Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Villa Memories => Topic started by: algy on November 18, 2025, 08:55:34 AM
-
Since there’s a Best XI …
Rules - players can be from any era, even before football was invented in 1992. They should’ve played a reasonable number of games (say equivalent of a full season, so roughly 40 games minimum).
Edit: to loosen the criteria a bit, the playing time rule is meant purely to exclude short term loan signings (Drinkwater, Gabor Kiraly, ..) and players who just made odd substitute appearances or didn’t play at all, eg Andy Marshall was never in serious contention for a first team spot. Use your own judgement as to whether a player meets those criteria.
Go.
-
It's probably just a lucky dip of players from 2015 - 2018, with Grealish and Agbonlahor taken out isn't it?
Because anyone who was doing a poor job for us at any other any other time was still good enough to be doing it for us in the Premier League rather than 13th in the Championship.
-
The shitebags that scratched the Oxford University game.
-
Based on the approx. 40 games minimum criteria I'll go as below (since 1996). Obviously the likes of Tonev, Balaban, Danny Drinkwater, Mark Bunn etc. would be included with a less strict criteria on the amount of games. It also feels harsh to include Nyland considering his performance in the League Cup semi, but I'm struggling for a terrible keeper that played that many games.
Nyland
Richards, Elphick, Lescott, Cissokho
Bacuna, Kinsella, Sanchez, Richardson
Gestede, C.Cole
-
We've had far worse than Bacuna.
-
This one sadly, is more competitive that the best 11. Going to have to rule out some real stinkers.
-
Edited the criteria to cover the intention of the playing time rule (exclude short term loans and players who were signed as 3rd choice keeper or the like)
-
We've had far worse than Bacuna.
That was the stand-out for me too. Think that back four is probably the textbook answer though.
-
There's a few from the 1986-1987 relegation season I can think of too!!!
-
With the adjusted criteria:
Bunn
Beye Senderos Baker Shorey
El Ahmadi Sylla Sanchez
Holman Hogan Richardson
I know a few of them didn't play all that often but all of them were signed with the intention of being regulars and the ones who didn't manage that were so shit that we either spent again to replace them or played people out of position in their place. I can accept that I'm probably being a little harsh on El Ahmadi but, for me, having him in our midfield after the likes of Barry, Milner and Delph is the point where the hope under Lerner really died. Baker might also be harsh but if he hadn't come through our academy he'd probably have struggled to have a career much above League 1, that he played well over 100 times for us shows just how far we'd fallen by the time we got relegated.
-
There are loads of crap midfielders…. Djemba Djemba, Carlos?, that Egyptian guy that just used to chase opposing midfielders.
I’ve tried to blank out most of them…
-
It's too painful to recall our worst players but it's easy for me to highlight Rudy Gestede as the poorest footballer I've seen in a Villa shirt.
-
It's probably just a lucky dip of players from 2015 - 2018, with Grealish and Agbonlahor taken out isn't it?
Because anyone who was doing a poor job for us at any other any other time was still good enough to be doing it for us in the Premier League rather than 13th in the Championship.
Tonev has to be in there as I think he just missed that 2015-18 inglorious period.
I remember when he signed someone posted the obligatory YT video of him playing in Polish league and most of it consisted of him firing shots and crosses wildly into the stands.
Gets on VP turf and starts doing the same....
Hate using the term "competition winner" to describe players but he looked every inch one so he comfortably goes on the right of our worst ever team.
-
It's too painful to recall our worst players but it's easy for me to highlight Rudy Gestede as the poorest footballer I've seen in a Villa shirt.
Gestede had no chance having to replace Benteke with his limited technique. However he did score 6-7 goals that prem season and also the winner v SHA so just on that he dosen't go into worst team.
We signed McCormack a year later for massive fee, wages and expectations and he was a complete disaster so depends how you judge signings and what you expect.
Think we also got most of our money back for Gestede when he went to Boro so it was just a poor player in a poor era for us.
-
The whole of the 2015/16 side - 17 points, nuff said!
Even in 1986/87 we got 36 points (in 42 games I know)
-
How often did Aleksander "crap with both feet" Tonev play for us?
