Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: aj2k77 on May 13, 2014, 09:40:33 AM
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Assuming that a deal goes through and this doesn't drag on and on for seasons how do you think his reign will be remembered when the dust has settled?
When he came I thought he was the perfect fit. A very wealthy guy but one he really seemed to understand certain things about this club that we hold dear and feel proud of. The initial interviews where he talked of building something for the West Midlands and local community struck a chord and were backed up by the sponsorship deal.
I don't know exactly where the turning point was that made him draw up the bridge and retreat and decide his time was nearly up, was it the arrival of Man City's Gazzilionaires? The MON backstabbing? The Divorce? Houllier? Or even just the end of another punishing season where most things that can go wrong have? But the proud History Bright Future mantra had long been replaced by Young and Hungry.
I for one, now the anger of last season has subsidied a bit will look back on it quite fondly. The clubs communication wasn't good, we have been drifting for a while, we have lacked leadership and the transfers have been poor for too long but I will remember mostly that he gave it a go, a real go, not a Doug Ellis couple of players to shut you up go but genuinely backed the club to the hilt with his wallet for a while, Wembley twice in one season, better facilities, two genuine runs at the top four, the home game against Sheffield Utd, a belief that we were on the verge of something big enough anyway to pack 40,000+ constantly into Villa Park for the first time in 58 years.
So for me now, if he does as Doug before him did and sell to a better person to lead us forward then I'll be looking back fondly on the good period and putting out of my mind the mistakes of his naivety in football and hope the lessons have been learned and we don't make them again.
So cheers Randy it was fun, for a while.
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Arrived full of promise and optimisim and left without achieving any on the field success. However developed the training facilty and didn't leave us (hopefully) in the sh1t financially.
Sadly will always be linked to appointing TSM!!
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Spent a lot of money, shook things up for a few years, made some terrible decisions, abruptly lost interest, sold to good people.
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Sadly the thing I'll remember him most for was the biggest WTF? football moment I've ever had, when he appointed McLeish.
I still can't believe that.
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Good intentions and bad levels of competence in equal measure.
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At the risk of looking like I'm spamming the site, as this is the second time I've posted this link today, I published a blog on this just this morning.
It's at http://thomastparker.com/2014/05/13/lessons-lern-ed-as-villa-sale-looms/ (http://thomastparker.com/2014/05/13/lessons-lern-ed-as-villa-sale-looms/) if anyone's interested.
(Sorry mods, no more spam from me now!)
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Did everything brilliantly...Acorns, Ground, pub, BMH, hospitality, everything...except the bit that really counts.
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As a person who always had Villa's best interests at heart, but unfortunately made some really poor decisions that ultimately have left Villa way below the standards we expected when he arrived.
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I shall remember like the shunammite
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Thanks for trying - wonderful generosity when compared with the previous incumbent.
I just wish the early big money had been (much) better managed by the first 2 managerial incumbents.
Oh and the smaller amounts available thereafter to the latter 2 incumbents.
The Road to Hell is paved with Good Intentions.
Counterbalanced against the well meaning albeit naeive approach was the abject and appaling football related decisions which emanated from the board.
Not having any sort of independent football person and one or two non lackey members of the board would have helped.
And as long as I draw breath I will never ever be able to fathom out the appointment of McLeish.
Why - because it screamed out to the fans. We have become SMALL TIME!!
Oh and appointing an unbelieveably inexperienced CEO, clearly out of his depth from Day 1 and letting him carry on for 4 years is non too wise.
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It possibly depends who he sells us to. If it is to someone who takes us to the next level then he will be remembered fondly. If it is more of the same then I think the good he has done will be overlooked in the future.
Like most people have said good intentions but not always well-executed or fulfilled.
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Randy Lerner has proved that success in football isn't just about money. How you run a football club is equally, if not more important than the investment you put into it.
At the beginning he put a lot of money into the 'project' but the club was effectively being run by MON. So you had a benevolent, principled owner with the best interests of the club at heart, who believed in letting his man have free reign. And that man was Martin O'Neill, who appears only to be interested in Martin O'Neill.
When MON flounced out, Randy was left to his own devices, and it was painfully obvious that he had no idea how to run a football club. It was a rude awakening for him. He made foolish appointments in Houllier (who was poor at Villa, whatever the revisionists say) and McLeish (the most baffling managerial appointment in the club's history). The letter to Fergie was more than a huge embarrassment for the club, it showed how out of touch and naive Randy was. We all had higher hopes for Lambert, but he also proved to be poor, yet Randy was apparently too weary to sack him and make another ill-advised appointment. He hadn't the stomach for it.
All the while, the spending was harshly reduced, which placed us in perilous danger for three consecutive seasons. And all the while, Randy refused to enlist help at board level in the form of a man who understands the game.
It was clear it couldn't go on the way it was. The fans, mostly loyal, supportive and in great numbers, were reaching breaking point. There was nobody at the club with the nous to steer us back on course. He had to go. Hopefully, he can sell to the right people. If they can invest as much as Lerner has, it'll put us on the right road; but they'll need to be much smarter than Lerner was when it comes to running the club. You need both for success.
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Did everything brilliantly...Acorns, Ground, pub, BMH, hospitality, everything...except the bit that really counts.
Agreed.
Succinct.
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I shall remember like the shunammite
I'm getting a shunammite tattoo on my ankle.
Fact.
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There have been many faux-pas under Randy's tenure but for me the biggest bollock dropped by far was when they started playing Chelsea fucking Dagger after we scored. I still cannot believe somebony at the club thought that was a good idea.
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There have been many faux-pas under Randy's tenure but for me the biggest bollock dropped by far was when they started playing Chelsea fucking Dagger after we scored. I still cannot believe somebony at the club thought that was a good idea.
That is a freaky coincidence
Last night my Mrs was watching something on telly and they played that song. I turned around and said "I fucking hate that song". She said "me too".
I then started saying "I remember once at Villa Park, when we scored, and ...." at which point she shouted at me to shut up as she knew it was a football story.
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Came flying out the start line but no one told him he was in a marathon and not a sprint. His expensive isotonic drinks got him up near the front of the pack but burned a whole in his wallet. He got half way round the track and his legs gave out, finding himself struggling at the back with the fat blokes and the runners in animal costumes. Now his Asda smart price isotonics don't give him much of a boost at all. They just make his gut funny, and he continues just about keeping ahead of the 3 slowest runners. He's spent 3 years crawling to the finishline and if he stays in the race another year he probably won't make it and end up being taken out by ambulance to Championship Hospital in South Purgatory.
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Started well, off and on the pitch. Trusted MON too much without having another football man in place. Just as stability was attained MON left and Lerner never recovered from the aftershock.
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Tried to go for gold, ended up with tin.
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Overall, positively. I think Randy is a good bloke who tried his best and put a lot of effort, heart, and money into the task at hand. He seemed to embrace the history of the club and did many great things to make the fans smile. Unfortunately, he also made a lot of daft decisions and was ultimately undone by his lack of football nous and the absence of any advisers to plug the gap.
Regardless, he made us dream for a little while and for that I say thank you, Randy.
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As Sven Goran Ericksson might put it, first half, good. Second half, not so good.
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A lovely man and the single worst hirer of managers in the known history of the universe. Caligula was better at appointments.
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A lovely man and the single worst hirer of managers in the known history of the universe. Caligula was better at appointments.
Caligula was better at managing fiances too. Bankrupt my arse, how did Claudius afford to invade Britain if he'd bankrupted the state? Ah? AH!
Claigula in!
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I think he'll be remembered as someone who gave up when the going got a bit rough. These last 4 appalling seasons erase all the feel good factor he created in his early years.
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A lovely man and the single worst hirer of managers in the known history of the universe. Caligula was better at appointments.
Caligula was better at managing fiances too. Bankrupt my arse, how did Claudius afford to invade Britain if he'd bankrupted the state? Ah? AH!
Claigula in!
Too fecking right. Why should we believe Tacitus etc? Dey just b jealz that Caligz b gettin all da bitchez.
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He put a hell of a lot of money into my club. Improving so many things, and being a perfect owner in so many ways. He, unlike so many of todays owners really cared about the club, and tried to make the best decisions based on this rather than basing them on financial, hard nosed, business decisions. I cant blame a man for caring too much, and ruling with his heart rather than his head. Because to be fair, he probably has done exactly what i would have done if i had my dream to own the best club in the world. I think im pretty ruthless in my job, but matters of the heart, like my club, or my daughter, im a pushover
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A lovely man and the single worst hirer of managers in the known history of the universe. Caligula was better at appointments.
Caligula was better at managing fiances too. Bankrupt my arse, how did Claudius afford to invade Britain if he'd bankrupted the state? Ah? AH!
Claigula in!
Too fecking right. Why should we believe Tacitus etc? Dey just b jealz that Caligz b gettin all da bitchez.
Romanes eunt domus.
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As odd as it may sound, I think the long-term perception of Randy's time at Villa will be largely influenced by who he sells to. If he finds an Ellison-type who comes in and throws money around, we'll all remember Randy as a great bloke who did the right thing for the club when he realised he couldn't go any further. If he sells to a half-arsed consortium of randoms, who don't, then we'll remember him as a tight-arse who oversaw the start of the decay of our great club.
In my opinion, we're all quite fond of Doug these days because (we thought) he sold to the right guy.
