Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: Holy Trinity on September 13, 2010, 04:38:39 PM
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ssn just said that gary mcallister is leaving boro to join us as GH number 2, personally i like him and think he will be a very good assistant and is a very grounded individual. might just help keep some of our young players feet on the ground
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Good choice. Everyone needs a good number two from time to time.
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Could be a good choice, but is it not slightly worrying that he's part of what appears to be a disastrous Middlesbrough set up?
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He would be good as most players will remember him in action and can look up to him unlike MON and JR and co. McAllister have a long playing career so he would be a good role model as well. Will he be able to teach Nigel Reo Coker how to pass short ball.
Not bad two different playmakers in coaching staff :)
And it is about time we poach staff/players back from Villaboro :)
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Could be a good choice, but is it not slightly worrying that he's part of what appears to be a disastrous Middlesbrough set up?
nah its strachans fault, he belives the spl is as good as the prem and thinks that buying 2nd class spl players will make boro a prem team once again lol
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Could be a good choice, but is it not slightly worrying that he's part of what appears to be a disastrous Middlesbrough set up?
Not really, the majority of their signings have been from the SPL....the current league place reflects the quality of the squad.
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Seems like a good choice, I think; he certainly knows Houllier well and, as mentioned above, he has the 'clout' to gain respect from players I would imagine. He's also reckoned to be a very good 'manager-in-training' (albeit by my mate that supports 'Boro!).
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Nice one If true.. Great player..
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Seemed a natural choice. I'm pleased with that. Was a class player, and will certainly have plenty of decent input for our midfielders.
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Sell Sidwell Play Macca .. Job Done
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Good choice. Everyone needs a good number two from time to time.
I need a good number two every day.
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Does that mean he will take over managing the first team until GH is up and running?
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Mcallister is a very good choice. A good player and leader in his day and most definately someone to look up to. Did I read somewhere that Hamann was also sounded out for a coaching role but declined in favour of continuing to play with MK Dons?
Shame as he would have been a good personality type to have round the training ground.
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Assistant Manager? He can have a game if he wants.
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I'd like him to still be playing for Scotland today. None of our current players are fit enough to lick his boots.
If you think that Houllier signed both him and Hamman at Liverpool you can tell he knows a good midfielder which is good as that is where we need most work.
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Does that mean he will take over managing the first team until GH is up and running?
Don't think so.
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I think this if true would be a good appointment
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Wonderful player but I don't know anything about his managing experience.
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Rather him than Phil Thompson. Always liked him as a player too. One of Houllier's best signings for Liverpool even if he was well into his 30's at the time.
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Wonderful player but I don't know anything about his managing experience.
Gary McAllister's managerial career
Team From To Games Won Lost Drawn
Leeds 30-01-2008 22-12-2008 50 25 17 8
Coventry 24-04-2002 11-12-2003 76 21 29 26
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I'm happy with this appointment. I reckon he will work well with GH and probably has good contacts with the game and how to handle players given his relative youth.
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People are actually in agreement that this could benefit the club? :P
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Didn't he jump of the Tallahatchee Bridge?
Where are my tablets??
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According to the Daily Mail:
However, it seems that the Frenchman might have to wait for McAllister as he is currently contracted to Middlesbrough, working with Gordon Strachan and has moved closer to the club's training complex signalling his intention to stay.
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Mr Beige leads Mr Bland with insipid results.
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Gary McAllister a failed coach and rubbish manager ... of all the coaches available in europe is this the best GH can do?
This would be a sad appointment. :'(
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Gary McAllister a failed coach and rubbish manager ... of all the coaches available in europe is this the best GH can do?
This would be a sad appointment. :'(
What do you base the above on?
You're turning into gregnash, give the bloke a chance for fucks sake.
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where is Greg Nash?
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Gary McAllister a failed coach and rubbish manager ... of all the coaches available in europe is this the best GH can do?
This would be a sad appointment. :'(
Just as well he' not being appointed as First team Coach but as Assistant Manager then.
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Would be great for our midfield to have Gary Mc coaching them, I'm sure Delph will be excited about working with him again!
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Mcallister was a coach when Coventry went down and as manager there and at Leeds was a huge flop- he's struggling at boro , so let's hope if he comes that GED works some of his magic on him.
As a player Gary mac was a great player but it is time he had some success in coaching or managing and I hope he is successful.
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where is Greg Nash?
Last seen digging a 6' hole to bury MON.......and Ellis
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* so do the number 2 requirement must be a former Liverpool Player who play under GH.
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Gary McAllister a failed coach and rubbish manager ... of all the coaches available in europe is this the best GH can do?
This would be a sad appointment. :'(
What do you base the above on?
You're turning into gregnash, give the bloke a chance for fucks sake.
Based on his record at Leeds and Coventry. Chris we are not here to hire people at very high salary who have poor record.
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Gary McAllister a failed coach and rubbish manager ... of all the coaches available in europe is this the best GH can do?
This would be a sad appointment. :'(
Just as well he' not being appointed as First team Coach but as Assistant Manager then.
Yes he has a clean slate as Assistant Manager!!
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Based on his record at Leeds and Coventry. Chris we are not here to hire people at very high salary who have poor record.
He took over both clubs when they were doing badly, getting Leeds to the play-offs and keeping Coventry afloat. It's not a great record but it isn't a bad one.
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Gary McAllister a failed coach and rubbish manager ... of all the coaches available in europe is this the best GH can do?
This would be a sad appointment. :'(
What do you base the above on?
You're turning into gregnash, give the bloke a chance for fucks sake.
Well said Chris.
Give the guy some time.
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Many cov fans regarded gary macs era as coach and manager a disaster but in fairness to him his wife was dying at the time.
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He's who the manager wants, therefore I hope he gets him.
You could look at Steve Clarke's spell at West Ham and say "see, he's shit' which would totally negate his good work at Chelsea.
Give him a chance.
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Villa's ambition seems to be dying by the day.
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I'm not sure why appointing, or looking to appoint, McAllister is seen as dying ambition.
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Anyway is he joining us? Not heard anything more than initial speculation.
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I'd like him on board, fingers crossed.
At this rate, he may be with us before Houllier !
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To say he's struggling at Boro is using a lot of poetic license... he was appointed in May 2010, I read. I know Boro didn't win many matches in June and July, but even so.
Sometimes the most important factor in hiring an assistant manager is that he will work well with the manager himself... if Gary Mac is Houllier's choice, that's fine. I don't believe you can push someone on to the manager - has to be his choice.
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Has anyone got any info on this? Is it happening?
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Has anyone got any info on this? Is it happening?
The way Villa are communicating at the moment, we probably won't know he's joined until he gives his first post-match interview.
I'm getting cynical here, but someone at the club needs to make some official noise. It's getting beyond a joke now
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I would agree with that. There are all sorts of conflicting messages flying around about the Villa, and some kind of clarification would be welcome.
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I've never known so much fuss made over an assistant manager.
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Can't we get Alan Shearer? He might be able to teach our strikers to score.
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Strachan confirmed villa have approached boro about Gary mac and they will sit down today and discuss it- he only moved from Leicester to a new home in the north east last month but I would imagine this job will attract him back- and who's to say strachan will last much longer at boro- last night they had 2nd lowest crowd ever at the riverside in the league and fans were chanting strachan out!
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I've never known so much fuss made over an assistant manager.
I've never known such a cack handed way of appointing a manager and his assistant.
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Must admit the silence official or otherwise does seem a little incredulous
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Blimey, enough with the continual demands on the club to keep having to give us all 24/7 reports on what is happening. As Dave said, as there ever been so much fuss made over the appointment of an assistant manager? Did we all get this excited or create so much euphoria when John Ward, Steve Harrison or Roy Aitken was appointed?
In addition, the appointment of Houllier has obviously been made because the board sees it as a long-term appointment. If the board believe they have the right man for the long-term benefits of the club then I applaud that approach. It is not a short-term fix.
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I've never known so much fuss made over an assistant manager.
I've never known such a cack handed way of appointing a manager and his assistant.
It is the Villa!
btw like the use of the phrase "cack handed"
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Blimey, enough with the continual demands on the club to keep having to give us all 24/7 reports on what is happening
It's not really 24/7 demands for information though. It's been a week since GH was trotted out as our manager and I don't think it's too demanding of us to ask when we can expect to see him in the dugout. They expect fans to buy tickets for forthcoming games without knowing who will be in charge?
To give them some credit, Villa seem to have grasped the concept of 24/7 communication when it comes to emailing me with their latest offers though.
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No, an official 'Gerard Houllier will start his duties on xxxx' statement is all I'm after. Every time we get a day closer it seems his arrival is put back a couple of days! He must have a starting date. There must be a set notice period with the French FA. All seems rather strange.
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No, an official 'Gerard Houllier will start his duties on xxxx' statement is all I'm after. Every time we get a day closer it seems his arrival is put back a couple of days! He must have a starting date. There must be a set notice period with the French FA. All seems rather strange.
Monday. Bloody Monday.
