Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Match Threads & Player Ratings => Topic started by: PeterWithesShin on August 12, 2023, 07:37:04 PM
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Well. We've had better 3 day spells.
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String the match thread author up!
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String the match thread author up!
I pray it's his last.
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Bullied all over the park. Mings is a massive loss.
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I hate football again.
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String the match thread author up!
I pray it's his last.
:(
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Fucking diabolical. Looked utterly unprepared and several players gave up.
Kamara had an absolute shocker. Pau is going to need to learn very fast, he miles off it.
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Oh well. We humped them last time out. They've humped us this time. Swings and roundabouts.
Fucking hate the Jawdie Arabians, though.
Hopefully one of the Perseid meteors will obliterate Saint James' Park tonight.
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That was a shocking display, wrong team selection compounded by some totally inept performances.
Watkins Cash Martinez Konsa Bailey what the fuck were you doing?
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I'm struggling to think of a worse performance under Emery. So much was wrong.
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Is the season over yet?
Massive reality check for us. Top 6, nowhere near good enough. Mings is going to be a massive massive loss for us this season. As is Buendia. With those 2, this is a draw.
Big decisions need to be made. Yet again, it feels like we are badly underprepared from what looked like a good preseason.
Totally gutted. Newcastle looked lethal still so any hope of their bubble bursting is just hope. In the meantime, we have a lot of things we need to sort out urgently. Really urgently. Again.
Bad - if not a disastrous - first game of the season, not only because of the result, but because of the injuries.
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Just gutted and in disbelief of what’s transpired over the last few days. We’ve lost on so many levels.. don’t know how this always seems to happen. We have to go out and buy now, real players not projects.
Hope we can batter Everton next week to turn the mood around. Emery looked to be in shock for the last 30.
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Tyrone is going to be a massive loss to this team.
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Siri, what does the worst imaginable opening day look like?
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Looks like the old Villa is back, breaking the wrong type of records again. Let’s hope it has a cathartic effect.
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I thought we might lose, it was always going to be very tough. I didn’t think we’d be a complete rabble. Masses of work to do.
At least Coutinho looked bright.
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What kills me most about today is that Eddie Howe has clearly had it circled in red since we caned them last season, and we made it so fucking easy for them.
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The usual first day apocalypse.
Think Mings injury rather than the end scoreline will impact more on us up to January.
We sign endless players and still the squad looks very light at the key parts now although potentially two ACLs in under a week is ridiculous luck and something you simply can't legislate for.
Emery is human and did get his team wrong today as it was an awful first 10 minutes and also a game where we needed to control the tempo and midfield area but we simply never got close bar looking o.k at 2-1 towards end of first half.
Disappointing but you can lose by four goals at Newcastle and finish 7th (or 6th as Brighton did) so a week too early for doom predictions.
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Wank
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Dreadful. We need a Right Back. We nee Moreno back.
We need to get the balance in midfield and we need to sell Bailey tonight.
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3-1, because their second and third shouldn't have stood but KSS have clearly bought the league.
I mean really, yes it's a reality check, yes they were better, but I feel like I'm being fucking gaslit here. Is nobody going to talk about how that offside wasn't given? Really? He was a whole leg offside! But you don't give decisions against the Crown Prince and you certainly don't talk about that.
Honestly, I hate it. The rich psycopaths who run everything else have now come for your hobbies, your loves, the things that give you meaning. And they've devoured them and left not a crumb.
Football is over. Fuck it, fuck everything.
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Worse than our worst nightmares. An absolutely shocker.
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Firstly, I blame Toronto's thread title. Secondly, I believe (I'm starting to sound like Footy) if we hadn't started with Bailey, the whole game would have panned out differently.
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Wank
No, those are enjoyable. Or so I’m told.
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The usual first day apocalypse.
Think Mings injury rather than the end scoreline will impact more on us up to January.
We sign endless players and still the squad looks very light at the key parts now although potentially two ACLs in under a week is ridiculous luck and something you simply can't legislate for.
Emery is human and did get his team wrong today as it was an awful first 10 minutes and also a game where we needed to control the tempo and midfield area but we simply never got close bar looking o.k at 2-1 towards end of first half.
Disappointing but you can lose by four goals at Newcastle and finish 7th (or 6th as Brighton did) so a week too early for doom predictions.
Yes there’s no need for utter doom stations. It’s a catastrophically bad display, with a dreadful injury on top of it, but it’s recoverable. But my god McGinn, Kamara, Digne, Pau, and Konsa in particular were utterly embarrassing. Massive kick up the arse needed.
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Cash and Bailey are two players we need to improve on significantly.
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Never seen Kamara play so many short forward passes, some stopped running .
Our defence was smashed apart , literally
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Garbage the lot of them.
Kamara sunk to a new level of ineptitude, though Bailey, Digne and Konsa weren't far behind.
I most certainly got the answer to my question of how UE was going to defend the ball over the top (or in behind us) with our high line...he left us vulnerable :(
McGinn completely neutralized playing on the left. The players bear much of the responsibility for that performance but UE got the tactics completely wrong.
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I’m off out for a nice meal shortly, and it had better be the best Lasagne I’ve ever had now to make this trip worthwhile.
I think we look shaken from losing two of the team in short succession. The plan was out the window before we kicked a ball, and say what you like about the captaincy, but Mings is a real leader on the pitch and I think we really missed that too.
We knew going in that overly playing out from the back and playing a very high line were the key dangers against this Newcastle side, but we fell into it completely in a way we avoided at Villa Park.
It’s disappointing, but what Emery needs now is a few weeks to get things back together.
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Optimism evaporated. It's fairly obvious who organises our defence on the pitch.
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It’s one game. An absolutely shit game and utterly shit 3 days. But it’s one game. And we will be better. Much better. Newcastle is arguably the hardest place to go and we were completely trounced. So sugar coating it. But it’s one game. Let’s keep perspective.
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We’ll improve from here no doubt, how could we get any worse?!
Big love to Tyrone looked bloody awful.
The rest of you, get a fucking grip and put it right against Everton.
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No need for panic, unless you feel like it. 2 offside goals not really checked but they were better than us. Konsa's mistake was crucial and so was Mings injury, Teilemens was awful and no better than Bailey, but to throw the shit around now is a huge overreaction and this result will not be indicative of the seaaon
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With Buendia and Mings, that game is a draw.
We lose those 2 in 3 days and it’s mid-table unless we buy replacements.
Mings isn’t just a player - he’s a leader, a colossus and our strongest player mentally.
Jesus fucking Christ. Every time we threaten to kick on, fate pulls a fast one on us and we end up back at square one. Terrible terrible luck
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Well, that was sobering! Too many players below par to mention, as a whole, defensively, we were a car crash. That was horrible to watch. Newcastle were sharper, first to the ball. I have a real issue with the VAR decision for their second and I think the Tyrone injury may have knocked the stuffing out of us, not surprisingly. Diaby is a breath of fresh air but the rest of them, I honestly can't think of another acceptable performance, other than Martinez.
We need a couple more leaders on the pitch, one being a centre back. Unusually bad from Kamara, Cash and Konsa. I am looking forward to Moreno and Ramsey getting fit as they offer us pace and energy, which was lacking today. This high line crap worries me.
Let's not panic though eh? One game down 37 to go!
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Window still open is the only positive.
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I am shell shocked about Buendia and Mings. I think half the team were and all
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Can't take any more Sky, so after thinking I've not watched anything on Pluto TV in a while I've flicked over. They're only showing the bloody highlights!
Oh, hang on, my mistake, it's Laurel and Hardy.
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Another performance like that and I’m going to rip up my season ticket waiting number.
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No leadership on the pitch. I expect more from our captain in such games. Atrocious today.
Fuck it, it's almost 4am and I'm too irritated to sleep.
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Keep the faith.
That's all.
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Well, I enjoyed my Saturday tea time Lasagne and glass of red. Shame the football was fucking wank.
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Losing is one thing, but it’s the way we appeared to give up in the second half that’s the most worrying thing. Very moody away end too this afternoon. People stumbling around paralytic drunk and Villa fans arguing with each other all second half.
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I may give MOTD a miss later.
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That was a bit shit.
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3-1, because their second and third shouldn't have stood but KSS have clearly bought the league.
I mean really, yes it's a reality check, yes they were better, but I feel like I'm being fucking gaslit here. Is nobody going to talk about how that offside wasn't given? Really? He was a whole leg offside! But you don't give decisions against the Crown Prince and you certainly don't talk about that.
Honestly, I hate it. The rich psycopaths who run everything else have now come for your hobbies, your loves, the things that give you meaning. And they've devoured them and left not a crumb.
Football is over. Fuck it, fuck everything.
I love this post. I’m not actually sure I agree it was the case today, but by God ain’t it the truth as a general comment on the world.
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Losing is one thing, but it’s the way we appeared to give up in the second half that’s the most worrying thing. Very moody away end too this afternoon. People stumbling around paralytic drunk and Villa fans arguing with each other all second half.
Maybe these superfans can let some others attend
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3-1, because their second and third shouldn't have stood but KSS have clearly bought the league.
I mean really, yes it's a reality check, yes they were better, but I feel like I'm being fucking gaslit here. Is nobody going to talk about how that offside wasn't given? Really? He was a whole leg offside! But you don't give decisions against the Crown Prince and you certainly don't talk about that.
Honestly, I hate it. The rich psycopaths who run everything else have now come for your hobbies, your loves, the things that give you meaning. And they've devoured them and left not a crumb.
Football is over. Fuck it, fuck everything.
I love this post. I’m not actually sure I agree it was the case today, but by God ain’t it the truth as a general comment on the world.
Bravo Monty, the best and most accurate post I have read. Puts into words all of my anger and frustration at the absolute state the world has got itself into and how spineless the institutions have been.
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Relegation battle starts here.
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We just don't do opening days, too obvious aren't they
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I had a bad feeling on this game. Especially after Emi's injury and now Tyrone. We miss JJ and Moreno badly. I still don't get why Ashley wasn't given a further 12 months contract. No replacement for him is baffling. Mings is such a rock at the back. We have to sign someone to cover for him.
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Relegation battle starts here.
Bottom of the table 6 pointer next week.
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Sorry with Bailey he's had enough chances and think it now time to depart
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Fucking hell, that was terrible.
At half time I thought we could get back in it, last 30 mins was terrible.
Not an ideal fixture for first game but I had hopes for a point, others have said lack of leaders is scary after Mings went off.
Purse strings to be opened I think.
Need some imposing figures to lead from the front
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Monty's observation about the VAR decisions for two of their goals crossed my mind. Just cursory glances and goal given. I suggested out loud there was a direct line from Riyadh to Stockley Park.
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Relegation battle starts here.
Nonsense. It’s a really bad day, clearly, it basically went as wrong as it possibly could. Emery has shown plenty already to demonstrate that isn’t the norm.
It was always going to be an incredibly hard, even if we played well. They rarely lose at home, so us having a really poor day led us to slaughter. The biggest issue is Mings, because the other issues from today are recoverable, but his isn’t.
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Emery got it the starting line up wrong. If we had an exta body in midfield, parked the bus early and quieten the crowd it could of been a different game.
Maybe he thought he Bailey would get some joy against Burn, I was suprised we didn't target him more.
Heads dropped when McGinn went off, it was game over pretty soon after that. No Mings or McGinn on the pitch thats a massive part of the spine missing.
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I’m off out for a nice meal shortly, and it had better be the best Lasagne I’ve ever had now to make this trip worthwhile.
I think we look shaken from losing two of the team in short succession. The plan was out the window before we kicked a ball, and say what you like about the captaincy, but Mings is a real leader on the pitch and I think we really missed that too.
We knew going in that overly playing out from the back and playing a very high line were the key dangers against this Newcastle side, but we fell into it completely in a way we avoided at Villa Park.
It’s disappointing, but what Emery needs now is a few weeks to get things back together.
Didn't Mings get injured at 2-1? Can't blame his injury on the very poor first 10 minutes.
We just couldn't cope with their intensity which is often the case up there.
They recovered from a similar game at VP in April, we need to do the same quickly and Everton is probably the ideal game as we have a brilliant recent record since coming back up and they're not the sort of team who'll stretch you so we can keep the ball better and hopefully construct some decent attacks.
Only plus point today was Diaby has settled in very quickly with loads more to come. Wouldn't shock me if he's our hybrid CF by second half of the season as he has all the attributes to play that role.
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Losing is one thing, but it’s the way we appeared to give up in the second half that’s the most worrying thing. Very moody away end too this afternoon. People stumbling around paralytic drunk and Villa fans arguing with each other all second half.
Maybe these superfans can let some others attend
It's exactly why, having had a pretty impeccable booking history for a few years, we let our away booking history lapse a couple of years go. A significant part of our regular away support are utter bellends. I like a drink as much as the next bloke, but I dont want to spend most of the game worrying if the bloke behind me or next to me is going to spew, or if someone coked up to they eyeballs is going to take offence to nothing at all and want a fight with me, or drunkenly grab my wife's hair and use it as a lever to springboard themselves over us when we score. Just stopped being fun, sadly,
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Cash destroyed by Gordon.
Watkins nowhere to be seen.
Defence all over the place.
Christ, it can only get better after today.
At least we still have time to bring in some more players.
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Relegation battle starts here.
Nonsense. It’s a really bad day, clearly, it basically went as wrong as it possibly could. Emery has shown plenty already to demonstrate that isn’t the norm.
It was always going to be an incredibly hard, even if we played well. They rarely lose at home, so us having a really poor day led us to slaughter. The biggest issue is Mings, because the other issues from today are recoverable, but his isn’t.
I don't think they tongue being in my cheek is visible in text.
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I trust Unai, he’s done more with less. We do need an immediate injection of talent into the starting XI.
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3-1, because their second and third shouldn't have stood but KSS have clearly bought the league.
I mean really, yes it's a reality check, yes they were better, but I feel like I'm being fucking gaslit here. Is nobody going to talk about how that offside wasn't given? Really? He was a whole leg offside! But you don't give decisions against the Crown Prince and you certainly don't talk about that.
Honestly, I hate it. The rich psycopaths who run everything else have now come for your hobbies, your loves, the things that give you meaning. And they've devoured them and left not a crumb.
Football is over. Fuck it, fuck everything.
Dear oh dear
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Losing is one thing, but it’s the way we appeared to give up in the second half that’s the most worrying thing. Very moody away end too this afternoon. People stumbling around paralytic drunk and Villa fans arguing with each other all second half.
Maybe these superfans can let some others attend
It's exactly why, having had a pretty impeccable booking history for a few years, we let our away booking history lapse a couple of years go. A significant part of our regular away support are utter bellends. I like a drink as much as the next bloke, but I dont want to spend most of the game worrying if the bloke behind me or next to me is going to spew, or if someone coked up to they eyeballs is going to take offence to nothing at all and want a fight with me, or drunkenly grab my wife's hair and use it as a lever to springboard themselves over us when we score. Just stopped being fun, sadly,
PS : If not obvious, all three of those things happened at away games within the last 3 years.
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Relegation battle starts here.
Nonsense. It’s a really bad day, clearly, it basically went as wrong as it possibly could. Emery has shown plenty already to demonstrate that isn’t the norm.
It was always going to be an incredibly hard, even if we played well. They rarely lose at home, so us having a really poor day led us to slaughter. The biggest issue is Mings, because the other issues from today are recoverable, but his isn’t.
I don't think they tonue being in my cheek is visible in text.
Fair enough - the bit beyond the first word stands!
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Whilst totally shocking may be it was coming. Players ended well last season and had a pretty good pre season so lot of complacency crept in. May be Unai also needs to think a little differently. All in all a terrible day.
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Cash destroyed by Gordon.
Watkins nowhere to be seen.
Defence all over the place.
Christ, it can only get better after today.
At least we still have time to bring in some more players.
That would be the Anthony Gordon that a 37 year old Ashley Young had firmly in his pocket last time
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That had disturbing undertones of Fulham away, the way the players gave up and folded.
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Bailey made Burn look like Maldini.
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Losing is one thing, but it’s the way we appeared to give up in the second half that’s the most worrying thing. Very moody away end too this afternoon. People stumbling around paralytic drunk and Villa fans arguing with each other all second half.
Maybe these superfans can let some others attend
It's exactly why, having had a pretty impeccable booking history for a few years, we let our away booking history lapse a couple of years go. A significant part of our regular away support are utter bellends. I like a drink as much as the next bloke, but I dont want to spend most of the game worrying if the bloke behind me or next to me is going to spew, or if someone coked up to they eyeballs is going to take offence to nothing at all and want a fight with me, or drunkenly grab my wife's hair and use it as a lever to springboard themselves over us when we score. Just stopped being fun, sadly,
PS : If not obvious, all three of those things happened at away games within the last 3 years.
That sounds absolutely shit, mate. I'm sorry to hear it.
On top of that you have those YouTuber/blogger types filming the whole fucking game. I hate them. At least they're not violent, I suppose.
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Over to you Monchi.
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Cash destroyed by Gordon.
Watkins nowhere to be seen.
Defence all over the place.
Christ, it can only get better after today.
At least we still have time to bring in some more players.
That would be the Anthony Gordon that a 37 year old Ashley Young had firmly in his pocket last time
Didn't he play central midfield that day?
Gordon hit a lovely cross for the first goal but I thought he was average apart from that (Cash was poor though generally).
Big issues were Isak and failing to get any control on their midfield so we need to learn from that.
