Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Match Threads & Player Ratings => Topic started by: PeterWithesShin on December 30, 2025, 10:14:12 PM
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Never in... bollocks.
Forest game will show us what we're made of.
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A mere blip.
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Looks like Unai left early
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Switched off with 10 to go. Did we pull it back again?
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Never mind, I think deep down we all knew we weren't in it this season but bouncing back is the important part now. Get 4th and win the bloody cup
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It had to be those entitled ****** didn't it
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Well, Arse have set a marker. They were able to beat our B side and kids.
Nice.
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Our chances of champions league football for next season have actually probably increased tonight given other results.
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Shame we didn’t get to see how we’d get on against 10 at 2-0
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Shouldn’t be too disheartened. Games can see big swings from small things.
If Onana, who dominated the midfield in the first half, doesn’t get injured, and Merino gets a deserved red card, it could have been a very different score.
Just need to put it behind us and make sure we win on Saturday.
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Bring on Forest lets do another massive winning run, it was fun....
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We go again. Proud of the boys. The run had to end eventually and my guess Emery is too polite to want the record for himself. To have done what we have done is immense. So we will just have to kick it off again vs Forest at Villa Park.
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Pity the run had to end in such a poor 30 minutes.
The imperative is we now beat Forest and get on another winning run.
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We are a better team going forward but with a weaker keeper and defence. They’re not a champion team.
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Chelsea and Man U dropped points so chin up everyone. Need to bounce back at the weekend (whenever that is).
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Onana going off totally changed it, carved apart from then on. Next.
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We always win eleven games in a row after a defeat so not overly concerned.
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We go again with our 2 best.players back om Saturday.
First half done well.
Arsenal better but still Roger Black of Premier League
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Chelsea and Man U dropped points so chin up everyone. Need to bounce back at the weekend (whenever that is).
Yeah and I couldn't give a hoot about Arsenal, they won't win the league title.
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Disappointing drop-off in the second-half.
It wasn't the reason we lost but Merino should have received a second yellow and walked - the ref was also poor.
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Was always going to be really tough, but disappointing collapse in the second half after a solid first half.
That said we were always going to lose eventually and the absences, including Onana at half-time, were massive. Need to bounce back at the weekend.
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It's one of them where I'm absolutely not down hearted. Better side most of the first half. Nice to bring on two of our youths.J-A will be a baller.
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Shame we didn’t get to see how we’d get on against 10 at 2-0
100%!!!
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Chelsea and Man Utd both dropping points. That makes this result not as bad as it could have been. We're third, and have a decent cushion. Beat Forest at the weekend and forget about this result.
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The squad is too thin, we know that but:
Martinez and Sancho were both weak, allowing them to get ahead. The ref then bottles the second yellow, and with all that it was an uphill battle and we weren't quite up to it.
But let me be the first to congratulate Woolwich on winning the title again at Christmas.
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Martinez chucked another on in, that combined with Onana going off completely killed our plan.
We’ll beat Forest.
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Agreed with those that say losing Onana was the killer. Out midfield in the second half was anonymous without his presence.
All four goals were gifts. Martinez obviously was a howler. But Sancho, Fine and Garcia were all guilty of mistakes for the others (not strong enough).
Still onwards..Ever onwards.
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These things will naturally come to an end. We just couldn’t compete in that 15 mins after half time and we just didn’t have the bench to change it. Ah well, back home, regroup and on to Forest on Saturday, no point trying to dissect it, we got blown away in about 20 minutes. For games like that you need your first XI and decent subs, we had neither. Onwards….
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We are a better team going forward but with a weaker keeper and defence. They’re not a champion team.
Yep, champions don’t get sliced open again and again like they were in the first half. The league is Man City’s to lose this year.
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It happens, i refuse to see this game as an end of year pasting, seriously, we stepped aside a little, but cometh the weekend cometh the Villa.
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We dropped points away to one of the best sides in Europe. ManU and Chelses dropped points at home to shit sides. Beat Forest, who just lost at home to Everton, and all is ok.
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It’s like we’ve spent the last thirty years protecting keepers to suddenly say fuck it, do what you want in there, so if that’s the case Martinez needs to toughen up and throw a punch at the attackers. If they can challenge with elbows up, then it’s a free for all.
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Chins up. That game isn't a reflection of who or where we are. We finished with Bogarde, Garcia and two kids on the pitch. It's not enough away at top of the league and I think we all knew when Kamara and Cash got suspended that it would be too much.
Unbelievable run. Trick is to win the next one and get motoring again. United and Chelsea dropping points at home to shite whilst we lose at the Emirates is an unexpected bonus.
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With Kamara and Onana both playing most of the match we could have got at least a point there.
Our shape in the middle went to pot second half.
Thought first two goals conceded were very poor defensively.
But I still don't understand how elbowing tbe goalkeeper is now legitimate.
Plus the referee was a complete bottle job. Saka should have been booked and Merino sent off. Pretty pathetic.
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Fine margins. We could have been two up before Arsenal scored. Poor miss from Watkins, poor passing going forward when in great positions. Crap from Martinez for the first goal, giving the ball away for a couple of the other goals. It goes to show that we are a thinner squad and struggle to live with the top two when we have a few injuries or suspensions and we should celebrate the brilliant manager that we have because he gets every ounce of effort and energy from some ordinary players (Lindelof, Sancho, Malen etc). If we can go and get a couple of loans or permanent transfers to give us a boost, that would be very welcome. It's about time Arsenal beat us, wankers.
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We dropped points away to one of the best sides in Europe. ManU and Chelses dropped points at home to shit sides. Beat Forest, who just lost at home to Everton, and all is ok.
Indeed, it’s frustrating after a good first half, but that was always a very difficult game. Need to bounce back now, and Emi needs to start being much better in physical challenges.
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We dropped points away to one of the best sides in Europe. ManU and Chelses dropped points at home to shit sides. Beat Forest, who just lost at home to Everton, and all is ok.
100%
An amazing run has come to an end to the favs to win the league, it had to at some point.
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Arsenal aint winning the league , 115 are but we will still push Ass to second place.
We was very under strength tonight and the first half with Onana we was the better team .
We reset , beat the trees and Palace and we are there sniffing their pathetic backsides.
All I want is chumps league ( which is 1000% on ) and to finish above those twats . . .. .
THanks for the 11 wins Villa.
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Not too down hearted after that. Things went against us tonight and the differences in the respective squad depths really showed.
The ref was pathetic for not sending off Merino.
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He does some good things but to win a title you can't carry players like Sancho who put in countless half hearted challenges. Along with the squad depth these are the things that mark out champions and we don't have that. Yet.
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Some of the Arsenal fans celebrating being top of the league, etc, in December, so premature and entirely in keeping with why they won’t win the league.
We were really in the game and playing well but the two goals in quick succession killed us. We need to work with Martinez to stop getting caught out on corners like this. That’s two games on the bounce we've conceded the same goal.
A word for the ref: I worried when I saw he was given this game. Saka committed 3 professional fouls and didn’t get booked once. Merino should easily have been sent off for a cynical foul after he’s been booked. Contrast with Rodgers and Watkins each being booked for nothing. It was always going to be an uphill task to get anything from this game. But you need a ref who at least is going to keep a level playing fiend.
We’ve had an amazing run and it had to come to an end. Well done lads.
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A bit of perspective
Squad depth (lack of) clearly exposed.
Substitutes
Arsenal
Jesus - £50m
Ben White - £50m
Norgaard £10m
Madeuke £50m
Myles-Skelly - Academy
Villa
McGinn £2.5m
Garcia £6m
Malen £21m
Hemmings - Academy
Jimoh-Aloba - Academy
Arse spent a net £263m in the summer.
Arteta's spent a net £900m.
Since Unai arrived, our net spend is €48m
Arsenal have spent €463m in that time.
When Onana went off could' we have put Garcia on at full back and pushed Bogey into midfield alongside Youri?
And replaced Sancho with McGinn to offer protection to Garcia.
Still giving away such a stupidly shitty opening goal was a killer.
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Well that was a flip reverse peformance to the Chelsea game.
Played very well first half and should have been ahead.
Arsenal did turn up the oven a bit second half and we faded which is no shock
UTV!
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All about getting a result at the weekend now.
The chasing pack arent out of 2nd gear really and we've got some tough games out of the way.
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Proud of what we’ve achieved, if you had offered 6 points from last 3 games we’d all have taken it.
First half we should have gone in with a lead. Poor miss by Ollie.
They are a very good team, so no disgrace.
Even the last 10 minutes we kept at it and could have had 2 goals.
Let’s stuff Forest.
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It happens, some pretty poor individual errors but I'm not having a go at Garcia, the poor sod hasn't played for months so it was pretty barmy putting him on on that situation.
