Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: PeterWithesShin on November 30, 2023, 08:55:58 PM
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So with WMP completely messing up tonight, I wonder what will happen next. We'll get a portion of the blame as it's our match. While Legia fans have a nasty element keeping them kettled on Witton Lane for hours and refusing them entry is piss poor. And tbh i'm not surprised they've reacted to that. I wonder if we'll get any punishment, both for this or future games as it seems WMP, us, and the city are incapable of coping.
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Also, I can't think of any previous examples where all the away fans were refused entry into a ground in England.
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It'll be fine, the away fans have been throwing bottles into the ground and have injured coppers. I'm not saying it's been handled well but it won't be difficult for authorities to find cover for us given the Legia fans behaviour
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You've only got to see what happened to the Liverpool supporters in Paris to see there's no way the police are getting the blame.
This'll be on the Legia fans. Don't think they're solely at fault here, but they're the ones that'll feel the consequences IMO.
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It doesn't look great, you wonder to what degree WMP set the tone by reducing the ticket allocation and then bringing in the horses and dogs in such numbers.
However, at the same time, we don't know what sort of provocation they've been under.
It's just a shame that, regardless of what has gone on and who started it, there will be a lot of people who haven't done anything wrong, treated like they have, and not allowed to enter the ground tonight.
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Does anyone know why WMP kept them in the car park?
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So with WMP completely messing up tonight, I wonder what will happen next. We'll get a portion of the blame as it's our match. While Legia fans have a nasty element keeping them kettled on Witton Lane for hours and refusing them entry is piss poor. And tbh i'm not surprised they've reacted to that. I wonder if we'll get any punishment, both for this or future games as it seems WMP, us, and the city are incapable of coping.
Also none of it has happened in the stadium, we will be fine
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Think I might give the next game in Warsaw a miss, if we ever draw them again.
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Also - you don't blame them for their reaction?l and how is the city to blame, exactly?
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Does anyone know why WMP kept them in the car park?
It sounds like they were only supposed to be kept there for a bit but they started throwing stuff at the police, injuring 3, and the decision was taken to just not let them in.
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Be interesting to see the after game time line, were they kettled because they’d caused aggro, or caused aggro after being kettled for hours? And it looks like they haven’t even done a good job of kettling them as 30 or so are chucking stuff into the ground.
Let’s face it, WMP have treated us like shit on enough occasions. And yes, a crying shame for the ordinary fans who have wasted time and money to stand in a freezing car park.
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The police will state that letting the fans into the ground in the mood they were in and tension already created would put at risk home fans in the stadium. They’ve used a broad brush approach and impacted supporters who had nothing to do with this. But a big part of this is the “ultras” phenomenon who go with the specific desire to present a threatening environment in numbers.
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From BBC WM
West Midlands Police said fans of the Polish side were not being allowed into the stadium after objects were thrown at officers.
The force urged people to avoid Witton Lane if possible.
Aston Villa said supporters who had tickets for R block had to access the stadium via the Upper North (T Block turnstiles) and were directed by AVFC Staff.
Earlier Legia hit out at Villa publicly for what they described as restrictions on the number of tickets for away fans.
Witnesses on X, formerly known as Twitter, said they had seen several people be arrested outside the stadium and areas of Villa Park had been damaged with various items being thrown.
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Also - you don't blame them for their reaction?l and how is the city to blame, exactly?
Where did I say I don't blame them? I said I wasn't surprised. And after being kettled outside for hours and then refused entry having spent money on tickets and travel it doesn't surprise me they've reacted.
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What was the arrangement for their fans to pick up their tickets? Where were they to go for their tickets? And at what time?
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How many hours were they there before being wankers?
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How many hours were they there before being wankers?
2 hours plus.
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Does anyone know why WMP kept them in the car park?
I can imagine the plan was round them all up and then escort them to away section perhaps 15 minutes before kick off as we've seen in the past when likes of SHA have been escorted from Witton station.
To me it would've been better just to get them in the ground early (half 6) as european fans prefer making an event of the matchday compared to us shuffling in 5-10 minutes before kick off and deal with the troublemakers if they were arriving late.
Just treating all 2k as cattle isn't great at all. Even worse some groups have clearly got out of the pen and are just roaming around the stadium perimeter chucking stuff into the Holte so going to be issues after the game I fear.
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Legia fans in Upper DE and Trinity. Who’d have thought it?
Me, for one.
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Love the Villa. Love watching the Villa. Love foreign travel. But the idea of going to an away tie in Europe holds absolutely zero interest to me, given all that it seemingly entails.
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No idea how true it is as i'm not searching X and translating everything in Polish to do with the game, but one post I did see was that they were advised to go to the coach park for ticket collection, and then kept there.
From everything i've seen, apart from some pyro and singing no issues of note started until the run up to kick off when WMP wasn't letting anyone out to go to the game.
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Have a look in the match thread at the statement released by the club. Seems Legia only have themselves to blame.
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I'm really not trying to argue about this, but there's a lot of blame being put on WMP and the club without knowing what the actual situation was.
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I haven't blamed the club, I said it reflects badly on us. And there's not much we can do about that. We're the host club.
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Just seems odd to me, they were on the trains together with Villa fans being boisterous but nothing beyond that so if you can travel on public transport together then it's surely o.k for them to go 200 yards from Witton station and just enter the away end there and then.
WMP don't really have a great reputation from visiting fans up and down the country for policing our games.
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And there's the statement.
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Club statement lifted from the match thread.
Aston Villa Football Club can confirm that no away fans were allowed into Villa Park for this evening’s UEFA Europa Conference League fixture with Legia Warsaw on the advice of West Midlands Police following large-scale disorder outside the stadium caused by visiting supporters.
The UK safety authorities, UEFA and Aston Villa, communicated on November 2 that the ticket allocation for away fans for this fixture would be reduced to 1,002 on the advice of safety authorities as a result of previous large-scale disorder caused by Legia fans last month at AZ Alkmaar.
A number of Dutch police officers were injured during that disorder. As a consequence, UEFA banned Legia supporters from travelling to Mostar for their game against HŠK Zrinjski.
In spite of numerous requests for cooperation from Legia Warsaw concerning their travelling supporters, especially in the last two days, no assistance on the serious safety matter of away fans attending Villa Park was forthcoming from the visiting club. The club has repeatedly, including this morning, raised concerns in conjunction with UEFA and all the relevant authorities to Legia that ticketless away supporters were attempting to attend Villa Park.
Approximately an hour before kick-off, Legia fans engaged in planned and systematic violent acts against West Midlands Police officers and a decision was then made by West Midlands Police to exclude all Legia supporters.
Aston Villa strongly condemns the behaviour of those visiting supporters and would like to thank West Midlands Police for their professionalism in very difficult circumstances.
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Although what were Legia supposed to do about ticketless supporters?
Glad I didn’t take my kid now, it will be dickhead convention after the game. If this is the scrupulous planning talked about pre-game, I’d hate to see what chaos looks like.
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Footage on twitter of them kicking off in the city centre pre-match.
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And yes, I do blame WMP. Same as I blame the Spanish police for what we endured in Madrid back in the day. I also have said many times that Legia have an element that are absolute twats.
However i'm really not sure that the best course of policing to try and diffuse any potential issues is kettle them for hours in a car park on a freezing cold night and then not let them go to the ground, and then ban them completely from entering the ground.
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".... I wonder if we'll get any punishment, both for this or future games as it seems WMP, us, and the city are incapable of coping."
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So it all sounds rather like Villa and the WMP have done absolutely the right thing.
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Who'd have thought it, eh?
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So it all sounds rather like Villa and the WMP have done absolutely the right thing.
It does
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And yes, I do blame WMP. Same as I blame the Spanish police for what we endured in Madrid back in the day. I also have said many times that Legia have an element that are absolute twats.
However i'm really not sure that the best course of policing to try and diffuse any potential issues is kettle them for hours in a car park on a freezing cold night and then not let them go to the ground, and then ban them completely from entering the ground.
Why are you so bothered?
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".... I wonder if we'll get any punishment, both for this or future games as it seems WMP, us, and the city are incapable of coping."
Which is how UEFA are likely to look at it. Again, we're the host club that has been unable to have away fans in for a match.
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".... I wonder if we'll get any punishment, both for this or future games as it seems WMP, us, and the city are incapable of coping."
Which is how UEFA are likely to look at it. Again, we're the host club that has been unable to have away fans in for a match.
The club statement sounds like we did all we could to guarantee their fans could come. They didn't engage with us on it. I'm not sure how we can come in for any criticism for that.
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And yes, I do blame WMP. Same as I blame the Spanish police for what we endured in Madrid back in the day. I also have said many times that Legia have an element that are absolute twats.
However i'm really not sure that the best course of policing to try and diffuse any potential issues is kettle them for hours in a car park on a freezing cold night and then not let them go to the ground, and then ban them completely from entering the ground.
Why are you so bothered?
Is there a reason I shouldn't be bothered about how WMP police our matches?
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".... I wonder if we'll get any punishment, both for this or future games as it seems WMP, us, and the city are incapable of coping."
Almost definitely a financial punishment, its what UEFA do .
Punish the British club regardless.
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And yes, I do blame WMP. Same as I blame the Spanish police for what we endured in Madrid back in the day. I also have said many times that Legia have an element that are absolute twats.
However i'm really not sure that the best course of policing to try and diffuse any potential issues is kettle them for hours in a car park on a freezing cold night and then not let them go to the ground, and then ban them completely from entering the ground.
Why are you so bothered?
Is there a reason I shouldn't be bothered about how WMP police our matches?
If you wanna crack on with in depth cop tactics then go wild mate
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If you think that's in depth then it explains a lot.
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Getting saucy
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Statement has just been released. Lots of naughtiness outside the Witton Stand, avoid the area, three officers injured.
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Currently the 3rd most read article on the Beeb. Well we wanted the media to talk about us more!
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They were refusing to go in anyway, due to not getting a full allocation.
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However i'm really not sure that the best course of policing to try and diffuse any potential issues is kettle them for hours in a car park on a freezing cold night and then not let them go to the ground, and then ban them completely from entering the ground.
I’m not going to jump to any conclusions given that I have literally no knowledge about what has gone on, but this does seem like collective punishment. If I was travelling abroad with Villa, I’d be disappointed if I was punished for the actions of a small minority of other Villa supporters.
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They were refusing to go in anyway, due to not getting a full allocation.
There you go.
Club refuse to communicate with us. Too many turn up, obviously plenty without tickets, police say no go. Fans (probably without tickets) get pissed off, throw things at nasty police. Police decide not to let anybody in. Game over. Villa win 2-1. Legia get a nasty letter from UEFA. Legia ignore it as they're shit scared of those naughty ultra kids hiding their faces in black, man made fibre knitwear.
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I would expect arrests then.
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However i'm really not sure that the best course of policing to try and diffuse any potential issues is kettle them for hours in a car park on a freezing cold night and then not let them go to the ground, and then ban them completely from entering the ground.
I’m not going to jump to any conclusions given that I have literally no knowledge about what has gone on, but this does seem like collective punishment. If I was travelling abroad with Villa, I’d be disappointed if I was punished for the actions of a small minority of other Villa supporters.
It sounds like they knew this would happen if you read the Villa statement, I’d be aiming my ire at Warsaw personally.
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You've only got to see what happened to the Liverpool supporters in Paris to see there's no way the police are getting the blame.
This'll be on the Legia fans. Don't think they're solely at fault here, but they're the ones that'll feel the consequences IMO.
The police and UEFA got all blame eventually for that CL final. AVFC far too quick out with the club statement backing the local constabulary imo
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As we know full well the police version of events re football supporters can always be relied upon.
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However i'm really not sure that the best course of policing to try and diffuse any potential issues is kettle them for hours in a car park on a freezing cold night and then not let them go to the ground, and then ban them completely from entering the ground.
I’m not going to jump to any conclusions given that I have literally no knowledge about what has gone on, but this does seem like collective punishment. If I was travelling abroad with Villa, I’d be disappointed if I was punished for the actions of a small minority of other Villa supporters.
It sounds like they knew this would happen if you read the Villa statement, I’d be aiming my ire at Warsaw personally.
Exactly.
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Maybe because i'm old I still distrust football police, especially SYP and WMP. Either way I still think it could have been dealt with a lot better.
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You've only got to see what happened to the Liverpool supporters in Paris to see there's no way the police are getting the blame.
This'll be on the Legia fans. Don't think they're solely at fault here, but they're the ones that'll feel the consequences IMO.
The police and UEFA got all blame eventually for that CL final. AVFC far too quick out with the club statement backing the local constabulary imo
Difference being that the CL final wasn't hundreds of fans attacking the cops or fans throwing bottles at fans in the stands was it. Not for one second do I just think the cops are in the right here but Warsaw had reduced numbers due to previous behaviour and have ended up bottling and attacking police and home fans.
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They were refusing to go in anyway, due to not getting a full allocation.
‘To join our Ultra group, we require you to travel 1500 miles to stand in a car park for hours in sub zero temperatures, then get nicked for throwing traffic cones’
Tough sell that.
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However i'm really not sure that the best course of policing to try and diffuse any potential issues is kettle them for hours in a car park on a freezing cold night and then not let them go to the ground, and then ban them completely from entering the ground.
I’m not going to jump to any conclusions given that I have literally no knowledge about what has gone on, but this does seem like collective punishment. If I was travelling abroad with Villa, I’d be disappointed if I was punished for the actions of a small minority of other Villa supporters.
It sounds like they knew this would happen if you read the Villa statement, I’d be aiming my ire at Warsaw personally.
They became a different beast as a joy division.
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My son was in the AZ Alkmar club shop and the guy behind the counter told them that the Legia 'fans' caused a load of trouble when they were there and are now effectively banned from the area.
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However i'm really not sure that the best course of policing to try and diffuse any potential issues is kettle them for hours in a car park on a freezing cold night and then not let them go to the ground, and then ban them completely from entering the ground.
I’m not going to jump to any conclusions given that I have literally no knowledge about what has gone on, but this does seem like collective punishment. If I was travelling abroad with Villa, I’d be disappointed if I was punished for the actions of a small minority of other Villa supporters.
Exactly that.
I find it very unlikely that every fans was engaged in acts of violence against the police and it’s more likely to me that some were just here to see a game and have been denied that because of a few knobheads. We hear about this loads on away travels against England fans and we dish it out here now it seems.
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The club thought it was highly likely this was going to happen. UEFA knew aswell. They and the police were on the front foot due to anticipating ticketless Warsaw fans would be trying to force entry, causing trouble so they got rushed off the streets and into the ground. That sounds like what panned out. First bit I know for sure, the rest is my reading of what happened knowing the first bit.
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They were refusing to go in anyway, due to not getting a full allocation.
Legia fan phoned up TalkSport and basically admitted that they were trying to force Villa/The Police to let 2000-3000 fans in by force of numbers.
I think they miscalculated their negotiating position, and thought that force of numbers would make WMP back down and allow the allocation they thought they were "entitled" to.
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I went to PSG vs Liverpool in the 90s (3-1 if you want to check the year, 94?). My strongest memory is of coming up the escalator from the Metro into a line of armed/canine police with shields, not a terribly inviting atmosphere. The police tunnel led all the way to the stadium and back to the station after the match.
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Club statement on the club website now too. Legia's officials seemed to know that fans without tickets were going to travel and failed to instruct their fans not to do so. Twice they have done this. Kick them out of the competition.
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Club statement on the club website now too. Legia's officials seemed to know that fans without tickets were going to travel and failed to instruct their fans not to do so. Twice they have done this. Kick them out of the competition.
Travelling without tickets isn't a problem, I'm sure loads of Villa fans went to Warsaw and Alkmaar without tickets. Showing up at the ground expecting to get in is where the problem is.
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Maybe because i'm old I still distrust football police, especially SYP and WMP. Either way I still think it could have been dealt with a lot better.
Access to European games normally involves several ticket checks before you can get close to the ground, nevermind enter the stadium. It's not fool proof (I've seen Sporting - Celtic and Benfica - Barca without a ticket/mad Celtic fan giving me his ticket but still getting in) but generally it's very well controlled. Tonight there were obviously far too many without a ticket and the police knew there was no way they could control the numbers without tickets.
I do wonder if a ticket check down Witton Lane could have helped letting in those with tickets in, those that had probably spent close to £500+ to go see a game. Instead they get treated like shit. Considering there was only 2,000 fans from Poland, would it have been an error to let them in and stick the non-ticketed fans in the Upper Witton Lane where they could have been controlled more closely? At least after the game you can control them all. I guess time will tell.
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It’s not like they haven’t got previous, even one of their players is up in Alkmaar on an assault charge soon following an incident after their game at AZ.
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Oh well. At least we don't have to play them again until next May in Athens.
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Considering there was only 2,000 fans from Poland, would it have been an error to let them in and stick the non-ticketed fans in the Upper Witton Lane where they could have been controlled more closely? At least after the game you can control them all. I guess time will tell.
What kind of message would that have sent, though?
Come over with no ticket, kick off, get in to see the game?
Worst of all worlds.
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Club statement on the club website now too. Legia's officials seemed to know that fans without tickets were going to travel and failed to instruct their fans not to do so. Twice they have done this. Kick them out of the competition.
Didn't somebody mention earlier this evening the the club are shit scared of their ultras?
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Traveling without a ticket and then marching towards the ground in a big chanting mob isn't a crime. Maybe the police saw how many were there and panicked a bit, maybe they all tried to pile into the ground, who knows.
But surely as many people as they want can 'travel' regardless of if they've got a ticket. If they've got history of being knobs then maybe fair enough, I also wouldn't instantly believe what the police have said either.
When was the last time in this country that travelling fans weren't allowed in, at all?
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Considering there was only 2,000 fans from Poland, would it have been an error to let them in and stick the non-ticketed fans in the Upper Witton Lane where they could have been controlled more closely? At least after the game you can control them all. I guess time will tell.
What kind of message would that have sent, though?
Come over with no ticket, kick off, get in to see the game?
Worst of all worlds.
And then if it all goes to shit as invariably it would with blokes travelling to games without tickets (why else would they be there if they didn’t have tickets to start with?), then we as a club are fucked with UEFA and local police who we need partner with.
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Traveling without a ticket and then marching towards the ground in a big chanting mob isn't a crime.
Singing fucking Pet Shop Boys songs is. Get a grip!
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Traveling without a ticket and then marching towards the ground in a big chanting mob isn't a crime.
Singing fucking Pet Shop Boys songs is. Get a grip!
Whilst waving sparklers
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Traveling without a ticket and then marching towards the ground in a big chanting mob isn't a crime.
Singing fucking Pet Shop Boys songs is. Get a grip!
Whilst waving sparklers
Sounds like a lovely evening.
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Considering there was only 2,000 fans from Poland, would it have been an error to let them in and stick the non-ticketed fans in the Upper Witton Lane where they could have been controlled more closely? At least after the game you can control them all. I guess time will tell.
What kind of message would that have sent, though?
Come over with no ticket, kick off, get in to see the game?
Worst of all worlds.
I fully appreciate it's far from ideal but so has been the response. I'll leave it out there until we see how tonight ends. I still maintain, with all the experience WMP have of controlling football crowds, tonight was a training exercise.
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So with WMP completely messing up tonight, I wonder what will happen next. We'll get a portion of the blame as it's our match. While Legia fans have a nasty element keeping them kettled on Witton Lane for hours and refusing them entry is piss poor. And tbh i'm not surprised they've reacted to that. I wonder if we'll get any punishment, both for this or future games as it seems WMP, us, and the city are incapable of coping.
What a load of garbage. They had running battles with police all evening and turned up in numbers far exceeded the amount of tickets that they KNEW beforehand they had been allocated. On top of that a number of them threw missles into the Holte and then tried to break into the lower Holte at HT. And then there were pockets of away fans in the home end. It was the right call to deny them entry. Fuck them.
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The police and the club got it right. They went looking for trouble and as the LW fan on the radio admitted they all met up in order to force their way into the ground as they were pissed off at their small allocation. When it became clear their tactic wasn’t going to work they kicked off. I’m glad they kept them out as they’d have smashed the place up and caused no end of trouble. Hopefully they don’t qualify.
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I've never heard of the entire away support being denied entry . Seems a bit extreme . Might have been better to let them in and let them experience the catering service in the Doug Ellis as punishment. They've got off lightly here.
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One thing I haven't seen is where did they all go? From about half time they seemed to vanish as I haven't seen any updates about them and is doesn't seem like many were about at full time.
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So with WMP completely messing up tonight, I wonder what will happen next. We'll get a portion of the blame as it's our match. While Legia fans have a nasty element keeping them kettled on Witton Lane for hours and refusing them entry is piss poor. And tbh i'm not surprised they've reacted to that. I wonder if we'll get any punishment, both for this or future games as it seems WMP, us, and the city are incapable of coping.
I was walking along Witton Road when they came off the train. I heard several times the Police tell them to go into the ground and they weren’t interested. They came to cause trouble and many turned up without tickets.Its their own fault, nobody else’s and they should be kicked out. They did it in Holland and tried to storm the turnstiles which is why they had their allocation cut.
I’ve heard a Polish bloke on the radio and he said they decided that if they all couldn’t get in then no one would. They did it at Leicester as well. They should not be in the competition and from what I saw the Police did a good job.
Kick em out!!!!
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I've never heard of the entire away support being denied entry . Seems a bit extreme . Might have been better to let them in and let them experience the catering service in the Doug Ellis as punishment. They've got off lightly here.
Those with tickets admitted that they weren’t going in unless both those with and those without tickets were allowed entry. That was never going to happen.
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One thing I haven't seen is where did they all go? From about half time they seemed to vanish as I haven't seen any updates about them and is doesn't seem like many were about at full time.
They all be back on the building sites at 730am tomorrow if they're from the UK. If they've come over from Poland god knows probably down Broad Street now in Popworld and Reflex
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So with WMP completely messing up tonight, I wonder what will happen next. We'll get a portion of the blame as it's our match. While Legia fans have a nasty element keeping them kettled on Witton Lane for hours and refusing them entry is piss poor. And tbh i'm not surprised they've reacted to that. I wonder if we'll get any punishment, both for this or future games as it seems WMP, us, and the city are incapable of coping.
I was walking along Witton Road when they came off the train. I heard several times the Police tell them to go into the ground and they weren’t interested. They came to cause trouble and many turned up without tickets.Its their own fault, nobody else’s and they should be kicked out. They did it in Holland and tried to storm the turnstiles which is why they had their allocation cut.
I’ve heard a Polish bloke on the radio and he said they decided that if they all couldn’t get in then no one would. They did it at Leicester as well. They should not be in the competition and from what I saw the Police did a good job.
Kick em out!!!!
Ah right, that's put a different slant on things. Seems it was a choregraphed protest/effort about reduced allocation. In that case police did totally the right thing as would've been real danger of crushing in the away end.
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Thats also pretty impressive solidarity (see what I did there) for absolutely no-one to go in the ground with a ticket.
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Time to ban them if that's the case
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Plus, they love to march together in a group to the ground, clapping away in unison to the Pet Shop Boys greatest hits.