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Can't we get Alan Shearer? He might be able to teach our strikers to score.
I'd take him as a player right now - he'd score more goals than Heskey!!
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Wow. Been offline for a couple of days and people seem to have gone hopping mad.
the stoke loss was galling and made me very angry, but I fear some are simply trying to take that out on the club with some of the posting across topics on here. Clearly Thompson and Burgeus have said no due to family reasons which is their call. Gary McAllister looks likely now to be number 2, there is a fitness coach from France being talked about and I am sure Houllier will sort the rest in due course. We have made an ok start under the circumstances. While in a mire our rivals have not run away from us, surely we can chill look at it rationally and wait for the club to straighten themselves out when Houllier is sorted with the French FA. He has clearly gone down the honorable route. Beat Bolton at the weekend and we have 9 from 5. That would give us over 60 points if taken through the rest of the season. People need to get a bit of perspective.
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Wow. Been offline for a couple of days and people seem to have gone hopping mad.
the stoke loss was galling and made me very angry, but I fear some are simply trying to take that out on the club with some of the posting across topics on here. Clearly Thompson and Burgeus have said no due to family reasons which is their call. Gary McAllister looks likely now to be number 2, there is a fitness coach from France being talked about and I am sure Houllier will sort the rest in due course. We have made an ok start under the circumstances. While in a mire our rivals have not run away from us, surely we can chill look at it rationally and wait for the club to straighten themselves out when Houllier is sorted with the French FA. He has clearly gone down the honorable route. Beat Bolton at the weekend and we have 9 from 5. That would give us over 60 points if taken through the rest of the season. People need to get a bit of perspective.
Or perhaps people see that a start of West Ham at home, Newcastle away, Everton at home, Stoke away, and then Bolton at home should see us with a bare minimum of 11 points. We shouldn't be sitting here with 6 and a minus goal difference.
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While some are claiming that Houllier is just a French version of MON, it should be clear by now that their attitudes towards the concept "notice period" differ.
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Or perhaps people see that a start of West Ham at home, Newcastle away, Everton at home, Stoke away, and then Bolton at home should see us with a bare minimum of 11 points. We shouldn't be sitting here with 6 and a minus goal difference.
Quite. The West Ham win looked promising, but it's since transpired that they look as if they're going to get a hammering every week. We've lost both our away league fixtures - one of which (and I say this with a cool, analytical head on and not in the heat of the post-match moment) was arguably our worst league defeat of all-time, considering the opposition, and we're out of Europe. Our squad hasn't been strengthened, so much so that we looked seriously short of options on Monday night.
I'm not panicking or raging at the board, but I think it's fair to say that the summer months have almost totally been a waste, and that - while I do respect what has happened at the club since 2006 - it's only reasonable to be just slightly concerned.
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We lost in Europe last season, and got a good couple of thumpings towards the end of the season too. Add that to the manager going 5 days before the season starts and I would say if we can get 9 from 5, we are going to be doing ok. Couple of defeats - one nothing short of a complete disgrace and the other very unfortunate, and out of Europe to the same side that the great martin lost to last season. I just think getting our knickers in a twist about the timing of when the manager can start, when he himself quite clearly said it would most likely be the Blackburn game at the press conference, followed by getting in a flap about people turning the assistant job down, or more to the point ruling themselves out before being offered, is another bit of silliness. The whole coaching team are or equal importance to sort, but i imagine Houllier wants to survey what he has in front of him before that he brings too many in. Just chill, nothing we rant at on here is going to make him arrive any faster, he has the job, we are not in crisis at all like many seem to want to peddle, and enjoy us thumping Bolton on Sat to give Kevin Mac a good send off and to welcome the G Dog.
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G Dog?!? Ha! Love it.
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But, but, McAllister already has a job! This just won't do!
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But, but, McAllister already has a job!
Clearly, that applies to Mr. Houllier as well.
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Mcallister will be fourth choice. And i think he will decline this offer. So who next ??????
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Villa Insider (http://twitter.com/Villa_Insider), who has proven him/herself to give accurate tips, says: Gary McAllister to join GH in stands at tomorrows match.
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Just read the bit on the generals thread about Staunton & Southgate, Where has this come from? Rumour or does it have some truth?
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According to Five Live he's agreed to become Assistant Manager and will be at the game today.
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According to Five Live he's agreed to become Assistant Manager and will be at the game today.
Along with Sid Cowans as first-team coach I'm told (didn't hear the piece personally so can't confirm)
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According to Five Live he's agreed to become Assistant Manager and will be at the game today.
Along with Sid Cowans as first-team coach I'm told (didn't hear the piece personally so can't confirm)
I heard it, and can confirm that they said Sid will be first team coach.
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1416: Let's firm up what we heavily suspected earlier: Aston Villa have confirmed Gary McAllister has agreed to become assistant manager to Gerard Houllier.
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According to Five Live he's agreed to become Assistant Manager and will be at the game today.
Along with Sid Cowans as first-team coach I'm told (didn't hear the piece personally so can't confirm)
I heard it, and can confirm that they said Sid will be first team coach.
Very strange, especially as Houllier had offered MacDonald a desk job not coaching, according to the Guardian.
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Promoting Sid to first team coach is a canny appointment by Houlier. Whatever his attributes on the training ground, his presence on the bench will give the management team an immediate creditability with many Villa fans.
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Good news IMO opinion. If we still can't string a pass together with Sid and GM taking training we never will
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Welcome aboard Gary Mac, and congratulations on the promotion Sid.
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I have no idea what G Mac is like as a coach, so best of luck to him, always liked his style as a player. And congrats as well to Sid, those two playing together would have been like Xavi and Xabi Alonso (hyperbole alert!), so let's hope they can get the midfield moving of the ball properly.
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Also Robert Duverne has been appointed an Assistant/Fitness Coach
OS
http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2157961,00.html
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Promoting Sid to first team coach is a canny appointment by Houlier. Whatever his attributes on the training ground, his presence on the bench will give the management team an immediate creditability with many Villa fans.
Quite right.
Could it be construed as a kick in the teeth for KM though. Sid must be much highly thought of to get that promotion, very highly thought of.
Interesting appointment
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Could be good news for the Fonz too.
McAllister was very keen on him during his time at Leeds, tried to get him on loan on a few occasions.
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My favourite memory of McAllister is from the League Cup Final in 1996. Sat on the coach leaving Wembley about an hour after the game, stuck in traffic as per usual, when I looked to my right we just happened to be parked right next to the Leeds team bus. McAllister was about five feet away and had a face like his cat had been run over.
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Nice to see sid step up to 1st team coach and a big welcome to Gary mac and GED and his staff - let's hope a great new era awaits us
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Wonder how he got the job? As in, does he know Houllier? Is Houllier aware of who he is?
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Don't be ridiculous Houllier is a student of football - Sid Cowans is in all the core textbooks.
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Wonder how he got the job? As in, does he know Houllier? Is Houllier aware of who he is?
Houllier got an ex club player in to be part of his team at Liverpool. No surprise with this one. Considering he does a good coaching job anyway and Kmac decided first team coach wasn't for him.
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Get to Bodymooor on Monday Gary and sort this lot out mate ffs
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Also Robert Duverne has been appointed an Assistant/Fitness Coach
OS
http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2157961,00.html
Good luck with Richard Dunne
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My favourite memory of McAllister is from the League Cup Final in 1996. Sat on the coach leaving Wembley about an hour after the game, stuck in traffic as per usual, when I looked to my right we just happened to be parked right next to the Leeds team bus. McAllister was about five feet away and had a face like his cat had been run over.
Interestingly enough I managed two get two Wembley Gallery tickets from Mac at face value - Have had a soft spot for him ever since
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Wonder how he got the job? As in, does he know Houllier? Is Houllier aware of who he is?
Houllier got an ex club player in to be part of his team at Liverpool. No surprise with this one. Considering he does a good coaching job anyway and Kmac decided first team coach wasn't for him.
It certainly seems a good idea to get someone like Cowans involved more than he is. He'd certainly deserve a lot of respect from the players. And if they don't know who he is, then someone better tell them quick!
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Is there anything to the fact that since McAllister was linked to us Boro have started to win games?
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GH made special mention of Sid at the press conference, now that was a player
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2 real ball playing midfield players as part of the set up, i can only see these appointments as good news
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From Pravda (http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2157961,00.html):
The Club is pleased to announce that Gary McAllister has agreed to become assistant manager to Gerard Houllier, while Gordon Cowans will become first team coach.
Former Scotland international McAllister, capped 57 times, was described by the new Villa manager as "my most inspirational signing" during their time at Liverpool where McAllister played an integral role in the unique treble triumph of 2001 (Uefa Cup, FA Cup and League Cup).
He has also managed at Coventry City and Leeds United.
Villa legend Cowans, who was capped 10 times for England, joined Villa as an apprentice when he was 15 years old and in three spells at the club made a total of 527 appearances.
He won the league in 1981 and the European Cup in 1982 and has been coaching Villa's youth for many years.
