Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: eastie on November 06, 2010, 06:51:20 PM
-
Just been reading on the mirror website there seems a war of words between gerard and Carew and both criticising each other publicly - can't paste the article because I'm on iPod but houllier lauched his blast at Carew after today's game in his press conference, referring to him being stupid and living in the past.
-
Really? Can't imagine him featuring much again if true.
-
Clicky (http://www.football365.com/story/0,17033,8690_6490963,00.html)
-
Just read that "article."
Content aside, it was one of the most appallingly written things I've seen in ages.
Whether it was true or not, who knows? But yes, Carew does need to up his game for sure.
-
Good riddance to what has become bad rubbish.
-
I'm with Gerard on this one. Methinks Carew's days are numbered.
-
I blame MON
-
Indeed. Looking at it, he's very stupid, and now (barring injuries) don't want him playing for the villa any more. If he thinks that he doesn't need to earn a new deal after the rubbish he's produced over the last year or so, then he's absolutely deluded
-
Aston Villa boss Gerard Houllier turned on Norwegian striker John Carew by labelling the player 'stupid' after their 1-1 draw at Fulham.
Carew had been set to deputise for injured Emile Heskey against Fulham but he damaged a calf muscle in training and missed out.
Fulham 1-1 Aston Villa: Late Hangeland header denies Houllier victory
But Carew, who is out of contract at the end of the season, took offence to Houllier's earlier remarks about him taking the chance to earn a new deal.
Houllier is reported to have said: "John is at the end of his contract and it is an opportunity to express what he wants - whether he wants to stay at the club or whether he wants to go somewhere else."
But an angry Carew, 31, hit back today by claiming that Houllier had demonstrated a lack of respect.
"If he wants me to fight for a contract, he should speak to me directly and not through the media," said Carew in VG.
"This is disrespectful to me and to the fans who sing my name week in week out."
In a public spat that overshadowed Villa's draw at Craven Cottage, Houllier denied he had been respectful to Carew but labelled him as being "stupid" and "living in the past".
"I was told about his comments," said Houllier. "I think he is stupid. How can he say that? I didn't lack respect to him or anybody.
"Somebody asked me if it was a good chance for him and I said yes. What do you want me to say? No? I think John is living in the past at the moment.
"He should look at the figures, how long has he played and how many goals have we scored when he has been playing. I didn't lack respect to him but in doing that, he is lacking respect to me.
"I don't question his ability. I am not living in the past. We have been very unlucky with him with injury and illness. I know his ability.
"If he thinks that me saying yes is lacking respect, then I am not going to say sorry. I feel he should focus on the games, we are in difficulty at the moment. We don't get enough points."
Villa should beaten Fulham after taking a 42nd minute lead through Marc Albrighton. But they squandered numerous chances before Fulham defender Brede Hangeland scored a last-gasp equaliser.
"The overall performance was good," added Houllier. "We sometimes played very good football.
"I told the boys I am extremely unhappy with the result but the performance was outstanding in terms of effort and discipline and we had enough chances to seal the game.
"The only thing we could blame ourselves for was that we had the chances to finish it off."
But Houllier, already without Carew and Heskey, will not be without captain Nigel Reo-Coker for at least three weeks with a knee injury collected in a clash with Jonathan Greening.
"I don't think Nigel will be able to play for another two or three weeks minimum," said Houllier. "It is a knee injury. There was a challenge with Jonathan Greening.
"Jonathan fell on his ankle and he twisted his knee. It is very unfortunate. It is am medial ligament injury and we need to know the gravity of it is."
Fulham boss Mark Hughes was relieved his side managed to steal a point from the game.
"In the first-half I thought we edged the better chances," said Hughes. "I was disappointed to concede just before half-time and in the second-half, Villa were able to get people behind the ball and play on the counter and that was always a worry for us.
"But we kept on going and doing the right things. We didn't ask enough questions in the second-half, in terms of balls into the box, but the one ball we did produce brought us the goal and we are thankful for that.
"At that late stage you are thinking the game is lost and it has gone beyond you. We got something out of the game so we are pleased.
"We have got to be pleased with the point."
But the return of striker Andrew Johnson, out of the game for 13 months with groin and knee injuries, was a boost for Hughes.
He had a gilt-edged chance to score after coming on as a second-half substitute but Villa keeper Brad Friedel won the one-on-one contest nine minutes from time.
"Andrew looked bright," added Hughes. "I just felt we needed to stretch the game. We kept going and that is the positive we will take from it.
"But Andrew showed once again he still has that awareness and I am sure he was disappointed not to convert his chance. But credit to Brad who came out very quickly and closed his angle down. It was good play all round."
-
I'm beginning to dislike this Houllier fellow.
-
I'm beginning to dislike this Houllier fellow.
For telling a few home truths to and vastly under-performing, highly paid player?
-
Or using the media to do his dirty work for him...
-
Or using the media to do his dirty work for him...
So it's fine for carew to do it then? He openly challenged the manager, which should never be allowed to happen. The only person I'm beginning to dislike is Carew.
-
It's no coincidence that Carew has moved to so many clubs in his career - he's been a decent signing for us but I won't be sorry to see him go.
-
How many times do we see this, a player forcing an issue just so he has an excuse to leave!
If he wants to leave so be it!
-
I think Gerard wants him out, and that is fine by me. Carew was pretty much undroppable under MON and has done nothing for a while. If nothing else, I like the way seniority counts for little under the new boss.
-
I'm sorry I'm with Carew. He is a Villa legend and houllier should have abit of respect.
Carew has said nothing out of turn.
-
I think Gerard wants him out, and that is fine by me. Carew was pretty much undroppable under MON and has done nothing for a while. If nothing else, I like the way seniority counts for little under the new boss.
Shame he was dropped quite alot, I think now he needs to prove himself to Houllier and us who've lost faith in him.
"The fans who sing my name every week" - barely hear it any more and dont use us as an excuse Mr. Carew
-
TOtally disagree gibbo- he's been a decent signing but no way would I call him a villa legend- Carew on his day was top draw but his day was all too rare and his attitude and workrate were often well below par- I wish him well wherever he goes but I'm totally on houlliers side on this issue.
Carew should have been running his balls off to try and earn a new contract and I will not be sorry to see him replaced by a much better striker.
-
I'm beginning to dislike this Houllier fellow.
For telling a few home truths to and vastly under-performing, highly paid player?
I can't remember the last time Carew had a good game for us. I remember him having a good 20 minutes in the Reading away game last season but since then he's been fairly pointless and has probably helped to hinder the Fonz's progress. MON always seemed to be pissed off with him but was perhaps better at managing him than Houllier. Even so, Carew's performances and effort were not good enough even under MON and it looks like his time here is up. As with many naturally gifted footballers, if their attitudes don't match their talents they fail wherever they go and become known as 'if only' players.
If he doesn't fit into Houllier's system then he needs to move on and we replace him with a player that is willing to contribute properly.
-
I think Gerard wants him out, and that is fine by me. Carew was pretty much undroppable under MON and has done nothing for a while. If nothing else, I like the way seniority counts for little under the new boss.
Shame he was dropped quite alot, I think now he needs to prove himself to Houllier and us who've lost faith in him.
"The fans who sing my name every week" - barely hear it any more and dont use us as an excuse Mr. Carew
39 appearances last season despite some pretty iffy games. Hardly Luke Young type of dropped.
-
Carew being a Villa legend is just about one of the most ridiculous things I've read on here in a long time.