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As Sven Goran Ericksson might put it, first half, good. Second half, not so good.
That's a good point.
In fact, I'd say, given he's had eight seasons, his reign has been like many Villa matches this season.
One good half, one bad one.
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As odd as it may sound, I think the long-term perception of Randy's time at Villa will be largely influenced by who he sells to. If he finds a Ellison-type who comes in and throws money around, we'll all remember Randy as a great bloke who did the right thing for the club when he realised he couldn't go any further. If he sells to a half-arsed consortium of randoms, who don't, then we'll remember him as a tight-arse who oversaw the start of the decay of our great club.
In my opinion, we're all quite fond of Doug these days because (we thought) he sold to the right guy.
Spot on
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A lovely man and the single worst hirer of managers in the known history of the universe. Caligula was better at appointments.
When he hired McLeish, at the end of the day, Caligula would have blushed. And heaven knows we're miserable now.
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A good man, who's always conducted his affairs with decency and respect. Despite the cock-ups, I'll be sad to see him go. He's made mistakes, but has been poorly served by the people he put his faith in.
Though as he said in his statement, fate is fickle. Had we signed Bent instead of Heskey in 2009, who knows what might have been.
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Now he's decided to do the decent thing rather than dragging it on even longer, he will be remembered a lot better i think. Lets be honest, if you take it over the 8 years, half of it was good and half was crap, but as i say, at least he knows when to quit so fair play to him.
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A lovely man and the single worst hirer of managers in the known history of the universe. Caligula was better at appointments.
When he hired McLeish, at the end of the day, Caligula would have blushed. And heaven knows we're miserable now.
You've been at this club too long the General said, and Randy naturally fled.
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Good stuff off the pitch,on it lucky he followed Doug.
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Naive, reclusive, silent, poor judge, poor decision maker, bluffer.
Thought a bit of American-style schmooz could compensate for a lack football knowledge and failed. The early days were ok but they were more than overshadowed by the last 3 seasons of absolute rubbish.
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Randy came here expecting to throw a lot of money at the club and obtain quick success. When it was obvious that he couldn't compete he decided to cut his losses and sell up (The end of the O'neill era)
I have no idea if his intentions were to make money or he genuinely felt the history and wanted to try and rejuvenate a prestigious old club - only he can honestly tell you that.
I have the sense that he felt let down by the fans, his last number of communications seem to almost belittle the fans. (If you think back to when he made it clear he would make the decisions and not the fans)
Maybe I'm being paranoid but the fickle and shunammite references could be interpreted as - we should have been more content or happy with what we had.
I've probably explained what I mean badly, but I do think he is a little bitter about the experience.
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Randy came here expecting to throw a lot of money at the club and obtain quick success. When it was obvious that he couldn't compete he decided to cut his losses and sell up (The end of the O'neill era)
I have no idea if his intentions were to make money or he genuinely felt the history and wanted to try and rejuvenate a prestigious old club - only he can honestly tell you that.
I have the sense that he felt let down by the fans, his last number of communications seem to almost belittle the fans. (If you think back to when he made it clear he would make the decisions and not the fans)
Maybe I'm being paranoid but the fickle and shunammite references could be interpreted as - we should have been more content or happy with what we had.
I've probably explained what I mean badly, but I do think he is a little bitter about the experience.
There's probably an element of truth to that. I mean his approval rating for the first 4 years was pretty much through the roof. From the moment he bought Houllier in and changed his transfer policy he's been losing fans. I think the McLeish appointment did the most damage. He's been unable to recover from that, and two more years of drek under Lambert, under Randy's very tight constraints haven't done him many favours with us.
I would imagine to some degree Randy hasn't like the way many fans opinions have suddenly changed on him. Some may call it fickle, but most of us would say that we've been well within our rights. Many of us even in the good times sensed that something would eventually snap with the way he was just dishing out money willy nilly to O Neill.
The difference between Randy and Doug, is that whilst Doug wanted to ensure we were left in good hands, I'm not sure that would be paramount in Randy's thinking. If he has to wait till November to sell, he'll sell. If it means we're left picking up the pieces, with little time to fix the mess of squad he's left behind, so be it. If we get relegated next summer, I don't think Randy would bat an eye-lid if he's already sold us. It's purely business for him now I reckon. I think he's lost any passion he had for the club because of how things have turned, and because of how far his popularity has fallen.
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A gigantic missed opportunity.
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Ultimately I will judge/remember him for who he hands us over to.
There's no doubt he's a good guy and he certainly understands the club and it's traditions: the Holte End, Holte Hotel and BMH are brilliant monuments to his eye for detail and he embraced the McGregor statue initiative, too. He'll be remembered for doing some very good things, the crowning glory, the tie up with Acorns, in my opinion.
His on field decision-making was shocking, though. He can put all that right by handing us over to people who have the ambition and know-how to get us back on top! (Easier said than done I know.)
Thanks for everything, Randy. You tried your best and it's appreciated.
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as the man who changed our glorious badge to the watered down crap thing we have now
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An honourable, generous man. I will be sad to see him go and that he didnt get the success he deserved.
His single biggest error was the power he gave Martin O'Neill at the start and the faith he bestowed in him. We cna talk all about the subsequent bad decisions made on management choices, but by then the horse had bolted and the finances werent there to crack the top 4 especially given the Man City emergence.
I think had he not backed MON when Fitzgerald was fired then we would have got to the top 4, probbaly without O'Neill.
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Respected the traditions of the club, seemed genuine about his affection for the club as well, made a significant amount of money available to the managers (it must be remembered that we get gates averaging mid-thirties and dont have the global appeal of a Man U) where it all started to go wrong was with MONs unchecked spending, the eventual reigning-in of which, caused him to walk out and claim constructive on the grounds of being unable to spend Randys cash like water. Randys biggest problem was in being ill-advised by those closest to him about player purchases and managers (remember Fergies accursed letter). writing personally, i wish him well, he certainly seemed to act with a good heart, he was just catastrophically naive about "Soccer".
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Bit like ghostbusters 2 . Hugely anticipated, good start, poor middle ,crap ending
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Best of intentions for the club. I think he found English football to be a hard unforgiving sport/business and is moving on. If he sells to a decent owner then i am sure he will be judged well.
For me time wil tell how he is judged. People who slagged HDE (who sit by me at VP) were speaking of him very well this season (This would never happen under Doug) so i suspect if Lerner sells to a decent owner we will look back and say he was a good owner.
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I do wonder what would have happened had MON not done his usual routine of getting any potential threat to his power (ie FitzGerald / Cunnah) removed.
As it stands, I'll remember him as being in it for the right reasons, but being completely out of his depth.
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I will remember him as a guy who had a go and didn't pull it off. Anyone who spends hundreds of millions on my club is alright by me. His full legacy will be defined eventually, like others have said, by who he sells to.
Had Dowd and MON performed better he probably wouldn't even be selling.
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Bit like ghostbusters 2 . Hugely anticipated, good start, poor middle ,crap ending
I never got past the first 30 mins thankfully.
Unlike with Randy's stewardship.
He does need to hand it over to someone who can think longer term and who can put in place an appropriate, forward looking football management and coaching team. It has been a long time since we had one.
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I'll remember him for the exciting times of the early days, allowing MON to bring in exciting players like Ashley Young, John Crew and Jamie Milner. I'll never forget us signing Darren Bent who saved us from a terrible season.
He's left us in a good state of affairs, he could of buggered off after the money dried up and we still had the massive burden of the MON signing frenzy. He stayed and made sure the last managers main aim was to balance the books. It ended in a poor state on the playing field, that's plainly obvious, however a new fresh regime could change things pretty quickly and push us up the table a wee bit and steady the ship. Then, maybe exciting times could be ahead again.
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The problem was him and Faulkner aren't really 'football' people and put all their trust and money in MON due to his reputation and immediate success.
In fairness to him he has made sure to stay with the club while we've reversed the horrible financial decisions, and now we're at a massive crossroads.
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I was lucky to meet Mr Lerner and my impression of him then, as it is now, is that he has a good heart and integrity in abundance. I thank him for being genuine enough to care about stuff like Acorns, The Holte Pub and paying for coaches to Chelsea. I think he needed an experienced CEO to get the playing side right including recruitment of Managers and organising player contracts. So near, yet ultimately, so far.
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(https://farm3.staticflickr.com/2152/2984038494_10e205b02c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/5xFYFy)Villa Park Holte End Mosaic (https://flic.kr/p/5xFYFy) by Bad English (https://www.flickr.com/people/18684774@N00/), on Flickr
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There is no point really looking back and torturing ourselves with the "if only's"
If only he hadn't bought Heskey, if only Stoke hadn't equalised, if only we'd kept Barry Bannan etc etc.
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The problem was him and Faulkner aren't really 'football' people and put all their trust and money in MON due to his reputation and immediate success.
In fairness to him he has made sure to stay with the club while we've reversed the horrible financial decisions, and now we're at a massive crossroads.
Probably why the cutbacks happened quick and we jumped from the £50k p/w transfers to the £15k p/w transfers, he had every intention by then of getting out and wanted to balance the books somewhat before he did?
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I shall remember like the shunammite
I'm getting a shunammite tattoo on my ankle.
Fact.
How many people can say I've got one of those!?
