Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: VillaZogmariner on April 29, 2011, 11:08:19 AM
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Now that we are as good as safe in the league now, do you think we should experiment a bit more with our line ups between now and the end of the season? I'm not saying play them all at the same time, but maybe mix and match more.
I'd like to see Seitgeist, Bradley, Delph, Bannan, Gardner and Johnson give more of a run out for a start, as well as giving Makoun more chance to get used to the Premier League.
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I've already said inthe pre match thread I'd start Bannan behind Bent.
We need to build up our youngsters and show abit of faith in them.
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I would like to see Delph Gardner and Bannon given some more time on the pitch and apparently Bannon is in the squad after being recalled from Leeds, I think we have seen the last of Pires on the bench. They wont make many changes though each position in the league is worth a lot of money.
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I'd certainly like to see a Gardner, Bannan, Delph in lieu of Pires - surely his work here is done now.
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I think we should give kids run out after 65 minutes depending on the game. I would like to try out the young goalkeeper. If we got it right he could be our Iker Callias
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I'm willing to try anal but NOT if I have to be the recipient.
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Yes. I'd like to see some youngsters given a chance. Maybe even give Bradley a fair chance. Maybe it is time to give Makoun some games again to help him acclimatise for next season he is after all much more likely to be here next season than NRC or Petrov.
We should try to give the players who will be here next season a game.
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Absolutely. Delph and Bannan should be playing, Clark at centre-back (with Cuellar), give Baker a few more games, bring Delfounseo in alongside Bent and maybe even play Guzan.
If GH is staying, I'd also bring back his original plan of getting the team to pass the ball a lot more. There was quite a few games where we were the better team, but lost due to poor defensive errors. I thought, in general, we looked ok passing the ball around and the players were just getting used to it.
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If Bradley doesn't play in the last few games then the decision must have been made already that he's not staying
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At £1m per league placing, I would say that experimenting is out of the question.
I don't think Wigan's rivals would be too happy either.
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Yes to Clark, gardner, banana and delph
Also, the players who have no future could possibly be benched
Their is a financial implication here though as in places mean millions of extra income
This is not some science lab experiment
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i hope not to the point it affects our results. a good end to the season would take some of the sting out of this piss poor excuse for a season
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Spot on and will strengthen demand for summer ST purchases
Every game is massive, especially tomorrow
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---------------------Seigrist-----------------
---Walker---Cuellar---Clark---Baker---
---------------Makoun---Delph------------
--Young---------Bannan------Downing--
---------------------Bent---------------------
Friedel, Collins, Bradley, Albrighton, Gardner, Petrov, Agbonlahor
That side would beat Wigan.
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If Bradley doesn't play in the last few games then the decision must have been made already that he's not staying
Surely we'd have sent him back if that was the case?
I'd like to see a couple of changes, Clark is due a return, and Bannan playing off of Bent, and Albrighton is sureky getting frustrated on the bench. The problem is there are so many players around the squad that could do with a game we could change the entire team...where do you stop?? I'd hate to be a manager.
With Houllier still out of action I'd not expect any great changes, he'd be murdered if it went wrong, there's enough people sharpening knives as it is.
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---------------------Seigrist-----------------
---Walker---Cuellar---Clark---Baker---
---------------Makoun---Delph------------
--Young---------Bannan------Downing--
---------------------Bent---------------------
Friedel, Collins, Bradley, Albrighton, Gardner, Petrov, Agbonlahor
That side would beat Wigan.
i thought that about most our our sides vs Wigan at home since they've been promoted but unfortunately it hasnt been the case. Hopefully we can stuff them this time.
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I think with the gap between 9th & 14th so tight, we need to make sure we pick up six points in the next two games. Then maybe go with something similar to VS's team above. The kids put in a pretty good turn against ManYoo earlier in the season, maybe with the pressure off they might surprise a few people.
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I expect an unchanged starting line up tomorrow, bannan on the bench instead of Pires
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Yes, we've found a bit of form. Let's not dock around
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-------------------Friedel-------------------
---Walker---Cuellar---Clark---LYoung--
---------------Makoun---Bradley------------
Albrighton-------Bannan------Downing--
---------------------Bent---------------------
Would be as about as untried as I would go. I may be being a bit harsh on the likes of Young, Petrov and NRC but it is important to note that they could come in and we could mix and match. The guys coming in are by no means bad players IMHO and in some cases may prove given the chance than players who have played more this season who have been monumental let downs on and off the pitch or merely proved at best limited on it. The only player who this is harsh on
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That's way too much change for tomorrow
The whole spine of that line up is one experiment too far
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I'd prefer to beat the Baggies first.
