Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Match Threads & Player Ratings => Topic started by: Legion on October 30, 2010, 08:40:09 PM
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Available Sunday afternoon.
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Abysmal for a lot of the first half, better in second but other than a couple of good efforts from Ash and Bannan, no goal threat really. Not good enough.
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We play one up front what do we expect?
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42-page SHA pull-out in the Meaning Evil tomorrow no doubt.
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Poor performance, predictable with such a negative team selected.
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Abysmal game, predictable result.
Time for the pub.
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I hope Gabby is back soon, because we cannot score.
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What shit. Best chance those cocks have had to beat us in years, and they'll consider this draw the equivalent of an FA Cup win.
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At least we came back in 2nd half, Downing back to his old self, Young pissing around with the ball our defenders were decent Clarke and NRC did ok Heskey kept getting caught offside, there isnt much quality
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Predictable poor scrappy 0-0
Our deficiencies in midfield and upfront are more obvious than ever.
Do we blame O'Neil or our injuries/suspensions?
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At least i can keep using my '6 in a row' keyring. Would have to change it if we won.
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Clark did ok, but he was an unnecessarily negative selection today.
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shit game from two sides who were not interested in trying to win...
heskey is the most pointless dickwad in the game, closely followed by that ginga twat sidwell...
i wish both of them would just fuck off...
barry banana and clark did well...
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no dodgy penalty
no own goals
howard webb and liam ridgewell, hold your heads in shame.
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both teams wanted 0-0 by look of it - very negative and hugely poor performance , nothing else to say im afreaid.
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shit game from two sides who were not interested in trying to win...
heskey is the most pointless dickwad in the game, closely followed by that ginga twat sidwell...
i wish both of them would just fuck off...
barry banana and clark did well...
Extremely harsh on Heskey, he had no support and did the best he could.
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Typical derby, we just lacked that extra bit of flair to win the match. We played far too deep and gave them far too much respect.
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A really poor game, neither team wanted to win & both definitely didn't want to lose. Dunne looked embarrassing when Jerome came on, after games like that it's always a relief when you don't lose.
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All very predictable. I think our league position is starting to mirror our talent. I'm not overly concerned (yet) as Houllier has not had a chance to shape the squad and buy players.
Positives - Clark looks very good and composed on the ball.
Negatives - Where do you start. The selection was very negative.
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very poor game, could have lasted a fortnight and would've finished 0-0.
Forget the derby element, i cannot believe that we could send out that negative a team at home to a poor side. How can you play 3 defensive midfielders? I also cannot believe that in a game so lacking in ideas and invention, that Ireland was not brought on.
I'm not angry, just really depressed after a very bad performance.
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I'm not unhappy. They were due to get something against us sooner or later. A draw i can handle.
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I think our league position is starting to mirror our talent.
If thats the case then MON worked miracles, which i refuse to believe.
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I think GH was worried about losing this one with key players out, by now he will know what talent we have and it isn't a lot. They all tried even Sidwell but the talent just isn't there, hopefully he has targets in mind for January.
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we really miss petrov
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Awful
Only not losing makes it palatable.
Don't care about the poor squad, or the injuries that was a bad team selection, for a home game.
It was the selection of a manager with relegation on his mind, far too negative, far, far too negative.
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Shame to see the gulf in class last time we played them has narrowed so much, they've improved we've fallen back i think.
Only saw the second half but i thought Clark and Bannan looked decent. Heskey did as well as could be expected trying to link up play but there was too big a gap between him and runners from midfield.
It was scary how easily and often jerome managed to get in behind our defence.
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It's starting to look like the papers and Scouse fans predictions that Houllier likes to play safe are coming true. No strikers on Wednesday against a Championship outfit and now 5 defenders against the scum.
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Shame to see the gulf in class last time we played them has narrowed so much, they've improved we've fallen back i think.
Only saw the second half but i thought Clark and Bannan looked decent. Heskey did as well as could be expected trying to link up play but there was too big a gap between him and runners from midfield.
It was scary how easily and often jerome managed to get in behind our defence.
I don't know they battered us at Villa Park last time and we got away with it.
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i am not too sure GH had that many choices, Ireland who i suspect he didnt trust for a derby
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Same as the game last season. Only difference being a dodgy Penalty.
Time to move on, go to the pub, and concentrate on the League Cup game.
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I'm really interested in Houllier's reasoning for his team selection. I hope he's not allowed to duck that issue.
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i am not too sure GH had that many choices, Ireland who i suspect he didnt trust for a derby
Surely if he had played 2 defensive midfielders and Ireland, instead of the 3 defensive midfielders he did play, we would have. had a better chance of getting a goal.
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Let's look at the positives. That's 6 wins and 1 draw out of the last 7. 19 points as against their 1. Our winning streak had to come to an end at some stage. Now let's go and beat them the next 6, then a draw, then another 6.
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I think our league position is starting to mirror our talent.
If thats the case then MON worked miracles, which i refuse to believe.
Not really. Houllier has inherited a squad without it's best player (milner) and has also been hit by injuries and suspensions so its logical that we're going to drop down the table.
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Our league form is very poor at the moment.
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What a bloody awful game of football that was between two spectaculary average teams.
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I'm really interested in Houllier's reasoning for his team selection. I hope he's not allowed to duck that issue.
it reminded me of DOL's first derby. packing the midfield to not get beat.
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A better performance than last year's home match against them - very rarely did they cause us trouble today.
Seeing Ciaran and Barry Bannan thrust into such a game and look comfortable is a big, big positive for me. In the end it was a typical derby match - we can't go on winning them forever. A good effort, lads, now onto the next match...
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I'm really interested in Houllier's reasoning for his team selection. I hope he's not allowed to duck that issue.
I don't see any problem with the team selection, it was the defensive tactics that let us down. We played far too deep and failed to get players into the box. The Rags were highly organised, especially first half and they were willing to get players to support the attack. We weren't until the last 10-15 minutes. See the challenge by Heskey on their keeper in the second half - not a Villa player in sight to pick up the pass.
Not too disappointed. Gabby can't come back soon enough but he'll have to start showing Heskey a bit more respect and try and work together on a partnership. Always got the feeling Gabby preferred to play with Carew, more for personal than professional reasons.
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I'm listening to the WM radio phone in, villa fans are honestly calling for Houllier to go!
This is a guy that has not had the opportunity to buy anyone. Has lost gabby, albrighton and petrov from his first team.
Where is the perspective?
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I think our league position is starting to mirror our talent.
If thats the case then MON worked miracles, which i refuse to believe.
Not really. Houllier has inherited a squad without it's best player (milner) and has also been hit by injuries and suspensions so its logical that we're going to drop down the table.
ah, i see what you mean now, i thought you were talking about the squad in general.
There is no way with players fit that we should be anywhere near this low in the league.
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Just got back in the car, thats about it
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Let's look at the positives. That's 6 wins and 1 draw out of the last 7. 19 points as against their 1. Our winning streak had to come to an end at some stage. Now let's go and beat them the next 6, then a draw, then another 6.
I'm not bothered about this being against them. We don't get double points for results against them. We need to start winning matches. We haven't scored in three league games now and haven't won one in over a month. I want to start seeing three points appearing on the board regularly or we need to start looking over our shoulder rather then who is in front of us.
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I'm listening to the WM radio phone in, villa fans are honestly calling for Houllier to go!
This is a guy that has not had the opportunity to buy anyone. Has lost gabby, albrighton and petrov from his first team.
Incredible. Why do they let these people on the radio?
too thick and ugly for tv.
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People calling up for Houllier to go is ridiculous, he made mistakes today and was far far too negative. But give the guy a chance to get some of his own players in.
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We were abysmal. They weren't much better.
Awful, awful game.
Injuries have left a few holes in our team and they will need filling in January otherwise I think we'll struggle. We really miss Petrov, he is our only centre midfielder with any composure.
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I'm listening to the WM radio phone in, villa fans are honestly calling for Houllier to go!
Listening to that drivel as well. WM feeding the bait that Villa are going backwards without taking into account the facts of the situation...basically weak squad hit with injuries and suspensions. Apparently "Blues have bridged the gap" on the basis of that 90 minutes. The best chance they've had in a long time against us and they still couldnt get a decent sniff at goal. Pathetic.
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A very poor game, but considering our squad and our injuries i'm not that surprised.
Yes very negative 'play safe' tactics from Houllier but i'd rather that than lose the game. The worrying element is that with just 2 players injured, Petrov and Gabby, our side offers a distinct lack of composure and cutting edge. As most of us have been saying for the last couple of years, a quality midfielder and attacker are a must at the next transfer window.
Friedel didn't have too much to do, the rest of the defence were solid enough, though Young looked a little off the pace, and Dunne was getting skinned with ease when Jerome came on. Collins was solid as always. Warnock was crunching as always and seemed to be better going forward than he was defending.
Thought Clarke played well, and Bannan too when he came on. I don't think Sidwell played badly, but he certainly didn't play well. Reo Coker did what he should and got stuck in, as captain though he has to lead by example and he can't be acting like he did at the end of the game.
