Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine

Heroes & Villains => Match Threads & Player Ratings => Topic started by: Dave P on December 23, 2019, 07:52:43 AM

Title: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Dave P on December 23, 2019, 07:52:43 AM
I think this is our first genuine ‘must win’ game of the season. Let’s see how the squad react.

Everyone has their own ideas on the team and formation so I won’t bother. Is Mings back?

If we lose we are in real trouble but I think something will click so I’m saying 2-0 Villa. Connor and Wes.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: LukeJames on December 23, 2019, 08:10:32 AM
2-2
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Risso on December 23, 2019, 08:40:22 AM
Southampton felt fairly 'must win' to me, it has to be said.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Jon Crofts on December 23, 2019, 08:47:19 AM
Compare and contrast.

Pukki and Cantwell running at our back 4 or balls bouncing off Wesley all afternoon?

Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Risso on December 23, 2019, 08:52:00 AM
0-2 Norwich.  It'll be another pick'n'mix ineffective midfield from us, with Wesley lumbering around up front not looking like scoring. The 5-1 in the away fixture will look a million miles off..
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: eamonn on December 23, 2019, 09:01:57 AM
Norwich looked electric for an hour of that Wolves game based on the highlights. Whoever scores first wins this, both teams' heads go down upon conceding at the moment.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Mossie Hennebry on December 23, 2019, 09:10:47 AM
Wesley cannot start this game - he does not deserve it. Start anyone else there.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: villa `cross the mersey on December 23, 2019, 09:17:50 AM
We could field 12 players, with Wesley up front and nobody would notice
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Richard E on December 23, 2019, 09:21:54 AM
2-0 down at half time. We bring on the three contestants from the half time "Prize Where It Lies" competition, as they show a higher degree of passing ability than anyone in the starting line up. They each score a goal in the second half and we win 3-2.

It sparks a renaissance and we do not lose again for the rest of the season, bringing home the Carabao Cup and our first FA Cup for 63 years.   
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: brontebilly on December 23, 2019, 09:57:25 AM
Very difficult one to pick a team for, one thing is clear and that is the formation needs to change. I'm hoping Chester is fit and for experience alone I think Elmo also needs to come in. Wes needs saving at least Kodjia will run in behind anyway. I don't rate Jota either but everyone else has had a chance of late and failed.

-------------Heaton
---Chester, Engels, Hause
Elmo, Luiz, Nakamba, Targett
-----------Jota, Grealish,
---------------Kodjia

Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: phantom limb on December 23, 2019, 09:58:34 AM
We quite simply have to win this, which is why we probably won’t.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Mossie Hennebry on December 23, 2019, 10:03:32 AM
I can't see the formation changing before Thursday - there just isn't the time.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: AV82EC on December 23, 2019, 10:05:32 AM
I’d definitely drop El Ghazi he’s been an utter waste of a shirt all season.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: aj2k77 on December 23, 2019, 10:12:37 AM
4-5-1 with Wesley trotting around doing fuck all, Luiz being a fanny and Targett meandering half way line out of position and they can all fuck off and we might as well pull the trigger.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: darren woolley on December 23, 2019, 10:14:28 AM
This is a must win game no doubt about it after Southampton we really must win this.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: OzVilla on December 23, 2019, 10:26:11 AM
I can't see the formation changing before Thursday - there just isn't the time.

Especially when they’ve got Christmas Day off.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: TonyD on December 23, 2019, 10:36:52 AM
1.4
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Luke8 on December 23, 2019, 10:39:13 AM
I can't see the formation changing before Thursday - there just isn't the time.

Especially when they’ve got Christmas Day off.

Of course there is time. Leicester managed to do it in the four days between playing Watford and us. I’m sure there has been plenty of other instances too.

Whether Smith believes it is the right think to do is the biggest issue facing any potential formation change in my opinion.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Legion on December 23, 2019, 10:47:54 AM
D 1-1.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: KRS on December 23, 2019, 10:53:43 AM
On current form, Pukki could have a field day running at and getting between Engels and Hause. I’ve voted for the win, but the more I think about this game, the less I’m liking the likely outcomes. Hope I’m wrong. Another miserable Boxing Day...

2-3 Norwich
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: ROBBO on December 23, 2019, 10:59:21 AM
How far have we fallen in two months cannot see us winning.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: eamonn on December 23, 2019, 11:10:17 AM
How far have we fallen in two months cannot see us winning.

Not even that. 20 days between nearly winning at OT and that shitshow on Shaturday.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: ChicagoLion on December 23, 2019, 11:15:57 AM
If smith goes with the same set up, expect the same result. Which I think he will.
Norwich win
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: SoccerHQ on December 23, 2019, 11:26:31 AM
Would start Taylor, Chester, Trez, Kodjia and move Jack to number 10 role.