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We may still need 2 more points let's not lose sight of that
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Id love to experiment , but the other half wont let us.
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I don't give a toss as long as we get enough points for safety.
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-------------------Friedel-------------------
---Walker---Cuellar---Clark---LYoung--
---------------Makoun---Bradley------------
Albrighton-------Bannan------Downing--
---------------------Bent---------------------
A major problem with our defense this season is that we've had no settled central defense - so the first thing everybody suggests is replacing the central defense we've managed to go 4 games unbeaten with. That makes sense. *shrug*
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Friedel
Walker
Collins
Dunne
Young
Downing
Petrov (c)
NRC
Young
Heskey
Bent
There's your team, set up to win a gritty derby
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I think we should give kids run out after 65 minutes depending on the game. I would like to try out the young goalkeeper. If we got it right he could be our Iker Callias
Well we've had Bannan (optimistically) compared to Iniesta before, so why not. If we can dig out a Baresi or Beckenbauer from the stiffs we'll be set.
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We need to finish as high up the table to earn as much money as possible to buy the best players available in the summer.
Can I assume season ticket holders would be reluctant to make up the difference in lost revenue should we experiment now?
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Experimentation now would be an act of unbelievable naivety
I can't see it happening other than cameo sub appearances
We need a strong finish ie. At least 8 more points
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---------------------Seigrist-----------------
---Walker---Cuellar---Clark---Baker---
---------------Makoun---Delph------------
--Young---------Bannan------Downing--
---------------------Bent---------------------
Friedel, Collins, Bradley, Albrighton, Gardner, Petrov, Agbonlahor
That side would beat Wigan.
I like that. And why not? These lads are going to be our future. The pressure is largely off and they should be encouraged to enjoy their football and show what they can do.
If we end up a position or two lower than what we may have ended up (and you can argue that all you like without ever getting a definitive answer) then the couple of million lost will be money well spent when you look at the experience the lads will be getting.
Anyway, I don't think that squad would cause us to drop places. It's quality, that.
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I really think that some people are making our first team to be something they aren't. What difference does dropping some of them make? I have absolutely zero faith in so many of them. Anyone on here who doesn't shit themself every time the ball goes near Collins and Dunne must have nerves and bowels of steel. The only reason we haven't kept that many clean sheets this season is because those oafs have been playing and if they weren't it was a green youngster like Baker or Herd filling in. Look at Cuellar's performances this season and you won't find much cause to complain and Clark has impressed in spells and has a big future. Anyone who doesn't see Petrov and NRC as deeply limited needs new glasses. I hate to be blunt and I do appreciate both players and their qualities but they are not the greatest players in the world. Makoun is better than Petrov and just needs the game time to get up to speed. With Bradley the jury is out because he has hardly played.
We are safe and we are not going down and I don't really care where we finish outside of that this season. Next season is more important and our performance then will be maximised by having a squad of players who have at least some experience of the game played at premier league speed and who know each others' games. We need to know if Bannan, Delph and Gardner are good enough to have an immediate impact. We could waste millions more than that we would lose in prize money bringing in new players we don't need.
As I say I have absolutely zero faith in many of our current players. I don't think we will beat West Brom with them and West Brom are no great shakes. It is a shocking indictment of how bad our first team are. My team was an extreme selection there is no reason why it wouldn't work with just two changes to give some different players a go?
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We may still need 2 more points let's not lose sight of that
We still need 6 more pts or 3 plus we draw with Wigan
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I would not wan't to make wholesale changes maybe bring Bannan and Gardner in i reckon they would improve the team so that is not a bad thing i would use Albrighton more than we are doing at the moment i really have a lot of faith in this kid i think finishing as high up the table as we can and getting a decent league placing is important after the season we have had because we wan't to attract the best players to Villa Park and our league position could be crucial to do that.
