Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Match Threads & Player Ratings => Topic started by: Bad English on January 08, 2023, 06:26:38 PM
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When you take the piss with your selections this is what happens.
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We have some shit at the club. Plus wrong approach.
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Fully deserved. Sanson did well. Everyone else was fucking shit. Including the manager.
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Bunch of arseholes. Ought to be ashamed of themselves. There goes any hope of a trophy for another fucking year. Furious.
Congratulations to Stevenage.
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Our second string are third rate. Humiliating and completely avoidable.
If I never see Bailey in a Villa shirt again I won't be disappointed.
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Awful, just awful..
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Hahaha fucking hell. Our mentality was appauling throughout. Fair play Stevenage.
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Just remarkable.
Olsen - beaten like the utter fucking chump he is.
Bailey - not good enough yet again
Coutinho - pathetic
Dendoncker - brainless ******
The total lack of marking for their second goal, a thing of absolute horror.
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Selections or not that team should have won that tie by 2 or 3 clear goals. The players we have simply aren’t good enough. Absolute shite we’ve spaffed fucking millions on.
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Where do you start with that? What a bloody shambles. Half the squad aren't good enough. Half the first team aren't good enough ffs.
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That’s why we haven’t won the FA cup in 60 years
Management and players don’t take it seriously enough
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Nothing to do with the selection. That team should have been far too good for stevenage. The individual players were not up to it though. Olsen is garbage. Chambers was garbage. Luiz and coutinheo couldn't impose themselves against a league 2 outfit. Bailey is a waste of a shirt. Etc etc
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In before the site crash.
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Utter shite
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The manager has disrespected our club and has shown no understanding of the FA Cup.
Idiotic
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Emery out!
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Let's hope that in next year's third round we're drawn away to Man Utd/Man City/Liverpool/Arsenal. At least the inevitable defeat won't be a humiliating embarrassment.
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Have we ever been involved in a more embarrassing FA Cup exit.
Total humiliation
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Sell everyone on the pitch for us.
Clearly not up to it.
Clearly not our year. Again.
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Bailey hasn't got 'it', Coutinho has lost 'it', Olsen never had 'it' and Cash has close to fuck all end product. Our 2nd string is just piss poor.
Stevenage deserved it.
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As always with Villa a new low is never very far away.
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Fucking booooooooooooo
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Well done Stevenage. No complaints.
Sadly, I have really grown to hate the FA Cup. Pretty much my entire life, all I can remember are the 2000 & 2015 finals, losing to Man Utd (often in improbable circumstances) and generally playing like we don't care.
I don't even think of it as a competition at the beginning of the season, rather a tedious and usually brief obligatory stroll towards embarrassment.
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The manager has disrespected our club and has shown no understanding of the FA Cup.
Idiotic
and the players gave it 100% and shown full respect for the FA cup :)
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The manager has disrespected our club and has shown no understanding of the FA Cup.
Idiotic
and the players gave it 100% and shown full respect for the FA cup :)
However, it is not uncommon for Emery's Arsenal teams to make mistakes when playing out of the back. So seen that before
As comfortable as it was, I was disappointed hadn't had a cushion of goals towards the end.
And Dendoncker must be blamed for the defeat. His daydream and fouling led to the penalty and sending off. It was never a penalty because it was a foul outside the box. It's very poor officiating and VAR use.
I then thought well very poor to draw this match.
But of course somehow we contrived to lose as concede second goal.
And here it was blame Buendia for losing possession up field and conceding the corner, Watkins for failing to come out to block the shot, and Olsen for failing to save it.
It's truly unbelievable.
I can't quite fanthom how we actually lost as a draw was annoying enough.
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The manager has disrespected our club and has shown no understanding of the FA Cup.
Idiotic
What utter garbage. He has won more cups in ten years than we have in 40 years. He hasn't signed a single player yet. A premier-league squad should be beating Stevenage, it's on the players.
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That must go down as the worst giant killing embarrassment in my Villa supporting life. Pathetic.
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Olsen back to his Nyland impression. It's like having no keeper at all.
Not that he's solely responsible for that catastrofuck.
Well played Stevenage.
We're big on video data now, apparently. This match should be played and played again to Emery or any future Villa manager tempted to piss about with selections to that degree in a major cup competition.
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The manager has disrespected our club and has shown no understanding of the FA Cup.
Idiotic
Every Prem team plays squad players in the FA Cup. We had by far the better players on the pitch today but our "game intelligence" was woeful.
And that winning goal an absolute horror-show. A Sunday League team wouldn't defend a corner like that.
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When you take the piss with your selections this is what happens.
There was nothing much wrong with the selection, the team picked should of have had more than enough to beat a team from Div 2. The players are to blame here.
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Nothing to do with the selection. That team should have been far too good for Stevenage.
Fair enough. But the fact remains that the manager selected a team (and the substitutes), and we are out. Captain Hindsight here.
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most embarrassing defeat of the round.. of course it’s Villa. Get Olsen out tomorrow, sit Bailey for a month and stop fucking about with crap players.
Fucking livid right now. At home to an absolute Blues Stevenage side.
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Dion had it right from about the first minute when he said we needed to be moving it about with a bit of a zip. We didn’t and it was utter shite.
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Have we ever been involved in a more embarrassing FA Cup exit.
Total humiliation
Stand to be corrected but I think the last time we went out to a Div 4 side was Southend in 1971. Our keeper that day (Tommy Hughes) had a stinker and never appeared in a Villa shirt again.
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To be fair to Unai. The selection should beat a league 2 side if they put a shift in. Clearly there is work to do, we have to give him a chance. We are not going to win every game. It will take time to develop the squad. This at least gives him a clearer idea of what is required. Frankly I was not at all surprised at this result , we seem to have a habit of this.
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F-cking dreadful! Absolutely f-cking dreadful!
Other than Sanson every other player should be f-cking disgusted with that! Substitutions didn’t improve us at all. Captain for the last home match...where was Young’s leadership when he came on alongside 2 poor cbs. An international goalkeeper who gets beaten at his near post by a daisy cutter is f-cking disgraceful and what kind of hospital ball was that to dendoncker for their 1st. We were sh-t throughout and barely troubled their keeper.
The lot of them can just go and f-ck off!
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Olsen was crap. Bailey was crap. Ings was crap. Coutinho was crap. Anyone else.
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There should be some fucking public beheadings for that second goal.
Absolutely nobody anywhere near the scorer when the corner comes out to him, all the time in the world, and our fucking useless keeper gets easily beaten at his near post.
Comedically piss poor.
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It’s like waiting for an ambulance trying to get on to this site.
Everything is broken these days.
Obviously no deliberate disrespect by Emery but I don’t think he realises just how bad some of our players are. The list is getting bigger match by match.
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An awful display from start to finish.
Over 90 mins there goalie has barely had a save to make.
It's a typical feature of the modern daygame; squad players come in with a misplaced arrogance. They thought they could stroll round at a testimonal pace going nowhere with tippy tappy passing and were well and truly found out.
Bailey, PC, Cash, Olsen, & the left back not good enpough for sarters.
Take a look at the winner again...Watkins shows all of his bravery by turning his back and practically jumping put of the way.
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Utterly pathetic. And so Villa. Change the manager, change the owners, change the players and we still lose to a lower league side AGAIN! WTF? They never actually played with any conviction. Too slow, too ponderous and acted like Stebeage were atop side - well they were better than us today. Spitting blood here about that performance.
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One FA cup win since losing in the final in 2014 is some record but not one to be fucking proud of. Premier league managers constantly bang on about wanting to do well in the cups yet put out reserve sides against lower league opponents who are always up for it.
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Nothing to do with the selection. That team should have been far too good for Stevenage.
Fair enough. But the fact remains that the manager selected a team (and the substitutes), and we are out. Captain Hindsight here.
I'd say it's all about selection.
How many years have Villa messed about with the line up when the 3rd round comes round and we draw "lesser sides"?
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Difficult to know what to say after that. A braindead turn on his penalty box by Dendonker aside we'd have won it, people would've been saying routine, if uninspired win. My internet crashed after the penalty so I haven't seen their winner. But to capitulate like that against a 4th division side is somewhat worrying.
I'm not as bothered about the FA Cup as many on here are, but this defeat is pretty embarrassing and unnecessarily dents a good start by Emery. We looked totally uncomfortable with having most of the possession and never looked really dangerous with the ball.
The most disappointing thing (after the result itself) is Coutihno's performance. He looks finished I'm afraid, and the look on his face when subbed was one of acknowledgement of that fact.
Bailey was totally wasteful again. Ings looked old. I'd sell both if we can.
From here, we must have a big transfer window. This game's all about momentum and losing that in the way we did has fucked our momentum right up.
Sigh.
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That must go down as the worst giant killing embarrassment in my Villa supporting life. Pathetic.
It's still Doncaster. We were shit today but still dominated, Doncaster we were outclassed everywhere.
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That's the most Villa thing I've seen in quite some time. We totally Villa'd that game. Absolutely dreadful but pretty much in the bag then a couple of moments of insanity.
Everyone bar probably Sanson and Augustinsson were dreadful today.
Well done Stevenage. Kept plugging away, worked incredibly hard and fully deserved. Opportunistic with their chances.
Dendonkey was woeful. Chambers look very good last season but has looked like a pub player whenever he's appeared this season.
Why on Earth can't Leon Bailey actually kick a ball properly? He also looks painfully slow. It's shocking.
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That is by far the most embarrassing performance and result in all my time supporting Villa.
We should've started strong, and complacency persisted all game.
When we lost to Bradford, it was bad, but this caps the lot.
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Just remarkable.
Olsen - beaten like the utter fucking chump he is.
Bailey - not good enough yet again
Coutinho - pathetic
Dendoncker - brainless ******
The total lack of marking for their second goal, a thing of absolute horror.
Dendonker was an idiot, Olsen was at fault for both goals. Why play that pass to Dendonker at that moment? All risk and no reward. Then his goalkeeping for the second was astonishingly bad. But fuck knows how you just allow someone to run into the box and shoot like that.
It’s an utterly pathetic effort and every single one of them, bar Sanson, should be ashamed of their efforts. The FA Cup effort from Villa in the last 7 years has been chronic, but this is a new level of shame.
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That must go down as the worst giant killing embarrassment in my Villa supporting life. Pathetic.
It's still Doncaster. We were shit today but still dominated, Doncaster we were outclassed everywhere.
Yes. Doncaster was more embarrassing although not sure what division they were in at the time
I'm sure Bradford were in a worse position than Stevenage...and that was over two legs!
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Absolute shambles
I really hope some of these players never play for us again. I’m not giving the manager a free pass but our under 21s should be able to beat Stevenage. The brainless fuck that got sent off was playing for one of the World Cup favourites a week ago - no manager in the world can legislate for international players being so continually useless
Whoever signed Olsen should be sacked - he has cost us exits in both cups - all are fullbacks - bar the 37 yo Young are championship standard at best
Luiz, Bailey, Phil all need a rocket up their arse and a reminder that if they were half as good as they think they are we would have won that
The thing that grinds my gears the most is this is what we have seen under the last 3 managers - as soon as our backs are to the wall we start looking like spineless chancers
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Still in a bit of shock about that. No urgency or real.effort to.get a second and it has cost us. When we.did get opportunities, we were just so wasteful and Bailey on the right just isn't working.
Credit goes to Stevenage. They were workmanlike at best, but stayed in the contest and took their chances when they came. That is an absolutely horrific and embarrassing result for us though.
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Sick of buendia losing the bloody ball
Lightweight,makes the wrong decisions..
Got caught out again before their corner .
Always giving the ball away
Fucked off
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That must go down as the worst giant killing embarrassment in my Villa supporting life. Pathetic.
It's still Doncaster. We were shit today but still dominated, Doncaster we were outclassed everywhere.
Bradford is the worst by far. Semi final over two legs.
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stop this fucking tipy tapy football, back to the GK/out to the centre half back to the G/K
if the manager took this seriously he would have not played the stiffs to start, put out your first team get a lead and then experiment
They may be Div 4 but they are a team, I think only lost 1 in last 14 we were a grouping of players with no cohesion or plan
words fail me on some of the Individual performances, to move on very few of todays team will feature, the three guys with names to long to type, chambers. Coutinho, Olsen, Watkins, Buendia, Bailey they can all fuck off
Upgrades on, Cash
Worst Cup humiliation in my 60 years +
Well done to Stevenage, well drilled, kept formation and deserved the win
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Don’t see the manager as culpable in this.
Everyone on the pitch had a reason to be sparkling and inspirational. They weren’t, possibly with the exception of Sansom who made the most of the only move there was in the first 45.
Subs were logical but the sheer inertia of the team came from those playing.
I still can’t believe that this team fell apart after a red card but it says such a lot about the lack of nous and leadership, whoever was meant to be senior, clued in, and know what they were doing.
Sell the dead wood. After this, we know who’s ligging a living.
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The stench of mediocrity that has surrounded this club for too long still lingers and has just got worse. An appalling performance from players who should’ve walked this game, in fact some of them did but not in a good way.
Clueless in every sense of the word and we’ve got to have a huge cull and allow Emery to install professionalism throughout this club. If anyone needed a reason as to why some don’t get a game then it’s here for all to see. I’ve got faith in Emery but he’s got a monumental task on his hands building a squad to challenge for anything.
What an embarrassment!!!!!
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Absolute masterclass from Dendonker and Bailey in particular. Taxi for Dendonker. Leon, get daddy to come and pick you up to take you somewhere. Anywhere.
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When you've got a squad of players who know they're playing the biggest game of their lives up against a squad who arrogantly assume they can play with the intensity of a training match, it can't be too much of a surprise that the committed squad wins in the end.
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I totally blame the players for this as some of them were so pedestrian, so lacking in desire and hunger for the win that the game was Stevenage's for the taking if they got their tactics right. I will be interested to hear what the manager says about this performance and, looking ahead, back him totally to build us a winning Villa squad.
Well done and congrats to Stevenage.
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Its absolutely shambles and I won't get over this for a while!
Seeing or hearing another fa cup game this season will make weep! I had thought it was our year after what Emery said.
Villa play Leeds friday it hard to go on but at least have a game to get back to.
Clearly some issue playing up against some low legaue opposition who didn't offer anything and was hard motivation for several players.
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. Fucking shambolic bunch of ****** our players and Unai you can fuck off as well for not taking this game seriously. I hate you all, all of you so called players and the coach you can all fuck off to the end of the earth.
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I really wasn't concerned for 70 odd minutes with the one goal lead but then there's a few nerves as it gets later but fuck me, what goals to concede. First horrendous individual error, second awful, awful collective error not to be picking the bloke up. So bad it's almost funny.
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We can only win 3 trophies. The league is currently out of reach. So the cups require a maximum six games to win. If we wont play our strongest XI why bother entering the competitions?
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When you take the piss with your selections this is what happens.
The team selected at the start had us 1-0 up. The side that finished game which is pretty much the first XI is the one that collapsed.
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Emery hasn't brought a player in yet. He can see the crap we see.
A change of personnel against a league 2 team, at home,and still we are sooo slow in our play it's bloody painful!!
So, Unai, time to get that axe out!
The exit asap to: Bailey, Coutinho, Cash,Watkins, Mings, Augustine, Deaddonkey and a man stealing a living as a professional goalie,Olsen ---------------by the way, isn't defending a corner the job of our brilliant set piece couch too!
Well done to Stevenage though, I wish we had their fight.
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Probably the most humiliating VP cup defeat, can't think of any worse.
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When you take the piss with your selections this is what happens.
The team selected at the start had us 1-0 up. The side that finished game which is pretty much the first XI is the one that collapsed.
I don't think so. No Martinez, Mings, Kamara, McGinn...
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For those focusing on the selection, on my count 12 of the players involved today, played some part against spurs away this time last week. Im not trying to give Emery a free pass as no one is above criticism and ultimately its his job to get the players mentally and tactically right to win today. But he had enough players in that team who are first teamers or thereabouts and they should be winning that comfortably. We have a proven winner as manager, we need to start moving some of the players on.
Two other points, footy has already mentioned this and he’s correct. Dendonker clearly fouled their player initially a yard or two outside the box, he deserved to be sent off, but it should of been a free kick, if VAR does its job, the game probably turns out differently despite the poor performance.
Beundia giving the ball away that late in the game was criminal. Watkins initially falling asleep at the near post then putting in a pathetic attempted block, was worse, Olsen leaving a huge gap at his near post….sigh.
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That must go down as the worst giant killing embarrassment in my Villa supporting life. Pathetic.
Losing to Fourth Division Bradford over two legs of the LC semi final in 2013 still takes it for me.
But this is up there.
We actually got worse when our subs came on. And it's not as if we looked too clever beforehand.
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the one positive is that the transfer window is open now and tonight's bag of wank shows that there's so many turds that Emery won't be able to polish.
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I never understand the logic of ‘resting’ a goalkeeper.
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A lot of players need to go but who the fuck would buy them.
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OK, so, the manager of course deserves his share. Motivation is partly the coach's responsibility of course, and the tone is set at the top. If the tone is half-arsed, or if he's not but fails to get his point across, obviously he's failed.
However.
The selection is not the issue. These weren't the kids or the bomb squad, every single one of those players are in contention every week for a place. To a man, played for their countries, or in Europe, all played in one of the big European leagues for practically all their careers. One week of each of their wages would pay for God knows how much of their opposite number's salary.
It's a team, in short, that would have expected themselves to compete in a Premier League game. And what they have managed to do today should haunt them for the rest of their careers. Shameful in the extreme.
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When you take the piss with your selections this is what happens.
The team selected at the start had us 1-0 up. The side that finished game which is pretty much the first XI is the one that collapsed.
I don't think so. No Martinez, Mings, Kamara, McGinn...
One of whom is injured. Seasoned internationals started this game today, hardly putting out the under 16s.
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When you've got a squad of players who know they're playing the biggest game of their lives up against a squad who arrogantly assume they can play with the intensity of a training match, it can't be too much of a surprise that the committed squad wins in the end.
I agree completely especially if you factor in that they are nowhere near the quality they think they are.
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We weren't very good for most of that game.
For 89 minutes it was just shaping up as win 1-0 and pretend that match never happened.
The last 5 minutes means we'll never forget it now for all the wrong results.
I really really hope we're not reverting to type with performances especially at VP.
After today from the established players Cash, Coutinho and Bailey really shouldn't be starting for foreseeable future.
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OK, so, the manager of course deserves his share. Motivation is partly the coach's responsibility of course, and the tone is set at the top. If the tone is half-arsed, or if he's not but fails to get his point across, obviously he's failed.
However.
The selection is not the issue. These weren't the kids or the bomb squad, every single one of those players are in contention every week for a place. To a man, played for their countries, or in Europe, all played in one of the big European leagues for practically all their careers. One week of each of their wages would pay for God knows how much of their opposite number's salary.