-
With the adjusted criteria:
Bunn
Beye Senderos Baker Shorey
El Ahmadi Sylla Sanchez
Holman Hogan Richardson
I know a few of them didn't play all that often but all of them were signed with the intention of being regulars and the ones who didn't manage that were so shit that we either spent again to replace them or played people out of position in their place. I can accept that I'm probably being a little harsh on El Ahmadi but, for me, having him in our midfield after the likes of Barry, Milner and Delph is the point where the hope under Lerner really died. Baker might also be harsh but if he hadn't come through our academy he'd probably have struggled to have a career much above League 1, that he played well over 100 times for us shows just how far we'd fallen by the time we got relegated.
Think some of them were more huge disappointments rather than worst ever. Beye and Shorey were decent enough mid table prem full backs when we got both in but neither were much good for us under MON and became expensive wage drains.
From memory didn't Senderos play about five games with Vlaar in which we kept 3-4 clean sheets then picked up an injury and was never seen again? I can remember him being brilliant away to Liverpool so that's a surprising one.
Never ever rated Clark as a CB. He was a bit like Ridgwell, always had an error in him at key point in game and we conceded a huge amount from corners when he was a regular.
-
God bless his soul but Bernie Gallagher is an absolute shoe in at left back.
-
Sanchez is the single worst player I've seen.
-
Sanchez is the single worst player I've seen.
He was Caceido-esque for the first 60 minutes of a game then seemed to disappear into a time shift vortex and play like his boots were on the wrong feet for the final 30.
-
Based on the approx. 40 games minimum criteria I'll go as below (since 1996). Obviously the likes of Tonev, Balaban, Danny Drinkwater, Mark Bunn etc. would be included with a less strict criteria on the amount of games. It also feels harsh to include Nyland considering his performance in the League Cup semi, but I'm struggling for a terrible keeper that played that many games.
Nyland
Richards, Elphick, Lescott, Cissokho
Bacuna, Kinsella, Sanchez, Richardson
Gestede, C.Cole
Richards
Richards Richards Richards Richards
Richards Richards Richards Richards
Richards Richards
Subs
Richards
Richards
Richards
Richards
Richards
-
There's a few from the 1986-1987 relegation season I can think of too!!!
They were the worst underachievers - sure some were past their best and some not quite to level they achieved but fupp me Spink, Evans, Dorigo, Keown, Walters, Birch Thompson should never have been relegated. A half decent coach would have had them mid table.
-
Most on these lists as they tend to feature players that tried their best but just weren't good enough, which isn't really their fault. Take Bowery, never good enough but tried like fuck, not his fault we signed him and played him and I don't blame him for joining us. My ire is generally for the likes of Collymore, Ireland, McCormack etc who performed far below their ability.
Even Lescott, everyone sensible knew he was past his best, but then seem surprised he was a bit shit. Richards, we couldn't even insure him and then seemed surprised he was too injured to play after giving him a long and expensive contract.
-
God bless his soul but Bernie Gallagher is an absolute shoe in at left back.
Absolutely.
Along with Paul Kerr, Darren Bradley & Ray(?) Walker.
-
With the adjusted criteria:
Bunn
Beye Senderos Baker Shorey
El Ahmadi Sylla Sanchez
Holman Hogan Richardson
I know a few of them didn't play all that often but all of them were signed with the intention of being regulars and the ones who didn't manage that were so shit that we either spent again to replace them or played people out of position in their place. I can accept that I'm probably being a little harsh on El Ahmadi but, for me, having him in our midfield after the likes of Barry, Milner and Delph is the point where the hope under Lerner really died. Baker might also be harsh but if he hadn't come through our academy he'd probably have struggled to have a career much above League 1, that he played well over 100 times for us shows just how far we'd fallen by the time we got relegated.
Think some of them were more huge disappointments rather than worst ever. Beye and Shorey were decent enough mid table prem full backs when we got both in but neither were much good for us under MON and became expensive wage drains.
From memory didn't Senderos play about five games with Vlaar in which we kept 3-4 clean sheets then picked up an injury and was never seen again? I can remember him being brilliant away to Liverpool so that's a surprising one.