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(https://farm3.staticflickr.com/2152/2984038494_10e205b02c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/5xFYFy)Villa Park Holte End Mosaic (https://flic.kr/p/5xFYFy) by Bad English (https://www.flickr.com/people/18684774@N00/), on Flickr
THAT is a thing of beauty
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EDIT
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There have been many faux-pas under Randy's tenure but for me the biggest bollock dropped by far was when they started playing Chelsea fucking Dagger after we scored. I still cannot believe somebony at the club thought that was a good idea.
That is a freaky coincidence
Last night my Mrs was watching something on telly and they played that song. I turned around and said "I fucking hate that song". She said "me too".
I then started saying "I remember once at Villa Park, when we scored, and ...." at which point she shouted at me to shut up as she knew it was a football story.
When was this? My memory is atrocious
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There have been many faux-pas under Randy's tenure but for me the biggest bollock dropped by far was when they started playing Chelsea fucking Dagger after we scored. I still cannot believe somebony at the club thought that was a good idea.
That is a freaky coincidence
Last night my Mrs was watching something on telly and they played that song. I turned around and said "I fucking hate that song". She said "me too".
I then started saying "I remember once at Villa Park, when we scored, and ...." at which point she shouted at me to shut up as she knew it was a football story.
When was this? My memory is atrocious
A few years ago. Against Bolton, I think.
Scored, suddenly PA starts blaring out Chelsea Fucking Dagger.
Everyone around us stopped jumping up and down and stared at each other in disbelief.
it was when General Krulak still posted here. When he logged on on the Monday morning, there must have been 100 posts to him about making it stop.
It never happened again, thankfully.
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First three years he did well and the fans were looking forward to the bright future bit, but after that total garbage making poor decision after poor decision.
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First three years he did well and the fans were looking forward to the bright future bit, but after that total garbage making poor decision after poor decision.
This
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Probably best summed up as some good, some bad, but could have been at lot worse as Messrs Yeung, Allam, Tan and the Venkys have shown.
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Some good things already mentioned. Best single moment for me was seeing the European cup winning team back on the pitch at villa park. Truly emotional.
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When Lerner first took over we had an air of invincibility about us, we were finally, finally moving back to where we belong as a club. He understood us, even loved the Villa. What a joy those days were. Knowing we'd beat Bolton 4-1 or 5-1 every time we played them. Being massively ahead of Arsenal in the league (I know how it ended but it was amazing while it lasted). But my favourite Randy-linked memory has to be the Semi-final against Blackburn. My generation's Tranmere game I think. An evening of pure Villa joy.
I have a lot of time for Lerner. You could argue he has been arrogant in seeming to not take advice on picking managers and staff, but he did a lot for us. I'll remember him very fondly, but also sadly that things haven't worked out at all.
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Some good things already mentioned. Best single moment for me was seeing the European cup winning team back on the pitch at villa park. Truly emotional.
It was great to see but it was basically PR though. It's on the pitch where it really matters though, and he hasn't got it right.
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Did everything brilliantly...Acorns, Ground, pub, BMH, hospitality, everything...except the bit that really counts.
Same for me.
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(https://farm3.staticflickr.com/2152/2984038494_10e205b02c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/5xFYFy)Villa Park Holte End Mosaic (https://flic.kr/p/5xFYFy) by Bad English (https://www.flickr.com/people/18684774@N00/), on Flickr
Quality.
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He did many things well. The Italian mosaics (excellent photo, BE) are an illustration of the style that he brought back to Villa. I have no doubt that he identified with our great tradition - the "proud history" - and took his role as our custodian very seriously. But there was always the feeling that, despite his good intentions, he was not seeking the advice of people who understood football and this was a grave failing. I wrote a piece for H&V some months ago which suggested that we could have done a lot worse - look at Pompey, Blues, Blackburn, Hearts, etc - but ultimately these 8 years have not been a success and the "bright future" is more distant than ever.
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If he is about, I would like to ask a question of Pelty.
How do you think Randy would like to be remembered?
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He was very well intentioned but obviously ultimately it didn't work out. I wonder whether there was some kind of cultural naïveté about the UK. I remember one game when one of his guests was a former American footballer. They showed some of his career highlights. Most people around me applauded out of politeness, but there seemed to be an air of 'what the hell is this?'.
Anyway, as he's lost interest/moved in, it's preferable to him staying, IMO.
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I want to see if he sells the club and who to first .
I think he was out of his depth when it came to running a football club but seems a good bloke who did care about us for a while.
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I hate to say "I told you so", but...
In those first few years of the Great Randy Love-In, I was always sceptical that we were subject to American schmooze and marketing, but was willing to reserve judgement until such time as things weren't going so well on the pitch and he was faced with difficult decisions.
Based on everything that has happened since he precipitated MON's departure, I would say that his ownership has been poor. Indeed, based on his three managerial appointments, I actually wonder if Doug hadn't got in O'Neill as his parting gift, what mess he would have made in appointing DOL's successor.
Understanding - or at least appreciating - the heritage and what we consider to be unique about Aston Villa is one thing, and the one thing I give him credit for, but ultimately all that really matters is indicated by the other two words in the club name: we are a Football Club, and as such it is on the football side of things by which he must ultimately be judged.
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Here is a thought. People are clamouring for Klinsmann now. It might well have been him then if Doug had not signed up MON as a leaving gift.
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In a nutshell the positives:
The first 2 -3 years were great, acorns, Holte pub, acorns, bodymoor, scarf, coaches, acorns
The bad -
Mcleish , Faulkner , General naivety, not going sooner, lambert, houllier , worst of all the lack of comms to the most important component - THE SUPPORTERS !!
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On the pitch we have a squad that is not unlike the one he inherited, 5 or 6 good players and a lot of upgradeables. He invested a fair chunk and it didn't quite work out. That is the most likely outcome in football, but at least we bought a ticket.
ff the pitch absolute class. We couldn't have asked for better, albeit with a slight question mark over the badge.
I hope he keeps the tattoo.
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He got Doug out, and from that perspective he'd have to extinguish cigarettes on my testicles for me to think ill of him.
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i posted this story under my other name on here perry_barr_pet till i was told to change it (long story).so sorry if ya read it already
i work on the gas in central london and was doing a massive job by harrods one day who should come walking towards me the one and only randy lerner i vaulted the barriers he possibly thought i was going to mug him till he seen my villa hat and just smiled at me i shook his hand and thanked him for everything he had done for the villa.
this was just after mon had left and we chatted for about 20 minutes about the villa in that time his phoned beeped about 10 times and rang at least 4 times he looked at his phone and said they can wait im talking to you about the villa thats more important. jesus christ how did that make me feel, he said that he had got caught up in the wave of optimism and euphoria that we all thought would end up with champions league football ( to be honest didnt we all). but he admitted that the players he was seeing on big money contracts not playing and the final straw being the europa league debacle.
sorry guys he came with the best intentions and it nearly worked and for 20 minutes he made me feel like the most important villa fan in the world so i cant slag him off
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i posted this story under my other name on here perry_barr_pet till i was told to change it (long story).so sorry if ya read it already
i work on the gas in central london and was doing a massive job by harrods one day who should come walking towards me the one and only randy lerner i vaulted the barriers he possibly thought i was going to mug him till he seen my villa hat and just smiled at me i shook his hand and thanked him for everything he had done for the villa.
this was just after mon had left and we chatted for about 20 minutes about the villa in that time his phoned beeped about 10 times and rang at least 4 times he looked at his phone and said they can wait im talking to you about the villa thats more important. jesus christ how did that make me feel, he said that he had got caught up in the wave of optimism and euphoria that we all thought would end up with champions league football ( to be honest didnt we all). but he admitted that the players he was seeing on big money contracts not playing and the final straw being the europa league debacle.
sorry guys he came with the best intentions and it nearly worked and for 20 minutes he made me feel like the most important villa fan in the world so i cant slag him off
Enjoyed the story the first time, just wish it could have worked out for all of us... including your name change.
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I will remember attending a final at Wembley. Even though we lost.
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me to "the left side" so much but heres to the next guy ,would love him or them to take a seat at a packed vp holte end upper (before they put pen to paper) when its rocking just to give him or them a feel of what this club is really all about. forget the balance sheets forget the fundamentals and all that shit then they will know what sort of club and support they are purchasing.
the new owners need to be told that this club once ruled half the footballing world
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Naive, reclusive, silent, poor judge, poor decision maker, bluffer
This isn't about my leadership its about Lerner's, get over it and move on.
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I think of him as a good man with sound intentions but bloody unlucky that Man Citys owners came in when they did, his hiring and supervision left a lot to be desired.
He gave us hope, then took it away.
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He gave us reasons to be optimistic after the Ellis era but he went too far too soon financially.
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This is what happens to kids who inherit money. His own kids will be shrewder having watched dad fritter acres of spondulex away
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He confirmed my now long held suspicion that I will never ever see the Villa be Champions of England or lift the European Cup again.
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He gave us hope, then took it away.
That pretty much nails it in eight words, I reckon. Good work.
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He was better than Robert Maxwell.
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I think of him as a good man with sound intentions but bloody unlucky that Man Citys owners came in when they did, his hiring and supervision left a lot to be desired.
He gave us hope, then took it away.
He saw the whole of the moon.
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A person who believed all he had to do was wave his cheque book around to get what he wanted.
Shocking business sense and should have sold 4 years ago when MON left as his heart has not been in it since then.