Rafa Gonzalez, who came to the club in the 2007-08 season as goalkeeping coach to the reserve team, will be goalkeeping coach and Robert Duverne, who worked with Houllier at Lyon where they won back-to-back titles, will assist as coach/fitness coach.
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Up and running I guess. We need to hit the ground running. Hopefully KMac can get back on the reserves. Would be sad to see him go really.
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2 real ball playing midfield players as part of the set up, i can only see these appointments as good news
You'd think so, but then again Tony Adam's time as coach or manager wherever he's been has resulted in an absolutely pisspoor defence.
Actually that was a bit pessimistic. I take it back, Sid and Macca will do the biz!
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I'm not happy with McCallister and Cowans as coaches. They should be playing instead of Petrov and Ireland
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Hello fellow Villains
Let me start by saying I Love Aston Villa. (no full stop could give ever give it justice)
I am a very very very long time H&V lurker (that long maybe its my own first thread to start) in fact I feel like I know you all but I have held off because I knew once I started it would be like Pringles.
Dave W knows me to look at and have the banter the with (only when I buy the the programme) and i even saw VillaJK in the Holte Pub earlier (recognised the photos from Frank) - I feel like a stalker!
More about and my Villa heritage will follow but the reasons i felt compelled to start now is...
Today is my eldest daughters Bella 5th birthday and she had a pamper day - nails hair and all that......i got my pass out to go straight to the Villa after if it had finished with everybody's blessings with UP THE VILLA from 10 little girls ringing round my ears
Im not a moaner but maybe I expected more but I was bored and felt worryingly that I could count on one hand the players that even nearly felt my desire and passion for THE VILLA
So why my rant now......
I've got to know some of the old players through the AV FPA more and more over the years (again more to follow) and it was a pleasure to then chat with Sid and Neil Rioch in the Holte Pub. It cheered me up know end and of course we congratulated him. We laughed and revered that that him and Gary Mac could sort our current midfield out or if not maybe play.....but Sid was his normal self dismissive self and said lets wait and see - Sid refused a drink but Neil encouraged us and we bought Sid a bitter (without him knowing us loyal 5 Villains all kissed it before we give it him) he gave me a massive hug.
Without doubt he is THE VILLA MAN of my era - he fully understands the history and the place and it is a great appointment by GH
Hopefully with some clear direction and a bit of love from the fans the good lord Aston Villa ship is now steering back in the right direction
Keep the faith
Howla
ps. General Krulak - you are the man - keep talking to us
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We got two of best British playmakers over last 2 decades as coach as well :) This will mean attractive passing game for me. As they won't allow kick and hoof and hope.
Who will get Gordon's last job.
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All I can say with Gary Mac and Sid coaching the players day in day out, if we can't produce a passing and possession confident team within 6 months to a year, we might aswell give up!
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We will find out which of our players can control a football and pass to
oneof our own-
Welcome to Villa Park Gary
Sid - you deserve some of the limelight - good luck - we all know
there's claret & blue blood running through your veins
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Welcome to the club Mr. MaCallister (ill learn to spell your name in time!!) and heres hoping to that bright future finally coming. An FA cup would be nice
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In addition, the appointment of Houllier has obviously been made because the board sees it as a long-term appointment. If the board believe they have the right man for the long-term benefits of the club then I applaud that approach. It is not a short-term fix.
What makes you say this Legion? Genuinely interested as I think Villa need to start operating this way, with a clearer long term, sustainable, achievable strategy.
My biggest concern with Houllier is that it smacks me as being a short-term appointment - He's in his 60's, has had an operation on his heart and not worked in football management for a few years. Plus, I'm sure I read it is only a three year contract.
Hopefully behind the scenes Gary Mac (or whoever) will be groomed as the long-term successor with Ged taking a director level role.
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We will find out which of our players can control a football and pass to
oneof our own-
Welcome to Villa Park Gary
Sid - you deserve some of the limelight - good luck - we all know
there's claret & blue blood running through your veins
That shouldn't take them long at all from what I have seen over the last 12 months...
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I think the appointment is long term thinking.
Sort out the playing system, scouting and introduce new ideas and make our academy even better with extra technical knowledge from his old job and bring in up and coming talents from France. I think MON is too old school. But who know how long Gerald will stay at Villa Park. He might carry on after 3 years. Maybe Gary McAllister will make the step up afterwards.
We might become the team for every young English and French players choose to join our academy.
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I think the appointment is long term thinking.
Sort out the playing system, scouting and introduce new ideas and make our academy even better with extra technical knowledge from his old job and bring in up and coming talents from France. I think MON is too old school. But who know how long Gerald will stay at Villa Park. He might carry on after 3 years. Maybe Gary McAllister will make the step up afterwards.
We might become the team for every young English and French players choose to join our academy.
You are spot on IMO. GH elluded to KMac potentially taking over after him. But he rejected the 1st team role. So I assume it will be McAllister now if all goes to plan. That will have been the incentive for him leaving Boro so quickly after moving his family to N Yorks.
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good stuff...
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Someone said McAllister was coach at Coventry when they went down, but I think you'll find he was too busy being part of GH's treble winning team that season. Good player, talks sense on TV, got Ok results at Coventry with no money and a tragic personal issue going on. Got Leeds in the play-offs but wasn't given enough time by Bates. I think he's a decent choice, he could have sat tight at Boro and waited for them to sack Strachen! Also, Chris Waddle reckons one of the only decent decisions he made as Burnley boss was to give Sid his first proper coaching job.
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Mcallister was a coach when Coventry went down and as manager there and at Leeds was a huge flop- he's struggling at boro , so let's hope if he comes that GED works some of his magic on him.
As a player Gary mac was a great player but it is time he had some success in coaching or managing and I hope he is successful.
Well my future Brother-In-Law who is a big Cov fan speaks of him highly and says that when McAllister was their manager it was when Cov were at their worset with no money. He had to cope with no money and loan players from lower divisions and he basically got those players playing better then they actually were, so i'm happy with him as our assistant manager.
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I'm quite happy with our new management set-up. Guile is a major part of it (no Streetfighter gags please) and Gary McAllister and Gordon Cowans know how good, attractive, winning football is played. Houllier has years of experience and has been successful in wining trophies.
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I've not seen anything about that highly regarded French coach being part of the backroom - the one that was credited as being a major part of Houllier's success during the first few years at Liverpool.
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I've not seen anything about that highly regarded French coach being part of the backroom - the one that was credited as being a major part of Houllier's success during the first few years at Liverpool.
He turned him down didn't he at about the same time Pinochio was mentioned.
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Sid refused a drink but Neil encouraged us and we bought Sid a bitter (without him knowing us loyal 5 Villains all kissed it before we give it him) he gave me a massive hug.
That made me laugh, probably because I know where you're coming from. Sid really was a class player, certainly my all time favourite Villa player. I really hope it works out for him as First team coach.
I still think we'll be seeing Patrice Bergues joining the coaching staff in the not too distant future. All the links with him suggested he wasn't currently available but was still in line to join up with us at some point.
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Sid Cowans was on our train going to Wembley for the CC Final. With his son. It really surprised me that he wouldn't have been part of the clubs entourrage.
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Robert Duverne is going to be the hardest working man in football over the next couple of weeks and months.
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Any idea how good is Robert ?
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He was with the French national set up so I imagine he's more than qualified. He also took major umbrage with the disgraceful antics of the French players in quite an amusing fashion.
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Great to have Sid working with the first team and welcome to all the other new faces, if they can start passing the ball like Sid and McAllister and then have the legs to keep running after 70 mins then we could become a force again, good times are coming!
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I love that Sid has stepped up to the 1st team. What a great bloke.
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I do too but can't help wondering.. why Sid?
All the coaches in the world and Houllier chooses Sid from our Academy. I don' get it.
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He was with the French national set up so I imagine he's more than qualified. He also took major umbrage with the disgraceful antics of the French players in quite an amusing fashion.
was he the one who had a flid-out and threw his stopwatch into the hedge? That was my top moment of the World Cup
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I do too but can't help wondering.. why Sid?
All the coaches in the world and Houllier chooses Sid from our Academy. I don' get it.
Perhaps Houllier recognised that the players had a really tight bond with Kev Mac and as he wanted to go back to the reserves Sid's appointment makes sense for two reasons.
Firstly, with KMac and Sid in the reserves its kind of potentially creating a club within a club. The new regime at the top and 'Villamen' underneath them. The second point is regarding first team players. It seems clear that they were close to Kev Mac. Appointing Sid makes sure that the players will work with the new manager rather than hanker for their man. If there are any whispers, or dissenters, then Sid could be the bridge to the past and the future.
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One criticism of the board is that the entire coaching staff was more loyal to O'Neill than to the club, and when they flounced with Martin we were fucked.
There's no chance of that with Sid.
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One criticism of the board is that the entire coaching staff was more loyal to O'Neill than to the club, and when they flounced with Martin we were fucked.
There's no chance of that with Sid.
Considering that MON, Robertson and Walford have always worked as part of a team, i was'nt in the slightest bit surprised that they all went. It happens a lot.
