Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: Loxton01 on February 01, 2016, 04:43:59 PM
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So after waving the white flag of surrender in January it is time to start planning for the Championship. I am sure Garde is underway with this but who would everyone keep and who would go.
GO
Guzan - confidence shot and needs to be moved on
Siegrist - not broken through and unlikely too
Richards - likely to generate a fee and a high wage earner
Lescott - aging and a high wage earner
Richardson - out of contract - lets learn and not renew it
NZog - out of contract - complete an utter disaster
Lewis Kinsella - out of contract - possible renew but would suggest they wont
Janoi Donacien - read Kinsella above
Callum Robinson - not good enough - release as in last year of deal
GET RID IF WE CAN FIND A BUYER
Gabby - needs to leave big wage earner - has ridden the gravy train long enough
Gestede - if they are not going to play to his strengths have to try and find a taker
Clark/Baker - have been at the club too long - if we can find a buyer let go
Westwood - not good enough
Bacuna - as Westwood
Sinclair - the new Downing - gutless goes missing when the chips are down
KEEP
Bunn - no 2
Cissokho/Amavi - decent LBs - will they want to stay
Okore - one of the key spine players
Hutton - keep him last year of deal, may make mistakes but least he has a go
Gardner - has to be given the chance
Sanchez - just survives
Gana
Veretout
Lyden
Joe Bennett - deserves a run can cross a ball at the very least
Kozak
Ayew
Grealish
Traore
Ive probably forgotten a few but ive got 15 players that's its - scary, so much money pissed down the drain. Of the 14 can see a few going like Ayew/Amavi.
Its frightening but I think its the only way - clean the decks and start again
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Keep:
Veretout
Ayew
Traore
Okore
Amavi
Get rid:
Everyone else
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Keep: Bunn (backup and deserves his place),
Okore
Amavi
Veretout
Gil
Adama
Jack
Ayew
Gestede (championship is more his bag)
Rest can all leave and be replaced imo
Realistically though - Ayew, Adama, Veretout will all want out
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so we're fucked even before a ball is kicked? I can't cheerlead for doom in such a big way - to corrupt Arnie We'll be back!
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You know there isn't a single player I'd lose sleep over. I'm more bothered about us getting a new owner.
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Keep:
Veretout
Ayew
Traore
Okore
Amavi
Get rid:
Everyone else
about right
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Keep:
Veretout
Ayew
Traore
Okore
Amavi
Get rid:
Everyone else
& a move to Salford Stadium & the Power League
Don't rule anything out with Lerner.
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Get rid of the fecking lot of them and good riddance!
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Keep because they're good enough
Okore
Keep because they might be good enough for the premiership long term (but done nothing to prove it)
Grealish
Traore
Amavi
Lyden
Gardener - at a push
Keep because they might do a job in the championship & get us promoted but would then need to be got rid of
Hutton
Gestede
Lescott
Gabby?
The rest are either not good enough or certainly not so good that they must be held onto at all costs
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I honestly wouldn't be bothered by any losses. For all the bright sparks of an Ayew or a Veretout I don't think either are particularly special.
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Get rid of the fecking lot of them and good riddance!
after the board
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Keep:
Veretout
Ayew
Traore
Okore
Amavi
Get rid:
Everyone else
about right
agree
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Keep:
Veretout
Ayew
Traore
Okore
Amavi
Get rid:
Everyone else
About right.
This.
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GK: New Signing, Steer
Full-backs: New Signing, Amavi, New Signing, Cissokho
Centre-halfs: Okore, Lescott, Clark, Donacien
Midfield: Veretout, Gana, 2 new signings, Lyden, Gardner
Advanced midfield: New signing, Traore, Grealish, Gil
Strikers: Ayew, 2 new signings, Robinson, Hepburn-Murphy/Sellars
Just the 8 new signings then. Unless any of the above go as well, which they probably will.
It's a goodbye from me to Guzan, Bunn, Hutton, Bacuna, Richards, Baker, Bennett, Richardson, Sanchez, N'Zogbia, Sinclair, Agbonlahor, Westwood, Kozak , Siegrist, Crespo and Gestede.
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Get rid of the fecking lot of them and good riddance!
This. :)
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Baker back as Captain next season. He has the attitude needed.
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Baker back as Captain next season. He has the attitude needed.
Baker is a Championship player. We need better than that. He'll do a job, granted but we want to come back up, not stay there. Clark ditto.
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Which player would we keep is a silly question. We ,the club, have no choice in this as we can not get rid of players unless they want to go.
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Sign 5-6 decent pros who will run themselves into the ground and who can be relied upon. Of which we need a solid spine and most definitely someone who can score goals.
Keep:
Bunn, Okore, Clark (good back up at that level), Baker (as Clark), Westwood (only just and as a squaddie), Amavi, Troare, Grealish (must deliver), Kozak, Gestede.
Maybe: Gana, Sanchez, Lescott (for a year. No extension), Gardner, Steer.
Want to keep but will probably go: Veretout, Ayew.
Fuck off: Everyone else.