I am sure he is a very personable man but I find it difficult to feel a lot of sympathy for the money he has wasted whilst playing at running a football club. His decisions wasted his money and has left the rest of us with a club which if not bought quickly could slide down a very slippery slope.
He is certainly proving the saying a fool and his money etc.
I may be being a little harsh on him but it annoys me when something that has meant so much to me for 50 odd years can be used and tossed aside as a rich persons plaything.
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This is what happens to kids who inherit money. His own kids will be shrewder having watched dad fritter acres of spondulex away
A fool and his money are soon parted...
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A person who believed all he had to do was wave his cheque book around to get what he wanted.
Shocking business sense and should have sold 4 years ago when MON left as his heart has not been in it since then.
I am sure he is a very personable man but I find it difficult to feel a lot of sympathy for the money he has wasted whilst playing at running a football club. His decisions wasted his money and has left the rest of us with a club which if not bought quickly could slide down a very slippery slope.
He is certainly proving the saying a fool and his money etc.
I may be being a little harsh on him but it annoys me when something that has meant so much to me for 50 odd years can be used and tossed aside as a rich persons plaything.
Jinx!!
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A person who believed all he had to do was wave his cheque book around to get what he wanted.
Shocking business sense and should have sold 4 years ago when MON left as his heart has not been in it since then.
I am sure he is a very personable man but I find it difficult to feel a lot of sympathy for the money he has wasted whilst playing at running a football club. His decisions wasted his money and has left the rest of us with a club which if not bought quickly could slide down a very slippery slope.
He is certainly proving the saying a fool and his money etc.
I may be being a little harsh on him but it annoys me when something that has meant so much to me for 50 odd years can be used and tossed aside as a rich persons plaything.
Jinx!!
You snooze you lose
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Promise unfulfilled. For us and Randy.
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Nice bloke, shame about the Shunammite.
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...he precipitated MON's departure...
His big mistake was not throwing O'Neill out on his arse for the handling of the Moscow debacle.
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Oh fuck Moscow again...I really dread to think how some will react when we get back into the Europa and the manager starts rotating the squad. The club will need to have a stash of Big John's vouchers on hand at all times to appease the masses.
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Did everything brilliantly...Acorns, Ground, pub, BMH, hospitality, everything...except the bit that really counts.
He did nothing with the ground in terms of capacity. Did a good job with the Holte pub. But, ultimately, he should have sold-up in 2010. Has left a second-rate squad behind.
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Oh fuck Moscow again...I really dread to think how some will react when we get back into the Europa and the manager starts rotating the squad. The club will need to have a stash of Big John's vouchers on hand at all times to appease the masses.
No problem with squad rotation. It was the 'fuck you' attitude to the fans that came along with it.
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Did everything brilliantly...Acorns, Ground, pub, BMH, hospitality, everything...except the bit that really counts.
He did nothing with the ground in terms of capacity. Did a good job with the Holte pub. But, ultimately, he should have sold-up in 2010. Has left a second-rate squad behind.
By ground I am referring to the Holte Suite the concourse areas and the hospitality areas. Doing anything to the ground in terms of capacity would have been a further waste of money.
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This is what happens to kids who inherit money. His own kids will be shrewder having watched dad fritter acres of spondulex away
A fool and his money are soon parted...
A fool and his money are soon partying
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Did everything brilliantly...Acorns, Ground, pub, BMH, hospitality, everything...except the bit that really counts.
He did nothing with the ground in terms of capacity. Did a good job with the Holte pub. But, ultimately, he should have sold-up in 2010. Has left a second-rate squad behind.
By ground I am referring to the Holte Suite the concourse areas and the hospitality areas. Doing anything to the ground in terms of capacity would have been a further waste of money.
So 8 years to fill in / refurbish a few areas under the stands? I hardly call that progressing the stadium. Deadly Doug did far more in terms of the upgrade of the stadium. It's been so long since Lerner attended a game (December 2012) he's probably forgotten what Villa Park looks like! In the end a failure on the pitch where it only really counts - fair play on the things he did/ supported off the field.
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Who is responsible for the financial mess we are in? I know he wrote of some of the debt, but the reality is he will be leaving us in a mess.
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Did everything brilliantly...Acorns, Ground, pub, BMH, hospitality, everything...except the bit that really counts.
He did nothing with the ground in terms of capacity. Did a good job with the Holte pub. But, ultimately, he should have sold-up in 2010. Has left a second-rate squad behind.
By ground I am referring to the Holte Suite the concourse areas and the hospitality areas. Doing anything to the ground in terms of capacity would have been a further waste of money.
So 8 years to fill in / refurbish a few areas under the stands? I hardly call that progressing the stadium. Deadly Doug did far more in terms of the upgrade of the stadium. It's been so long since Lerner attended a game (December 2012) he's probably forgotten what Villa Park looks like! In the end a failure on the pitch where it only really counts - fair play on the things he did/ supported off the field.
Yeah, Deadly did loads for the stadium, and did us (him) all a favour by doing all the work through his building firm, no doubt saving us (him) a fortune.
And what a marvellous job he did with the lower tier his very own stand.
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Oh fuck Moscow again...I really dread to think how some will react when we get back into the Europa and the manager starts rotating the squad. The club will need to have a stash of Big John's vouchers on hand at all times to appease the masses.
How easy do you think I am?! TGI Fridays please!!
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Who is responsible for the financial mess we are in? I know he wrote of some of the debt, but the reality is he will be leaving us in a mess.
We're ready to meet FFP now so we're not in that much of a mess.
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I think he had the best of intentions.
It is a pity that he got screwed by O`Neil, it could have been s different.
Since then he has had a run of bad decisions and awful appointments.
He lost focus, interest and strategy.
A combination of (some) bad luck, being let down, poorly advised and poor decisions. Its a shame, it could should have been better than this.
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I feel that we'll always be wondering what Shunammite have been.
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Did everything brilliantly...Acorns, Ground, pub, BMH, hospitality, everything...except the bit that really counts.
He did nothing with the ground in terms of capacity. Did a good job with the Holte pub. But, ultimately, he should have sold-up in 2010. Has left a second-rate squad behind.
By ground I am referring to the Holte Suite the concourse areas and the hospitality areas. Doing anything to the ground in terms of capacity would have been a further waste of money.
So 8 years to fill in / refurbish a few areas under the stands? I hardly call that progressing the stadium. Deadly Doug did far more in terms of the upgrade of the stadium. It's been so long since Lerner attended a game (December 2012) he's probably forgotten what Villa Park looks like! In the end a failure on the pitch where it only really counts - fair play on the things he did/ supported off the field.
Ellis had to do the work he did because of the Taylor Report and much of it was financed by the Football Trust.
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I feel that we'll always be wondering what Shunammite have been.
Good stuff
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Not rich enough to buy success, not bright enough to earn it.
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A genuine guy who had/has the club at heart and was shafted by MON.
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Lacking Football knowledge.
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Will the whole truth of the MON walkout ever come out?
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Think he'll be quickly forgotten. Just like he quickly forgot us.
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I think how his reign is remembered may be determined by who he sells us to and when he sells us. If he sells us promptly and we get mega rich owners who respect our traditions and get us competing at the top of the league, he'll be remembered as steadying the ship and helping us into a new era of success. If he sells us to terrible owners he'll be remembered as the guy who opened the door to our ruin.
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The guy seems decent and meant well, talked a good game and initially backed it up with funding. He did some good things off the pitch, but ultimately he and his chosen representatives lacked the necessary football nous (or any semblance of it) and arguably the business nous (how much did we lose on Beye?) to make us a success on the pitch. I'm afraid he'll be remembered for wasting our best and possibly last opportunity to establish ourselves in the top niche of clubs by not copping on sooner to MON's limitations (the Harewood signing was the first sign in my view) , and then making a series of quite horrendously bad decisions with the nadir being the sheer and utter lunacy of thinking McLeish was the man to take us forward. At least he gave us some optimism for a while which had been lost under Ellis, but ultimately he took us back to square one and then some.
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Regarding the traditions. How does everyone feel should we get mega rich owners who invest heavily into the team but want to re-name Villa Park, change the colours etc etc? Are our traditions more important than what is one the pitch?
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Yes any new owner has to respect the club's traditions, and build on them.
We are Aston Villa, we play at Villa Park and wear claret and blue.
Nobody should ever feel they have the right to change that just because they're filthy rich, and if they think they can then they can fuck off back to where they came from and find something else to spend it on.
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Proud history. Nice scarf.
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Bet he's regretting having that shit badge tattooed on his leg
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Bet he's regretting having that shit badge tattooed on his leg
That reminds me of a nose I used to know who had the coloured-in Kumar version of their badge on his leg.
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Off the pitch: 10/10
On the pitch (MON era): 7/10
On the pitch (thereafter): 2/10
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Acorns on the shirt, probably my proudest moment as a Villa fan.
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He didn't get a kitten.
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Acorns on the shirt, probably my proudest moment as a Villa fan.
No offence mate, but we're a football club not a charity.
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Acorns on the shirt, probably my proudest moment as a Villa fan.
No offence mate, but we're a football club not a charity.
Nonetheless, it was a fantastic gesture.
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Acorns on the shirt, probably my proudest moment as a Villa fan.
No offence mate, but we're a football club not a charity.
Nonetheless, it was a fantastic gesture.
