Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: olaftab on May 29, 2024, 01:33:45 PM
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I notice that Unai Emery thread has been hijacked by a like/dislike discussion about past managers. I really want to see that thread stay pure and shiny just like the man himself so let's have some thoughts on here about past managers. Please keep it simple, the one that you most liked and the one you really hated.
For me:
Liked: Sir Brian Little.
Disliked: Dave O'Leary (makes my blood boil at the mention of his name.
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Most liked at the time: MON.
Most disliked since then: MON.
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Liked : Little
Disliked : Lambert
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Liked... Smith
Disliked... Oleary or Gerrard. Both are thundercunts.
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Liked: BFR - gave us our mojo back and raised profile.
Disliked: This is a very difficult one - probably Houllier.
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Liked, Little, JG, Unai
Dislike, O'leary, Gerrard, Black. Sherwood, Garde, Di Matteo
Edit: Forgot Bruce! I hated the "We go again"...
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Liked: SGT
Hated: Gerrard.
I've never wanted a manager gone more than I did that prick. Even O'Leary I could muster some sympathy for as he had to work with relatively little funds under Doug. The feeling when the news of his sacking came through was pure joy.
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Speaking of past managers, Steven Gerrard has been talking about us to the telegraph. Sorry if it's already posted.
Steven Gerrard:
I actually felt my own performance at Villa was really good. I actually felt I went to the next level in terms of what I had learnt from Rangers. I felt like I had grown. But we had a bad run of results. I have to own that & take full responsibility for that..”
“I think when top footballers are not performing at their level I am not going to pull any punches. We had players who weren’t giving what I felt they should have been giving at the time & that’s my responsibility..”
“Villa is a fantastic club. It was an incredible opportunity at the time & I have nothing bad to say. The owners gave me a fantastic chance..”
“The initial period, our form was top 8 in the Premier League & obviously the opinion of me now from a lot of people will be that I failed, if you like, but I know there was a period there where we got an awful lot of things right. We had the team doing okay..”
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Liked = Dr Jo, SGT, BFR, Sir B, JG, Deano.
Hate = Pubehead, Old Dreary, Lamberk, Mr Slippy.
Ambivalent = The rest.
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Like: Little, Gregory, Smith
Dislike: O'Leary, Gerrard, McLeish, Houllier, and Lambert
Madly, deeply in love with: Emery.
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Liked most - Saunders
Disliked most - McNeill
Honourable mentions: SGT, Barton, Sir Brian, Dean, Unai
Dishonourable mentions: DO'L, MON, Gerrard, Bruce.
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I assumed we're not including Unai in this thread?
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Like: Big Ron, Little, Gregory, Unai
Don't mind: Smith, O'Neil
Dislike: Lambert, Garde, Bruce, Sherwood, Houllier
Hate: Eric Black and miniature head stevie
Not worth much thought: Di Matteo, O'Leary
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Back onto Bruce who I didn't dislike by the way, I think his big problem apart from his very meat and potatoes football is that he was bordering on lazy. Lots of anecdotes about him slipping off to his Algarve apartment every chance he could get. And the infamous 'I don't do tactics' comment was pretty much borne out once he came up against a half decent opponent.
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I assumed we're not including Unai in this thread?
I'm afraid we've had to let him go.
United.
Colchester United.
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Loved: Brian Little. Knew he’d one day come back to manage us. Last time I thought fate played a role in Villa’s fortunes.
Hated: Billy McNeill. I was a teenager so easier to hate stuff/people than nowadays. And we were utter shite.
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Absolutely fucking love- Emery, Atkinson, Little
Like- Taylor, Gregory, Smith
Not bothered- Garde, Sherwood, Di Matteo
Dislike- Bruce, Houllier, Lambert.
Absolutely fucking despise with a passion only limited by law- Gerrard, O'Leary, O'Neil, McLeish
If there are any others I have missed, then lump them in "not bothered" as they weren't important enough to remember.
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I'm old enough to have remembered how Graham Turner was regarded but I can't really. Brain fog. I wanted him to do well because he'd arrived from God's county.
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Speaking of past managers, Steven Gerrard has been talking about us to the telegraph. Sorry if it's already posted.
Steven Gerrard:
I actually felt my own performance at Villa was really good. I actually felt I went to the next level in terms of what I had learnt from Rangers. I felt like I had grown. But we had a bad run of results. I have to own that & take full responsibility for that..”
“I think when top footballers are not performing at their level I am not going to pull any punches. We had players who weren’t giving what I felt they should have been giving at the time & that’s my responsibility..”
“Villa is a fantastic club. It was an incredible opportunity at the time & I have nothing bad to say. The owners gave me a fantastic chance..”
“The initial period, our form was top 8 in the Premier League & obviously the opinion of me now from a lot of people will be that I failed, if you like, but I know there was a period there where we got an awful lot of things right. We had the team doing okay..”
After he had a pre season and several of his own signings and dropping Mings, Luiz, Watkins and various others.
1 Bournemouth 2–0 Aston Villa Kings Park, Bournemouth
13 August 20222 Aston Villa 2–1 Everton Aston, Birmingham
20 August 20223 Crystal Palace 3–1 Aston Villa Selhurst
28 August 20224 Aston Villa 0–1 West Ham United Aston, Birmingham
31 August 20225 Arsenal 2–1 Aston Villa Holloway
3 September 20226 Aston Villa 1–1 Manchester City Aston, Birmingham
16 September 20228 Aston Villa 1–0 Southampton Aston, Birmingham
2 October 20229 Leeds United 0–0 Aston Villa Beeston, Leeds
10 October 202210 Nottingham Forest 1–1 Aston Villa West Bridgford
16 October 202211 Aston Villa 0–2 Chelsea Aston, Birmingham
20 October 202212 Fulham 3–0 Aston Villa Fulham
We beat 2 of the bottom 4, drew with another and lost to the worst Chelsea side in 30 years.
Still he can continue to be deluded if he so wishes.
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Crowe yes
Saunders yes
Barton yes
Turner no
McNeill very no
Taylor yes
Venglos shame really
Atkinson yes
Little yes
Gregory yes
Taylor never go back
O’Leary fuck off
O’Neill no
Houllier no
McLeish should have stayed away
Lambert no
Sherwood strangely ok by me
Garde no
Di Matteo no
Bruce no
Smith yes
Gerrard fuck right off
Having done that run through I think the ones I like understand what a privilege they have. The ones I hate think they are doing us a favour. The rest just seemed to think it was a job and they’d see what happened.
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Heroes: Saunders, Barton, Sir Graham, Big Ron, Brian Little, Smith.
Ands: Dr Jo, Gregory, Turner, Houlier, MON, Garde, Scottish Manager, Di Matteo, Sherwood.
Villains: Billy Mac, DOL, Gerrard.
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Its like i was with ex girlfriends
Since SUE i cannot even remember any that were there before ;D
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Heroes: Saunders, Barton, Sir Graham, Big Ron, Brian Little, Smith.
Ands: Dr Jo, Gregory, Turner, Houlier, MON, Garde, Scottish Manager, Di Matteo, Sherwood.
Villains: Billy Mac, DOL, Gerrard.
Pretty much agree with this, though as someone who lived further away and couldn't get to matches, I quite liked Gregory.
You missed Bruce off the list.
In the 'Ands' group, I think there is a mix of incompetence, arrogance and poor fits for the club. The blokes in the Villains list have, at least, two out of the three.
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Most Loved
"Villa have amazing support. If you hung 11 Villa shirts on a washing line five thousand fans would turn up to watch them!"..,The Doc. (win %age 28.26)
Most Hated
"There is a genuine bunch of fans and then there is a fickle mob who get on your back very quickly,"...O'Leary. (win %age 35.88)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Aston_Villa_F.C._managers
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If managers are successful, then generally people are going to love them. Similarly if they fail, the converse generally applies.
I thought these ranged from poor to bad, but I didn't find them detestable people:
Garde, Turner, McNeill, Venglos, McLeish
I thought these were good and likeable or personable:
Taylor, Atkinson Little, Smith
I didn't really warm to these, whatever the verdict:
O'Leary, Houllier, Lambert
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Heroes: Saunders, Barton, Sir Graham, Big Ron, Brian Little, Smith.
Ands: Dr Jo, Gregory, Turner, Houlier, MON, Garde, Scottish Manager, Di Matteo, Sherwood.
Villains: Billy Mac, DOL, Gerrard.
Pretty much agree with this, though as someone who lived further away and couldn't get to matches, I quite liked Gregory.
You missed Bruce off the list.
In the 'Ands' group, I think there is a mix of incompetence, arrogance and poor fits for the club. The blokes in the Villains list have, at least, two out of the three.
Gregory in no way deserves to be grouped along with Houllier. I'd have the latter firmly in the Villains camp.
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From the ones in my supporting lifetime:
Total C-words: Gerrard, O'Leary
Clueless twat: Sherwood
Really rather bad: McLeish, Lambert, Garde, SGT Mk II, Houlier, Di Matteo, Bruce
Nearly, but not quite: O'Neill, Gregory
A nice idea, but no: Dr Jo
Some great football but I cannot forgive the choice of language: Atkinson
Heroes: SGT, Little, Smith
Divine: Emery
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From the ones in my supporting lifetime:
Total C-words: Gerrard, O'Leary
Clueless twat: Sherwood
Really rather bad: McLeish, Lambert, Garde, SGT Mk II, Houlier, Di Matteo, Bruce
Nearly, but not quite: O'Neill, Gregory
A nice idea, but no: Dr Jo
Some great football but I cannot forgive the choice of language: Atkinson
Heroes: SGT, Little, Smith
Divine: Emery
That's where I am overall.
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I assumed we're not including Unai in this thread?
Yes, and I hope he surpasses Sir Ron's achievement and touches those of our most successful Manager, I mean The Secretary.
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From the ones in my supporting lifetime:
Total C-words: Gerrard, O'Leary
Clueless twat: Sherwood
Really rather bad: McLeish, Lambert, Garde, SGT Mk II, Houlier, Di Matteo, Bruce
Nearly, but not quite: O'Neill, Gregory
A nice idea, but no: Dr Jo
Some great football but I cannot forgive the choice of language: Atkinson
Heroes: SGT, Little, Smith
Divine: Emery
Agree with 99% of that.
I liked McLeish, nice bloke - I wonder if he would have been better than Bruce if he had joined us at at that time instead?
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Since SGT1;
Like a lot - SGT, Big Ron, Little, Smith, Unai.
Like - Gregory, O Neill.
Neither here nor there - Venglos, McLeish, Bruce.
Not keen - Houllier, Lambert, Sherwood, De Matteo, Gerrard.
Can’t stand - O Leary, Garde.
That isn’t completely to do with how successful they were although it is partly, just generally what I thought of them overall, different circumstances have an effect also. I think Unai could end up being out on his own as he’s the most talented of the lot, quite comfortably.
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Heroes: Saunders, Barton, Sir Graham, Big Ron, Brian Little, Smith.
Ands: Dr Jo, Gregory, Turner, Houlier, MON, Garde, Scottish Manager, Di Matteo, Sherwood.
Villains: Billy Mac, DOL, Gerrard.
Pretty much agree with this, though as someone who lived further away and couldn't get to matches, I quite liked Gregory.
You missed Bruce off the list.
In the 'Ands' group, I think there is a mix of incompetence, arrogance and poor fits for the club. The blokes in the Villains list have, at least, two out of the three.
Bruce fits firmly into the Ands, who, generally, tried to a certain degree but ultimately came up short. Add Scottish Manager Ii to that list as well. I forgot him.
The latter 3 were just arseholes who deliberately put their interests ahead of the club. The Tories if you like where the Ands are Labour/Liberal Dem and the heroes cannot be compared to any political party without firmly insulting their impeccable character.
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Saunders should be untouchable, but the manner of his leaving and where he pitched up next still rankles.
SGT Mk I; BFR; Sir Brian and Sir Dean all left the club in a far better place than they found it. (So did MON but decided to torch his reputation by flouncing out.)
I will always think fondly about Vic Crowe, Tony Barton and John Gregory. Dr Jo and SGT Mk II - right man, wrong time and I'm particularly sad how it ended for the latter. Graham Turner was the wrong man at the wrong time, but I think he was a decent bloke and was happy for him that he got a degree of success with Wolves.
The three whose image I metaphorically have pinned to my dartboard are McNeill, O'Leary and Gerrard. Lambert a close fourth.
(I've deliberately not included SUE as tenures should only be judged once they're over.)
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Docherty - great publicist; shame we didn't do better.
Crowe yes
Saunders very yes
Barton yes
Turner no
McNeill very no
Taylor very yes
Venglos shame really
Atkinson yes
Little yes
Gregory yes
Taylor never go back
O’Leary fuck off
O’Neill yes, on appointment; no eventually
Houllier yes, on appointment; no eventually
McLeish should have stayed away
Lambert yes, on appointment; no eventually
Sherwood strangely no
Garde no; strange choice really
Black - why; just, why?!!
Di Matteo no
Bruce very no
Smith yes
Gerrard fuck right off
Having done that run through I think the ones I like understand what a privilege they have. The ones I hate think they are doing us a favour. The rest just seemed to think it was a job and they’d see what happened.
Pretty much summed up for me, although I've added a couple of comments in italics. And, I agree about the privilege thinking.
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Going back to the start of my Villa supporting days.
Saunders - Love
Barton - Love
Turner - Meh
McNeil - Hate
Taylor Mk I - Love
Venglos - Meh
Atkinson - Love
Little - Love
Gregory - Meh
Taylor Mk II - Meh
O'Leary - War of the Roses level hate
O'Neil - Hate for the damage he did on leaving
Houllier - Meh
McLeish - Hate for putting my son off watching the Villa with me.
Lambert - Meh
Sherwood - Hate (or maybe it's Tom "shortlist of one" Fox)
Garde - Meh
Black - Hate
De Mateo - Meh
Bruce - Meh
Smith - Love (especially for getting my son back into watching us again.)
Gerrard - Hate
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From the ones in my supporting lifetime:
Total C-words: Gerrard, O'Leary
Clueless twat: Sherwood
Really rather bad: McLeish, Lambert, Garde, SGT Mk II, Houlier, Di Matteo, Bruce
Nearly, but not quite: O'Neill, Gregory
A nice idea, but no: Dr Jo
Some great football but I cannot forgive the choice of language: Atkinson
Heroes: SGT, Little, Smith
Divine: Emery
Pretty much my thoughts exactly.
My only caveat would be around Gerrard and Lambert.
Gerrard, I detested with every fibre of my being from the second we were linked with him.
Lambert had a terrible hand dealt to him. But he was still useless and I vividly remember my celebrations when he was sacked.
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Saunders LOVE
Barton LOVE
Turner INDIFFERENT
McNeill INDIFFERENT
Taylor LOVE
Venglos LIKE
Atkinson LOVE
Little LOVE
Gregory LOVE
Taylor LOVE
O’Leary HATE
O’Neill DISLIKE
Houllier LIKE
McLeish LIKE
Lambert DISLIKE
Sherwood LIKE
Garde INDIFFERENT
Di Matteo DISLIKE
Bruce LIKE
Smith LOVE
Gerrard HATE
Emery LOVE
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Hate is a strong word but Gerrard really agitates me . Just as angry with Purslow for ever giving him the job. Sherwood i think took the piss a bit. O'Leary annoyed me with his utter arrogance. MON destroyed all goodwill with the way he left and the sabotage. Houllier came in and acted like a consultant in my mind , purveying over some ruins that were a bit beneath him. Most of the other managers worked hard regardless of results. What Emery has done is off the scale and we've not had a manager of this calibre in the modern football era (Prem League) .
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There were several who were just massively out of their depth such as Turner, McLeish, Lambert, Garde and Di Matteo. I can't say I was disappointed to see any of them leave.
Some had monumental egos - Gerrard, O'Leary and O'Neill even Bruce - who all to a greater or lesser extent seemed to think they were doing us a favour just by being Villa manager. Them leaving was a relief although O'Neill deliberately left us in the shit.
Some were in the the unfortunate position of the game moving on - BFR and SGT II - as well as being hamstrung by Doug. John Gregory probably falls into this category as well. My ire for them going was aimed squarely at the chairman.
One - McNeill - just wasn't interested. And should never have been appointed.
Ron Saunders, Tony Barton, SGT I, Brian Little and Dean Smith were the ones I didn’t want to see leave at any point of their tenure. Unai Emery falls into this category.
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O'Neill was the only who one who consciously tried to inflict the maximum amount of harm possible. He was an irritating twat which you could overlook when things were going well, but he was the start of everything going tits up and it took us years to recover.
Houllier gave the impression that he didn't want to be at Villa park at all, and he should have stayed in semi-retirement. His mawkish longing for Liverpool really stuck in the craw as well.
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I forgot Houllier completely. He would probably into the ego category.
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O'Neill was the only who one who consciously tried to inflict the maximum amount of harm possible. He was an irritating twat which you could overlook when things were going well, but he was the start of everything going tits up and it took us years to recover.
Houllier gave the impression that he didn't want to be at Villa park at all, and he should have stayed in semi-retirement. His mawkish longing for Liverpool really stuck in the craw as well.
That night we went back to Anfield with Houllier and his antics , we lost 0-3 makes my skin crawl.
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Graham Turner - Meh.
Billy McNeill - Meh.
Graham Taylor - Love.
Dr Josef Venglos - Meh.
Ron Atkinson - Love.
Brian Little - Love.
John Gregory - Positive.
David O'Leary - fuck off, then fuck off again, then when you get back here, fuck off again.
Martin O'Neill - (with the benefit of hindsight) twat.