The fact we can fight for Europe every year is pretty much a miricle considering the amount of money we aren't allowed to spend.
That lad should have been sent off, no two ways about it. Referee bottled it completely.
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December has been so much better than expected but making it that has come home to roost tonight, and even then we gave them the means to win it. The next couple of league games will be more important than tonight for where we want to be.
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If Martinez gets wrestled he needs to go down, not get involved, I thought he had more nous than that. 2 goals in 2 games with the same tactic. Naive really...... Onana going off kills us with Kamara out. Still in a strong position after tonight's results and Arsenal likely to shit the bed against Liverpool.
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We were always going to lose to someone at some point.
It was away to the best team in the league, 3 days after our last away match.
Other results went for us tonight.
We just need to pick up and start another insane winning run.
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Crap first goal as usual.
Never the same once Onana went off.
Nice to see lots of vengeful African Arsenal fans invading our pages crowing. Theres dozens and dozens of them.
We now need to go off on another run. Kamara and Cashy will be back. Onwards and upwards.
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All about getting a result at the weekend now.
The chasing pack arent out of 2nd gear really and we've got some tough games out of the way.
That's the point, big games out the way and we produced good results and a massive points gap, its all on the next game now to win and win well, put the fear factor back and let everybody know we have not been blown of course.
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(https://i.ibb.co/mCMDYRft/FB-IMG-1767133611422.jpg) (https://ibb.co/mCMDYRft)
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The media focussed on Rice being out, but the real difference was our injuries, suspensions and Onana going off.
The margins are less than the score line suggests.
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Unai will be back on his laptop as we speak shuffling the formation ready for Saturday
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If Martinez gets wrestled he needs to go down, not get involved, I thought he had more nous than that. 2 goals in 2 games with the same tactic. Naive really...... Onana going off kills us with Kamara out. Still in a strong position after tonight's results and Arsenal likely to shit the bed against Liverpool.
Martinez isn't getting wrestled though. He is just weak as piss from corners.
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I saw more of Rice than when he plays ffs.
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One of those nights unfortunately. But all things considered, our league position in strategic terms is stronger tonight than it was before Chelsea and Arsenal away.
I don't usually bother commenting on a refereeing display, especially after a 4-1 defeat, but fucking hell.
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Two decades of Moral Victory FC and it's all fouls, set pieces, and getting away with deserved red cards. Whatever. Already beat them this year once, I'll take 3-3 for the season against the probable champions.
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Fingers crossed Onana's injury isn't serious and it was just a precaution, he seemed to play on okay after feeling it in the first half. With Kamara back it's not essential he plays at the weekend, but those two in front of our back four makes us so much more solid at set pieces.
If I were Sean Dyche, I'd have their corner takers practising dropping it on the six-yard line every session for the next couple of days. Emi and the coaching staff really need to figure out a solution. Either Emi starts punching it (which isn't his natural game), or we figure out something else, because without someone like Onana or Mings in there, we're clearly susceptible to soft corner goals when Emi gets bumped about a bit and can't get a run up at the ball.
On the plus side, Jimoh-Aloba looks very comfortable at this level, so fingers crossed that's another decent squad option from next season.
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We played poorly tonight but the ref seemed to have taken lessons from Thomas Bramhall. How Merino stayed on is a complete mystery.
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A bit of perspective
Squad depth (lack of) clearly exposed.
Substitutes
Arsenal
Jesus - £50m
Ben White - £50m
Norgaard £10m
Madeuke £50m
Myles-Skelly - Academy
Villa
McGinn £2.5m
Garcia £6m
Malen £21m
Hemmings - Academy
Jimoh-Aloba - Academy
Arse spent a net £263m in the summer.
Arteta's spent a net £900m.
Since Unai arrived, our net spend is €48m
Arsenal have spent €463m in that time.
When Onana went off could' we have put Garcia on at full back and pushed Bogey into midfield alongside Youri?
And replaced Sancho with McGinn to offer protection to Garcia.
Still giving away such a stupidly shitty opening goal was a killer.
Add in Eze and Havertz who were around £65m a pop who were unused subs tonight.
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"I never comment on referees, and I'm not going to break the habit of a lifetime for that prat."
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We take it on the chin and move on. This game won’t define season.
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That was their revenge first our last minute goal. Let them have it. We'll be back.
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"I never comment on referees, and I'm not going to break the habit of a lifetime for that prat."
Who said that? I line it.
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"I never comment on referees, and I'm not going to break the habit of a lifetime for that prat."
Who said that? I line it.
Ron Atkinson.
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The referee wasn't the reason we lost tonight.
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Massive positives from the first half. We went toe to toe with them.
But a decimated team, and a couple of howlers in the first few minutes of the second half did for us.
I’m calling out Lindelof again, who had a very, very good game and whose integration into the team has been seamless. He was not at fault in any of their goals.
The same can’t be said for Sancho. A wastrel who flatters to deceive and has amassed a fortune and reputation based on fuck knows what.
Sadly, I doubt we will be able to return him in January.
Onto to Forest and the hope it’s the start of another long and glorious run.
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We take it on the chin and move on. This game won’t define season.
Indeed, I seem to recall we lost to Ipswich 3 times in 80/81.
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Like others I’m not overly upset about the result tonight. We gifted them 3 (possibly 4) of their goals and I thought our first half performance was pretty good. If Watkins scores at least one of his two chances and Rogers pass to Sancho was better it might have been a whole different story. Clearly Merino should have had a second yellow and Saka should have been booked for doing the same trip twice. I’m positive we’ll turn this round and come back stronger
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Never seen such positivity on this thread after a loss…. We all
know where we are….and where we’re going….UTV!!
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Would have taken two points from Chelsea and Arsenal away so in my eyes mission accomplished. Onwards and upwards.
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We go again!
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Would have taken two points from Chelsea and Arsenal away so in my eyes mission accomplished. Onwards and upwards.
Yep I would have taken one point, so agree. We just need to get a couple of players back and really hit back against Forest.
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We'll murderise them.
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Unai will get them back firing Saturday. Kamara and Cash will be fresh. Let's hope Onana was just precautionary and not another injury.
Forest
Palace
Everton
Newcastle
Brentford
Next 5 games, target 9/10 points.
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Sancho played to his usual standard…., not very good at all! Stealing a living for years!
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Sancho is definitely to be avoided. A wide player in January of some ability would help us immensely.
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Curious what Unai will say. Pretty sure he left before the end of the match!
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Onana going off was a huge blow and a major factor in our defeat, the first half we played some lovely stuff going forward and on another day could have gone in ahead at half time. Looking at January's fixtures I can see us going on another long winning run, starting with Forest on Saturday.
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Pretty deflated but not disappointed in the team or manager. Yes Lindelof has done well, but we miss Torres massively, we missed Kamara, Cash and then Onana, who was immense first half.
The main positive is Watkins scoring. A streaky striker getting his mjo back for the second half of the season is just what we need.
Forest and Everton the next two home hames are both winnable, even Kryptonite Crystal Palace away next week looks potentially winnable. 9 points from the next three please.
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And that, boys and girls, is why we won't be winning the league: a couple of injuries and suspensions and we're having to throw on kids.
Once Onana went off it all went to shit, although some credit has to go to Arteta, who adjusted their press perfectly in the second half.
Things might have been different had the referee not bottled showing Merino the second yellow he deserved, mind. Or if Ollie had better technique.
Anyway, Emery's still a god, and I'm looking forward to the next few games. UTV.
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Shame we didn’t get to see how we’d get on against 10 at 2-0
That was a real pity, referee bottled it sadly.
Mad 10 mins killed us after half time. In the end at least we were able to rest a few and bring a couple of kids on. Could not afford another suspended or injured player. Very strong first half but we didn't make it count. After Onana went off all presence in midfield disappeared, left with fourth/fifth choice midfielder at right back, fourth choice centre back at LCB. Just too many gaps unfortunately. Have Cash and Kamara back the next day and hopefully at least one of Torres or Mings. We go again. Even at 4-0, I was thinking fair play to the likes of McGinn and Malen for keeping it going.
Martinez 5 - very strong first half but bullied horribly for the first. One great save to be fair
Bogarde 4 - decent first half but overran in second, out of position to be fair at right back but couldn't cope in middle either
Konsa 5 - lucky their duffer up front headed that over on his blindside, thought our CB partnership collapsed second half. Space between them for second was ridiculous
Lindelof 4 - just poor really, not sure what he was at for the second goal
Digne 4 - could have been sharper getting out to one goal, best days coming to an end. Dug out a nice cross for Watkins at end
Onana 7 - really sharp first 30 mins, once he went down you just knew he was gone at half time. Big loss
Tielemans 3 - strong first half but back to imitating a traffic cone in a horrific second half
Sancho 4 - solid first half but jumped out of two tackles at start of second half, second of which led to their goal. Replaced within minutes.
