Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: olaftab on April 12, 2015, 10:13:10 AM
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OK was trying keep off Ellis but... He is responsible for destroying every Renaissance in our recent history. 1982, 1990, 1993 and 1996 by not being ambitious enough. We could and should have been up there with Man U, Arsenal and Liverpool. I exclude Chelsea and City as they a totally manufactured.
Discuss-
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Nowt to discuss - you've already hit the nail on the head sir.
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Not again ......
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Let's look forward not back. Ellis has been done to death on here many times before.
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I thought it was a joke about an Ellis thread.
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Doug Ellis love Villa and done a lot for the club but he did not achieve enough or go for extra mile. But there are worse owners/chairman. What is done and done. No point looking back.
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Ellis has been done to death on here.
If only ;-)
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Ellis has been done to death on here.
If only ;-)
That made me laugh!
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He's an elderly man so let's just leave him alone. Let's just hope we get decent new owners in the summer.
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He's an elderly man so let's just leave him alone. Let's just hope we get decent new owners in the summer.
What is done is done. Far better than Jack Jones,slightly better than Randy,but nowhere near Fred Rinder and Wiliam McGregor who speak for themselves in the proud history of Aston Villa.
and yes lets hope the new owners have the clubs interests at heart.
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Good idea for an Ellis thread. Maybe we should call this one "Let's win the Cup for Doug".
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Jimmy Greaves gave him the nickname Deadly when they were on a fishing trip and Doug killed a bear with a single bicycle kick to the head.
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Good idea for an Ellis thread. Maybe we should call this one "Let's win the Cup for Doug".
This. As a club we can only be compared with the likes of Coventry, Sheffield Wednesday, Leeds and Wolves, and therefore shouldn't be associated with winning trophies. But Doug deserves a cup for his unwavering commitment to all things claret and blue. Let's do it for uncle Doug!
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Why didn't Barry take the penalty?
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He's an elderly man so let's just leave him alone. Let's just hope we get decent new owners in the summer.
I couldn't agree more, and just how many times now have we done this thread? Go outside, enjoy the sunshine, the Villa beating one of your most hated teams and the thought of Wembley. Dream a little about what it would mean to put a team you hate even more out of the Cup...
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Lets not forget Doug also invented cricket boxes, bubblegum and the female orgasm.
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His contribution to architecture will be remembered long after he is:
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-L6H1wXifKFQ/TasgSxxI34I/AAAAAAAAE6g/k7HSyXhQNK4/s1600/Villa+Park+5-2.jpg)
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Like any chairman, Dougy did some good, he did some bad, but he knew what he was doing. He never quite had the guts to really push us that bit further at times when we had potential to win titles but his love of the club couldn't really be questioned. This wasn't some play thing he got bored of like our current chairman. He left us financially stable, sold us on to someone with bold ideas (though sadly no plan B). He was fairly consistent with his transfer funding. The odd splurge, then he closed the purse a bit. Randy on the hand shat out a lot of money hand over fist and we've been on a shoestring since, and have risked our Top flight status in doing so.
I enjoy seeing Doug when he's at the ground. It wasn't always great under him. He was a pain in the backside at times but we won trophies under him and came close to winning the league a couple of times. There will always be a feeling of "what if?" but by the same token, at least we got close sometimes.
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Leave the old sod alone.
I'm calling for a 'Justice for Doug Day'' where those who are like minded can celebrate all things invented by the old codger.
In all seriouness, the past is the past.
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There is no doubt that Ellis loves the Villa,i even see him at the reserve games,but there is also no doubt he made a good living out of Villa and always put himself first
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Like any chairman, Dougy did some good, he did some bad, but he knew what he was doing. He never quite had the guts to really push us that bit further at times when we had potential to win titles but his love of the club couldn't really be questioned. This wasn't some play thing he got bored of like our current chairman. He left us financially stable, sold us on to someone with bold ideas (though sadly no plan B). He was fairly consistent with his transfer funding. The odd splurge, then he closed the purse a bit. Randy on the hand shat out a lot of money hand over fist and we've been on a shoestring since, and have risked our Top flight status in doing so.
I enjoy seeing Doug when he's at the ground. It wasn't always great under him. He was a pain in the backside at times but we won trophies under him and came close to winning the league a couple of times. There will always be a feeling of "what if?" but by the same token, at least we got close sometimes.
Sorry Tom his "love of the club" can and often has been questioned, and rightly so. There are those of us who believe his only regard for the club was the use it was to him in boosting his own ego and profile. There were worse chairmen around for suer, but he did just enough to maintain the spotlight on himself. No-one who really loved the club would give himself the label "Mr Aston Villa" or name a stand after himself.
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Like any chairman, Dougy did some good, he did some bad, but he knew what he was doing. He never quite had the guts to really push us that bit further at times when we had potential to win titles but his love of the club couldn't really be questioned. This wasn't some play thing he got bored of like our current chairman. He left us financially stable, sold us on to someone with bold ideas (though sadly no plan B). He was fairly consistent with his transfer funding. The odd splurge, then he closed the purse a bit. Randy on the hand shat out a lot of money hand over fist and we've been on a shoestring since, and have risked our Top flight status in doing so.
I enjoy seeing Doug when he's at the ground. It wasn't always great under him. He was a pain in the backside at times but we won trophies under him and came close to winning the league a couple of times. There will always be a feeling of "what if?" but by the same token, at least we got close sometimes.
Sorry Tom his "love of the club" can and often has been questioned, and rightly so. There are those of us who believe his only regard for the club was the use it was to him in boosting his own ego and profile. There were worse chairmen around for suer, but he did just enough to maintain the spotlight on himself. No-one who really loved the club would give himself the label "Mr Aston Villa" or name a stand after himself.
