Post by: LukeJames on October 31, 2021, 06:25:08 PM
Post by: PaulWinch again on October 31, 2021, 06:26:28 PM
Post by: wince on October 31, 2021, 06:26:29 PM
Post by: Villan82 on October 31, 2021, 06:28:09 PM
Post by: Proposition Joe on October 31, 2021, 06:28:35 PM
Post by: villadelph on October 31, 2021, 06:28:55 PM
Dean Smith v. Chris Kavanagh
Post by: saint13 on October 31, 2021, 06:29:55 PM
We are piss poor in midfield and the decision not to get a central midfield player in on loan after tracking ESR & JWP all summer will cost him his job.
Post by: LukeJames on October 31, 2021, 06:31:10 PM
Post by: Demitri_C on October 31, 2021, 06:31:48 PM
Crap subs no belief from our players defending horrible. A complete and utted shit show.
Smith out
Post by: CT Villan on October 31, 2021, 06:32:05 PM
Nakamba 7/10
AEG 6/10
Everyone else 3/10
Smith 0/10
Post by: aj2k77 on October 31, 2021, 06:32:21 PM
Arsenal 22 shots
Wolves 9 shots
Tottenham 17 shots
Man Utd 28 shots
Everton 11 shots
Chelsea 12 shots
Brentford 13 shots
Newcastle 9 shots
Watford 13 shots
A massive increase in the last 5 games, from not having conceded more than 13 shots we're now letting teams have 20+ and we've already conceded 3 goals or more in 5 games. We've only played 10. A big shit show and work for a better manager than a very limited, championship mid table manager, like Smith.
Post by: jwarry on October 31, 2021, 06:33:10 PM
The post Jack era is not going well I’m afraid - so I’m blaming him!
Post by: steamer on October 31, 2021, 06:33:16 PM
Post by: Beard82 on October 31, 2021, 06:33:22 PM
It’s not the defeats - it’s the performances.
Feel today was this season in 90 mins - no luck with injuries, misfourntune and a dire performance.
Thought the referee was awful.
But the players seem to have lost faith.
Post by: aj2k77 on October 31, 2021, 06:33:56 PM
Post by: PaulWinch again on October 31, 2021, 06:34:06 PM
Utter garbage...
Nakamba 7/10
AEG 6/10
Everyone else 3/10
Smith 0/10
Nakamba 7/10? Christ - seems committed enough, but he’s woefully short of what we need.
Post by: LukeJames on October 31, 2021, 06:35:03 PM
Utter garbage...
Nakamba 7/10
I know we all see games differently but I thought he was the worst player on the pitch by a long way.
Post by: TopDeck113 on October 31, 2021, 06:36:30 PM
Post by: Beard82 on October 31, 2021, 06:38:01 PM
Once again there is something toxic at Villa Park. For me the coaching departures and recruitment need to be put under the microscope. There's too much that isn't working - and has in actual fact gone backwards since last season.This - 1000% recruitment looks wrong, coaching looks wrong - really worrying
Post by: RichardBatchelor on October 31, 2021, 06:38:18 PM
Post by: Stu on October 31, 2021, 06:38:33 PM
Post by: RichardBatchelor on October 31, 2021, 06:39:09 PM
Utter garbage...
Nakamba 7/10
I know we all see games differently but I thought he was the worst player on the pitch by a long way.
Utter nonsense, he was easily our best player.
Post by: jwarry on October 31, 2021, 06:39:32 PM
Played with spirit between the unjustified red card and 3-1.
[/quote
Careful you don’t want to be too positive on here or you will get slaughtered!
Post by: danno on October 31, 2021, 06:40:08 PM
That went as bad as it could have - I’m gutted to say it but I think that’s it for dean.
It’s not the defeats - it’s the performances.
But the players seem to have lost faith.
Yep and yep.
I had hoped the Arsenal game would be a wake up call, a switch to 4-3-3 and competing for everything. Yet again it looked like we got caught cold by West Ham being up for it.
First two goals we conceded looked so soft. Any point made to Mings was rendered null and void before the first have was over.
We look like we are in big trouble. Ten games in and how many good performances? One? Two?
Post by: Proposition Joe on October 31, 2021, 06:40:45 PM
Utter garbage...
Nakamba 7/10
I know we all see games differently but I thought he was the worst player on the pitch by a long way.
I honestly think McGinn is more of a problem. He is way too frantic and he seems to have some random number generator that decides what his foot is going to do with the ball. Short, long, forwards or back, shoot, pass, it just seems lucky dip.
Post by: Woody17 on October 31, 2021, 06:41:00 PM
Post by: villa for life on October 31, 2021, 06:41:11 PM
This team has the potential to be stars but somehow they are looking like relegation fodder.
Post by: Jon Crofts on October 31, 2021, 06:41:32 PM
When is the last time West Ham had such an emphatic result at VP?
More to the point is when has a team that’s always been a mid to lower echelon team like West Ham beaten Villa 4-1 at home. I’m struggling to recall.
Post by: jwarry on October 31, 2021, 06:44:10 PM
Post by: Risso on October 31, 2021, 06:44:15 PM
Post by: olaftab on October 31, 2021, 06:44:16 PM
Post by: Allan C on October 31, 2021, 06:44:23 PM
No chance 4/10 at the very best. AEG no better then 3/10. I’m not sure any of them were worth more than 5/10.Utter garbage...
Nakamba 7/10
I know we all see games differently but I thought he was the worst player on the pitch by a long way.
Utter nonsense, he was easily our best player.
Post by: RichardBatchelor on October 31, 2021, 06:44:32 PM
When is the last time West Ham had such an emphatic result at VP?
More to the point is when has a team that’s always been a mid to lower echelon team like West Ham beaten Villa 4-1 at home. I’m struggling to recall.
But now they’re a top six team and a very good one (even if Bowen is a bit of a t***, to put it mildly).
Post by: olaftab on October 31, 2021, 06:45:38 PM
When is the last time West Ham had such an emphatic result at VP?Never is the answer.
Post by: RichardBatchelor on October 31, 2021, 06:45:45 PM
No cohesion, no tactics, no urgency. Smith is hopelessly out of his depth. Stealing a living.
Zzzz. Glad you’re not my boss.
Post by: malckennedy on October 31, 2021, 06:45:54 PM
Post by: Jon Crofts on October 31, 2021, 06:46:16 PM
When is the last time West Ham had such an emphatic result at VP?
More to the point is when has a team that’s always been a mid to lower echelon team like West Ham beaten Villa 4-1 at home. I’m struggling to recall.
But now they’re a top six team and a very good one (even if Bowen is a bit of a t***, to put it mildly).
They won’t finish there and we made them look decent.
Post by: Rigadon on October 31, 2021, 06:46:18 PM
Post by: TonyD on October 31, 2021, 06:46:37 PM
Truly embarrassing.
I will be mightily pissed off if he is still in charge at Southampton.
He has to go.
Post by: LukeJames on October 31, 2021, 06:47:51 PM
Utter garbage...
Nakamba 7/10
I know we all see games differently but I thought he was the worst player on the pitch by a long way.
Utter nonsense, he was easily our best player.
Funny post.
Post by: KevinGage on October 31, 2021, 06:49:32 PM
After extra time midweek, they were starting to look jaded even though we were down to 10. But playing advantage when on the attack is verboten now, according to that lemon. And it's perfectly OK to throw opposing players to the ground. Absolute shit cxnt.
If Smith ultimately gets the bullet it would be nice to think Kavanagh does as well.
Post by: edgysatsuma89 on October 31, 2021, 06:53:42 PM
Utter garbage...
Nakamba 7/10
I know we all see games differently but I thought he was the worst player on the pitch by a long way.
Utter nonsense, he was easily our best player.
Funny post.
How anyone gets above 5 is beyond me.
Post by: brontebilly on October 31, 2021, 06:53:58 PM
Post by: Drummond on October 31, 2021, 06:54:05 PM
Bailey didn't look great. Buendia's assist was good.
Not much else to add.
Post by: pauliewalnuts on October 31, 2021, 06:54:29 PM
We spent the entire summer stressing the need for a CDM, but didn't get one.
Watching that today, us with the enthusiastic but not good enough Nakamba in that role, and them with two absolute top class players in that role, that was horrible.
Then to make things worse, Ramsey goes off and is replaced by Ashley Fucking Young playing centrally? What on earth was the thinking there?
He then compounds the mistake when Konsa gets sent off by not hooking Young, but taking Buendia off.
That is Smith in a nutshell there. Terrible game management - so bad, that his actual coaching standard would need to be excellent to make up for it, but it clearly is not, as we frequently do not look like we know what we are doing.
I get the OGS comparisons - Smith does the same. Strings together a run of awful results, then picks up a highly unlikely win which buys him more time that he doesn't really deserve/ I just don't see any way he is going to get out of that cycle.
He's got a squad with plenty of really excellent players, but he constantly makes them look less than the sum of the parts. I also thought there were some real signs today that the players don't believe in him (same at Arsenal).
Over a quarter of the season gone and we're 15th and on the back of four straight, utterly limp defeats, three of which featured truly disgraceful performances.
How many of us would have settled for that in August? None of us. Nice bloke, and he's no doubt got enough excuses for today, but we are just pissing another season down the drain the longer we persist with this.
Post by: Demitri_C on October 31, 2021, 06:54:34 PM
No cohesion, no tactics, no urgency. Smith is hopelessly out of his depth. Stealing a living.
Zzzz. Glad you’re not my boss.
Barring the last sentence what has he said thats wrong?
Post by: Ian. on October 31, 2021, 06:56:30 PM
Post by: TonyD on October 31, 2021, 06:58:22 PM
Taking off Buendia was also truly dumb.
Post by: jwarry on October 31, 2021, 06:59:05 PM
West Ham are a good side, but right from the first kick, we made it so, so easy for them.
We spent the entire summer stressing the need for a CDM, but didn't get one.
Watching that today, us with the enthusiastic but not good enough Nakamba in that role, and them with two absolute top class players in that role, that was horrible.
Then to make things worse, Ramsey goes off and is replaced by Ashley Fucking Young playing centrally? What on earth was the thinking there?
He then compounds the mistake when Konsa gets sent off by not hooking Young, but taking Buendia off.
That is Smith in a nutshell there. Terrible game management - so bad, that his actual coaching standard would need to be excellent to make up for it, but it clearly is not, as we frequently do not look like we know what we are doing.
I get the OGS comparisons - Smith does the same. Strings together a run of awful results, then picks up a highly unlikely win which buys him more time that he doesn't really deserve/ I just don't see any way he is going to get out of that cycle.
He's got a squad with plenty of really excellent players, but he constantly makes them look less than the sum of the parts. I also thought there were some real signs today that the players don't believe in him (same at Arsenal).
Over a quarter of the season gone and we're 15th and on the back of four straight, utterly limp defeats, three of which featured truly disgraceful performances.
How many of us would have settled for that in August? None of us. Nice bloke, and he's no doubt got enough excuses for today, but we are just pissing another season down the drain the longer we persist with this.
Can’t disagree with much of that mate, and I am the tee all optimist. But to be fair to Dean when the going has got tough in the past he has got going but I suspect he’s probably only got until Xmas to turn it around
Post by: hipkiss92 on October 31, 2021, 07:01:06 PM
Embarrassing. As bad as the relegation year. Manager has got to go.
Were you there? This is nowhere near as bad.
Post by: ROBBO on October 31, 2021, 07:02:08 PM
Post by: RichardBatchelor on October 31, 2021, 07:02:55 PM
The worst bit was the foul on Nakamba and the game was brought back when we were in an excellent threatening position and just get a free kick in our own half and they got 2 yellows when it should have been a minimum of 1 red to a player who subsequently scored their third! At that point our 10 were comfortably the better team and unlucky not to be level when we hit the bar, that’s the fucking disgrace - but it won’t be described like that. Cockney kit stealing, ground embezzling twats!
Agreed but the ref is to blame. A balanced view of the game though. We deserved to lose, but not by 4-1.
Post by: KRS on October 31, 2021, 07:03:42 PM
Post by: Villatillidie25 on October 31, 2021, 07:03:51 PM
Hause is the one that annoys me the most. Why he goes in to tackle Fornals with the outside of his boot and his back almost turned I’ll never know. Tackle him properly he wins the ball or at worst it pings off somewhere else and the Konsa trip never happens, absolutely shocking defending that he was v lucky not to get sent off for. That said, Konsa’ was never a red.
Cash, Watkins and probably Nakamba (although he’s so limited on the ball) probably the only 3 with any semblance of credit. I was really glad when we signed Buendia but he looks miles off the pace at the moment bar one moment of skill. Targett looks like the player we signed in the first season and could easily have got a red for his “tackle” on Antonio. Mcginn is fine if there’s at least one player next to him who can pass the ball, otherwise he’s a bit of headless chicken.
Post by: RichardBatchelor on October 31, 2021, 07:04:12 PM
West Ham are a good side, but right from the first kick, we made it so, so easy for them.
We spent the entire summer stressing the need for a CDM, but didn't get one.