A good player on his day, yes but his day was rare even to begin with. He has taken the piss with some of the performances he's had and how little effort he has put in.
He's no more a Villa legend than Mark Draper.
-
If Carew thinks he's got the fans on his side because a couple of muppets are still singing his name, I think he's got a bit of a shock on the way. He's about as much of a Villa Legend as Dave Chance.
He'll get another club no problem, but he's done nothing recently to earn a new deal here.
-
(http://watchmojo.com/blogs/images/rodney_dangerfield_no_respect2.jpg)
-
I don't think either of them come out of this particularly well. Carew shouldn't have made the comments he did but Houllier should have dealt with it in private not through the press, it's undignified
-
I'm sorry I'm with Carew. He is a Villa legend and houllier should have abit of respect.
Carew has said nothing out of turn.
He is in no way a Villa legend.
-
I think Gerard wants him out, and that is fine by me. Carew was pretty much undroppable under MON and has done nothing for a while. If nothing else, I like the way seniority counts for little under the new boss.
Shame he was dropped quite alot, I think now he needs to prove himself to Houllier and us who've lost faith in him.
"The fans who sing my name every week" - barely hear it any more and dont use us as an excuse Mr. Carew
39 appearances last season despite some pretty iffy games. Hardly Luke Young type of dropped.
Well maybe it was just his inaffectiveness then.. Luke Young was unfairly dropped
-
gerard is right in what he says , he didn't say anything wrong in implying it was chance for Carew to show what he can do to try and merit a new deal
I don't see how Carew finds that being disrespectful to him, either way he has burnt his bridges now I feel..
-
I'm with Gerard on this one. Methinks Carew's days are numbered.
I posted a couple of weeks ago that in the case of Carew it should be good riddance to bad rubbish and got called an idiot by a few.
The blokes attitude is a fucking disgrace and how on earth he has been elevated to a cult hero is beyond me.
Andy Gray - yes
Brain little - yes
paul mcgrath - yes
birchy - yes
Carew - my fucking arse
-
I'm sorry I'm with Carew. He is a Villa legend and houllier should have abit of respect.
Carew has said nothing out of turn.
I hope you calling Carew a legend is tongue in cheek
What does it say about a players commitment and professionalism when he has to break a curfew to go lap dancing.
The bloke is a first class wanker
-
(http://watchmojo.com/blogs/images/rodney_dangerfield_no_respect2.jpg)
Hey everybody! It's a mid table party!
-
Houllier was asked a question. He answered. Carew portrays the answer as a huge insult.
It is possible that Carew intended to put pressure on Houllier when he made this comment, by suggesting that the new manager is unpopular with the players. However, I think both Carew and Houllier knew the striker's days were numbered when the Frenchman arrived at Villa Park. Thus, the comments by Carew may just have been a plot to make it look like Carew's inevitable exit was caused by a rift with Houllier -- and not the fact that he is not good enough anymore.
-
I can forgive players who try their best for the club if they don't perform to a high standard, but Carew all too often has looked like he couldn't care less about the club and his performances on many occassions have left me appalled at the lack of effort he has shown.
I would not be surprised to see him frozen out now until being released in January. Aston villa deserve players who will give 100% to the cause- Carew does not fit that bill!
-
No more Carew in a Villa shirt I'd wager. He's been a good, not great player.
As somebody said on another thread, I'm not convinced he's injured. I'm not convinced and never have been completely convinced that he's top drawer.
Villa need a proper, proper goal scorer. He isn't one.
-
I agree with Chris - neither of them get much credit from this and it could, and probably should, have been avoided.
There was nothing in Houllier's original remark to warrant Carew feeling his manager was being disrespectful, but Houllier's follow up comments aren't great.
-
If Houllier's comments are true then they're totally unprofessional and inappropriate. He, like Carew, should shut the fuck up and get on with his job.
-
I'm sorry I'm with Carew. He is a Villa legend and houllier should have abit of respect.
Carew has said nothing out of turn.
I don't believe Carew is a Villa legend. I think he's gained more from Villa than Villa have gained from him. He's good, but not world class, and he's been in the right place at the right time to look good.
-
I get the impression Houllier is aware that any kind of bad vibes are likely to upset the apple cart before he gets chance to put his mark on the club. The overly defensive approach to the derby, this slightly undignified response.
I like Houllier and think that if he survives this injury crisis he'll do as well as the last manager.
Carew, if using the fact he wants a move at Christmas to not be available until then through 'injury' has proved to be more of a villain than hero.
-
[/quote]I think Gerard wants him out, and that is fine by me. Carew was pretty much undroppable under MON and has done nothing for a while. If nothing else, I like the way seniority counts for little under the new boss.
Shame he was dropped quite alot, I think now he needs to prove himself to Houllier and us who've lost faith in him.
"The fans who sing my name every week" - barely hear it any more and dont use us as an excuse Mr. Carew
39 appearances last season despite some pretty iffy games. Hardly Luke Young type of dropped.
Well maybe it was just his inaffectiveness then.. Luke Young was unfairly dropped
I agree. I was surprised it was 39 games when I looked it up.
-
I'm with Gerard on this one. Methinks Carew's days are numbered.
I posted a couple of weeks ago that in the case of Carew it should be good riddance to bad rubbish and got called an idiot by a few.
The blokes attitude is a fucking disgrace and how on earth he has been elevated to a cult hero is beyond me.
Andy Gray - yes
Brain little - yes
paul mcgrath - yes
birchy - yes
Carew - my fucking arse
Birch? A Villa legend? An average player who ran around a lot and tried really hard. And you have him up there with McGrath, Little and Gray. Crikey.
-
Its probably speeded up his departure to January rather than the summer. Probably best for all involved.
Lets face it, we're hardly going to miss his recent contributions and I would prefer to see the Fonz playing even if (right now) he is not as good as Carew.
-
For Houlier, the next two transfer windows cannot come around soon enough. It will bye bye to quite a few names: Carew, Sidwell, Davies being the most obvious. Bring in some technically gifted French lads who are quick and young and we can push on again.
-
Houllier has done nothing wrong here. I'm liking his style. He's an intelligent fella and when asked a question he answers honestly. Carew has took offence and spouted off. Houllier obviously won't take any shit and won't have players living on reputation which is good because too many of them have become too comfortable.
Carew thinks he's a legend because his name is sung, however he doesn't realise that he's just very lucky that that his name fits in with a catchy anthem.
Gerrard is going to be good for us.
-
I'm sorry I'm with Carew. He is a Villa legend and houllier should have abit of respect.
Carew has said nothing out of turn.
I think the oft-misused world 'legend' just hit new lows here.
-
Non story. If houllier had arrived when JC still had something to offer then it might be an issue, but he doesn't and it's moot.
-
In my opinion Houllier is completely right to say that Carew, or any player, should have to work hard to prove they are due another contract. He said the same about Reo Coker and i don't remember him throwing his toys out of the pram.
And as for the following:
"If he wants me to fight for a contract, he should speak to me directly and not through the media," said Carew in VG.
"This is disrespectful to me and to the fans who sing my name week in week out."
Who does he think he is? That just makes him sound like an egotistical idiot who thinks he just has to turn up and wave to the fans occasionally to pick up his nice £50k or so a week. He'll be gone soon, too inconsistent, too injury prone, too old, too expensive and too big for his boots.
I've always liked Carew, he was a good swap and he's had some good periods at the club but I don't think we could ever really afford to have him and Heskey in the squad, and say what you like about Heskey but I think his attitude, commitment and work ethic have never been in question.
