Me too.
Yup, add me to the list
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Although with Hindsight 9 th was better than I could have hoped for a few months ago it's the increasing fear and dread I was feeling with 4 or 5 games to go. I really did fear being relegated and every time I think about maybe Houllier was slowly taking us in the direction we should be, that feeling comes back to me.
We should never have been in that position with the squad we have, and for that I am Glad he is going. I wish him a happy retirement and wouldn't even mind him being employed in some role as Dr Jo was when he left.
The board hopefully have learnt that they cannot afford to delayand we get new man in soon
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Dave
Sorry mate you are having a laugh.
On around May 1st (I haven't got the figures to hand) - we were out of the bottom three by 1 POINT , 1 POINT !!!!
i cvan't remember the game GH took over, or left - I think GMac's first game was Wolves if I recall (the game after we threw it away to Bolton)
We got 15 of our 48 points in this time
If I remember I think he took over after the Wolves game (even though he had already been appointed) - if thats correct we were on 10 points
That means he got 23 points whilst in charge of the Villa in 23 games
If you tell me that isnt a disaster tell me what is !!
Lets face it - I cant stand the bloke, but we have GMac to thank for us being in the PL next year !
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Dave
Sorry mate you are having a laugh.
I think we're all having a good laugh.
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Dave
Sorry mate you are having a laugh.
On around May 1st (I haven't got the figures to hand) - we were out of the bottom three by 1 POINT , 1 POINT !!!!
i cvan't remember the game GH took over, or left - I think GMac's first game was Wolves if I recall (the game after we threw it away to Bolton)
We got 15 of our 48 points in this time
If I remember I think he took over after the Wolves game (even though he had already been appointed) - if thats correct we were on 10 points
That means he got 23 points whilst in charge of the Villa in 23 games
If you tell me that isnt a disaster tell me what is !!
Lets face it - I cant stand the bloke, but we have GMac to thank for us being in the PL next year !
On May 1st we had 41 points. So would have been safe. On 20th April we were on 40 points with 5 games to play, and were 7 points outside the relegation zone (and actually safe by then). So by the time that Houllier was out ill, we were safe. Meaning your whole argument is, well, bollocks.
But carry on, I'm enjoying this.
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Dave
Sorry mate you are having a laugh.
On around May 1st (I haven't got the figures to hand) - we were out of the bottom three by 1 POINT , 1 POINT !!!!
i cvan't remember the game GH took over, or left - I think GMac's first game was Wolves if I recall (the game after we threw it away to Bolton)
We got 15 of our 48 points in this time
If I remember I think he took over after the Wolves game (even though he had already been appointed) - if thats correct we were on 10 points
That means he got 23 points whilst in charge of the Villa in 23 games
If you tell me that isnt a disaster tell me what is !!
Lets face it - I cant stand the bloke, but we have GMac to thank for us being in the PL next year !
Again you're assuming Houllier would have got the same results as McAllister in the Stoke, Wigan and West Brom games.
The bottom line is after the Wigan game we were on 42 points... we were safe, we couldn't of gone down. Just because we beat both Arsenal and Liverpool you're now assuming those two results kept us up lol (the Arsenal win in particular).
The most important result was the last minute win against West Ham... under Houllier.
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On around May 1st (I haven't got the figures to hand) - we were out of the bottom three by 1 POINT , 1 POINT !!!!
Is it worse with 4 exclamation marks?
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Repeat after me: We were safe before GH took ill. We were safe before GH took ill. Repeat until you've worked it out. Better get a calculator though.
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I've actually just checked it up on the official site, I was wrong, but the figures are even worse.
Basically GMac was in charge of 5 games and got 10 points , GH got I think (its hard to keep track) 30 points in 27 games.
Sorry, thats bloody abysmal !
You have to ask yourself why a guy who has totally failed as a manager at two clubs managed to get 2 points a game, which is basically similar form to what O'Neill got out of the same side, when GH got 1.1 !
I feel sorry for Gerard - but his time was a disaster, and I honestly feel, if had not had gone at the time he had, we would not have got the subsequent results and may have gone.
But nobody will ever know !
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You don't have the statistics to hand so you've decided to make them up I take it?
In 28 games under Houllier we got 33 points.
In 5 games under Mcallister we got 8 points.
in 5 games under Mcdonald we got 7 points.
slightly more than the 23 points you plucked out of the sky to strength your argument.
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MacAllister got 8 points in 5 games. And we were safe before he took ill, so it couldn't be described as a disaster.
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You don't have the statistics to hand so you've decided to make them up I take it?
In 28 games under Houllier we got 33 points.
In 5 games under Mcallister we got 8 points.
in 5 games under Mcdonald we got 7 points.
slightly more than the 23 points you plucked out of the sky to strength your argument.
you must be mistaken Paul,
he's checked them on the official site
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Bad forum etiquette on my part but it's worth pointing out that 33 in 28 is the exact same situation we were in after 28 games in mons first season.
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You don't have the statistics to hand so you've decided to make them up I take it?
In 28 games under Houllier we got 33 points.
In 5 games under Mcallister we got 8 points.
in 5 games under Mcdonald we got 7 points.
slightly more than the 23 points you plucked out of the sky to strength your argument.
you must be mistaken Paul,
he's checked them on the official site
Me too, the difference is I can count :P
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In the 11 games before GH was sick we gained 18 points. That happened to coincide with the time when injuries had cleared up and Bent had signed. So once he had a full squad to choose from results far from being "disastrous" were pretty decent and is when fears of relegation were banished. The last few games was the icing on the cake that gave us a respectable finish.
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You're all laughing now you pack of hyenas, picking at the bones.
But when holtepaul takes his shoes and socks off and improves his mathematical aptitude two fold, you'll be sorry.
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here is maths
Work all those out as points per game.
Then put them in order of who achieved the most points per game.
Tell me out of 1st , 2nd and 3rd - who came third
Then tell me the person in 3rd did a good job ! (and that is without all the off the field stuff that we had to put up with)
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Manchester City.
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Apologies, I meant 42 points before Ars and Liverpool not 36
Anyway, the point is the same, no matter what the points / teams etc...
The fact was with two games to go, we could have gone down - for a team that less than 12 months ago had gone to Wembley twice, and finished 6th and was a whisker from getting Champions League. For a team that started to fight each other, for a team whose players started to slag off the club, for a team who had to banish players to train with the youth side, for a team who had the worst injury crisis in years (but the players actual said before the crisis occurred that they did not feel the new regime was working) ,
Shall I carry on ?
The season was a total disaster.
Luckily, and you have to give him credit, McAllister rallied the team enough to see us safe, but no matter how you look at it - it was a disaster !
I haven't got the figures to hand, but I wouldn't mind betting we earned more points per game with both KMac and GMac in charge than GH
So please don't tell me GH's tenure was nothing but a disaster- because it was !
Now, if he had stayed, he could have turned it around, remember, GT's first year in Div 1 ended with us staying up on the last day, we went on to finish runners up the next year - GH may have done the same - but he will not now, and we will never know, so he goes down in history as being as bad as an appointment as Dr Jo, Graham Turner and Co !
As I pointed out before the Arsenal game - if you were to put £1 on as an accumulator for what was required to happen for us to go down (losing both our games by 4 goals each match, Blackpool winning by 3 at Man Utd etc etc) you'd have won over £35million.
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Aha, nice try, but the issue isn't whether it was a good season or not. It was whether the season was a disaster, which you keep trying to say it was, and I keep telling you that it wasn't. And not to worry paul, maths isn't for everyone.
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I'd be lying if i said i was disapointed, in fact i'm excited about the future now.
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I have just popped in for some hopeful excitng news update. After reading this ridiculous points "dispute which is not even a dispute" i am bordering on self harming .......
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Surely the point is, this is the same team with the addition of one of the best strikers in the Premiership at 24ml, for half a season, this is a team that finished consistently 6th, qualified for Europe consistently, Wembley cup finals, cup semi finals...blah blah blah, all in the last 4 seasons, and then we where contenders for relegation for a good part the season, by anybodies reckoning, that's a pretty poor season.
Also point out that in most other season 45pts would have placed us bottom half of the table, no problem...
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I still struggle to understand how the signing of Bent is used as a stick to beat Houllier with. Other managers get credit for building sides capable of winning matches, but appears it's different for him.
And i presume you're being funny about 45 points, yeah?
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here is maths
Work all those out as points per game.
Then put them in order of who achieved the most points per game.
Tell me out of 1st , 2nd and 3rd - who came third
Then tell me the person in 3rd did a good job ! (and that is without all the off the field stuff that we had to put up with)
It's an artificial distinction to take GM as separate from GH given that he was just continuing with his work. Then you also have to take into account the worst run of injuries any of us have ever seen. It's a completely bogus argument.
The facts are that we finished 9 points and 9 places above the relegation places when people like you were telling us for months that we were doomed. Now because you can't accept that you got it completely wrong you're trying to invent statistics to support a ridiculous position.
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Surely the point is, this is the same team with the addition of one of the best strikers in the Premiership at 24ml, for half a season, this is a team that finished consistently 6th, qualified for Europe consistently, Wembley cup finals, cup semi finals...blah blah blah, all in the last 4 seasons, and then we where contenders for relegation for a good part the season, by anybodies reckoning, that's a pretty poor season.
Also point out that in most other season 45pts would have placed us bottom half of the table, no problem...
think you'l find any team that finished with 45 points this season would also have been in the bottom half
is this for real ?
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Dave
Sorry mate you are having a laugh.
On around May 1st (I haven't got the figures to hand) - we were out of the bottom three by 1 POINT , 1 POINT !!!!
On May 1st we were out of the bottom three by 6 POINTS, 6 POINTS !!!!
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here is maths
Work all those out as points per game.
Then put them in order of who achieved the most points per game.
Tell me out of 1st , 2nd and 3rd - who came third
Then tell me the person in 3rd did a good job ! (and that is without all the off the field stuff that we had to put up with)
As I said, but people like you always emit things like this when you lose arguaments - I actually put "I don't have the figures to hand but if I remember it was......... , but forgetting the points, it is the point I am getting at.
And the POINT IS
We had three managers this year - two of them GMac and KMac - absolutely NO ONE wants as managers as they are clearly not good enough , yet - they performed better than Houllier ! - why - answer me.
GH - had to pick up the pieces you say - NO - KMac had to pick up the pieces - HE HAD A BETTER RECORD !
ONeill had left ni-on two months prior to Houllier coming. It was no ones fault but his own he tried to change things too quickly.
Banishing Dunne / Collins - who he eventually put back in (wierdly after they fought each other) and they kept us up , banishing others like Warnock when he had no replacement, slagging off Carew in the press the week he arrived , banishing Cueller
Of course it needed doing in time, but not straight away - there was no need, and it nearly took us down.
I know football fans have short memories but I am dumb founded people have forgotten the crap we have just endured after 9 days !!
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here is maths
Work all those out as points per game.
Then put them in order of who achieved the most points per game.
Tell me out of 1st , 2nd and 3rd - who came third
Then tell me the person in 3rd did a good job ! (and that is without all the off the field stuff that we had to put up with)
Nice idea but completely pointless when using samples of 5 games, 5 games and 28 games, basic statistics shows that the difference in standard deviation between the samples makes the results close to useless and certainly nothing a decent statistician would put their name to.
Aside from that we could just as easily compare Houllier before Bent (HbB) to Houllier after Bent (HaB) and prove that he made a statistically significant improvement to our performances with 1 signing. Given that we could infer that further signings would likely have continued that trend.
Just for info -
HbB - 14 from 16 (0.875)
HaB - 19 from 12 (1.583)
Having worked those out it's fairly easy to suggest that GMac's stats of 1.6 are almost a direct continuation of the performance after we signed Bent.
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Do 4 (four) exclamation marks lend anything to your argument?
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Do 4 (four) exclamation marks lend anything to your argument?
I think each exclamation mark is to signify each time Carrick touched the ball on Saturday.
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here is maths
Work all those out as points per game.
Then put them in order of who achieved the most points per game.