Watching that today, us with the enthusiastic but not good enough Nakamba in that role, and them with two absolute top class players in that role, that was horrible.
Then to make things worse, Ramsey goes off and is replaced by Ashley Fucking Young playing centrally? What on earth was the thinking there?
He then compounds the mistake when Konsa gets sent off by not hooking Young, but taking Buendia off.
That is Smith in a nutshell there. Terrible game management - so bad, that his actual coaching standard would need to be excellent to make up for it, but it clearly is not, as we frequently do not look like we know what we are doing.
I get the OGS comparisons - Smith does the same. Strings together a run of awful results, then picks up a highly unlikely win which buys him more time that he doesn't really deserve/ I just don't see any way he is going to get out of that cycle.
He's got a squad with plenty of really excellent players, but he constantly makes them look less than the sum of the parts. I also thought there were some real signs today that the players don't believe in him (same at Arsenal).
Over a quarter of the season gone and we're 15th and on the back of four straight, utterly limp defeats, three of which featured truly disgraceful performances.
How many of us would have settled for that in August? None of us. Nice bloke, and he's no doubt got enough excuses for today, but we are just pissing another season down the drain the longer we persist with this.
I disagree. Buendia had to come off. He is beyond awful.
Post by: cdbearsfan on October 31, 2021, 07:06:28 PM
Post by: pauliewalnuts on October 31, 2021, 07:07:12 PM
West Ham are a good side, but right from the first kick, we made it so, so easy for them.
We spent the entire summer stressing the need for a CDM, but didn't get one.
Watching that today, us with the enthusiastic but not good enough Nakamba in that role, and them with two absolute top class players in that role, that was horrible.
Then to make things worse, Ramsey goes off and is replaced by Ashley Fucking Young playing centrally? What on earth was the thinking there?
He then compounds the mistake when Konsa gets sent off by not hooking Young, but taking Buendia off.
That is Smith in a nutshell there. Terrible game management - so bad, that his actual coaching standard would need to be excellent to make up for it, but it clearly is not, as we frequently do not look like we know what we are doing.
I get the OGS comparisons - Smith does the same. Strings together a run of awful results, then picks up a highly unlikely win which buys him more time that he doesn't really deserve/ I just don't see any way he is going to get out of that cycle.
He's got a squad with plenty of really excellent players, but he constantly makes them look less than the sum of the parts. I also thought there were some real signs today that the players don't believe in him (same at Arsenal).
Over a quarter of the season gone and we're 15th and on the back of four straight, utterly limp defeats, three of which featured truly disgraceful performances.
How many of us would have settled for that in August? None of us. Nice bloke, and he's no doubt got enough excuses for today, but we are just pissing another season down the drain the longer we persist with this.
I disagree. Buendia had to come off. He is beyond awful.
He wasn't looking so awful with the assist for our goal.
Post by: RichardBatchelor on October 31, 2021, 07:07:25 PM
No cohesion, no tactics, no urgency. Smith is hopelessly out of his depth. Stealing a living.
Zzzz. Glad you’re not my boss.
Barring the last sentence what has he said thats wrong?
What’s wrong mate is that this is simply a bad patch, after three years of Smith fulfilling the remit. This season is about restarting and that’s down to Grealish, not Smith.
Post by: LukeJames on October 31, 2021, 07:07:49 PM
Post by: Stu on October 31, 2021, 07:08:00 PM
West Ham are a good side, but right from the first kick, we made it so, so easy for them.
We spent the entire summer stressing the need for a CDM, but didn't get one.
Watching that today, us with the enthusiastic but not good enough Nakamba in that role, and them with two absolute top class players in that role, that was horrible.
Then to make things worse, Ramsey goes off and is replaced by Ashley Fucking Young playing centrally? What on earth was the thinking there?
He then compounds the mistake when Konsa gets sent off by not hooking Young, but taking Buendia off.
That is Smith in a nutshell there. Terrible game management - so bad, that his actual coaching standard would need to be excellent to make up for it, but it clearly is not, as we frequently do not look like we know what we are doing.
I get the OGS comparisons - Smith does the same. Strings together a run of awful results, then picks up a highly unlikely win which buys him more time that he doesn't really deserve/ I just don't see any way he is going to get out of that cycle.
He's got a squad with plenty of really excellent players, but he constantly makes them look less than the sum of the parts. I also thought there were some real signs today that the players don't believe in him (same at Arsenal).
Over a quarter of the season gone and we're 15th and on the back of four straight, utterly limp defeats, three of which featured truly disgraceful performances.
How many of us would have settled for that in August? None of us. Nice bloke, and he's no doubt got enough excuses for today, but we are just pissing another season down the drain the longer we persist with this.
I disagree. Buendia had to come off. He is beyond awful.
Well then in that case, it's often the case that poor signings cost managers their jobs. Now what?
Post by: hipkiss92 on October 31, 2021, 07:09:15 PM
West Ham are a good side, but right from the first kick, we made it so, so easy for them.
We spent the entire summer stressing the need for a CDM, but didn't get one.
Watching that today, us with the enthusiastic but not good enough Nakamba in that role, and them with two absolute top class players in that role, that was horrible.
Then to make things worse, Ramsey goes off and is replaced by Ashley Fucking Young playing centrally? What on earth was the thinking there?
He then compounds the mistake when Konsa gets sent off by not hooking Young, but taking Buendia off.
That is Smith in a nutshell there. Terrible game management - so bad, that his actual coaching standard would need to be excellent to make up for it, but it clearly is not, as we frequently do not look like we know what we are doing.
I get the OGS comparisons - Smith does the same. Strings together a run of awful results, then picks up a highly unlikely win which buys him more time that he doesn't really deserve/ I just don't see any way he is going to get out of that cycle.
He's got a squad with plenty of really excellent players, but he constantly makes them look less than the sum of the parts. I also thought there were some real signs today that the players don't believe in him (same at Arsenal).
Over a quarter of the season gone and we're 15th and on the back of four straight, utterly limp defeats, three of which featured truly disgraceful performances.
How many of us would have settled for that in August? None of us. Nice bloke, and he's no doubt got enough excuses for today, but we are just pissing another season down the drain the longer we persist with this.
So throw in an 18 or 17 year old against one of the form teams in the country, to try and win the midfield battle against Rice and Soucek?
Buendia was awful for the majority of the game, so obvious candidate to go off when we need to bring on another centre half.
Agreed that the style.of play needs sorting out, where's the play through midfield we so often used to see from Smith at Brentford? All seems very long ball into the channel to Watkins.
Quarter of the season gone yes, but our away fixtures on paper were alway a struggle, with Watford first (promoted teams 1st game always a challenge), followed by Chelsea, United, Spurs and Arsenal.
3 very big games in November, but stilltoo early calling for Smith to go in my opinion. Those calling him a chancer and worse on other threads are way over the top.
Post by: hipkiss92 on October 31, 2021, 07:10:21 PM
This is terribly similar to 2015/16 season. Not good I think we are in trouble.
It really isn't.
Post by: hipkiss92 on October 31, 2021, 07:11:47 PM
No cohesion, no tactics, no urgency. Smith is hopelessly out of his depth. Stealing a living.
Christ, wouldn't want to ever have a job appraisal with you.
Post by: Sexual Ealing on October 31, 2021, 07:13:12 PM
Post by: wittonwarrior on October 31, 2021, 07:13:28 PM
Buendia is a luxury no to be played when we are so far off form and Bailey perhaps better as an impact player
Post by: aldridgeboy on October 31, 2021, 07:13:59 PM
First half we were poor , and looked scared to press and go forward.
The injury meant Young coming on, and I though he was poor.
Hause had a good game I thought, as did Cash. Buendina great Assist, but quiet other than that. Same for Bailey.
Nkamba made some great tackles and a good effort , I just don’t think he has the quality for centre mid.
At 2-1 we hit the bar and I thought we were coming back into it. The the sending off which shafts us ( because we don’t seem to cope well with 10, yet when we play against 10 we struggle )
The we have a real break on and he calls it back. Then one of theirs assaults one of ours and gets a yellow. Predictably he then scores a minute or two later. We seem to be in that run Deano has once a year. Fans seem to be turning.
I’d give him a few more games. He just about has enough credit for me for that. But time is running out.
Post by: cdbearsfan on October 31, 2021, 07:14:38 PM
The thing that amazes me is finding out that anyone on here reads anyone else's player ratings.
I'm waiting with bated breath for Flin5tone's. They'll be with us as soon as he's worked out how to do a minus sign on his phone.
Post by: edgysatsuma89 on October 31, 2021, 07:14:58 PM
The thing that amazes me is finding out that anyone on here reads anyone else's player ratings.
I rate this post 9/10
Post by: Stu on October 31, 2021, 07:19:52 PM
The thing that amazes me is finding out that anyone on here reads anyone else's player ratings.
I know. The site used to have a separate forum for them.
Post by: RamboandBruno on October 31, 2021, 07:22:11 PM
The worst bit was the foul on Nakamba and the game was brought back when we were in an excellent threatening position and just get a free kick in our own half and they got 2 yellows when it should have been a minimum of 1 red to a player who subsequently scored their third! At that point our 10 were comfortably the better team and unlucky not to be level when we hit the bar, that’s the fucking disgrace - but it won’t be described like that. Cockney kit stealing, ground embezzling twats!
Completely agree. The crowd were really behind the team at that point and though it wasn’t full of quality it was full of heart, epitomised by Cash and Nakamba, however much of a limited player he is. The ref fucked us twice in that moment, not levelling out the playing field after a shocking tackle and not playing on.
Im as disappointed as snyone, but im not sure i get any criticism over the subs today.
Post by: pauliewalnuts on October 31, 2021, 07:23:27 PM
The thing that amazes me is finding out that anyone on here reads anyone else's player ratings.
I'm waiting with bated breath for Flin5tone's. They'll be with us as soon as he's worked out how to do a minus sign on his phone.
Ha ha ha very good.
Post by: richtheholtender on October 31, 2021, 07:23:38 PM
The thing that amazes me is finding out that anyone on here reads anyone else's player ratings.
I'm waiting with bated breath for Flin5tone's. They'll be with us as soon as he's worked out how to do a minus sign on his phone.
Ha ha
Post by: Footy-Vill on October 31, 2021, 07:24:39 PM
Feel for Smith as things were going wrong
Targett , Young were particularly poor
And Hause did something very rash
I though Bailey was a struggle but glimpses Watkins worked so hard and was very good as was Buendia
It was a very unlucky result and Deans comments after match were fine and reasonable because it wasn't a 4-1 defeat performance.
Shame for Ramsey getting injured and that changed things
Same for Red card for Konsa which it wasn't which saw Buendia get subbed.
On to Friday as we do have the quality there to turn things around.
I'll refuse to get carried away with coach changes because that was alot better than the Arsenal match.
Tough to take that as West Ham were poor
Up the Villa
Post by: LukeJames on October 31, 2021, 07:24:39 PM
Post by: Beard82 on October 31, 2021, 07:25:27 PM
Post by: rougegorge on October 31, 2021, 07:28:31 PM
Post by: Legion on October 31, 2021, 07:31:52 PM
Post by: Villatillidie1982 on October 31, 2021, 07:33:09 PM
Post by: Footy-Vill on October 31, 2021, 07:34:16 PM
It really shouldn’t have ended like this. I hate this - I hate that Deans lost the team, I hate that he’s going to be sacked, I hate that Joe left - and most of all I hate the fact that I started to believe that this wasn’t all another false dawn
Dean has hardly lost the team
Thats an over reaction if ever I read one
Post by: LukeJames on October 31, 2021, 07:41:00 PM
It really shouldn’t have ended like this. I hate this - I hate that Deans lost the team, I hate that he’s going to be sacked, I hate that Joe left - and most of all I hate the fact that I started to believe that this wasn’t all another false dawn
Dean has hardly lost the team
Thats an over reaction if ever I read one
I mean, when one of your employees lobs a water bottle at you and another one storms off, you probably have lost them.
Post by: colin69 on October 31, 2021, 07:41:23 PM
Dean has to go I’m afraid along with the whole of the coaching team.
I don’t ever want to see another long throw or see Ashley Young in midfield.
And as for Declan Rice giving it the big un to the Holte End…..just fuck right off. I dislike him almost as much as I dislike Patrick Bamford for that.
Post by: Goldenballs on October 31, 2021, 07:50:00 PM
Marv was probably our best player, at least he seemed to have a bit of drive about him. Everyone else was pathetic.
Post by: Chris_Jephcott on October 31, 2021, 07:53:14 PM
It really shouldn’t have ended like this. I hate this - I hate that Deans lost the team, I hate that he’s going to be sacked, I hate that Joe left - and most of all I hate the fact that I started to believe that this wasn’t all another false dawn
This is a post that sums up exactly what I feel like right now.
Another false dawn.
Post by: brontebilly on October 31, 2021, 07:54:33 PM
Was a steaming heap of dung that was. Haven't seen any of it again but felt Martinez should've done better with their first 2, and didn't think it was a red. Clear an obvious if it takes 10 minutes?
