Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: BC Villain on December 10, 2023, 08:39:40 PM
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Putting aside all of the 'O'Neill was a tosser for running off when he couldn't get what he wanted" stuff, how would Emery's side fare against the last Villa side to challenge this high up the table?
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Emery’s team would win. He would focus on MON’s plan A and nullify it. Game over.
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Emery vs O'Neill is just not a fair comparison. Emery is so far ahead it's unreal. I know people who have worked with O'Neill and they all say the same. An egotistical, ignorant man. His lack of tactical nous and lack of ability to bring in players who could take us to the next level was plainly obvious. The 2023 model would smash O'Neill's Villa. Milner and Barry might get a game on a regular basis but the others would struggle.
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Emery’s team would win. He would focus on MON’s plan A and nullify it. Game over.
Emery's Villa are brilliant at home, whereas O'Neill's team was better suited to being on the road. We tend to have problems with teams who are conservative at home, which was arguably the strongest facet of O'Neill's Villa.
Emery is clearly a far better manager operating at a level O'Neill could only dream of however
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O’Neill’s reign was completely unsustainable. I spent the whole time hoping that we could somehow fluke top four because it was clear that the wheels were about to fall off. It doesn’t feel like this with Emery. In terms of which team would win, as TV had said, Emery would have a plan to nullify O’Neill.
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Emery vs O'Neill is just not a fair comparison. Emery is so far ahead it's unreal. I know people who have worked with O'Neill and they all say the same. An egotistical, ignorant man. His lack of tactical nous and lack of ability to bring in players who could take us to the next level was plainly obvious. The 2023 model would smash O'Neill's Villa. Milner and Barry might get a game on a regular basis but the others would struggle.
I’d say Young and a fit Laursen would be fine. I agree with your post though.
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I think Unai's team would win.
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Emery vs O'Neill is just not a fair comparison. Emery is so far ahead it's unreal. I know people who have worked with O'Neill and they all say the same. An egotistical, ignorant man. His lack of tactical nous and lack of ability to bring in players who could take us to the next level was plainly obvious. The 2023 model would smash O'Neill's Villa. Milner and Barry might get a game on a regular basis but the others would struggle.
Ashley Young was getting a game on a regular basis for Unai last year! ;)
I'd love to see the Carew from back then in this Villa side.
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No contest.
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O’Neil signed Marlon Harewood. I don’t think he deserves to be spoken of in the same breath as Emery. We finished 6th because a lot of other teams were shite.
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Emery vs O'Neill is just not a fair comparison. Emery is so far ahead it's unreal. I know people who have worked with O'Neill and they all say the same. An egotistical, ignorant man. His lack of tactical nous and lack of ability to bring in players who could take us to the next level was plainly obvious. The 2023 model would smash O'Neill's Villa. Milner and Barry might get a game on a regular basis but the others would struggle.
Ashley Young was getting a game on a regular basis for Unai last year! ;)
I'd love to see the Carew from back then in this Villa side.
Of the players of O'Neill era I thought these were absolutely the greats.
Heroes of the time
Laursen, Barry, Young, Milner And Carew
Honourable mentions to Petrov, Friedel and Gabby
:)
Barry and Young outstanding and for me would be in Villa team today. Carew upfront would be great wouldn't it!?
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O’Neill’s reign was completely unsustainable. I spent the whole time hoping that we could somehow fluke top four because it was clear that the wheels were about to fall off. It doesn’t feel like this with Emery. In terms of which team would win, as TV had said, Emery would have a plan to nullify O’Neill.
I felt the same about O'Neill, it was fun while it lasted but it almost felt like we'd just hit a purple patch and there was no telling how or when it would end, just that it would end. This time it feels like we're seeing the results of deliberate action. There's planning involved, short term, long term, alternative plans, back up plans for the alternative plans.
Emery's team would beat O'Neill's, and probably Emery with O'Neill's team would beat O'Neill with Emery's team.
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O’Neil signed Marlon Harewood. I don’t think he deserves to be spoken of in the same breath as Emery. We finished 6th because a lot of other teams were shite.
And Harewood wasn't even the shittest player he signed, which I'd say was Habib Beye. Shorey was a disaster too.
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O’Neil signed Marlon Harewood. I don’t think he deserves to be spoken of in the same breath as Emery. We finished 6th because a lot of other teams were shite.
And Harewood wasn't even the shittest player he signed, which I'd say was Habib Beye. Shorey was a disaster too.
Stephen Warnock is always affectionate in speaking on Villa
Tipped us for Champions League.
Sidwell doesn't seem to be much bothered yet have to endure him and Crouch on European nights.
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Habib Beye, 31, 3 year contract, 40k a week, 9 appearances. Who sanctioned that?