Tell me out of 1st , 2nd and 3rd - who came third
Then tell me the person in 3rd did a good job ! (and that is without all the off the field stuff that we had to put up with)
As I said, but people like you always emit things like this when you lose arguaments - I actually put "I don't have the figures to hand but if I remember it was......... , but forgetting the points, it is the point I am getting at.
And the POINT IS
We had three managers this year - two of them GMac and KMac - absolutely NO ONE wants as managers as they are clearly not good enough , yet - they performed better than Houllier ! - why - answer me.
GH - had to pick up the pieces you say - NO - KMac had to pick up the pieces - HE HAD A BETTER RECORD !
ONeill had left ni-on two months prior to Houllier coming. It was no ones fault but his own he tried to change things too quickly.
Banishing Dunne / Collins - who he eventually put back in (wierdly after they fought each other) and they kept us up , banishing others like Warnock when he had no replacement, slagging off Carew in the press the week he arrived , banishing Cueller
Of course it needed doing in time, but not straight away - there was no need, and it nearly took us down.
I know football fans have short memories but I am dumb founded people have forgotten the crap we have just endured after 9 days !!
Your response is quoting yourself.
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I know football fans have short memories but I am dumb
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????????????????????
What the devil - I look at it like before Bent / after Bent
Sorry if it was as simple as this - basically, that we lacked a forward before he signed Bent
Can I ask this simple question
WHY DID HE SLAG OFF OUR TOP SCORER THE WEEK HE ARRIVED AND THEN NEVER PLAYED HIM !!!!!
Granted, carew is no Darren Bent - but he was a Villa player, and one who was top scorer for the past three years.
You play your best team until you have better. If you don't and you lose games, you only have yourself to blame (and the same goes for playing Herd instead of Warnock , Lichaj instead of Cueller, one of a number instead of Dunne , and so on and so on !!
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I blame Billy McNeill...Useless gimp.
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????????????????????
What the devil - I look at it like before Bent / after Bent
Sorry if it was as simple as this - basically, that we lacked a forward before he signed Bent
So he identified a problem, rectified it at the first opportunity and the player delivered immediately. Sounds like good management to me.
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So he identified a problem, rectified it at the first opportunity and the player delivered immediately. Sounds like good management to me.
The utter bastard.
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End of season report (http://www.heroesandvillains.info/forumv3/index.php?topic=43590.msg1786199#quickreply)
No matter how we got there, we finished 9th - only one point of 8th and what was it, about 6 off 6th. (havent got the table at the mo)
So, at the end of the day, we went backwards but not by much, giving the fact we let so many points go from winning positions, and the players he has brought being one hell of a leap forwards from the players they replaced,
and, more importantly, the players Gerard has bought, have been our best players - suggesting he knows what he is doing
leads me to believe he deserves another year and backing in the market. We couldn't score goals, he saw it, he got Bent, we score goals.
We concede goals, he has saw it - common sense says I should trust him to solve it.
Given all the cirumstances I think this year has been a C , with a remark of "This has been an awkward year for Gerard but if he diects his potential in the correct areas he could have a much better year next year".
But I agree with the Liverpool thing , he badly got that wrong and I hope he has learnt from it, because I for one, won't accept it again (and Man City)
I used to be indecisive, but now I'm not so sure.
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????????????????????
What the devil - I look at it like before Bent / after Bent
Sorry if it was as simple as this - basically, that we lacked a forward before he signed Bent
Ok, now I'm confused are you agreeing or disagreeing that signing Bent was a much bigger turning point than Houllier going to hospital?
October to January was a disaster, I'll give you that, outside that period we were top easily a top 8 side. October to January also coincided with Houllier having had no chance to add his own players (other than an over the hill Pires who was signed to add numbers at a time when we had 9 midfielders out injured) and having to cope through the worst injury crisis I've ever seen at the club.
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Hahaha, quality bazz! Now, about the word disaster Paul. That's anything under and including C then, is it?
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????????????????????
What the devil - I look at it like before Bent / after Bent
Sorry if it was as simple as this - basically, that we lacked a forward before he signed Bent
Can I ask this simple question
WHY DID HE SLAG OFF OUR TOP SCORER THE WEEK HE ARRIVED AND THEN NEVER PLAYED HIM !!!!!
Granted, carew is no Darren Bent - but he was a Villa player, and one who was top scorer for the past three years.
You play your best team until you have better. If you don't and you lose games, you only have yourself to blame (and the same goes for playing Herd instead of Warnock , Lichaj instead of Cueller, one of a number instead of Dunne , and so on and so on !!
Nice changing of argument there. And for the record i supported Houllier 100% in the episode with Carew, and still do. Carew was bang out of line, and he'd have looked like a very weak manager if he hadn't acted.
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Can I ask this simple question
WHY DID HE SLAG OFF OUR TOP SCORER THE WEEK HE ARRIVED AND THEN NEVER PLAYED HIM !!!!!
Granted, carew is no Darren Bent - but he was a Villa player, and one who was top scorer for the past three years.
You play your best team until you have better. If you don't and you lose games, you only have yourself to blame (and the same goes for playing Herd instead of Warnock , Lichaj instead of Cueller, one of a number instead of Dunne , and so on and so on !!
Do you mean the top scorer who has a 2010/11 record of 20(7) games and 1 goal, across 2 clubs?
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Banishing Dunne / Collins - who he eventually put back in (wierdly after they fought each other) and they kept us up .
Dunne and Collins fought each other? I think you'll find they didn't. Completely changing events from what actually happened doesn't really add credibility to your arguments.
Also, it's interesting to know that it was all down to the dynamic, faultless defending of Dunne and Collins that we stayed up. Perhaps I was watching a different team.
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Quality. Well done for digging that post up!
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Anyway I'm glad he's going - he never was for Villa long term.
There is a massive opportunity now, let's grab it.
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Has a press conference been called for tomorrow ?
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Anyway I'm glad he's going - he never was for Villa long term.
There is a massive opportunity now, let's grab it.
I'm not. I'd have loved to see what could have been.
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Anyway I'm glad he's going - he never was for Villa long term.
There is a massive opportunity now, let's grab it.
Let's hope they learnt their lesson after all the dithering in August/September...
Carlo please!
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I think we can ignore all of the ITK speculation that's going around. As we know from Houllier's appointment, it will definately not be based on what the public knows about any manager, but how he performs at the interview with Randy.
Randy has to work closely with the new manager and has to trust this person with his multi-million pound investment. He will not choose Hughes/ Ancelotti/ Moyes etc on the basis of what they have achieved in the past, but on how he feels as they progress through the recruitment processs.
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I think we can ignore all of the ITK speculation that's going around. As we know from Houllier's appointment, it will definately not be based on what the public knows about any manager, but how he performs at the interview with Randy.
Randy has to work closely with the new manager and has to trust this person with his multi-million pound investment. He will not choose Hughes/ Ancelotti/ Moyes etc on the basis of what they have achieved in the past, but on how he feels as they progress through the recruitment processs.
Get back off the subject.
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I think we can ignore all of the ITK speculation that's going around. As we know from Houllier's appointment, it will definately not be based on what the public knows about any manager, but how he performs at the interview with Randy.
Randy has to work closely with the new manager and has to trust this person with his multi-million pound investment. He will not choose Hughes/ Ancelotti/ Moyes etc on the basis of what they have achieved in the past, but on how he feels as they progress through the recruitment processs.
Get back off the subject.
Actualy he was off the subject considering this is the houllier leaving thread not the who should replace him thread... :P
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No - if you look at my posts I have always said, I dont mind Houllier staying as , I think in two or three years he can get it right - and I still think that.
However, whatever he does / do or would of done in 2014 - does not hide the fact 2010-2011 was an utter disgrace of a season for Aston Villa Football Club.
performances on the pitch were appalling. The manager made balls up after balls up, the players fought with each other, the players slagged the management off publically, the management slagged the players off publically, players were told to stay away from the training ground and so on and so on.
I felt given time GH may have got it right, and was prepared to give him a chance.
But that does NOT mean this year was acceptable, it was appalling, it was an embarrassment, and it was a disgrace.
No one will know who was to blame, but as the manager, gerard Houllier has to take responsibility for it
And as for finishing 9th, and as I said, no matter how we got there , we got there. But McAllister got 8 crucial points in 5 awkward games , 6 of those points totally against the odds. So to me GH was no where near responsible for what was at the end, and acceptable finish.
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I can't say I remember any public slagging off from our players? Did I miss this?
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So you never saw the interviews with Carew, Ireland, Warnock, Dunne (post training dispute when they threatened to walk out) ,
Seriously, have I woke up from a 9 month dream, coz people seem to have totally forgotten what has gone on over the last nine months - it's unbelievable !
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So you never saw the interviews with Carew, Ireland, Warnock, Dunne (post training dispute when they threatened to walk out) ,
Seriously, have I woke up from a 9 month dream, coz people seem to have totally forgotten what has gone on over the last nine months - it's unbelievable !
Sorry, I also forgot Luke Youngs "wasted year" interview as well
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No - if you look at my posts I have always said, I dont mind Houllier staying as , I think in two or three years he can get it right - and I still think that.
However, whatever he does / do or would of done in 2014 - does not hide the fact 2010-2011 was an utter disgrace of a season for Aston Villa Football Club.
performances on the pitch were appalling. The manager made balls up after balls up, the players fought with each other, the players slagged the management off publically, the management slagged the players off publically, players were told to stay away from the training ground and so on and so on.
I felt given time GH may have got it right, and was prepared to give him a chance.
But that does NOT mean this year was acceptable, it was appalling, it was an embarrassment, and it was a disgrace.
No one will know who was to blame, but as the manager, gerard Houllier has to take responsibility for it
And as for finishing 9th, and as I said, no matter how we got there , we got there. But McAllister got 8 crucial points in 5 awkward games , 6 of those points totally against the odds. So to me GH was no where near responsible for what was at the end, and acceptable finish.
It's the bottom bit of this that I don't understand, yes we got 6 points against arsenal and liverpool that we didn't expect but they're not worth anything more than the 3 points against man city in january, or any other win in the season.
To repeat at the risk of winning the 'discussion through persistence. The form between october and january was a disaster. The rest of the season was no great drop from what we experienced under MON (and was certainly in line with what any sane person would expect given the circumstances of MONs departure), to consider the entire season an unmitigated disaster is just not a reflection of what happened.
However you paint it the period where we struggled also coincided with a shocking run of injuries. If you don't get just haw bad our injury problems were go have a look - http://www.physioroom.com/news/english_premier_league/clubs/2/aston_villa_injuries.html (http://www.physioroom.com/news/english_premier_league/clubs/2/aston_villa_injuries.html) In my opinion no side outside the top 4-5 has a squad big enough to cope with that. When you add in suspensions and the shocking form of 4-5 players during that period (warnock I'm looking at you) it was never going to be easy. That doesn't mean I don't think Houllier could've done things better but he certainly didn't have any luck.
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No - if you look at my posts I have always said, I dont mind Houllier staying as , I think in two or three years he can get it right - and I still think that.
However, whatever he does / do or would of done in 2014 - does not hide the fact 2010-2011 was an utter disgrace of a season for Aston Villa Football Club.
performances on the pitch were appalling. The manager made balls up after balls up, the players fought with each other, the players slagged the management off publically, the management slagged the players off publically, players were told to stay away from the training ground and so on and so on.
I felt given time GH may have got it right, and was prepared to give him a chance.
But that does NOT mean this year was acceptable, it was appalling, it was an embarrassment, and it was a disgrace.
No one will know who was to blame, but as the manager, gerard Houllier has to take responsibility for it
And as for finishing 9th, and as I said, no matter how we got there , we got there. But McAllister got 8 crucial points in 5 awkward games , 6 of those points totally against the odds. So to me GH was no where near responsible for what was at the end, and acceptable finish.
So why didn't you say that last week instead of "Given all the cirumstances I think this year has been a C , with a remark of "This has been an awkward year for Gerard but if he diects his potential in the correct areas he could have a much better year next year"?
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Well if October - January was a disaster - lets face it, Houllier was only there October to April
February record was L 1 D2 W1
March was played 3 lost 3 ! (although that has been the case for 5 years)
April was D1 won 2
So by that token you say his return was a disaster from Oct - Jan - then in the next three months we had three wins.
