Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: sonlyme on December 21, 2012, 02:15:09 PM
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I am puzzled.
I don't go in for conspiracy theories - much. But I'm getting the distinct feeling that 'football's number 1 expert' has it in for the Villa.
(https://si0.twimg.com/profile_images/58449837/paul_chuckle.jpg)
Lovely Lawro - but why does he hate the Villa?
Reading his latest Premiership predictions for the weekend on the BBC Sport website I was struck by yet another pessimistic opinion of the Villa.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20784357 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20784357)
Lawrenson says - The Villa fans seem to have accepted where they are at right now under Paul Lambert. They know they don't have much quality but, if their team gives them absolutely everything, then they are happy with that.
The thing that gets me is the middle bit.
'They know they don't have much quality'
Do we? I don't know that at all. And if I try to be as unbiased as I can be - Villa's second goal against Lawrenson's beloved Liverpool last weekend still speaks of nothing but quality. Indeed - if Liverpool, or Arsenal, or Man Utd had scored it we would have had ten minutes of MOTD dedicated to analysis and back-slapping such was its quality. But still - it was scored by the Villa - so make some nice noises and move on.
But this is not all that preplexes me. This does.
(http://i1071.photobucket.com/albums/u501/Grommmet/MarkLawrensonsPremierLeaguepredictions_zps6445aa0a.jpg)
I know - we are in transition. We only just escaped last year. We've had a slow start, etc. But compare where Lawro has us - and has QPR - and most of that is pre-Harry.
I may be alone but I am sensing a dismissive tone from Lawrenson when talking of Villa.
This is not like Lily Savage's prediction - which while annoying - was at least designed to get him some attention and boost his fledgling media career. Lawrenson's ire seems to run deeper - have we done him some terrible injustice? Because his view of where and who Villa are does not in any way tally with mine.
I shall keep watch fellow Villans. And update where necessary.
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Perhaps his sister bought him some claret and blue curtains for the bedroom once, but they didn't quite go with his bedding.
I just hate the bloke's voice, it goes through me. I only watch MoTD once in a blue moon, that's when Lawro or the Jug-Eared Goalhanger aren't present. Last week I was in heaven, as the Villa won and neither of those pricks were on board.
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I hate the bloke- he's seems permenantly pissed off to be doing a job most people would kill for and doesn't put much effort in to it.
However, I can't really argue with that synopsis of our team- we're not 3 points off the relegation zone for no reason and Benteke aside you can argue there's not a great deal of quality there.
If he said the same about Sunderland or West Ham you wouldn't bat an eyelid. In fact, I bet supporters of most teams in the Premier League think he's got it in for them.
Such is football.
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Perhaps his sister bought him some claret and blue curtains for the bedroom once, but they didn't quite go with his bedding.
I just hate the bloke's voice, it goes through me. I only watch MoTD once in a blue moon, that's when Lawro or the Jug-Eared Goalhanger aren't present. Last week I was in heaven, as the Villa won and neither of those pricks were on board.
Lawro was there with Shearer.
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was he actually that good as a player ? I know he won a few things with Liverpoo but most of their fans I know seem to hold Hughes,Hansen, Hysen, Scales, Thompson and even Skrtel in higher regard than the moustached Irish Maldini.
oh and by the way he is a Villa hating twat.
UTV
The Doc
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I find him arrogant, sarcastic, sometimes ill-informed and decidedly unfunny, but he was a decent player.
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Lawro was there with Shearer.
You're right, I must have got carried away in the joy of Lineker not being there.
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he has NOT got it in for Villa.
He's just a c unt !!
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I find him arrogant, sarcastic, sometimes ill-informed and decidedly unfunny, but he was a decent player.
Yes. This is biggest crime.
Also:
Happy Christmas Lawro
Since this is the last Mediawatch before the mid-point of the season, it seems a decent time to take a look at how Mark Lawrenson's predictions for The BBC Website are coming along.
If Lawro's foretellings came to pass, then Norwich would be in the bottom three, rather than their actual position of eighth. West Brom are 13th in Lawroworld, while back in reality they sit in seventh. Liverpool are of course five places better off in the world according to Mark, while all Arsenal's troubles are soothed by their position of second on the Lawrotable.
However, QPR are the biggest winners, sitting a very comfortable eighth place with 27 points in the Lawrostandings, as opposed to their actual position of 19th with ten.
Happy Christmas Lawro. Don't ever change.
(F365)
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I hate the bloke- he's seems permenantly pissed off to be doing a job most people would kill for and doesn't put much effort in to it.
The same applies to most of the MoTD team. They showed themselves up in South Africa when one of the minnows (possibly New Zealand) were playing and they all admitted they knew nothing about them.