Remember last time at VP we started Donk after months of inaction and he had a stormer so to me their are certain games where you need a physical midfield disruptor and Newcastle is certainly that type of game nowadays as we looked a small team v them today.
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Cash destroyed by Gordon.
Watkins nowhere to be seen.
Defence all over the place.
Christ, it can only get better after today.
At least we still have time to bring in some more players.
That would be the Anthony Gordon that a 37 year old Ashley Young had firmly in his pocket last time
Cash was awful last game of the season and I am trying to understand why the RB position hasn’t been a priority in this window, I hope after today it is because Cash is no where near good enough.
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That had disturbing undertones of Fulham away, the way the players gave up and folded.
I think big Emi might be dishing out a few bollockings. He was furious (and rightly so).
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Now my sarcasm meter has returned to normal... the most worrying thing from the day is Tyrone Mings' injury. I doubt we would have been so chaotic at the back in the last half hour if he had still been on the pitch. His organisational skills are possibly mire important to the team than his defensive abilities.
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I was unfortunate enough to be at the game, in with home fans. I never want to see Newcastle ever again.
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Always hated this fixture.
Lets move on.
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3-1, because their second and third shouldn't have stood but KSS have clearly bought the league.
I mean really, yes it's a reality check, yes they were better, but I feel like I'm being fucking gaslit here. Is nobody going to talk about how that offside wasn't given? Really? He was a whole leg offside! But you don't give decisions against the Crown Prince and you certainly don't talk about that.
Honestly, I hate it. The rich psycopaths who run everything else have now come for your hobbies, your loves, the things that give you meaning. And they've devoured them and left not a crumb.
Football is over. Fuck it, fuck everything.
I love this post. I’m not actually sure I agree it was the case today, but by God ain’t it the truth as a general comment on the world.
Bravo Monty, the best and most accurate post I have read. Puts into words all of my anger and frustration at the absolute state the world has got itself into and how spineless the institutions have been.
He should love the latest Paddy Power TV ad.
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Now my sarcasm meter has returned to normal... the most worrying thing from the day is Tyrone Mings' injury. I doubt we would have been so chaotic at the back in the last half hour if he had still been on the pitch. His organisational skills are possibly mire important to the team than his defensive abilities.
we were not too clever before his injury.
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Credit to Newcastle, they looked up for it from the word go, capitalised on our huge injury misfortunes and deserved the win. We all have to dig deep and stick together.
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It was all there
Elite manager
Top coaching team
Off the field setup looking good
Good players brought in to complement a good squad that got us 7th
Very good pre-season
But on the badge is says "Aston Villa", so we get the shit we got today. All of this has happened before, all of this will happen again.
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Credit to Newcastle, they looked up for it from the word go, capitalised on our huge injury misfortunes and deserved the win. We all have to dig deep and stick together.
Caveated with - they’re only where they are due to being owned by a state with a abhorrent human rights record and pretty much anyone employed by them should be embarrassed.
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Not surprised we lost there. We always do.
I am shocked at how badly it went, how wrong Emery got it and the lack of effort.
Hopefully an outlier come the end of the season.
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That had disturbing undertones of Fulham away, the way the players gave up and folded.
Different context though. Gerard was on his last legs and the players and in particular the influential
Ones (Mings, Luiz et al) seemed to down tools. Today was a car crash for all sorts of reasons, but its not the same as players losing faith with the management.
Saying that i dont know what it was, shambolic 2nd half.
Optimism burst.,
But you know what, if i was Everton id be shitting it.
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I'm struggling to think of a worse performance under Emery. So much was wrong.
Emery needs to take responsibility for that mess of a starting lineup and team shape. His faith in Leon Bailey, particularly away from home, is badly misplaced.
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All the villa stereotypes were out in force today.
An opening day mauling.
Hope turns to shit.
A major injury.
Wilson scoring.
Barnes scoring.
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Newcastle were hungrier than we were.
They wanted it more than we did.
And the ref let them have it more then he did us.
They were allowed to leave a foot in.
They were allowed to push us off balance.
They were allowed to pull us off balance.
As soon as we entered their safe space, they tripped themselves over & the ref blew the whistle before they hit the deck.
Thats not why we lost, but it contributed to why we lost so badly.
How that second was allowed for the block on Cash, I will never know.
What the actual fuck is VAR useful for?
As for our players, they were all shit, except for a few bright spots from Diaby & Pau Torres.
My only hope about our defence parting like the red sea every time they attacked us is that Konsa & Torres haven't played much together, if at all & once they do, they will become stronger as a unit.
When Mings & Konsa first started playing together in Emerys system, they also conceded quite a few for a short while.
But as soon as they got used to it all, our defence became very tight.
So hopefully, Torres & Konsa/Carlos will be the same...
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That had disturbing undertones of Fulham away, the way the players gave up and folded.
Different context though. Gerard was on his last legs and the players and in particular the influential
Ones (Mings, Luiz et al) seemed to down tools. Today was a car crash for all sorts of reasons, but its not the same as players losing faith with the management.
Saying that i dont know what it was, shambolic 2nd half.
Optimism burst.,
But you know what, if i was Everton id be shitting it.
I was thinking that. It wouldn’t surprise me if we hit them for six.
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Credit to Newcastle, they looked up for it from the word go, capitalised on our huge injury misfortunes and deserved the win. We all have to dig deep and stick together.
Yes they definitely did. Psychologically, the injury to Mings won't have helped either.
In many ways, they did to us what we did to them in April
We were ok in the first half, and I never saw the capitulation of the 2nd half coming.
It became very ragged and I did something I would very rarely do and left early.
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I’m going early with positivity - we’ll be above them within 3 games.
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Honestly, I hate it. The rich psycopaths who run everything else have now come for your hobbies, your loves, the things that give you meaning. And they've devoured them and left not a crumb.
Football is over. Fuck it, fuck everything.
Just this.
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On R5 today the reporter said that Everton basically battered Fulham, but couldn't score, Fulham's keeper basically kept them in it. Everton had a goal bizarrely disallowed as well, I'm not so confident.
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When does the season start? I'm really looking forward to it.
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On R5 today the reporter said that Everton basically battered Fulham, but couldn't score, Fulham's keeper basically kept them in it. Everton had a goal bizarrely disallowed as well, I'm not so confident.
I’m going with the view that given an extended sample size that performance was a massive anomaly. I believe in Emery’s ability to work it out and turn it round quick. I am worried about the Mings injury clearly, we’ll have to bring someone in to address that. But I believe we’ll look hugely different against Everton. Also today was horrible, but three of the goals we basically handed to them and we actually created several good chances to score. We redress that balance and we can run through Everton.
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On R5 today the reporter said that Everton basically battered Fulham, but couldn't score, Fulham's keeper basically kept them in it. Everton had a goal bizarrely disallowed as well, I'm not so confident.
Our record v them since we came up is won 6 and two draws.
They'll sit back and we'll have endless possession so we should create plenty although no Mings at other end is a bit concerning as they'll be hitting in endless crosses.
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String the match thread author up!
He's fortunate he lives in Canada, there's a mob gathering with pitchforks.
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On R5 today the reporter said that Everton basically battered Fulham, but couldn't score, Fulham's keeper basically kept them in it. Everton had a goal bizarrely disallowed as well, I'm not so confident.
I think they've actually signed a striker too, just too late to play today.
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It’s one game. An absolutely shit game and utterly shit 3 days. But it’s one game. And we will be better. Much better. Newcastle is arguably the hardest place to go and we were completely trounced. So sugar coating it. But it’s one game. Let’s keep perspective.
This for me, I'm more concerned about the injury to Tyrone than the loss of the game.
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Q: When did we kick off today?
A: Every 15 minutes
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The injuries this week have to have had an impact on the performance. Nevertheless I think the high line is going to be targeted by opposition this season and Newcastle exploited its frailties perfectly.
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Since Emery arrived, Mings has been the foundation on which we have been built. Without that foundation, we collapsed. Plan B defensively, has not had sufficient time to gell, as yet.
Like Emery, I still think we have a better squad (when fit) than Newcastle and he decided to go for the jugular today. I don't blame him, with 4 wins out of the last 88 at Newcastle a new approach was required. It backfired.
A lot of work to do defensively but we still have the tools in the bag to have a very good season.
Hopefully, this is our Stevenage moment for the 2023 -2024 season.
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It was all there
Elite manager
Top coaching team
Off the field setup looking good
Good players brought in to complement a good squad that got us 7th
Very good pre-season
But on the badge is says "Aston Villa", so we get the shit we got today. All of this has happened before, all of this will happen again.
It is all still there. We didn’t suddenly become absolutely shit because of one game.
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Calm needed.
1 terrible performance doesn’t undo all the good things happening at our club. It happens. Nothing we knew before the game has changed - a football season is not defined by the first 90 mins. Last season we lost 4 of the first 5 and still finished 7th. Just about everything that could have gone wrong did today - capped off by the awful injury to Ty.
Emery will get it working and the time to reflect and draw any conclusions is normally 10 games in.
Let’s get behind the boys - UTV
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Match stats are interesting - basically even, except shots on target.
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Calm needed.
1 terrible performance doesn’t undo all the good things happening at our club. It happens. Nothing we knew before the game has changed - a football season is not defined by the first 90 mins. Last season we lost 4 of the first 5 and still finished 7th. Just about everything that could have gone wrong did today - capped off by the awful injury to Ty.
Emery will get it working and the time to reflect and draw any conclusions is normally 10 games in.
Let’s get behind the boys - UTV
Agree, even Liverpool whne they were champions had worse results than this. One of them was actually 7-2.
Please bounce back Villa it might be sad and pathetic but it does get me down when they have results like today.
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Didn’t think we were that bad for 70mins.
3 at the back didn’t work.
Did Carlos have a kick? Losing Mings and him being being one of the options to replace him is a major worry.
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Out fought and outplayed for the majority of the game, I know losing Tyrone is a huge loss but we fell apart in the second half.
Newcastle deserved the three points and the way they doubled up on our players out wide with the ball meant we couldn't feed Watkins as much as I wished.
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Out fought and outplayed for the majority of the game, I know losing Tyrone is a huge loss but we fell apart in the second half.
Newcastle deserved the three points and the way they doubled up on our players out wide with the ball meant we couldn't feed Watkins as much as I wished.
No, we weren't outplayed. We were out fought, which is standard playing these cloggers. They are the modern day Moyes's Everton. They took their chances and we didn't, and 5-1 flattered them massively.
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Dreadful result and performance (some of them actually stopped running !! - Kamara !!), but even worse is the loss of Mings . The defence is in tatters without him.
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We didn’t lose we got battered it was shocking really if it happened to some other team we would all on here ripping the piss it was that bad
Premier league is different gravy and Pau Torres knows all about it now, I can guarantee he sat in the changing room after the game and thought bloody hell now I know what they are talking about, he will never have played in anything quite like that,
He is a good player, and I believe he will learn and adapt in time
The amount of times Newcastle got through the back line was unbelievable 5 goals flattered us, it’s the biggest problem we have at the moment with Mings being out as well
Has all the hallmarks of last season’s first game with the level of disappointment, punctured balloon it was more like the Hindenburg going down
But we are in a better place and in better hands
Today is a bitter blow and I’m not pretending otherwise or making excuses
I think Uni I looked shellshocked at the end as well
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Dreadful result and performance (some of them actually stopped running !! - Kamara !!), but even worse is the loss of Mings . The defence is in tatters without him.
Edit! Quote fail.
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Let's chill out, we got done today but first game integrating new players and we lost our leader. I'm sure toon were fuming when we battered them last season.
I'm sure we'll respond to this well
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At half time, I thought we were the better team, had created the better chances & played the better football. Newcastle had done very little to warrant being ahead.
But the 3rd goal was the killer & some seemed to stop playing. Quite why we kept trying to play a high line when 4-1 down was beyond ridiculous. At that point we should look at damage limitation.
But Ming's is a huge loss, from a leadership, strength & organisational point of view. That will have a huge impact going forward.
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But Ming's is a huge loss, from a leadership, strength & organisational point of view. That will have a huge impact going forward.
yep huge blow
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Let's chill out, we got done today but first game integrating new players and we lost our leader. I'm sure toon were fuming when we battered them last season.
I'm sure we'll respond to this well
No I’m not chilling out
I’m gona moan like mad and be depressed for a bit
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Pfhhh. Load of old waz. Put it away and start again.
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Let's chill out, we got done today but first game integrating new players and we lost our leader. I'm sure toon were fuming when we battered them last season.
I'm sure we'll respond to this well
We started the game with one new player!
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Let's chill out, we got done today but first game integrating new players and we lost our leader. I'm sure toon were fuming when we battered them last season.
I'm sure we'll respond to this well
I agree with the sentiment, it’s just one game, but we were only integrating one new player from the start, and he scored.
We looked like an absolute clusterfuck out there.
I am sure we will sort it out, and we now have more transfer work to do, but there’s no escaping the fact that was utterly terrible.
We absolutely went to pieces, shat the bed.
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Well that was fucking dreadful.
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For what’s it’s worth:
Martinez 9 - thought he was outstanding, the silly foul apart. Had Olsen played that game we could have been talking about double figures.
Cash 2 - really dreadful today
Digne 5
Mings 10 - his absence was poignant
Konsa 3 - a nightmare performance
McGinn 3 - strange off day
Kamara 5.5 - weird performance, thought he was rubbish in the first half, but the only decent player for 30 minutes in the second half, some good surging runs l.l then gave up.
Bailey 3 - ineffectual, but underrate Burn atyour own peril. He’s an excellent player
Diaby 6 - magnificent in patches first half - faded in the second, but we should be excited by him.
Watkins 3 - largely hopeless
Doug 4 - he’s had better days
Torres 3.5 A majestic first touch, after that, a defensive nightmare. He’ll come good.
Tielemans 2 - dreadful. Not convinced it was ever a good signing, was awful last season.
Philogene 6
Carlos 4 - got ripped apart.
Coutinho 7 - get him in!
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We need to stay calm and not overreact. We also need to call Mr Allardyce and get him in if we lose to Everton.
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startled deer in the headlights . Totally embarrassing and unacceptable. Feel sorry for the fans who paid and spent all day going to that shite
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We’ll beat Everton.
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Eessh, that was dreadful. Start the relegation watch thread.
We looked mentally asleep to start the game and mentally checked out after Mings went down. Still, we had glimpses of brilliant football, which should at least be a little bit encouraging. I thought Watkins and Cash missed tap-ins and Luiz missed a free header. had one or two of those gone in, I'm wondering if we would be looking at a different outcome.
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Unai out.
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Plan B defensively, has not had sufficient time to gel, as yet.
BINGO! HOUSE!
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Unai out.
XXX
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I wouldn't describe WatkIns' chance as a tap-in, but it was the kind of opportunity put away, or at very least works the goalkeeper, by strikers playing for teams that win stuff.
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Eessh, that was dreadful. Start the relegation watch thread.
We looked mentally asleep to start the game and mentally checked out after Mings went down. Still, we had glimpses of brilliant football, which should at least be a little bit encouraging. I thought Watkins and Cash missed tap-ins and Luiz missed a free header. had one or two of those gone in, I'm wondering if we would be looking at a different outcome.
And I think you touch on the point there. I think both sides were ropey defensively in the first 60 mins. They just took their chances much better. After the third we really fell apart. Doesn’t change the fact we were rubbish and need to massively improve, but a bit more composure and we’re in that game.
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I wouldn't describe WatkIns' chance as a tap-in, but it was the kind of opportunity put away, or at very least works the goalkeeper, by strikers playing for teams that win stuff.
The trouble is he's a bit of a one trick pony. Likes to run down the channels, then slow up, cut inside the defender and then get his shot off. The trouble is his shots are just too inconsistent and drift harmlessly wide more often than they trouble the goalkeeper.
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Today was probably the game when my patience with Leon Bailey ran out.
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Out fought and outplayed for the majority of the game, I know losing Tyrone is a huge loss but we fell apart in the second half.
Newcastle deserved the three points and the way they doubled up on our players out wide with the ball meant we couldn't feed Watkins as much as I wished.
No, we weren't outplayed. We were out fought, which is standard playing these cloggers. They are the modern day Moyes's Everton. They took their chances and we didn't, and 5-1 flattered them massively.
It didn't. They were vastly superior all over the pitch on the day.
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Watkins had a higher shot accuracy percentage last season than Kane, Haaland, Salah, Toney, Wilson.
Although on the flip side, he had one of the lowest coversion rates of the top scorers last season.
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Today was probably the game when my patience with Leon Bailey ran out.
amen to that bru
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Newcastle were hungrier than we were.
They wanted it more than we did.
And the ref let them have it more then he did us.
They were allowed to leave a foot in.
They were allowed to push us off balance.
They were allowed to pull us off balance.
As soon as we entered their safe space, they tripped themselves over & the ref blew the whistle before they hit the deck.
Thats not why we lost, but it contributed to why we lost so badly.
How that second was allowed for the block on Cash, I will never know.
What the actual fuck is VAR useful for?
As for our players, they were all shit, except for a few bright spots from Diaby & Pau Torres.
My only hope about our defence parting like the red sea every time they attacked us is that Konsa & Torres haven't played much together, if at all & once they do, they will become stronger as a unit.
When Mings & Konsa first started playing together in Emerys system, they also conceded quite a few for a short while.
But as soon as they got used to it all, our defence became very tight.
So hopefully, Torres & Konsa/Carlos will be the same...