Never ever rated Clark as a CB. He was a bit like Ridgwell, always had an error in him at key point in game and we conceded a huge amount from corners when he was a regular.
My thinking with Senderos, Beye and Shorey is partially that I didn't want to just fill the team with the relegation squad but also because all 3 were signed as established players ready to come in a do a job and, for whatever reason, they turned invisible within weeks. I think it's because I find utterly pointless players more of an issue than players who just aren't good enough. That's also why Bowery didn't get included but I struggled to pick between Richardson and Dawkins. Also (dis)honourable mention to Balaban, Berson, Makoun and Bradley (and many others) for similar reasons.
The other one I reckon is controversial is Holman over Tonev but I knew the latter would get mentions so I went with a player so forgettable he probably needs a few minutes looking in the mirror every morning.
-
How often did Aleksander "crap with both feet" Tonev play for us?
My recollection is he played a fair amount in 2013/14. Maybe not many subs but he came on as sub fairly regularly. N'zogbia didn't play a single game that season so I presume he was injured and Albrighton was on his way out.
Soccerbase has it as 17 prem appearances and three games in the cup so 20 over the season.
-
With the adjusted criteria:
Bunn
Beye Senderos Baker Shorey
El Ahmadi Sylla Sanchez
Holman Hogan Richardson
I know a few of them didn't play all that often but all of them were signed with the intention of being regulars and the ones who didn't manage that were so shit that we either spent again to replace them or played people out of position in their place. I can accept that I'm probably being a little harsh on El Ahmadi but, for me, having him in our midfield after the likes of Barry, Milner and Delph is the point where the hope under Lerner really died. Baker might also be harsh but if he hadn't come through our academy he'd probably have struggled to have a career much above League 1, that he played well over 100 times for us shows just how far we'd fallen by the time we got relegated.
Think some of them were more huge disappointments rather than worst ever. Beye and Shorey were decent enough mid table prem full backs when we got both in but neither were much good for us under MON and became expensive wage drains.
From memory didn't Senderos play about five games with Vlaar in which we kept 3-4 clean sheets then picked up an injury and was never seen again? I can remember him being brilliant away to Liverpool so that's a surprising one.
Never ever rated Clark as a CB. He was a bit like Ridgwell, always had an error in him at key point in game and we conceded a huge amount from corners when he was a regular.
My thinking with Senderos, Beye and Shorey is partially that I didn't want to just fill the team with the relegation squad but also because all 3 were signed as established players ready to come in a do a job and, for whatever reason, they turned invisible within weeks. I think it's because I find utterly pointless players more of an issue than players who just aren't good enough. That's also why Bowery didn't get included but I struggled to pick between Richardson and Dawkins. Also (dis)honourable mention to Balaban, Berson, Makoun and Bradley (and many others) for similar reasons.
The other one I reckon is controversial is Holman over Tonev but I knew the latter would get mentions so I went with a player so forgettable he probably needs a few minutes looking in the mirror every morning.
Brett Holman...can remember the name but no idea who we signed him from or even what season (or two or three) he was here! McLeish year?
He ran around and scored a couple of goals before drifting back into obscurity after leaving us.
KEA looked on paper an o.k signing and think he did well back at Feyenoord when he left us. He and maybe Sanchez to a degree was just a case of prem being a yard too quick for them in midfield area and they looked fine going back to slower paced leagues.
It was a scandal in 2-3 years we went from a regular midfield of Downing-Milner-Barry/Petrov-Young to some of those names listed above so no shock at all we quickly fell down the prem table.
Would be like replacing all the current midfield options we have now with what Burnley put out.
-
From memory we agreed the Holman Bosman while McLeish was manager meaning he played for us the first Lambert season. And left after a year. My main memory of him is he scored a couple at a World Cup rather than anything he did with us.
-
Paul Mortimer needs a slot in the nonexistent midfield
-
We've had far worse than Bacuna.
That was the stand-out for me too. Think that back four is probably the textbook answer though.
And now he's off to the World Cup.
-
How often did Aleksander "crap with both feet" Tonev play for us?
My recollection is he played a fair amount in 2013/14. Maybe not many subs but he came on as sub fairly regularly. N'zogbia didn't play a single game that season so I presume he was injured and Albrighton was on his way out.