I think it was odds on that Carew was always going to the first casualty of the Houllier regime. No doubt Houllier's previous words about players having to be professional and stay away from night clubs (or lap dancing clubs) would have been partially aimed at him too. I think Carew probably sets a bad example to the younger players at the club in that regard as well.
John Carew, Carew,
It's time to say adieu,
Because you know Hou,
He's bigger than me or you.
-
Bang on dribbler- excellent post!
-
Sorry, but there's very little that feels right about the club at the moment.
-
I'm with Gerard on this one. Methinks Carew's days are numbered.
I posted a couple of weeks ago that in the case of Carew it should be good riddance to bad rubbish and got called an idiot by a few.
The blokes attitude is a fucking disgrace and how on earth he has been elevated to a cult hero is beyond me.
Andy Gray - yes
Brain little - yes
paul mcgrath - yes
birchy - yes
Carew - my fucking arse
Birch? A Villa legend? An average player who ran around a lot and tried really hard. And you have him up there with McGrath, Little and Gray. Crikey.
i agree birch is no villa legend, well liked and the fans loved his attitude!
As for John Carew, i thought on his day he could have been whatever he wanted to be, but i would also bracket him with Dalian Atkinson for potential!
-
Fairly clear that Houllier is a great motivator!
-
Fairly clear that Houllier is a great motivator!
And I'm sure Luke, Reo Coker, Albrighton, Heskey, Bannan and Clark agree.
-
Ireland certainly looked fired up today.
-
I'm with Houllier here. Carew has felt unwell and had niggling injuries over the past couple of weeks. Just how injured is he? He does need to earn a new contract and there is nothing wrong with Houllier saying so.
I just don't think Carew has the motivation to do so.
-
IMO even if we had offered him a new deal he would be off. He can negotiate a nice Bosman from 1st Jan and I think that he would have gone regardless of this. One big last pay day.
-
How dare anybody criticise Carew. He's got a good song that the fans love to sing about him...
-
I heard Marc Albrighton on the radio say "the gaffer told us to go out and forget what happened in training" - Did Big John just damge his calf in the week or did it kick off Reo-Coker style?
Either way I don't think Carew has been fully fit for over a year now - definitely time for him to move on but I will not be giving him wanker signs for a few misguided comments, he's been a good player for us on the whole and scored a few goals.
-
"If he wants me to fight for a contract, he should speak to me directly and not through the media," said Carew in the media.
I would have thought that Houllier has been around too long to make this kind of comment, why it cant have been done out of the glare of the media I dont know. Whatever you think of Carew, alienating him when he's the only nearly fit forward we have seems a bit avoidable.
-
Hilts is right on this - the original comments were completely innocuous.
Since then both Carew's reaction and Houllier's follow-up do absolutely nothing to help anyone.
-
Hilts is right on this - the original comments were completely innocuous.
Since then both Carew's reaction and Houllier's follow-up do absolutely nothing to help anyone.
Unfortunately GH does seem to get into stupid press fuelled feuds. His comments on Ginola and Liverpool' progress after he left show that.
-
Like it's been said on here many times on his day brilliant but he is rarely seen playing like that now i do think he needs to up his game i agree he should have to work for a new contract like Dribbler said.
-
In my opinion Bannan, Clark and Albrighton are showing him how to behave on and off the pitch they look hungry and look like they want to play for the club! I am a big Carew fan but I don't like the way he & Houllier are behaving towards each other, I don't think airing your views in public is the way to go.
Carew's days are over I think and its a shame it has to end this way. I was listening to Ron Toss yesterday on BRMB and he was saying he had it on good authority that carew stormed out before the Burnley game. I have also heard he was out late at lap dancing clubs again
-
John Carew got the strength and skills and power to be an awesome striker and legend but he doesn't have the toughness or hunger or Viking spirit. If he have Martin Laursen's heart he will be unstoppable.
-
Birch? A Villa legend? An average player who ran around a lot and tried really hard. And you have him up there with McGrath, Little and Gray. Crikey.
To be a legend you don't necessarily have to be the best player.
-
They need to have a meeting, in private, and even if they disagree they need to at least agree on not saying this stuff in the press.
I for one will be sad when Carew leaves. The word legend is over-used but he has played a big part in some very enjoyable times over the last few years. But we move on, we always do
-
I'm beginning to dislike this Houllier fellow.
Funny how we see things differently as I started disliking Carew quite a while ago and now want to see the back of him for good
-
Goodbye John. Yes you were good now and than but mostly you have been "stealing" money from us.
-
Birch? A Villa legend? An average player who ran around a lot and tried really hard. And you have him up there with McGrath, Little and Gray. Crikey.
To be a legend you don't necessarily have to be the best player.
come on now Dave. The term "legend" gets thrown around far too easily, and needs to be reserved for our true greats. I loved Paul Birch for his effort and enthusiasm but he isn't one of our true greats by any stretch.
-
I think John is over estimating his popularity, his name gets sung a lot cos it's a good song.
We only need 1 of Heskey or Carew in the future but then with the injuries both have we could get rid of both of them
-
no footballer is bigger than the great aston villa...
-
I'm with Gerard on this one. Methinks Carew's days are numbered.
I posted a couple of weeks ago that in the case of Carew it should be good riddance to bad rubbish and got called an idiot by a few.
The blokes attitude is a fucking disgrace and how on earth he has been elevated to a cult hero is beyond me.
Andy Gray - yes
Brain little - yes
paul mcgrath - yes
birchy - yes
Carew - my fucking arse
Birch? A Villa legend? An average player who ran around a lot and tried really hard. And you have him up there with McGrath, Little and Gray. Crikey.
i agree birch is no villa legend, well liked and the fans loved his attitude!
As for John Carew, i thought on his day he could have been whatever he wanted to be, but i would also bracket him with Dalian Atkinson for potential!
Maybe not a legend
but Birch like ian taylor typifies for me what i expect out of a player - 100% comittment everytime they pull that shirt on and would run themselves into the ground doing so
-
Carew was a good player for us, but he's far too injury prone now. I'd say overall he has been successful and scored good goals for us.
-
Oh dear thing do seem to be going awry under our new manager.
-
I'm sorry I'm with Carew. He is a Villa legend and houllier should have abit of respect.
Carew has said nothing out of turn.
Of course not. He never did anything wrong when Mon fined him either. He was blameless at his previous clubs when wine and women took precedence over football too and they sacked him.
As to what he's done for Villa, I'd love to know what that is apart from cause trouble
Should have been got rid of ages ago but the turncoat couldn't do it
-
Oh dear thing do seem to be going awry under our new manager.
something which of course never happened with our previous manager.
-
I'm sorry I'm with Carew. He is a Villa legend and houllier should have abit of respect.
Carew has said nothing out of turn.
Of course not. He never did anything wrong when Mon fined him either. He was blameless at his previous clubs when wine and women took precedence over football too and they sacked him.
As to what he's done for Villa, I'd love to know what that is apart from cause trouble
Should have been got rid of ages ago but the turncoat couldn't do it
When should he have been got rid of then?
-
Oh dear thing do seem to be going awry under our new manager.
Yes, we have a few injuries and one player doesn't get on with him.
-
Exactly what I was thinking. Well except that him and Ireland don't get on either. Oh and we can't score goals with regularity Oh and we play 5 across midfield including a Centre Half in midfield against Blues at home. And we then wait until 8 minutes from time before changing to an attacking formation, 10 minutes after the opposing manager did so. And he calls a player stupid and living in the past to the press ratherthan to the player himself.