Oh he made a good living out the club and did put his ego first many times. But had he not had a genuine love of the club behind all that, I don't think he'd be coming to games with the regularity he has since departing. If I didn't love the Villa I'd probably have given up watching in the last 4 years.
By the way, if I ever inherit a billion dollars, I apologise in advance for the "Supertom stand."
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A lot of us wanted him gone, he's gone. He obviously lives the club, he still goes to watch them and this was done to death years ago, don't understand why it's been brought up again?
Can we get back to the important stuff like what music should Villa use to run out to, do you think Bendall is responsible for most of the problems at Villa and is Prince Wiliam a Villa fan?
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Can we get back to the important stuff like what music should Villa use to run out to?
Fine, but if anyone says Kasabian I reserve the right to return to the less depressing topic of Doug Ellis.
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Like any chairman, Dougy did some good, he did some bad, but he knew what he was doing. He never quite had the guts to really push us that bit further at times when we had potential to win titles but his love of the club couldn't really be questioned. This wasn't some play thing he got bored of like our current chairman. He left us financially stable, sold us on to someone with bold ideas (though sadly no plan B). He was fairly consistent with his transfer funding. The odd splurge, then he closed the purse a bit. Randy on the hand shat out a lot of money hand over fist and we've been on a shoestring since, and have risked our Top flight status in doing so.
I enjoy seeing Doug when he's at the ground. It wasn't always great under him. He was a pain in the backside at times but we won trophies under him and came close to winning the league a couple of times. There will always be a feeling of "what if?" but by the same token, at least we got close sometimes.
Sorry Tom his "love of the club" can and often has been questioned, and rightly so. There are those of us who believe his only regard for the club was the use it was to him in boosting his own ego and profile. There were worse chairmen around for suer, but he did just enough to maintain the spotlight on himself. No-one who really loved the club would give himself the label "Mr Aston Villa" or name a stand after himself.
1. He didn't.
2 He didn't
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Like any chairman, Dougy did some good, he did some bad, but he knew what he was doing. He never quite had the guts to really push us that bit further at times when we had potential to win titles but his love of the club couldn't really be questioned. This wasn't some play thing he got bored of like our current chairman. He left us financially stable, sold us on to someone with bold ideas (though sadly no plan B). He was fairly consistent with his transfer funding. The odd splurge, then he closed the purse a bit. Randy on the hand shat out a lot of money hand over fist and we've been on a shoestring since, and have risked our Top flight status in doing so.
I enjoy seeing Doug when he's at the ground. It wasn't always great under him. He was a pain in the backside at times but we won trophies under him and came close to winning the league a couple of times. There will always be a feeling of "what if?" but by the same token, at least we got close sometimes.
Sorry Tom his "love of the club" can and often has been questioned, and rightly so. There are those of us who believe his only regard for the club was the use it was to him in boosting his own ego and profile. There were worse chairmen around for suer, but he did just enough to maintain the spotlight on himself. No-one who really loved the club would give himself the label "Mr Aston Villa" or name a stand after himself.
1. He didn't.
2 He didn't
Yes, of course. It was a 'surprise' from his birthday party committee.
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And he of course bent over backwards to stop it...
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Can we get back to the important stuff like what music should Villa use to run out to?
Fine, but if anyone says Kasabian I reserve the right to return to the less depressing topic of Doug Ellis.
Looking through the old thread it's almost inevitable somebody would welcome such a hideous thing, in which case fill your boots.
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He saved the club and brought in Tommy Doc and that's when I started supporting the Villa. Also to play Santos and see Pele at Villa Park was a special night in the dark times of 3 day weeks and power cuts etc.
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He saved the club and brought in Tommy Doc and that's when I started supporting the Villa. Also to play Santos and see Pele at Villa Park was a special night in the dark times of 3 day weeks and power cuts etc.
"He" didn't save anything. He was part of a consortium, the rest of whose names are scandalously forgotten when great Villa men's names are mentioned. .
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I met Doug a couple of years ago at a charity function. I was only there because the person who should have been representing our organisation was ill and I went as a last minute substitute.
I didn't know Doug would be there but as I walked past him he spotted my Villan lapel badge smiled and said "Ah, you're a fellow Villan young man" he then spent about twenty minutes speaking to me about games from the 80's and 90's that I at the spritely age of 66 could barely remember. He was sharp as a pin.
Oh and he has a sense of humour. As we shook hands at the end of our conversation he said don't believe everything you hear about me........I didn't invent the bicycle kick.
There were loads of questions I'd have loved to ask him but I didn't want to appear churlish and it wasn't the time or place.
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One thing's for sure, he'd love this thread.
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Like any chairman, Dougy did some good, he did some bad, but he knew what he was doing. He never quite had the guts to really push us that bit further at times when we had potential to win titles but his love of the club couldn't really be questioned. This wasn't some play thing he got bored of like our current chairman. He left us financially stable, sold us on to someone with bold ideas (though sadly no plan B). He was fairly consistent with his transfer funding. The odd splurge, then he closed the purse a bit. Randy on the hand shat out a lot of money hand over fist and we've been on a shoestring since, and have risked our Top flight status in doing so.
I enjoy seeing Doug when he's at the ground. It wasn't always great under him. He was a pain in the backside at times but we won trophies under him and came close to winning the league a couple of times. There will always be a feeling of "what if?" but by the same token, at least we got close sometimes.
Sorry Tom his "love of the club" can and often has been questioned, and rightly so. There are those of us who believe his only regard for the club was the use it was to him in boosting his own ego and profile. There were worse chairmen around for suer, but he did just enough to maintain the spotlight on himself. No-one who really loved the club would give himself the label "Mr Aston Villa" or name a stand after himself.