Elevate 4-5 youngsters into the squad and integrate them into the side over the season. Loan out a few more until Jan and evaluate their ability to step up if needs be at that point. See what Sellars, Green, Ian Rush Audrey Hebpurn Eddie Murphy, Lyden, Kinsella etc can do. Give em a go. City had a 19 year old banging in a bloody hattrick against us.
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So after waving the white flag of surrender in January it is time to start planning for the Championship. I am sure Garde is underway with this but who would everyone keep and who would go.
GO
Guzan - confidence shot and needs to be moved on
Siegrist - not broken through and unlikely too
Richards - likely to generate a fee and a high wage earner
Lescott - aging and a high wage earner
Richardson - out of contract - lets learn and not renew it
NZog - out of contract - complete an utter disaster
Lewis Kinsella - out of contract - possible renew but would suggest they wont
Janoi Donacien - read Kinsella above
Callum Robinson - not good enough - release as in last year of deal
GET RID IF WE CAN FIND A BUYER
Gabby - needs to leave big wage earner - has ridden the gravy train long enough
Gestede - if they are not going to play to his strengths have to try and find a taker
Clark/Baker - have been at the club too long - if we can find a buyer let go
Westwood - not good enough
Bacuna - as Westwood
Sinclair - the new Downing - gutless goes missing when the chips are down
KEEP
Bunn - no 2
Cissokho/Amavi - decent LBs - will they want to stay
Okore - one of the key spine players
Hutton - keep him last year of deal, may make mistakes but least he has a go
Gardner - has to be given the chance
Sanchez - just survives
Gana
Veretout
Lyden
Joe Bennett - deserves a run can cross a ball at the very least
Kozak
Ayew
Grealish
Traore
Ive probably forgotten a few but ive got 15 players that's its - scary, so much money pissed down the drain. Of the 14 can see a few going like Ayew/Amavi.
Its frightening but I think its the only way - clean the decks and start again
Looks about right but I would be getting rid of Hutton as well. Might be tempted to keep Robinson for another year and give him a chance. With your list of 'get rid if we can find a buyer', a lot will depend on relegation clauses in contracts. It may be that at lower wages we can get rid easier as they may not want to sit around seeing out contracts.
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GK: New Signing, Steer
Full-backs: New Signing, Amavi, New Signing, Cissokho
Centre-halfs: Okore, Lescott, Clark, Donacien
Midfield: Veretout, Gana, 2 new signings, Lyden, Gardner
Advanced midfield: New signing, Traore, Grealish, Gil
Strikers: Ayew, 2 new signings, Robinson, Hepburn-Murphy/Sellars
Just the 8 new signings then. Unless any of the above go as well, which they probably will.
It's a goodbye from me to Guzan, Bunn, Hutton, Bacuna, Richards, Baker, Bennett, Richardson, Sanchez, N'Zogbia, Sinclair, Agbonlahor, Westwood, Kozak , Siegrist, Crespo and Gestede.
This is how I see it.
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Got to be looking at which players in the Championship should we be targeting straight away.
McCormack - 15 goals and 6 assists already this season
Judge at Brentford
Daniel Johnson from Preston
These are the sort of players performing really well in that division. If we want to come up we keep what we are left with, fight to keep Veretout, Amavi and Okore, and the rest see what stays. Ayew will get bought anyway.
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Assuming Lerners austerity will continue (and I now think it will) I would keep as many of our current players as possible. We are not going to be buying players of higher quality any time soon.
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No point speculating who to keep, who will want to stay here?
Besides, anything of any value will no doubt be sold.
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Who to keep, change that to which shite cant we get rid off. I do not see one player in the current squad apart from Richards that we paid no fee for, that we will get what we paid for them back.
Anyone going to give us 9 mill for Gestede, 7 mill for Kozak, maybe only Okore would fetch a profit, we will lose money on Veretout, Ayew, Ghana, but Hollis will only look at what he can save on wages, big yard sale at yard sale prices too.
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Ayew will go for at least what we paid. Veretout and Gueye will be kept unless we got our money back for at least one season I bet. Their wages are not that high. Gestede cost 6m and I bet a few championship clubs would pay it but he should be kept for that league.
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Christ I was depressed about this season..now I'm depressed about next season already...just when you think it can't get any worse.
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We are so short of quality it is untrue. We have a mismatch of a squad that has been thrown together by a number of different managers with no coherent style of play.
You might as well get rid of the lot and start again.
For the record I would try and keep Okore, Veretout, Ayew and Amavi. Gana maybe. I'd keep Gestede if we suddenly decided to play with out and out wingers who crossed the ball, I might keep Gestede. Might.
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ozzjim, why will Ayew go for at least what we paid for him, if you are going by his goals record he has not been an outstanding success, he will also be one year less on his contract, plus we are not aware of what clauses are in his contract due to relegation. The same will go for Veretout and Ghana.
Please name me the club who would pay 6 million for Gestede, a player with one good season behind him who now looks completely shot confidence wise disregarding his initial lack of ability and movement they must be lining up around the block to buy him for 6 mill.
There will also be the calculation I am sure by Reg Hollis that the going rate for a championship player will be 20 k a week max, so therefore he will work his socks off to rid the club of any player on more than that guaranteed.