Gérard Houiller - No opinion. Ran out of good health.
Alex McLeish - No opinion.
Paul Lambert - But he learned loads in Germany. No opinion.
Tim Sherwood - Likeable, but meh.
Remi Garde - Did that really happen?
Roberto Di Matteo - What were we thinking?
Steve Bruce - Like, but he was deluded. Sacked at the right time.
Dean Smith - Love (signed eight of our current squad).
Steven Gerrard - see O'Leary. Did we really bounce Smith for this?
Unai Emery - Gure Erregea.
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Lambert's up there with O'Leary for me. Absolute fucking bellend, in charge of the most soul destroyingly awful team I've ever had the misfortune to follow.
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Lambert's up there with O'Leary for me. Absolute fucking bellend, in charge of the most soul destroyingly awful team I've ever had the misfortune to follow.
Lambert get's away with it for me because it was obvious by then that Lerner had given up.
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Lambert's up there with O'Leary for me. Absolute fucking bellend, in charge of the most soul destroyingly awful team I've ever had the misfortune to follow.
Lambert get's away with it for me because it was obvious by then that Lerner had given up.
I accept it's a matter of opinion but my retort is he's a fucking twat and I wouldn't piss on him if he was on fire
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Lambert's up there with O'Leary for me. Absolute fucking bellend, in charge of the most soul destroyingly awful team I've ever had the misfortune to follow.
Lambert get's away with it for me because it was obvious by then that Lerner had given up.
I accept it's a matter of opinion but my retort is he's a fucking twat and I wouldn't piss on him if he was on fire
That's fair enough if that's how you feel. For me there are others at the front of the queue for firebombing and witholding of liquid dousing supplies.
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Billy fucking McNeill miles at the front of the queue.
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I have a soft spot for The Doc and Vic Crowe as they were my first managers
All in all I have say Ron Saunders was my favourite. There have been many that come close, Emery and Smith the most recent but I absolutely loved watching Villa under Ron.
We’ve had our fair share of shockers over the years but Bruce tops them all. His brand of football was left behind in the 80’s and he failed in a sub-standard league. One or two others would be worthy of a mention
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Billy fucking McNeill miles at the front of the queue.
He won his first game , I was there . After that it went downhill fast.
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I’m surprised there is less hate for O’Neill, the man who wasted our best chance in decades and flounced off at a time deliberately intended to fuck us over. He had shedloads of cash and spent most of it on utter shite.
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From the ones in my supporting lifetime:
Total C-words: Gerrard, O'Leary
Clueless twat: Sherwood
Really rather bad: McLeish, Lambert, Garde, SGT Mk II, Houlier, Di Matteo, Bruce
Nearly, but not quite: O'Neill, Gregory
A nice idea, but no: Dr Jo
Some great football but I cannot forgive the choice of language: Atkinson
Heroes: SGT, Little, Smith
Divine: Emery
Pretty much my thoughts exactly.
My only caveat would be around Gerrard and Lambert.
Gerrard, I detested with every fibre of my being from the second we were linked with him.
Lambert had a terrible hand dealt to him. But he was still useless and I vividly remember my celebrations when he was sacked.
We absolutely destroyed Paul Lambert, back to back promotions at Norwich (like McKenna now), remember that game at Norwich under McLeish where the Villa fans were chanting for him. Joining us after Lerner had already pulled the plug on the finance was a terrible career decision. His reign was painful, we were firmly circling the relegation drain throughout. That last night in Hull in the rain was as grim as it gets.
Gerrard was the worst really, no redeeming feature.
Houllier's reign was a disaster too, that was far from a bad team he inherited plus Lerner giving him crazy cash to sign Bent. If he gave that money to MON the previous summer we would have stayed competitive.
The most unlucky was McLeish. Should never have got the gig and the style of football was awful. But we were all set for a solid midtable finish until an unbelievable run of injuries/illness to key players.
Emery is by far the best we have had since the BFR days.
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I’m surprised there is less hate for O’Neill, the man who wasted our best chance in decades and flounced off at a time deliberately intended to fuck us over. He had shedloads of cash and spent most of it on utter shite.
It's almost summer, we're in the Champions League, we love all our players, our manager, loads of football to relax to over the next few weeks, life is good and moves on, most have vented on their feelings regarding the pubeheaded chancing, self loving, twat. Those that haven't will get there eventually.
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Saunders Love
Barton Love
Turner Wasn’t keen
McNeill Muppet
Taylor Love
Venglos Likeable, too early for an English side
Atkinson Love
Little Love
Gregory Love
Taylor Mistake bringing him back
O’Leary ‘We’re not fickle, We don’t like you’
O’Neill More positive than negative
Houllier Nice bloke
McLeish Dislike but he didn’t have a chance, monumentally stupid appointment.
Lambert Came across like an arsehole but did a good job keeping us up with the players he had.
Sherwood Screw loose, certainly entertaining.
Garde Clueless
Di Matteo Clueless
Bruce Nice bloke, did okay steadying the ship
Smith Love
Gerrard Dislikeable, clueless, arrogant
Emery Best thing to happen to us in the last 20 years.
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LEGENDS: Saunders, Barton, Emery
RESPECTED: Taylor, Atkinson, Little, Smith
DECENT: Gregory, O'Neill
MEH:Venglos, O'Leary, Houllier, Sherwood, Bruce
BAD: Turner, Lambert, Gerrard
UGLY: McNeill, McLeish, Garde, DiMatteo
Special dishonourable mention for Eric Black, who could at least have tried to do something but didn't.
Whilst the relegation season was dismal, the worst sustained period I've ever felt as a Villa fan was that Christmas/New Year (2012/13) period under Lambert, where we lost 8-0 to Chelsea, got walloped by nearly every one we played, and then got knocked out of a League Cup semi final against Bradford, and then out of the FA Cup by Millwall.
Sherwood is perhaps generously high because his brief spell in keeping us up and getting us to an FA Cup Final was the only spark of light in that entire post MON/pre Smith era. I think he was also a bit unlucky in a few of the games that cost him his job in the following season.
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I have a soft spot for The Doc and Vic Crowe as they were my first managers
All in all I have say Ron Saunders was my favourite. There have been many that come close, Emery and Smith the most recent but I absolutely loved watching Villa under Ron.
We’ve had our fair share of shockers over the years but Bruce tops them all. His brand of football was left behind in the 80’s and he failed in a sub-standard league. One or two others would be worthy of a mention
I agree.
Vic Crowe is often forgotten, but we played some great football when was in charge.
Ron Saunders was a wonderment.
Unai is out of this world.
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In my supporting lifetime/memory.
Saunders: my first ever game was the one after he resigned, a 1-4 loss at man u, not that i knew much about it at 8 years old.
Barton: ditto, too young.
Turner: even as a teenager I was meh and so it proved, but seemed a nice enough chap, all Dougs doing.
Mcneil: i was excited for a few games, then it was shit and read stuff since that he really didnt want to be there.
SGT: Absolute hero, to take us from a newly relegated team that had been in decline to runners up in Div 1 in 3 years, unbelievable.
Venglos: Sigh, after the lord mayors show.
BFR: so excited when he came, 92-93 one of my favourite seasons, pure razzmatazz. Like SE said, I struggle to square he comments later and can’t forget those.
Little: shone really brightly for not long enough. 95-96 was brilliant though.
Gregory: first half bolshy and brilliant. Second half lost his nerve. Can’t really forget the ultra negative tactics in a very winnable cup final.
O’Leary: Really poor manager who didnt want to be at Villa.
O’Neil: hard one as was genuinely excited when he signed. Felt a big statement in a new era when we could achieve stuff, and the first two years reflected this. Ultimately ran out of steam and ideas and then shafted us. Compare him to the driven but humble Emery now, really highlights his flaws.
Houllier: A more talented O’Leary for me. Thought he was better than us. Whimsically touching the ‘this is anfield’ sign when we played them, oh do feck off.
McLeish: took them lot down and we then appointed him and he nearly did the same with us. Nice man but uninspired appointment.
Lambert. Given a club to manage in decline and he managed that decline. We aged him and he aged us. Dour, dreadful times, with Benteke being the only light.
Sherwood: his bombast actually felt like light relief compared to Lambert, but God he was just a bit of a gobshite and out of his depth.
Garde: wrong man for a sinking ship.
De Matteo: wrong man for a sunk ship.
Bruce: he did stabilise us for a couple of years and we won a lot of games, but Villa, like Newcastle was a job too big for him. Should of gone after the 2018 play off final and made a real hash if it thereafter. Saving grace is that we didn’t get promoted with him in charge.
Smith: loved him for a while. Felt like the best managerial appointment we’d made since O’Neil 12 years earlier. The 10 game run, promotion, a cup final, just about staying up, some great football, beating Liverpool 7-2. It was a rollercoaster. Villas own chicken and egg scenario, did Grealish make him or visa versa, a bit of both I feel. Sadly it was time when he went.
Gerrard: a more bombastic, twatish, arrogant version of O’Leary and Houllier. What a disaster of a football manager.
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I’m surprised there is less hate for O’Neill, the man who wasted our best chance in decades and flounced off at a time deliberately intended to fuck us over. He had shedloads of cash and spent most of it on utter shite.
It's almost summer, we're in the Champions League, we love all our players, our manager, loads of football to relax to over the next few weeks, life is good and moves on, most have vented on their feelings regarding the pubeheaded chancing, self loving, twat. Those that haven't will get there eventually.
Lots of people on this thread have him as decent, more good than bad etc. I thought he’d probably be the most hated.
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I’m surprised there is less hate for O’Neill, the man who wasted our best chance in decades and flounced off at a time deliberately intended to fuck us over. He had shedloads of cash and spent most of it on utter shite.
It's almost summer, we're in the Champions League, we love all our players, our manager, loads of football to relax to over the next few weeks, life is good and moves on, most have vented on their feelings regarding the pubeheaded chancing, self loving, twat. Those that haven't will get there eventually.
Lots of people on this thread have him as decent, more good than bad etc. I thought he’d probably be the most hated.
Well he had a modicum of success before acting like a total cnut.
I put him with DOL and Gerard as the biggest pricks to manage us although StevieMe was the worst of the 3 in terms of managerial ability and even more deluded than anyone to have managed us
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I’m surprised there is less hate for O’Neill, the man who wasted our best chance in decades and flounced off at a time deliberately intended to fuck us over. He had shedloads of cash and spent most of it on utter shite.
It's almost summer, we're in the Champions League, we love all our players, our manager, loads of football to relax to over the next few weeks, life is good and moves on, most have vented on their feelings regarding the pubeheaded chancing, self loving, twat. Those that haven't will get there eventually.
Lots of people on this thread have him as decent, more good than bad etc. I thought he’d probably be the most hated.
He was a useless ****** and unprofessional charlatan who pissed a quarter of a billion quid up the wall and it’s all the more galling as I was all in on the project. The stuff that has come out from various ex players over the last few months has made my blood boil. We could at a bare minimum have been semi competitive in this league for the last 15 years if we’d appointed a half decent manager at that time but we got Mr Thought he was the new Clough and have had a decade of utter shite to show for it. He can fuck off, and when he gets to there he can fuck odd again the big pubeheaded wanker. God I’d forgotten how much I actually fucking hate him, what a total ****** who seems to get a pass from all his media lickspittles. ******.
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I’m surprised there is less hate for O’Neill, the man who wasted our best chance in decades and flounced off at a time deliberately intended to fuck us over. He had shedloads of cash and spent most of it on utter shite.
It's almost summer, we're in the Champions League, we love all our players, our manager, loads of football to relax to over the next few weeks, life is good and moves on, most have vented on their feelings regarding the pubeheaded chancing, self loving, twat. Those that haven't will get there eventually.
Lots of people on this thread have him as decent, more good than bad etc. I thought he’d probably be the most hated.
He was a useless ****** and unprofessional charlatan who pissed a quarter of a billion quid up the wall and it’s all the more galling as I was all in on the project. The stuff that has come out from various ex players over the last few months has made my blood boil. We could at a bare minimum have been semi competitive in this league for the last 15 years if we’d appointed a half decent manager at that time but we got Mr Thought he was the new Clough and have had a decade of utter shite to show for it. He can fuck off, and when he gets to there he can fuck odd again the big pubeheaded wanker. God I’d forgotten how much I actually fucking hate him, what a total ****** who seems to get a pass from all his media lickspittles. ******.
This pretty much sums up my feelings as well.
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Without wanting to rake over too many coals, MON did elevate us to a position where we were playing in Europe, challenging for silverware in cups, challenging for CL football and attracting good players at the top of their game (Milner, Young, Delph). There were some decent games in there too.
It wasn't all bad.
Don't hate him, don't love him either, in the middle for me.
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From the ones in my supporting lifetime:
Total C-words: Gerrard, O'Leary
Clueless twat: Sherwood
Really rather bad: McLeish, Lambert, Garde, SGT Mk II, Houlier, Di Matteo, Bruce
Nearly, but not quite: O'Neill, Gregory
A nice idea, but no: Dr Jo
Some great football but I cannot forgive the choice of language: Atkinson
Heroes: SGT, Little, Smith
Divine: Emery
Pretty much my thoughts exactly.
My only caveat would be around Gerrard and Lambert.
Gerrard, I detested with every fibre of my being from the second we were linked with him.
Lambert had a terrible hand dealt to him. But he was still useless and I vividly remember my celebrations when he was sacked.
We absolutely destroyed Paul Lambert, back to back promotions at Norwich (like McKenna now), remember that game at Norwich under McLeish where the Villa fans were chanting for him.
Emery is by far the best we have had since the BFR days.
At the time i found that complete cringe . It totally backfired.
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Garde- no idea why he is vilified he had absolutely no chance.
O,Neil - absolute charlatan, it was all about hm and his ego.
Bruce, was just an idiot , but got by on the myth that he somehow knew what he was doing.
Lambert - “I thought we were excellent “ should have been taken round the back of the barn and shot.
Gerrard- another O,Neil
Houlier than thou- the consultant, never got us and we never got him.
DOL- twat
Heroes
Smith
BFR-
Little
Saunders
Emery
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Without wanting to rake over too many coals, MON did elevate us to a position where we were playing in Europe, challenging for silverware in cups, challenging for CL football and attracting good players at the top of their game (Milner, Young, Delph). There were some decent games in there too.
It wasn't all bad.
Don't hate him, don't love him either, in the middle for me.
But ultimately failed, left us in the most destructive way possible having emptied the bank account.
His legacy endured for years, from which we have only recently recovered.
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Liked most Saunders
Disliked most Gerrard
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Gerrard is the only manager I've disliked more than David O'Leary. Gave him the benefit of the doubt for the first part-season, but it was clear he was less than useless by the first game of his first full season. Absolute charlatan and highly dislikeable individual.
Favourite: between the Brian Little manager/John Gregory assistant manager combo and Deano. I'd just about pick the former, but Deano ran them very very close.
Blotted copybooks: BFR was probably the best manager, but whilst I don't believe him to be a racist, his comment was atrocious and unforgivable. Still like him, mind, but I couldn't label him in that group following it.
Also Graham Taylor. It's hard because he's unable to defend himself, but the Barry Bennell stuff happened under his watch, he was told about it, and whilst his reported reaction was in some ways understandable, I don't think I could support someone who didn't stand up for (essentially) a child in such a situation.
Shit managers I've liked as people:
Steve Bruce - come across as a good bloke
Dr Jo - same
Big Eck - seems like a good sort
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Garde, Lambert and to an extent McLeish fall into a different category for me, namely 'Shit, but I just feel a bit sorry for them.'
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Just reaIised I missed Josef Venglos as well. I liked him but it was probably a good appointment at the wrong time. 6 years later Wenger got the Arsenal job and revolutionised coaching in England which is what Venglos could have done if the game was ready in 1990. I blame Doug for pretty much everything wrong at Villa while he was chairman but giving Dr Jo the job could have been visionary - add your own cliché about stopped clicks and right tines here though.
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Without wanting to rake over too many coals, MON did elevate us to a position where we were playing in Europe, challenging for silverware in cups, challenging for CL football and attracting good players at the top of their game (Milner, Young, Delph). There were some decent games in there too.
It wasn't all bad.
Don't hate him, don't love him either, in the middle for me.
Exactly where I am, got us regularly in the top 6 and had some cracking games with him in charge regardless of the crap way it all ended.
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Love
Saunders
BFR
Barton
Little
Smith
SGT
Hate
O’Dreary
Pube head
Gerrard
Lamberk
McLeish
Indifference
Sherwood
Gregory
Houllier
Dr Jo
Garde doesn’t even register on my give a shit-ometer.
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Garde was that inconsequential one night stand when you were at a low ebb that's best left buried deep in your own mind.
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Garde was that inconsequential one night stand when you were at a low ebb that's best left buried deep in your own mind.
Just read up on him, sacked by a MLS team in 2019, not managed since.
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Liked most - Saunders
Disliked most - McNeill
Honourable mentions: SGT, Barton, Sir Brian, Dean, Unai
Dishonourable mentions: DO'L, MON, Gerrard, Bruce.
This!
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Garde was that inconsequential one night stand when you were at a low ebb that's best left buried deep in your own mind.
Just read up on him, sacked by a MLS team in 2019, not managed since.
Villa Park is a managerial graveyard! It finished many upward trending careers. Sherwood never managed again bar twatting out cliches on SSN every other week. Gerrard couldn't even get a championship gig. RDM?
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Without wanting to rake over too many coals, MON did elevate us to a position where we were playing in Europe, challenging for silverware in cups, challenging for CL football and attracting good players at the top of their game (Milner, Young, Delph). There were some decent games in there too.