It's a team, in short, that would have expected themselves to compete in a Premier League game. And what they have managed to do today should haunt them for the rest of their careers. Shameful in the extreme.
Well said! A lot of attitude by those players and especially the coasting going on and then failure in the last 5 minutes.
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Doncaster was worse. I was 20 something and it hurt like hell I'm 45 now and this feels like something we've all seen far too often. The performance tonight was poor but we still looked.set to progress up until that penalty. The collapse from then on was prime prime Villa.
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Every one connected with Aston Villa should be ashamed and embarrassed by that performance.
Play walking football for 80 odd minutes and you stand the chance of a sucker punch.
Had we played with pace, drive and power we’d have burned them out in 60 mins. As it was we helped conserve their energy for them.
2 games on the bounce where we haven’t turned up.
What the fuck is going on?
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Was going to say that if you think _that_ was the most embarrassing Villa display, you've clearly either not been a Villa supporter for long, or have a very short memory!
As someone else said, we absolutely Villa'd them!
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Strolled around like Billy big bollocks and paid the price, deservedly so. So many players were woeful but special mention to Bailey who was dreadful from start to finish, well done.
Bradford still takes award for the worst cup performance(s) ever but this is definitely up there.
Congratulations to Stevenage, they were organised and worked their socks off and knew they would get a half chance at some point.
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Watkins and Mings did not play in the match today.
Their attitude, skills and usual work rate would probably have made a big difference, but they were not on the pitch.
Just confirming this, because they have both featured in certain fans’ vitriolic posts about today’s performance above; why, I have absolutely no idea.
The celebrated internationals and senior players in their roles failed to generate enough wattage to illuminate a gnat.
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The selection is not the issue. These weren't the kids or the bomb squad, every single one of those players are in contention every week for a place. To a man, played for their countries, or in Europe, all played in one of the big European leagues for practically all their careers. One week of each of their wages would pay for God knows how much of their opposite number's salary.
It's a team, in short, that would have expected themselves to compete in a Premier League game.
Does he pick that team with that amount of unenforced changes for a key PL game? No.
So the selection is an issue. It's not the only one, granted. But it sets the tone and tells the players the result is in the bag no matter what.
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F-cking dreadful! Absolutely f-cking dreadful!
Other than Sanson every other player should be f-cking disgusted with that! Substitutions didn’t improve us at all. Captain for the last home match...where was Young’s leadership when he came on alongside 2 poor cbs. An international goalkeeper who gets beaten at his near post by a daisy cutter is f-cking disgraceful and what kind of hospital ball was that to dendoncker for their 1st. We were sh-t throughout and barely troubled their keeper.
The lot of them can just go and f-ck off!
Sorry but apart from the goal I thought Sanson was, and is, rubbish. If you observe him closely you’ll notice that every single time he receives the ball he plays it safe, dragging it back on to his favoured foot, away from goal, before passing it sideways and quashing momentum. He very rarely does one touch. I just don’t see what he offers and I think we should sell him. He certainly wasn’t the only culprit today, but he’s just so average.
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Watkins and Mings did not play in the match today.
Their attitude, skills and usual work rate would probably have made a big difference, but they were not on the pitch.
Just confirming this, because they have both featured in certain fans’ vitriolic posts about today’s performance above; why, I have absolutely no idea.
The celebrated internationals and senior players in their roles failed to generate enough wattage to illuminate a gnat.
Spot on.
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Watkins and Mings did not play in the match today.
Their attitude, skills and usual work rate would probably have made a big difference, but they were not on the pitch.
Just confirming this, because they have both featured in certain fans’ vitriolic posts about today’s performance above; why, I have absolutely no idea.
The celebrated internationals and senior players in their roles failed to generate enough wattage to illuminate a gnat.
Watkins was on the pitch, not closing down the scorer of the winning goal!
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Our players seemed to hit deck more than theirs too. A premier league thing perhaps.
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We could not have played more like clowns if our players had been wearing actual clown shoes. Fucking embarrassing, losing to a team that didn't even seem overly bothered about winning.
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The selection is not the issue. These weren't the kids or the bomb squad, every single one of those players are in contention every week for a place. To a man, played for their countries, or in Europe, all played in one of the big European leagues for practically all their careers. One week of each of their wages would pay for God knows how much of their opposite number's salary.
It's a team, in short, that would have expected themselves to compete in a Premier League game.
Does he pick that team with that amount of unenforced changes for a key PL game? No.
So the selection is an issue. It's not the only one, granted. But it sets the tone and tells the players the result is in the bag no matter what.
Literally every single manager in the world would have rung the changes. Every single one. And every one of the players who came in is a senior member of the squad, one who should be able to contribute to wins in the Premier League. You can say it set the tone, but honestly I can't imagine letting the players off the hook that easy. Every manager would've done the same, and they should have had enough to beat a team in League 2. I'm sorry, it's that simple.
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Watkins and Mings did not play in the match today.
Their attitude, skills and usual work rate would probably have made a big difference, but they were not on the pitch.
Just confirming this, because they have both featured in certain fans’ vitriolic posts about today’s performance above; why, I have absolutely no idea.
The celebrated internationals and senior players in their roles failed to generate enough wattage to illuminate a gnat.
Watkins came on in the second half, but take your point about Mings.
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Watkins and Mings did not play in the match today.
Their attitude, skills and usual work rate would probably have made a big difference, but they were not on the pitch.
Just confirming this, because they have both featured in certain fans’ vitriolic posts about today’s performance above; why, I have absolutely no idea.
The celebrated internationals and senior players in their roles failed to generate enough wattage to illuminate a gnat.
Spot on.
Im not anti Watkins, but he had a huge role to play in their second goal.
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There are no excuses. The selection was poor and the players adopted a "pre season, low pace, keep ball strategy."
It was a spectacular example of shooting oneself in the foot (indeed both feet).
Given the attitude thank heavens tbe game was free to season ticket holders.
Huge commiserations to anybody who paid to watch the pageant of mediocrity which at times almost reached a speed of 10 miles per hour!!
Very, very poor indeed.
Good luck to Stevenage at Stoke but the Potters will give them a game; something we certainly didn't
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F-cking dreadful! Absolutely f-cking dreadful!
Other than Sanson every other player should be f-cking disgusted with that! Substitutions didn’t improve us at all. Captain for the last home match...where was Young’s leadership when he came on alongside 2 poor cbs. An international goalkeeper who gets beaten at his near post by a daisy cutter is f-cking disgraceful and what kind of hospital ball was that to dendoncker for their 1st. We were sh-t throughout and barely troubled their keeper.
The lot of them can just go and f-ck off!
Sorry but apart from the goal I thought Sanson was, and is, rubbish. If you observe him closely you’ll notice that every single time he receives the ball he plays it safe, dragging it back on to his favoured foot, away from goal, before passing it sideways and quashing momentum. He very rarely does one touch. I just don’t see what he offers and I think we should sell him. He certainly wasn’t the only culprit today, but he’s just so average.
If you think Sanson was average when clearly the best player on the pitch heaven knows how you must rate the rest, many of which are Involved every week. On a bleak night sanson was the only positive and at least tried to move the ball at a speed beyond our usual pedestrian nature
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The selection is not the issue. These weren't the kids or the bomb squad, every single one of those players are in contention every week for a place. To a man, played for their countries, or in Europe, all played in one of the big European leagues for practically all their careers. One week of each of their wages would pay for God knows how much of their opposite number's salary.
It's a team, in short, that would have expected themselves to compete in a Premier League game.
Does he pick that team with that amount of unenforced changes for a key PL game? No.
So the selection is an issue. It's not the only one, granted. But it sets the tone and tells the players the result is in the bag no matter what.
Literally every single manager in the world would have rung the changes. Every single one. And every one of the players who came in is a senior member of the squad, one who should be able to contribute to wins in the Premier League. You can say it set the tone, but honestly I can't imagine letting the players off the hook that easy. Every manager would've done the same, and they should have had enough to beat a team in League 2. I'm sorry, it's that simple.
Completely agree with this Monty.
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There was nothing much wrong with the selection, the team picked should of have had more than enough to beat a team from Div 2. The players are to blame here.
Initial selections, fair enough. Substitutions and game management - 2 out of 10. Dick's substitutions weren't great. Leaving Bailey on is a joke, Cash was gash and Sanson should have stayed on. Olsen is a muppet: poor distribution and being beaten on his near-post is criminal.
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Not going to blame the manager. It's Stevenage. The players should have been able to win that game even if Emery had gone down the pub.
Sadly, too many of them shit their pants when under any kind of pressure.
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Embarrassing, fair play to Stevenage.
Our second string are really poor and the attitude and mentality of approach was poor from the off. We had two shots on target throughout, one was the goal. I was Emery to rip it up and start again as we've spent millions on shit. Tippy-tappy football, all very comfortable but no pace or flair throughout. A lack of incisive football, other than out goal, which was lovely. Olsen, Cash, Ludwig, Bednarek, Dendonker, Bailey, Ings all poor and need sending back or allowing to leave if we can get a deal for them. Chambers, Luiz, Coutinho should be taking the game by the scruff and pushing our players forward, they were just as bad. Sanson did ok, but can we pause as this was against a league 2 side? We simply don't have the players to do what Emery wants them to do. That said, I also think that the substitutions lost us some momentum as a second goal looked odds on. Shambles at the end with a lack of pace, energy, leadership etc. Rip it up, start again.
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Dog dirt.
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Just remarkable.
Olsen - beaten like the utter fucking chump he is.
Bailey - not good enough yet again
Coutinho - pathetic
Dendoncker - brainless ******
The total lack of marking for their second goal, a thing of absolute horror.
Dendonker was an idiot, Olsen was at fault for both goals. Why play that pass to Dendonker at that moment? All risk and no reward. Then his goalkeeping for the second was astonishingly bad. But fuck knows how you just allow someone to run into the box and shoot like that.
It’s an utterly pathetic effort and every single one of them, bar Sanson, should be ashamed of their efforts. The FA Cup effort from Villa in the last 7 years has been chronic, but this is a new level of shame.
All teams do it and it annoys me not playing your best keeper. There’s no way Aston Villa can win the FA Cup without playing their no 1 keeper. And it’s a goalkeeper, he won’t be tired for the next effing match.
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That really wasn't very good at all.
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Doncaster was worse. I was 20 something and it hurt like hell I'm 45 now and this feels like something we've all seen far too often. The performance tonight was poor but we still looked.set to progress up until that penalty. The collapse from then on was prime prime Villa.
Not so. It was shit from first to last. We were fortunate that their 'goal' in the first half was disallowed, and on the entire balance of play we deserved what we got, the last five minutes of the game epitomising the previous 90.
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Watkins and Mings did not play in the match today.
Their attitude, skills and usual work rate would probably have made a big difference, but they were not on the pitch.
Just confirming this, because they have both featured in certain fans’ vitriolic posts about today’s performance above; why, I have absolutely no idea.
The celebrated internationals and senior players in their roles failed to generate enough wattage to illuminate a gnat.
Spot on.
Agreed. Ings starting and as captain is laughable.
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I'm not disagreeing with that but up to ten seconds before the penalty was given we looked set to progress. It felt like second half we'd weathered their storm and despite being shit we were probably going to get away with it. That was my point.
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A Lange masterpiece.
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Probably the most humiliating VP cup defeat, can't think of any worse.
Bradford was still worse given it was over two legs, we were one game away from a winnable final etc.
Today was very poor though.
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Treated it like a practice game & got mugged at the end. There's a lot of work to do to get this team / squad where we want it to be & it won't happen soon.
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Of course the manager deserves stick, he picked a team that were not up to it.
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The selection is not the issue. These weren't the kids or the bomb squad, every single one of those players are in contention every week for a place. To a man, played for their countries, or in Europe, all played in one of the big European leagues for practically all their careers. One week of each of their wages would pay for God knows how much of their opposite number's salary.
It's a team, in short, that would have expected themselves to compete in a Premier League game.
Does he pick that team with that amount of unenforced changes for a key PL game? No.
So the selection is an issue. It's not the only one, granted. But it sets the tone and tells the players the result is in the bag no matter what.
Literally every single manager in the world would have rung the changes. Every single one. And every one of the players who came in is a senior member of the squad, one who should be able to contribute to wins in the Premier League. You can say it set the tone, but honestly I can't imagine letting the players off the hook that easy. Every manager would've done the same, and they should have had enough to beat a team in League 2. I'm sorry, it's that simple.
Our under 21s should have been amble to handle that. The guy who got sent off was playing for a World Cup hopeful last month.
The selection shouldn’t matter. All these players should be good enough to beat these
I can on think of the Bradford game that was worse - purely cos it was over 2 legs
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The selection is not the issue. These weren't the kids or the bomb squad, every single one of those players are in contention every week for a place. To a man, played for their countries, or in Europe, all played in one of the big European leagues for practically all their careers. One week of each of their wages would pay for God knows how much of their opposite number's salary.
It's a team, in short, that would have expected themselves to compete in a Premier League game.
Does he pick that team with that amount of unenforced changes for a key PL game? No.
So the selection is an issue. It's not the only one, granted. But it sets the tone and tells the players the result is in the bag no matter what.
Literally every single manager in the world would have rung the changes. Every single one. And every one of the players who came in is a senior member of the squad, one who should be able to contribute to wins in the Premier League. You can say it set the tone, but honestly I can't imagine letting the players off the hook that easy. Every manager would've done the same, and they should have had enough to beat a team in League 2. I'm sorry, it's that simple.
Gerrard didn’t
and we won against lowly Bolton
He won’t play that side on Friday because he wants to win that game more than the FA Cup. It’s as simple as that.
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He deserves stick for them not being up *for* it. But they should be up *to* it if they'd been coaching themselves for 2 months. Sorry, the idea the selection was the problem is an absurd crutch. The problem was the disastrous, horrible, half-arsed, shit-brained, lily-livered candy-ass spiced pumpkin horseshit performance from the players.
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Looks like Cash will be out for a while not that he was much use…never actually went forward, perhaps Bailey was in his way . Any involvement of Bailey was minimal and usually useless…mercurial my arse…rather have seen what KY could have offered. Coutinho is bust.. see Barkley.
Augustinsson was ok….nothing special. Buendia struggled to get up to pace and gave the ball away far too often. Watkins couldn’t hold the ball up…Inngs too slow. Olsen spoiled a reasonable start with that 120 seconds of uselessness. Luiz thought it was a stroll.Dendonker is the sort of player you never notice until he fxxks up and boy does he. Chambers is not upto it when compared with Konza and Mings and that speaks volumes.
Only Sansom seemed interested and imagine he’s off as soon as he can book his seat on Ryanair.
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Villa spent most of the game on their 18 yard line going left going right then going backwards. We should of gone for the jugular and killed the game off as quickly as possible. 1-0 they're still in the game.
I thought Samson was the only player to come out of that with any praise.
We started to crumble after the multiple substitutions.
Ings always looks like a passenger when he starts.
Couthino and Luiz flicking it about all day but not hurting the opposition.
Leon Bailley will be crying himself to sleep again.
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The manager needs to learn about the squad. He shouldn’t be afraid to rotate. The players he brought in today included the starting keeper and LB for Sweden, internationals for Brazil, Poland. It should have been more than enough to beat a L2 side. These players let the club down. I’m not fully excusing the manager but the vast majority of the blame goes to players who either took this too lightly or simply didn’t do their jobs. The performance of almost all of them was simply inexcusable
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We didn’t work hard enough to get the second goal so we were never comfortable.
What a wasted opportunity for this club
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Today was worse than Bradford. This was the team that lost to Bradford:
S Given
M Lowton
C Clark (c)
N Baker
J Bennett
G Agbonlahor
F Delph
B Bannan
C N'Zogbia
A Weimann
C Benteke
A right load of shite.
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That must go down as the worst giant killing embarrassment in my Villa supporting life. Pathetic.
It's still Doncaster. We were shit today but still dominated, Doncaster we were outclassed everywhere.
Yes. Doncaster was more embarrassing although not sure what division they were in at the time
I'm sure Bradford were in a worse position than Stevenage...and that was over two legs!
Doncaster was away, this was at Villa Park. As Villa Lew said, today was humiliating.
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The manager needs to learn about the squad. He shouldn’t be afraid to rotate. The players he brought in today included the starting keeper and LB for Sweden, internationals for Brazil, Poland. It should have been more than enough to beat a L2 side. These players let the club down. I’m not fully excusing the manager but the vast majority of the blame goes to players who either took this too lightly or simply didn’t do their jobs. The performance of almost all of them was simply inexcusable
When has playing a weakened team ever gone well for us? The manager took it too lightly, just like he did with the League Cup against Man U, and now we're out of both of them.
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Complete and utter garbage.
Bailey has been awarded Stevenage MOTM.
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I’ll see your Doncaster and raise you a Peterborough
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Complete and utter garbage.
Bailey has been awarded Stevenage MOTM.
Ollie Watkins also gets an assist.
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To be fair to Unai. The selection should beat a league 2 side if they put a shift in. Clearly there is work to do, we have to give him a chance. We are not going to win every game. It will take time to develop the squad. This at least gives him a clearer idea of what is required. Frankly I was not at all surprised at this result , we seem to have a habit of this.
If they're prepared properly, which they clearly weren't and did not particularly give a toss by the looks of things.
Pinnochio has fucked up two cup competitions in the space of a few weeks after bullshitting us when he arrived that he wanted to take the cups seriously.
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There are no excuses. The selection was poor and the players adopted a "pre season, low pace, keep ball strategy."
It was a spectacular example of shooting oneself in the foot (indeed both feet).
Given the attitude thank heavens tbe game was free to season ticket holders.
Huge commiserations to anybody who paid to watch the pageant of mediocrity which at times almost reached a speed of 10 miles per hour!!
Very, very poor indeed.
Good luck to Stevenage at Stoke but the Potters will give them a game; something we certainly didn't
If I were Unai Emory I would expect the team I named to be out to impress, banging the ball all over the place, 4 or 5 or 6 nil up by half time.
Today, I’d be asking for more at half time. We know he does this in the PL and we know from his CV he wants to win cups.
I still don’t believe they were actually playing at walking pace for most of the first half and then, for a lot of the second.
What was going on in their minds?
This abject performance has got to have convinced him about who to buy and who, definitely, has to be moved on.
Hoping for a lively transfer window. UTV!
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He deserves stick for them not being up *for* it. But they should be up *to* it if they'd been coaching themselves for 2 months. Sorry, the idea the selection was the problem is an absurd crutch. The problem was the disastrous, horrible, half-arsed, shit-brained, lily-livered candy-ass spiced pumpkin horseshit performance from the players.
Be interesting what happens with selection now.
Last season we had Gerrard moaning endlessly at the end of many games from January onwards...and then a week later he'd pick pretty much the same team with a similar result.
With the injuries to the FBs Young and Digne are certs to start and really the backline picks itself (although wouldn't shock me if we sign the Betis guy this week).
Beyond that it will be a very interesting selection. If Ramsey isn't fit to start who actually starts in that area?