Young and Downing were both fairly poor and ineffective today. Heskey tried his best but was fed on scraps at best. Carew didn't have much of a chance really.
All in all it just didn't really work today, but considering it was a derby and we have several key players out we did ok. I seem to remember us playing a lot worse last year.
Ref: Did ok today i think, was pretty fair to both sides and could have quite easily sent Reo-Coker off.
Highlight of the game, Bannan going up against Zigic for a header.
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I'm really interested in Houllier's reasoning for his team selection. I hope he's not allowed to duck that issue.
I don't see any problem with the team selection, it was the defensive tactics that let us down. We played far too deep and failed to get players into the box. The Rags were highly organised, especially first half and they were willing to get players to support the attack. We weren't until the last 10-15 minutes. See the challenge by Heskey on their keeper in the second half - not a Villa player in sight to pick up the pass.
Not too disappointed. Gabby can't come back soon enough but he'll have to start showing Heskey a bit more respect and try and work together on a partnership. Always got the feeling Gabby preferred to play with Carew, more for personal than professional reasons.
Surely part of the reason for us playing so deep was having 3 defensive midfielders. If he didn't trust Ireland, then surely Bannan could have been given a go. Surely NRC and Clark/Sidwell would have been enough to snuff out their limited attacking threat.
I struggled to see who in the team could get us a goal. Young and Downing might have. Heskeys got a few but that wasn't going to last forever.
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On a slightly positive note...we looked the more likely to score in the last 15-20 minutes, but as also pointed out by GH, we are completely clueless upfront and dont even look like putting the ball in the back of the net.
How long is Gabby expected to be out?
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I'm really interested in Houllier's reasoning for his team selection. I hope he's not allowed to duck that issue.
I don't see any problem with the team selection, it was the defensive tactics that let us down. We played far too deep and failed to get players into the box. The Rags were highly organised, especially first half and they were willing to get players to support the attack. We weren't until the last 10-15 minutes. See the challenge by Heskey on their keeper in the second half - not a Villa player in sight to pick up the pass.
Not too disappointed. Gabby can't come back soon enough but he'll have to start showing Heskey a bit more respect and try and work together on a partnership. Always got the feeling Gabby preferred to play with Carew, more for personal than professional reasons.
Surely part of the reason for us playing so deep was having 3 defensive midfielders. If he didn't trust Ireland, then surely Bannan could have been given a go. Surely NRC and Clark/Sidwell would have been enough to snuff out their limited attacking threat.
I struggled to see who in the team could get us a goal. Young and Downing might have. Heskeys got a few but that wasn't going to last forever.
Sidwell should have been more box to box. If you see just before he got subbed he managed to get himself in a perfect goalscoring position but unfortunately the cross was met by the first Villa player (?). We were generally far too rigid and lacked the courage to break as a team.
I get the feeling GH feared a defeat today could have thrown us right off course. He may be right but a victory would have set us up nicely for Fulham with the whole club buzzing. A point against the Rags always feels like a defeat.
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edited
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At this particular time, the pragmatism shown by Houllier is warranted. I thought it was Small Heath's best chance for a while to turn us over and they couldn't do it. The new manager surely should be given time to build a team, remember we lost a long standing boss with little time until the start of the season. In twelve months time I would hope for a more positive approach all round.
Much talk from McShit about the gap narrowing, and he's right. But that because we have gone backwards rather than any managerial genius from that Ginger Rodent.
The open top bus is being prepared at Washwood Heath garage.
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I remember when villa went something like six games without scoring. Then Cyril Regis scored.
I'm pretty sure that was the first villa goal i saw at villa park.
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The open top bus is being prepared at Washwood Heath garage.
They are not comimg any where near Washwood heath Garage. They can use that Small Heath shed opposite their sty!
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We are a far better team than those wankers. Once again had a poor half. I honestly couldn't believe what I was watching. Every single person that watched that game knew it was crying out for Stevie Ireland to be put on. Shocked that he wasn't. Incredibly disappointed and ashamed.
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Just returned from VP. That was painful. Really poor match with football of the most odious quality played by both teams.
As an advert for our City this game did us no favours.
As 1 off result I am not bothered about this. Our run against them, based on law of averages, had to end sometimes however very worrying from an overall prospective. We are within touching distance of 3rd from bottom after 10 games and that is not good. We don't appear to have any method of attacking play or at least sustained forward movement and pressure.
Rene's selection was mystifying. OK we were handicapped with Agbonlahor and Albrighton not being available but surely Hleb just coming back from injury did not need his own minder in the shape of Clark.
Having said that NRC and Clark were good. Ash Young and Downing disappointing and everyone else about average.
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What a waste of time. Blues are the new Wimbledon.
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On a slightly positive note...we looked the more likely to score in the last 15-20 minutes, but as also pointed out by GH, we are completely clueless upfront and dont even look like putting the ball in the back of the net.
How long is Gabby expected to be out?
We miss Gabby for sure - but is he really the answer - sure he as close to prolific as we have but - we need a poacher (who's name is not Michael Owen or Robbie Keene) and some creativity in the middle.
For me (watching on an ALbanian stream which was a treat) is was a typical derby between two sides lacking real quality.
Couple of things i noted:
- Bannan looks comfortable - was much more visible and effective that Sidwell when he came on - needs to be given a run in my opinion while Petrov gets fit
- Clark looks capable and will turn into something very good indeed
- NRC was combative which is perfect for the game today - would have loved to have seen a Dublin on Savage when Ferguson rushed in (nasty ineffective little jock twat)
- Heskey is pointless when the gap between midfield and him is 30 yards (which is an improvement on Heskey is useless - which is what i would have posted previously)
- Did anyone else think that Sidwell trudging off slowly head down was the last we will see of him - no confidence at all, if i was him i'd be onto my agent - Villa has not worked out on any level for him - Villa and he need to part company for the good of all concerned
- Thanks goodness we didn't spunk any cash on Hleb
- Dunny ?? Hmmmm
- Gardener is a tosser
Could have been worse - if Emily has connected in the first half from Ash's through ball, if Clark has been an inch to the lest before Foster took his swede off - if Barry had got a bit more power behing the shot etc- only real scare for us was when Jerome got in - so in a way it was ugly but comfortable - we were not going to lose - but back to the real issue, goals - we have scored less goals than everyone bar Blackburn and WEst Ham i think - which is a worry - ans we don't look threatening at all - even from set pieces these days.
GED has got some big work to do in Jan else we will be looking over our shoulders rather than the other direction come second half of the season.
My 2p's worth
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I get the feeling GH feared a defeat today could have thrown us right off course. He may be right but a victory would have set us up nicely for Fulham with the whole club buzzing. A point against the Rags always feels like a defeat.
If that is the case, and I am inclined to agree with you, I would say his fear was well founded. A defeat today followed by a less than positive result in the QF, and he would be a dead man walking. Illogical, I know, but sadly true, in my view.
The positives from today: we played with plenty of spirit, and the defence was solid. Barry Bannan looks
like a player who knows how to inject pace and tempo into a move, something we have lacked for a long time.
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Yawn.
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6th, 6th, 6th. Now we are 3 points off relegation after 10 games. Work it fucking out.
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6th, 6th, 6th. Now we are 3 points off relegation after 10 games. Work it fucking out.
Our manager left us a few days before the start of the season and we are crippled by injuries. Settle down.
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Shocking game and why we feel the need to play 3 defensive midfielders is beyond me and when we play 4 5 1 it means Ashley can go missing which he did again. Poor team selection and I have just heard GH say that the players were tired ??
The facts are we havnt scored for 3 games and have won 1 away game out of the 5 we have played which when you think 2 out of our next 3 home games are against Man Utd and Arsenal its a bit concerning
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It wasn't good enough, but it wasn't a disaster. However we cannot be that negative again, because it effectively takes Ash, Downing and Heskey out of the game.
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It's just worth noticing that many people had Collins playing in midfield in their personal team selections both on here and VT. Ok, so Clarke played there but I don't think the overall effect would have been too different. Due to the lack of players to choose from, given injuries/suspensions, I'm not sure any of us really believed the game would be any different to how it turned out. If he had played two up front then our midfielf would've have lost out to theirs and we'd have probably lost, same goes for the inclusion of Ireland. We are severely undergunned in midfield following the loss of JM, even at full strength, so I can't see why people are so shocked TBH.
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Crap game.
NRC should've been sent off - very lucky, could've had the effect it had when Dublin was sent off i.e. we go on to lose.
Clark and Bannan are coming along well.
Looked to me like NRC handballed in the area.
And that's that, all very boring.
We really do need to win a game though.
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Crap game.
NRC should've been sent off - very lucky, could've had the effect it had when Dublin was sent off i.e. we go on to lose.
Clark and Bannan are coming along well.
Looked to me like NRC handballed in the area.
And that's that, all very boring.
We really do need to win a game though.
Oh, and Sidwell is fucking shit.