It certainly was, but ultimately we're about the football not a charity.
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Acorns on the shirt, probably my proudest moment as a Villa fan.
No offence mate, but we're a football club not a charity.
Nonetheless, it was a fantastic gesture.
It certainly was, but ultimately we're about the football not a charity.
Our football has been very charitable.
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Acorns on the shirt, probably my proudest moment as a Villa fan.
No offence mate, but we're a football club not a charity.
Nonetheless, it was a fantastic gesture.
It certainly was, but ultimately we're about the football not a charity.
We've been a charity at home for the past season and especially charitable to clubs in need of a pick me up.
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Acorns on the shirt, probably my proudest moment as a Villa fan.
No offence mate, but we're a football club not a charity.
Nonetheless, it was a fantastic gesture.
It certainly was, but ultimately we're about the football not a charity.
Hence why said 'was'. I doubt we'll do it again.
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It puzzles me how some people are claiming they saw this coming and the rest of us were all just duped by razzmatazz. Whether the Lerner reign lasted eight years or eighty, there's no way you could tell it was going to go the way it has.
I guess for me, Lerner's legacy is not so much what he leaves to Aston Villa but how it's changed expectations. If he'd bought the club on the cusp of the Millennium, it stands a chance we could be in a club like Arsenal's shoes now - possibly a couple of titles, almost certainly Champions League mainstays. But post-Abramovich, the reality is that unless he was prepared to constantly see his money disappear down the plug hole, a man like Lerner couldn't buy success. His decision to cut us off following a decent stab at the big time shows the artifice of success in the game - it needs cash and lots of it. We're not big enough to bankroll our own ambition and the last two seasons show that with clarity.
When Lerner arrived I was overjoyed and prepared to believe that I thought anything was possible for the club. But it's only possible with a constant flow of ludicrous wealth and I don't hold it against Lerner that he realised that. The last few seasons have made me very cynical about the game and sad that barring a miracle, we're one of the also-rans now.
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It was a fantastic gesture and I'm much happier Acorns benifitted from it than an average footballer and his greedy agent. I think the club benifitted from it more too.
Clubs take enough TV money (£73m this season for finishing 15th ffs) they should be made to ensure local communities, charities and supporters (through ticket pricing) get a cut too.
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That's pretty much it for me too.
When Lerner took over, there was a fair degree of envy from other clubs because -outside of the Sky lot- not many other clubs had access to consistent, major funding.
The landscape has changed considerably since then. Forget Citeh being a gamechanger, it would have been naive in the extreme for Lerner to think that no other billionaire would want to get involved in British football. That said, we are now in a position where the majority of top flight clubs are bankrolled by billionaires. That is the rule, clubs like Everton, Palace and Swansea are the exception. So any new owner coming in faces far sterner competition than Lerner did in 2006.
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Acorns on the shirt, probably my proudest moment as a Villa fan.
No offence mate, but we're a football club not a charity.
None taken SH, I just thought it was a wonderful gesture by the club.
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"The road to hell is paved with good intentions"
I saw that quote today, and the first thing i thought of was Randy Lerner.
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"The slums of Chicago are full of Day 1 leaders of the US Open".
No direct relation to Villa but I quite like this quote.
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my farther bought me a villa share in the sixties Randy took that off me for a sum of money i had no choice!!! , now i have no shares in the club i love .
Thanks Randy
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It puzzles me how some people are claiming they saw this coming and the rest of us were all just duped by razzmatazz. Whether the Lerner reign lasted eight years or eighty, there's no way you could tell it was going to go the way it has.
Not strictly true in my view - his track record at the Brown's up to that point had been atrocious and there were plenty of Browns fans all too ready to express disbelief at the esteem in which he was being held by Villa fans, and to warn us that he was an awful owner, and not to be surprised if it all went pear shaped. That only mildly tempered my enthusiasm and optimism as I still hoped maybe it would be different for us, and at least he had money and wasn't Ellis. It looked good initially but possibly only because he had MON in situ who was at least able to keep us looking decent for a while whilst emptying the coffers.
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"The slums of Chicago are full of Day 1 leaders of the US Open".
No direct relation to Villa but I quite like this quote.
It does not make any sense, they don't play golf in the slums of Chicago, you should check it out. You might need a decent set of clubs mind.
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"The slums of Chicago are full of Day 1 leaders of the US Open".
No direct relation to Villa but I quite like this quote.
It does not make any sense, they don't play golf in the slums of Chicago, you should check it out. You might need a decent set of clubs mind.
And a turbocharged buggy might come in useful.
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Scolari. Isn't he facing charges in Portugal?
Edit. Yes. Tax fraud investigation.
Edit Edit.I 'm in the wrong thread.
Whatever. He's too old.
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If Randy was self made he wouldn't have made the mistakes he did in squandering so much money on average players, but the money was given to him by his father and there are plenty of examples in British history of family fortunes being wasted.
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I'm guessing this is what can happen when you inherit a fortune if you are not streetwise and savvy and have lived a closeted life of privilege without any exposure to life's trials and tribulations and pariahs & shishesters who will eat you for breakfast then take a dump in your flower bed.
Not sure what Lerners next venture will be now he appears to be out of sports ownership but hopefully he's learned some lessons .
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"The slums of Chicago are full of Day 1 leaders of the US Open".
No direct relation to Villa but I quite like this quote.
It does not make any sense, they don't play golf in the slums of Chicago, you should check it out. You might need a decent set of clubs mind.
Apologies it was from the masters . Peter Jacobsen Jacobsen said: “The slums of Chicago are full of first-round leaders.”
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Not sure if this has been posted elsewhere
http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/aston-villa-randy-lerner-spent-7131673
£214.8 Million outgoing on players. Presume it doesn't incluse wages, signing on fees, agent fees, Bodymoor, Villa Park, Holte Hotel and paying of managers and staff, but it must be well over £300 Million that Randy has spent since August 2006.
If only some of that cash had been spent better.
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Not sure if this has been posted elsewhere
http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/aston-villa-randy-lerner-spent-7131673
£214.8 Million outgoing on players. Presume it doesn't incluse wages, signing on fees, agent fees, Bodymoor, Villa Park, Holte Hotel and paying of managers and staff, but it must be well over £300 Million that Randy has spent since August 2006.
If only some of that cash had been spent better.
Yet still, some simpletons will insist he's taking money out of the club.
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Not sure if this has been posted elsewhere
http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/aston-villa-randy-lerner-spent-7131673
£214.8 Million outgoing on players. Presume it doesn't incluse wages, signing on fees, agent fees, Bodymoor, Villa Park, Holte Hotel and paying of managers and staff, but it must be well over £300 Million that Randy has spent since August 2006.
If only some of that cash had been spent better.
Yet still, some simpletons will insist he's taking money out of the club.
Is that all out of his own pocket or does that include income as well?
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Not sure if this has been posted elsewhere
http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/aston-villa-randy-lerner-spent-7131673
£214.8 Million outgoing on players. Presume it doesn't incluse wages, signing on fees, agent fees, Bodymoor, Villa Park, Holte Hotel and paying of managers and staff, but it must be well over £300 Million that Randy has spent since August 2006.
If only some of that cash had been spent better.
Yet still, some simpletons will insist he's taking money out of the club.
Is that all out of his own pocket or does that include income as well?
That's just him.
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Not sure if this has been posted elsewhere
http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/aston-villa-randy-lerner-spent-7131673
£214.8 Million outgoing on players. Presume it doesn't incluse wages, signing on fees, agent fees, Bodymoor, Villa Park, Holte Hotel and paying of managers and staff, but it must be well over £300 Million that Randy has spent since August 2006.
If only some of that cash had been spent better.
Yet still, some simpletons will insist he's taking money out of the club.
By my reckoning, they have all departed for pastures new.
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As a complete waste of everyone's time and effort would be my answer.
I honestly can't work out just what Lerner thought he was getting into but I'm glad that he has given up because the last 3 seasons have been nothing short of painful.
Goodbye you wont be missed.
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He came in like a knight on a white steed looking to be our champion. Got smacked a couple of times by a more experienced knight only known as 'Pubehead'. Got injured, lost heart and wandered away, sadly, to whence he came. Now, we are seeking a new champion. With a bigger lance and a cleverer strategy.
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The twat that couldn't even sell us properly.
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Id say he's put the club in it's most perilous position in it's history. And I'm not being melodramatic I genuinely am worried .
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I also think that his lasting epitaph will be as the owner who could not find a proper buyer for us.
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I think he bought the club on a whim and now he's selling it on a whim. What sort of person buys a football club plays with it gets bored inside 3 years and now wants to flog it. Weird man.
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I'm amazed at some of these posts. I don't see the reason to panic in May. You get the impression from some that Randy made his statement and now is firmly sat on his arse doing nothing waiting for the phone to ring. I'm pretty sure it doesn't work like that. He has told his current employees to keep going in their existing capacity and not let the weeds grow. If that involves securing some contracts even a player or two then that is what Lambert will do within the guidelines he has been set. Those don't have to follow along the same guidelines as last summer or January even. Circumstances might have changed. But to think that the club will be identical to what is and therefore we are certain to go down is ludicrous and negative to say the least.