It wasn't all bad.
Don't hate him, don't love him either, in the middle for me.
Exactly where I am, got us regularly in the top 6 and had some cracking games with him in charge regardless of the crap way it all ended.
He got blamed for far too much for years after. Pulis left Palace in similar circumstances but they didn't collapse. Handing him free reign over the budget was where Lerner went wrong and he was ultimately accountable for the financial stability of the club. MON I think would have kept the show on the road for another season anyway if given the budget Houllier got. His career petered out quickly after us too, flopping at Sunderland, so maybe we got some of the best out of him.
MON is an ego maniac and prickly beyond belief to any hint of criticism. His antics at the end of his gig with Ireland were pathetic. But his results with us were pretty solid in the main and the squad he left us was far superior to the one he inherited.
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MON I think would have kept the show on the road for another season anyway if given the budget Houllier got.
I disagree with this. I have more confidence that Houllier would have identified what the squad needed, and acted decisively to improve it. After all, he signed Bent in his first transfer window. O’Neill would probably have signed another four centre halves to play across the back given the opportunity.
… his results with us were pretty solid in the main and the squad he left us was far superior to the one he inherited.
I disagree with this. Whilst the squad was better than the one O’Neill inherited, it should have been a lot better for the money he spent, and still wasn’t balanced.
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He left a squad that had a few gems and a load of overpriced and overpaid milk bottle players.
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McNeil was comically bad. It’s not that I disliked him. It’s just that his stint was so appalling those of a certain age wouldn’t appreciate it unless you were there to witness it. He started off with two successive 2-0 home wins v Newcastle and Leicester if memory serves and all seemed bright then we went on a monumentally terrible run after that.
The players who contained bright lights such as Keown and Paul Elliot took the piss out of him because in training when they got something right he would shout out ‘bingo’. Hence the nickname Billy McBingo. The S*n also named him Billy McBungle for taking us and Citeh down in the same season.
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There is a podcast under the Kosh? where James Collins discusses him
and Richard Dunn joining Villa just before the blues game . They met the night before
and i think the consensus was with O’neil was to chuck them in for all set pieces. , you are big lumps you will do some damage
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MON had his last shot with us, really rather a lot of money, and it was the last time that kind of 'old school' (read: lazy bloke bullshit) management style worked or would ever work. We squandered our last chance at getting to the top table on a hoof-and-run merchant, going backwards while everyone else was modernising. In a league increasingly of chic bistros, we stayed a Toby Carvery.
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MON had his last shot with us, really rather a lot of money, and it was the last time that kind of 'old school' (read: lazy bloke bullshit) management style worked or would ever work. We squandered our last chance at getting to the top table on a hoof-and-run merchant, going backwards while everyone else was modernising. In a league increasingly of chic bistros, we stayed a Toby Carvery.
Can he play right-back etc.
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Loved - Taylor, BFR, Little, Gregory, Smith, Emery
Respected - O Neill, Bruce, O'Leary (1st year and half)
Meh - McLeish, Lambert, Gerrard
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From memory, the one manager I couldnt really warm to at the time other than Gerrard was Houiller. I'm not sure why because you could see what he was trying to do and I think and I stand correct, he had awful issues with injuries. Lambert stayed far too long, O'Leary towards the end seemed to think he was too good for us and Mcleish was just a really poor choice albeit a seemingly decent bloke.
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MON I think would have kept the show on the road for another season anyway if given the budget Houllier got.
I disagree with this. I have more confidence that Houllier would have identified what the squad needed, and acted decisively to improve it. After all, he signed Bent in his first transfer window. O’Neill would probably have signed another four centre halves to play across the back given the opportunity.
… his results with us were pretty solid in the main and the squad he left us was far superior to the one he inherited.
I disagree with this. Whilst the squad was better than the one O’Neill inherited, it should have been a lot better for the money he spent, and still wasn’t balanced.
People at the time suggested Houllier for some sort of director of football position, but perhaps overlook the fact that his later signings at Liverpool were nearly all absolutely dreadful. It's not like Darren Bent was a great signing really. He cost an awful lot of money for the time, and while he scored a few goals in that first half a season, he didn't add a lot else in terms of performance and was injured a fair amount. I guess most of us on here would have pointed at somebody banging them in for Sunderland, but in reality it all went a bit 'Danny Ings'.
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In fairness to Bent he was 18 in 38 before Wigan. After that he was never the same, another Villa player done by injury. Although as said apart from scoring goals he didn't offer much else so the game was leaving players like him behind at the top level, unless a freak like Haaland.
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Garde was that inconsequential one night stand when you were at a low ebb that's best left buried deep in your own mind.
Just read up on him, sacked by a MLS team in 2019, not managed since.
Villa Park is a managerial graveyard! It finished many upward trending careers. Sherwood never managed again bar twatting out cliches on SSN every other week. Gerrard couldn't even get a championship gig. RDM?
Didn't Sherwood manage Swindon after us .
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Love unconditionally: Saunders, Taylor, Emery
Really Like: Little, Barton, Smith
Really like but with caveats: BFR, Gregory
Quite like: O’Neill
Meh: Turner, Lambert, Di Matteo
Seemed alright people but shit managers: McLeish, Garde, Venglos
Disliked them at Villa but had a lot of respect for what they’d done before they got here: Houllier, Gerrard
Got on my nerves: McNeill, Bruce, Sherwood
Disliked a lot: O’Leary, Black
No hate as yet. Hope it stays that way.
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Worst manager for me was Bruce
Hated every single minute of his tenure knew it was never going to work The bloke was useless
He had the best and most expensive squad in the championship and managed to finish 13
Honestly I’d back myself to have done better
The following season when we should’ve pissed the league by 10 clear points we get to the play-off final and as usual play Bruceball and deservedly lose
Football was rubbish. The tactics were rubbish. Bruce was rubbish
His tactics were Neanderthal, he got a few results because we in general we had better players than anybody else, but he still managed to turn that squad into a total box standard mid table championship team, now that he was the king of
He never started anything he never steadied any ship, he never stopped any rot He just continued it in the most boring fashion imaginable, supporting Villa during his time was absolutely dire
The day he left was a great day for me and Villa and we never looked back
Everywhere he’s gone since he’s stunk the place out
He was absolutely rubbish
( he was a very good player mind but it don’t count because it wasn’t for us)
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But apart from that he was okay?
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Worst manager for me was Bruce
Hated every single minute of his tenure knew it was never going to work The bloke was useless
He had the best and most expensive squad in the championship and managed to finish 13
Honestly I’d back myself to have done better
The following season when we should’ve pissed the league by 10 clear points we get to the play-off final and as usual play Bruceball and deservedly lose
Football was rubbish. The tactics were rubbish. Bruce was rubbish
His tactics were Neanderthal, he got a few results because we in general we had better players than anybody else, but he still managed to turn that squad into a total box standard mid table championship team, now that he was the king of
He never started anything he never steadied any ship, he never stopped any rot He just continued it in the most boring fashion imaginable, supporting Villa during his time was absolutely dire
The day he left was a great day for me and Villa and we never looked back
Everywhere he’s gone since he’s stunk the place out
He was absolutely rubbish
( he was a very good player mind but it don’t count because it wasn’t for us)
Worse than Gerrard ? Yeah ok what a load of B******s.
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Worst manager for me was Bruce
Hated every single minute of his tenure knew it was never going to work The bloke was useless
He had the best and most expensive squad in the championship and managed to finish 13
Honestly I’d back myself to have done better
The following season when we should’ve pissed the league by 10 clear points we get to the play-off final and as usual play Bruceball and deservedly lose
Football was rubbish. The tactics were rubbish. Bruce was rubbish
His tactics were Neanderthal, he got a few results because we in general we had better players than anybody else, but he still managed to turn that squad into a total box standard mid table championship team, now that he was the king of
He never started anything he never steadied any ship, he never stopped any rot He just continued it in the most boring fashion imaginable, supporting Villa during his time was absolutely dire
The day he left was a great day for me and Villa and we never looked back
Everywhere he’s gone since he’s stunk the place out
He was absolutely rubbish
( he was a very good player mind but it don’t count because it wasn’t for us)
Worse than Gerrard ? Yeah ok what a load of B******s.
By a distance
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He did stop the rot, well he stopped us losing. We'd have gone all the way down if it had carried on seeing as we only picked up 16 points the season before. He should have done a lot better than he did with the resources he had but give me him over 'look me in the eye' Gerrard anyday.
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I agree with every word of John's post. We've had plenty of bad managers but Bruce gets far more credit than he deserved by being average (and fucking boring) after taking us over at our lowest point since the 60s. That Bruce has had the jobs he's been given and has somehow held on to a reputation that he's anything other than a lazy and useless sack of shit who couldn't be replaced by any of millions of football manager players is scary.
I never liked or wanted him but when he gave it the big un after the rotherham game just before he was sacked summed the prick up perfectly, fans were angry after 6 games without a win and he couldn't wait to moan about how difficult it was and how unfair it was for fans to expect him to do his fucking job.
I honestly believe the cabbage and everything it represented is the single most important event in turning us into what we are now.
As for comparisons with Gerrard I think they were both shit but at least with Gerrard we didn't have a whole bunch of evidence showing us how poor he was and how badly he managed his squads when we decided he was 'exactly what we needed'. Gerrard, even if people won't admit it, was a roll of the dice to see if his name and reputation could make up for his inexperience, Bruce was meant to be a sure thing.
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Bruce relied on the ability of our superior players in a poor league to pull off some magic far too often. Like Gregory, MON, Gerrard, to name a few others, he lacked the ability to coach them to be better as both individuals and as a tactically intelligent team.
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I agree with every word of Paul e’s post
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Bruce relied on the ability of our superior players in a poor league to pull off some magic far too often. Like Gregory, MON, Gerrard, to name a few others, he lacked the ability to coach them to be better as both individuals and as a tactically intelligent team.
Yep, and the bold bit is why he's worse than the others and I think you're a little harsh on Gregory there who was just about still part of an era in English football where almost everyone did that. The rest of them saw what people like Wenger had done and decided competence wasn't for them.
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I agree with the Es (apart from the Gerrard bit)
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Gerrard was just an all-round ******.
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https://www.instagram.com/reel/C7eKDkLNlp-/?igsh=MWRsM2d5N3BsbzdzZw==
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Not getting one of the biggest clubs in England relegated to the third division is hardly an achievement deserving of credit. Bruce was crap. The play off final against Fulham was one of the all time lows.
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Not getting one of the biggest clubs in England relegated to the third division is hardly an achievement deserving of credit. Bruce was crap. The play off final against Fulham was one of the all time lows.
It's not credit as such, John said he didn't stop the rot and he did but then again, I'm sure anybody would have. Like I said though, with what he had to work with he should have done a whole lot better but he's not one I look back at with any hatred.
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For me I loved BFR, Brian Little, Deano and Lord Emery.
Hated Stevie G string, O Dreary and Mr Mumbles. And Tim nice but dim.
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I've probably done this before, so hopefully it's vaguely consistent, but my popularity rating for managers of the Premier League era is as follows:
Great managers
Emery
Little
Atkinson
Gregory
Smith
Sherwood
Gerrard
McLeish
Lambert
Di Matteo
Garde
Bruce
Houllier
O'Leary
O'Neill
Absolute pillocks
Emery has now just shaded it over Sir Brian for me, because achieving 4th with the injuries he had, whilst retaining his positive demeanour and politeness shows what a great bloke he is. The bottom four I really, really dislike intensely. The ones in the middle (below Smith) are a bit of a morass of rubbish and/or being twats.
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I've probably done this before, so hopefully it's vaguely consistent, but my popularity rating for managers of the Premier League era is as follows:
Great managers
Emery
Little
Atkinson
Gregory
Smith
Sherwood
Gerrard
McLeish
Lambert
Di Matteo
Garde
Bruce
Houllier
O'Leary
O'Neill
Absolute pillocks
Emery has now just shaded it over Sir Brian for me, because achieving 4th with the injuries he had, whilst retaining his positive demeanour and politeness shows what a great bloke he is. The bottom four I really, really dislike intensely. The ones in the middle (below Smith) are a bit of a morass of rubbish and/or being twats.
That Sherwood is as high on that list as he is (I’d have MON above him but I understand the disdain) is fuckin nuts! So many shite managers.
Thank the lord above we have finally got a great one now.
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I've probably done this before, so hopefully it's vaguely consistent, but my popularity rating for managers of the Premier League era is as follows:
Great managers
Emery
Little
Atkinson
Gregory
Smith
Sherwood
Gerrard
McLeish
Lambert
Di Matteo
Garde
Bruce
Houllier
O'Leary
O'Neill
Absolute pillocks
Emery has now just shaded it over Sir Brian for me, because achieving 4th with the injuries he had, whilst retaining his positive demeanour and politeness shows what a great bloke he is. The bottom four I really, really dislike intensely. The ones in the middle (below Smith) are a bit of a morass of rubbish and/or being twats.
Literally my only ocmplaint with is is that I'd have MoN at the top of the group of shit because whilst he is a complete and utter c**t there were a couple of seasons where many of us believed we might be going somewhere and, until nswe came in, it was the only period of sustained positivity amongst the fans in a 20year spell of mediocrity. I'll give him a slither of credit for that. The only other change is that, despite him only being a caretaker, I'd have to include Black in that group as well.
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https://www.instagram.com/reel/C7eKDkLNlp-/?igsh=MWRsM2d5N3BsbzdzZw== (https://www.instagram.com/reel/C7eKDkLNlp-/?igsh=MWRsM2d5N3BsbzdzZw==)
That's actually great, it's the sort of thing that would be lauded as genius if it came from someone like Guardiola.
I'm all for focusing on detailed tactics, making plans to create confusion in the opposition and generally trying to play in a way that stacks the cards in your favour by controlling the play, it's clearly something that is needed but I'm also a rugby player. I know full well that sometimes the best thing to do is to just let pure physicality carry you, be that a big fucker winning everything in the air (or smashing through tackles in other sports) or a quick fucker who defenders just can't catch up to. Having tactics to make the most of those advantages is when you start winning things.
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Worst manager for me was Bruce
Hated every single minute of his tenure knew it was never going to work The bloke was useless
He had the best and most expensive squad in the championship and managed to finish 13
Honestly I’d back myself to have done better
The following season when we should’ve pissed the league by 10 clear points we get to the play-off final and as usual play Bruceball and deservedly lose
Football was rubbish. The tactics were rubbish. Bruce was rubbish
His tactics were Neanderthal, he got a few results because we in general we had better players than anybody else, but he still managed to turn that squad into a total box standard mid table championship team, now that he was the king of
He never started anything he never steadied any ship, he never stopped any rot He just continued it in the most boring fashion imaginable, supporting Villa during his time was absolutely dire
The day he left was a great day for me and Villa and we never looked back
Everywhere he’s gone since he’s stunk the place out
He was absolutely rubbish
( he was a very good player mind but it don’t count because it wasn’t for us)
Worse than Gerrard ? Yeah ok what a load of B******s.
By a distance
Ahahahahahahahah ok . Look me in the eye and say that.
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I've probably done this before, so hopefully it's vaguely consistent, but my popularity rating for managers of the Premier League era is as follows:
Great managers
Emery
Little
Atkinson
Gregory
Smith
Sherwood
Gerrard
McLeish
Lambert
Di Matteo
Garde
Bruce
Houllier
O'Leary
O'Neill
Absolute pillocks
Emery has now just shaded it over Sir Brian for me, because achieving 4th with the injuries he had, whilst retaining his positive demeanour and politeness shows what a great bloke he is. The bottom four I really, really dislike intensely. The ones in the middle (below Smith) are a bit of a morass of rubbish and/or being twats.
That Sherwood is as high on that list as he is (I’d have MON above him but I understand the disdain) is fuckin nuts! So many shite managers.
Thank the lord above we have finally got a great one now.
It's based on popularity rather than ability. Even though he was a bit of an idiot, and more than a bit inept, he kept us up first season, and gave us the extremely enjoyable semi win against Liverpool. I don't recall that he ever said anything bad about the fans and in the intervening years seems to have retained a bit of a soft spot for us. That for me makes him more likeable than anybody underneath him, even if in the case of somebody like O'Neill, they were clearly much better managers.
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Liked Little, SGT, BFR, Dean and MON, when he arrived.
Disliked MON for what he did, the sulky twat, Dr Jo, Graham Turner, O'Leary, Gerrard, Di Matteo, Sherwood, Black McLeish, Garde.
Meh, Bruce, Gregory, Houllier, Lambert
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We probably need a graph with 2 axes - Likeability vs Success; and plot each manager that way.
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Liked Little, SGT, BFR, Dean and MON, when he arrived.
Disliked MON for what he did, the sulky twat, Dr Jo, Graham Turner, O'Leary, Gerrard, Di Matteo, Sherwood, Black McLeish, Garde.
Meh, Bruce, Gregory, Houllier, Lambert
“Black McLeish” sounds like the antagonist of a Celtic fairytale
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SGT1 : loved. Exactly who we needed at the time. Should never have allowed Ellis to talk him into returning in 2002 though. Losing to Small Heath twice tarnished him, though still did some good things.
Venglos: respected Lovely guy, but wrong place at wrong time
Atkinson: Loved. Villa through and through and did some great things. Cup win probably saved him though as our league form from mid 93 to end of 94 was ropey at best.
SBL: Loved. Rare example of brilliant as a player and brilliant as a manager as well. Ran out of steam towards the end though.
Gregory: indifferent. No doubt loved the club, but also loved himself a bit too much as well.