Buendia 6 - incredibly harsh decision to take him off. Possibly our best player first half
Rogers 4 - game passed him by I thought. Some nice touches around their box but gave up possession far too often
Watkins 6 - strong first half but missed the big chance to put us ahead. Bullied a bit in second but fine header late on that hit post and got the consolation goal at end
McGinn, less said about that miss the better, by the time he got his second wind the game was ok. Malen took ages to get into it but did very well for the goal. Garcia didn't cover himself in glory when missing a key tackle for one of their goals. Nice to see the two kids get on and get on plenty of ball.
Emery - crazy decision not to start McGinn. Thought he went two up top a bit too early but game probably gone by then.
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We can't really have squad depth though seeing as we're not allowed to buy anyone anymore now we've come too close to upsetting the apple cart.
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Funny how Arseholes committed 16 fouls and ended with 1 booking but we commit 9 and end up with 3.
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Contained them pretty well in the first half, but then melted under increased pressure in the second. We just give the ball away too easily at times and can't afford to do it against opposition like that tonight.
That said, we've been on a great run of results and hope they can just brush off tonight and go again on Saturday. It's just this nagging feeling though that we've done really well to climb the mountains on various competitions over the past few seasons and have the summit in our sights, only to then fall short in the games that really count and often through our own mistakes.
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Unai will get them back firing Saturday. Kamara and Cash will be fresh. Let's hope Onana was just precautionary and not another injury.
Forest
Palace
Everton
Newcastle
Brentford
Next 5 games, target 9/10 points.
15
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Not our night but that shouldn’t take the gloss off the incredible win we’ve been on.
Despite the incessant media ramblings about their terrible injuries Arsenal’s squad depth was there for all to see. Couple of key moments didn’t go our way (Watkins chance, Merinio second bookable offence) and if they do, it’s a very different night.
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In games of this magnitude you've got to take the opportunities when they come & we didn't.
The usual shite set piece Arsenal goal just after half time changed it. I thought the ref was very favourable towards Arsenal. But fair play to them they beat our B team. It's going to be enjoyable watching them collapse again in the run in.
I'm not going to criticise anybody, because as a unit & as individuals they've been immense. We start again on Saturday.
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Worth noting that the fucking awful tackling on Onana from their midfield is probably why he went off and yet it took until just before half time for the ref to do anything about it.
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Time to replace Martinez.
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Let them gloat, it will be all the sweeter when they miss out again. Martinez should have gone the punch but i still believe if Onana was on the pitch they wouldn't have scored, we are definately undersized when it comes to defending corners. The positive for me is that we competed well for half the game, Onana going off caused us massive problems. At least two incoming in January i reckon.
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We’ve currently got a squad, when fit that are capable of competing with any team in this league. What a transformation from a few years ago.
If we can add a few this month then who knows what we can achieve? We lost this due to injuries and the fact we’ve had to play 2 away games in a few days to teams around us and who’ve spent massive amounts over years.
The club have justifiably questioned why we have been asked to play the 2 games away in 4 days but as we know, the PL is all about the few. Even so, we are only half way through the season so let’s see where we are after the next 4/5 games. I don’t think we’ll be going anywhere and will remain a threat. These players don’t quit and are a credit to our club.
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Time to replace Martinez.
No.
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Time to replace Martinez.
No.
Seconded, No
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We were signing the keeper from Lisbon I thought.
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I do wonder, if we had scored a goal identical to their first, would it have been allowed?
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I do wonder, if we had scored a goal identical to their first, would it have been allowed?
My exact thoughts at the time. Same for the non-existent second yellow for Merino.
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Beaten by two refs - the one on Saturday and tonight’s - and the fixture list. We can claw back the gap with these serial bottlers before the end of the season. Not so sure about 115.
Proud of the lads.
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A game too far and excactly why PSR is a problem. Fcuk everyone.
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However coming through that ridiculous December period beaten only once is quite frankly extraordinary.
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My take, the ref shitting and clearly obvious booking. That aside, Emi, you can punch the ball away from danger. That’s two in two now.
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We take it on the chin and move on. This game won’t define season.
Indeed, I seem to recall we lost to Ipswich 3 times in 80/81.
Yeah, a bit annoying that they claimed the moral championship. Could we not have smashed them just once that season?⁰
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Re squad depth - we have two senior players for every position (García for Cash being questionable) which is the general benchmark, and today 5 of ours were injured or suspended - Mings, Torres, Cash, Kamara and Barkley plus Onana from half time on. Arsenal's only injury was Rice. So, we don't actually have a small or weak squad. We just are missing some due to the usual reasons.
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However coming through that ridiculous December period beaten only once is quite frankly extraordinary.
This is the bigger picture we need to remember at times like this.
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However coming through that ridiculous December period beaten only once is quite frankly extraordinary.
This is the bigger picture we need to remember at times like this.
Seconded, and we continue to give up really soft goals, it was bound to end at some point.
I’m almost ok with it being this lot, the thought of winning 14 in a row and losing to Palace, for me would be a lot worse.
We’ll batter Forest and the new run starts.
UTV!
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Re squad depth - we have two senior players for every position (García for Cash being questionable) which is the general benchmark, and today 5 of ours were injured or suspended - Mings, Torres, Cash, Kamara and Barkley plus Onana from half time on. Arsenal's only injury was Rice. So, we don't actually have a small or weak squad. We just are missing some due to the usual reasons.
This is a good point.
Garcia is a conundrum, he quickly needs some games to test his ability. Lose cash and the whole team needs a re-jig. That’s always going to be a problem.
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Special mention for Unai to disappear down the tunnel and not shake that wankers hand, was brilliant.
Celebrating like he’d won the league every goal and at FT, fuck him. As much as I hate 115, I’d prefer them to win it than that cnut and shit fans.
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A game too far and excactly why PSR is a problem. Fcuk everyone.
Problem solved then. It finishes next season doesn’t it?
Seriously, we’re about the twelfth richest club in the world, with one of the very best managers, in competition with clubs who are allowed the same number of players in the first team squad.
The PSR blaming is wearing thin with me. Player sales, the academy, scouting and recruitment can overcome it, otherwise we’d be below Chelsea, Spurs, Liverpool and Manure.
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Crap 2nd half with too many of our first teamers missing through suspension/injury. Kamara/Cash/Torres were a massive miss.
We were never in a title race this season but we are absolutely in the fight for third so need to regroup and get back to it.
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Arsenal fans are the absolute worst. If it’s not us wining it at the end, as long as we have our CL spot wrapped up Man City winning it on the last day to deny Arsenal would be delightful. Couldn’t give two fucks about Man City winning another title. Most of their fans won’t care either. The Arsenal meltdown would be at nuclear levels.
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Yep, was just making my morning cuppa thinking, as long as we are confirmed in the champions league, how nice it would be to let City win the title on the last day just to see those pricks cry with rage 😅
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Re squad depth - we have two senior players for every position (García for Cash being questionable) which is the general benchmark, and today 5 of ours were injured or suspended - Mings, Torres, Cash, Kamara and Barkley plus Onana from half time on. Arsenal's only injury was Rice. So, we don't actually have a small or weak squad. We just are missing some due to the usual reasons.
Maybe in terms of numbers but the drop off in the case of Cash and McGinn to Garcia or Sancho/Guessand is huge. Malen isn't really competition for Watkins either.
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Re squad depth - we have two senior players for every position (García for Cash being questionable) which is the general benchmark, and today 5 of ours were injured or suspended - Mings, Torres, Cash, Kamara and Barkley plus Onana from half time on. Arsenal's only injury was Rice. So, we don't actually have a small or weak squad. We just are missing some due to the usual reasons.
Maybe in terms of numbers but the drop off in the case of Cash and McGinn to Garcia or Sancho/Guessand is huge. Malen isn't really competition for Watkins either.
Ideally we need to ship them out before we find replacements. Potentially needing a sale to fund the changes. Theoretically the Wakins/McGinn player could be the same person (just dont ask me who).
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Arsenal fans are the absolute worst. If it’s not us wining it at the end, as long as we have our CL spot wrapped up Man City winning it on the last day to deny Arsenal would be delightful. Couldn’t give two fucks about Man City winning another title. Most of their fans won’t care either. The Arsenal meltdown would be at nuclear levels.
Last day of the season is 4 days after the Europa League final so hopefully we'll even have a decent excuse for having our minds elsewhere.
I'd play a weakened team just to enrage that fucker Arteta, maybe give Habib Beye a run out if he's still kicking around somewhere.
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A game too far and excactly why PSR is a problem. Fcuk everyone.
Problem solved then. It finishes next season doesn’t it?