In a game we have lost 5-1, to blame the officials to that extent is just plain daft
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The Mings injury is the real blow. The result and performance were both really poor, particularly the last 20/30 mins, but it could have been put behind us. But Mings, and Emi to a lesser extent, now leave us with two massive gaps to fill. Unai has a lot of work to do, but I could absolutely see us winning the next two league games and then it starts to look a lot better.
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Bailey, Jesus, how bad was he.
Lethargic, unbothered, constantly giving the ball away and he’s the slowest “fast player” I’ve ever seen.
Offers nothing but somehow persists.
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As Brilliant as Emery has been since he got here, he undeniably got the selection wrong today. That being said, he cannot take sole blame as way too many players just weren't at it today which is all the more surprising considering what a strong pre season we had.
Needs a big response next week.
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I don’t know what’s happened to Bailey’s pace, his first couple of games he looked lightening. Maybe his injuries have done for him.
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Emery's post match interview says the doctors first impression of Mings injury was that it was "something important". He said hopefully not but they'll know more tomorrow. I'd imagine the medical team know enough to know a bad injury when they see one.
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startled deer in the headlights . Totally embarrassing and unacceptable. Feel sorry for the fans who paid and spent all day going to that shite
Football fans buy tickets knowing full well we will either have a great day, a shit day or a pretty average day… and if we have a great day we mock those who’ve had a shit day. So no-one should ever feel sorry for us, least of all ourselves. Just be happy at being born a Villa fan, how lucky is that.
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I bet it’s his ACL.
What rotten luck.
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Bailey, Jesus, how bad was he.
Lethargic, unbothered, constantly giving the ball away and he’s the slowest “fast player” I’ve ever seen.
Offers nothing but somehow persists.
Every outfield player had passing stats in the 70, 80 or 90 percent brackets today. Apart from Bailey, who manged the grand sum of 36%. You can't have a player losing the ball two thirds of the times he passes it.
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The ball straight to Isak stood out.
He also combines being shit with looking like he doesn’t care too much.
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Bailey, Jesus, how bad was he.
Lethargic, unbothered, constantly giving the ball away and he’s the slowest “fast player” I’ve ever seen.
Offers nothing but somehow persists.
Every outfield player had passing stats in the 70, 80 or 90 percent brackets today. Apart from Bailey, who manged the grand sum of 36%. You can't have a player losing the ball two thirds of the times he passes it.
I've had enough of Bailey now. I've been a lot more forgiving than a lot of supporters towards him but today was the straw that broke the camels back. Unai has to take a lot of the blame for picking him
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Watkins had a higher shot accuracy percentage last season than Kane, Haaland, Salah, Toney, Wilson.
Although on the flip side, he had one of the lowest coversion rates of the top scorers last season.
Well, quite. It's not difficult to hit it at the big fucker in neon green running toward you.
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The ball straight to Isak stood out.
He also combines being shit with looking like he doesn’t care too much.
cracking pass that was if you were a Newcastle playmaker. Get rid of him and fast
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Cash isn't good enough. Digne's not much better. And Watkins - clearly a confidence player - ought to do more to build his own confidence (and that of those around him).
We're going to massively miss Tyrone Mings. The rest of them were pathetic without him.
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Today was probably the game when my patience with Leon Bailey ran out.
Ditto. He’s played under 3 managers now, and flattered to deceive for all of them.
Totally half-arsed today, and should not be earning a starting berth over anyone else in that squad from here on in. Coutinho or Bidace for me.
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Cash isn't good enough. Digne's not much better. And Watkins - clearly a confidence player - ought to do more to build his own confidence (and that of those around him).
We're going to massively miss Tyrone Mings. The rest of them were pathetic without him.
Cash is good enough
Watkins needs help.
Shut first day. We won’t be any worse than that all season again.
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startled deer in the headlights . Totally embarrassing and unacceptable. Feel sorry for the fans who paid and spent all day going to that shite
Football fans buy tickets knowing full well we will either have a great day, a shit day or a pretty average day… and if we have a great day we mock those who’ve had a shit day. So no-one should ever feel sorry for us, least of all ourselves. Just be happy at being born a Villa fan, how lucky is that.
i get that , i go to a fair few aways myself. But that was unacceptable. Players giving up etc. I'd be furious if i went .
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Cash is the absolute dictionary definition of average, at best. He spent plenty of time with 120 year old Ashley Young in his place last season.
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Watkins did ok today, that chance apart. His problem was the midfield were just off it and not providing enough support.
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Watkins did ok today, that chance apart. His problem was the midfield were just off it and not providing enough support.
"That chance apart" is what he gets paid for.
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Cash is the absolute dictionary definition of average, at best. He spent plenty of time with 120 year old Ashley Young in his place last season.
Cash had a ridiculously bad game, made Gordon look like Ronaldo and then Barnes look like Messi .
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It’s one game. An absolutely shit game and utterly shit 3 days. But it’s one game. And we will be better. Much better. Newcastle is arguably the hardest place to go and we were completely trounced. So sugar coating it. But it’s one game. Let’s keep perspective.
This. It was shit, but this.
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Watkins did ok today, that chance apart. His problem was the midfield were just off it and not providing enough support.
"That chance apart" is what he gets paid for.
That's the problem with Watkins in a nutshell.
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Watkins did ok today, that chance apart. His problem was the midfield were just off it and not providing enough support.
"That chance apart" is what he gets paid for.
That's the problem with Watkins in a nutshell.
would you cash in now ?
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I bet we absolutely funeral Everton next week, mind.
Funeral them, then bring them back to life, then funeral them again all over.
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We won’t be any worse than that all season again.
Why am I not convinced?
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Watkins did ok today, that chance apart. His problem was the midfield were just off it and not providing enough support.
"That chance apart" is what he gets paid for.
That's the problem with Watkins in a nutshell.
would you cash in now ?
No, because then we'd have no strikers other than 12 year old Jhon Duran and a totally unproven Sir Cameron Archer.
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Watkins did ok today, that chance apart. His problem was the midfield were just off it and not providing enough support.
"That chance apart" is what he gets paid for.
That's the problem with Watkins in a nutshell.
would you cash in now ?
I would. And it's not just a reaction to today.
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Watkins had a higher shot accuracy percentage last season than Kane, Haaland, Salah, Toney, Wilson.
Although on the flip side, he had one of the lowest coversion rates of the top scorers last season.
I've a theory to explain those stats, based on nothing more than my own musings. The other 5 tend not to aim at the middle of the goal, which gives them simultaneously higher chances of both scoring and missing.
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I would. And it's not just a reaction to today.
I honestly don't think we can. In Carlos and Torres we've got a central defensive partnership with just over three Premier League games between them, combined. Unless we bring in some unexpectedly good, experienced Premier League strikers, the spine of our team would be way too inexpereinced if we sold Watkins. Much as he blows hot and cold, we need to be at least keeping him around, not replacing him. And I do mostly agree with your opinion on him.
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Yes, I agree, with Watkins in that hypothetical situation, it's hard to see how, even if you could make an argument based on his ability or not, anyone could mount a convincing case to sell him 2 weeks before the end of the window, with no other feasible strikers in the squad.
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I reckon Zaniolo will be in the squad next weekend.
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Cash isn't good enough, Watkins isn't a centre forward and if we play like that second half too often we won't get off the bottom of the league. Konsa had nightmare but I thought Digne did okay. At least he seemed to care.
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where was McGinn today ?
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Kamara worried me more than I was expecting (even though I know he made mistakes last season). There was one point where he went out and checked Gordon, lost his boot and it was so completely pointless, as in piss poor decision making. It made no sense and then he went on to be pretty poor for the rest of the game. He didn't look very composed at all today.
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Probably the most calamitous start to a season I can remember and when you think about the last 2 years that’s saying something.
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The Donk might find a way back into favour. We were weak enough as a team even with Mings in it. Without Mings teams will look to crucify us at set piece time. Starting with Dycheball.
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Watkins did ok today, that chance apart. His problem was the midfield were just off it and not providing enough support.
"That chance apart" is what he gets paid for.
That's the problem with Watkins in a nutshell.
would you cash in now ?
No, because then we'd have no strikers other than 12 year old Jhon Duran and a totally unproven Sir Cameron Archer.
Of which one is currently injured and the other has an uncertain future according to reports.
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Kamara worried me more than I was expecting (even though I know he made mistakes last season). There was one point where he went out and checked Gordon, lost his boot and it was so completely pointless, as in piss poor decision making. It made no sense and then he went on to be pretty poor for the rest of the game. He didn't look very composed at all today.
He's a great young prospect, but he doesn't do "having a stinker" by half.
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where was McGinn today ?
I realise the question was facetious, but stuck out on the left to make room for Bailey for some reason, even though defensively, he was needed on the right.
From a Captains POV, well we all know it was still Mings all of last season even if the armband was not on there.
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I thought one big difference was that they, who let's be honest don't play the most cultured type of football, at least looked absolutely full of energy.
Kamara, McGinn, Luiz, all looked really tired and flat. On the first day of the season. And as for Bailey, fucking hell, I know he came back from international competition late so hasn't had a break, but he looked like he'd dropped a load of pills before kick off.
I wonder if we've started to believe our own publicity a bit too much, and whether this will actually serve as the kick up the arse it needs to be.
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pretty bad when your uninjured captain is subbed off
Tactically today was a fucking train crash
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pretty bad when your uninjured captain is subbed off
Tactically today was a fucking train crash
For a defender when you're already losing 3-1
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We seemed to play with so much pace, spirit and invention in pre-season. And today, it had all disappeared.
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pretty bad when your uninjured captain is subbed off
Tactically today was a fucking train crash
For a defender when you're already losing 3-1
Damage limitation?
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pretty bad when your uninjured captain is subbed off
Tactically today was a fucking train crash
For a defender when you're already losing 3-1
Damage limitation?
I dunno. A loss is 0 points regardless of how many goals we ship. And also it didn't work.
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pretty bad when your uninjured captain is subbed off
Tactically today was a fucking train crash
For a defender when you're already losing 3-1
Damage limitation?
I dunno. A loss is 0 points regardless of how many goals we ship. And also it didn't work.
Agreed. Shows how much faith he has in his attacking options.
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-4 GD after one game.
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-4 GD after one game.
Don't look at the Table whatever you do
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It’s our worst defeat in the first game of the season since football was reinvented in 1992.
If this was under Gerrard as it was this time last year we would be crucifying him.
We need to go and sign a central defensive leader on Monday. What is Gary Cahill up to these days?
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Gerard was a fucking charlatan though. Emery has proven himself to be anything but. It’s why he has loads of credit in the bank and deservedly so.
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What a complete and utter nightmare of a game. The result is bad enough but Mings gone to another ACL injury too? If that happens to you on Championship Manager you absolutely have to turn the game off without saving. I feel sick.
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It’s our worst defeat in the first game of the season since football was reinvented in 1992.
If this was under Gerrard as it was this time last year we would be crucifying him.
We need to go and sign a central defensive leader on Monday. What is Gary Cahill up to these days?
Yeah but Gerrard had no credit in the bank. Emery has fucking tons of it. What nonsense.
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Gerrard was a charlatan who should never have been appointed in the first place. Emery is a proven, successful manager.
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It’s our worst defeat in the first game of the season since football was reinvented in 1992.
If this was under Gerrard as it was this time last year we would be crucifying him.
We need to go and sign a central defensive leader on Monday. What is Gary Cahill up to these days?
i know, Harry Slabhead
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It’s our worst defeat in the first game of the season since football was reinvented in 1992.
If this was under Gerrard as it was this time last year we would be crucifying him.
We need to go and sign a central defensive leader on Monday. What is Gary Cahill up to these days?
Yeah but Gerrard had no credit in the bank. Emery has fucking tons of it. What nonsense.
It came out wrong. I’m very sorry. But today was so bad.
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Maguire I would take if it was still an option.
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Maguire I would take if it was still an option.
No thanks.
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Maguire I would take if it was still an option.
No need. Chill
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I can think of positives.
- Diaby
- One game closer to never seeing this kit again
- Window still open and we'll almost certainly be bringing more in
- Early wake up call
- Tough fixture out of the way
- Diego/Pau definitely going to get a run now
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Maguire I would take if it was still an option.
I was about to say (re the other post) no worries, I gets you, but THEN THIS?
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Maguire I would take if it was still an option.
didn't he go west Ham ? sorry been busy few days
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Another thing I found myself thinking, Isak is a much, much better player than Watkins, technically miles better, different level.
Their second choice striker Wilson is also very decent, much better than our 'options' which are a couple of inexperienced kids.
I get the entire "yeah but who would we get if we wanted to improve on Watkins" idea, but Newcastle spent 65m on Isak. They're our peers, they are the people we need to be competing with, maybe we need to go out and be bold and do the same?
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He didn't do much after he came on, but did anyone notice that 'pass' by Tielemans, when he basically just hammered the ball knee high at one of our players, possibly Watkins, possibly Diaby, who was no more than about 15 yards from him? Or was it something I imagined?
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After a quick scan, it may well be our heaviest ever opening day defeat. We conceded 5 at Bolton in 51/52, but we scored 2.
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Maguire I would take if it was still an option.
didn't he go west Ham ? sorry been busy few days
ManU won't let it go through until they've decided on a replacement for him, apparently.
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Another thing I found myself thinking, Isak is a much, much better player than Watkins, technically miles better, different level.
Their second choice striker Wilson is also very decent, much better than our 'options' which are a couple of inexperienced kids.
I get the entire "yeah but who would we get if we wanted to improve on Watkins" idea, but Newcastle spent 65m on Isak. They're our peers, they are the people we need to be competing with, maybe we need to go out and be bold and do the same?
This is our 5th year back, and in that time in terms of strikers we've bought Wesley, who got injured and who the jury was out on anyway, Samatta who was a crap emergency replacement, Ings, who was the wrong player at the wrong time and lasted just over a year, Watkins and a hugely expensive kid in Duran. For most of that time then we've relied on one striker, and had to hope that nothing bad happens to them. The one I don't get is Duran. Wouldn't we have been better putting that £18m to a more proven, expensive player?
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I thought we were second best from the start to the finish although the scoreless flattered them a tad.
They were simply more aggressive in pressing and winning the ball back, they simply did to us what did to them at VP,mand we had no answers, which is worrying
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Based on a hunch I think we would’ve signed Abraham. But of course he did his ACL.
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Maguire I would take if it was still an option.
I was about to say (re the other post) no worries, I gets you, but THEN THIS?
One bad defeat and usually regular, solid, rational thinkers lose their damn mind.
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Lightning slow Maguire and our high line? Hmmm…
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It’s our worst defeat in the first game of the season since football was reinvented in 1992.
If this was under Gerrard as it was this time last year we would be crucifying him.
We need to go and sign a central defensive leader on Monday. What is Gary Cahill up to these days?
Yeah but Gerrard had no credit in the bank. Emery has fucking tons of it. What nonsense.
Yes he has got credit in the bank. Doesn't mean he gets a free pass when gets it wrong, and he fucked up that game today from start to finish.
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Quote fail...
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Thought some of the pre match optimism on this site a little over the top. Our failure to make a telling tackle or get a foot in during the first 10 minutes reeked of complacency.
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I woner what a player like Diaby is feeling tonight? "I turned down a million quid a week for this?!?!?!?!11111"
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It’s our worst defeat in the first game of the season since football was reinvented in 1992.
If this was under Gerrard as it was this time last year we would be crucifying him.
We need to go and sign a central defensive leader on Monday. What is Gary Cahill up to these days?
Yeah but Gerrard had no credit in the bank. Emery has fucking tons of it. What nonsense.
Yes he has got credit in the bank. Doesn't mean he gets a free pass when gets it wrong, and he fucked up that game today from start to finish.
Who’s giving him a free pass? But comparing this to anything that Lego headed con man did is ridiculous. He shouldn’t ever be used in the same library, let alone same book or same sentence.
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Yes, for all the various misfortunes and indeed calamities that came along at fairly regular intervals, the cast was pretty much set by those opening minutes.
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I woner what a player like Diaby is feeling tonight? "I turned down a million quid a week for this?!?!?!?!11111"
Nah, I think that's going a bit too far.
It was a shit result, a poor performance, Diaby scored, which is nice, but we suffered a second hideous injury in three days, and struggled.
I'd much rather not lose on the first day of the season, especially against Saudi Arabia, and it was a disturbing day in general, but we'll absolutely fucking funeral Everton and be back on course.
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I think the Buendia injury changed things late for us and then the psychological impact of Tyrone getting stretchered off. It was always going to be hard but what looks to be ACL injuries to two starting players in two days is a hell of a blow. Monchi will likely have to go and find another defender now, and the incoming loan player has done his ACL twice before now, I’ve just discovered. Weeeyyyyy
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We’ve already been through the dodgy offside goals but I can’t see that anyone has brought up the dead set penalty. Luiz had his leg taken away while he was in control of the ball. Nothing.
But I think the big issue was missing Buendia. We looked flat without his buzzing and nark. It looks like he was more important than we gave him credit for.
And poor Tyrone. A second major knee injury.
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Another thing I found myself thinking, Isak is a much, much better player than Watkins, technically miles better, different level.
Their second choice striker Wilson is also very decent, much better than our 'options' which are a couple of inexperienced kids.
I get the entire "yeah but who would we get if we wanted to improve on Watkins" idea, but Newcastle spent 65m on Isak. They're our peers, they are the people we need to be competing with, maybe we need to go out and be bold and do the same?
Well Wilson was an option in summer 2020 of course. People didn't want him then as he was constantly injured but excellent scoring record at Newcastle, infact it's pretty much largely mirrored his output at Bournemouth and he'll be a very good player to bring on for last 20 minutes as their season goes on.