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Emery vs O'Neill is just not a fair comparison. Emery is so far ahead it's unreal. I know people who have worked with O'Neill and they all say the same. An egotistical, ignorant man. His lack of tactical nous and lack of ability to bring in players who could take us to the next level was plainly obvious. The 2023 model would smash O'Neill's Villa. Milner and Barry might get a game on a regular basis but the others would struggle.
I’d say Young and a fit Laursen would be fine. I agree with your post though.
I'd forgotten about Laursen to be fair. Good shout, loved him. Young was great too and possibly a shout for the current wide berth we may be missing. That said, the original verdict is the same. Emery is simply better. However, if Emery had O'Neill's team, we'd have been in the top four.
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Emery vs O'Neill is just not a fair comparison. Emery is so far ahead it's unreal. I know people who have worked with O'Neill and they all say the same. An egotistical, ignorant man. His lack of tactical nous and lack of ability to bring in players who could take us to the next level was plainly obvious. The 2023 model would smash O'Neill's Villa. Milner and Barry might get a game on a regular basis but the others would struggle.
Ashley Young was getting a game on a regular basis for Unai last year! ;)
I'd love to see the Carew from back then in this Villa side.
We should sign Boniface then.
He reminds me most of Carew as any player since Carew played.
I loved Carew. I think it was against West Ham that I realised just how good he was when he took the ball down on his toe, with three players around him & he spun around & left all three in his dust.
If he was more consistent, he would never have played for us though...
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I think if the question was what would be the best XI out of the 2 sides, that would be a tougher question.
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Emery vs O'Neill is just not a fair comparison. Emery is so far ahead it's unreal. I know people who have worked with O'Neill and they all say the same. An egotistical, ignorant man. His lack of tactical nous and lack of ability to bring in players who could take us to the next level was plainly obvious. The 2023 model would smash O'Neill's Villa. Milner and Barry might get a game on a regular basis but the others would struggle.
Ashley Young was getting a game on a regular basis for Unai last year! ;)
I'd love to see the Carew from back then in this Villa side.
We should sign Boniface then.
He reminds me most of Carew as any player since Carew played.
I loved Carew. I think it was against West Ham that I realised just how good he was when he took the ball down on his toe, with three players around him & he spun around & left all three in his dust.
If he was more consistent, he would never have played for us though...
Yes, if he didn't take the attitude of going down the Rocket Club before European games.
Emery would not be impressed and neither was I!
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The current team would outpass the O'Neill side who would tire and Emery's team would be fitter in the last 20 minutes. O'Neill teams never seemed to do well against more technical opposition.
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Likes of Lausen, James Collins and Richard Dunne at attacking set pieces though. Along with Carew. And Ash and Barry on delivery -Archie McPhee in his element !
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Emery vs O'Neill is just not a fair comparison. Emery is so far ahead it's unreal. I know people who have worked with O'Neill and they all say the same. An egotistical, ignorant man. His lack of tactical nous and lack of ability to bring in players who could take us to the next level was plainly obvious. The 2023 model would smash O'Neill's Villa. Milner and Barry might get a game on a regular basis but the others would struggle.
I’d say Young and a fit Laursen would be fine. I agree with your post though.
I'd forgotten about Laursen to be fair. Good shout, loved him. Young was great too and possibly a shout for the current wide berth we may be missing. That said, the original verdict is the same. Emery is simply better. However, if Emery had O'Neill's team, we'd have been in the top four.
Can't really remember if we even saw it because of injuries, but a team of Friedel, L Young, Cuellar, Laursen, Bouma, Petrov, Milner, Barry, Downing, Young and Carew would have been good to see.
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Emery vs O'Neill is just not a fair comparison. Emery is so far ahead it's unreal. I know people who have worked with O'Neill and they all say the same. An egotistical, ignorant man. His lack of tactical nous and lack of ability to bring in players who could take us to the next level was plainly obvious. The 2023 model would smash O'Neill's Villa. Milner and Barry might get a game on a regular basis but the others would struggle.
On Amazon before Man City.
I thought his aloof approach to his punditry wasn't in the spirit of things. He refused to ask Emery a question and barely looked at Guardiola. Seemed to not enjoy being out in the cold.
He said he took it personal the selling of James Milner. And now on reflection should not have.
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Emery would probably amass a pile of 40 DVDs of MON Villa's matches and have his 'tactics' totally sussed before he had to do any disc-changing.
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Emery would probably amass a pile of 40 DVDs of MON Villa's matches and have his 'tactics' totally sussed before he had to do any disc-changing.
Sit deep, let them have the ball, double up on Ashley Young. Attack them after seventy minutes.
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I liked O'Neil's Villa, but Emery's Villa would win.
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We’d smash them, especially at home. 6 or 7 nil.
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We’d smash them, especially at home. 6 or 7 nil.