If the formation isn't going to be changed significantly then at least change the personnel in it.

Not sure that will be enough for the win though. 2-2.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Jon Crofts on December 23, 2019, 11:28:41 AM
Can't see us winning this, Norwich will have too much for us, (fucking hell, did I just type that) we are in free fall. 0-3
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: ChicagoLion on December 23, 2019, 11:32:29 AM
Southampton felt fairly 'must win' to me, it has to be said.
We have gone from must win to last chance saloon.
It really would be very difficult to come back from defeats at home to Southampton and Norwich
Not looking forward to watford either.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: RamboandBruno on December 23, 2019, 11:37:08 AM
Think he’ll stay with same formation, but will tweak team. He has to move Grealish back into the middle. I’m right behind Smith but if he doesn’t do that he’s hugely culpable. He cannot keep playing Jack our wide to try and support Wes more because he doesn’t know how to run the lines.

Saying that Wes tried hard on Saturday but needs to be taken out the firing line now. I don’t think Kodja is the answer but we have to give him a go for this one.

El Ghazi was so awful on Saturday he has to be dropped, that could for a few others but we have to put out a team. He may we’ll put an experienced head such as Elmo in on Boxing Day but I don’t think at the expense of Guilbert, who had a poor game Saturday but has generally been good. When under the cosh he sometimes resorts to Elmo wide midfield to support defensively, honestly don’t know if that’s a good idea or not.

Saying all that I think his team might be

                     Heaton
Guilbert  Engels  Hause Targett

                      Nakamba

                    Luiz   Grealish

Elmo.             Kodja.             Trez
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Axl Rose on December 23, 2019, 11:39:15 AM
3-2 us.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: achilles on December 23, 2019, 11:56:19 AM
If smith goes with the same set up, expect the same result. Which I think he will.
Norwich win

Exactly this, same formation, same result, only an idiot continues to do this!
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Bad English on December 23, 2019, 12:00:22 PM
Following a post by joe_c regarding Villa Park being 'Whamageddoned' last Saturday, I'd like to cheer you up with the 2019 remix which you can sing on Wednesday if it happens again:

Last kick-off we gave you a goal
But the very next play gave a second away.
This half we're having a laugh
We're giving the ball to Wesley.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: ChicagoLion on December 23, 2019, 12:00:37 PM
There are 3 problems that Smith has to solve.
The first is the lack of defensive cover from the midfield and i struggle to see from the players at his disposal how he fixes this.
And playing a flat 3 is not working and putting Jack in to do defensive work is wasting our best player. As soon as Hourihane plays you know the gaps get even bigger he is terrible defensively.
Nakamba is the strongest but lacks discipline and Luis is also not suited to the dirty work of harass and closing down.
The next problem is the attack and Wes is not good enough for this level yet so he either pushes someone up along side him or plays without a centreforward, ( before he turned to absolute shit I would have given AEG a go through the middle).
The next is left back which could be solved by Hauhe or Taylor.
I would completely radical
Fred Chester Engels Hause
          Konsa
Luis Marvel Tres
        Jack
     Wes

Of course I know that Smith would not contemplate this but it is one way of getting our best players on the pitch and shoring up the defense.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: PeterWithesShin on December 23, 2019, 12:02:08 PM
If we pick the same kind of team and formation and don't win then DS is going to be under massive pressure.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: tony scott on December 23, 2019, 12:04:30 PM
0-2/defeat I’d put Guilbert in the midfield he’s got pace and can tackle
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Luke8 on December 23, 2019, 12:06:18 PM
Is Mings definitely unavailable for this game?
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: achilles on December 23, 2019, 12:10:28 PM
Team I would like:

                     Heaton

             Konsa     Engels     Hause

    Guilbert  Nakamba  Luiz  Targett

                   Grealish

            Kodja.            Wesley

__________________________________________________________

The team I think DS will play:

                     Heaton

      Elmo  Engels  Hause Targett

        Nakamba   Grealish  Luiz

        Trez      Wesley       El Ghazi
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Steve67 on December 23, 2019, 12:11:05 PM
Massive massive massive. For lots of reasons. We have to win or we face being a bit cut off at the bottom of the table.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: RamboandBruno on December 23, 2019, 12:18:19 PM
Team I would like:

                     Heaton

             Konsa     Engels     Hause

    Guilbert  Nakamba  Luiz  Targett

                   Grealish

            Kodja.            Wesley

__________________________________________________________

The team I think DS will play:

                     Heaton

      Elmo  Engels  Hause Targett

        Nakamba   Grealish  Luiz

        Trez      Wesley       El Ghazi

I’d really like him to try your first option with wing back but don’t think he will
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: ChicagoLion on December 23, 2019, 12:23:16 PM
Switching to a back 3 is actually quite difficult and with only 3 days to practice you are asking for even more trouble.
There is enough confusion all ready, so given time maybe but not now.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Mouse Potato on December 23, 2019, 01:02:48 PM
Switching to a back 3 is actually quite difficult and with only 3 days to practice you are asking for even more trouble.
There is enough confusion all ready, so given time maybe but not now.