This is where he earns his money now as no way after today will there be much patience if we start very slowly v Leeds. If ever there's a home game we need to come out of the blocks it's Friday.
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The manager has disrespected our club and has shown no understanding of the FA Cup.
Idiotic
What utter garbage. He has won more cups in ten years than we have in 40 years. He hasn't signed a single player yet. A premier-league squad should be beating Stevenage, it's on the players.
This.
Embarrassing, pathetic performance, mind, but let’s not overreact. Like every other manager in the league, Unai made changes but the players went out and were abysmal. Hopefully, it will signal the need for better players and we will see some leave and others come in this month.
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No intensity from the start, we created so little all game. I can't really recall their keeper making a save.
There's been an absolute fortune spent on the squad, but it's woeful, the stating XI isn't good enough and those fringe players showed why they don't play.
Only Sanson and Agustinsson can be content with how they performed today. Emery picked a side that should have beaten Stevenage at home, he'll have learnt more about his players today than at any time. No doubt they'll all be posting on Instagram anytime now about how sorry they are and how they'll 'come back stronger' etc etc. Bunch of wankers the lot of them.
If Emery does need any help then here's my two penneth.
1 Emiliano Martínez - Make him captain now. Show him we want him to lead us. We want winning mentality. He has it
2 Matty Cash - Not a priority to get rid until the summer but an improvement needed
3 Diego Carlos - Who knows? When is he back?
4 Ezri Konsa - Upgrade required in the summer possibly, but I assume that's Carlos?
5 Tyrone Mings - Useful squad player but shouldn't really start regularly. Sell if offered enough money
6 Douglas Luiz - I think he'll flourish under Emery, with better players around him. Keep.
7 John McGinn - Squad player, gives us drive from midfield but isn't anything like the player he was, can Emery get him back to his former self? I'd be inclined to give him the opportunity.
8 Morgan Sanson - He did well today but unless he's going to get the chance in the Premier League we may as well move him on.
9 Danny Ings - He's a goal scorer our most natural. If we can bring in a Mitrovic or similar/better player then let him go, but i'd be inclined to keep him for now.
10 Emiliano Buendía - Does some great stuff but is too inconsistent. If we can get 2/3 of our money back i'd let him go.
11 Ollie Watkins - Needs to play wide and not central. If not may as well sell
12 Jed Steer - Get rid
16 Calum Chambers - Poor, needs to be upgraded.
17 Ludwig Augustinsson - I guess he's going back from his loan at some point.
18 Ashley Young - Good character yes, past it yes. Needs gone.
19 Marvelous Nakamba - I'd actually forgot we had him. Get rid
23 Philippe Coutinho - Sadly, just not doing it, doesn't look anything like the player he was. If we can get rid of him, to get him off the wage bill it needs to be done
24 Frederic Guilbert - I remember him, every manager we have had since he arrived doesn't rate him and he doesn't play. Get him off the wage bill.
25 Robin Olsen - Has there ever been a worse goalkeeper in a Villa Shirt? Nyland was poor, Enckleman awful, Gabor Kiraly was pretty horendous. Kalinic? Gollini? We've actually had some pretty shit keepers haven't we?
27 Lucas Digne - He's ok, does ok, not top of my list to be got rid of just yet, but I suspect with another LB due to arrive immanently he may well be phased out.
29 Kaine Kesler Hayden - Get him back, good young kid who appears to be doing ok on loan. He'll certainly do no worse than the crap we have now.
31 Leon Bailey - Cancel his contract, truly, truly awful footballer. Not a reaction to his miss at Wolves that he blarted about but his general all round play.
32 Jaden Philogene-Bidace - Scored today v Leeds for Cardiff. Would he be any worse to look at him for the rest of the season. Recall him and give him a chance.
35 Cameron Archer - Really wish we hadn't let him go to Boro he could be in and around the team
40 Aaron Ramsey - Glad he's back. Lets use the rest of the season to have a look.
41 Jacob Ramsey - Keep.
42 Filip Marschall - Give him a chance instead of Robinaliving Olsen
44 Boubacar Kamara - Missed him today.
45 Ben Chrisene - Give him a chance for the rest of the season.
47 Tim Iroegbunam - Can we get him back and have a look at him?
48 Oliwier Zych - no idea?
59 Josh Feeney - No idea?
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[Villa being Villa in the FA cup but you don't expect it at home against Stevenage . The manager and half hearted players need to have a complete rethink .
Let's not forget the shambolic first half against Wolves this week.
We're going backwards
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You know when in life you get past caring , that's what I feel with the Villa sometimes
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The manager has disrespected our club and has shown no understanding of the FA Cup.
Idiotic
What utter garbage. He has won more cups in ten years than we have in 40 years. He hasn't signed a single player yet. A premier-league squad should be beating Stevenage, it's on the players.
This.
Embarrassing, pathetic performance, mind, but let’s not overreact. Like every other manager in the league, Unai made changes but the players went out and were abysmal. Hopefully, it will signal the need for better players and we will see some leave and others come in this month.
100% its on the players.
One positive is it accelerates the exit of a few.
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I left at 78 minutes at a goal up and assumed the game would peter out to a one-nil.
I assume Unai wanted to see how some of our squad perform in a match environment. And now he knows.
We won't see some of those players again.
That said, watching the highlights key moments I'm wondering how the penalty was given. We keep hearing how shirt pulls should be punished, well it clearly started outside the area.
Oh well.
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The one positive - Unai can surely now be in no doubt that some of those players are fringe at best if we are serious about progress.
Special mention to Bailey, Coutinho, Cash - if they never play another game in a Villa shirt I’d be happy. Charlatans the trio.
It feels really painful right now but turn Leeds over Friday and we can look forward again.
And the criticism of Unai - dear oh dear. The guy has done virtually everything right since being appointed. Who’d be a soccer manager
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Terrible. Terrible performance. Terrible result. Terrible players. I would Keep Ramsey of all that played tonight & bin off the rest over time. Maybe keep Cash as the backup RB too. The rest can fuck right off.
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What horseshit blaming the manager for that.
That side should easily have been enough.
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Complete and utter garbage.
Bailey has been awarded Stevenage MOTM.
Ollie Watkins also gets an assist.
And Buendia.
Throughout the game we were so passive and complacent. The only time we upped the intensity we scored, and clearly assumed we had the job done.
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Just remarkable.
Olsen - beaten like the utter fucking chump he is.
Bailey - not good enough yet again
Coutinho - pathetic
Dendoncker - brainless ******
The total lack of marking for their second goal, a thing of absolute horror.
Dendonker was an idiot, Olsen was at fault for both goals. Why play that pass to Dendonker at that moment? All risk and no reward. Then his goalkeeping for the second was astonishingly bad. But fuck knows how you just allow someone to run into the box and shoot like that.
It’s an utterly pathetic effort and every single one of them, bar Sanson, should be ashamed of their efforts. The FA Cup effort from Villa in the last 7 years has been chronic, but this is a new level of shame.
All teams do it and it annoys me not playing your best keeper. There’s no way Aston Villa can win the FA Cup without playing their no 1 keeper. And it’s a goalkeeper, he won’t be tired for the next effing match.
The alternative is to risk our only competent G/K getting injured in a match we should win at a canter.
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If you want to win something you set out to win it from the beginning
If you take the attitude ‘well this should do, this will see us through’ you run the risk of Man United and today
The only thing I like about Gerrard was he took the cup seriously
At Bolton, he drew criticism for playing certain players, not from me
If we are ever gonna win that fucking thing again, we need a manager who won’t put people the likes off Olsen in goals and hoping for the best
Because the best is not what you get
We live in a world where finishing 9th not 10th is preferable to winning the FA Cup
That’s just a fact you only have to look at the team selections
So here we are again, 60 odd years and counting
things will never change until we make it a priority, and I am not sure that’s ever going to happen
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I really feel for Sanson. He finally gets a game, is the best player out there but has to share a pitch with that shower of shite.
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Emery needs players in asap. Just appalling to witness that gutless display.
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Why should Emery be above criticism?
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Aston Villa 1-2 Stevenage: League Two side produce stunning late comeback - https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/64198131
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There's no way Sam Allardyce would have lost this match.
My mate cried all of the water out of his body after this result, it was a fucking disgrace.
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One thing I will blame Emery for is believing in Bailey.
So fucking tired of that wanker - again today, a litany of air shots, mishits, the usual rubbish plus the old slouching around when he'd been (again) easily dispossessed.
He needs taking out of the firing line.
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Just got home, I thought Bailey and Coutinho were Blues as were Ramsay, Watkins, Digne and Buendia when they came on. I couldn't see the incident clearly from the Holte but it seemed like Olsen trying to be cute probably caused the penalty.
There was zero movement, no one making runs, no one trying a forward pass, no one taking charge. I can't blame the manager when that was essentially a Villa first team, minus the two centre backs.
Bailey should be crying again tonight because if you can't do it against League 2 opposition, when will you?
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Emery still seems like as good an acquisition as we could have hoped for at the time, no arguments from me there.
But how many games does he need to see that some of those chancers should be nowhere near the first team.
I never had him down as slow on the uptake.
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What horseshit blaming the manager for that.
That side should easily have been enough.
Unai Emery
“If I start match again, I will play same players because we had our plan & have players with experience. Now we have to be together & continue working as this is our process. But we can look at each one because everyone has to be critical with himself."
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Emery is not above critiscm
But we had a team full of internationals including one who is one of the top 5 most expensive players ever
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At the very least Emery will now see the task he has before him. Havn't watched the game but it sounds like a repeat of the many that went before. All the players selected are part of a squad, they should all be up to premiership standard and there is absolutely no excuse to be beaten by Stevenage.
Emery has had a good start at Villa but this loss has taken some of the shine off, I would hope he brings new additions in quickly.
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Emery could have improved our chances by picking a full-strength team but our chances of winning even with the stiffs should have been enough. It'll just have confirmed for him that not only does our first team require support but also that such support isn't going to come from the squad players. Abject humiliation shouldn't have been part of that learning process though.
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To be fair to Unai. The selection should beat a league 2 side if they put a shift in. Clearly there is work to do, we have to give him a chance. We are not going to win every game. It will take time to develop the squad. This at least gives him a clearer idea of what is required. Frankly I was not at all surprised at this result , we seem to have a habit of this.
If they're prepared properly, which they clearly weren't and did not particularly give a toss by the looks of things.
Pinnochio has fucked up two cup competitions in the space of a few weeks after bullshitting us when he arrived that he wanted to take the cups seriously.
we just landed an elite level coach a few weeks back after ridding ourselves of a chancing charlatan, do you realise how ridiculous this post looks?
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When you take the piss with your selections this is what happens.
100%
Why take the risk with a weaker line up. Everyone knows what happens.
This is on Emery. I think Emi would have saved the winner.
We should be still in both cups.
He has really pissed me off as there is no need to prick about.
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Emery still seems like as good an acquisition as we could have hoped for at the time, no arguments from me there.
But how many games does he need to see that some of those chancers should be nowhere near the first team.
I never had him down as slow on the uptake.
He’s had 6 games
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Nobody seemed up for it today. The ground seemed subdued?
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Arrogant, lazy, complacent, pathetic, are the words that spring to mind. Against a Division 4 team is another thing in my head. There are a number of players we are not going to progress with in that team today. I’m sick of the same shit season after season.
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Why should Emery be above criticism?
He's not at all. It's just that the selection is a knee-jerk thing. Clearly, clearly that team was good enough to beat - and this cannot be stressed enough - Fourth Division Stevenage.
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I didn't expect him to pick the same team who started against Wolves. But:
Picking Olsen. One clean sheet doth not a summer make. The bloke is shit Emery, you should be able to see that by now. I trust now he's helped knock us out of both cups you don't need any more evidence.
Bailey - he's been dismal for ages now. Stop leaving him on the pitch when he's having a shocker, or better still, don't pick him at all.
Chambers - he's not very good
Bednarek - send him back to Southampton please
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The first goal was calamitous. Pissing around at the back. The second was the most pathetic defending I think I have ever seen. Where were they? What on earth was the goalkeeper thinking? A gap as wide as the Aston Expressway at the near post. Lord oh lord. We need a new backup keeper in January. As for Bailey - less said the better except 90% of the time he just isn't good enough. Congratulations to Stevenage - some FA Cup magic right there.
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Those who are already turning on Emery, who exactly do you think we'll get who is any better? We're already "punching" with him.
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This is the third (and most successful) of the managers the majority of these players have had whilst at Villa and yet still they collapse in a familiar fashion, conceding 2 goals in quick succession. It’s not an anomaly and a major cultural shift is required. There’s nowhere to hide for a number of them now and we need to be ruthless in managing them, either whilst they’re in a Villa shirt or out of the club.
The 11 we put out should have been more than enough to deal with a league 2 team but I don’t understand why in the 2 cup games we’ve had under Emery he’s played weakened teams. That is on him no matter which way you spin it.
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There's no way Sam Allardyce would have lost this match.
My mate cried all of the water out of his body after this result, it was a fucking disgrace.
Emery still seems like as good an acquisition as we could have hoped for at the time, no arguments from me there.
But how many games does he need to see that some of those chancers should be nowhere near the first team.
I never had him down as slow on the uptake.
He’s had 6 games
Emery still seems like as good an acquisition as we could have hoped for at the time, no arguments from me there.
But how many games does he need to see that some of those chancers should be nowhere near the first team.
I never had him down as slow on the uptake.
He’s had 6 games
Indeed.
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Keeper aside (who is shit), we lost due to attitude rather than ability. A good proportion of that side thought they could just turn up, tippy tap it about and win. It started with Coutinho and filtered through to the rest of them.
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When you take the piss with your selections this is what happens.
100%
Why take the risk with a weaker line up. Everyone knows what happens.
This is on Emery. I think Emi would have saved the winner.
We should be still be in both cups.
He has really pissed me off as there is no need to prick about.
Not one single person called it out as a risk before kick off.
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I really feel for Sanson. He finally gets a game, is the best player out there but has to share a pitch with that shower of shite.
Why did he take Sanson off?
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Poor mentality all round today, mostly from the players but the manager isn’t without blame, we’re simply not good enough to make wholesale changes. I don’t really understand what we’re resting players for.
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Those saying the selection of the team wasn't the issue today are wrong. To bring in maybe one or two fringe players into an otherwise settled team, and/or to continue with a player or two out of form, would have been one thing. However, to select a team packed with such players, and to have expected them to gel as a team, was a gross error. In his time in charge, Emery should have seen enough of the individuals and squad under his watch to have recognised that the team he put out today would not pass muster, even against lower league opposition.
From pretty much the first minute today, that performance was totally unacceptable, we were lucky that Stevenage had their goal in the first half chalked off for offside, and lucky to go in a goal up at half time. Even before the game got under way today, I was thinking the eleven who started the game may not have been the worst eleven that ever started a Villa game, but I'm not sure there could have ever been an eleven as slow. And did it show, from the first minute. Lethargy begat complacency, and complacency begat lethargy, exemplified by the pitiful performances of the substitutes, and we got absolutely what we deserved, the last 10 minutes of the game being no more than a reflection of all that had preceeded them.
Well done Stevenage, clearly more energised by the prospect of an FA Cup tie at Stoke City than were the Villa.
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I really feel for Sanson. He finally gets a game, is the best player out there but has to share a pitch with that shower of shite.
Why did he take Sanson off?
Match fitness maybe? He wanted to give Ramsey a run-out too.
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Those who are already turning on Emery, who exactly do you think we'll get who is any better? We're already "punching" with him.
Some people can't see beyond the last game.
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Those who are already turning on Emery, who exactly do you think we'll get who is any better? We're already "punching" with him.
Yeah turning on him is daft.
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Is anyone actually turning on Emery though?
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I'm not turning on Emery. I'm just pissed off at losing. I think he should have played Kamara and Martinez at least. I was going to say Mings too but he is prone to a fuck up or two as well. Granted there is no excuse for the XI who started not putting 3 past Stevenage.
Now, stop laying in to me for moaning about the selection and go and give a kicking to the poster who said Sanson was shit. ;-)
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The only obvious mistake for in terms of selection was Olsen. If Emi is fit to play he should always play.
On Bailey - I rate him more than others, but he’s very obviously a massive confidence player. He’s not confident at the moment and I get the impression he’s trying far too hard.
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As a cop specialist, he’s gone about his first two cup games in a very odd manner.
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As a cop specialist, he’s gone about his first two cup games in a very odd manner.
I don't think he's arrested our development though.
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If there was a game that could be described as quintessentially 21st century Aston Villa that was it. An absolute clown show.
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The only obvious mistake for in terms of selection was Olsen. If Emi is fit to play he should always play.
On Bailey - I rate him more than others, but he’s very obviously a massive confidence player. He’s not confident at the moment and I get the impression he’s trying far too hard.
Trying too hard? He could take his shirt back to the club shop tomorrow and get a full refund.
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As a cop specialist, he’s gone about his first two cup games in a very odd manner.
I don't think he's arrested our development though.
They should all be under arrest , fucking puns !!!
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You can see he that’s why he’s losing shape on any shots he takes. We’ve seen what he can do when he’s confident.
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And another small irritant, we proved the bbc right in picking our game for an upset. That commentator was practically giddy...
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You can see he that’s why he’s losing shape on any shots he takes. We’ve seen what he can do when he’s confident.
I good goal every 9 or 10 games is nowhere near good enough though, especially with how mediocre the rest of his play is.
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It looked like winning a squad number and winning a lucrative contract is all that some of our players ever want to win!!
Hopefully today helped Emery sort the 'wheat from the chaff'.
Embarrassing. >:(
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As a cop specialist, he’s gone about his first two cup games in a very odd manner.
I don't think he's arrested our development though.
Bad cop. Bad cup.
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Eternal optimist here.
Watch Villa go on an amazing, unmatched, modern era unbeaten run that delivers European football next season.
Oh the joys of alcohol.
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Never got out of first gear first half, just like the first half against Wolves we lacked any type of urgency.
I was cringeing at those behind me singing "Champions of Europe you'll never sing that" to feckin Stevenage!
At least Unai got a chance to see fringe players in a competative game, he now knows many are nowhere near good enough.
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Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa aarrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr rggggggggggggggggggg hhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.
What a Shit Sandwich.
The Lot of Them should be utterly ashamed - give your wages to a food bank this week
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You can see he that’s why he’s losing shape on any shots he takes. We’ve seen what he can do when he’s confident.
I good goal every 9 or 10 games is nowhere near good enough though, especially with how mediocre the rest of his play is.
Yep. He is awful more times than he is good.
How does his old man cope.
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What really irks is the much lauded Youth team of a year or 2 ago and none seemingly around to replace the dirge that has been bought at considerable cost only to time and time again fluff their lines.
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Where do you start?
Absolute shambles. Professional, International, Premier League players who played at a walking pace for most of the game and couldn’t find a way through a League 2 side.