D'OL: Despised. Utter arsehole who repeatedly took the piss out the fans and couldn't stop talking about Leeds.
M'ON: indifferent. Wasted a huge chance to build a legacy by doing everything on the short term. Moscow drove a wedge between him and the fans that never healed. Unforgivable to walk out when he did.
Houllier: indifferent. Turning up at his first press conference in a bloody red tie told you how it was going to end.
Mcleish: indifferent. Couldn't blame him for taking the job, but would have had to win the quadruple to win people over.
Lambert: disliked. Supported his appointment, but got spooked by getting battered at Chelsea and he never recovered. Broke record after record, but all the shit ones.
Sherwood: Disliked. Played up to the flash cockney geezer and made self-preservation an art.
Garde: disliked. Was out of his depth from the start, but never had a chance with what he inherited.
RDM: disliked. Never good enough. Far too lazy and dined out on luckiest champions league win ever.
Bruce: indifferent. Did some good things, but was beginning to undo them when he left. Got to preoccupied with taking digs at the fans.
Smith: loved. United the club and brought us back to the top flight. Sad day when he left, but it was the right time as it saved things turning nasty.
Gerrard: wanker. Completely rubbed the players up the wrong way to the point where they wouldn't play for him.
Emery: love. Completely changed the club. Just needs a trophy now.
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Of the ones I've spoken to:
Tommy Cummings was a nice enough bloke who admitted he wasn't good enough and was here at our worst.
Tommy Docherty was a surprisingly soft-spoken, almost gentle man whose affection for the Villa was obvious decades after he left.
Ron Saunders had presence and then some. I'm glad I never really spoke to him because I fear I wouldn't have liked him. But as with everything else about him, none of that matters.
Tony Barton was the nicest, most modest man you could ever meet. He seemed genuinely surprised at how highly he was thought of.
Graham Turner is the first to admit he shouldn't have been offered the job or taken it, but he couldn't turn it down
Sir Graham was everything you'd expect.
Jo Venglos was happy to tell you about his success elsewhere. Ahead of his time in England but not really cut out to manage here.
BFR loves football. He loves watching it, talking about it, living it.
Brian Little walks on water.
John Gregory I never warmed to. There was always something of the Ukip/Reform voter about him.
Alex McLeish is a lovely fella. Like Turner he should never have been offered the job but couldn't refuse it.
Steve Bruce stopped the rot but couldn't do any more.
Deano is you and me in the dug-out.
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Sacking Barton was bad but then replacing him with Shrewsbury Towns' Graham Turner is astonishing. What was Ellis thinking?
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I assume the thinking was that Turner was the next Graham Taylor. He was only 36 when we appointed him and he'd done wonders at Shrewsbury. He's still the only manager to lead them to the second tier, and FAC QFs. He probably wasn't ready for the Villa job, especially with the 80-82 team breaking up because of Ellis, including losing Shaw and Cowans.
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Imagine if we'd have appointed a Ferguson or a Clough back then when we had the profile to do it.
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In another universe we dominated the 80s. Even from '83 on we had a number of good players, many of whom went on to win trophies elsewhere. A combination of injuries and Ellis meant we spent most of it being shit instead.
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Worst manager for me was Bruce...
The day he left was a great day for me and Villa and we never looked back
Everywhere he’s gone since he’s stunk the place out
He was absolutely rubbish
We certainly did look back. We looked back and said 'where's the bloody defence?'. Correct if I'm wrong as we've had so many poor mangers up until this point but wasn't it Bruce that left us without a defence? If memory serves the only defender we had was his son on here.
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Jedi at CH, ah those were the days. After Bruce we could field a defence, just, but we did pretty much destroy James Chester in doing so as there was no one else.
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SGT1 : loved. Exactly who we needed at the time. Should never have allowed Ellis to talk him into returning in 2002 though. Losing to Small Heath twice tarnished him, though still did some good things.
Venglos: respected Lovely guy, but wrong place at wrong time
Atkinson: Loved. Villa through and through and did some great things. Cup win probably saved him though as our league form from mid 93 to end of 94 was ropey at best.
SBL: Loved. Rare example of brilliant as a player and brilliant as a manager as well. Ran out of steam towards the end though.
Gregory: indifferent. No doubt loved the club, but also loved himself a bit too much as well.
D'OL: Despised. Utter arsehole who repeatedly took the piss out the fans and couldn't stop talking about Leeds.
M'ON: indifferent. Wasted a huge chance to build a legacy by doing everything on the short term. Moscow drove a wedge between him and the fans that never healed. Unforgivable to walk out when he did.
Houllier: indifferent. Turning up at his first press conference in a bloody red tie told you how it was going to end.
Mcleish: indifferent. Couldn't blame him for taking the job, but would have had to win the quadruple to win people over.
Lambert: disliked. Supported his appointment, but got spooked by getting battered at Chelsea and he never recovered. Broke record after record, but all the shit ones.
Sherwood: Disliked. Played up to the flash cockney geezer and made self-preservation an art.
Garde: disliked. Was out of his depth from the start, but never had a chance with what he inherited.
RDM: disliked. Never good enough. Far too lazy and dined out on luckiest champions league win ever.
Bruce: indifferent. Did some good things, but was beginning to undo them when he left. Got to preoccupied with taking digs at the fans.
Smith: loved. United the club and brought us back to the top flight. Sad day when he left, but it was the right time as it saved things turning nasty.
Gerrard: wanker. Completely rubbed the players up the wrong way to the point where they wouldn't play for him.
Emery: love. Completely changed the club. Just needs a trophy now.
agree 100%
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Jedi at CH, ah those were the days. After Bruce we could field a defence, just, but we did pretty much destroy James Chester in doing so as there was no one else.
Jedinak up front at Leeds after Bamford got Anwar sent off will never not be funny.
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John Gregory I never warmed to. There was always something of the Ukip/Reform voter about him.
Is that fair? He's managed in Israel, Kazakhstan and India, which dosn't strike me as the sort of career path somebody would take if they had any sort of antipathy to foreign types, or were a little Englander. The players and fans all absolutely loved him in India, by all accounts.
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Been thinking about this and whats interesting is my opinion at the time was different than it is now.
BFR - (Then) Loved, (Now) Always shaded by his ITV sacking.
SBL = (t)Loved, (n)loved -Brilliant
JG - (t)Indifferent, (n)Like - spoilt by the last 2 managers - but now group in "the good time"
GT (t)Indifferent, (n)Like - Always liked him, but didn't think it was the right appointment.
DOL (t)Indifferent, (n)mild dislike, was pleased when he was appointed - but also pleased when he left. As grown older - released he is an unlikeable person.
MON (t) Liked, (n)mild dislike - as above
GH (t) Indiffernt, (n) indifferent
McLeish (t) Hated, (n) indifferent. Signaled giving up then. Now, better than some of the shite that came after.
Lambert (t) Liked, (n) indifferent - don't think he did too bad considering, massively limited, rubbish football
Sherwood - (t) disliked, (n) disliked - bit of a twat - mostly harmless
RG - (t) indifferent, (n) indifferent - couldn't pick him out of a line up
RDM - (t) indifferent, (n) indifferent - at least it was brief
SB - (t) indifferent, (n) Mild like - he did ok, and stopped it from becoming more of a shit storm then it needed to be. limited but amazing author.
Deano - (t) Loved, (n) Loved - for me at least, gave me a connection back to the club - gave me some of my favorite times supporting the club - laid a lot of good foundations and a top guy.
SG - (t) Dispised, (n) mild dislike - Was against from the start - was obvious CP would go for him, so guess we had to get that out of the system. Was worried it signaled that as a club we didn't have a clue, and played out exactly as expected. He was promoted above his pay grade but was always going to be our next manager when Deano left. At least no long-term damage was done. He will probably be England manager at some point
Unai Love - every day I think about how this is a match made in heaven. Could be dynasty-level kind of stuff
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As time has gone on I think McLeish's season looks (slightly) better than it did.
His issue was of course coming here after relegating SHA playing terribly negative football. He also joined when we'd finished 6th just 12 months previously so his appointment wasn't aligned with where we thought the club should go back to rather than the massive austerity drive that was just starting.
I think like most of the fanbase we all just sat with our arms folded in a muted fashion up to the December as results were solid if unspectacular. Then he played Hutton right midfield at Spurs and all hell brook loose.
That typical Villa season in the 2010s where we actually had some decent results on the road but were poor at VP. Can remember a fantastic out of nowhere 3-1 at Chelsea in the xmas period and winning at Wolves with a couple of cracking Robbie Keane goals was a game I fondly recall aswell.
He tried his best and was a decent bloke and seemed to have the respect of most of the squad back then although did chuckle at Stephen Warnock saying on a recent podcast he was reading from a statement when he was introducing himself on the first day of pre season.
We'd have finished higher if we hadn't lost Bent and Petrov for the final three months of that season. Think Dunne also did his shoulder and missed a few months aswell.
Considering Lambert came in and made us even more boring despite having better attackers his season looks a little better given what followed. Still should never have been put in that position mind.
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From the ones in my supporting lifetime:
Total C-words: Gerrard, O'Leary
Clueless twat: Sherwood
Really rather bad: McLeish, Lambert, Garde, SGT Mk II, Houlier, Di Matteo, Bruce
Nearly, but not quite: O'Neill, Gregory
A nice idea, but no: Dr Jo
Some great football but I cannot forgive the choice of language: Atkinson
Heroes: SGT, Little, Smith
Divine: Emery
Agree with 99% of that.
I liked McLeish, nice bloke - I wonder if he would have been better than Bruce if he had joined us at at that time instead?
McLeish I think would've been better after a Lambert type. He followed MON/Houllier so expectations were we should still be pushing for europe/top 8 regardless of who we were selling.
If it was just keep us up on a low budget and introducing young players he'd have probably just about kept on doing it like he did in 11/12.
It's basically the job Dyche is being asked to do at Everton, keep them up with little spending until they move into the new ground.
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I forgot Houllier completely. He would probably into the ego category.
Houllier was basically the managerial equivalent of signing Ginola or Pires. Very good in his prime as he showed rebuilding Liverpool from nearly men in the 90s to a decent European force but he was never going to do the same here, not least due to his health which cut short his one season here.
Back then we really need an Emery type given we'd just finished 6th three years running.
Looking at the list and it's baffling why we persisted with solid but unspectacular British managers for so long.
Find a decent European coach, back him and you'll be comfortable top half at the very least as many other clubs showed in the 2000s.
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Houllier did sign Pires didn't he ? Pires did not age well on a football field , ran about like an OAP.
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To have only had 5 overseas managers, and 3 of them were already well experienced in England, possibly explains why we've been shit for so long.
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To have only had 5 overseas managers, and 3 of them were already well experienced in England, possibly explains why we've been shit for so long.
That's what disappointed me about the second half of the Lerner ownership. If you're going to cut costs and sign cheaper players at least appoint a manager who has a good grasp of foreign markets.
I guess that was the thinking behind trying to get in Martinez in summer 2011 as he'd signed some unknowns at Wigan who'd done well from Latin America and elsewhere.
Instead we went from wanting a Martinez to a McLeish and just following the conservative and dull British route.
In some respects having a complete control freak like O'Neill as manager was actually the best appointment for Lerner as meant he didn't have to find competent people to fill in technical director/DOF roles. Again we later saw what a disaster that was in the final 18 months.
Probably the one manager I quite liked who's seen as a general disaster is Sherwood.
Took over when we were on one of our endless scoring droughts but quickly got Benteke scoring, gave a chance to Grealish when he was still a complete novice and that Liverpool cup SF was genuinely outstanding in how comfortable we looked. Which made the complete surrender in the final more disappointing.
He did what was required though. All the talk then of him not wanting the foreign players but he stayed played likes of Gana,Ayew and Amavi at least. Had no chance with Gestede effectively being Benteke's replacement and went early enough in that season for us still to have some chance of staying up.
Also still speaks well enough of us in interviews compared to Bruce or Lambert.
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I've said this before about Sherwood. And the QF and SF will always be in the memory as 2 fantastic days.
I think that Sherwood was exactly what we need when he was appointed. I think sometimes we forget how bad things were when he arrived. Pretty much everyone thought we were down after that Hull defeat and 'performance'. We needed a cocky fecker to come in and use enthusiasm and cockiness etc to lift everything, players and fans. It sounds stupid now but his "A sherwood team wins" kind of guff was needed.
I also think he was exactly what we didn't need to be in charge at the start of the following season.
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I've said this before about Sherwood. And the QF and SF will always be in the memory as 2 fantastic days.
I think that Sherwood was exactly what we need when he was appointed. I think sometimes we forget how bad things were when he arrived. Pretty much everyone thought we were down after that Hull defeat and 'performance'. We needed a cocky fecker to come in and use enthusiasm and cockiness etc to lift everything, players and fans. It sounds stupid now but his "A sherwood team wins" kind of guff was needed.
I also think he was exactly what we didn't need to be in charge at the start of the following season.
Good analysis.
As I used to say: "Positivity without a plan".
He gave us a much needed boost, but was never going to last without a good DoF.
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John Gregory I never warmed to. There was always something of the Ukip/Reform voter about him.
Is that fair? He's managed in Israel, Kazakhstan and India, which dosn't strike me as the sort of career path somebody would take if they had any sort of antipathy to foreign types, or were a little Englander. The players and fans all absolutely loved him in India, by all accounts.
I don't do rational.
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Houllier really was awful, worse than DOL in how dismissive he was of the club and the players. Fawning over Liverpool at every turn.
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John Gregory I never warmed to. There was always something of the Ukip/Reform voter about him.
Is that fair? He's managed in Israel, Kazakhstan and India, which dosn't strike me as the sort of career path somebody would take if they had any sort of antipathy to foreign types, or were a little Englander. The players and fans all absolutely loved him in India, by all accounts.
I don't do rational.
I don't remember too much about Gregory, but as a child at the time he definitely scared me. I wasn't prepared for him after the gentleness of Brian.
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Houllier was bang on about some players though, especially Gabby. It's been said before, but Houllier had the feeling of a consultant brought in for a year or two to sort stuff out rather than a manager with a personal interest in the club.
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A quick Google to remind me of this. "score one game and out the next", from a bloke that scored 3 goals in 26 league games. And the last bit, well by the end of the season he had scored 4 in 33 league games.
Gabriel Agbonlahor has accused former Aston Villa manager Gerard Houllier of ruining his England career.
The 24-year-old has not featured for England in nearly two years, and he blames Houllier and assistant Gary McAllister, claiming his inability to hold down a place in Villa's starting XI last season scuppered his chances of a call-up.
"Last season killed me a lot," Agbonlahor said. "I feel I have to start again with England now. It was a season to forget. The set-up was frustrating.
"One game you would score, the next game you would be on the bench. I was not used to it. Luckily the manager left and McAllister left as well."
Agbonlahor, who scored five goals in a testing season for Villa last term, already has two goals to his name this season, and he hopes a good run of form will attract the interest of England manager Fabio Capello.
"Euro 2012 is still a target," he said. "Anything can happen with injuries and people can lose their form. The new manager has given me a chance.
"England have really good players but if I could get that chance, then I would be excited by it. Hopefully I'll steer clear of injuries and play well for Villa."
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John Gregory I never warmed to. There was always something of the Ukip/Reform voter about him.
Is that fair? He's managed in Israel, Kazakhstan and India, which dosn't strike me as the sort of career path somebody would take if they had any sort of antipathy to foreign types, or were a little Englander. The players and fans all absolutely loved him in India, by all accounts.
I don't do rational.
I don't remember too much about Gregory, but as a child at the time he definitely scared me. I wasn't prepared for him after the gentleness of Brian.
I don't know at all about his politics, but taking coin doing his job abroad doesn't really tilt it either, for me.
That's funny you say that because he used to scare me as well, like a strict PE teacher you didn't want to piss off. Must have been our age.
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The difference between Emery and all previous managers is the preparation that happens before games and his ever presence on the touchline. My lasting memory of Gerard was of him sitting in the dugout with a look of total defeat on his face. Reading Dave Woodhalls post it seems that most of the managers we've had, football aside, were really nice people. Happy to read that.
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John Gregory I never warmed to. There was always something of the Ukip/Reform voter about him.
Is that fair? He's managed in Israel, Kazakhstan and India, which dosn't strike me as the sort of career path somebody would take if they had any sort of antipathy to foreign types, or were a little Englander. The players and fans all absolutely loved him in India, by all accounts.
I don't do rational.
I don't remember too much about Gregory, but as a child at the time he definitely scared me. I wasn't prepared for him after the gentleness of Brian.
I don't know at all about his politics, but taking coin doing his job abroad doesn't really tilt it either, for me.
That's funny you say that because he used to scare me as well, like a strict PE teacher you didn't want to piss off. Must have been our age.
Yes, the kind of PE teacher who'd say "right girls, line up and we're going to watch Rory run ten laps of the pitch in his pants - make sure you laugh and point".
It never happened (unless I've buried the memory) but always felt an imminent threat.
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SB - (t) indifferent, (n) Mild like - he did ok, and stopped it from becoming more of a shit storm then it needed to be. limited but amazing author.[/B
Finally someone on here giving him credit for his true calling in life. Definitely up there with Dickens, Shakespeare, and Sit Arthur Conan Doyle in that regard
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John Gregory I never warmed to. There was always something of the Ukip/Reform voter about him.
Is that fair? He's managed in Israel, Kazakhstan and India, which dosn't strike me as the sort of career path somebody would take if they had any sort of antipathy to foreign types, or were a little Englander. The players and fans all absolutely loved him in India, by all accounts.
I don't do rational.