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I have to say that this a cracking photo and no, I don't condone anything.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GANa0pKXAAA-7OW?format=jpg&name=4096x4096)
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What utter garbage
(https://i.ibb.co/KG5PVM4/Screenshot-20231130-231342-X.jpg) (https://ibb.co/KG5PVM4)
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What's that fucking smell??
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Does anyone know why WMP kept them in the car park?
It sounds like they were only supposed to be kept there for a bit but they started throwing stuff at the police, injuring 3, and the decision was taken to just not let them in.
Fully deserved to keep them out. There was warnings yesterday of potential violence from their thugs posing as fans.
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What utter garbage
(https://i.ibb.co/KG5PVM4/Screenshot-20231130-231342-X.jpg) (https://ibb.co/KG5PVM4)
Written by one of Rooneys fanboys.
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Written by a Bolton fan...
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Really strange atmosphere tonight. I was rather uncomfortable with the fact that the fans weren't allowed in but as things become clearer it looks like they were just acting like entitled twats in refusing to go in unless everyone was let in.
There were some Polish lads in the Bartons but no hint of trouble, and I saw nothing else to and from the ground but it had the sort of edge that you get when the Rags are at our place.
Glad it's out of the way and hope no one got into any bother but the condiments being lobbed into the Holte was really rather bizarre.
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One thing I haven't seen is where did they all go? From about half time they seemed to vanish as I haven't seen any updates about them and is doesn't seem like many were about at full time.
Well i was at the bus stop by Bartons at about 1030 and a group of them jumped 4 or 5 Irish lads who i think were villa fans. Most got away OK but at least one of ours was fully KO'd on the floor last I saw. Hope he's OK.
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One thing I haven't seen is where did they all go? From about half time they seemed to vanish as I haven't seen any updates about them and is doesn't seem like many were about at full time.
They all be back on the building sites at 730am tomorrow if they're from the UK. If they've come over from Poland god knows probably down Broad Street now in Popworld and Reflex
You really are a ridiculous little Soccer Bantz child aren’t you?
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What utter garbage
(https://i.ibb.co/KG5PVM4/Screenshot-20231130-231342-X.jpg) (https://ibb.co/KG5PVM4)
Hmmm, started his account in July 2023 and just rubbishes anything to do with Villa. When did we pot Wilmas husband again?
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One thing I haven't seen is where did they all go? From about half time they seemed to vanish as I haven't seen any updates about them and is doesn't seem like many were about at full time.
They all be back on the building sites at 730am tomorrow if they're from the UK. If they've come over from Poland god knows probably down Broad Street now in Popworld and Reflex
You really are a ridiculous little Soccer Bantz child aren’t you?
I learned it all off you bru
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Also, I can't think of any previous examples where all the away fans were refused entry into a ground in England.
Villa fans who went by train to Forest (admittedly not all), who were subsequently represented by Charlie Royle of Glaisyers Solicitors. Similarly, Portsmouth fans who went to Shrewsbury and were held at the station.
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Also, I can't think of any previous examples where all the away fans were refused entry into a ground in England.
Villa fans who went by train to Forest (admittedly not all), who were subsequently represented by Charlie Royle of Glaisyers Solicitors. Similarly, Portsmouth fans who went to Shrewsbury and were held at the station.
So basically no still.
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I don’t really know what else WMP (there were also Nottinghamshire and Thames Valley police there) could have done really. They obviously came en mass down Witton Road and they wouldn’t have been able to deal with them at the away entrance behaving the way they were. As more and more came to the area, I think it got to the point that the resources just weren’t there to separate those who had tickets from those who didn’t. Given their behaviour, I don’t think putting a checkpoint in place would have worked as those that came in big numbers would have kicked off big time at that point when they got turned away.
I feel for their genuine, non-moronic fans who have spent money coming over and not got into the ground. The morons that kicked off and came without tickets can get stuffed quite frankly.
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One thing I haven't seen is where did they all go? From about half time they seemed to vanish as I haven't seen any updates about them and is doesn't seem like many were about at full time.
They all be back on the building sites at 730am tomorrow if they're from the UK. If they've come over from Poland god knows probably down Broad Street now in Popworld and Reflex
You really are a ridiculous little Soccer Bantz child aren’t you?
I learned it all off you bru
Stop being a ******. Stereotyping nationalities is cuntish behaviour.
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I feel for their genuine, non-moronic fans who have spent money coming over and not got into the ground. The morons that kicked off and came without tickets can get stuffed quite frankly.
There's a lot of people saying they were refusing to go in themselves, so even the fans who got tickets stood out in the car park by choice. When that didn't get them what they wanted it kicked off and then the choice was taken from them. So its hard to feel too sorry for any of them. (Unless they were afraid to go against the rest of them and just go in, but it seems it was an organised "protest")
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All the WMP horses were made redundant a few years ago. Where did they cone from?
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One thing I haven't seen is where did they all go? From about half time they seemed to vanish as I haven't seen any updates about them and is doesn't seem like many were about at full time.
They all be back on the building sites at 730am tomorrow if they're from the UK. If they've come over from Poland god knows probably down Broad Street now in Popworld and Reflex
You really are a ridiculous little Soccer Bantz child aren’t you?
I learned it all off you bru
Stop being a ******. Stereotyping nationalities is cuntish behaviour.
Actually the cuntish behaviour was from them this evening in case you missed it . Hopefully they'll be banned now .
-
One thing I haven't seen is where did they all go? From about half time they seemed to vanish as I haven't seen any updates about them and is doesn't seem like many were about at full time.
They all be back on the building sites at 730am tomorrow if they're from the UK. If they've come over from Poland god knows probably down Broad Street now in Popworld and Reflex
You really are a ridiculous little Soccer Bantz child aren’t you?
I learned it all off you bru
Stop being a ******. Stereotyping nationalities is cuntish behaviour.
An absolute text-book piece of racism from Dim Tim there.
What an idiotic comment.
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Can’t remember which poster whose lad didn’t like fireworks but hope that if they went they weren’t put off going to the villa.
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One thing I haven't seen is where did they all go? From about half time they seemed to vanish as I haven't seen any updates about them and is doesn't seem like many were about at full time.
They all be back on the building sites at 730am tomorrow if they're from the UK. If they've come over from Poland god knows probably down Broad Street now in Popworld and Reflex
You really are a ridiculous little Soccer Bantz child aren’t you?
I learned it all off you bru
Stop being a ******. Stereotyping nationalities is cuntish behaviour.
An absolute text-book piece of racism from Dim Tim there.
What an idiotic comment.
Don't think so Dim Pauline . I was commenting on a group of thugs in B6 this evening or "ultras" who came intent on trouble .
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I’ve been stuck in this pen in Nottingham station since 1989 anyone know when we will be allowed out?
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One thing I haven't seen is where did they all go? From about half time they seemed to vanish as I haven't seen any updates about them and is doesn't seem like many were about at full time.
They all be back on the building sites at 730am tomorrow if they're from the UK. If they've come over from Poland god knows probably down Broad Street now in Popworld and Reflex
You really are a ridiculous little Soccer Bantz child aren’t you?
I learned it all off you bru
Stop being a ******. Stereotyping nationalities is cuntish behaviour.
An absolute text-book piece of racism from Dim Tim there.
What an idiotic comment.
Agree wholeheartedly. Shall share this comment with a Polish events manager I know. Enough stereotypical bollocks around different nations as it is.
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Can’t remember which poster whose lad didn’t like fireworks but hope that if they went they weren’t put off going to the villa.
yammers.
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One thing I haven't seen is where did they all go? From about half time they seemed to vanish as I haven't seen any updates about them and is doesn't seem like many were about at full time.
They all be back on the building sites at 730am tomorrow if they're from the UK. If they've come over from Poland god knows probably down Broad Street now in Popworld and Reflex
You really are a ridiculous little Soccer Bantz child aren’t you?
I learned it all off you bru
Stop being a ******. Stereotyping nationalities is cuntish behaviour.
An absolute text-book piece of racism from Dim Tim there.
What an idiotic comment.
Don't think so Dim Pauline . I was commenting on a group of thugs in B6 this evening or "ultras" who came intent on trouble .
They'll be "back on the building sites" will they?
How is that not racist? All Poles work on building sites, do they?
What a half-witted comment.
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I’ve been stuck in this pen in Nottingham station since 1989 anyone know when we will be allowed out?
When you buy a packet of Tunes.
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One thing I haven't seen is where did they all go? From about half time they seemed to vanish as I haven't seen any updates about them and is doesn't seem like many were about at full time.
They all be back on the building sites at 730am tomorrow if they're from the UK. If they've come over from Poland god knows probably down Broad Street now in Popworld and Reflex
You really are a ridiculous little Soccer Bantz child aren’t you?
I learned it all off you bru
Stop being a ******. Stereotyping nationalities is cuntish behaviour.
An absolute text-book piece of racism from Dim Tim there.
What an idiotic comment.
Don't think so Dim Pauline . I was commenting on a group of thugs in B6 this evening or "ultras" who came intent on trouble .
They'll be "back on the building sites" will they?
How is that not racist? All Poles work on building sites, do they?
What a half-witted comment.
I'm married to a Pole so I know very well thanks. Those ****** who rocked in B6 are Neanderthals and that's who I'm referring to but thanks anyway for your pathetic accusations
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One thing I haven't seen is where did they all go? From about half time they seemed to vanish as I haven't seen any updates about them and is doesn't seem like many were about at full time.
They all be back on the building sites at 730am tomorrow if they're from the UK. If they've come over from Poland god knows probably down Broad Street now in Popworld and Reflex
You really are a ridiculous little Soccer Bantz child aren’t you?
I learned it all off you bru
Stop being a ******. Stereotyping nationalities is cuntish behaviour.
Actually the cuntish behaviour was from them this evening in case you missed it . Hopefully they'll be banned now .
Behave.
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All the WMP horses were made redundant a few years ago. Where did they cone from?
Someone calling in to Talksport said Thames Valley.
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They were refusing to go in anyway, due to not getting a full allocation.
Legia fan phoned up TalkSport and basically admitted that they were trying to force Villa/The Police to let 2000-3000 fans in by force of numbers.
I think they miscalculated their negotiating position, and thought that force of numbers would make WMP back down and allow the allocation they thought they were "entitled" to.
There were a few in front of us trying to tailgate families through turnstiles in the Trinity and had to be sent away.
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All the WMP horses were made redundant a few years ago. Where did they cone from?
Someone calling in to Talksport said Thames Valley.
They were. And for all the accusations flying hither & yon tonight I don't think the police could have done much different. Their ultras told their ordinary supporters that they weren't going in (unconfirmed but from a reliable source well over an hour before kick-off) and I doubt more than a few of their supporters got anywhere near ours.
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Can’t remember which poster whose lad didn’t like fireworks but hope that if they went they weren’t put off going to the villa.
yammers.
He was ok thanks for asking! I (like others) was aware of what was going on but he was oblivious. He did keep asking why no away fans though!
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I'm married to a Pole so I know very well thanks. Those ****** who rocked in B6 are Neanderthals and that's who I'm referring to but thanks anyway for your pathetic accusations
No, Alkmaar at the Neanderthal team, Legia are from Poland.
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They were refusing to go in anyway, due to not getting a full allocation.
Legia fan phoned up TalkSport and basically admitted that they were trying to force Villa/The Police to let 2000-3000 fans in by force of numbers.
I think they miscalculated their negotiating position, and thought that force of numbers would make WMP back down and allow the allocation they thought they were "entitled" to.
There were a few in front of us trying to tailgate families through turnstiles in the Trinity and had to be sent away.
What they didn't account for was that you do not fuck with WMP.
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All the WMP horses were made redundant a few years ago. Where did they cone from?
Worcestershire or Shropshire was mentioned the other month when they were outside for another match.
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Judging by what I’ve read here and from a few other sources the phrase “hoist by your own petard” seems most appropriate. Got everything they deserved the moronic pricks.
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Getting off the train at Aston around 6 about 30 coppers came charging up the stairs, one dropped her handcuffs, to surround a small group of away fans, no idea if they’d caused any bother but it looked heavy handed. From the Aston Tavern we walked up through the church yard to the ground and there were dozens if not hundreds of Legia fans milling about about on the road but it wasn’t confrontational. So my experience tonight was of seemingly heavy handed policing but have no real idea of what might have occurred elsewhere.
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Can’t remember which poster whose lad didn’t like fireworks but hope that if they went they weren’t put off going to the villa.
yammers.
He was ok thanks for asking! I (like others) was aware of what was going on but he was oblivious. He did keep asking why no away fans though!
Bless him!
I hope he (and you 😊 )enjoyed the match, mate.
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Similarly to someone earlier I too did wonder what the police did with them once they let them out once the match had started, if that’s what they did. I should imagine they’d be quite frustrated once let loose!
There was a Polish bloke causing a bit of a nuisance by me as we were queuing up to get in the lower trinity pre kick off.
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Thames Valley 'osses on the Holte car park.
I think the OP is really wide of the mark. It's nothing like Madrid.
Let's contextualise it. We were kept in at Warsaw for ages after the game because their black Ultras (the sad ****** who bring gum shields to football games) were looking to ambush us, with weapons, not too far from the ground. It took a small army of Warsaw Police to get that under control.
They had jet sprays of pepper spray for us and despite Warsaw having being cleared, their police decided to funnel us through a choke point and push us about with riot shields. The area around the ground was very moody in fairness on the bus back.
The whole time we're drinking in Old Town, their firm is milling about in the park, hoping to bump into Villa.
Fast forward to Alkmaar. They're banned from Alkmaar and have to collect tickets from Hague. Only 200 turn up to do this, which gives you an indication of how many "normals" follow them. Instead, for an allocation of 950, 1200+batter through police lines and knock seven shades out of the Dutch Police.
I was speaking to a Dutch version of Bladen in Alkmaar, together with Bladen. It was the worst this Dutch copper had seen and the Dutch have their own issues. There was Villa risk, but they had all stayed in Amsterdam. That pointless turnstile was installed just for us, before the real turnstiles.
They were banned from Mostar.
Bladen's summing up of the Polish police, is not polite so I won't repeat it. The club have issued a statement showing a complete lack of engagement from Legia Warsaw. This is of no surprise.
The Police rightly, based on 9 officers being injured at Leicester, with 1 retiring, all recent history, did not want Legia fabs en masse. They made the decision. It was a correct one.
Legia self evidently believed they could turn up at Villa Park and jib or rush the gates as in Alkmaar. They figured wrong.
Villa did not behave like Warsaw, despite being settled at their ground. We were held for a while at Alkmaar and behaved there too.
WMP were clearly in no mood to fuck around with these twats and their behaviour absolutely justifies the measures taken.
Tonight Legia embarrassed themselves again. From twats throwing stuff into the Hotle, to those trying to kick in the doors, they're pathetic and ought to be booted out the competition.
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From Twitter/X.
Richard H
@Lichrich
·
1h
3000 travelled with only 1000 having tickets. Villa tried to help out by putting a big screen on what's normally the coach carpark so the 2000 ticketless could watch it there but they started rioting outside that the moment they arrived.
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One thing I haven't seen is where did they all go? From about half time they seemed to vanish as I haven't seen any updates about them and is doesn't seem like many were about at full time.
They all be back on the building sites at 730am tomorrow if they're from the UK. If they've come over from Poland god knows probably down Broad Street now in Popworld and Reflex
You really are a ridiculous little Soccer Bantz child aren’t you?
I learned it all off you bru
Stop being a ******. Stereotyping nationalities is cuntish behaviour.
Actually the cuntish behaviour was from them this evening in case you missed it . Hopefully they'll be banned now .
Behave.
Apologies to the moderators. They don’t need extra work from me!
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And yes, I do blame WMP. Same as I blame the Spanish police for what we endured in Madrid back in the day. I also have said many times that Legia have an element that are absolute twats.
However i'm really not sure that the best course of policing to try and diffuse any potential issues is kettle them for hours in a car park on a freezing cold night and then not let them go to the ground, and then ban them completely from entering the ground.
Was it WMPs fault for the trouble they caused when they played Leicester? Was it WMPs fault for the trouble they caused when they played AK which then caused then to have their fans banned from going to Mostar? Is it also WMPs fault that they have been issued a play behind closed doors punishment suspended?
I'm not a big fan of the WMP but I work with a Legia fan and he confirms the behaviour we saw is how they behave everywhere they go.
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We walked up from Brookvale Road , got to Witton Square and couldn't turn left into Manor road or Witton Lane due to a massive Police presence (supported by loads of Meat Wagons). This meant all the Villa fans carrying straight on over the Island to turn left at the access road onto the North Stand car park or Nelson Road a bit further up. Surreal moment as there were dozens of Warsaw fans the other side of the island waiting out of Police view. Villa fans walked past them and neither side engaged in any verbals or shenanigans.
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I feel for their genuine, non-moronic fans who have spent money coming over and not got into the ground. The morons that kicked off and came without tickets can get stuffed quite frankly.
There's a lot of people saying they were refusing to go in themselves, so even the fans who got tickets stood out in the car park by choice. When that didn't get them what they wanted it kicked off and then the choice was taken from them. So its hard to feel too sorry for any of them. (Unless they were afraid to go against the rest of them and just go in, but it seems it was an organised "protest")
If that was the case, then those who did that can be filed into the 'can get stuffed' category as well and have only got themselves to blame.
I do think that it was a pretty unique situation given that it was a Polish team and there is a large Polish contingent living in this country. Probably meant more were able to travel to Birmingham quite easily, though there seems to have been similar issues at AZ as well.
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The ones who wanted to go in didn't have much choice. The ultras say you're staying outside, outside you stay.
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I must say, the BBC story isn't doing enough to clarify who the troublemakers were for my liking. For anybody browsing, it reads like it was general trouble around VP, which could easily be misconstrued as involving our fans.
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The ones who wanted to go in didn't have much choice. The ultras say you're staying outside, outside you stay.
Ah right. What a warped bunch.
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Anyone got any idea what their fans did after they didn't get in? Did they just get the train back to town? I assume WMP had some kind of plan to disperse them
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Be interesting to know what criteria they had for purchasing tickets . You'd think most of their fans who travel home and away would have known what was going down tonight so not many were caught unaware of the strategy of the Ultras ?
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Just wondering when West Midlands Finest (now in special measures) were holding planning meetings and they decided to restrict the ticket alication for Legia fans; did anybody stand up and say:
Being as intelligence tells us at least 2,000 are travelling what do we do if they all turn up at the turnstiles?
From what's happened tonight it looks as if nobody did.
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From what I've read we put a big screen up for them knowing loads wouldn't be getting in so it sounds like the authorities planned for it but the reaction wasn't as expected so what else are they supposed to do .
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Just wondering when West Midlands Finest (now in special measures) were holding planning meetings and they decided to restrict the ticket alication for Legia fans; did anybody stand up and say:
Being as intelligence tells us at least 2,000 are travelling what do we do if they all turn up at the turnstiles?
From what's happened tonight it looks as if nobody did.
In mitigation, do we know how many travelled from Poland and how many were already in the country? And how much advanced knowledge of travelling numbers would WMP even have?
You may be able to control numbers going in and out of the stadium, but you can't stop people from converging outside.
It reminded me a little of the Rapid Vienna game, when groups of theirs were walking out of Tesco with trolleys of beer, not paying. I overheard a bit of a row between the manager and a security guy who said, "when there are 5 of us and 200 of them, what do you think we can do?!"
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Just wondering when West Midlands Finest (now in special measures) were holding planning meetings and they decided to restrict the ticket alication for Legia fans; did anybody stand up and say:
Being as intelligence tells us at least 2,000 are travelling what do we do if they all turn up at the turnstiles?
From what's happened tonight it looks as if nobody did.
Their intention was obvious, they were going to force entry, as they did at Alkmaar. WMP stopped them, so they attacked the Police.
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I can only imagine what might have happened to us in Warsaw as we were held for 2 hours after the game. The police were definitely ready and waiting to get stuck in. It was very moody but luckily the Villa fans behaved as grown ups and it passed of peacefully. The Legia fans came looking for trouble and seemed to think that bringing numbers without tickets should be a reason to be let in. It's a shame really, because the atmosphere would have been great with them inside the ground.
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Just wondering when West Midlands Finest (now in special measures) were holding planning meetings and they decided to restrict the ticket alication for Legia fans; did anybody stand up and say:
Being as intelligence tells us at least 2,000 are travelling what do we do if they all turn up at the turnstiles?
From what's happened tonight it looks as if nobody did.
Their intention was obvious, they were going to force entry, as they did at Alkmaar. WMP stopped them, so they attacked the Police.
Agreed. Not saying the police always perform admirably when covering football (to say the least) but a substantial number of Legia fans seemingly wanted to prove a point using weight of numbers as their leverage.
If that is the case, I'm glad they were locked out, the silly wankers. I hope the decent fans who just wanted to watch the game are reimbursed by their club.
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https://twitter.com/MrAndyPowell/status/1730365085808263240
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https://twitter.com/MrAndyPowell/status/1730365085808263240
Haha, "fuck off back to Erdington"?
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https://twitter.com/MrAndyPowell/status/1730365085808263240
Haha, "fuck off back to Erdington"?
“Welcome to Hellmans”
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https://twitter.com/MrAndyPowell/status/1730365085808263240
Haha, "fuck off back to Erdington"?
He's the bloke who phoned in. "Can I 'ave a Gdansk hat Tom?"
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Thats also pretty impressive solidarity (see what I did there) for absolutely no-one to go in the ground with a ticket.
i imagine you have to be of a certain age group to get the pun...very good though
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What I don’t get is the club saying they limited away tickets because they could not get Legia to co-operate concerning their fans turning up without tickets.
What the hell were Legia supposed to do?
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What I don’t get is the club saying they limited away tickets because they could not get Legia to co-operate concerning their fans turning up without tickets.
What the hell were Legia supposed to do?
Cooperate?
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What I don’t get is the club saying they limited away tickets because they could not get Legia to co-operate concerning their fans turning up without tickets.
What the hell were Legia supposed to do?
Cooperate?
But you can not stop people traveling.
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https://twitter.com/MrAndyPowell/status/1730365085808263240
Andy is a member and contributor to this site, although under an assumed name.
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Just wondering when West Midlands Finest (now in special measures) were holding planning meetings and they decided to restrict the ticket alication for Legia fans; did anybody stand up and say:
Being as intelligence tells us at least 2,000 are travelling what do we do if they all turn up at the turnstiles?
From what's happened tonight it looks as if nobody did.
Their intention was obvious, they were going to force entry, as they did at Alkmaar. WMP stopped them, so they attacked the Police.
That's my suspicion, too. Also, because the police took action based on what they "thought" the fans were going to do, they can't use that as justification. The Legia fans kicking off and injuring police made it a VERY easy decision to prevent them all from getting in. I do feel sorry for the genuine fans interested in the game, not in aggro (of which there must have been quite a few), but I also think it was the right decision to stop them all getting in the moment they turned violent, and it became clear ticketless fans were part of the group trying to gain entry to the ground. Having done it in the Netherlands, they have previous in that respect.
Also bear in mind Villa Park is a ground for the 2028 Euros, so UEFA will have been looking VERY closely at how this was managed. Especially given the issues at the Euro final against Italy with ticketless fans forcing entry. Only time will tell if preventing entry to a violent groups of fans (even if it's not 100% of them) is considered the correct move. I suspect it will be.