Apart from Sanson, everyone else was utter garbage and clearly not good enough.
Coutinho I’m afraid is a shadow of his former self and Bailey just constantly runs into trouble. The defence and keeper were an embarrassment.
Lots of work for Emery to do but I think he will in the long term.
The only plus point was that I didn’t have to pay for my ticket to watch that shit show!!
But we’ll done to Stevenage, they played well and capitalised on our mistakes.
Hopefully we never see some of those players in Villa shirts again.
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We picked a team good enough to win this game. Emery needed to see some players get first team experience, & with the likes of Bailey give them what should have been successful attacking confidence. It was one selection away from the team we guessed at home this morning (we thought Southampton wouldn't want Bednarek cup tied).
It was all to sterile. Stevenage defended well, & as usual when against such a defensive set up (we always seem to struggle against 10 men too) we had no real ideas.
The massive benefit of this gives Emery the ammunition to go to the board & show them how much change is required for PL sustainability.
Credit to Sanson for his efforts - would hope this might sway Emery to give him a chance as he did look the one spark of energy in an otherwise off-par afternoon out.
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The line up was fine. A forward line of Bailey, Ings and Coutinho should have been enough. We clear the ball at the end like we should have and we unconvincingly go though. Woeful.
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There was nothing much wrong with the team selection. All bar one has played for their country and that odd man out scored our goal.
Tactically it was all wrong though. They set up with a bank of 5 and a bank of 4, it was always going to be tough to play through them and we need to play with pace and width. For the most part, we lacked both.
Hard to know how much of that was tactics and the instructions from the manager and how much of it was down to the players just treating it like a walk in the park.
I am chuffing sick of our cup record. 8 defeats on the trot would be unacceptable for any team of any level. The fact that includes several lower league sides makes it all the worse.
Emery has been here five minutes. He will be learning. But coming forward, we looked best in the first 15 minutes of his reign. I don't think he is a pragmatist but if he was, he might consider changing the style of play to suit the players he has.
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Those who are already turning on Emery, who exactly do you think we'll get who is any better? We're already "punching" with him.
That’s the problem isn’t it. If someone like Emery can’t do it I don’t know who will, and is there some deeper problem at the club such as a comfort zone problem with players that we seem to have had for many years. Very depressing.
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Why should Emery be above criticism?
He's not at all. It's just that the selection is a knee-jerk thing. Clearly, clearly that team was good enough to beat - and this cannot be stressed enough - Fourth Division Stevenage.
But it doesn't work that way saying that selected players were good enough to beat a 4th division team. The players who come in know that they are only being played because they are not considered good enough for League team. The regular players from the League team who are selected think that clearly they are not special enough so they have to play. It's just a wrong message all around and results is there for all to see.
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Oh the atmosphere at the end was weird. Not even that much anger from those around me in the Holte
We have started accepting defeat in the FA Cup no matter the level of opposition.
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There are no excuses for what happened but had Dendonkey or Olsen just belted the ball up field we’d all be saying “job done”. All this shite about how we were ponderous and slow, Stevenage played with 10 men behind the ball, where exactly do we become pacey with no room to play into.
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and we need to play with pace and width. For the most part, we lacked both.
We haven’t had any pace or width for years
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Sanson did show drive and energy, scored a good goal, but he still misplaced passes unnecessarily like everyone.
Also, our insistence on playing out from the back cost us as soon as Stevenage started to press higher as time wore on. Dendoncker also mis-controlled prior to the penalty.
We lost today by playing the game at such a slow pace, showing complacency all game, and topping it off by an insistence at playing out from the back with players who are not adept at it. I could only see Stevenage scoring from some kamikaze defending.
There is a time and a place, but the risks far outweigh the rewards, particularly if the scoreline is close, even if the opponents are three divisions below.
Apart from our howler, yesterday there was Allison and Guaita who were culpable, and I've just seen Bristol City, Norwich and Barnsley all concede unnecessarily doing the same kind of thing today.
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You at least move the ball quickly, like we did for the goal. And perhaps switch play a bit more often.
Are we saying that because they had 10 men behind the ball, they were basically unbeatable?
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As alluded in earlier post singing Champions of Europe you’ll never sing that to Stevenage cringeworthiness of the highest order.
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Fell asleep in the first half. Woke up to that shit result.
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As alluded in earlier post singing Champions of Europe you’ll never sing that to Stevenage cringeworthiness of the highest order.
Fucking hell. Got what we deserved in that case.
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The entire team were poor but Olsen is blame for the defeat. If he hadn't played that awful ball to Dendonker which led to the penalty and red card we wouldn't have conceded the second when our defensive shape and mindset were in total disarray partly due to being down to 10 players.
A poor display but a 1-0 would have had many people saying getting through is the most important thing.
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You at least move the ball quickly, like we did for the goal. And perhaps switch play a bit more often.
Are we saying that because they had 10 men behind the ball, they were basically unbeatable?
No, I mean when a team defends in numbers pace is not going to break them down, you need to use quick passing to make space, which is how we scored, unfortunately we only did that once, though Bailey and Chambers both had chances they should have finished before the nightmare ending.
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Dendonker turned into the defender and got robbed, it was his fault.
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I hate this shit. I put myself in their fans' shoes and I would just be scratching my head. 'Shit support m'Lord' as usual too. All makes me wince.
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As alluded in earlier post singing Champions of Europe you’ll never sing that to Stevenage cringeworthiness of the highest order.
Did they counter with, "we're in the fourth round, you rarely sing that"?
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Well there’s the wake up call of the attitude and building job through the whole club. Shocking of the highest order.
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It's largely irrelevant now, but the ref's made a mistake hasn't he with the sending off and penalty?
The double jeopardy rule says that it's only a red card AND penalty if there was no genuine attempt to play the ball. The shirt pull was worthy of a red card, but that took place outside the area, so if that was the action that got him sent off, it shouldn't have been a penalty. If the penalty was for Dendoncker bringing him down in the area with his legs, well that was an attempt to win the ball. Still a penalty, but no red card.
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Credit to Stevenage, who defensively gave us a taste of our own medicine, mirroring our defensive display against Spurs last week. Realistically, we were playing a team 3 tiers below us, so ANY 11 we put out should have been enough to see them off. Congrats to the club and the fans - Hope they keep it up and see off Stoke in the next round.
I don't blame Emery for today at all, as the only way he's going to get to know what he's working with is by seeing them play. He will have learnt an awful lot today in that defeat. Sanson aside, not ONE of those players has a reason to go knocking on the manager's door asking why they're not playing... they've pretty much all played their way into the departure lounge.
The only minor blot in Emery's copy book is not hooking Bailey - Effort is there, but his confidence in the final third is getting close to Watkins proportions - Needs a spell on the sidelines.
Olsen - Rubbish
Cash - Got turned inside out in defense, and couldn't cross the road going forwards. Not worthy of a starting place.
Chambers/Bednarek - Not even close to pushing for a starting lineup berth.
Augustinsson - Played better midweek/today than Digne, but that's not to say he's the answer at LB. Hobbled off, so looks like it's Digne for the foreseeable!
Sanson - Little rusty (to be expected), but grew into the game. Good goal and some tidy play - Needs a run in the team.
Luis - Played ok but a little too overconfident later on. Good player but needs to sort his attention span out
Coutinho - Fancy turns/flicks followed by a John Smith special into row Z... A luxury we can't afford at the minute.
Bailey - Lots of running and some comical crosses/shots. Confidence in front of goal is completely shot. All fart, no shit.
Dendoncker - Thought he looked ok till the brain fart late on. We should have put it to bed way before their equaliser, but he has to be to blame for the loss.
Ings - Zero service, but nevertheless STILL looks our most likely goal threat.
Subs
Young was an improvement at RB, the rest was much of muchness. Good to see Ramsey back.
Starting to think we're not allowed nice things. Next year it is then! :(
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Gerrard was allowed to bring in a lot of poor players, Emery was stupid enough to play most of them.
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Well there’s the wake up call of the attitude and building job through the whole club. Shocking of the highest order.
But with the exception of our promotion year we’ve been saying this for every one of the last 10 seasons
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Didn't realise how bad some second string players were,
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It's largely irrelevant now, but the ref's made a mistake hasn't he with the sending off and penalty?
The double jeopardy rule says that it's only a red card AND penalty if there was no genuine attempt to play the ball. The shirt pull was worthy of a red card, but that took place outside the area, so if that was the action that got him sent off, it shouldn't have been a penalty. If the penalty was for Dendoncker bringing him down in the area with his legs, well that was an attempt to win the ball. Still a penalty, but no red card.
I wonder whether there will be an appeal and overturned as I reckon you're right. Clearly, the foul started outside the box, I can only presume the referee didn't want to give the shirt pull as a foul?
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I don't blame Emery for today at all, as the only way he's going to get to know what he's working with is by seeing them play. He will have learnt an awful lot today in that defeat.
How many times does he need to see Olsen exactly? He picked a bad team, and seemingly couldn't organise or motivate them properly to see off a 4th division side.
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Sanson aside, not ONE of those players has a reason to go knocking on the manager's door asking why they're not playing... they've pretty much all played their way into the departure lounge.
Agreed.
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It's largely irrelevant now, but the ref's made a mistake hasn't he with the sending off and penalty?
The double jeopardy rule says that it's only a red card AND penalty if there was no genuine attempt to play the ball. The shirt pull was worthy of a red card, but that took place outside the area, so if that was the action that got him sent off, it shouldn't have been a penalty. If the penalty was for Dendoncker bringing him down in the area with his legs, well that was an attempt to win the ball. Still a penalty, but no red card.
I wondered exactly the same thing.
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Gerrard was allowed to bring in a lot of poor players, Emery was stupid enough to play most of them.
What's he supposed to do? Play the same 11 week after week after week. He absolutely HAS to give all of them the chance to play. Stevenage? Our under-23's should be strong enough to beat them.
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Deserved all we got. Thought we could turn up and they’d roll over, over playing and trying to pass the ball in. I don’t recall their keeper making a save (goal aside) which tells you all you need t9 know about our cutting edge. Shameful.
That aside, full credit to Stevenage, they stuck to their guns and got themselves a historic win.
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I don't blame Emery for today at all, as the only way he's going to get to know what he's working with is by seeing them play. He will have learnt an awful lot today in that defeat.
How many times does he need to see Olsen exactly? He picked a bad team, and seemingly couldn't organise or motivate them properly to see off a 4th division side.
Yep, Olsen should have saved that second goal, but where were the 10 (*sorry NINE) outfield players chasing down the striker from the corner? It should never have even got to a shot on goal if they'd had their arses in gear.
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At least I dont need to go to Stoke...
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Changed my mind. Hope Stoke smash em!
https://twitter.com/StevenageFC/status/1612146167248297984?s=20&t=0O6aHSiCMjNkaAxg75iMBg
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I don't blame Emery for today at all, as the only way he's going to get to know what he's working with is by seeing them play. He will have learnt an awful lot today in that defeat.
How many times does he need to see Olsen exactly? He picked a bad team, and seemingly couldn't organise or motivate them properly to see off a 4th division side.
Yep, Olsen should have saved that second goal, but where were the 10 (*sorry NINE) outfield players chasing down the striker from the corner? It should never have even got to a shot on goal if they'd had their arses in gear.
I think due to a man light they all just got sucked into the pile on in the box and just expecting Stevenage to cross it in and see what happens.
Credit to the corner taker for thinking quickly and playing it short and we got done big time from it.
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Bailey needs to be sat on the bench for a long time. Everyone keeps speaking of his pace and he never outruns anyone.
Also, why do managers insist on playing him on the right? He has *no* right foot and the notion that he will be enabled to cut in and curl one in with his left is a 1-in-1000 proposition. His most effective game of late, if I recall, came under Danks who had him on the left and saw Bailey putting in good crosses. Frankly, I want a wing to put in crosses effectively as this will pay off far more often than the rare banger from the top of the box.
If you are going to play him, at least recognize his limitations and stick him where he can be most effective. Better, though, do not play him.
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The manager has disrespected our club and has shown no understanding of the FA Cup.
Idiotic
Grow up…..all you post is bloody negative
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There's no way Sam Allardyce would have lost this match.
My mate cried all of the water out of his body after this result, it was a fucking disgrace.
I don't think Dean Smith or MoN would have lost this game either.
The players selected were not motivated and went through the motions. Emery probably thought they would be smart enough to realise the level of performance necessary. Well, now he knows otherwise.
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Entitled, posturing preeners, all tats and headphones, swaggering into VP as if they’re Greek gods, tippy tapping safe triangles in safe areas whilst waving to the family and chewing gum 1- 2 Hardworking, committed professionals being the best version of themselves, focussed, determined, integrity personified.
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Olsen 40 caps
Cash 11 caps
Agustinsson 50 caps
Bednarek 46 caps
Chambers 3 caps
Luiz 9 caps
Dendoncker 31 caps
Sanson 10 caps
Bailey 18 caps
Ings 3 caps
Coutinho 69 caps
How do we have a team full of internationals serve up such a shower of shit that we get beat by a league 2 team?
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It's largely irrelevant now, but the ref's made a mistake hasn't he with the sending off and penalty?
The double jeopardy rule says that it's only a red card AND penalty if there was no genuine attempt to play the ball. The shirt pull was worthy of a red card, but that took place outside the area, so if that was the action that got him sent off, it shouldn't have been a penalty. If the penalty was for Dendoncker bringing him down in the area with his legs, well that was an attempt to win the ball. Still a penalty, but no red card.
I've just watched it back. It wasn't really, in all honesty, was it?
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Just home from the game. That game has to go in the Hall of Shame with the others that have been inflicted on us by the team we support. The big difference about that one compared with Doncaster, Wycombe, Port Vale and the rest is that that game was tossed away with an arrogance that had to be seen to be believed.
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The manager has disrespected our club and has shown no understanding of the FA Cup.
Idiotic
Grow up…..all you post is bloody negative
Yep. The 'disrespected our club' thing is just utter bollocks.
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To be honest, I’m already over being knocked out of the FA Cup. I’ll start caring about it when they do, if you want to win something you play your best team and we didn’t. Having said that, the team picked should have won comfortably. What I do care about going forward is the total lack of quality in our squad players which has been blatantly obvious for at least 3 seasons. All of the players brought in today were awful. Bang average players and yes I include Sanson in that who did no more than ok today against a 4th division side. Dendoncker, Bailey, Bednarek, Chambers, Bailey, Augustinsson and Olsen need replacing as quickly as possible for us to progress. This lot were poor under Gerrard and no amount of “proper coaching” is gonna improve them.
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I didn't like the way we tried to walk it into the net either, especially in the second half.
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Emery isn’t about criticism at all - he shoulders some of the blame today.
But some of the nonsense on here is a joke. One poster said “that’s all on Emery” - doesn’t even deserve a response.
The guy has been a breath of fresh air at the club.
He’s had 6 games.
None of these players were signed by him.
Many of these players are clearly not good enough (and we knew that long before kick off) but he can only pick from the squad he inherited - he hasn’t even had a tsfr window yet
Listen, if it makes you feel better to find a scape goat for todays debacle, fill your boots. But Emery is here now to help sort this shit out and needs longer than 10 weeks. Many of us said the rest of this season was going to be a roller-coaster as he gets to work - the Spurs victory on New Years Day and todays horror show is ample proof of that.
Tylenol taken.
Onto Leeds on Friday - UTV
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Not disrespect, but a massive error of judgement on his part for this. I still think he is the one to take us forward, though.
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Calmed down a bit now. Just Villa being Villa. Hopefully Emery will have learned a lot today, let’s judge on how he reacts.
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When you know you’re not going to do anything in the league and have the chance to win the only trophy on offer, what do you do? Yes, that’s right, play the reserves and get knocked out asap. What a load of bollocks. You couldn’t make this shit up.
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Firstly massive congratulations to Stevenage, they defended superbly for 75 minutes then got themselves in the game.
For me that was an arrogant, lazy performance, we were trying to create the perfect goal with flicks and back heels around the box and a complete lack of interest in getting shots away. Their keeper barely had anything to do for the entire game.
Slow, ponderous, uncontrolled & physically weak…
The only starters I’d say were ok were Sanson and Bednarek who did everything he needed to do in the game.
Olsen, simply a keeper in the Nyland mould, can look ok then has a brain fart.
Cash, zero effect in attack
Augustinsson, can’t beat an egg, should have been hooked at half time
Bednarek, was ok
Chambers, looked decent when arrived, not now
Luiz, was at heart of play, guilty of over playing
Dendoncker, adequate squad player, won’t go anywhere if he’s a starter
Sanson, guess that was au revoir, played ok but
Is very weak
Bailey, lot of ball, did nothing with it, easily upgraded!
Coutinho, offered for ball but was most guilty of over playing
Ings, better finisher than Watkins we know, offers literally nothing else to play
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Didn't see game today fortunately but that's a humiliating result for the club. Team selection should have been more than strong enough to get the win. Olsen was shocking for the winner. A number of players might have had their last game for the club.
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Firstly massive congratulations to Stevenage, they defended superbly for 75 minutes then got themselves in the game.
For me that was an arrogant, lazy performance, we were trying to create the perfect goal with flicks and back heels around the box and a complete lack of interest in getting shots away. Their keeper barely had anything to do for the entire game.
Slow, ponderous, uncontrolled & physically weak…
The only starters I’d say were ok were Sanson and Bednarek who did everything he needed to do in the game.
Olsen, simply a keeper in the Nyland mould, can look ok then has a brain fart.
Cash, zero effect in attack
Augustinsson, can’t beat an egg, should have been hooked at half time
Bednarek, was ok
Chambers, looked decent when arrived, not now
Luiz, was at heart of play, guilty of over playing
Dendoncker, adequate squad player, won’t go anywhere if he’s a starter
Sanson, guess that was au revoir, played ok but
Is very weak
Bailey, lot of ball, did nothing with it, easily upgraded!
Coutinho, offered for ball but was most guilty of over playing
Ings, better finisher than Watkins we know, offers literally nothing else to play
I’d say that’s pretty fair. I’d be a little more damning of Olsen and I thought Bednarek was a little worse than ok but otherwise pretty spot on. Coutinho and Bailey didn’t lack effort but if you can’t be more effective than that against a Div 4 team you’re really in the shit. They did defend pretty well but even so…
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It's largely irrelevant now, but the ref's made a mistake hasn't he with the sending off and penalty?
The double jeopardy rule says that it's only a red card AND penalty if there was no genuine attempt to play the ball. The shirt pull was worthy of a red card, but that took place outside the area, so if that was the action that got him sent off, it shouldn't have been a penalty. If the penalty was for Dendoncker bringing him down in the area with his legs, well that was an attempt to win the ball. Still a penalty, but no red card.
I wonder whether there will be an appeal and overturned as I reckon you're right. Clearly, the foul started outside the box, I can only presume the referee didn't want to give the shirt pull as a foul?