No - you are not convincing me !
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So you never saw the interviews with Carew, Ireland, Warnock, Dunne (post training dispute when they threatened to walk out) ,
Seriously, have I woke up from a 9 month dream, coz people seem to have totally forgotten what has gone on over the last nine months - it's unbelievable !
Sorry, I also forgot Luke Youngs "wasted year" interview as well
I have only read an interview with Carew to be honest. I have not forgotten any of the rumblings with Dunne but I was unaware of any public criticism of GH from Dunne. I thought Ireland was slagging of Birmingham as a city not anyone at Villa? Not that I'd listen to him anyway. It would not surprise me if Warnock has had a dig. Anyone who loses their place with a new manager does this, Sorenson rings a bell after MON joined.
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So you never saw the interviews with Carew, Ireland, Warnock, Dunne (post training dispute when they threatened to walk out) ,
Seriously, have I woke up from a 9 month dream, coz people seem to have totally forgotten what has gone on over the last nine months - it's unbelievable !
Sorry, I also forgot Luke Youngs "wasted year" interview as well
That was an anti-mon interview, nothing to do with houllier.
Ireland's opinion is about as valid as that of a bluenose, he's clearly mad as a box of frogs and he was awful in the most part whenever he played.
Warnock had to blame someone for going from an england player to a liability in the matter of a few months.
Dunne was just upset that he was having to do fitness work in training after a summer on the pies, no one can say he looked fit at the start of the season.
Carew may have had a point but considering his season has seen 1 goal in 27 appearances I think he should be looking much more closely at his own game rather than complaining about the manager, it's hard to defend someone being dropped, and told to up his game in the press, in that situation. Aside from that as soon as Houllier was appointed it was clear there was going to be issues with Carew given the way he left Lyon to come to us.
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I have not forgotten any of the rumblings with Dunne
That was just his stomach.
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I tell you why I said it - because I hated ONeill and to be honest, I'll give him any benefit of doubt I can.
But again, dont try and tell me this year has been OK, coz it was bloody awful until April - and Gerard wasnt here then !
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So you want McAllister to take over? He saved our season and was our best manager this year if I'm following your argument.
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I move we hand back the European Cup following our unexpected win in the final.
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I have not forgotten any of the rumblings with Dunne
That was just his stomach.
Ha, ha very good.
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So you want McAllister to take over? He saved our season and was our best manager this year if I'm following your argument.
Oh stop being ridiculous - its like discussing quantum physics with a mute ape in here tonight !
Goodnight !
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So you want McAllister to take over? He saved our season and was our best manager this year if I'm following your argument.
Goodnight !
Thank god for that.
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Oh stop being ridiculous - its like discussing quantum physics with a mute ape in here tonight !
Goodnight !
Considering you skills with basic maths I would really like to see you tackle quantum physics.
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So you want McAllister to take over? He saved our season and was our best manager this year if I'm following your argument.
Oh stop being ridiculous - its like discussing quantum physics with a mute ape in here tonight !
Goodnight !
Can you not accept that, given how many people disagree with you, you might be over reacting.
As for the form since christmas (well since signing BENT because I really can't be bothered redoing the stats) under houllier we got 1.58 points per game. Over a season that is 60 points. That is top 6 form based on this seasons table.
before that (but after kmac) we got 0.875 points per game, over a season that's 33 points and would've seen us joint bottom.
If you can't see a difference in form between those 2 periods then there really is no hope for you.
To reiterate, the form from houllier taking over until we signed Bent was awful (a disaster), the form outside that time was fine and was only marginally worse than under MON the previous season. I really don't see how you're struggling to understand this.
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If youre a new man coming in, you could do with a player like Coker, who works hard and is influential. You may also have use for a talent like Carew. When he clicks with a manager, he's a talent. So it's a shame they've already gone.
But I'm not too disappointed in Ged going. He's not a Villa manager. He got it wrong more often than right, and took too long to change tac when needed, and it could have cost us. Signing Bent was good, but we did have to pay good money anyway, and any of us could have told Randy that Bent is likely to score a few, if he didn't already know. Clearly the dressing room was split over him too. Some just didn't take too him at all. Fuckers some of them may be, but it works both ways.
New appointment is key. Rafa I don't think suits as one bit. I'd worry if he came. He's not the gaffer he was before the CL win went to his head. Fact! Footballing style too, I just don't think we have the players he'd want. It take a lot of chopping and changing for him to get us playing how he wants, and the results aren't garaunteed.
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I move we hand back the European Cup following our unexpected win in the final.
Genuine lol!
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Please come back Holtepaul ? PS "Mute Ape" also known as Bentman. Leave him alone ..............
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Just read the last few pages. Very entertaining reading.
Goodnight!
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Just read the last few pages. Very entertaining reading.
This.
Although I am now confused as to how many points we finished with!
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So apart from discovering that Houllier is shit, no - brilliant. Do we know if he's stepping down or not? As no where else seems to be running with this story apart from here.
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Reports today that houllier has medical evidence he is ok and villa won't accept it, seems it's far from mutual and he is holding out for a big pay off -from mirror reports it's more of a sacking than a mutual agreement.
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I think this is going to get messy.
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It would be ironic if it became a struggle to get the bloke to leave having struggled to get him here in the first place.
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Villa target Hughes as their new manager
Published 23:01 31/05/11 By John Percy
Recommend
Aston Villa have identified Mark Hughes as their No. 1 target to replace Gerard Houllier - despite the continuing wrangle over the terms of the Frenchman’s exit from the club.
Villa's American owner Randy Lerner is ready to move for the Fulham boss, who is available after delaying putting pen to paper on a new two-year deal at Craven Cottage.
Lerner, who got his fingers badly burned last summer when Martin O’Neill left him in the lurch just days before the Premier League season kicked off, has been alerted to the fact he can appoint Hughes quickly due to the existing terms of the Welshman’s contract with Cottagers chief Mohamed Al-Fayed.
Hughes, 47, can effectively walk away without Fulham receiving any compensation, and Lerner is desperate to make a fast appointment when he finally clears up the mess of Houllier’s departure.
Former Wales boss Hughes has been offered a new deal by Al-Fayed but has not signed it yet, opening the door for Villa to exploit a clause written into the contract he agreed last summer.
Fulham will be reluctant to part with the manager who guided them to a respectable eighth-placed finish - and into next season’s Europa League via the Fair Play system.
Ironically, Hughes was on Villa’s radar just days after his appointment at Fulham, following O’Neill's shock exit in August.
They do not anticipate any problems approaching him this time around, although they have also ear-marked former Spurs boss Martin Jol - who is a free agent - and Everton’s David Moyes, although he would be costly in terms of compensation.
Lerner’s first task is to finally end the uncertainty over Houllier, who is thrashing out a severance package worth around £5million.
Houllier's departure has been delayed and complicated by the fact that the 63-year-old is keen to continue and has medical evidence to back up his claims that he is healthy enough to cope with the demands of the job following his heart scare in April.
However, Villa have their own reports from club doctors and are reluctant to avoid landing themselves in legal hot water in what is already a political nightmare for the club.
Last night, it still appeared far from certain Villa and Houllier would agree to part ways by “mutual consent”, though it is widely expected the matter will finally be sorted today.
Read more: http://www.mirrorfootball.co.uk/news/Aston-Villa-Fulham-news-Mark-Hughes-is-No-1-target-to-be-manager-after-Gerard-Houllier
Read more: http://www.mirrorfootball.co.uk/news/Aston-Villa-Fulham-news-Mark-Hughes-is-No-1-target-to-be-manager-after-Gerard-Houllier-gets-5m-payoff-article743277.html#ixzz1O0XPAiAA
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If we're going for managers who don't cost too much in compensation what was the point of paying mega money for Bent? Mixed messages there but it's in the mirror so.....
If it's true, Hughes would be quite uninspiring, solid, a bit boring really. Better than a Curbishley, not as good as a Moyes and nothing like as exciting as Ancelotti. About where we are right now so it has the ring of truth.
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I wouldn't be disappointed in Hughes at all. I think Lerner is looking for an experienced Premier League manager and one who will have the respect of the dressing room.
He has good connections with players he has worked with before and who have been mentioned as possible transfer targets anyway - Robinson, Samba. He may also be the manager who is able to turn our headcase into the creative, goalscoring midfield player we need and save us a fortune in the transfer market.
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Fair enough, Nick. It just doesn't excite me. Not sure I want to see Ireland in a Villa shirt again either.
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not my first choice but a solid enough manager and far better than mclaren, curbishley and that ilk, a bit maybe like an o neill style of football but hughes should have us challenging in the top 6 or 7 again.
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If I'm being totally honest, to me there's not a significant difference between Hughes and Moyes, IMO. Both similar types of manager; whereas Moyes has achieved some solid results and progress with Everton, Hughes did a very good job at Blackburn, was doing well at City (I believe had he stayed he'd have achieved what Mancini has this season), and had a good first season at Fulham, following a tough act in Roy Hodgson. Both he and Moyes would be safe, steady managers...
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If I'm being totally honest, to me there's not a significant difference between Hughes and Moyes, IMO. Both similar types of manager; whereas Moyes has achieved some solid results and progress with Everton, Hughes did a very good job at Blackburn, was doing well at City (I believe had he stayed he'd have achieved what Mancini has this season), and had a good first season at Fulham, following a tough act in Roy Hodgson. Both he and Moyes would be safe, steady managers...
this.
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The Mirror, must be true.
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Can't compare moyes and Hughes really. Hughes has no track record apart from failing miserably at being a chequebook manager. Yeah he did ok at Blackburn but they were horrible horrible team with no redeeming features.
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If he's been cleared by several independent assessments then I'd worry about those doctors. The man clearly isn't well enough to be in stressful employment given his age and his history of heart trouble.
I do sympathise with him but if we can't see the wood from the trees on this issue what are you supposed to say? One would hope those are false rumours apart him being cleared to continue, whilst also wishing him well.
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Can't compare moyes and Hughes really. Hughes has no track record apart from failing miserably at being a chequebook manager. Yeah he did ok at Blackburn but they were horrible horrible team with no redeeming features.
Hughes has actually won something in his time as Premier League manager, Moyes has won the square root of sod all in his time at Everton.
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The more I think about it, the more I'd like Hughes as manager. Houllier needs to stop fighting and go. If we, the club, decide we can't risk him staying on because of his health he has to accept it. It's damaging for him and us if he stays, and he needs to bite the bullet and accept his severance.
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The way I see it is the story broke yesterday in the local press and the red tops have now picked it up and need to add something (as in it's not mutual consent) to spice it up a bit and make them seem more informed than they really are. I can see there being some behind the scenes wrangling over the exact settlement figure, but I still think it'll be an amicable parting of ways in the end.
As for Hughes, I said yesterday he's who I expect to see coming in, even if he's not my pick. But as he's the logical choice and would fit the presses view of us, this could easily be them putting 2 and 2 together and again trying to portray some non-existant insider knowledge. Think what happened when Houllier came in - let's hope he's the new Bob Bradley!!
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while i agree its the clubs decision, if you were in any other job and you were sacked when you had been given a bill of clean health after an illness, the company would be in deep crap, and rightly so. The board have to tread carefully
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Can't compare moyes and Hughes really. Hughes has no track record apart from failing miserably at being a chequebook manager. Yeah he did ok at Blackburn but they were horrible horrible team with no redeeming features.
I've answered this on the new manager thread, Greg.
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Hughes would be a terrible appointment at a time when, as has been pointed out on here, the Club has an opportunity to make a statement.
Appointing Hughes just says: "We are a club with limited ambition. We are happy to just bob around mid-table, have the odd cup run and avoid relegation."
To the 'want-away' players it says: "You are right to want away. We will never even remotely worry the teams in the Champions League places."
To the likes of Darren Bent it says: "Call your agent and engineer a move away from here at the earliest opportunity."
Looking at the calibre of the managers currently out of work around Europe, as well as those who could reasonably be tempted into joining us, this would be a massive mistake and I really hope the papers have made this up (as in: "Villa have got no money and are a similiar size to Fulham and Hughes would be cheap = Hughes to Villa).