Also, we are really capable of passing the ball, so why do we fucking hoof it so many times? It's really annoying.
Someone needs to tell James Collins that he's not a 40-yard playmaker and to stick to the simple passing.
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We are a far better team than those wankers. Once again had a poor half. I honestly couldn't believe what I was watching. Every single person that watched that game knew it was crying out for Stevie Ireland to be put on. Shocked that he wasn't. Incredibly disappointed and ashamed.
Is Steve Ireland the new Joe Cole. If he plays we would win 6-0 or something. I admit we so need something but is Ireland the answer as he hasn't been in other matches including his poor showing against Burnley midweek.
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Looks bad for Ireland and sidwell- clearly not gerards cup of tea I feel.
Brings into question the logic of signing an expensive player without a manager.
I look forward to the transfer windows and seeing GED address the problems left at our club by mr o neill!
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Could'nt see them lot scoring apart from Zigic header tbh.
They can't play much better, we can.We have to perservere with Ireland, apart from Ashley he is the only central attacking midfielder we have who can link with 1 foward.
Two FBs today were very poor with distribution, and i'm afraid to say Gardener and Ferguson were a better central midfield 2 than NRC and Sidwell.Quite depressing really, we badly need a sharp Gabby back, and an improved Ireland.
Hard to think of many positives today tbh.
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Frankly I have never been so bored in my life. At work until 2am and then get up to watch that, then to be herded round like cattle because 2 sets of numpty supporters can't walk home or to their cars without giving it the large to each other. I think it was a completely depressing 2 hours all in all.
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6th, 6th, 6th. Now we are 3 points off relegation after 10 games. Work it fucking out.
And we are also 3 points off 5th\6th.
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Looks bad for Ireland and sidwell- clearly not gerards cup of tea I feel.
Brings into question the logic of signing an expensive player without a manager.
I look forward to the transfer windows and seeing GED address the problems left at our club by mr o neill!
Looks bad for the Fonz too which is a shame
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Did you see all the noses celebrating their Cup Final draw with such joy? That's what makes them so small time. Forever in our shadow.
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I could not understand the midfield we put out today.
Take away the fact that its a derby, why on earth would you put out three defensive minded midfielders against the Blues? They’ve not won away from home and they don’t carry a goal threat. Why it took 70 minutes to work that out I don’t know.
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OK just think someone really shit like Zigic playing for us.... now admire Heskey and Carew despite their short comings!
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Can somebody shed light on NRC at the end? What happened?
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Anyone wondering why it wasn't on Sky need only see a few minutes of that, dreadful game of football. Thought we looked promising early on but gradually got dragged down to their level and reverting the long ball to Heskey.
Glad it's over, a point is no disaster but we need to start scoring and winning again soon.
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We are a far better team than those wankers. Once again had a poor half. I honestly couldn't believe what I was watching. Every single person that watched that game knew it was crying out for Stevie Ireland to be put on. Shocked that he wasn't. Incredibly disappointed and ashamed.
Is Steve Ireland the new Joe Cole. If he plays we would win 6-0 or something. I admit we so need something but is Ireland the answer as he hasn't been in other matches including his poor showing against Burnley midweek.
You obviously didn't watch the first half of the Burnley game. Him and Young were the pinnacle of our attacks - linking up fantastically well. Fair enough though he did go silent in the second half, which seems to be a very big problem. As much as I hate Man City, their fans did say that he very often doesn't show up when it is needed.
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Awful game - thud and blunder. They maybe should have had a penalty and Houllier was right to take Reo off before he got himself sent off. Thought they looked a lot more threatening when Jerome came on to partner the lamppost, but Ash and Clarke could have nicked it in the last 15 minutes.
Was surprised at team selection but thought if anyone had to step up to defensive midfielder Ciaran fitted the bill - comfortable on the ball and think he may do a Barry-esque transfer from defence to midfield in the future. Given we had Ciaran and Reo in the middle I was surprised not to see Ireland (although he was pretty shit on Wednesday, but so was Sidwell). I was also surprised to see Bannan come on in the middle but thought he did well.
After that display I really don't fancy us for the cup game.
On the way back I also heard people calling for Houllier to go, and the guy on WM was more than encouraging the notion. Beggars belief - no pre-season, inherited squad with our best player sold, no chance to buy anyone, only just got his staff together etc. I think we will take a couple of steps back in the short term while he evaluates the squad (and to be fair he has given nearly all the players a chance to claim a place) and imposes his style and fitness requirements. Maybe a couple of signings in January will improve us for the second half of the season and I'm reserving judgement til at least after the summer.
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I thought clark did ok in his new role but would rather have had nige , Clark and Ireland than sidwell- we miss milner hugely and are struggling to create chances , never mind score them.
It's a shame the fonz hasn't had a few games to stake his claim as he now looks well down the pecking order- interestingly James Collins is banging in the goals on loan at burton.
I think GED may need more than
one or two in January as we really are crying out for creativity and goals- I do not blame him as he inherited this squad but maybe it shows why o neill felt he'd taken us as far as he could- he's left some very average players behind after squandering many millions.
I'm resigned to losing ash in the summer and the next 2 transfer windows will shape the future of our club.
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The personnel he put out on the pitch just didn't suit the formation he decided to play. I actually though Clark did ok in an unfamiliar position all things considered. Felt sorry for Heskey, neither Young nor Downing were close enough to him and we kept giving them the ball back in the 1st half. When he finally took one of the defensive midfielders off we looked immediately better and more flexible. Albrighton will walk back in that team next week.
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No Gabby - no Villa. That's what it is at the moment. Without his pace and goals, we're completely lacking in the final third. The ridiculous system and personnel contributed today to.
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Why the fuck did Clark play in midfield? I'm sorry but he was shit today. Dunne was shit too, so was Sidwell again.
We should of beat small heath today - it's like drawing against a Championship team at home, just not acceptable. No creativity in midfield... still, even though we weren't great today it just shows how awful small heath are. They have a dire attack, Zigic is just a slow shit - terrible player.
Oh well, we still haven't lost to the Blues in 5 and half years... them getting a draw meant the world to their fans at full-time. There fans are the scum of the earth with some of the stuff they sing... oh how'd I love to be a small heathen.
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Frankly I have never been so bored in my life. At work until 2am and then get up to watch that, then to be herded round like cattle because 2 sets of numpty supporters can't walk home or to their cars without giving it the large to each other. I think it was a completely depressing 2 hours all in all.
Agreed mate.
Neanderthal Man wins again.
And as for the game, what a shyte affair that was.
Who missed what looked like a fantastic headed goal about 5 mins from the end ?
On the positive side, Clark looks class - a bit too good on the ball for an English central defender.
ps. Dunne was appalling again
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I can think of two positives, I was impressed by Bannan when he came on. Also Clark look assured in possession which bodes well for his future career at centre half.
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Can you imagine Coker and Gardner in a fight? Coker would just completely destroy the little scrote of a liar.
Gardner is such a wanker - he should of been sent off today along with Zigic. Coker did nothing and didn't deserve a yellow, that retarded ref made a mountain of a molehill.
Just remember blosers, you've got two of rejects in your team because they weren't good enough for the Villa.
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Just remember blosers, you've got two of rejects in your team because they weren't good enough for the Villa.
I think you'll find it's three with another on the bench.
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I thought Clark did ok in midfield, I felt sorry for Heskey, the rest of the team were miles way from him, we were really negative and I couldn't wait for the half time whistle. Second Half was better, Bannan changed the game really, his energy was exactly what we were lacking, we need Gabby back asap.
They looks calm in the first half but never carved out a decent opening, they did have some long range effrots, draw was a fair result
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I also thought they had a strong shout for a penalty in the first half when NRC looked to handle the ball, this was evened up when Foster took Clark out after his header, anywhere else on the pitch and that's a foul.
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What's was going on outside the North Stand after the game? I see the police thugs were all lined up and ready to go but I also see flares everywhere? What was going on?
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Haven't seen many comments as just got back but, here's my take : Bannan to start for next match, again Sidwell did nowt. We need a striker. That's it..
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Why the fuck did Clark play in midfield? I'm sorry but he was shit today. Dunne was shit too, so was Sidwell again.
We should of beat small heath today - it's like drawing against a Championship team at home, just not acceptable. No creativity in midfield... still, even though we weren't great today it just shows how awful small heath are. They have a dire attack, Zigic is just a slow shit - terrible player.
Oh well, we still haven't lost to the Blues in 5 and half years... them getting a draw meant the world to their fans at full-time. There fans are the scum of the earth with some of the stuff they sing... oh how'd I love to be a small heathen.
If you thought Clark was shit you didnt watch same game as me
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If you thought Clark was shit you didnt watch same game as me
Clark had a good assured game and nearly got the winner. What the hell are you talking about Situ? We miss Gabbty obviously and I would have liked to have seen the Delf have a go at them to compensate for the lack of Gabby. I feel so sorry for Cuellar after watching Dunne today making Jerome look like Messi - appalling. Heskey worked hard but had no support and they totally snubbed out Ash. A draw was a fair result and in these games both sets of fans are just happy not to lose. The Cup game will be a cracker though...