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He was with the French national set up so I imagine he's more than qualified. He also took major umbrage with the disgraceful antics of the French players in quite an amusing fashion.
was he the one who had a flid-out and threw his stopwatch into the hedge? That was my top moment of the World Cup
That was skill.
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One criticism of the board is that the entire coaching staff was more loyal to O'Neill than to the club, and when they flounced with Martin we were fucked.
There's no chance of that with Sid.
Considering that MON, Robertson and Walford have always worked as part of a team, i was'nt in the slightest bit surprised that they all went. It happens a lot.
It went beyond those three, and even if it happens a lot, I suspect they want to limit the chances of it happening again
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I do too but can't help wondering.. why Sid?
All the coaches in the world and Houllier chooses Sid from our Academy. I don' get it.
I mentioned before that Houliier has previous on employing someone in the caching team with links to the players and fans of the club. Pinnochio at Liverpool and now Sid at Villa. I do believe that KMac was possibly the preferred choice and when he turned it down then Sid was the next obvious candidate.
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I do too but can't help wondering.. why Sid?
All the coaches in the world and Houllier chooses Sid from our Academy. I don' get it.
Most foreign coaches get someone in with a link to the club when they come in e.g. Mourinho and Steve Clarke, Wenger and Pat Rice and Houllier getting Pinocchio off Sky to join the set up at Liverpool when he first came in so nothing unusual.
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One criticism of the board is that the entire coaching staff was more loyal to O'Neill than to the club, and when they flounced with Martin we were fucked.
There's no chance of that with Sid.
Considering that MON, Robertson and Walford have always worked as part of a team, i was'nt in the slightest bit surprised that they all went. It happens a lot.
It went beyond those three, and even if it happens a lot, I suspect they want to limit the chances of it happening again
I think they walked out of loyalty for the man who has employed them has he's backroom staff wherever he's managed, nothing more than that.
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One criticism of the board is that the entire coaching staff was more loyal to O'Neill than to the club, and when they flounced with Martin we were fucked.
There's no chance of that with Sid.
Considering that MON, Robertson and Walford have always worked as part of a team, i was'nt in the slightest bit surprised that they all went. It happens a lot.
It went beyond those three, and even if it happens a lot, I suspect they want to limit the chances of it happening again
I think they walked out of loyalty for the man who has employed them has he's backroom staff wherever he'smanaged, nothing more than that.
That's exactly what I mean.
First loyalty to MON, not the club. They won't want that happening again.
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I do too but can't help wondering.. why Sid?
All the coaches in the world and Houllier chooses Sid from our Academy. I don' get it.
Perhaps Houllier recognised that the players had a really tight bond with Kev Mac and as he wanted to go back to the reserves Sid's appointment makes sense for two reasons.
Firstly, with KMac and Sid in the reserves its kind of potentially creating a club within a club. The new regime at the top and 'Villamen' underneath them. The second point is regarding first team players. It seems clear that they were close to Kev Mac. Appointing Sid makes sure that the players will work with the new manager rather than hanker for their man. If there are any whispers, or dissenters, then Sid could be the bridge to the past and the future.
I see what you're getting at Peter, even if Sid was not Reserve team coach bit an Academy coach. SHQ points out how other foreign managers have appointed a club man as part of their team but all those listed were Assistant Managers not First team coaches. There should be a big difference in the roles, maybe there won't be, I guess we'll soon find out.
My concern remains that Sid's appointment has not been made on best man for the job but having a Club man on the staff. I know Sid will give it 110% but whether he's ready to make the step up from the kids to the first team squad, I've no idea, it seems risky business. It certainly appears to be a much bigger step up than Kevin Mac taking over first team duties.
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I wouldn't say the appointment of Sid is riskier than giving Kevin Mac the top job.
Sid has decent credentials, but first and foremost he'll be working under instruction from GH -who has a wealth of experience- and Gary Mac who has also managed to a decent standard.
Also, the fact that GH was receptive to the idea of working first with Kevin Mac and then with Sid hopefully indicates that he's flexible enough to not just want to work with his mates. When it comes to important positions, jobs for the boys doesn't always cut it - as we've seen. Every manager wants to surround himself with a few people he knows and trusts, that's natural. But you can't make every staffing decision using that criteria.
If for whatever reason it is felt further in down the track that Sid isn't up to scratch, I'm pretty certain GH won't be shy in making changes. He'll need the approval of the board, obv. But if it's important to him I can't see them refusing.
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One criticism of the board is that the entire coaching staff was more loyal to O'Neill than to the club, and when they flounced with Martin we were fucked.
There's no chance of that with Sid.
Considering that MON, Robertson and Walford have always worked as part of a team, i was'nt in the slightest bit surprised that they all went. It happens a lot.
It went beyond those three, and even if it happens a lot, I suspect they want to limit the chances of it happening again
I think they walked out of loyalty for the man who has employed them has he's backroom staff wherever he'smanaged, nothing more than that.
That's exactly what I mean.
First loyalty to MON, not the club. They won't want that happening again.
Did Allan Evans also flounce after Brian Little walked.
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One criticism of the board is that the entire coaching staff was more loyal to O'Neill than to the club, and when they flounced with Martin we were fucked.
There's no chance of that with Sid.
Considering that MON, Robertson and Walford have always worked as part of a team, i was'nt in the slightest bit surprised that they all went. It happens a lot.
It went beyond those three, and even if it happens a lot, I suspect they want to limit the chances of it happening again
I think they walked out of loyalty for the man who has employed them has he's backroom staff wherever he'smanaged, nothing more than that.
That's exactly what I mean.
First loyalty to MON, not the club. They won't want that happening again.
Did Allan Evans also flounce after Brian Little walked.
No, wasn't he in charge for one match and then Gregory came in.
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Evans stayed, then left when Gregory got the job two days later.
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First loyalty to MON, not the club.
There are one or two supporters that are very much the same.
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First loyalty to MON, not the club.
There are one or two supporters that are very much the same.
So where are the supporters of Aston Villa who left after MON resigned? Or do we all have to follow you in your Doh'Neill crusade?
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First loyalty to MON, not the club.
There are one or two supporters that are very much the same.
So where are the supporters of Aston Villa who left after MON resigned? Or do we all have to follow you in your Doh'Neill crusade?
Whilst I agree, it's not as if people have stopped supporting us, but there are plenty who have taken the side of the former manager against the club the last few weeks,.
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First loyalty to MON, not the club.
There are one or two supporters that are very much the same.
So where are the supporters of Aston Villa who left after MON resigned? Or do we all have to follow you in your Doh'Neill crusade?
Whilst I agree, it's not as if people have stopped supporting us, but there are plenty who have taken the side of the former manager against the club the last few weeks,.
Absolutely.
There are two non internet supporters in The North Stand near me who reckon that we
'Shat on O'Neill and it's all the boards fault'
Another one in the Bartons once said to me
'If O'Neill leaves, it would be the beginning of the end for the club.'
!!!
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Whilst I agree, it's not as if people have stopped supporting us, but there are plenty who have taken the side of the former manager against the club the last few weeks,.
And there were plenty of people who took the side of say Big Ron against the club when he was sacked. What is this not allowed now in the Randy era?
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Whilst I agree, it's not as if people have stopped supporting us, but there are plenty who have taken the side of the former manager against the club the last few weeks,.
And there were plenty of people who took the side of say Big Ron against the club when he was sacked. What is this not allowed now in the Randy era?
Big Ron vs Ellis - No contest.
An honest board who have granted the manager and supporters virtually anything they've asked for vs An ego-maniac who's bizarre transfer dealings led him into having a hissy fit and walking out - No contest.
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Very objective Mark, now get back to your voodoo doll.
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First loyalty to MON, not the club.
There are one or two supporters that are very much the same.
So where are the supporters of Aston Villa who left after MON resigned? Or do we all have to follow you in your Doh'Neill crusade?
Whilst I agree, it's not as if people have stopped supporting us, but there are plenty who have taken the side of the former manager against the club the last few weeks,.
The fuckers, how dare anyone have a different opinion.
I think a few people have aired genuine concerns about the way the club have handled finding a replacement, the delays in GH taking up the post, the General's needless comments, our lack of spending, the kit cock up and the Kevin MacDonald will he won't he affair and others have decided that means they've taken sides.
I'm still behind the board, think that they've done a good job to date and hope that they continue to do so. I'm behind the new manager and his team. My only concern with our ex-manager is when people try to rewrite history to suit themselves and pretend that they know exactly what happened to cause him to walk out.
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Whilst I agree, it's not as if people have stopped supporting us, but there are plenty who have taken the side of the former manager against the club the last few weeks,.
And there were plenty of people who took the side of say Big Ron against the club when he was sacked. What is this not allowed now in the Randy era?
Nobody is saying it isn't allowed. I was just pointing out that it has happened.
Although if we're comparing Randy to Doug we've got short memories.
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The fuckers, how dare anyone have a different opinion.
Somewhat over the top, Chris.
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First loyalty to MON, not the club.