I'm shocked and disappointed at how many people on here would accept Hughes as a decent appointment.
You might as well scrub out the 'Bright Future' and just leave the 'Proud History'.
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The way I see it is the story broke yesterday in the local press and the red tops have now picked it up and need to add something (as in it's not mutual consent) to spice it up a bit and make them seem more informed than they really are. I can see there being some behind the scenes wrangling over the exact settlement figure, but I still think it'll be an amicable parting of ways in the end.
this...
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Hughes would be a terrible appointment at a time when, as has been pointed out on here, the Club has an opportunity to make a statement.
Appointing Hughes just says: "We are a club with limited ambition. We are happy to just bob around mid-table, have the odd cup run and avoid relegation."
To the 'want-away' players it says: "You are right to want away. We will never even remotely worry the teams in the Champions League places."
To the likes of Darren Bent it says: "Call your agent and engineer a move away from here at the earliest opportunity."
Looking at the calibre of the managers currently out of work around Europe, as well as those who could reasonably be tempted into joining us, this would be a massive mistake and I really hope the papers have made this up (as in: "Villa have got no money and are a similiar size to Fulham and Hughes would be cheap = Hughes to Villa).
I'm shocked and disappointed at how many people on here would accept Hughes as a decent appointment.
You might as well scrub out the 'Bright Future' and just leave the 'Proud History'.
Whoever comes in i think we can forget about the champions league for the foreseeable future unless randy has 100m or so to pump in each summer-the gap now is huge and growing wider, i think whoever comes in will be looking at top 6 and europa league as realistic ambitions and maybe grab a cup.
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When did the Europa League start to mean nothing to our club? We don't seem to take it seriously - but that's stupid. Okay, it isn't the CL, it's still a prestigious competition that we should try and win when we get the chance to.
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Just read the last few pages. Very entertaining reading.
This.
Although I am now confused as to how many points we finished with!
48 POINTS! 48 POINTS!!!!
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I've now cross-referenced 267 different sites offering league tables from last season, but to be honest I still wasn't quite sure about our finishing number of points. But then those last four exclamation points finally swayed me. 48 it is then.
That was tough - thanks Dave!!!!
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Whoever comes in i think we can forget about the champions league for the foreseeable future unless randy has 100m or so to pump in each summer-the gap now is huge and growing wider, i think whoever comes in will be looking at top 6 and europa league as realistic ambitions and maybe grab a cup.
See, I simply don't accept that.
What we should be doing is looking at what we need to get into the top 4 and seeing how best to achieve that with our resources. We're not paupers, but also don't have the money to buy pur way in a la Man City. So it's a matter of focusing what we do have and maximising every pound spent.
Here's an example blueprint:-
We have a decent squad that looked dis-organised and unmotivated last year, so get a manager (Moyes) who can get the best out of them by addressing those issues. To build further, get the scouting to be top notch (maybe a job for Houllier?) so that we're getting £10m players for £5m and so on. Continue to develop the youth so that they take places saving money for other areas and/or a top notch £20m signing.
Do that and we won't be far away!
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Whoever comes in i think we can forget about the champions league for the foreseeable future unless randy has 100m or so to pump in each summer-the gap now is huge and growing wider, i think whoever comes in will be looking at top 6 and europa league as realistic ambitions and maybe grab a cup.
See, I simply don't accept that.
What we should be doing is looking at what we need to get into the top 4 and seeing how best to achieve that with our resources. We're not paupers, but also don't have the money to buy pur way in a la Man City. So it's a matter of focusing what we do have and maximising every pound spent.
Here's an example blueprint:-
We have a decent squad that looked dis-organised and unmotivated last year, so get a manager (Moyes) who can get the best out of them by addressing those issues. To build further, get the scouting to be top notch (maybe a job for Houllier?) so that we're getting £10m players for £5m and so on. Continue to develop the youth so that they take places saving money for other areas and/or a top notch £20m signing.
Do that and we won't be far away!
Without huge and substantial investment the champions league is just a dream, arsenal and man u have huge attendances and cash and man city and chelsea have pots of cash to spend , we are very much in the bracket of everton and maybe a bit behind spurs and competing for a top 6 place in my view-it took city over £200m to break the top 4 and the gap is far wider now than when randy took over.
I reluctantly have reassessed my hopes and now top 6 and a cup seem realistic aims to me.
Sadly when we get good players coming through they are being picked off by the richer clubs and its very hard to stop that happening in the current football climate- the game is now very different from the 80s.
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So no new developments on this then?
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Hughes would be a terrible appointment at a time when, as has been pointed out on here, the Club has an opportunity to make a statement.
Appointing Hughes just says: "We are a club with limited ambition. We are happy to just bob around mid-table, have the odd cup run and avoid relegation."
To the 'want-away' players it says: "You are right to want away. We will never even remotely worry the teams in the Champions League places."
To the likes of Darren Bent it says: "Call your agent and engineer a move away from here at the earliest opportunity."
Looking at the calibre of the managers currently out of work around Europe, as well as those who could reasonably be tempted into joining us, this would be a massive mistake and I really hope the papers have made this up (as in: "Villa have got no money and are a similiar size to Fulham and Hughes would be cheap = Hughes to Villa).
I'm shocked and disappointed at how many people on here would accept Hughes as a decent appointment.
You might as well scrub out the 'Bright Future' and just leave the 'Proud History'.
Think I agree with this.
I'm oscillating between GHou + young, up-and-coming manager (although I suspect GHou's involvement is fast-becoming unlikely) and a proven European manager of Ancelotti / Van Gaal proportions (with all the risks that they may simply bugger offf when a 'better' club comes calling).
Maybe the compromise is a Jol / Hughton combination, if that could be put together to the satisfaction of all parties.
Whatever, I do think it is time to be brave: we have a good crop of youngsters who need to feel that they are going to move forward, with opportunties to shine, led by a highly-respected management team with lasting ambition for AVFC. Rather than see a first-team squad compiled from tried-and-tested but limited professional, led by a management team with limited ambition.
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Whoever comes in i think we can forget about the champions league for the foreseeable future unless randy has 100m or so to pump in each summer-the gap now is huge and growing wider, i think whoever comes in will be looking at top 6 and europa league as realistic ambitions and maybe grab a cup.
See, I simply don't accept that.
What we should be doing is looking at what we need to get into the top 4 and seeing how best to achieve that with our resources. We're not paupers, but also don't have the money to buy pur way in a la Man City. So it's a matter of focusing what we do have and maximising every pound spent.
Here's an example blueprint:-
We have a decent squad that looked dis-organised and unmotivated last year, so get a manager (Moyes) who can get the best out of them by addressing those issues. To build further, get the scouting to be top notch (maybe a job for Houllier?) so that we're getting £10m players for £5m and so on. Continue to develop the youth so that they take places saving money for other areas and/or a top notch £20m signing.
Do that and we won't be far away!
Without huge and substantial investment the champions league is just a dream, arsenal and man u have huge attendances and cash and man city and chelsea have pots of cash to spend , we are very much in the bracket of everton and maybe a bit behind spurs and competing for a top 6 place in my view-it took city over £200m to break the top 4 and the gap is far wider now than when randy took over.
I reluctantly have reassessed my hopes and now top 6 and a cup seem realistic aims to me.
Sadly when we get good players coming through they are being picked off by the richer clubs and its very hard to stop that happening in the current football climate- the game is now very different from the 80s.
Whoever comes in i think we can forget about the champions league for the foreseeable future unless randy has 100m or so to pump in each summer-the gap now is huge and growing wider, i think whoever comes in will be looking at top 6 and europa league as realistic ambitions and maybe grab a cup.
See, I simply don't accept that.
What we should be doing is looking at what we need to get into the top 4 and seeing how best to achieve that with our resources. We're not paupers, but also don't have the money to buy pur way in a la Man City. So it's a matter of focusing what we do have and maximising every pound spent.
Here's an example blueprint:-
We have a decent squad that looked dis-organised and unmotivated last year, so get a manager (Moyes) who can get the best out of them by addressing those issues. To build further, get the scouting to be top notch (maybe a job for Houllier?) so that we're getting £10m players for £5m and so on. Continue to develop the youth so that they take places saving money for other areas and/or a top notch £20m signing.
Do that and we won't be far away!
Without huge and substantial investment the champions league is just a dream, arsenal and man u have huge attendances and cash and man city and chelsea have pots of cash to spend , we are very much in the bracket of everton and maybe a bit behind spurs and competing for a top 6 place in my view-it took city over £200m to break the top 4 and the gap is far wider now than when randy took over.
I reluctantly have reassessed my hopes and now top 6 and a cup seem realistic aims to me.
Sadly when we get good players coming through they are being picked off by the richer clubs and its very hard to stop that happening in the current football climate- the game is now very different from the 80s.
Whoever comes in i think we can forget about the champions league for the foreseeable future unless randy has 100m or so to pump in each summer-the gap now is huge and growing wider, i think whoever comes in will be looking at top 6 and europa league as realistic ambitions and maybe grab a cup.
See, I simply don't accept that.
What we should be doing is looking at what we need to get into the top 4 and seeing how best to achieve that with our resources. We're not paupers, but also don't have the money to buy pur way in a la Man City. So it's a matter of focusing what we do have and maximising every pound spent.
Here's an example blueprint:-
We have a decent squad that looked dis-organised and unmotivated last year, so get a manager (Moyes) who can get the best out of them by addressing those issues. To build further, get the scouting to be top notch (maybe a job for Houllier?) so that we're getting £10m players for £5m and so on. Continue to develop the youth so that they take places saving money for other areas and/or a top notch £20m signing.
Do that and we won't be far away!
Without huge and substantial investment the champions league is just a dream, arsenal and man u have huge attendances and cash and man city and chelsea have pots of cash to spend , we are very much in the bracket of everton and maybe a bit behind spurs and competing for a top 6 place in my view-it took city over £200m to break the top 4 and the gap is far wider now than when randy took over.
I reluctantly have reassessed my hopes and now top 6 and a cup seem realistic aims to me.
Sadly when we get good players coming through they are being picked off by the richer clubs and its very hard to stop that happening in the current football climate- the game is now very different from the 80s.
Yet Arsenal are there and stay there with relatively little spent.
Also, some similarities can be seen between us and Spurs, who got there:- been close for a few years, then change the manager and fall back, but change again shortly afterwards and get there. And for all the talk of £200m, we were a Darren Bent away under MON.
You may be right, but I see a danger to limiting ourselves to top 6 and a cup run here and there. Lets try to be as good as we can and see where that takes us.
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So no new developments on this then?
the rumour is houllier has medical proof he is ok and wants to stay and villa refuse to accept that so it seems more of a sacking than a mutual decision, looks like we may have to pay him a substantial payoff.
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Whoever comes in i think we can forget about the champions league for the foreseeable future unless randy has 100m or so to pump in each summer-the gap now is huge and growing wider, i think whoever comes in will be looking at top 6 and europa league as realistic ambitions and maybe grab a cup.
See, I simply don't accept that.
What we should be doing is looking at what we need to get into the top 4 and seeing how best to achieve that with our resources. We're not paupers, but also don't have the money to buy pur way in a la Man City. So it's a matter of focusing what we do have and maximising every pound spent.
Here's an example blueprint:-
We have a decent squad that looked dis-organised and unmotivated last year, so get a manager (Moyes) who can get the best out of them by addressing those issues. To build further, get the scouting to be top notch (maybe a job for Houllier?) so that we're getting £10m players for £5m and so on. Continue to develop the youth so that they take places saving money for other areas and/or a top notch £20m signing.
Do that and we won't be far away!
Without huge and substantial investment the champions league is just a dream, arsenal and man u have huge attendances and cash and man city and chelsea have pots of cash to spend , we are very much in the bracket of everton and maybe a bit behind spurs and competing for a top 6 place in my view-it took city over £200m to break the top 4 and the gap is far wider now than when randy took over.
I reluctantly have reassessed my hopes and now top 6 and a cup seem realistic aims to me.
Sadly when we get good players coming through they are being picked off by the richer clubs and its very hard to stop that happening in the current football climate- the game is now very different from the 80s.