Oh he made a good living out the club and did put his ego first many times. But had he not had a genuine love of the club behind all that, I don't think he'd be coming to games with the regularity he has since departing. If I didn't love the Villa I'd probably have given up watching in the last 4 years.
By the way, if I ever inherit a billion dollars, I apologise in advance for the "Supertom stand."
His continued regular attendance keeps him the spotlight - might have something to do with it.
And if you used some of your billion to inject funds into the club instead of paying yourself a handsome salary you'd be quite entitled to name a stand after yourself, and I doubt many would complain.
As for Ron Manager, I can only chuckle that people sill fall for that birthday surprise nonsense.
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I was as anti-Ellis as anybody at the time, but it all just seems slightly pointless to be having a go at him now.
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"His continued regular attendance keeps him in the spotlight" ?
Big deal.
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I'd love to ask him what his username is when he posts on here
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"His continued regular attendance keeps him in the spotlight" ?
Big deal.
Keeps him alive, I'd say.
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"His continued regular attendance keeps him in the spotlight" ?
Big deal.
Keeps him alive, I'd say.
If there's any season that could finish him off it'd be this one.
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I'd love to ask him what his username is when he posts on here
villakicks.
We were very close to signing Altidore and Spearing.
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"His continued regular attendance keeps him in the spotlight" ?
Big deal.
Keeps him alive, I'd say.
If there's any season that could finish him off it'd be this one.
In all seriousness, I honestly believe that without Villa he wouldn't be alive now. For all his money and his fame (if that's the right word) he has nothing else in his life.
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"His continued regular attendance keeps him in the spotlight" ?
Big deal.
Keeps him alive, I'd say.
If there's any season that could finish him off it'd be this one.
In all seriousness, I honestly believe that without Villa he wouldn't be alive now. For all his money and his fame (if that's the right word) he has nothing else in his life.
I'm sure he's got family and friends, Dave. Has he?
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I'm sure he's got family and friends, Dave. Has he?
"His continued regular attendance keeps him in the spotlight" ?
Big deal.
Keeps him alive, I'd say.
If there's any season that could finish him off it'd be this one.
In all seriousness, I honestly believe that without Villa he wouldn't be alive now. For all his money and his fame (if that's the right word) he has nothing else in his life.
I'm sure he's got family and friends, Dave. Has he?
He's got family and people who he would call friends but stories over the years make me think that when he closes the door behind him at Dunsacking he's completely on his own.
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Thanks for
1. helping to save the club in the sixties.
2. not selling to Ray Ranson.
Shame that your lack of conviction / fear of failure stalled the club so many times throughout the 80s and 90s.
As close to unforgivable anything in football can come for
1. the treatment of anyone and anything to do with the 80-82 squad.
2. the fact that we had to have the great unwashed show us how to show Tony Barton's widow compassion and respect.
Done is done, so enjoy your last years and if following the Villa as fan brings meaning and purpose to your life, congratulations, you finally have a semblance of understanding of what it feels like to be a fan.
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"His continued regular attendance keeps him in the spotlight" ?
Big deal.
Keeps him alive, I'd say.
If there's any season that could finish him off it'd be this one.
In all seriousness, I honestly believe that without Villa he wouldn't be alive now. For all his money and his fame (if that's the right word) he has nothing else in his life.
Typical Doug.
Rest of us = Villa take years off our lives
Doug = doubles life span.
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I'm sure he's got family and friends, Dave. Has he?
"His continued regular attendance keeps him in the spotlight" ?
Big deal.
Keeps him alive, I'd say.
If there's any season that could finish him off it'd be this one.
In all seriousness, I honestly believe that without Villa he wouldn't be alive now. For all his money and his fame (if that's the right word) he has nothing else in his life.
I'm sure he's got family and friends, Dave. Has he?
He's got family and people who he would call friends but stories over the years make me think that when he closes the door behind him at Dunsacking he's completely on his own.
Him and the fragrant Heidi, obviously.
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Him and the fragrant Heidi, obviously.
On the organ.
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Him and the fragrant Heidi, obviously.
/quote]
fragrant as in been dead for a few years ?
IIRC, it wasn't a consortium that backed Ellis - just Percy "Kindly call me Pat" Matthews and hi First National Finance Corporation - a dubious enough character to warrant a mention in Private Eye.
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He saved the club and brought in Tommy Doc and that's when I started supporting the Villa. Also to play Santos and see Pele at Villa Park was a special night in the dark times of 3 day weeks and power cuts etc.
"He" didn't save anything. He was part of a consortium, the rest of whose names are scandalously forgotten when great Villa men's names are mentioned. .
Although I tend to disagree with Dave on most things re Doug in this case he is quite correct. Percy 'Pat' Matthews of First National put the board together and brought The Doc to the club. Doug made a song and dance about his glory being stolen but he wanted a media savvy
manager to suit his ego. He got one in the Doc and for a long time Villa Park was a wonderful place to be connected with.
Percy 'Pat' Mathews was the real force behind the takeover. He is largely forgotten now and that is very very wrong.
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He saved the club and brought in Tommy Doc and that's when I started supporting the Villa. Also to play Santos and see Pele at Villa Park was a special night in the dark times of 3 day weeks and power cuts etc.
"He" didn't save anything. He was part of a consortium, the rest of whose names are scandalously forgotten when great Villa men's names are mentioned. .
Although I tend to disagree with Dave on most things re Doug in this case he is quite correct. Percy 'Pat' Matthews of First National put the board together and brought The Doc to the club. Doug made a song and dance about his glory being stolen but he wanted a media savvy
manager to suit his ego. He got one in the Doc and for a long time Villa Park was a wonderful place to be connected with.