Soccerbase has it as 17 prem appearances and three games in the cup so 20 over the season.
Thanks SHQ. So he played far too much.
-
Bunn
Richards
Clark
Lescott
Cissokho
Bjarnasson
Mortimer
Berson
Tonev
Gestede
Helenius
-
Only a few games for this guy but Didier Agathe was absolutely useless.
-
It will always be Stephen "stinker" Ireland for me in any rubbish 11 - we used to watch his warm-up flicks and tricks and then see if we could spot him when the match started. Remarkably poor
-
Only a few games for this guy but Didier Agathe was absolutely useless.
Agathe reminded me of De La Cruz a bit, full of running up and down the right but the end product was very often lacking. He was someone who'd done very well at Celtic for MON so was just brought in on the right as think Delaney got another injury that eventually forced him to retire.
-
Desperate times. MO'N came in quite late in the window, so didn't have much time to line up signings. I think Stan was the only one we paid a fee for. Agathe and Sutton were both free agents that O'Neill knew, so he brought them in.
-
Enckleman
Richards Tiler Lescott Beye
Tonev Sanchez Djemba-Djemba Callaghan
Balaban McCormack
-
3 pages in and not a mention of Steve Hodge, he'd be in my worst 11.
-
Worst XI for being a twat, maybe, but not as a player.
-
Worst XI for being a twat, maybe, but not as a player.
Yes, I'd go along with that too.
I once heard him interviewed about his time at Villa. I took from it that he thought Villa were better than they actually were, as though he was naive for joining Villa in the first place.
-
I read somewhere that Hodge joined Villa and was looking forward to playing alongside Steve McMahon in midfield.
Shortly after Hodge signed, McMahon left Villa for Liverpool.
-
God this thread is depressing.
-
Only a few games for this guy but Didier Agathe was absolutely useless.
He kept knocking the ball a few yards ahead, to use the pave that he no longer had. After the 20th time, you'd think he might have adapted his playing style a bit.
-
If anything depicts the 2010s era it’s us trying to convince ourselves that Chris Herd was going to be amazing.
-
Moreira
Richards, Senderos, Lescott, Gallacher
Djemba, Drinkwater, Holman, Bradley (both!)
David Hunt, Bowery
Manager: McNeill
-
I'd like to jump to the defence of poor Mr Senderos. From memory I'm pretty sure he played about 4/5 games at the start of the 2014/15 season, most of which we won and looked solid at the back, then he got injured and disappeared and was never seen again.
So in theory, based on performance level per game he should be closer to our best eleven than our worst eleven!
-
W3 D1 L3 with Senderos. Although the defeats were Arsenal when we'd been hit by squad sickness and then Chelsea and Man C. Think he made a sub appearance after that and then was injured the rest of the season.
-
Well I thought he was gash :oD
-
Well I thought he was gash :oD
Perhaps it was due to his gormless face.
-
Moreira
Richards, Senderos, Lescott, Gallacher
Djemba, Drinkwater, Holman, Bradley (both!)
David Hunt, Bowery
Manager: McNeill
I'd go with that Tim, but I'd swap the keeper for that Croation keeper we chased for ages and was absolute dog shit and who's name escapes me.
The cup defeat at home to Swansea in the Championship was the worst goalkeeping display I've ever seen, and as bad as your nominee was he did save a penalty.
-
Moreira
Richards, Senderos, Lescott, Gallacher
Djemba, Drinkwater, Holman, Bradley (both!)
David Hunt, Bowery
Manager: McNeill
I'd go with that Tim, but I'd swap the keeper for that Croation keeper we chased for ages and was absolute dog shit and who's name escapes me.
The cup defeat at home to Swansea in the Championship was the worst goalkeeping display I've ever seen, and as bad as your nominee was he did save a penalty.
Lovre Kalanic played 7 times for us according to Wikipedia.
-
Moreira
Richards, Senderos, Lescott, Gallacher
Djemba, Drinkwater, Holman, Bradley (both!)
David Hunt, Bowery
Manager: McNeill
I'd go with that Tim, but I'd swap the keeper for that Croation keeper we chased for ages and was absolute dog shit and who's name escapes me.