There are one or two supporters that are very much the same.
So where are the supporters of Aston Villa who left after MON resigned? Or do we all have to follow you in your Doh'Neill crusade?
Whilst I agree, it's not as if people have stopped supporting us, but there are plenty who have taken the side of the former manager against the club the last few weeks,.
The fuckers, how dare anyone have a different opinion.
I've often thought the same when making points against Mon. Did you think that then ?
I'm still behind the board, think that they've done a good job to date and hope that they continue to do so. I'm behind the new manager and his team. My only concern with our ex-manager is when people try to rewrite history to suit themselves and pretend that they know exactly what happened to cause him to walk out.
I couldn't agree more.
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MON is'nt the first manager to walk out on a football club and i'm pretty sure he won't be the last. We're in danger of making ourselves look silly if we keep harping on about it 7 weeks after it happened. We'll probably never know what happened until he writes his autobiography. Until then, can't we just get over it and support the new regime?
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On topic, I really rated McAllister as a player and Sid is a legend - a true Villa legend.
Thus, I am looking forward to the 'new regime' with much positivity.
OK, these guys won't be pulling n the shirt, but they will be a massive influence on the way we play; the structure of the team going forward.
Vive le difference.
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MON is'nt the first manager to walk out on a football club and i'm pretty sure he won't be the last. We're in danger of making ourselves look silly if we keep harping on about it 7 weeks after it happened. We'll probably never know what happened until he writes his autobiography. Until then, can't we just get over it and support the new regime?
There's nothing wrong with discussing a previous manager.
We still sometimes discuss O'Leary even now.
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MON is'nt the first manager to walk out on a football club and i'm pretty sure he won't be the last. We're in danger of making ourselves look silly if we keep harping on about it 7 weeks after it happened. We'll probably never know what happened until he writes his autobiography. Until then, can't we just get over it and support the new regime?
There's nothing wrong with discussing a previous manager.
We still sometimes discuss O'Leary even now.
You're coming across as a bit obessed if you don't mind me saying so Mark.
Anyway, O'Neill did a good job. O'Deary was a waste of space. I've moved on from both either way.
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Like the general balance of the new management team. When some of the KMac adorers of the first team dont see eye to eye with H Cowans will be there to talk it through and settle things down. Also Mcallister will bring a strong presence to the team ......
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MON is'nt the first manager to walk out on a football club and i'm pretty sure he won't be the last. We're in danger of making ourselves look silly if we keep harping on about it 7 weeks after it happened. We'll probably never know what happened until he writes his autobiography. Until then, can't we just get over it and support the new regime?
There's nothing wrong with discussing a previous manager.
We still sometimes discuss O'Leary even now.
You're coming across as a bit obessed if you don't mind me saying so Mark.
Anyway, O'Neill did a good job. O'Deary was a waste of space. I've moved on from both either way.
I do mind you saying so, he's being discussed on a regular basis because his actions have impacted on the way the season has started and all the problems we've encountered.
Righly or wrongly, he left the club 5 days before the start of the season which is highly unusual for any top flight club, I can see no harm in discussing/debating his merits and trying to get to the bottom of exactly WHY he left.
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MON is'nt the first manager to walk out on a football club and i'm pretty sure he won't be the last. We're in danger of making ourselves look silly if we keep harping on about it 7 weeks after it happened. We'll probably never know what happened until he writes his autobiography. Until then, can't we just get over it and support the new regime?
There's nothing wrong with discussing a previous manager.
We still sometimes discuss O'Leary even now.
You're coming across as a bit obessed if you don't mind me saying so Mark.
Anyway, O'Neill did a good job. O'Deary was a waste of space. I've moved on from both either way.
I do mind you saying so, he's being discussed on a regular basis because his actions have impacted on the way the season has started and all the problems we've encountered.
Righly or wrongly, he left the club 5 days before the start of the season which is highly unusual for any top flight club, I can see no harm in discussing/debating his merits and trying to get to the bottom of exactly WHY he left.
We're nowhere near stopping feeling the impact of his fucking off when he did, it's pretty much bollocksed the entire season.
We shouldn't let it dominate the rest of the season, we need to move forward under GH, but really, it is naive to assume some sort of statute of limitations exists which means that enough time has passed for the effects to not matter any more.
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MON is'nt the first manager to walk out on a football club and i'm pretty sure he won't be the last. We're in danger of making ourselves look silly if we keep harping on about it 7 weeks after it happened. We'll probably never know what happened until he writes his autobiography. Until then, can't we just get over it and support the new regime?
There's nothing wrong with discussing a previous manager.
We still sometimes discuss O'Leary even now.
You're coming across as a bit obessed if you don't mind me saying so Mark.
Anyway, O'Neill did a good job. O'Deary was a waste of space. I've moved on from both either way.
I do mind you saying so, he's being discussed on a regular basis because his actions have impacted on the way the season has started and all the problems we've encountered.
Righly or wrongly, he left the club 5 days before the start of the season which is highly unusual for any top flight club, I can see no harm in discussing/debating his merits and trying to get to the bottom of exactly WHY he left.
Agreed, and on an Aston Villa discussion board why not discuss Martin O'Neill? Or David O'Leary? Or Graham Taylor or John Gregory? Heck, we still have arguments over Doug Ellis every now and then.
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We're nowhere near stopping feeling the impact of his fucking off when he did, it's pretty much bollocksed the entire season.
Actually, has it? bear with me here....
OK, we're out of Europe. But the same opponents knocked us out last year aswell, so would him have staying changed that?
And we have 7 points from 5 games, which were gained under the leadership of what we now know to be the wrong man for the job. Most importantly we're only 1 point from 4th, so everything to play for there.
Yes, his leaving may have stopped us recruiting, but does that not mean we're ideally placed to be big players in Jan? Imagine another Carew and Young added to our present squad.
I think our season starts now and we may be surprised!
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I like your style!
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I think in hindsight we'll look back to his sudden departure and conclude that he did us a big favour my leaving, even if the timing was not ideal.
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I think in hindsight we'll look back to his sudden departure and conclude that he did us a big favour my leaving, even if the timing was not ideal.
Your leaving would indeed be doing us a very big favour, Kelly, you massive drama queen.
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MON is'nt the first manager to walk out on a football club and i'm pretty sure he won't be the last. We're in danger of making ourselves look silly if we keep harping on about it 7 weeks after it happened. We'll probably never know what happened until he writes his autobiography. Until then, can't we just get over it and support the new regime?
There's nothing wrong with discussing a previous manager.
We still sometimes discuss O'Leary even now.
You're coming across as a bit obessed if you don't mind me saying so Mark.
Anyway, O'Neill did a good job. O'Deary was a waste of space. I've moved on from both either way.
I do mind you saying so, he's being discussed on a regular basis because his actions have impacted on the way the season has started and all the problems we've encountered.
Righly or wrongly, he left the club 5 days before the start of the season which is highly unusual for any top flight club, I can see no harm in discussing/debating his merits and trying to get to the bottom of exactly WHY he left.
We're nowhere near stopping feeling the impact of his fucking off when he did, it's pretty much bollocksed the entire season.
We shouldn't let it dominate the rest of the season, we need to move forward under GH, but really, it is naive to assume some sort of statute of limitations exists which means that enough time has passed for the effects to not matter any more.
Of course it hasn't "bollocksed the entire season". We're only one significant player different from last season with, I hope, the prospect of adding to the squad in January. If Gerard can get us organised and competitive over the coming months and we then get the boost of new signings after Christmas then I think we can look forward with some optimism.
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We're nowhere near stopping feeling the impact of his fucking off when he did, it's pretty much bollocksed the entire season.
Actually, has it? bear with me here....
OK, we're out of Europe. But the same opponents knocked us out last year aswell, so would him have staying changed that?
And we have 7 points from 5 games, which were gained under the leadership of what we now know to be the wrong man for the job. Most importantly we're only 1 point from 4th, so everything to play for there.
Yes, his leaving may have stopped us recruiting, but does that not mean we're ideally placed to be big players in Jan? Imagine another Carew and Young added to our present squad.
I think our season starts now and we may be surprised!
We've spent first few weeks looking for a new manager, and now we have one, he's having to meet the players for the first time a month into the season.
He's never going to hit the ground running and get things going his way from the off.
The reason we found ourselves fishing from a limited pool of managerial options is the same reason MON's leaving when he did is going to have such a lasting impact - we'd have struggled to convince other managers to do to their clubs what MON did to ours, ie drop them in a sizeable vat of shit.
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We've spent first few weeks looking for a new manager, and now we have one, he's having to meet the players for the first time a month into the season.
He's never going to hit the ground running and get things going his way from the off.
Yet how often do you we see managers taking a job mid season and getting an imediate reaction from the players?
Houllier has a good squad to work with, basically the squad that finished 6th last year, so should be able to do well with us if he's any good!
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trying to get to the bottom of exactly WHY he left.