Across Newcastle's forward line they have him, Isak and Almiron which was about 40 prem goals last season. Addition of Barnes takes that to over 50 given he hit double figures for Leicester so that's why they'll be in contention for top 4 again.
For a team actually in europe our forward options are pretty naff when you look at it:
Ollie- Frustrating today but hit double figures in all his prem seasons so remains our best CF starter as it stands.
Diaby- Excellent debut and looks that next level forward player we've demanded last three years as he can drop in and link up with midfield no problem
Big drop off after those two though...
Coutinho....Basically impact sub now. Won't stay fit if starting 2-3 games.
Bailey- Rubbish first half and generally very poor in away games in his two seasons.
Buendia- N/A
Archer- Probably leaving.
Duran- Very raw, should be loaned out and missed all of pre season injured anyway.
It's not exactly an attack to have an assault on four competitions is it?
Last season West Ham had Antonio, Bowen, Benrahama and then added Ings mid season and that was widely considered not good enough but just about got them over the line in europe so we are well short imo.
If we can sign a decent RW then I think that gives us flexibility to go something like Ramsey-Diaby-RW in certain games.
I presume Zaniolo will be more of a Buendia replacement based on his profile.
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Wilson had the chance to join us or Newcastle, and chose Newcastle.
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Imagine Wilson and our injury record? We'd be burying the poor fecker within 6 months.
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When I looked at starting line up it was obvious to me it was light defensively.
Add Bailey and we are effectively playing with 10 men. Or worse with him nine.
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Wilson had the chance to join us or Newcastle, and chose Newcastle.
Of course but at the time people were saying he had endless injuries at Bournemouth (he's played 75 prem games in three seasons up there) and also why bother signing him when he'd just be an expensive back up to Ollie rather than options to rotate.
Just because Ings didn't work out dosen't mean we should abort attempt to get another decent forward in the squad although I suspect it will be more of a right sided player e.g. Brennan Johnson.
If the plan is just to expect Ollie to start 60 games this season he'll be joining walking wounded FC soon enough.
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But it’s only one game.
I sure hope Emery never never never plays Bailey again.
He is never never never gonna become consistently good enough at this level
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Thought some of the pre match optimism on this site a little over the top. Our failure to make a telling tackle or get a foot in during the first 10 minutes reeked of complacency.
I was out with Chico Hamilton III last night and said I had a bad feeling about today. I think there has been an assumption we’d just pick up our form from the end of last season which wasn’t exactly the case today.
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Take a chill pill guys.
A bad, yes a very bad day at the office.
But the season is still young.
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Saw the result then decided to watch the recording, have to say I saw a different game to most. Yes the result was a disappointment but we still played some nice football, when Mings was down injured Watkins missed a golden chance to put us level, when Barnes was adjudged to be onside why didn't we see the line drawn on the screen, to me and the commentator he looked a mile off. Konsa was at fault for their third which virtually finished the game. I thought Torres did okay and Diaby, well, can we buy two more like him please.
Apart from Bailey who should be sold as quickly as possible we still have a decent squad, it isn't all gloom and doom.
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Just home. I thought days like today were a thing of the past, I was wrong.
Get well soon Tyrone and get better soon the rest of the fcukers.
Good night.
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We never do well in their turn up the PA to create an atmosphere, dump.
Even when Bruce was in charge, we couldn't win.
An awful start to the season. Am not impressed with so many of our players.
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I don’t comment often but I’ve noticed that most initial reactions are rash…two days later this thread will be more reasonable….
We were well beaten by a better team……
Some of the crap I’ve seen is delusional…🤷🏼♂️
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Saw the result then decided to watch the recording, have to say I saw a different game to most. Yes the result was a disappointment but we still played some nice football, when Mings was down injured Watkins missed a golden chance to put us level, when Barnes was adjudged to be onside why didn't we see the line drawn on the screen, to me and the commentator he looked a mile off. Konsa was at fault for their third which virtually finished the game. I thought Torres did okay and Diaby, well, can we buy two more like him please.
Apart from Bailey who should be sold as quickly as possible we still have a decent squad, it isn't all gloom and doom.
Fair play…first sensible response I’ve seen…..
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Saw the result then decided to watch the recording, have to say I saw a different game to most. Yes the result was a disappointment but we still played some nice football, when Mings was down injured Watkins missed a golden chance to put us level, when Barnes was adjudged to be onside why didn't we see the line drawn on the screen, to me and the commentator he looked a mile off. Konsa was at fault for their third which virtually finished the game. I thought Torres did okay and Diaby, well, can we buy two more like him please.
Apart from Bailey who should be sold as quickly as possible we still have a decent squad, it isn't all gloom and doom.
Fair play…first sensible response I’ve seen…..
I have generally avoided posting on the match and post-match threads today, but there have been plenty of sensible responses.
I don't think we played well at all, and I don't think 5-1 flattered Newcastle.
I won't pretend I like their ownership or fanbase (I really, really don't) and I don't think their squad is all that good, but they were better than us in every department yesterday.
Balls to excuses; they played well and we didn't. But you're bang on that it's just one game. I have faith in Emery and the players of ours who aren't currently in hospital.
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Missed the live game celebrating my daughters birthday. Just rewatching the recording game and that was piss poor.
Reasons for such a bad result in my view:
Our great momentum and pattern of play hacked through by the injury to Buendia who was outstanding in preseason.
Looked like complacency after beating the likes of Lazio and Valencia from kick off and were 1-0 down before blinking.
Losing stalwart and talisman Mings whose vocality and presence cannot be under estimated.
Official of course was giving them everything.
Emery over coached Bailey and over faith’s in his ability and he fucked him over.
McGinn wasn’t happy where he was playing out left which contributed to our downfall in this match.
Rolls Royce Kamara - did not recognise the player - injured or not at the races.
Cash - piss poor performance.
Emery too slow to hook Bailey and set the team up wrong.
Doug should have had a penalty.
Watkins needs 3 chances to score and this just won’t do if we’re trying to go up a lavel but his backups of Dhuran, Archer and we look too light weight.
No Ramsey, Moreno, Mings, Buendia - they’d have made a difference here.
Bar codes still smarting from that pasting we handed out and wanted revenge so we’re at it from the off - we should have been ready.
Psychologically they all packed up at 3-1 and we could have lost 7 or 8 due to their spineless play by then, we needed some nasty bastard subs to physically hold them off with the game lost and if you want to come as far as our area then it’ll cost you a kneecap.
Sometimes (with supporting villa now 37 years) things happen here for a reason. The Fulham play off defeat, whilst bitter and angry at the time would have been bad for the club with the 2 idiots in charge for a Prem assault.
Gutted to lose my hero Mings but my view here is that the Mings-Konsa partnership needs upgrading to Torres-Carlos at some point and this rotten luck may have brought that forward.
You can really trust some Villa fans to go over the top in their reactions to a calamitous unexpected defeat, fortunately the next match isn’t too far away and Emery (my main man) is awake right now like me at 4am but pondering to put us back on track. I have trust in the guy.
I’d expect Bailey to start the next match if Smith or Gerrard were in charge. Not so with UE.
Let’s get behind the boys with a full house to roar the lads to victory over the toffees,
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Saw the result then decided to watch the recording, have to say I saw a different game to most. Yes the result was a disappointment but we still played some nice football, when Mings was down injured Watkins missed a golden chance to put us level, when Barnes was adjudged to be onside why didn't we see the line drawn on the screen, to me and the commentator he looked a mile off. Konsa was at fault for their third which virtually finished the game. I thought Torres did okay and Diaby, well, can we buy two more like him please.
Apart from Bailey who should be sold as quickly as possible we still have a decent squad, it isn't all gloom and doom.
The stats also show a very different game. Sure there were a number of bad performances but the Gods were against us yesterday. Every time we finally managed to get a grip on the game something transpired against us. I’m sure that won’t happen again all season
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Massive reality check. Newcastle weren’t that good and it wasn’t a 5-1 result based upon the performance, but we were nowhere near good enough. Kamara and Bailey were awful. McGinn completely absent and our team tactics very questionable.
You don’t lose your first game of the season 5-1 against a rival and expect to do anything in the season without some significant changes.
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We were very poor and gifted pretty much all the goals. I'm pretty sure that Carlos and Torres will be the centre backs next week with either Konsa or Cash out right. And I'm sure those two will be a pretty fantastic pairing but will need to get up to speed. Digne played well yesterday and looked as if he give a shit.
My big worry is up front, Watkins will never be anything other than an OK Centre Forward, he fluffed his lines yet again when we could have got back to 2-2, and we have nothing in reserve. If we want to play with the big boys we have to get a proven striker.
I genuinely think that some of the lads had bought into the press that we're world beaters, we are not and the managers job over the next few days is to make that very clear.
If this squad treat it as a wake up call, then it may be a good battering to have had as who genuinely thought Newcastle away on the first day of the season would produce points?
I think we will see plenty of ins and outs in the next two weeks and there will be a massive reaction next week so as utterly crap as yesterday was, against a club that has happily sold it's soul, Emery will have learnt more in that pile of turd than some of the average performances of last season.
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Kamara worried me more than I was expecting (even though I know he made mistakes last season). There was one point where he went out and checked Gordon, lost his boot and it was so completely pointless, as in piss poor decision making. It made no sense and then he went on to be pretty poor for the rest of the game. He didn't look very composed at all today.
He's a great young prospect, but he doesn't do "having a stinker" by half.
Reminds me a bit of early years Luiz. One of the biggest improvements Doug has made is to take some of those 4-5/10 games up to a 6/10.
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Massive reality check. Newcastle weren’t that good and it wasn’t a 5-1 result based upon the performance, but we were nowhere near good enough. Kamara and Bailey were awful. McGinn completely absent and our team tactics very questionable.
You don’t lose your first game of the season 5-1 against a rival and expect to do anything in the season without some significant changes.
Newcastle played very well, don't be daft. They're a very good side, and last season we battered them also. Chill
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Bailey, Jesus, how bad was he.
Lethargic, unbothered, constantly giving the ball away and he’s the slowest “fast player” I’ve ever seen.
Offers nothing but somehow persists.
The thing is, when he was on the pitch we looked much more dangerous. I don't disagree, his performance was mostly poor but we often do perform better as a team with him around strangely
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Saw the result then decided to watch the recording, have to say I saw a different game to most. Yes the result was a disappointment but we still played some nice football, when Mings was down injured Watkins missed a golden chance to put us level, when Barnes was adjudged to be onside why didn't we see the line drawn on the screen, to me and the commentator he looked a mile off. Konsa was at fault for their third which virtually finished the game. I thought Torres did okay and Diaby, well, can we buy two more like him please.
Apart from Bailey who should be sold as quickly as possible we still have a decent squad, it isn't all gloom and doom.
Im away on holiday and only saw the second half, but Im nearer to this assessment then anything else. At 1-2, i thought we came out 2nd half and looked to play our normal controlled game and i really felt an equaliser was come. Konsa bizarre error absolutely killed us. The worrying thing from there was how we fell apart. Although again Barnes looked miles off for Wilsons goal.
Anyway Everton will not doubt be a more nervy affair now, but I do think we will start our season again next week.
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It’s incredible how consumed and bitter they still are by what happened in 2009.
The social media stuff seemed confined to a few trolls, but yesterday they were singing about it in a bar before the game. I should stress, everyone was singing it, not just a few. Then in the ground as the goals went in, they were doing it again.
I thought we were done with horror shows like yesterday, but when we’re spineless and leaderless, we do it properly.
So sad about Tyrone.
Got home at 2.35am, and my old MP3 died too. Bollocks.
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It’s incredible how consumed and bitter they still are by what happened in 2009.
The social media stuff seemed confined to a few trolls, but yesterday they were singing about it in a bar before the game. I should stress, everyone was singing it, not just a few. Then in the ground as the goals went in, they were doing it again.
I thought we were done with horror shows like yesterday, but when we’re spineless and leaderless, we do it properly.
So sad about Tyrone.
Got home at 2.35am, and my old MP3 died too. Bollocks.
I guess they would, but who cares, all I care about is AVFC
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Again, I feel like I'm going mad. Their VAR-'checked' goals should've both been ruled out. Am I insane here? Why is nobody talking about this? Not the BBC, not the Guardian, and not even here? We seriously think the Premier League is above corruption? Especially from that bunch, after the summer we've all just seen?
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They were both on I think.
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Well, for the second goal, whilst there were players clearly offside when the ball came in, the fella who got to it and knocked it to Isak, wasn’t.
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Well, for the second goal, whilst there were players clearly offside when the ball came in, the fella who got to it and knocked it to Isak, wasn’t.
Cash was massively fouled. And I thought the other one was off by a whole leg
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Didn’t see too much wrong with it myself, players can’t help being stronger than others.
Overall, I think we lost because we didn’t get close to them in terms of aggression and intensity, bit of a cliche but at all levels you have to have players winning their individual battles against the opposition and who did, I’d argue no one. A complete mirror image of the VP game.
All is not lost mind, we will go a long time before we see a whole team all perform so poorly.
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I think we lost fair enough but that they did get more than the rub of the green at crucial times, which at least contributed to the scoreline and at most tipped the balance. And I think we can expect plenty more of it this season.
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It reminded me of the Leicester game at home last season a bit. We conceded 11 in the space of three games and turned it round so let's see how they react.
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Emery got it the starting line up wrong. If we had an exta body in midfield, parked the bus early and quieten the crowd it could of been a different game.
Maybe he thought he Bailey would get some joy against Burn, I was suprised we didn't target him more.
The head scratcher for me is we targeted him a treat in April with McGinn. Today he played on the opposite side of the pitch.
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Well, for the second goal, whilst there were players clearly offside when the ball came in, the fella who got to it and knocked it to Isak, wasn’t.
But isaak was
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Not when the defender got to the cross to knock it to him.
You saw how teams are changing to adapt the very next time we got an attacking free kick, McGinn took it and 3 of ours were stood miles off on the 18 yard line, but as the ball missed them all out, no flag.
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Newcastle benefited from a VAR decision that went there way despite several of their players being offside including the eventual scorer but we were well beaten anyway so not really crucial. Luton got a ridiculous penalty for handball while Arsenal got away with a similar one against Forest. Is VAR corrupt? I sometimes wonder but it's definitely inept.
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Another nightmare game at Newcastle. Big moment for me, apart from the Ming's injury, was Watkins missing a golden chance at 2-1. Until that point and all the first half it was an open yet even game. We shaded the good chances. All fell apart in the second half. We will miss Ty but in Carlos and Torres we have purchased two of the best CH's in Spain so hopefully they can step up and learn fast. Loosing 2 players for the season means we have effectively only added one senior player to the squad. With the extra games that won't be enough. So unless more major signings come in, I just don't think it's to be expected that we should finish higher than last season. All those around us have stronger squads. Such a frustrating start to the season when expectations only a week ago were so high.
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Another nightmare game at Newcastle. Big moment for me, apart from the Ming's injury, was Watkins missing a golden chance at 2-1. Until that point and all the first half it was an open yet even game. We shaded the good chances. All fell apart in the second half. We will miss Ty but in Carlos and Torres we have purchased two of the best CH's in Spain so hopefully they can step up and learn fast. Loosing 2 players for the season means we have effectively only added one senior player to the squad. With the extra games that won't be enough. So unless more major signings come in, I just don't think it's to be expected that we should finish higher than last season. All those around us have stronger squads. Such a frustrating start to the season when expectations only a week ago were so high.
You can't say we've only added one player to the squad when we've signed three. I can' see what you're saying but it's wrong to put it like that.
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Why do people keep saying the fella that scored the first goal was offside when he wasn’t
VAR draw the lines down to a Nats cock
Yes, others were offside but not the one that touched the ball first
Don’t go down the conspiracy rabbit hole we lost because we were rubbish on the day
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If the Watkins miss and the chance Cash missed had been scored, it’s a different game.
The Konsa mistake on top of those misses just cemented the result.
Gordon gave Cash nightmares and Bailey was poor.
Maybe this is the start of the Pau, Diego partnership.
Still gutted we lost.
In Emery we trust
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Massive reality check. Newcastle weren’t that good and it wasn’t a 5-1 result based upon the performance, but we were nowhere near good enough. Kamara and Bailey were awful. McGinn completely absent and our team tactics very questionable.
You don’t lose your first game of the season 5-1 against a rival and expect to do anything in the season without some significant changes.
Newcastle played very well, don't be daft. They're a very good side, and last season we battered them also. Chill
I don’t think it was a 5-1 game but after Konsa messed up it was game over and in that sense, it was majorly disappointing. We weren’t really in it second half and I put that down more to us to them. As opening day performances go it was a huge disappointment. Kamara goes to sleep for Tonali’s goal, Konsa messes up for the third. By the time goals 4 and 5 go in we’ve given up. It was always going to be a hard game but boy did we make it much easier for them. We lost 4-0 to them with a caretaker manager last season. Of course it’s a massive reality check. This was a game against a rival and we massively, massively fluffed our lines and that should be a concern. Fair play to you if you can chill on that and think all will be rosey.
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It's not a case of thinking everything will be rosy. The game has gone now, it's about putting it right next time out.