Seriously, we’re about the twelfth richest club in the world, with one of the very best managers, in competition with clubs who are allowed the same number of players in the first team squad.
The PSR blaming is wearing thin with me. Player sales, the academy, scouting and recruitment can overcome it, otherwise we’d be below Chelsea, Spurs, Liverpool and Manure.
I'm not sure about that last line to be honest. Whilst I accept that we have spent a reasonable amount of money over the past couple of seasons and have not spent it that wisely in some cases, PSR restrictions have meant that we haven't been able to bring in the type of quality players needed to take us up to that next level.
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Disappointing drop-off in the second-half.
It wasn't the reason we lost but Merino should have received a second yellow and walked - the ref was also poor.
The Morgan Rogers booking was atrocious. He just stood there and the Arsenal player threw the ball in front of him then kicked the ball straight into his legs. Rogers could do nothing about it. Appalling decision.
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Arsenal fans are the absolute worst. If it’s not us wining it at the end, as long as we have our CL spot wrapped up Man City winning it on the last day to deny Arsenal would be delightful. Couldn’t give two fucks about Man City winning another title. Most of their fans won’t care either. The Arsenal meltdown would be at nuclear levels.
The worst fanbase by a country mile. Every decision that goes against them gets a cacophony of howls and boos regardless of if it's right or wrong. They reflect their manager who has a fanny fit every time an opposing player goes anywhere near one of his. And then there's Arsenals self entitled Tarquin army who infect every corner of social media. Piers Morgan is a Gooner and that sums them up.
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Apart from feeling that it was a 'free hit' in that we had enough points on the board to absorb a defeat, I felt that we played a great first half but that Arteta had set his team up to match our pace in the first half, fully expecting a tougher second half. The gift of a first goal obviously made things easier for Arse (no foul there; just Martinez getting sucked into a physical battle he wasn't going to win).
The rest of the game demonstrated to me that:
- McGinn needed the time off and came on too early for us;
- Garcia is massively undercooked: asking him to come in having had no minutes since April seems almost unfair on the lad;
- Sancho is no central midfielder, having none of the guile or physical strength (him losing the ball after that first goal, to set up their 2nd, was a pivot-point in the game);
- players like Garcia, Jimoh-Aloba and Hemmings need more minutes across several games if Emery sees them as credible first-teamers.
I hated losing to Arse but - in the grander scheme of things - we can move quickly o with minimal damage. The loss is only acceptable, though, if we immediately win again, starting this weekend.
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Disappointing drop-off in the second-half.
It wasn't the reason we lost but Merino should have received a second yellow and walked - the ref was also poor.
The Morgan Rogers booking was atrocious. He just stood there and the Arsenal player threw the ball in front of him then kicked the ball straight into his legs. Rogers could do nothing about it. Appalling decision.
As were his failures to give Saka a yellow card for two cynical and blatant fouls designed to prevent us breaking away, the first on Rogers, the second one just five or so minutes later, on Digne .
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Haven't heard the word "depleted" much in relation to us. Funny that.
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I share the view that losing Onana was a game changer for us - or rather, it was the Bouba booking vs Chelsea. We can do without one, but not both. The Bogarde/Garcia selection decision was probably justified based on Garcia’s second half performance, but as anticipated, we were then left with too few options in centre midfield.
Thought we were terrific first 25 mins, and really should have gone in at half time a goal to the good.
Then things went tits up.
Nonetheless, I liked that we kept our heads and plugging away, playing our football. We looked in the last 15 minutes like we were preparing the Forest game. I liked that we forced a goal, that we blooded a couple of (very tidy) kids. We were beaten for sure, but not bowed.
UTV!
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Disappointing drop-off in the second-half.
It wasn't the reason we lost but Merino should have received a second yellow and walked - the ref was also poor.
The Morgan Rogers booking was atrocious. He just stood there and the Arsenal player threw the ball in front of him then kicked the ball straight into his legs. Rogers could do nothing about it. Appalling decision.
and took the free kick nowhere near where it was. He moved it on 5 yards .
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A game too far and excactly why PSR is a problem. Fcuk everyone.
Problem solved then. It finishes next season doesn’t it?
Seriously, we’re about the twelfth richest club in the world, with one of the very best managers, in competition with clubs who are allowed the same number of players in the first team squad.
The PSR blaming is wearing thin with me. Player sales, the academy, scouting and recruitment can overcome it, otherwise we’d be below Chelsea, Spurs, Liverpool and Manure.
I'm not sure about that last line to be honest. Whilst I accept that we have spent a reasonable amount of money over the past couple of seasons and have not spent it that wisely in some cases, PSR restrictions have meant that we haven't been able to bring in the type of quality players needed to take us up to that next level.
I’m not sure what it is in the last line you’re not sure about? If PSR stops us doing better than clubs with higher revenue, how are we doing better than clubs with higher revenue?
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They did the Pep, kick the ball 5 yards after every free kick too. If a player touches the ball after the ref has whistled it should be a card.
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It’s not quite so binary though is it, Percy?
Not that I disagree with your broader point (there’s a food chain, and though we are not at its apex, we’re pretty high up!).
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It’s not quite so binary though is it, Percy?
Not that I disagree with your broader point (there’s a food chain, and though we are not at its apex, we’re pretty high up!).
Binary? I feel like I’m bringing nuance to the simple assertion that less revenue=can’t compete.
I just think that when you can afford to buy and pay the wages of 25 of the best footballers in the world, as we can, and have them developed, coached and instructed by one of the best managers in the world plus his 26 hand-picked coaches, and have them supplemented by an academy for which there is no limit on fees paid for the best prospects, or investment in facilities, we should be able to compete with clubs with higher revenue. I submit the Premier League table, the Europa league table and last season’s Champions League table as exhibits A, B & C.
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Haven't heard the word "depleted" much in relation to us. Funny that.
I’ve just listened to the 5 Live debrief podcast which initially went with a Declan Riceless Arsenal beat Villa 4-1. It took Clinton Morrison, of all people, to mention that we were without suspended players and the game changed with Onana going off.
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I think PSR is perfectly valid - we are doing amazing despite the restrictions PSR places on us.
It makes it harder to compete because you need a squad of 22 players at a similar level and we probably only have 16.
We’re doing better than most of them because we’re doing everything else right - whereas a lot of the clubs were doing better than are simply not as well ran as we are
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Now the dust has settled, we were always going to lose eventually and 6/9 from the three games over Christmas is a pretty good return. Just got to win the next eleven. UTV HAPPY New Year!
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I think PSR is perfectly valid - we are doing amazing despite the restrictions PSR places on us.
It makes it harder to compete because you need a squad of 22 players at a similar level and we probably only have 16.
We’re doing better than most of them because we’re doing everything else right - whereas a lot of the clubs were doing better than are simply not as well ran as we are
So you’re saying being well run can overcome the disadvantages of having less revenue?
I think we agree.
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Now the dust has settled, we were always going to lose eventually and 6/9 from the three games over Christmas is a pretty good return. Just got to win the next eleven. UTV HAPPY New Year!
The return over the November/December period has been exceptionally good. Last night was disappointing, mainly because we had got so much right in the first half and an injury really knackered us. But it shouldn’t colour how well we’ve done and the key bit is how we respond. We’re not going to do another insane winning run, but we don’t need to. We just need to get back on track.
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I think PSR is perfectly valid - we are doing amazing despite the restrictions PSR places on us.
It makes it harder to compete because you need a squad of 22 players at a similar level and we probably only have 16.
We’re doing better than most of them because we’re doing everything else right - whereas a lot of the clubs were doing better than are simply not as well ran as we are
So you’re saying being well run can overcome the disadvantages of having less revenue?
I think we agree.
The stars have to align completely though. Being well run isn’t enough, lots of other teams are well run. A club also needs a genius for a manager, which we’re lucky to have.
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The return over the November/December period has been exceptionally good. Last night was disappointing, mainly because we had got so much right in the first half and an injury really knackered us.
I agree, and the ref didn't help, but I'll repeat something I said above: I think Arteta had set his team up to match our pace in the first half, fully expecting a tougher second half. Credit due to Legohead, I think he got it right on the night, even if the first goal was 'lucky' in that Martinez gifted it, thus setting them on their way.
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Special mention for Unai to disappear down the tunnel and not shake that wankers hand, was brilliant.
Celebrating like he’d won the league every goal and at FT, fuck him. As much as I hate 115, I’d prefer them to win it than that cnut and shit fans.
I can't stand Arteta but I don't think Unai can criticise him for over celebrating a goal after he threw his coat in the air when we got the winner against Arsenal a couple of weeks ago.
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I think PSR is perfectly valid - we are doing amazing despite the restrictions PSR places on us.
It makes it harder to compete because you need a squad of 22 players at a similar level and we probably only have 16.