Marv was probably our best player, at least he seemed to have a bit of drive about him. Everyone else was pathetic.
The Konsa red was 50/50 for me, terrible defending in any case. Why dive in? Targett and Hause were stonewall reds, mind
11 v 11 and I thought we looked a rabble.
Post by: Matt C on October 31, 2021, 07:54:59 PM
Post by: LamBeast on October 31, 2021, 07:55:43 PM
Post by: RamboandBruno on October 31, 2021, 07:59:57 PM
We got royally fucked today.Team selection said it all…What should the tram selection have been?
Post by: Ad@m on October 31, 2021, 08:01:00 PM
The worst part was the lack of pressure on their players first half which was how they found themselves 2-1 up. Once we had Konsa wrongly sent off we were chasing the game and got done on the counter twice. West Ham didn't really offer much beyond being organised.
Don't get me wrong, it wasn't a good performance but it also wasn't a "4-1 stuffing at home performance".
I'm glad Dean has ditched three at the back and I thought the team he picked could've got a result today, but the substitutions were bizarre (why being Young in to centre midfield when he could've brought El Ghazi on and moved Buendia inside given we were behind at that point?).
Pressure is massively on Dean now though. 4 on the bounce is bad, but given our upcoming fixtures if he can't stop the rot I think he's toast.
Post by: Drummond on October 31, 2021, 08:01:01 PM
We got royally fucked today.Team selection said it all…What should the tram selection have been?
Something to keep us on track.
Post by: ChicagoLion on October 31, 2021, 08:02:19 PM
based on availability and form seemed a reasonable team.We got royally fucked today.Team selection said it all…What should the tram selection have been?
Post by: wince on October 31, 2021, 08:02:40 PM
We have been derailedWe got royally fucked today.Team selection said it all…What should the tram selection have been?
Something to keep us on track.
Post by: Grande Pablo on October 31, 2021, 08:04:22 PM
At the risk of being a happy clapper, I don't think tonight was that bad.
The worst part was the lack of pressure on their players first half which was how they found themselves 2-1 up. Once we had Konsa wrongly sent off we were chasing the game and got done on the counter twice. West Ham didn't really offer much beyond being organised.
Don't get me wrong, it wasn't a good performance but it also wasn't a "4-1 stuffing at home performance".
I'm glad Dean has ditched three at the back and I thought the team he picked could've got a result today, but the substitutions were bizarre (why being Young in to centre midfield when he could've brought El Ghazi on and moved Buendia inside given we were behind at that point?).
Pressure is massively on Dean now though. 4 on the bounce is bad, but given our upcoming fixtures if he can't stop the rot I think he's toast.
Sanest post of the day. My glass too remains half full in a Dad's Army sort of way, but we need some bottle to grind a couple of results out to stop the rot.
Young does look way, way past his prime.
Post by: RichardBatchelor on October 31, 2021, 08:06:14 PM
West Ham are a good side, but right from the first kick, we made it so, so easy for them.
We spent the entire summer stressing the need for a CDM, but didn't get one.
Watching that today, us with the enthusiastic but not good enough Nakamba in that role, and them with two absolute top class players in that role, that was horrible.
Then to make things worse, Ramsey goes off and is replaced by Ashley Fucking Young playing centrally? What on earth was the thinking there?
He then compounds the mistake when Konsa gets sent off by not hooking Young, but taking Buendia off.
That is Smith in a nutshell there. Terrible game management - so bad, that his actual coaching standard would need to be excellent to make up for it, but it clearly is not, as we frequently do not look like we know what we are doing.
I get the OGS comparisons - Smith does the same. Strings together a run of awful results, then picks up a highly unlikely win which buys him more time that he doesn't really deserve/ I just don't see any way he is going to get out of that cycle.
He's got a squad with plenty of really excellent players, but he constantly makes them look less than the sum of the parts. I also thought there were some real signs today that the players don't believe in him (same at Arsenal).
Over a quarter of the season gone and we're 15th and on the back of four straight, utterly limp defeats, three of which featured truly disgraceful performances.
How many of us would have settled for that in August? None of us. Nice bloke, and he's no doubt got enough excuses for today, but we are just pissing another season down the drain the longer we persist with this.
So throw in an 18 or 17 year old against one of the form teams in the country, to try and win the midfield battle against Rice and Soucek?
Buendia was awful for the majority of the game, so obvious candidate to go off when we need to bring on another centre half.
Agreed that the style.of play needs sorting out, where's the play through midfield we so often used to see from Smith at Brentford? All seems very long ball into the channel to Watkins.
Quarter of the season gone yes, but our away fixtures on paper were alway a struggle, with Watford first (promoted teams 1st game always a challenge), followed by Chelsea, United, Spurs and Arsenal.
3 very big games in November, but stilltoo early calling for Smith to go in my opinion. Those calling him a chancer and worse on other threads are way over the top.
Thank you.
Post by: paul_e on October 31, 2021, 08:07:53 PM
The Young sub was totally wrong though.
More important though was the players didn't give the reaction you'd expect from how shit we were last week and after weeks of playing a 5 I think it was pretty clear in the first 15-20 minutes that some of our players needed a bit of time to adjust to a 4 and this is why dropping the most vocal player, and captain, at the same time as changing the formation was a poor decision.
Post by: RichardBatchelor on October 31, 2021, 08:10:38 PM
It really shouldn’t have ended like this. I hate this - I hate that Deans lost the team, I hate that he’s going to be sacked, I hate that Joe left - and most of all I hate the fact that I started to believe that this wasn’t all another false dawn
And both players you mention have been totally shit. The problem is theirs, not the management - though we shouldn’t have signed either of them.
Dean has hardly lost the team
Thats an over reaction if ever I read one
I mean, when one of your employees lobs a water bottle at you and another one storms off, you probably have lost them.
Sanson and Buendia have been rubbish. Their frustration is with their own form.
Post by: Chris Harte on October 31, 2021, 08:12:39 PM
I'm interested to see again the incident that lead to three players being booked when play was stopped with Ollie in a very good position down the left.
I'd like to see Dean Smith get more time. Four games ago everything was tickety-boo. He hasn't suddenly become a bad manager. However, the unknown quantity here is how patient the owners are. We simply do not know.
Post by: Bent Neilsens Screamer on October 31, 2021, 08:13:39 PM
With enforced absences he’s picked a team and formation that pleased most people and it was still poor, although we played better with 10 men not accounting for the last 10 minutes.
It wasn’t long ago that praise was given for the work Shakespeare and McPhee were doing and now we’re questioning the influence Terry ROK had.
The increased quality of the squad has posed more questions than it’s given answers and confusion now reigns.
Post by: Sexual Ealing on October 31, 2021, 08:15:53 PM
Post by: RamboandBruno on October 31, 2021, 08:19:23 PM
We got royally fucked today.Team selection said it all…What should the tram selection have been?
Something to keep us on track.
Boom boom!! Team i meant team 🙄😂
Post by: Vegas on October 31, 2021, 08:21:24 PM
It also looks like he wanted a centre mid in the summer and was told no, so I have sympathy there as we are weak in midfield.
There was very little wrong with the team selection today; he made the changes that most people were asking for.
That said, there’s something strange about the coaching changes, and the tactics do seem to consist of a) lump it forward from left centre back, and b) get Cash to do a long throw.
So he’s starting to skate on thin ice, but I’d like to see him turn it round over the next three.
Post by: Hookeysmith on October 31, 2021, 08:21:50 PM
The worst bit was the foul on Nakamba and the game was brought back when we were in an excellent threatening position and just get a free kick in our own half and they got 2 yellows when it should have been a minimum of 1 red to a player who subsequently scored their third! At that point our 10 were comfortably the better team and unlucky not to be level when we hit the bar, that’s the fucking disgrace - but it won’t be described like that. Cockney kit stealing, ground embezzling twats!
Spot on. 2 speculative shots that caught our keeper out and as inept a refereeing performance as you are likely to see.
How they do not get a red is beyond me.
Dean was brave, and correct, to dropMings and Tuanzebe. Next it should be McGinn. For all his graft the amount of ball he gives away is criminal. Whether 2 metre pass or a 50 metre pass he gives
possession to the opposition so much.
I thought Nakamba was everywhere but needed more support against a superb Rice and Souchek.
Too soon to get rid for me but we really need it to turn around
Post by: Villa Lew on October 31, 2021, 08:23:18 PM
Post by: Beard82 on October 31, 2021, 08:23:43 PM
Surely if Now’s not the time for over reaction and questioning every single one of our life choices - I don’t know when is.It really shouldn’t have ended like this. I hate this - I hate that Deans lost the team, I hate that he’s going to be sacked, I hate that Joe left - and most of all I hate the fact that I started to believe that this wasn’t all another false dawn
And both players you mention have been totally shit. The problem is theirs, not the management - though we shouldn’t have signed either of them.
Dean has hardly lost the team
Thats an over reaction if ever I read one
I mean, when one of your employees lobs a water bottle at you and another one storms off, you probably have lost them.
Sanson and Buendia have been rubbish. Their frustration is with their own form.
Next your going to say I shoukd stop after the 8th beer
Seriously though, I think he’s done - and I am very sad to say that
Post by: London Villan on October 31, 2021, 08:25:36 PM
Post by: astonvilla82 on October 31, 2021, 08:25:59 PM
Post by: Clive W on October 31, 2021, 08:26:33 PM
When things go wrong, as they always will do even in the good times, you need a captain with the ability to know which players need some TLC and which ones need a kick up the arse, and also someone that can change things tactically on the pitch
Showing my age, when did we last have an Ian Ross, or Kevin Richardson, Andy Townsend, Sir Denis, Martin Laursen or Stan?
Not all of them necessarily top class players in their own right, but all had good man management skills and commanded respect.
I’m sure that with a respected and inspirational captain some of the debacles (Micah Richards panto video?) would have been avoided and also maybe some of the collapses during matches
Post by: Villatillidie1982 on October 31, 2021, 08:28:40 PM
This is terribly similar to 2015/16 season. Not good I think we are in trouble.At least in the last few matches we have played for about 20 minutes in each. The 2015-16 didn't play at all in most matches. If we had had a bit of luck at 2-1 down and playing with 10 men, we could have won that. But the lack of confidence running through the team is worrying.
Post by: SamTheMouse on October 31, 2021, 08:30:10 PM
Post by: paul_e on October 31, 2021, 08:31:40 PM
I also think he deserves more time. We’ve been consistently heading upwards in his time here, and I’m still off the opinion that injuries, disrupted pre-season and Copa America absences have made it much more difficult to get anything going.
It also looks like he wanted a centre mid in the summer and was told no, so I have sympathy there as we are weak in midfield.
There was very little wrong with the team selection today; he made the changes that most people were asking for.
That said, there’s something strange about the coaching changes, and the tactics do seem to consist of a) lump it forward from left centre back, and b) get Cash to do a long throw.
So he’s starting to skate on thin ice, but I’d like to see him turn it round over the next three.
Is the bold bit true? I've seen nothing to suggest the money wasn't available to buy someone.
Post by: AV82EC on October 31, 2021, 08:32:09 PM
On we go…..
Post by: VILLA MOLE on October 31, 2021, 08:33:05 PM
I also think he deserves more time. We’ve been consistently heading upwards in his time here, and I’m still off the opinion that injuries, disrupted pre-season and Copa America absences have made it much more difficult to get anything going.
It also looks like he wanted a centre mid in the summer and was told no, so I have sympathy there as we are weak in midfield.
There was very little wrong with the team selection today; he made the changes that most people were asking for.
That said, there’s something strange about the coaching changes, and the tactics do seem to consist of a) lump it forward from left centre back, and b) get Cash to do a long throw.
So he’s starting to skate on thin ice, but I’d like to see him turn it round over the next three.
Is the bold bit true? I've seen nothing to suggest the money wasn't available to buy someone.
then surely dont buy ings if obviously money was an issue ?
Post by: Beard82 on October 31, 2021, 08:35:28 PM
This isn’t just a reflection on today’s game, but the one thing that strikes me as relevant over the last (10?) years has been our lack of leadership on the pitch.I think this is true - TBF when Joe was captain - I thought he did well in a lead by example kind of way.
When things go wrong, as they always will do even in the good times, you need a captain with the ability to know which players need some TLC and which ones need a kick up the arse, and also someone that can change things tactically on the pitch
Showing my age, when did we last have an Ian Ross, or Kevin Richardson, Andy Townsend, Sir Denis, Martin Laursen or Stan?
Not all of them necessarily top class players in their own right, but all had good man management skills and commanded respect.
I’m sure that with a respected and inspirational captain some of the debacles (Micah Richards panto video?) would have been avoided and also maybe some of the collapses during matches
Post by: UK Redsox on October 31, 2021, 08:36:01 PM
Was Sanson injured?
Ill and/or on the naughty step
Post by: paul_e on October 31, 2021, 08:39:28 PM
then surely dont buy ings if obviously money was an issue ?I also think he deserves more time. We’ve been consistently heading upwards in his time here, and I’m still off the opinion that injuries, disrupted pre-season and Copa America absences have made it much more difficult to get anything going.