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We're unbeaten in 4 since we dropped Makoun and steadied the ship with the guile and experience of NRC & Petrov in the middle
Now is not the time to "fanny/tinker around", we need more points, starting with 3 tomorrow
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Not much to argue with there Bentman and your team is certainly an option without too much risk, with the possible exception of Bradley, who if he's looking good at Bodymoor Heath should at least be on the bench instead of Pires, who let's face it, has no future here. I'd still like to see Gabby in the middle, especially tomorrow. Agree completely with Ashley Young but if his future really is undecided and there's a real chance he will stay, I'd play him. The thought of a new manager or GH finally telling him to play for the team and to his strengths is worth his inclusion. If not, drop him. He's been all fart and no shit (thanks Paulie) for far too long.
DW, Gardner, who I've only seen once this season against Chelsea and was completely invisible throughout the game, should if up to speed, be also on the bench.
We need to try and finish the season on an high. Apart from the additional money for our final position, a few wins between now and the end of the season will leave us with something to look forward to over the summer, not to mention have an impact it may have on those season ticket holders that are considering not renewing.
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Now that Bannan is back I'd like to see him involved -maybe even starting v Wigan.
Two in midfield behind him and instruct him to focus purely on weighting throughballs into DB, see how the pair of them link up.
That would be about the height of my experimentation though. We already know what Marc Albrighton can bring to the side and he'll probably be a big player for us next season if either Ash or Downing (or both) are off.
For the rest of them, they have to earn the right. Quite a few of them have had decent opportunities this year and whilst most of them haven't badly let us down, they didn't particularly stand out either. Play so well in the reserves that they can't afford to be left out, that should be the challenge to them. Not being handed staring positions on a plate (with the double whammy of deliberately weakening the starting XI).
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Is bannan back? I would use players as subs only. With arsenal & liverpool last I'd like to see as many points on board as possible
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I really think that some people are making our first team to be something they aren't. What difference does dropping some of them make? I have absolutely zero faith in so many of them. Anyone on here who doesn't shit themself every time the ball goes near Collins and Dunne must have nerves and bowels of steel. The only reason we haven't kept that many clean sheets this season is because those oafs have been playing and if they weren't it was a green youngster like Baker or Herd filling in. Look at Cuellar's performances this season and you won't find much cause to complain and Clark has impressed in spells and has a big future. Anyone who doesn't see Petrov and NRC as deeply limited needs new glasses. I hate to be blunt and I do appreciate both players and their qualities but they are not the greatest players in the world. Makoun is better than Petrov and just needs the game time to get up to speed. With Bradley the jury is out because he has hardly played.
We are safe and we are not going down and I don't really care where we finish outside of that this season. Next season is more important and our performance then will be maximised by having a squad of players who have at least some experience of the game played at premier league speed and who know each others' games. We need to know if Bannan, Delph and Gardner are good enough to have an immediate impact. We could waste millions more than that we would lose in prize money bringing in new players we don't need.
As I say I have absolutely zero faith in many of our current players. I don't think we will beat West Brom with them and West Brom are no great shakes. It is a shocking indictment of how bad our first team are. My team was an extreme selection there is no reason why it wouldn't work with just two changes to give some different players a go?
Don't buy most of that TBF Sandman.
Our recent upturn in form from the Everton game onwards has been due in no small part to the return of senior players like Petrov and Luke Young. They gave us a calmness and stability when we needed it most.
The other senior players have also contributed to this turnaround, so to completely skittle the wee bit of cohesion we have just built up again for the sake of it seems pointless to me -particularly when we're still not absolutely, mathematically safe.
Clark, Baker and a few of the others have all shown promise. But they've been caught out making some pretty basic errors that have cost us dearly too. Might come with the territory, them being so young. But as mentioned earlier, their form hasn't been so exceptional that they shouldn't be left out.
In this Black Dog of a season, I don't think we can cock a snook at local pride either. Generally the likes of the Rags and the Olbiyun shouldn't even be on our radar, save for four games per season (when they're in the same division, of course. Not always a given). You can tell always tell how bad a campaign it's been when they're not a million miles off us. Lets not make things any easier for the cants by deliberately fielding weakened teams and giving them the opportunity to finish above us.
Still plenty to play for.
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Heskey for Bent, Walker for Cuellar. This is still largely last season's team, playing last season's football.