They're both "we" : ;)
There were more weak links in the O'Neill sides, but the best of them - Young, Barry, Milner, Laursen, Mellberg would have all have been incredible if they were playing under Emery.
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We’d smash them, especially at home. 6 or 7 nil.
They're both "we" : ;)
Self-funeral scenario.
How would we handle the SCORCHIIIIIIOOOOOOOs?
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O’Neil signed Marlon Harewood. I don’t think he deserves to be spoken of in the same breath as Emery. We finished 6th because a lot of other teams were shite.
And Harewood wasn't even the shittest player he signed, which I'd say was Habib Beye. Shorey was a disaster too.
I’d forgotten Beye.
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I remember his song more than the player.
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Emery’s team would win. He would focus on MON’s plan A and nullify it. Game over.
Indeed even if O Neill got the first 6 picks
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No competition. As it stands I'd be confident that Emery's Villa would beat Brazil 1970. O'Neill's Villa would get absolutely trounced.
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It's a tough call - player for player I don't think there is a lot in. We're much more adaptable now, but still are a little soft at the back (at times, but not this week obviously.)
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There were more weak links in the O'Neill sides, but the best of them - Young, Barry, Milner, Laursen, Mellberg would have all have been incredible if they were playing under Emery.
We pretty much have Barry and Milner already on the pitch in the form of McGinn. Engine to go all day everyday, but the range of passing, and especially the arse of Barry.
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It's a tough call - player for player I don't think there is a lot in. We're much more adaptable now, but still are a little soft at the back (at times, but not this week obviously.)
One of the most satisfying things about this week was the clean sheets. If we could take this into our away games things would greatly improve
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Peak MON villa would give most teams a game, but never dominated against the top sides like this team does. It was all counter attacking and physicality back then - very effective and exciting though it was. This team is just better all round and I think will actually win something and break the glass ceiling of the modern era (CL qualification).
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To fit our current style of play I'd take Petrov, Barry, Young and Milner, as much as I love Laursen and Olaf, I'm not how they would cope with tight passing in front of goal.
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We’d smash them, especially at home. 6 or 7 nil.
They're both "we" : ;)
Self-funeral scenario.
How would we handle the SCORCHIIIIIIOOOOOOOs?
ExcelDawg with spreadsheets to explain the disparity in the wage bill between both teams.
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I think we would dick ourselves.
An Emery team would dismantle an O'Neil team with ease.
Don't get me wrong, the O'Neill years were great, but O'Neils teams were always lacking in the "final' push from being good to being great.
And thats because there is only so far a manager can take a team when all he is relying upon is his ability to man manage players.
Because tactically, O'Neil was limited.
Especially in the final 20-30 mins of a game.
And especially in the final third of a season as players were winding down after the sugar rush.
I forget how many times I said to the people around me that as soon as he started sitting us deep that we would concede.
Emery is so far advanced regarding tactics compared to O'Neil, they might as well be playing a different game.
I hate that "chequers v 3D chess" bollocks saying from American politics, but it's probably the best way to describe the two in terms of management ability...
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Emery > Judas Pubehead.
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O’Neil signed Marlon Harewood. I don’t think he deserves to be spoken of in the same breath as Emery. We finished 6th because a lot of other teams were shite.
That's ridiculous and I'm not a MON fan! 3 x 6th placed finishes is a row suggests a very competitive team. Blew a CL spot definitely one of those seasons, the disastrous signing of Heskey and unbalancing the midfield to accommodate the donkey did for us. Emery hasn't yet but he will make a terrible signing or two!
I know there's a lot of whinging about Phil Dowd in that league cup final but from memory that wasn't a regular Man United X1 we played on the day. Bar that good start we kind of flopped if I recall correctly. MON's odious personality detracts from an objective assessment of his reign imo.
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To fit our current style of play I'd take Petrov, Barry, Young and Milner, as much as I love Laursen and Olaf, I'm not how they would cope with tight passing in front of goal.
Think Luiz is already a better player for us than Petrov was at his best. McGinn by the end of this season probably makes the best Villa X1 of last 25-30 years if he continues his form. Better than GB though? That's a tough one. Ramsey still has a big contribution to make this season too.
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Not wanting to be glib, but the game has changed so much I think our current crop would beat most of that era of PL teams, let alone our former selves.
Fielding theoretically the strongest possible MON side, with Barry, Milner, Young, Carew, Laursen, I think they'd definitely score, because there was a lot of danger in that side. But the current boys would utterly dominate the midfield and, tactically, Unai would have MON on toast.
4-1 to the 2023 vintage would be my guess, with about 75% possession.
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Pointless comparison.
Whilst not a fan of O’Neill his team sustained a consistent achievement in League positions and a cup final and semi final, Unai has not delivered anything as yet other than we have won many games and a lot of promise. We can look at this at the end of the season.