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It’s the worst opening day performance in 149 year history
We lost 5-1 and the goalkeeper was still man of the match making half a dozen goalbound saves including a few one on ones
You can’t just write that off as a bad day where we got a bit unlucky
Historically it’s the worst
The High line where they were slicing through us at will and that some bad individual performances killed us
Having said that, we have the best manager to put it right
But he needs to accept that that was totally shit today, tactics lineups performances all wrong
In football as in life, you have to accept responsibility
We will improve of course we will we can’t go any worse, Luton town got battered and they’re still above us in the league, literally the only way is up
I’m not suggesting it’s all doom and gloom, but I am saying it’s more than just a bad day at the office We need to accept we have problems and put them right
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It's not a case of thinking everything will be rosy. The game has gone now, it's about putting it right next time out.
I think that it was more than just a bad day at the office. If we’ve serious about this season you don’t lose like that and in that manner against supposedly direct competition. It was most concerning that at points we were simply not switched on at all and more concerning, we didn’t seem capable of changing it with what we have. Beating Everton next week shouldn’t mask that.
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It's not a case of thinking everything will be rosy. The game has gone now, it's about putting it right next time out.
I think that it was more than just a bad day at the office. If we’ve serious about this season you don’t lose like that and in that manner against supposedly direct competition. It was most concerning that at points we were simply not switched on at all and more concerning, we didn’t seem capable of changing it with what we have. Beating Everton next week shouldn’t mask that.
It's not good losing games like that and in the manner we did but now and again it happens to every team. It's how we bounce back and how we learn from it which is the main thing.
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Another thing I found myself thinking, Isak is a much, much better player than Watkins, technically miles better, different level.
Their second choice striker Wilson is also very decent, much better than our 'options' which are a couple of inexperienced kids.
I get the entire "yeah but who would we get if we wanted to improve on Watkins" idea, but Newcastle spent 65m on Isak. They're our peers, they are the people we need to be competing with, maybe we need to go out and be bold and do the same?
Isak is pure quality. He is in a different league to Watkins. I think Newcastle have bought very well. I thought Tonali was excellent right from the off and Barnes will be very good as well.
I think today showed that we need an upgrade on Cash, Digne, Mcginn and Bailey. Somehow he needs to get Tielemans firing and in the team. I now it is every early but he looks really sluggish and passive in the albeit brief cameos I have seen from him.
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It was truly awful - we looked a 6s and 7s and the fact we are capable of being that bad is a huge issue. As is our current injury list. Emi, mings, Ramsey, Young, Mareno we’re all key last season - taking players of that quality out of our team is huge - and our recruitment hasn’t gone far enough to replace that injury list. It probably was never intended to.
We’re still a work in progress it will take time - but the fact that they clearly don’t fancy archer is another concern as we’re rely on one striker currently.
We need to do something more in the window and get some of our injury list back
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It's not a case of thinking everything will be rosy. The game has gone now, it's about putting it right next time out.
I think that it was more than just a bad day at the office. If we’ve serious about this season you don’t lose like that and in that manner against supposedly direct competition. It was most concerning that at points we were simply not switched on at all and more concerning, we didn’t seem capable of changing it with what we have. Beating Everton next week shouldn’t mask that.
It's not good losing games like that and in the manner we did but now and again it happens to every team. It's how we bounce back and how we learn from it which is the main thing.
It can happen but equally you have to break down what happened and review it for the reality. This wasn’t a case of them scoring loads of 25 yarders into the top corner and it just being one of those days. It should be a massive wake up call because by the end it wasn’t close and that should be a big concern. There are games where you shake it off and go it was just a bad day. But I don’t think yesterday was one of them. We looked ill prepared, lacking focus and to think we considered Bailey to be a reliable option away from home in a big game was ridiculous and it was rectified swiftly.
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Of course they'll review it and break it down. Emery will if anyone will, that's his job. Like I said, it's gone now, it's how you come back from it.
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Not when the defender got to the cross to knock it to him.
You saw how teams are changing to adapt the very next time we got an attacking free kick, McGinn took it and 3 of ours were stood miles off on the 18 yard line, but as the ball missed them all out, no flag.
Surely if Isaak was offside when the initial ball was kicked he cannot be played on by receiving a direct pass from a teammate that was onside? This is not a separate phase of play
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The goals were onside, you could argue Cash was fouled and just the general bullshit rule where Isak can gain an advantage being offside until the final ball but technically all the goals looked onside.
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Yes, it’s 3 points gone, time to move on. We’ve now got two games we definitely should be winning, coming up. Everton at home is as much of a home banker as you can get with us. We’ve then got Liverpool away, which is almost certainly a defeat, but then Palace at home, which again we should be winning. 9 points from 5 games would be a decent start to the season, and hopefully we’ll have a few new players joining as well.
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I'm not for a moment saying it would have made any difference to the result but how can Isaak who was offside when the free kick was taken be played onside when no Villa player has played the ball either intentionally or not?
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Having said that I haven't seen a frame with the lines added
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It's not a case of thinking everything will be rosy. The game has gone now, it's about putting it right next time out.
I think that it was more than just a bad day at the office. If we’ve serious about this season you don’t lose like that and in that manner against supposedly direct competition. It was most concerning that at points we were simply not switched on at all and more concerning, we didn’t seem capable of changing it with what we have. Beating Everton next week shouldn’t mask that.
Our experience under Emery suggests that ‘bad day at the office’ is exactly what it was. He’ll already be working on his plan for next week and I am absolutely certain that we will see a reaction. Losing Mings after half an hour on top of Buendia a couple of days ago completely disrupted preparations. I doubt we’ll be that unlucky again. It’s also true that many of our fans underrated Newcastle so it was a difficult game to start the season.
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It's not a case of thinking everything will be rosy. The game has gone now, it's about putting it right next time out.
I think that it was more than just a bad day at the office. If we’ve serious about this season you don’t lose like that and in that manner against supposedly direct competition. It was most concerning that at points we were simply not switched on at all and more concerning, we didn’t seem capable of changing it with what we have. Beating Everton next week shouldn’t mask that.
Your in danger of writing of the season or implying it. Now beating Everton won’t make up for yesterday? It was shite and once and only once the third goal went in, shambolic, and yes Emery and his team need to review etc, revelation of the year that one. But actually good teams do get battered from time to time, Man Utd lost by 7 to a faltering Liverpool last season, we put 7 past Liverpool a few years back etc. its more heightened because its the first game and we have all had such high hopes.
But are we all of a sudden saying Emery doesnt know what he’s doing??
Despite yesterday, despite the nature of it, despite the shite injuries, we will still have a very good season.
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Another thing I found myself thinking, Isak is a much, much better player than Watkins, technically miles better, different level.
Their second choice striker Wilson is also very decent, much better than our 'options' which are a couple of inexperienced kids.
I get the entire "yeah but who would we get if we wanted to improve on Watkins" idea, but Newcastle spent 65m on Isak. They're our peers, they are the people we need to be competing with, maybe we need to go out and be bold and do the same?
Isak is pure quality. He is in a different league to Watkins. I think Newcastle have bought very well. I thought Tonali was excellent right from the off and Barnes will be very good as well.
I think today showed that we need an upgrade on Cash, Digne, Mcginn and Bailey. Somehow he needs to get Tielemans firing and in the team. I now it is every early but he looks really sluggish and passive in the albeit brief cameos I have seen from him.
Are you really going to roll out McGinns name in this. He has been brilliant since Emery turned up, one game…JFC
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Another thing I found myself thinking, Isak is a much, much better player than Watkins, technically miles better, different level.
Their second choice striker Wilson is also very decent, much better than our 'options' which are a couple of inexperienced kids.
I get the entire "yeah but who would we get if we wanted to improve on Watkins" idea, but Newcastle spent 65m on Isak. They're our peers, they are the people we need to be competing with, maybe we need to go out and be bold and do the same?
Isak is pure quality. He is in a different league to Watkins. I think Newcastle have bought very well. I thought Tonali was excellent right from the off and Barnes will be very good as well.
I think today showed that we need an upgrade on Cash, Digne, Mcginn and Bailey. Somehow he needs to get Tielemans firing and in the team. I now it is every early but he looks really sluggish and passive in the albeit brief cameos I have seen from him.
Are you really going to roll out McGinns name in this. He has been brilliant since Emery turned up, one game…JFC
It’s the narrative some people will always have on McGinn for some reason they don’t think he’s good enough when he quite clearly is and as soon as they get an opportunity they’re on it again
Same as me and Konsa to be fair
My narrative has always been he’s not good enough for a top half premiership team
Yesterday we saw again just how limited he is
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I somehow feel more at peace we lost this way then if we lost 1-0 with a dodgy goal in the 90+5th minute. We can address so much and not feel sorry for ourselves.
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Fair play to Howe. When Emery went to a back three, he put Barnes on to attack the space in behind Cash. Unsurprisingly it worked.
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I think we were still in the game until their 3rd goal went in, and that was at 60 minutes. Emery even said it himself afterwards, we didn't control the last 30 minutes. A loss is a loss but 3-1 looks and feels a lot better, or at least less shit, than 5-1.
I don't doubt Newcastle are a good team and everyone will struggle against them up there, but they're not 4 goals better than us, or more importantly we're not 4 goals worse than them.
Losing 2 key players to serious injury in the way we did is something you just can't plan for. It's a shit result, and a shit feeling after all the optimism we had around us only a few days ago, but I don't think it's a marker for the season to come, I think we'll see a completely different performance next week and we'll be fine.
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People seem to be forgetting Martinez made at least 3 world class saves to keep it down to 5 , plus Watkins cleared one off the line . We were garbage and 5-1 was about right
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Yes, there was a question for VAR on the offside - but, if we defend better, it might stop the goal too.
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It's not a case of thinking everything will be rosy. The game has gone now, it's about putting it right next time out.
I think that it was more than just a bad day at the office. If we’ve serious about this season you don’t lose like that and in that manner against supposedly direct competition. It was most concerning that at points we were simply not switched on at all and more concerning, we didn’t seem capable of changing it with what we have. Beating Everton next week shouldn’t mask that.
Your in danger of writing of the season or implying it. Now beating Everton won’t make up for yesterday? It was shite and once and only once the third goal went in, shambolic, and yes Emery and his team need to review etc, revelation of the year that one. But actually good teams do get battered from time to time, Man Utd lost by 7 to a faltering Liverpool last season, we put 7 past Liverpool a few years back etc. its more heightened because its the first game and we have all had such high hopes.
But are we all of a sudden saying Emery doesnt know what he’s doing??
Despite yesterday, despite the nature of it, despite the shite injuries, we will still have a very good season.
The reality is that that was our heaviest defeat under Emery against side that played no differently from what we would expect and which was equally aided and abetted by us. And as auditions go for competing near the higher end of things, it was woeful. And no, beating Everton (which hopefully we will) won’t address things because that’s not where our season will be defined. Our season will be defined in fixtures like yesterday if we’re looking to get into the top 6. It was the performance more than the result which I found most disappointing. Heavy losses can happen but crikey did we help them and worse, once the third went in we never looked like getting back into it even with 30 minutes still to go.
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Their defence was just as bad as ours first half. Gordon had the half of his life in the first half and Burns did a job on Cash for the second goal. One game does not define a season, no matter how bad we played. For justification of that see the Saudis at VP last season, moving on to claim champions league football.
Personally Kamara disappointed me most yesterday behind Bailey (who didn’t really disappoint me just reminded me of his limitations). His control was poor along with decision making. He looked off the pace. In the second half Diaby was away through the middle, Kamara on the ball. A simple pass put Diaby in on goal. Kamara’s pass to their centre half was exquisite.
Watkins and Diaby will terrorise sides when they get the supply, they cut that off well in the second half. The Konsa error killed the game as a contest but we collapsed defensively after that.
Far too early to write off the starting eleven I suggest.
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Gordon really did have the game.of his life. What a hideous man he is. His face make me feel sick.
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Another thing I found myself thinking, Isak is a much, much better player than Watkins, technically miles better, different level.
Their second choice striker Wilson is also very decent, much better than our 'options' which are a couple of inexperienced kids.
I get the entire "yeah but who would we get if we wanted to improve on Watkins" idea, but Newcastle spent 65m on Isak. They're our peers, they are the people we need to be competing with, maybe we need to go out and be bold and do the same?
Isak is pure quality. He is in a different league to Watkins. I think Newcastle have bought very well. I thought Tonali was excellent right from the off and Barnes will be very good as well.
I think today showed that we need an upgrade on Cash, Digne, Mcginn and Bailey. Somehow he needs to get Tielemans firing and in the team. I now it is every early but he looks really sluggish and passive in the albeit brief cameos I have seen from him.
Isaak is a top quality striker who scores goals for fun. Watkins will terrorise defenders for sure but a quality goal scorer he ain't. He misses way too many chances. Until we address this fundamental issue we won't be winning too many trophies.
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Gordon really did have the game.of his life. What a hideous man he is. His face make me feel sick.
Cash had a shocker though
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Gordon really did have the game.of his life. What a hideous man he is. His face make me feel sick.
Cash had a shocker though
That, too.
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Newcastle were hungrier than we were.
They wanted it more than we did.
And the ref let them have it more then he did us.
They were allowed to leave a foot in.
They were allowed to push us off balance.
They were allowed to pull us off balance.
As soon as we entered their safe space, they tripped themselves over & the ref blew the whistle before they hit the deck.
Thats not why we lost, but it contributed to why we lost so badly.
How that second was allowed for the block on Cash, I will never know.
What the actual fuck is VAR useful for?
As for our players, they were all shit, except for a few bright spots from Diaby & Pau Torres.
My only hope about our defence parting like the red sea every time they attacked us is that Konsa & Torres haven't played much together, if at all & once they do, they will become stronger as a unit.
When Mings & Konsa first started playing together in Emerys system, they also conceded quite a few for a short while.
But as soon as they got used to it all, our defence became very tight.
So hopefully, Torres & Konsa/Carlos will be the same...
In a game we have lost 5-1, to blame the officials to that extent is just plain daft
I do not know what words you read of what I wrote, but I didn't blame the officials to any extent other than call them out for their inadequacies.
The key sentence being in bold...
I've had enough of Bailey now. I've been a lot more forgiving than a lot of supporters towards him but today was the straw that broke the camels back. Unai has to take a lot of the blame for picking him
I am in this camp. I have been the same with my patience, but today it ran out.
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I thought these types of performances were in the past. A real kick in the balls.
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I thought these types of performances were in the past. A real kick in the balls.
We were never going to lose a game by 3-4 goals again?
It happens to 99% of clubs in a season.
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A disastrous day. trying to look on the positive side, it could have been a lot different, if McGinn hadn't given a needless free kick away, which led to their 2nd goal and if Watkins, Luiz and Diaby hadn't fluffed all excellent chances they had in the first half, plus their 3rd, I doubt whether Konsa will make a bigger cock up for the rest of the season.
Needless to say there were a lot of bad performances, I reckon the biggest disappointment was Kamara, that was probably the worst game he's had for us.
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Yes I am.starting to get a little worried about Kamara. Not sure he can really be arsed.
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A disastrous day. trying to look on the positive side, it could have been a lot different, if McGinn hadn't given a needless free kick away, which led to their 2nd goal and if Watkins, Luiz and Diaby hadn't fluffed all excellent chances they had in the first half, plus their 3rd, I doubt whether Konsa will make a bigger cock up for the rest of the season.
Needless to say there were a lot of bad performances, I reckon the biggest disappointment was Kamara, that was probably the worst game he's had for us.
I think Leicester was worse for Kamara. I’d probably give him a rest for Everton. McGinn on the right of a midfield 4, Luiz and Tielemans in the middle and Philogene on the left.
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Yes I am.starting to get a little worried about Kamara. Not sure he can really be arsed.
It's one game. He had two injuries last year but played well when he returned both times.
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Yes I am.starting to get a little worried about Kamara. Not sure he can really be arsed.
Had a right pop at Bouba after he visibly gave up yesterday in the second half. I can accept other players being better, but thought we’d left this sort of shite behind with Lescott, Bacuna etc.
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This may a bit extreme, or theoretical, but given how their second goal was allowed, what would there be to stop let's say Erling Haaland from simply standing in the opposition penalty area throughout a game, whilst just making sure to be in an onside position when a pass happens to be made to him?
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This may a bit extreme, or theoretical, but given how their second goal was allowed, what would there be to stop let's say Erling Haaland from simply standing in the opposition penalty area throughout a game, whilst just making sure to be in an onside position when a pass happens to be made to him?
Nothing.
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This may a bit extreme, or theoretical, but given how their second goal was allowed, what would there be to stop let's say Erling Haaland from simply standing in the opposition penalty area throughout a game, whilst just making sure to be in an onside position when a pass happens to be made to him?
Happened last season with that Man U goal ( not against us)
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Watkins had a higher shot accuracy percentage last season than Kane, Haaland, Salah, Toney, Wilson.
Although on the flip side, he had one of the lowest coversion rates of the top scorers last season.
And there, in a nutshell, is the problem with him
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Gordon really did have the game.of his life. What a hideous man he is. His face make me feel sick.
Cash had a shocker though
Sadly the two were not mutually exclusive yesterday.
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Yes I am.starting to get a little worried about Kamara. Not sure he can really be arsed.
Had a right pop at Bouba after he visibly gave up yesterday in the second half. I can accept other players being better, but thought we’d left this sort of shite behind with Lescott, Bacuna etc.
I think this is an over reaction. He’s a 21 year from another country who was largely outstanding in the games he played last season. I didn’t see a player giving up, just having a bad game.
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Kamara is 24 in a few months. Which is still young and he'll hopefully learn, and I can't see Unai letting any slackness pass.