Maybe because his stock at Villa was falling by the day as more and more of even his staunchest supporters [I'm including myself there] were seeing through his childish stobborness towards certain costly purchases, the England job looked likely to be up for grabs at any day and he gambled on getting a crack at it, now or never, before his bubble burst and Randy sent him packing ten games into the season.
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I think in hindsight we'll look back to his sudden departure and conclude that he did us a big favour my leaving, even if the timing was not ideal.
Your leaving would indeed be doing us a very big favour, Kelly, you massive drama queen.
Thanks, your majesty. I'm going to put your Royal seal of approval on all my posts and stationery now.
Her Majesty Queen of Drama Paulie Walnuts I, has awarded a Royal Warrant to Mark Kelly.
What exactly is your coat of arms. A crown, a handbag, some lipstick, a pair of high heels on a big girls blouse?
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What has "bollocksed" the season, is the boards inability to appoint a manager before the end of the transfer window.
MON left, it would/should have been an ideal opportunity to get a new manager in, with the funds from the Milner sale, to invest in better players than we currently have, and if possible, move some out.We did'nt, and for me the bigger question is why did MON go, and why did'nt we get a manager in until after the transfer window.
Worrying times for me as a Villa fan, if we had appointed a Jol/Hiddink/Moyes/Hughes, we would have got an extra 5'000 in the last 3 home games.Thats an extra £200k per game.Short sighted thinking in my eyes.
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And how do you know none of those were approached?
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And how do you know none of those were approached?
A very good source I have here told me we approached Quieroz, although there's no solid confirmation. Quieroz did say just after he was fired by the Portuguese FA, that he'd turned down 3 offers in the last couple weeks, i.e. the same time we were looking for a manager. Make of that what you will.
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We've spent first few weeks looking for a new manager, and now we have one, he's having to meet the players for the first time a month into the season.
He's never going to hit the ground running and get things going his way from the off.
Yet how often do you we see managers taking a job mid season and getting an imediate reaction from the players?
Houllier has a good squad to work with, basically the squad that finished 6th last year, so should be able to do well with us if he's any good!
Nah he's past it, dodgy heart, was lucky to win, 3 cups at Liverpool, he's no chance of emulating Blessed O'Neill let alone being able to turn around a squad without their best player any more and no one bought to replace him, oh apart from a make weight, nearly forgot him.
What has "bollocksed" the season, is the boards inability to appoint a manager before the end of the transfer window.
MON left, it would/should have been an ideal opportunity to get a new manager in, with the funds from the Milner sale, to invest in better players than we currently have, and if possible, move some out.We did'nt, and for me the bigger question is why did MON go, and why did'nt we get a manager in until after the transfer window.
Worrying times for me as a Villa fan, if we had appointed a Jol/Hiddink/Moyes/Hughes, we would have got an extra 5'000 in the last 3 home games.Thats an extra £200k per game.Short sighted thinking in my eyes.
Amazing
You missed Harry Potter off your list too
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To quote Bob Paisley, KG "good players are never available, you make them available".
In this case, it's a manager, but of those on my list.
Hiddink.....at Turkey?............................possibly unavailable
Moyes....................................should have been attainable.
Hughes...................................should have been attainable.
Jol...........................................should have been attainable.
So, if we was serious about progression, and the above named where our targets, then one of them should have been appointed before the transfer window shut, and given some money.
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What has "bollocksed" the season, is the boards inability to appoint a manager before the end of the transfer window.
MON left, it would/should have been an ideal opportunity to get a new manager in, with the funds from the Milner sale, to invest in better players than we currently have, and if possible, move some out.We did'nt, and for me the bigger question is why did MON go, and why did'nt we get a manager in until after the transfer window.
Worrying times for me as a Villa fan, if we had appointed a Jol/Hiddink/Moyes/Hughes, we would have got an extra 5'000 in the last 3 home games.Thats an extra £200k per game.Short sighted thinking in my eyes.
Blimey, we have our share of slack-jawed galoots posting here (you don't have to go far in this thread to find a prize example) but the joined-up dots of your thought processes look like something produced by a St. Vitus's Dance sufferer after their first encounter with an Etch-A-Sketch.
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To quote Bob Paisley, KG "good players are never available, you make them available".
In this case, it's a manager, but of those on my list.
Hiddink.....at Turkey?............................possibly unavailable
Moyes....................................should have been attainable.
Hughes...................................should have been attainable.
Jol...........................................should have been attainable.
So, if we was serious about progression, and the above named where our targets, then one of them should have been appointed before the transfer window shut, and given some money.
Moyes - unwilling to move at the start of the season and drop his club in it.
Jol - said he wants to see how it goes with Ajax. A successful Ajax manager will be looking at somewhere like Barecelona or Milan as his next job.
Hughes - unwilling to move after a month in a new job.
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To quote Bob Paisley, KG "good players are never available, you make them available".
In this case, it's a manager, but of those on my list.
Hiddink.....at Turkey?............................possibly unavailable
Moyes....................................should have been attainable.
Hughes...................................should have been attainable.
Jol...........................................should have been attainable.
So, if we was serious about progression, and the above named where our targets, then one of them should have been appointed before the transfer window shut, and given some money.
Moyes - unwilling to move at the start of the season and drop his club in it.
Jol - said he wants to see how it goes with Ajax. A successful Ajax manager will be looking at somewhere like Barecelona or Milan as his next job.
Hughes - unwilling to move after a month in a new job.
Hiddick is on about £8m a year. It would have been extremely expensive to hire him, never mind buy out his contract.
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To quote Bob Paisley, KG "good players are never available, you make them available".
In this case, it's a manager, but of those on my list.
Hiddink.....at Turkey?............................possibly unavailable
Moyes....................................should have been attainable.
Hughes...................................should have been attainable.
Jol...........................................should have been attainable.
So, if we was serious about progression, and the above named where our targets, then one of them should have been appointed before the transfer window shut, and given some money.
Moyes - unwilling to move at the start of the season and drop his club in it.
Jol - said he wants to see how it goes with Ajax. A successful Ajax manager will be looking at somewhere like Barecelona or Milan as his next job.
Hughes - unwilling to move after a month in a new job.
Bob Paisley quote - Circa 1977.
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How negative are some of you being about literally everything ? No wonder we get constant bad press. They will look on these sites and hear "why didn`t we do this and that" Ye the majority of us wanted Jol. But we got a manager who has a better record in the premiership than any other manager we have ever had. So support him. I am totally aware that we are hear to debate things but some of you live in a life of "doom" Suppose the next derogatory remark about Houllier will be "I hate that tie he was wearing" ..........
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Still current now MF.
So you are telling me then dave, that if Man Citeeeh approached Moyes/Jol/Hughes(i know unlikely), they would turn them down for the reasons you gave.......can't see it.
If we want to be a top team, then you appoint a manager to make you a top team.The length of time it took, the actual appointment, and the revelation by MK that we approached others, indicated to me that unfortunately we are not as big a draw as we like to think we are.
Not quite sure what your point is NL, i think the board purposely delayed an appointment, and that we will struggle because of this reason, more than the departure of MON.......simple enough?
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So you are telling me then dave, that if Man Citeeeh approached Moyes/Jol/Hughes(i know unlikely), they would turn them down for the reasons you gave.......can't see it.
You're telling us we can hope to compete with Man City considering what they can offer people? If we could we'd still have Barrry and Milner wouldn''t we?
Is it nice living up in Cloud Cuckoo Land? The view must be great.
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Houllier is a manager who has achieved success at other clubs that we would be delighted with if he were to replicate it at Villa.
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To quote Bob Paisley, KG "good players are never available, you make them available".
In this case, it's a manager, but of those on my list.
Hiddink.....at Turkey?............................possibly unavailable
Moyes....................................should have been attainable.
Hughes...................................should have been attainable.
Jol...........................................should have been attainable.
So, if we was serious about progression, and the above named where our targets, then one of them should have been appointed before the transfer window shut, and given some money.
I think I can say without giving too much away that we approached Moyes and Jol. Dunno about Hughes and Hiddink, but I'm pretty certain preliminary enquiries were made to ascertain whether they'd be interested.
Hughes has just started a new job, and even with claret-tinted specs it's perhaps too much to assume that he'd walk out on his new club after just a few weeks. We might say now -in Sept 2010- that's what he should have done and blow the consequences. But doing something like that can get you a reputation, a reputation that follows you around for years and can blacken your name.
Moyes wouldn't have walked out on Everton after so many years in charge, he just wouldn't. Not at that stage of the season - leaving them well and truly in the shit. By all accounts the board do like him though, have done for a while. And now he knows that for certain - if he didn't before. So you could say he's had his card marked and -if he decides further on down the track- that he's taken Everton as far as he can we'll be an option. But it will be done in the right way.
Jol went on record as saying "Villa will have to wait." He could have just said "Not interested. Happy here." But he's got unfinished business in Holland and the pull of Real Madrid and AC Milan in the CL was a big incentive to remain too.
Hiddink, I would love. But so would most of Europe. There is no indication that he was even interested in the job.
Short of abducting them and chaining them to the VP dugout I'm not sure what more we could have done.