VAR made the decision & when they were focusing on the shirt pull they looked at it from when he started the shirt pull, which was clearly outside the box, & then focused on where it ended. Which was inside the box. I was under the impression that free kicks are given from where incidents start. Otherwise, one could easily start pulling the shirt from inside the box & let go when they run outside the box. Would that make it a free kick or a pen? But whether the VAR made a mistake or not, should not detract from how complete & utter shite we were.
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It’s not Olsen’s fault, he is what he is, not very good
He’s let in 16 goals in 6 games ffs
You’re not going to win the FA Cup with him in goals even if you get through the first rounds you’ll come a cropper at some point
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When you know you’re not going to do anything in the league and have the chance to win the only trophy on offer, what do you do? Yes, that’s right, play the reserves and get knocked out asap. What a load of bollocks. You couldn’t make this shit up.
That's where I am, fella.
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Making say, 5 changes is bad enough when you bring in players who are in and around the first team a fair amount, as it means you lose a bit of understanding and fluidity. When you bring in players who rarely get any minutes at all like Chambers, Bednarek and Sanson, then those attributes goes out of the window altogether, and you're relying on the players' greater ability to outdo the cohesion of the opposition. I would say that this approach has never, ever served us well.
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When you know you’re not going to do anything in the league and have the chance to win the only trophy on offer, what do you do? Yes, that’s right, play the reserves and get knocked out asap. What a load of bollocks. You couldn’t make this shit up.
That's where I am, fella.
And me. Especially seeing that Chelsea, Bournemouth, Palace, Newcastle, Everton, Forest and Brentford are all out; with two of Man City, Liverpool, Arsenal, Wolves or Brighton definites to go out of the 4th round. Seems a massive wasted opportunity.
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We're too ponderous.
I demand lightning quick players this window. And ones that have an end product.
I'm a bit tired of players like Bailey
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Honestly I can't quite believe this is still the line. Oh they might lose a bit of fluidity, oh he's only the Swedish international goalkeeper, are we serious? We seriously think that fielding that team should look like a risk?
Put it this way. What should be the bigger gap: between our first and second elevens, or between our second eleven and League Two?
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When you know you’re not going to do anything in the league and have the chance to win the only trophy on offer, what do you do? Yes, that’s right, play the reserves and get knocked out asap. What a load of bollocks. You couldn’t make this shit up.
As many people have said pre and post match, the starting XI should have been strong enough to see out the game, and indeed had got us to being 1 up with 5 minutes left.
More than enough first teamers on by the end that should have seen it out.
Attitude was the issue, rather than selection.
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Honestly I can't quite believe this is still the line. Oh they might lose a bit of fluidity, oh he's only the Swedish international goalkeeper, are we serious? We seriously think that fielding that team should look like a risk?
Put it this way. What should be the bigger gap: between our first and second elevens, or between our second eleven and League Two?
Well there's plenty of evidence in the last few years to demonstrate that picking a team that has never played together rarely works, even against lower league opposition.
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An arrogant performance that came a bit us on the arse. I am sick of watching us play around with the ball along the back line. Whenever the defence start pissing about it fills me with dread and today was a clear example why.
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Honestly I can't quite believe this is still the line. Oh they might lose a bit of fluidity, oh he's only the Swedish international goalkeeper, are we serious? We seriously think that fielding that team should look like a risk?
Put it this way. What should be the bigger gap: between our first and second elevens, or between our second eleven and League Two?
Well there's plenty of evidence in the last few years to demonstrate that picking a team that has never played together rarely works, even against lower league opposition.
So why does it seem to work for everyone else? Seriously, this is now completely standard and I don't think there's been any increase in upsets overall.
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Honestly I can't quite believe this is still the line. Oh they might lose a bit of fluidity, oh he's only the Swedish international goalkeeper, are we serious? We seriously think that fielding that team should look like a risk?
Put it this way. What should be the bigger gap: between our first and second elevens, or between our second eleven and League Two?
If he played the the team he picks for Leeds on Friday do you think we’d have still lost today
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Honestly I can't quite believe this is still the line. Oh they might lose a bit of fluidity, oh he's only the Swedish international goalkeeper, are we serious? We seriously think that fielding that team should look like a risk?
Put it this way. What should be the bigger gap: between our first and second elevens, or between our second eleven and League Two?
If he played the the team he picks for Leeds on Friday do you think we’d have still lost today
I don't think a Premier League side should have to worry about that against fourth tier opposition.
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Honestly I can't quite believe this is still the line. Oh they might lose a bit of fluidity, oh he's only the Swedish international goalkeeper, are we serious? We seriously think that fielding that team should look like a risk?
Put it this way. What should be the bigger gap: between our first and second elevens, or between our second eleven and League Two?
If he played the the team he picks for Leeds on Friday do you think we’d have still lost today
I don't think a Premier League side should have to worry about that against fourth tier opposition.
No, you’re right but don’t forget we’ve been here a million times before so we do worry
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The Man Utd selection pissed me off, but this...the team is absolutely, one hundred percent fine. In fact the only one who was a bit of a risk coming in was Sanson, who was the best player!
No, I know we like to make these things as explicable as possible, makes it easier to blame single decisions that we can learn from, but sometimes a black swan just invades your living room and shits on your sandwich. Those players should have been miles, miles, miles too good to lose today.
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When you know you’re not going to do anything in the league and have the chance to win the only trophy on offer, what do you do? Yes, that’s right, play the reserves and get knocked out asap. What a load of bollocks. You couldn’t make this shit up.
That's where I am, fella.
And me. Especially seeing that Chelsea, Bournemouth, Palace, Newcastle, Everton, Forest and Brentford are all out; with two of Man City, Liverpool, Arsenal, Wolves or Brighton definites to go out of the 4th round. Seems a massive wasted opportunity.
Yes, and we knew beforehand what the draw was.
Mind you, had we won, we'd just have played a similar line up at Stoke most probably.
If this result and performance does not result in some big changes and big improvements, then the pain and embarrassment of losing, and wasting a massive chance will only be exacerbated.
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When you know you’re not going to do anything in the league and have the chance to win the only trophy on offer, what do you do? Yes, that’s right, play the reserves and get knocked out asap. What a load of bollocks. You couldn’t make this shit up.
As many people have said pre and post match, the starting XI should have been strong enough to see out the game, and indeed had got us to being 1 up with 5 minutes left.
More than enough first teamers on by the end that should have seen it out.
Attitude was the issue, rather than selection.
Yep, the team that started should have won that game. The fact they didn't was entirely down to a lethargic approach in not trying and finish the tie off and some completely unprofessional and slack moments in the very last minutes of the game.
On the issue of selection though, the goalkeeper has now cost us dearly in both cup competitions.
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We've had 11 managers since we last won an FA Cup... Tie. Never mind the fucking trophy.
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We've had 11 managers since we last won an FA Cup... Tie. Never mind the fucking trophy.
Fucking hell!
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I don't blame Emery for today at all, as the only way he's going to get to know what he's working with is by seeing them play. He will have learnt an awful lot today in that defeat.
How many times does he need to see Olsen exactly? He picked a bad team, and seemingly couldn't organise or motivate them properly to see off a 4th division side.
Other than Chambers, Benderak and Sanson, those players playing today have been getting regular game time under Emery and before him. There have been cup games in recent seasons where we’ve changed 8/9/10 players, this wasn’t one of them. I don’t think the selection was the problem, it was the players.
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We've had 11 managers since we last won an FA Cup... Tie. Never mind the fucking trophy.
Apologies if I'm missing a joke but I count six even if you include Eric Black (which I don't normally)
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I was cringeing at those behind me singing "Champions of Europe you'll never sing that" to feckin Stevenage!
Seriously though, that is messed up. Glad they had this weird shit stuck right up them.
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I am not going to knock Emery for the team, it should have been good enough to win and for 88 mins it was, embarrassing as the defeat is, we were pretty much in complete control until those two gaffes out of the blue, Dendonker simply wouldn’t have tried that against other opposition so he deserves all the stick coming his way, no real surprise Olsen dropped another clanger but real Parks league defending.
Of for some pace in the side, with them being very well organised and working hard to get in shape we should have seen more attacking intent from the full backs, no excuse for them being so conservative with two holding midfielders to fill in.
Desperate for a new creative player, Bailey looks shot and Buendia a little boy lost.
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So who should have played that makes a significant difference? Emi Martinez sure. But if as a club we are at the end of the game only 1-0 up against Stevenage that’s not a keeper issue. How about Ollie Watkins? Hardly known for his scoring or individual brilliance. The midfield created nothing for Ings so how would Watkins have done better. Kamara is DM. Did we really need a DM today? Do Digne, Mings and Konsa make a huge difference had they played? McGinn was hurt so that’s moot. I don’t see why this team today couldn’t win this game. If we’d played a better Championship side or PL then maybe we needed closer to the first XI. But we had more than enough to win the game. And as much as the keeper pissed me off at the end it wasn’t all down to him. We had 60%+ possession and did pretty much fuck all with it. That’s why we lost more than the ultimate ineptitude of the keeper.
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The only reasoning behind it is that we have a match on Friday night. Even so, play your best 11 and try to get the game done asap. But no. Piss around with the ball slowly going nowhere is what we did for the most part. Where’s the invention, ability to get beyond players from Division 4?
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I don't blame Emery for today at all, as the only way he's going to get to know what he's working with is by seeing them play. He will have learnt an awful lot today in that defeat.
How many times does he need to see Olsen exactly? He picked a bad team, and seemingly couldn't organise or motivate them properly to see off a 4th division side.
Other than Chambers, Benderak and Sanson, those players playing today have been getting regular game time under Emery and before him. There have been cup games in recent seasons where we’ve changed 8/9/10 players, this wasn’t one of them. I don’t think the selection was the problem, it was the players.
It wasn't so long ago that a group of our reserves & youth players absolutely battered League 2 Barrow 6-0...
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I don't blame Emery for today at all, as the only way he's going to get to know what he's working with is by seeing them play. He will have learnt an awful lot today in that defeat.
How many times does he need to see Olsen exactly? He picked a bad team, and seemingly couldn't organise or motivate them properly to see off a 4th division side.
Other than Chambers, Benderak and Sanson, those players playing today have been getting regular game time under Emery and before him. There have been cup games in recent seasons where we’ve changed 8/9/10 players, this wasn’t one of them. I don’t think the selection was the problem, it was the players.
Augustinsson's played 80 minutes all season. Dendoncker's got 30 minutes of first team action spread over the last 4 league games. Coutinho hasn't played for more than an hour since the middle of October. The least said about Olsen the better.
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We've had 11 managers since we last won an FA Cup... Tie. Never mind the fucking trophy.
Apologies if I'm missing a joke but I count six even if you include Eric Black (which I don't normally)
Reverse order..
Emery
Danks
Gerrard
Smith
MacDonald
Bruce
Clarke
Di Matteo
Black
Garde
MacDonald
Sherwood
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And it is a bloody joke isn't it?!
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It's largely irrelevant now, but the ref's made a mistake hasn't he with the sending off and penalty?
The double jeopardy rule says that it's only a red card AND penalty if there was no genuine attempt to play the ball. The shirt pull was worthy of a red card, but that took place outside the area, so if that was the action that got him sent off, it shouldn't have been a penalty. If the penalty was for Dendoncker bringing him down in the area with his legs, well that was an attempt to win the ball. Still a penalty, but no red card.
I wonder whether there will be an appeal and overturned as I reckon you're right. Clearly, the foul started outside the box, I can only presume the referee didn't want to give the shirt pull as a foul?
VAR made the decision & when they were focusing on the shirt pull they looked at it from when he started the shirt pull, which was clearly outside the box, & then focused on where it ended. Which was inside the box. I was under the impression that free kicks are given from where incidents start. Otherwise, one could easily start pulling the shirt from inside the box & let go when they run outside the box. Would that make it a free kick or a pen? But whether the VAR made a mistake or not, should not detract from how complete & utter shite we were.
I'm not sure what VAR were looking at to be honest. They seemed to slow down on the shirt pull outside the area so I thought they were going to give a free kick. I think it is probably fair to penalise the offending team in the way they did, it's like they've played advantage for first foul and given second one, but I doubt this is some sort of shift in policy and more that they're making it up as they go along.
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We've had 11 managers since we last won an FA Cup... Tie. Never mind the fucking trophy.
Apologies if I'm missing a joke but I count six even if you include Eric Black (which I don't normally)
Reverse order..
Emery
Danks
Gerrard
Smith
MacDonald
Bruce
Clarke
Di Matteo
Black
Garde
MacDonald
Sherwood
Remi Garde won a cup tie as manager
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So? Are they or are they not, by all reasonable estimation, good enough to beat Stevenage? Seriously, there are so many things to criticise about today, this proper correlation-causation goof up is not one of them. The team had Philippe Coutinho in it. Coutinho! I know he's not what he was but are we kidding? This is some sort of unacceptable risk against a fourth division team? It's nonsense, I'm sorry.
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A front line of Coutinho, Ings and Bailey - all three internationals now or at some point of their careers should have been able to get 1 shot on target between them.
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We've had 11 managers since we last won an FA Cup... Tie. Never mind the fucking trophy.
Apologies if I'm missing a joke but I count six even if you include Eric Black (which I don't normally)
Reverse order..
Emery
Danks
Gerrard
Smith
MacDonald
Bruce
Clarke
Di Matteo
Black
Garde
MacDonald
Sherwood
You don't fully appreciate just how much shit we have had until you see it in front of you like a shopping list.
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The only reasoning behind it is that we have a match on Friday night. Even so, play your best 11 and try to get the game done asap. But no. Piss around with the ball slowly going nowhere is what we did for the most part. Where’s the invention, ability to get beyond players from Division 4?
I found it surprising that Martinez didn't start.
I kind of get all the others but why have your no.1 keeper sitting around doing nothing in the cold when he could have been safely in goal probably standing around doing nothing in the cold. Just like Man U away. If he'd played I think we'd have won.
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We've had 11 managers since we last won an FA Cup... Tie. Never mind the fucking trophy.
Apologies if I'm missing a joke but I count six even if you include Eric Black (which I don't normally)
Reverse order..
Emery
Danks
Gerrard
Smith
MacDonald
Bruce
Clarke
Di Matteo
Black
Garde
MacDonald
Sherwood
Wow!
What a stat that is.
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We don’t take it seriously, not just Emery any manager we’ve had down the years
Even those like Smith got us to finals by default a lot of the times in the early rounds,
Started taking a bit more seriously when we got near
We’ve played the same sort of side against Stevenage and against Manchester United, whether it’s a top side or a bottom side, the selection is the same and it’s one that says I think these are capable of winning the game, but not the most capable ,
that’s where we are. That’s what we do. Emery don’t care about the FA Cup or league cup
I like Emery, I’ve got no problem with him being our manager but he’s not sitting at home tonight Crying about going out the FA Cup, he won’t be that bothered
I know he’s a cup specialist in other countries where cups are not that important, and I don’t imagine he was selecting weaker sides in the Europa cup
Unfortunately, he has a 100% record with us
Year after fucking year this happens, I just want a manager that will go out to win the cup and not fuck about
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I don't blame Emery for today at all, as the only way he's going to get to know what he's working with is by seeing them play. He will have learnt an awful lot today in that defeat.
How many times does he need to see Olsen exactly? He picked a bad team, and seemingly couldn't organise or motivate them properly to see off a 4th division side.
Other than Chambers, Benderak and Sanson, those players playing today have been getting regular game time under Emery and before him. There have been cup games in recent seasons where we’ve changed 8/9/10 players, this wasn’t one of them. I don’t think the selection was the problem, it was the players.
Augustinsson's played 80 minutes all season. Dendoncker's got 30 minutes of first team action spread over the last 4 league games. Coutinho hasn't played for more than an hour since the middle of October. The least said about Olsen the better.
Ok fair enough referencing the minutes played, but Coutinho played a half against Wolves and has been getting increased game time since the post WC re start, Donk was a regular until Emery and played at the WC. I agree Olsen shite, but he has played 3 out of the last 4. None of them came to the game cold imo.
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So who should have played that makes a significant difference? Emi Martinez sure. But if as a club we are at the end of the game only 1-0 up against Stevenage that’s not a keeper issue. How about Ollie Watkins? Hardly known for his scoring or individual brilliance. The midfield created nothing for Ings so how would Watkins have done better. Kamara is DM. Did we really need a DM today? Do Digne, Mings and Konsa make a huge difference had they played? McGinn was hurt so that’s moot. I don’t see why this team today couldn’t win this game. If we’d played a better Championship side or PL then maybe we needed closer to the first XI. But we had more than enough to win the game. And as much as the keeper pissed me off at the end it wasn’t all down to him. We had 60%+ possession and did pretty much fuck all with it. That’s why we lost more than the ultimate ineptitude of the keeper.
Yep, that's how I see it really. Never felt that Stevenage threatened really and that we had some control on the game, but we were just so lethargic and went through the motions when we should have been upping the pace to finish the tie off. The self inflicted implosion in the final minutes was inexplicable and was poor beyond belief.
Part of the problem is we've got a lot of similar types of players. Buendia, Coutinho, Sanson - no real pace there and as a result we hadn't really got an outlet. Bailey was positioned wide quite often, but is really struggling.
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We've had 11 managers since we last won an FA Cup... Tie. Never mind the fucking trophy.
Apologies if I'm missing a joke but I count six even if you include Eric Black (which I don't normally)
Reverse order..
Emery
Danks
Gerrard
Smith
MacDonald
Bruce
Clarke
Di Matteo
Black
Garde
MacDonald
Sherwood
Wow!
What a stat that is.
Garde won an FA cup tie and you can't seriously count Clarke. Macdonald and Danks.
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I'm not sure what VAR were looking at to be honest. They seemed to slow down on the shirt pull outside the area so I thought they were going to give a free kick. I think it is probably fair to penalise the offending team in the way they did, it's like they've played advantage for first foul and given second one, but I doubt this is some sort of shift in policy and more that they're making it up as they go along.
Also, 'denying an obvious goal scoring opportunity' was doing a lot of heavy lifting there, seeing as we had two defenders in the area in attendance. It's crying over spilt milk and we got what we ultimtaely deserved, but we seem to have been done a bit there. But as it's Stevenage, even mentioning it is a bit embarrassing. I'd appeal the red card but then it might be successful meaning that Dendonkey is available again, so probably best left.
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It's largely irrelevant now, but the ref's made a mistake hasn't he with the sending off and penalty?
The double jeopardy rule says that it's only a red card AND penalty if there was no genuine attempt to play the ball. The shirt pull was worthy of a red card, but that took place outside the area, so if that was the action that got him sent off, it shouldn't have been a penalty. If the penalty was for Dendoncker bringing him down in the area with his legs, well that was an attempt to win the ball. Still a penalty, but no red card.
I wonder whether there will be an appeal and overturned as I reckon you're right. Clearly, the foul started outside the box, I can only presume the referee didn't want to give the shirt pull as a foul?