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Hopefully no women and children were kettled by WMP - IF we get to the final, how many of us are going to travel without tickets to Athens, it will be interesting to read the reactions on here if we are treated the same by the Greek police.
The further into this competition we go the more likelihood is of us drawing another club with a big away following, are WMP and Villa going to ban their fans as well?
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Hopefully no women and children were kettled by WMP - IF we get to the final, how many of us are going to travel without tickets to Athens, it will be interesting to read the reactions on here if we are treated the same by the Greek police.
The further into this competition we go the more likelihood is of us drawing another club with a big away following, are WMP and Villa going to ban their fans as well?
My view on last night is that this wasn't a case of "this is how we treat away fans", but rather, "this is how we treat fans that stormed the Alkmaar stadium, attacked Dutch police officers and were banned by UEFA from one game in this tournament already."
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There's a difference with being in the same city and trying to jib in to the ground. You saw that last night. Whenever there are big finals, fan parks are set up, that wasn't really an option last night and the match was on TV anyway so there was no excuse. A mixture of entitlement and being twats led to what was saw.
The Condiment Battle of Trinity Road will live long in the memory though....
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What I don’t get is the club saying they limited away tickets because they could not get Legia to co-operate concerning their fans turning up without tickets.
What the hell were Legia supposed to do?
Cooperate?
But you can not stop people traveling.
No, but you could advise them not to. Instead they just had a pop at the number of tickets we gave them. That can't have helped.
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Hopefully no women and children were kettled by WMP - IF we get to the final, how many of us are going to travel without tickets to Athens, it will be interesting to read the reactions on here if we are treated the same by the Greek police.
The further into this competition we go the more likelihood is of us drawing another club with a big away following, are WMP and Villa going to ban their fans as well?
There’s quite a major difference as most Villa fans who travel without tickets don’t try to storm the ground or go any where near it, if they can’t get a ticket they tend to behave like a grown up and watch in a bar on a telly. See Warsaw and Alkmaar.
And if we draw another club with a big following and they try the same trick I hope they get dealt with exactly the same way.
We don’t see a lot of large scale trouble in England these days so fair play to WMP in dealing with it. If I was a normie LW fan with a ticket and just wanting to watch the football I’d be fuming.
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There's plenty the club (LW) could do. There's plenty the Polish police could do too, whose policing of us was dire.
Legia Warsaw were content to let their gum shield roid heads attempt to dictate proceedings. Content to let them refuse to go into the ground, so en masse they could congregate and then storm the turnstiles to force entry. Fair play to WMP who were prepared for them and taught them choices have consequences.
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There's plenty the club (LW) could do. There's plenty the Polish police could do too, whose policing of us was dire.
Completely agree Ads.
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https://twitter.com/MrAndyPowell/status/1730365085808263240
Don’t mess with us, we’re the Daddies.
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Hopefully the Police dogs and horse that were injured are okay
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There is a Twitter pic of a young fella in the Holte absolutely covered in mayonnaise from one of the bottles thrown over.
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39 arrests apparently.
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There is a Twitter pic of a young fella in the Holte absolutely covered in mayonnaise from one of the bottles thrown over.
Another moral victory for the Blues, Mayonnaise is so middle class. I am sure if it was at the sty , working class condiments would have been the chosen weapon like Daddies sauce or HP !
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From The Athletic
This puts a bit more meat on the bone as regards Legia's involvement. They don't appear to have been too co-operative, or to have been prepared to take a conciliatory approach.
Four police officers injured and 39 arrests after crowd trouble before Aston Villa vs Legia Warsaw
Four police officers were injured and 39 arrests were made after crowd disorder outside Villa Park before Aston Villa’s Europa Conference League fixture against Legia Warsaw.
Legia supporters were not allowed into the away end at Villa Park due to the trouble. Birmingham Police confirmed missiles were thrown at officers and a “significant policing operation” was required.
Members of the public were advised to avoid Witton Lane, where the Villa Park away end is located.
A statement from West Midlands Police stated: “We were faced with disgusting and highly dangerous scenes as trouble flared ahead of the fixture between Aston Villa and Legia Warsaw. We had a significant policing presence in place because of safety concerns. This stemmed from visiting fans having been involved in previous match day disorder.
“Tonight’s disorder is believed to have sparked when tickets were not distributed by the away club to supporters outside the ground, as had been anticipated.
“During the disorder, four officers were injured – with one taken to hospital – along with two police horses and two police dogs as missiles including flares were thrown towards them. Thankfully their injuries are not believed to be serious.
“We’ve so far made 39 arrests on suspicion of offences including violent disorder and assaulting a police officer and they have been taken into custody for questioning. We will further review all available footage to identify perpetrators.”
Legia released a statement 30 minutes before kick off claiming Villa’s decision to reduce their away allocation had “unnecessarily exacerbated the atmosphere”.
Legia’s ticket allocation for the fixture was reduced due to concerns after previous incidents of crowd trouble. Legia were fined €15,000 by UEFA and away supporters were banned from attending their Europa League group stage fixture against HSK Zrinjski Mostar following crowd disturbances at October’s match against AZ Alkmaar.
Legia claim their Villa Park allocation was reduced to 890, while Villa claim it was 1,002.
UEFA regulations state home clubs must make at least five per cent of their stadium capacity available exclusively to visiting supporters — this would amount to 2,100 seats at Villa Park.
A Legia statement read: “Instead of relieving potential pre-match tensions, Aston Villa FC’s restrictive measures as the host club unnecessarily exacerbate the atmosphere. In our opinion, such measures are counterproductive and baseless.”
An Aston Villa statement read: “Aston Villa Football Club can confirm that no away fans were allowed into Villa Park for this evening’s UEFA Europa Conference League fixture with Legia Warsaw on the advice of West Midlands Police following large-scale disorder outside the stadium caused by visiting supporters.
“The UK safety authorities, UEFA and Aston Villa, communicated on November 2 that the ticket allocation for away fans for this fixture would be reduced to 1,002 on the advice of safety authorities as a result of previous large-scale disorder caused by Legia fans last month at AZ Alkmaar.
“In spite of numerous requests for cooperation from Legia Warsaw concerning their travelling supporters, especially in the last two days, no assistance on the serious safety matter of away fans attending Villa Park was forthcoming from the visiting club. The club has repeatedly, including this morning, raised concerns in conjunction with UEFA and all the relevant authorities to Legia that ticketless away supporters were attempting to attend Villa Park.
“Approximately an hour before kick-off, Legia fans engaged in planned and systematic violent acts against West Midlands Police officers and a decision was then made by West Midlands Police to exclude all Legia supporters.”
The Athletic has contacted UEFA for comment.
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I presume their fans who had tickets were mightly pissed off at not getting in so who knows, in the long run it might change the mindset of a few of their fans who normally tolerate the Ultra/Pet Shop Boys mob who follow them. Even their club might wise up a little as well.
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I presume their fans who had tickets were mightly pissed off at not getting in so who knows, in the long run it might change the mindset of a few of their fans who normally tolerate the Ultra/Pet Shop Boys mob who follow them. Even their club might wise up a little as well.
From what Legia are saying, I doubt it. Their club officials seem afraid to do anything about the problem.
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I presume their fans who had tickets were mightly pissed off at not getting in so who knows, in the long run it might change the mindset of a few of their fans who normally tolerate the Ultra/Pet Shop Boys mob who follow them. Even their club might wise up a little as well.
It's a nice thought, but if you're prepared to lob a glass bottle into a crowd of people with no regard to the possible consequences, then I don't imagine the feelings of decent fans are going to be taken into consideration by those cretins.
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Nothing will change for their fans if the club are not willing to condemn the violence and also blame it on us for reducing the capacity - which was also in part to their involvement in previous violence.
Can only imagine the club are scared of the ultras, or that they have strong links to the club hierarchy
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There were some Legia fans by me in the Middle Trinity they were quickly removed by the stewards.
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It does feel like we've set a precedent here. Either this will be widely criticised across the board, including by UEFA, or travelling away fans better get used to the prospect of not actually seeing games, tickets or not.
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What I don’t get is the club saying they limited away tickets because they could not get Legia to co-operate concerning their fans turning up without tickets.
What the hell were Legia supposed to do?
In the days leading up to the game Legia made provocative statements saying how hard they’d tried to get extra tickets and how unreasonable we were being.
If we had been in this position, Villa’s public statements would be telling fans we were not to travel without tickets under any circumstances.
OK - it would have no effect on these idiots, but Legia made no attempt to calm the situation, no statement regarding it being due to their fans behaviour in previous rounds, they went on about how unfair it all was - they basically stirred the pot. That can’t go in noticed.
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Kick them out. The club are complicit. Everybody knew they were going to try and re-run Alkmaar, by battering their way through. They thought WMP would acquiesce and just let them in. That the club failed to take any measures to distribute tickets makes them responsible as much as their roid head fight club gimps that orchestrated it.
Ban them from Europe. Small Heath style wankers.
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‘Tonight’s disorder is believed to have sparked when tickets were not distributed by the away club to supporters outside the ground, as had been anticipated.”
Why would Legia do that and exacerbate the situation? Maybe, as others have suggested, they are intimidated by these ultras, but it’s clear the police and Villa couldn’t have done anything other than close the ground to them.
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A Legia fan on talksport (I know, I know) without a ticket phoned up and basically said that they knew they only had 900 tickets but turned up anyway and said you either let us all in or none of us are going in. Might try this the next time I dont get a ticket for an event.
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What a bizarre attitude and culture that club has. Everybody's fault but theirs and scared of their own thuggish fans.
I hope we never have to play them again.
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What a bizarre attitude and culture that club has. Everybody's fault but theirs and scared of their own thuggish fans.
I hope we never have to play them again.
reminds me of a club in the EPL ::)
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I’m fairly sure a Legia fan sat next to me. Not a word out of him throughout the 90 mins and his attire were the giveaways. Hope he enjoyed the game as much as he could. I caught the train at Chester Rd and seen a Polish Mother and Father with their 6 or 7 year old son, the Mom with Villa hat and the son, villa hat and scarf. Looked like it was his first game and theirs. We exchanged smiles.
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Assistant Chief Constable of WMP just been on Talksport. He was saying that the tickets were given to Legia Warsaw and they didn't allocate any as they weren't happy with the allocation.
He then went on to say that the coach park on Witton Road was a ticket collection point where the Legia Warsaw fans were supposed to pick their tickets up from and then those with tickets were supposed to be escorted to the turnstiles.
He then said that the decision was made an hour before that they wouldn't be letting any of them in. 46 in custody now apparently.
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It is a real shame some cant behave as it would have been brilliant atmosphere with them in there
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All the WMP horses were made redundant a few years ago. Where did they cone from?
Worcestershire or Shropshire was mentioned the other month when they were outside for another match.
What a dark day for our once great club. Even the police horses are all from the shires and don't drink in town.
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Am I understanding this correctly, at the point they were all in that car park none of them had been allocated tickets and weren't going to be as it would have been too late?
Wasn't there a less volatile place they could have been taken then?
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All the WMP horses were made redundant a few years ago. Where did they cone from?
Worcestershire or Shropshire was mentioned the other month when they were outside for another match.
What a dark day for our once great club. Even the police horses are all from the shires and don't drink in town.
Ha ha, excellent.
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Bewdley?
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https://twitter.com/MrAndyPowell/status/1730365085808263240
Haha, "fuck off back to Erdington"?
Oi!! :D
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Hopefully no women and children were kettled by WMP - IF we get to the final, how many of us are going to travel without tickets to Athens, it will be interesting to read the reactions on here if we are treated the same by the Greek police.
The further into this competition we go the more likelihood is of us drawing another club with a big away following, are WMP and Villa going to ban their fans as well?
Hundreds turned up without tickets and staff from Legia did not turn up to issue fans with tickets as a protest. Should they have let ticketless fans in and then how many?
Unfortunately you’re going to get innocent people who’ve been caught up in it but it was unavoidable. Up to 3,000 apparently turned up with Legia refusing to tell them not to and washing their hands of it. Their fans were not banned, their allocation was cut because they can’t behave and yet they still turned up with a view to force their way in.
Hell bent on violence as per previous games and remember they were let in at Leicester and played up in the ground. I’ve absolutely no doubt if they been let in the game would’ve been stopped at some point and maybe innocent fans from our side would’ve been hurt.
They should be banned and for a considerable amount of time as well.
WMP and our club should be praised not ridiculed.
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All the WMP horses were made redundant a few years ago. Where did they cone from?
Worcestershire or Shropshire was mentioned the other month when they were outside for another match.
What a dark day for our once great club. Even the police horses are all from the shires and don't drink in town.
Magnificent.
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It does feel like we've set a precedent here. Either this will be widely criticised across the board, including by UEFA, or travelling away fans better get used to the prospect of not actually seeing games, tickets or not.
No. Police decision correct decision. They behaved badly. We have been to Warsaw and Alkmaar. Ticket distribution efficiently organised by our club and exemplarily behaviour from those of us who were there despite local agitation. Correction should be applied where the fault lies.
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https://twitter.com/MrAndyPowell/status/1730365085808263240
Don’t mess with us, we’re the Daddies.
The bloody sauce of it ...
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On all the pics I've seen, there doesn't appear to be 2k people in that car park, or anywhere near it. Are there reports of lots of them staying in town?
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On all the pics I've seen, there doesn't appear to be 2k people in that car park, or anywhere near it. Are there reports of lots of them staying in town?
I've also read that Legia didn't release the allocated tickets to their fans in protest.
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Has anyone found out where they all went to after the match? Didn't see a single one of the post-game.
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I’ve read a few comments about Pet Shop Boy crowd/ mob etc, what’s all that about?
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Has anyone found out where they all went to after the match? Didn't see a single one of the post-game.
I’d imagine that they all fucked off back to central Brum. Apart from the Sauce Throwers.
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Has anyone found out where they all went to after the match? Didn't see a single one of the post-game.
Snobs
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All the WMP horses were made redundant a few years ago. Where did they cone from?
There were actually a couple by the coach park for the Luton game which surprised me as like you haven't seen them in games for years.
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Is this a fair summary?
Legia were given tickets to distribute but refused.
The coach park was chose to be the best venue for distribution.
For those without tickets a big screen was also put on there to create an effective "fanzone"
Rather than comply supporters attacked police resulting in a police woman set on fire, three other injuries and injuries to horses and dogs.
Other supporters through projectiles at Villa supporters inside the ground.
Surely pretty straightforward statement for AVFC and WMP to Uefa?
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More from The Athletic
It looks as if Legia's hierarchy weren't prepared to do anything to defuse the ticketing issue and now seem to be playing the victim card.
Punishment for Legia
Kicked out of the competition?
Hone game v AZ to be played behind closed doors?
Financial penalties?
HOW ASTON VILLA’S EUROPEAN TIE WITH LEGIA WARSAW DESCENDED INTO CHAOS
No one will remember Aston Villa’s victory over Legia Warsaw for the football after an evening of chaos at Villa Park. For the record, it was 2-1 to the home team but it was events off the pitch that will linger in the memory.
Legia supporters were barred from entering the stadium following what West Midlands police described as “disgusting and highly dangerous scenes.”
Forty-six arrests were made for a variety of offences, including violent disorder and assaulting police officers. West Midlands police say they will further review all available footage to identify the perpetrators, with four officers hurt and one being taken to hospital. Two police horses and two dogs were injured, with objects, including flares, thrown in their direction. All injuries are believed not to be serious.
Chief Inspector and match commander Tim Robinson said: “This should have been a great evening of football which was enjoyed by fans from both clubs. Unfortunately, there were appalling scenes which saw away fans dangerously throw flares and other missiles at our officers. We were there to help keep people safe, yet officers’ own safety was put at risk because of the deplorable actions of others.
“Due to the extreme violence, there was no other choice but to prevent away fans entering the stadium. The safety of everyone is our priority, and clearly we had no other option. There can never be a place for such appalling behaviour, and this is something ourselves and the wider community should never have to experience.”
Legia supporters had been penned inside the car park on Witton Lane, situated between the North Stand and the Doug Ellis Stand, as kick-off approached. Police were armed with riot shields and batons with tensions quickly escalating.
Both clubs have painted a contrasting picture behind the reasons for the trouble and what transpired on Thursday evening. The Athletic explains the initial disagreement and a timeline of events…
Going into the game, Villa and Legia were level on nine points after four UEFA Conference League group-stage matches. Victory for either would leave them in the driving seat to finish top of the group and progress to the round of 16.
However, potential trouble was identified 28 days before the match, when the UK safety authorities, UEFA and Villa informed Legia that the ticket allocation available for visiting supporters would be reduced to 1,000 after “previous large scale disorder” last month away to AZ Alkmaar, having observed, as Villa’s statement describes, “a number of Dutch police officers” injured. UEFA subsequently banned Legia fans from travelling to Bosnia for their next away trip against HSK Zrinjski.
The quota for away supporters in UEFA competitions is five per cent of the stadium’s capacity, which would equate to 2,100 tickets at Villa Park. Legia say they applied for that number but were refused. There remains a disagreement between the two clubs as to how many tickets were given to Legia fans, with the Polish side stating it was 890.
The Athletic has spoken to local businesses in Alkmaar who allege Legia supporters left negative reviews on their relevant websites and attempted to damage the areas around the stadium. During the fixture, riots broke out with local police, prosecutors and AZ issued a statement condemning the behaviour.
Legia supporters strongly denied any wrongdoing and criticised what they perceived as an anti-Polish bias from Dutch authorities and media.
Similarly, Legia were deeply unhappy with the ticket reduction at Villa Park and claimed to have “repeatedly appealed”, asking Villa to comply with the previous compromised solution, agreed on September 21, of 1,700 tickets — the same number they gave Villa in the reverse fixture. In a club statement released on Thursday evening, Legia insist the “proposal was officially accepted and duly documented in the UEFA delegate’s report.”
A Legia statement read: “Rather than defuse potential pre-match tensions as the host club, they unnecessarily exacerbate the atmosphere. In our opinion, such measures are counterproductive and baseless.”
The UK authorities’ decision to reduce the ticket allocation sparked increasing fury among Legia fans this week. Despite a smaller quota, it is understood around 1,000 additional ticketless supporters travelled from Warsaw to Birmingham.
In the build-up, Legia declared they had sent representatives to England to negotiate with the relevant authorities and hoped to resolve the issue. Villa, though, insisted “no assistance on the serious safety matter of away fans attending Villa Park was forthcoming from the visiting club.”
A Villa statement, released at half-time on Thursday, read: “The club has repeatedly, including this morning (November 30), raised concerns in conjunction with UEFA and all the relevant authorities to Legia that ticketless away supporters were attempting to attend Villa Park. Approximately an hour before kick-off, Legia fans engaged in planned and systematic violent acts against West Midlands Police officers and a decision was then made by West Midlands Police to exclude all Legia supporters.
“Aston Villa strongly condemns the behaviour of those visiting supporters and would like to thank West Midlands Police for their professionalism in very difficult circumstances.”
There was a strong police presence around Villa Park from mid-afternoon. Dozens of police vans were parked on the roads outside the Trinity Road and Doug Ellis stands, with additional vehicles, including horseboxes, in the Holte End car park.
At 7.28pm, just over half an hour before kick-off, it was confirmed that Witton Lane — the road where Legia supporters were being funnelled by police and away from The Holte End — would be closed off for Villa supporters. Home fans requiring that route would need to access the stadium from a different turnstile, directed by club staff.
Legia fans were still not in the ground, instead being penned in the nearby car park. Sharp objects, including bits of tree and flares were being thrown, with police attempting to control the situation. Supporters, clad in black and some wearing balaclavas, attempted — a cluster successfully — to access the stadium via home turnstiles.
In their club statement, Legia claimed its official delegation, management board and owner and president Dariusz Mioduski decided against going into the stadium.
Just as the match was getting underway, the police confirmed no Legia supporters would be allowed in following disorder and missiles thrown at them. Pieces of equipment, including roadwork signs and debris, were trashed. Three officers had been injured while, in the police’s words, “a significant policing operation” continued.
The atmosphere inside the ground, meanwhile, was subdued. The away end remained empty with four rows of stewards standing in the area for the first 15 minutes of the game, before dispersing and moving elsewhere.
Accepting Legia fans could not be allowed inside Villa Park, police attempted to shift Legia supporters away from the stadium. They walked back out of Witton Lane and towards The Holte End, when Villa supporters, situated between that stand and the neighbouring Trinity Road end, were able to see Legia supporters, some of whom were banging on the metal doors outside the ground.
“There were moments where Legia fans were being manhandled out all around the ground,” said Dom Smith, a Villa supporter sitting in The Holte Lower. “Other Villa fans were looking around thinking ‘Is the guy next to me a Legia fan?’ It felt like it could erupt at any time. More people were looking out at Legia fans throwing bottles than watching the match.”
“Aston Villa apologises for the delay in entering the stadium due to safety reasons,” read the stadium announcer in the 19th minute, before repeating the same message a quarter of an hour later. “Due to safety reasons, no supporters will be able to visit the smoking area at half-time. We apologise for the inconvenience.”
Legia’s equaliser, scored by forward Ernest Muci, provoked further disruption after a handful of Legia supporters had managed to get themselves into the ground via The North Stand and celebrated. They were quickly ejected, with heavily-equipped police forming a line and scanning the area for any more Legia supporters.
Despite Legia’s supporters largely dispersing and filtering away from Villa Park, The Athletic spoke to five visiting fans a few hundred yards away at half-time, standing outside the Trinity Road stand. They tucked their Legia scarves underneath their coats, with the increased police presence blocking roads. They initially claimed to have been Villa supporters.
“A steward started pushing me towards the exit at half-time and said he was escorting me out because I was an away fan,” said Patrick Edmond, a Villa supporter who sat in The Holte End. “His colleague figured he got the wrong guy — there was a bloke behind me all in black who was clearly a Legia fan. There were quite a few of them in the home end.
“Everyone was on edge a little bit. There was nobody there when we got out, though. From everything I saw, I don’t know what justified shutting them (Legia supporters) out completely.”
Polish journalist Samuel Szczygielski, who witnessed the trouble, echoed a contrasting account from Legia’s perspective. He posted a photo of his bloodied left hand and insisted the police had been violent against away supporters. “The English are sick animals,” he tweeted. “Total brutality towards Legia fans.”
Legia coach Kosta Runjaic declined to comment on Legia’s fans being locked out, while counterpart Unai Emery offered a short response, attesting he only focused on Villa’s home atmosphere. Legia’s press officer Bartosz Zaslawski, however, told journalists that players had their concentration affected, stating they were thinking about their families getting into that ground, but that possibility was cancelled.”
Police vans only began to exit Villa Park after 11 pm, The Holte End still full with dozens of vehicles. Further ramifications of a deeply disturbing evening are to come.
UEFA released the following statement on Friday morning: “UEFA strongly condemns the unacceptable violence which occurred around the Aston Villa v Legia Warsaw match. UEFA is in the process of gathering all official reports from the game before deciding on potential next steps.”
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I dont think there was a fan zone or any attempt to create one. Not within the footprint of the ground.
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I think that the reporter doesn't know the location of the coach park.
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I dont think there was a fan zone or any attempt to create one. Not within the footprint of the ground.