There is not a player at Villa park apart from Okore and as stated Richards because we got him for nowt that would make a penny profit for AVFC, for christ sake this is the club that gave Bent away.
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What we need to try and do is create a good footballing side. Teams full of cloggers don't win or get out of the Championship now, it's an old myth. If we could get a team playing good football and keep our good players we'd be alright. We obviously need to add about 5 players, but retaining our good players is key.
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GK: Bunn New Signing
Right Back - Hutton, New Signing
Centre Backs - Okore, Baker, Clark, New Signing
Left Backs - Amavi, Cissokho
Centre Mid - Gana, Sanchez, Veretout, New Signing, Westwood
Forwards - Ayew, Traore, Gil, Grealsih
Strikers: Gestede, New Signing, Sellars/Hepburn
OUT: Guzan, Richardson, Bacuna, Richards, Bennett, Nzogbia, Gabby, Kozak, Lescott, Sinclair,
5 quality signings who will be first teamers needed
So my starting lineup is
New Signing (GK)
RB(new Signing) Okore CB(New Signing) Amavi
Veretout New Signing Gana
Gil/Traore/Grealish
Ayew New Signing
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Not many, as an aside we released our 25 man squad list. It's only 23 players and includes 4 goal keepers two of which are on loan.
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Guzan - Out
Richards - Out
Lescott - Out
Richardson - Out
NZog - Out
Gabby - Keep
Gestede - Keep
Clark - Keep
Baker - Keep
Westwood - Keep
Bacuna - Out
Sinclair - Out
Bunn - Keep
Cissokho - Out
Amavi - Keep
Okore - Keep
Hutton - Keep
Gardner - Out
Sanchez - Out
Gana - Out
Veretout - Keep
Kozak - Out
Ayew - Keep
Grealish - Keep
Traore - Keep
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Guzan - Out
Richards - Out
Lescott - Out
Richardson - Out
NZog - Out
Gabby - Keep Out to reduce wage bil
Gestede - Keep Out if we could get half back on what we paid for him
Clark - Keep
Baker - Keep neither Clark or Baker should be first choice and both play same position therefore one should go - Out
Westwood - Keep Out - he is not going to improve and I do not think he will influence in the Championship. Free up space in squad
Bacuna - Out
Sinclair - Out
Bunn - Keep
Cissokho - Out Keep - usefull back up for Amavi
Amavi - Keep
Okore - Keep
Hutton - Keep Out - see Westwood
Gardner - Out Keep - seems as though he has done well at Forest, give him a chance
Sanchez - Out if we can get some money for him, otherwise may be tempted to keep for next season
Gana - Out Keep - I think there is a lot more to come from him
Veretout - Keep
Kozak - Out
Ayew - Keep
Grealish - Keep
Traore - Keep
My thoughts in bold above.
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I think from the present squad I think we could all think of a dozen we would like to see the back of, the reality is only two Richardson and N,Zogbia are out of contract. This leaves us with a dilemma who is going to want players who performed so badly ??? Do we have many in their final year next season I hope there's at least 6we will need players . Nightmare scenario if vast majority of squad remain to see their contracts out.
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I think from the present squad I think we could all think of a dozen we would like to see the back of, the reality is only two Richardson and N,Zogbia are out of contract. This leaves us with a dilemma who is going to want players who performed so badly ??? Do we have many in their final year next season I hope there's at least 6we will need players . Nightmare scenario if vast majority of squad remain to see their contracts out.
I think a lot will depend on if there are relegation clauses in contracts. If so, the wages might be lowered to a point that somebody may be willing to buy them.
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It all well and good saying who we'd keep or let go.
In most cases I don't think the club will have much say.
Suffice to say we'll end up keeping most of the ones 'we' don't want and losing most of the ones who we'd want to keep.
I've has a few rums.
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Ian Rush Audrey Hebpurn Eddie Murphy
Now that's the shirt I'd buy... ;D
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It all well and good saying who we'd keep or let go.
In most cases I don't think the club will have much say.
Suffice to say we'll end up keeping most of the ones 'we' don't want and losing most of the ones who we'd want to keep.
I've has a few rums.
It is very noticeable in the recent upturn in form, Gana, Verretout and Okore are clearly excelling, which I think ultimately will be bad news for us.
Gregg Evans has written 2-3 articles about or in which he is full of praise for Gana and there are starting to be similar praising articles for Veretout. Likewise people are noticing the effect Okore has had on the side.
I think it is going to be a really hard struggle to hold on to any of the 4, including Ayew. I just hope there is room to negotiate a decent profit on them, as we have gone through the pain of them adapting and won't see any benefit unless there is a decent profit. From the 4, I would be disappointed to not see more than £35 million come back in if sold. And that is lowest end.
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apart from Okore they all have reasonably long contracts so I'd like to think we would resist the urge to sell until Summer 2017at least?