Whoe
Yet Arsenal are there and stay there with relatively little spent.
Also, some similarities can be seen between us and Spurs, who got there:- been close for a few years, then change the manager and fall back, but change again shortly afterwards and get there. And for all the talk of £200m, we were a Darren Bent away under MON.
You may be right, but I see a danger to limiting ourselves to top 6 and a cup run here and there. Lets try to be as good as we can and see where that takes us.
Agreed arsenal spend little but they reportedly get £3m from each home game in revenue and besides their champions league income have gates that double ours.
Of course we have to aim to do as well as we can but i see us and everton along with maybe spurs in a chase to catch the top 5 as liverpool now seem to be in a position to compete financially under their new owners and are expected to splash the cash this summer.
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you can't reply without quoting 3 times mate...
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Agreed arsenal spend little but they reportedly get £3m from each home game in revenue and besides their champions league income have gates that double ours.
Of course we have to aim to do as well as we can but i see us and everton along with maybe spurs in a chase to catch the top 5 as liverpool now seem to be in a position to compete financially under their new owners and are expected to splash the cash this summer.
Arsenal's turnover is of very little relevance if they aren't using it to finance the playing side. I'm not convcinced of any great spending power Liverpool will have, but do think they'll be difficult to finish above given the King Kenny factor.
Thing is though, I think back to our chances at 4th in 2009 and 2010 and each time someone would say "We'll never have a better chance." Yet we were closer in 2010 than 2009 and if you look at last season's table, had we had our act together who knows what would have happened.
Of the current top 4:-
Arsenal faded badly last season and there seems to be a growing disatisfaction with Wenger. Will that carry through to this season, especially if Fabregas does one?
Chelsea have great spending power, but lack stability with what now seems like regular managerial changes. They also have an aging squad (Drogba, Terry, Lampard, Cole, Malouda all 30+) so although they have the money to replace them, they could be in for a 'transitional season' with a new manager.
Man City will keep spending on an level envied by even Chelsea, so they may be untouchable.
Man Utd have issues financially with the Glaziers and debt repayment, even though they earn enough to do it and still spend. They're probably safe aslong as Fergie is there, but again key players are aging (already now need a Scholes replacement) and once he goes the wrong apointment, in what must be the most difficult act to follow in the history of the game, could see them falter somewhat.
I suppose the phrase is 'raising the bar' and if the top 4 clubs do that we need to do what we can to raise our game. Otherwise, what's the point?
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So no new developments on this then?
Official statement expected this afternoon.
Edit: Matt Kendrick at the Mail now saying it may not happen today.
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So no new developments on this then?
Official statement expected this afternoon.
Edit: Matt Kendrick at the Mail now saying it may not happen today.
Looks like geds holding out for a big pay off, if reports are true he says he has medical proof hes fit so it seems to be more like a sacking rather than him agreeing to go.
Another tribunal case beckoning maybe?
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It's just a case of when and not if this is announced. Quite funny that the picture on the Villa homepage is of a smiling Carlos Cuellar. He's just thinking thank god Houllier's off!
Houllier did make some puzzling decisions with players, Cuellar's omission for a half-fit Dunne earlier this season was perhaps his oddest one.
Ultimately his face never really fit with the fans and he didn't help himslef in this regard.
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Except we don't know the reasoning behind Cuellar not playing. Considering he is going in for an operation (an operation that he put off during the season in order to cover for others), I'd wager that whatever injury he has / had meant he wasn't going to be risked unless others were also out injured.
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Just read the last few pages. Very entertaining reading.
This.
Although I am now confused as to how many points we finished with!
48 POINTS! 48 POINTS!!!!
Are you sure it wasn't 45? Or 42?!!!
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Snore. Matt Kendrick, dependable as ever.
This may never happen.
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Just read the last few pages. Very entertaining reading.
This.
Although I am now confused as to how many points we finished with!
48 POINTS! 48 POINTS!!!!
Are you sure it wasn't 45? Or 42?!!!
Awww! I don't know now, because you've used four exclamation marks which sort of makes it official.
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For weeks now GH has been stating that he is fit and wants to stay. G Mac has been planning for next season. Whoever said it - I think you are right- this could cost the club if he is proven as medically fit.
Personally for what it is worth I think he should go. It is simply not establishing any stable foundation with a man his age and medical history. Yes I know Sir Alex is older but he is fit.
No, his Wife is right- time to call it quits and I would be bloody angry if he waved his contract at us.
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Well this has all gone very quiet now.
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Well this has all gone very quiet now.
Tom Ross on facebook says there will be an official announcement tommorow
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I understand legally the Villa wouldn't have a leg to stand on, but surely morally, GH could never show his face again if he demanded his contract paid up.
Joins in October, leaves at the beginning of April, does a poor job in the 6 months he is here, has a dodgy heart (now I know he cant be blamed for that) and then when Villa raise a concern , he demands his 6 million quid he is owed.
As I say legally, yes, but how on bloody earth can he have a go at the likes of Warnock and Carew one minute and do that the next.
I have always said - no malice, quite like the bloke, but if he tries to take us for the lot, he will lose all credibility with me.
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Matt Kendrick is now saying that a statement may be released tonight.
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I understand legally the Villa wouldn't have a leg to stand on, but surely morally, GH could never show his face again if he demanded his contract paid up.
Joins in October, leaves at the beginning of April, does a poor job in the 6 months he is here, has a dodgy heart (now I know he cant be blamed for that) and then when Villa raise a concern , he demands his 6 million quid he is owed.
As I say legally, yes, but how on bloody earth can he have a go at the likes of Warnock and Carew one minute and do that the next.
I have always said - no malice, quite like the bloke, but if he tries to take us for the lot, he will lose all credibility with me.
Is that Houllier or a sum up of Benitez's Italian caper
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apparently Kendrick justed tweeted that the decision could come tonight. They are in the final stages right now.
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apparently Kendrick justed tweeted that the decision could come tonight. They are in the final stages right now.
I'd really like it to be resolved, we don't want another situation dragging on.
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apparently Kendrick justed tweeted that the decision could come tonight. They are in the final stages right now.
I'd really like it to be resolved, we don't want another situation dragging on.
that's the thing though. It hasn't dragged on. In fact, the process has been remarkably smooth. The thing is with 24 hour everything, we wait for any type of news and then react to it. True or false. Following your team nowadays is like watching the hands of a clock. Not like back in the day where you only found in the paper the next day or the radio. It's painful to say the least.
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Done and dusted (http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2370322,00.html)
All the very best, M. Houllier.
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If ever a statement reads like "I don't really want to go, but im being pushed" then this is it. Sounds like he very much wanted to go on and Villa took the decision out of his hands. Well onto the next guy then. Think it's going to be Hughes now, how dull and uninspiring..........Prove me wrong Villa.
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All the best in the future GH. Have a good long life with your family.
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Good luck to him and his health,I feel mixed about it,as I think he couldve made some good summer signings. Now we need to make a smart long term choice, UTV.
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Done and dusted (http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2370322,00.html)
All the very best, M. Houllier.
yeh, well said. I wanted him to stay and see things through. However, it wasn't to be.
Good luck Gerard in whatever you do next. Hopefully it won't be a lot of anything other wine and rest.
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The Club can confirm that, by mutual consent, Gerard Houllier has stepped down as manager of Aston Villa with immediate effect.
The 63-year-old took charge in September 2010 but suffered a dissection of the descending aorta in April 2011.
He was unable to take charge of team affairs for the final five games of the season and doctors have advised that he will require further time to recuperate.
The Club and Gerard have agreed amicably to this resolution and the search has begun for a new manager in order to prepare the team for the coming season.
"I would like to thank Gerard for his considerable efforts over the past nine months and for the dedication, commitment and work ethic he has demonstrated as Villa manager," said chief executive Paul Faulkner.
"We regret the circumstances of Gerard's departure and, naturally, we wish him well in his continued recovery.
"I know I speak for everyone associated with Aston Villa in expressing our hope that Gerard will return to full health as quickly as possible and we wish him all the best for the future.
"As a Board we are very conscious of the need to ensure that the Club is prepared fully to meet the demands of the new season and, to that end, we have already embarked upon the process which will lead to the appointment of a new manager.
"We will update when appropriate and until such time as we can make an announcement there will be no further comment from the Club on this matter."
Gerard Houllier said: "I am extremely disappointed that I will not have the opportunity to manage Aston Villa next season.
"My health has improved considerably since I was taken ill on April 20. I now intend to take the next few months to concentrate on recuperating fully before I may return to football.
"I was very much looking forward to the prospect of my first full season as Villa manager and returning for pre-season training to prepare for the campaign ahead, a luxury that I did not have last season.
"I have been extremely touched by all of the messages I have received and by the reaction of people throughout the world of football.
"I am very grateful to the Villa fans for their genuine concern and encouragement and to the fans of clubs up and down the country for their kind sentiments.
"I would especially like to thank my assistant manager, Gary McAllister, my staff, the players and all at Aston Villa for their support and, of course, for their efforts in securing a very positive end to last season.
"It has been an honour to manage this great club and I wish everyone connected with Aston Villa every success for the future."
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We are in for a battering in the media, he has declared himself fit and we have sacked him is what I'm reading between the lines.
Ive mixed feelings now, abit of a sour taste.
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Well at least we have plenty time to get the situation sorted this time around.
Ancelotti please.
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Thanks and good luck, Gerard.
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Well at least we have plenty time to get the situation sorted this time around.
Ancelotti please.
Seconded, and best of Luck GH
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We are in for a battering in the media, he has declared himself fit and we have sacked him is what I'm reading between the lines.
Ive mixed feelings now, abit of a sour taste.
I would certainly say it wasn't his decision. Villa as an employer does have a duty of care though, so not as black and white as they have just callously sacked him. Think they had his and Villa's best interests at heart.
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Best wishes Gerard- seems to be gathering pace this Benitez link.
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We are in for a battering in the media, he has declared himself fit and we have sacked him is what I'm reading between the lines.
Ive mixed feelings now, abit of a sour taste.
Pretty much my feelings too.
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we have already embarked upon the process which will lead to the appointment of a new manager.
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We are in for a battering in the media, he has declared himself fit and we have sacked him is what I'm reading between the lines.
Ive mixed feelings now, abit of a sour taste.
he said his health had considerably improved which isn't the same as declaring himself fit, or indeed the club sharing the same view as it relates to the demands of the PL. If people do want to look at it from that stance, then consider the club having the balls to pull the trigger in their (our) long term interests rather than his.
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I read it that he wanted to stay but needed longer to recover and we didn't want the issue around his health, to carry on. I was looking forward to see if he could turn us around but think it's the correct decision.
All the best GH.
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Not sure how it could have been handled any better really? Some of the press may spin it against the club, but that statement is about the best I had hoped for, given the circumstances.
Good luck in the future Mr H.
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All the best Gerard. Hopefully you make a full recovery.
Genuinely disappointed, as I think he could have done an excellent job in building a proper squad that could have challenged for honours. Not to be unfortunately.
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All the best Gerard. Hopefully you make a full recovery.
Genuinely disappointed, as I think he could have done an excellent job in building a proper squad that could have challenged for honours. Not to be unfortunately.
Same here.
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A shame, as I was interested to see if he could turn it round, but I think for the best. Regardless of how you might view his managerial ability, he has struck me as a really nice guy throughout and I wish him all the best.
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Reads like a man, who needs to say he has a future in the game in order to believe it himself. I for one, hope he makes a full recovery and at some point if it helps keep him alive and well (some people literally live to work) back in the dugout. Good luck Mr Houllier, you are a man of honour and class.
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The club for me have handled this as well as they could and have acted sensitively but decisively - now onto the next big call which we need to get right.
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Finishing 9th on the back of what we had to endure both in pre season and injury wise probably merited another crack at it. I was also curious as to what names he might bring in.
But we just couldn't chance it with his health - even if he was adamant he wanted to come back. If there is any truth in the rumours that he agreed to go at the end of the season in the aftermath of the Wolves defeat -which I've heard in a few places- but then changed his mind recently to angle after a better payout, I might have a smidgen less sympathy for him.
All in all, £7 million for a less than spectacular 8 months work is good going.