We’re doing better than most of them because we’re doing everything else right - whereas a lot of the clubs were doing better than are simply not as well ran as we are
So you’re saying being well run can overcome the disadvantages of having less revenue?
I think we agree.
The stars have to align completely though. Being well run isn’t enough, lots of other teams are well run. A club also needs a genius for a manager, which we’re lucky to have.
I did mention that in my list of things that constitute being well run higher up the thread.
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Disappointing drop-off in the second-half.
It wasn't the reason we lost but Merino should have received a second yellow and walked - the ref was also poor.
The Morgan Rogers booking was atrocious. He just stood there and the Arsenal player threw the ball in front of him then kicked the ball straight into his legs. Rogers could do nothing about it. Appalling decision.
and took the free kick nowhere near where it was. He moved it on 5 yards .
Exactly. And that's what makes it such a bad decision. The ref should be pulled up for that one but he won't be and you can't appeal a yellow.
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To do a first half as we did without several key players in those circumstances is enormous -proof of what an outstanding manager and cultured team we have. Second half we fell from an aggressive approach from them without protection from solid referring as our lightweight and inexperienced players could not hold on still we did fight back even with academy players. The Arse players celebrated like wild (see fx Gabriel in second half blocking shot from Rogers with his head to give a away a corner).
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Gabriel is a right ****** isn’t he. It’ll be hilarious when they bottle the league again.
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Disappointing drop-off in the second-half.
It wasn't the reason we lost but Merino should have received a second yellow and walked - the ref was also poor.
The Morgan Rogers booking was atrocious. He just stood there and the Arsenal player threw the ball in front of him then kicked the ball straight into his legs. Rogers could do nothing about it. Appalling decision.
and took the free kick nowhere near where it was. He moved it on 5 yards .
Exactly. And that's what makes it such a bad decision. The ref should be pulled up for that one but he won't be and you can't appeal a yellow.
Morgs picked up another cheap one against Chelsea when he was wrestled to the ground with the Chelsea player having both arms round him yet HE gets booked. With only 5 cards before a suspension, you can lose players pretty easily.
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I think PSR is perfectly valid - we are doing amazing despite the restrictions PSR places on us.
It makes it harder to compete because you need a squad of 22 players at a similar level and we probably only have 16.
We’re doing better than most of them because we’re doing everything else right - whereas a lot of the clubs were doing better than are simply not as well ran as we are
So you’re saying being well run can overcome the disadvantages of having less revenue?
I think we agree.
The stars have to align completely though. Being well run isn’t enough, lots of other teams are well run. A club also needs a genius for a manager, which we’re lucky to have.
I did mention that in my list of things that constitute being well run higher up the thread.
Fair. I just don’t think these rules can be disregarded as a check on ambition. We and other clubs would have to be run perfectly from top to bottom, consistently compete in the CL and win things for a couple of decades to catch up with teams who don’t have PSR concerns.
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Special mention for Unai to disappear down the tunnel and not shake that wankers hand, was brilliant.
Celebrating like he’d won the league every goal and at FT, fuck him. As much as I hate 115, I’d prefer them to win it than that cnut and shit fans.
I can't stand Arteta but I don't think Unai can criticise him for over celebrating a goal after he threw his coat in the air when we got the winner against Arsenal a couple of weeks ago.
I think it was more the not shaking Artetas hand at the end, that caught the eye of the media coverage. Emery pointed out in a roundabout way that he’s not going to wait around whilst the other manager celebrates with his team. His view is you congratulate/commiserate with the opposing manager first.
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Special mention for Unai to disappear down the tunnel and not shake that wankers hand, was brilliant.
Celebrating like he’d won the league every goal and at FT, fuck him. As much as I hate 115, I’d prefer them to win it than that cnut and shit fans.
I can't stand Arteta but I don't think Unai can criticise him for over celebrating a goal after he threw his coat in the air when we got the winner against Arsenal a couple of weeks ago.
I think it was more the not shaking Artetas hand at the end, that caught the eye of the media coverage. Emery pointed out in a roundabout way that he’s not going to wait around whilst the other manager celebrates with his team. His view is you congratulate/commiserate with the opposing manager first.
Protocol is to shake then celebrate but as they have won the league in December you can understand Arteta lack of grace.
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Not nice to lose but I think most of us expected it due to the quality not available to us on the day. Plenty of positives yesterday though:
1) With the squad temporary depleted, better to lose to top of the league than a game we are expected to win.
2) Cash and Kamara got a much needed rest.
3) Blooded new players.
4) Two Arsenal games out the way and only reached halfway point of the season.
5) Chelsea and Man Utd had a nightmare and show no signs of improving.
6) Title talk binned which reduces pressure.
7) Man City will win league anyway which will really fuck Arses off.
8) Our players will be really focused on beating Forest and getting back on track. Unai won't accept anything less.
Not nice but not bad.
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I think most of us would have taken a win at Chelsea and a loss at Arsenal over a draw at both. It’s disappointing but not _that_ disappointing given the larger context.
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I think PSR is perfectly valid - we are doing amazing despite the restrictions PSR places on us.
It makes it harder to compete because you need a squad of 22 players at a similar level and we probably only have 16.
We’re doing better than most of them because we’re doing everything else right - whereas a lot of the clubs were doing better than are simply not as well ran as we are
So you’re saying being well run can overcome the disadvantages of having less revenue?
I think we agree.
The stars have to align completely though. Being well run isn’t enough, lots of other teams are well run. A club also needs a genius for a manager, which we’re lucky to have.
I did mention that in my list of things that constitute being well run higher up the thread.
Fair. I just don’t think these rules can be disregarded as a check on ambition. We and other clubs would have to be run perfectly from top to bottom, consistently compete in the CL and win things for a couple of decades to catch up with teams who don’t have PSR concerns.
Disagree. Mainly because we are already doing better than clubs without PSR concerns (Chelsea, Manure, Spurs) despite not consistently competing in the CL or having those decades of winning things.
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Anyone have any idea what Onana's injury was. At first when he was sitting down I thought it was a head injury, but not sure. As he walked off at half time there was nothing visibly obvious. Anyone know?
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Better side first half, should have taken our chances.
An Onana shaped chasm in the midfield in the second half. We cannot carry that hole without Kamara and Onana against a side as good as they are. Felt the score flattered them really, but well beaten in the end.
The nippers coming on summed up the zoomed out picture between a side that has had to reintergrate a player like Buendia who the manager didn't want and who spent £30m net (poorly on Guessand) and one that had spent £250m net on top of the other £210m since Emery took over.
If we zoom that lens further and reflect some more; we're a smidge away from 40 at the turn. We likely need another 26 points to guarantee top 5. We should motor past that; what an achievement it is to date and what it will be.
Then come the reckoning we can all make use of Man City's title lifting to nip onto the tram back onto Manchester a little less burdened, with Champions League football secured and a trophy in the cabinet come our return to Istanbul.
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Special mention for Unai to disappear down the tunnel and not shake that wankers hand, was brilliant.
Celebrating like he’d won the league every goal and at FT, fuck him. As much as I hate 115, I’d prefer them to win it than that cnut and shit fans.
I can't stand Arteta but I don't think Unai can criticise him for over celebrating a goal after he threw his coat in the air when we got the winner against Arsenal a couple of weeks ago.
Unai came across a bit petulant really. Saying he was cold wasn't far off the dog ate my homework excuse. Likely a bit of previous there with Arsenal, as you say he certainly didn't hold back when we won a few weeks back.
Trawling through the wreckage of that defeat last night, I think there were some positives and Emery will think the same. Onana's display, Watkins scoring again, Garcia and a couple of kids getting a taste for it. Cash and Kamara back instantly improve us for Saturday.
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Unai's a gent, and he expects gent-like conduct from his opposite numbers, especially a fellow euskaldun. Arteta's job is to make straight for him to shake his hand, particularly as a) the victor and b) the home manager. He is, however, in his soul a grotty little oik. No nobility of spirit. Unai was quite within his rights to bolt for his bovril.
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Anyone have any idea what Onana's injury was. At first when he was sitting down I thought it was a head injury, but not sure. As he walked off at half time there was nothing visibly obvious. Anyone know?
I'm guessing tight hamstring as his right leg was being stretched when he was with the physios
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Emery has set a very high standard as a Gentleman of the game so he should be allowed to stray occasionally. He was probably worried that they were going to play that song again so took the sensible option and did one.
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A bit surprising Unai didn't shake hands, but still. Actually, Arteta was OK after the defeat to us the other week and also shook hands with Villa players etc afterwards.
If we can't win the league, and it's between Arsenal and Man City, I would be supporting Arsenal. They haven't done anything really underhand to get where they are today; well, apart from somehow getting themselves promoted after WW1 and relegating Spurs in the process.