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Guzan - Out
Richards - Keep
Lescott - Keep
Richardson - Out
NZog - Out
Gabby - Out
Gestede - Out
Clark - Out
Baker - Out
Westwood - Out
Bacuna - Out
Sinclair - Out
Bunn - Keep
Cissokho - Keep
Amavi - Keep
Okore - Keep
Hutton - Out
Gardner - Keep
Sanchez - Keep
Gana - Keep
Veretout - Keep
Kozak - Out
Ayew - Keep
Grealish - Keep
Traore - Keep
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apart from Okore they all have reasonably long contracts so I'd like to think we would resist the urge to sell until Summer 2017at least?
By which time we're back in the big time and they've grown to love us for who we are.
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It's those contracts that are going to determine what we can do, if we have release clauses based on relegation and or wage reductions based on relegation then it could be a long hard summer with Garde having little influence on who stays and go.
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The ones we will want to keep will the the ones to go.
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New Signing (GK)
RB(new Signing) Okore CB(New Signing) Amavi
Veretout New Signing Gana
Gil/Traore/Grealish
Ayew New Signing
I agree with most of that, though I would keep Lescott as his form has really picked up. Although Gana has done well in the holding role recently, he is still pretty erratic and we could do with a real leader type in there who provides a physical presence. We could do with a similar player to Veretout, but who can attack at pace and preferably take set pieces!! I've read on here that Amavi has played in central midfield before, so maybe it would be worth trying him in that position. Centre forward is a must and should be the best option we can get.
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I would like to keep:
Lescott
Okore
Gana
Ayew
Amavi
Gil
Traore
Richards (going against the grain I know)
I would understand if the club kept:
Bunn
Veretout
Grealish
Cissokho
Many of the others have such a deeply-ingrained losing mentality and a propensity for mistake-making, that I cannot see much benefit in them staying, either for us or for them. However, given they may not all be very marketable and upgrades will not necessarily be forthcoming, it could mean more of them extending their stay.
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I think we will be stripped of 4 or 5 that we won't want to sell. Lescott Okore Cissokho Gana Veretout and Ayew plus maybe Gil will get picked off.
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Bacuna and Westwood are contracted til next decade.
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Given we are dropping down to The Championship I don't particularly want to see wholesale changes to the current squad nor do I believe we need them as I think we are only a keeper, a winger and a striker away from being more than competitive at that level (e.g. automatic promotion or play offs at worst)
Personally would like to see Guzan, Baker, Bennett, Richardson, N'Zgobia, Robinson, Kozak, Sinclair and Sanchez all gone - the rest I'm happy to keep
Realistically the likes of Gana, Ayew, Richards and Lescott will all be gone when we get relegated but would rather they stayed and helped get us out of the mess that they got us in in the first place!
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Keep:
Bunn
Amavi
Cissoko
Clark
Okore
Hutton
Vertout
Gueye
Sanchez
Gardener
Westwood
Lyden
Gil
Grealish
Traore
Ayew
Not certain we'll be able to keep all of them and I doubt we'll be able to shift all of the rest.
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No point speculating who to keep, who will want to stay here?
Besides, anything of any value will no doubt be sold.
Agreed. We cannot be too cavalier about who we get rid of as we're just a small squad. We must hang on to the more honest lads.
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Bacuna and Westwood are contracted til next decade.
Rejoice!
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The club will sell every single player an offer comes in for, which will likely mean we start next season without Ayew, Gana, Sinclair, Richards, Lescott, Okore, Guzan, Grealish, Kozak, Baker, Bennett and Gardner.
That leaves us with a pretty poor team, which I hope we add too but I am not holding my breath. Goodness knows who will be manager, someone like Warnock, Holloway or Pearson most likely.
Can't see things improving until Lerner buggers off, and can't see him taking a low offer. Until then we will be cutting costs to be profitable at whatever level we drop to. I honestly don't think Lerner gives a toss what level that is so long as he doesn't have to put money in again.
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Assume we get relegated
Bunn (as reserve keeper)
Lescott
Okore (though I doubt we can)
Bacuna probably his level
Amavi
Veretout
Ayew
Traore
Kozak
Those under 21 mainly
The rest can go bye bye
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I think we will be stripped of 4 or 5 that we won't want to sell. Lescott Okore Cissokho Gana Veretout and Ayew plus maybe Gil will get picked off.
Well that basically leaves us with virtually no-one of use. It'd only be Amavi, Traore and Grealish I'd definitely want kept other than those. In Grealish's case it's purely hope that he might end up alright.
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The club will sell every single player an offer comes in for, which will likely mean we start next season without Ayew, Gana, Sinclair, Richards, Lescott, Okore, Guzan, Grealish, Kozak, Baker, Bennett and Gardner.
That leaves us with a pretty poor team, which I hope we add too but I am not holding my breath. Goodness knows who will be manager, someone like Warnock, Holloway or Pearson most likely.
Can't see things improving until Lerner buggers off, and can't see him taking a low offer. Until then we will be cutting costs to be profitable at whatever level we drop to. I honestly don't think Lerner gives a toss what level that is so long as he doesn't have to put money in again.
Yup that's about right. As I have said before, it's going to get worse before it gets better. While Lerner remains in charge, we will continue to drop. Frightening times for a once proud institution
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The club will sell every single player an offer comes in for, which will likely mean we start next season without Ayew, Gana, Sinclair, Richards, Lescott, Okore, Guzan, Grealish, Kozak, Baker, Bennett and Gardner.