You'd hope it's something they have already been working on, just on the off chance that 433 is a bit, erm... shite.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: ChicagoLion on December 23, 2019, 01:11:11 PM
Switching to a back 3 is actually quite difficult and with only 3 days to practice you are asking for even more trouble.
There is enough confusion all ready, so given time maybe but not now.


You'd hope it's something they have already been working on, just on the off chance that 433 is a bit, erm... shite.
Completely agree that 4 3 3 is shite, I think the biggest problem is to stop giving the opposition as many chances as we do.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Villafirst on December 23, 2019, 01:11:21 PM
I can only see a draw at best. Norwich looked excellent when they drew 1-1 at Leicester. They were unlucky against Wolves. They have good passing and movement and don't give it away cheaply (unlike Villa) Without Mings and McGinn I can't see a win. The team lacks passion and has no stomach for a relegation scrap, apart from Jack.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: ChicagoLion on December 23, 2019, 01:15:38 PM
Norwich and us have conceded the most goals 37 in the league.
Grealish is 3 goals in 5 games, so moving him further away from the goal is probably not the best idea.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Goldie.7 on December 23, 2019, 01:19:02 PM
We haven't won a game of football when both Nakamba and Luiz have started together or played the majority of the match. In fact, we're likely to concede 2 goals or more when they do.

Just go ahead and write off any hope of getting 3 points if you want those lightweights to both start.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Damo70 on December 23, 2019, 01:20:22 PM
I want to see Kodjia start. We have just lost a six pointer so we now need to win a six pointer.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Rudy Can't Fail on December 23, 2019, 01:24:13 PM
I'd be tempted to drop Jack just to see the reaction of the players. They all need to step up and contribute instead of relying on Grealish to solve all our problems.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: mallo on December 23, 2019, 01:28:25 PM
I think we've got enough to draw at home with the mighty Norwich. If Kodjia starts I'd even say we might sneak a win. Southampton and the next 2 games will surely shape our season.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Luke8 on December 23, 2019, 02:15:34 PM
I'd be tempted to drop Jack just to see the reaction of the players. They all need to step up and contribute instead of relying on Grealish to solve all our problems.

That reaction presumably being that the manager had lost his mind?
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: hilts_coolerking on December 23, 2019, 02:20:32 PM
I'd be tempted to drop Jack just to see the reaction of the players. They all need to step up and contribute instead of relying on Grealish to solve all our problems.

That reaction presumably being that the manager had lost his mind?

I'd quite like to see the fans' reaction too.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: wince on December 23, 2019, 02:24:58 PM
We should not drop jack to prove a point. Maybe not being so dependent on him in the first place would be better. Proving a point like this is a sure way to get us into the shit. I would drop Wes for a game and have him on the bench.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Deano's Mullet on December 23, 2019, 02:26:05 PM
Its Villa, its Boxing Day therefore we shall lose. I think Norwich will really fancy their chances and go for it. I really want Dean Smith to be a success but i cant see him changing the way we set up or personnel plus confidence seems really low. 0-2 defeat. Please prove me wrong Villa.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: CT on December 23, 2019, 02:27:27 PM
I've just got my fingers crossed that Dean will have something different for Norwich.

If we line up, same old, same old, and they go a goal up. I fear the worst. Absolutely must win.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Bobby Boy on December 23, 2019, 04:12:07 PM
It's hard to see us winning this at the moment. Confidence is everything and our confidence is on the floor.

Norwich are very fallible as we have shown ourselves but they were decent at Leicester and unlucky to lose at home to Wolves.

1-3.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Sexual Ealing on December 23, 2019, 05:17:37 PM
https://twitter.com/OfficialTM_3/status/1209149224413270016

If Mings could by some miracle make back in time for this one it would be a huge boost - psychologically, as well as defensively.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Risso on December 23, 2019, 05:20:12 PM
https://twitter.com/OfficialTM_3/status/1209149224413270016

If Mings could by some miracle make back in time for this one it would be a huge boost - psychologically, as well as defensively.

Saw somewhere else that he was training today and Boxing Day and had been pencilled in to return at Watford. 
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: PaulWinch again on December 23, 2019, 05:22:51 PM
Must win and have to be the complete antithesis of what we were on Saturday.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Sexual Ealing on December 23, 2019, 05:39:40 PM
https://twitter.com/OfficialTM_3/status/1209149224413270016

If Mings could by some miracle make back in time for this one it would be a huge boost - psychologically, as well as defensively.