I don't remember too much about Gregory, but as a child at the time he definitely scared me. I wasn't prepared for him after the gentleness of Brian.
I don't know at all about his politics, but taking coin doing his job abroad doesn't really tilt it either, for me.
That's funny you say that because he used to scare me as well, like a strict PE teacher you didn't want to piss off. Must have been our age.
Exactly that, a PE teacher. Had zero sympathy with Collymore’s depression and probably made him swim in the pool in his underpants. He regretted it afterwards.
He’s mellowed now though - seems a really nice bloke when interviewed, and Villa through and through. That first year under him was incredible.
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To have only had 5 overseas managers, and 3 of them were already well experienced in England, possibly explains why we've been shit for so long.
Agree with this
Was only chatting with my lad the other night saying there’s no old school British managers left in the prem now
Alardyce Pardue pulis warnock Bruce McLeish, even Moyes whose is probably not as bad but still in the same mold in the end, went for playing the football No one wants to see.
Potter and howe both play more progressive football and can’t be classed as old school dinosaurs I don’t think
Don’t know about the new fella at Ipswich
What I’m really saying is that up and at them type Football has all but disappeared from the Premier League
I think Wenger had the biggest influence on that, everyone plays that Pep ball now but Wenger started it in the Prem
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Bruce assembled the bones of the team that got us up - McGinn, JT, Elmo, AEG. Credit due where required.
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Bruce assembled the bones of the team that got us up - McGinn, JT, Elmo, AEG. Credit due where required.
JT wasnt playing in the team that got promoted and the way Bruce started that season until we got the boot, we were heading for mid table at best. It took and up, down and then very up (10 game run from Smith/Grealish) to get us into the play offs.
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Bruce assembled the bones of the team that got us up - McGinn, JT, Elmo, AEG. Credit due where required.
JT wasnt playing in the team that got promoted and the way Bruce started that season until we got the boot, we were heading for mid table at best. It took and up, down and then very up (10 game run from Smith/Grealish) to get us into the play offs.
JT was part of the team that got us up though.
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He wasn’t.
Edited - Unless you’re talking about him as a coach. Which is a stretch
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Bruce assembled the bones of the team that got us up - McGinn, JT, Elmo, AEG. Credit due where required.
El Ghazi barely played and slagged Bruce off after he left IIRC. Bolaise was also signed around then and his spell here was a non-event.
McGinn was an excellent signing, no issue about that. Getting in Tammy was critical given Kodjia simply wasn't the same after the two injuries in 2017.
Steve Bruce could bring in good players with his contacts and sales pitch but it was how we were playing that was the issue and that was the lack of work on the training ground as we really were doing the bare minimum to win games in the championship.
All blew up in the play off final when Fulham ran rings around us in the first half.
That's what I love about Emery. When you look at his 18 months we really haven't spent that much compared to many who finished below us and he just gets on with improving underachieving existing players e.g. Bailey.
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Most managers, even the unpopular ones signed some great players. O'Leary signed Laursen and Solano, Lambert got Benteke, Bruce gave us McGinn and Gerrard brought in Kamara.
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John Gregory I never warmed to. There was always something of the Ukip/Reform voter about him.
Is that fair? He's managed in Israel, Kazakhstan and India, which dosn't strike me as the sort of career path somebody would take if they had any sort of antipathy to foreign types, or were a little Englander. The players and fans all absolutely loved him in India, by all accounts.
I don't do rational.
I don't remember too much about Gregory,but as a child at the time he definitely scared me. I wasn't prepared for him after the gentleness of Brian.
I think if I'd have met Saunders as a kid , I would still be in counselling now ! On the Scary Manager scale no one comes near Sir Ron.
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I think if I'd have met Saunders as a kid , I would still be in counselling now ! On the Scary Manager scale no one comes near Sir Ron.
He was built like a brick shithouse. He was managing in the days when a few pints and a packet of Benson and Hedges were seen as modern elite fuelling, but he had a physique that would put Cristiano Ronaldo to shame.
(https://i.ibb.co/mvcLT3q/Screenshot-2024-06-01-at-12-34-55.png) (https://ibb.co/mvcLT3q)
Think that was from his Norwich days.
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When Saunders rang my house the phone stood to attention.
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At a time when it was two points for a win, Ron's overall record with Villa was 1.52 points per game apparently. That's pretty impressive.
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When Saunders rang my house
*** CLANG! ***
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Bruce assembled the bones of the team that got us up - McGinn, JT, Elmo, AEG. Credit due where required.
JT wasnt playing in the team that got promoted and the way Bruce started that season until we got the boot, we were heading for mid table at best. It took and up, down and then very up (10 game run from Smith/Grealish) to get us into the play offs.
JT was part of the team that got us up though.
He wasn’t, him, Snodgrass etc didn’t have contracts renewed, or loans continued after the play off loss and subsequent financial meltdown. We had a shit show of a defence, which Bruce allowed until he was sacked. Smith came in and had to make do (Bree and Elphick as a pair for one or two dismal games I seem to remember) until he got Tuanzebe back from injury (a Bruce loan fair doo’s) and brought in Mings on loan.
Terry was brought in as coach under Smith.
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Bruce assembled the bones of the team that got us up - McGinn, JT, Elmo, AEG. Credit due where required.
Dean Smith perform miracles to get that team out the championship
Bruce had turned it into such a championship level team that when we went up we had to get rid of nearly all the players and buy in a completely new side
Honestly he was so bad it still upsets me to think he was anything to do with Villa
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You can say Bruce steadied things, but with the money we spent and squad we had at that level it was hardly some Herculean achievement. You can also say that we had our worst league finish since 1974 under him.
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Most managers, even the unpopular ones signed some great players. O'Leary signed Laursen and Solano, Lambert got Benteke, Bruce gave us McGinn and Gerrard brought in Kamara.
Laursen has a case for being my favourite player. Didn't O'Leary bring in Freddie B too? Half a league winning standard of defence imo. If memory serves he didn't get much out of either due to injury.
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O'Leary actually got closer to Champions League qualification than O'Neill or anyone else did until now.
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Graham Turner - hopelessly out of his depth
Billy McNeill - didnt want to be here, it showed
Graham Taylor - mk1 walked on water for me
Dr Josef Venglos - nice idea Doug but way too soon
Ron Atkinson - fun football, ended at right time
Brian Little - nice guy and good times, again ended at right time
John Gregory - generally good but can’t ignore the bottle job of that Cup final (& very nearly the semi too)
David O'Leary - utter moron who just didn’t get the club in any way - selfish and hopeless
Martin O'Neill - can’t get past the way he left for anything - had some great times with his team but it was about him always
Gérard Houiller - Liverpool obsession was annoying but would have been intrigued if he had had another summer
Alex McLeish - nice guy, made a mental career decision (well 2 actually!)
Paul Lambert - hopeless hopeless
Tim Sherwood - tactics Tim, good sound bites and that semi vs a Liverpool was great fun
Remi Garde - non entity
Roberto Di Matteo - another who didn’t seem to get the club
Steve Bruce - Tim nice but dim - should have walked the Champ with the squad he had…worst performing of all the managers for me
Dean Smith - ledge…another who ended at right time with reputation intact…wouldn’t be where we are without
Steven Gerrard - utter fraud…
Unai Emery - potentially the greatest?
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I've said it many times but the biggest mystery of the lot to me was how O'Leary behaved. If he'd kept quiet he would have ridden the protest wave and been reasonably popular but instead he went out of his way to alienate everyone.
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O'Leary actually got closer to Champions League qualification than O'Neill or anyone else did until now.
Blew it at Southampton if I recall correctly. In any case, we'd have needed to beat Man U in the final game and you know what always happens there.
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I've said it many times but the biggest mystery of the lot to me was how O'Leary behaved. If he'd kept quiet he would have ridden the protest wave and been reasonably popular but instead he went out of his way to alienate everyone.
I remember the pound sign protests when we were bottom three after he first took over. There were posters with "Top 3 manager, bottom three board" (or words to that effect) outside the ground. The second half of his first season and the first half of his second were very, very good. It's a little bit odd how he's done next to nothing since. I know he's a twat, but there have almost as big a twats and worse managers who have worked continuously since then.
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I'm not sure any manager has matched the career suicide that Mr Fickle did that season.
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From the ones in my supporting lifetime:
Total C-words: Gerrard, O'Leary
Clueless twat: Sherwood
Really rather bad: McLeish, Lambert, Garde, SGT Mk II, Houlier, Di Matteo, Bruce
Nearly, but not quite: O'Neill, Gregory
A nice idea, but no: Dr Jo
Some great football but I cannot forgive the choice of language: Atkinson
Heroes: SGT, Little, Smith
Divine: Emery
That's where I am overall.
Sorry but harsh on Sherwood, who gave me one of the best days of being a Villa fan in that semi-final at Wembley. And he seems quite nice.
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I broadly agree with what most posters have said on this topic and is, in my opinion, one of the most thoughtful threads in quite a while. I am old enough to remember Vic Crowe and it ought to be remembered that the road to Rotterdam began with the rebuilding job he started. Even the team that beat Everton in the League Cup Final 1n 1977 (3 years after he left) contained 5 players who began their Villa careers under his stewardship: Gidman, Robson, Nicholl, Graydon and Little. The League Cup semi-final against Yanited in 1970 remains one of my favourite Villa memories and the football played under him was generally good. I recently re-watched the 1971 LC final against Spuds and if you hadn't known, you would never have said that they were 2 divisions above us. As good a Villa man as you could have wished for. I also think it is worth noting that no-one has left VP and gone to be conspicuously successful elsewhere since Joe Mercer in the 1960s. Perhaps this is a message of some kind from the footballing gods: Villa is the pinnacle!
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From the ones in my supporting lifetime:
Total C-words: Gerrard, O'Leary
Clueless twat: Sherwood
Really rather bad: McLeish, Lambert, Garde, SGT Mk II, Houlier, Di Matteo, Bruce
Nearly, but not quite: O'Neill, Gregory
A nice idea, but no: Dr Jo
Some great football but I cannot forgive the choice of language: Atkinson
Heroes: SGT, Little, Smith
Divine: Emery
That's where I am overall.
Sorry but harsh on Sherwood, who gave me one of the best days of being a Villa fan in that semi-final at Wembley. And he seems quite nice.
His 'preparation' for that season was a huge factor in our shiteness and ultimate demise. Just astonishingly unprofessional and irresponsible.
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From the ones in my supporting lifetime:
Total C-words: Gerrard, O'Leary
Clueless twat: Sherwood
Really rather bad: McLeish, Lambert, Garde, SGT Mk II, Houlier, Di Matteo, Bruce
Nearly, but not quite: O'Neill, Gregory
A nice idea, but no: Dr Jo
Some great football but I cannot forgive the choice of language: Atkinson
Heroes: SGT, Little, Smith
Divine: Emery
That's where I am overall.
Sorry but harsh on Sherwood, who gave me one of the best days of being a Villa fan in that semi-final at Wembley. And he seems quite nice.
I won't diminish that semi-final, but 'quite nice'?! If you think thick, charlatan, spiv chancers are quite nice then I guess I agree!
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The semi-final win was fantastic but unfortunately it was followed by the final (I know that’s obvious, but you know what I mean.)
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From the ones in my supporting lifetime:
Total C-words: Gerrard, O'Leary
Clueless twat: Sherwood
Really rather bad: McLeish, Lambert, Garde, SGT Mk II, Houlier, Di Matteo, Bruce
Nearly, but not quite: O'Neill, Gregory
A nice idea, but no: Dr Jo
Some great football but I cannot forgive the choice of language: Atkinson
Heroes: SGT, Little, Smith
Divine: Emery
That's where I am overall.
Sorry but harsh on Sherwood, who gave me one of the best days of being a Villa fan in that semi-final at Wembley. And he seems quite nice.
I won't diminish that semi-final, but 'quite nice'?! If you think thick, charlatan, spiv chancers are quite nice then I guess I agree!
Sorry, I was being a bit sarcastic about that bit! Still wouldn't call him a clueless twat though.
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How shit the final was doesn't alter how fantastic the QF and SF were. They were 2 fantastic days and always will be.
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It’s pretty clear that there is universal agreement that Gerrard was ‘unloved’ here.
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It’s pretty clear that there is universal agreement that Gerrard was ‘unloved’ here.
He loved himself a lot, so that does balance it out a bit.
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How shit the final was doesn't alter how fantastic the QF and SF were. They were 2 fantastic days and always will be.
Yep. And they will live long in the memory.
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How shit the final was doesn't alter how fantastic the QF and SF were. They were 2 fantastic days and always will be.
Yep. And they will live long in the memory.
I agree but if we’re assessing him as a manager overall the final does colour my view of him.
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From the ones in my supporting lifetime:
Total C-words: Gerrard, O'Leary
Clueless twat: Sherwood
Really rather bad: McLeish, Lambert, Garde, SGT Mk II, Houlier, Di Matteo, Bruce
Nearly, but not quite: O'Neill, Gregory
A nice idea, but no: Dr Jo
Some great football but I cannot forgive the choice of language: Atkinson
Heroes: SGT, Little, Smith
Divine: Emery
That's where I am overall.
Sorry but harsh on Sherwood, who gave me one of the best days of being a Villa fan in that semi-final at Wembley. And he seems quite nice.
I won't diminish that semi-final, but 'quite nice'?! If you think thick, charlatan, spiv chancers are quite nice then I guess I agree!
Well she is married to me to be fair to her
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It's ancient history now, but I still feel that Tony Barton didn't do much wrong. After a top 6 finish in his first full season, the next term was mid table (nearly made a League Cup final) and and clearly, the issue of an ageing team had to be addressed. Unfortunately, Ellis replaced him with that plank from Shrewsbury Town.
Saunders was my greatest manager and Taylor might have matched that if he'd stayed a bit longer first time round. Had some great days with Atkinson, O'Neill and Deano of course
No axe to grind with Sherwood or McLeish, just not good enough despite their best efforts. McNeill, Garde, Lambert, Di Matteo, Bruce all garbage. David O'Leary, a complete wanker.
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Eric Houghton has to be one of my favourites for giving us the FA Cup, plus Joe Mercer, who sadly suffered from ill health during his tenure, Sir Graham, BFR, Sir Brian, but top of the list has to be Sir Ron, most disliked O'Leary.
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My overriding memory of Sherwood is his team being the most wretched bunch of losers I've seen in over 40 years watching Villa. Sank to the bottom of the table early on and never moved for the rest of the season.
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I think if I'd have met Saunders as a kid , I would still be in counselling now ! On the Scary Manager scale no one comes near Sir Ron.
He was built like a brick shithouse. He was managing in the days when a few pints and a packet of Benson and Hedges were seen as modern elite fuelling, but he had a physique that would put Cristiano Ronaldo to shame.
(https://i.ibb.co/mvcLT3q/Screenshot-2024-06-01-at-12-34-55.png) (https://ibb.co/mvcLT3q)
Think that was from his Norwich days.
Brilliant. Fancy turning up for training with him out there!!!
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From the ones in my supporting lifetime:
Total C-words: Gerrard, O'Leary
Clueless twat: Sherwood
Really rather bad: McLeish, Lambert, Garde, SGT Mk II, Houlier, Di Matteo, Bruce
Nearly, but not quite: O'Neill, Gregory
A nice idea, but no: Dr Jo
Some great football but I cannot forgive the choice of language: Atkinson
Heroes: SGT, Little, Smith
Divine: Emery
That's where I am overall.
Sorry but harsh on Sherwood, who gave me one of the best days of being a Villa fan in that semi-final at Wembley. And he seems quite nice.
With you Hane on that day in London which will only be bettered when Unai wins the cup next season however he is a bit of a twat😂
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Unai up there with SGT. What Graham Taylor did here in the late 80's was miraculous.
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Bruce assembled the bones of the team that got us up - McGinn, JT, Elmo, AEG. Credit due where required.
Dean Smith perform miracles to get that team out the championship
Bruce had turned it into such a championship level team that when we went up we had to get rid of nearly all the players and buy in a completely new side
Honestly he was so bad it still upsets me to think he was anything to do with Villa
He did extremely well to make up the lost ground from Bruce's time, but that play off final team had Mings, McGinn, Grealish and Abraham, who were all miles too good for that level and are all international level still, as well as very good players for top end Championship/lower Prem like Hourihane, El Ghazi and Elmo.
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In my mind we tend to end the careers of managers, or at least their upward trajectory. If that is the case, is it just a symptom of us ultimately not being very good for the last 30 years? Or a combination of this and there not being many more prestigious manager positions available?
Who was the last Villa manager who went on to greater things (objectively speaking) after leaving us? SGT left on his own terms for the England job, but Watford and Villa were clearly his career highlights. We were obviously Big Ron’s last hurrah. Sir Brian entered the managerial wilderness fairly quickly, likewise Gregory. O’Neill had one more underwhelming EPL stint left in him.
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I think if I'd have met Saunders as a kid , I would still be in counselling now ! On the Scary Manager scale no one comes near Sir Ron.
He was built like a brick shithouse. He was managing in the days when a few pints and a packet of Benson and Hedges were seen as modern elite fuelling, but he had a physique that would put Cristiano Ronaldo to shame.
(https://i.ibb.co/mvcLT3q/Screenshot-2024-06-01-at-12-34-55.png) (https://ibb.co/mvcLT3q)
Think that was from his Norwich days.
Fit.
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From the ones in my supporting lifetime:
Total C-words: Gerrard, O'Leary
Clueless twat: Sherwood
Really rather bad: McLeish, Lambert, Garde, SGT Mk II, Houlier, Di Matteo, Bruce
Nearly, but not quite: O'Neill, Gregory
A nice idea, but no: Dr Jo
Some great football but I cannot forgive the choice of language: Atkinson
Heroes: SGT, Little, Smith
Divine: Emery
That's where I am overall.