That leaves us with a pretty poor team, which I hope we add too but I am not holding my breath. Goodness knows who will be manager, someone like Warnock, Holloway or Pearson most likely.
Can't see things improving until Lerner buggers off, and can't see him taking a low offer. Until then we will be cutting costs to be profitable at whatever level we drop to. I honestly don't think Lerner gives a toss what level that is so long as he doesn't have to put money in again.
Yup that's about right. As I have said before, it's going to get worse before it gets better. While Lerner remains in charge, we will continue to drop. Frightening times for a once proud institution
Agree bud, the fat lady is gargling the mouthwash.
I think it's about who will stay and try to bring us back up again ... Gestede MIGHT be ok in the Championship again, and Gabby might run riot at some defences.
But it won't be an easy ride.
It'll be more fun than the perennial relegation flaunting that we've endured since MON went mind.
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On the subject of keep or get rid, my apologies to Loxton
GO
Guzan - Value £7.5m Wages £30,000 per week
Siegrist - £300,000 £5,500 Out of contract end of season
Richards - £8m £50,000
Lescott - £925,000 £45,000
Richardson - £875,000 £22,500 Out of contract end of season
NZog - £3.4m £48,000 Out of contract end of season
Lewis Kinsella - £84,000 £1,500 Out of contract end of season, has contract extension clause
Janoi Donacien - £245,000 £3,000 Out of contract end of season
Callum Robinson - £625,000 £4,000 Out of contract end of season, has contract extension clause
GET RID IF WE CAN FIND A BUYER
Gabby - £ 7m £55,000
Gestede - £ 7.75m £30,000
Clark - £5.5m £30,000
Baker - £ 4.7m £ 25,000
Westwood - £ 7.25m £30,000
Bacuna - £4.9m £25,000
Sinclair - £6.5m £35,000
There are 19 other players out of contract at the end of the season, 8 of whom have extension clauses.
Out of contract players without extension clauses (including those in the GO list),would have a combined value of approximately £5,202,000 and a wage saving of approx. £88,500 per week.
Unfortunately, the players who aren't out of contract would require a combined total of over £ 71m in compensation, just to end their contracts,if we cannot find a buyer.
Sorry everyone, but Lerner aint gonna pay out that much, so apart from the 26 players who are out of contract ,who are mostly U21's and U18's, everyone else in the above lists (Go & Get Rid)will still be here next season.
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Guzan - Value £7.5m
*raises eyebrow quizzically*
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I would like to see us get rid of anyone with a shit attitude or were we are not getting close to value for money. Not being privvy to what goes on behind the scenes I'm not sure but I would suspect Gabby, NZogbia and Guzan would be good to offload, and maybe Sinclair and Grealish if he doesn't shape up quickly. I would suspect that Gana, Richards and Ayew will get offers to stay in the PL, but if our first choice 11 next season is something like;
GK Bunn
RB Hutton
LB Sissoko
CB Lescott
CB Okore
RM Bacuna
CM Westwood
CM Veretout
LM Amavi
AM Gill
CF Gestede
I'd be fairly confident of a return back to the PL. You may scoff at the likes of Westwood, Bacuna and Gestede but I think they'd look good a league down. I'd fancy the game plan to be Bacuna and Amavi whipping balls in from wide with Gill and Veretout breaking forward to join the attacks, and I think we'd be a very solid unit with that line up.
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Guzan - Value £7.5m
*raises eyebrow quizzically*
Values and wages are averages of various football sites on the internet at the start of the season.
From what I can remember, at the start of last season he was valued as more than that by the club.
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You can just remove the 'm' and it's about spot on.
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Other than Richardson and Charles who are out of contract I'd keep the lot,
Keepers: Guzan, Bunn, Steer
Defenders: Hutton, Richards, Amavi, Bennett, Cissokho, Okore, Baker, Clark, Lescott, Crespo
Midfielders: Gardner, Bacuna, Veretout, Westwood, Gana, Sanchez, Gil
Forwards: Gestede, Gabby, Kozak, Sinclair, Ayew
U21s: Jack, Traore
25 seniors plus the kids job done.
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Other than Richardson and Charles who are out of contract I'd keep the lot,
Keepers: Guzan, Bunn, Steer
Defenders: Hutton, Richards, Amavi, Bennett, Cissokho, Okore, Baker, Clark, Lescott, Crespo
Midfielders: Gardner, Bacuna, Veretout, Westwood, Gana, Sanchez, Gil
Forwards: Gestede, Gabby, Kozak, Sinclair, Ayew
U21s: Jack, Traore
25 seniors plus the kids job done.
I might be wrong, but I think the "squad of 25" is a Premier League rule. So another thing that we don't need to worry about.
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If we go down we have to rebuild. If players (young players excepted) are not good enough for the PL now, they are not going to be good enough when we come back up. We are not going to come back stronger keeping players with negative attitudes and lack of fighting quality.
Going down to the Championship gives you the chance to rebuild, we must take it.