-
Him and Ireland. Your proof is? We have our first choice four strikers out, play a makeshift midfield in one game and you cite this as proof that things are 'awry'.
-
The article about Ireland needing to work harder (another go public article) in The Guardian allows me to make an educated guess that all is not well between those two. Otherwise why not just keep it behind closed doors. We know players are in the main stupid and egotistical however, this is an intelligent, experienced, articulate manager who goes public on things he shouldn't and has a history of playing boring, negative football despite injuries.
-
Who has maybe worked out the best way to motivate a player. It happens.
-
The article about Ireland needing to work harder (another go public article) in The Guardian allows me to make an educated guess that all is not well between those two. Otherwise why not just keep it behind closed doors. We know players are in the main stupid and egotistical however, this is an intelligent, experienced, articulate manager who goes public on things he shouldn't and has a history of playing boring, negative football despite injuries.
Ireland came on and looked useful for once. Two or three really good paces and he worked himself too. Taking the same sort of short-termism that you’ve used, its problem solved, well done Houllier you’ve motivated a player.
Only a moron would conclude that its Houlliers fault we’re not scoring given the Everton style injury circumstances we’ve got.
-
Oh so someone who offers a different view to yours is a moron. How puerile.
-
I think we should all get a sense of perspective. We must all remember that Gérard Houllier has vast experience when it comes to hanging on for a result. It's not as if he's got previous when it comes to losing in the 94th minute (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oMbCxl4hnzA), is it?
-
I think we should all get a sense of perspective. We must all remember that Gérard Houllier has vast experience when it comes to hanging on for a result. It's not as if he's got previous when it comes to losing in the 94th minute (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oMbCxl4hnzA), is it?
Wasn't that scored in the regulation 90?
-
Carew has been a success, particularly as a straight swap for Baros. Time to move on though. Gabby, heskey and AN other as first choice forwards for me.
I am a bit worried about the mentality of the players having gone a bit easy street over the summer. Dunne, Carew, Gabby perhaps?
-
Legend too strong maybe, but he will be remembered for years to come though as a fan favourite. He has been our most consistent and most prolific goal scorer for 4 years, he isn't in the best of form at the moment, but still deserves abit of respect. Which Houllier has not shown.
Im liking how Houllier is keeping the fans informed but he is getting to the point of washing his linen in public. He should be abit more discrete on certain issues!
-
Legend too strong maybe, but he will be remembered for years to come though as a fan favourite. He has been our most consistent and most prolific goal scorer for 4 years, he isn't in the best of form at the moment, but still deserves abit of respect. Which Houllier has not shown.
Isn't in the best of form at the moment?????? You truly are the king of understatement. At the moment makes it sound like the last few weeks, whereas in reality it's been the last year or so
-
January can't come quick enough - we need to off load at least a couple
and bring in a proven striker (even though GH is reported as saying it's not
a priority)
As for John Carew - yes I've got some good memories of when he was
occasionally 'un-playable' but sadly for him, and us it didn't happen very often
-
With all these injured strikers it's a crying shame we didn't manage to sign Michael Owen in the summer.
-
Goodbye John. Yes you were good now and than but mostly you have been "stealing" money from us.
I know, it's like slipping a wad of £20 notes in a stripper's G string and then not even gettting a lap dance for your trouble. Disgraceful!
-
Legend too strong maybe, but he will be remembered for years to come though as a fan favourite. He has been our most consistent and most prolific goal scorer for 4 years, he isn't in the best of form at the moment, but still deserves abit of respect. Which Houllier has not shown.
Isn't in the best of form at the moment?????? You truly are the king of understatement. At the moment makes it sound like the last few weeks, whereas in reality it's been the last year or so
Last year??? Carew was out top scorer last season, that's fact! Another fact is that it looks as though his villa career is nearing an end.
I and most villa fans will remember Carew and if he ever came back as a player he would get a great reception.
The whole point of this thread was that Houllier has come out and criticised Carew in public without telling him first. This is in my opinion a lack of respect.
People have this notion that Carew doesn't care when in thruth he has had alot of injuries which have affected his form.
-
Sorry to be a pedant, but it's not a fact that "it looks as though his Villa career is nearing an end", it's a possibility and a probability, but it's not a fact.
Also you sound as though you have your time-line muddled, Houllier, when asked, said Carew (as any player) needs to prove he is worth a new contract, nothing wrong with that IMO, then Carew starts mouthing off that this is disrespectful, then Houllier responded. No doubt that there's been a bit of media manipulation here, but Houllier's initial comments were innocuous and yet Carew responds in great hypocrite style, by saying to the media that people shouldn't be saying things to the media. Not the smartest of chaps is he. I would agree with Houllier that he is 'stupid' to say the things he did, unless of course there is some ulterior motive.
-
Nothing but respect for the manager from these comments. I thought there might be an issue between them when Houllier arrived because of the Leon relationship, but Gerard is right, Carew has done very little for us for a long time, and I can't for the life of me understand why fans sing his name...
-
Carew is no great loss to us- I'm sure he will be allowed to leave on a free in January.
Some people seem very critical of houllier but he has inherited this squad and we are decimated with injuries- we are only 3 points off the top 6 so there's no panic- he has been able to see who is worth keeping and who isn't and I'm sure he will improve us greatly in the next 2 transfer windows- keep the faith!
-
What a twat Carew is. He's done nothing on the pitch since 20 mins against Reading last year, and is obviously far more bothered about fans singing his name than playing or scoring. He can feck off. Houllier has done nothing wrong, but for Carew to claim Houllier has more to prove to the fans than he does is ridiculous and shows how obsessed he is with his own cult hero status (which for me is an absurd belief held by some Villa fans) and how disrespectful he is about the new regime.
If I ever see him in a Villa shirt again I will be very disappointed. He's the past, not the club's present or future.
-
I think we should all get a sense of perspective. We must all remember that Gérard Houllier has vast experience when it comes to hanging on for a result. It's not as if he's got previous when it comes to losing in the 94th minute (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oMbCxl4hnzA), is it?
Wasn't that scored in the regulation 90?
94 minutes and 58 seconds. That's why it was fucking awesome. I was watching live.
Houllier (on Canal + France) was still calling Ginola a 'twat' for his crossfield ball this summer, seventeen years later (Ginola went ape and said he wanted to press charges for libel or whatever). So it must be fresh in his mind...
-
Oh so someone who offers a different view to yours is a moron. How puerile.
No, it was your post that led us to that conclusion.
-
I think we should all get a sense of perspective. We must all remember that Gérard Houllier has vast experience when it comes to hanging on for a result. It's not as if he's got previous when it comes to losing in the 94th minute (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oMbCxl4hnzA), is it?
Wasn't that scored in the regulation 90?
94 minutes and 58 seconds. That's why it was fucking awesome. I was watching live.
Houllier (on Canal + France) was still calling Ginola a 'twat' for his crossfield ball this summer, seventeen years later (Ginola went ape and said he wanted to press charges for libel or whatever). So it must be fresh in his mind...
I was just going on the clock in the corner that was ticking up to 45.00. According to that it was scored 44:58.
-
I think we should all get a sense of perspective. We must all remember that Gérard Houllier has vast experience when it comes to hanging on for a result. It's not as if he's got previous when it comes to losing in the 94th minute (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oMbCxl4hnzA), is it?
Wasn't that scored in the regulation 90?
94 minutes and 58 seconds. That's why it was fucking awesome. I was watching live.