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Unai couldn't shake his hand because Arteta was ignoring him, the classless twat.
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A bit surprising Unai didn't shake hands, but still. Actually, Arteta was OK after the defeat to us the other week and also shook hands with Villa players etc afterwards.
If we can't win the league, and it's between Arsenal and Man City, I would be supporting Arsenal. They haven't done anything really underhand to get where they are today; well, apart from somehow getting themselves promoted after WW1 and relegating Spurs in the process.
It was just a loss of temper after Arteta went into that huddle rather than follow normal protocol . I don’t think he wanted to stand around waiting with the crowd baiting and TV cameras in him. Of course he can’t say that afterwards so I thought he dealt with it v well.
From Arteta reaction it’s pretty clear they shook hands inside.
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Unai's comments on not shaking hands:
https://www.breakingnews.ie/sport/unai-emery-defends-decision-not-to-shake-mikel-arteta-hand-as-arsenal-beat-villa-1847051.html
Much ado about nothing.
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Unai's a gent, and he expects gent-like conduct from his opposite numbers, especially a fellow euskaldun. Arteta's job is to make straight for him to shake his hand, particularly as a) the victor and b) the home manager. He is, however, in his soul a grotty little oik. No nobility of spirit. Unai was quite within his rights to bolt for his bovril.
Grubby little oik and bolt for bovril... Wonderful flourishes of language and working titles for songs by The Fall.
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In fairness to Arsenal and Arteta, when the pressure came on them last night at half time, they showed their mettle and turned it around brilliantly. Atmosphere turned very quickly in the first half once we started well. Tielemans and McGinn were the midfield pairing when we effectively ended their title bid there a couple of seasons ago. It wasn't as it we put two kids in there when Onana went off. Huge pressure on them, Rice injured etc and we have been their bogey team for a few years. If they go on and win the title they will point to this game being the key one. Not sure how any neutral would want Man City and their cheating to win it out again.
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In fairness to Arsenal and Arteta, when the pressure came on them last night at half time, they showed their mettle and turned it around brilliantly. Atmosphere turned very quickly in the first half once we started well. Tielemans and McGinn were the midfield pairing when we effectively ended their title bid there a couple of seasons ago. It wasn't as it we put two kids in there when Onana went off. Huge pressure on them, Rice injured etc and we have been their bogey team for a few years. If they go on and win the title they will point to this game being the key one. Not sure how any neutral would want Man City and their cheating to win it out again.
I want 115 to win it again so I can immediately dismiss it due to the charges still not being dealt with. As for Woolwich showing their "mettle", the contributions of Emi, Sancho and the ref had a large bearing on the outcome. That is not to say that the home side didn't deserve their win, they did thoroughly, but there was more to it than just the result. The same could be said of our loss at Liverpool.
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Yeah, Man City wins don't count. Arsenal can fuck off, they shouldn't even be in the top flight.
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I agree with CD and Nev. Plus Arteta will be under serious pressure if they don't win the title or Champions League.
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Our next three league games
Forest (H)
Palace (A)
Everton (H)
Arsenals
Bournemouth (A)
Liverpool (H)
Forest (A)
I know we all come out in boils and scurvy at the thought of playing Palace, but their not in a great place at the moment. Moyes will make it tough to beat Everton, but I can see us getting 9 points. Whereas it wouldn’t surprise me if Arsenal drew with Liverpool, the gap then becomes 4. There really isn’t loads in this.
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Arsenal aren't the issue. They'll bottle it. They'e won the league in December about ten years running. Man City will win every game for the last three months, as ever, so we would need to be at least five or six points clear by Easter to have a realistic chance of winning the league.
It isn't going to happen.
Get top four wrapped up by the Liverpool game and go all out for the Europa League, please.
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I don’t give a shit who wins the league if it’s not Villa.
Except for Chelsea and the racist, Rangers-loving twats that support them. They can go to hell.
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Not nice to lose but I think most of us expected it due to the quality not available to us on the day. Plenty of positives yesterday though:
1) With the squad temporary depleted, better to lose to top of the league than a game we are expected to win.
2) Cash and Kamara got a much needed rest.
3) Blooded new players.
4) Two Arsenal games out the way and only reached halfway point of the season.
5) Chelsea and Man Utd had a nightmare and show no signs of improving.
6) Title talk binned which reduces pressure.
7) Man City will win league anyway which will really fuck Arses off.
8) Our players will be really focused on beating Forest and getting back on track. Unai won't accept anything less.
Not nice but not bad.
Agree with this.
Forest are not as bad as the league suggests so being fully focused and fresh is critical.
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In fairness to Arsenal and Arteta, when the pressure came on them last night at half time, they showed their mettle and turned it around brilliantly. Atmosphere turned very quickly in the first half once we started well. Tielemans and McGinn were the midfield pairing when we effectively ended their title bid there a couple of seasons ago. It wasn't as it we put two kids in there when Onana went off. Huge pressure on them, Rice injured etc and we have been their bogey team for a few years. If they go on and win the title they will point to this game being the key one. Not sure how any neutral would want Man City and their cheating to win it out again.
I want Man City to win it. Fuck Arsenal, the cringiest, weirdest, most Tarquin fan base in the country with the biggest ****** going as a manager.
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I think PSR is perfectly valid - we are doing amazing despite the restrictions PSR places on us.
It makes it harder to compete because you need a squad of 22 players at a similar level and we probably only have 16.
We’re doing better than most of them because we’re doing everything else right - whereas a lot of the clubs were doing better than are simply not as well ran as we are
So you’re saying being well run can overcome the disadvantages of having less revenue?
I think we agree.
The stars have to align completely though. Being well run isn’t enough, lots of other teams are well run. A club also needs a genius for a manager, which we’re lucky to have.
At the end of the day it is a handicap - we get around it by doing everything else so well. But if we could also invest more in the playing squad. Unai is a huge difference maker - but if we could invest more I think we would be regularly winning silverware.
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Having to cleanse the algorithm from ****** saying things like "you got to hold this" what does that even mean you Tarquin prick? Everything about them is cringey. From that fruity North London forver, to having a fucking drum, to the gimp who thinks he's the Napoli stadium announcer, to their Lego haired manager, their imminently punchable players, just blergh. I feel sorry for Tottenham (and I hate Tottenham) having to share the same space as these people. They're what happens when Twitter manifests into real life.
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And the millions of vengeful African/Asian supporters who invade our pages mocking/taunting and generally acting like arrogant and entitled twats. Chelsea have loads of them too.
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Think it was one of those nights - which thankfully we dont have very often anymore. A few vital bits that could have gone differently on a different day.
Had Ollie taken that chance in the first half. Emi needs to be stronger for the first goal. And they had a clear second yellow the ref bottled.
Given that goalkeepers no longer seem to be over protected - it still really annoys me that we missed out on CL football with the Man Utd keeper being incorrectly over protected.
I would have liked to have seen the lines for the build up to the second and third goal as they looked off side to me.
That said - what a run and its set us up so well for the rest of the season. I wouldnt have been surprised if over the last two games Chelsea had gained 6 points on us - instead we're 2 better off.
With Kamara and cash back - a home win against Forest would be brilliant way to finish off an amazing festive period.
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I’d be happy for Villa to never win another trophy if it meant that we didn’t have to turn into the kind of middle class football theme park of club that Arsenal are. They can shove their big flags and choreographed “ultras” playing at being London “footy” fans before leaping on a train back to safe, leafy Hertfordshire. And that fucking dirge of an anthem they’ve invented…..Football Hell for the Soccer AM generation. They’re welcome to it. What a shit night.
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That song was apparently written in 2022 by the son of the woman off Birds of a Feather. I know this because I googled it. They are a cringeworthy fan base for sure.
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In all fan bases, the most vocal ones all seem to be the twats.
I’m very good friends with 3 Arsenal season ticket holders and all have the same doom thoughts before many games. Very congratulatory to me when we beat them (a lot recently).
One is even a Northern Soul DJ!!
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I think if Arsenal had six first teamers either out or injured during the game they would struggle as well. But no that doesn’t fit the narrative. As I said last night it was a game too far in a ridiculous December schedule. But overall when the fixtures came out we were dreading December. To win every game except one is an astonishing achievement.
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In all fan bases, the most vocal ones all seem to be the twats.
I’m very good friends with 3 Arsenal season ticket holders and all have the same doom thoughts before many games. Very congratulatory to me when we beat them (a lot recently).
One is even a Northern Soul DJ!!
Yes, I haven't experienced the generalisation that they are either the weirdest or the most cringeworthy fans in the country. As you say, all fan bases have people who are annoying, loud-mouthed etc...
My son-in-law is an Arsenal fan and is very reasonable as are the other ones I have met, so I could have been mixing in the wrong circles.