The coach park was the plan.
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The Athletic has spoken to local businesses in Alkmaar who allege Legia supporters left negative reviews on their relevant websites
Hanging is too good for them. Bastards.
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Is this a fair summary?
Legia were given tickets to distribute but refused.
The coach park was chose to be the best venue for distribution.
For those without tickets a big screen was also put on there to create an effective "fanzone"
Rather than comply supporters attacked police resulting in a police woman set on fire, three other injuries and injuries to horses and dogs.
Other supporters through projectiles at Villa supporters inside the ground.
Surely pretty straightforward statement for AVFC and WMP to Uefa?
Shocking if true, but I've not heard this from elsewhere.
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The whole ultra culture is a load of bollocks. It's just criminality dressed up as being ultra passionate about your club. It's about time UEFA and FIFA started to clamp down more on these clubs with notorious ultras. They all look pathetic anyway! Like a bunch of ninjas without the Kung Fu skills. Pathetic hooligan Wannabees.
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Is it a case that the Legia staff didn't distribute tickets as a protest, or were they afraid to face their own fans who weren't going to be given tickets?
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Is this a fair summary?
Legia were given tickets to distribute but refused.
The coach park was chose to be the best venue for distribution.
For those without tickets a big screen was also put on there to create an effective "fanzone"
Rather than comply supporters attacked police resulting in a police woman set on fire, three other injuries and injuries to horses and dogs.
Other supporters through projectiles at Villa supporters inside the ground.
Surely pretty straightforward statement for AVFC and WMP to Uefa?
Shocking if true, but I've not heard this from elsewhere.
I'd seen reports of that too, not confirmed.
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Is this a fair summary?
Legia were given tickets to distribute but refused.
The coach park was chose to be the best venue for distribution.
For those without tickets a big screen was also put on there to create an effective "fanzone"
Rather than comply supporters attacked police resulting in a police woman set on fire, three other injuries and injuries to horses and dogs.
Other supporters through projectiles at Villa supporters inside the ground.
Surely pretty straightforward statement for AVFC and WMP to Uefa?
Shocking if true, but I've not heard this from elsewhere.
Its on the Daily Mail website, with pics, looks like a flare thrown set fire to his/her trousers.
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If they'd been let into the ground with or without tickets, you can only imagine what they'd have done once inside. Home fans would have been the next target & things would have escalated from there. Following that UEFA would have charged us with failing to control our fans.
If we meet them again in the final would we get their share of the tickets?
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If they'd been let into the ground with or without tickets, you can only imagine what they'd have done once inside. Home fans would have been the next target & things would have escalated from there. Following that UEFA would have charged us with failing to control our fans.
If we meet them again in the final would we get their share of the tickets?
There’s no way they’re getting anywhere near the final. A well organised team with a few good individuals ( that Muci is a nice little player) but they’re no where near good enough to get beyond the R16 imv.
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Legia appear utterly detached from reality. Fucking sad twats, from top to bottom.
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If we meet them again in the final would we get their share of the tickets?
From the evidence of last night if that does happen you would have ticketless Legia fans roaming Athens mixed with Villa fans who may or may not have tickets. It probably wouldn't end well.
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Is there no way Mostar can finish 2nd now? Seems like picking the lesser of 2 evils between AZ and Legia. (Although I think AZ were well behaved both games vs us?)
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Is this a fair summary?
Legia were given tickets to distribute but refused.
The coach park was chose to be the best venue for distribution.
For those without tickets a big screen was also put on there to create an effective "fanzone"
Rather than comply supporters attacked police resulting in a police woman set on fire, three other injuries and injuries to horses and dogs.
Other supporters through projectiles at Villa supporters inside the ground.
Surely pretty straightforward statement for AVFC and WMP to Uefa?
Shocking if true, but I've not heard this from elsewhere.
Its on the Daily Mail website, with pics, looks like a flare thrown set fire to his/her trousers.
Unfortunately there's video footage with her screams. I think the bravery shown last night was astonishing really.
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Is there no way Mostar can finish 2nd now? Seems like picking the lesser of 2 evils between AZ and Legia. (Although I think AZ were well behaved both games vs us?)
Six points away from second place with only game remaining I believe.
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Is there no way Mostar can finish 2nd now? Seems like picking the lesser of 2 evils between AZ and Legia. (Although I think AZ were well behaved both games vs us?)
Six points away from second place with only game remaining I believe.
So........if it kicks off between AZ and Legia fans and they both get kicked out of the competition as punishment.
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Alkmaar aren't taking an allocation over to Warsaw. It will be behind close doors I suspect.
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If we meet them again in the final would we get their share of the tickets?
From the evidence of last night if that does happen you would have ticketless Legia fans roaming Athens mixed with Villa fans who may or may not have tickets. It probably wouldn't end well.
Considering the allocation for both clubs that make the final will be pitiful the chances of thousands of fans, especially if we make the final, without tickets will be high. Just got to hope that the organisation is on point.
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I’ve read a few comments about Pet Shop Boy crowd/ mob etc, what’s all that about?
Their fans burst into a rendition of Go West by all accounts.
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Legia are shite. They're getting nowhere near the final.
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I’ve read a few comments about Pet Shop Boy crowd/ mob etc, what’s all that about?
Their fans burst into a rendition of Go West by all accounts.
Oh right… so much for “life is peaceful there”.
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I’ve read a few comments about Pet Shop Boy crowd/ mob etc, what’s all that about?
Their fans burst into a rendition of Go West by all accounts.
It’s a sin if that is true…
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what have we done to deserve this
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Is this a fair summary?
Legia were given tickets to distribute but refused.
The coach park was chose to be the best venue for distribution.
For those without tickets a big screen was also put on there to create an effective "fanzone"
Rather than comply supporters attacked police resulting in a police woman set on fire, three other injuries and injuries to horses and dogs.
Other supporters through projectiles at Villa supporters inside the ground.
Surely pretty straightforward statement for AVFC and WMP to Uefa?
Shocking if true, but I've not heard this from elsewhere.
Its on the Daily Mail website, with pics, looks like a flare thrown set fire to his/her trousers.
Unfortunately there's video footage with her screams. I think the bravery shown last night was astonishing really.
Not hearing the screams although sound is cut in places but the video in on the BBC website.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-birmingham-67588149
Reports were all minor injuries so might be superficial burns and nothing serious. It looks like the flare got entangled in the clothing as they are hard to put out because all the fuel is contained within, dropping and rolling did not work either.
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Is this a fair summary?
Legia were given tickets to distribute but refused.
The coach park was chose to be the best venue for distribution.
For those without tickets a big screen was also put on there to create an effective "fanzone"
Rather than comply supporters attacked police resulting in a police woman set on fire, three other injuries and injuries to horses and dogs.
Other supporters through projectiles at Villa supporters inside the ground.
Surely pretty straightforward statement for AVFC and WMP to Uefa?
Shocking if true, but I've not heard this from elsewhere.
I'd seen reports of that too, not confirmed.
It was a flare I think, that got stuck on her when she was on the ground having taken a blow to the head.
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The Polish guy who works in my building kind of shrugged his shoulders and said you have to expect a bit of trouble with football fans.
I think that may have been the case30/40 years ago here, but we live in a different world now.
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Four police officers and police dogs were hurt in clashes with away fans, with one officer suffering concussion when he was hit by a flare.
The concussed officer's jacket caught fire after he was hit with a flare, but the jacket was removed quickly and he did not suffer burns.
The officer, sent by West Mercia Police to support the West Midlands force, was later taken to hospital with smoke inhalation after the smoke from the flare made it into his helmet.
Several police dogs suffered cuts to their paws from broken glass and two police horses were injured when they were punched.
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Are those the same kind of flares you can buy on Amazon for a tenner or so, or something different? If the latter how do they get them on the planes over?
I did start looking on Amazon then saw one of them described as 'perfect for gender reveal parties' then got so irked I had to close the window down.
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Fucking Geordies. I knew it.
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The Polish guy who works in my building kind of shrugged his shoulders and said you have to expect a bit of trouble with football fans.
I think that may have been the case30/40 years ago here, but we live in a different world now.
Poland are 30/40 years behind us in terms of football "hooliganism" , it's in its renaissance period over there
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Imagine being so utterly brain dead, you punch a police horse.
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It would appear that Legia are utterly brain dead from top to bottom...
As the saying goes, "the fish rots from the head down."
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Imagine being so utterly brain dead, you punch a police horse.
I'll bet it wasn't very happy about it either......
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Are those the same kind of flares you can buy on Amazon for a tenner or so, or something different? If the latter how do they get them on the planes over?
I did start looking on Amazon then saw one of them described as 'perfect for gender reveal parties' then got so irked I had to close the window down.
Most of the ones used won't be the type you get on Amazon etc. The main ones you can buy over here are the type used in stuff like paintball. But the strongest ones are the types you buy in Europe. We used to do some pyro down Bromsgrove a few years ago and one of the lads used to bring them over, mainly from Poland. We mainly did smokes rather than flares though.
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Imagine being so utterly brain dead, you punch a police horse.
didn't that happen in Newcastle
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Is this a fair summary?
Legia were given tickets to distribute but refused.
The coach park was chose to be the best venue for distribution.
For those without tickets a big screen was also put on there to create an effective "fanzone"
Rather than comply supporters attacked police resulting in a police woman set on fire, three other injuries and injuries to horses and dogs.
Other supporters through projectiles at Villa supporters inside the ground.
Surely pretty straightforward statement for AVFC and WMP to Uefa?
Shocking if true, but I've not heard this from elsewhere.
Its on the Daily Mail website, with pics, looks like a flare thrown set fire to his/her trousers.
I see, Daily Mail and inferior foreigners, seems to fit whether true or not.
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Talk sport this morning were bemoaning the fact that they had come all that way for nuthin - completely missing the fact that most of them live in Erdington. I jumped on a bus from town six oclock-ish, half way through Newtown about twenty "military-age males" as the phrase goes, jumped on, no colours apart from one who had a scarf, none of them paid and nearly all had bottles of Vodka in their hands. To be fair, they were no bother - thankfully - because i was stood right in the middle of them in a Villa scarf. Their hierachy covered themselves in glory by refusing point-blank to condemn the fucking idiots that did the damage - which was most of them from what i've heard. Also hearing the Witton Arms got smashed to fuck as well.
Do us a favour Piotr - stick to plumbing....
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Talk sport this morning were bemoaning the fact that they had come all that way for nuthin - completely missing the fact that most of them live in Erdington. I jumped on a bus from town six oclock-ish, half way through Newtown about twenty "military-age males" as the phrase goes, jumped on, no colours apart from one who had a scarf, none of them paid and nearly all had bottles of Vodka in their hands. To be fair, they were no bother - thankfully - because i was stood right in the middle of them in a Villa scarf. Their hierachy covered themselves in glory by refusing point-blank to condemn the fucking idiots that did the damage - which was most of them from what i've heard. Also hearing the Witton Arms got smashed to fuck as well.
Do us a favour Piotr - stick to plumbing....
Ah yes the Polish, they’re all plumbers, car washers and Spitfire pilots.
Cut the racial stereotypes can we please. Thanks.
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Has anyone found out where they all went to after the match? Didn't see a single one of the post-game.
fruit picking - thats all some of them are good for...
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Violence from away fans is no excuse for casual racism.
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Talk sport this morning were bemoaning the fact that they had come all that way for nuthin - completely missing the fact that most of them live in Erdington. I jumped on a bus from town six oclock-ish, half way through Newtown about twenty "military-age males" as the phrase goes, jumped on, no colours apart from one who had a scarf, none of them paid and nearly all had bottles of Vodka in their hands. To be fair, they were no bother - thankfully - because i was stood right in the middle of them in a Villa scarf. Their hierachy covered themselves in glory by refusing point-blank to condemn the fucking idiots that did the damage - which was most of them from what i've heard. Also hearing the Witton Arms got smashed to fuck as well.
Do us a favour Piotr - stick to plumbing....
Ah yes the Polish, they’re all plumbers, car washers and Spitfire pilots.
Cut the racial stereotypes can we please. Thanks.
Good pilots by all accounts and showed our lot up in The Battle of Britain
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Talk sport this morning were bemoaning the fact that they had come all that way for nuthin - completely missing the fact that most of them live in Erdington. I jumped on a bus from town six oclock-ish, half way through Newtown about twenty "military-age males" as the phrase goes, jumped on, no colours apart from one who had a scarf, none of them paid and nearly all had bottles of Vodka in their hands. To be fair, they were no bother - thankfully - because i was stood right in the middle of them in a Villa scarf. Their hierachy covered themselves in glory by refusing point-blank to condemn the fucking idiots that did the damage - which was most of them from what i've heard. Also hearing the Witton Arms got smashed to fuck as well.
Do us a favour Piotr - stick to plumbing....
Ah yes the Polish, they’re all plumbers, car washers and Spitfire pilots.
Cut the racial stereotypes can we please. Thanks.
Good pilots by all accounts and showed our lot up in The Battle of Britain
Not sure they showed our lot up but they were without doubt skilled & brave pilots along with the 1st Independent Parachute Brigade at Operation Market Garden who also fought with skill and bravery and took heavy losses.
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'"Military age males" as the saying goes.' The saying of...Ratko Mladic??
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Club statement on the club website now too. Legia's officials seemed to know that fans without tickets were going to travel and failed to instruct their fans not to do so. Twice they have done this. Kick them out of the competition.
Didn't somebody mention earlier this evening the the club are shit scared of their ultras?
Their Ultras basically run the club, which explains everything. Mongrels.
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It must be shit to be a normal fan that supports clubs like Legia. Being tarred with the same brush, ending up not allowed into games etc. Be it like last night or bans on fans from matches.
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Doesn't bare thinking about if they had of managed to get into the Witton or worse still the Holte.
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I'm still not clear - did Legia actually refuse to distribute tickets to their fans at the place that had been set aside for that purpose? And was it that refusal that left the police needing to decide what to do?
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I'm still not clear - did Legia actually refuse to distribute tickets to their fans at the place that had been set aside for that purpose? And was it that refusal that left the police needing to decide what to do?
I'm not sure but I think we wanted it done in town and they refused, then they said the ultras were in charge of giving them out and those charming lads said all or nothing.
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I did wonder if the Police had stated do it on the coach park so they had a cordon already and not having it kick-off in the city centre itself where more damage could be caused.
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The whole ultra culture is a load of bollocks. It's just criminality dressed up as being ultra passionate about your club. It's about time UEFA and FIFA started to clamp down more on these clubs with notorious ultras. They all look pathetic anyway! Like a bunch of ninjas without the Kung Fu skills. Pathetic hooligan Wannabees.
Totally agree. Dullard mask wearing hooligan wannabes. Tedious fuckers whatever nationality.
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The whole ultra culture is a load of bollocks. It's just criminality dressed up as being ultra passionate about your club. It's about time UEFA and FIFA started to clamp down more on these clubs with notorious ultras. They all look pathetic anyway! Like a bunch of ninjas without the Kung Fu skills. Pathetic hooligan Wannabees.
Totally agree. Dullard mask wearing hooligan wannabes. Tedious fuckers whatever nationality.
Sparkler waving, Pet Shop Boy Singing, Mayo throwing ******
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I'm still not clear - did Legia actually refuse to distribute tickets to their fans at the place that had been set aside for that purpose? And was it that refusal that left the police needing to decide what to do?
I'm not sure but I think we wanted it done in town and they refused, then they said the ultras were in charge of giving them out and those charming lads said all or nothing.
Apparently Legia didn't accept any allocation until 4pm yesterday and didn't collect them until 6.15pm.
We've launched an official complaint against Legia to UEFA.
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I'm still not clear - did Legia actually refuse to distribute tickets to their fans at the place that had been set aside for that purpose? And was it that refusal that left the police needing to decide what to do?
I'm not sure but I think we wanted it done in town and they refused, then they said the ultras were in charge of giving them out and those charming lads said all or nothing.
Apparently Legia didn't accept any allocation until 4pm yesterday and didn't collect them until 6.15pm.
We've launched an official complaint against Legia to UEFA.
why on earth would we release tickets that late ?
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I'm still not clear - did Legia actually refuse to distribute tickets to their fans at the place that had been set aside for that purpose? And was it that refusal that left the police needing to decide what to do?
I'm not sure but I think we wanted it done in town and they refused, then they said the ultras were in charge of giving them out and those charming lads said all or nothing.
Apparently Legia didn't accept any allocation until 4pm yesterday and didn't collect them until 6.15pm.
We've launched an official complaint against Legia to UEFA.
why on earth would we release tickets that late ?
Legia, on Thursday morning, were still telling us that they didn't know if they would accept ANY tickets from us. It's not a case of us being late, it is a case of them prevaricating pointlessly.
They then refused to take them (ie to accept them at the pick up point) unless all of them were let in, which was clearly never going to happen.
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The club have released a couple of statements today explaining it all. Sounds like Legia have behaved ridiculously
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That said you never know with our ticket office…….
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Did they call Nicola?
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Aston Villa can confirm it has lodged an official complaint with UEFA over the conduct of Legia Warsaw Football Club and the behaviour of their supporters prior to last night’s UEFA Europa Conference League match at Villa Park.
Four police officers were injured and 46 Legia supporters were arrested after unprecedented violence by the Polish fans outside the stadium.
This shocking behaviour followed Legia club officials’ complete lack of cooperation with West Midlands Police, Aston Villa and UEFA throughout the day.
It started during the standard pre-match operational meeting that commenced at 10.30am on Thursday morning and was attended by UEFA representatives, including UEFA’s security team, as well as West Midlands Police including representatives from both clubs. Legia Warsaw refused to confirm if they would accept their allocation of tickets for the match at that point. This is in stark contrast to normal UEFA operational procedures.
They advised the meeting that they would meet with their supporters at 2.30pm and communicate the decision at 3pm but advised there was a possibility that they would not accept the tickets.
Despite repeated requests before and after the 3pm deadline for a decision, there was no communication until 4pm when Legia informed Aston Villa that they wished to receive their ticket allocation.
These tickets were handed to Legia officials immediately upon their arrival at the stadium at 6.16pm. To reiterate, Legia officials were advised on a call that included a number of UEFA representatives on November 2 that they would receive an allocation of 1002 – exactly four weeks prior to last night’s fixture.
Chris Heck, President of Business Operations at Aston Villa, said: “The lack of cooperation and prevarication from Legia Warsaw officials prior to the match was entirely unacceptable and deeply disappointing. This behaviour increased the danger that West Midlands Police officers and our own fans were subjected to before the game and the scenes of disorder from the Legia fans have no place in modern football or civilised society.
“Aston Villa will be making further representations to UEFA in order to ensure that other clubs and police forces across Europe are not exposed to similar serious safety risks at the hands of Legia Warsaw.
“We are immensely grateful to West Midlands Police for keeping our supporters and our local community safe last night and are pleased that they will also be making their own representations via the UK police authorities to UEFA.”
https://www.avfc.co.uk/news/2023/december/01/club-statement/
Sounds like the club are pretty fucking angry, and it is not surprising.
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Talk sport this morning were bemoaning the fact that they had come all that way for nuthin - completely missing the fact that most of them live in Erdington. I jumped on a bus from town six oclock-ish, half way through Newtown about twenty "military-age males" as the phrase goes, jumped on, no colours apart from one who had a scarf, none of them paid and nearly all had bottles of Vodka in their hands. To be fair, they were no bother - thankfully - because i was stood right in the middle of them in a Villa scarf. Their hierachy covered themselves in glory by refusing point-blank to condemn the fucking idiots that did the damage - which was most of them from what i've heard. Also hearing the Witton Arms got smashed to fuck as well.
Do us a favour Piotr - stick to plumbing....
Ah yes the Polish, they’re all plumbers, car washers and Spitfire pilots.
Cut the racial stereotypes can we please. Thanks.
Good pilots by all accounts and showed our lot up in The Battle of Britain
Not sure they showed our lot up but they were without doubt skilled & brave pilots along with the 1st Independent Parachute Brigade at Operation Market Garden who also fought with skill and bravery and took heavy losses.
They went in all guns blazing, which upset the British high command old chap, read the autobiography of the Polish general in charge and apportion blame on him for one of the failures of the mission,think he was exconerated about the seventies or eighties
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Throw the fuckers out, absolute wankers. They've put everyone at risk with that shite.
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So does PWS back down on his statements from last night or is it still the fault of the club, the city and the WMP?
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Aston Villa can confirm it has lodged an official complaint with UEFA over the conduct of Legia Warsaw Football Club and the behaviour of their supporters prior to last night’s UEFA Europa Conference League match at Villa Park.
Four police officers were injured and 46 Legia supporters were arrested after unprecedented violence by the Polish fans outside the stadium.
This shocking behaviour followed Legia club officials’ complete lack of cooperation with West Midlands Police, Aston Villa and UEFA throughout the day.
It started during the standard pre-match operational meeting that commenced at 10.30am on Thursday morning and was attended by UEFA representatives, including UEFA’s security team, as well as West Midlands Police including representatives from both clubs. Legia Warsaw refused to confirm if they would accept their allocation of tickets for the match at that point. This is in stark contrast to normal UEFA operational procedures.
They advised the meeting that they would meet with their supporters at 2.30pm and communicate the decision at 3pm but advised there was a possibility that they would not accept the tickets.
Despite repeated requests before and after the 3pm deadline for a decision, there was no communication until 4pm when Legia informed Aston Villa that they wished to receive their ticket allocation.
These tickets were handed to Legia officials immediately upon their arrival at the stadium at 6.16pm. To reiterate, Legia officials were advised on a call that included a number of UEFA representatives on November 2 that they would receive an allocation of 1002 – exactly four weeks prior to last night’s fixture.
Chris Heck, President of Business Operations at Aston Villa, said: “The lack of cooperation and prevarication from Legia Warsaw officials prior to the match was entirely unacceptable and deeply disappointing. This behaviour increased the danger that West Midlands Police officers and our own fans were subjected to before the game and the scenes of disorder from the Legia fans have no place in modern football or civilised society.
“Aston Villa will be making further representations to UEFA in order to ensure that other clubs and police forces across Europe are not exposed to similar serious safety risks at the hands of Legia Warsaw.
“We are immensely grateful to West Midlands Police for keeping our supporters and our local community safe last night and are pleased that they will also be making their own representations via the UK police authorities to UEFA.”
https://www.avfc.co.uk/news/2023/december/01/club-statement/
Sounds like the club are pretty fucking angry, and it is not surprising.
That is disgraceful behaviour from the club officials at Legia.
Its no wonder a lot of their fans are hooligans...
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Do we know how so many Legia fans turned up in home ends yet?
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Talk sport this morning were bemoaning the fact that they had come all that way for nuthin - completely missing the fact that most of them live in Erdington. I jumped on a bus from town six oclock-ish, half way through Newtown about twenty "military-age males" as the phrase goes, jumped on, no colours apart from one who had a scarf, none of them paid and nearly all had bottles of Vodka in their hands. To be fair, they were no bother - thankfully - because i was stood right in the middle of them in a Villa scarf. Their hierachy covered themselves in glory by refusing point-blank to condemn the fucking idiots that did the damage - which was most of them from what i've heard. Also hearing the Witton Arms got smashed to fuck as well.