Houllier (on Canal + France) was still calling Ginola a 'twat' for his crossfield ball this summer, seventeen years later (Ginola went ape and said he wanted to press charges for libel or whatever). So it must be fresh in his mind...
Yet another reason I'm warming to this manager.
I'm still seething at that fat ponce waving to all the lovely Tottingham fans whilst warming up as a substitute for us, and that was the best part of 10 years ago.
-
LeeB you are fuckin hilarious.
-
What a twat Carew is. He's done nothing on the pitch since 20 mins against Reading last year, and is obviously far more bothered about fans singing his name than playing or scoring. He can feck off. Houllier has done nothing wrong, but for Carew to claim Houllier has more to prove to the fans than he does is ridiculous and shows how obsessed he is with his own cult hero status (which for me is an absurd belief held by some Villa fans) and how disrespectful he is about the new regime.
If I ever see him in a Villa shirt again I will be very disappointed. He's the past, not the club's present or future.
I reckon the people who support him at the games aren't as enlightened as we internet users and that they base their opinion solely on the fact he is one of the most prolific goalscorers they have ever seen in a Villa shirt. Dopes.
-
Whether you side with Carew or Mr Houllier, the fact is that the latter agreed to a swap deal that relieved us of Baros and got us a significant goalthreat for years after. I suppose we must like him for that at least.
-
LeeB you are fuckin hilarious.
Thank you, that's very gracious of you.
-
even during periods that he was apparently "on fire" he would play games intent on giving away free kicks by pushing and shoving, he is one of those players that you can tell after about 15 minutes what sort of game he is going to have, sadly most times dissapointing and now all the time
-
I don't think either of them come out of this particularly well. Carew shouldn't have made the comments he did but Houllier should have dealt with it in private not through the press, it's undignified
I have to agree with this 100%. I thought pretty much the same thing after i read it.
As for Carew being a Villa Legend, just because he has his own song, dose'nt make him a legend.
-
I may have missed it but has anyone seen this interview that carew has the hump over?
-
I think we should all get a sense of perspective. We must all remember that Gérard Houllier has vast experience when it comes to hanging on for a result. It's not as if he's got previous when it comes to losing in the 94th minute (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oMbCxl4hnzA), is it?
Wasn't that scored in the regulation 90?
94 minutes and 58 seconds. That's why it was fucking awesome. I was watching live.
Houllier (on Canal + France) was still calling Ginola a 'twat' for his crossfield ball this summer, seventeen years later (Ginola went ape and said he wanted to press charges for libel or whatever). So it must be fresh in his mind...
I was just going on the clock in the corner that was ticking up to 45.00. According to that it was scored 44:58.
Oh FUCK! I got my counting skills mixed up again. I was going by the clock on that thingy too. However, my numeracy is as reliable as Carew's back and I can't count, add up or do anything that involves decimals. Well, let's call it last minute goal experience, eh?
-
Birch? A Villa legend? An average player who ran around a lot and tried really hard. And you have him up there with McGrath, Little and Gray. Crikey.
To be a legend you don't necessarily have to be the best player.
come on now Dave. The term "legend" gets thrown around far too easily, and needs to be reserved for our true greats. I loved Paul Birch for his effort and enthusiasm but he isn't one of our true greats by any stretch.
And again I say, a legend does not have to be a great player.
It's all about perception.
In legend stakes I would put Eamon Deacey above John Carew.
-
...
And again I say, a legend does not have to be a great player.
It's all about perception.
In legend stakes I would put Eamon Deacey above John Carew.
I don't neessarily disagree but are players like McInally, Saunders, Deehan, Atkinson, Saunders, Dublin legends? All with similar goalsoring records. Would Carew be entitled to legendary status if we had won the League cup last season
-
Carew is no legend, just another journey man making good money and about to arrange his exit from Villa by kicking up a storm. Obviously his seen the writing on the wall.
-
What a twat Carew is. He's done nothing on the pitch since 20 mins against Reading last year, and is obviously far more bothered about fans singing his name than playing or scoring. He can feck off. Houllier has done nothing wrong, but for Carew to claim Houllier has more to prove to the fans than he does is ridiculous and shows how obsessed he is with his own cult hero status (which for me is an absurd belief held by some Villa fans) and how disrespectful he is about the new regime.
If I ever see him in a Villa shirt again I will be very disappointed. He's the past, not the club's present or future.
I reckon the people who support him at the games aren't as enlightened as we internet users and that they base their opinion solely on the fact he is one of the most prolific goalscorers they have ever seen in a Villa shirt. Dopes.
OK, nowhere did I question his goalscoring record, I merely pointed out that he has been inexcusably shit when he has played (which has not been often) over the course of the last 18 or so months, aside from 20 mins in the second half against Reading. It pisses me off so much that whilst playing, actually on the pitch, he will turn to the Holte to applaud them for singing a song - he should be concentrating on the fucking match. You don't see anyone else do that mid-game. I think the hero worship of him is seriously misplaced - he's done nothing on the pitch for a while, looks disinterested, if reports are true can't even be bothered to turn up for certain cup games mid-week, and generally shows an overinflated opinion of himself which for me clearly translates into a lack of effort.
Considering his physique and ability I think he shows a criminal lack of effort to produce the best he can as often as he can, especially considering his likely wage. Look instead at the hunger showed by Bannan, Albrighton, Clark, even Delfouneso at the weekend.
He's a waste of space. The song is a delusional effort based on past glories and wasted on an egomaniac. Get rid, as quickly as possible. But if you want to carry on signing an embarrasing song, its up to yuou.
-
Headline in today's Times: Carew May Have Burnt His Bridges With Villa.
Gérard Houllier called it paranoia, Mark Hughes called it emotion and some may label it as childish. But the row that has erupted between the Aston Villa manager and John Carew, his striker, is sufficiently vitriolic possibly to spell the end of the Norwegian's career in the Midlands.
"I like John but if the fans chant his name and the end product is nothing then fans will chant, 'Houllier go home,'" Houllier said.
-
See you John. You were decent but way too lazy.
-
Shame if it ends like this with Carew - he's generally done pretty well for us, though a few too many niggly injuries. I think come the summer we'll see him and several other senior players moved on; Houllier seems to have identified the need to shake things up a bit.
-
What a twat Carew is. He's done nothing on the pitch since 20 mins against Reading last year, and is obviously far more bothered about fans singing his name than playing or scoring. He can feck off. Houllier has done nothing wrong, but for Carew to claim Houllier has more to prove to the fans than he does is ridiculous and shows how obsessed he is with his own cult hero status (which for me is an absurd belief held by some Villa fans) and how disrespectful he is about the new regime.
If I ever see him in a Villa shirt again I will be very disappointed. He's the past, not the club's present or future.
I reckon the people who support him at the games aren't as enlightened as we internet users and that they base their opinion solely on the fact he is one of the most prolific goalscorers they have ever seen in a Villa shirt. Dopes.
OK, nowhere did I question his goalscoring record, I merely pointed out that he has been inexcusably shit when he has played (which has not been often) over the course of the last 18 or so months, aside from 20 mins in the second half against Reading. It pisses me off so much that whilst playing, actually on the pitch, he will turn to the Holte to applaud them for singing a song - he should be concentrating on the fucking match. You don't see anyone else do that mid-game. I think the hero worship of him is seriously misplaced - he's done nothing on the pitch for a while, looks disinterested, if reports are true can't even be bothered to turn up for certain cup games mid-week, and generally shows an overinflated opinion of himself which for me clearly translates into a lack of effort.