I think we've handled the situation as well as we could under the circumstances, bar the uncertainty over when exactly GH would start.
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Still current now MF.
So you are telling me then dave, that if Man Citeeeh approached Moyes/Jol/Hughes(i know unlikely), they would turn them down for the reasons you gave.......can't see it.
If we want to be a top team, then you appoint a manager to make you a top team.The length of time it took, the actual appointment, and the revelation by MK that we approached others, indicated to me that unfortunately we are not as big a draw as we like to think we are.
Not quite sure what your point is NL, i think the board purposely delayed an appointment, and that we will struggle because of this reason, more than the departure of MON.......simple enough?
Yes, they probably would turn down Manchester City. What can they offer Jol that he hasn't already got? He's said he wants to see what he can do with Ajax and if he makes a success of that much bigger jobs than Manchester City will become available. Moyes has some quaint notion called 'loyalty.' They wouldn't ask Hughes.
Build it and they'll come is a Hollywood notion, and this is real life.
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My point is, and it seems to be beyond the comprehension of some people on here, is that if you are seriously ambitious you attract as good as you can get.
Now Mourihnio etc were never going to be available, but Jol was willing to join Fulham, Hughes must see Villa as a bigger job than Fulham, Moyes has no money at Everton, and must think that it might be time for a change.
Now i accept that Ajax getting in the latter stages of the CL, may have swayed his decision, but don't tell me that we should'nt be able to attract Fulhams manager, or even a frustrated Evertons manager.The only way we can't turn their heads is if the ambition is'nt there at board level......which is what frightens me tbh.
Simple enough not3bad?
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My point is, and it seems to be beyond the comprehension of some people on here, is that if you are seriously ambitious you attract as good as you can get.
Now Mourihnio etc were never going to be available, but Jol was willing to join Fulham, Hughes must see Villa as a bigger job than Fulham, Moyes has no money at Everton, and must think that it might be time for a change.
Now i accept that Ajax getting in the latter stages of the CL, may have swayed his decision, but don't tell me that we should'nt be able to attract Fulhams manager, or even a frustrated Evertons manager.The only way we can't turn their heads is if the ambition is'nt there at board level......which is what frightens me tbh.
Simple enough not3bad?
I'm sorry that your flawless logic is beyond the comprehension of mere mortals such as I, but Jol didn't join Fulham, Hughes had only been in his job a few weeks and your superior intellect must also make you privvy to the inner workings of Moyes' mind because from when I'm sitting he was approached and declined.
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My point is, and it seems to be beyond the comprehension of some people on here, is that if you are seriously ambitious you attract as good as you can get.
On that basis, as Randy is loaded, we should sign Torres and Gerrard.
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Well, if Macca and Sid cant get this lot passing a ball, nobody can.
I like the sound of what Houllier was saying in his latest interview too. New ideas, more sophisticated play and continental philosophy. It will make a refreshing change.
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If we want to be a top team, then you appoint a manager to make you a top team.The length of time it took, the actual appointment, and the revelation by MK that we approached others, indicated to me that unfortunately we are not as big a draw as we like to think we are.
The timing was all wrong. There was no way Quieroz was going to leave Portugal before the two Euro international games. What self respecting, half decent manager with more than an ounce of integrity would?
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Moyes will be gettable in the Summer, is my prediction. His extremely shite start might make it even easier. Another season where they've no chance of finishing any higher than 5th already will surely make him want to look elsewhere with better resources?
That's a back up policy if Houllier is a disaster.
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Someone mentioned a 'what if' scenario earlier.
What if MON had struggled at the start of the season and been sacked around about now. Might have even been on this very thread.
Personally I don't think RL would have ever sacked him, barring a horrendous run or something so grave outside of pure footballing matters that he had no alternative. But I do think MON might have walked around now even if had toughed it out in August. Increasing criticism from the stands and a slide in popularity would have probably seen to that.
You never know, with McGeady and Keane on board we mighty have hit the ground running instead. Unlikely but not impossible. They would have needed to start brightly though to allay any fears that he'd had a 'mare in the transfer market again. And if they didn't, I'd say there's every chance he'd have bailed.
That being the case and were we to start the search for a manager now would Moyes be more likely to join us? Possibly. They'd probably be more receptive to letting him go anyroad - with a large cash payoff as some kind of incentive.
Queiroz is also available at present and -if we were to give it a month or so from now as we did with GH- I dare say there could be other European based managers looking for a new gig.
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I spotted this in Everton's last annual report from the chairman Bill Kenwright...
Maintaining our progress, continuing to punch above our weight if you like,
will be very difficult but I stand by my assertion that we have a manager
who will go down as one of our all time greats and a squad of players that
is amongst our very best over the last two decades. As has always been
the case, David was fully supported by myself and by my fellow Board
members. He remains the single, most important figure at the Club and
we all strive – on a daily basis – to provide him with the tools he believes
are necessary if we are to continue to evolve and develop into a genuine,
meaningful force within both English and European football.
Once again, every available penny was channelled towards the manager to
facilitate the upgrading of the senior-squad.
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And your point is?
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When they turn, they don't half turn, don't they?
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The strange this is that while O'Neill was the one who was given millions of pounds to spend, and who wasted much of it in achieving very little, and then who quit just before the start of the new season, taking most of the club's coaching staff with him, for some it's the board who are the bad guys.
I don't understand that reasoning at all.
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I spotted this in Everton's last annual report from the chairman Bill Kenwright...
Maintaining our progress, continuing to punch above our weight if you like,
will be very difficult but I stand by my assertion that we have a manager
who will go down as one of our all time greats and a squad of players that
is amongst our very best over the last two decades. As has always been
the case, David was fully supported by myself and by my fellow Board
members. He remains the single, most important figure at the Club and
we all strive – on a daily basis – to provide him with the tools he believes
are necessary if we are to continue to evolve and develop into a genuine,
meaningful force within both English and European football.
Once again, every available penny was channelled towards the manager to
facilitate the upgrading of the senior-squad.
All well and good VD.
They're hardly likely to officially say "Done well, bit miffed about the consistent slow starts though. If we get a big compensation offer lets cash in."
I'm not saying for certain that's the approach they would take. But they're consistently strapped and if Moyes forced their hand I'm not sure there is a huge lot they could realistically do about it, short of getting the best possible price.
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Well, if Moyes keeps this up he'll be kicking himself for turning Villa down.
And maybe we've dodged a bullet.
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Well, if Macca and Sid cant get this lot passing a ball, nobody can.
I like the sound of what Houllier was saying in his latest interview too. New ideas, more sophisticated play and continental philosophy. It will make a refreshing change.
Day 1 confusion:
McAllister: "Now, Carlos, you pass the ball along the ground to Petrov"
Cuellar: "Not shank to man in back of da Trinity?"
McAllister: "No, on the ground".
Cuellar: "No hoof"
McAllister: "No. No hoof!"
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Som GH comments from the Official Site:
Houllier also revealed his delight at the new backroom team he has assembled - assistant manager Gary McAllister, coach Gordon Cowans, fitness coach Robert Duverne and goalkeeping coach Rafa Gonzalez.
He added: "I wanted Gary - or Macca as we call him. He had a few stints at management, which means he is motivated. He was first team coach at Middlesbrough but the good thing about Macca is I know him, I trust him and he knows the way I want to play. That's very important. That will speed things up.
"Then I have two coaches - one is local and a hero here, Gordon. I was pleased when he said he would like to work with me.
"The second one is Robert, who is French. He is a fitness coach initially but he can help with other things too. His main function is to be the fitness coach.
"I have known him for a long time because I worked with him at Lyon. He is a different type of fitness coach.
"The goalkeeping coach is Rafa. He was doing a good job and Kevin asked if I would keep him and I said yes.
"We have just five, just like the fingers of the hand. We have to be extremely united, trusting of each other - manager, assistant manager, two coaches and a goalkeeping coach. That's all.
"I know some clubs have far more but it's OK. We have two former top players, one is a specialist for goalkeepers and the other is a specialist in fitness. It's very complementary.
"The way I work is I meet with them every day in the morning before training - and I give them a programme and say 'this is what I want' and off we go."
Houllier is relishing his return to the Premier League and highlighted the changes in the top-flight since he left in 2004.
He added: "It's tougher, far tougher. The contact is very hard but we will cope with that, no problem. You can't be soft here.
"There's also the pace of the game, of course and quality of the players. They are good players."
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5? So that means Kev is going back to only reserve work.
I think he'll be off.
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"The second one is Robert, who is French. He is a fitness coach initially but he can help with other things too. His main function is to be the fitness coach.
"I have known him for a long time because I worked with him at Lyon. He is a different type of fitness coach.
I think we might see a slimmer version of Richard Dunne next time he makes a start.
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Most new managers seem to have an immediate effect - i am excited and looking forward to what he will bring
I agree with him - none of us can forget that we have some very good players in our squad - lets hope he can bring the best formation and get the best out of them.
