Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: Dave Cooper please on November 24, 2010, 01:25:21 PM
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Did you see this (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/europe/9221957.stm), two Real players were on yellows and if they had been booked in the last group game they would have missed the first knockout game, so, allegedly, they deliberately got themselves booked and sent off so they would miss the meaningless last group game.
Cheating? Poor gamesmanship? Clever thinking?
What do you reckon?
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Bit of all three. It's impossible top prove it was deliberate, so they'll get away with it.
If we were in that position I'd like Villa players to do the same.
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If they really managed this deception, they will consider themselves cunning geniuses.
I think it would make them cheating scum and sadly typical of modern footballers.
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With the amount of money associated with progressing in the competition, players natural hunger to win the trophy, it makes perfect sense to do something like that.
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Is it any different to what Beckham did for England in a Euro/World Cup qualifier against Wales a few years back?
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Beckham did it a few years back to miss an England game against some minnows and be ready for a top of the group clash if I remember right. It's the clever thing to do, I thought it smacked of Mourinho but madrid did it last year too apparently. It made me laugh when Ramos shook the ref's hand for sending him off though.
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Roy Keane got himself booked (or maybe sent off) towards the end of a Republic game and when asked why he replied "Have you seen where we're playing next?" It's always happened, it always will.
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Personally I think the ref should have been wise to it and just pointed to his watch saying "we'll be here all night if you like but I'm not booking you". After all. it was 4-0, Ajax weren't going to stage a comeback.
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Just ban them from the knock out game. Simple.
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It's dodgy but if the rules can be that easily bent, then there's nothing wrong with it. It can be done so why not take advantage..?
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I've certainly heard of this happening before, though can't remember where. Certainly not a new thing anyway. Is there not a fine of any kind imposed as standard for a red card, or if a team generates a number of them throughout a competition? I can't really see as there is much benefit to it really, surely in a game Real don't need anything from they could have just rested a couple of players.
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Steve Foster was trying to get himself sent-off at the end of the 82-83 season so he could play in the final. It was treated mostly as a comical thing to do and everyone seemed to sympathise. I've no problem with them doing it in this situation (Real Madrid) because there is nothing on their last game so may as well have their players suspended for that rather than a crucial tie.
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Makes perfect sense to me. Good tactics
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I must be missing something then. which tends to happen alot.
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I can't really see as there is much benefit to it really, surely in a game Real don't need anything from they could have just rested a couple of players.
I think the cards carry forward into the knock out games, so players still 'on a yellow' could miss future games if booked again. By missing the pointless match the ban is served and they start from scratch in the knock out matches.
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It's wrong but what can the powers that be do they can't prove they went out to get themselves sent off. I think they should be banned for the knockout game to teach them a lesson.
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Very wrong.
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Steve Foster was trying to get himself sent-off at the end of the 82-83 season so he could play in the final. It was treated mostly as a comical thing to do and everyone seemed to sympathise. I've no problem with them doing it in this situation (Real Madrid) because there is nothing on their last game so may as well have their players suspended for that rather than a crucial tie.
I seem to remember this, he tried everything including ridiculous handballs but the ref wouldnt send him off! Brighton did well in the final without him and drew 2-2 with Man U, and he eturned for the replay only lose 4-0.
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Steve Foster was trying to get himself sent-off at the end of the 82-83 season so he could play in the final. It was treated mostly as a comical thing to do and everyone seemed to sympathise. I've no problem with them doing it in this situation (Real Madrid) because there is nothing on their last game so may as well have their players suspended for that rather than a crucial tie.
I seem to remember this, he tried everything to get sent off including ridiculous handballs but the ref wouldnt send him off! Brighton did well in the final without him and drew 2-2 with Man U, and he returned for the replay only to lose 4-0.
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Makes perfect sense to me. Good tactics
Yes it does.
Typical Mourhino scheme
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Cheating foriegn scum may be... maybe no. Mr Glenn Hoddle said that that was a common thing to do in England when bookings in reserve matches counted towards bans. First team players got themselves booked away from the glare of publicity. A change of rule put a stop to that so players in PL have to be more careful.
Still having seen it I can not believe how blatant Alonso and Ramos were!
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It would have been more clever/riskier if they had fouled to get booked.
Anyway, the real question, as Coops suggests is ''Is it 'sendings off' or 'sending offs'?'' Come on BE, sort it.
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When Captain Golden Bollocks did it, he was being clever. When Madrid players do it, they're cheating foreigners. You can't have it both ways.
The only people it should concern are the other teams in that group, as Madrid playing a weakened team could have an effect on who finished third. I can't see Auxerre getting anything there though.
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It leaves a bad taste in the mouth.
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If I recall rightly Ugo kicked Robbie Fowler 10 feet up in the air to get a booking in a game against Liverpool we were losing 3-0 anyway so he would miss the next League game rather than the League Cup final against leeds. Howver, I think Robbie was in on it as he certainly made the most of it and very sportingly shook hands with Ugo as soon as he was on his feet with a big grin on his face.
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It leaves a bad taste in the mouth.
That's what she said.
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Very clever thing to do imo.
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I say fair play. It's a stupid rule with the yellow cards, so fair game for getting around an unfair rule.
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I say fair play. It's a stupid rule with the yellow cards, so fair game for getting around an unfair rule.
So timewasting shouldn't be a yellow card? Or that multiple yellow cards shouldn't result in a suspension?
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It's called 'cheat to win', Mourinho thought it was in his best intrest to use that tactic but what he didn't do very well was giving out his instructions to Ramos and Alonso in how they should get sent off. Just go in and slide a player from behind, why make it so obvious with the tedious, timewasting tactics which they mornicially they did twice. It was so blatant.