Do us a favour Piotr - stick to plumbing....
Ah yes the Polish, they’re all plumbers, car washers and Spitfire pilots.
Cut the racial stereotypes can we please. Thanks.
Good pilots by all accounts and showed our lot up in The Battle of Britain
Not sure they showed our lot up but they were without doubt skilled & brave pilots along with the 1st Independent Parachute Brigade at Operation Market Garden who also fought with skill and bravery and took heavy losses.
My Dad was in WW2 and had a great deal of time for the Poles. I work in retail and have always found them very straightforward, friendly and easy to deal with. Every country has its proportion of dickheads and as someone has already mentioned they have similar problems now that were all too prevalent in this country some 20/30 years ago.
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So does PWS back down on his statements from last night or is it still the fault of the club, the city and the WMP?
I never said it was the fault of the club, I said it could reflect badly on us and didn't reflect well on coping.
And yes, the info that has come out since does mean I put the blame on Legia. I based what I was saying on the info at the time, I now base it on the info we now have.
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I'm still not clear - did Legia actually refuse to distribute tickets to their fans at the place that had been set aside for that purpose? And was it that refusal that left the police needing to decide what to do?
I'm not sure but I think we wanted it done in town and they refused, then they said the ultras were in charge of giving them out and those charming lads said all or nothing.
Apparently Legia didn't accept any allocation until 4pm yesterday and didn't collect them until 6.15pm.
We've launched an official complaint against Legia to UEFA.
why on earth would we release tickets that late ?
Legia, on Thursday morning, were still telling us that they didn't know if they would accept ANY tickets from us. It's not a case of us being late, it is a case of them prevaricating pointlessly.
They then refused to take them (ie to accept them at the pick up point) unless all of them were let in, which was clearly never going to happen.
why the fuck didn't we give them a deadline way ahead of matchday itself ?? seems ridiculous
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Because it takes two to tango, plus the tickets were always only going to be handed over on the day itself, ie the club reps come and pick them up and take them somewhere to distribute. It is not up to us to tell them to eff off, that is UEFAs job.
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why the fuck didn't we give them a deadline way ahead of matchday itself ?? seems ridiculous
Because it's not up to us to change the whole protocol that is already in place for such actions.
This is NOT on Villa.
We did everything by the book & Legia as a club fucked around so they could do their little protest & be hooligans.
The actual club hierarchy must have been in cahoots with the Legia hooligans on the ground who attacked the police & Villa fans.
I really hope that there is a massive punishment given to them...
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fair enough
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I'm still not clear - did Legia actually refuse to distribute tickets to their fans at the place that had been set aside for that purpose? And was it that refusal that left the police needing to decide what to do?
I'm not sure but I think we wanted it done in town and they refused, then they said the ultras were in charge of giving them out and those charming lads said all or nothing.
Apparently Legia didn't accept any allocation until 4pm yesterday and didn't collect them until 6.15pm.
We've launched an official complaint against Legia to UEFA.
why on earth would we release tickets that late ?
Legia, on Thursday morning, were still telling us that they didn't know if they would accept ANY tickets from us. It's not a case of us being late, it is a case of them prevaricating pointlessly.
They then refused to take them (ie to accept them at the pick up point) unless all of them were let in, which was clearly never going to happen.
why the fuck didn't we give them a deadline way ahead of matchday itself ?? seems ridiculous
Read the article above. It explains clearly what happened.
They kept saying they weren’t sure they wanted any right up until the day of the game.
It’s not up to us to set deadlines.
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How does stewarding work with European ties? Does the away team provide stewards?
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I'm still not clear - did Legia actually refuse to distribute tickets to their fans at the place that had been set aside for that purpose? And was it that refusal that left the police needing to decide what to do?
I'm not sure but I think we wanted it done in town and they refused, then they said the ultras were in charge of giving them out and those charming lads said all or nothing.
Apparently Legia didn't accept any allocation until 4pm yesterday and didn't collect them until 6.15pm.
We've launched an official complaint against Legia to UEFA.
why on earth would we release tickets that late ?
Legia, on Thursday morning, were still telling us that they didn't know if they would accept ANY tickets from us. It's not a case of us being late, it is a case of them prevaricating pointlessly.
They then refused to take them (ie to accept them at the pick up point) unless all of them were let in, which was clearly never going to happen.
why the fuck didn't we give them a deadline way ahead of matchday itself ?? seems ridiculous
Read the article above. It explains clearly what happened.
They kept saying they weren’t sure they wanted any right up until the day of the game.
It’s not up to us to set deadlines.
so they didnt sell any tickets until the day of the game ?? makes zero sense to have no deadlines in place ahead of this
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Always the victims this lot. Moaning about not getting enough tickets yet failing to blame their own idiots for causing issues throughout Europe over the past few years.
What you would expect is some responsibility from the hierarchy at the club, but no. Surely they have some intelligence somewhere and know why they don’t get tickets or recieve bans. They’ve got form as long as your arm and no one wants them. Even a ban on tickets won’t work as they turn up causing the same issues as last night.
I haven’t heard any apology from that club, instead they are blaming us. That shows you that Europe is not only fighting a battle with the fans but the club itself. A long ban, huge fine and whatever other punishment you can think of is the only way. What an embarrassment of a club they are.
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As we're relying on info from Legia it's hard to know if they actually sold the tickets, if so how many, who bought them etc.
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I'm still not clear - did Legia actually refuse to distribute tickets to their fans at the place that had been set aside for that purpose? And was it that refusal that left the police needing to decide what to do?
I'm not sure but I think we wanted it done in town and they refused, then they said the ultras were in charge of giving them out and those charming lads said all or nothing.
Apparently Legia didn't accept any allocation until 4pm yesterday and didn't collect them until 6.15pm.
We've launched an official complaint against Legia to UEFA.
why on earth would we release tickets that late ?
Legia, on Thursday morning, were still telling us that they didn't know if they would accept ANY tickets from us. It's not a case of us being late, it is a case of them prevaricating pointlessly.
They then refused to take them (ie to accept them at the pick up point) unless all of them were let in, which was clearly never going to happen.
why the fuck didn't we give them a deadline way ahead of matchday itself ?? seems ridiculous
Read the article above. It explains clearly what happened.
They kept saying they weren’t sure they wanted any right up until the day of the game.
It’s not up to us to set deadlines.
so they didnt sell any tickets until the day of the game ?? makes zero sense to have no deadlines in place ahead of this
Eh?
No. They had sold the tickets beforehand, they just acted like they were not going to accept them - ie "here are the tickets to distribute to your fans who have already bought them" - at all until a couple of hours before kick off.
Clearly they were pushing this "all of us or none of us" line, expecting us to cave.
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As we're relying on info from Legia it's hard to know if they actually sold the tickets, if so how many, who bought them etc.
In the run up to the match when they were complaining about the allocation reduction, they said they'd already sold a lot of tickets to people who had booked hotels etc etc.
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I'm still not clear - did Legia actually refuse to distribute tickets to their fans at the place that had been set aside for that purpose? And was it that refusal that left the police needing to decide what to do?
I'm not sure but I think we wanted it done in town and they refused, then they said the ultras were in charge of giving them out and those charming lads said all or nothing.
Apparently Legia didn't accept any allocation until 4pm yesterday and didn't collect them until 6.15pm.
We've launched an official complaint against Legia to UEFA.
why on earth would we release tickets that late ?
Legia, on Thursday morning, were still telling us that they didn't know if they would accept ANY tickets from us. It's not a case of us being late, it is a case of them prevaricating pointlessly.
They then refused to take them (ie to accept them at the pick up point) unless all of them were let in, which was clearly never going to happen.
why the fuck didn't we give them a deadline way ahead of matchday itself ?? seems ridiculous
Read the article above. It explains clearly what happened.
They kept saying they weren’t sure they wanted any right up until the day of the game.
It’s not up to us to set deadlines.
so they didnt sell any tickets until the day of the game ?? makes zero sense to have no deadlines in place ahead of this
Eh?
No. They had sold the tickets beforehand, they just acted like they were not going to accept them - ie "here are the tickets to distribute to your fans who have already bought them" - at all until a couple of hours before kick off.
Clearly they were pushing this "all of us or none of us" line, expecting us to cave.
that makes no sense
above it says on THURSDAY MORNING legia were still telling us that they didn't know if they would accept ANY tickets from us. Does that mean they sold tickets to fans and were not going to give them out ?
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I'm still not clear - did Legia actually refuse to distribute tickets to their fans at the place that had been set aside for that purpose? And was it that refusal that left the police needing to decide what to do?
I'm not sure but I think we wanted it done in town and they refused, then they said the ultras were in charge of giving them out and those charming lads said all or nothing.
Apparently Legia didn't accept any allocation until 4pm yesterday and didn't collect them until 6.15pm.
We've launched an official complaint against Legia to UEFA.
why on earth would we release tickets that late ?
Legia, on Thursday morning, were still telling us that they didn't know if they would accept ANY tickets from us. It's not a case of us being late, it is a case of them prevaricating pointlessly.
They then refused to take them (ie to accept them at the pick up point) unless all of them were let in, which was clearly never going to happen.
why the fuck didn't we give them a deadline way ahead of matchday itself ?? seems ridiculous
Read the article above. It explains clearly what happened.
They kept saying they weren’t sure they wanted any right up until the day of the game.
It’s not up to us to set deadlines.
so they didnt sell any tickets until the day of the game ?? makes zero sense to have no deadlines in place ahead of this
Eh?
No. They had sold the tickets beforehand, they just acted like they were not going to accept them - ie "here are the tickets to distribute to your fans who have already bought them" - at all until a couple of hours before kick off.
Clearly they were pushing this "all of us or none of us" line, expecting us to cave.
that makes no sense
above it says on THURSDAY MORNING legia were still telling us that they didn't know if they would accept ANY tickets from us. Does that mean they sold tickets to fans and were not going to give them out ?
YES
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My point is we have no idea if that's the case or just what they are saying as it seems they have been uncooperative through most of this.
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that makes no sense
above it says on THURSDAY MORNING legia were still telling us that they didn't know if they would accept ANY tickets from us. Does that mean they sold tickets to fans and were not going to give them out ?
Yes. With most of the European games, the Away fans picks up their tickets on the day at a designated spot from their own club representatives. Those club reps are supposed to go to the home stadium on the day and pick up said tickets. Ads or Olaf can tell you about the same experiences abroad. I believe Mostar and Alkmaar distributed their ones at some bars in the city centre.
On Thursday, Legia reps said "we don't know, let us discuss it and get back to you" instead of "give us the tickets please".
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Yes. With most of the European games, the Away fans picks up their tickets on the day at a designated spot from their own club representatives. Those club reps are supposed to go to the home stadium on the day and pick up said tickets.
And that is the bit that Legia failed to do, distribute them.
The guy who had done UEFA inspections who was at the game and tweeting last night said this:
https://twitter.com/cliffordstott/status/1730492369449927162
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that makes no sense
above it says on THURSDAY MORNING legia were still telling us that they didn't know if they would accept ANY tickets from us. Does that mean they sold tickets to fans and were not going to give them out ?
Yes. With most of the European games, the Away fans picks up their tickets on the day at a designated spot from their own club representatives. Those club reps are supposed to go to the home stadium on the day and pick up said tickets. Ads or Olaf can tell you about the same experiences abroad. I believe Mostar and Alkmaar distributed their ones at some bars in the city centre.
i get that part, it's clear.
i just don't get what Legia did Thursday am .
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My point is we have no idea if that's the case or just what they are saying as it seems they have been uncooperative through most of this.
Well, we kind of do, because Villa referred to 1,000 odd with tickets but another thousand or so without.
It is the same distribution model our fans have experienced abroad - collecting tickets on day of match etc etc.
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that makes no sense
above it says on THURSDAY MORNING legia were still telling us that they didn't know if they would accept ANY tickets from us. Does that mean they sold tickets to fans and were not going to give them out ?
Yes. With most of the European games, the Away fans picks up their tickets on the day at a designated spot from their own club representatives. Those club reps are supposed to go to the home stadium on the day and pick up said tickets. Ads or Olaf can tell you about the same experiences abroad. I believe Mostar and Alkmaar distributed their ones at some bars in the city centre.
i get that part, it's clear.
i just don't get what Legia did Thursday am .
They said on Thursday morning that they were not sure if they were willing to accept - ie physically take off us to distribute - any tickets as a protest at the reduced allocation.
It looks very much like they were trying to force our hand to give them the 2000 or whatever and have them all in.
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The guy who had done UEFA inspections who was at the game and tweeting last night said this:
https://twitter.com/cliffordstott/status/1730492369449927162
Have you seen his latest tweet showing the destruction and makeshift weapons used.
https://twitter.com/cliffordstott/status/1730617505339629804
He mentioned last night that it was the worst he had seen at a UEFA sanctioned event. I wonder if he was also involved with the discussions during the day as well and was commenting on that point as well.
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that makes no sense
above it says on THURSDAY MORNING legia were still telling us that they didn't know if they would accept ANY tickets from us. Does that mean they sold tickets to fans and were not going to give them out ?
Yes. With most of the European games, the Away fans picks up their tickets on the day at a designated spot from their own club representatives. Those club reps are supposed to go to the home stadium on the day and pick up said tickets. Ads or Olaf can tell you about the same experiences abroad. I believe Mostar and Alkmaar distributed their ones at some bars in the city centre.
i get that part, it's clear.
i just don't get what Legia did Thursday am .
They said on Thursday morning that they were not sure if they were willing to accept - ie physically take off us to distribute - any tickets as a protest at the reduced allocation.
It looks very much like they were trying to force our hand to give them the 2000 or whatever and have them all in.
kick the feckers out . It's the tail wagging the dog at that club
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I stated earlier I doubt a club would be kicked out for fan behaviour and UEFA will just fine and close doors them. They probably also wouldn't have been done for un-ticketed fans showing up in the country. However with the evidenced lack of cooperation shown from the club, I can see them going.
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My point is we have no idea if that's the case or just what they are saying as it seems they have been uncooperative through most of this.
Well, we kind of do, because Villa referred to 1,000 odd with tickets but another thousand or so without.
It is the same distribution model our fans have experienced abroad - collecting tickets on day of match etc etc.
We gave them 1000 tickets, but one of the things that apparently happened is Legia gave no info about who they were sold to, so we don't know for sure they were sold. It's semantics really but them saying they did ABC is very different to them actually doing it judging by what's coming out.
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As we're relying on info from Legia it's hard to know if they actually sold the tickets, if so how many, who bought them etc.
In the run up to the match when they were complaining about the allocation reduction, they said they'd already sold a lot of tickets to people who had booked hotels etc etc.
Back in September when the draw and dates were confirmed, Legia would have expected 5% of capacity, i.e. approximately 2,000 tickets. Flights and hotels would have been booked. Then their fans misbehave and UEFA, Villa and WMP decide to reduce the number of tickets by 50%. Whilst I feel sorry for the fans, Legia should have financially compensated their fans and advised them not to travel. They did neither and thought they'd bluff us to letting in all their fans that turn up. They'd also see their unticketed fans storm the entrances at AZ so it was pretty predictable what may happen should we not lie down and fall for their bluff.
I feel sorry for those genuine fans that bought flights and booked hotels back in September but it's their club they should be angry with.
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Bigger fools the ones who booked before knowing they'd get a ticket.
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Bigger fools the ones who booked before knowing they'd get a ticket.
Quite a few on here have done the same this year, however they just went and enjoyed themselves in a bar watching the game.
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My son was in the AZ Alkmar club shop and the guy behind the counter told them that the Legia 'fans' caused a load of trouble when they were there and are now effectively banned from the area.
Like we were then.
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Back in September when the draw and dates were confirmed, Legia would have expected 5% of capacity, i.e. approximately 2,000 tickets. Flights and hotels would have been booked. Then their fans misbehave and UEFA, Villa and WMP decide to reduce the number of tickets by 50%. Whilst I feel sorry for the fans, Legia should have financially compensated their fans and advised them not to travel. They did neither and thought they'd bluff us to letting in all their fans that turn up. They'd also see their unticketed fans storm the entrances at AZ so it was pretty predictable what may happen should we not lie down and fall for their bluff.
I feel sorry for those genuine fans that bought flights and booked hotels back in September but it's their club they should be angry with.
Although from our statements, they had a month to tell their fans this, it wasn't that sudden a decision. They didn't seem to until the 25th Nov when the first complaints from Legia appeared on SM. Obviously they might have been complaining to UEFA in the background but when they publicised it, all they did was blame us.
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From my friend who is a Legia supporter/STH (didn't travel) on how its being reported over there. Note I am not agreeing with him I'm just saying there are different perspectives here:
The focus in Poland is on the cause of the problem, and the cause is that according to UEFA official regulations, AV was supposed to allocate 2100 tickets to Legia fans (5% of the stadium). Initially AV proposed I think 1200, which was against the regulations, but we somehow accepted that and both clubs agreed on 1700. But without any explanations AV changed the number to 890 at the very last minute. This happened after a lot of fans bought the plane tickets. So they got pissed off. So while yes, media do report the fact that they started riots and it's clear that our fans are to blame, there is an overall feeling of having been treated really unfairly, being in major part the explanation of what happened in Birmingham last night.
Trying to be objective I do know that our fans can be wild and they shouldn't have started clashing against the police - it definitely won't help our cause i.e. other clubs will continue treating us as savages and - lawfully or unlawfully - they will do anything they can to limit our presence on away games. So in that context it was plain stupid. At the same time I would go ballistic if I organised my time and spend money on the plane ticket only to learn at the very last minute that some said "well, yeah, fuck off" 🤷🏻♂️😁. Especially that we gave you full allocation, there were I think around 2000 AV fans in Warsaw, all happened in peace, all enjoyed the trip (except for the result) so we were expecting basic reciprocity.
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Bigger fools the ones who booked before knowing they'd get a ticket.
So wait until 4pm on the day of the game?
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Although the 2000 fans in Warsaw had to be kept in the ground for 2 hours to ensure a "peaceful" visit.
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Bigger fools the ones who booked before knowing they'd get a ticket.
So wait until 4pm on the day of the game?
4 pm on the day of the game was because Legia wouldn't even accept the tickets until then. They had a month to tell their fans of the reduced capacity and all their bleating in the media to their fans will easily be debunked in the UEFA investigation.
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Though I can kind of see why it's done, this regime whereby all of the away fans have to assemble at a single point to obtain their tickets, a few hours before the game, is not one I like.
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This regime where if 50-100 of fans kick off the other 800 are lumped in with them and denied access having spent time and money travelling and having done nothing wrong is shameful treatment in my opinion. Clearly if every one of them rioted then that different but from the footage this doesn't seem to be the case, in fact some fans couldnt have as they got access to the home sections.
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From my friend who is a Legia supporter/STH (didn't travel) on how its being reported over there. Note I am not agreeing with him I'm just saying there are different perspectives here:
The focus in Poland is on the cause of the problem, and the cause is that according to UEFA official regulations, AV was supposed to allocate 2100 tickets to Legia fans (5% of the stadium). Initially AV proposed I think 1200, which was against the regulations, but we somehow accepted that and both clubs agreed on 1700. But without any explanations AV changed the number to 890 at the very last minute. This happened after a lot of fans bought the plane tickets. So they got pissed off. So while yes, media do report the fact that they started riots and it's clear that our fans are to blame, there is an overall feeling of having been treated really unfairly, being in major part the explanation of what happened in Birmingham last night.
Trying to be objective I do know that our fans can be wild and they shouldn't have started clashing against the police - it definitely won't help our cause i.e. other clubs will continue treating us as savages and - lawfully or unlawfully - they will do anything they can to limit our presence on away games. So in that context it was plain stupid. At the same time I would go ballistic if I organised my time and spend money on the plane ticket only to learn at the very last minute that some said "well, yeah, fuck off" 🤷🏻♂️😁. Especially that we gave you full allocation, there were I think around 2000 AV fans in Warsaw, all happened in peace, all enjoyed the trip (except for the result) so we were expecting basic reciprocity.
The friend is talking out of his / her hole. The Assistant Chief Constable of WMP confirmed on national radio today that Legia Warsaw were informed that they were to have an allocation of 1000 tickets on November 2nd. They then refused to distribute the tickets to their fans when given the opportunity to do so.
He / she needs to.be pissed off at the clowns at their own club who caused this. This is all on them.
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This regime where if 50-100 of fans kick off the other 800 are lumped in with them and denied access having spent time and money travelling and having done nothing wrong is shameful treatment in my opinion. Clearly if every one of them rioted then that different but from the footage this doesn't seem to be the case, in fact some fans couldnt have as they got access to the home sections.
The ultras said no-one was going in.
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Talk sport this morning were bemoaning the fact that they had come all that way for nuthin - completely missing the fact that most of them live in Erdington. I jumped on a bus from town six oclock-ish, half way through Newtown about twenty "military-age males" as the phrase goes, jumped on, no colours apart from one who had a scarf, none of them paid and nearly all had bottles of Vodka in their hands. To be fair, they were no bother - thankfully - because i was stood right in the middle of them in a Villa scarf. Their hierachy covered themselves in glory by refusing point-blank to condemn the fucking idiots that did the damage - which was most of them from what i've heard. Also hearing the Witton Arms got smashed to fuck as well.
Do us a favour Piotr - stick to plumbing....
Ah yes the Polish, they’re all plumbers, car washers and Spitfire pilots.
Cut the racial stereotypes can we please. Thanks.
Good pilots by all accounts and showed our lot up in The Battle of Britain
Not sure they showed our lot up but they were without doubt skilled & brave pilots along with the 1st Independent Parachute Brigade at Operation Market Garden who also fought with skill and bravery and took heavy losses.
They went in all guns blazing, which upset the British high command old chap, read the autobiography of the Polish general in charge and apportion blame on him for one of the failures of the mission,think he was exconerated about the seventies or eighties
of which none were present last night.
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Back in September when the draw and dates were confirmed, Legia would have expected 5% of capacity, i.e. approximately 2,000 tickets. Flights and hotels would have been booked. Then their fans misbehave and UEFA, Villa and WMP decide to reduce the number of tickets by 50%. Whilst I feel sorry for the fans, Legia should have financially compensated their fans and advised them not to travel. They did neither and thought they'd bluff us to letting in all their fans that turn up. They'd also see their unticketed fans storm the entrances at AZ so it was pretty predictable what may happen should we not lie down and fall for their bluff.
I feel sorry for those genuine fans that bought flights and booked hotels back in September but it's their club they should be angry with.
Although from our statements, they had a month to tell their fans this, it wasn't that sudden a decision. They didn't seem to until the 25th Nov when the first complaints from Legia appeared on SM. Obviously they might have been complaining to UEFA in the background but when they publicised it, all they did was blame us.
Oh absolutely! I've just found the first club statement from yesterday:
The UK safety authorities, UEFA and Aston Villa, communicated on November 2 that the ticket allocation for away fans for this fixture would be reduced to 1,002 on the advice of safety authorities as a result of previous large-scale disorder caused by Legia fans last month at AZ Alkmaar.
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When did we play Fulham? I knew the allocation had been halved back then.
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Always the victims this lot. Moaning about not getting enough tickets yet failing to blame their own idiots for causing issues throughout Europe over the past few years.