It seems with each passing day if nothing happens then the world is coming to an end. And it certainly doesn't help with some of the bollocks being spouted at TBAR that simply raises and dashes hopes. When the next new made up billionaire isn't buying us Randy is a wanker and cannot sell the club. It's farcical. Nobody really knows what has happened or is happening behind the scenes no more than we did when Doug sold the club and Randy showed up pretty much out of nowhere. The club will be sold, we may or may not have Lambert as manager. That is as much as anyone can say for certain.
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I think he bought the club on a whim and now he's selling it on a whim. What sort of person buys a football club plays with it gets bored inside 3 years and now wants to flog it. Weird man.
Financial crisis + divorce = he can't afford it?
But I don't think anyone buys a football club on a whim.
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He's made a cock up of almost everything to do with the footballing side, I wouldn't be surprised if his attempt to sell turns into a major clusterfuck as well.
All this talk of news embargos and mystery meetings and people flying in for announcements, it's wishful thinking, it's what we want to be happening. The reality is what we don't want happening. We are going again. Year 5 of struggle.
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I'm amazed at some of these posts. I don't see the reason to panic in May. You get the impression from some that Randy made his statement and now is firmly sat on his arse doing nothing waiting for the phone to ring. I'm pretty sure it doesn't work like that. He has told his current employees to keep going in their existing capacity and not let the weeds grow. If that involves securing some contracts even a player or two then that is what Lambert will do within the guidelines he has been set. Those don't have to follow along the same guidelines as last summer or January even. Circumstances might have changed. But to think that the club will be identical to what is and therefore we are certain to go down is ludicrous and negative to say the least.
"Ludicrous and negative" ? Or reality ?
The club is an absolute shambles . Merely a week after the last game and already the first player appears out the door, and he's one of the better performers from the last sorry season. Your unwavering optimism is both admirable but also naive.
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I'm amazed at some of these posts. I don't see the reason to panic in May. You get the impression from some that Randy made his statement and now is firmly sat on his arse doing nothing waiting for the phone to ring. I'm pretty sure it doesn't work like that. He has told his current employees to keep going in their existing capacity and not let the weeds grow. If that involves securing some contracts even a player or two then that is what Lambert will do within the guidelines he has been set. Those don't have to follow along the same guidelines as last summer or January even. Circumstances might have changed. But to think that the club will be identical to what is and therefore we are certain to go down is ludicrous and negative to say the least.
"Ludicrous and negative" ? Or reality ?
The club is an absolute shambles . Merely a week after the last game and already the first player appears out the door, and he's one of the better performers from the last sorry season. Your unwavering optimism is both admirable but also naive.
And your constant pessimism is a pain in the arse. "Most perilous position in history." Really? Worse than being in the third division? Than finishing halfway up division two? Than asking supporters to turn up on Sunday mornings to paint the ground? Now you're complaining that a player who a couple of months ago wasn't good enough might - only might - be leaving and a quarter-billion pound business deal hasn't been concluded within a week.
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"Most perilous position in history." Really? Worse than being in the third division? Than finishing halfway up division two? Than asking supporters to turn up on Sunday mornings to paint the ground?
The internet and the Premier League didn't exist when any of those things were happening so they don't count.
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The twat that couldn't even sell us properly.
This clearly wins the first stupidest post of pre-season award.
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The twat that couldn't even sell us properly.
This clearly wins the first stupidest post of pre-season award.
close second to the General's 2014/15 season prediction
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The twat that couldn't even sell us properly.
This clearly wins the first stupidest post of pre-season award.
close second to the General's 2014/15 season prediction
Which is what?
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The twat that couldn't even sell us properly.
This clearly wins the first stupidest post of pre-season award.
close second to the General's 2014/15 season prediction
Which is what?
runner up and fa cup winner no doubt
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There are some people on here who I wonder how they make it out of the door to work each day such is the level of their pessimism.
There seems to be no inbetween from it is all great or absolutely everything in the world is utterly shit.
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There are some people on here who I wonder how they make it out of the door to work each day such is the level of their pessimism.
There seems to be no inbetween from it is all great or absolutely everything in the world is utterly shit.
Just like the Villa in that respect though.
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For example, the Supporters Trust statement about Lerner seems fair enough. The short version of that being thanks for the money, sell quickly and to someone good.
Some of the slating he is taking because of the shit we have served up on the pitch is grossly unfair in my view.
We have people posting here who are so miserable they believe he has spent years ripping us off when the evidence is absolutely to the contrary.
He might have buggered it up but it wasn't for the want of him chucking his own cash at it.
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What I don't understand is why he never saw the need to get someone with football knowledge into the club's administration.
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What I don't understand is why he never saw the need to get someone with football knowledge into the club's administration.
Because Lerner is incompetent and knows very little about the game. Ditto his shiny faced bag carrier.
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http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=HSH--SJKVQQ
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The longer this drags on, the more he'll be remembered as a clueless, inept chancer.
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He might have buggered it up but it wasn't for the want of him chucking his own cash at it.
That's the thing that riles me on here. The fact that there will still be people who suggest he:
1. Will make money out of the club when he sells it (not a chance)
2. Has been taking money out of the club (entirely untrue, he's been spaffing it into the club).
3. Hasn't really spent much money.
Mentioning no names but a former poster on here who has now departed used to insist that point 2 above was true, even though it was demonstrably incorrect by even the quickest of glances at the accounts, or the figures in the press. We'd explain why he was wrong, and then a few weeks later, he'd resurface again insisting it was true.
It's not just an opinion or conjecture - it is a cold, hard fact, so factual that accountants signed their name to it - that Lerner has spent a fortune on the club.
I have plenty of issues with his dreadful management of the club and the way he watched so much of that money get wasted, he's been a disaster on that front for four years now, but I honestly can't believe that people still seem to doubt the fact he's spent a lot of money on us.
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The longer this drags on, the more he'll be remembered as a clueless, inept chancer.
unfortunately this is true. The quality of his withdrawal really will inform public opinion.
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The longer this drags on, the more he'll be remembered as a clueless, inept chancer.
Yep. The bad years now outnumber the good, unfortunately.
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The longer this drags on, the more he'll be remembered as a clueless, inept chancer.
at what point will it be determined that it has dragged on too long? And who will make that determination? It's been a week and there are some who already have that opinion. That's not fair at all. I agree if it hasn't been resolved by the start of the season and the correct level of investment on the playing side has not been made, then it will really taint his tenure. I just don't think he will want it to go that long.
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What I don't understand is why he never saw the need to get someone with football knowledge into the club's administration.
He must have thought Paul Faulkner had such pedigree.
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I work for a huge American corporation who have been trying to sell their European arm for a year without success.
I know Premier League football is an entirely special case when it comes to such dealings but it may not be as quick as people think.
The fact that Lambert was retained to me points to a deal later on this year.
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I work for a huge American corporation who have been trying to sell their European arm for a year without success.
I know Premier League football is an entirely special case when it comes to such dealings but it may not be as quick as people think.
The fact that Lambert was retained to me points to a deal later on this year.
I don't think you can compare PL football, arguable the best marketed sports league in the world to any other business. If you are an American company that wants exposure in Asia, as an example, and have some interest in sport, then there are few better vehicles than the PL in order to do that.
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The longer this drags on, the more he'll be remembered as a clueless, inept chancer.
at what point will it be determined that it has dragged on too long? And who will make that determination?
If we're still in this state when the season starts? As for the second question that's subjective isn't?
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Haven't Everton been for sale for about 10 years.
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Haven't Everton been for sale for about 10 years.
This is getting like the Barry penalty.
According to someone on here who's spoken to an Everton director, Kenwright is saying that publicly but has no intention of selling.
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Haven't Everton been for sale for about 10 years.
This is getting like the Barry penalty.
According to someone on here who's spoken to an Everton director, Kenwright is saying that publicly but has no intention of selling.
What penalty?
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Haven't Everton been for sale for about 10 years.
This is getting like the Barry penalty.
According to someone on here who's spoken to an Everton director, Kenwright is saying that publicly but has no intention of selling.
What penalty?
The one Barry didn't take...
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Haven't Everton been for sale for about 10 years.
This is getting like the Barry penalty.
According to someone on here who's spoken to an Everton director, Kenwright is saying that publicly but has no intention of selling.
What penalty?
The one Barry didn't take...
Why ?
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Haven't Everton been for sale for about 10 years.
This is getting like the Barry penalty.
According to someone on here who's spoken to an Everton director, Kenwright is saying that publicly but has no intention of selling.
What penalty?
The one Barry didn't take...
Why ?
he had a vision in his car that if he took a penalty a young child would die
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Mostly positive. The ride under MON was the most thrilling in quite sometime. And he has been a sensible owner who has bought into the history of the club. I think he is selling at about the right time, so I wish him well.
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Mostly positive. The ride under MON was the most thrilling in quite sometime. And he has been a sensible owner who has bought into the history of the club. I think he is selling at about the right time, so I wish him well.
The last four years have been a bloody disgrace though, and all the good feeling he generated in those first few years have been absolutely eroded for me.
Good riddance to him. He turned us into perennial relegation strugglers and I for one won't forgive him for that.
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I can only think he appointed Mcleish to spite the villa fans. For that he cannot be forgiven.
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I can only think he appointed Mcleish to spite the villa fans. For that he cannot be forgiven.
Off course he did. I imagine he sat down with Faulkner drew a spider diagram with the goal Fucking Over Villa fans in the middle. Nobody is saying it wasn't a really bad decision but you don't have come out with some Pearls of Misery.