VAR made the decision & when they were focusing on the shirt pull they looked at it from when he started the shirt pull, which was clearly outside the box, & then focused on where it ended. Which was inside the box. I was under the impression that free kicks are given from where incidents start. Otherwise, one could easily start pulling the shirt from inside the box & let go when they run outside the box. Would that make it a free kick or a pen? But whether the VAR made a mistake or not, should not detract from how complete & utter shite we were.
I'm not sure what VAR were looking at to be honest. They seemed to slow down on the shirt pull outside the area so I thought they were going to give a free kick. I think it is probably fair to penalise the offending team in the way they did, it's like they've played advantage for first foul and given second one, but I doubt this is some sort of shift in policy and more that they're making it up as they go along.
They didn't look at the foul inside the box at all though. Would have been a pen, but then no red card. Especially as Chambers was right over too at the point. I have said it for a long time, VAR is just a way so they can manipulate results.
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To be fair the covering defenders were only in a position to maybe get a tackle in as Dendonker had slowed the fella down by pulling his shirt and then chopping him down. No argument on the red but thought it would have been a free kick for the initial pull.
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Every PL club rotated their first team in round 3. This notion that because we did we don’t take it seriously is nonsense.
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Every PL club rotated their first team in round 3. This notion that because we did we don’t take it seriously is nonsense.
I don't care about any other club. We haven't won an FA Cup game in 7 years, and have nothing else to play for.
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We've had 11 managers since we last won an FA Cup... Tie. Never mind the fucking trophy.
Apologies if I'm missing a joke but I count six even if you include Eric Black (which I don't normally)
Reverse order..
Emery
Danks
Gerrard
Smith
MacDonald
Bruce
Clarke
Di Matteo
Black
Garde
MacDonald
Sherwood
Wow!
What a stat that is.
Garde won an FA cup tie and you can't seriously count Clarke. Macdonald and Danks.
They've all been in charge, as manager /Head Coach, so of course they count.
Garde won a replay with Wycombe, I'd forgotten that. But he lost the next so that makes 10. I'd argue a technicality but there's no point. We've been garbage in the Cup since the semi final against Liverpool.
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Every PL club rotated their first team in round 3. This notion that because we did we don’t take it seriously is nonsense.
I don't care about any other club. We haven't won an FA Cup game in 7 years, and have nothing else to play for.
By not playing a stronger team we have pretty much ended the season.
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In the long run, we're going to regret sending Archer out on loan this season.
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I thought it was quite a funny stat Drummond, you crack on son.
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Every PL club rotated their first team in round 3. This notion that because we did we don’t take it seriously is nonsense.
I don't care about any other club. We haven't won an FA Cup game in 7 years, and have nothing else to play for.
And most of them have just had 6 weeks off !!!
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And what did he gain by rotating?
Giving Olsen more game time is that because he’s going to be the number two for the conceivable future, I hope not he’s bloody rubbish
What about Augustinsson is there any point at all in playing him,
We were squabbling about trying to get friendlies 3 weeks ago and now we’re resting World Cup winners. It is pathetic
We will not finish in the European spots and we won’t go down, its the ideal time to take a full tilt at winning a cup and we have blown both
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He played seasoned professionals and current internationals. He didn’t play a bunch of kids. That would justify the outrage. For me, the blame lies squarely with players who massively underperformed. This will be a red letter day for many of them as they won’t be part of our future.
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Yeah, i get the arguments about rotating, but that team should have been easily good enough to beat a League Two side, and if they're not, then we've got some significant problems.
Some of that stuff today was just eyeball-bleedingly shit.
Dendoncker the clumsy wanker.
Bailey with one of the worst performances I've seen from a Villa forward in literally decades.
Cash a clueless fuckwit going forward.
Olsen, a goal keeper who never makes saves.
Watkins, whose job it was (going on what Digne seemed to be saying to him) to close down the man at the corner seemingly totally fucking unaware where he was.
Coutinho, a player who not that long ago fetched a fee of £140m - almost one and a half Grealishes - putting in a fucking pathetic performance against a pub side.
Honestly, a lot of these players need to be put into a cannon and fired at the sun, the wankers.
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Several of the players seemed to be playing as they merely had to breathe and we'd beat Stevenage. Coutinho being the worst culprit - just taking random pot shots and not really trying to get involved.
Honestly, if someone offered us £10m for him I'd snap their hand off. Not got the mentality to play at the top level now.
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I just got back a few minutes agoafter an extended comfort food break at Strensham. It was the first game I'd been to since the start of last season.
I was shocked not by the team rotation as I still thought we should have enough to win but I was very surprised and angry about the complete lack of urgency and desire to win which was replaced by ill founded arrogance and at times, incompetence. A truly shocking display which has at least proved that we have no strength in depth and that some of our first choice players are also not good enough.
To think that we haven't won a FA Cup game since 2015 is incredible and to lose after being one up with 5 minutes to play is typical Villa.? I just hope the manager gave them the bollocking they deserved.
I'm just so fucking angry.
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When you take the piss with your selections this is what happens.
The team selected at the start had us 1-0 up. The side that finished game which is pretty much the first XI is the one that collapsed.
I don't think so. No Martinez, Mings, Kamara, McGinn...
One of whom is injured. Seasoned internationals started this game today, hardly putting out the under 16s.
Do you need anymore straws or you ok for now?
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Shooting aside, I didnt think Coutinho was too bad, he suffered from us having pretty much zero width so kept playing safe passes whilst he waited for the full backs to advance forward, which they didn’t seem to want to.
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Oh FFS are we still discussing the selection of Olsen??
As I said in another thread for about the past 10-15 years it is standard practice that when you try to sign a back-up 'keeper you have to promise them they will get minutes in the cups. No 'keeper wants to be a backup and those that end up as backups want guarantees around game time so they have a chance to push the number 1. We will have more than likely promised Olsen he would get cup games when we signed him. It's not a question of 'resting' Martinez or 'taking a look' at Olsen.
This is 2023 not 1993.
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And what did he gain by rotating?
Giving Olsen more game time is that because he’s going to be the number two for the conceivable future, I hope not he’s bloody rubbish
What about Augustinsson is there any point at all in playing him,
We were squabbling about trying to get friendlies 3 weeks ago and now we’re resting World Cup winners. It is pathetic
We will not finish in the European spots and we won’t go down, its the ideal time to take a full tilt at winning a cup and we have blown both
Yes indeed. He fucked up.
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Gosh, it would be a massive shame if we didn't play Olsen in the cup games, and he got pissed off and wanted to leave. That wouldn't do, at all.
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He played seasoned professionals and current internationals. He didn’t play a bunch of kids. That would justify the outrage. For me, the blame lies squarely with players who massively underperformed. This will be a red letter day for many of them as they won’t be part of our future.
That’s not the point though. By not playing his best XI he sent the wrong message and the game is about mentality more than attributes.
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I also blame that Lego haired ****** Gerrard for selling off all our wingers. Tosser
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Oh FFS are we still discussing the selection of Olsen??
As I said in another thread for about the past 10-15 years it is standard practice that when you try to sign a back-up 'keeper you have to promise them they will get minutes in the cups. No 'keeper wants to be a backup and those that end up as backups want guarantees around game time so they have a chance to push the number 1. We will have more than likely promised Olsen he would get cup games when we signed him. It's not a question of 'resting' Martinez or 'taking a look' at Olsen.
This is 2023 not 1993.
Olsen’s had enough fucking minutes in the last month or so, there was no need to risk and important FA cup tie on that score. If he’s not happy he can go and do one.
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Gosh, it would be a massive shame if we didn't play Olsen in the cup games, and he got pissed off and wanted to leave. That wouldn't do, at all.
I am not a legal man but I am sure it would be written into the contracts. But thanks for the condescending remark and resume your hounding of the manager with the best CV we have had in a generation.
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He played seasoned professionals and current internationals. He didn’t play a bunch of kids. That would justify the outrage. For me, the blame lies squarely with players who massively underperformed. This will be a red letter day for many of them as they won’t be part of our future.
That’s not the point though. By not playing his best XI he sent the wrong message and the game is about mentality more than attributes.
These are professional footballers. The manager shouldn’t have to play the same team week after week. And our strongest team doesn’t need to be the same team. It has to be the best required team for the given opponent. If we are to become anything of note in the future we absolutely need to use all of our squad and not the same XI. And this was Stevenage of league 2. Not Man City or Arsenal.
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The last 12 minutes was just so unprofessional, we had been poor but winning 1-0 .....the lack of game awareness in the 85th minute for so called experienced players is mind boggling.
Why does Olsen even make that pass to Dendoncker ?
Why does Dendoncker even think about making the turn rather than play back to the keeper ?
In both cases clear the fucking ball, they are probably not going to break us down in open play.
Nobody comes out to the corner taker then when Watkins finally wakes up he ambles out and turns his back, pathetic.
As for Olsen getting beat at the near post is anyone surprised ?
I am 59 and crave for us to win the FA Cup but its never going to happen when we do not take it seriously, The overpaid players will just shrug it off while supporters will be hurting at what might have been for yet another year.
I think Emery is the man and will re-build us but needs time, he has had 6 games ...I just hope we see a procession of these players leaving the club with the new players looking like they give a shit buy hey this is the modern game where securing your premier league place matters more than actually trying to win one of the 3 trophies on offer.
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I'm afraid it was one of those 'We hammered them one-nil games for 87 minutes. We were never in any trouble (except for their off-side goal), had almost 80% of the ball and just missed out on the finishing (again). Then game the two 'howlers'. I was surprised he hooked Sanson, who was the best player on the pitch, but I guess that was to give Ramsey some match time - didn't work. Worse, we lost Cash and Agustinsson to what looked like bad injuries. No excuses, but sometimes it just doesn't go for you.
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Gosh, it would be a massive shame if we didn't play Olsen in the cup games, and he got pissed off and wanted to leave. That wouldn't do, at all.
I am not a legal man but I am sure it would be written into the contracts. But thanks for the condescending remark and resume your hounding of the manager with the best CV we have had in a generation.
Yep sure, a reserve keeper who wasn't wanted by Sheffield United had it written into his contract that he'd be guaranteed to start in cup games for us. Of course he did.
And nobody's hounding the manager, but people have got every right to be pissed off with that shambles today. He's built his career on cup runs rather than being particularly good in the league, and yet he's chucked both away this season for us at the first attempt.
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He played seasoned professionals and current internationals. He didn’t play a bunch of kids. That would justify the outrage. For me, the blame lies squarely with players who massively underperformed. This will be a red letter day for many of them as they won’t be part of our future.
That’s not the point though. By not playing his best XI he sent the wrong message and the game is about mentality more than attributes.
These are professional footballers. The manager shouldn’t have to play the same team week after week. And our strongest team doesn’t need to be the same team. It has to be the best required team for the given opponent. If we are to become anything of note in the future we absolutely need to use all of our squad and not the same XI. And this was Stevenage of league 2. Not Man City or Arsenal.
No doubt.
But you have to tell the players:
"Look here vous overpaid eejits, these boyos won't bother the high press bollox yous are used to. They will play a deep block of 5-4-1. No point fannying about at the back with fanny dangling trying to draw them in. Get it forward quickly by one means or another, preferably all means alternately, and crush their spirit early doors. Ya cuntz".
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We're too ponderous.
I demand lightning quick players this window. And ones that have an end product.
I'm a bit tired of players like Bailey
Bailey was exactly that in the Bundesliga!
It should've been a top signing but world cup break came at the wrong time and he's looked sunday league standard since.
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Emi probably would have saved the pen as well as the second goal.
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We've had 11 managers since we last won an FA Cup... Tie. Never mind the fucking trophy.
Apologies if I'm missing a joke but I count six even if you include Eric Black (which I don't normally)
Reverse order..
Emery
Danks
Gerrard
Smith
MacDonald
Bruce
Clarke
Di Matteo
Black
Garde
MacDonald
Sherwood
Wow!
What a stat that is.
Garde won an FA cup tie and you can't seriously count Clarke. Macdonald and Danks.
They've all been in charge, as manager /Head Coach, so of course they count.
Garde won a replay with Wycombe, I'd forgotten that. But he lost the next so that makes 10. I'd argue a technicality but there's no point. We've been garbage in the Cup since the semi final against Liverpool.
Yeah, but it's the type of stat Blose fans will Facebook and piss you off with.
How many FA Cup games did Danks, McDonald, Clarke, Di Matteo and Black preside over as manager of Villa? I'm guessing none.
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We're too ponderous.
I demand lightning quick players this window. And ones that have an end product.
I'm a bit tired of players like Bailey
Bailey was exactly that in the Bundesliga!
It should've been a top signing but world cup break came at the wrong time and he's looked sunday league standard since.
He wasn’t exactly Neymar before the World Cup break.
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I hope William didn’t watch ITV tonight.
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Oh FFS are we still discussing the selection of Olsen??
As I said in another thread for about the past 10-15 years it is standard practice that when you try to sign a back-up 'keeper you have to promise them they will get minutes in the cups. No 'keeper wants to be a backup and those that end up as backups want guarantees around game time so they have a chance to push the number 1. We will have more than likely promised Olsen he would get cup games when we signed him. It's not a question of 'resting' Martinez or 'taking a look' at Olsen.
This is 2023 not 1993.
It's a trend that started in Spain and has crept over here in last 15 years. Emery won europa with Villareal with their number two in goal.
Only issue though is Olsen had two prem games over xmas so we could've balanced it out by giving Emi one of his designated games.
Since he's been available for selection again a world cup winning keeper has been on the bench for two of the three games.
At least now Martinez and Mings will be available for selection for every game left they're fit for so that is probably the last time we see Olsen in a Villa shirt.
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We're too ponderous.
I demand lightning quick players this window. And ones that have an end product.
I'm a bit tired of players like Bailey
Bailey was exactly that in the Bundesliga!
It should've been a top signing but world cup break came at the wrong time and he's looked sunday league standard since.
He wasn’t exactly Neymar before the World Cup break.
He was starting to show what he was about though. Chelsea at home when we had that dominant spell he should've scored the header but he hit a wonderful cross that Ings headed straight at the keeper from six yards so should've had assist.
Brentford at home he scored and had two assists.
Newcastle was poor all round but I thought first half he was a threat.
Both Man. United games he was excellent.
So something to build on there but feels like that Liverpool game where he kept falling over when in good positions has impacted him even before the Wolves miss so he needs to be taken out now even if it means playing Ramsey as a wide midfielder.
We need to make some signings in final third soon.
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I was cringeing at those behind me singing "Champions of Europe you'll never sing that" to feckin Stevenage!
Please tell me they weren't?
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I was cringeing at those behind me singing "Champions of Europe you'll never sing that" to feckin Stevenage!
Please tell me they weren't?
For the first time in many a long year, you could hardly hear them singing anything unless you were in close proximity.
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I was cringeing at those behind me singing "Champions of Europe you'll never sing that" to feckin Stevenage!
Please tell me they weren't?
For the first time in many a long year, you could hardly hear them singing anything unless you were in close proximity.
Our fans can be very witty, but sometimes I do cringe.
I think the first time I felt that was early-00s when Sunderland brought about 3,000 to a midweek game, overall attendance was about 33,000, and some were singing 'empty seats, m'lord'.
Read the room, lads.
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I think that 15 of the 16 that featured for us today have played full internationals. To struggle to create many worthwhile chances at home against a 4th division side is piss poor. Today smacked of us thinking we just had to turn up and would go through as we were very one paced. One of the very rare times we moved the ball with pace we scored.
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Didn't see the game and certainly have no intention too and we can slate Emery all we like but...... that starting 11 should be more than comfortable to see off a side like Stevenage.
Somehow, the club needs to get the message that these cup surrenders have gone on too long. These games are our only chance of winning something which is kind of the whole point of it all. So they can say what they like on Instagram but until the players take these games seriously this will keep happening, like it has done for long enough already.
A donation of all players involved weekly wages to a local charity would be a decent start at showing some contrition - I wont be holding my breath.
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I've mentioned it previously, but why did they push Archer out on loan so early in this transfer window? This was an ideal game to give him 90 minutes. That said, the players whole attitude in this game was shocking. Pedestrian football for large parts of the game was excruciating to watch.
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Still seething - no excuse for that unprofessional shite
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Do modern players even care anymore? This way they get extra time off and still get paid. I know a lot of people at work who would think the same. Why work harder for no extra reward?
Also, what was the Sanson celebration about? Was he having a dig at someone or just having a word with himself.
I noticed a couple of the players on the bench Young and Cash i think doing the same gesture after he scored and smiling/laughing.
What a shit record of not winning an FA Cup game for 7 years! FFS
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They clearly don't really care. It's just the cup. A bit of a laugh. A little training game that they don't have to try too hard in.
Should the manager ensure they have a better attitude? I'd hope so.
Thing is we'd still have won if it wasn't for the joke of a keeper.
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We are not going to win the league or finish top four any time soon. We really should be throwing everything at cup competitions which is our only chance of success. Can someone please pass this on to our owners?
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They clearly don't really care. It's just the cup. A bit of a laugh. A little training game that they don't have to try too hard in.
Should the manager ensure they have a better attitude? I'd hope so.
Thing is we'd still have won if it wasn't for the joke of a keeper.
Nah, it's not his fault we lost, we weren't good enough anywhere on the pitch.
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Our squad should be set up to play 45 to 50 games per season to take into account cup competitions. We’re never going to win the league so the cups really should take a much more significant role in how we approach each season. It could even be that the bonuses for cup wins are even greater than league matches to act as an incentive to players, but something has to change.
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Realistically the cups are probably the easiest way to get into Europe
I am ok with the selection - I think it was pretty strong - and these experienced players should be able to do it. In the cold light of day
Never play for our club again
Olsen
LB guy from Sweden
CB from Southampton
Need to seriously improve by the end of the season
Phil
Cash
Bailey
Watkins
Ings
Emi 10
Digne
Dendoker
Business since Grealish left has been very poor and shown no strategy
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Realistically the cups are probably the easiest way to get into Europe
I am ok with the selection - I think it was pretty strong - and these experienced players should be able to do it. In the cold light of day
Never play for our club again
Olsen
LB guy from Sweden
CB from Southampton
Need to seriously improve by the end of the season
Phil
Cash
Bailey
Watkins
Ings
Emi 10
Digne
Dendoker
Business since Grealish left has been very poor and shown no strategy
I would be ok losing the 8 you say should improve.
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The selection wasn't that ridiculous, most of those players have plenty of first team minutes for Villa and several were involved in the Spurs win.
Our problem is we just don't have the guile to break down a low block. There seemed to be very little moveent, Ings had all but given up making runs in the second half and if he did get the ball he was surrounded by four players. When we did get in a crossing position more often than not it was lofted in for a line op of giant Stevenage defenders to easily mop up.
To his credit Bailey did continue running, constantly making runs and looking for space. The propblem with him is when he did get the ball he seemed to be trying too hard and invariably lost it cheaply. He seems to have lost his pace and his confidence, but I give him some credit for sticking at it.