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when the fixtures came out we were dreading December. To win every game except one is an astonishing achievement.
Yes, I remember that.
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The vitrol their fans have towards Unai & therefore us is quite a suprise - we've been living rent-free in their heads much more than I gave that credit for. We were a couple of decisions by players & officials from at least a draw.
I fear Onana was targetted with a bit of rough treatment after he went down & off the first time. Win by all means.
Not bitter, & now let's go on another unbeaten run.
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In all fan bases, the most vocal ones all seem to be the twats.
I’m very good friends with 3 Arsenal season ticket holders and all have the same doom thoughts before many games. Very congratulatory to me when we beat them (a lot recently).
One is even a Northern Soul DJ!!
Yes, I haven't experienced the generalisation that they are either the weirdest or the most cringeworthy fans in the country. As you say, all fan bases have people who are annoying, loud-mouthed etc...
My son-in-law is an Arsenal fan and is very reasonable as are the other ones I have met, so I could have been mixing in the wrong circles.
If you went last night or any other time in the past few years you'd think differently.
And I'm related to a Nose, he's a good bloke but I have zero interest im extrapolating his normal behaviour to the rest of the Chimney Boys.
Arsenal are Tarquin twats. Fuck them.
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To call that song an 'anthem' sums up Arsenal perfectly. They still can't let go about Martinez and are in complete denial over Unai. They know and we know who is the better manager.
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To call that song an 'anthem' sums up Arsenal perfectly. They still can't let go about Martinez and are in complete denial over Unai. They know and we know who is the better manager.
I honestly don't understand the vitriol toward Martinez: He gave them 10 years of his life, FFS, and they then dumped him.
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The whole thing is cognitive dissonance to pretend Lego Head is the messiah rather than the Spanish Pulis who has spunked the thick end of a billion to win nigh on fuck all.
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From the looks of things on the TV last night, every single Woolwich fan had spent £100 in the club shop, I've never seen so many scarfs and hats. Usually you get scalfers, old skool casuals dressed neutrally, the odd tourist with half and halfs, someone wearing a tracksuit top or replica shirt but everyone last night looked like an extra from Fever Pitch.
The whole place reeks of a desperate attempt to regain the heritage they junked when they left Highbury - the clock bolted onto the stand to somehow replicate the old Clock End in a ground that has no character whatsoever, that song etc etc.
I always feel that deep, deep down there is still a small bit of the old Man City within 115, probably represented by the few older fans left but in South, sorry, North London, there is nothing.
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In all fan bases, the most vocal ones all seem to be the twats.
I’m very good friends with 3 Arsenal season ticket holders and all have the same doom thoughts before many games. Very congratulatory to me when we beat them (a lot recently).
One is even a Northern Soul DJ!!
Yes, I haven't experienced the generalisation that they are either the weirdest or the most cringeworthy fans in the country. As you say, all fan bases have people who are annoying, loud-mouthed etc...
My son-in-law is an Arsenal fan and is very reasonable as are the other ones I have met, so I could have been mixing in the wrong circles.
If you went last night or any other time in the past few years you'd think differently.
And I'm related to a Nose, he's a good bloke but I have zero interest im extrapolating his normal behaviour to the rest of the Chimney Boys.
Arsenal are Tarquin twats. Fuck them.
I didn't go last night but I have been a few times to see us at the Emirates in recent seasons, but I can't say I've experienced anything terrible nor would I generalise them as being some of the worst fans, but just my opinion.
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I know 3 Arsenal fans who I consider friends. They are proper decent balanced people. Obviously, otherwise they wouldn't be my friends.
However a few seasons ago I met 3/4 on the train back from Aston to New Street and they were total ******. Massively disparaging about out city and our club and then they asked me if there were any Michelin star restaurants in centre where they could possibly eat. I said there are 5 or 6 at which they laughed loudly saying "just that, there are more in Holloway prison".
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I still don't hate them as much as Man Utd, Liverpool, Man City and Chelsea
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I still don't hate them as much as Man Utd, Liverpool, Man City and Chelsea
I know but they are making a bloody good effort with their plastic fans and wannabe anthem.
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Adding my voice to those who know some reasonable Arsenal fans in London. I don't judge them by the Arsenal you tube twats who almost make the noses look sensible. The Arsenal fans I know respect us and are always complementary about Villa Park and our history. Not as marked as our deluded neighbours but they also have to put up with the headbangers at WHL who somehow think they are on a par with Arsenal, despite having only won the league twice in their history.
Last night showed we need to be at our very best to beat the top sides. We didn't take some really good chances in the first half, which was generally even, though our best work came in a spell between 10-20th minutes I reckon. All 4 goals came from errors - Martinez (although impeded he should have been stronger), Sancho, Digne and Garcia twice (a weak attempt at an interception then the lack of nous to bring his man down). For a while I thought they'd run riot and was willing the final whistle to come.
Wish McGinn had scored that sitter to make the score more respectable but pleased Ollie finally got his. It keeps his form going but also when we next play them they will be conscious he has scored in 3 consecutive games there. This plays in the heads of teams -see us with Sarr.
One final thing: we need a throw in coach. We may as well just bounce the ball to the opposition.
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Pat, I have been moaning for years about how often we give the ball away at throw ins or take so long that all our players are marked by the time that we finally get round to it.
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Only time we didn't automatically lose balls from throw ins was when we had Grealish
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Pat, I have been moaning for years about how often we give the ball away at throw ins or take so long that all our players are marked by the time that we finally get round to it.
It's mad. For a team with coaches who have a fine eye for detail we are consistently atrocious at simply keeping possession. never mind doing something vaguely creative..
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Still waiting for FIFA to bring in Wenger's idea of putting the ball on the floor and playing it.
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There are three things which put me off Arsenal (and tbh, I lived in Finsbury Park for a while in the early 90s, Arsenal Central basically, and they didn't concern me at all then, these are all recent things).
One is that their fans are the worst thing on the internet. They're so unbelievably cringey, they're just the worst thing out there. Seeing them on twitter and that cringey fucking AFTV is like being subjected to watching Jarsquatter (please do not google) on loop for hours.
The second is this immense sense of fucking entitlement they have. They genuinely can't lose a match without affecting some sort of righteous indignation that someone has been better than them.
The third is that in recent years, for a historic club, they've achieved a new sheen of artificiality, above all since they left Highbury. That 'North London Forever' thing is just absolutely hilariously shit, how naff. I thought Spurs singing that slow 'When the Spurs go Marching In' thing was easily the worst sound in football, but now they've got their new anthem, it's not even the worst thing in North London football.
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Pat, I have been moaning for years about how often we give the ball away at throw ins or take so long that all our players are marked by the time that we finally get round to it.
It's mad. For a team with coaches who have a fine eye for detail we are consistently atrocious at simply keeping possession. never mind doing something vaguely creative..
I just don’t get why folk are willing to pay tens of millions of pounds in transfer fees plus millions of pounds per year in players’ wages yet don’t seem to see the value in a set piece coach, let alone specialist coaches for absolutely everything - goal kicks, throw ins, warming up as a substitute, putting the kettle on, … you’d naturally assume that none of that would be left to chance. Yet it feels like it is sometimes.
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This is why Emery is right. I know it was about us and our title chances and he quickly reminded every twat reporter before and after the game there is a long way to go. In the same way, all of a sudden perennial choke masters Arsenal have righted all the wrongs because they beat a depleted Villa last night (see Athletic article today by Mark Carey). It’s too early to determine that. At the business end of the season they have constantly fucked it up but the load blowing by sections of the media will have you believe it’s all going to be ok now. It’s unbearable. And as for Arsenal missing Rice and still winning last night, nobody talks about who we were missing. Or that Arsenal despite missing a key player who cost almost 2/3 of what the entire Villa starting XI cost, spent 10x what we did in the summer on strengthening the squad, and had unused players on the bench that cost the better part of £200M. So fuck them. All of them. The entitled deluded twats.
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I never expected us to win the League because I've been a fan too long. But after last night and everything that went along with it from the Arsenal side...now I want us to win the League.
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^^ Jimmy Floyd Hasselbaink surprised me earlier on SSN, mentioning how weakened we were.
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Talking of throw-ins, from my corner of the world it looked like every Arsenal throw-in was a foul throw. Is that another rule that's changed or does it only apply to the Tarquins?
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I feel a strange empathy with Spuds fans, putting up with those tossers as their rivals.
Almost as bad as what we have to deal with. Almost.
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The Arsenal narrative and general pundits seem to think beating Villa means they are now favourites to win the League. It was a game they couldn't afford to get beat. Not because of Villa, but because of City. Nothing has changed in that regard. They still have to play away at City. They all know that City are still favourites.