The cup defeat at home to Swansea in the Championship was the worst goalkeeping display I've ever seen, and as bad as your nominee was he did save a penalty.
Kalinic, he's definitely near the top of the list for shocking keepers.
I don't think it's fair to have Bowery in there, he was a very cheap punt from the lower leagues who at lest seemed to realise how lucky he was to get the chance. Most of the time a player like that would've had 1-2 season with the reserves/U21s maybe get on the bench a few times and then leave with no one being all that surprised, he's only even remembered because the rest of our squad was so poor at the time.
I'm much more willing to put players like Hogan, McCormack and Gestede on the shit list because they were signed to be first team players and were fucking terrible, 2 of them barely looked like footballers and the other was a lazy fat twat who couldn't be arsed to put in the minimum of effort for us.
-
I've said before that I think it's harsh to include any player that wasn't good enough, and instead include players that should have been good enough but couldn't be arsed often enough. Gestede was never a top flight player, we were the ones stupid enough to sign him to replace Benteke. I never remember thinking Gestede wasn't trying his best, plus the stuff he did helping the homeless gives him bonus points.
Although Gestede did turn more into McCormack after leaving us.
McCormack is the the perfect example of a player that should be listed. Was 30, rattled goals in for fun at that level, don't think he even managed another 50 games in the rest of his career once he was getting our wages.
-
I think Hogan was a bit unlucky as well. It wasn't his fault we were throwing around stupid money and neither was it his fault he didn't suit our style of play, such as it was.
-
Some perspective.
This is, I think, when we were relegated to Division 3.
I had most of these players inked on my satchel.
https://www.11v11.com/matches/aston-villa-v-sheffield-united-13-april-1970-114735/ (https://www.11v11.com/matches/aston-villa-v-sheffield-united-13-april-1970-114735/)
-
Thought Bunn was maybe the worst Keeper I've seen play for us and Baston was truly dreadful up front. Not sure either played that much for us though.
-
Enckelmen
Beye Richards Lescott Grayhab
Agathe, Darren Bradley, Ireland, Djemba Djemba
Boulding Penrice
-
Enckelmen
Beye Richards Lescott Grayhab
Agathe, Darren Bradley, Ireland, Djemba Djemba
Boulding Penrice
Enckleman is way too obvious, and had a stormer later in the season away at West Ham in a game we couldn't afford to lose.
-
Have we ever done an absolute ****** XI? DOL would be that teams manager, with Craig Gardener captain.
-
Some perspective.
This is, I think, when we were relegated to Division 3.
I had most of these players inked on my satchel.
https://www.11v11.com/matches/aston-villa-v-sheffield-united-13-april-1970-114735/ (https://www.11v11.com/matches/aston-villa-v-sheffield-united-13-april-1970-114735/)
That's pretty much the team that took us to the League Cup Final the following season, knocking out Man Utd in the semi final.
-
As far as I can remember, Moreira only played twice for us, conceded one goal and saving a penalty. He may well be a terrible goalkeeper, but I don't think we had sufficient evidence based solely on his Villa career.
-
Do you remember the pre match warm up video, where he didn't make a single save? :oD
-
I've said before that I think it's harsh to include any player that wasn't good enough, and instead include players that should have been good enough but couldn't be arsed often enough. Gestede was never a top flight player, we were the ones stupid enough to sign him to replace Benteke. I never remember thinking Gestede wasn't trying his best, plus the stuff he did helping the homeless gives him bonus points.
Although Gestede did turn more into McCormack after leaving us.
McCormack is the the perfect example of a player that should be listed. Was 30, rattled goals in for fun at that level, don't think he even managed another 50 games in the rest of his career once he was getting our wages.
So you are selecting a poor value for money XI; mine is based on ineptitude. Bowery was simply very, very bad.
-
Not vfm but how to close their best ability did they show with us. Lansbury didn't cost much but had far more ability than we saw on a regular basis. Bree wasn't very good but probably played pretty close to as well as he could. Lansbury would be a contendor for my worst XI and Bree wouldn't.
-
Bowery was a low-risk signing and should have stayed in the lower divisions.
Having said that, he played a regular part in us staying up in his first season.