Saw somewhere else that he was training today and Boxing Day and had been pencilled in to return at Watford. 

Yep, just clutching at straws!
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Ads on December 23, 2019, 05:39:47 PM
Heaton

Targett
Hause
Engles
Guilbert

Nkamba

Luiz
Hourihane

Grealish

Kodjia
Wesley
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Des Little on December 23, 2019, 05:58:15 PM
I’m with Ads. No AEG and two up front.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: AV82EC on December 23, 2019, 06:04:47 PM
Yep Ads has nailed it there for me, get rid of El Ghazi, absolute passenger.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Risso on December 23, 2019, 06:08:41 PM
Heaton

Targett
Hause
Engles
Guilbert

Nkamba

Luiz
Hourihane

Grealish

Kodjia
Wesley


That in a diamond formation for me.  Frees Jack up to support the front two and be able to do what he does best.  I suspect it'll be this though:

Heaton
Elmo Engels Hause Taylor
Hourihane Nakamba Luiz
Trezeguet Wesley Grealish.

El Ghazi on for Trezeguet after 70 minutes, obviously.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Ads on December 23, 2019, 06:15:23 PM
It was meant to be a diamond, but I agree, I cannot see us deploying a new system. I feel we need to do more to flood the middle out of possession and we absolutely must get Jack central.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: levico on December 23, 2019, 06:19:45 PM
Seems to me that the majority, if not all, of the contributors to this thread could pick a team on Thursday that could challenge Norwich.

Pretty certain that Deano is unable to do so.

0-3
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: GXVilla on December 23, 2019, 06:21:06 PM
We can't play 4 at the back with 2 full backs that can't defend and someone as slow as Engels. Konsa and Hause are too raw as well so I'm not looking forward to this. Never thought that I'd want Taylor back in but at least he can defend. We are far too easy to score against and once we concede the first goal, we're done.El Ghazi was a disgrace on saturday and needs to go. Grealish has to be moved in fro the wing.

      Heaton

 Konsa Engels Hause

Elmo Nakamba Luiz Targett

         Grealish
      Wesley Kodja
Surely with 10 minutes preparation we could defend better than Saturday!
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: villalion on December 23, 2019, 06:27:10 PM
Have a look on their forums. 1 win in god knows how long?
But they are licking their lips at this fixture.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: The Moose on December 23, 2019, 06:29:22 PM
Thing is, I don't think our defenders are too slow, they are just continually caught out of position and struggle to cope. The whole set up of the team is wrong. Trouble is, Dean can't or won't change. Out of his depth.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: andyh on December 23, 2019, 06:34:13 PM
We can't play 4 at the back with 2 full backs that can't defend and someone as slow as Engels. Konsa and Hause are too raw as well so I'm not looking forward to this. Never thought that I'd want Taylor back in but at least he can defend. We are far too easy to score against and once we concede the first goal, we're done.El Ghazi was a disgrace on saturday and needs to go. Grealish has to be moved in fro the wing.

      Heaton

 Konsa Engels Hause

Elmo Nakamba Luiz Targett

         Grealish
      Wesley Kodja
Surely with 10 minutes preparation we could defend better than Saturday!
I don’t disagree that it needs a radical shake up like this suggestion.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: SoccerHQ on December 23, 2019, 07:29:32 PM
Is Mings definitely unavailable for this game?

From BBC report he's targeting Watford game for his comeback.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: eamonn on December 23, 2019, 07:33:14 PM
No one choosing Chester in their XIs?  He's fit and a leader, we don't have any of them at the mo.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: ChicagoLion on December 23, 2019, 07:43:19 PM
No one choosing Chester in their XIs?  He's fit and a leader, we don't have any of them at the mo.
I did mate.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: CT on December 23, 2019, 07:46:38 PM
Yep, Chester should be in 100% for me too.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Rudy65 on December 23, 2019, 07:54:35 PM
We can't play 4 at the back with 2 full backs that can't defend and someone as slow as Engels. Konsa and Hause are too raw as well so I'm not looking forward to this. Never thought that I'd want Taylor back in but at least he can defend. We are far too easy to score against and once we concede the first goal, we're done.El Ghazi was a disgrace on saturday and needs to go. Grealish has to be moved in fro the wing.

      Heaton

 Konsa Engels Hause

Elmo Nakamba Luiz Targett

         Grealish
      Wesley Kodja
Surely with 10 minutes preparation we could defend better than Saturday!