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Best wishes GH - no malice !, you go with my thanks.
However, one quick last favour before you leave Bodymoor.
Can you take down the car parking sign which says "GMAC" please.
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I wish GH a full recovery and best of luck for the future but I'm not sorry to see the end of his reign.
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The total opposite of the departure of DOL who I would've gratefully kicked all the way up Witton Lane, GH never came across as anything but professional, and while I don't think he did a good job, it wasn't for the want of trying and for that alone I hope he is welcomed back to Villa Park in the future as a visitor and afforded the respect that is due to an ex-manager of Aston Villa.
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As he says, he wanted to return but needs a few months to recuperate fully. Unfortunately we can't afford that luxury so a parting of the ways is the best for both parties. I'm not sure he will return to full time club management. Surely it's not worth the risk for him?
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Reportedly a £2.5 m pay off so that's not as bad as it could be, now the fun begins as we wait to see who will be our new leader- whoever it is let's hope they get the right man.
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As he says, he wanted to return but needs a few months to recuperate fully. Unfortunately we can't afford that luxury so a parting of the ways is the best for both parties. I'm not sure he will return to full time club management. Surely it's not worth the risk for him?
Maybe a gig back with the French FA? I don't think anyone will take the risk with him as a manager, here or abroad.
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The total opposite of the departure of DOL who I would've gratefully kicked all the way up Witton Lane, GH never came across as anything but professional, and while I don't think he did a good job, it wasn't for the want of trying
Other than at Man City in the FA Cup you mean?
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All the best Gerard. Hopefully you make a full recovery.
Genuinely disappointed, as I think he could have done an excellent job in building a proper squad that could have challenged for honours. Not to be unfortunately.
Same here.
Thirded. Really was hoping he would get a chance at least another season to show what he could do. Feel a little bit down.
Best of luck Gerard.
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Of the last three managers to vacate the Villa Park hotseat, he's the only one to leave with any dignity. All the best, Gerard. Au revoir.
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A shame all round really. I hope some of the shit-stirrers in the squad are proud of themselves. Now we've got to hope Randy appoints someone good and not the cheapest (Hughes)
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Very best wishes for a full and quick recovery, Gerard.
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I was warming to him until the Man City game, which I'm still annoyed about, but a decent finish in the end.I liked his dealings in the transfer market too, Pires aside.The end of a year to forget, all the best GH
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Best wishes in your recuperation. Don't go back to managing though Gerard. A nice 'comfy' position upstairs awaits you somewhere.
I hoped you asked to let Gary Mac step aside too.
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Closure
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Good luck GH, but he wont be missed
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The total opposite of the departure of DOL who I would've gratefully kicked all the way up Witton Lane, GH never came across as anything but professional, and while I don't think he did a good job, it wasn't for the want of trying
Other than at Man City in the FA Cup you mean?
Like a lot of his decisions, he did what he thought was best and I and many others couldn't have disagreed more, but as I have said before, I don't believe it was done with any malice. Incompetance maybe, but not malice.
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Good luck GH, but he wont be missed
By you maybe.
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I'll miss him. As I've said before I'd have liked to have seen what he could have done with a full pre-season, his own players and his system. I think we'd have done really well given time.
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Bit of a sad day really. Fair play to him, kept us up in difficult circumstances, got the best signing in years to come here. The football was up and down but moving in the right direction and I would have loved to see what he could do with a full pre season and a few more of his own signings.
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Thoroughly good bloke and I wish him all the best. Lets see how many more managers want to come and take some of the abuse he has.
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Bit of a sad day really. Fair play to him, kept us up in difficult circumstances, got the best signing in years to come here. The football was up and down but moving in the right direction and I would have loved to see what he could do with a full pre season and a few more of his own signings.
Spot on. Would trust him with transfers etc a hell of a lot more than I do Aisla.
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Its Ailsa. And I hope thats the last time I have to make that correction.
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Quite sad about this really. I hoped he would succeed and wanted him to be well enough to manage the next season.
I worry that no-one's going to be good enough for some folk....hope I'm wrong.
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Yes some of the results were shite. Yes some of the decisions from him were baffling, but I'm sure a lot of us could see what he trying to achieve. Above all he kept his dignity and I wish him well for his future health.
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Now the fun begins..
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Leeg - for the benefit of us pedants could you change the title to P28.
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i'l miss him more if we end up with Hughes
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Good luck to the bloke, i hope he gets another crack in management before he retires, but i think it's for the best all round really.
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It's 18 on my laptop. I think it's to do with the number of posts per page you have set.
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Good luck GH, but he wont be missed
Yes he will.
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It looked as if things were turning around until Man City away, which was one of many odd decisions he made (Pires, Liverpool, loaning Bannan). Good luck, good health but this club needs better.
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Best of luck for a full and speedy recovery Gerard. I don't question Randy's committment to Villa, I want him to go out and show the doubters that he wants the best by getting in Ancelotti.
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Maybe the doctors advised against him returning, he banged his fists when he heard this because he believes he's healthy enough to return, Villa had some doubt anyway, when hearing what the doctors had to say it made their decision easier.
Since the signing of Bent I've seen some really promising things from the team and Houllier. I'm very sorry to see his health got in the way of him doing his job, atleast we now have the chance of carefully selecting our next manager.
We ended the season on a high note, lets look at the positives and look towards the future.
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I don't think it's the most mutual of consents.
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I m not sad he s gone as the felling I had with about 6 games to go was one of fear and dread. We should not have been in that position.
But I thank him for Bent and genuinely hope he has a long healthy life.
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Heard it on Radio 5 on the way home and they had Pat Murphy on. According to him, Hughes has a day 'window' in which to inform Fulham that he was going elsewhere. This was a contractual agreement and that window was yesterday, so as of today Hughes is the Fulham manager and we would have to approach them and pay compo in order to get him.
Murphy also suggests that Moyes may be a target since Lerner is attracted by him being able to work on a shoestring, although again, Everton will want money off us if Moyes wants to leave. He thinks Ancelotti will want too much money and informs us that his tip is Steve McLaren. He's available now, he has extensive European contacts (apparently) and is eager to prove himself.
In mu opinion we should not be looking at Steve McLaren to steady the ship. He has a stigma over here and if he wants to rebuild his reputation in England, I don't want us to be the guinea pig.
God knows what will happen. Lets hope its over quickly, for better or worse.
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I don't think it's the most mutual of consents.
That's how I read it. Hope we haven't got another Tribunal on the horizon
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Leeg - for the benefit of us pedants could you change the title to P28.
I put it at page 28 but someone changed it to 18.
I've changed it back.
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I for one are quite dissapointed that he's gone, would've liked to see what he could've done next season with his own players, I sincerely hope with everything i've got that we have'nt given Ged the chop to bring in Mark Hughes.
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http://astonvilla-views.com/2011/06/01/pat-murphy-hughes-mcclaren-rafa-avfc/
I really do hope the board listen to the fans this time, getting it wrong the first time - fair enough, everyone makes mistakes, getting it wrong twice shows you're inept.
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I'm praying it's Hughes if the alternative is McLaren.
Jesus wept.
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I'm praying it's Hughes if the alternative is McLaren.
Jesus wept.
Maybe that's the idea - float McLaren as a possibility so anyone else is a relief.
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I'm praying it's Hughes if the alternative is McLaren.
Jesus wept.
Exactly.
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http://astonvilla-views.com/2011/06/01/pat-murphy-hughes-mcclaren-rafa-avfc/
I really do hope the board listen to the fans this time, getting it wrong the first time - fair enough, everyone makes mistakes, getting it wrong twice shows you're inept.
The last group of people they should be listening to is the fans, or it'll end in a Newcastle-esque circus.
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I'm praying it's Hughes if the alternative is McLaren.
Jesus wept.
[/quote
Maybe that's the idea - float McLaren as a possibility so anyone else is a relief.
And give Moany Murphy the chewed-out bone.
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Not McClaren please or Curbishley, I repeat.
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Not McClaren please or Curbishley, I repeat.
I think it's absolutely worth repeating.
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Van Gaal please!
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I hope he makes as well a recovery as he can, and settles down to a quiet retirement with his family.
That said, I am not really sorry to see him go.
I warmed to him as a man, but could not warm to him as our manager, for me for every step forward he took 3 steps back.
Farewell Gerard.
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http://astonvilla-views.com/2011/06/01/pat-murphy-hughes-mcclaren-rafa-avfc/
I really do hope the board listen to the fans this time, getting it wrong the first time - fair enough, everyone makes mistakes, getting it wrong twice shows you're inept.
The last group of people they should be listening to is the fans, or it'll end in a Newcastle-esque circus.
So you want McLaren as manager?
This place will go into meltdown if he's our new manager.
If Houllier's health wasn't in question he'd still be manager next season.
If you're manager of Aston Villa how can you even consider McLaren? There is only one option...
(http://football.uk.reuters.com/uploads/2011/04/14/fs_2011-04-14T192905Z_01_MOS31_RTRIDSP_2_SOCCER-EUROPA.jpg)
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http://astonvilla-views.com/2011/06/01/pat-murphy-hughes-mcclaren-rafa-avfc/
I really do hope the board listen to the fans this time, getting it wrong the first time - fair enough, everyone makes mistakes, getting it wrong twice shows you're inept.
The last group of people they should be listening to is the fans, or it'll end in a Newcastle-esque circus.
My thoughts exactly - if Man Utd directors had listened to fans Fergie wouldn't have lasted as long as Xmas 1990.
Listen to us when it comes to things like ticket sales and which beer to sell in the ground.
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http://astonvilla-views.com/2011/06/01/pat-murphy-hughes-mcclaren-rafa-avfc/
I really do hope the board listen to the fans this time, getting it wrong the first time - fair enough, everyone makes mistakes, getting it wrong twice shows you're inept.
The last group of people they should be listening to is the fans, or it'll end in a Newcastle-esque circus.
agreed, if they had listen to the fans 3 months ago we would have got rid of GED and brought in Allardyce
no thanks
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Any of Ancelotti, Benitez, Hughes or Moyes would please me greatly
Probably in that order as well
I wonder if the fact that in Hughes' case, him being known to have worked and gotten the best out of Ireland and Warnock would work in his favour for getting the job
Those two back to form would save a fair bit of dough
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Hughes or McClaren? well there goes the theory there's better choices than last summer.
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So you want McLaren as manager?
This place will go into meltdown if he's our new manager.
If Houllier's health wasn't in question he'd still be manager next season.
If you're manager of a football club how can you even consider McLaren? There is only one option...
Where did I say I wanted McClaren? I said that they shouldn't listen to the fans. Newcastle did that and ended up with Shearer. Football fans are the most bi-polar people imaginable, and change their minds all to easily. I'd prefer RL and PF to pick the best man for the job, not who the fans want. (I accept that these may not be different people).
And I agree that Houllier would have been manager next season were it not for the health issues. As I would have liked it.
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Can't say i'm sorry to see him go, but I bear him no malice.
Alas the candidate list isn't inspiring.
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Hughes or McClaren? well there goes the theory there's better choices than last summer.
Hughes who just finished higher than Houllier you mean? Great logic there Greg.
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Urgh... I wasn't saying ''let the fans pick our new manager''. That would be chaos.
What i'm saying is the board need to be awared that the likes of McLaren is just a no go.
Someone like Villa Boas, Ancelotti, Hughes and Moyes would fit our club well as manager. All 4 managers have the type of personnel to manage our team.
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Urgh... I wasn't saying ''let the fans pick our new manager''. That would be chaos.
What i'm saying is the board need to be awared that the likes of McLaren is just a no go.
Someone like Villa Boas, Ancelotti, Hughes and Moyes would fit our club well as manager. All 4 managers have the type of personnel to manage our team.
i'd take McClaren over both Hughes and Moyes,
he's actually done something,
been knocked down got back up had to leave the country to get work, won the league in Holland with a team who had never won it before,
even in this country he won more than Moyes and Hughes put together with smaller clubs,in lessser time.
he's not liked or respected here, so thats the massive problem, and i admit its a massive problem, and theres no getting over that.
he's certainly no where near my first choice, but he's definitley in front of those other two dullards
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All the best for the future Gerard, and thanks for getting Darren Bent to the club. Err that's about it..