No surprise that we look better than earlier this season, but good as some of the kids are, the whole club was in turmoil, and it was unfair to ask them to perform week in, week out.
Where we go from here is the question. Do we rebuild the squad or just bring in a couple of "top" players?
Big, big decisions to be made. But who will make them?
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Heskey for Bent, Walker for Cuellar. This is still largely last season's team, playing last season's football.
No surprise that we look better than earlier this season, but good as some of the kids are, the whole club was in turmoil, and it was unfair to ask them to perform week in, week out.
Where we go from here is the question. Do we rebuild the squad or just bring in a couple of "top" players?
Big, big decisions to be made. But who will make them?
Find out on next weeks episode!
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No, we cannot afford to experiment yet, we are not safe by any means yet.
A win tomorrow, and we probably will be - in my eyes.
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3 PTs tomorrow then maybe give delph or bannan a game v Wigan
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Experimentation at this stage, while still not safe would be ridiculous and points = money so experiment in pre season.
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We are safe, we should definately be giving some of the young players a go even if that means bringing them on for the odd half hour,
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Said William to Kate as soon as they were alone ....
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Win against WBA and Wigan and we are pretty much nailed on for 9th. Experiment against Arsenal and Liverpool.
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Win against WBA and Wigan and we are pretty much nailed on for 9th. Experiment against Arsenal and Liverpool.
Bent at Left Back ? Heskey in goal ? Bannan Centre Half
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I think we need to win today and against wigan before we can be considered "safe"
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We were safe after our win at West Ham. Not sure about experimenting need to finish as high as possible.
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I think we need to win today and against wigan before we can be considered "safe"
Win today and the only way we can get relegated is if we lose every game and every other result for the rest of the season sees the team lowest in the league at the time winning their fixture. And even then they'd need to turn 7 goals around in the GD column.
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I know what your saying but I'd rather make sure were safe before we start messing. Sub appearances I fine I think but I wouldn't alter the starting line up
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Let's just win today before any possible tinkering
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No, not today. Have Bannan on the bench by all means but try and win today. And against Wigan.
If we win 3 of our last four we could finish 8th, certainly 9th.
Top 8 with no manager for the start of the season, losing our best player without adequatly replacing him, only having our star forward for half the season, and having four managers since August would be pretty decent return in the end.
Especially with the kids having got some serious time under their belts. Clark, Bannan and Albrighton are all genuine first team players now.
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Win today and the only way we can get relegated is if we lose every game and every other result for the rest of the season sees the team lowest in the league at the time winning their fixture. And even then they'd need to turn 7 goals around in the GD column.
I think you will find that if the scenario you mentioned takes place our goal difference will be abysmal! if we lose every game our GD will be -20.
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I thought this whole season has been an expermiment. That was the trade off to my mind - a much lower league placing than if we'd stuck to Hoof Ver.1.8.10 but once the bugs are ironed out we'd play a better style. Personally a good finish to the season with a bit of consistency would do for me rather than messing around - surely GH knows how he wants to play and who can play it by now?
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The wins over West Ham and Newcastle were crucial but I wouldn't want us to go into the last two games with even a mathematical possibility of relegation. Play the kids if you think they'll do a better job than the player they replace in the team, don't play the kids just to give them experience.
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I'm SO glad we went with experience today. It was the right choice. Well done to the Gary Mac.
And well picked, WikiVilla...you really DO know everything. Give yourself a big pat on the back for popping up every other post disputing the benefits of youth. You know about as much about football as Ashley Young does about taking free kicks....two fifths of one third of fuck all.
Maybe there's a job in management at Villa for you. They seem to like clueless twats down there.
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It doesn't really matter. As today has shown our first team of senior players consists largely of gutless, spineless limited players. I really cannot see how our young players could have been any worse. Those like WikiVilla who have carped on endlessly on this thread about experience show the same kind of thinking exhibited in bringing on Pires and having him on the bench ahead of other players.
I have said that I have no faith in those players and today my lack of faith has been rewarded. Can we please try something different than these oafs who have failed and failed again this season. It is them who have got us into this mess and they have struggled to get us out of it. We lost today for this first time in twenty odd years to those bastards down the road. A not very good Baggies team with 10 men beat that spine WikiVilla praises so highly. Spineless would be more apt.