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we really miss petrov
Really? I thought we passed it sideways and backwards quite well today.
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I thought Clark did ok in midfield, I felt sorry for Heskey, the rest of the team were miles way from him, we were really negative and I couldn't wait for the half time whistle. Second Half was better, Bannan changed the game really, his energy was exactly what we were lacking, we need Gabby back asap.
They looks calm in the first half but never carved out a decent opening, they did have some long range effrots, draw was a fair result
Pretty much my assessment of the game that.
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It's just worth noticing that many people had Collins playing in midfield in their personal team selections both on here and VT. Ok, so Clarke played there but I don't think the overall effect would have been too different. Due to the lack of players to choose from, given injuries/suspensions, I'm not sure any of us really believed the game would be any different to how it turned out. If he had played two up front then our midfielf would've have lost out to theirs and we'd have probably lost, same goes for the inclusion of Ireland. We are severely undergunned in midfield following the loss of JM, even at full strength, so I can't see why people are so shocked TBH.
A lot did have collins in midfield yes, but not as part of a defensive midfield 3. Small heaths midfield is not that incredible that 2 defensive midfielders wouldn't have been able to stop them surely.
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Lacked quality in the final third.
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When did sidwell become a defensive midfielder?
Just because he's shit, dosen't make him a DM, to me he has always been just a central midfielder, who pitches in with both attack and defence, though clearly he's not particularly good at either.
I would much rather have Bannan in there though.
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I thought the first half was dire. All hoof and hope.
Second half was better, more passing football.
Clark played well in his midfield role and I thought Bannan played well and hope he starts against Fulham.
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For the money spent, Martin O'Neill signed some fucking average players!!!
Downing 12 million? Really. Sidwell 5? Reo Coker 8.5? Just some astonishingly average players for the money spent.
Clark looked our best player by a street and could play a more advanced midfield role comfortably on that showing for me.
Bannan looked composed but so lightweight.
Dunne should be dropped for Carlos.
Heskey was ok but little movement. Can go on about service but our forwards hardly moved.
Ashley did not do enough for the talent he has to win us the game. Sidwell shoudl not have started, Ireland should.
January will be interesting.
Clark should have been given a pen when Foster took him out and the little scroat Gardner and the man pussy Zigic should both ahve been sent off, but then so should Reo by the time he was taken off. If the ginger drunk in charge of them bleats about Coker in the game he should look closer to home first.
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To be fair other than today Downing has been very very good this season.
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The game was crap, I just can't believe we were so negative. All in all its a point we didn't lose and we don't have to worry about them for another 30 odd days. Fair play to the lad in the Witton Lane who headed the ball, fell over the pitch side hoarding and was then thrown out!! You have to say stewards can be ridiculously pedantic about rules sometimes.
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I thought that was over-zealous stewarding to say the least.
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Me Three........
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we really miss petrov
Really? I thought we passed it sideways and backwards quite well today.
Really. Petrov has quality to win and keep the ball and get play moving. We lost so much possession today. He may do the simple things but he has the real quality to do it. But apart from Petrov there is an extremely large hole in that team the size of James Milner.
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Not good enough today. Too negative. Clark was my MOTM.
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Just remember blosers, you've got two of rejects in your team because they weren't good enough for the Villa.
I think you'll find it's three with another on the bench.
And if we include Fahey, it's four...
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Desperately poor game between two ordinary sides. For all the supposed renaissance of players like NRC and Heskey, they're still well short of the quality we require if we want to get back up the table. You can add Sidwell to that too.
I know we were missing a few players today but we could nevertheless have picked a more attacking formation and personnel. The way we were set up it was hardly surprising, but still disappointing, that we didn't create very much against a Blues side whose only strength is their defensive organisation.
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What's was going on outside the North Stand after the game? I see the police thugs were all lined up and ready to go but I also see flares everywhere? What was going on?
Not too much really lol. Birmingham and Villa fans rowing, we went back in the stand and watched from where the north upper exits are and it was pretty much over in about 30 seconds, Birmingham fans turned and ran. Also iv heard that it kicked off elsewhere and there main man has been 'sparked out'.
Anyway the important thing today was we diddnt lose although they clearly felt it was a win.. I thought Bannan and Clarke were awesome considering it was there first derby and it was rather heated out there. Midfield wasnt the best and its been well documented. We had some good chances and maybe deserved the win a little more i feel. Also i thought it was quite a good atmosphere today
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The players who let us down today were not the rookies - Clark was excellent, I thought, as was Bannan - it was the so-called experienced players: Dunne, Sidwell, Warnock and Ashley Young. Time and again we've seen Sidwell prove that he's just not quite P'ship standard. Warnock was poor generally.
AY - where do I start?! we lacked width; we played into the traffic that is the SHA strength (their central mid and defensive players). So AY plays in the middle rather than stretching the poor opposition fullbacks. Crazy. The games was there to be won, on the wings; so we play narrow. Mad!
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Some fairly scathing comments from GH on Ireland...
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To see the way our stewards handled that bloke that headed the ball that went out was a fukin disgrace and embarassment. He gets involved in a bit of fun and look what happens. As for the match i thought we did ok second half. Houllier has been dealt these cards and has to use them. Im glad he is using our youngsters like Albrighton,Clarke,Bannan.
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Some fairly scathing comments from GH on Ireland...
What was said Matt?
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Some fairly scathing comments from GH on Ireland...
What did he say?
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Houllier said: "I don’t want to have players who say ‘he’s a good player but'...He needs to get rid of these ‘buts’ & be a good player.”
When asked why Ireland wasn't playing
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Some fairly scathing comments from GH on Ireland...
What did he say?
He had better have a word with the board then as they signed him...............
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The BBC's Phil McNulty said: "Gerard Houllier's assessment of Stephen Ireland was brutal - non-selection & message afterwards a wake-up call."
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6th, 6th, 6th. Now we are 3 points off relegation after 10 games. Work it fucking out.
I've just worked it out.
If your manager leaves you five days before the start of the season, you cannot strengthen because of this and then you get injuries to key players, you tend to struggle.
Is that the answer?
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Yes pretty scathing.
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6th, 6th, 6th. Now we are 3 points off relegation after 10 games. Work it fucking out.
I've just worked it out.
If your manager leaves you five days before the start of the season, you cannot strengthen because of this and then you get injuries to key players, you tend to struggle.
Is that the answer?
And your chairman waits until the transfer window closes before appointing a new manager
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Houllier said: "I don’t want to have players who say ‘he’s a good player but'...He needs to get rid of these ‘buts’ & be a good player.”
When asked why Ireland wasn't playing
I think that sounds like a bit of a challenge towards Ireland, this is a good test, will he rise to the challenge? Or sulk and leave?
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6th, 6th, 6th. Now we are 3 points off relegation after 10 games. Work it fucking out.
I've just worked it out.
If your manager leaves you five days before the start of the season, you cannot strengthen because of this and then you get injuries to key players, you tend to struggle.
Is that the answer?
And your chairman waits until the transfer window closes before appointing a new manager
Yes, because they're just there waiting to be picked off the trees.
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6th, 6th, 6th. Now we are 3 points off relegation after 10 games. Work it fucking out.
I've just worked it out.
If your manager leaves you five days before the start of the season, you cannot strengthen because of this and then you get injuries to key players, you tend to struggle.
Is that the answer?
And your chairman waits until the transfer window closes before appointing a new manager
Aye, that's possibly one for the conspiracy theorists, but yes, it didn't help.
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And your chairman waits until the transfer window closes before appointing a new manager
Oh behave!
When MON left there was about 3 weeks til the end of the transfer window closed. Given MON's desertion was so sudden the club, quite understandably, had to then sit down and draw up a list of suitable candidates.
All of the potential candidates out there were in contracts (except the likes of Curbishley but the thought of that makes me shudder!). With interviews to take place and then contracts to sort out I think it's being cynical to the extreme to suggest the process was deliberately delayed until after the closure of the transfer window. We got someone in as quickly as could reasonably be done.
Anyway, what would be the motive for deliberately delaying matters as you suggest?
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My apologies for saying Clark was shit (was angry at time lol) - he wasn't he had a decent game, made a few silly tackles, but overall he did considering he was thrown in a derby game not playing his normal position. Nearly won it at the end for us as well.
I don't agree with Houllier playing Sidwell, Coker and Clarke - where's the creativity? Should of just played Clarke Coker and Ireland.
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6th, 6th, 6th. Now we are 3 points off relegation after 10 games. Work it fucking out.
I've just worked it out.
If your manager leaves you five days before the start of the season, you cannot strengthen because of this and then you get injuries to key players, you tend to struggle.
Is that the answer?
Of course. We drew today and had no shots on target in the first half because of O'Neill. It's all his fault. Not about the weird team selection or defensive mentality at home.
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I thought Clarke and Bannan played well.
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Well we are fucked until January, we have no composure in the final third. We are all scared when an opposition player is within 2 yards of us.