That’s was my line up earlier discussing with my lad save as Chester being one of the CB’s
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: hilts_coolerking on December 23, 2019, 08:01:19 PM
It's all about the first goal.  We don't handle adversity very well.  Mind you, we don't handle leading very well either.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: ROBBO on December 23, 2019, 08:16:44 PM
Chester has to be in there to steady the ship, El Ghazi should not even be on the bench, that might shake him up.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: GXVilla on December 23, 2019, 08:25:12 PM
Chester struggled to manage 75 minutes against Liverpool youth team so don’t see him being ready yet unfortunately. I agree that we desperately need his leadership skills so maybe he could cope in the middle of a back 3?
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Steve67 on December 23, 2019, 09:40:34 PM
People talking Chester up must realise that he is not hugely experienced at this level.  Whilst more experienced than most, because we signed a load of foreign players, Chester has only played 60 Prem games.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Pete3206 on December 23, 2019, 10:27:23 PM
1-1
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Luke8 on December 23, 2019, 11:09:20 PM
Is Mings definitely unavailable for this game?

From BBC report he's targeting Watford game for his comeback.

Thanks.

In which case, I think it’s absolutely imperative we don’t just set up as 4-3-3 in the same manner as we have been. It wasn’t exactly solid with Mings, but we are conceding a goal pretty much every half an hour since he got injured.

I think I would go three at the back, probably Konsa, Chester and Hause if all ready and available. Gives us some balance and a bit of pace and leadership back there which we massively miss without Mings. Gives us an additional player to help build from the back and should help make us secure enough to get Jack back centrally. Allows Guilbert and Targett to show the positive side to their game without being overly exposed behind them and also then probably negates the need for wingers/wide forwards as much.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: pauliewalnuts on December 23, 2019, 11:35:03 PM
People talking Chester up must realise that he is not hugely experienced at this level.  Whilst more experienced than most, because we signed a load of foreign players, Chester has only played 60 Prem games.

Only 60 PL games? Way more than Mings.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: pauliewalnuts on December 23, 2019, 11:35:50 PM
Lose this and I think we need to seriously look at changing the manager - that is how bad things will be looking.

It's not just the current league position, it is the momentum, the way things feel like they are heading, and it feels to me like they are getting worse.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Luke8 on December 23, 2019, 11:59:52 PM
Lose this and I think we need to seriously look at changing the manager - that is how bad things will be looking.

It's not just the current league position, it is the momentum, the way things feel like they are heading, and it feels to me like they are getting worse.

Crazy how quick things have changed. Go back just three games ago and things seemed reasonably ok (granted Chelsea outplayed us but we stayed in the game and almost nicked a point). But the Leicester game seems to have absolutely smashed some of the players and, worryingly, the management teams confidence. Combine this with the fact it gave teams the blue print of exactly how best to play against us and it is beginning to look like quite a pivotal moment in our season.

Hopefully Dean Smith can makes the changes necessary for Thursday to help the players out and arrest this mini slump before it goes too far.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: tomd2103 on December 24, 2019, 12:15:13 AM
Is Mings definitely unavailable for this game?

From BBC report he's targeting Watford game for his comeback.

Thanks.

In which case, I think it’s absolutely imperative we don’t just set up as 4-3-3 in the same manner as we have been. It wasn’t exactly solid with Mings, but we are conceding a goal pretty much every half an hour since he got injured.

I think I would go three at the back, probably Konsa, Chester and Hause if all ready and available. Gives us some balance and a bit of pace and leadership back there which we massively miss without Mings. Gives us an additional player to help build from the back and should help make us secure enough to get Jack back centrally. Allows Guilbert and Targett to show the positive side to their game without being overly exposed behind them and also then probably negates the need for wingers/wide forwards as much.

Finally got round to watching the goals from Saturday.  Couldn't see it from the North Stand on the day, but why on earth was El Ghazi marking their centre half who scored the second?  Not exactly the first name that would spring to mind when you want people to be strong in your own box. 

Engels being outpaced for the first goal looks worse on each viewing.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: ROBBO on December 24, 2019, 12:47:01 AM
I watched El Ghazi go up for headers three or four times during the match and he bottled every one and the previous poster was correct why was he marking their centre half?
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Luke8 on December 24, 2019, 07:44:43 AM
I think Smith said that El Ghazi wasn’t supposed to be the one marking him. Was initially McGinn and then after the injury it was supposed to be Luiz but somehow the message didn’t get across. So not a great look for us as a team.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: brentastonb6 on December 24, 2019, 09:54:50 AM
2-0 down at half time. We bring on the three contestants from the half time "Prize Where It Lies" competition, as they show a higher degree of passing ability than anyone in the starting line up. They each score a goal in the second half and we win 3-2.

It sparks a renaissance and we do not lose again for the rest of the season, bringing home the Carabao Cup and our first FA Cup for 63 years.   
Cheered me up no end , then I realised we’d be fielding three ineligible players and the FA would demote us to the Vanarama league 😂
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: passport1 on December 24, 2019, 12:36:49 PM
They are playing good football at the moment and we are not. I think the best we will get is a draw.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: ChicagoLion on December 24, 2019, 12:55:35 PM
Lose this and I think we need to seriously look at changing the manager - that is how bad things will be looking.