It also looks like he wanted a centre mid in the summer and was told no, so I have sympathy there as we are weak in midfield.
There was very little wrong with the team selection today; he made the changes that most people were asking for.
That said, there’s something strange about the coaching changes, and the tactics do seem to consist of a) lump it forward from left centre back, and b) get Cash to do a long throw.
So he’s starting to skate on thin ice, but I’d like to see him turn it round over the next three.
Is the bold bit true? I've seen nothing to suggest the money wasn't available to buy someone.
well yeah, exactly, there's plenty of things we've done i the last year or so that suggest the money was there. Aside from anything else Smith gave the impression that he saw Sanson as the midfield signing the fans were calling for.
Post by: artvandelay on October 31, 2021, 08:40:01 PM
Post by: Beard82 on October 31, 2021, 08:42:43 PM
Something was strange with the recruitment - I don’t think it was lack of money but with JWP particularly it was there for us we just didn’t think he was worth it - not sure who makes the callsI also think he deserves more time. We’ve been consistently heading upwards in his time here, and I’m still off the opinion that injuries, disrupted pre-season and Copa America absences have made it much more difficult to get anything going.
It also looks like he wanted a centre mid in the summer and was told no, so I have sympathy there as we are weak in midfield.
There was very little wrong with the team selection today; he made the changes that most people were asking for.
That said, there’s something strange about the coaching changes, and the tactics do seem to consist of a) lump it forward from left centre back, and b) get Cash to do a long throw.
So he’s starting to skate on thin ice, but I’d like to see him turn it round over the next three.
Is the bold bit true? I've seen nothing to suggest the money wasn't available to buy someone.
then surely dont buy ings if obviously money was an issue ?
Post by: KRS on October 31, 2021, 08:46:32 PM
Post by: Nev on October 31, 2021, 08:46:48 PM
I'm also baffled by the long throws, the enormous punt out of play when we kicked off, the collapse in cohesion, team spirit, balance and the fact that the style, approach and attitude of the kids in midweek is light years ahead of today, and reminiscent of how we used to play.
Post by: Chico Hamilton III on October 31, 2021, 08:54:31 PM
Post by: VILLA MOLE on October 31, 2021, 08:55:42 PM
we hoof it long in the end anyway so just get on with it
we might as well play Davis up there at least it might stick for a bit
Post by: Aldridge Villa on October 31, 2021, 08:58:33 PM
Post by: Steve67 on October 31, 2021, 09:00:07 PM
Post by: SW9-VILLA on October 31, 2021, 09:02:20 PM
Post by: Nev on October 31, 2021, 09:04:40 PM
Out of interest who would people have preferred to see come on instead of Young?
I would have given Chuky a spin, dropped McGinn a bit deeper. A risk of course but fortune favours the brave.
Post by: SamTheMouse on October 31, 2021, 09:06:21 PM
The sort of thing that doesn't so much make you question the manager's tactics as his sanity.
Post by: Ad@m on October 31, 2021, 09:08:59 PM
Out of interest who would people have preferred to see come on instead of Young?
El Ghazi so Buendia could move in to the centre to replace Ramsey.
Given we were already 1-0 down, that would have been the sort of substitution Dean used to make.
Post by: VILLA MOLE on October 31, 2021, 09:15:05 PM
Out of interest who would people have preferred to see come on instead of Young?
El Ghazi so Buendia could move in to the centre to replace Ramsey.
Given we were already 1-0 down, that would have been the sort of substitution Dean used to make.
Stick chucka in there he yes he is young but has legs and can create .
What is he doing on the bench if not ready , might of been his chance
Post by: Skerra on October 31, 2021, 09:15:56 PM
Post by: paul_e on October 31, 2021, 09:18:12 PM
Out of interest who would people have preferred to see come on instead of Young?
El Ghazi so Buendia could move in to the centre to replace Ramsey.
Given we were already 1-0 down, that would have been the sort of substitution Dean used to make.
Stick chucka in there he yes he is young but has legs and can create .
What is he doing on the bench if not ready , might of been his chance
Chuk as a straight swap or AEG and go to a 4231. Neither would've been ideal but both show more thought than bringing an ageing left back into midfield.
Post by: Footy-Vill on October 31, 2021, 09:27:46 PM
As a hold up player Big KD has got his uses
But yes any of CC or AEG or KD in hindsight would have been more forward thinking than Young
Post by: TelfordVilla on October 31, 2021, 09:28:48 PM
Post by: London Villan on October 31, 2021, 09:32:06 PM
Post by: Clampy on October 31, 2021, 09:35:10 PM
That wasn't good. Their first two shots went in, and putting Ashley on for Ramsey was just absoutley ridiclous and although we tried to make a fist of it after Konsa went off (which I've not seen back yet), it was never going to be enough. That all said, I hope he gets the next three games to turn it round.
Post by: Risso on October 31, 2021, 09:40:00 PM
Accusing Smith of 'Stealing a Living' is one of the more pathetic things I've read on here.
You'll get over it I'm sure, Clamps.
Post by: The_ads on October 31, 2021, 09:41:40 PM
Post by: PaulWinch again on October 31, 2021, 09:44:43 PM
Post by: Andy_Lochhead_in_the_air on October 31, 2021, 09:45:59 PM
That all said, I hope he gets the next three games to turn it round.
That takes him to Selhurst Park. BFR and Sir Brian both had their final games as manager there.
Post by: Risso on October 31, 2021, 09:46:47 PM
The bit that concerns me is that there is no sign things are getting better - we’re getting worse. The players look massively at odds at each other. Also the fucking long throws - ok as an occasional thing to mix things up, but not every fucking time.
Especially not when they're taken by our best creative player in Bailey, when he can't actually execute them at all. What next, Watkins coming back to take the goal kicks.
Post by: Chico Hamilton III on October 31, 2021, 09:48:01 PM
Accusing Smith of 'Stealing a Living' is one of the more pathetic things I've read on here.
That wasn't good.
I’d say that “that wasn’t good” is just as much an understatement as “Smith stealing a living” is an overstatement. So maybe somewhere between both of those silly statements is where we really are.
Post by: The_ads on October 31, 2021, 09:49:40 PM
Unlucky by many accounts
Feel for Smith as things were going wrong
Targett , Young were particularly poor
And Hause did something very rash
I though Bailey was a struggle but glimpses Watkins worked so hard and was very good as was Buendia
It was a very unlucky result and Deans comments after match were fine and reasonable because it wasn't a 4-1 defeat performance.
Shame for Ramsey getting injured and that changed things
Same for Red card for Konsa which it wasn't which saw Buendia get subbed.
On to Friday as we do have the quality there to turn things around.
I'll refuse to get carried away with coach changes because that was alot better than the Arsenal match.
Tough to take that as West Ham were poor
Up the Villa
Buendia was very good? Fuck me
Post by: markeeeebeeee2005 on October 31, 2021, 09:57:08 PM
Unlucky by many accounts
Feel for Smith as things were going wrong
Targett , Young were particularly poor
And Hause did something very rash
I though Bailey was a struggle but glimpses Watkins worked so hard and was very good as was Buendia
It was a very unlucky result and Deans comments after match were fine and reasonable because it wasn't a 4-1 defeat performance.
Shame for Ramsey getting injured and that changed things
Same for Red card for Konsa which it wasn't which saw Buendia get subbed.
On to Friday as we do have the quality there to turn things around.
I'll refuse to get carried away with coach changes because that was alot better than the Arsenal match.
Tough to take that as West Ham were poor
Up the Villa
Buendia was very good? Fuck me
‘Very unlucky result’ was the bit that got me.
Post by: Flin5tone on October 31, 2021, 09:58:00 PM
This has been coming for a long time.
Infuriating
Post by: The_ads on October 31, 2021, 10:01:01 PM
Post by: Villan82 on October 31, 2021, 10:02:50 PM
That all said, I hope he gets the next three games to turn it round.
That takes him to Selhurst Park. BFR and Sir Brian both had their final games as manager there.
The next three games are absolutely vital. We have to to be getting 5 points minimum in my opinion given the fixtures in December. We need to be careful we don't find ourselves right in the shit come 1 January. .
Post by: Legion on October 31, 2021, 10:04:03 PM
If you watched that game and surmised that Buendia was ‘very good’ then I can only assume you don’t have eyes. He was diabolical. Absolutely weak as piss and reminds me of Carles Gill, too lightweight for the premier league.
He did well to set up our goal. Apart from that, meh.
Post by: ROBBO on October 31, 2021, 10:04:28 PM
Post by: Clampy on October 31, 2021, 10:05:04 PM
Accusing Smith of 'Stealing a Living' is one of the more pathetic things I've read on here.
You'll get over it I'm sure, Clamps.
I'm sure you wil too.
Post by: AlexAlexCropley on October 31, 2021, 10:05:27 PM
Deeply worrying.
Post by: RamboandBruno on October 31, 2021, 10:12:11 PM
Out of a lot of puzzlements and brainteasers with our malaise my main worry is Buendia.I don't see it.Where is this baller that was gonna be our catalyst?
Deeply worrying.
I was really pissed off with him when stormed off to the dressing room, total lack of discipline, and not at all what we need to see. No one should act like that, fecking big time charlies is not what we need.
Post by: Footy-Vill on October 31, 2021, 10:13:27 PM
Not to me and 3 West Ham fans said same to me
Dean Smith said it
And their players and manager weren't convinced of their victory
Considering that west ham were 4th and form team they hardly outshone us
Post by: The_ads on October 31, 2021, 10:14:15 PM
If you watched that game and surmised that Buendia was ‘very good’ then I can only assume you don’t have eyes. He was diabolical. Absolutely weak as piss and reminds me of Carles Gill, too lightweight for the premier league.
He did well to set up our goal. Apart from that, meh.
He did but any remaining modicum of credit in the bank for that evaporated when he stormed off down the tunnel. I hope he gets fucking dropped for that
Post by: charlatan on October 31, 2021, 10:15:43 PM
Once again there is something toxic at Villa Park. For me the coaching departures and recruitment need to be put under the microscope. There's too much that isn't working - and has in actual fact gone backwards since last season.Presumably this must happen to teams in roughly half of all their seasons?
Post by: VILLA MOLE on October 31, 2021, 10:16:04 PM
Come on you think that was a 4-1 result ?
Not to me and 3 West Ham fans said same to me
Dean Smith said it
And their players and manager weren't convinced of their victory
Considering that west ham were 4th and form team they hardly outshone us
They didnt need to get of 3rd gear I am afraid that is the worry for me , but I admire your optimism
Post by: Legion on October 31, 2021, 10:16:15 PM
Come on you think that was a 4-1 result ?
Not to me and 3 West Ham fans said same to me
Dean Smith said it
And their players and manager weren't convinced of their victory
Considering that west ham were 4th and form team they hardly outshone us
They were all over us.
Post by: Risso on October 31, 2021, 10:16:35 PM
Come on you think that was a 4-1 result ?
Not to me and 3 West Ham fans said same to me
Dean Smith said it
And their players and manager weren't convinced of their victory
Considering that west ham were 4th and form team they hardly outshone us
Well of course Dean Smith said it, he's a delusional idiot fighting for his job. Everything about them was better than us today. Passing, movement, pressing, defence. Even befre the sending off.
Post by: cdbearsfan on October 31, 2021, 10:21:23 PM
If you watched that game and surmised that Buendia was ‘very good’ then I can only assume you don’t have eyes. He was diabolical. Absolutely weak as piss and reminds me of Carles Gill, too lightweight for the premier league.
He did well to set up our goal. Apart from that, meh.
He did but any remaining modicum of credit in the bank for that evaporated when he stormed off down the tunnel. I hope he gets fucking dropped for that
What? Should he be pleased at being substituted? If it was me I'd rather go and get in the shower than sit around on the bench stinking. Some people have decided they hate Buendia and will find any old reason to have a go at him. He wasn't brilliant today, but was still one of our better players, and shouldn't have been substituted.
Post by: AV82EC on October 31, 2021, 10:23:17 PM
Post by: Steve67 on October 31, 2021, 10:26:09 PM
Post by: adrenachrome on October 31, 2021, 10:28:41 PM
If you watched that game and surmised that Buendia was ‘very good’ then I can only assume you don’t have eyes. He was diabolical. Absolutely weak as piss and reminds me of Carles Gill, too lightweight for the premier league.
He did well to set up our goal. Apart from that, meh.
He did but any remaining modicum of credit in the bank for that evaporated when he stormed off down the tunnel. I hope he gets fucking dropped for that
The Championship is far more physical than the PL, yet he excelled there. Unlike Carlos, he is a solid unit.
As for storming off, there seems to be dissent with the camp; not unusual when the wheels fall off. I agree there must be a price to pay for petulance, but at this rate all our new signings will be sidelined, and we will be pre-Joe withhout a paddle.
Post by: LukeJames on October 31, 2021, 10:29:57 PM
Come on you think that was a 4-1 result ?