Sorry but harsh on Sherwood, who gave me one of the best days of being a Villa fan in that semi-final at Wembley. And he seems quite nice.
With you Hane on that day in London which will only be bettered when Unai wins the cup next season however he is a bit of a twat😂
Add me to that. I took my son, and it will be remembered as one of the great days out. And he kept us up. Just about.
Also I can't understand the total hatred for DOL. He didn't do too badly, just lost the plot a bit towards the end.
He was also manager for the first game I took son to. The 3-3 at Craven Cottage.
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From the ones in my supporting lifetime:
Total C-words: Gerrard, O'Leary
Clueless twat: Sherwood
Really rather bad: McLeish, Lambert, Garde, SGT Mk II, Houlier, Di Matteo, Bruce
Nearly, but not quite: O'Neill, Gregory
A nice idea, but no: Dr Jo
Some great football but I cannot forgive the choice of language: Atkinson
Heroes: SGT, Little, Smith
Divine: Emery
That's where I am overall.
Sorry but harsh on Sherwood, who gave me one of the best days of being a Villa fan in that semi-final at Wembley. And he seems quite nice.
With you Hane on that day in London which will only be bettered when Unai wins the cup next season however he is a bit of a twat😂
Add me to that. I took my son, and it will be remembered as one of the great days out. And he kept us up. Just about.
Also I can't understand the total hatred for DOL. He didn't do too badly, just lost the plot a bit towards the end.
He was also manager for the first game I took son to. The 3-3 at Craven Cottage.
Results not withstanding, he was a narcissistic bell end that spent his time here pining for Leeds, denigrating the club is my recollection.
I remember watching the press conference wheel he was announced and saying to my wife, "what the he'll is a chequebook manager like him doing with Ellis."
Honest bunch of lads.
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From the ones in my supporting lifetime:
Total C-words: Gerrard, O'Leary
Clueless twat: Sherwood
Really rather bad: McLeish, Lambert, Garde, SGT Mk II, Houlier, Di Matteo, Bruce
Nearly, but not quite: O'Neill, Gregory
A nice idea, but no: Dr Jo
Some great football but I cannot forgive the choice of language: Atkinson
Heroes: SGT, Little, Smith
Divine: Emery
That's where I am overall.
Sorry but harsh on Sherwood, who gave me one of the best days of being a Villa fan in that semi-final at Wembley. And he seems quite nice.
With you Hane on that day in London which will only be bettered when Unai wins the cup next season however he is a bit of a twat😂
Add me to that. I took my son, and it will be remembered as one of the great days out. And he kept us up. Just about.
Also I can't understand the total hatred for DOL. He didn't do too badly, just lost the plot a bit towards the end.
He was also manager for the first game I took son to. The 3-3 at Craven Cottage.
Results not withstanding, he was a narcissistic bell end that spent his time here pining for Leeds, denigrating the club is my recollection.
I remember watching the press conference wheel he was announced and saying to my wife, "what the he'll is a chequebook manager like him doing with Ellis."
Honest bunch of lads.
Indeed.
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Sir Graham - magnificent first spell, turned the club around, what a great job he did. Second spell - not great, but he's SGT.
Dr Jo - a surprisingly forward bit of thinking by Ellis, but didn't really get much of a chance. Nice chap, though.
BFR - gave us one of my favourite Villa sides, the football was great, until he went to the 1994 world cup and came back with John Fashanu. Alarm bells.
Sir Brian Little - loved him as a player, loved him as a manager, do not feel qualified to really criticise him in any way, my knees wobble a bit every time I think about him.
Gregory - did relatively well but with a penchant for resorting to horrorball football.
O'Leary - thought he was bigger than the club. Did decent job to start with but alienated people so much, in the end even Chris Smith had had enough of him.
MON - limited manager who ultimately wanted everything to be about him, and got us more or less where you'd expect us to get, given the money he got, but also factoring the IMMENSE money wastage he sanctioned.
Houllier - we actually had a reasonable season given the circumstances, and I thought he did a decent job, but he couldn't STFU about Liverpool. The badge tapping in the Anfield tunnel and the comments after his arrival press conference were fucking disgusting.
McLeish, Bruce - nice enough blokes, but relics from a bygone era, providing truly dreadful football. No malice, but fuck me, what horrible times.
Garde - honestly, hard to recall he was ever our manager. Didn't seem that bothered, but was saddled with a bunch of twats of a squad.
Lambert - thought it was a great appointment and started well. Soon disintegrated. Those photos of him and Keane sat on the bench looking like a couple of piss soaked tramps just sum up that grim period perfectly.
Sherwood - out of his depth, bit of a knob at times, but overall he seemed like a decent type who really cared, and still clearly has a huge amount of respect for us. He 'got' us. That semi final was majestic. Fuck me, the three times I've smiled more than any time in my recent life were seeing David Byrne live, seeing Kraftwerk, and winning that semi final. Although at the same time, that match at Leicester, what a turning point that was. If you'd said before those stupid subs, one of these teams is going to win the league, I'd have lumped everything I owned on us. Sliding doors moment.
Di Matteo - genuinely forget he was our manager.
Dean Smith - a good man, a Villa man, and he did a great job to get us promoted and keep us up, but I think even he knew that the next step was beyond him.
Gerrard - an absolute toxic arsehole with no idea what he was doing. Alienated the players and fans. The only good thing about him is that he united fans and players like no other - all united in thinking he was a cunt
Unai Emery - the English language is yet to evolve enough to provide sufficiently powerful words with which to describe him. Magnificent. And very demanding.
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My overriding memory of Sherwood is his team being the most wretched bunch of losers I've seen in over 40 years watching Villa. Sank to the bottom of the table early on and never moved for the rest of the season.
To be fair, when he took over that wretched bunch hadn’t scored a goal for about 900 hours of football, and then it got quite exciting for a bit. We went on a cup run and looked good in some league games too! At the time it was great. Then we lost horribly at Southampton just before the cup final, & we just never looked the same again
…. there was a little while when he made those wretched bunch of losers inexplicably light up, before burning out again…
& that’s how I think of Tim Sherwood really - like a firework that burned really brightly for a while & then went pfffft.
….but it was a bit magical while it lasted.
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My overriding memory of Sherwood is his team being the most wretched bunch of losers I've seen in over 40 years watching Villa. Sank to the bottom of the table early on and never moved for the rest of the season.
To be fair, when he took over that wretched bunch hadn’t scored a goal for about 900 hours of football, and then it got quite exciting for a bit. We went on a cup run and looked good in some league games too! At the time it was great. Then we lost horribly at Southampton just before the cup final, & we just never looked the same again
…. there was a little while when he made those wretched bunch of losers inexplicably light up, before burning out again…
& that’s how I think of Tim Sherwood really - like a firework that burned really brightly for a while & then went pfffft.
….but it was a bit magical while it lasted.
I remember playing, I think, Burnley at home before the cup final, and their fans singing "Arsenal will murder you" and thinking, they're probably right. And they were.
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Someone mentioned it earlier , Hourihane , another very good steve Bruce signing as was Kodija and Adoma .
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Someone mentioned it earlier , Hourihane , another very good steve Bruce signing as was Kodija and Adoma .
Kod and Albert were signed under RDM.
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It’s pretty clear that there is universal agreement that Gerrard was ‘unloved’ here.
If you ever needed an endorsement of the difference between the previous two managers then their comments in recent days tell their own story.
One a humble man who has congratulated the club on getting into the top 4.
The other a self-indulgent berk who moaned the players didnt play for him, with not the slightest shred of congratulations.
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My overriding memory of Sherwood is his team being the most wretched bunch of losers I've seen in over 40 years watching Villa. Sank to the bottom of the table early on and never moved for the rest of the season.
To be fair, when he took over that wretched bunch hadn’t scored a goal for about 900 hours of football, and then it got quite exciting for a bit. We went on a cup run and looked good in some league games too! At the time it was great. Then we lost horribly at Southampton just before the cup final, & we just never looked the same again
…. there was a little while when he made those wretched bunch of losers inexplicably light up, before burning out again…
& that’s how I think of Tim Sherwood really - like a firework that burned really brightly for a while & then went pfffft.
….but it was a bit magical while it lasted.
It really was!
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I've said it many times but the biggest mystery of the lot to me was how O'Leary behaved. If he'd kept quiet he would have ridden the protest wave and been reasonably popular but instead he went out of his way to alienate everyone.
He simply hadn't got over losing the Leeds job which was the love of his life. Go back to those days and he really connected with their fanbase.
He never really tried to do that here from day one which was strange. First six months he kept on talking about Leeds and then after it was all small squad and the kids not being good enough.
Guess if you talked about Dean Smith to Norwich fans they'd probably say the exact same thing about him. Perhaps it's best for managers to have a year out of the game when they lose their dream job as Pochettino is another who's never sounded right after Spurs sacked him.
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I've said it many times but the biggest mystery of the lot to me was how O'Leary behaved. If he'd kept quiet he would have ridden the protest wave and been reasonably popular but instead he went out of his way to alienate everyone.
He simply hadn't got over losing the Leeds job which was the love of his life. Go back to those days and he really connected with their fanbase.
He never really tried to do that here from day one which was strange. First six months he kept on talking about Leeds and then after it was all small squad and the kids not being good enough.
Guess if you talked about Dean Smith to Norwich fans they'd probably say the exact same thing about him. Perhaps it's best for managers to have a year out of the game when they lose their dream job as Pochettino is another who's never sounded right after Spurs sacked him.
DOL will be remembered for his honest bunch of lads.
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I've said it many times but the biggest mystery of the lot to me was how O'Leary behaved. If he'd kept quiet he would have ridden the protest wave and been reasonably popular but instead he went out of his way to alienate everyone.
He simply hadn't got over losing the Leeds job which was the love of his life. Go back to those days and he really connected with their fanbase.
He never really tried to do that here from day one which was strange. First six months he kept on talking about Leeds and then after it was all small squad and the kids not being good enough.
Guess if you talked about Dean Smith to Norwich fans they'd probably say the exact same thing about him. Perhaps it's best for managers to have a year out of the game when they lose their dream job as Pochettino is another who's never sounded right after Spurs sacked him.
DOL will be remembered for his honest bunch of lads.
And being a twat
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How shit the final was doesn't alter how fantastic the QF and SF were. They were 2 fantastic days and always will be.
Just watching the YouTube coverage of that semi final again, we played some good stuff!
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When Saunders rang my house
*** CLANG! ***
Ron Saunders' daughter was my French and Spanish teacher...but no-one knew she was his daughter until she left the school.
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I've said it many times but the biggest mystery of the lot to me was how O'Leary behaved. If he'd kept quiet he would have ridden the protest wave and been reasonably popular but instead he went out of his way to alienate everyone.
I was informed by an ex pro that O’Leary was universally disliked by everyone in the game.
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That would help explain why he’s never worked again. Neither in the game nor as a pundit. I’m not surprised at all, the massive sugar bag.
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Three I actually could not stand, O Leary, Gerrard, and O'Neil after his first season.
Some I felt sorry/embarrassed for, Lambert , so out of his depth, rambling man, Bruce, limited , but lots of shit going on behind the scenes he picked himself up and went again. McLeish, cringeworthy appointment. Decent Human. Tactics Tim, should have left after keeping us up, always has a good word to say for us.
Heroes, Crowe, Ron, Brian, Big Ron, Barton, Worthy mention, The Doc, Gregory, Deano
The rest in my lifetime (maybe I missed a biggie) Forgettable, Cummins, Turner, Dr Jo, Black, Cox ?, Hollier, the Italian, the guy who took us and Man city down
Some pretty poor administrations along the way as well, from the guy who cycled to villa park, The Bendall's who if I remember correctly were crooks. Lermer after he lost interest and realised O Neil had spunked his money. Time has not softened my memory of Doug. And how did tony con his way in ?
Hopefully this really is a new dawn with owners and management.
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Pauliewalnuts has posted one of the greatest summaries ever posted on here.
Lambert - thought it was a great appointment and started well. Soon disintegrated. Those photos of him and Keane sat on the bench looking like a couple of piss soaked tramps just sum up that grim period perfectly.
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I've said it many times but the biggest mystery of the lot to me was how O'Leary behaved. If he'd kept quiet he would have ridden the protest wave and been reasonably popular but instead he went out of his way to alienate everyone.
I was informed by an ex pro that O’Leary was universally disliked by everyone in the game.
Twenty odd years is a long time though, surely at some point during that, at least one club must have thought about taking him on. Alan Curbishley is another one. Perhaps they both just waited a bit too long for the perfect job and then got forgotten about.
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That would help explain why he’s never worked again. Neither in the game nor as a pundit. I’m not surprised at all, the massive sugar bag.
Didnt he manage in the middle east for a bit?
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Paul Lambert became manager twelve years ago today.
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Liked:- Dean Smith.
Disliked:- David O'Leary. Wasn't overly keen on Gerrard either.
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I've said it many times but the biggest mystery of the lot to me was how O'Leary behaved. If he'd kept quiet he would have ridden the protest wave and been reasonably popular but instead he went out of his way to alienate everyone.
I was informed by an ex pro that O’Leary was universally disliked by everyone in the game.
Twenty odd years is a long time though, surely at some point during that, at least one club must have thought about taking him on. Alan Curbishley is another one. Perhaps they both just waited a bit too long for the perfect job and then got forgotten about.
Sounds like he had O’Neil levels of money and managerial freedom at Leeds and then was micro managed by Doug at Villa, two extremes for him. I didn’t remember Leeds doing so well under him, but just been reading back at it was 4th, 5th, 4th league finishes and UEFA and Champions league semi finals in his time, he had buckets of money though, so maybe he should of won something.
I remember being reasonably pleased when he got the Villa job, but from the outside looking in, it became clear very quickly that he was seemingly comparing his time at Villa with his time at Leeds, which just became toxic for us fans.
Doug couldn’t of helped with any of this.
As Clampy just said looks like his last managerial role was an unsuccessful year in the middle east till 2011. Seems like he’s made his millions and just retired early.
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I rembr hm gttng caught sndg sxy txts to a waitress. xxx lol
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The only positive part of the DOL era was winning at The Sty , Kevin Phillips goal.
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The only positive part of the DOL era was winning at The Sty , Kevin Phillips goal.
When he bought Solano we were ace for a bit, then we he left we were shite again.
Can't remember who it was who said as a player the only thing he was interested in was making money
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Someone mentioned it earlier , Hourihane , another very good steve Bruce signing as was Kodija and Adoma .
Kod and Albert were signed under RDM.
Is that every defence of Bruce from Coopers roundly seen off now?
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Three I actually could not stand, O Leary, Gerrard, and O'Neil after his first season.
Some I felt sorry/embarrassed for, Lambert , so out of his depth, rambling man, Bruce, limited , but lots of shit going on behind the scenes he picked himself up and went again. McLeish, cringeworthy appointment. Decent Human. Tactics Tim, should have left after keeping us up, always has a good word to say for us.
Heroes, Crowe, Ron, Brian, Big Ron, Barton, Worthy mention, The Doc, Gregory, Deano
The rest in my lifetime (maybe I missed a biggie) Forgettable, Cummins, Turner, Dr Jo, Black, Cox ?, Hollier, the Italian, the guy who took us and Man city down
Some pretty poor administrations along the way as well, from the guy who cycled to villa park, The Bendall's who if I remember correctly were crooks. Lermer after he lost interest and realised O Neil had spunked his money. Time has not softened my memory of Doug. And how did tony con his way in ?
Hopefully this really is a new dawn with owners and management.
You missed out Garde, which probably says a lot about how his tenure went.
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Pauliewalnuts has posted one of the greatest summaries ever posted on here.
Lambert - thought it was a great appointment and started well. Soon disintegrated. Those photos of him and Keane sat on the bench looking like a couple of piss soaked tramps just sum up that grim period perfectly.
Lambert might have had more goodwill if he'd left the previous Summer (I fully expected him to go and was amazed when the new season started that he was still here and even more so when he signed a new deal). There was no way back for him at the end as you couldn't defend it anymore.
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Can't remember who it was who said as a player the only thing he was interested in was making money
I remember reading stuff about him in WSC when it was still a bit edgy.
No idea why this stuck in my mind but I also remember they used to go on about what an arsehole Alan Ball was and how his Mrs would turn up at training when he was managing somewhere and shout at players through a loudhailer.
Pretty sure wsc was also one of the few publications (maybe the only one) who would acknowledge what everyone who met Bobby Charlton thought of him - ie he was an absolute wanker.
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Pauliewalnuts has posted one of the greatest summaries ever posted on here.
Lambert - thought it was a great appointment and started well. Soon disintegrated. Those photos of him and Keane sat on the bench looking like a couple of piss soaked tramps just sum up that grim period perfectly.
Lambert might have had more goodwill if he'd left the previous Summer (I fully expected him to go and was amazed when the new season started that he was still here and even more so when he signed a new deal). There was no way back for him at the end as you couldn't defend it anymore.
The original ‘ i now have the players to play it out the back and play possession football’ 😳
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Pauliewalnuts has posted one of the greatest summaries ever posted on here.
Lambert - thought it was a great appointment and started well. Soon disintegrated. Those photos of him and Keane sat on the bench looking like a couple of piss soaked tramps just sum up that grim period perfectly.
Lambert might have had more goodwill if he'd left the previous Summer (I fully expected him to go and was amazed when the new season started that he was still here and even more so when he signed a new deal). There was no way back for him at the end as you couldn't defend it anymore.