We just don't look like scoring and we are now 13th and 3 points off the bottom 3. We could quite easily find ourselves near the bottom off the table come January if we don't start scoring goals.
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Didn't see the game but doesn't like I missed a lot. What was that team selection all about?
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Too many crosses into an empty box. Just the same as under O'Neil
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Of course. We drew today and had no shots on target in the first half because of O'Neill. It's all his fault. Not about the weird team selection or defensive mentality at home.
It's not all O'Neill's fault, but he didn't exactly help, the timing of his departure meant that a squad that was already deficient in certain positions could not be bolstered, plus Hotlips could not stamp his signature on the squad and won't be able to do so until next season.
As for today's defensive formation, well when your forward choices are:
Gabby - injured
Carew - uninterested
Heskey - good so far but hardly prolific
Delfouneso - God knows but Hotlips obviously doesn't rate him
then it's difficult to pick an attacking formation even if he had wanted to.
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I thought Clarke and Bannan played well.
I agree. The thing I like about Bannan is that he always wants the ball. I'd be happy to see him start a few games now while Petrov is out. It's useful to know that Clark can play the holding role so well if required.
The main thing for me today was how much we miss Gabby. I think if he comes back 100% fit we will see an immediate improvement in results.
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I have no problem with the board taking their time in appointing MON's replacement and if a consequence of that mean't missing the transfer window so be it. Even if the new manager had been appointed in August he would have been unlikely to have sufficient time to sign new players.
To me the real issue is the decision to sell our best player during our managereless period.
Houliier's comments about Ireland today underline the error of football decisions being taken by non football people and whoever was responsible for this deal must be cringing.
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I thought the first half was dire. All hoof and hope.
Second half was better, more passing football.
Clark played well in his midfield role and I thought Bannan played well and hope he starts against Fulham.
It is watching a football match sober that makes you talk a lot of sense.
PS I agree with your comments,
apart from our couple of chances I liked the lads header for the throw in and The Bannan vs Zigic halfway line header challenge
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The BBC's Phil McNulty said: "Gerard Houllier's assessment of Stephen Ireland was brutal - non-selection & message afterwards a wake-up call."
Have I missed something? What was the message after?
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By Phil McNulty
BBC Sport at Villa Park
Aston Villa and Birmingham City shared the points after they fought out a dour midlands derby deadlock at Villa Park.
Gerard Houllier had set his sights on victory in his first confrontation with arch-rivals Birmingham since his appointment as Villa boss - and saw his side waste the best of the chances in an encounter that was high on endeavour but desperately lacking in serious quality.
Ciaran Clark almost grabbed a late winner for Villa when his close-range header was only inches wide, and Ashley Young came even closer seconds later when he hit the woodwork with City keeper Ben Foster beaten.
But Blues boss Alex McLeish will feel his side's defensive discipline and work ethic, with Roger Johnson outstanding, made them worth a point, and it was clear the visitors were happier with the result at the final whistle.
And Birmingham will also state a convincing case that they could have had more rewards, with referee Howard Webb ignoring a clear handball by Villa captain Nigel Reo-Coker in the first half.
Birmingham still nurse a sense of injustice after losing to a late penalty at Villa Park last season, and they clearly felt the fates were against them again here.
Villa boss Houllier gave Clark a midfield role in the absence of Stilyan Petrov, but after a bright opening the game swiftly became a war of attrition so often associated with derbies.
Emile Heskey was only inches away from getting a crucial touch on to Ashley Young's shot and Reo-Coker almost charged down Foster's clearance, the rebound dropping narrowly wide.
But Birmingham's gameplan soon reduced Villa to too many long balls aimed in Heskey's direction as the early creativity all but disappeared from their play.
And the away side were rightly infuriated nine minutes before the interval when referee Webb, despite looking right at the incident, ignored Reo-Coker's obvious handling offence inside the Villa penalty area.
Chances were once more at a premium after the break, but Reo-Coker tested Foster with a shot that the Birmingham keeper was able to collect with the minimum of fuss.
McLeish introduced Cameron Jerome for the subdued Alexander Hleb with 19 minutes left, and his impact was almost instant as he outmuscled Richard Dunne - no mean feat - and worked his way into the area, only to hit his cross straight at Brad Friedel with Nikola Zigic unmarked and waiting for a simple finish.
Reo-Coker had been having an eventful afternoon in an uneventful game, and he was eventually successful in earning himself a booking for a flare-up with Craig Gardner, who had been shown a yellow card early on after the pair clashed.
Villa substitute Barry Bannan had been lively, and his 20-yard effort brought a fine diving save from Foster with only nine minutes remaining.
John Carew was eventually introduced for Reo-Coker with nine minutes left, and his header set up a chance for Clark, who could only direct his finish wide under heavy pressure from Foster, sustaining a nose injury for his bravery.
Villa were ending the game the stronger side, and Ashley Young almost made the decisive contribution in the final minute with a rising drive that crashed to safety off the angle of post and bar.
It was the final act of a colourless game - although there was still time for Reo-Coker to re-enter the pitch looking for an argument after the final whistle. As with his earlier efforts, he had little satisfaction.
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6th, 6th, 6th. Now we are 3 points off relegation after 10 games. Work it fucking out.
I've just worked it out.
If your manager leaves you five days before the start of the season, you cannot strengthen because of this and then you get injuries to key players, you tend to struggle.
Is that the answer?
And your chairman waits until the transfer window closes before appointing a new manager
Yeh, I can just see Randy checking his watch every few minutes making 100% sure he didn't appoint anyone during the window. What a load of complete bollocks. And as for 3 points of relegation (in October FFS), how about saying we're 3 points off 5th, and that Spurs are 6 points off relegation. I despair sometimes at the melodramatics.
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We're 3 points off 5th, as are Liverpool, and Spurs are 6 points off relegation.
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We were poor today no idea's against also a poor team apart from the Bannan effort and ashley coming close there was nothing really so dissapointed.
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As soon as the teams were read out it was blatantly going to be 0-0. This may well have been mentioned lots but there seemed to be a bit of trouble just outside the away end about 20 minutes before kick off. Not sure exactly what happened, I thought it might be best to take the long way round to the Holte and avoid it.
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On a slightly positive note...we looked the more likely to score in the last 15-20 minutes, but as also pointed out by GH, we are completely clueless upfront and dont even look like putting the ball in the back of the net.
How long is Gabby expected to be out?
We miss Gabby for sure - but is he really the answer - sure he as close to prolific as we have but - we need a poacher (who's name is not Michael Owen or Robbie Keene) and some creativity in the middle.
For me (watching on an ALbanian stream which was a treat) is was a typical derby between two sides lacking real quality.
Couple of things i noted:
- Bannan looks comfortable - was much more visible and effective that Sidwell when he came on - needs to be given a run in my opinion while Petrov gets fit
- Clark looks capable and will turn into something very good indeed
- NRC was combative which is perfect for the game today - would have loved to have seen a Dublin on Savage when Ferguson rushed in (nasty ineffective little jock twat)
- Heskey is pointless when the gap between midfield and him is 30 yards (which is an improvement on Heskey is useless - which is what i would have posted previously)
- Did anyone else think that Sidwell trudging off slowly head down was the last we will see of him - no confidence at all, if i was him i'd be onto my agent - Villa has not worked out on any level for him - Villa and he need to part company for the good of all concerned
- Thanks goodness we didn't spunk any cash on Hleb
- Dunny ?? Hmmmm
- Gardener is a tosser
Could have been worse - if Emily has connected in the first half from Ash's through ball, if Clark has been an inch to the lest before Foster took his swede off - if Barry had got a bit more power behing the shot etc- only real scare for us was when Jerome got in - so in a way it was ugly but comfortable - we were not going to lose - but back to the real issue, goals - we have scored less goals than everyone bar Blackburn and WEst Ham i think - which is a worry - ans we don't look threatening at all - even from set pieces these days.
GED has got some big work to do in Jan else we will be looking over our shoulders rather than the other direction come second half of the season.
My 2p's worth
Pretty much summed up my thoughts there mate.
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Their game plan stopped Brad rolling the ball out to help us retain posession. As a result it went long to Heskey time after time and the midfield and wide players never got close enough to him. As a result, we lost too many second balls and consequently posession.
The changes made in the second half coupled with the game getting more stretched improved things but we lacked quality and a bit of luck in the final third.
Of the side today, five - Heskey, Young, Clark, Sidwell and Reo-Coker, wouldn't have played under O'Neill. We are going through a period of change and transition and have to accept that we need to be patient and that Houllier needs time to put his stamp on the side.
In the circumstances, a draw is an ok result. We need to get through to the New Year, with a couple of fresh faces and our injued players back and see how the second half of the season pans out.
The one big positive - Ciaran Clark reminded me of a young Gareth Barry today. Nice first touch and a composed left foot amongst the hurly burly of a derby.
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Mate has just txt me asking if it was true that Reo broke Gardner's nose in the tunnel? Anyone heard anything?
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I don't think they get on very well.