It's not just the current league position, it is the momentum, the way things feel like they are heading, and it feels to me like they are getting worse.
I don’t see any way back from 2 home defeats to 2 bottom clubs either.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Luke8 on December 24, 2019, 01:54:13 PM
They are playing good football at the moment and we are not. I think the best we will get is a draw.

Their away record is pretty much as bad as ours, with the added bonus that they barely score any goals. Cue the obvious 0-2...
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Bad English on December 24, 2019, 01:55:01 PM
Message from the Barton's Arms re Boxing Day:
Quote from: The Bartons Arms
For those of you attending the boxing day Championship fixture at Villa Park between Aston Villa FC and Norwich City FC please be aware of our revised Christmas opening times.

The Bartons Arms will open at 11am on Thursday 26th December and will remain open until 6pm with last orders being called at 5:45pm. Please also note that there will be no Thai food offering on this short day. The Restaurant will be closed.

Many Thanks for all your support, loyalty and custom in 2019.

Kob, Wichai, Dave & the rest of the Bartons Arms team.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Nev on December 24, 2019, 01:59:07 PM
Message from the Barton's Arms re Boxing Day:
Quote from: The Bartons Arms
For those of you attending the boxing day Championship fixture at Villa Park between Aston Villa FC and Norwich City FC please be aware of our revised Christmas opening times.

The Bartons Arms will open at 11am on Thursday 26th December and will remain open until 6pm with last orders being called at 5:45pm. Please also note that there will be no Thai food offering on this short day. The Restaurant will be closed.

Many Thanks for all your support, loyalty and custom in 2019.

Kob, Wichai, Dave & the rest of the Bartons Arms team.

Looks like they think we are down already.....
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: LukeJames on December 24, 2019, 02:10:00 PM
2-2

There is no way that we wont conceed atleast 2 but on the basis that I have had a drink, I am now revising this to a 3-2 win.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: JUAN PABLO on December 24, 2019, 02:23:17 PM
People talking Chester up must realise that he is not hugely experienced at this level.  Whilst more experienced than most, because we signed a load of foreign players, Chester has only played 60 Prem games.

Only 60 PL games? Way more than Mings.

probably more than Konsa, engels and Hause put together
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: ChicagoLion on December 24, 2019, 02:28:05 PM
People talking Chester up must realise that he is not hugely experienced at this level.  Whilst more experienced than most, because we signed a load of foreign players, Chester has only played 60 Prem games.

Only 60 PL games? Way more than Mings.

probably more than Konsa, engels and Hause put together
If Chester is fit enough and ready he should play.
We really need some sense leadership out there on Boxing Day, nerves are going to be shredded.
I am nervous just thinking about it, it is such an important game.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: baddowvillans on December 24, 2019, 03:10:32 PM
Playing one of only two teams below you at home -. I don't think they can come more "must win" than that can they?
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Damo70 on December 24, 2019, 03:38:51 PM
2-1 Villa. We have scored five more goals than Norwich this season and conceded four less. Their goal difference is minus eighteen to our minus nine. We need to win this one because the next game away to Watford is looking more difficult than it appeared a couple of weeks back.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Toronto Villa on December 24, 2019, 04:03:47 PM
I'll stick my neck out and suggest Dean will put Jack in the middle and Kodjia up top in something radically different caused by injuries and circumstance and much improved performance and win. Because the alternative pushes him closer to the door. And I hope he realizes we all want him to do well and stay but he has to evolve. Lampard changed his system and outcoached Mourinho. If it's good enough for a very new manager like Lampard then it shouldn't be beyond Dean Smith vs Norwich.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: john2710 on December 24, 2019, 04:34:18 PM
I don't understand the desperation to get Grealish moved back into midfield. He's scored & created goals since he moved. Prior to that he had done very very little.

Our problems are at the back & midfield where we are far too lightweight & show little energy.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Steve67 on December 24, 2019, 04:46:17 PM
Just man the fuck up and win the game Villa.  Concentrate, be strong, compete.  It's all we ask of you.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: aj2k77 on December 24, 2019, 04:58:06 PM
Can none of these fucking muppets gift the opposition a goal either!
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: SoccerHQ on December 24, 2019, 06:18:37 PM
I think Smith said that El Ghazi wasn’t supposed to be the one marking him. Was initially McGinn and then after the injury it was supposed to be Luiz but somehow the message didn’t get across. So not a great look for us as a team.

This is more weakness of game management for me. How can simple messages like who to mark at corners not be understood by those on the pitch? Really schoolboy stuff like seemingly thinking a player who strained a hamstring could actually play on in the match.