Not to me and 3 West Ham fans said same to me
Dean Smith said it
And their players and manager weren't convinced of their victory
Considering that west ham were 4th and form team they hardly outshone us
What on earth are you talking about? When you consistently allow 20+ goals on your goal, theres a good chance you will get thrashed.
Post by: aj2k77 on October 31, 2021, 10:35:54 PM
Buendia is so weak, compare him to a strong, quick, clever Grealish. He can pick a pass if given time but is too easy for the opposition to physically dominate out of a game. Very underwhelming and his little tantrum highlights the lack of discipline running throughout at the moment.
The long throws. Utter tripe. Defending set pieces and continually being mismatched with smaller players expected to mark much bigger ones, confusing. Hacking at the ball whenever crosses come in to the box, I lose count of the number of times a game we invite pressure on by failing to deal with balls in to the box first time, thanks to a swipe.
It's really really poor viewing at the moment. If I spent £300 million i'd be wanting a lot more than excuses and Nakamba, Ramsey and McGinn as my centre midfield.
Post by: Footy-Vill on October 31, 2021, 10:37:10 PM
Facts are we lost which isn't great.
Will see how we get on next match.
Hope for something bettwr and more luck as was all disappointing in the end when full of hope at start and even at half time.
Post by: aj2k77 on October 31, 2021, 10:37:49 PM
If you watched that game and surmised that Buendia was ‘very good’ then I can only assume you don’t have eyes. He was diabolical. Absolutely weak as piss and reminds me of Carles Gill, too lightweight for the premier league.
He did well to set up our goal. Apart from that, meh.
He did but any remaining modicum of credit in the bank for that evaporated when he stormed off down the tunnel. I hope he gets fucking dropped for that
The Championship is far more physical than the PL, yet he excelled there. Unlike Carlos, he is a solid unit.
As for storming off, there seems to be dissent with the camp; not unusual when the wheels fall off. I agree there must be a price to pay for petulance, but at this rate all our new signings will be sidelined, and we will be pre-Joe withhout a paddle.
I disagree, you get away with more in the Championship thanks to the wank standard of refereeing but the players aren't as strong, aren't as quick and aren't as clever.
Post by: charlatan on October 31, 2021, 10:40:12 PM
Come on you think that was a 4-1 result ?
Not to me and 3 West Ham fans said same to me
Dean Smith said it
And their players and manager weren't convinced of their victory
Considering that west ham were 4th and form team they hardly outshone us
Well of course Dean Smith said it, he's a delusional idiot fighting for his job. Everything about them was better than us today. Passing, movement, pressing, defence. Even befre the sending off.
Not their goalkeeper
Post by: charlatan on October 31, 2021, 10:41:05 PM
Come on you think that was a 4-1 result ?
Not to me and 3 West Ham fans said same to me
Dean Smith said it
And their players and manager weren't convinced of their victory
Considering that west ham were 4th and form team they hardly outshone us
What on earth are you talking about? When you consistently allow 20+ goals on your goal, theres a good chance you will get thrashed.
Good point. We never score 20.
Post by: Risso on October 31, 2021, 10:41:12 PM
Post by: charlatan on October 31, 2021, 10:43:46 PM
Post by: Meanwood Villa on October 31, 2021, 10:44:35 PM
Post by: baddowvillans on October 31, 2021, 10:45:03 PM
Post by: The_ads on October 31, 2021, 10:45:07 PM
If you watched that game and surmised that Buendia was ‘very good’ then I can only assume you don’t have eyes. He was diabolical. Absolutely weak as piss and reminds me of Carles Gill, too lightweight for the premier league.
He did well to set up our goal. Apart from that, meh.
He did but any remaining modicum of credit in the bank for that evaporated when he stormed off down the tunnel. I hope he gets fucking dropped for that
What? Should he be pleased at being substituted? If it was me I'd rather go and get in the shower than sit around on the bench stinking. Some people have decided they hate Buendia and will find any old reason to have a go at him. He wasn't brilliant today, but was still one of our better players, and shouldn't have been substituted.
What do you mean ‘what’ ? It’s fine to disagree without patronising me but in my view you stay on the bench and you don’t fuck off down the tunnel like a petulant child. He was absolutely awful and would probably have been hooked anyway given his performance. As for ‘some people have decided….’ I’ve no issue with Buendia whatsoever, I’d love him to do well, but you stay on the bench you don’t storm off.
Post by: Meanwood Villa on October 31, 2021, 10:46:27 PM
Post by: adrenachrome on October 31, 2021, 10:47:22 PM
If you watched that game and surmised that Buendia was ‘very good’ then I can only assume you don’t have eyes. He was diabolical. Absolutely weak as piss and reminds me of Carles Gill, too lightweight for the premier league.
He did well to set up our goal. Apart from that, meh.
He did but any remaining modicum of credit in the bank for that evaporated when he stormed off down the tunnel. I hope he gets fucking dropped for that
The Championship is far more physical than the PL, yet he excelled there. Unlike Carlos, he is a solid unit.
As for storming off, there seems to be dissent with the camp; not unusual when the wheels fall off. I agree there must be a price to pay for petulance, but at this rate all our new signings will be sidelined, and we will be pre-Joe withhout a paddle.
I disagree, you get away with more in the Championship thanks to the wank standard of refereeing but the players aren't as strong, aren't as quick and aren't as clever.
Clever yes; quick and strong no. IMHO.
Post by: Clampy on October 31, 2021, 10:48:12 PM
Just an alternative look at it.
Post by: Footy-Vill on October 31, 2021, 10:48:40 PM
Come on you think that was a 4-1 result ?
Not to me and 3 West Ham fans said same to me
Dean Smith said it
And their players and manager weren't convinced of their victory
Considering that west ham were 4th and form team they hardly outshone us
What on earth are you talking about? When you consistently allow 20+ goals on your goal, theres a good chance you will get thrashed.
I posted further down about the West ham forum link with plenty seeing that they didn't play well and it wasn't a 4-1
Nothing more needs to be said by me . Unlucky in parts tonight in a strange game . And as everyone saw and many said we actually bossed and outplayed them with 10 men
Anyway I focus on Southampton now.
Post by: The_ads on October 31, 2021, 10:49:34 PM
I suppose you could argue if it would have been a 4-1 game had Konsa not gone. The only thing I can remember them doing in that first half was score from two long range goals. Don't get me wrong, we weren't great and we were always going to concede again trying to get back into it.
Just an alternative look at it.
We also cleared one off the line.
Post by: cdbearsfan on October 31, 2021, 10:50:44 PM
If you watched that game and surmised that Buendia was ‘very good’ then I can only assume you don’t have eyes. He was diabolical. Absolutely weak as piss and reminds me of Carles Gill, too lightweight for the premier league.
He did well to set up our goal. Apart from that, meh.
He did but any remaining modicum of credit in the bank for that evaporated when he stormed off down the tunnel. I hope he gets fucking dropped for that
What? Should he be pleased at being substituted? If it was me I'd rather go and get in the shower than sit around on the bench stinking. Some people have decided they hate Buendia and will find any old reason to have a go at him. He wasn't brilliant today, but was still one of our better players, and shouldn't have been substituted.
What do you mean ‘what’ ? It’s fine to disagree without patronising me but in my view you stay on the bench and you don’t fuck off down the tunnel like a petulant child. He was absolutely awful and would probably have been hooked anyway given his performance. As for ‘some people have decided….’ I’ve no issue with Buendia whatsoever, I’d love him to do well, but you stay on the bench you don’t storm off.
I said "what" as fail to see why anyone would care whether a substituted player walks off or stays on the bench. Substituted players leave early all the time, you see that corner of the Lower Trinity clapping them off. You've decided to make an issue out of nothing.
Post by: Footy-Vill on October 31, 2021, 10:51:32 PM
Plenty saw it not as a 4-1 and West Ham not being so good
Post by: Clampy on October 31, 2021, 10:53:56 PM
I suppose you could argue if it would have been a 4-1 game had Konsa not gone. The only thing I can remember them doing in that first half was score from two long range goals. Don't get me wrong, we weren't great and we were always going to concede again trying to get back into it.
Just an alternative look at it.
We also cleared one off the line.
We also hit the bar at 2-1. Like I said, it wasnt great but I'm just pondering if we would have got anything out of it with 11 men. I've still not seen the sending off by the way.
Post by: pauliewalnuts on October 31, 2021, 10:57:19 PM
Yeah the refereeing was shit but we could replay that match ten times and we’d lose them all.
We were absolutely pathetic from start to finish. On top of that we managed to look like a team who genuinely didn’t know what they were supposed to be doing
I can’t believe anyone thinks that was anywhere near acceptable.
Post by: paul_e on October 31, 2021, 10:58:30 PM
Post by: tomd2103 on October 31, 2021, 11:13:06 PM
I thought we were at our best when down to 10. There was a shift in momentum after the ref failed to play advantage when El Ghazi was through. I thought he was going to send West Ham player off given he stopped it. He then did play advantage a minute later and West Ham had their third, scored by the player who fouled Nakamba of course.
We had a decent little spell after we went down to 10 men, where some of our players decided to get after the opposition and we began to win the ball back in their half. During that spell though, Targett was left two on one at the back from one of our own corners, but nothing came of it. Shortly after, the same thing happened again and this time they did make it 3-1 and we gave up the ghost.
We were so passive when not in possession in the first half and I just couldn't understand why McGinn in particular dropped in so deep, marking nobody and leaving Rice and Soucek so much room. Not bringing in a quality defensive midfielder in during the window looks very costly.
Post by: Meanwood Villa on October 31, 2021, 11:17:07 PM
Post by: RamboandBruno on October 31, 2021, 11:18:13 PM
If you watched that game and surmised that Buendia was ‘very good’ then I can only assume you don’t have eyes. He was diabolical. Absolutely weak as piss and reminds me of Carles Gill, too lightweight for the premier league.
He did well to set up our goal. Apart from that, meh.
He did but any remaining modicum of credit in the bank for that evaporated when he stormed off down the tunnel. I hope he gets fucking dropped for that
What? Should he be pleased at being substituted? If it was me I'd rather go and get in the shower than sit around on the bench stinking. Some people have decided they hate Buendia and will find any old reason to have a go at him. He wasn't brilliant today, but was still one of our better players, and shouldn't have been substituted.
What do you mean ‘what’ ? It’s fine to disagree without patronising me but in my view you stay on the bench and you don’t fuck off down the tunnel like a petulant child. He was absolutely awful and would probably have been hooked anyway given his performance. As for ‘some people have decided….’ I’ve no issue with Buendia whatsoever, I’d love him to do well, but you stay on the bench you don’t storm off.
I said "what" as fail to see why anyone would care whether a substituted player walks off or stays on the bench. Substituted players leave early all the time, you see that corner of the Lower Trinity clapping them off. You've decided to make an issue out of nothing.
Weve lost 3 in a row, we’re 2-1 down at home in the 4th game and our best defender has just got sent off. The manager has no choice but to take off one of the 3 forwards off and Beundia despite setting up the goal , was the least effective of the three. With the team, club and manager under huge pressure, i think it is petulant and is a fairly big deal given the on going situation.
If we were 2-0 up or on a run of 3 wins in a row no real problem, but doing it as he did adds to the sense theres disharmony.
He’s certainly not made enough of a name for himself in the premier league to be doing a diva act.
Post by: BC Villain on October 31, 2021, 11:21:08 PM
I thought we were at our best when down to 10. There was a shift in momentum after the ref failed to play advantage when El Ghazi was through. I thought he was going to send West Ham player off given he stopped it. He then did play advantage a minute later and West Ham had their third, scored by the player who fouled Nakamba of course.
We had a decent little spell after we went down to 10 men, where some of our players decided to get after the opposition and we began to win the ball back in their half. During that spell though, Targett was left two on one at the back from one of our own corners, but nothing came of it. Shortly after, the same thing happened again and this time they did make it 3-1 and we gave up the ghost.
We were so passive when not in possession in the first half and I just couldn't understand why McGinn in particular dropped in so deep, marking nobody and leaving Rice and Soucek so much room. Not bringing in a quality defensive midfielder in during the window looks very costly.
It's damning that in three years with the money that's been spent that we STILL haven't addressed the need for a good defensive midfielder
Post by: cdbearsfan on October 31, 2021, 11:23:36 PM
If you watched that game and surmised that Buendia was ‘very good’ then I can only assume you don’t have eyes. He was diabolical. Absolutely weak as piss and reminds me of Carles Gill, too lightweight for the premier league.
He did well to set up our goal. Apart from that, meh.
He did but any remaining modicum of credit in the bank for that evaporated when he stormed off down the tunnel. I hope he gets fucking dropped for that
What? Should he be pleased at being substituted? If it was me I'd rather go and get in the shower than sit around on the bench stinking. Some people have decided they hate Buendia and will find any old reason to have a go at him. He wasn't brilliant today, but was still one of our better players, and shouldn't have been substituted.
What do you mean ‘what’ ? It’s fine to disagree without patronising me but in my view you stay on the bench and you don’t fuck off down the tunnel like a petulant child. He was absolutely awful and would probably have been hooked anyway given his performance. As for ‘some people have decided….’ I’ve no issue with Buendia whatsoever, I’d love him to do well, but you stay on the bench you don’t storm off.