Considering his physique and ability I think he shows a criminal lack of effort to produce the best he can as often as he can, especially considering his likely wage. Look instead at the hunger showed by Bannan, Albrighton, Clark, even Delfouneso at the weekend.
He's a waste of space. The song is a delusional effort based on past glories and wasted on an egomaniac. Get rid, as quickly as possible. But if you want to carry on signing an embarrasing song, its up to yuou.
and yet managed to score 20 goals in that time.
The people who sing the John Carew song at Villa Park (we're too busy muttering under our breath in my section of the ground) are singing it because they turn up to watch us score goals and John Carew does that more than just about any other player they have ever seen in a Villa shirt. To label them absurd, delusional and embarrassing is a bit arse about face if you ask me.
-
Headline in today's Times: Carew May Have Burnt His Bridges With Villa.
Gérard Houllier called it paranoia, Mark Hughes called it emotion and some may label it as childish. But the row that has erupted between the Aston Villa manager and John Carew, his striker, is sufficiently vitriolic possibly to spell the end of the Norwegian's career in the Midlands.
"I like John but if the fans chant his name and the end product is nothing then fans will chant, 'Houllier go home,'" Houllier said.
I've just seen this, were these comments part of the same interview or has Houlllier been drawn into making further unseemly comments again? If so I wish he would turn it in.
-
I think it's now getting to the point where Carew being still at the club will be counter productive - he won't play and we'll keep seeing these stories.
We'd be better off shipping him out in Jan for a nominal fee or on loan.
-
The Times say Carew stated that 'Houllier was under prepared for the role when he joined Villa'
Is that true?
-
VD - for me its the impression I leave matches with of him. I can only remember a small handful of times where I came away from a game thinking Carew had been outstanding, even good. Yes he may well score goals (over a third of those you refer to were penalties, which could have been scored or taken by anyone else) but how often was he the matchwinner? Three or four times over the last year maybe? Also the new footballing mentality the management are trying to instil in the team leaves no room for egos like his. MON may have indulged or ignored it, but I'm delighted that Houllier is apparently refusing to do so.
Also, a little pedantically, I wasn't refering to the fans as absurd or embarasing, merely the song and hero worship, which, given as my opinion, is not insulting anyone I believe.
-
He's got more yellow cards playing for Norway than he has goals for us this season. He's scored in 3 Villa league wins in the past 12 months. 4 if you go back to the beginning of last season (Portsmouth, Stoke, Bolton & Hull).
Might be an idea Mr Carew, that you do a bit more talking on the pitch when we aren't playing lower league cup sides rather than complaining to the press.
-
The Times say Carew stated that 'Houllier was under prepared for the role when he joined Villa'
Is that true?
Carew snapped: “I don’t know if he has a problem with me but if he does then he should talk to me about it.
“Prove myself? There’s a reason why the fans are singing my name. I have been important and involved and scored goals.
“Houllier has big shoes to fill. He has more to prove than many others in the club.
“The manager said to the players that we should keep things internal and not in the media. He broke his own rule and it annoys me.
“If he thinks I should fight for a new contract with the club he should take it up with me.
“I don’t think the fans or the players think much of it either.
“It requires a mutual respect. I am puzzled and offended. He should have been here a little longer before he started making demands.”
When Houllier arrived at Villa Park, he annoyed supporters by suggesting that the club were used to a mid-table position despite the fact that O’Neill had led the team to three successive top-six places.
His comments riled Carew too. The forward, whose deal runs out next summer, added: “I don’t know if Houllier was poorly prepared for Villa when he took over. Maybe he was.
“A lot has changed in recent years, especially since Ashley Young and I got to the club.
“Since then several more players have come and we are all very involved in the success Villa have had.
“We have finished sixth three seasons in a row and been in a cup final.
“Therefore, I think Houllier insults both me and the fans when he says things like that.”
The People - Clicky (http://www.people.co.uk/sport/football/news/2010/11/07/aston-villa-s-john-carew-cuts-loose-over-gerard-houllier-s-insult-102039-22697929/)
Interesting snippet at the end of the article...
Houllier, who has been under fire from supporters for his negative tactics, is hiring former Newcastle United talent-spotter Jeff Vetere as his new chief scout.
Vetere was part of the controversial ‘Cockney Mafia’ at the Toon when he worked closely with Dennis Wise under Mike Ashley’s control.
Vetere brought in players for the Geordies during Kevin Keegan’s reign and has previously worked for Charlton.
-
I dont care about who said what, and whether Carew can still do a job for us isnt the point.
Who else would like to get back to the days when players who are employed and very well remunerated by clubs did as they were told. Get back to the days where what the team manager says is what goes.
-
Carew won't play for us again it seems!
-
Sometimes I want to wake up and it's July 1st next year. As much as I loved a lot of the MON era, we need to broom it away now, and some of the players that have stayed past their welcome with it.
-
Would he even pass a physical to get rid of him in Jan for cash?
-
One of my main concerns when GH was appointed was remembering reading Robbie Fowlers book, Houllier doesn't exactly come across as someone players get on with. If he thinks Ireland and Carew needed a kick up the arse, fine - but I think it should be in private and not through the media.
-
It gets in the press and twisted even if it's done in private.
-
Too many of M'On's signings are no longer good enough for us, Davies, Petrov, Sidwell, Heskey and arguably Reo Coker are all redundant for me once Delph, Gabby, Weiman and a few new signings enter the fray post January and with the emergence of Clark, Bannan, Albrighton etc. Friedel wont go on forever either and I dont think GH will put up with Dunne for much longer the way he is playing.
-
I like Dunne but for me Collins and Cuellar should be the partnership.
-
Sometimes I want to wake up and it's July 1st next year. As much as I loved a lot of the MON era, we need to broom it away now, and some of the players that have stayed past their welcome with it.
I'm afraid the 'Ghost of Mon' isn't going to be that easy to exorcise, a few new faces in Jan isn't going to do it. The type of culture he generated will I'd guess be hard to remove, most everyone will be looking over their shoulder all the time to justify themselves rather than impress others.
Houllier has a hard job on his hands and its not helped by the worst injury list for some years, not helped of course by what has become evident as a poorly built and substandard squad, once the first 11 choices are gone.
Its not just the playing staff either there's an undercurrent within the fan base, even General K has made some change to the style of his thread, especially on here, and I'd guess even the staff at VP have been affected.
Its a time of change and I admit to having some concerns as GH isn't the most dynamic communicators even if he is quite eloquent and knowledgeable and always comes over well, he rarely looks to be an earth mover. Randy similarly. He may be making huge moves behind the scenes on the quiet but the fact remains he was caught out somewhat by that conniving previous manager, did take some time to find an alternative and has never really refuted he hasn't stopped or at least dramatically cut back on transfer funds.
There's plenty of uncertainty, and its not aided by the recent confusion of various 'stars' and their not being offered or signing new contracts. Carew included.
-
As a complete aside, I really hate to see people - especially players - listing appearing in a cup semi fina/final as defining success. Winning trophies is success.
-
I don't agree with that (sfx412). I think we can move on fairly quickly from the MON era and already are, in a way. Overlooked and ignored players are now getting a chance in the side and the culture has already started to change; think about MON's time and how all of us on here could log on and predict his Saturday afternoon team days in advance - and nail it. Our last two matches, Houllier has surprised me completely with his starting line-up and use of players.
What he needs is a couple of transfer windows and I think we'll see changes - some new players in, but most importantly, some 'big' names out. Those synonymous with O'Neill will leave - Carew could be the first - and gradually things will move on, and Houllier will make his own team.