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Guzan - Value £7.5m
*raises eyebrow quizzically*
Values and wages are averages of various football sites on the internet at the start of the season.
From what I can remember, at the start of last season he was valued as more than that by the club.
No offence but we'd be lucky to get half the amount for most players you listed with a value.
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Okore
Amavi
Adama
One of Clark/Baker as back up.
One of Bunn/Steer
Hutton
Bacuna
Veretout
Gestede
Ayew
Cissokho
Grealish (if we can sort his head out him and Adama would run riot down there imo)
That's the basis really. I think people like Gana and probably Ayew will push to leave and likes of Richards, Gabby and Lescott will be earning too much so need to be pushed out
Keep a solid core of 12 plus returning loanees like Gardner and Baker who have a full season at that level and add 5-6 new signings and we should be good to go.
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Guzan - Value £7.5m
*raises eyebrow quizzically*
Values and wages are averages of various football sites on the internet at the start of the season.
From what I can remember, at the start of last season he was valued as more than that by the club.
No offence but we'd be lucky to get half the amount for most players you listed with a value.
No offence taken mate. As I said to Dave, the values are what was quoted at the start of the season.
I don't reckon we'd get anywhere near the values, as long as we got something.
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The club will sell every single player an offer comes in for, which will likely mean we start next season without Ayew, Gana, Sinclair, Richards, Lescott, Okore, Guzan, Grealish, Kozak, Baker, Bennett and Gardner.
That leaves us with a pretty poor team, which I hope we add too but I am not holding my breath. Goodness knows who will be manager, someone like Warnock, Holloway or Pearson most likely.
Can't see things improving until Lerner buggers off, and can't see him taking a low offer. Until then we will be cutting costs to be profitable at whatever level we drop to. I honestly don't think Lerner gives a toss what level that is so long as he doesn't have to put money in again.
I thought I was a bit glass half empty, but even at my most pessimistic,I can't conceive of this scenario... I do hope you're wrong.
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I think we will be stripped of 4 or 5 that we won't want to sell. Lescott Okore Cissokho Gana Veretout and Ayew plus maybe Gil will get picked off.
Unfortunately, I also think this is likely, in which case, getting out of the Championship will seem extremely optimistic.
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I'm not overly concerned in who we keep. I just want to hear of, (as I only see televised games), a squad that has some self belief and is able to gain some momentum by winning a few games on the trot. The ever present threat of relegation has sucked all belief out of the team and the club and if relegated that may just be the relief valve we need.
I refuse to think it will turn into an even greater cluster f**k than what has been witnessed the last few years - so that means keeping Garde. He may not have pulled up any trees, but he has managed to demonstrate the attitude, intelligence and stability in his brief tenure with the inherited shambles of a team, that should bring us back up if allowed to chose who to let go and bring in.
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It's conceivable that with a proper striker - someone who has more mobility than a pillar box and a better touch than one - grealish and Traore could be really good in the championship
Ayew could be that man but I think he's too good for that league
Gardner must be worth a try in that league
Keep Amavi and veretout if they'll stay
Keep Gestede as he can clearly score goals in that league
Not bothered about many others
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Brad Guzan
Micah Richards (captain)
Jores Okore
Ciaran Clark
Leandro Bacuna
Scott Sinclair
Gabriel Agbonlahor
Ashley Westwood
Joleon Lescott (vice-captain)
Kieran Richardson
Alan Hutton
Carlos Sánchez
Lewis Kinsella
Libor Kozák
Charles N'Zogbia
Mark Bunn
Jordan Lyden
Rudy Gestede
Aly Cissokho
That leaves
Gueye, Adama, Veretout, Gill, Amavi , Grealish ...... ermmmm
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What the hell has Lyden done to deserve to be got rid of?
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Brad Guzan
Micah Richards (captain)
Scott Sinclair
Gabriel Agbonlahor
Joleon Lescott (vice-captain)
Kieran Richardson
Alan Hutton
Carlos Sánchez
Charles N'Zogbia
Nathan Baker
I've trimmed it down a bit, but don't think Agbonlahor and Hutton will be going anywhere.
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Brad Guzan contract ends 30/06/17
Micah Richards (captain) 30/06/19
Jores Okore 30/06/17
Ciaran Clark 30/06/20
Leandro Bacuna 30/06/20
Scott Sinclair 30/06/19
Gabriel Agbonlahor 30/06/18
Ashley Westwood 30/06/20
Joleon Lescott (vice-captain) 30/06/17
Kieran Richardson 30/06/16
Alan Hutton 30/06/17
Carlos Sánchez 30/06/18
Lewis Kinsella 30/06/16 1year extension option
Libor Kozák 30/06/17
Charles N'Zogbia 30/06/16
Mark Bunn 30/07/17
Jordan Lyden 30/06/17
Rudy Gestede 30/06/20
Aly Cissokho 30/06/18
That leaves
Gueye, Adama, Veretout, Gill, Amavi , Grealish ...... ermmmm
I've added the contract end dates to the above list and although many would agree with your "Get Rid Of " wish list, compensation for ending the contracts early, unfortunately means we're stuck with em.