It's costing us goals so those on the bench need to shape up aswell.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Villafirst on December 24, 2019, 07:06:43 PM
Need to be well and truly up for the fight. About time these players stood up to a battle for once! Too many went into hiding last Saturday......show some bottle!!
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Toronto Villa on December 24, 2019, 10:38:37 PM
The Norwich press conference has filled me with nothing other than immense concern that not a thing will change in terms of how we approach the game. Now I'm sure he isn't there to divulge his plans but making the point we beat Liverpool U9's in between 4 league wins shows me that he is clutching at straws. We haven't played well in large part because the tactics we have employed have been dreadful and the players either don't know what the fuck they are doing or don't believe in what they are doing. I am hoping that Dean Smith has taken a long hard look in the mirror since Southampton and realized he is a huge part of the problem abd if he doesn't evolve quickly as a manager he will be out of a job.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: brontebilly on December 25, 2019, 12:00:26 AM
Chester struggled to manage 75 minutes against Liverpool youth team so don’t see him being ready yet unfortunately. I agree that we desperately need his leadership skills so maybe he could cope in the middle of a back 3?

Didn't he play at Hull on the right side of the three? If any way fit he needs to come in. That team collapsed like a deck of cards last time out. A new captain and formation would send the right message. I expect neither though.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: tomd2103 on December 25, 2019, 01:18:19 AM
Chester struggled to manage 75 minutes against Liverpool youth team so don’t see him being ready yet unfortunately. I agree that we desperately need his leadership skills so maybe he could cope in the middle of a back 3?

Didn't he play at Hull on the right side of the three? If any way fit he needs to come in. That team collapsed like a deck of cards last time out. A new captain and formation would send the right message. I expect neither though.

Always played on the right of the three for Wales when they played that formation.  Depending on how you play it, you either tend to put the biggest lump in the middle of the three with more mobile players either side, or its more of a sweeper role for someone decent on the ball (ie Southgate under Little and Gregory).
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: wittonwarrior on December 25, 2019, 04:59:12 AM
2-2 and we all trudge off home hands in heads
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: ROBBO on December 25, 2019, 05:56:10 AM
The fundamental need is to pick players who will give their all and not drop their heads that's why if he picks El Ghazi I will give up on Smith totally. I would be tempted to play Hause as defensive midfield as he will put a tackle in and he has strength to go with it. Up front if he plays Wesley he has to have Kodja with him that or Kodja by himself and hope he can rediscover his form.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: postal on December 25, 2019, 07:51:44 AM
2-2 and we all trudge off home hands in heads

This suggests we will score 2 goals, in the same game, here's hoping!  :D a long range screamer from Luiz will be nice
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Des Little on December 25, 2019, 11:03:10 AM
Play two up front, drop AEG and make sure we don’t concede straight after half time and this one’s in the bag. Simples!
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: hilts_coolerking on December 25, 2019, 11:47:15 PM
I would be tempted to play Hause as defensive midfield as he will put a tackle in and he has strength to go with it.
That reminds me of when Keegan played Southgate in midfield against Germany.  It didn't work.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: adrenachrome on December 26, 2019, 12:42:38 AM
I would be tempted to play Hause as defensive midfield as he will put a tackle in and he has strength to go with it.
That reminds me of when Keegan played Southgate in midfield against Germany.  It didn't work.

It didn't, but he was a midfield player when he came to us from Palace.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Scamps180 on December 26, 2019, 03:50:00 AM
Think I would shake it up a bit.
                        Heaton

            Chester  Engles  Hause
Elmo                                            Target
                        Nakamba
      Freddy.                        Hourihane
                           Jack

                          Kodjia

I would put Freddy in midfield as he's got a tackle in him and great energy,

Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: JD on December 26, 2019, 05:04:23 AM
Just bloody win Villa, any win will do me.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Nev on December 26, 2019, 07:15:54 AM
3-1
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: brian green on December 26, 2019, 07:48:06 AM
Southgate was a bang average midfielder when he came to us.  I saw Stan Lynn played at centre forward.  That did not work either.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Abbeyfealeavfc on December 26, 2019, 08:04:45 AM
Come on Villa boys!! A win and good performance needed. UTV! Happy Christmas!
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Mossie Hennebry on December 26, 2019, 08:37:45 AM
Think I would shake it up a bit.
                        Heaton

            Chester  Engles  Hause
Elmo                                            Target
                        Nakamba
      Freddy.                        Hourihane
                           Jack

                          Kodjia

I would put Freddy in midfield as he's got a tackle in him and great energy,
I think this would turn into 5 at the back and we would just be inviting them onto us for 90 mins. In other words, we would get the mother and father of all hammerings.

If there are any deviations from the normal starting 11, I think he'll drop Wes for Kodj, but that will be it.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Rigadon on December 26, 2019, 08:42:02 AM
Feels very much like a sink or swim moment for Smith.   I really hope he comes through it. 