The original ‘ i now have the players to play it out the back and play possession football’ 😳
I always remember Lamberts first press conference. Although i was in favour of him getting the job, his body language was hunched up with his arms folded, almost as if he was on the defensive straight away.
That said, the first season there were some encouraging signs. We played Liverpool off the park up there and then the Sunderland game. The 15 goals of Christmas and the Bradford humiliation spooked him and we were dull as ditchwater after that.
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They came before Sunderland.
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The only positive part of the DOL era was winning at The Sty , Kevin Phillips goal.
When he bought Solano we were ace for a bit, then we he left we were shite again.
Can't remember who it was who said as a player the only thing he was interested in was making money
I recall DOL's agent was also his lawyer . Always prepared for a tribunal that bloke.
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That would help explain why he’s never worked again. Neither in the game nor as a pundit. I’m not surprised at all, the massive sugar bag.
Financially he didn't need to work again. He had a gig out in Saudi, naturally enough, after us. Big payoff there too. Baros, maybe his big signing, disappointed really.
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That would help explain why he’s never worked again. Neither in the game nor as a pundit. I’m not surprised at all, the massive sugar bag.
Financially he didn't need to work again. He had a gig out in Saudi, naturally enough, after us. Big payoff there too. Baros, maybe his big signing, disappointed really.
The only good thing about Baros was that Houllier somehow deemed him worth one John Carew, which is also the best thing Houllier did for us.
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Tony Cascarino said that when they were in the RoI squad O'Leary would talk about anything except football.
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Tony Cascarino said that when they were in the RoI squad O'Leary would talk about anything except football.
I’m surprised O’Leary ever talked about anything other than himself.
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That would help explain why he’s never worked again. Neither in the game nor as a pundit. I’m not surprised at all, the massive sugar bag.
Financially he didn't need to work again. He had a gig out in Saudi, naturally enough, after us. Big payoff there too. Baros, maybe his big signing, disappointed really.
The only good thing about Baros was that Houllier somehow deemed him worth one John Carew, which is also the best thing Houllier did for us.
I think that was MON wasnt it? Carew came in the same January window as Ashley Young didnt he?
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O'Leary - thought he was bigger than the club. Did decent job to start with but alienated people so much, in the end even Chris Smith had had enough of him.
Ha! In defence of Chris he was right that we needed to break the three year managerial cycle. The problem with his demand was we kept hiring poor managers. Hopefully now he's happy to be finally right regarding managers. ;)
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That would help explain why he’s never worked again. Neither in the game nor as a pundit. I’m not surprised at all, the massive sugar bag.
Financially he didn't need to work again. He had a gig out in Saudi, naturally enough, after us. Big payoff there too. Baros, maybe his big signing, disappointed really.
The only good thing about Baros was that Houllier somehow deemed him worth one John Carew, which is also the best thing Houllier did for us.
I think that was MON wasnt it? Carew came in the same January window as Ashley Young didnt he?
Houllier was manager of Lyon at the time so sanctioned the Baros/Carew deal from their side.
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I've said it many times but the biggest mystery of the lot to me was how O'Leary behaved. If he'd kept quiet he would have ridden the protest wave and been reasonably popular but instead he went out of his way to alienate everyone.
I was informed by an ex pro that O’Leary was universally disliked by everyone in the game.
That would be because he was a disreputable morally defunct shitbag of a human being.
If he was a tradesman doing work at my house I would be worrying about him ripping me off.
If I was in a group drink with him I would be worried if he was going to stand his round.
If I had been a professional footballer and he was my manager I would be talking to my agent,
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Every summer DOL took us to Sweden to play a plethora of Scandinavian pub teams.
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I seem to recall Steve Stride said that even though it didn't work out, he always got on alright with O'Leary.
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That would help explain why he’s never worked again. Neither in the game nor as a pundit. I’m not surprised at all, the massive sugar bag.
Financially he didn't need to work again. He had a gig out in Saudi, naturally enough, after us. Big payoff there too. Baros, maybe his big signing, disappointed really.
The only good thing about Baros was that Houllier somehow deemed him worth one John Carew, which is also the best thing Houllier did for us.
I think that was MON wasnt it? Carew came in the same January window as Ashley Young didnt he?
Houllier was manager of Lyon at the time so sanctioned the Baros/Carew deal from their side.
Ah, ok, i read it wrong, stand corrected
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Tony Cascarino said that when they were in the RoI squad O'Leary would talk about anything except football.
I’m surprised O’Leary ever talked about anything other than himself.
That was him.
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When he started talking about himself in the third person I knew then we had a problem.
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When he started talking about himself in the third person I knew then we had a problem.
Tokyo Sexwhale hates that.
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Baros I didn't mind but he seemed to like to hit the deck a lot which was extremely frustrating when he was probably in a better position to try and go for go.
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Baros I didn't mind but he seemed to like to hit the deck a lot which was extremely frustrating when he was probably in a better position to try and go for go.
Startd off OK, but soon showed his limitations. He just ran with his head down looking at the ball the whole time, which seemed like a bit of an issue for a footballer. No awareness around him whatsoever.
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Remember that Berson guy we signed? Was huge hype, he came in and looked neat and tidy and then didn't play again and was just loaned out for a year or two.
Pretty much identical to Sanson. Our record with French players isn't the best.
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Remember that Berson guy we signed? Was huge hype, he came in and looked neat and tidy and then didn't play again and was just loaned out for a year or two.
Pretty much identical to Sanson. Our record with French players isn't the best.
Ginola, Amavi, Makoun II, Veretout, Six. It's a long list.
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Remember that Berson guy we signed? Was huge hype, he came in and looked neat and tidy and then didn't play again and was just loaned out for a year or two.
Pretty much identical to Sanson. Our record with French players isn't the best.
Ginola, Amavi, Makoun II, Veretout, Six. It's a long list.
Guilbert, N'Zogbia, Pires...
Thankfully, Digne, Kamara and Diaby seem to have broken the curse.
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I'd put a pretty heavy * next to Amavi and Guilbert in that list. 1 was a good player who did ok despite a horrible injury but was always going to look at moving on (and being moved on) after relegation once he proved his fitness and the other was a player signed by a championship club who unexpectedly got promotion before he actually arrived and despite that he did ok for us.
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Liked
Saunders / Barton
Atkinson
Taylor
Little
Smith
Disliked
O'Leary
McNeill
Garde
Lambert
Di Matteo
Liked as a person but didn't rate as a manager
Turner
Mcleish
Bruce
Venglos
Gerrard
Liked for a while
ONeill
Gregory
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Tony Cascarino said that when they were in the RoI squad O'Leary would talk about anything except football.
Cas absolutely hates O'Leary, it's kind of a strange one as they were teammates for years but weren't competing for the same position. DOL has an uncanny ability to piss people off, Charlton of course exiled him from the international squad for years in one of his first acts as Ireland manager. Martin Laursen is another one who can't stand him.
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Pissing off personalities as diverse Tony Cascarino, Jack Charlton and Martin Laursen is quite the range.
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Remember that Berson guy we signed? Was huge hype, he came in and looked neat and tidy and then didn't play again and was just loaned out for a year or two.
Pretty much identical to Sanson. Our record with French players isn't the best.
Ginola, Amavi, Makoun II, Veretout, Six. It's a long list.
There is an even longer list of English players who have been shit for us. Our record with English players is therefore worse.
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Remember that Berson guy we signed? Was huge hype, he came in and looked neat and tidy and then didn't play again and was just loaned out for a year or two.
Pretty much identical to Sanson. Our record with French players isn't the best.
Ginola, Amavi, Makoun II, Veretout, Six. It's a long list.
There is an even longer list of English players who have been shit for us. Our record with English players is therefore worse.
No BE. We've already 'gone foreign' and it hasn't worked.
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Can someone help me out here? I'm trying to remember the name of a manager who Dean Saunders hated (and most of the players). There was some story about the manager and a player having a scrap and Dean saying he wanted to kick the manager while he was down. I think Dean was pissed at someone scoring as well as it kept him in a job. I heard it on the Socially Distant Sports Bar podcast a while ago so it was probably a Wales manager. It's just bugging me that I can't remember.
Edit: Ignore. I did what I should have done in the first place and looked at all the Wales managers he played under. It was Bobby Gould.
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Can someone help me out here? I'm trying to remember the name of a manager who Dean Saunders hated (and most of the players). There was some story about the manager and a player having a scrap and Dean saying he wanted to kick the manager while he was down. I think Dean was pissed at someone scoring as well as it kept him in a job. I heard it on the Socially Distant Sports Bar podcast a while ago so it was probably a Wales manager. It's just bugging me that I can't remember.
Edit: Ignore. I did what I should have done in the first place and looked at all the Wales managers he played under. It was Bobby Gould.
Before you got the end I'd ruled out Villa (Little/BFR), Oxford and Derby (Arthur Cox) so it was either Souness or Gould.
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Can someone help me out here? I'm trying to remember the name of a manager who Dean Saunders hated (and most of the players). There was some story about the manager and a player having a scrap and Dean saying he wanted to kick the manager while he was down. I think Dean was pissed at someone scoring as well as it kept him in a job. I heard it on the Socially Distant Sports Bar podcast a while ago so it was probably a Wales manager. It's just bugging me that I can't remember.
Edit: Ignore. I did what I should have done in the first place and looked at all the Wales managers he played under. It was Bobby Gould.
Before you got the end I'd ruled out Villa (Little/BFR), Oxford and Derby (Arthur Cox) so it was either Souness or Gould.
Dropping Savage for jokingly chucking a Maldini shirt in the bin and then reinstating him a day later. Sounds like a bit of a.. err... character.
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Can someone help me out here? I'm trying to remember the name of a manager who Dean Saunders hated (and most of the players). There was some story about the manager and a player having a scrap and Dean saying he wanted to kick the manager while he was down. I think Dean was pissed at someone scoring as well as it kept him in a job. I heard it on the Socially Distant Sports Bar podcast a while ago so it was probably a Wales manager. It's just bugging me that I can't remember.
Edit: Ignore. I did what I should have done in the first place and looked at all the Wales managers he played under. It was Bobby Gould.
Before you got the end I'd ruled out Villa (Little/BFR), Oxford and Derby (Arthur Cox) so it was either Souness or Gould.
Dropping Savage for jokingly chucking a Maldini shirt in the bin and then reinstating him a day later. Sounds like a bit of a.. err... character.
Wales were also training at a prison before games in those times. No wonder Giggs never wanted to play for them.
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Respected/Revered: Crowe, Saunders, Taylor, Big Ron, TMWWOW, Gregory(at least the start),
MO'N (in some respects), Bruce(see across), Deano, Unai.
The rest (I started in 1965) were either not very good or were in a near-impossible situation where the way the club was run made any progress very difficult. (e.g. Joe Mercer).
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Liked: Saunders Atkinson & Taylor
Disliked: O'Leary, McNeill & Di Matteo
Trying to forget: Bruce, Garde and Lambert
Absolutely hate with every fibre of my being and that's putting it VERY mildly: Houllier and Gerrard .
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Can someone help me out here? I'm trying to remember the name of a manager who Dean Saunders hated (and most of the players). There was some story about the manager and a player having a scrap and Dean saying he wanted to kick the manager while he was down. I think Dean was pissed at someone scoring as well as it kept him in a job. I heard it on the Socially Distant Sports Bar podcast a while ago so it was probably a Wales manager. It's just bugging me that I can't remember.
Edit: Ignore. I did what I should have done in the first place and looked at all the Wales managers he played under. It was Bobby Gould.
Before you got the end I'd ruled out Villa (Little/BFR), Oxford and Derby (Arthur Cox) so it was either Souness or Gould.
Dropping Savage for jokingly chucking a Maldini shirt in the bin and then reinstating him a day later. Sounds like a bit of a.. err... character.
Wales were also training at a prison before games in those times. No wonder Giggs never wanted to play for them.
I think it was Mark Hately on the Under the Cosh podcast recently that said Gould was a wanker, literally his words.
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Steve Bruce is now at Blackpool and I wish him well. It was frustrating under him but certainly didn't dislike him like Gerrard.
Dean Smith has and will always have my greatest affection
I honestly believe if had kept faith then would have turned it around from 5 defeats.
There was a rebuild going on after losing Grealish and he always said there was context and mitigating circumstances.
I love Deano how can anyone not watch this and feel warmth and remind us of the happy times under his tenure. I watch all his Charlotte FC work and love how he speaks about football
This is his latest press conference - just a reminder for those who wonder about him
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Loved the two Ron's, Dean, SGT, Brian and Unai's about to join them.
Special ire reserved for MON who blew the greatest opportunity for years to progress, squandered tens of millions of Lerners money, fucked off 6 days before the season started and from that moment on Lerner didn't want to know thus starting a chain of events which eventually led to relegation, Lambert, Garde, Bruce and the cabbage.
Prick.
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Taylor
Emery
Saunders
Atkinson
Little
Smith
Gregory
Barton
MON
Bruce
McLeish
Venglos
Garde
RDM
Sherwood
Turner
McNeil
DOL
Gerrard
Lambert
Don't think I've missed anyone!
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McNeill is still a massive twat. Wanker.
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In order:
- The Scouse Fraud (just soooo out of his depth)
- DimTim (out of his depth)
- McNeill (couldn't swim and had no water wings)
- MON (wantonly vindictive toward the club)
- Bruce (just fuckin' meh, to the nth)
- McLeish (should never have been appointed - he had no credibility at club level)
- DOL (Not totally a bad manager; just couldn't resist alienating the fanbase with his motormouth).
All of the above muppets suffered from an overwhelming sense of self-importance and an inflated opinion of their own ability. But MON is the one I feel most antagonistic about: he came in as part of the post-Ellis clean-up and promised so much. Ultimately, he allowed his ego to override the promised-land opportunity that Villa offered; the chance of sainthood sacrificed at the altar of personal vanity.
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No way Tim Sherwood who got us to a cup final is above that prick DOL. And that list probably should include Remi Garde who fucked up whatever good reputation he had by making a bad situation way worse.
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In order:
- The Scouse Fraud (just soooo out of his depth)
- DimTim (out of his depth)
- McNeill (couldn't swim and had no water wings)
- MON (wantonly vindictive toward the club)
- Bruce (just fuckin' meh, to the nth)
- McLeish (should never have been appointed - he had no credibility at club level)
- DOL (Not totally a bad manager; just couldn't resist alienating the fanbase with his motormouth).
All of the above muppets suffered from an overwhelming sense of self-importance and an inflated opinion of their own ability. But MON is the one I feel most antagonistic about: he came in as part of the post-Ellis clean-up and promised so much. Ultimately, he allowed his ego to override the promised-land opportunity that Villa offered; the chance of sainthood sacrificed at the altar of personal vanity.
Bit harsh on McLeish there, in my opinion. He wasn't good enough but always seemed a decent bloke.
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In order:
- The Scouse Fraud (just soooo out of his depth)
- DimTim (out of his depth)
- McNeill (couldn't swim and had no water wings)
- MON (wantonly vindictive toward the club)
- Bruce (just fuckin' meh, to the nth)
- McLeish (should never have been appointed - he had no credibility at club level)
- DOL (Not totally a bad manager; just couldn't resist alienating the fanbase with his motormouth).
All of the above muppets suffered from an overwhelming sense of self-importance and an inflated opinion of their own ability. But MON is the one I feel most antagonistic about: he came in as part of the post-Ellis clean-up and promised so much. Ultimately, he allowed his ego to override the promised-land opportunity that Villa offered; the chance of sainthood sacrificed at the altar of personal vanity.
McNeil was slight before I was really following things so I have no strong opinion of him. Otherwise all those you've named are my shit-list. After that Venglos, Houllier, Lambert, Garde and RDM were all pretty shit but not enough for me to hate them because I think they all had problems to deal with which had a big impact, I'd consider shifting McLeish into that group as well. Everyone else from Taylor mk1 on I'm glad were with us.
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... Venglos, Houllier, Lambert, Garde and RDM were all pretty shit but not enough for me to hate them because I think they all had problems to deal with which had a big impact, I'd consider shifting McLeish into that group as well. Everyone else from Taylor mk1 on I'm glad were with us.
Yes, agreed.
- Venglos: before his time, and Ellis saw what the man had but not how it would play out in the context of the First Division.
- Houllier: okay, RedScouse-blind but I think he saw what was needed even if he couldn't get the changes over the line.
- Lambert: I was definitely an advocate but he vacillated and was then caught up in Lerner's travails.
- Garde: simply, the wrong man at the wrong time.
- RDM: shit but not totally dislikeable.
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Bit harsh on McLeish there, in my opinion. He wasn't good enough but always seemed a decent bloke.
Harsh but - and you know this! - true.
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No way Tim Sherwood who got us to a cup final is above that prick DOL. And that list probably should include Remi Garde who fucked up whatever good reputation he had by making a bad situation way worse.
Sorry: Tim was simply Dim! Out of his depth even if he came across as a likeable bloke.
I resent him for one reason: he fucked up at Leicester when the team was flying, and we never recovered from that. Funnily enough, when I looked recently at the DOL period, we did okay then: he was doomed both because of Ellis but also because of his constant demeaning of the club.
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MON is the only one that knowingly set out to damage the club. The others on the shit list were all levels of crap but I don't think there was any pre-meditated sabotage. I'd be tempted to throw Eric Black in there too, but he was only caretaker.
My list would be :
Saunders
Taylor
Barton
Atkinson
Little
Emery (and climbing...)