I said "what" as fail to see why anyone would care whether a substituted player walks off or stays on the bench. Substituted players leave early all the time, you see that corner of the Lower Trinity clapping them off. You've decided to make an issue out of nothing.
Weve lost 3 in a row, we’re 2-1 down at home in the 4th game and our best defender has just got sent off. The manager has no choice but to take off one of the 3 forwards off and Beundia despite setting up the goal , was the least effective of the three. With the team, club and manager under huge pressure, i think it is petulant and is a fairly big deal given the on going situation.
If we were 2-0 up or on a run of 3 wins in a row no real problem, but doing it as he did adds to the sense theres disharmony.
He’s certainly not made enough of a name for himself in the premier league to be doing a diva act.
I didn't see any diva act. I saw a disappointed player walking off. Would you rather he had a big smile on his face? Didn't Bacuna used to get slaughtered for that?
Criticise players' performances, if you feel they deserve it. Trying to find some unlicensed body language to take offence at is a bit desperate, though.
Post by: martyn ellis on October 31, 2021, 11:40:32 PM
Post by: RamboandBruno on October 31, 2021, 11:42:42 PM
If you watched that game and surmised that Buendia was ‘very good’ then I can only assume you don’t have eyes. He was diabolical. Absolutely weak as piss and reminds me of Carles Gill, too lightweight for the premier league.
He did well to set up our goal. Apart from that, meh.
He did but any remaining modicum of credit in the bank for that evaporated when he stormed off down the tunnel. I hope he gets fucking dropped for that
What? Should he be pleased at being substituted? If it was me I'd rather go and get in the shower than sit around on the bench stinking. Some people have decided they hate Buendia and will find any old reason to have a go at him. He wasn't brilliant today, but was still one of our better players, and shouldn't have been substituted.
What do you mean ‘what’ ? It’s fine to disagree without patronising me but in my view you stay on the bench and you don’t fuck off down the tunnel like a petulant child. He was absolutely awful and would probably have been hooked anyway given his performance. As for ‘some people have decided….’ I’ve no issue with Buendia whatsoever, I’d love him to do well, but you stay on the bench you don’t storm off.
I said "what" as fail to see why anyone would care whether a substituted player walks off or stays on the bench. Substituted players leave early all the time, you see that corner of the Lower Trinity clapping them off. You've decided to make an issue out of nothing.
Weve lost 3 in a row, we’re 2-1 down at home in the 4th game and our best defender has just got sent off. The manager has no choice but to take off one of the 3 forwards off and Beundia despite setting up the goal , was the least effective of the three. With the team, club and manager under huge pressure, i think it is petulant and is a fairly big deal given the on going situation.
If we were 2-0 up or on a run of 3 wins in a row no real problem, but doing it as he did adds to the sense theres disharmony.
He’s certainly not made enough of a name for himself in the premier league to be doing a diva act.
I didn't see any diva act. I saw a disappointed player walking off. Would you rather he had a big smile on his face? Didn't Bacuna used to get slaughtered for that?
Criticise players' performances, if you feel they deserve it. Trying to find some unlicensed body language to take offence at is a bit desperate, though.
Id rather he sat down on the bench with the rest of the squad and show some unity during the match in front of 40,000 supporters and then had a word with the manager in private about his frustrations.
With us losing games, players arguing at Arsenal, Sanson and the water bottle, the captain being dropped, it just doesn’t look good in that context. Maybe it was nothing or maybe it was something, either way it strikes me as ill disciplined. And actually i dont often criticise players for playing shite as long as they try, anyone can lose form for a whole host of reasons.
Post by: pooligan on October 31, 2021, 11:45:06 PM
Post by: cdbearsfan on October 31, 2021, 11:46:21 PM
Post by: Ian. on October 31, 2021, 11:48:16 PM
For me,the fact that we had the likes of Targett,Young,Hause El Ghazi and Nakamba on the pitch at the end says it all for me None of these players are anywhere near good enough of the standard to compete in the Premier
Targett was close to an England call up towards the end of last season. He’s started this season like the start of last season. I like him and still thinks he’s a good player, asking him to play wing back has really done him no favours at all.
In fact I think that system has knocked the confidence out of Konsa and Mings as well as Targett.
Post by: Villan82 on October 31, 2021, 11:53:58 PM
so Dean out and then what? I can't believe some of the negativity on here. People have cried out for Smith to change the system - he does it today and makes some brave changes. We take a while to get into the game after a defensive and goalkeeping error and then lose one of our more promising players through injury.
With a quarter of the season gone, in our third season back, after a shit tonne of spending, we are in a relegation scrap and conceding goals for fun. of course people are concerned.
Post by: adrenachrome on November 01, 2021, 12:30:46 AM
For me,the fact that we had the likes of Targett,Young,Hause El Ghazi and Nakamba on the pitch at the end says it all for me None of these players are anywhere near good enough of the standard to compete in the Premier
Targett was close to an England call up towards the end of last season. He’s started this season like the start of last season. I like him and still thinks he’s a good player, asking him to play wing back has really done him no favours at all.
In fact I think that system has knocked the confidence out of Konsa and Mings as well as Targett.
I agree.
Konsa and Mings were sound in a back 4, and Targett was decent on the left. He was never a wing back. Matt Cash can do it on right side.
Post by: KRS on November 01, 2021, 12:50:45 AM
Post by: robbo1874 on November 01, 2021, 12:55:29 AM
Post by: robbo1874 on November 01, 2021, 01:06:00 AM
Post by: jwarry on November 01, 2021, 04:39:26 AM
Suppose what I’m trying to say is that I don’t think it’s all Deano’s fault, some of it is, but he’s the manager and has to find a way to fix it, else it’s cheerio.
I agree
Post by: ChicagoLion on November 01, 2021, 04:54:34 AM
I agree, changing the formation has fucked cohesion and confidence.For me,the fact that we had the likes of Targett,Young,Hause El Ghazi and Nakamba on the pitch at the end says it all for me None of these players are anywhere near good enough of the standard to compete in the Premier
Targett was close to an England call up towards the end of last season. He’s started this season like the start of last season. I like him and still thinks he’s a good player, asking him to play wing back has really done him no favours at all.
In fact I think that system has knocked the confidence out of Konsa and Mings as well as Targett.
I agree.
Konsa and Mings were sound in a back 4, and Targett was decent on the left. He was never a wing back. Matt Cash can do it on right side.
With so much change to players and personnel he really did not need add further uncertainty.
It’s probably cost Smith his job.
Post by: ROBBO on November 01, 2021, 05:10:31 AM
Post by: sid1964 on November 01, 2021, 06:36:39 AM
If we are going to launch it we may as well get Emi to do that for us!
Post by: Lsvilla on November 01, 2021, 06:38:43 AM
Whats happened to the defence? we have scored more goals than half of the teams in the premiership but the defence which was being lauded as the best we have had for decades has suddenly looked slow and disorganised. We try to play out of defence but a hard press makes us look slow and cumbersome usually leading to a long punt at the end of a succession of either sideway or backwards passes. Players are pointing at each other but in truth they all are responsible.John Terry ?
Post by: nick harper on November 01, 2021, 06:49:55 AM
Whats happened to the defence? we have scored more goals than half of the teams in the premiership but the defence which was being lauded as the best we have had for decades has suddenly looked slow and disorganised. We try to play out of defence but a hard press makes us look slow and cumbersome usually leading to a long punt at the end of a succession of either sideway or backwards passes. Players are pointing at each other but in truth they all are responsible.
We can’t get the ball into the midfield any more. None are good enough to take the ball off the back four to break the press. Painful as it is to say, Grealish invariably made that happen, either by his ability to keep the ball under pressure and link the play, or by being fouled.
Post by: django on November 01, 2021, 06:49:57 AM
Including today’s games there are moments which could possibly have gone the other way and could have got us more points and Smith under less pressure.
But that’s true of almost every team on a poor run, we need to somehow stop the rot and get some results before the players become resigned and lose all belief.
There are signs that Smith is focusing on those moments of misfortune and difficult circumstances, understandable maybe, but it won’t help us or him get out of the current rut.
Post by: Mortimer's Bear on November 01, 2021, 07:13:02 AM
Post by: kippaxvilla2 on November 01, 2021, 07:40:22 AM
When is the last time West Ham had such an emphatic result at VP?Never is the answer.
Last season.
Post by: cdbearsfan on November 01, 2021, 08:10:33 AM
Post by: ROBBO on November 01, 2021, 08:28:29 AM
Post by: Duncan Shaw on November 01, 2021, 08:35:43 AM
Anyway, my West Ham supporting boss has just come in and he didn't think we were that bad at all and was worried at 2-1. Funny old game innit!!
Post by: brontebilly on November 01, 2021, 08:47:23 AM
John Terry is a pont of difference that is hard to overlook. He had defensive responsibilities and during his tenure we definately became a solid defensive unit. Do we have a defensive coach anymore? if not why not, we should have defence midfield and forward coaches each having responsibility for their area, anything less is unacceptable.
We were also rubbish defensively with Terry on board in our first season up. His influence is possibly overplayed bar getting in duds from Chelsea like Drinky and Barks.
We still have four more than capable centre halves, goalkeeper and two decent full backs. All are struggling for form individually and as a unit are all over the place. Its likely to be Tuanzebe/Mings on Friday night, another change. The last thing Deano needs to do is try Hause at RCB again.
Post by: Ad@m on November 01, 2021, 08:51:20 AM
When we try and pass ball the ball out of defence why do we then launch it up field after 2 passes between our defenders
If we are going to launch it we may as well get Emi to do that for us!
Because without Luiz in there there's zero options for the defence to play it short.
It's utterly baffling that with three central midfielders on the pitch none of them can provide an option for a pass. It's difficult to conclude it's down to personnel more than tactics.
Post by: Drummond on November 01, 2021, 08:52:35 AM
But it all adds up.
Post by: Ad@m on November 01, 2021, 08:57:55 AM
Yesterday wouldn't have felt so bad given all the circumstances of we hadn't been so dire against Arsenal, in the latter part of Wolves, v Spurs, Watford and the draw with Brentford.
But it all adds up.
Yep, as a one off it was a freak result. We probably didn't deserve to win but we also didn't deserve to concede 4.
The performance was similar to the Wolves one but the fact of the matter is that if you're conceding 3 or 4 in a home game you'll lose a lot more than you'll win.
Post by: Drummond on November 01, 2021, 09:01:35 AM
Yesterday wouldn't have felt so bad given all the circumstances of we hadn't been so dire against Arsenal, in the latter part of Wolves, v Spurs, Watford and the draw with Brentford.
But it all adds up.
Yep, as a one off it was a freak result. We probably didn't deserve to win but we also didn't deserve to concede 4.
The performance was similar to the Wolves one but the fact of the matter is that if you're conceding 3 or 4 in a home game you'll lose a lot more than you'll win.
Yep, what's different this season is that we haven't got Ratboy. The replacements aren't fit yet and they can't get used to the system of play because we've changed and nobody is used to it.
Post by: Legion on November 01, 2021, 09:02:39 AM
Post by: Drummond on November 01, 2021, 09:04:09 AM
Wow. What a word!
Erm.... Corrected! 😁
Post by: brontebilly on November 01, 2021, 09:04:36 AM
When we try and pass ball the ball out of defence why do we then launch it up field after 2 passes between our defenders
If we are going to launch it we may as well get Emi to do that for us!
Because without Luiz in there there's zero options for the defence to play it short.
It's utterly baffling that with three central midfielders on the pitch none of them can provide an option for a pass. It's difficult to conclude it's down to personnel more than tactics.
McGinn is becoming increasingly uncomfortable facing his own goal receiving the ball. The bum roll trick is becoming a liability in our half. We need him further forward where he does his best work. If Luiz and Sanson are fit on Friday night, they need to come in.
One positive from yesterday was that Watkins was much happier leading the line. Need to get McGinn playing off him.
Post by: Clampy on November 01, 2021, 09:08:08 AM
Post by: AV82EC on November 01, 2021, 09:09:15 AM
When we try and pass ball the ball out of defence why do we then launch it up field after 2 passes between our defenders
If we are going to launch it we may as well get Emi to do that for us!
Because without Luiz in there there's zero options for the defence to play it short.
It's utterly baffling that with three central midfielders on the pitch none of them can provide an option for a pass. It's difficult to conclude it's down to personnel more than tactics.
McGinn is becoming increasingly uncomfortable facing his own goal receiving the ball. The bum roll trick is becoming a liability in our half. We need him further forward where he does his best work. If Luiz and Sanson are fit on Friday night, they need to come in.
One positive from yesterday was that Watkins was much happier leading the line. Need to get McGinn playing off him.
Strong agree on Watkins, thought he looked to be getting back to something like normal and he absolutely ran his balls off second half.
Also agree on Sanson/Luiz, ball players, need to control that ball more in the middle of the pitch.