Percy 'Pat' Mathews was the real force behind the takeover. He is largely forgotten now and that is very very wrong.
Also Harry Parkes, Harry Kartz, Jim Hartley, Harry Cressman, Roy Ladbrooke and Bob Mackay.
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How are we supposed to remember them though? This is football and we only remember players and managers in reality.
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He saved the club and brought in Tommy Doc and that's when I started supporting the Villa. Also to play Santos and see Pele at Villa Park was a special night in the dark times of 3 day weeks and power cuts etc.
"He" didn't save anything. He was part of a consortium, the rest of whose names are scandalously forgotten when great Villa men's names are mentioned. .
Although I tend to disagree with Dave on most things re Doug in this case he is quite correct. Percy 'Pat' Matthews of First National put the board together and brought The Doc to the club. Doug made a song and dance about his glory being stolen but he wanted a media savvy
manager to suit his ego. He got one in the Doc and for a long time Villa Park was a wonderful place to be connected with.
Percy 'Pat' Mathews was the real force behind the takeover. He is largely forgotten now and that is very very wrong.
Also Harry Parkes, Harry Kartz, Jim Hartley, Harry Cressman, Roy Ladbrooke and Bob Mackay.
To be honest I had forgotten Roy Ladbrooke. What did he do for a living?
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How are we supposed to remember them though? This is football and we only remember players and managers in reality.
Er.. Harry Parkes played for us for about fifteen years at full back!
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159 pages.
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How are we supposed to remember them though? This is football and we only remember players and managers in reality.
Er.. Harry Parkes played for us for about fifteen years at full back!
Well apart from him. Even I remember him.
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"His continued regular attendance keeps him in the spotlight" ?
Big deal.
It was in answer to someone else's point, and within the context of the previous points made, so your response is pointless. Why not ignore it if you think it's so meaningless?
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He saved the club and brought in Tommy Doc and that's when I started supporting the Villa. Also to play Santos and see Pele at Villa Park was a special night in the dark times of 3 day weeks and power cuts etc.
"He" didn't save anything. He was part of a consortium, the rest of whose names are scandalously forgotten when great Villa men's names are mentioned. .
Although I tend to disagree with Dave on most things re Doug in this case he is quite correct. Percy 'Pat' Matthews of First National put the board together and brought The Doc to the club. Doug made a song and dance about his glory being stolen but he wanted a media savvy
manager to suit his ego. He got one in the Doc and for a long time Villa Park was a wonderful place to be connected with.
Percy 'Pat' Mathews was the real force behind the takeover. He is largely forgotten now and that is very very wrong.
Also Harry Parkes, Harry Kartz, Jim Hartley, Harry Cressman, Roy Ladbrooke and Bob Mackay.
To be honest I had forgotten Roy Ladbrooke. What did he do for a living?
No idea. This was back in the days when football clubs were the preserve of small local businessmen so he probably owned a factory or something.
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The neatest epithet for him was Meg of Crossroads. It may have been Pat Murphy who first used it. The scenery shook, the cast forgot their lines, the story lines were unconvincing but the show went on. I never was close to any of his worst stuff but the story my younger son tells about meeting him to plan a series about the Villa youth side and him laying down the law about his role in the series rings very true. My son eventually despaired and went to Newcastle to make the programme. My other son Damon tells the story about how he interfered so much in an interview with Merse that they shot it from two sofas in the centre circle of the pitch. Oh, Herbert, boring you were not.
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He's an elderly man so let's just leave him alone. Let's just hope we get decent new owners in the summer.
I couldn't agree more, and just how many times now have we done this thread? Go outside, enjoy the sunshine, the Villa beating one of your most hated teams and the thought of Wembley. Dream a little about what it would mean to put a team you hate even more out of the Cup...
I didn't realise we had Man Utd in the Semi-Final?
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I've no doubt that Doug is Villa through and through.
Some of the 'Bad' things he did could easily be forgiven, but the one thing I cannot is his, seemingly, resentment of the European Cup winning team which ultimately led to his disgraceful treatment of Tony Barton's widow and the testimonial match for her.
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Are we only on page 4?
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How about a poll ?
Should Doug lead the team out at Wembley in May ?
No, because...............
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Are we only on page 4?
I'm going to keep quoting page references until we get to my prediction.
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Name a chairman that isn't / wasn't a dickhead occasionally ? Chop ellis in half he is claret and blue , I don't get all the pent up anger.
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I suspect it's an age thing. I'm 33 and therefore was not following Villa in the aftermath of the European glory and subsequent demise in the mid 80's when Doug returned. For that reason I do not feel the animosity towards him that so many on here seem to.
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Name a chairman that isn't / wasn't a dickhead occasionally ? Chop ellis in half he is claret and blue , I don't get all the pent up anger.
I'll repeat what I said last time this topic came up. Doug Ellis's greatest achievement was to make some of us think he cares as much about the Villa as we do.
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Can we merge this thread with one about MON?
:)
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Ellis is one of the reasons why we are in our current position. There are many reasons why as a big club, we are where we are now.
After winning the League and European Cup and later in the 90's, if HDE had put the club first, rather than himself and built on the success and courted the media, we could have been one of the clubs that benefitted from the money coming into the game. HDE lacked the vision at the time and was still a 60's/70's businessman at heart. He wanted total control and would not bring in people that could have really pushed the club forward.
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I still remember Graham Taylor's last match at Goodison Park and the Villa support staying behind demanding he come out to take the acclaim of the support and Ellis walking out before retreating when he heard the abuse*.
*Over time this recollection may have altered slightly.
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I suspect it's an age thing. I'm 33 and therefore was not following Villa in the aftermath of the European glory and subsequent demise in the mid 80's when Doug returned. For that reason I do not feel the animosity towards him that so many on here seem to.