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We had one corner all game ffs, says a lot that does.
If only Clark's header or Ash's shot had landed in the back of the net - it would be a much happier claret and blue mood.
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Mate has just txt me asking if it was true that Reo broke Gardner's nose in the tunnel? Anyone heard anything?
Please let this be true!
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I hope it's not, because he'll be banned for ages if it is.
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Mate has just txt me asking if it was true that Reo broke Gardner's nose in the tunnel? Anyone heard anything?
Please let this be true!
Please let this be bullshit.
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Also it's not really acceptable from our Captain to behave like that.
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Call me Mr Cynical but I'm going to assume that didn't happen.
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I think it's bullshit. Listening to Radio 5 after the game, heard Pat Murphy interviewing Craig Gardner. He was quite complimentary about Villa, and sounded like a reasonably intelligent footballer.
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Call me Mr Cynical but I'm going to assume that didn't happen.
I'm thinking that too. Given the amount of press that were at the ground today this would already be all over the internet if it were true.
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They're talking about it on a SHA forum and have reached the conclusion that it's bollocks.
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Hard to disagree with this assessment:
http://bbc.in/d3SRit
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In fairness in the context of that interview, that's not too bad. He's saying he will lend support, but Ireland has to meet him halfway.
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When Emile was left on his own with no one within shouting range of him, then it was always on the cards that the ball was going to come straight back. Try as he might, he could not overcome Dann and Johnson together without any help - which he did not get.
Personally I would have thought it better to bring Downing inside to play off him and also run at pace at their back two. Might have made a difference.
If not that, why does Downing have to play for the first 80 minutes on the right wing when 99% of the time he checks back onto his stronger foot? Why not move him (and Ash) back and forth so the opposition cannot get settled? At least on the left he could have tried to go outside Carr and then maybe pull a centre back across, thus creating a bit of space.
Todays match also shows up what Pelty said about GH looking at the midfield. IMO neither Sidwell nor NRC is good enough to take us up to a top 6 challenging position. Will be intereting to see what happens in January.
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Mate has just txt me asking if it was true that Reo broke Gardner's nose in the tunnel? Anyone heard anything?
Please let this be true!
I got the same text from a Nose
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neither Sidwell nor NRC is good enough to take us up to a top 6 challenging position. Will be intereting to see what happens in January.
We have known this for a while to be fair. I think MON would even admit this one. I love NRC work rate and commitment but its not enough at the top end of the table.
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I'm listening to the WM radio phone in, villa fans are honestly calling for Houllier to go!
This is a guy that has not had the opportunity to buy anyone. Has lost gabby, albrighton and petrov from his first team.
Where is the perspective?
I heard that that Franks'y is a twat, Is he a nose or something? Villa are going backwards etc there were some callers saying the people who were saying that were idiots, I tried to get through.
I have no problem with clark playing defensive midfield he can pass it well, were hardly blessed in the forwards position are we?
Hope gabby comes back soon it was a shit game yeah but it ALWAYS is, last year both derbies were utter shit except we won, if we had won 1-0 in the last min everyone would come on this thread and say it were great
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I'm pretty sure that Franksy is a dog-head.
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Haven't seen any of it but judging by the comments it was back to last seasons home form. bore draw.
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Haven't seen any of it but judging by the comments it was back to last seasons home form. bore draw.
Nope, it was worse than last season. This was due to them being a bit better and us missing some players through injury and sale.
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Listening to both managers interviews after the game summed up the whole match, both deploying negative tactics and both more than happy with a point. On the whole a very poor match played out by two poor teams, (admittedly we are missing some key players).
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Random fact: Warnock has now been booked in six of his last seven league games.
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My take on the game....it was mega bollocks.....and also how the feck did sidwell end up at a big club like chelsea.....
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Free transfer, but we now know why he never played.
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My take on the game....it was mega bollocks.....and also how the feck did sidwell end up at a big club like chelsea.....
And you were doing so well..... :)
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I thought Sidwell did well when we didn't have the ball, he pressured them and covered a lot of ground.
Admittedly in the pub afterward I seemed to be in a minority of one.
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I'm pretty sure that Franksy is a dog-head.
He's Villa.
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We should have had a pen though....mind you i think villa were in for a shout for one as well....oh yeh if baggies win at blackpool tomorrow they are 6/7 pts ahead of the pair of us.....now who would have thought that at the start of the season
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Just back in North Yorkshire - some c**t broke my car window and took the sat-nav (late arrival meant I forgot to hide it.. hey ho)
Thought after a bright start we were rubbish for most of the first half. Improved after half time and might have snatched it at the death.
Question: If a central defender was as late in the challenge on Clark as Foster was then we would probably have got a penalty. Why are goalkeepers allowed to get away with things like this when, if another player so much as looks at them in an aggresive way then they most likely get a free kick - just as Foster did in the first half??
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Random fact: Warnock has now been booked in six of his last seven league games.
Was he suspended for the other game?! He's got more bookings than any other player in the top flight!!
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Team selection and tactics today would have been understandable
playing Chelsea/Arsenal/Manu away............but surely not at home
against a team that doesn't win on the road
Plus points were Ciaran Clark who looked accomplished in front of
the back four and Barry Bannan who nearly won us the game late on
Mid table mediocrity looks increasingly likely but I wouldn't blame
current manager for that entirely
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Just back in North Yorkshire - some c**t broke my car window and took the sat-nav (late arrival meant I forgot to hide it.. hey ho)
Thought after a bright start we were rubbish for most of the first half. Improved after half time and might have snatched it at the death.
Question: If a central defender was as late in the challenge on Clark as Foster was then we would probably have got a penalty. Why are goalkeepers allowed to get away with things like this when, if another player so much as looks at them in an aggresive way then they most likely get a free kick - just as Foster did in the first half??
same thoughts, he took clarke out
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I remember when villa went something like six games without scoring. Then Cyril Regis scored.
I'm pretty sure that was the first villa goal i saw at villa park.
From 11th Jan to Feb 8th, 1992 inclusive, we went five league games without scoring, Regis then scored in the sixth, a 1-0 win at home to Oldham on 22nd Feb. We then went on a run of a further five league games without scoring, from 29th Feb to 21st Mar (the day my younger son was born) inclusive, before Staunton scored in the sixth, a 1-0 win at home to Norwich on 28th Mar.
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Statto alert!
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Just back in North Yorkshire - some c**t broke my car window and took the sat-nav (late arrival meant I forgot to hide it.. hey ho)
Thought after a bright start we were rubbish for most of the first half. Improved after half time and might have snatched it at the death.
Question: If a central defender was as late in the challenge on Clark as Foster was then we would probably have got a penalty. Why are goalkeepers allowed to get away with things like this when, if another player so much as looks at them in an aggresive way then they most likely get a free kick - just as Foster did in the first half??
same thoughts, he took clarke out
It is a definite penalty but they never give them so I won't lose any sleep over it.
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Don't forget Gardner the Liar's handball in the penalty box in the second-half - the ref was never going to give it after not giving them a penalty.
What Foster did was a disgrace, did he even get a yellow card? I can't remember.
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Don't forget Gardner the Liar's handball in the penalty box in the second-half - the ref was never going to give it after not giving them a penalty.
What Foster did was a disgrace, did he even get a yellow card? I can't remember.
If the ref never gave a penalty indicating a foul why would he then proceed to book him?
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Just watching it again, nice to see them celebrating at the end like that, its always like that when the minnows come to a big club like us and manage a point.
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Don't forget Gardner the Liar's handball in the penalty box in the second-half - the ref was never going to give it after not giving them a penalty.
What Foster did was a disgrace, did he even get a yellow card? I can't remember.
If the ref never gave a penalty indicating a foul why would he then proceed to book him?
lol, I have no idea what I was saying there.
Still, what Foster did was a disgrace and how he got away with what he did is pretty poor from the referee, but that doesn't surprise me though because Howard Webb is an awful referee and vastly overrated. Gardner, Foster and Zigic could of all easily been sent off today, especially that scrote Gardner who should of been booked again after fouling Coker again.
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Situ
NRC should ahve gone for his retaliation as well.
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No he shouldn't, Gardner the scrote deserved what he got after fouling Coker again... Gardner should have got his second-yellow and been on walking down the tunnel*
*I did not clearly see the lash out, my mate sitting next to me said "I think Coker might get sent off for that". When I see the lash out properly in a bit I'll make a judgement then.
I love Coker though, showed so much passion today and played well. You've got to laugh when some morons were shouting "Shooooooot" with the ball dropping to him from 30 yards out lol.
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After seeing the Foster Clark incident for the first time there is no way that would ever be called a penalty. The ball was well away before the hit. If he had clattered Clark as he headed it then there might have been something in it.
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After seeing the Foster Clark incident for the first time there is no way that would ever be called a penalty. The ball was well away before the hit. If he had clattered Clark as he headed it then there might have been something in it.
Isn't it the fact that it was so late that makes it a possible penalty?