What you would expect is some responsibility from the hierarchy at the club, but no. Surely they have some intelligence somewhere and know why they don’t get tickets or recieve bans. They’ve got form as long as your arm and no one wants them. Even a ban on tickets won’t work as they turn up causing the same issues as last night.
I haven’t heard any apology from that club, instead they are blaming us. That shows you that Europe is not only fighting a battle with the fans but the club itself. A long ban, huge fine and whatever other punishment you can think of is the only way. What an embarrassment of a club they are.
I fully agree with this.
We had a long ban from Europe to fix our hooligan problem.
The same is needed for them...
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Though I can kind of see why it's done, this regime whereby all of the away fans have to assemble at a single point to obtain their tickets, a few hours before the game, is not one I like.
This regime where if 50-100 of fans kick off the other 800 are lumped in with them and denied access having spent time and money travelling and having done nothing wrong is shameful treatment in my opinion. Clearly if every one of them rioted then that different but from the footage this doesn't seem to be the case, in fact some fans couldnt have as they got access to the home sections.
The club reps could have had the tickets in the morning and have been giving them out to the 800 or so throughout the day at a "safe" location. They decided not to take them until 4pm, which then forced the fans to come to VP to pick them up. However they still didn't give them out then, but instead tried to get WMP to backdown en-masse.
Unless of course you do not believe independent observers, the WMP, or the club on what happened?
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From my friend who is a Legia supporter/STH (didn't travel) on how its being reported over there. Note I am not agreeing with him I'm just saying there are different perspectives here:
The focus in Poland is on the cause of the problem, and the cause is that according to UEFA official regulations, AV was supposed to allocate 2100 tickets to Legia fans (5% of the stadium). Initially AV proposed I think 1200, which was against the regulations, but we somehow accepted that and both clubs agreed on 1700. But without any explanations AV changed the number to 890 at the very last minute. This happened after a lot of fans bought the plane tickets. So they got pissed off. So while yes, media do report the fact that they started riots and it's clear that our fans are to blame, there is an overall feeling of having been treated really unfairly, being in major part the explanation of what happened in Birmingham last night.
Trying to be objective I do know that our fans can be wild and they shouldn't have started clashing against the police - it definitely won't help our cause i.e. other clubs will continue treating us as savages and - lawfully or unlawfully - they will do anything they can to limit our presence on away games. So in that context it was plain stupid. At the same time I would go ballistic if I organised my time and spend money on the plane ticket only to learn at the very last minute that some said "well, yeah, fuck off" 🤷🏻♂️😁. Especially that we gave you full allocation, there were I think around 2000 AV fans in Warsaw, all happened in peace, all enjoyed the trip (except for the result) so we were expecting basic reciprocity.
Did you ask him/her about what happened in Madrid, Holland and Leicester. Whose fault was that?
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They should be kicked out of the competition. Simple as that.
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If the tickets were never distributed then no one was getting in anyway.
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When did we play Fulham? I knew the allocation had been halved back then.
12th November. It trickled into public consciousness about the 25th when posts appeared in the Conference group thread asking about Legia posts about it, with people on here having ago at the club then about the "sudden" decision.
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If I'd arranged travel to anything, not just football, in a different city or country and then found out the thing I was planning to attend was now not available to me, I'd either suck it up and just not go, but more likely I'd still go but do something else. I've sorted the travel, I've juggled my time, enjoy it like I would've anyway. I certainly would not think, "fuck it, I'll smash my way in", and anybody that does is a ****** possessing the highest levels of antisocial fuckwittery. No excuses. ******, to a man.
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When did we play Fulham? I knew the allocation had been halved back then.
12th November. It trickled into public consciousness about the 25th when posts appeared in the Conference group thread asking about Legia posts about it, with people on here having ago at the club then about the "sudden" decision.
If my Polish brother-in-law knew it back then from the Polish sports news, then they all did. If he can hear of it in south London, then they have no excuse.
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Reassuring to see that the deplorable behaviour of the away fans is now taking centre stage on this thread as opposed to the initial posts inexplicably questioning the antics of WMP.
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How does stewarding work with European ties? Does the away team provide stewards?
Yeah it's part of the rules that you have to provide your own stewards at a certain ratio to fans.
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Plenty of the twats appeared to be wearing balaclavas so obviously here to behave and have a good time.
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When did we play Fulham? I knew the allocation had been halved back then.
12th November. It trickled into public consciousness about the 25th when posts appeared in the Conference group thread asking about Legia posts about it, with people on here having ago at the club then about the "sudden" decision.
If my Polish brother-in-law knew it back then from the Polish sports news, then they all did. If he can hear of it in south London, then they have no excuse.
Bladen told me at Alkmaar that the allocation had been cut, so they knew from October at least.
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The guy who had done UEFA inspections who was at the game and tweeting last night said this:
https://twitter.com/cliffordstott/status/1730492369449927162
Have you seen his latest tweet showing the destruction and makeshift weapons used.
https://twitter.com/cliffordstott/status/1730617505339629804
He mentioned last night that it was the worst he had seen at a UEFA sanctioned event. I wonder if he was also involved with the discussions during the day as well and was commenting on that point as well.
To be truthful the debris shown in photos is nothing unusual in the streets aroun Villa Park.
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When did we play Fulham? I knew the allocation had been halved back then.
12th November. It trickled into public consciousness about the 25th when posts appeared in the Conference group thread asking about Legia posts about it, with people on here having ago at the club then about the "sudden" decision.
If my Polish brother-in-law knew it back then from the Polish sports news, then they all did. If he can hear of it in south London, then they have no excuse.
Bladen told me at Alkmaar that the allocation had been cut, so they knew from October at least.
Allocation decisions have to be made transparent to UEFA, so all dates such as 2 November date when allocation was set at 1002 can be confirmed by UEFA.
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Legia Warsaw knew the allocation. They were just arrogant enough to assume that they could violently ignore it.
Fucking tin pot twats.
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https://twitter.com/MrAndyPowell/status/1730365085808263240
Haha, "fuck off back to Erdington"?
“Welcome to Hellmans”
Wonderful.
If there's a positive to be taken I reckon Villa and WMP come out of this well. Even with the benefit of hindsight it's hard to see what they did wrong or could've done better.
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At one point did the Ultras break into "West End Girls"
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If I'd arranged travel to anything, not just football, in a different city or country and then found out the thing I was planning to attend was now not available to me, I'd either suck it up and just not go, but more likely I'd still go but do something else. I've sorted the travel, I've juggled my time, enjoy it like I would've anyway. I certainly would not think, "fuck it, I'll smash my way in", and anybody that does is a ****** possessing the highest levels of antisocial fuckwittery. No excuses. ******, to a man.
Exactly mate. I made travel and hotel arrangements for all 3 of our away fixtures mostly non refundable fully accepting that I may not get tickets and I will either not travel or travel and be nice in someone else’s city. I have been lucky to secure a ticket for all 3 but that’s neither here nor there.
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So what was the match 28 years ago that had severe trouble.
Trabzonspor?
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Although the 2000 fans in Warsaw had to be kept in the ground for 2 hours to ensure a "peaceful" visit.
It was 1 hour and a few minutes. The cynic in me thought it was just enough for the police to hit overtime targets. I didn't know at the time that their ultras were up to no good. Up to and after that point everyone I'd met in Warsaw had been great. It's a fine city and I'd like to go back.
It's the same everywhere, in more aspects of life than football. The idiots are a loud minority. I guess on away games their percentage can be amplified.
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Although the 2000 fans in Warsaw had to be kept in the ground for 2 hours to ensure a "peaceful" visit.
It was 1 hour and a few minutes. The cynic in me thought it was just enough for the police to hit overtime targets. I didn't know at the time that their ultras were up to no good. Up to and after that point everyone I'd met in Warsaw had been great. It's a fine city and I'd like to go back.
It's the same everywhere, in more aspects of life than football. The idiots are a loud minority. I guess on away games their percentage can be amplified.
I was going on Ads comments for the time waiting. Maybe his section was longer.
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It was at least 90 mins and close to 120 when last buses left the stadium.
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At one point did the Ultras break into "West End Girls"
A few moments after they had taken off their shirts.
And I applaud them for that, its a modern world.
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UEFA need to grow a pair over this. They would definitely be all over us if the scenario was reversed.
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Young Boys were fined €28k for their fan behavior when they played Man City in Manchester a few weeks back.
They had flares, vandalised seats and toilets in the stadium, threw some stuff, and a few other crowd disturbances.
They were given a 1 match ban on selling tickets for away games, but that is suspended for 2 years.
Not at all the same level as what we saw yesterday, but I wouldn't be surprised if there's no major punishment for Legia.
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It was at least 90 mins and close to 120 when last buses left the stadium.
Yep. We managed to get an Uber back to the hotel after being held in the ground and then at the police line for approximately 90 mins total. They would only let us break the cordon when the taxi was showing as 1 minute away on my phone.
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Although Legia has form from last season as well, and have already had the away fans ban. Plus it seems the club officials blatantly stoked the problems, both with their public statements for the last week or so, then with the actions they did on the day with the tickets.
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Plenty of the twats appeared to be wearing balaclavas so obviously here to behave and have a good time.
It was chuffing cold in the ground last night. I wouldn’t have minded a balaclava myself
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So it seems that Legia Warsaw purposely delayed, pontificated and ignored requests about the ticket allocation and distribution so that the pricks that follow them could do what they have done in the past and force the local old bill to relent and let them in.Except when it didnt happen this time both the club and the bell end 'ultras' threw their toys out the pram.
Im no great fan of WMP but I don't think any blame lies with them this time.
Fuck Legia Warsaw, hope they go bust.
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Young Boys were fined €28k for their fan behavior when they played Man City in Manchester a few weeks back.
They had flares, vandalised seats and toilets in the stadium, threw some stuff, and a few other crowd disturbances.
They were given a 1 match ban on selling tickets for away games, but that is suspended for 2 years.
Not at all the same level as what we saw yesterday, but I wouldn't be surprised if there's no major punishment for Legia.
Any major punishment more likely going to be due to the actions of the club rather than the fans, ie not handling ticket sales/distribution properly and poor communication with UEFA and the police.
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Two things stand out from the club's statement today:
Aston Villa can confirm it has lodged an official complaint with UEFA over the conduct of Legia Warsaw Football Club ...
AND
To reiterate, Legia officials were advised on a call that included a number of UEFA representatives on November 2 that they would receive an allocation of 1002 – exactly four weeks prior to last night’s fixture.
It's pretty clear to me that we're trying to alert UEFA to Legia’s part in last night's events. The club seems to have been wholly complicit in the whole sorry affair and don't appear to be prepared to accept any responsibility.
For conspiracy theorists - are we hoping UEFA kick them out of this year's competition?
There's a fortnight until the final legs are played. Long enough for UEFA to grow a figurative pair and take proper action. But I'm not holding my breath.
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No conspiracy. Just common decency between clubs, not forthcoming from Legia.
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Reassuring to see that the deplorable behaviour of the away fans is now taking centre stage on this thread as opposed to the initial posts inexplicably questioning the antics of WMP.
Yep found that really disconcerting last night that people still held those sorts of attitudes. Definitely balanced out today and been some really good commentary from Villa supporters!
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At what point did the police say they were going to kettle the away fans in the car park and not let them out and what had happened prior to this that led them to conclude the entire support, every one of them had been involved in violent activity?
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It's pretty clear to me that we're trying to alert UEFA to Legia’s part in last night's events. The club seems to have been wholly complicit in the whole sorry affair and don't appear to be prepared to accept any responsibility.
For conspiracy theorists - are we hoping UEFA kick them out of this year's competition?
If it's anything other than us just being pissed off at Legia, it will be an awareness of how stupid UEFA can be when it comes to dishing out punishments. We'll want to make it abundantly clear that we did everything by the book and the blame falls entirely on Legia.
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Any group of fans who refer to themselves as "ultras" want chucking in the bin.
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Didn't realize there were no away fans at ground yesterday as I was at far end of lower Witton Lane (the bit that blocks loads of Holte End seats from seeing anything) - appreciate there were tonnes of Legia dickheads but we have a few of our own and imagine the furore if we had our fans banned from entering a ground away in Europe and spent hundreds of thousands on an away day? This is a worrying development and reminds me of some of the shit you get North if the border with the Old Firm!
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Didn't realize there were no away fans at ground yesterday as I was at far end of lower Witton Lane (the bit that blocks loads of Holte End seats from seeing anything) - appreciate there were tonnes of Legia dickheads but we have a few of our own and imagine the furore if we had our fans banned from entering a ground away in Europe and spent hundreds of thousands on an away day? This is a worrying development and reminds me of some of the shit you get North if the border with the Old Firm!
who the feck came up with the design for this
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Doug Ellis and his cost cutters
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Didn't realize there were no away fans at ground yesterday as I was at far end of lower Witton Lane (the bit that blocks loads of Holte End seats from seeing anything) - appreciate there were tonnes of Legia dickheads but we have a few of our own and imagine the furore if we had our fans banned from entering a ground away in Europe and spent hundreds of thousands on an away day? This is a worrying development and reminds me of some of the shit you get North if the border with the Old Firm!
I
Know what you mean but if you look at the club’s statement earlier it’s not as simple as people being banned.
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Doug Ellis and his cost cutters
my ST is up there , i sometimes wander down to the Holte End end at HT and look over edge and think , how can them lot down there see anything ::)
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If there are 46 still in Stockland Green nick, I assume the other 1,954 fans are waiting outside for them? It's all of them or none of them going home, right?
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Were any of the Legia fans who got booted from the home sections causing trouble? I wonder if genuine fans who just wanted to see the game and avoid the trouble might have thought that was their best option? Or was it just all chancers there to cause trouble?
On that note too, how did staff know if they were Legia fans who travelled or just Polish people living locally, even if Legia fans? I saw a picture of a woman being removed and she didn't look like an obvious Legia fan.
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Were any of the Legia fans who got booted from the home sections causing trouble? I wonder if genuine fans who just wanted to see the game and avoid the trouble might have thought that was their best option? Or was it just all chancers there to cause trouble?
On that note too, how did staff know if they were Legia fans who travelled or just Polish people living locally, even if Legia fans? I saw a picture of a woman being removed and she didn't look like an obvious Legia fan.
From what I saw they were genuine fans watching their team but as we all know, nothing raises the ire of football supporters more than people like them doing what they're doing.
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Reassuring to see that the deplorable behaviour of the away fans is now taking centre stage on this thread as opposed to the initial posts inexplicably questioning the antics of WMP.
Yep found that really disconcerting last night that people still held those sorts of attitudes. Definitely balanced out today and been some really good commentary from Villa supporters!
I agree with you on this. It’s easy to jump to conclusions rather than waiting for evidence.
The people telling their stories of how the Polish police treated them in Warsaw..they do this to
all away teams. I’ve been at pre-season friendlies and they treat you like shit too.
I’ve been on a tram on the way to a game and rival fans on the tram sing their songs…but when they pass the police they all join in together chanting against the police.
Whatever you think about WMP or the police in general, this was not some “let’s fuck off football fans” aggression.
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Reassuring to see that the deplorable behaviour of the away fans is now taking centre stage on this thread as opposed to the initial posts inexplicably questioning the antics of WMP.
Yep found that really disconcerting last night that people still held those sorts of attitudes. Definitely balanced out today and been some really good commentary from Villa supporters!
I agree with you on this. It’s easy to jump to conclusions rather than waiting for evidence.
The people telling their stories of how the Polish police treated them in Warsaw..they do this to
all away teams. I’ve been at pre-season friendlies and they treat you like shit too.
I’ve been on a tram on the way to a game and rival fans on the tram sing their songs…but when they pass the police they all join in together chanting against the police.
Whatever you think about WMP or the police in general, this was not some “let’s fuck off football fans” aggression.
I thought the police in Warsaw were ok and not at all aggressive. I also heard of two people who separately got cornered outside the stadium and were given a personal escort to the away end.
I was on the halfway line in Warsaw with an English mate and his British / American mates who are season ticket holders. Kept my trap shut and had no problem - they were all wearing Legia shirts so didn’t stand out. I’ve done it several times in England too and rarely let on I support the Villa and never large it when we score.
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At what point did the police say they were going to kettle the away fans in the car park and not let them out and what had happened prior to this that led them to conclude the entire support, every one of them had been involved in violent activity?
Probably at the point the Legia officials decided they were not going to dish out the tickets to the genuine fans, or did you not read that bit in the multiple statements made by people in the know like Dave W, the club officially, WMP, the independent people monitoring and probably others still to come?
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This is on the Beeb article
10:30 GMT: In a standard pre-match operational meeting, Legia Warsaw refuse to confirm if they will accept their allocation of tickets for the match. Aston Villa claims this is in stark contrast to normal Uefa operational procedures.
14:30: Legia Warsaw (LW) officials due to meet Polish supporters
15:00: Legia expected to communicate the decision on tickets, but advise there is a possibility that they will not accept them
16:00: Legia inform Aston Villa that they wish to receive their ticket allocation
18:16: The tickets are handed to Legia officials immediately upon their arrival at the stadium
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At what point did the police say they were going to kettle the away fans in the car park and not let them out and what had happened prior to this that led them to conclude the entire support, every one of them had been involved in violent activity?
What did you expect the Police to do? Maybe ask em politely one by one if they were going to cause trouble? They made the decision all or nothing when their club officials tried to supply em with about 1000 tickets. They then resorted to violence and the only safe thing to do was stop em all which no doubt resulted in some good fans being punished and for that the blame rests with their ultras.
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wrong post.....
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Reassuring to see that the deplorable behaviour of the away fans is now taking centre stage on this thread as opposed to the initial posts inexplicably questioning the antics of WMP.
Yep found that really disconcerting last night that people still held those sorts of attitudes. Definitely balanced out today and been some really good commentary from Villa supporters!
It's not completely out of character though. Hillsborough being the obvious one. Though you could point to Stephen Lawrence, Dalian Atkinson, that rapist fellow in the metropolitan police, ..
Don't get me wrong, I think we're very fortunate in this country that by and large the police are, and are seen to be, trustworthy. The bad apples represent a miniscule proportion. However, when you're job is to uphold the law, you can't really afford any bad apples, and any which are found will end up casting a long shadow.
--
All that said, it does look like WMP & the club tried to get the situation sorted out in the most reasonable way possible. I can't see how either can take any blame for this, it's clearly been down to the belligerence of Legia - first their club officials, then these hooligans of theirs.
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Chuck them out of the Conference, immediately. Neither the club nor the fans deserve to be in it.
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Seems like their Ultras have lot of power within the club , makes you wonder if the game would've even taken place had the team no arrived before the fans
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Given their apparent propensity to violence, it's perhaps surprising that they allowed themselves to get locked into one car park as one large group, rather than disperse themselves into a few squads, marauding around the local streets for an hour or two before the game. As far as I've heard, this didn't happen.
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Hopefully there will be some learnings from this as we might be getting the likes of Eintracht Frankfurt or similar with more of these Pet Shop Boys singing , sparkler waiving "Ultras" coming to B6 next year
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Given their apparent propensity to violence, it's perhaps surprising that they allowed themselves to get locked into one car park as one large group, rather than disperse themselves into a few squads, marauding around the local streets for an hour or two before the game. As far as I've heard, this didn't happen.
It seems their main objective was to get into the stadium rather than to "just" cause trouble. Roaming around the streets for an hour or two before wouldn't have gotten them in. Gathering en masse where the tickets were supposed to be given out was presumably the plan. I'd say they weren't expecting to be met with such a big police operation either.
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WMP have charged 46 men (arsewipes) aged between 21 and 63 with various offences following Thursday night’s game. All but 1 to appear before magistrates in Brum today.
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I am in the camp that thinks there should be a reprisal for both club and fans as the club should have taken more of a stance, as requested by UEFA in relation to the ticket allocation. Either a points deduction in this competition, or throw them out this season and the next. time they are in European football Even our very own FA wouldn't bottle this decision.
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Seems like their Ultras have lot of power within the club , makes you wonder if the game would've even taken place had the team no arrived before the fans
Quite a few European countries have that problem (Italy, for one), the problem being that the ultras are so close to actually running the club.
I read something re Thursday's trouble that when it came to distribute the tickets (which I assume would have happened where their fans were being held), the response was 'we all go in or nobody does' in the belief that they'd force a way for all 2,000 of them to enter the ground. You have to also wonder if the refusal of their directors to go in is part of that dynamic, and whether that is what Legia were angling for all through this "we might not accept tickets" saga.
If they'd really decided not to distribute them, then that's the police's worst nightmare - they were worried about having 1,000 with and another thousand without tickets, but in this context, they've got 2,000 hostile away fans all ticketless.
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On the subject of their ratio of Loons/Normal fans travelling over, I heard a (third hand) story doing the rounds that they had got hold of the phone number of one of our more excitable fans of yesteryear, now pushing sixty, and offered a bout of organised fisticuffs. With them able to put 1000 in the field, so to speak. The story reports the answer as being a gulp, swift intake of breath and a polite but firm decline and a return to watching The Chase.
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Seems like their Ultras have lot of power within the club , makes you wonder if the game would've even taken place had the team no arrived before the fans
Quite a few European countries have that problem (Italy, for one), the problem being that the ultras are so close to actually running the club.
I read something re Thursday's trouble that when it came to distribute the tickets (which I assume would have happened where their fans were being held), the response was 'we all go in or nobody does' in the belief that they'd force a way for all 2,000 of them to enter the ground. You have to also wonder if the refusal of their directors to go in is part of that dynamic, and whether that is what Legia were angling for all through this "we might not accept tickets" saga.
If they'd really decided not to distribute them, then that's the police's worst nightmare - they were worried about having 1,000 with and another thousand without tickets, but in this context, they've got 2,000 hostile away fans all ticketless.
I'd have thought the way it played out was the lesser of two evils. 2,000 idiots in one car park trying to cause trouble is easier to manage than the potential situation of 1,000 idiots in the ground being stewarded by a bunch of minimum wage teenagers and 1,000 ticketless fans outside trying to cause trouble.
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If they'd really decided not to distribute them, then that's the police's worst nightmare - they were worried about having 1,000 with and another thousand without tickets, but in this context, they've got 2,000 hostile away fans all ticketless.
That sounds quite probable. They may have thought the threat of double the number outside would have forced our hand and we'd have let everyone in. Later in the day when it became clear the decision wasn't changing they may have realised they would now have to face their own violent fans with only half the tickets and didn't fancy it themselves.
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A very reliable friend of mine told me well before kick-off that he'd been talking to an ordinary Legia fan who'd been ordered by the ultras not to go into the ground if they all couldn't. The most likely explanation of events is that everything Legia officials did was with the aim of their supporters all getting in, by force if necessary. What they didn't count on was the best police in the world when it comes to crowd control.
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Supposedly brought 2000 over but I've not seen a single picture/clip of them anywhere apart from what happened outside villa park ..
Its like they appeared & then disappeared in a puff of smoke.
Bizarre!
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Not really bizarre.
40k fans appear and disappear within a 4 hour window when we have a match on at home so 5 % of that could appear and disappear in a shorter time frame. Most of the normal supporters would have just gone back to their hotel rooms, bars or even home once they were released from the area by Police. The troublemakers who stayed were then some of the ones trying to force their way in the gates at the North and Holte and throwing condiments.