Smith
Houllier
Gregory
Bruce
McLeish
Venglos
Garde
RDM
Sherwood
Turner
DOL
Lambert
McNeil
MON / Gerrard
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I still have a soft spot for Sherwood. Like that time you experiment at a festival and have a mad trip before it all comes crashing down a few hours later.
Sherwood's tenure was like that. Wild high scoring games at the start, a genuinely great performance v Liverpool before Southampton 6-1 found him out. He also gave Grealish a proper chance when Lambert had barely used him for six months.
After Vlaar, Benteke and especially Delph all left within weeks he had no chance and I think deep down he knew it. Yes I know plenty didn't like him dismissing our signings and absolving himself but Garde didn't really get that much better from likes of Veretout and the strategy for that summer was always a major gamble.
The Leicester game management at 2-0 was completely idiotic though. If we'd sacked him a week later we'd have probably got in Big Sam and had a decent chance at staying up but we needed to go down to properly reset as a club.
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Sherwood is a fucking dickhead.
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Why is he a dickhead? Never says a bad word about us. Always complimentary when he speaks about the club. He should never have got the job. He gave us some bright moments in a very dark time. Inevitably he failed because he wasn’t good enough.
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Sherwood is a complete prick. Sulking and refusing to pick certain players that he didn't sign even though they were clearly better than the ones he signed and he knew the transfer arrangement when he signed up. He basically guaranteed our relegation, and did absolutely nothing to reduce the poisonous and xenophobic atmosphere around the club.
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I'm very much in the 'Sherwood is a prick' camp.
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Sherwood was in charge of a dressing room that became as toxic as anything we've seen at the club. Whether that makes him a prick or not is up to you but it undeniably puts him firmly in the race to be our worst manager.
I hate him for making me ashamed of us for the only time.
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Sherwood is definitely a dickhead, but I don't mind him too much, as far as dickheads go.
Think he gets way too much credit for the FA Cup, considering we were already in the QF before he took over, and the final was just mortifying.
Equally, I think he gave us a short term boost and kept us up with our league performances.
He should've been given a nice little bonus after the season ended, and cut loose. I would add 'easy with the gift of hindsight', but those were my thoughts at the time.
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I think that Sherwood was exactly what we need when he was appointed. I think sometimes we forget how bad things were when he arrived. Pretty much everyone thought we were down after that Hull defeat and 'performance'. We needed a cocky fecker to come in and use enthusiasm and cockiness etc to lift everything, players and fans. It sounds stupid now but his "A sherwood team wins" kind of guff was needed.
I also think he was exactly what we didn't need to be in charge at the start of the following season.
Always my view on Sherwood.
I think people forget just how bad we were before he came in. Which was sort of unofficially Leicester in the 5th round.
At the point he joined we were on a run of 2 wins and 8 goals in 21 league games.
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I think that Sherwood was exactly what we need when he was appointed. I think sometimes we forget how bad things were when he arrived. Pretty much everyone thought we were down after that Hull defeat and 'performance'. We needed a cocky fecker to come in and use enthusiasm and cockiness etc to lift everything, players and fans. It sounds stupid now but his "A sherwood team wins" kind of guff was needed.
I also think he was exactly what we didn't need to be in charge at the start of the following season.
Always my view on Sherwood.
I think people forget just how bad we were before he came in. Which was sort of unofficially Leicester in the 5th round.
At the point he joined we were on a run of 2 wins and 8 goals in 21 league games.
Agreed.
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The one I love Dean Smith has agreed a new contract with Charlotte FC until 2027. Now in his second season in charge.
In 2024, Smith guided Charlotte to a franchise-record 51 points and its first-ever playoff victory.
"I've thoroughly enjoyed being the head coach of Charlotte FC and I'm honoured to sign a new contract with the club”
"Everyone at the club is aligned in our vision to be a leader in Major League Soccer. To our supporters, you have made our family feel welcome in this city and for that we're grateful to each one of you. We will work together with the aim of consistently challenging for major trophies every season."
Good Luck Deano. Class act.
I think he’ll be back at Villa in some capacity one day.
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Agreed, footy.
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I think that Sherwood was exactly what we need when he was appointed. I think sometimes we forget how bad things were when he arrived. Pretty much everyone thought we were down after that Hull defeat and 'performance'. We needed a cocky fecker to come in and use enthusiasm and cockiness etc to lift everything, players and fans. It sounds stupid now but his "A sherwood team wins" kind of guff was needed.
I also think he was exactly what we didn't need to be in charge at the start of the following season.
Always my view on Sherwood.
I think people forget just how bad we were before he came in. Which was sort of unofficially Leicester in the 5th round.
At the point he joined we were on a run of 2 wins and 8 goals in 21 league games.
At the time he left he had taken us back to a similar level of crapness. The relegation is on him.
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Lambo in season 2012/13 was fielding the youngest team - in part to make a point to the Owner.
youngest average age of starting 11
(https://i.ibb.co/2G8LNP6/Screenshot-20250322-205236-2.png) (https://ibb.co/2G8LNP6)
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Gerrard is by far the biggest wanker we’ve had managing our club. It’s not even close.
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Agree.
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David O'Leary has entered the room.
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David O'Leary has entered the room.
He probably gets away with it because there were at least some good results and performances under him and we were never seriously in relegation danger under him. As far as I can remember anyway!
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David O'Leary has entered the room.
He probably gets away with it because there were at least some good results and performances under him and we were never seriously in relegation danger under him. As far as I can remember anyway!
We absolutely were in danger. We were favourites to go down if he hadn't been mutually agreemented.
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Yeah I'm not a fan of O'Leary at all. Always thought he was above us.
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Also there is a Kamara factor that sends the title DO’Ls way.
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With all managers, when things are going well on the pitch a lot is forgiven. DO'L would have been pretty much universally popular in the summer of 2004 I think. Even under Gerrard we had an initial bounce and some decent results in his first few months that suggested he knew what he was doing. With both of them, as soon as the wheels came off on the pitch, their thin skinned arrogance was there for all to see. Pair of twats.
I still put Lambert above them in the hatred stakes though. His team were so monumentally depressing to watch in that winter of 2014/15 and then all that crap he came out with about wanting to be sacked afterwards. Bellend.
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I think that Sherwood was exactly what we need when he was appointed. I think sometimes we forget how bad things were when he arrived. Pretty much everyone thought we were down after that Hull defeat and 'performance'. We needed a cocky fecker to come in and use enthusiasm and cockiness etc to lift everything, players and fans. It sounds stupid now but his "A sherwood team wins" kind of guff was needed.
I also think he was exactly what we didn't need to be in charge at the start of the following season.
Always my view on Sherwood.
I think people forget just how bad we were before he came in. Which was sort of unofficially Leicester in the 5th round.
At the point he joined we were on a run of 2 wins and 8 goals in 21 league games.
At the time he left he had taken us back to a similar level of crapness. The relegation is on him.
Ideally, with hindsight, Sherwood needed to go after the FA Cup Final - however, whoever came in the next season we was going down - no way could we handle losing Benteke and Delph, less so Vlaar - but we lost all leadership.
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Lambert was the most depressingly bad one, but don't think he was as up his own backside as DOL and Stevie Me.
Im terms of actually hating them, I'd have DOL 1st and Gerrard 2nd.
DOL had such an overinflated opinion of himself and thought Villa were nothing.
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with DOL, do you think he'd have done better than MON, with those players and the money?
my god he was a bell end.
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With all managers, when things are going well on the pitch a lot is forgiven. DO'L would have been pretty much universally popular in the summer of 2004 I think. Even under Gerrard we had an initial bounce and some decent results in his first few months that suggested he knew what he was doing. With both of them, as soon as the wheels came off on the pitch, their thin skinned arrogance was there for all to see. Pair of twats.
I still put Lambert above them in the hatred stakes though. His team were so monumentally depressing to watch in that winter of 2014/15 and then all that crap he came out with about wanting to be sacked afterwards. Bellend.
Remember him saying we were outstanding when we were absolute dross and his treatment of Darren Bent. Lambert was an idiot.
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I don't really hate O'Leary. Really enjoyed that season we finished sixth. It wasn't a bad side and Angel was at his best. Yeah, he was a twat, but we definitely weren't underachieving, aside from the final season.
Lambert's tenure was just a pit of misery, but the rug had been pulled by that point and it sits with Lerner rather than the manager. Did I like him? No. Did he have much to work with? Also no.
I really save it for the two who had a great opportunity and blew it. O'Neill and Gerrard. The former set us up for years of misery by blowing a fortune and achieving fuck all (same highest position as DOL), whilst Gerrard took a top 6-8 squad and turned it into relegation fodder. It's that which winds me up more than if they're a cock or not.
And the both are, fwiw.
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What was Gerrard’s role in the Kamara signing? Was he as influential as is supposedly the case?
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Northampton Town boss Kevin Nolan says he finds it hard to believe Steve Bruce is managing at the same level as him.
"He's a top manager, I can't believe he's in League One. Someone of his calibre and experience, I didn't ever think I'd see him at this level”
With Villa, despite being a Prem experience manager, some of the football Bruce served up at times was even lower!
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Sherwood is definitely a dickhead, but I don't mind him too much, as far as dickheads go.
Think he gets way too much credit for the FA Cup, considering we were already in the QF before he took over, and the final was just mortifying.
Equally, I think he gave us a short term boost and kept us up with our league performances.
He should've been given a nice little bonus after the season ended, and cut loose. I would add 'easy with the gift of hindsight', but those were my thoughts at the time.
He did keep us up though. By the end of Lambert's reign we looked completely doomed. That last night in Hull was rock bottom stuff. He galvanised us a bit anyway and we stayed up. He's like that fling you have at the end of a relationship. Great fun until you realise they are single for many reasons.
Sherwood is a complete spoofer let's be honest, naturally never managed again and found his true calling in the SSN studio.
Houllier and Gerrard were the two worst I think. Both had decent players and budgets available to them but were woeful at man management.
Up to Emery, Villa Park was a managerial graveyard for 30 years. We finished the careers of most of them.
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The sad thing about Lambert is that he clearly had something in his early days, but he seemed to decide that £X million was enough to be Lerner's human shield for a few years. I wonder whether he still feels that way.
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I absolutely couldn’t stand Houllier at Villa. He may have inherited in his view an undisciplined lot from O’Neil, but he also gave off the feeling that we were beneath him. That watery eyed touching the Anfield sign shite when we played up there, was totally disrespectful to our support. Not related to this point, but he also played a much weakened team in a FA Cup QF replay at an imminently beatable Man City at that time, when we were pretty much mid-table.
Gerrard was a massive tosser, massively out of his depth. There have been so many highs under Emery, so this is a minor victory compared, but the fact Emery’s successes have shed no doubt on Gerrard utter shiteness as a football manager, is a lovely added bonus.
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with DOL, do you think he'd have done better than MON, with those players and the money?
my god he was a bell end.
I actually reckon he would have done better with the money MON had. With the limited money DOL had (as he was forever telling us) apart from Djemba djemba, he spent it quite well with Sorensen, McCann, Solano, Laursen, Bouma, Hughes all coming in for relatively little money. Baros was decent in his first season although relatively expensive. Phillips was a good signing as a back up striker.
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Nah, like Gregory, O'Leary was a chequebook manager with no eye for a player. The more he spent the worse we got.
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... I really save it for the two who had a great opportunity and blew it. O'Neill and Gerrard. The former set us up for years of misery by blowing a fortune and achieving fuck all (same highest position as DOL), whilst Gerrard took a top 6-8 squad and turned it into relegation fodder. It's that which winds me up more than if they're a cock or not.
And the both are, fwiw.
I think this is where I'm at. I abhor McNeill and Bruce but MON and Stevie Me take the biscuit.
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Nah, like Gregory, O'Leary was a chequebook manager with no eye for a player. The more he spent the worse we got.
His only real outlay was Baros. The rest were pretty much all around the couple of million mark unless I’ve missed some.
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O'Leary felt like a bloke who thought he was doing us a favour by 'stooping' to our level. He thought he was stamping his authority by taking the decision to drop Ollie Mellberg on the opening day at Portsmouth when all he was doing was weakening the team. See also Gerrard with Tyrone Mings. Alienating a fan favourite at the beginning of a managerial reign rarely ends well.
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David O'Leary has entered the room.
He probably gets away with it because there were at least some good results and performances under him and we were never seriously in relegation danger under him. As far as I can remember anyway!
We absolutely were in danger. We were favourites to go down if he hadn't been mutually agreemented.
Where did we finish the season before he was let go? My memory is hazy. I don't remember it being such a struggle under him as under say McLeish, Houlier, Lambert. I do remember a lot of fan anger, aimed at both DOL and Doug though.
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I detested DOL and I still do to this day. I had a seat a couple of rows back from the dugout those seasons. He must've been sick of my voice.
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David O'Leary has entered the room.
He probably gets away with it because there were at least some good results and performances under him and we were never seriously in relegation danger under him. As far as I can remember anyway!
We absolutely were in danger. We were favourites to go down if he hadn't been mutually agreemented.
Where did we finish the season before he was let go? My memory is hazy. I don't remember it being such a struggle under him as under say McLeish, Houlier, Lambert. I do remember a lot of fan anger, aimed at both DOL and Doug though.
We got progressively worse under D'OL. 6th in the first season (a decent second half of the season but still missed out of Europe after losing to 9 player Man Utd on the last day), 10th and then 16th in 2005/06.
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I detested DOL and I still do to this day. I had a seat a couple of rows back from the dugout those seasons. He must've been sick of my voice.
His agent was also his lawyer which kind of summed him up .
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We were sixteenth in his last season. I remember the VP game against Small Heath and it felt like whoever lost would go down. Luckily it was them.
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McNeil for me closely followed by Gerrard, then DO’L and MO’N, both should have done better with their squads and money.
I think Houllier, although unpopular, would have turned us around.
McLeish was hamstrung by cost cutting and should never have taken the job.
To a degree, so was Lambert, he bought decent young players, but unfortunately we’re not ready for the premier league. He, and these players, would have been perfect once we were relegated
On the ‘Love’ side
Dean Smith
Graham Taylor
Brian Little
And Vic Crowe
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I was in the Lower Holte for the last match v Sunderland and although we won when he and the players did the lap of appreciation loads were throwing their ST books onto the pitch. Or were aiming them at him.
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McNeil for me closely followed by Gerrard, then DO’L and MO’N, both should have done better with their squads and money.
I think Houllier, although unpopular, would have turned us around.
McLeish was hamstrung by cost cutting and should never have taken the job.
To a degree, so was Lambert, he bought decent young players, but unfortunately we’re not ready for the premier league. He, and these players, would have been perfect once we were relegated
On the ‘Love’ side
Dean Smith
Graham Taylor
Brian Little
And Vic Crowe
Those would probably be mine. But if you are going back as far as Vic Crowe, surely Ron Saunders should be in there. And I could be persuaded to include Ron Atkinson.
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McNeil for me closely followed by Gerrard, then DO’L and MO’N, both should have done better with their squads and money.
I think Houllier, although unpopular, would have turned us around.
McLeish was hamstrung by cost cutting and should never have taken the job.
To a degree, so was Lambert, he bought decent young players, but unfortunately we’re not ready for the premier league. He, and these players, would have been perfect once we were relegated
On the ‘Love’ side
Dean Smith
Graham Taylor
Brian Little
And Vic Crowe
Those would probably be mine. But if you are going back as far as Vic Crowe, surely Ron Saunders should be in there. And I could be persuaded to include Ron Atkinson.
Tony Barton needs adding obviously.
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McNeil for me closely followed by Gerrard, then DO’L and MO’N, both should have done better with their squads and money.
I think Houllier, although unpopular, would have turned us around.
McLeish was hamstrung by cost cutting and should never have taken the job.
To a degree, so was Lambert, he bought decent young players, but unfortunately we’re not ready for the premier league. He, and these players, would have been perfect once we were relegated
On the ‘Love’ side
Dean Smith
Graham Taylor
Brian Little
And Vic Crowe
Those would probably be mine. But if you are going back as far as Vic Crowe, surely Ron Saunders should be in there. And I could be persuaded to include Ron Atkinson.
Tony Barton needs adding obviously.
Hang my head in shame, how on earth did I forget those two 🫣
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Disappointed Deano lost away to Colorado the weekend . 2-0 away defeat.
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David O'Leary has entered the room.
He probably gets away with it because there were at least some good results and performances under him and we were never seriously in relegation danger under him. As far as I can remember anyway!
We absolutely were in danger. We were favourites to go down if he hadn't been mutually agreemented.
Where did we finish the season before he was let go? My memory is hazy. I don't remember it being such a struggle under him as under say McLeish, Houlier, Lambert. I do remember a lot of fan anger, aimed at both DOL and Doug though.
It was a struggle for sure. The fickle bedsheets over the Holte End. That game at Arsenal at the end, he was only asking to be fired really. Not all his fault, Ellis provided little or no support when it was needed. MON has spoken recently that he was discussing the role with Lerner long before he joined so maybe both Ellis and DOL knew what was coming.
After coming 6th in 03/04 - which was some achievement - considering the mess left after Taylor - lots of talented young players and the likes of JPA and Barry transformed - we got in Laursen and dross like the Djemba twins and Berson. Crouch, which was a mistake, was let go to fund a loan for Calton Cole. We had no chance of kicking on.
DOL for the sake of his reputation should have walked then really. What possessed him to iniate the heave against Ellis with the "players statement" we will never know. Echoes of his book of "Leeds on trial" when two of his players literally were on trial. Utterly dislikeable guy but a long way from our worst manager.
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Martin O'Neill is on pitch side pundit duty on TNT sports for the Forest v Man Utd match.