I'm the same age and despise the old tosser. We could have been one of the biggest clubs in Europe now had he not spent the whole of the 90s stopping us (and a variety of managers) reaching our full potential.
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Name a chairman that isn't / wasn't a dickhead occasionally ? Chop ellis in half he is claret and blue , I don't get all the pent up anger.
I'll repeat what I said last time this topic came up. Doug Ellis's greatest achievement was to make some of us think he cares as much about the Villa as we do.
I get the impression he isn't on your Christmas card list Dave ;)
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I suspect it's an age thing. I'm 33 and therefore was not following Villa in the aftermath of the European glory and subsequent demise in the mid 80's when Doug returned. For that reason I do not feel the animosity towards him that so many on here seem to.
I'm the same age and despise the old tosser. We could have been one of the biggest clubs in Europe now had he not spent the whole of the 90s stopping us (and a variety of managers) reaching our full potential.
Leeds tried that and for one season almost were the champions of Europe, remind me where they are now.
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yeah it was nice to see doug getting all emotional at white hart lane yesterday
that victory meant a lot to him
god knows how old he is but still drives himself to every match
and he caught a massive fish once
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Doug's a true blue nose so credit to him
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I suspect it's an age thing. I'm 33 and therefore was not following Villa in the aftermath of the European glory and subsequent demise in the mid 80's when Doug returned. For that reason I do not feel the animosity towards him that so many on here seem to.
I'm the same age and despise the old tosser. We could have been one of the biggest clubs in Europe now had he not spent the whole of the 90s stopping us (and a variety of managers) reaching our full potential.
Leeds tried that and for one season almost were the champions of Europe, remind me where they are now.
Yep and so did Arsenal.
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I'm not sure losing a semi-final 3-0 is almost winning a trophy. There's also a big difference between going massively beyond your means like Leeds did and not taking any risks to try and get there which is what we did. There's a decent middle ground there but Ellis never had the balls to go for it.
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I'm not sure losing a semi-final 3-0 is almost winning a trophy. There's also a big difference between going massively beyond your means like Leeds did and not taking any risks to try and get there which is what we did. There's a decent middle ground there but Ellis never had the balls to go for it.
Exactly. Finishing second twice in three seasons then winning the league cup twice in three seasons should have been an excellent opportunity to go on to better things. In Ellis's eyes those relative successes just helped to keep the fans quiet.
Prick.
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Name a chairman that isn't / wasn't a dickhead occasionally ? Chop ellis in half he is claret and blue , I don't get all the pent up anger.
There's a world of difference between being a dickhead and wilfully dismantling a team that had won the highest honours without giving the manager the resources to rebuild.
There's a world of difference between being a dickhead and wilfully refusing to recognise said teams achievements in the subsequent 24 years despite so many opportunities.
There's a world of difference between being a dickhead and wilfully placing the club in a situation where that lot from B9 showed more class and compassion towards Tony Barton's family than we did.
Edit
There's a world of difference between being a dickhead and appointing an obviously under qualified manager to replace Barton to manage the retrenchment that resulted in relegation. It was akin to replacing the tempremental Irishman with Dean Smith at Walsall.
Can you spot the theme yet?
Then just for good measure, throw in his refusal/inability to allow the club to progress at several subsequent points throughout the 90's for god knows what reasons.
Just hypothesising here but options are:
1. He genuinely was so short sighted that he couldn't see the opportunities when they presented themselves.
2. He was too scared to really give it a go.
3. Mid table mediocrity with the occasional good run suited him down to the ground. Maximum ego massage for minimum risk (not to his own fortune I might add) whilst being able to draw a (for the times) enormous salary for the privilege in an era where club chairman didn't draw a salary for functioning as a de facto CEO.
4. He was scared of what might happen to his position / relevance with a truly successful manager.
People may offer up Leeds as an example of how it could go wrong but there were three fundamental differences.
1. They started throwing money at it from comparatively nowhere (they's finished 13th and 11th in the previous 2 seasons) before they really started throwing money at it in '97-98. We're talking about building on teams that were already sniffing around the top.
2. The scale of investment required with half decent management would have been significantly lower
3. The financing of the splurge on players was suicidal.
I'm sure others can thing of more.
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Name a chairman that isn't / wasn't a dickhead occasionally ? Chop ellis in half he is claret and blue , I don't get all the pent up anger.
There's a world of difference between being a dickhead and wilfully dismantling a team that had won the highest honours without giving the manager the resources to rebuild.
There's a world of difference between being a dickhead and wilfully refusing to recognise said teams achievements in the subsequent 24 years despite so many opportunities.
There's a world of difference between being a dickhead and wilfully placing the club in a situation where that lot from B9 showed more class and compassion towards Tony Barton's family than we did.
Edit
There's a world of difference between being a dickhead and appointing an obviously under qualified manager to replace Barton to manage the retrenchment that resulted in relegation. It was akin to replacing the tempremental Irishman with Dean Smith at Walsall.
Can you spot the theme yet?
Then just for good measure, throw in his refusal/inability to allow the club to progress at several subsequent throughout the 90's for god knows what reasons.
Just hypothesising here but options are:
1. He genuinely was so short sighted that he couldn't see the opportunities when they presented themselves.
2. He was too scared to really give it a go.
3. Mid table mediocrity with the occasional good run suited him down to the ground. Maximum ego massage for minimum risk (not to his own fortune I might add) whilst being able to draw a (for the times) enormous salary for the privilege in an era where club chairman didn't draw a salary for functioning as a de facto CEO.
4. He was scared of what might happen to his position / relevance with a truly successful manager.
I'm sure others can thing of more.
Say what you think and don't chicken out, come on!!!