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There's already a thread for this
http://www.heroesandvillains.info/forumv3/index.php?topic=55484.0
EDIT - Thanks for the merge
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I'd like us to keep the mascot. No one else.
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Brad Guzan contract ends 30/06/17
Micah Richards (captain) 30/06/19
Jores Okore 30/06/17
Ciaran Clark 30/06/20
Leandro Bacuna 30/06/20
Scott Sinclair 30/06/19
Gabriel Agbonlahor 30/06/18
Ashley Westwood 30/06/20
Joleon Lescott (vice-captain) 30/06/17
Kieran Richardson 30/06/16
Alan Hutton 30/06/17
Carlos Sánchez 30/06/18
Lewis Kinsella 30/06/16 1year extension option
Libor Kozák 30/06/17
Charles N'Zogbia 30/06/16
Mark Bunn 30/07/17
Jordan Lyden 30/06/17
Rudy Gestede 30/06/20
Aly Cissokho 30/06/18
That leaves
Gueye, Adama, Veretout, Gill, Amavi , Grealish ...... ermmmm
I've added the contract end dates to the above list and although many would agree with your "Get Rid Of " wish list, compensation for ending the contracts early, unfortunately means we're stuck with em.
This is the most worrying thing I have seen. If we are stuck with the majority of that squad our demise will continue for a very long time.
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Brad Guzan contract ends 30/06/17
Micah Richards (captain) 30/06/19
Jores Okore 30/06/17
Ciaran Clark 30/06/20
Leandro Bacuna 30/06/20
Scott Sinclair 30/06/19
Gabriel Agbonlahor 30/06/18
Ashley Westwood 30/06/20
Joleon Lescott (vice-captain) 30/06/17
Kieran Richardson 30/06/16
Alan Hutton 30/06/17
Carlos Sánchez 30/06/18
Lewis Kinsella 30/06/16 1year extension option
Libor Kozák 30/06/17
Charles N'Zogbia 30/06/16
Mark Bunn 30/07/17
Jordan Lyden 30/06/17
Rudy Gestede 30/06/20
Aly Cissokho 30/06/18
That leaves
Gueye, Adama, Veretout, Gill, Amavi , Grealish ...... ermmmm
I've added the contract end dates to the above list and although many would agree with your "Get Rid Of " wish list, compensation for ending the contracts early, unfortunately means we're stuck with em.
All those out of contract will go. Out of the others I could see there being interest in Guzan and Lescott from the MLS, Sanchez from the South American market and maybe we could hoodwink a couple of the newly promoted teams to take Richards and Sinclair. As for the rest, I agree that we're stuck with them. The length of time Bacuna and Westwood have left on their contracts is staggering.
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Hutton would be one of the first names on my team sheet next year. He's perfect for the championship.
I just don't want him to be our main attacking threat down that side.
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I'd like to keep
DFs: Okore, Amavi
MDs: Traore Gil Grealish
ATs: Sinclair Ayew
Think those 7 would do well as first-teamers in the Championship. Would keep the likes of Hutton, Clark, Westwood and Gestede for the squad. Need to add some steel to allow the skilful players to play.
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Surely Ayew will attract interest from other clubs and Traore will be offloaded due to his pay structure if we go by what has been posted about his contract on here
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I'd want to get rid of the lot but that won't be possible.
Okore was originally one of the ones I'd want to keep but as he only has a year left and he won't sign a new contract, I'd let him go. I'm pretty sure him and Lescott won't play tomorrow due to them being unable to play three games in a week. Neither of them are cut out for the championship grind
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That list just emphasises why we need a manager who can motivate the existing bunch and not hope he brings in his own players because, like it or not, the existing bunch is gonna make up the core of our "championship challenge" next year. Say we sold Ayew for 15m, we may all think that means 15m on replacements, but the reality is its the wage bill that Lerner lives by and until the big earners go it won't be used on new players. You can bet the N'zogbia and richardson salary savings have already been used to off-set the frankly horrific losses we'll make next year.
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I'd like us to keep the mascot. No one else.
Not been the same since he dyed his hair red. He can do one as well.
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that bella could do a job in central midfield. the legs of suit could do with a wash though
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Surely Ayew will attract interest from other clubs and Traore will be offloaded due to his pay structure if we go by what has been posted about his contract on here
Can see someone coming in with a £3m-£4M bid for Ayew...no more than that.
Would anyone match Traore's wages? Especially with his injury record. I doubt it very much.
We're going to have to face it - there will be no firesale of players. The squad that took us down will be (pretty much) the squad that is expected to bring us up. Bring in a new manager, rinse repeat. That will be the mantra.
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Just sell any player who either wants to leave or has a shit attitude. Recoup as much as possible. Go back to basics and let's start developing a young and hungry squad around 2-3 key experienced core players
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optimistic - sacking off the disaffected and those with shitty attitudes would leave us with just the line painting machine.
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Surely Ayew will attract interest from other clubs and Traore will be offloaded due to his pay structure if we go by what has been posted about his contract on here
Can see someone coming in with a £3m-£4M bid for Ayew...no more than that.
Would anyone match Traore's wages? Especially with his injury record. I doubt it very much.