I wonder how brittle the teams confidence actually is at present.  No Mings, No McGinn.  I'd probably take a draw but by God we need a win.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: brontebilly on December 26, 2019, 08:59:25 AM
Think I would shake it up a bit.
                        Heaton

            Chester  Engles  Hause
Elmo                                            Target
                        Nakamba
      Freddy.                        Hourihane
                           Jack

                          Kodjia

I would put Freddy in midfield as he's got a tackle in him and great energy,

Elmo and Freddy down our right flank is about as negative as it gets.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: dorsetvillian on December 26, 2019, 09:28:07 AM
Just setting out for Villa Park. Hopefully things will turn for the better today. Safe journey everyone.UTV
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Clampy on December 26, 2019, 09:33:33 AM
He needs to change it, it needs freshening up as it's become far too predictable of late. Bring in Kodjia and Tresquet as a front two, Grealish through the middle with Luiz, Nakamba and Hourihane behind him. Not sure if that leaves us too open mind. I think he'll stick with Wesley though simply because of the two he got against them earlier in the season. We need to get the first goal otherwise the heads will drop again.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: john e on December 26, 2019, 10:06:09 AM
Without doubt this is the most important game for us since the last one
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Axl Rose on December 26, 2019, 10:13:02 AM
Smash them, Villa!
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: PaulWinch again on December 26, 2019, 10:18:56 AM
Change something Dean please.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: AlexAlexCropley on December 26, 2019, 10:44:27 AM
A wild 5-1 season's greetings goal-fest
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: thick_mike on December 26, 2019, 10:45:15 AM
Brother-in-law can’t go today, so I bagged his season tickets and will be taking my dad to the game today.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: BoVillan esq on December 26, 2019, 10:53:05 AM
We have to win this, 2-1 Villa, at very least this is the one game over the Christmas period we must win, it won't get any easier from here.

Come on Villa, Deano!!!!, do something.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: RamboandBruno on December 26, 2019, 10:55:09 AM
Just reading the interview with Smith in the bham mail online & he seems to me to be implying that two up top didn’t yield anything in the last 30 mins against a Southampton team that was cruising by then. Might be wrong but that makes me think he still play the same system. Hopefully he’ll at least tweak things.

Hopefully jack in the middle, give Kodjia 60 mins up front to see how he gets on, id probs go with midfield of Nakamba, Luiz, Hourihane (for set piece threat only), jack and give Trez a go, despite his truly wasteful free kick with 10 mins to go on Saturday. El Ghazi can’t be anywhere near after Saturday.

Not sure how our back line will cope with Pukki 🥺 gonna be an anxiety fuelled trip to VP
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: ChicagoLion on December 26, 2019, 11:37:25 AM
Without doubt this is the most important game for us since the last one
It’s more important be because we lost the last one.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: ADVILLAFAN on December 26, 2019, 12:17:30 PM
Just win baby
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Clark W Griswold on December 26, 2019, 12:25:28 PM
I actually have a hunch we’ll win, with no real reason to do so.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: pauliewalnuts on December 26, 2019, 12:32:06 PM
With the exception of a replacement for McGinn, I fear we’ll see the same starting line up as last time which means zero points.

We need to try something different.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Steve67 on December 26, 2019, 12:33:07 PM
How about, no late Christmas presents from our defence, no Christmas cheer from our really hard working midfield and a lack of benevolence from our centre forward?  Would be nice.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: postal on December 26, 2019, 12:51:56 PM
Basics lesson 1:
Score more than them
Hassle, and just want the ball than them
Don't concede straight from the kick off, from either start of a half
Work hard and look for chances ( thats you Wesley if you realise that you might start earning your money)
If someone along with Jack, could score?

And please win, not only for the 3 points, but also my other half and her family, and also my brother are Norwich fans.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: Roysmert on December 26, 2019, 12:57:55 PM
The brilliant Richard Hawley likes us the Villa - https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/50856019 (https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/50856019)

Richard's prediction: Both of these teams came up from the Championship last season, and they are both struggling. This is a no-brainer for me, though, because my drummer Dean Beresford is a massive Villa fan, and his granddad Joe Beresford played for them from 1927 to 1934. He is in the process of writing a book about him at the moment and the stories are legend.

So, if I don't say Villa are going to win, I might end up without a drummer. In any case I have always had a secret liking of Villa because of their claret and blue colours. I think that goes to the 1970s because I can always picture Andy Gray in their kit. 2-0.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: PaulTheVillan on December 26, 2019, 01:37:40 PM
I think Smith will make some big changes today. A must win game, if there ever were one.
Title: Re: Aston Villa v Norwich Pre Match Thread
Post by: SamTheMouse on December 26, 2019, 02:05:42 PM
I think Smith will make some big changes today. A must win game, if there ever were one.

Think again!
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