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They're that much of a joke that they had to manufacture an ultras section, I just find it impossible to take them seriously.
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As I mentioned in my preview, if ever there was a club in the right place at the right time it was Arsenal. Nick Hornby started it, Islington became gentrified and as football got luvvier its residents discovered a ground they could walk to with a team whose manager was French and therefore off the scale of cool. Everywhere else has kicked back against football hipsters; Arsenal have industrialised them.
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They ended up with a 60,000 stadium devoid of any atmosphere.
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Same as the other 60k stadiums in this country then.
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There’s is particularly bad as they have no real end with singing support.
I was at the 2.0 the season before last and considering they were top of the league they hardly sang or created a noise.
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Villa bossed the first half with a team ravaged by injury and suspensions. A full strength Villa team would've won in my opinion.
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^^ Jimmy Floyd Hasselbaink surprised me earlier on SSN, mentioning how weakened we were.
You always have to say his full name. Just like Obafemi Martins. You can’t say ‘Jimmy Floyd’ or ‘Hasselbaink.’ It can only be Jimmy Floyd Hasselbaink.
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The commentator was nauseating, he glorified every goal they scored ranting that they were making a statement, not once did he mention how many players we were missing. Gone to the top of my dislike list even above the two Manc sides.
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Our first half performance was outstanding and we could/should have been ahead.
The scoreline is irrelevant because we weren't outclassed, we made some mistakes that they punished.
The first, Martinez should have been stronger.
Second wouldn't have happened if it had been McGinn instead of Sancho.
Pointless picking the bones out of the rest.
We are a damn good side with at least two of our better players returning on Saturday. This is a blip that gives us work to do to win the league....
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^^ Jimmy Floyd Hasselbaink surprised me earlier on SSN, mentioning how weakened we were.
You always have to say his full name. Just like Obafemi Martins. You can’t say ‘Jimmy Floyd’ or ‘Hasselbaink.’ It can only be Jimmy Floyd Hasselbaink.
Think it's the rule for players with either really long names like Jan Vennegoor of Hesselink. Or really short names like Ruel Fox.
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We’ll beat Forest, they will beat Bournemouth, we’ll scrape a win at Palace, doing a Clark Kent in Superman II and they will draw with Liverpool. And the gap will be 4, no gap really.
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Same with Man City if they win tonight
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Our first half performance was outstanding and we could/should have been ahead.
The scoreline is irrelevant because we weren't outclassed, we made some mistakes that they punished.
The first, Martinez should have been stronger.
Second wouldn't have happened if it had been McGinn instead of Sancho.
Pointless picking the bones out of the rest.
We are a damn good side with at least two of our better players returning on Saturday. This is a blip that gives us work to do to win the league....
I thought our first half showing was brilliant, but losing Onana was just too big a hole to fill for us and we got overran as soon as they went in front.
I've every confidence in Unai picking us up and us going on another impressive run now.
Roll on Saturday!
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Taken a little time to let the emotions cool from the other evening.
Agree with others in that the fact that Arsenal (not just their wankpot fans, but the players themselves) saw this as such a huge win, albeit at home, is a massive indicator in how far we have come.
Tuesday evening was the first time in a decent while that I didn’t feel as confident in the strength from the bench. We were always going to miss the likes of Boubacar and Matty, and against lesser opposition we may have managed with the loss of Onana so early in the second half, but our imposed transfer handicap was always going to catch up with us eventually.
There were more than enough moments that for a bit of luck and better officiating, we could have been talking about a much more positive result.
So thank you Mr Emery, lets smash these fuckers in the FA cup final please.
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Smashing them in an FA Cup final? Yes fucking please, I’ll have some of that.
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The commentator was nauseating, he glorified every goal they scored ranting that they were making a statement, not once did he mention how many players we were missing. Gone to the top of my dislike list even above the two Manc sides.
Who was the commentator? He was every bit as annoying as Drury, albeit in a different way.
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Pat, I have been moaning for years about how often we give the ball away at throw ins or take so long that all our players are marked by the time that we finally get round to it.
It's mad. For a team with coaches who have a fine eye for detail we are consistently atrocious at simply keeping possession. never mind doing something vaguely creative..
I just don’t get why folk are willing to pay tens of millions of pounds in transfer fees plus millions of pounds per year in players’ wages yet don’t seem to see the value in a set piece coach, let alone specialist coaches for absolutely everything - goal kicks, throw ins, warming up as a substitute, putting the kettle on, … you’d naturally assume that none of that would be left to chance. Yet it feels like it is sometimes.
I put Mings' injury at Liverpool down to not being warmed up correctly and I thought then why, in this day and age, isn't there a coach on the touchline with subs to make sure they're ready to come into the game if called upon.
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For all the money they've spent compared to us, the extra time Arteta has had to mould his side than what Emery's had, there was still only a 3 point gap before the other night. Even with the start of the season we had. Let's see how things look when Emery's had 1-2 more years and hopefully we've been able to spend some money.
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There’s is particularly bad as they have no real end with singing support.
I was at the 2.0 the season before last and considering they were top of the league they hardly sang or created a noise.
Bertie Mee said to Bill Shankly have you heard of the North Bank Highbury
Shank says no i dont think so but ive heard of the Holte end
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There’s is particularly bad as they have no real end with singing support.
I was at the 2.0 the season before last and considering they were top of the league they hardly sang or created a noise.
Bertie Mee said to Bill Shankly have you heard of the North Bank Highbury
Shank says no i dont think so but ive heard of the Holte end
The Holte End is the best in British football. That alone, is reason enough to never move from B6.
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There’s is particularly bad as they have no real end with singing support.
I was at the 2.0 the season before last and considering they were top of the league they hardly sang or created a noise.
Bertie Mee said to Bill Shankly have you heard of the North Bank Highbury
Shank says no i dont think so but ive heard of the Holte end
…agro.
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Agro is the correct quote Percy as you so wisely say...Also as in "Hi Ho Aston Villa, everywhere we go there's agro. Stanley knives and toe caps shining ,razor blades in your Crombie lining."
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As I mentioned in my preview, if ever there was a club in the right place at the right time it was Arsenal. Nick Hornby started it, Islington became gentrified and as football got luvvier its residents discovered a ground they could walk to with a team whose manager was French and therefore off the scale of cool. Everywhere else has kicked back against football hipsters; Arsenal have industrialised them.
Yet we criticise Ellis for not doing similar with Villa? Chelsea did the same really and West Ham have tried to, with a free stadium, but have failed.
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Agro is the correct quote Percy as you so wisely say...Also as in "Hi Ho Aston Villa, everywhere we go there's agro. Stanley knives and toe caps shining ,razor blades in your Crombie lining."
Haha, I still sing that when they play it at the match.
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Agro is the correct quote Percy as you so wisely say...Also as in "Hi Ho Aston Villa, everywhere we go there's agro. Stanley knives and toe caps shining ,razor blades in your Crombie lining."
Our version was ".. I see your toecaps shining, with a razor in your Crombie lining"
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What was the quote about them being like an American who has read a book about how to be a soccer fan?
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I think PSR is perfectly valid - we are doing amazing despite the restrictions PSR places on us.
It makes it harder to compete because you need a squad of 22 players at a similar level and we probably only have 16.
We’re doing better than most of them because we’re doing everything else right - whereas a lot of the clubs were doing better than are simply not as well ran as we are
So you’re saying being well run can overcome the disadvantages of having less revenue?
I think we agree.
The stars have to align completely though. Being well run isn’t enough, lots of other teams are well run. A club also needs a genius for a manager, which we’re lucky to have.
I did mention that in my list of things that constitute being well run higher up the thread.
Fair. I just don’t think these rules can be disregarded as a check on ambition. We and other clubs would have to be run perfectly from top to bottom, consistently compete in the CL and win things for a couple of decades to catch up with teams who don’t have PSR concerns.
Disagree. Mainly because we are already doing better than clubs without PSR concerns (Chelsea, Manure, Spurs) despite not consistently competing in the CL or having those decades of winning things.
I totally get that perspective mate. I just wonder if our position is sustainable over a long period of time given spending constraints whereas for those other teams not competing in the CL definitely is sustainable because of all the previous success and/or other income generation.
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My current expectation is that it will all go to shit when Unai leaves but who knows?
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There’s is particularly bad as they have no real end with singing support.
I was at the 2.0 the season before last and considering they were top of the league they hardly sang or created a noise.
Bertie Mee said to Bill Shankly have you heard of the North Bank Highbury
Shank says no i dont think so but ive heard of the Holte end
An Old Codger writes...
From memory I think the line was 'Shanks says no I don't think so, but I've heard of the Villa aggro. Ah, na na na na, na na na, na na na na, na na na, .....etc etc We are the Villa boot boys! As sung by the Holte End Late 60s-1970s