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You can't argue with most of that. The 80's stuff aside, which appears vindictive and probably was, he just got bypassed by the modern era. Whilst he was undeniably a ****** for much of the time he was owner, it still brings a smile to my face seeing him when the cameras zoom in on him at matches these days. My friend on here Chico III tells a very funny story of a late night letter penned with his brother in law to Ellis after copious drink / substances taken. I'd love to see the cameras zoom in on him when Delph is lifting the fa cup in May.
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To me I see the big picture of the whole period of his power at Villa Park as being dominated by self interest. He saw the chance to rise from middling prosperous entrepreneur to, by regional standards, great personal wealth and influence. Villa was far better for him than he was for Villa. The coup which was the sale of shares in the club to fans like me, for him would far outweigh anything achieved on the football field. He comes across as a benign old buffer now and to me he is like the old bloke who likes to go down to the paddock and pat the horse he once won a lot of money on.
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Name a chairman that isn't / wasn't a dickhead occasionally ? Chop ellis in half he is claret and blue , I don't get all the pent up anger.
He spent a number of years on the board at the Sty. Also looked at the possibility of buying Wolves. Would any of us have contemplated that. Chop him in half, and it says Doug Ellis.
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Name a chairman that isn't / wasn't a dickhead occasionally ? Chop ellis in half he is claret and blue , I don't get all the pent up anger.
He spent a number of years on the board at the Sty. Also looked at the possibility of buying Wolves. Would any of us have contemplated that. Chop him in half, and it says Doug Ellis.
He didn't look at, he bought Wolves.
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Blimey, first of all I see the Who’s Who thread cropping up and now a debate on Ellis is raging. It feels as if I feel asleep and have woken up somewhere around 2005, when I was a far more prolific poster.
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I'm no Ellis fan but even at his vintage he can still be arsed to go to VP more than many likeminded egocentrics who fuel them selves posting shit on here for likes.
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Name a chairman that isn't / wasn't a dickhead occasionally ? Chop ellis in half he is claret and blue , I don't get all the pent up anger.
He spent a number of years on the board at the Sty. Also looked at the possibility of buying Wolves. Would any of us have contemplated that. Chop him in half, and it says Doug Ellis.
He didn't look at, he bought Wolves.
Did he make a profit on the sale? Serious question.
Wasn't he involved with Derby as well? Or is that my imagination?
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Name a chairman that isn't / wasn't a dickhead occasionally ? Chop ellis in half he is claret and blue , I don't get all the pent up anger.
He spent a number of years on the board at the Sty. Also looked at the possibility of buying Wolves. Would any of us have contemplated that. Chop him in half, and it says Doug Ellis.
He didn't look at, he bought Wolves.
Did he make a profit on the sale? Serious question.
Wasn't he involved with Derby as well? Or is that my imagination?
He took Wolves into receivership so I doubt he made anything there. He's often mentioned as a director of Derby but I've never seen it confirmed anywhere.
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He saved the club and brought in Tommy Doc and that's when I started supporting the Villa. Also to play Santos and see Pele at Villa Park was a special night in the dark times of 3 day weeks and power cuts etc.
"He" didn't save anything. He was part of a consortium, the rest of whose names are scandalously forgotten when great Villa men's names are mentioned. .
Ive said it before Dave, theres a book in it somewhere, Ellis the Villa years ;)
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I'm no Ellis fan but even at his vintage he can still be arsed to go to VP more than many likeminded egocentrics who fuel them selves posting shit on here for likes.
Guilty as charged.
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I'm no Ellis fan but even at his vintage he can still be arsed to go to VP more than many likeminded egocentrics who fuel them selves posting shit on here for likes.
Guilty as charged.
I must have missed the bit where this site had a "like" function. Can someone show me how to use it?
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I'm no Ellis fan but even at his vintage he can still be arsed to go to VP more than many likeminded egocentrics who fuel them selves posting shit on here for likes.
Guilty as charged.
I must have missed the bit where this site had a "like" function. Can someone show me how to use it?
I misread and thought it said "licks". I only do stuff for licks.
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Deadly took over the Champions of Europe and 2 and half decades later left with us struggling for cash in the lower reaches of the division and selling a car park to keep the books balanced. Whatever your opinion of him that is shit leadership.
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I'm no Ellis fan but even at his vintage he can still be arsed to go to VP more than many likeminded egocentrics who fuel them selves posting shit on here for likes.
Guilty as charged.
I must have missed the bit where this site had a "like" function. Can someone show me how to use it?
I misread and thought it said "licks". I only do stuff for licks.
*slurp*
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I'm no Ellis fan but even at his vintage he can still be arsed to go to VP more than many likeminded egocentrics who fuel them selves posting shit on here for likes.
It's pretty easy to do when you have millions in the bank, it's free and you have fuck all else in your life.
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I'm no Ellis fan but even at his vintage he can still be arsed to go to VP more than many likeminded egocentrics who fuel them selves posting shit on here for likes.
It's pretty easy to do when you have millions in the bank, it's free and you have fuck all else in your life.
I'm not sure what this "he's got fuck all else to do in his life" thing is all about. That could be said about any of us who watch the Villa regularly.
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I'm no Ellis fan but even at his vintage he can still be arsed to go to VP more than many likeminded egocentrics who fuel them selves posting shit on here for likes.
It's pretty easy to do when you have millions in the bank, it's free and you have fuck all else in your life.
Surely with millions in the bank he could have plenty of alternative pastimes in his life if he so wished.
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Once again, it's all about ego and survival for Ellis. Villa gives him a purpose and a spotlight, and I suspect that's all he's interested in now he's made his money.
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I'm no Ellis fan but even at his vintage he can still be arsed to go to VP more than many likeminded egocentrics who fuel them selves posting shit on here for likes.