Post by: john e on November 01, 2021, 09:14:32 AM
We complain about the long hoof but the alternative is for them to try and play out, unfortunately all our central defenders everyone of them aren’t good enough to do that
They just play themselves into a load of trouble because technically they aren’t up to it
So they boot the ball long and round and round we go
What made it worse yesterday was because of injuries We ended up with Young McGinn Nakamba
You’re never going to play the ball through midfield with that lot
I thought Nakamba did well in breaking up play but he’s no midfield playmaker Like Luiz or even Ramsey
So we ended up with a defence and midfield that on the whole we’re not comfortable on the ball and technically good enough to retain possession pass and move from defence through midfield
I thought Dean Smith had a massive problem yesterday with injuries
And unfortunately we had too many backup players who aren’t good enough on the pitch
Post by: Drummond on November 01, 2021, 09:15:27 AM
Post by: sendô WHU on November 01, 2021, 09:16:13 AM
Villa started really badly, and after the first went in I wondered if they'd implode and it'd be a thrashing, but all credit your boys dug in and came right back at West Ham. The extra body in midfield seemed to help, and Villa were making good inroads down the flanks. The equaliser was probably deserved on the balance of play.
Then it went from the sublime to the ridiculous as a good equaliser was followed up by allowing Rice acres of space to have a pop. I felt for your keeper who was probably unsighted for both of West Ham's first two goals.
Fouls and cards galore through the second half. I felt for Konsa, it's one of them ones isn't it - is it a clear goalscoring opportunity or not? What way is the ball going, is there a covering defender, did Bowen have time to line up the shot? Letter of the law he was last man and pulled Bowen down. The ref actually gave a yellow, but it was VAR that overturned it. Hause however should have gone straight red for that forearm smash straight into an onrunning Fornals. I don't know how VAR have not given that - bottling out of giving Villa two reds for one passage of play? Most likely.
The Fornals foul on Nakamba looked like two players diving in at a loose ball. I didn't see studs up or two feet so can't see how more than a yellow was warranted.
The third and fourth were harsh on Villa given the overall balance of the game - I thought you lot were the better team with ten men until Moyes hooked Benrahma for Lanzini - but that's what happens when you're chasing the game with ten men, you get picked off.
I honestly thought Villa played well for chunks of the game. It was certainly more even than the score suggests and like I said above, at 2-1 with you down to ten men you looked the more likely to score. I thought Matt Cash played well, McGinn looked decent, and your keeper pulled off a couple of excellent saves including the Bowen shot that Fornals put in for the third. Watkins showed why he is a quality striker who will always get goals, twice getting himself into space in the box, scoring one and forcing an excellent save from Fabianski at the back.
The main issue seemed to be you were far too open at times, and made silly mistakes at the back. There's some good players in the team still. Certainly on paper Villa are better than the current league position.
All the best for the season lads.
Post by: AV82EC on November 01, 2021, 09:17:05 AM
Post by: john e on November 01, 2021, 09:22:20 AM
I tell you what, I'm becoming more convinced on Rice. I didn't think much of him before but he's a top player isn't he?
I watched him more closely yesterday because of the hype around him, you sometimes get a different perspective in a live performance
Have to say he is a class player
Post by: john e on November 01, 2021, 09:23:52 AM
Yep Rice is a quality player, the bastard. Far too good for West Ham😜
I hope they hold onto him all this too good for them is the same as we had with Grealish
Post by: AV82EC on November 01, 2021, 09:25:35 AM
Yep Rice is a quality player, the bastard. Far too good for West Ham😜
I hope they hold onto him all this too good for them is the same as we had with Grealish
If they don’t get Champs League he’ll be off as he’s out of contract I think this summer coming, I recall he refused to sign a new contract in the summer.
Post by: brontebilly on November 01, 2021, 09:28:19 AM
I tell you what, I'm becoming more convinced on Rice. I didn't think much of him before but he's a top player isn't he?
I watched him more closely yesterday because of the hype around him, you sometimes get a different perspective in a live performance
Have to say he is a class player
We gave him a ridiculous amount of space though. Certainly seems to be developing as an athlete, physically very strong now and also gets around the pitch a lot better than he used to. I still think at the very highest level, he will struggle to get turned on the ball in midfield.
Post by: Sexual Ealing on November 01, 2021, 09:28:20 AM
Yep Rice is a quality player, the bastard. Far too good for West Ham😜
I hope they hold onto him all this too good for them is the same as we had with Grealish
I agree with that, John. Despite not being fond of them as a club. They're doing well and it's good to see that it can be done.
Post by: SW9-VILLA on November 01, 2021, 09:30:49 AM
Whats happened to the defence? we have scored more goals than half of the teams in the premiership but the defence which was being lauded as the best we have had for decades has suddenly looked slow and disorganised. We try to play out of defence but a hard press makes us look slow and cumbersome usually leading to a long punt at the end of a succession of either sideway or backwards passes. Players are pointing at each other but in truth they all are responsible.John Terry ?
I've wondered that. To be fair he was also part of the coaching staff when we were leaking goals for fun pre-pandemic. I think switching to 3 at the back obviously takes getting used to and we've not taken to it particularly well or quickly.
Post by: LukeJames on November 01, 2021, 09:41:06 AM
Post by: The Edge on November 01, 2021, 09:46:12 AM
Well I'll say one thing, it was a bit of a whirlwind of a game. It had a real feel of a derby about it.Pretty much agree with all of that sendo. West Ham are starting to look like the real deal and top 4 is definitely on the cards. For all our spending we don't seem to have clicked yet. Too many of our lot seem to be out of sorts and we need them to get their act together pronto. All the best for the season.
Villa started really badly, and after the first went in I wondered if they'd implode and it'd be a thrashing, but all credit your boys dug in and came right back at West Ham. The extra body in midfield seemed to help, and Villa were making good inroads down the flanks. The equaliser was probably deserved on the balance of play.
Then it went from the sublime to the ridiculous as a good equaliser was followed up by allowing Rice acres of space to have a pop. I felt for your keeper who was probably unsighted for both of West Ham's first two goals.
Fouls and cards galore through the second half. I felt for Konsa, it's one of them ones isn't it - is it a clear goalscoring opportunity or not? What way is the ball going, is there a covering defender, did Bowen have time to line up the shot? Letter of the law he was last man and pulled Bowen down. The ref actually gave a yellow, but it was VAR that overturned it. Hause however should have gone straight red for that forearm smash straight into an onrunning Fornals. I don't know how VAR have not given that - bottling out of giving Villa two reds for one passage of play? Most likely.
The Fornals foul on Nakamba looked like two players diving in at a loose ball. I didn't see studs up or two feet so can't see how more than a yellow was warranted.
The third and fourth were harsh on Villa given the overall balance of the game - I thought you lot were the better team with ten men until Moyes hooked Benrahma for Lanzini - but that's what happens when you're chasing the game with ten men, you get picked off.
I honestly thought Villa played well for chunks of the game. It was certainly more even than the score suggests and like I said above, at 2-1 with you down to ten men you looked the more likely to score. I thought Matt Cash played well, McGinn looked decent, and your keeper pulled off a couple of excellent saves including the Bowen shot that Fornals put in for the third. Watkins showed why he is a quality striker who will always get goals, twice getting himself into space in the box, scoring one and forcing an excellent save from Fabianski at the back.
The main issue seemed to be you were far too open at times, and made silly mistakes at the back. There's some good players in the team still. Certainly on paper Villa are better than the current league position.
All the best for the season lads.
Post by: kippaxvilla2 on November 01, 2021, 09:54:23 AM
Post by: LeeB on November 01, 2021, 09:56:02 AM
Post by: sickbeggar on November 01, 2021, 10:02:48 AM
Post by: Sexual Ealing on November 01, 2021, 10:04:03 AM
Post by: Richard E on November 01, 2021, 10:05:07 AM
Post by: Brend'Watkins on November 01, 2021, 10:06:46 AM
Post by: Legion on November 01, 2021, 10:07:48 AM
https://vm.tiktok.com/ZM8uCFQ3H/
Post by: sickbeggar on November 01, 2021, 10:08:48 AM
Nice to see you back, sb.Cheers SE ;)
Post by: Mister E on November 01, 2021, 10:09:01 AM
West Ham are a good side, but right from the first kick, we made it so, so easy for them.Yeah, agree with all of that.
We spent the entire summer stressing the need for a CDM, but didn't get one.
Watching that today, us with the enthusiastic but not good enough Nakamba in that role, and them with two absolute top class players in that role, that was horrible.
Then to make things worse, Ramsey goes off and is replaced by Ashley Fucking Young playing centrally? What on earth was the thinking there?
He then compounds the mistake when Konsa gets sent off by not hooking Young, but taking Buendia off.
That is Smith in a nutshell there. Terrible game management ...
WHU weren't great yesterday, but we were inept.
I actually thought Nakamba (he intercepted and tackled well and his passing was limited but generally safe) and Hause (positionally and defensively better than the recent performances from Mings) played okay; but we did not have the guile and strength to get Bailey and Buendia into the game. I'm not sure what instructions were given to Bailey, but standing out on the left for most of the game was not very helpful to us and he was easily marked by the Spammers defence.
The game seemed to break down whenever the ball went to McGinn and Targett; distribution generally was piss-poor.
Why does Cashski think that - because he scored his first Villa goal earlier in the season - he should shoot whenever 40 yds from goal? Stop it FFS!!
I'm afraid Ashley Young is not up to the Premier League game any more. And, it was his poor pass which led to the break which in turn led to the red card incidents.
As others have said, there is something very not right at VP currently, and I'm not sure Smith will sort it out.
Post by: cdbearsfan on November 01, 2021, 10:16:35 AM
Didn’t Sendo shithouse us on KUMB a while ago?
Let's not get all Newcastle about it. Not everyone has to like us.
Post by: LeeB on November 01, 2021, 10:18:28 AM
Didn’t Sendo shithouse us on KUMB a while ago?
Let's not get all Newcastle about it. Not everyone has to like us.
That's true enough, but then being all of our mates for years then going back to your lot and absolutely ripping us as an entitled bunch of bellends was a bit below the mark for me.
Post by: cdbearsfan on November 01, 2021, 10:33:45 AM
Post by: Ads on November 01, 2021, 10:57:17 AM
Post by: Allan C on November 01, 2021, 10:57:36 AM
I honestly can’t fathom some of the comments on here. Once again, maybe I was watching a different match. We even started the game with a long punt upfield for a throw in to them. Throughout the match, I never thought we looked anything like winning it. Too sloppy with passes, not very much passion from the players. I could go on. I love the Villa but, can’t seem to buy those claret and blue tinted glasses anywhere.Our passing has been poor all season, too many times we’re either passing to the opposition or out of play. McGinns unforced pass against Arsenal culminating in their third was possibly the worst example of it. That for me is the difference from last season
Post by: Allan C on November 01, 2021, 11:09:40 AM
I tell you what, I'm becoming more convinced on Rice. I didn't think much of him before but he's a top player isn't he?Soucek for me, they’ve probably got the most hardworking midfield in PL they have exactly what we haven’t got
Post by: sickbeggar on November 01, 2021, 11:12:55 AM
I tell you what, I'm becoming more convinced on Rice. I didn't think much of him before but he's a top player isn't he?Soucek for me, they’ve probably got the most hardworking midfield in PL they have exactly what we haven’t got
yep Soucek and Rice are quality. No contest with our lot.
Post by: PaulTheVillan on November 01, 2021, 11:14:42 AM
I tell you what, I'm becoming more convinced on Rice. I didn't think much of him before but he's a top player isn't he?Soucek for me, they’ve probably got the most hardworking midfield in PL they have exactly what we haven’t got
yep Soucek and Rice are quality. No contest with our lot.
They have it all. Composure, work rate and know when to put a foot in. Not sure we have anyone who can do all three.
Post by: sickbeggar on November 01, 2021, 11:19:57 AM
Post by: exigo on November 01, 2021, 11:21:20 AM
Post by: PeterWithe on November 01, 2021, 11:21:23 AM
Thought Emi could have done better for both the first half goals. The equalizer was totally against the run of play, the only contribution of the whole game by Emi2. When you think that front 3 cost us £100m you can see how much confidence is shot, Bailey looked well off the pace and was playing far too deep and narrow, Buendia just looked lost.
A strange game in that the team and certain players looked decent in snatches and awful in other parts, Hause kept Antonio very quiet but ,and he was one of many, looked very ponderous with the ball. The performace lacked zip.
Maybe when you look at a midfield 3 of Young, McGinn and Marv you question the recruitment but they all did well in individual patches, Young showed for the ball into feet in areas the other two didnt, McGinn did some decent defensive covering and Marv showed a bit of much needed energy in the second half despite him treating the ball like it was radioactive.
Overall it was difficult to see what we were trying to do and we looked like we lacked managerial direction, players werent committing to following the leading guy into the press so we were easily played round. We didnt get wide fast enough and committ the full backs forward enough. Cant have too many complaints about the red card although he probably wouldnt have got it last weekend. Didnt see enough of the potential red for them. Thought we played with a lot of heart between the second and third goals.