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Emery > Judas Pubehead.
Quite. It's like comparing Rembrandt or Picasso with Rolf Harris.
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Pointless comparison.
Whilst not a fan of O’Neill his team sustained a consistent achievement in League positions and a cup final and semi final, Unai has not delivered anything as yet other than we have won many games and a lot of promise. We can look at this at the end of the season.
So to narrow it down, MON gave us no trophies and Emery has given us no trophies so they are equal?
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I liked watching O'Neil's Villa.
We were at the right end of the table and had some great players.
O'Neil can get to fuck, but since he fucked off, Emery is the first manger I've been able to really really get behind. Everyone else was either crap, inept or overrated (slightly)
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Pointless comparison.
Whilst not a fan of O’Neill his team sustained a consistent achievement in League positions and a cup final and semi final, Unai has not delivered anything as yet other than we have won many games and a lot of promise. We can look at this at the end of the season.
So to narrow it down, MON gave us no trophies and Emery has given us no trophies so they are equal?
No. Love what Unai has done so far, but we need to wait. Football is chalk and cheese but till we have place and/or trophy nothing is proven.
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Easily Emery.
As for the squad, I'd take some of the players already mentioned. Young, Milner, Barry, Laursen, Carew. But would they get in ahead of the current crop? I'm not sure.
Emery would definitely see the value in Young (ahead of Bailey) , love the versatility of Milner (ahead of McGinn?) and Barry (I'd rather Luiz), but he'd pick Torres ahead of Laursen and Watkins ahead of Carew.
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May have already been mentioned, but we benefit from a massively better GK compared to back then, radiating stability.
The rest of it though, seems down to UE's superior coaching and nous.
It was fun being consistently top 6 in that era, but turned out MON's run was artificial. Whereas the way the 2022-23 team is being built gives hope it is sustainable.
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Sick of hearing about O'Pube. I believe Emery's Villa would spank his team.
Don't you have snow to clear in British Columbia?
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Sick of hearing about O'Pube. I believe Emery's Villa would spank his team.
Don't you have snow to clear in British Columbia?
😂
Had a video call with students doing a study abroad thingy in Vancouver this afternoon and rain is on the horizon.
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Usual then!
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I liked watching O'Neil's Villa.
We were at the right end of the table and had some great players.
O'Neil can get to fuck, but since he fucked off, Emery is the first manger I've been able to really really get behind. Everyone else was either crap, inept or overrated (slightly)
I think that's fair about MON. He got us back into the top six and Europe on a regular basis and got us to a final at Wembley. The biggest criticism would be that he couldn't take us to that next level and wasted a fair chunk of the financial resources at his disposal which could have helped us get there.
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I liked watching O'Neil's Villa.
We were at the right end of the table and had some great players.
O'Neil can get to fuck, but since he fucked off, Emery is the first manger I've been able to really really get behind. Everyone else was either crap, inept or overrated (slightly)
Which of those three was Dean Smith?
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The league wasn't as good back then either, it was the last time you could get away with some really basic-bitch football towards the top of the league (Harry Redknapp in the Champions League anyone?).
Much love for Laursen, Olof, Ash etc, but it would be like 10-0.
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The league wasn't as good back then either, it was the last time you could get away with some really basic-bitch football towards the top of the league (Harry Redknapp in the Champions League anyone?).
The top EPL teams were dominating the CL around then! John Terry slipping on his hole in the penalty shoot out was one of those MON seasons.
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The league wasn't as good back then either, it was the last time you could get away with some really basic-bitch football towards the top of the league (Harry Redknapp in the Champions League anyone?).
Much love for Laursen, Olof, Ash etc, but it would be like 10-0.
Yep, it was a massive chance missed to get into the Champions League really.
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The league wasn't as good back then either, it was the last time you could get away with some really basic-bitch football towards the top of the league (Harry Redknapp in the Champions League anyone?).
The top EPL teams were dominating the CL around then! John Terry slipping on his hole in the penalty shoot out was one of those MON seasons.
Mourinho and money were changing things but it had hardly filtered down yet. So much of the league was dumbfuck clogging.
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The league wasn't as good back then either, it was the last time you could get away with some really basic-bitch football towards the top of the league (Harry Redknapp in the Champions League anyone?).
The top EPL teams were dominating the CL around then! John Terry slipping on his hole in the penalty shoot out was one of those MON seasons.
Mourinho and money were changing things but it had hardly filtered down yet. So much of the league was dumbfuck clogging.
Bottom half of league this year is very weak. If anything the PL was arguably at its strongest back then.
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They look weak against the ludicrous standard the top half sets. Back then, Marouane Fellaini was a devastating attacker, Richard Dunne was a top six defender, Roque Santa Cruz was considered quite a big deal, etc etc etc.
This league makes that league look comical with the exception of two teams.