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Yeah it was poor from Kamara, but everyone can have a bad day. I’m hoping a number of players got their bad day out of the way there. One small positive - if there was even a semblance of complacency in the squad it’s been blown away now.
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Kamara is 24 in a few months. Which is still young and he'll hopefully learn, and I can't see Unai letting any slackness pass.
Yes sorry got his age wrong, stand corrected on that.
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Bad day at the office I'm worried about the injury to Tyrone and I didn't get back home until 2am.
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Yes I am.starting to get a little worried about Kamara. Not sure he can really be arsed.
Question - do him and Luiz ever play well together?
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I realize this heavy loss is painful but successful teams on occasion do get battered. There is a team this season playing CL football that won last season won a trophy and lost 7-0 to a team that didn’t make the CL.
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Yes I am.starting to get a little worried about Kamara. Not sure he can really be arsed.
Question - do him and Luiz ever play well together?
Yes, lots of times.
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What an awful day, some excuses
- pre season results led to over confidence among the group
- this maybe led to a dreadful team selection by Emery, Gerrard esque, leaving us light in midfield
- Leon Bailey cannot be trusted to start away from home
- Neither Cash or Digne are good enough for games like this, worryingly Cash is still first choice
- Impact of Mings injury, coming so soon after Buendia's, destroyed the team
- Tielemans and Torres particularly will need to time to adjust
- first game of the season can throw out bizarre results, hopefully this is it.
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I think Kamara must have had a very short summer break as he was off on international duty in June after getting married. He was consistently very good last season so am sure he’ll get his form back.
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- Tielemans and Torres particularly will need to time to adjust
Genuine question. Tielemans has been in the Premier League for 4.5 years, and he's been with the squad from day 1 of preseason. What is it he needs to adjust to?
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Yes I am.starting to get a little worried about Kamara. Not sure he can really be arsed.
Question - do him and Luiz ever play well together?
Really?
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- Tielemans and Torres particularly will need to time to adjust
Genuine question. Tielemans has been in the Premier League for 4.5 years, and he's been with the squad from day 1 of preseason. What is it he needs to adjust to?
Maybe to realise that he's not playing for a relegation contender team?
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I know some fans can be an impatient bunch but asking why a new player is not quite up to speed after playing 45 minutes for his new club is quite something.
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- Tielemans and Torres particularly will need to time to adjust
Genuine question. Tielemans has been in the Premier League for 4.5 years, and he's been with the squad from day 1 of preseason. What is it he needs to adjust to?
He hasnt been physically or mentally tuned into PL football for about 12-18 months. Not a good first cameo yesterday to put it mildly.
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Everything went wrong yesterday, conceding when and how we did, not taking good chances that came our way, injuries, starting with 10 men because of Bailey, Cash, Kamara and Konsa playing like donkeys, the ref pulling us up for every contact but allowing them to come through the back of us at will, the VAR selective sight.
Might as well get it all out in one go and start again next week I suppose.
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What an awful day, some excuses
- pre season results led to over confidence among the group
- this maybe led to a dreadful team selection by Emery, Gerrard esque, leaving us light in midfield
- Leon Bailey cannot be trusted to start away from home
- Neither Cash or Digne are good enough for games like this, worryingly Cash is still first choice
- Impact of Mings injury, coming so soon after Buendia's, destroyed the team
- Tielemans and Torres particularly will need to time to adjust
- first game of the season can throw out bizarre results, hopefully this is it.
I agree with this, and in particular points 4, 5 and 6.
Also we were rinsed down our right flank yet again. I hate it when that happens.
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What an awful day, some excuses
- pre season results led to over confidence among the group
- this maybe led to a dreadful team selection by Emery, Gerrard esque, leaving us light in midfield
- Leon Bailey cannot be trusted to start away from home
- Neither Cash or Digne are good enough for games like this, worryingly Cash is still first choice
- Impact of Mings injury, coming so soon after Buendia's, destroyed the team
- Tielemans and Torres particularly will need to time to adjust
- first game of the season can throw out bizarre results, hopefully this is it.
I agree with this, and in particular points 4, 5 and 6.
Also we were rinsed down our right flank yet again. I hate it when that happens.
I agree with all of it, and to add wondered if a bit of over confidence comes from thinking everything will be fine because of who our manager is.
That's fine for us fans, the players, not so much.
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- Tielemans and Torres particularly will need to time to adjust
Genuine question. Tielemans has been in the Premier League for 4.5 years, and he's been with the squad from day 1 of preseason. What is it he needs to adjust to?
He hasnt been physically or mentally tuned into PL football for about 12-18 months. Not a good first cameo yesterday to put it mildly.
He certainly didn't look good yesterday, but that's not confined to him. I would have thought having the entire preseason with Emery and the squad would have been enough to shake off any of his lacklustre attitude remaining from last season. As I said though, everyone was bad yesterday, so hopefully in his case it's just a one off.
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Everything went wrong yesterday, conceding when and how we did, not taking good chances that came our way, injuries, starting with 10 men because of Bailey, Cash, Kamara and Konsa playing like donkeys, the ref pulling us up for every contact but allowing them to come through the back of us at will, the VAR selective sight.
Might as well get it all out in one go and start again next week I suppose.
So we have 37 vs 38 games to win the league. So what. We only needed 1/2 season to get into Europe. Piece of piss.
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It should have been fine, at least in being competitive and not getting a solid thrashing. We added good players to a squad who finished the season strongly, but the manager picked the wrong team, got the tactics wrong and made the wrong subs. It happens of course, and of course the Mings injury was the dog turd on top of the cake, but we've got to work out what went so very badly wrong, and quickly.
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It's not a case of thinking everything will be rosy. The game has gone now, it's about putting it right next time out.
I think that it was more than just a bad day at the office. If we’ve serious about this season you don’t lose like that and in that manner against supposedly direct competition. It was most concerning that at points we were simply not switched on at all and more concerning, we didn’t seem capable of changing it with what we have. Beating Everton next week shouldn’t mask that.
Your in danger of writing of the season or implying it. Now beating Everton won’t make up for yesterday? It was shite and once and only once the third goal went in, shambolic, and yes Emery and his team need to review etc, revelation of the year that one. But actually good teams do get battered from time to time, Man Utd lost by 7 to a faltering Liverpool last season, we put 7 past Liverpool a few years back etc. its more heightened because its the first game and we have all had such high hopes.
But are we all of a sudden saying Emery doesnt know what he’s doing??
Despite yesterday, despite the nature of it, despite the shite injuries, we will still have a very good season.
The reality is that that was our heaviest defeat under Emery against side that played no differently from what we would expect and which was equally aided and abetted by us. And as auditions go for competing near the higher end of things, it was woeful. And no, beating Everton (which hopefully we will) won’t address things because that’s not where our season will be defined. Our season will be defined in fixtures like yesterday if we’re looking to get into the top 6. It was the performance more than the result which I found most disappointing. Heavy losses can happen but crikey did we help them and worse, once the third went in we never looked like getting back into it even with 30 minutes still to go.
I understand what your saying in terms of competing against teams we are expecting to be in and around, but Im not sure that I agree that beating Everton won’t address things. There is all sorts that is fundamentally wrong with that statement. Firstly and most obviously , 3 points is 3 points, secondly momentum is massive in football and we start on that train. Other than that, i just don’t beating teams we are perhaps expected to beat, is less important or that it doesn’t start to address issues such as the numerous ones that occurred yesterday.
I’d suggest after the three heavy losses against Leicester, Man City and Arsenal in Feb, the 1-0 home win over Palace, was just as important in many ways as the 3-0 demolition of Newcastle. Likewise the 3-0 over Bournemouth was just as important as any result/performance in establishing the Emery style.
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It should have been fine, at least in being competitive and not getting a solid thrashing. We added good players to a squad who finished the season strongly, but the manager picked the wrong team, got the tactics wrong and made the wrong subs. It happens of course, and of course the Mings injury was the dog turd on top of the cake, but we've got to work out what went so very badly wrong, and quickly.
Exactly what Newcastle fans said about their team and manager when they took a kicking at Villa Park. It happens. And they didn’t even have a massive injury to contend with either. Man U lost 7-0 to Liverpool last season and qualified for the CL and won a cup. We will bounce back because the players are still good and the manager is still great. Yesterday didn’t change those two things.
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It should have been fine, at least in being competitive and not getting a solid thrashing. We added good players to a squad who finished the season strongly, but the manager picked the wrong team, got the tactics wrong and made the wrong subs. It happens of course, and of course the Mings injury was the dog turd on top of the cake, but we've got to work out what went so very badly wrong, and quickly.
Yeah, in fairness his hand been forced losing Buendia who'd looked sharp as fuck against this mob a couple of weeks ago.
But I thought we looked light when we didn't have the ball against Valencia last week with Bailey and Diaby together and much more in control once Buendia and Coutinho came on for them, it was asking for it a bit to go that way again, although again with no Ramsey and Moreno available were short of options on the left.
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Playing both Bailey and Diaby was a mistake yesterday. Well certainly playing the former. Newcastle always attack in waves against any team at home and we needed a stronger midfield set up. I know we wanted to attack them vs defend but it wasn’t the right approach. And completely agree on Buendia. Not only does he work hard tracking back he is very direct going forward. Had Buendia been available Bailey wouldn’t have played yesterday.
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I'm still in shock with the manner of the defeat rather than the scoreline. I predicted a 2-0 defeat as Sid Jame Park is no easy place to go to for anybody, they had a brilliant defence last season and ignoring the pre-season game against us, they have put together a very fluid, talented team. If the Saudi fans are to be believed, they're a top left back short of completing the side. They also seem to recruit their defenders from the local rugby league side, they're all massive, physically strong and don't mind leaving a foot in if in danger. These new rules allow for such behavior and against our normal/small sized lads they have it all their way. I thought the ref let far too much go but I guess I'm going to have to get used to it.
The warning signs were there pre-season especially against Lazio (first half) and Valencia, two teams that with better strikers could have provided a different result. Was it the Valencia game where McGinn hardly touched the ball as Emery moved him from his normal position? Yesterday was the same, we need players like McGinn to be running the show but the team selection and tactics were poor. Everybody knew it would be a battle to win the midfield and Unai decides to go with Bailey. We'd lost the energy, fight and vision of Buendia but had Tielemans who can battle and thread a ball through sitting on the bench. Why? Even Coutinho could have given us 45 minutes controlling the midfield better than the formation we put out.
Losing Ty was the biggest disappointment of the day and pretty much forces Unai's hand to build a new partnership with Torres and Carlos. I doubt Konsa's error won't be forgotten quickly. But we have to go back to the midfield and get that mess sorted. Yes Kamara had a shocker but he'd spent the day chasing shadows; McGinn was played out of position and hauled off like it was his fault. Dougie never got to control the game as he never had the support around him instead watching far inferior countrymen run riot.
Yes we still created chances and better finishing could have changed the game but it didn't and we have Martinez to thank for keeping it down to five. I just don't understand what Unai was expecting and hoping to achieve. We normally first half bore the opposition to death and just when they think they're comfortable we go and take the lead with some fluid football. Did he really think we could go all gung-ho, face to face and beat them like we did at Villa Park last season? As I said, I really didn't understand his team selection, formation and tactics. His post match comments I hope were just to keep confidence levels up but he has to really have a sit down and analyse not just the players performances but how he could could have, should have set us up differently.
Moving on, I expect us to somehow put this defeat behind us and really punish Everton. We made Newcastle look far better than they are, not that they're not a good team, they most certainly are but we're no where near as poor as we were yesterday.
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We will sign at least one player. We will win next weekend and be 3 points off top spot sitting mid table. The world will be fine.
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We will sign at least one player. We will win next weekend and be 3 points off top spot sitting mid table. The world will be fine.
Yes just don’t start the match thread….
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We will sign at least one player. We will win next weekend and be 3 points off top spot sitting mid table. The world will be fine.
Yes just don’t start the match thread….
Yesterday didn’t matter who started it.
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Playing both Bailey and Diaby was a mistake yesterday. Well certainly playing the former. Newcastle always attack in waves against any team at home and we needed a stronger midfield set up. I know we wanted to attack them vs defend but it wasn’t the right approach. And completely agree on Buendia. Not only does he work hard tracking back he is very direct going forward. Had Buendia been available Bailey wouldn’t have played yesterday.
We were at our best last season with Ramsey and McGinn wide, and either Buendia or Bailey up front next to Watkins. This season that should now mean Diaby next to Watkins, and probably Tielemans left and McGinn right.
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Playing both Bailey and Diaby was a mistake yesterday. Well certainly playing the former. Newcastle always attack in waves against any team at home and we needed a stronger midfield set up. I know we wanted to attack them vs defend but it wasn’t the right approach. And completely agree on Buendia. Not only does he work hard tracking back he is very direct going forward. Had Buendia been available Bailey wouldn’t have played yesterday.
We were at our best last season with Ramsey and McGinn wide, and either Buendia or Bailey up front next to Watkins. This season that should now mean Diaby next to Watkins, and probably Tielemans left and McGinn right.
Hopefully it’s the last we see of Bailey. I defended him with that late miss because I felt he didn’t need to be slaughtered for it. But the odd nice moment and odd game aside he’s a massive liability. His control might be amongst the worst I’ve ever seen in a Villa player. He cannot start next week.
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Playing both Bailey and Diaby was a mistake yesterday. Well certainly playing the former. Newcastle always attack in waves against any team at home and we needed a stronger midfield set up. I know we wanted to attack them vs defend but it wasn’t the right approach. And completely agree on Buendia. Not only does he work hard tracking back he is very direct going forward. Had Buendia been available Bailey wouldn’t have played yesterday.
We were at our best last season with Ramsey and McGinn wide, and either Buendia or Bailey up front next to Watkins. This season that should now mean Diaby next to Watkins, and probably Tielemans left and McGinn right.
Hopefully it’s the last we see of Bailey. I defended him with that late miss because I felt he didn’t need to be slaughtered for it. But the odd nice moment and odd game aside he’s a massive liability. His control might be amongst the worst I’ve ever seen in a Villa player. He cannot start next week.
In truth we have seen this inconsistenty since he's arrived, shame really because he definitely got the talent
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Wrong thread
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I wonder how Newcastle would have coped with losing Guimares for the season on Wednesday and Botman for the same after 20 mins. It has been a terrible few days for the squad. Let’s see where we are over the next month. We have a great manager so trust him to stabilise things and re-set.
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I wonder how Newcastle would have coped with losing Guimares for the season on Wednesday and Botman for the same after 20 mins. It has been a terrible few days for the squad. Let’s see where we are over the next month. We have a great manager so trust him to stabilise things and re-set.
In the cold light of today and with the sickness I felt of defeat gone, I agree with this. I am sure we will be smart in what is left of the transfer window
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I think we have 6 key players if we want to play to our best and the Unai way. Martinez, Mings, Moreno, JJ, Buendia and Ollie. By half time yesterday we only had 2 of them fit.
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It's not a case of thinking everything will be rosy. The game has gone now, it's about putting it right next time out.
I think that it was more than just a bad day at the office. If we’ve serious about this season you don’t lose like that and in that manner against supposedly direct competition. It was most concerning that at points we were simply not switched on at all and more concerning, we didn’t seem capable of changing it with what we have. Beating Everton next week shouldn’t mask that.
Your in danger of writing of the season or implying it. Now beating Everton won’t make up for yesterday? It was shite and once and only once the third goal went in, shambolic, and yes Emery and his team need to review etc, revelation of the year that one. But actually good teams do get battered from time to time, Man Utd lost by 7 to a faltering Liverpool last season, we put 7 past Liverpool a few years back etc. its more heightened because its the first game and we have all had such high hopes.
But are we all of a sudden saying Emery doesnt know what he’s doing??
Despite yesterday, despite the nature of it, despite the shite injuries, we will still have a very good season.
The reality is that that was our heaviest defeat under Emery against side that played no differently from what we would expect and which was equally aided and abetted by us. And as auditions go for competing near the higher end of things, it was woeful. And no, beating Everton (which hopefully we will) won’t address things because that’s not where our season will be defined. Our season will be defined in fixtures like yesterday if we’re looking to get into the top 6. It was the performance more than the result which I found most disappointing. Heavy losses can happen but crikey did we help them and worse, once the third went in we never looked like getting back into it even with 30 minutes still to go.
I understand what your saying in terms of competing against teams we are expecting to be in and around, but Im not sure that I agree that beating Everton won’t address things. There is all sorts that is fundamentally wrong with that statement. Firstly and most obviously , 3 points is 3 points, secondly momentum is massive in football and we start on that train. Other than that, i just don’t beating teams we are perhaps expected to beat, is less important or that it doesn’t start to address issues such as the numerous ones that occurred yesterday.
I’d suggest after the three heavy losses against Leicester, Man City and Arsenal in Feb, the 1-0 home win over Palace, was just as important in many ways as the 3-0 demolition of Newcastle. Likewise the 3-0 over Bournemouth was just as important as any result/performance in establishing the Emery style.
Where we gain real momentum is getting results against those we’re competing with to propel us forward. If you want to look at last season we gained more doing the double over a Spurs or Brighton then we did doing the double over Everton. Not so much the points, but beating them in a head to head scenario which ultimately propelled us above Spurs. We gained more and learned more in head to heads like yesterday then Everton at home, which should we win, what will it prove? To just consider it as of equal value because each game is potentially worth 3 points misses the point. There would be no big games if that was the case. Getting the job done against Everton should be the minimum if we’re going to get into the top 6. The teams we’re looking to compete against will view that fixture in a similar way with their mission to get the job done. It won’t necessarily address what we saw yesterday for the very reason that we have a better squad, a better manager and are the home side. We could play badly and still win, something which we absolutely cannot do against sides like Newcastle. Should we beat Everton, it will demonstrate nothing.