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After seeing the Foster Clark incident for the first time there is no way that would ever be called a penalty. The ball was well away before the hit. If he had clattered Clark as he headed it then there might have been something in it.
Agreed. Watching it live from the North Stand I saw Clark able to head the ball completely unobstructed before Foster piled into him. Not for a second i thought it was a penalty.
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Mate has just txt me asking if it was true that Reo broke Gardner's nose in the tunnel? Anyone heard anything?
Please let this be true!
Oh yes, please let it be true that our captain acted like an unprofessional ******.
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My take on the game....it was mega bollocks.....and also how the feck did sidwell end up at a big club like chelsea.....
Either you are taking the piss or you are under 18?
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After seeing the Foster Clark incident for the first time there is no way that would ever be called a penalty. The ball was well away before the hit. If he had clattered Clark as he headed it then there might have been something in it.
Isn't it the fact that it was so late that makes it a possible penalty?
Exactly. If the keeper had punched it away and then Clark had clattered him it would have been a foul against the keeper, and possibly a booking for Clark.
But as Percy says, these are never given so no point in arguing really.
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The ball was almost dead by the time Foster got to him. Clark made a mess of an easy scoring opportunity.
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After seeing the Foster Clark incident for the first time there is no way that would ever be called a penalty. The ball was well away before the hit. If he had clattered Clark as he headed it then there might have been something in it.
Isn't it the fact that it was so late that makes it a possible penalty?
Exactly. If the keeper had punched it away and then Clark had clattered him it would have been a foul against the keeper, and possibly a booking for Clark.
But as Percy says, these are never given so no point in arguing really.
If the keeper had punched the ball into play and he had been clattered then the ref would have called it as he would have stopped him from saving a possible follow on shot. I'm not arguing about it being a foul if Clark had pulled it down and been clattered. As for it being only keepers who get away with that, how many defenders slide into strikers just after they take a shot that is going wide?
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Awful awful game. Credit Bham and McLeish, they came for a point and deserved it. With Larsson's deliveries they threatened too. Granted Heskey and Clark missed great chances and Young had a great effort but our attacks were isolated and there was never any sustained pressure. Main problem was our midfielders whose passing lacked any tempo and was so predictable. Sidwell and Reo Coker are just not comfortable in possession when the opposition presses them. Clark was a bit better but hid for a while too I thought. Difficult for our attackers today but Downing and Heskey were diabolically poor I felt.
Friedel 6 - nothing to do
Young 5 - not great in possession and had absolutely no understanding with downing
Collins 7 - our best player but Zigic is pretty crap
Dunne 5 - a quiet day too but was so lacklustre that time with Jerome
Warnock 5 - stupid booking, poor in first half but alright in second
Downing 3 - absolutely awful. I hate when he plays on the right.
Reo coker 4 - won a share of ball but got involved in a lot of stupid stuff and could have seen red
Sidwell 5 - won a good bit of ball too I felt but so predictable on it. Harsh subsitution perhaps
Clark 6 - started well and finished well. Should have scored and was the only midfielder with a semblance of composure on the ball. That he is a centre half says it all about the other two
Young 6 - generally shit but still provided the only two moment of quality in the game. Great pass for Heskey and brilliant run and shot near the end.
Heskey 3 - hopeless. held up the ball alright sometimes but lack of pace is a huge issue - Bham just pushed up. Caught offside stupidly on numerous occasions and never a threat in the box. We badly need Gabby back.
Bannan 6 - alright. at least looked for ball, had a shot, tried to be creative. very lightweight but promising enough.
Carew 6 - won a great header for Clark's chance. To be honest, even at his laziest and most frustrating he is more of a threat than Heskey.
thought for Bham, their centre halves did well, carr was very good in the first half, larsson has a great delivery and barry ferguson played his role well and was my MoTM. Ridgwell wasnt great and Gardner didnt get on the ball much. Zigic was hopeless. If your playing with a lone striker they need to be mobile.
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Haha Ridgewell was shitting himself at times when Ash was running at him, unlucky that Ash's shot hit the top of the post and didn't go in the roof of the net.
Oh well. Small Heath got what they wanted - they came here for a point, they didn't come to Villa Park for all 3 points, they were happy and content with 1 point. Kind of small time it is and there fans are delighted, but if they play that awful style of football they play for the rest of the season, they're in serious danger of being relegated. They can pack the midfield with as many players as they like, there is no attacking threat from them. Jerome did well for them when he came on - but that's about it. Zigic was just awful.
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Pretty sobering account from the Telegraph. I agree with their assessment of NRC: aggressive and dynamic he might be but he can't pass and he can't shoot. Sadly for us, with Petrov crocked, Ireland out of favour already, and Sidwell truly useless, NRC's probably our best bet in central midfield. Which says more about the alternatives than it does about him.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/competitions/premier-league/7943526/Aston-Villa-0-Birmingham-City-0-match-report.html
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heskey is the most pointless dickwad in the game
what utter shite that is! yes he was caught offside often today but held the ball up well (as he always does!) thats his job! he did alright today!
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heskey is the most pointless dickwad in the game
what utter shite that is! yes he was caught offside often today but held the ball up well (as he always does!) thats his job! he did alright today!
Yesterday was one of his poor games, however the system we played and the lack of support didn't do him any favours.
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Awful awful game. Credit Bham and McLeish, they came for a point and deserved it. With Larsson's deliveries they threatened too. Granted Heskey and Clark missed great chances and Young had a great effort but our attacks were isolated and there was never any sustained pressure. Main problem was our midfielders whose passing lacked any tempo and was so predictable. Sidwell and Reo Coker are just not comfortable in possession when the opposition presses them. Clark was a bit better but hid for a while too I thought. Difficult for our attackers today but Downing and Heskey were diabolically poor I felt.
Friedel 6 - nothing to do
Young 5 - not great in possession and had absolutely no understanding with downing
Collins 7 - our best player but Zigic is pretty crap
Dunne 5 - a quiet day too but was so lacklustre that time with Jerome
Warnock 5 - stupid booking, poor in first half but alright in second
Downing 3 - absolutely awful. I hate when he plays on the right.
Reo coker 4 - won a share of ball but got involved in a lot of stupid stuff and could have seen red
Sidwell 5 - won a good bit of ball too I felt but so predictable on it. Harsh subsitution perhaps
Clark 6 - started well and finished well. Should have scored and was the only midfielder with a semblance of composure on the ball. That he is a centre half says it all about the other two
Young 6 - generally shit but still provided the only two moment of quality in the game. Great pass for Heskey and brilliant run and shot near the end.
Heskey 3 - hopeless. held up the ball alright sometimes but lack of pace is a huge issue - Bham just pushed up. Caught offside stupidly on numerous occasions and never a threat in the box. We badly need Gabby back.
Bannan 6 - alright. at least looked for ball, had a shot, tried to be creative. very lightweight but promising enough.
Carew 6 - won a great header for Clark's chance. To be honest, even at his laziest and most frustrating he is more of a threat than Heskey.
thought for Bham, their centre halves did well, carr was very good in the first half, larsson has a great delivery and barry ferguson played his role well and was my MoTM. Ridgwell wasnt great and Gardner didnt get on the ball much. Zigic was hopeless. If your playing with a lone striker they need to be mobile.
For those of us stuck listening to it on the radio, how nice to read a fair assessment of the actual football and players on show, including their lot. Thank you!
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Why was Collins man of the match?
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I thought Heskey worked his knackers off,held it up as often as possible considering the quality of ball played upto him(mostly 200 mph and diagonally aimed or looped at him).Also I agree with Peterwithes assesment ditto Sidwell,he put himself about and broke it up.I too was in the majority of one amongst post match drinking buddies.
Thought we were set up to counter their formation,however,we had the quality wide players,whom were never utilised or were on their game(messrs Young,Downing).Ditto our fullbacks,on paper they should be better supporting.
We had the last 10/15 mins mainly because they took Hleb off and it slightly opened up in midfield.With regard to the cup game,can't see the Heathens being quite so defensively set up,which'll help us.
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Pretty sobering account from the Telegraph. I agree with their assessment of NRC: aggressive and dynamic he might be but he can't pass and he can't shoot. Sadly for us, with Petrov crocked, Ireland out of favour already, and Sidwell truly useless, NRC's probably our best bet in central midfield. Which says more about the alternatives than it does about him.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/competitions/premier-league/7943526/Aston-Villa-0-Birmingham-City-0-match-report.html
Ironically, NRC was one of the few that had a shot on target. I agree with the paucity of options in midfield. I was calling for Collins to do a job in Sidwell's place but as it turns out Clark was chosen to play in midfield and did really well. But alongside Sidwell.
I would like to see Clark used alongside NRC with Ireland in front of them. I think that could work at times.
Until we get a chance to address the midfield problems anyway.
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Maz, some of Collins passing out of defence was terrible. He is our best centre half and Cuellar should join him instead of Dunne.
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Collins is usually pretty good on the ball in fairness.
I agree about Cuellar and Collins being the centre halves. Dunne is looking something short of sharp this season so far and Cuellar seems in great form.