When the game is that compressed I'm not sure why we don't mix it up a bit more with more width and at times when we did draw them out not break with more pace and numbers.
It really was a poor performance, but we're out because of individual errors really.
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As my lad said to me post-match, a large number of that "team" won't play for us again this season. This was there chance to shine.
For some reasons when we play our so-called second string at home in cup games they are a disjointed and passive mess. There is something culturally missing...
My view is, when not in Europe there are 3 trophies to play for, we aren't winning the league or getting top 4 so may as well go for it in the cups.
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I thought it was an interesting insight into the psychology of a team of players who knew they were comfortably better than their opponents.
All the extra touches, turns, flicks that our players were making were presumably them trying to give a good account of themselves personally and avoid embarrassment, but it slowed the game down so much that it allowed Stevenage to get everybody back.
We didn’t have a player on either wing who could go outside and put a cross in so everyone was trying to play through the most congested penalty area I’ve ever seen. So the last thing we needed was to move the ball so slowly.
It was notable that for a few minutes after half time we seemed to move the ball a bit quicker and looked a bit better. Then reverted to slowing things down too much.
For me it confirms that we have too few players who are prepared to take risks, more worried about potentially giving the ball away or getting robbed of the ball (as dendonker ultimately was) than moving the ball quickly and being more effective as a team. I think it’s a problem that happens from making too many changes, with lots of players looking to make an impression and not mess up, so to that extent Emery shares some of the blame, (although the team we put out should have been more than capable of beating Stevenage.)
It also highlights a problem with our players in game management. They’re not kids, that’s not the first game they’ve played against lower league players who sit in, the solutions should be hard wired into them by this stage of their careers.
For me, as much as Buendia frustrates by giving the ball away, he at least seems to be prepared to take risks. Ings didn’t really get any service. Everyone else revealed why they’re probably never going to be up to it at the level we want to aim for.
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Oh FFS are we still discussing the selection of Olsen??
As I said in another thread for about the past 10-15 years it is standard practice that when you try to sign a back-up 'keeper you have to promise them they will get minutes in the cups. No 'keeper wants to be a backup and those that end up as backups want guarantees around game time so they have a chance to push the number 1. We will have more than likely promised Olsen he would get cup games when we signed him. It's not a question of 'resting' Martinez or 'taking a look' at Olsen.
This is 2023 not 1993.
Then neither Villa, nor any other mid-table side, will ever win the Cup. Bollocks to that culture. I'm sure he's a nice bloke and I wish him every happiness and success in his life, but I don't care about Olsen's game time issues at Villa. Emi plays yesterday, 95% the goals don't happen.
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I'm 99% sure that the second goal doesn't go in if Emi was in goals. That was a bog standard save for pretty much any keeper who gets paid to play - male or female. Olsen is clearly not good enough to wear the Aston Villa shirt and that's got to be the last time we ever see him playing for our club. As for keeper's getting assurances of game time in the cups. Fuck that. If you accept the privilege of a contract at Aston Villa then the only assurances you should get is you will get game time based on your performance whether that's on the training ground or in practice matches.
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They had the Stevenage manager on the radio this morning, and even he said he'd be disappointed if his keeper had let their second goal in.
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It's about changing the mindset. We are one of maybe 6-8 clubs that should be putting everything into cup competitions. The games should be key milestones in the fixture list and taken as seriously and approached in the same way you would a game against the top 4. The tactic of playing players that have hardly kicked a ball this season, or are clearly out of form is just crazy.
Nothing will change though.
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They had the Stevenage manager on the radio this morning, and even he said he'd be disappointed if his keeper had let their second goal in.
He looked so fat I’m surprised he could even fit on radio.
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My last vestige for the FA cup died yesterday. After 50 odd years of "this is our year" I am done.
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This defeat will stay with us for a long time,surely the players have got to be as gutted as us the fans, and will be desperate to put it right. Emery should be able to utilise this in the near future. I wonder what Nas and Wes think of their investment at the moment. Slightly off topic how come it’s ok to use Var in some fa cup ties and not in others, where’s the the level playing field. Until we can use it across the board we shouldn’t use it’s just not fair.
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the club the manager the players don’t care about the FA Cup
Premier League position is what it’s all about
I don’t like it, it makes me angry but that’s where we are that’s what we’ve got to accept
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My last vestige for the FA cup died yesterday. After 50 odd years of "this is our year" I am done.
Same here.
Fair play to Stevenage: good luck to them against Stoke.
So where do we go from here? Taxi for Bailey: my mother could finish better than him and she's 84 tomorrow!
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They had the Stevenage manager on the radio this morning, and even he said he'd be disappointed if his keeper had let their second goal in.
He looked so fat I’m surprised he could even fit on radio.
Really?
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I might have to come back on here Friday , still hurting and so pointless at the moment
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My feelings yesterday were ones of numbed shock but on reflection yet again I’m fucking seething.
3 things I noticed from yesterday.
The Phil and Dougie show - a couple of Brazilian show ponies who delivered precisely zero end product despite playing neat little triangles 40 yards from goal. Their complete inability to quickly switch play to utilise the acres of space Bailey, Cash and Sanson had was so frustrating. The end result of this against a team playing a very well disciplined and structured 5-3-2 was to create overloads out wide on their wingbacks which we summarily failed to do as I can count on one hand the number of times we actually got behind them.
Slow play and passing - god it was ponderous. As above if you’re going to break down a well structured defence you have got to move the ball at pace, we didn’t apart from about 10-15 minutes at the start of the second half.
The set up - I think the one thing Emery got wrong yesterday was his set up, as soon as he saw they were playing with aback 5 he should have adjusted as we had the opportunity to absolutely destroy them down the sides particularly on the right with the pace of Cash and Bailey. In addition after the subs Donk ended up as the defensive midfielder for some
Reason and he just hasn’t got the technical ability to play on the half turn like Doug so is an absolute liability when accepting the ball from the keeper under pressure.
Fair play to Stevenage there 3 centre backs won’t have had an easier game this season. They also pressed us really well with the more athletic and pacy players they bought on in the last 10 to 15 minutes.
The players had better put in a better display on Friday.
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They had the Stevenage manager on the radio this morning, and even he said he'd be disappointed if his keeper had let their second goal in.
That second goal was laughably pathetic. Pathetic for the total lack of anyone closing the man down, yes, but also pathetic for the ease with which it beat our 'goalkeeper'.
Absolutely fucking pathetic.
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He didn't get near the pen, the first offside goal (which was well finished, in fairness) and that near post effort driven straight at him.
He was also flat footed with that curler in the first half that no top flight keeper should've been caught out by.
Like Nyland, he'll have the odd decent game. But ineptness is his default.
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They had the Stevenage manager on the radio this morning, and even he said he'd be disappointed if his keeper had let their second goal in.
That second goal was laughably pathetic. Pathetic for the total lack of anyone closing the man down, yes, but also pathetic for the ease with which it beat our 'goalkeeper'.
Absolutely fucking pathetic.
I've only just seen it, Jesus. I'd left with my lad with 10 mins to go as nothing was happening and he's not that bothered with football. Went home and just put my headphones on and listened to podcasts in an attempt to shut out reality.
Hopefully it will end up being a blessing in disguise as it reveals the true nature of some of the wastes of space employed to play football for us.
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They had the Stevenage manager on the radio this morning, and even he said he'd be disappointed if his keeper had let their second goal in.
That second goal was laughably pathetic. Pathetic for the total lack of anyone closing the man down, yes, but also pathetic for the ease with which it beat our 'goalkeeper'.
Absolutely fucking pathetic.
Yep. There was lots of arm waving afterwards by various players but once someone realised they were going short who was running at full tilt to block the shot, not one of them. Wankers.
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His only decent game has been one in which he literally had no shot to save.
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He deserves stick for them not being up *for* it. But they should be up *to* it if they'd been coaching themselves for 2 months. Sorry, the idea the selection was the problem is an absurd crutch. The problem was the disastrous, horrible, half-arsed, shit-brained, lily-livered candy-ass spiced pumpkin horseshit performance from the players.
Exactly this! We convincingly beat League 2 Barrow a couple of seasons ago by playing our U21s!
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Awful and embarrassing.
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His only decent game has been one in which he literally had no shot to save.
Absolutely correct
I can understand, using squad players and rotate a bit, but when it comes to the goalkeeper he is the most important position on the pitch he can very easily win you games or lose you games . We all know which this one does
He is a proven failure. We know that through watching him in all his previous games bar the one you’re talking about
Why would you keep putting a proven failure in the Nets
There’s only ever going to be one outcome
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Awful and embarrassing.
I used them once. Never again. The worst estate agents I've ever seen.
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For 4th and 5th round weekends the entire squad should be volunteered to work for local charities / coach local junior teams…100% not weekends off
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They had the Stevenage manager on the radio this morning, and even he said he'd be disappointed if his keeper had let their second goal in.
He looked so fat I’m surprised he could even fit on radio.
Really?
Well, no not really, I was using the idiom of irony and sarcasm to elaborate my proposal that he rarely consumes salads
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There needs to be fallout from this.
There can't just be a shrug of the shoulders from coaching staff, middle management etc that it's a bad day at the office/just one of those things.
The FA Cup should always matter to Aston Villa.
Our attitude and approach to it has been fucking appalling for too long now.
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I had an ominous feeling about what could happen sitting on a slender one goal lead when Coutinho put the ball in row Z for the fourth time!
Leon Bailey: you don't have to be Messi to realise that if you've got the close attention of three opposing players, then there's a good chance one of your team will be in free space for a pass (umpteen times!).
Premier League players are supposed to be fitter than lower league players. So, why not try to tire them out by playing at a faster pace than walking football?
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They had the Stevenage manager on the radio this morning, and even he said he'd be disappointed if his keeper had let their second goal in.
That second goal was laughably pathetic. Pathetic for the total lack of anyone closing the man down, yes, but also pathetic for the ease with which it beat our 'goalkeeper'.
Absolutely fucking pathetic.
If that happened at a race course there would definitely be a Stewards enquiry and Race Authorities will look around for betting trends.
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The first goal was utterly stupid. But sometimes things like that happen.
The second was unforgiveable. No leadership or organisation from anyone. If Martinez or Mings had been on the pitch there's no way on earth that would have happened.
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The only possible positive that I can think of about yesterday's debacle is that it accelerates Emery's squad overhaul.
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I feel so sorry for the young Villa fans (some of whom would have been "treated" to a game at Villa Park, which is prohibitively expensive now for so many, possibly for the first time in a while) and will be today suffering the taunts of all and sundry. Some of the youngsters will be thinking they'd rather claim allegiance to one of the self styled big six after that disgraceful performance.
Where does the blame lie? I won't criticise the manager for rotating the squad. That eleven still had more than enough experience and talent to see off a well drilled League Two side. However, I thought the mentality of the players was appalling; no urgency, no nous, no determination.
Compare how Leeds (with several youngsters in the team) fought back against a Cardiff team in a tough away fixture.
You've got to want it... and (unlike us fans) our players didn't.
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You can’t blame the manager for rotating his squad but what about him playing a sub standard goalkeeper one who’s a proven failure who other defenders good or bad have no faith in, who continuously lets the team down and costs us goals
why if you’ve not been up to the job 4 out of 5 times do you keep doing the same thing
I blame him for that because it’s bordering on incompetence
unless of course he don’t give a shit about the FA Cup, which I think is the case
And to top it off and make it even worse he’s got one of the best goalkeepers in the world sitting on the fucking bench
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Well having slept on it and with a visit to gym, swim and sauna I have reflected on what i said yesterday and now my considered view is just fuck off Emery and the players just fuck off. You lot don't know how much it hurts you overpaid pampered useless twats.
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Well having slept on it and with a visit to gym, swim and sauna I have reflected on what i said yesterday and now my considered view is just fuck off Emery and the players just fuck off. You lot don't know how much it hurts you overpaid pampered useless twats.
You've gone soft in your old age! ;)
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Your problem is going to the gym and swimming. No-one has ever come away happy from either.
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Well having slept on it and with a visit to gym, swim and sauna I have reflected on what i said yesterday and now my considered view is just fuck off Emery and the players just fuck off. You lot don't know how much it hurts you overpaid pampered useless twats.
You've gone soft in your old age! ;)
A weekend break at Champney's can do that to a man.
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Well having slept on it and with a visit to gym, swim and sauna I have reflected on what i said yesterday and now my considered view is just fuck off Emery and the players just fuck off. You lot don't know how much it hurts you overpaid pampered useless twats.
You've gone soft in your old age! ;)
Thats what happens when you are pampered with a swim and sauna.
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So pissed off and depressed about last nights capitulation, such a half arsed display keeping possession but doing sweet fa with the ball, so many players let us down and there’s a lot of talk re Olsen which I agree with but Ollie Watkins casual stroll out to challenge the guy who scored capped it all off for me, what a shit show.
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I'm still a bit confused about the red card. I thought it was only a yellow these days if a penalty was awarded?
Unless he was sent off for the shirt pull (which was outside the box) and the penalty was for the lunge tackle thing?
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I felt it should have been a yellow card and a free-kick outside the area for the shirt pull.
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I'm still a bit confused about the red card. I thought it was only a yellow these days if a penalty was awarded?
Unless he was sent off for the shirt pull (which was outside the box) and the penalty was for the lunge tackle thing?
I think it was a clear goalscoring opportunity, rather than just a foul.
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I feel so sorry for the young Villa fans (some of whom would have been "treated" to a game at Villa Park, which is prohibitively expensive now for so many, possibly for the first time in a while) and will be today suffering the taunts of all and sundry. Some of the youngsters will be thinking they'd rather claim allegiance to one of the self styled big six after that disgraceful performance.
This is so true, there was loads of young kids and proud Dads in the Holte last night, taking photos and videos etc. I noticed before the game and it really made me smile. They must be gutted how it turned out.
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I felt it should have been a yellow card and a free-kick outside the area for the shirt pull.
If the ref allows play on and an idiot eventually scythes him down in the penalty area then its a penalty.
I don't have any problem with that decision, the double jeopardy is wrong though.
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If it keeps him away from the first team for three games the ref did us a favour.
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I felt it should have been a yellow card and a free-kick outside the area for the shirt pull.
If the ref allows play on and an idiot eventually scythes him down in the penalty area then its a penalty.
I don't have any problem with that decision, the double jeopardy is wrong though.
Not if the ref deemed it to be a deliberate foul with no genuine attempt at the ball. Which, given the earlier foul outside the box is a reasonable assumption to make.
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I don't think anybody will argue that it wasn't a clear goalscoring opportunity. The red depends on whether or not you think it was a genuine attempt to play the ball. Fwiw, I don't. It was the panicky lunge of a desperate man.
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Just home from the game. That game has to go in the Hall of Shame with the others that have been inflicted on us by the team we support. The big difference about that one compared with Doncaster, Wycombe, Port Vale and the rest is that that game was tossed away with an arrogance that had to be seen to be believed.
100% agreed Brian. Arrogance was the word I used whilst watching at 1 0 up.
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I'm still a bit confused about the red card. I thought it was only a yellow these days if a penalty was awarded?
I thought it wasn't even a 'last man, goal denied' foul either as we had a couple of defenders closing in.
Although, then again, Olsen. It's a fair cop.
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Just home from the game. That game has to go in the Hall of Shame with the others that have been inflicted on us by the team we support. The big difference about that one compared with Doncaster, Wycombe, Port Vale and the rest is that that game was tossed away with an arrogance that had to be seen to be believed.
100% agreed Brian. Arrogance was the word I used whilst watching at 1 0 up.
I think it was the manner of our goal - which was a very good one with a bit of showboating - that made us more arrogant.
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I'm still a bit confused about the red card. I thought it was only a yellow these days if a penalty was awarded?
Unless he was sent off for the shirt pull (which was outside the box) and the penalty was for the lunge tackle thing?
A Cov player got sent off on Saturday for saving a shot with his hand, I too thought that 'double jeopardy' thing had stopped that, though I'm unsure about any fucking rule these days.
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For double jeopardy, it only counts if the defending player is making a genuine attempt for the ball.
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For double jeopardy, it only counts if the defending player is making a genuine attempt for the ball.
Ok, so they've added a level of subjectivity to help clear things up.
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I'm giving up like most of yesterday's 11.
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I dread to think of what this site would have been like today had Gerrard been manager yesterday - I think the current manager is getting off relatively lightly as his "in game management" was woeful - as poor as anything Slippy G presided over - in fact he was sacked for less
I have witnessed many poorer performances during my 60+ years of supporting the Villa but not felt this utterly embarrassed at being humiliated at home by a lower league side.
As for the post match statement - isn't that what he is paid for - i.e. motivation
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6 games in and I don't really think he has too much blame.
I don't think the two starting 11s for the cup games were right, but as a new manager he has to see what he's got. 6 months in and it would be a different conversation. 12 months in and he'd get as much blame as the players.
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I feel so sorry for the young Villa fans (some of whom would have been "treated" to a game at Villa Park, which is prohibitively expensive now for so many, possibly for the first time in a while) and will be today suffering the taunts of all and sundry. Some of the youngsters will be thinking they'd rather claim allegiance to one of the self styled big six after that disgraceful performance.
This is so true, there was loads of young kids and proud Dads in the Holte last night, taking photos and videos etc. I noticed before the game and it really made me smile. They must be gutted how it turned out.
agree, I have seen the good times and just hoping one day they see the same
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Yeah I wouldn’t get too worked up about blaming the manager after 6 games, especially one who has demonstrated he’s bloody good. He’ll be acutely aware yesterday was piss poor.
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6 games in and I don't really think he has too much blame.
I don't think the two starting 11s for the cup games were right, but as a new manager he has to see what he's got. 6 months in and it would be a different conversation. 12 months in and he'd get as much blame as the players.
Failing to beat a 4th tier team at home whilst fielding a side of 11 Internationals is grim whichever way you look at it - they got what they deserved and that has to be down to the Manager/Coach
He failed to "read the game" well enough and therefore make positive changes to unlock a strong/physical but limited team. i don`t always agree with Dion Dublin but he read it right - early in the game when he pointed to our lack of pace and speed of delivery . We changed it once and scored - then reverted to type
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Where are the leaders on the pitch, if your teammates are being dicks tell them,stop being matey matey with them, Emery needs to sort this out,if they are going to cry give him a hanky to cry into
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Yes but I doubt he sent them out saying play slowly and show no urgency. Now clearly you want the manager to address that if it’s happening, but sometimes within a single game it’s hard. The flip side is we shouldn’t over praise his tactical tweaks in other games that have resulted in positive outcomes. The point is it’s very early days and he’s done enough in his career to be trusted.
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They played slowly with no urgency until half time against Wolves too.
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Even if we won yesterday,I couldn't see us beating Stoke on that performance
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They played slowly with no urgency until half time against Wolves too.