I reckon that mad 10 mins against Wolves has shot our self belief
Post by: Pete3206 on November 01, 2021, 11:30:16 AM
Post by: Footy-Vill on November 01, 2021, 11:38:57 AM
I tell you what, I'm becoming more convinced on Rice. I didn't think much of him before but he's a top player isn't he?Soucek for me, they’ve probably got the most hardworking midfield in PL they have exactly what we haven’t got
yep Soucek and Rice are quality. No contest with our lot.
But Smith isn't interested in big men in midfield he prefers technicians or at least not overly fussed on big units in the midfield with prowess in the air.
Doesn't tie in at the moment with way we are playing with these longer throws and things and wonder what happened to the strategy that Purlsow and he had with everything
Post by: Mister E on November 01, 2021, 11:52:51 AM
Rice and Soucek are both technicians - as you call them - so the 2 (being technically good and being big) are not mutually exclusive.But Smith isn't interested in big men in midfield he prefers technicians or at least not overly fussed on big units in the midfield with prowess in the air.yep Soucek and Rice are quality. No contest with our lot.I tell you what, I'm becoming more convinced on Rice. I didn't think much of him before but he's a top player isn't he?Soucek for me, they’ve probably got the most hardworking midfield in PL they have exactly what we haven’t got
Post by: Footy-Vill on November 01, 2021, 11:57:36 AM
Only one is a technician in my eyes.
Busquets or Soucek ?
Only one is a technician in my eyes.
Post by: PaulWinch again on November 01, 2021, 11:58:45 AM
Hard and difficult choices ahead for the owners.
I don’t think they are really. Not pleasant yes, but if you look at this calendar year the choice is very obvious.
Post by: VinnieChase84 on November 01, 2021, 12:13:54 PM
Post by: VinnieChase84 on November 01, 2021, 12:16:28 PM
I tell you what, I'm becoming more convinced on Rice. I didn't think much of him before but he's a top player isn't he?
Prob my favourite non Villa player in the league. Lads quality
Post by: Risso on November 01, 2021, 12:33:14 PM
Post by: Ian. on November 01, 2021, 12:35:07 PM
I tell you what, I'm becoming more convinced on Rice. I didn't think much of him before but he's a top player isn't he?
Prob my favourite non Villa player in the league. Lads quality
Me too, I thinks he's superb. I've been very impressed ever since the second game we had against them last season. Also every time he plays for England he's excellent.
Post by: LeeB on November 01, 2021, 12:36:49 PM
I tell you what, I'm becoming more convinced on Rice. I didn't think much of him before but he's a top player isn't he?
Prob my favourite non Villa player in the league. Lads quality
Me too, I thinks he's superb. I've been very impressed ever since the second game we had against them last season. Also every time he plays for England he's excellent.
I'd written off as a bit of a clogger but I'll eat my words, he was imperious yesterday.
Post by: Keeno on November 01, 2021, 12:39:25 PM
Man U should have gone for Rice rather than Sancho in the summer.
100%. Best player on the park yesterday by some distance.
Reflecting on the result a day after I do believe the 4-1 was a harsh result on us, but that's the way things go when you're in a bad run of form.
The next three games are pivotal in whether Smith goes or stays. He's definitely built up enough credit to be allowed that time to turn it round - if we get 6+ points from those three we could potentially move back into the top half.
However, if the performances and results over these three games follow the trend of October, with easier opponents in Southampton, Brighton and Palace, then no excuses - he'll have had a third of a season and shown no progress in moving us forward post-Joe, with a decent, top-half-capable squad - and I think the owners would be justified in looking at replacements.
One positive should the worst case scenario occur is that we have a very good interim option in Craig Shakespeare on our bench already, with plenty of experience managing in the PL - so we wouldn't need to rush for an appointment and could take our time (relatively) in getting the right man in.
Post by: ChicagoLion on November 01, 2021, 12:45:51 PM
Post by: ajmant on November 01, 2021, 12:52:30 PM
Post by: Mister E on November 01, 2021, 12:52:56 PM
Jorginho or Rice?Nah, sorry: disagree with you. All 4 mentioned are technically gifted and physically imposing.
Only one is a technician in my eyes.
Busquets or Soucek ?
Only one is a technician in my eyes.
Post by: darren woolley on November 01, 2021, 12:56:26 PM
Post by: VinnieChase84 on November 01, 2021, 01:02:51 PM
I would be astonished if he got another 3 games.
You wont have to be astonished mate
Post by: remy on November 01, 2021, 01:12:18 PM
Reasoning is there is then a 2 week gap in which to recruit a new man, sort the defence out first by making us hard to break down and using something called 'coaching' to transition the ball from defence to midfield to the forwards without hoofing it or trying to throw the ball further.
It's possible that Mings had a go at Smith, Smith had a go back and benched him. Players aren't happy. This is the best squad for years we are in the bottom 6!
Post by: Villatillidie1982 on November 01, 2021, 01:28:21 PM
Palace beat Citeh and Brighton came from 2 goals down to draw with Liverpool. Easier opponents?Man U should have gone for Rice rather than Sancho in the summer.
100%. Best player on the park yesterday by some distance.
Reflecting on the result a day after I do believe the 4-1 was a harsh result on us, but that's the way things go when you're in a bad run of form.
The next three games are pivotal in whether Smith goes or stays. He's definitely built up enough credit to be allowed that time to turn it round - if we get 6+ points from those three we could potentially move back into the top half.
However, if the performances and results over these three games follow the trend of October, with easier opponents in Southampton, Brighton and Palace, then no excuses - he'll have had a third of a season and shown no progress in moving us forward post-Joe, with a decent, top-half-capable squad - and I think the owners would be justified in looking at replacements.
One positive should the worst case scenario occur is that we have a very good interim option in Craig Shakespeare on our bench already, with plenty of experience managing in the PL - so we wouldn't need to rush for an appointment and could take our time (relatively) in getting the right man in.
Post by: LeeB on November 01, 2021, 01:48:35 PM
Post by: andyh on November 01, 2021, 01:54:39 PM
I said exactly the same during the game….until he scored then I decided I don’t like him after all.I tell you what, I'm becoming more convinced on Rice. I didn't think much of him before but he's a top player isn't he?
Prob my favourite non Villa player in the league. Lads quality
He is a top player.
Post by: KRS on November 01, 2021, 02:12:18 PM
Just your opinion or do you know something Vinnie?I would be astonished if he got another 3 games.
You wont have to be astonished mate
Post by: sid1964 on November 01, 2021, 02:45:14 PM
Post by: olaftab on November 01, 2021, 03:00:36 PM
I would be astonished if he got another 3 games.Lose to Southampton and it's cheerio I am afraid.
Post by: Allan C on November 01, 2021, 03:53:05 PM
I think Dean Smith has 1 game to save himself. If we don't get a good performance at the Saints and concede yet another 3 or 4 goals it's Au Revoir.I think we need to be careful not making something where there’s nothing. The vast majority on here suggested that Mings needed dropping and Smith did it. There didn’t need to be an argument. He’s been poor and he was dropped
Reasoning is there is then a 2 week gap in which to recruit a new man, sort the defence out first by making us hard to break down and using something called 'coaching' to transition the ball from defence to midfield to the forwards without hoofing it or trying to throw the ball further.
It's possible that Mings had a go at Smith, Smith had a go back and benched him. Players aren't happy. This is the best squad for years we are in the bottom 6!
Post by: Bobby Boy on November 01, 2021, 06:26:52 PM
We had a new formation, new personnel. There was no cohesion, we were disjointed and lost. As you might expect.
Who is surprised that West Ham won?
If Dean won't work out what he wants can we get someone in who does?
Post by: LukeJames on November 01, 2021, 06:36:48 PM
West Ham had their first choice eleven out. They were well organised, well drilled, every player knew their role, their job.Apart from the most under rated right back in the League.
Post by: saint13 on November 01, 2021, 07:32:00 PM
Man U should have gone for Rice rather than Sancho in the summer.
I have been saying that for weeks. He would have made them 50% better & cannot believe they didn't get him instead paying well over the odds for the type player they already have 3 of.
Post by: astonvilla82 on November 01, 2021, 07:35:00 PM
Post by: Ad@m on November 01, 2021, 07:40:23 PM
Post by: LukeJames on November 01, 2021, 07:50:02 PM
That performance wasn't as bad as the Spurs or Arsenal performances.
It was similar to the Spurs one, the Arsenal one we couldn't of complained if we'd lost 6-1
Post by: Steve67 on November 01, 2021, 07:52:48 PM
That performance wasn't as bad as the Spurs or Arsenal performances.
I think West Ham are a better side than both of those, but Villa were terrible yesterday.
Post by: Ad@m on November 01, 2021, 08:01:50 PM
That performance wasn't as bad as the Spurs or Arsenal performances.
It was similar to the Spurs one, the Arsenal one we couldn't of complained if we'd lost 6-1
The thing with the Spurs game was that they (OK, Son) were carving us open at will. It could've easily been 4 or 5 if Kane wasn't such a mardy bum and actually tried.
But West Ham did sod all other than a couple of speculative hits where we gave them too much time and up until the sending off, just like the Wolves game, on another day it could've easily been a draw.
Post by: Steve67 on November 01, 2021, 08:06:39 PM
Post by: martin o`who?? on November 01, 2021, 09:20:07 PM
Best West Ham side I can remember - quality all over the pitch and they never stepped running. If Declan Rice continues to step up he is going to be some player - not that he already isn't. The only plus point from yesterday was Ollie looked a bit more like the Ollie of last season even though he had fuck-all to feed off. We keep hearing how well we bought in pre-season but only Ings was proven Premiership quality. We've now conceded 12 goals in four games and lost the lot. We went as soon as the fourth went in but my mind went back to that 4:1 obliteration of the Hammers on boxing day 1976 and the optimism it generated - that seems a million years gone at the minute.
Post by: brontebilly on November 01, 2021, 11:27:34 PM
That's part of the issue though Ad@m with us standing so far off them, giving them far too much respect and many of our players either ambling back or simply standing and watching as West Ham attacked. The efforts of Taggart, Bailey and El Ghazi yesterday for the goals were absolutely awful. All about opinions I guess but I thought large elements of yesterday's game was as bad as the Arsenal game. A six and two three's, so to speak!
I thought we were really poor at 11 v 11. Sure Martinez should be saving both their first two goals but we completely ceded control of our midfield to them. With the exception of Watkins, we were putting no pressure on them without the ball. With the ball, there was no cohesion at all really bar a fine move for our goal which was completely out of the blue. A bit of a fightback at 1-2 with 10 men but three of our rearranged back four lost their heads completely. Konsa can have no complaints for me with that stupid decision he made and as for the other 2 with their MMA tackles. All out of character. What's got into our players?
Post by: VinnieChase84 on November 02, 2021, 12:29:06 AM
Just your opinion or do you know something Vinnie?I would be astonished if he got another 3 games.
You wont have to be astonished mate
Posted last week on what the situation was and lay of the land (that sounds Dickish and don’t mean it to) but
Think I’ve tried to be as honest as I can be with the situation. Nothing changed
Post by: The Edge on November 02, 2021, 10:07:25 AM
Post by: Chico Hamilton III on November 02, 2021, 10:19:30 AM
I forced myself to watch a re-run of motd2 last night. It was every bit as bad as I thought at the time. If not worse.
Same here. I was screaming at some of those shit long throws. My nerd son tells me that Tim Sherwood’s 28 game nightmare in charge of us was more successful than Smith’s last 28 games for us. Is that right?
Post by: Nev on November 02, 2021, 10:48:10 AM
Post by: The Edge on November 02, 2021, 11:11:52 AM
Not a stats guy myself but I can well believe it. Quite a shocking stat that is. Dean's villa fan credits will only go so far.I forced myself to watch a re-run of motd2 last night. It was every bit as bad as I thought at the time. If not worse.
Same here. I was screaming at some of those shit long throws. My nerd son tells me that Tim Sherwood’s 28 game nightmare in charge of us was more successful than Smith’s last 28 games for us. Is that right?
Post by: dcdavecollett on November 06, 2021, 07:43:37 PM
Hause's challenge looks awful, thou I'm not sure there was any intent.
Post by: dcdavecollett on November 10, 2021, 11:48:16 PM
Next time, I'd go with Carney.
Post by: robleflaneur on November 11, 2021, 12:30:52 AM
Oh, and while poor old Deano gets pelters for bringing on Young in central midfield, I wonder to what extent his decision was based on not wanting to expose Carney to West Ham's midfield Big Two at this stage of his career?The best solution would have been to bring on Mings go to a back 3,bring Buendia into midfield.It would have made us physically stronger and given us pace and more skill in midfield and Bailey's lack of tracking back would have been less of an issue.
Next time, I'd go with Carney.
If the Konsa red card still happens,Ashley wing back and Targett to left side of central defence.
Post by: dcdavecollett on November 11, 2021, 11:43:14 PM
Of course, changing the shape as you suggest might have caused an explosion amongst the 3-5-2 phobics!!