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I can only think he appointed Mcleish to spite the villa fans. For that he cannot be forgiven.
Oh, please, what utter nonsense.
Honestly, do you really believe that? Really?
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I can only think he appointed Mcleish to spite the villa fans. For that he cannot be forgiven.
It's no secret why we ended up with McLeish, it was because of the beloved embarrassing letter from Alex Ferguson bigging up one of his mates.
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I can only think he appointed Mcleish to spite the villa fans. For that he cannot be forgiven.
I thought he was better than Houllier?
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I can only think he appointed Mcleish to spite the villa fans. For that he cannot be forgiven.
I thought he was better than Houllier?
Really? It's time to step away from whatever tipple you are partaking of my friend. Houllier at least had an ethos of playing football even if it fell away at times, McLeish was the very definition of negativity.
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I can only think he appointed Mcleish to spite the villa fans. For that he cannot be forgiven.
I thought he was better than Houllier?
Really? It's time to step away from whatever tipple you are partaking off my friend. Houllier at least had an ethos of playing football even if it fell away at times, McLeish was the very definition of negativity.
Sorry, should explain the backstory here. Sillhillvilla spent quite a long time trying to argue that McLeish was better than Houllier, and yet here he is saying that the McLeish appointment was the unforgivable low point. I'm just trying to find out which it is.
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I can only think he appointed Mcleish to spite the villa fans. For that he cannot be forgiven.
I thought he was better than Houllier?
Really? It's time to step away from whatever tipple you are partaking of my friend. Houllier at least had an ethos of playing football even if it fell away at times, McLeish was the very definition of negativity.
I think you'l find Monty is referring to Sihillvilla's suggestion that McLeish was better than Houllier.
Meanwhile, pour me a glass of whatever that is you're drinking.
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I can only think he appointed Mcleish to spite the villa fans. For that he cannot be forgiven.
I thought he was better than Houllier?
Really? It's time to step away from whatever tipple you are partaking of my friend. Houllier at least had an ethos of playing football even if it fell away at times, McLeish was the very definition of negativity.
I think you'l find Monty is referring to Sihillvilla's suggestion that McLeish was better than Houllier.
Meanwhile, pour me a glass of whatever that is you're drinking.
You're far to middle class to drink what I am drinking Paulie.....Asda home brand premium lager.
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I can only think he appointed Mcleish to spite the villa fans. For that he cannot be forgiven.
I thought he was better than Houllier?
Really? It's time to step away from whatever tipple you are partaking of my friend. Houllier at least had an ethos of playing football even if it fell away at times, McLeish was the very definition of negativity.
I think you'l find Monty is referring to Sihillvilla's suggestion that McLeish was better than Houllier.
Meanwhile, pour me a glass of whatever that is you're drinking.
You're far to middle class to drink what I am drinking Paulie.....Asda home brand premium lager.
I'm drinking wine from a box and eating Maltesers.
:-(
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I can only think he appointed Mcleish to spite the villa fans. For that he cannot be forgiven.
I thought he was better than Houllier?
Really? It's time to step away from whatever tipple you are partaking of my friend. Houllier at least had an ethos of playing football even if it fell away at times, McLeish was the very definition of negativity.
I think you'l find Monty is referring to Sihillvilla's suggestion that McLeish was better than Houllier.
Meanwhile, pour me a glass of whatever that is you're drinking.
You're far to middle class to drink what I am drinking Paulie.....Asda home brand premium lager.
I'm drinking wine from a box and eating Maltesers.
:-(
In your Y fronts and gravy stained vest no doubt......wine out of a box? I dream of wine out of a box.
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I can only think he appointed Mcleish to spite the villa fans. For that he cannot be forgiven.
I thought he was better than Houllier?
Really? It's time to step away from whatever tipple you are partaking of my friend. Houllier at least had an ethos of playing football even if it fell away at times, McLeish was the very definition of negativity.
I think you'l find Monty is referring to Sihillvilla's suggestion that McLeish was better than Houllier.
Meanwhile, pour me a glass of whatever that is you're drinking.
You're far to middle class to drink what I am drinking Paulie.....Asda home brand premium lager.
I'm drinking wine from a box and eating Maltesers.
:-(
In your Y fronts and gravy stained vest no doubt......wine out of a box? I dream of wine out of a box.
Whoever thought of wine out of the Box is an even bigger idiot than our last manager (that being Fergie's mate not MON2.0), I am always spilling the damn stuff!
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I can only think he appointed Mcleish to spite the villa fans. For that he cannot be forgiven.
I thought he was better than Houllier?
Really? It's time to step away from whatever tipple you are partaking of my friend. Houllier at least had an ethos of playing football even if it fell away at times, McLeish was the very definition of negativity.
I think you'l find Monty is referring to Sihillvilla's suggestion that McLeish was better than Houllier.
Meanwhile, pour me a glass of whatever that is you're drinking.
You're far to middle class to drink what I am drinking Paulie.....Asda home brand premium lager.
I'm drinking wine from a box and eating Maltesers.
:-(
In your Y fronts and gravy stained vest no doubt......wine out of a box? I dream of wine out of a box.
Whoever thought of wine out of the Box is an even bigger idiot than our last manager (that being Fergie's mate not MON2.0), I am always spilling the damn stuff!
I bet there are people who don't open the box and squeeze the bag too
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Indeed! Also, unless you are a posh twat, the only time you are ever going to have wine in a box is on a picnic or at a dodgy music festival. Sorry to the posh twats on here, am sure you are just really friendly people :-X
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I can only think he appointed Mcleish to spite the villa fans. For that he cannot be forgiven.
I thought he was better than Houllier?
Really? It's time to step away from whatever tipple you are partaking of my friend. Houllier at least had an ethos of playing football even if it fell away at times, McLeish was the very definition of negativity.
I think you'l find Monty is referring to Sihillvilla's suggestion that McLeish was better than Houllier.
Meanwhile, pour me a glass of whatever that is you're drinking.
You're far to middle class to drink what I am drinking Paulie.....Asda home brand premium lager.
I'm drinking wine from a box and eating Maltesers.
:-(
In your Y fronts and gravy stained vest no doubt......wine out of a box? I dream of wine out of a box.
Whoever thought of wine out of the Box is an even bigger idiot than our last manager (that being Fergie's mate not MON2.0), I am always spilling the damn stuff!
I bet there are people who don't open the box and squeeze the bag too
I open the box, take out the bag, hang it on a stand and then have it intravenously fed to me. I'm not a piss head but I do like the odd drink or two. ;D
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I just let the butler see to it
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So close and yet so far.....
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A well meaning div.
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A well meaning div.
Winner
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From an article in the FT:
Premier League pay hits new high (http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/41620d92-ebff-11e3-ab1b-00144feabdc0.html#axzz33iOnTR00)
The advent of Financial Fair Play – new rules from governing body Uefa aimed at making clubs live within their means and limiting a new owner’s ability to come in and spend wildly – was labelled “a change potentially as profound as that brought about by the Bosman ruling [which let out-of-contract players leave a club for free]” by Deloitte.
But the effects of previous big spenders are still being felt. Chelsea-owner Roman Abramovich has loaned just under £1bn to the club since buying it in 2003.
Chelsea and some other clubs, such as Newcastle United, Aston Villa and Queens Park Rangers, benefit from so-called “soft loans” from their owners. This meant that despite combined net debt of £1.4bn, the four clubs paid less than £1m in financing costs for the 2012/13 season.
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oh Randolf, gave it the big one, spilt his wine and didnt want to play no more. really a poor custodian of a great football club. he has put "US" in a situation that could for a long time f us up. and he says he supports Aston Villa. Proud History.
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He came and had a go.
Man City joined in, he gave up.
He tried to sell up and it took a long time.
He gambled on free transfers and loans to protect his investment.
To be continued.....
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Bump
2006 - MON years; optimism, enjoyment, then a bit frustrating, followed by horrifying betrayal and associated devastation in a week in August
2010 - appointed safe pair of hands followed with internationally acclaimed team builder
2011 - IATB very ill, appointed Pedestrian ( but recommended) Safe Pair Of Hands after deputy to IATB had finished season OK
2012 - relegation battle. Sacked PSPOH, went after Scandinavian potential superstar, appointed go-getting Scottish manager wanting young and hungry players. Coincided with needing to balance books and then some. Partly FFP, partly own business in USA.
2013 - relegation battle
2014 - relegation battle
2015 - relegation battle. Sacked CEO PF, appointed TF. Sacked GGSM, appointed Mouthy but Bostin and Confident Manager. Witnessed Renaissance.
FACup
14th place in PL.
2016
FACup again, 5th place premier League, Manager of The Year.
2017
FACup again, 1st place Premier League, MOTY, CL semi finalists.
2018 - 2040
FACup again, UEFA Champions League Cup winners...MOTY....
2040 -
FA Cup again. Outer Galactic Arm League Champions....
Look at the middle bit. 2010 - 2015. We've all suffered. I would really like Randy to enjoy the Villa getting somewhere, as we all would.
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Question to be answered on 31st May.
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So close......and yet so far.