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Reading his comments it's more like he was pushed. Certainly given the last nine months, regardless of his medical prognosis, the argument could be made that the appointment didn't work and purely on results (without going into gaffes) he had taken us backwards. His dubious strategy of trying to get us to play football, as confidence drained away and then sacrificing any organisation in defence, nearly cost us dearly. If the Bent signing is held up as a huge positive, in my view we would never have spent the money if we hadn't been in huge trouble. Maybe that's his legacy - we had to be that bad under him before we'd have a chance of getting someone that good.
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bit sad to see him go because i think he would of done allright with his own player,aslong as he is replaced with either Moyes,Ancelloti or Hughes ill be happy!
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Urgh... I wasn't saying ''let the fans pick our new manager''. That would be chaos.
What i'm saying is the board need to be awared that the likes of McLaren is just a no go.
Someone like Villa Boas, Ancelotti, Hughes and Moyes would fit our club well as manager. All 4 managers have the type of personnel to manage our team.
i'd take McClaren over both Hughes and Moyes,
he's actually done something,
been knocked down got back up had to leave the country to get work, won the league in Holland with a team who had never won it before,
even in this country he won more than Moyes and Hughes put together with smaller clubs,in lessser time.
he's not liked or respected here, so thats the massive problem, and i admit its a massive problem, and theres no getting over that.
he's certainly no where near my first choice, but he's definitley in front of those other two dullards
But it's a different league and different country though, he managed a small market team. Look what happened when he went to Germany? Job was too big for him and couldn't handle the pressure of the Bundesliga managing a club who'd just won the league earlier. He showed he couldn't rise to a new level.
He hasn't done it in England. It may have worked for him somewhere else but it hasn't quite happened here.
He doesn't fill me with much confidence and people will dismiss him with how he failed so badly with the England team.
I'm sorry, but he's not the man for the job, he might be the man for another club, but if we really want to progress we need to look at a manager who fits the bill for this club. I just can't see McLaren taking us to that new level we dream of.
I would have more faith in Moyes and Hughes than McLaren.
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Reading what Faulkner & Houllier have said is confusing to say the least but none the less
I reckon it's best for both club and individual -
Enjoy your retirement (if that's what you do) Gerard - we will never know if you could have
taken us to where we all strive -
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He doesn't fill me with much confidence and people will dismiss him with how he failed so badly with the England team.
Look at the mess Capello has made of the same job.Maclaren wouldn't get the fans excited but he gets a raw deal.If he repeated wheat he did at Boro he'd be the best Villa manager since Saunders-one trophy,one European final
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Houllier has been an on field and PR disaster. FACT!. He thought concentrating on the starter (Fitness) and the Dessert (Scouting) would be fine whilst leaving McDuff to cook the main course. The Liverpool debacle was reason enough to sack him. Did Peter Taylor wave at Forest fans as manager of Derby in 1982? The Double Whammy of Man City especially the 2nd one was a disgrace especially as The Other Lot won a trophy and anyone here cannot remember the last time we won FA Cup. A Villa match on the box and I knew the result before kick off - so did everyone. Everyone!
Added to that we PAID Boro for McDuff's services. That pair is the worst appointment in terms of thought process in Villa's recent history. Faulkner needs to be sacked tomorrow too. An abject appointment from the past.
Moyes, Hughes and even McLaren are more in touch with day to day management than Houllier. A shambolic season - he is gone. For GOOD on everyone's part.
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Does shouting FACT! mean that we can't disagree with your post then?
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Sad to see Gerard go, seems a nice man to me. Having seen the squad before the West Ham game boarding the bus with Houllier, I would say there was definite respect there despite what the stirrers say. As for replacements:
Moyes - cannot see a real reason why he would leave Everton for us, unless we would guarantee him funds. That seems to be his only gripe currently.
Hughes - Meh. We wouldn't progress, but we shouldn't do worse than 7-11th each season. Not where we should be aiming each August though.
McLaren - A risk, a definite risk, and not one I'd like to see us take. I cannot imagine him attracting a high calibre of player, or indeed persuading the current dis-illusioned bunch to stay.
Ancelotti, Villaa Boas - Dream on.
Martin Jol - Maybe.
Maybe just keep McAllister and McDonald on for a year before Guardiola's contract expires ;)
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Bit harsh on Mcclaren re Wolfsburg, their best players were sold from under him as he arrived, not to be replaced. I wouldn't mind seeing what he can do for us.
Best of luck GH, hope you keep well and thanks for your efforts. Thanks especially for signing Darren Bent, I suspect that this will be remembered as your most significant act.
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I realise that I'm in a small minority on here, but I never quite gave up on GH, even in the darkest of days, although there were one or two occasions when I came close. He did a job under very trying circumstances. I'm disappointed that he's leaving, because I still believe that next season could have been exciting, but although I'm sure it's not what he wants, I am sure for the sake of what is after all a serious life threatening condition, that this resolution is the right one.
I have no doubt that Gerard is a thoroughly decent man and I wish him the best.
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Houllier has been an on field and PR disaster. FACT!.
Didn't read any further. As soon as someone shouts FACT after expressing their own subjective view, I am not interested. I prefer to read reasoned argument, and make up my own mind. Thanks.
By the way, I disagree with what you say in the first sentence. But that is simply my opinion.
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I realise that I'm in a small minority on here, but I never quite gave up on GH,
I think you are probably in the silent majority actually.
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Sorry to see GH go, if it wasn't for his health problems he would have been good for Villa, he had a vision of the way we should play and i was confident he would bring in the players we needed.
Hughes or Moyes would be a disappointment as neither fills me with confidence of getting us challenging for top four or playing the kind of football we all want to watch.
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Best for all concerned. At least Villa can now get on with the task of appointing the right man. Something that was near to impossible last August.
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From the statement I've just read printed on SSN and the recorded back up interview with Pinnochio the mutual consent line hasn't lasted long. GH is looking forward to returning to football as early as possible next season after a summer break. Pinnochio has stuck the boot into us again (for a change) by saying he is shocked because GH was telling him in the last few days how he was looking forward to pre-season training. Obviously no gagging order involved in this pay off deal.
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haven't felt this way about a change of manager since the 1986 back page of the sun which read "Villa Axe Turner"
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Moxley in the Daily Heil reckons the compensation deal works out at a total cost of 150k a game for Houllier. Not bad for nine months work.
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Moxley in the Daily Heil reckons the compensation deal works out at a total cost of 150k a game for Houllier. Not bad for nine months work.
They've had it in for us ever since we refused to give the Nazi salute.
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I realise that I'm in a small minority on here, but I never quite gave up on GH, even in the darkest of days, although there were one or two occasions when I came close. He did a job under very trying circumstances. I'm disappointed that he's leaving, because I still believe that next season could have been exciting, but although I'm sure it's not what he wants, I am sure for the sake of what is after all a serious life threatening condition, that this resolution is the right one.
I have no doubt that Gerard is a thoroughly decent man and I wish him the best.
I'm in your gang on this one.
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I realise that I'm in a small minority on here, but I never quite gave up on GH, even in the darkest of days, although there were one or two occasions when I came close. He did a job under very trying circumstances. I'm disappointed that he's leaving, because I still believe that next season could have been exciting, but although I'm sure it's not what he wants, I am sure for the sake of what is after all a serious life threatening condition, that this resolution is the right one.
I have no doubt that Gerard is a thoroughly decent man and I wish him the best.
I'm in your gang on this one.
Can you have a gang of two?
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Cannot understand the support for Houllier on here. The revisionism imo is stunning. He has pocketed a fair old packet from his awful tenure at Villa Park so I dont understand this feeling sorry for him either.
He made one great signing, a good loan one. Gave a few of our younger players chances. I think they were the highlights. Certainly dont think he should attempt to return to football management again and with his earnings from our club can enjoy a happy healthy retirement.
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I'm quite baffled how so many people on here wanted him to stay in charge after the season we've just had.
Final position was 9th but where were we before GMac semi rescued the season?
The guy was completely out of his depth and I lost confidence in him a long long time ago.
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There is only one option...
(http://football.uk.reuters.com/uploads/2011/04/14/fs_2011-04-14T192905Z_01_MOS31_RTRIDSP_2_SOCCER-EUROPA.jpg)
Rick Moranis?
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Apart from all the others oddities (the white flag raised in FA Cup, the players played out of role, etc.) I'll never forget that Mr GH kept on the bench this guy:
www.youtube.com/embed/fWQyA0kMqTQ
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i'd take McClaren over both Hughes and Moyes, he's actually done something,
even in this country he won more than Moyes and Hughes put together with smaller clubs,in lessser time.
He won one cup, but the league doesnt lie. One top ten finish in six seasons at one of the biggest spending clubs of that era does not equal success.
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All things considered, I thought he was bloody rubbish.
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Cannot understand the support for Houllier on here. The revisionism imo is stunning.
before GMac semi rescued the season?
Talk about revisionism!
No, it wasn't a great season, but I would have liked to have seen what he could have done with a full summer and his own stamp on the squad. However, given his health issues, I understand the boards stance on this.
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I didn't, the guy before me did.
Why would you have liked to have seen what he could have done, when youve already seen what he couldnt do? I just dont get it. If 'he' had a half decent season then yeah I'd be with you.
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I didn't, the guy before me did.
Why would you have liked to have seen what he could have done, when youve already seen what he couldnt do? I just dont get it. If 'he' had a half decent season then yeah I'd be with you.
I would like to see what he could have done without the crippling injuries that we had (look back and see what kind of team we had out before January). I would like to see what he could have done with a full summer under his belt and the players adopting his training methods before the season started, not a several games into the season - I see how that could be disruptive. I would like to see what he could do with his stamp on the squad, more players of his choosing and not some of the dross left by MON.
There are just three things, but key things that affected his time in charge. It's all too easy to switch managers nowadays in football, but the grass isn't always greener. However, as I said, I understand and support the board on this one because of the health angle.
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Who or what is ''Ailsa''?
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There is only one option...
(http://football.uk.reuters.com/uploads/2011/04/14/fs_2011-04-14T192905Z_01_MOS31_RTRIDSP_2_SOCCER-EUROPA.jpg)
Rick Moranis?
Looks like he could be Iker Casillas' daddy (the guy in the photo, not Moranis).
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I realise that I'm in a small minority on here, but I never quite gave up on GH, even in the darkest of days, although there were one or two occasions when I came close. He did a job under very trying circumstances. I'm disappointed that he's leaving, because I still believe that next season could have been exciting, but although I'm sure it's not what he wants, I am sure for the sake of what is after all a serious life threatening condition, that this resolution is the right one.
I have no doubt that Gerard is a thoroughly decent man and I wish him the best.
I'm in your gang on this one.
Me too.
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Who or what is ''Ailsa''?
I once had a cat called Ailsa. We named here after Ailsa Craig as I was working at the Turnberry hotel at the time which looked right out over said rock
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Who or what is ''Ailsa''?
Mark Hughes:
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_zCO5p9vR5gY/SzkQjpgi2nI/AAAAAAAAABc/0_3wBg99ISc/s200/untitled.bmp)
Ailsa Stewart from Aussie soap Home and Away:
(http://ofoi.files.wordpress.com/2008/01/mark_hughes.thumbnail.jpg)
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For the best really I know Dr said he's fine but what would have happened if in sept he has an episode again? Too risky imo
Hope he does well in whatever he does, seemed like a nice fellah
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The only decision that could have been made, we need to get this appointment right and start moving forward again and it has to be David Moyes, he will come.
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Leeg - for the benefit of us pedants could you change the title to P28.
I put it at page 28 but someone changed it to 18.
I've changed it back.
I changed it and explained why. I'm currently on Page 22, by the way. Can't wait to see what Page 28 has to offer!
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I'm only on page 11.
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Leeg - for the benefit of us pedants could you change the title to P28.
I put it at page 28 but someone changed it to 18.
I've changed it back.
I changed it and explained why. I'm currently on Page 22, by the way. Can't wait to see what Page 28 has to offer!
next manager will have been sacked by then, I am on 11 too. The largest number of posts per page is the way to go.