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yeah i'm starting to think 2000 of them is a hoax, no footage of them in town , at the airport etc
i'm guessing 500-1000 came over say 750
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In whose interest would it be to create a hoax?
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A very reliable friend of mine told me well before kick-off that he'd been talking to an ordinary Legia fan who'd been ordered by the ultras not to go into the ground if they all couldn't. The most likely explanation of events is that everything Legia officials did was with the aim of their supporters all gettingbin, by force if necessary. What they didn't count on was the best police in the world when it comes to crowd control.
This is true. The Dutch police in Alkmaar relented and allowed them in to keep the peace, that was never going to happen here. Walking up to VP from the Church side you could sense that WMP were not going tp stand for any nonsense. I had to show credentials to be allowed past the riot shields in to DE stand. There were hundreds of people in the churchyard presumably Legia fans totally clueless as to what to do next.
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Supposedly brought 2000 over but I've not seen a single picture/clip of them anywhere apart from what happened outside villa park ..
Its like they appeared & then disappeared in a puff of smoke.
Bizarre!
Not bizarre. Villa Park is still a small area where 2000 mulling around looks big however Brum as a city is enormous, even the city centre will easily cope with influx of 20 odd thousand.
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In whose interest would it be to create a hoax?
The zionists, obviously. Dur!
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In whose interest would it be to create a hoax?
the "ultras" egos . they seem to thrive off a weird notoriety of being hard men and travel in numbers . Setting women police officers on fire , sad feckers
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yeah i'm starting to think 2000 of them is a hoax, no footage of them in town , at the airport etc
i'm guessing 500-1000 came over say 750
The only reason there was footage of Alkmaar and Mostar fans en-masse in the city centre was because they met up in the city centre to get their tickets and were then escorted down. The Poles were told to meet at Villa park, hence the stories of pockets on different means of travel going to Villa Park.
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In whose interest would it be to create a hoax?
the "ultras" egos . they seem to thrive off a weird notoriety of being hard men and travel in numbers . Setting women police officers on fire , sad feckers
Weren't you stating they were no hard men, it was just pretend reputation, fireworks don't hurt anyone and people should have nothing to fear from them. Pick a lane.
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In whose interest would it be to create a hoax?
the "ultras" egos . they seem to thrive off a weird notoriety of being hard men and travel in numbers . Setting women police officers on fire , sad feckers
Weren't you stating they were no hard men, it was just pretend reputation, fireworks don't hurt anyone and people should have nothing to fear from them. Pick a lane.
yeah exactly , sorry should have put "hard men" . Waving fireworks about singing West End Girls is really intimidating , so is acting hard behind a wall of coppers
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Its not true the The Witton Arms was smashed up.
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Also I don't think it's true that a WPC was deliberately set on fire. Some people like Daily Mail type of reporting.
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A very reliable friend of mine told me well before kick-off that he'd been talking to an ordinary Legia fan who'd been ordered by the ultras not to go into the ground if they all couldn't. The most likely explanation of events is that everything Legia officials did was with the aim of their supporters all gettingbin, by force if necessary. What they didn't count on was the best police in the world when it comes to crowd control.
This is true. The Dutch police in Alkmaar relented and allowed them in to keep the peace, that was never going to happen here. Walking up to VP from the Church side you could sense that WMP were not going tp stand for any nonsense. I had to show credentials to be allowed past the riot shields in to DE stand. There were hundreds of people in the churchyard presumably Legia fans totally clueless as to what to do next.
From Ads discussions, it sounded like they had no choice as they all stormed the ticket barriers, hence the extra barriers that seemed superfluous when you went. Looking at the Alkmaar stadium, it is in a very open area so easier to do then Villa Park which is enclosed by housing and walls on most sides. So WMP found it easier to then force Legia fans into the Coach Park for pre-checks.
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Also I don't think it's true that a WPC was deliberately set on fire. Some people like Daily Mail type of reporting.
Yes the flare was an unfortunate follow up to being smashed on the helmet with hard lump of masonry which knocked her down with concussion. Still Ultras aren't dangerous and are all just smoke and mirrors.
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Also I don't think it's true that a WPC was deliberately set on fire. Some people like Daily Mail type of reporting.
The police confirmed yesterday that a male officer was concussed when hit in the head by a thrown flare. His jacket then caught fire and he had to be helped out of it. He was taken to hospital for smoke inhalation, the smoke from the flare having gotten inside his helmet. That's the only confirmation of a specific injury I've seen, and certainly the only confirmation of anyone being set on fire, but clearly not deliberately.
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I wish them the best of luck in court with that, ‘I threw a flare with fire coming out the end at a copper but didnt mean to set him on fire’
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In whose interest would it be to create a hoax?
the "ultras" egos . they seem to thrive off a weird notoriety of being hard men and travel in numbers . Setting women police officers on fire , sad feckers
Weren't you stating they were no hard men, it was just pretend reputation, fireworks don't hurt anyone and people should have nothing to fear from them. Pick a lane.
yeah exactly , sorry should have put "hard men" . Waving fireworks about singing West End Girls is really intimidating , so is acting hard behind a wall of coppers
It was Go West actually (well the tune) but then most football fans have chants to that. Of course the actual wording could easily be "We come, and kill you all, we come and kill you all" but nah, you seem to have now swerved into "they are not hard at all lane again"
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Looks like they’ll be arguing that they can only be held responsible for the actions of fans who had tickets and entered the ground…
Statement of Legia Warsaw
In compliance with UEFA regulations and public law, Aston Villa F.C., as the host club, along with local authorities, has a responsibility to ensure an adequate level of security both inside the stadium and in its immediate surroundings. Prior to our match against Aston Villa F.C., we have consistently maintained that our responsibility extends only to individuals entering the visitors' sector with tickets distributed by us. No club should be held accountable for the actions of unidentified individuals without tickets for the match.
Our staff arrived in Birmingham earlier than usual and maintained continuous communication with the English club, UEFA, and the local police. We repeatedly informed the British counterparts about necessary measures for the security of the venue and its vicinity. Despite this, the British police, in their official responses, only acknowledged the potential risks without implementing our suggestions. Regrettably, due to the actions and inactions of Aston Villa F.C., adverse incidents occurred yesterday. By disregarding our constructive feedback, the host club bears full responsibility for the situation.
Aston Villa F.C. breached UEFA regulations multiple times - initially by not allocating the required 2,100 tickets (5% of the stadium's capacity), then reducing the agreed 1,700 tickets to just 890. Such decisions contributed to the escalation of tensions.
We have repeatedly highlighted the emotional impact on numerous individuals from Poland and the UK who, despite incurring high travel and accommodation costs, were denied tickets, contrary to the inter-club agreement of 21 September. The host club and the British authorities were fully aware of these circumstances. Respecting the host's responsibility for security, we consistently communicated the British restrictions through our club channels.
Due to the inability to authenticate and distribute tickets effectively, Legia Warsaw returned the tickets to the host club. We emphasize that none of the individuals detained by the police had tickets for yesterday's match. Therefore, we strongly object to Legia Warsaw being blamed for Thursday's incidents in Birmingham.
For years, visiting supporters and official delegations have been safely accommodated during matches at Legia Warsaw's stadium. Our commitment to ensuring the safety of visiting team fans has been consistently recognized, as experienced by representatives from Aston Villa F.C., Zrinjski Mostar, and FK Austria Vienna this season.
As a club, we are committed to upholding the highest standards in line with UEFA regulations. We expect reciprocal conduct from other club representatives. We remain prepared to present further evidence to UEFA regarding the actions of the British Police and Aston Villa F.C.
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In the wake of the violence, Legia Warsaw said We emphasise that none of the individuals detained by the police had tickets for the match
Kind of correct, no-one did, because you didnt give them out.
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In whose interest would it be to create a hoax?
the "ultras" egos . they seem to thrive off a weird notoriety of being hard men and travel in numbers . Setting women police officers on fire , sad feckers
Weren't you stating they were no hard men, it was just pretend reputation, fireworks don't hurt anyone and people should have nothing to fear from them. Pick a lane.
yeah exactly , sorry should have put "hard men" . Waving fireworks about singing West End Girls is really intimidating , so is acting hard behind a wall of coppers
It was Go West actually (well the tune) but then most football fans have chants to that. Of course the actual wording could easily be "We come, and kill you all, we come and kill you all" but nah, you seem to have now swerved into "they are not hard at all lane again"
‘ Przyjdziemy i zabijemy was wszystkich’ doesn’t scan very well.
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Supposedly brought 2000 over but I've not seen a single picture/clip of them anywhere apart from what happened outside villa park ..
Its like they appeared & then disappeared in a puff of smoke.
Bizarre!
I think one of the contributing factors would have been the number of Poles residing in the UK and Birmingham itself, who would have travelled to the game separately and wouldn't have been at the airport, in town etc.
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Of the 46 nicked, 40 are from Poland. I agree, seems strange no-one bumped into any groups of them at all away from VP
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I saw a handful going back to Witton station and a few more bouncing round Witton Road but that was all. It was very strange.
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Looks like they’ll be arguing that they can only be held responsible for the actions of fans who had tickets and entered the ground…
Statement of Legia Warsaw
In compliance with UEFA regulations and public law, Aston Villa F.C., as the host club, along with local authorities, has a responsibility to ensure an adequate level of security both inside the stadium and in its immediate surroundings. Prior to our match against Aston Villa F.C., we have consistently maintained that our responsibility extends only to individuals entering the visitors' sector with tickets distributed by us. No club should be held accountable for the actions of unidentified individuals without tickets for the match.
Our staff arrived in Birmingham earlier than usual and maintained continuous communication with the English club, UEFA, and the local police. We repeatedly informed the British counterparts about necessary measures for the security of the venue and its vicinity. Despite this, the British police, in their official responses, only acknowledged the potential risks without implementing our suggestions. Regrettably, due to the actions and inactions of Aston Villa F.C., adverse incidents occurred yesterday. By disregarding our constructive feedback, the host club bears full responsibility for the situation.
Aston Villa F.C. breached UEFA regulations multiple times - initially by not allocating the required 2,100 tickets (5% of the stadium's capacity), then reducing the agreed 1,700 tickets to just 890. Such decisions contributed to the escalation of tensions.
We have repeatedly highlighted the emotional impact on numerous individuals from Poland and the UK who, despite incurring high travel and accommodation costs, were denied tickets, contrary to the inter-club agreement of 21 September. The host club and the British authorities were fully aware of these circumstances. Respecting the host's responsibility for security, we consistently communicated the British restrictions through our club channels.
Due to the inability to authenticate and distribute tickets effectively, Legia Warsaw returned the tickets to the host club. We emphasize that none of the individuals detained by the police had tickets for yesterday's match. Therefore, we strongly object to Legia Warsaw being blamed for Thursday's incidents in Birmingham.
For years, visiting supporters and official delegations have been safely accommodated during matches at Legia Warsaw's stadium. Our commitment to ensuring the safety of visiting team fans has been consistently recognized, as experienced by representatives from Aston Villa F.C., Zrinjski Mostar, and FK Austria Vienna this season.
As a club, we are committed to upholding the highest standards in line with UEFA regulations. We expect reciprocal conduct from other club representatives. We remain prepared to present further evidence to UEFA regarding the actions of the British Police and Aston Villa F.C.
They seem to forget that UEFA agreed to the reduction to 1000 a month ago. So complain all they want, I definitely trust our clubs events over theirs.
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That statement is laughable really. Firstly they don't seem to understand that the decision to reduce the away capacity was not made by Villa, it was made by a Safety Advisory Group which includes a number of local organisations.
They also fail to mention the problems their fans have caused at previous away games and that the decision to reduce the capacity was based on that.
To be honest, they have come across as entitled and arrogant w@nkers in the aftermath of all this.
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You’d guess that the constructive feedback was ‘let anyone in who fancies it if they have a ticket or not’
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yeah i'm starting to think 2000 of them is a hoax, no footage of them in town , at the airport etc
i'm guessing 500-1000 came over say 750
But they had more than that in terms of ticket allocation to all get into the stadium.
Logically, your math doesn't work...
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Where does the 2000 number come from? Is it just an assumption based on that's how many tickets they were supposed to get?
Their statement reads like they offered their own safety advice, but it's quite possible that was "let everyone in or they'll smash the place up."
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There didnt look to be 2000 people in that car park, there didnt look to be 750.
Sure it will all become clear soon.
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Not a single word of condemnation of their fans’ behaviour.
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Looks like they’ll be arguing that they can only be held responsible for the actions of fans who had tickets and entered the ground…
Statement of Legia Warsaw
In compliance with UEFA regulations and public law, Aston Villa F.C., as the host club, along with local authorities, has a responsibility to ensure an adequate level of security both inside the stadium and in its immediate surroundings. Prior to our match against Aston Villa F.C., we have consistently maintained that our responsibility extends only to individuals entering the visitors' sector with tickets distributed by us. No club should be held accountable for the actions of unidentified individuals without tickets for the match.
Our staff arrived in Birmingham earlier than usual and maintained continuous communication with the English club, UEFA, and the local police. We repeatedly informed the British counterparts about necessary measures for the security of the venue and its vicinity. Despite this, the British police, in their official responses, only acknowledged the potential risks without implementing our suggestions. Regrettably, due to the actions and inactions of Aston Villa F.C., adverse incidents occurred yesterday. By disregarding our constructive feedback, the host club bears full responsibility for the situation.
Aston Villa F.C. breached UEFA regulations multiple times - initially by not allocating the required 2,100 tickets (5% of the stadium's capacity), then reducing the agreed 1,700 tickets to just 890. Such decisions contributed to the escalation of tensions.
We have repeatedly highlighted the emotional impact on numerous individuals from Poland and the UK who, despite incurring high travel and accommodation costs, were denied tickets, contrary to the inter-club agreement of 21 September. The host club and the British authorities were fully aware of these circumstances. Respecting the host's responsibility for security, we consistently communicated the British restrictions through our club channels.
Due to the inability to authenticate and distribute tickets effectively, Legia Warsaw returned the tickets to the host club. We emphasize that none of the individuals detained by the police had tickets for yesterday's match. Therefore, we strongly object to Legia Warsaw being blamed for Thursday's incidents in Birmingham.
For years, visiting supporters and official delegations have been safely accommodated during matches at Legia Warsaw's stadium. Our commitment to ensuring the safety of visiting team fans has been consistently recognized, as experienced by representatives from Aston Villa F.C., Zrinjski Mostar, and FK Austria Vienna this season.
As a club, we are committed to upholding the highest standards in line with UEFA regulations. We expect reciprocal conduct from other club representatives. We remain prepared to present further evidence to UEFA regarding the actions of the British Police and Aston Villa F.C.
They seem to forget that UEFA agreed to the reduction to 1000 a month ago. So complain all they want, I definitely trust our clubs events over theirs.
At least they were kind enough to admit that they refused to distribute the tickets to their fans who had already travelled to England.
Backs up what we have been saying.
I really hope that shitty little tinpot club & its gang of hooligans gets a long European ban.
English clubs needed that to fix our hooligan problems.
So do Legia...
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Not really bizarre.
40k fans appear and disappear within a 4 hour window when we have a match on at home so 5 % of that could appear and disappear in a shorter time frame. Most of the normal supporters would have just gone back to their hotel rooms, bars or even home once they were released from the area by Police. The troublemakers who stayed were then some of the ones trying to force their way in the gates at the North and Holte and throwing condiments.
No it is very unusual in today's world . Not even 1 clip from their side of the compound or of their ultras meeting up anywhere
Yet there a dozen or so different clips of the clash of the condiments on Trinity Rd .
Very odd.
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They're also forgetting not coming to take the tickets off us until less than two hours before kick off.
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TBH, I don't know who has officially stated 2 k fans were in the compound anyway. The number is more bandied around as Legia kept on stating they and the fans expected 2k tickets and they had already bought their transport and were still coming. It might well be the more sane fans had cancelled last month, or came over and stayed in town rather then head for the ground on the off-chance, with any sane fans who had a ticket taking a swerve on the night when they knew their nutters would be kicking off.
But even if there were only a few hundred in the compound, it doesn't excuse them or their club for the trouble that was caused.
As for the clips, their own fans might realise it is not healthy for them or the club to film their own fans kicking off, plus roaming charges etc, where Villa fans, with the vast majority having phones would have no such qualms.
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Fucking hell, what moron put that statement out?
"We have repeatedly highlighted the emotional impact on numerous individuals from Poland and the UK who, despite incurring high travel and accommodation costs, were denied tickets."
If people are going to book travel and accommodation before they get a ticket, that risk is on them.
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Aye, they looked a sensitive bunch, particularly the ones who dismantled the generator and floodlights before chucking it at the old bill. Must have right hurt their feelings.
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you normally get footage of them pre-game on X in town chanting in the streets at innocent shoppers in the afternoon, or throwing plastic chairs about etc.
Nothing , like ghosts . Perhaps they do have true ninja insurgency and espionage skills and they came and went (all 2000 of them) leaving no evidence
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So that's their beef, hurty feelings? They really are pathetic.
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In whose interest would it be to create a hoax?
the "ultras" egos . they seem to thrive off a weird notoriety of being hard men and travel in numbers . Setting women police officers on fire , sad feckers
Weren't you stating they were no hard men, it was just pretend reputation, fireworks don't hurt anyone and people should have nothing to fear from them. Pick a lane.
yeah exactly , sorry should have put "hard men" . Waving fireworks about singing West End Girls is really intimidating , so is acting hard behind a wall of coppers
It was Go West actually (well the tune) but then most football fans have chants to that. Of course the actual wording could easily be "We come, and kill you all, we come and kill you all" but nah, you seem to have now swerved into "they are not hard at all lane again"
‘ Przyjdziemy i zabijemy was wszystkich’ doesn’t scan very well.
We were in the War Saw bar in the old town after the away game and a few fans were singing to this - their lyrics are stunningly simple: “Legia, Legia Warszawa”. Repeat ad nauseum. Pub was mainly Villa fans and no problems with the Legia fans - had a drink with them and took a few photos together.
They said those ultras wearing white / team shirts are their to sing and support their team. The ultras in black are just looking for a fight.
I feel sorry for their normal fans who traveled to see their team, spending a good amount of cash in the process, only to be kettled into a car park.
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Fucking hell, what moron put that statement out?
"We have repeatedly highlighted the emotional impact on numerous individuals from Poland and the UK who, despite incurring high travel and accommodation costs, were denied tickets."
If people are going to book travel and accommodation before they get a ticket, that risk is on them.
And its not like it was Villa who "denied tickets" to their fans.
They have admitted in their statement that they did...
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Bearing in mind Legua were fully aware of the reduced allocation 4 weeks ago, then it would be interesting to know how many fans travelled from Poland with their official travel club - aassuming they have one.
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I was just reading the thoughts of Legias communications director, it’s all Villas fault for not just letting them all in.
A few fellow Poles have asked her why such misunderstood peace loving fans were nicked for possessing knives. 4 they say.
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In whose interest would it be to create a hoax?
the "ultras" egos . they seem to thrive off a weird notoriety of being hard men and travel in numbers . Setting women police officers on fire , sad feckers
Weren't you stating they were no hard men, it was just pretend reputation, fireworks don't hurt anyone and people should have nothing to fear from them. Pick a lane.
yeah exactly , sorry should have put "hard men" . Waving fireworks about singing West End Girls is really intimidating , so is acting hard behind a wall of coppers
It was Go West actually (well the tune) but then most football fans have chants to that. Of course the actual wording could easily be "We come, and kill you all, we come and kill you all" but nah, you seem to have now swerved into "they are not hard at all lane again"
‘ Przyjdziemy i zabijemy was wszystkich’ doesn’t scan very
I feel sorry for their normal fans who traveled to see their team, spending a good amount of cash in the process, only to be kettled into a car park.
They weren't "kettled into a car park" Pat. That was the ticket collection point. They went into there and then refused to take the tickets or were told by their own fans that they couldn't.
What were the police supposed to do then - just allow them to roam outside the ground and cause carnage?
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^ it sounds like they didn't refuse to take tickets because the Legia officials didn't actually try to distribute them.
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^ it sounds like they didn't refuse to take tickets because the Legia officials didn't actually try to distribute them.
yes because the Ultras were calling the shots. Tail wagging dog.
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In whose interest would it be to create a hoax?
the "ultras" egos . they seem to thrive off a weird notoriety of being hard men and travel in numbers . Setting women police officers on fire , sad feckers
Weren't you stating they were no hard men, it was just pretend reputation, fireworks don't hurt anyone and people should have nothing to fear from them. Pick a lane.
yeah exactly , sorry should have put "hard men" . Waving fireworks about singing West End Girls is really intimidating , so is acting hard behind a wall of coppers
It was Go West actually (well the tune) but then most football fans have chants to that. Of course the actual wording could easily be "We come, and kill you all, we come and kill you all" but nah, you seem to have now swerved into "they are not hard at all lane again"
‘ Przyjdziemy i zabijemy was wszystkich’ doesn’t scan very well.
We were in the War Saw bar in the old town after the away game and a few fans were singing to this - their lyrics are stunningly simple: “Legia, Legia Warszawa”. Repeat ad nauseum. Pub was mainly Villa fans and no problems with the Legia fans - had a drink with them and took a few photos together.
They said those ultras wearing white / team shirts are their to sing and support their team. The ultras in black are just looking for a fight.
I feel sorry for their normal fans who traveled to see their team, spending a good amount of cash in the process, only to be kettled into a car park.
I’m still pissed off I missed you and olaftab in there, I’d walked over to the whisky bar instead for a night cap.
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I don’t know why we’d be interested to engage in dialogue with them to be honest, they’re absolutely full of shit. Fuck ‘em.
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Were any of the Legia fans who got booted from the home sections causing trouble? I wonder if genuine fans who just wanted to see the game and avoid the trouble might have thought that was their best option? Or was it just all chancers there to cause trouble?
On that note too, how did staff know if they were Legia fans who travelled or just Polish people living locally, even if Legia fans? I saw a picture of a woman being removed and she didn't look like an obvious Legia fan.
I would say there was a mixture of both
Where I was very close to the Holte end in the lower Doug Ellis there was a few that got thrown out
But that was after they scored, which was their mistake easily identifiable if you’re going to celebrate your own teams goal in the home areas
One of the people that was rejected was a woman she was arguing, but certainly didn’t look like she’d come looking for trouble, but like I say her and her partner celebrating a goal doesn’t go down well
There was a couple of Legia fans sitting right in front of me, they sat there respectfully the whole match didn’t celebrate no one said a word no one was bothered,
On the way to the ground, I saw a couple of pockets of Legia fans up near the fork where the Holte pub is, they were just standing there not saying anything not causing any trouble
The walk back from the ground I saw no Legia and no trouble
I also doubt the numbers that are said to have been there, but obviously all the trouble was down at Witton away area which was closed off so I wouldn’t really know,
All in all it was a very weird night The atmosphere was very subdued before the match started I didn’t understand why until later
when we got back and the next day I was getting text messages and calls from friends and family members asking if we were okay as if we’ve been in a war zone
When I told them we didn’t even know it was going on they were amazed
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That's the thing about it. If you'd come from the Aston or Trinity Road sides of the ground you wouldn't have seen anything out of the ordinary except wondering why the away section was empty.