This time next year I think we'll see a very different Villa.
-
i think we all knew this was coming
GH doesn't rate Big john
that's why he was so keen to swap him with Baros(who we were keen to get rid of)
I agree Carew hasn't done enough to warrant a new contract
I am a big fan of his when he is 'up for it'/on fire' but i haven't seen that for a while from him
"john carew
Carew
it's now time to say Adieu
You're Agent will do the do
and you'll move to Crewe"
-
This time next year I think we'll see a very different Villa.
We may, but is that a good thing?
OK, results so far this season have been poor, but to me we still have a good squad to choose from with the ability to make top 6 again. So there's a lot here to work with, even if there is a need to shift some out. What I'd like to bee is maybe 4 player brought in, who would be starters, in the right positions some of the 'deadwood' is moved on.
I'm just concerned about going backwards if we abandon what and who got us to a regular 6th position. I'd like to see us build on that as opposed to starting again.
-
How do you define a legend? Ian Taylor is one for me but most of the players who have played for the last 10 years or so would not make it to the "Legend" status. I think it would be best for everyone if Carew left as he has not done enough for some time for me.
-
Carew has been a lazy bastard at times this year but Houllier's increasing desire to have a pop at all and sundry is starting to wear a bit thin.
I have had very little positive that he has to say about anyone at the club other than Heskey.
-
This time next year I think we'll see a very different Villa.
We may, but is that a good thing?
OK, results so far this season have been poor, but to me we still have a good squad to choose from with the ability to make top 6 again. So there's a lot here to work with, even if there is a need to shift some out. What I'd like to bee is maybe 4 player brought in, who would be starters, in the right positions some of the 'deadwood' is moved on.
I'm just concerned about going backwards if we abandon what and who got us to a regular 6th position. I'd like to see us build on that as opposed to starting again.
whether people like Houllier or not, he does things his way, and undeniably he has won trophies wherever he has been. I don't need the players to like the manager. I want the players to respect the manager's role, and the decisions he has to make. GH will rotate the squad and we likely not in his reign see a regular line up. The players now, and in the future will need to get used to that. Additionally they need to get out of the comfort zone many were in under MON and realize that we can't just accept nearly getting there. That it will take something extra to turn semi-finals and final appearances to something more meaningful.
GH is going to rub a lot of people the wrong way, but at the end of the day I want trophies more than anything else. If going backwards this year "positionally" means the future we have stronger and better players, then I will take that. I expect a clearout of a number of under performers and kids given a chance. I'll take a hungry Bannan or Clark over a Sidwell or Carew any day of the week. If that equals going backwards in the short term then so be it.
-
How do you define a legend? Ian Taylor is one for me but most of the players who have played for the last 10 years or so would not make it to the "Legend" status. I think it would be best for everyone if Carew left as he has not done enough for some time for me.
I think in order to be classed as a Legend it's a mix of what you do for the club with how you leave and then your attitude afterwards. For me, of the recent batch that would be Taylor, Mellberg and Laursen.
Some, and Platt springs to mind, could have been if they were just a bit more respectful after leaving.
-
This time next year I think we'll see a very different Villa.
We may, but is that a good thing?
OK, results so far this season have been poor, but to me we still have a good squad to choose from with the ability to make top 6 again. So there's a lot here to work with, even if there is a need to shift some out. What I'd like to bee is maybe 4 player brought in, who would be starters, in the right positions some of the 'deadwood' is moved on.
I'm just concerned about going backwards if we abandon what and who got us to a regular 6th position. I'd like to see us build on that as opposed to starting again.
whether people like Houllier or not, he does things his way, and undeniably he has won trophies wherever he has been. I don't need the players to like the manager. I want the players to respect the manager's role, and the decisions he has to make. GH will rotate the squad and we likely not in his reign see a regular line up. The players now, and in the future will need to get used to that. Additionally they need to get out of the comfort zone many were in under MON and realize that we can't just accept nearly getting there. That it will take something extra to turn semi-finals and final appearances to something more meaningful.
GH is going to rub a lot of people the wrong way, but at the end of the day I want trophies more than anything else. If going backwards this year "positionally" means the future we have stronger and better players, then I will take that. I expect a clearout of a number of under performers and kids given a chance. I'll take a hungry Bannan or Clark over a Sidwell or Carew any day of the week. If that equals going backwards in the short term then so be it.
I've got no issue with taking a step back in order to take two forward, but I just don't think that needs to be all that big a step.
-
Really though it wouldn't matter who came in after MON abandoned ship, they would have had to re-build all over again. All managers want to put their own mark on a team. Only the ones who are willing to adapt and are good enough will remain.
-
This time next year I think we'll see a very different Villa.
We may, but is that a good thing?
OK, results so far this season have been poor, but to me we still have a good squad to choose from with the ability to make top 6 again. So there's a lot here to work with, even if there is a need to shift some out. What I'd like to bee is maybe 4 player brought in, who would be starters, in the right positions some of the 'deadwood' is moved on.
I'm just concerned about going backwards if we abandon what and who got us to a regular 6th position. I'd like to see us build on that as opposed to starting again.
whether people like Houllier or not, he does things his way, and undeniably he has won trophies wherever he has been. I don't need the players to like the manager. I want the players to respect the manager's role, and the decisions he has to make. GH will rotate the squad and we likely not in his reign see a regular line up. The players now, and in the future will need to get used to that. Additionally they need to get out of the comfort zone many were in under MON and realize that we can't just accept nearly getting there. That it will take something extra to turn semi-finals and final appearances to something more meaningful.
GH is going to rub a lot of people the wrong way, but at the end of the day I want trophies more than anything else. If going backwards this year "positionally" means the future we have stronger and better players, then I will take that. I expect a clearout of a number of under performers and kids given a chance. I'll take a hungry Bannan or Clark over a Sidwell or Carew any day of the week. If that equals going backwards in the short term then so be it.
I've got no issue with taking a step back in order to take two forward, but I just don't think that needs to be all that big a step.
Neither do I. I think it is a really fine line between where we are right now, and where we could be with some better luck with injuries, some better concentration at the end of games, and with a manager who would have had the chance to bring in his own players had the opportunity presented itself. Despite everything we are only a few points off 5th spot which is as bizarre as it is indicative of the mediocrity of the PL this season.
-
I'm just concerned about going backwards if we abandon what and who got us to a regular 6th position. I'd like to see us build on that as opposed to starting again.
Er.... me too, John. I think something got lost in translation there. I was referring to moving on from the MON era, which I think will be quick and easy to do with a handful of new signings in the next year and some senior departures - most of those fairly obvious, the likes of Carew, Heskey (despite improved form we still must move him on in the summer), Sidwell, Beye, possibly Davies.
The framework is there, I agree. But what I was saying was Houllier has already done things with this squad that O'Neill would never have done, and, for some players, it must feel like a complete breath of fresh air.
-
The football under o neill was awful to watch- take milner out of last seasons team and we would have been mid table - o neill had 4 yrs to buy a decent striker and multi millions to spend and he failed to address it.
Give houllier a yr to get things sorted and then I believe we will see a passing attractive style of football and most of all a winning team.
O neill hardly showed his face at bodymoor and the players now have a manager who will work tirelessly at the club - in his biography he often spent 16 hrs a day on club work and he is a breath of fresh air.
Good riddance to Carew, sidwell, davies and let's move on with players who fight for their place and put Aston villa first.