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After the game on Wedenesday I was worried about this game. Our best football this season has been when we've had Young behind Heskey, with Downing and Albrighton providing width and allowing him the sapce to play. With Petrov also missing it meant Sidwell and NRC had to play and I don't think either can be trusted fully.
We probably did go a little too negative but I can see why he did it. Hleb got rave reviews last week for them and he wanted to negate that. It worked as far as that went as they rearely threatened but it meant that we struggled with our own creative side. When Carew came on we had three decent chances to win in but a draw was a fair result and it was the score both me and my mate (a nose) had predicted on Friday night.
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It was a poor game all round I thought. They were happy with a draw and we, mainly due to fear of losing it, were as well. And a draw was a fair result on the balance of play.
They'll now fancy their chances in the cup, but I expect it to be a different game if Gabby is back.
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I'm astonished that Steve Sidwell draws a wage for playing football.
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Awful awful game. Credit Bham and McLeish, they came for a point and deserved it. With Larsson's deliveries they threatened too. Granted Heskey and Clark missed great chances and Young had a great effort but our attacks were isolated and there was never any sustained pressure. Main problem was our midfielders whose passing lacked any tempo and was so predictable. Sidwell and Reo Coker are just not comfortable in possession when the opposition presses them. Clark was a bit better but hid for a while too I thought. Difficult for our attackers today but Downing and Heskey were diabolically poor I felt.
I make that about spot on although I thought Downing, in the rare moments he got the ball in the final third, looked the player most likely to make something happen.
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I'm astonished that Steve Sidwell draws a wage for playing football.
I'm amazed he's still at our club.
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Mate has just txt me asking if it was true that Reo broke Gardner's nose in the tunnel? Anyone heard anything?
Load of bollocks
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And to be fair Gardener is a really decent bloke, as is Ridgewell
If Craig is a blue nose then he is hardly going to shout it from the rooftops when he played for us - ine wanker in history did that and look where he is now - a postie
He is always complimentory about the villa and his time here
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Thought the match was poor obviously and since he has been here GH tactics have been negative - the do try and pass the ball better but i feel its like trying to win a horse race with a pony - to play the way he wants will mean players more suited to that style and we have a team created by MON for a complatetly different style
I cannot see us making huge inroads in January window so i do fear that this season will be as dull as ditchwater where not losing takes precedent over everything else
From the horses mouth Gabby is 4 weeks away
And i feel there are a few at the club who will be wanting away as GH and his team are not happy with a few of them
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This assessment is very close to my own, encouragingly. http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/philmcnulty/2010/10/houllier_lays_down_the_law.html
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Awful awful game. Credit Bham and McLeish, they came for a point and deserved it. With Larsson's deliveries they threatened too. Granted Heskey and Clark missed great chances and Young had a great effort but our attacks were isolated and there was never any sustained pressure. Main problem was our midfielders whose passing lacked any tempo and was so predictable. Sidwell and Reo Coker are just not comfortable in possession when the opposition presses them. Clark was a bit better but hid for a while too I thought. Difficult for our attackers today but Downing and Heskey were diabolically poor I felt.
I make that about spot on although I thought Downing, in the rare moments he got the ball in the final third, looked the player most likely to make something happen.
I thought Heskey did pretty well considering he would have needed binoculars to see a clare and blue shirt close to him for much of the game. His touch and movement is better than Carew in that lone role.
When that support did get closer to him we began to look a threat - see the lay off to Bannan for the only save of note either goalkeeper made.
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And to be fair Gardener is a really decent bloke, as is Ridgewell
If Craig is a blue nose then he is hardly going to shout it from the rooftops when he played for us - ine wanker in history did that and look where he is now - a postie
He is always complimentory about the villa and his time here
Pah, the squinty eyed cock did a little jig at the end as though they'd won the cup.
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just about sums them all up that they were so excited about being second best but managing to hold an injury / suspension hit villa to a goal less draw...
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I remember us doing similar cartwheels after a 0-0 draw at the sty under DOL.
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Mate has just txt me asking if it was true that Reo broke Gardner's nose in the tunnel? Anyone heard anything?
Load of bollocks
So Hookey, any feedback on why the stewards threw the bloke out who headed the ball and fell over the hoarding? Were they told to clamp down on anything?
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I'm pretty sure that Franksy is a dog-head.
He's Villa.
Well, if he is Villa, Dave, then he has a serious attitude problem towards GH.
"Villa negative from the start, showed no initiative to try and win the game, only reacted when McLeish put Jerome on, Villa on way down, Blues now on a par with Villa" were some of his quoptes as far as I can remember. Was too busy trying to drive a straight line whilst shouting abuse at him.
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I'm pretty sure that Franksy is a dog-head.
He's Villa.
Can't stand Paul Franks. If he is Villa, why does he come out and be honest about it? Tom Ross is happy enough to let it be known who he supports.
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just about sums them all up that they were so excited about being second best but managing to hold an injury / suspension hit villa to a goal less draw...
That's what always winds me up about Blues. They're not a League 2 side coming to Villa Park in a cup and battling to earn a surprise draw; they're a Premier League club with a squad as good as half the league, and they're in the same league position as us. They actually strengthened their squad over the summer too. We didn't. Even in the build-up to the game, their players were all talking about their main aim this season is to avoid relegation - what ambition, given where they finished last season.
But then, considering their history, I suppose the level of their aspirations is justified.
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all the talk about "closing the gap" cracks me up...
they might as well try to cross the grande canyon across a toothpick...
fuckwits...
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I'm pretty sure that Franksy is a dog-head.
He's Villa.
Can't stand Paul Franks. If he is Villa, why does he come out and be honest about it? Tom Ross is happy enough to let it be known who he supports.
He is indeed a massive tosser, as are most of that station to be honest. Anybody who makes Tom Toss sound like a credible broadcaster is automatically a wanker an WM do that perfectly.
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Mate has just txt me asking if it was true that Reo broke Gardner's nose in the tunnel? Anyone heard anything?
Load of bollocks
So Hookey, any feedback on why the stewards threw the bloke out who headed the ball and fell over the hoarding? Were they told to clamp down on anything?
If your question is as to why they threw him out - simple - he for whatever reason encroached the playing area and that is clearly a criminal offence. Now as it was in "good nature" i would imagine he was not arrested and fined the mandatory £1000 fine and get banned. But there can be no grey area here - if the next time it happened it would be a case of "Well you let that guy off and i was only messing about" -might seem harsh but you really have to see it from our point of view sometimes
AS for the handling of it and if they went mob handed - that is for the internal inquest that i am sure will take place.
What i do know is that as a Steward you never go to tackle a situation on your own so it may have seem mob handed but if it was the call to make the ejection then could you imagine a single steward going in there - could have been a lot worse, again it seeing the situation from both sides it was at the end of the day a volatile derby with a set of fans that only needed a spark (like pitch encroachment) and it could have got pretty out of order
Stewards (and trust me i know good and bad) are there primarily for safety and order and we are well drilled in this sort of thing. So what might have been seen as a bit of fun, if you watch the whole crowd dynamique it can easily spill over into something else
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Im amazed there is so much Sidwell negativity. Im not his mum either. He tackled better than Coker, and didnt lose his head throughout the game, yet Coker has been lauded and Sidwell caned. Heskey played well with little real support, I thought Ash went missing too much early on, but came back into it later. Clark looks promising wherever he plays at the moment. I thought Collins defended well, but was poor at passing, and not man of the match for me, by some margin. Downing improved through the game, and for me remains our most consistent player. Warnock did what he needed, Luke Young was disappointing, constantly left space for attackers, but offered little going forward. Bannan impressed me way more than the cup game, good cameo. Carew. He is out of it for me. Just dissapointed we got dragged down to Brums way of playing, I think we have more to offer than this, and fair play to them for sticking to the game plan. Coker needs to sort himself out, these games are bigger than his ego. As for all the Ireland fans, I was very much one, but I want to see more appetite than I have seen from him yet. He has a long way to go to nail on a start. There is a bloody good player in there, I just want to see it
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How the fuck did McLeish, on MOTD2, come to the concluison
'we had the better chances' ? The man is an arse.
On the subject of MOTD2, how embarrasing were the Vincent Price style introductions to each match?
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I have stopped watching MOTD 2 it is a total embarrassment
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They should just call MOTD 2 "Carry on Football".
Especially when the camp lounging bloke in the 'straight from the packet' BHS shirts is on it.
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Anyone know where i can find a clip of motd2 and the villa fan heading the ball and falling over the barrier.....funny as feck.....its my mates son.....(sheldon villa)
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Best I could get. ;D ;D
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fair play to you mate......i know the kid really well and hes a nice lad......cant believe they kicked him out.....
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Clearly an accident. But you'll always get stewards who act like jumped up little Hitlerites at anything.
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Anyone know where i can find a clip of motd2 and the villa fan heading the ball and falling over the barrier.....funny as feck.....its my mates son.....(sheldon villa)
Motd is on BBC iplayer after Tuesday.