We're going to have to face it - there will be no firesale of players. The squad that took us down will be (pretty much) the squad that is expected to bring us up. Bring in a new manager, rinse repeat. That will be the mantra.
I'll be pretty happy if there isn't a firesale of the likes of Ayew and Adama.
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The way I feel at the moment, which albeit is at a pique of anger, I would be happy to see every one of them leave. I'll probably think it's worthwhile keeping a couple in the cold light of day. But even then it'll be a very limited number.
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Ayew is the only one I would keep and probably the only one we will sell.
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Ayew is the only one I would keep and probably the only one we will sell.
If you were him would you sitck around. He will be gone and who can blame him
The only talent we have
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it's very hard to predict, because we haven't a clue who, if anyone, will attract buyers, but based on Lerner probably wanting to halve the squad to i'd say 22-24ish. 5 of them would be youth players as cover. Another 6 would be players we can't get rid of but could be reserves. In that group possibly
Gabby
Sanchez
Guzan
Bacuna
Gill
Sinclair
That would leave 13 players to be selected from the remaining lot. Based on the likeliness for them to stay and be able to do a job in the championship, I'd have:
Bunn
Lescott
clark
baker
hutton
Westwood
gardner
Grealish
Gestade
4 signings added to that bunch, so that's about 9 out the door either because they are reasonablly likely to attract bids and aren't priced out of a move by their wages
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Right now I hate them all bar Hutton and Amavi.
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it's very hard to predict, because we haven't a clue who, if anyone, will attract buyers, but based on Lerner probably wanting to halve the squad to i'd say 22-24ish. 5 of them would be youth players as cover. Another 6 would be players we can't get rid of but could be reserves. In that group possibly
Gabby
Sanchez
Guzan
Bacuna
Gill
Sinclair
That would leave 13 players to be selected from the remaining lot. Based on the likeliness for them to stay and be able to do a job in the championship, I'd have:
Bunn
Lescott
clark
baker
hutton
Westwood
gardner
Grealish
Gestade
4 signings added to that bunch, so that's about 9 out the door either because they are reasonablly likely to attract bids and aren't priced out of a move by their wages
Why would you keep 3 left sided central defenders? None of them can play any other position.
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It's just a guess OMVF based on who we probably can't offload, and who would be prepared to graft in the Championship. I sure both lists will have names added/deleted come August.
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Bunn
Steer
Clark
Okore
Richards
Donacien? (Don't really know how good he is)
Hutton
Bacuna (Should be a decent midfielder in the Championship)
Bennett (Tell him to eat more and bulk up a bit)
Amavi
Veretout
Gueye
Sanchez
Gardner (Give him a chance)
Traore (If he's ever injury-free he could be quite exciting)
Grealish (Kick up the arse to get him playing well again)
Gil
Gestede
Kozak
Ayew
Players like Ayew, Gil and Richards will probably leave for better things. Players like Guzan, Baker and Gabby have had lots of chances and not been good enough. We will finally be free of N'Zogbia (and Richardson) this season. Think Robinson's contract is up too.
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Bunn
Steer
Clark
Okore
Richards
Donacien? (Don't really know how good he is)
Hutton
Bacuna (Should be a decent midfielder in the Championship)
Bennett (Tell him to eat more and bulk up a bit)
Amavi
Veretout
Gueye
Sanchez
Gardner (Give him a chance)
Traore (If he's ever injury-free he could be quite exciting)
Grealish (Kick up the arse to get him playing well again)
Gil
Gestede
Kozak
Ayew
Players like Ayew, Gil and Richards will probably leave for better things. Players like Guzan, Baker and Gabby have had lots of chances and not been good enough. We will finally be free of N'Zogbia (and Richardson) this season. Think Robinson's contract is up too.
I know realistically we can't get rid of everyone, much as I would like to, but that's retaining virtually the whole current team that's taking us down in ignominious style.
I like Ayew and also Gana in spells. I was not very convinced with Amavi before his injury (apart from some good crosses), but I'm hoping he must be better that what he showed. Gestede can obviously score in the Championship but only with a supply.
We need a team to get us out of the Championship as quickly as possible and then worry about the Premiership if we prove to be so lucky. I am doubtful that faith in the current players would be repaid.
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All the shit, all the can't be arsed twats and all of the ones we won't have much choice to keep should be the ones to go.
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Goalkeepers:
None of them are good enough to start. Maybe keep Bunn or Steer as backup.
Defenders:
Keep: Hutton, Okore, Amavi (if possible). Clark or Baker as a backup.
Midfield:
Keep: Grealish, Gana, Veretout, Traore if we can afford him.
Forwards:
Keep: Gestede - hopefully more effective in the Championship.
Overall, there's no-one other than Grealish that I'd be gutted to lose; and even with Jack it's purely because he's a genuine fan who might still come good.
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Ayew is the only one I would keep and probably the only one we will sell.
If you were him would you sitck around. He will be gone and who can blame him
The only talent we have
A club of Southampton's standard will buy Ayew.
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Anyone who wants to go = keep.
Anyone who wants to stay = go.
Roughly something like that with the odd exception.