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Just outside the ground, wankers
2 main reasons for the loss
Ciaran Clarks inexperience
Taking NRC off for Pires WTF !! Coker was running the show
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Ah...so now experience isn't the way to win games?
Make up your so-called mind.
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I'd play Delph against Wigan...possibly at LB, and definately play Makoun, NRC alongside him.
Might be tempted to play Clark and Cuellar as well.
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We were safe after our win at West Ham. Not sure about experimenting need to finish as high as possible.
Obviously we decided to experiment today!
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Just outside the ground, wankers
2 main reasons for the loss
Ciaran Clarks inexperience
Taking NRC off for Pires WTF !! Coker was running the show
Clark? He was much better than Dunne and Collins who are experienced.
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You're talking sense, Sandman. You'll get nowhere doing that with Wiki.
In order to see the world as he does, you need to first smash your head against a rock for a few hours, then take drain cleaner intravenously.
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Just outside the ground, wankers
2 main reasons for the loss
Ciaran Clarks inexperience
Taking NRC off for Pires WTF !! Coker was running the show
Clark? He was much better than Dunne and Collins who are experienced.
Point being, Clark gave away a needless stupid free kick for the equaliser
very naive
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Good point. Collins and Dunne have been faultless throughout the entire season.
Oh. No, wait. That's not right. Those fuckwits can't go 5 minutes without making ****** of themselves.
I suppose that's why you have an affinity with them.
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maybe it didnt come across on tv but had Clark stood the striker up, maybe seen it our for a throw ?
No, launches himself into a stupid foul and costs us our lead
That is where inexperience is very costly
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Where was Makoun today?
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Where was Makoun today?
African Nations ?
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Don't know? Was it?
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Makoun had a dead leg.
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I thought Collins was pulled out of position far too easily for the winning goal, and created the hgue gap for the scorer to run in too, then he ran around like a headless chicken at the end.
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Where was Cuellar today ?
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Where was Cuellar today ?
On the bench. He might not be a world beater but surely he should have been given a run in the team at some point. He'll probably leave in the summer and we'll never really know how good he could have been. Admittedly he could have been absolutely gash too.
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Collins always gets dragged out of position.
The 1st goal come from LYoung doing a shit pass, and leaving Clark in the mire,
The 2nd goal LYoung was too weak, Petrov did'nt cover his player, and Friedel went to ground too early.Clark was certainly not at fault.His passing, and use of the ball is far superior to Dunne, Collins, and Cuellar.
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How is Clarke better than Cuellar? Never in a million years. The rest of them, an absolute disgrace. No fight, no bottle. Against that shower of shite? Words fail me.
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Why bring back Bannan from leeds and leave him on the bench while you bring on pires who has a limited life as a footballer and young Barry will get more playing time in readiness for next season.
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Well I guess BB wasn't even on the bench, interesting.
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We've been experimenting all season. :'(
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Well I guess BB wasn't even on the bench, interesting.
Baffling, yet Pires gets a slot ??
Beggars belief
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Well I guess BB wasn't even on the bench, interesting.
Baffling, yet Pires gets a slot ??
Beggars belief
I agree completely
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Can I Play Daddy?
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Collins always gets dragged out of position.
The 1st goal come from LYoung doing a shit pass, and leaving Clark in the mire,
The 2nd goal LYoung was too weak, Petrov did'nt cover his player, and Friedel went to ground too early.Clark was certainly not at fault.His passing, and use of the ball is far superior to Dunne, Collins, and Cuellar.
Clark needs to fill out a bit more and get more aggressive in the air if he is to make it as a top defender. He has no recovery pace either so will need to be partnered with someone quick. Cuellar might fit the bill.
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Collins always gets dragged out of position.
The 1st goal come from LYoung doing a shit pass, and leaving Clark in the mire,
The 2nd goal LYoung was too weak, Petrov did'nt cover his player, and Friedel went to ground too early.Clark was certainly not at fault.His passing, and use of the ball is far superior to Dunne, Collins, and Cuellar.
Clark needs to fill out a bit more and get more aggressive in the air if he is to make it as a top defender. He has no recovery pace either so will need to be partnered with someone quick. Cuellar might fit the bill.
Everytime I see Clark play he reminds me of Gareth Barry at the same stage of his career too.