The first halves against Spurs and Liverpool were pretty shit as well. We've definitely been a second half team under Emery since the break. Well, until yesterday, that is.
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Even if we won yesterday,I couldn't see us beating Stoke on that performance
Well yeah, but I suspect with another month or whatever it is Emery will have influenced stuff more. I don’t think that performance is the benchmark of our level.
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You can’t blame the manager for rotating his squad but what about him playing a sub standard goalkeeper one who’s a proven failure who other defenders good or bad have no faith in, who continuously lets the team down and costs us goals
why if you’ve not been up to the job 4 out of 5 times do you keep doing the same thing
I blame him for that because it’s bordering on incompetence
unless of course he don’t give a shit about the FA Cup, which I think is the case
And to top it off and make it even worse he’s got one of the best goalkeepers in the world sitting on the fucking bench
Bailey was desperately bad, agree with everyone on that, but how many times did he do exactly what they wanted him to - cut inside onto his left and run into traffic? Change wings at half-time maybe?
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I didn't get to the game yesterday. I watched it on TV in the pub. I'm very surprised that they gave the attendance as 32k. I've seen various clips from all sides of the ground and for the life of me I can't see where the ten thousand empty seats were. Very strange.
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I didn't get to the game yesterday. I watched it on TV in the pub. I'm very surprised that they gave the attendance as 32k. I've seen various clips from all sides of the ground and for the life of me I can't see where the ten thousand empty seats were. Very strange.
It was a bit sparse up in the Upper North around me but that was it, everywhere else looked pretty full
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They played slowly with no urgency until half time against Wolves too.
Tactically we were all over the shop that first half. Blame rests primarily with Emery for that.
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Partly, but he was bollocking players all through the first half for being out of position and not closing down.
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Partly, but he was bollocking players all through the first half for being out of position and not closing down.
The likes of Cash played like he hadn't a clue where he was supposed to be and that's on the coach. It shouldn't have taken until half time for that tactical debacle to have been rectified either.
I often wonder across many sports if players even can hear or notice the coach losing it on the sideline during games. The unfortunate ones within immediate earshot maybe 🤔
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Partly, but he was bollocking players all through the first half for being out of position and not closing down.
The likes of Cash played like he hadn't a clue where he was supposed to be and that's on the coach. It shouldn't have taken until half time for that tactical debacle to have been rectified either.
I often wonder across many sports if players even can hear or notice the coach losing it on the sideline during games. The unfortunate ones within immediate earshot maybe 🤔
You might be right, but equally it could be that the player is just not willing/able to follow instruction.
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Partly, but he was bollocking players all through the first half for being out of position and not closing down.
The likes of Cash played like he hadn't a clue where he was supposed to be and that's on the coach. It shouldn't have taken until half time for that tactical debacle to have been rectified either.
I often wonder across many sports if players even can hear or notice the coach losing it on the sideline during games. The unfortunate ones within immediate earshot maybe 🤔
During lockdown with no crowds I remember a reporter commenting on how Roy Hodgson had talked a young Palace defender through his debut as he could communicate across the whole pitch.
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At least I now know why they call it a cup "upset" - it f**kin well upset me. And still does 24 hours later, perhaps even more so considering the pelters I have had to put up with at work today. I had to put up with sh*t from people who, as far as I knew, didn't even know I supported Villa.
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There was a documentary on in Ireland over Christmas about how God's first club St Patrick's Athletic had to go over to Libya in the 80s on a meet-and-greet after they'd got knocked out of the domestic cup.
I'd like to see similar benevolence extended to our fuckwits.
A nice bit of food poisoning or a hostage/kidnap situation out in Lebanon in the week when the 4th round is due to be played rather than the usual jolly in Dubai. Reinforce the benefits of staying in the comp.
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Wishing we had Manchester United now
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Partly, but he was bollocking players all through the first half for being out of position and not closing down.
The likes of Cash played like he hadn't a clue where he was supposed to be and that's on the coach. It shouldn't have taken until half time for that tactical debacle to have been rectified either.
I often wonder across many sports if players even can hear or notice the coach losing it on the sideline during games. The unfortunate ones within immediate earshot maybe 🤔
During lockdown with no crowds I remember a reporter commenting on how Roy Hodgson had talked a young Palace defender through his debut as he could communicate across the whole pitch.
shouldn't have to tell the like of Cash what do
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All the talk of ‘in game management’ misses the fact that we lost the game in the last few minutes.
If Stevenage had gone a goal up, or even equalised, with half an hour to go, we probably would have won.
While I’m here, the ref gave a red card when he gave a free kick for a foul outside the area. I believe that the VAR decision that turned that into a penalty, should also have rescinded the red.
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All the talk of ‘in game management’ misses the fact that we lost the game in the last few minutes.
If Stevenage had gone a goal up, or even equalised, with half an hour to go, we probably would have won.
We should have had the game sewn up well before the last few minutes. As for the second paragraph: speculation, your honour!
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Arteta made 7 changes tonight to face a side a league above Stevenage. He has included a few younger players which Emery didn't do. Difference being they are taking care of business and we didn't. That's on the players. Our side was good enough to beat a league two opponent.
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So they are implementing the manager's tactics and game plan.aftet being chosen by the aforementioned to do so? Marvellous!
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Arteta made 7 changes tonight to face a side a league above Stevenage. He has included a few younger players which Emery didn't do. Difference being they are taking care of business and we didn't. That's on the players. Our side was good enough to beat a league two opponent.
100%.
I have full faith in Emery.
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All the talk of ‘in game management’ misses the fact that we lost the game in the last few minutes.
If Stevenage had gone a goal up, or even equalised, with half an hour to go, we probably would have won.
We should have had the game sewn up well before the last few minutes. As for the second paragraph: speculation, your honour!
I don’t disagree that we should have had it sewn up by then, but plenty of games are won by one goal, and he actually had made changes to bring on more first choice players, who sadly remained as complacent as the ones he took off.
As for ‘speculation’, that’s why my sentence includes the word ‘probably’, but an earlier comeback from them might well have dealt with that complacency.
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I dread to think of what this site would have been like today had Gerrard been manager yesterday - I think the current manager is getting off relatively lightly as his "in game management" was woeful - as poor as anything Slippy G presided over - in fact he was sacked for less
I have witnessed many poorer performances during my 60+ years of supporting the Villa but not felt this utterly embarrassed at being humiliated at home by a lower league side.
As for the post match statement - isn't that what he is paid for - i.e. motivation
Im sorry Gerrard had more or less 12 months of more or less shite performances and cringeworthy man management. Yesterday was dreadful, but Emery has had 6/7 games in which we’ve beaten an in form Man United for the first time in 27 years, an in form Brighton and a top 4 Spurs side away. Absolutely zero comparison, none.
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So they are implementing the manager's tactics and game plan.aftet being chosen by the aforementioned to do so? Marvellous!
He's been here for 3 months like
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[Villa being Villa in the FA cup but you don't expect it at home against Stevenage . The manager and half hearted players need to have a complete rethink .
Let's not forget the shambolic first half against Wolves this week.
We're going backwards
3 wins out of 5 is not backwards though is it
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I felt it should have been a yellow card and a free-kick outside the area for the shirt pull.
The ref did award a free kick first but then quickly changed his mind to a penalty. I can only guess that he decided to play advantage whilst their man was still on his feet.
We can argue about penalties, free kicks, red cards all we like, at the end of the day it's angels on pinheads IMV. If you defend and foul like that in that area you're asking for trouble
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I dread to think of what this site would have been like today had Gerrard been manager yesterday - I think the current manager is getting off relatively lightly as his "in game management" was woeful - as poor as anything Slippy G presided over - in fact he was sacked for less
I have witnessed many poorer performances during my 60+ years of supporting the Villa but not felt this utterly embarrassed at being humiliated at home by a lower league side.
As for the post match statement - isn't that what he is paid for - i.e. motivation
Absolutely. Spot on. Couldn’t agree more.
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I dread to think of what this site would have been like today had Gerrard been manager yesterday - I think the current manager is getting off relatively lightly as his "in game management" was woeful - as poor as anything Slippy G presided over - in fact he was sacked for less
I have witnessed many poorer performances during my 60+ years of supporting the Villa but not felt this utterly embarrassed at being humiliated at home by a lower league side.
As for the post match statement - isn't that what he is paid for - i.e. motivation
Im sorry Gerrard had more or less 12 months of more or less shite performances and cringeworthy man management. Yesterday was dreadful, but Emery has had 6/7 games in which we’ve beaten an in form Man United for the first time in 27 years, an in form Brighton and a top 4 Spurs side away. Absolutely zero comparison, none.
Yes I understand the frustration with the result, it was terrible, but I think some are trying to read too much into and draw wider conclusions that aren’t there.
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So they are implementing the manager's tactics and game plan.aftet being chosen by the aforementioned to do so? Marvellous!
He's been here for 3 months like
Indeed. And he has regularly mentioned how he has been working on tactics, roles, instructions and strategy. I'd expect experienced footballers to be getting to grips with that, especially against 4th division sides.
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So they are implementing the manager's tactics and game plan.aftet being chosen by the aforementioned to do so? Marvellous!
He's been here for 3 months like
Two months.
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I felt it should have been a yellow card and a free-kick outside the area for the shirt pull.
The ref did award a free kick first but then quickly changed his mind to a penalty. I can only guess that he decided to play advantage whilst their man was still on his feet.
We can argue about penalties, free kicks, red cards all we like, at the end of the day it's angels on pinheads IMV. If you defend and foul like that in that area you're asking for trouble
I was just intrigued, hence the initial question. Just to be clear, I'm not using it as an excuse or complaining about it either. It doesn't take anything away from Stevenage, they won fair and square.
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So they are implementing the manager's tactics and game plan.aftet being chosen by the aforementioned to do so? Marvellous!
He's been here for 3 months like
Indeed. And he has regularly mentioned how he has been working on tactics, roles, instructions and strategy. I'd expect experienced footballers to be getting to grips with that, especially against 4th division sides.
That's on the players then isn't it. I think the idea that a manager walks into a club mid season, when the team is in a mess, and immediately everything just clicks is just fucking stupid. We've clearly improved overall, and there seems to to be a lack of ability to understand that teams aren't built immediately.
He hasn't got a single of his signings in the team yet, there isn't a manager alive who would click his fingers and get perfect performances from them straight away.
Even if emery had given zero tactics before Sunday, I'd expect international players to dispatch a 4th division side, it's mostly on them.
I'm also sick of hearing "He's meant to be a cup specialist"
Personally, I'm in no immediate rush to get European football, wolves and west ham are good examples of why not. Building a top 8 team is tricky and requires time. Sunday was fucking gash, but can we try and start putting a bit more faith in the manager, we've got a good one for the first time in a fucking lifetime
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I'd be quite happy with European football next season, thanks all the same.
And If managers aren't really accountable and it's all on the players maybe we should save £6 million a year and not have one.
Get the kitman to pick the side. Or run a poll on Birmingham Live.
Emery's previous record deserves respect.
But during his tenure with us he's picked the wrong side in both domestic cup competitions. And it's what he does with us that matters.
History teaches us that the truly successful Villa managers or the ones touched by genius don't have their names associated with shockers like Sunday. That's normally the preserve of shitehawks like DOL, Lamberk and so on.
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Arteta made 7 changes tonight to face a side a league above Stevenage. He has included a few younger players which Emery didn't do. Difference being they are taking care of business and we didn't. That's on the players. Our side was good enough to beat a league two opponent.
I don't see how this is analogous as Arsenals squad is clearly superior to ours and in any event the FA Cup isn't their priority , whereas it should have been ours. The side we picked was of course technically still good enough to win, but we could have picked a side that would almost certainly have won, which is what makes Sunday's defeat all the more frustrating as it was so avoidable.
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Not sure how five league games, 3 wins 1 draw 1 defeat, including beating Man United, Spurs away and Brighton at their place is “going backwards” by any standard we’ve reached in recent years.
Yeah I’d rather still be in both cups too but I’m much more concerned about not being on the cusp of the relegation places, and looking up the table rather than down given the constant diet of liquid cat shit we were force fed under Carpethead and his Neanderthal methods.
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Not sure how five league games, 3 wins 1 draw 1 defeat, including beating Man United, Spurs away and Brighton at their place is “going backwards” by any standard we’ve reached in recent years.
Yeah I’d rather still be in both cups too but I’m much more concerned about not being on the cusp of the relegation places, and looking up the table rather than down given the constant diet of liquid cat shit we were force fed under Carpethead and his Neanderthal methods.
Yep, I agree. I think part of the difficulty is that over the last few home games we've been served up some shit; defeats to Liverpool and Stevenage, a scraped draw to Wolves. It builds up and pisses people off. ManUtd feels like fucking ages ago right now, and the vast majority of us don't get to go to away games so missed them.
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Have gone through a few stages after Sunday. There was the initial shock of sitting in the North Stand watching it unfold and then that was followed by anger at the complete lack,of professionalism shown by the players in those final minutes.
Probably now at the head scratching phase of how players who are pretty much all capped internationally, could be so stupid to let that happen to them. They were a rabble by the end, culminating in the terrible organisation defending that corner.
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Something that is forgotten by managers and players is the knock on effect when going out of the FA Cup to a team like Stevenage
Obviously they don’t give a shit about the FA Cup, It won’t affect them at all but for us fans it puts us on a downer, look at all the posts on here regarding Emery’s tactics and selections,
He and the team have thought that on themselves
There’s a game on Friday night against Leeds I’m still pissed off about last weekends shitshow I will go because I’m a ST holder but if I wasn’t I reckon I might have given it a miss with a If they can’t be arsed why should I attitude
I know this is only a temporary feeling, but just when you think things have just turned positive for Villa with the new appointment The whole thing blows up into a world of negativity.
for them it blows over but for us fans it goes deep
I personally don’t think managers and players will ever understand how supporters feel
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Something that is forgotten by managers and players is the knock on effect when going out of the FA Cup to a team like Stevenage
Obviously they don’t give a shit about the FA Cup, It won’t affect them at all but for us fans it puts us on a downer, look at all the posts on here regarding Emery’s tactics and selections,
He and the team have thought that on themselves
There’s a game on Friday night against Leeds I’m still pissed off about last weekends shitshow I will go because I’m a ST holder but if I wasn’t I reckon I might have given it a miss with a If they can’t be arsed why should I attitude
I know this is only a temporary feeling, but just when you think things have just turned positive for Villa with the new appointment The whole thing blows up into a world of negativity.
for them it blows over but for us fans it goes deep
I personally don’t think managers and players will ever understand how supporters feel
They might not completely get supporters, but they certainly understand the importance of momentum to any sports team. I said after the game on Sunday that the result could dent momentum, which in my view would be miles worse than another year of cup shit-ness. We will see on Friday I suppose. Win that and we're properly looking up at a potential run on 6th or 7th (I know, be still your beating hearts, but fuck me it's better than recent history and might, just night enable us to sign some better players in the summer).
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So they are implementing the manager's tactics and game plan.aftet being chosen by the aforementioned to do so? Marvellous!
He's been here for 3 months like
Indeed. And he has regularly mentioned how he has been working on tactics, roles, instructions and strategy. I'd expect experienced footballers to be getting to grips with that, especially against 4th division sides.
That's on the players then isn't it. I think the idea that a manager walks into a club mid season, when the team is in a mess, and immediately everything just clicks is just fucking stupid. We've clearly improved overall, and there seems to to be a lack of ability to understand that teams aren't built immediately.
He hasn't got a single of his signings in the team yet, there isn't a manager alive who would click his fingers and get perfect performances from them straight away.
Even if emery had given zero tactics before Sunday, I'd expect international players to dispatch a 4th division side, it's mostly on them.
I'm also sick of hearing "He's meant to be a cup specialist"
Personally, I'm in no immediate rush to get European football, wolves and west ham are good examples of why not. Building a top 8 team is tricky and requires time. Sunday was fucking gash, but can we try and start putting a bit more faith in the manager, we've got a good one for the first time in a fucking lifetime
I don't think anybody are expecting it all to click upon Emery's arrival, I think most people have said it is on the useless wankers who pull their boots on players who are. I and others onhave definitely said, Emery should have selected a stronger team to start (with hindsight, after the game, obviously). Have been talking about Europe on this thread, I may have missed that? Most of it seems to be centred on 7 years of no progress in the FA Cup, which is very annoying indeed. Emery made his selection, they didn't do the job. Many are pissed off. I don't feel you can exempt Emery from criticism because he is paid to select and a team tell them what to do. We all know they 'should' have won but they didn't, hence the need to moan a bit.
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I don't think anybody are expecting it all to click upon Emery's arrival, I think most people have said it is on the useless wankers who pull their boots on players who are. I and others onhave definitely said, Emery should have selected a stronger team to start (with hindsight, after the game, obviously). Have been talking about Europe on this thread, I may have missed that? Most of it seems to be centred on 7 years of no progress in the FA Cup, which is very annoying indeed. Emery made his selection, they didn't do the job. Many are pissed off. I don't feel you can exempt Emery from criticism because he is paid to select and a team tell them what to do. We all know they 'should' have won but they didn't, hence the need to moan a bit.
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The european stuff wasn't necessarily aimed at you, but other posters complaining that cups are our best european shot and that with his selection he's thrown that away.
The argument seems to be that you either think emery fucked up for not selecting a full strength squad, or that you understand why he didn't, I fall into the latter category.
With cup selections, for better or worse, in the earliest rounds almost no premier league team ever selects a full strength team any more, even when playing other premier league teams, eve championship teams rotate their squad. Rotation isn't just about resting players, it's about preventing injury and also giving minutes to players who don't normally. You need to do that as if Martinez were to get injured we would have to rely on Olsen, and he is shit yes, but he will hopefully be less shit if he's played more. That's the theory, same with chambers/dendoncker/augistinsson. If we'd have played full strength, won and mings or martinez had got injured, it would be a massive problem for our season and had such a negative impact it would outdo winning that game on balance IMO.
Sundays game was lost not because olsen, but because our expensive forwards were absolute fucking clowns all game, as a manager, what can you do about that? My only criticism would be that K Young should have got minutes but he hasn't played at all yet so we don't know.
You either understand why rotation is necessary and part of the modern game, or you just think emery should never do that, seems to be what it comes down to
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We did our usual stroll around the ground on Sunday. I always like to see what exotic cars are in the player's car park. This time there was a 4 x 4 Lamborghini with a matt khaki paint job. Typical footballer's car I thought but after the game my thoughts were quite different.
I wondered which one of those lazy, indolent arrogant players still gets to drive home in that car after a casual stroll around the pitch which to him, counted as a day's work.
Made me seethe.
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[Villa being Villa in the FA cup but you don't expect it at home against Stevenage . The manager and half hearted players need to have a complete rethink .
Let's not forget the shambolic first half against Wolves this week.
We're going backwards
3 wins out of 5 is not backwards though is it
However it’s not 3 wins from 5 it’s 3 from 7 with 3 defeats including this humiliation.