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A point back of Liverpool. Season isn’t over yet.
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There seems to be a bit of revisionism over Buendia since his injury. I was getting the general thought to be he wouldn’t be in the first 11, yes he’d certainly provide an option from the bench as part of the squad, that option has now gone but peoples opinion of him now appear to have flipped and he’s now a huge miss for the first team.
If everyone is fit would he be in the first 11, it’s a no from me.
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There seems to be a bit of revisionism over Buendia since his injury. I was getting the general thought to be he wouldn’t be in the first 11, yes he’d certainly provide an option from the bench as part of the squad, that option has now gone but peoples opinion of him now appear to have flipped and he’s now a huge miss for the first team.
If everyone is fit would he be in the first 11, it’s a no from me.
I don't get this mentality (not having a pop at you here, but in general as I've read this argument a lot the last few days).
We need to stop thinking first XI and not-first -XI. We need differing line ups for different matches, it's not like MON era pick your best eleven and hope for the best.
He's a very valuable member of a squad that is going to have to play a lot of matches this season. He's now not available for probably the whole season, that's a problem.
Look back 24 hours to see how that's a problem. So many of the players absolutely not delivering, one of them crocked long term. That's why you need as many good players as you can get.
Pau Torres wasn't part of the first team at kick off yesterday, nor was Diego Carlos, but they both were on 90 minutes.
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I understand, that’s why I mentioned the squad. All I’m saying is there’s a bit of backtracking on Buendia since he got injured.
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Season going well so far as only 3 points behind The Blue Moons!
Seriously though, if we don’t address getting in a good striker and a replacement for Ty, we are going to struggle.
Pre match, I couldn’t believe some of the outlandish comments about how many we were going to beat them by. I would have happily settled for a draw.
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There seems to be a bit of revisionism over Buendia since his injury. I was getting the general thought to be he wouldn’t be in the first 11, yes he’d certainly provide an option from the bench as part of the squad, that option has now gone but peoples opinion of him now appear to have flipped and he’s now a huge miss for the first team.
If everyone is fit would he be in the first 11, it’s a no from me.
No, but with Ramsey out he would be in the team.
Much like how Vassell would be a huge miss if Joachim was already out injured.
Buendia played in every game last season, whatever anybody's opinion of him that is a huge miss. Those are minutes that have to be given elsewhere, and with more games this season sharing the workload around the squad will be vital.
ahh i think mr walnuts has said it already. eeeh!
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There seems to be a bit of revisionism over Buendia since his injury. I was getting the general thought to be he wouldn’t be in the first 11, yes he’d certainly provide an option from the bench as part of the squad, that option has now gone but peoples opinion of him now appear to have flipped and he’s now a huge miss for the first team.
If everyone is fit would he be in the first 11, it’s a no from me.
Its a no from me too.
Too lightweight & gives the ball away far too often.
And thats Baileys job...
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I don’t think it’s revisionism. But I think, sorry I know, he would have been far better than Bailey had he started yesterday. Buendia has his limitations. It’s why we bought Diaby and likely will buy others that pushes him down the pecking order. But he’s good enough to be an effective squad player or someone who starts in specific circumstances. Not someone who should be a regular starting option.
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We had options available not to pick bailey yesterday. Having three forwards was unusual from emery and seemed to unbalance the whole set-up. Mcginn should have been on the right with tielemans or philogene on the left of the four.
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I think if Ramsey was fit we'd be OK without Buendia, and brace yourselves, I think Cash would be perfectly fine if Moreno was on the other side. It's the extremely unfortunate overlap of all these injuries that has seemingly knocked everyone off-kilter.
We definitely need some solid heads to take charge over the next few weeks, and hopefully by mid September we'll have Ramsey and Moreno back, be qualified for Europe, and have 9-12 points in the bank.
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It's not a case of thinking everything will be rosy. The game has gone now, it's about putting it right next time out.
I think that it was more than just a bad day at the office. If we’ve serious about this season you don’t lose like that and in that manner against supposedly direct competition. It was most concerning that at points we were simply not switched on at all and more concerning, we didn’t seem capable of changing it with what we have. Beating Everton next week shouldn’t mask that.
Your in danger of writing of the season or implying it. Now beating Everton won’t make up for yesterday? It was shite and once and only once the third goal went in, shambolic, and yes Emery and his team need to review etc, revelation of the year that one. But actually good teams do get battered from time to time, Man Utd lost by 7 to a faltering Liverpool last season, we put 7 past Liverpool a few years back etc. its more heightened because its the first game and we have all had such high hopes.
But are we all of a sudden saying Emery doesnt know what he’s doing??
Despite yesterday, despite the nature of it, despite the shite injuries, we will still have a very good season.
The reality is that that was our heaviest defeat under Emery against side that played no differently from what we would expect and which was equally aided and abetted by us. And as auditions go for competing near the higher end of things, it was woeful. And no, beating Everton (which hopefully we will) won’t address things because that’s not where our season will be defined. Our season will be defined in fixtures like yesterday if we’re looking to get into the top 6. It was the performance more than the result which I found most disappointing. Heavy losses can happen but crikey did we help them and worse, once the third went in we never looked like getting back into it even with 30 minutes still to go.
I understand what your saying in terms of competing against teams we are expecting to be in and around, but Im not sure that I agree that beating Everton won’t address things. There is all sorts that is fundamentally wrong with that statement. Firstly and most obviously , 3 points is 3 points, secondly momentum is massive in football and we start on that train. Other than that, i just don’t beating teams we are perhaps expected to beat, is less important or that it doesn’t start to address issues such as the numerous ones that occurred yesterday.
I’d suggest after the three heavy losses against Leicester, Man City and Arsenal in Feb, the 1-0 home win over Palace, was just as important in many ways as the 3-0 demolition of Newcastle. Likewise the 3-0 over Bournemouth was just as important as any result/performance in establishing the Emery style.
Where we gain real momentum is getting results against those we’re competing with to propel us forward. If you want to look at last season we gained more doing the double over a Spurs or Brighton then we did doing the double over Everton. Not so much the points, but beating them in a head to head scenario which ultimately propelled us above Spurs. We gained more and learned more in head to heads like yesterday then Everton at home, which should we win, what will it prove? To just consider it as of equal value because each game is potentially worth 3 points misses the point. There would be no big games if that was the case. Getting the job done against Everton should be the minimum if we’re going to get into the top 6. The teams we’re looking to compete against will view that fixture in a similar way with their mission to get the job done. It won’t necessarily address what we saw yesterday for the very reason that we have a better squad, a better manager and are the home side. We could play badly and still win, something which we absolutely cannot do against sides like Newcastle. Should we beat Everton, it will demonstrate nothing.
[/quote)
Im sorry Leon its quite patronising to say im missing the point. I get your point, but I disagree.
To say next week (if we win) demonstrates nothing,’is just plain ridiculous really. Every game brings it challenges.
So from you say only games against the so called top six will define our season.
Man City drew to us at VP last season under Stevie G, did that define their season. There are so many examples it would be dull to listen them all.
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I think we have 6 key players if we want to play to our best and the Unai way. Martinez, Mings, Moreno, JJ, Buendia and Ollie. By half time yesterday we only had 2 of them fit.
I'd agree with five of those. I think Buendia would be a bit part player, unless he sorted his consistency and passing out.
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It's not a case of thinking everything will be rosy. The game has gone now, it's about putting it right next time out.
I think that it was more than just a bad day at the office. If we’ve serious about this season you don’t lose like that and in that manner against supposedly direct competition. It was most concerning that at points we were simply not switched on at all and more concerning, we didn’t seem capable of changing it with what we have. Beating Everton next week shouldn’t mask that.
Your in danger of writing of the season or implying it. Now beating Everton won’t make up for yesterday? It was shite and once and only once the third goal went in, shambolic, and yes Emery and his team need to review etc, revelation of the year that one. But actually good teams do get battered from time to time, Man Utd lost by 7 to a faltering Liverpool last season, we put 7 past Liverpool a few years back etc. its more heightened because its the first game and we have all had such high hopes.
But are we all of a sudden saying Emery doesnt know what he’s doing??
Despite yesterday, despite the nature of it, despite the shite injuries, we will still have a very good season.
The reality is that that was our heaviest defeat under Emery against side that played no differently from what we would expect and which was equally aided and abetted by us. And as auditions go for competing near the higher end of things, it was woeful. And no, beating Everton (which hopefully we will) won’t address things because that’s not where our season will be defined. Our season will be defined in fixtures like yesterday if we’re looking to get into the top 6. It was the performance more than the result which I found most disappointing. Heavy losses can happen but crikey did we help them and worse, once the third went in we never looked like getting back into it even with 30 minutes still to go.
I understand what your saying in terms of competing against teams we are expecting to be in and around, but Im not sure that I agree that beating Everton won’t address things. There is all sorts that is fundamentally wrong with that statement. Firstly and most obviously , 3 points is 3 points, secondly momentum is massive in football and we start on that train. Other than that, i just don’t beating teams we are perhaps expected to beat, is less important or that it doesn’t start to address issues such as the numerous ones that occurred yesterday.
I’d suggest after the three heavy losses against Leicester, Man City and Arsenal in Feb, the 1-0 home win over Palace, was just as important in many ways as the 3-0 demolition of Newcastle. Likewise the 3-0 over Bournemouth was just as important as any result/performance in establishing the Emery style.
Where we gain real momentum is getting results against those we’re competing with to propel us forward. If you want to look at last season we gained more doing the double over a Spurs or Brighton then we did doing the double over Everton. Not so much the points, but beating them in a head to head scenario which ultimately propelled us above Spurs. We gained more and learned more in head to heads like yesterday then Everton at home, which should we win, what will it prove? To just consider it as of equal value because each game is potentially worth 3 points misses the point. There would be no big games if that was the case. Getting the job done against Everton should be the minimum if we’re going to get into the top 6. The teams we’re looking to compete against will view that fixture in a similar way with their mission to get the job done. It won’t necessarily address what we saw yesterday for the very reason that we have a better squad, a better manager and are the home side. We could play badly and still win, something which we absolutely cannot do against sides like Newcastle. Should we beat Everton, it will demonstrate nothing.
[/quote)
Im sorry Leon its quite patronising to say im missing the point. I get your point, but I disagree.
To say next week (if we win) demonstrates nothing,’is just plain ridiculous really. Every game brings it challenges.
So from you say only games against the so called top six will define our season.
Man City drew to us at VP last season under Stevie G, did that define their season. There are so many examples it would be dull to listen them all.
No offence or patronising intended. Guess we just disagree on the points which is fine; opinion makes the world go round.
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It's not a case of thinking everything will be rosy. The game has gone now, it's about putting it right next time out.
I think that it was more than just a bad day at the office. If we’ve serious about this season you don’t lose like that and in that manner against supposedly direct competition. It was most concerning that at points we were simply not switched on at all and more concerning, we didn’t seem capable of changing it with what we have. Beating Everton next week shouldn’t mask that.
Your in danger of writing of the season or implying it. Now beating Everton won’t make up for yesterday? It was shite and once and only once the third goal went in, shambolic, and yes Emery and his team need to review etc, revelation of the year that one. But actually good teams do get battered from time to time, Man Utd lost by 7 to a faltering Liverpool last season, we put 7 past Liverpool a few years back etc. its more heightened because its the first game and we have all had such high hopes.
But are we all of a sudden saying Emery doesnt know what he’s doing??
Despite yesterday, despite the nature of it, despite the shite injuries, we will still have a very good season.
The reality is that that was our heaviest defeat under Emery against side that played no differently from what we would expect and which was equally aided and abetted by us. And as auditions go for competing near the higher end of things, it was woeful. And no, beating Everton (which hopefully we will) won’t address things because that’s not where our season will be defined. Our season will be defined in fixtures like yesterday if we’re looking to get into the top 6. It was the performance more than the result which I found most disappointing. Heavy losses can happen but crikey did we help them and worse, once the third went in we never looked like getting back into it even with 30 minutes still to go.
I understand what your saying in terms of competing against teams we are expecting to be in and around, but Im not sure that I agree that beating Everton won’t address things. There is all sorts that is fundamentally wrong with that statement. Firstly and most obviously , 3 points is 3 points, secondly momentum is massive in football and we start on that train. Other than that, i just don’t beating teams we are perhaps expected to beat, is less important or that it doesn’t start to address issues such as the numerous ones that occurred yesterday.
I’d suggest after the three heavy losses against Leicester, Man City and Arsenal in Feb, the 1-0 home win over Palace, was just as important in many ways as the 3-0 demolition of Newcastle. Likewise the 3-0 over Bournemouth was just as important as any result/performance in establishing the Emery style.
Where we gain real momentum is getting results against those we’re competing with to propel us forward. If you want to look at last season we gained more doing the double over a Spurs or Brighton then we did doing the double over Everton. Not so much the points, but beating them in a head to head scenario which ultimately propelled us above Spurs. We gained more and learned more in head to heads like yesterday then Everton at home, which should we win, what will it prove? To just consider it as of equal value because each game is potentially worth 3 points misses the point. There would be no big games if that was the case. Getting the job done against Everton should be the minimum if we’re going to get into the top 6. The teams we’re looking to compete against will view that fixture in a similar way with their mission to get the job done. It won’t necessarily address what we saw yesterday for the very reason that we have a better squad, a better manager and are the home side. We could play badly and still win, something which we absolutely cannot do against sides like Newcastle. Should we beat Everton, it will demonstrate nothing.
[/quote)
Im sorry Leon its quite patronising to say im missing the point. I get your point, but I disagree.
To say next week (if we win) demonstrates nothing,’is just plain ridiculous really. Every game brings it challenges.
So from you say only games against the so called top six will define our season.
Man City drew to us at VP last season under Stevie G, did that define their season. There are so many examples it would be dull to listen them all.
No offence or patronising intended. Guess we just disagree on the points which is fine; opinion makes the world go round.
No worries Leon…quoteathon over for everyone elses sake. UTV
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If you must have a quotathon could you at least try to do it properly?
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A big big reality check.
I'm glad I was camping and didn't see it
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A big big reality check.
I'm glad I was camping and didn't see it
Oooh Matron !!
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A big big reality check.
I'm glad I was camping and didn't see it
Oooh Matron !!
He don't care do he? He's bold!
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If you must have a quotathon could you at least try to do it properly?
Even trying to quote a quote and respond to it seemed to just put it into the quote after awhile. Not sure how to change it! Maybe it was just too much quoting?
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A big big reality check.
I'm glad I was camping and didn't see it
Oooh Matron !!
He is usually very intents.
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So, he put a tent pole up on the day we got spanked.
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We have not seen the team in such total disarray under Emery. This was a chastening and potentially scarring defeat. The first time we have seen a lack of commitment to the cause from a few, there was a point in the second half we were reduced to walking with the ball with no idea what to do. The selection was wrong and it got worse from there, they ran past Bailey as if he wasn’t there and behind him was the lamentable Cash. Despite this we carved out some decent chances and could have been a high scoring game but we looked vulnerable to every attack.
A lot of work to do on and off the pitch , this is a defeat that could have consequences.
I just hope it makes us stronger but it might not.
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I think we'll be fine personally. We have players to come back and hopefully players still to come in. Replacing Mings is something that needs to be got right but I'm not too worried overall.
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As I said before, our next couple of games are two that we absolutely should be winning. We'll get a good sense of whether Newcastle was just a one off aberration from those.
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I haven't watched it. But I still have a view.
We were excited about this season because of the manager and players we have. Then arguably our best in ore season got a season ending injury a couple of days before. Our leader for the last few years then suffered a season ending injury at 2-1 when we were still in the game. He was in severe pain and very distressed.
Newcastle pressed us at that point and we were in bits. Buendia, Mings, Ramsey, Moreno and Young all then not available who were when we trounced them. Letting Young go weakened the leadership team which didn't seem like a big deal at the time but is now.
We will bounce back and I can see us putting 4 past Everton. There's a week to prepare, to get over the psychological blow. You can bet Mings will be there this week, supporting the rest of the squad.
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I haven't watched it. But I still have a view.
We were excited about this season because of the manager and players we have. Then arguably our best in ore season got a season ending injury a couple of days before. Our leader for the last few years then suffered a season ending injury at 2-1 when we were still in the game. He was in severe pain and very distressed.
Newcastle pressed us at that point and we were in bits. Buendia, Mings, Ramsey, Moreno and Young all then not available who were when we trounced them. Letting Young go weakened the leadership team which didn't seem like a big deal at the time but is now.
We will bounce back and I can see us putting 4 past Everton. There's a week to prepare, to get over the psychological blow. You can bet Mings will be there this week, supporting the rest of the squad.
Mings was available though, and we'd conceded two of the five goals with him playing. The set up from the off was just completely wrong.
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It's the first time the high line has been really exposed. It will be against a side like Newcastle who have pace and skill in attack. I wished we had set up a bit more defensive from the start. Nullify them, frustrate them and build from there. Bailey should not have started this game and so it proved. We were in it for the first 45mins. Watkins really should have buried that chance he dragged wide and Cash should have been more composed with the follow up shot from Diaby's effort 2nd half. One of those goes in and it's a different game. I thought Torres did well in a difficult game to start his time with us. Looked confident, brought the ball out well and was accurate with his passing. Diaby was a threat. So there are some positives to be taken from the game but not many. We conceded to much in midfield and it felt like Newcastle would score every time they went forward.