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That's the thing about it. If you'd come from the Aston or Trinity Road sides of the ground you wouldn't have seen anything out of the ordinary except wondering why the away section was empty.
Yes, that was our experience
Because we were in the same stand as the away fans but the other end we couldn’t see what was going on
So I’m saying I’d expected them to be a bit noisier and a few fireworks going off, then my teenage boy says to me I can’t see any away fans not a single one, this was nigh on half Time by now
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...your math...
Just NO!
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...your math...
Just NO!
Disgraceful!
I’ve taken a screenshot.
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I have no problem with away fans being in the home end if there are tickets available.
It’s all about behaviour and respect for those around you.
I was in the home end for Legia v Villa in Warsaw and showed utmost respect and good behaviour….for fear of getting my teeth kicked out and my nipples fed to me, made to shit them out and eat them again.
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Fucking hell, what moron put that statement out?
"We have repeatedly highlighted the emotional impact on numerous individuals from Poland and the UK who, despite incurring high travel and accommodation costs, were denied tickets."
If people are going to book travel and accommodation before they get a ticket, that risk is on them.
What next, the emotional impact of a 2-1 defeat and despite? 'Due to the inability to score more than once and handle Villa's attack effectively, Legia Warsaw request the three points from the host club .'
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That's it, isn't it. If you're in with the home fans, you sit on your hands. In the days of lower attendances I've sat next to a visitor, and if they're not arseholes about it they're just as welcome as most you might find in the Barton's.
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...your math...
Just NO!
I apologise wholeheartedly & have just chopped off the end of my middle finger as an honour atonement...
That's it, isn't it. If you're in with the home fans, you sit on your hands. In the days of lower attendances I've sat next to a visitor, and if they're not arseholes about it they're just as welcome as most you might find in the Barton's.
I have gone with one of my Liverpool supporting mates to a game between our teams & he shut the fuck up for the entirety of the match & it was all fine & dandy...
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I was in the home end for Legia v Villa in Warsaw and showed utmost respect and good behaviour….for fear of getting my teeth kicked out and my nipples fed to me, made to shit them out and eat them again.
That’s rather too descriptive. Have bad things happened to you in the past?
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It’s quite possible that some Polish Brummies have adopted Villa as a 2nd team and have booking histories at Villa Park as Villa fans, but attended this one as Legia fans in home areas of the ground.
It’s definitely true though that whatever the background circumstances, you just don’t celebrate away goals in home areas.
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There were people being removed quite early on though, so they weren't caught out by celebrating. I just don't like the idea that local fans were being kicked out because of their accents or because they weren't speaking English. But I suppose Thursday night was somewhat exceptional circumstances and its unlikely to happen again.
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That's the thing about it. If you'd come from the Aston or Trinity Road sides of the ground you wouldn't have seen anything out of the ordinary except wondering why the away section was empty.
I posted yesterday that coming off the train at Aston just after six we had about 30 coppers come charging up the stairs to kettle a bunch of Legia fans and then at about twenty to eight we saw a large group mobbing up by the churchyard. There was then a big cordon of police going onto Witton Lane speaking to everyone to check accents so had an inkling that things were not quite as normal but obviously no idea of major issues until we saw the empty seats
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According to the BBC, the 1700 figure was agreed before the Alkmaar match when they caused all the trouble. After that match is when we further reduced it to the 1000 figure. As mentioned, there is no way UEFA would not be aware of this as it would have had to be cleared by them as well.
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It’s quite possible that some Polish Brummies have adopted Villa as a 2nd team and have booking histories at Villa Park as Villa fans, but attended this one as Legia fans in home areas of the ground.
It’s definitely true though that whatever the background circumstances, you just don’t celebrate away goals in home areas.
I spoke to a couple of Polish Villa supporters and they wanted to know why the police weren't more pro-active with the "fucking Legua bastards." They thought a few broken heads and water cannon would have been a good idea, and worse if they'd done something
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In whose interest would it be to create a hoax?
the "ultras" egos . they seem to thrive off a weird notoriety of being hard men and travel in numbers . Setting women police officers on fire , sad feckers
Weren't you stating they were no hard men, it was just pretend reputation, fireworks don't hurt anyone and people should have nothing to fear from them. Pick a lane.
yeah exactly , sorry should have put "hard men" . Waving fireworks about singing West End Girls is really intimidating , so is acting hard behind a wall of coppers
It was Go West actually (well the tune) but then most football fans have chants to that. Of course the actual wording could easily be "We come, and kill you all, we come and kill you all" but nah, you seem to have now swerved into "they are not hard at all lane again"
‘ Przyjdziemy i zabijemy was wszystkich’ doesn’t scan very well.
We were in the War Saw bar in the old town after the away game and a few fans were singing to this - their lyrics are stunningly simple: “Legia, Legia Warszawa”. Repeat ad nauseum. Pub was mainly Villa fans and no problems with the Legia fans - had a drink with them and took a few photos together.
They said those ultras wearing white / team shirts are their to sing and support their team. The ultras in black are just looking for a fight.
I feel sorry for their normal fans who traveled to see their team, spending a good amount of cash in the process, only to be kettled into a car park.
I’m still pissed off I missed you and olaftab in there, I’d walked over to the whisky bar instead for a night cap.
Next time mate! I’m pretty sure it was your recommendation on here that led us there and we went on both the Wednesday and Thursday nights. If I lived in central Warsaw that would be my local. The woman who runs it was lovely but slightly stressed.
IIRC you recommended a craft beer bar nearby but that was surprisingly quiet on the Wednesday. Which led us to walk 100m to the War Saw…..
As I’ve said before, generally it was a cracking trip and the Poles were friendly hosts. It’s just a shame that their hooligan element means their normal fans couldn’t enjoy a couple of days in Brum.
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‘You haven’t seen the Villa now f*** off home.’
‘No match on your big day out.’
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I have no problem with away fans being in the home end if there are tickets available.
It’s all about behaviour and respect for those around you.
I was in the home end for Legia v Villa in Warsaw and showed utmost respect and good behaviour….for fear of getting my teeth kicked out and my nipples fed to me, made to shit them out and eat them again.
"You're gonna get your f****n heads kicked in" was a catchier tune and easier to learn back in the day.
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Some of them turned up at the Sty today and sat in the home end singing. Funny as sha had been giving it the "wouldn't happen at our ground" and also the fact the ground was half empty and the Legia fans probably provided the only atmosphere.
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Some of them turned up at the Sty today and sat in the home end singing. Funny as sha had been giving it the "wouldn't happen at our ground" and also the fact the ground was half empty and the Legia fans probably provided the only atmosphere.
The last time people from Warsaw would have been in surroundings as desolate and brutal as the Sty would have been in 1945.
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‘You haven’t seen the Villa now f*** off home.’
‘No match on your big day out.’
I’m surprised there wasn’t a rendition of ‘we’ll smoke where we want, we’ll smoke where we waaaannt, we’re Aston Villa, we’ll smoke where we want’
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‘You haven’t seen the Villa now f*** off home.’
‘No match on your big day out.’
I’m surprised there wasn’t a rendition of ‘we’ll smoke where we want, we’ll smoke where we waaaannt, we’re Aston Villa, we’ll smoke where we want’
I laughed at the renditions of "empty seats my lord".
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That's the thing about it. If you'd come from the Aston or Trinity Road sides of the ground you wouldn't have seen anything out of the ordinary except wondering why the away section was empty.
That’s what it was like for me.
As kick off approached, I commented that maybe all the Legia fans planned to take their seats at the same time as some kind of display of strength/unity. Especially as the stewards in the away section were told to stand up about ten to eight.
When no fans entered, I ended up texting PWS to find out what was going on.
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I was in the home end for Legia v Villa in Warsaw and showed utmost respect and good behaviour….for fear of getting my teeth kicked out and my nipples fed to me, made to shit them out and eat them again.
That’s rather too descriptive. Have bad things happened to you in the past?
Never in that pub. They love my renditions of Manfred Man and Hollies tunes!
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I was in the home end for Legia v Villa in Warsaw and showed utmost respect and good behaviour….for fear of getting my teeth kicked out and my nipples fed to me, made to shit them out and eat them again.
That’s rather too descriptive. Have bad things happened to you in the past?
Never in that pub. They love my renditions of Manfred Man and Hollies tunes!
So that’s why the police turned up and emptied the bar at 1am!
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This ******. All hurt by events this week created a new badge for us.
https://x.com/k3233590/status/1731011351512805642?s=46
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This ******. All hurt by events this week created a new badge for us.
https://x.com/k3233590/status/1731011351512805642?s=46
Aw bless. If only his grasp of the events was slightly less rudimentary than his graphic design skills.
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The same poster decided to be homophobic in some of their replies as well. Fuck him and the others of the same ilk.
Edit: And for someone calling us Racists, his one reply to someone contained this gem
shitting pigs who make a mess everywhere they show up, you are a wild country, an Arab country, so I'm not surprised
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A Polish woman I worked with about 4 years ago contacted me a couple of weeks ago out of the blue, asking me if I could get tickets. She admitted that she already had 3, but needed another 2.
I politely refused to help because I didn't know who would be in those seats. I don't know if I would have been able to get any even if I was willing. It does make me wonder if that's how so many Legia fans got into the home areas.
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The main Beeb news reported last night that it was the worst violence at VP in 28 years..
Still thinking what was that match 28 years ago?
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The main Beeb news reported last night that it was the worst violence at VP in 28 years..
Still thinking what was that match 28 years ago?
Clearly they did not discuss matters with Mark Lawrenson before making those comments. We’ve had more recent dark days.
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The main Beeb news reported last night that it was the worst violence at VP in 28 years..
Still thinking what was that match 28 years ago?
One of the police commanders said it was the worse they'd seen in 28 years in the force. That's probably where they took it from.
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You mean there wasn't a Great Ketchup War in 1995?
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The main Beeb news reported last night that it was the worst violence at VP in 28 years..
Still thinking what was that match 28 years ago?
One of the police commanders said it was the worse they'd seen in 28 years in the force. That's probably where they took it from.
So not at VP then.
But for WMP in 28 years? I know it looked bad on Thursday night. But the pictures we saw were mainly at a gate at the car park with about 20 police holding them back. Bad as it was it didn’t seem that bad. Can only assume there was more trouble that wasn’t filmed.
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The main Beeb news reported last night that it was the worst violence at VP in 28 years..
Still thinking what was that match 28 years ago?
I wonder if the mean Manchester United v Crystal Palace Semi Final?
If so hardly comparable and the incident wasn’t even at the ground
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Assuming he has been at WMP all that time and not just within multiple forces, the only thing that might have run it close is the Birmingham riots in 2011. But I'm guessing the flares and the injuries involved, plus the viciousness of some of what they did might be it. He isn't the only one stating it is the worst they have seen, that independent advisor on hooliganism stated similar.
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The main Beeb news reported last night that it was the worst violence at VP in 28 years..
Still thinking what was that match 28 years ago?
I wonder if the mean Manchester United v Crystal Palace Semi Final?
If so hardly comparable and the incident wasn’t even at the ground
He joined the police in 95 and it is the worst he has seen since he joined. Not that there was a specific match in 95 that was worse.
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Assuming he has been at WMP all that time and not just within multiple forces, the only thing that might have run it close is the Birmingham riots in 2011. But I'm guessing the flares and the injuries involved, plus the viciousness of some of what they did might be it. He isn't the only one stating it is the worst they have seen, that independent advisor on hooliganism stated similar.
Which makes me think it wasn’t just the confrontations at the car park gates.
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Yes. But "bad as it was, it didn't seem to bad" seems to be you going on a couple of videos shown by passing supporters. It could have easily escalated after and the damage in picture elsewhere shows it was all along the fence and not just the gates. The pictures also include where they tried to throw a floodlight stanchion at the Police.
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As a few of us have said, if you weren't on Witton Lane you didn't see anything. I've certainly never known such a sustained attack on the police as that.
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The reason it didn’t look so bad to many people was the police doing their job - containing and controlling it.
I’m no fan of WMP but they did a good job in very difficult circumstances
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As a few of us have said, if you weren't on Witton Lane you didn't see anything. I've certainly never known such a sustained attack on the police as that.
Understood - it was a sustained attack. The rhetoric now makes sense.
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As a few of us have said, if you weren't on Witton Lane you didn't see anything. I've certainly never known such a sustained attack on the police as that.
Understood - it was a sustained attack. The rhetoric now makes sense.
A police statement said it was premeditated.
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As a few of us have said, if you weren't on Witton Lane you didn't see anything. I've certainly never known such a sustained attack on the police as that.
Understood - it was a sustained attack. The rhetoric now makes sense.
A police statement said it was premeditated.
Judging by past behaviour by Legia they were right.
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They should be banned. Let’s see what happens
We all know how corrupt UEFA is - especially with their chairman in their gang.
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This ******. All hurt by events this week created a new badge for us.
https://x.com/k3233590/status/1731011351512805642?s=46
It's facing the right way, there's no star. I think they're on to something, the ticket-quibbling, mayonnaise-hurling tarts.
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They should be banned. Let’s see what happens
We all know how corrupt UEFA is - especially with their chairman in their gang.
Knowing what UEFA are like, it really wouldn't surprise me if we got some of the blame from them.
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As a few of us have said, if you weren't on Witton Lane you didn't see anything. I've certainly never known such a sustained attack on the police as that.
Understood - it was a sustained attack. The rhetoric now makes sense.
A police statement said it was premeditated.
Clearly, it was premeditated, and the WMP, were prepared.
When the police deploy horses and dogs, that is usually a sign that they expect trouble.
Sadly, these ultra dudes think that if there are no guns on display then it is party time.
TBH, in retrospect, this could have very much worse.
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The fact that officers were drafted in from 5 different forces to be part of one of the biggest ever police operations at Villa Park backs that up.
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WMP have charged 46 men (arsewipes) aged between 21 and 63 with various offences following Thursday night’s game. All but 1 to appear before magistrates in Brum today.
So 1954 were treated badly having done nothing wrong and 840 odd of them at least had valid tickets?
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WMP have charged 46 men (arsewipes) aged between 21 and 63 with various offences following Thursday night’s game. All but 1 to appear before magistrates in Brum today.
So 1954 were treated badly having done nothing wrong and 840 odd of them at least had valid tickets?
No. The police wouldn’t have nicked everybody who was playing up, just the most aggressive and accessible. If they arrested 46 people I would reckon on at least 5 times as many were involved - based on the way cops used to Nick people in the bad old days.
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WMP have charged 46 men (arsewipes) aged between 21 and 63 with various offences following Thursday night’s game. All but 1 to appear before magistrates in Brum today.
So 1954 were treated badly having done nothing wrong and 840 odd of them at least had valid tickets?
Perhaps you should stop taking your friend's word at face value and look at what everyone else has to say on the subject.
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WMP have charged 46 men (arsewipes) aged between 21 and 63 with various offences following Thursday night’s game. All but 1 to appear before magistrates in Brum today.
So 1954 were treated badly having done nothing wrong and 840 odd of them at least had valid tickets?
Yes, that’s exactly how it works.
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WMP have charged 46 men (arsewipes) aged between 21 and 63 with various offences following Thursday night’s game. All but 1 to appear before magistrates in Brum today.
So 1954 were treated badly having done nothing wrong and 840 odd of them at least had valid tickets?
Yes, even though Legia Warsaw officials gave out no tickets, 840 odd had them somehow.
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Good effort Dougie.
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I know the game is at the Vitality but they do allow some away fans in.
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Jesus, Leon. That was dreadful as well.
Good effort Dougie.
Wrong thread!
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He’s having a mare
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D'oh!
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After all the fuss and drama and it's terrible that they weren't allowed in, take a guess how many of them were outside the ground?
700. Every Legia fan who turned up could have got in with room to spare.
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After all the fuss and drama and it's terrible that they weren't allowed in, take a guess how many of them were outside the ground?
700. Every Legia fan who turned up could have got in with room to spare.
Thanks Dave.
This whole event is baffling.
Ultimately is their actual Club that did the biggest wrong by not distributing tickets?
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So has there been any comment from Uefa yet?
They are making our own FA look like consumate professionals
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After all the fuss and drama and it's terrible that they weren't allowed in, take a guess how many of them were outside the ground?
700. Every Legia fan who turned up could have got in with room to spare.
Not that I don’t believe that figure, but where did 700 come from? Is it an estimate or based on any enquiries? Cheers.
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After all the fuss and drama and it's terrible that they weren't allowed in, take a guess how many of them were outside the ground?
700. Every Legia fan who turned up could have got in with room to spare.
Not that I don’t believe that figure, but where did 700 come from? Is it an estimate or based on any enquiries? Cheers.
It's an official estimate.
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After all the fuss and drama and it's terrible that they weren't allowed in, take a guess how many of them were outside the ground?
700. Every Legia fan who turned up could have got in with room to spare.
I did wonder the other day how many did cancel flights and hotels, or didn't bother coming to the ground because they knew the Ultras were going to kick off. And after the Alkmaar game, and the piss take that the fans already lost out then at Mostar, I suspect that they also didn't sell the full allocation of 1000 anyway. The 878(?) number they kept on banding about which were "all we were allowing" could have been the direct ticket sales number.
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So has there been any comment from Uefa yet?
They are making our own FA look like consumate professionals
Brown envelopes have arrived at the uefa office yet,
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So has there been any comment from Uefa yet?
They are making our own FA look like consumate professionals
UEFA are professionals.
In the corruption sense.
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What happened to the guys that appeared in court ?
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What happened to the guys that appeared in court ?
They were bailed on a £2,000 surety to appear in January. If they don't, which they probably won't, they lose the money and will have a warrant out for their arrest which means they can't get back into the UK. Magistrates aren't always daft.
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What happened to the guys that appeared in court ?
They were bailed on a £2,000 surety to appear in January. If they don't, which they provablyvwont, they lose the money and will have a warrant out for their arrest which means they can't get back into the UK. Magistrates aren't always daft.
That's a pretty handy way of cutting Legia off in the future too, should they ever draw an English club.
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What happened to the guys that appeared in court ?
They were bailed on a £2,000 surety to appear in January. If they don't, which they provablyvwont, they lose the money and will have a warrant out for their arrest which means they can't get back into the UK. Magistrates aren't always daft.
That's a pretty handy way of cutting Legia off in the future too, should they ever draw an English club.
Indeed. Them or Poland play here again, Border Force will have the airports covered.
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Fiery police office returns to work. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c1e2j0zq5klo
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After all the fuss and drama and it's terrible that they weren't allowed in, take a guess how many of them were outside the ground?
700. Every Legia fan who turned up could have got in with room to spare.
I must have missed this, I remember saying that there didn't look to be anywhere near 3000 in that car park.
So am I missing something here, why didn't they just distribute the tickets they did have to those there? And if they didn't ever have any intentions of going inside, why come to the ground rather than staying where they were?
Strange situation, strange people.
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Fiery police office returns to work. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c1e2j0zq5klo
That’s really good news, glad to hear it, thanks BV.
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After all the fuss and drama and it's terrible that they weren't allowed in, take a guess how many of them were outside the ground?
700. Every Legia fan who turned up could have got in with room to spare.
Strange situation, strange people.
Nice beer though. I sampled an imported 'Lech' lager last night and was very impressed with both it's flavour and it's general refreshing qualities.
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Good to know.
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After all the fuss and drama and it's terrible that they weren't allowed in, take a guess how many of them were outside the ground?
700. Every Legia fan who turned up could have got in with room to spare.
The whole thing is very strange. If it appears that Legia refused to distribute the tickets or returned them they should get a lengthy ban.
I must have missed this, I remember saying that there didn't look to be anywhere near 3000 in that car park.
So am I missing something here, why didn't they just distribute the tickets they did have to those there? And if they didn't ever have any intentions of going inside, why come to the ground rather than staying where they were?
Strange situation, strange people.
The whole thing is very strange. If it appears that Legia refused to distribute the tickets or returned them they should get a lengthy ban.
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Legia Warsaw fined €100k and BANNED from selling tickets to its away supporters for five UEFA matches after fan trouble in Birmingham.
Legia also ordered to contact Aston Villa to pay for damages caused by fans.
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They didnt see the Villa and fucked off home.
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Some lucky clubs in next years competitions then.
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They didnt see the Villa and fucked off home.
"you've seen the coach park, now fuck off home"
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Five games would potentially include the final. If we meet them there we'll surely get double the allocation we otherwise would have.
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Legia Warsaw fined €100k and BANNED from selling tickets to its away supporters for five UEFA matches after fan trouble in Birmingham.
Legia also ordered to contact Aston Villa to pay for damages caused by fans.
We should send them the bill for the new North Stand...
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Legia Warsaw fined €100k and BANNED from selling tickets to its away supporters for five UEFA matches after fan trouble in Birmingham.
Legia also ordered to contact Aston Villa to pay for damages caused by fans.
We should send them the bill for the new North Stand...
Somebody should send them the bill from WMP.
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What actual damage was caused ?
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What actual damage was caused ?
The condiments.
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What actual damage was caused ?
The condiments.
Metal fences were damaged - apparently metal bars from the fences were thrown at the police and horses resulting in injuries. A light column was also damaged. I think, given Legia fans violence in the AZ Alkmaar away fixture, that UEFA have been weak - Legia should've been thrown out of Europe. Can you imagine what UEFA would've done if it was our fans causing the same trouble in Warsaw?
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What actual damage was caused ?
Last picture shows the some of the damage Villa would have to pay to repair/ replace.
https://twitter.com/cliffordstott/status/1730617505339629804/photo/1
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After the Battle Of the Cruet the burger van was hooked up and towed away, so they lost out on post match revenue.
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Weak punishment in my opinion but no surprise.
Have Legia taken any responsibility for this yet or criticised the people involved? At the time they appeared to blame everyone else and I’ve not seen anything yet to say they’ve changed their mind. Let’s face it, this is the 4th time over the last few years they’ve been involved in similar incidents.
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What actual damage was caused ?
The condiments.
They sneaked into the Holte End and erected something called the Terrace View.
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Weak punishment in my opinion but no surprise.
Have Legia taken any responsibility for this yet or criticised the people involved? At the time they appeared to blame everyone else and I’ve not seen anything yet to say they’ve changed their mind. Let’s face it, this is the 4th time over the last few years they’ve been involved in similar incidents.
Which makes the hand wringing about WMP and Villa on here when the incident happened even more strange
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Weak punishment in my opinion but no surprise.
Have Legia taken any responsibility for this yet or criticised the people involved? At the time they appeared to blame everyone else and I’ve not seen anything yet to say they’ve changed their mind. Let’s face it, this is the 4th time over the last few years they’ve been involved in similar incidents.
I haven't spoken to one Legia fan either in person or online who has taken responsibility or accountability for any of the actions of either their club, or their fans.
It is entirely Villas fault apparently for antagonising them with the ticket allocation reduction because they are an "emotional fanbase"...
Throwing them out of Europe for one season would have been too good for them.
The punishment they were given, while it vindicates Villa for everything we did before & on the night, does nothing to deter them from acting like animals, as the whole point of them kicking off both at Villa Park & at Alkmaar, was due to them not having enough tickets in their eyes...