As been said elsewhere on other threads - the unusual thing about this appointment is usually Managers come in when teams are struggling and that is difficult - he already has a very good squad so the measure of his tactical awareness and man managemnt should be evident very soon
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Most new managers seem to have an immediate effect - i am excited and looking forward to what he will bring
I agree with him - none of us can forget that we have some very good players in our squad - lets hope he can bring the best formation and get the best out of them.
As been said elsewhere on other threads - the unusual thing about this appointment is usually Managers come in when teams are struggling and that is difficult - he already has a very good squad so the measure of his tactical awareness and man managemnt should be evident very soon
This is a point I was making yesterday. Swap Irealnd for Milner and it's the squad that finished 6th last season. The other players that have left basically didn't feature, so no 'weakening' there. Then add an improved Albrighton and other youngsters and he has a lot to work with!
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Well, if Macca and Sid cant get this lot passing a ball, nobody can.
I like the sound of what Houllier was saying in his latest interview too. New ideas, more sophisticated play and continental philosophy. It will make a refreshing change.
Well exactly. It was either the Guardian or the Telegraph who said that all MON and his assistants did was fitness training and practice matches, sometimes five-a-sides. The more you learn about his and their deficiencies, the more you wonder how good they must have been at some of the other stuff to take us to where they did.
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5? So that means Kev is going back to only reserve work.
I think he'll be off.
You sense that there's lot of bitterness, but looking at it, it's for the best. KM would have been in the Sid role, but Sid jumped at the chance when asked whereas KM went off in a huff. Had he accepted the assistant's job there still would have been that tension, so having him with the reserves will help the working relationship of the 1st team coaching staff. Quite frankly, his results showed us that he wasn't good enough, and if he feels he needs to leave it will be a shame. But there's no room for passengers at this level. Pull your weight or move on.
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Good sentiments there Toronto.
I'm not too convinced about him being in a huff though.
Seems to me he got what he really wanted, possibly because he didn't like the stress of the job, but where he is he is still involved and part of the 'family'
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If you take out the West Ham result (which looking at it now virtually any team in the league would have stuffed them) then KMc's CV was not really enhanced very much by his time in charge if he ever applies for the No.1 job somewhere else.
Personally I think it showed what he is good at, developing younger players who probably need the arm round the shoulder treatment far more than the boot up the backside which, to me, seemed like some of our first team squad looked as if they needed.
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The strange this is that while O'Neill was the one who was given millions of pounds to spend, and who wasted much of it in achieving very little, and then who quit just before the start of the new season, taking most of the club's coaching staff with him, for some it's the board who are the bad guys.
I don't understand that reasoning at all.
Agree with this. The mistake the Board made was not to Twitter their every move so that some of our less patient friends could be kept up to date. It seems to me that just because we conducted the recruitment process discreetly (as is the Chairman's way), people seemed happy to think the worse and that nothing was going on. Some of the comments about the Board being incapable and lacking leadership were ridiculous.
The resulting appointment of GH and staff has been excellent in my view and they must be really excited about working with some of the players in this squad and getting them playing properly. As said elsewhere on this thread, if Sid and Macca can't get them passing, god help us.
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As said elsewhere on this thread, if Sid and Macca can't get them passing, god help us.
And, as said elsewhere on this forum, see Robertson, John, ball, crossing of.
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Maybe we should appoint Shearer, Ronaldo and Messi as coaches.
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What has "bollocksed" the season, is the boards inability to appoint a manager before the end of the transfer window.
MON left, it would/should have been an ideal opportunity to get a new manager in, with the funds from the Milner sale, to invest in better players than we currently have, and if possible, move some out.We did'nt, and for me the bigger question is why did MON go, and why did'nt we get a manager in until after the transfer window.
Worrying times for me as a Villa fan, if we had appointed a Jol/Hiddink/Moyes/Hughes, we would have got an extra 5'000 in the last 3 home games.Thats an extra £200k per game.Short sighted thinking in my eyes.
Wonderful hindsight.
I agree it would have been great to have got someone in before 31-08, but the options were pretty limited and although the Board moved slowly they were not flush with candidates. Blimey, the media were having Curbs in at short odds! Imagine that outcome!!
Oh, and lest we forget: MON stitched us up - there was nothing spontaneous about his departure, IMHO; he left spitefully and vindictively at a time most likely to impact on our early-season performance and limiting our ability to find a qualified replacement.
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One thing the whole O'Neill saga has done is reminded me of how many otherwise seemingly rational thinkers believe the Villa should just do what they want, when they want, and everyone else in the world will go along with them.
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Words from Sid Cowans are very encouraging about the early days under Houllier
“Training is different to what we were doing under Kevin. Mr Houllier has brought his own ideas in – a lot of it is about possession – keeping the ball. If you look at the foreign players, you can see why they are so good at keeping possession of the ball. That is critical.
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What has "bollocksed" the season, is the boards inability to appoint a manager before the end of the transfer window.
MON left, it would/should have been an ideal opportunity to get a new manager in, with the funds from the Milner sale, to invest in better players than we currently have, and if possible, move some out.We did'nt, and for me the bigger question is why did MON go, and why did'nt we get a manager in until after the transfer window.
Worrying times for me as a Villa fan, if we had appointed a Jol/Hiddink/Moyes/Hughes, we would have got an extra 5'000 in the last 3 home games.Thats an extra £200k per game.Short sighted thinking in my eyes.
Oh, and lest we forget: MON stitched us up - there was nothing spontaneous about his departure, IMHO; he left spitefully and vindictively at a time most likely to impact on our early-season performance and limiting our ability to find a qualified replacement.
Has this been proven?? K Mac said in an interview that MON had been helping him after he'd left which doesn't support this argument at all.
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Words from Sid Cowans are very encouraging about the early days under Houllier
“Training is different to what we were doing under Kevin. Mr Houllier has brought his own ideas in – a lot of it is about possession – keeping the ball. If you look at the foreign players, you can see why they are so good at keeping possession of the ball. That is critical.
A-fucking-men to that.
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Words from Sid Cowans are very encouraging about the early days under Houllier
“Training is different to what we were doing under Kevin. Mr Houllier has brought his own ideas in – a lot of it is about possession – keeping the ball. If you look at the foreign players, you can see why they are so good at keeping possession of the ball. That is critical.
A-fucking-men to that.
won't it be nice to see the possession stats in our favour for a change? I enjoy watching counter attack once in a while, especially with the wheels in our side, but give me constant pressure with the ball at our feet over that any day.
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Words from Sid Cowans are very encouraging about the early days under Houllier
“Training is different to what we were doing under Kevin. Mr Houllier has brought his own ideas in – a lot of it is about possession – keeping the ball. If you look at the foreign players, you can see why they are so good at keeping possession of the ball. That is critical.
A-fucking-men to that.
won't it be nice to see the possession stats in our favour for a change? I enjoy watching counter attack once in a while, especially with the wheels in our side, but give me constant pressure with the ball at our feet over that any day.
Of course it will.
There's nothing wrong with the counter attacking game, just as there's nothing wrong with wing play. The problem is when that is all you ever do.
MON's side never gave even the feintest of nods towards keeping the ball, making the ball do the work. That, I think, more than anything is the reason we were never going to get any further with him - you can't be amongst the very best teams in the country if you don't apprecaite the importance of keeping the ball.
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What has "bollocksed" the season, is the boards inability to appoint a manager before the end of the transfer window.
MON left, it would/should have been an ideal opportunity to get a new manager in, with the funds from the Milner sale, to invest in better players than we currently have, and if possible, move some out.We did'nt, and for me the bigger question is why did MON go, and why did'nt we get a manager in until after the transfer window.
Worrying times for me as a Villa fan, if we had appointed a Jol/Hiddink/Moyes/Hughes, we would have got an extra 5'000 in the last 3 home games.Thats an extra £200k per game.Short sighted thinking in my eyes.
Oh, and lest we forget: MON stitched us up - there was nothing spontaneous about his departure, IMHO; he left spitefully and vindictively at a time most likely to impact on our early-season performance and limiting our ability to find a qualified replacement.
Has this been proven?? K Mac said in an interview that MON had been helping him after he'd left which doesn't support this argument at all.
That's the weakest of ripostes.
He fucked off at no notice at the worst possible time, and took pretty much the entire football apparatus with him.
The fact he rang KM and gave him some tips (probably "don't bother with subs, they're overrated" and "just keep doing the same thing for 90 minutes" judging by the way things panned out) is nothing like evidence enough to counteract the shit storm he stirred up.
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Have a much better feeling about the combination of this management team than the out dated tactics of the previous group. With the emphasis on work rate. And the inability of changing a game when everyone in the ground could see what was needed. Now with a European vision through the eyes of a proven premiereship manager and a Villa legend assisted by a respected player/manager (Mcallister) there is a new hope at Villa park and i feel good ..........
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The fact he rang KM and gave him some tips (probably "don't bother with subs, they're overrated" and "just keep doing the same thing for 90 minutes" judging by the way things panned out) is nothing like evidence enough to counteract the shit storm he stirred up.
'See if you can still get Jenas for £10m'