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I'm only on page 11.
Could've sworn this was 36.......?
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I'm only on page 11.
Could've sworn this was 36.......?
36! 36!!!!
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As he says, he wanted to return but needs a few months to recuperate fully. Unfortunately we can't afford that luxury so a parting of the ways is the best for both parties. I'm not sure he will return to full time club management. Surely it's not worth the risk for him?
Sums it up for me. It's a decision taken with both his interests at heart as well as the club's - Houllier, by his own admission, does not expect to be fully recovered for a few months yet and, after the fiasco of last summer Villa need to have a manager 100% focused on preparing the squad during pre-season.
I wish him well.
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I have to agree with most of this although I haven't had time to trawl through all the pages. Mark Hughes in my humble opinion is mid table mediocrity and nothing else. I sincerely hope I'm wrong and I'll do what I always do in times like these ( and there have been many in my time watching the Villa) and that is to give him a chance but the feeling is there that an oportunity has been missed again to make a statement of serious intent. Time will tell.
Hughes would be a terrible appointment at a time when, as has been pointed out on here, the Club has an opportunity to make a statement.
Appointing Hughes just says: "We are a club with limited ambition. We are happy to just bob around mid-table, have the odd cup run and avoid relegation."
To the 'want-away' players it says: "You are right to want away. We will never even remotely worry the teams in the Champions League places."
To the likes of Darren Bent it says: "Call your agent and engineer a move away from here at the earliest opportunity."
Looking at the calibre of the managers currently out of work around Europe, as well as those who could reasonably be tempted into joining us, this would be a massive mistake and I really hope the papers have made this up (as in: "Villa have got no money and are a similiar size to Fulham and Hughes would be cheap = Hughes to Villa).
I'm shocked and disappointed at how many people on here would accept Hughes as a decent appointment.
You might as well scrub out the 'Bright Future' and just leave the 'Proud History'.
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I noticed the statement said a return to football and as opposed to a return to management. It may be he fancies an upstairs job again, which would be better for him health wise while still keeping him involved in football.
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Who or what is ''Ailsa''?
Mark Hughes:
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_zCO5p9vR5gY/SzkQjpgi2nI/AAAAAAAAABc/0_3wBg99ISc/s200/untitled.bmp)
Ailsa Stewart from Aussie soap Home and Away:
(http://ofoi.files.wordpress.com/2008/01/mark_hughes.thumbnail.jpg)
Oh.... Alf's flamin' wife!
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i wish him well for the future...
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I've nothing against him personally and I wish him all the best for the future but from a football point of view I'm glad he's gone. I didn't want him in the first place and I saw nothing while he was here to change my mind. The Man City cup game was a disgrace and to top it off we lost the following game anyway. I also don't understand the credit he gets for signing Bent, we all could have recommended that signing to PF and RL. Hardly a David Platt or Dwight Yorke masterstroke was it?
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We could all have said Bent would be a good buy, I have been saying it since he was at Ipswich, but the manner in which it was executed was exemplary.
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We could all have said Bent would be a good buy, I have been saying it since he was at Ipswich, but the manner in which it was executed was exemplary.
Try telling Oliver Holt, who now looks a prize prick after all his bitching and moaning.
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Oliver Holt is a ******. Everything he said at that time was to try and back up his great pal MON being hard done by.
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http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11677_6964536,00.html
Houllier speaks .
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Key parts:
"I almost died. The doctors advised me to not resume before late in August or early in September. So it was a problem.
"The officials were also scared my comeback could be postponed again at that time. I can understand that. The risk exists.
"They are still traumatised with what happened last year, when Martin O'Neill left five days before the start of the season. So they didn't want such a possibility to happen again.
"I am on form again and I have recovered well. Last week, I went back to the training ground for the first time, and on a human level it is a real pain to have to make such a decision."
Houllier added: "Coaching is my job, my life, my passion.
"Maybe I will go on living in Birmingham for six months or one year, to have a good rest. I am in the countryside and very close to hospital and that is the perfect place."
I wish him all the best.
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As do I. A decent chap.
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I honestly underestimated just how poorly he was. I didn't realise he had 'almost died', so it only reaffirms the wisdom of the decision. I hope he's back on top form soon.
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Key parts:
"I almost died. The doctors advised me to not resume before late in August or early in September. So it was a problem.
"The officials were also scared my comeback could be postponed again at that time. I can understand that. The risk exists.
"They are still traumatised with what happened last year, when Martin O'Neill left five days before the start of the season. So they didn't want such a possibility to happen again.
"I am on form again and I have recovered well. Last week, I went back to the training ground for the first time, and on a human level it is a real pain to have to make such a decision."
Houllier added: "Coaching is my job, my life, my passion.
"Maybe I will go on living in Birmingham for six months or one year, to have a good rest. I am in the countryside and very close to hospital and that is the perfect place."
I wish him all the best.
That's quite a bit different to the spin some were putting on his comments on the day he left. I think he is genuinely very disappointed that his health has forced both parties into this decision. I'm sure Randy/Faulkner were very patient through all of this, and sympathetic. Business is business, and anyone who thinks at that level, he was walking away with nothing is naive. The club seems to have settled this amicably, and it doesn't appear from those comments that he feels pushed. As difficult as it is, he understands the situation, from his and the clubs perspective.
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"Aston Villa's Treatment of Gerard Houllier Was Nothing Short of Scandalous"
http://www.fanhouse.co.uk/2011/06/03/aston-villa-gerard-houllier/?
"Now he joins the ranks of managers jettisoned on owners' whims in Chris Hughton at Newcastle, Sam Allardyce at Blackburn and Carlo Ancelotti at Chelsea when they were doing sound jobs but became victims of ill-informed opinions and judgements.
We thought a bit better of Aston Villa, given Randy Lerner's seemingly enlightened attitudes previously, but after the departure of, and financial settlement with, Martin O'Neill, to be followed by the casting aside of Houllier, they appear to be in the same gutter as the majority in the Premier League."
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It does seem different TV but that could be the reality sinking in now. It's obvious the bloke lives for football and I'm sure he'd have loved a clear run at next season. He's a gent and if he does stick around Brum for the next 12 months, I really hope he gets himself down Villa Park to see a game or two. I imagine he'll be more than welcome.
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It does seem different TV but that could be the reality sinking in now. It's obvious the bloke lives for football and I'm sure he'd have loved a clear run at next season. He's a gent and if he does stick around Brum for the next 12 months, I really hope he gets himself down Villa Park to see a game or two. I imagine he'll be more than welcome.
I'm sure ones emotions at the time and a day or two later once he's had time to reflect would be a little more sedate. However, I genuinely don't think he would have been bitter at the way he ended, just very disappointed all round. A piece of him at the time would naturally have wanted the club to give him more time, and I'm sure he fought his case. In the end the right decision was made, and emotions aside I think he knows it too.
I'm glad he's thinking about sticking around the area. He'd be brilliant to have aound the club, even in an advisory capacity. Hasn't Sir Graham occasionally provided advice to the club? Maybe GH can do likewise.
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"Aston Villa's Treatment of Gerard Houllier Was Nothing Short of Scandalous"
http://www.fanhouse.co.uk/2011/06/03/aston-villa-gerard-houllier/?
"Now he joins the ranks of managers jettisoned on owners' whims in Chris Hughton at Newcastle, Sam Allardyce at Blackburn and Carlo Ancelotti at Chelsea when they were doing sound jobs but became victims of ill-informed opinions and judgements.
We thought a bit better of Aston Villa, given Randy Lerner's seemingly enlightened attitudes previously, but after the departure of, and financial settlement with, Martin O'Neill, to be followed by the casting aside of Houllier, they appear to be in the same gutter as the majority in the Premier League."
Had to look who had written such uninformed bollocks.
Ian Ridley - 'nuff said.
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"Aston Villa's Treatment of Gerard Houllier Was Nothing Short of Scandalous"
http://www.fanhouse.co.uk/2011/06/03/aston-villa-gerard-houllier/?
"Now he joins the ranks of managers jettisoned on owners' whims in Chris Hughton at Newcastle, Sam Allardyce at Blackburn and Carlo Ancelotti at Chelsea when they were doing sound jobs but became victims of ill-informed opinions and judgements.
We thought a bit better of Aston Villa, given Randy Lerner's seemingly enlightened attitudes previously, but after the departure of, and financial settlement with, Martin O'Neill, to be followed by the casting aside of Houllier, they appear to be in the same gutter as the majority in the Premier League."
Had to look who had written such uninformed bollocks.
Ian Ridley - 'nuff said.
Ian "I Know Tony Adams, me" Ridley?
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Even after the terrible defeats at City and Liverpool when I couldn't stand the site of GH,I did feel a bit sad with the news that he's gone. I know its all ifs and buts,but I feel he wouldve vastly improved the squad over the summer,got rid of the deadwood and we wouldve improved as a team,and be easier on the eye.
There's not much he doesn't know about the game,and he's wealth of experience could've shaped the future of the the club for a while,like a poor mans Wenger.
He's a decent guy,and I wish him all the best,especially concerning his health,for the future.
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Ian "I Know Tony Adams, me" Ridley?
That's the twat.
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I had no idea it was that serious. I think it's hard to find fault with any of Villa's conduct over this matter. Feel sorry for GHou but it really is the best decision for everyone concerned.
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I had no idea it was that serious. I think it's hard to find fault with any of Villa's conduct over this matter. Feel sorry for GHou but it really is the best decision for everyone concerned.
Reading the above, I have to agree with you. A shame. I'd have loved to see what could have been with him in charge.
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I think most of us would agree that no job is worth dying for (other than a trainee coroners practice body) and I would like to wish Houllier all the best for a speedy recovery. Who knows what might have been? Were the results towards the end of the season the start of the turnaround in our fortunes or just a bit of luck. That chapter has closed, so onwards and upwards.
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I had no idea it was that serious. I think it's hard to find fault with any of Villa's conduct over this matter. Feel sorry for GHou but it really is the best decision for everyone concerned.
Reading the above, I have to agree with you. A shame. I'd have loved to see what could have been with him in charge.
How were you thinking about our future after the games v Sunderland, Wolves and West Brom. Were you looking forward to seeing how it all panned out after these games ?
I wanted him gone after each of these games because all I could see was clueless , inept performances that I was sure at the time were gong to see us going down.
That along with the Anfield debacle and the 2 joyless trips to Eastlands.
Don't get me wrong , I wish the man a complete and speedy recovery but as for his reign as our manager I'm glad it is over.
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Gerard's plans would have been for the long haul with what he was trying to achieve. You only have to see what Sir Graham Taylor said about football management and the circumstances in Gerard's arrival at Villa. No manager in the world would have had a good 3 months with the problems he had to deal with.
I would rather have Gerard in charge now and preparing for the next 3 years and more if his health was not a issue.
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Now he joins the ranks of managers jettisoned on owners' whims in Chris Hughton at Newcastle, Sam Allardyce at Blackburn and Carlo Ancelotti at Chelsea when they were doing sound jobs but became victims of ill-informed opinions and judgements.
Not unlike this stream of bull****, then?
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I had no idea it was that serious. I think it's hard to find fault with any of Villa's conduct over this matter. Feel sorry for GHou but it really is the best decision for everyone concerned.
Reading the above, I have to agree with you. A shame. I'd have loved to see what could have been with him in charge.
Two more seasons of inept football and crap results I reckon.
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I disagree, but we'll never know.
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As he says, he wanted to return but needs a few months to recuperate fully. Unfortunately we can't afford that luxury so a parting of the ways is the best for both parties. I'm not sure he will return to full time club management. Surely it's not worth the risk for him?
Sums it up for me. It's a decision taken with both his interests at heart as well as the club's - Houllier, by his own admission, does not expect to be fully recovered for a few months yet and, after the fiasco of last summer Villa need to have a manager 100% focused on preparing the squad during pre-season.
I wish him well.
There is no way that he will meet the physical demands of being a premiership manager again. His Aorta has now suffered two damaging injuries that in turn weaken the wall of the vessell. The continuing treatment for the remainder of his life will be to limit stress and control blood pressure.