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The same applies to most of the MoTD team. They showed themselves up in South Africa when one of the minnows (possibly New Zealand) were playing and they all admitted they knew nothing about them.
They need a clear out really. Sky, mainly because of the Gray fiasco, had a clear out and found in Gary Neville a fresh new outlook on punditry. They also regularly add new faces to the Soccer Saturday line-up albeit to mixed results. MOTD have had the same faces pretty much for the last 15 years with Linekar, Hansen and Lawro with only the addition of Mr Charisma as a regular. Their one good hope, Dixon, was lost to ESPN.
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Don't forget his very successful period as Newcastle's "Defensive Co-ordinator"
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I agree with Somniloqism. Long overdue for a total clear out and rethink.
The current style is tired, insipid, lacking in any insight and in Lawrenson's case also lazy, and in Shearer's case lacking in anything worth listening to. In fact, I've got into the habit of either switching the sound off or flicking channels between games.
Hanson I still have a bit of time for, but it's really not good enough to rely just on animated computer wizardry to keep us interested during the punditry. (Which it doesn't anyway)
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"Rubber faced Prick"
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Pat Nevin's pretty good, but he seems to be confined to Five Live with that odious muppet Green. I think he does the Euro Vase games on Channel 5 as well.
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Lawrenson was a classy centre back in his time (yes, I know the word 'classy is difficult to associate with ML).
His punditry is - like most - lazy and lacking real analysis.
TV seems to think that unless someone has played the game at a decent level, they cannot possibly be any good at analysis. But it's clear by looking at the contribution of people like David Conn, Michael Cox, James Richardson and others that there are some very good analysts out there.
Shame we don't see them on TV much.
I find I pretty much turn off to the sound when watching footie on TV, and I rarely read anything that is written by ex-footballers.
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I find him arrogant, sarcastic, sometimes ill-informed and decidedly unfunny, but he was a decent player.
Yes. This is biggest crime.
Also:
Happy Christmas Lawro
Since this is the last Mediawatch before the mid-point of the season, it seems a decent time to take a look at how Mark Lawrenson's predictions for The BBC Website are coming along.
If Lawro's foretellings came to pass, then Norwich would be in the bottom three, rather than their actual position of eighth. West Brom are 13th in Lawroworld, while back in reality they sit in seventh. Liverpool are of course five places better off in the world according to Mark, while all Arsenal's troubles are soothed by their position of second on the Lawrotable.
However, QPR are the biggest winners, sitting a very comfortable eighth place with 27 points in the Lawrostandings, as opposed to their actual position of 19th with ten.
Happy Christmas Lawro. Don't ever change.
(F365)
That about sums him up!
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They don't analyse - they make lazy repetetive comments.
Looks like they have another clone in the making with Michael Owen. Dear Lord he makes Linekar look like Mick Jagger.
I remember when Ireland made Lampard look like an amateur last NYE for the 3rd goal and Lawro's comment was '..a bit sloppy..' Is thas it?
Personal favourite has to be after about 20 seconds into the Olympic Final (Mexico v Brazil).
'I can see Brazil turning it on and giving us a show today' 10 seconds later Mexico scored and gave them a bit of a lesson that day.
Anyway as others have sited they need a proper clear out.
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was he actually that good as a player ? I know he won a few things with Liverpoo but most of their fans I know seem to hold Hughes,Hansen, Hysen, Scales, Thompson and even Skrtel in higher regard than the moustached Irish Maldini.
oh and by the way he is a Villa hating twat.
UTV
The Doc
To be fair he was a very good player and the likes of Hysen and especially Sclaes can in no way be compared to him.
As a pundit he is shocking
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The problem is there's no real analysis going on here. I agree with you, Sonlyme, in that I see plenty of quality in our Villa side. The problem is these players of ours don't play for clubs the media promote and deem as "fashionable". A case in point the recent hoohah about Arsenal signing five of their young players onto long contracts. These five players - in the eyes of lazy, herd mentality football journos - are "quality". I happen to think Ciaran Clark, Nathan Baker, Andreas Weimann, Barry Bannan and the rest are every bit as good (I would say "better" but I want to sound as neutral as I can here.) It seems to me Villa would have to win a hundred games on the bounce before they actually start to take us seriously and welcome us to their cosy football narrative of who is "cool" and who is "big". It's a school yard mentality in many ways and it totally dominates (and ruins the credibility) of most football journalism.
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How are Villa getting on in Lawro's prediction table?