It's pretty easy to do when you have millions in the bank, it's free and you have fuck all else in your life.
Surely with millions in the bank he could have plenty of alternative pastimes in his life if he so wished.
Not many where he will be the centre of attention like he is in the directors box for a couple of hours a week.
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Well,on Sunday Mr Lerner will be making an appearance we are told. Bet the camera's on Doug though..... and Gerrard of course!
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Well,on Sunday Mr Lerner will be making an appearance we are told. Bet the camera's on Doug though..... and Gerrard of course!
Why should the camera be on Lerner? It'll only be his second game of the season!
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Well,on Sunday Mr Lerner will be making an appearance we are told. Bet the camera's on Doug though..... and Gerrard of course!
Why should the camera be on Lerner? It'll only be his second game of the season!
Oh fuck, don't tell sillhillvilla, he'll go ballistic that somebody who has only been to one game this season will get a better seat than him.
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Brian Green, you summed up Ellis exactly for me.
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Ellis was a creature of his time, he used the Villa for his own gains, both as an ego booster and a financial money maker for himself, but the old fella as Dave said probably has nothing else to do and going down the Villa gives him a reason to get up each day.
There were alot of dodgy characters running clubs all through his both periods at the club, and typical Villa, we could have done alot better, but we also could have done alot worse than the Ego has landed.
On a personal note, I was in the navy down in the Falklands at the time of our greatest victory and my family had written to Villa, saying where I was and how gutted I was that I would miss the match, later I got a personal letter from the club and an invite to have my photo taken with the cup on my return, something I still have to this day. Ellis was not there then and I do wonder if the same treatment from Villa would have been given if he had.
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Ellis was a creature of his time, he used the Villa for his own gains, both as an ego booster and a financial money maker for himself, but the old fella as Dave said probably has nothing else to do and going down the Villa gives him a reason to get up each day.
There were alot of dodgy characters running clubs all through his both periods at the club, and typical Villa, we could have done alot better, but we also could have done alot worse than the Ego has landed.
On a personal note, I was in the navy down in the Falklands at the time of our greatest victory and my family had written to Villa, saying where I was and how gutted I was that I would miss the match, later I got a personal letter from the club and an invite to have my photo taken with the cup on my return, something I still have to this day. Ellis was not there then and I do wonder if the same treatment from Villa would have been given if he had.
At the same time as this I was a cadet in the merchant navy, our company had two tankers supporting the air force for jet fuel and I requested an assignment on one of the ships - my company replied that they did not send cadets into war zones while I pointed out to them I lived in a war zone when at home, (Belfast at the time) - never did get the gig :-(
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Once again, it's all about ego and survival for Ellis. Villa gives him a purpose and a spotlight, and I suspect that's all he's interested in now he's made his money.
Doug had made his money before the revolution at Villa Park in the late sixties. Nothing wrong in Aston Villa 'giving him a purpose' it has always given me a purpose as well....and most who post on here I should think!
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Once again, it's all about ego and survival for Ellis. Villa gives him a purpose and a spotlight, and I suspect that's all he's interested in now he's made his money.
Doug had made his money before the revolution at Villa Park in the late sixties. Nothing wrong in Aston Villa 'giving him a purpose' it has always given me a purpose as well....and most who post on here I should think!
Of course, he'd already made his money, so there was no real need for him to be the first club director to pay himself a salary, there was no real need for him to rake in huge shareholder dividends from the club, there was no real need for him to float the club on the stock market netting him further millions, or to make as much as he could from selling the club, because he'd already made all the money he could possibly need.
When I talk about purpose, I'm talking about reasons to keep on living. I couldn't give a hoot whether he attends matches or not, but don't make out it's in any way a demonstration of his undying service to the club, any more than the bloke who has to pay his own way - at ridiculous prices - week in, week out.
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I'm no Ellis fan but even at his vintage he can still be arsed to go to VP more than many likeminded egocentrics who fuel them selves posting shit on here for likes.
It's pretty easy to do when you have millions in the bank, it's free and you have fuck all else in your life.
I wouldn't say he has nothing else to do. I know some keen fishermen and that is very time consuming. Then add to that all his work for charidee and trying to invent another new football kick. Doesn't he run the NHS as well?
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Once again, it's all about ego and survival for Ellis. Villa gives him a purpose and a spotlight, and I suspect that's all he's interested in now he's made his money.
Doug had made his money before the revolution at Villa Park in the late sixties. Nothing wrong in Aston Villa 'giving him a purpose' it has always given me a purpose as well....and most who post on here I should think!
http://www.theguardian.com/sport/blog/2006/aug/23/ellisrollsawayfromhisnice
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Once again, it's all about ego and survival for Ellis. Villa gives him a purpose and a spotlight, and I suspect that's all he's interested in now he's made his money.
Doug had made his money before the revolution at Villa Park in the late sixties. Nothing wrong in Aston Villa 'giving him a purpose' it has always given me a purpose as well....and most who post on here I should think!
http://www.theguardian.com/sport/blog/2006/aug/23/ellisrollsawayfromhisnice
I can't believe I hadn't read that at the time, but that piece says everything.
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It's only an anecdote about him and says no more about him than we know already. We were at Southwell races where I had a horse running. He joined us at our table and held forth at great length about what we should or shouldn't back. He spread his two quid Tote tickets on the table to show us his bets. He just had to be the centre of attention, even at the races.
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I'm no Ellis fan but even at his vintage he can still be arsed to go to VP more than many likeminded egocentrics who fuel them selves posting shit on here for likes.
Yep it must be a huge effort to circumnavigate his pile of Villa-generated cash and get his chauffeur to whisk him down to his free seat in the spotlight at VP, where he can mingle with the likes of Abramavic and pretend he is still relevant. I'm so glad I don't have that burden.