-
whether people like Houllier or not, he does things his way, and undeniably he has won trophies wherever he has been. I don't need the players to like the manager.
I know it's not the central point but I don't remember Houllier winning anything with the French national team, with Cantona, Ginola, M 'lazy' Desailly, L Blanc, J-P Papin, P Le Guen et al.
-
On a side note, I liked what GH said in the interview when he said "[Carew] should look at the facts. How many games has he played and how many goals have we scored when he's been playing?". It's a throw-away remark, but I like that he said "how many goals have we scored" rather than "how many goals has he scored"; the idea that it's not just the strikers who have to contribute in terms of goals, but that roles around the pitch are fluid and we expect a good contribution from all our attacking players in terms of both goals and assisting, a level of understanding of the game that I'm not totally sure MON possesses in absolute spades.
I have had very little positive that he has to say about anyone at the club other than Heskey.
NRC, Petrov, Gabby, Bannan, Albrighton, Delfouneso, Collins, Clark, Ashley Young, Luke Young and even Sidwell have all been publicly praised to a greater or lesser degree along with Heskey. He's criticised Ireland in terms that were massively exaggerated by others in my view, and now Carew has deservedly been the object of criticism. To be honest, if he'd tried to defend Carew I wouldn't have believed him and would have criticised him for wrapping up players in cotton wool
-
This time next year I think we'll see a very different Villa.
We may, but is that a good thing?
OK, results so far this season have been poor, but to me we still have a good squad to choose from with the ability to make top 6 again. So there's a lot here to work with, even if there is a need to shift some out. What I'd like to bee is maybe 4 player brought in, who would be starters, in the right positions some of the 'deadwood' is moved on.
I'm just concerned about going backwards if we abandon what and who got us to a regular 6th position. I'd like to see us build on that as opposed to starting again.
whether people like Houllier or not, he does things his way, and undeniably he has won trophies wherever he has been. I don't need the players to like the manager. I want the players to respect the manager's role, and the decisions he has to make. GH will rotate the squad and we likely not in his reign see a regular line up. The players now, and in the future will need to get used to that. Additionally they need to get out of the comfort zone many were in under MON and realize that we can't just accept nearly getting there. That it will take something extra to turn semi-finals and final appearances to something more meaningful.
GH is going to rub a lot of people the wrong way, but at the end of the day I want trophies more than anything else. If going backwards this year "positionally" means the future we have stronger and better players, then I will take that. I expect a clearout of a number of under performers and kids given a chance. I'll take a hungry Bannan or Clark over a Sidwell or Carew any day of the week. If that equals going backwards in the short term then so be it.
To use something of an oft used cliche, TV...'nail on head'.
-
whether people like Houllier or not, he does things his way, and undeniably he has won trophies wherever he has been. I don't need the players to like the manager.
I know it's not the central point but I don't remember Houllier winning anything with the French national team, with Cantona, Ginola, M 'lazy' Desailly, L Blanc, J-P Papin, P Le Guen et al.
It is a very select group that have won anything at international level. Needless to say, I was referring to his domestic achievements only which quite frankly is all that matters. Scolari being a World Cup winner didn't help him at Chelsea, whereas Hiddink who's similarily won nothing internationally did the business without too much bother.
-
How do you define a legend? Ian Taylor is one for me but most of the players who have played for the last 10 years or so would not make it to the "Legend" status. I think it would be best for everyone if Carew left as he has not done enough for some time for me.
I think in order to be classed as a Legend it's a mix of what you do for the club with how you leave and then your attitude afterwards. For me, of the recent batch that would be Taylor, Mellberg and Laursen.
Some, and Platt springs to mind, could have been if they were just a bit more respectful after leaving.
Taylor, Mellberg and Laursen weren't fit to lace Platt's boots as Villa players.
If we keep labeling half decent players like the former 3 as legends then eventually that word will start to lose it's impact. They're no more Villa legends than I am.
-
Mon had a scrap with NRC, pissed off, L. Young, Sorenson, Barry and probably Milner considering he only stayed 2 seasons. Was outspoken about the fans on how we should acknowledge his genious. Brought in some absolute crap with more money than any other manager had, but did no more than John Gregory / Brian Little. If GH carries on and tells it how it is with some of these players, I take my hat off to him. Carew has been crap, he scored a few goals, hugged a few ball boys and he gets legendary status ( in his own little mind). GH will bring a few players in, bring a few more of the kids in and we will be a lot better off and playing better football.
-
Is that all Houllier does is run to the media about his players? You hardly ever see Wenger or Fergie calling their players stupid etc.
It's either that or he's talking about the days back at Liverpool. He also needs to move fucking on and manage Aston Villa, and forget about those scousers.
-
whether people like Houllier or not, he does things his way, and undeniably he has won trophies wherever he has been. I don't need the players to like the manager.
I know it's not the central point but I don't remember Houllier winning anything with the French national team, with Cantona, Ginola, M 'lazy' Desailly, L Blanc, J-P Papin, P Le Guen et al.
It is a very select group that have won anything at international level. Needless to say, I was referring to his domestic achievements only which quite frankly is all that matters. Scolari being a World Cup winner didn't help him at Chelsea, whereas Hiddink who's similarily won nothing internationally did the business without too much bother.
Well, you could have said so, "wherever he has been" is quite unambiguous to the untrained eye.
-
The question for me is how many of the players that finished last season under MON can improve, how many can maintain the same level for 3 or 4 years and how many had reached their peak and the only way is down.
I think Carew falls into the last category so he needs to be moved on. Don't get me wrong, I think he has been a good player for us and what was needed at the time. I think his fitness has let him down over the last 12 months, whether this is down to his age or lack of preparation for games, I don't know.
Worrignly, we have too many players that do not fall into the first two categories above and therefore I think we need quite a clear out if we are going to improve, or even stay in the top six.
-
Totally agree. Dunne is a classic example, though i think it is down to fitness with him. With the transfer window coming up and Gary Gardner and Delph on the way back we just have to get some decent results in the next couple of months ............
-
Selling players at the right time is an inexact science. For me Carew should have gone over a year ago, you sell while there is stil some value left in the player. Cahill we sold too early, Petrov we cling on to and will be worth nothing at the end of his contract.
-
Petrov we cling on to and will be worth nothing at the end of his contract.
No player is worth anything at the end of a contract. They leave for free regardless.
-
John:
Its been great, you have been a good signing for us and had some great matches. You have also had a lot of mediocre ones. I will remember you fondly but I think its time you moved on and we had a more prolific striker.
Oh and btw when we sing you are gonna score 1 or 2 we didnt mean per season. (winky thing)
Best Wishes.
-
Is that all Houllier does is run to the media about his players? You hardly ever see Wenger or Fergie calling their players stupid etc.
No SAF has never critisized players or shipped them out the minute they pissed him off???
-
I think this is another case of a primadonna footballer who's paid far too much, thinking their opinion is worth sh*t! If the manager pisses him off, so what! That's his porogative!
The manager has the right to criticise players just as fans have every right to slag off, moan at, criticise (deserved or otherwise) anyone who has anything to do with footballing matters as the club.
We pay their wages (indirectly) and we'll be here long after they've left.
And i'm sick and tired of reading comments from these poor multi millionaires; be it Carew (as much as I like the bloke!) Rooney (the arrogant scouse little turd) or... someone as insignificant as Craig Gardner.
They're not paid to give interviews and voice opinions. They're there to play football, or sit on various treatment tables. And that's all!
And in 10 years time we'll get to listen to their ill informed opinions on Sky, and take what they say as gospel.