I'm changing my first manager sacking in the Prem too, it won't be Howe.
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I haven't watched it. But I still have a view.
We were excited about this season because of the manager and players we have. Then arguably our best in ore season got a season ending injury a couple of days before. Our leader for the last few years then suffered a season ending injury at 2-1 when we were still in the game. He was in severe pain and very distressed.
Newcastle pressed us at that point and we were in bits. Buendia, Mings, Ramsey, Moreno and Young all then not available who were when we trounced them. Letting Young go weakened the leadership team which didn't seem like a big deal at the time but is now.
We will bounce back and I can see us putting 4 past Everton. There's a week to prepare, to get over the psychological blow. You can bet Mings will be there this week, supporting the rest of the squad.
Mings was available though, and we'd conceded two of the five goals with him playing. The set up from the off was just completely wrong.
This.
Mings didn't look great, and neither did the rest of the defence before he got injured.
I don't really think Digne is that good of a left back. Always seems to get caught out by people arriving late into the box
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I think Digne is shite, and have done since he arrived.
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It was weird watching Newcastle just waltzing thru our midfield and defence at will in that last 30 minutes.
Unai will have us at it for Sunday is the straw I'm clutching as some sort of consolation.
I just wish the game was tomorrow rather than nearly a week away. Need to wash away the stain of that performance.
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I think Digne is shite, and have done since he arrived.
With Gerrard's signings other than Kamara - high wage, low sell on value due to age. Those so far, some due to injury, has demonstrated their value.
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for the first goal Bailey lost his runner but who didn't follow the Tonali run in ?
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The set up from the off was just completely wrong.
Yes, agree. The team didn't really look focussed in those first few minutes; cavalier might be a word to use in that they were running round like headless chickens. McGinn being on the left, after having terrorised Burn last season, and Bailey being on the pitch at all were immediate concerns.
Having said that, the Jawdies set about us and didn't allow us to find any rhythm.
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I think Digne is shite, and have done since he arrived.
That's nonsense mate, to be fair. He was one of our better performers on Saturday (albeit in a tallest dwarf competition) and it was his cross that led to the goal. He's not as good as Moreno, but more than played his part last year.
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Mings also to blame a bit for the first two goals I thought. Defensively we were all over the place from early on, that's on Emery. That first goal was shocking from multiple players, good save from Martinez from distance pushing ball to safety, they recycle ball back out to left. Bailey to start with half heartedly tracks Gordon, his cross takes out Cash (no man's land when he should be at front post) and 2 x CBs (Konsa mistimes his jump like a pub player, Mings dragged over with the forward to front post), Digne as always soft as butter in the physical contest. Also watch Kamara's pitiful attempts to track Tonali to start with, runs off the back of him so easily. That's 6 players all really poor. Second, Cash got caught like an idiot behind defensive line at the set piece and Mings I thought let Isak go too easily too.
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I think Digne is shite, and have done since he arrived.
That's nonsense mate, to be fair. He was one of our better performers on Saturday (albeit in a tallest dwarf competition) and it was his cross that led to the goal. He's not as good as Moreno, but more than played his part last year.
No, sorry mate, I'm not having it and I've been consistent with it. He's shite, and very expensive shite too, one average cross that got flicked on notwithstanding.
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for the first goal Bailey lost his runner but who didn't follow the Tonali run in ?
Even when he does get back he is too weak in the tackle
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I think Digne is shite, and have done since he arrived.
That's nonsense mate, to be fair. He was one of our better performers on Saturday (albeit in a tallest dwarf competition) and it was his cross that led to the goal. He's not as good as Moreno, but more than played his part last year.
No, sorry mate, I'm not having it and I've been consistent with it. He's shite, and very expensive shite too, one average cross that got flicked on notwithstanding.
The answer is somewhere in between. He’s more a stay at home defender than Moreno, who is very comfortable playing both attack and defence roles all game long. Digne doesn’t have the ability or engine for that so when he gets caught out of position it looks bad. But against weaker sides Digne will be fine, which is most of this division. Newcastle exposed us this weekend much like we did to them at Villa Park. It happens. Good teams sometimes get beaten and good players sometimes look less than their maximum ability. Digne isn’t he long term in that position because he won’t fit the system.
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I think Digne is shite, and have done since he arrived.
That's nonsense mate, to be fair. He was one of our better performers on Saturday (albeit in a tallest dwarf competition) and it was his cross that led to the goal. He's not as good as Moreno, but more than played his part last year.
No, sorry mate, I'm not having it and I've been consistent with it. He's shite, and very expensive shite too, one average cross that got flicked on notwithstanding.
The cross also deflected off a Barcode in our favour. Thanfully Ollie was resourceful and Diaby was fcuking clinical.
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Mings was available though, and we'd conceded two of the five goals with him playing. The set up from the off was just completely wrong.
Yep, and we were well in the game (2-1 down) despite being the poorer team. Given Emery's track record, I'd have backed him to sort it. However, it just didn't work at all and we sounded all over the place. Which is odd.
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For me the strangest choice of the day was taking McGinn off and replacing him with Carlos after 64 minutes and we'd only just gone 3-1 down. It was the last half hour where we just fell apart completely. We were still in it until that point, and even when the goal went in I thought if we get one back quickly enough there's plenty of time to push for the draw.
I know McGinn wasn't doing much but move him to the other side, or replace him with an attacking player. Emery either has no faith in any of our subs at that point, or he thought we were playing a 2 leg tie.
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It could have been worse - imagine if Martinez had been sent off for that tomfoolery on Almiron!!!
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For me the strangest choice of the day was taking McGinn off and replacing him with Carlos after 64 minutes and we'd only just gone 3-1 down. It was the last half hour where we just fell apart completely. We were still in it until that point, and even when the goal went in I thought if we get one back quickly enough there's plenty of time to push for the draw.
I know McGinn wasn't doing much but move him to the other side, or replace him with an attacking player. Emery either has no faith in any of our subs at that point, or he thought we were playing a 2 leg tie.
I wasn't sure why he took off McGinn, but I can sure as hell see why he brought on Carlos: he had to give the guy some minutes, given the loss of Mings! I'd have taken off Cash for Carlos.
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It was a masterclass in headless chicken performing from start to finish. Embarrassing to watch.
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For me the strangest choice of the day was taking McGinn off and replacing him with Carlos after 64 minutes and we'd only just gone 3-1 down. It was the last half hour where we just fell apart completely. We were still in it until that point, and even when the goal went in I thought if we get one back quickly enough there's plenty of time to push for the draw.
I know McGinn wasn't doing much but move him to the other side, or replace him with an attacking player. Emery either has no faith in any of our subs at that point, or he thought we were playing a 2 leg tie.
I wasn't sure why he took off McGinn, but I can sure as hell see why he brought on Carlos: he had to give the guy some minutes, given the loss of Mings! I'd have taken off Cash for Carlos.
Yeah, that's a fair point. Maybe 40 minutes of Konsa and Torres was enough for Emery to start planning ahead.
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Dermot Gallagher sticking up for VAR/refs again on sky today
INCIDENT:
‘Newcastle’s second goal through Alexander Isak was subject to an offside check. No lines here – who is playing Sven Botman onside and why were no lines drawn?’
DERMOT GALLAGHER SAYS:
“RIGHT CALL.
“Burn isn’t offside and he plays it to Isak to score. Botman is in an offside position but doesn’t take part in the move.
“People will say he does because he blocks off Cash but the feeling is Cash ran into him.
“The VAR has to make three decisions:
“Is Burn offside? No.
“Is Botman offside? Yes but not taking part in the move.
“Does he interfere with Cash? He feels no.”
Stephen Warnock:
“Botman shuffles ever so slightly to the side. One step is enough to stop the run. That’s obstruction. But it’s difficult to pick up.”
Sue Smith:
“I thought that was a foul. I thought Cash would have got back in.”
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It was a masterclass in headless chicken performing from start to finish. Embarrassing to watch.
Parts of the second half (probably because it was Newcastle) reminded me of that first half when Spurs went up there and got battered.
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As ever, the refs think they know better than the players, which is how the players get away with it.
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I think Digne is shite, and have done since he arrived.
Agreed, he's a nothing player really. Tidy left foot on the ball but just average at everything else. Moreno is so much more dynamic. Digne is one paced and physically weak.
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For me the strangest choice of the day was taking McGinn off and replacing him with Carlos after 64 minutes and we'd only just gone 3-1 down. It was the last half hour where we just fell apart completely. We were still in it until that point, and even when the goal went in I thought if we get one back quickly enough there's plenty of time to push for the draw.
I know McGinn wasn't doing much but move him to the other side, or replace him with an attacking player. Emery either has no faith in any of our subs at that point, or he thought we were playing a 2 leg tie.
I wasn't sure why he took off McGinn, but I can sure as hell see why he brought on Carlos: he had to give the guy some minutes, given the loss of Mings! I'd have taken off Cash for Carlos.
I just hope watching Konsa getting destroyed at RCB (of a three) or Cash further up was enough evidence for Emery not to try it again. We seem to have wasted a lot of pre season trying to get the third centre back into the team. It won't work and unbalances the team completely. I just fear the easy way out will be taken v Everton with Konsa at RB and Cash dropped..
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Dermot Gallagher sticking up for VAR/refs again on sky today
INCIDENT:
‘Newcastle’s second goal through Alexander Isak was subject to an offside check. No lines here – who is playing Sven Botman onside and why were no lines drawn?’
DERMOT GALLAGHER SAYS:
“RIGHT CALL.
“Burn isn’t offside and he plays it to Isak to score. Botman is in an offside position but doesn’t take part in the move.
“People will say he does because he blocks off Cash but the feeling is Cash ran into him.
“The VAR has to make three decisions:
“Is Burn offside? No.
“Is Botman offside? Yes but not taking part in the move.
“Does he interfere with Cash? He feels no.”
Stephen Warnock:
“Botman shuffles ever so slightly to the side. One step is enough to stop the run. That’s obstruction. But it’s difficult to pick up.”
Sue Smith:
“I thought that was a foul. I thought Cash would have got back in.”
Gallagher is a weasel little bell-end.
He always finds a way to twist things into making the decision the right call, unless its one of the media favourite clubs.
How anybody could think that Cash ran into the Newcastle player is beyond me.
Anybody with eyes & half a brain cell can tell that Cash is running back as part of an offside tactic.
Why the fuck would 'he' run into Burn? What possible advantage would that give to Villa?
Fucking moron...
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I think Digne is shite, and have done since he arrived.
Agreed, he's a nothing player really. Tidy left foot on the ball but just average at everything else. Moreno is so much more dynamic. Digne is one paced and physically weak.
Yes, that's it exactly.
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I think Digne is shite, and have done since he arrived.
Agreed, he's a nothing player really. Tidy left foot on the ball but just average at everything else. Moreno is so much more dynamic. Digne is one paced and physically weak.
Yes, that's it exactly.
Agreed...
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It was a masterclass in headless chicken performing from start to finish. Embarrassing to watch.
Pretty much agree. We won't play as bad all season and the Saudis won't have an easier opposition.
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How was Barnes not offside for their fourth goal?
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It was a masterclass in headless chicken performing from start to finish. Embarrassing to watch.
Parts of the second half (probably because it was Newcastle) reminded me of that first half when Spurs went up there and got battered.
I thought the 1st half was equally shambolic
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I think by how the rules are drafted they’re all onside. That being said though I think the rules make it incredibly hard to defend. I think if someone is getting an advance from being well offside, which enables them to be in an advanced position when the next phase begins it feels inherently dodgy.
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I think by how the rules are drafted they’re all onside. That being said though I think the rules make it incredibly hard to defend. I think if someone is getting an advance from being well offside, which enables them to be in an advanced position when the next phase begins it feels inherently dodgy.
My problem was the pick/screen play on Cash. He was clearly impeded by someone in an offside position and if that's allowed than we should be doing it on every set piece. Now, running off a teammates shoulder to run into space is one thing, but their objective was clear.
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No lines drawn when they're checking offsides for goals against us.
But when we score, you can guarantee they'll bring in fucking NASA to show that a hair on Ollie's shin was 1.5774 nanometres beyond the last defender.
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For me the strangest choice of the day was taking McGinn off and replacing him with Carlos after 64 minutes and we'd only just gone 3-1 down. It was the last half hour where we just fell apart completely. We were still in it until that point, and even when the goal went in I thought if we get one back quickly enough there's plenty of time to push for the draw.
I know McGinn wasn't doing much but move him to the other side, or replace him with an attacking player. Emery either has no faith in any of our subs at that point, or he thought we were playing a 2 leg tie.
I wasn't sure why he took off McGinn, but I can sure as hell see why he brought on Carlos: he had to give the guy some minutes, given the loss of Mings! I'd have taken off Cash for Carlos.
I just hope watching Konsa getting destroyed at RCB (of a three) or Cash further up was enough evidence for Emery not to try it again. We seem to have wasted a lot of pre season trying to get the third centre back into the team. It won't work and unbalances the team completely. I just fear the easy way out will be taken v Everton with Konsa at RB and Cash dropped..
I don’t think Emery can be accused of taking the easy way out with anything he’s done since being at the club, and whats pre season for if not to try things. Terrible performance on Saturday, but some revisionism of Emery and the tactics he favours. Not saying he didnt get it wrong on Saturday, but he’s always favoured a lop sided defence
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No lines drawn when they're checking offsides for goals against us.
But when we score, you can guarantee they'll bring in fucking NASA to show that a hair on Ollie's shin was 1.5774 nanometres beyond the last defender.
With the first one, it wasn't really a lines drawn situation though, it's whether the people involved were interfering with play. Lines drawn wouldn't have helped our case.
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No lines drawn when they're checking offsides for goals against us.
But when we score, you can guarantee they'll bring in fucking NASA to show that a hair on Ollie's shin was 1.5774 nanometres beyond the last defender.
With the first one, it wasn't really a lines drawn situation though, it's whether the people involved were interfering with play. Lines drawn wouldn't have helped our case.
You’re probably right but what he said is also true. They will give offside against by a bollock hair.
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True, and we’ve had it go for and against us.
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I think they only show the lines now when it's deemed offside ie. overturning a goal. That's how it seemed anyway at the weekend. If the goal is good they don't bother showing the lines to confirm ??
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No lines drawn when they're checking offsides for goals against us.
The package they have bought is basic with limited use of lines and they wanted to save some for Chelsea/Pool game, you know big clubs.
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The point is Isak was miles onside when he scored, so drawing lines was pointless. The decision was whether the others were interfering with play.
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I think by how the rules are drafted they’re all onside. That being said though I think the rules make it incredibly hard to defend. I think if someone is getting an advance from being well offside, which enables them to be in an advanced position when the next phase begins it feels inherently dodgy.
Yeah, it's so obviously against what the point of offside is that I don't understand why the rules aren't altered. It's bullshit. Hopefully we'll benefit from this at some point.
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They just analysed some of the game on Monday Night Football on Sky, it has to be said that Kamara had an absolute shocker. All over the place for their goals.
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They just analysed some of the game on Monday Night Football on Sky, it has to be said that Kamara had an absolute shocker. All over the place for their goals.
Yep he had a real nightmare.
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If emi had been sent off we would have olden in goal vs Everton. Yikes
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If emi had been sent off we would have olsen in goal vs Everton. Yikes
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If emi had been sent off we would have olden in goal vs Everton. Yikes
I bet they still wouldn't score.
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Barry Glendenning got it spot on in his assessment of us on the Granuiad podcast.
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For me the strangest choice of the day was taking McGinn off and replacing him with Carlos after 64 minutes and we'd only just gone 3-1 down. It was the last half hour where we just fell apart completely. We were still in it until that point, and even when the goal went in I thought if we get one back quickly enough there's plenty of time to push for the draw.
I know McGinn wasn't doing much but move him to the other side, or replace him with an attacking player. Emery either has no faith in any of our subs at that point, or he thought we were playing a 2 leg tie.
I wasn't sure why he took off McGinn, but I can sure as hell see why he brought on Carlos: he had to give the guy some minutes, given the loss of Mings! I'd have taken off Cash for Carlos.
I just hope watching Konsa getting destroyed at RCB (of a three) or Cash further up was enough evidence for Emery not to try it again. We seem to have wasted a lot of pre season trying to get the third centre back into the team. It won't work and unbalances the team completely. I just fear the easy way out will be taken v Everton with Konsa at RB and Cash dropped..
I don’t think Emery can be accused of taking the easy way out with anything he’s done since being at the club, and whats pre season for if not to try things. Terrible performance on Saturday, but some revisionism of Emery and the tactics he favours. Not saying he didnt get it wrong on Saturday, but he’s always favoured a lop sided defence
I don't recall him trying three centre backs last season, maybe the odd time when Chambers came on at right back. I do recall a daft attempt trying Cash at right mid at home to I think Wolves that at least he dumped at half time. Cash won't ever be good enough at RWB or Konsa at RB or RCB of a 3. It irks me that it's been tried.
There was no reason at all to go with Diaby & Bailey either. Not sure how many more times Bailey has to let us down, away from home especially, for the penny to finally drop that he can't be trusted. That selection decision screwed up our shape in midfield. Lots of players had nightmare performances but that also extends to Emery on the sideline.
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Barry Glendenning got it spot on in his assessment of us on the Granuiad podcast.
Yeah, you have to back Emery to sort it.
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https://talksport.com/football/1533839/
Funny old game innit