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I'm no Ellis fan but even at his vintage he can still be arsed to go to VP more than many likeminded egocentrics who fuel them selves posting shit on here for likes.
Yep it must be a huge effort to circumnavigate his pile of Villa-generated cash and get his chauffeur to whisk him down to his free seat in the spotlight at VP, where he can mingle with the likes of Abramavic and pretend he is still relevant. I'm so glad I don't have that burden.
It's only a minor point but I've seen him arrive at VP many times this season and every time he's been driving himself.
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I'm no Ellis fan but even at his vintage he can still be arsed to go to VP more than many likeminded egocentrics who fuel them selves posting shit on here for likes.
I've seen him drive into the pillars at the side of the gates before now, and reverse into John Gregory's Range Rover.
Yep it must be a huge effort to circumnavigate his pile of Villa-generated cash and get his chauffeur to whisk him down to his free seat in the spotlight at VP, where he can mingle with the likes of Abramavic and pretend he is still relevant. I'm so glad I don't have that burden.
It's only a minor point but I've seen him arrive at VP many times this season and every time he's been driving himself.
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Just been given a few bottles of Malvern Gold cider (not cidre ;) ) which, apparently, is from Doug's brewery, Aston Manor.
Didn't know he had a brewery, so I don't know how true the story is.
Nice cider, though.
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Wasn't Aston Manor one of the first producers of those awful "Alcopops" back in the early / mid nineties? Hooch maybe?
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Well I hope the old bastard has a marvellous time at Wembley on Sunday because it means we've beaten these bastards and that's really all that matters. Digging up all of this stuff, much of perfectly legit is for another day or week, maybe when the cricket is on. I hope that he's not only at Wembley on Sunday but he gets to see us lift the FA Cup.
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Wasn't Aston Manor one of the first producers of those awful "Alcopops" back in the early / mid nineties? Hooch maybe?
Indeed, not the only market explosion his renowned business acumen failed to exploit I'm afraid.
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Just been given a few bottles of Malvern Gold cider (not cidre ;) ) which, apparently, is from Doug's brewery, Aston Manor.
Didn't know he had a brewery, so I don't know how true the story is.
Nice cider, though.
Aston Manor brewery started up after Ansell's closed in Aston. I'm not sure when Doug got involved or the extent of what he did, but his son Peter ran it for many years. I also don't know what beers they brewed originally, but for a long while they've been cider manufacturers and bottlers, churning out amongst others Frosty Jack and Kingstone Press.
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Well I hope the old bastard has a marvellous time at Wembley on Sunday because it means we've beaten these bastards and that's really all that matters. Digging up all of this stuff, much of perfectly legit is for another day or week, maybe when the cricket is on. I hope that he's not only at Wembley on Sunday but he gets to see us lift the FA Cup.
<pedant alert>
The domestic cricket season started last week, and Warwickshire's first County Championship game is at Edgbaston on Sunday.
</pedant alert>
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Well I hope the old bastard has a marvellous time at Wembley on Sunday because it means we've beaten these bastards and that's really all that matters. Digging up all of this stuff, much of perfectly legit is for another day or week, maybe when the cricket is on. I hope that he's not only at Wembley on Sunday but he gets to see us lift the FA Cup.
<pedant alert>
The domestic cricket season started last week, and Warwickshire's first County Championship game is at Edgbaston on Sunday.
</pedant alert>
Yes you are :)
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Just been given a few bottles of Malvern Gold cider (not cidre ;) ) which, apparently, is from Doug's brewery, Aston Manor.
Didn't know he had a brewery, so I don't know how true the story is.
Nice cider, though.
Aston Manor brewery started up after Ansell's closed in Aston. I'm not sure when Doug got involved or the extent of what he did, but his son Peter ran it for many years. I also don't know what beers they brewed originally, but for a long while they've been cider manufacturers and bottlers, churning out amongst others Frosty Jack and Kingstone Press.
Thanks, Dave
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Well I hope the old bastard has a marvellous time at Wembley on Sunday because it means we've beaten these bastards and that's really all that matters. Digging up all of this stuff, much of perfectly legit is for another day or week, maybe when the cricket is on. I hope that he's not only at Wembley on Sunday but he gets to see us lift the FA Cup.
Agreed.
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Well I hope the old bastard has a marvellous time at Wembley on Sunday because it means we've beaten these bastards and that's really all that matters. Digging up all of this stuff, much of perfectly legit is for another day or week, maybe when the cricket is on. I hope that he's not only at Wembley on Sunday but he gets to see us lift the FA Cup.
<pedant alert>
The domestic cricket season started last week, and Warwickshire's first County Championship game is at Edgbaston on Sunday.
</pedant alert>
Yes you are :)
You are welcome.
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Just been given a few bottles of Malvern Gold cider (not cidre ;) ) which, apparently, is from Doug's brewery, Aston Manor.
Didn't know he had a brewery, so I don't know how true the story is.
Nice cider, though.
Aston Manor brewery started up after Ansell's closed in Aston. I'm not sure when Doug got involved or the extent of what he did, but his son Peter ran it for many years. I also don't know what beers they brewed originally, but for a long while they've been cider manufacturers and bottlers, churning out amongst others Frosty Jack and Kingstone Press.
yes i think dougs son peter ellis owned or still owns the brewery near villa park
started off brewing cheap low alcohol 3 per cent cans
before moving into the white 7.5% cider market where business is booming
the cheap plastic bottles of cider can get you paraletic drunk and incapable for less than a fiver
thats why you often see tramps , alcoholics and the homeless drinking it
the cider is also a major cause of violence in teenagers