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Good intentions but a couple of strange managerial appointments. GH was in his sixties, with a history of bad health and had been out of management for three years. TSM 1 had just got our local 'rivals' relegated and had been criticised for his style of play throughout his time there. TSM 2 was also a bad appointment, although to be fair seemed a good one at the time. But as I have said before, in any job if you make a bad appointment nobody will accept the 'good idea at the time' line, you will be held accountable if it turns out to be a bad choice. He also stuck with TSM 2 for too long, which was strange as he acted swiftly with TSM1.
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Failure. last 5 years have been dreadful (apart from last 2 months under TS)
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If we lift that trophy having stayed up, in what may be Lerners last game ? He would go down as a legend.
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Failure. last 5 years have been dreadful (apart from last 2 months under TS)
Agreed, but if we stay up (which we will) then lift the FA Cup at the end of the month he will be by default an absolute legend.
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His reign's not over yet!
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His reign's not over yet!
I think you're right there.
I think he has found the club harder to sell than he thought. I think he has had a change of thought and decided to keep the club but step back from any day-to-day involvement. I can see him growing the club commercially and diluting his ownership by bringing in key investors. The FFP rules have pulled up the drawbridge on major new investment in clubs and Lerner has seen this and was, I think, one of those that voted against it. However, with any financial rules, there will always be ways around them if you want to go that way.
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If we stay up and win the FA Cup, he might even change his mind about selling.
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If we stay up and win the FA Cup, he might even change his mind about selling.
Yep. If the above happens and he departs I think we are looking at some sort of statue , failing that a large plaque.
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I saw an old Guardian article from April of 2010 in passing the other day. Some may remember it. There was a suggestion, including what they had quoted from O Neill, that Pube Head was looking for assurances about the summer from Randy. Further it was suggested that due to fan discontent (this was after the Chelsea 7-1 all but ended our top 4 hopes) and an impending budget slash, O Neill may have been eyeing a way out.
So was his departure really that surprising? I recall in pre-season him not being to enthusiastic. He seemed to have lost interest. And of course the nature of his departure was still totally self serving (he knew what was coming and decided to fuck off before ruining his record here) and horrifically timed. He should have left in May and gone with a little good will (close but no cigar).
Anyway, without opening up another O Neill debate, it did seem like one or two whispers saw O Neill doing a runner even as far back as April that year and saw the Austerity measures in the horizon.
Anyway. As for Randy. He started off with great vigour but ultimately didn't have the nous. He only thought four years ahead and couldn't sustain what he was doing. He basically gambled on us being top 4. The implosion since has been partly a result of his financial dealings here, and also of course, mostly poor appointments since O Neill fakked off.
However. If his tenure brings about our first FA Cup trophy since 57, then that will go a long way into giving him a more popular legacy. And indeed appointing Fox seems a step in the right direction, and the D.O.F role has also been discussed. Whether we eventually need or get one is another matter but the identification that our structure needs work is at least a step in the right direction. He's got to back us financially again. He can provide more than he has whilst staying within FFP. He doesn't have to be here every week, he just needs to show he's still actively trying to push us forward, rather than merely surviving on a meagre budget. Again it was more gambling. Gambling that we would have just enough about us to stay in the league whilst operating on a shoe-string. I think this season was the first that Lerner realised there was always an inevitable outcome doing that. Thankfully we finally acted on canning Lambert.
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O Neill may have been eyeing a way out. So was his departure really that surprising? I recall in pre-season him not being to enthusiastic. He seemed to have lost interest. And of course the nature of his departure was still totally self serving (he knew what was coming and decided to fuck off before ruining his record here) and horrifically timed. He should have left in May and gone with a little good will (close but no cigar).
Anyway, without opening up another O Neill debate, it did seem like one or two whispers saw O Neill doing a runner even as far back as April that year and saw the Austerity measures in the horizon.
Sorry to carry on about O'Neill, but does anyone remember that Twitter story that O'Neill had quit being picked up by the media? It might well have been total nonsense, but who knows if there was any truth behind it. It wasn't long after that when he did actually go I think.
Lerner was incredibly badly treated by O'Neill I think. I seem to remember him flirting with Liverpool at one point too.
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O Neill may have been eyeing a way out. So was his departure really that surprising? I recall in pre-season him not being to enthusiastic. He seemed to have lost interest. And of course the nature of his departure was still totally self serving (he knew what was coming and decided to fuck off before ruining his record here) and horrifically timed. He should have left in May and gone with a little good will (close but no cigar).
Anyway, without opening up another O Neill debate, it did seem like one or two whispers saw O Neill doing a runner even as far back as April that year and saw the Austerity measures in the horizon.
Sorry to carry on about O'Neill, but does anyone remember that Twitter story that O'Neill had quit being picked up by the media? It might well have been total nonsense, but who knows if there was any truth behind it. It wasn't long after that when he did actually go I think.
Lerner was incredibly badly treated by O'Neill I think. I seem to remember him flirting with Liverpool at one point too.
Yeah I do. it was shortly before we played Bolton away in April 2010.
My first thoughts where immediately horrified.
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If we stay up and win the FA Cup, he might even change his mind about selling.
I think he might well stop actively looking for a buyer regardless.
It looks like the club has reached a point where it's pretty much self sustaining.
It looks like he's got a CEO in place who can actually run the club as opposed to Paul Faulkner who in retrospect seems to have been more of an operations manager type role.
If these two points pan out it's probably actually easier to keep us than try to sell us with the proviso that everything has it's price so if the right if the right "sort" turns up with a difficult to turn down kind of offer.
He's certainly in a position where he can sit back from any day to day affairs (which is probably better for him and us) and only be involved in big decisions, extra investment, sign off on change of manager and such like.
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If we stay up and win the FA Cup, he might even change his mind about selling.
I think he might well stop actively looking for a buyer regardless.
It looks like the club has reached a point where it's pretty much self sustaining.
It looks like he's got a CEO in place who can actually run the club as opposed to Paul Faulkner who in retrospect seems to have been more of an operations manager type role.
If these two points pan out it's probably actually easier to keep us than try to sell us with the proviso that everything has it's price so if the right if the right "sort" turns up with a difficult to turn down kind of offer.
He's certainly in a position where he can sit back from any day to day affairs (which is probably better for him and us) and only be involved in big decisions, extra investment, sign off on change of manager and such like.
Good points ViD. If I was Lerner I wouldn't sell, with the decisions he's made in the last 12 months, Lambert contract aside, are possibly the best he's made since he bought the club. It's ironic that as he's started to do that he's put it up for sale. Bizarre.....
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2006-2010 A new start and a dream ticket of an astute manager and a moneyed owner. What could possibly go wrong. Well it all blossomed a lot quicker than expected before the realisation set in that the manager wasn't quite up to his reputation and the owner was still only a billionaire after all. In retrospect, O'Neill was probably the manager from hell. A big risk if you said 'yes' and even bigger if you said 'no', courtesy of his media friends. Maybe we climbed too quickly in year two and money ended up being spent on shoring up faltering top 4 charges from launched from feet of clay, rather than investing with the long term in mind. We won fuck all, O'Neill's CV got worse rather than better and Lerner got poorer.
2010-11 Tries to do right thing, but ends up spending big money merely to arrest decline. The rivets are staring to pop.
2011-12 Can't do right for doing wrong. It starts to become apparent that the club is in serious financial crap. Brickbats that consisted of 'should have done more to keep O'Neill' are replaced with 'should have got rid sooner'. We didn't want the new manager before he arrived and it didn't get any better.
2013-2015 Did we do a Leeds? Pfft - amateurs. They may have had tens of thousands of pounds worth of tropical fish in the boardroom, but we got a 4 mill pub at the end of the street. With a 43 million pound loss posted at one stage and players contracts we can no longer afford we ought to be swimming in the same divisional backwaters as other financially knackered former greats. But we arent. Lerner sticks at it and takes a shedload of financial pain himself. Against this backdrop we unbelievably see out the storm and stay in the premier league. It's actually a minor miracle, but are people grateful or even offering a proverbial pat on the back?
On the pitch, Lamberts team is like a motor bike struggling to start. Fits of cylinders briefly spitting into life, but mostly the dispiriting lifeless whirr that suggests it's going to take a good deal more than a beefy kick start to get on the road.
2015 more compo and another fresh face, Well, fresh if you ignore the effects of sleep privation. From absolutely nowhere we are playing the best football seen from a Villa team for decades. We're are in the Cup Final and with greater reason for hope we had in 1957, let alone 2000. I actually want Lerner to stay. New owners may bring better executive management but it's only going to seem even less like my Aston Villa than it already does. I hope he's at the cup final and sees us win. It's not just the supporters that deserve a grand day in the sun after so many years of pain.
The future belongs to Louzie.
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I like him, think he really has the best interests of the club at heart but unfortunately life got in the way. Messy Divorce, kids moving out and to different schools, us 3000 miles away all leads to the last couple of years.
The numbers between our every day lives and his are of course different but I think he faced the same midlife pressures that a lot of us have faced and like when people avoid those issues for "another day" he did the same. The geography just makes it a bit easier for him to do it.
I would like to see him stay as I am very protective of the heritage of the club so always fear change and new owners as ultimately the club and it's cultural heritage is more important than short term results.
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According to Tom Fox at the Trust AGM he changed his mind about selling it shortly after saying it was for sale. If it was being touted for sale Fox wouldn't have come.
Right bid for us and Randy it will be sold but that is nowhere on the horizon.
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For sheer incompetence. No let's be charitable, a well meaning buffoon.