It's not nice seeing things like this, it's quite sad that it was done but managers these days will do all sorts so they can wriggle past certain rules legally.
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It would have been more clever/riskier if they had fouled to get booked.
Anyway, the real question, as Coops suggests is ''Is it 'sendings off' or 'sending offs'?'' Come on BE, sort it.
Neither or is it not either????? :-\ :'(
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I've just watched it on you tube and it's hilarious! Alonso for just sheer ridiculousness, the numerous false starts in run-ups, the incredibly long run up in the first place; and Ramos for shaking the ref's hand for sending him off.
Brilliant!!
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Yellow cards were a waste of time ...hahehaheeee
But really what was the point as the side 4-0 up, with 10 mins to go and injury time, wasting time so what?
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Was alll pre planned its to do with not being able to get suspended at a later stage. Was discussed by Rudi Hullit on a highlight show ......
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Very smart tactical move. I'm all for it.
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Hopefully, one day soon, people will be moaning about Villa doing the same thing to avoid suspensions in the last 16 of the CL
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You should all ask your daughterS-in-law or some passerS-by; then again, you could try random grown-upS, a couple of ten-year-oldS. You might get a few cop-outS but after numerous merry-go-roundS, you would eventually find, or even infer that these were sendingS-off.
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What if two players or more from the same team raised their legs at the same time to control the ball which was heading for an opposition player's head. Would that be given as a foul for ...
feets up
feet ups
feets ups
or would the ref not give a foul due to a potential grammatical inaccuracy?
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How many sugars does Mourinho take in his half time tea?
2 spoonfulls or 2 spoonsfull?
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You should all ask your daughterS-in-law or some passerS-by; then again, you could try random grown-upS, a couple of ten-year-oldS. You might get a few cop-outS but after numerous merry-go-roundS, you would eventually find, or even infer that these were sendingS-off.
Thank you!
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Why do I get the impression if this was Zilina UEFA would throw the book at them but since its Madrid they will just change the rules in future?
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How many sugars does Mourinho take in his half time tea?
2 spoonfulls or 2 spoonsfull?
Neither, he goes straight to the hard stuff and has three gins and tonic. Or three gin and tonics.
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Throw the book at them!
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Mourinho, Alsonso, Ramos and both goalkeepers have been charged by uefa.
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What if two players or more from the same team raised their legs at the same time to control the ball which was heading for an opposition player's head. Would that be given as a foul for ...
feets up
feet ups
feets ups
or would the ref not give a foul due to a potential grammatical inaccuracy?
None of these. Feet up.
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The BBC's story about these red cards and the charges being brought also included a snippet about the manager of Cluj "going mental" and smashing up the dugout.
Sadly, it wasn't as mental as the story had portrayed.
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Mourinho, Alsonso, Ramos and both goalkeepers have been charged by uefa.
I don;t agree with that. It was a smart tactical move by Jose.
Jose might be arrogant and act like he thinks he's the smartest guy in the room, but that's only because he IS the smartest guy in the room
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What if two players or more from the same team raised their legs at the same time to control the ball which was heading for an opposition player's head. Would that be given as a foul for ...
feets up
feet ups
feets ups
or would the ref not give a foul due to a potential grammatical inaccuracy?
None of these. Feet up.
Thanks for the heads-up!
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Mourinho, Alsonso, Ramos and both goalkeepers have been charged by uefa.
I don;t agree with that. It was a smart tactical move by Jose.
Jose might be arrogant and act like he thinks he's the smartest guy in the room, but that's only because he IS the smartest guy in the room
Doesn't stop him being a prick.
It's absolutely the correct decision to charge them, they should be banned for a few games.
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Doesn't stop him being a prick.
It's absolutely the correct decision to charge them, they should be banned for a few games.
Behave!
The plonker in all of this is the referee. Given how blatant it was the ref should have the limited common sense required to see what they were trying to do and not give it to them on a plate. A simple stopping of his watch and a wave of play on was all that was needed. He could then have put the incident in to his match report and let UEFA deal with the club.
I'd ban the ref before I banned the players or coaching staff.
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Roy Keane got himself booked (or maybe sent off) towards the end of a Republic game and when asked why he replied "Have you seen where we're playing next?" It's always happened, it always will.
That was classic.
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Didn't Beckham do something similar for England once?
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Fairplay Jose. Looked terrible but highly entertaining. The most influential manager in the last 10 years ..........
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Didn't Beckham do something similar for England once?
Yes. He got a deliberate yellow vs Wales in a qualifier for the same reasons as the Madrid players; To miss the next game.
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Mourinho, Alsonso, Ramos and both goalkeepers have been charged by uefa.
I don;t agree with that. It was a smart tactical move by Jose.
Jose might be arrogant and act like he thinks he's the smartest guy in the room, but that's only because he IS the smartest guy in the room
You in a room with him as you type UK?
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Roy Keane got himself booked (or maybe sent off) towards the end of a Republic game and when asked why he replied "Have you seen where we're playing next?" It's always happened, it always will.
Andy Townsend was saying on Talkshite last year how Dalian was whooping in the shower after a game because he'd managed to get himself suspended for a Boxing day fixture.
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I remember that rumour about sicknote getting himself suspended over christmas, I also remember a midweek game around that time against Southampton when we lost 1-0. The game was almost called off because of snow, I heard that Atkinson and McGrath were in Rosie's on Solihull the night before thinking the game would be postponed, during the game they were all over the place.