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I never thought I'd be writing this but I've been pleasantly surprised by Neville. I read a good article on the Guardian about him:
Gary Neville's punditry is the best, but others need to raise their game (http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/2012/nov/27/gary-neville-punditry-sky-bbc)
It talks about how he puts the old guard to shame. I couldn't agree more. Hopefully it'll be a catalyst for change.
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Good article. The BBC certainly does need to freshen up its format and its faces.
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He's a knob and I cant stand him. I met him at Moor Green with that Stoke fan bell end who used to present stuff in the 90s early noughties... cant recall his name. Nick something? Both charmless horrible pricks.
Oh yes, and he makes Liberace seem like Conan the Barbarian.
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Nick Hancock (appropriately).
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He's a knob and I cant stand him. I met him at Moor Green with that Stoke fan bell end who used to present stuff in the 90s early noughties... cant recall his name. Nick something? Both charmless horrible pricks.
Oh yes, and he makes Liberace seem like Conan the Barbarian.
Nick Hancock. As in whatever happened to?
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Nick Hancock?
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As for Lawrenson, he was a very good player, but his lack of knowledge considering he's employed as a pundit is shocking.
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Hancock occasionally stands in for Murray on Fighting Talk.
As for MOTD, don't ask for a reshuffle, you might get someone worse staring out from the sofa.
Garth Crooks.
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I don't give a shit what he thinks. We're Aston Villa.
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The strange thing is Cricket has a similar model whereby most pundits are ex-players but the level of knowledge they bring is just so much higher.
The worst thing is there are so many good analyst around who could do an excellent job with the football but yet no one is willing to replace the big name ex-player with the guy who can actually do the job. It's not just england with this problem though, football pundits are pretty poor everywhere you go.
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Gary Neville, and then Graeme Souness, are so far ahead of other pundits its embarassing. Hansen knows what he's talking about, but can't really be bothered. I don't think the others even really have much to add. I'm a massive advocate of the BBC generally, but their football coverage - like their cricket coverage used to be - is a good example of how a lack of genuine competition can lead to laziness.
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I used to like MOTD when it was Lynam, Hansen and Brooking.
I think it helped that we were quite good too as I recall.
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Gary Neville, and then Graeme Souness, are so far ahead of other pundits its embarassing. Hansen knows what he's talking about, but can't really be bothered. I don't think the others even really have much to add. I'm a massive advocate of the BBC generally, but their football coverage - like their cricket coverage used to be - is a good example of how a lack of genuine competition can lead to laziness.
Yes, agreed. You don't often hear people praising Souness but he's one of the best as he says it as he sees it rather than being too afraid to criticise for fear of upsetting people or because the TV network want to maintain the match was "great".
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The one thing that Souness can never be accused is being afraid to upset anyone. Sometimes like in punditry it is refreshing though I'm sure he might have measured it better during his managerial career.
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The one thing that Souness can never be accused is being afraid to upset anyone. Sometimes like in punditry it is refreshing though I'm sure he might have measured it better during his managerial career.
At least he's consistent. He didn't mind upsetting opposing teams with less than fair tackles in his playing career.
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i remember Stan Collymore criticising motd a couple of years back, views pretty much the same as many on here, lazy pundits, lack of research etc. Say what you want about him (and many have) but when Stan covers a match you can tell he's done his research
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I agree with Somniloqism. Long overdue for a total clear out and rethink.
The current style is tired, insipid, lacking in any insight and in Lawrenson's case also lazy, and in Shearer's case lacking in anything worth listening to. In fact, I've got into the habit of either switching the sound off or flicking channels between games.
Hanson I still have a bit of time for, but it's really not good enough to rely just on animated computer wizardry to keep us interested during the punditry. (Which it doesn't anyway)
It's not just the case with football at the BBC. The rugby punditry is just the same and is way behind the level of analysis on Sky.
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The strange thing is Cricket has a similar model whereby most pundits are ex-players but the level of knowledge they bring is just so much higher.
The worst thing is there are so many good analyst around who could do an excellent job with the football but yet no one is willing to replace the big name ex-player with the guy who can actually do the job. It's not just england with this problem though, football pundits are pretty poor everywhere you go.
Too right; until recently FSC's main pundit was 60s relic Tommy Smith !!
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The strange thing is Cricket has a similar model whereby most pundits are ex-players but the level of knowledge they bring is just so much higher.
The worst thing is there are so many good analyst around who could do an excellent job with the football but yet no one is willing to replace the big name ex-player with the guy who can actually do the job. It's not just england with this problem though, football pundits are pretty poor everywhere you go.
Too right; until recently FSC's main pundit was 60s relic Tommy Smith !!
One massively annoying wanker and only topped by the Geordie twat Ray Hudson on Gol TV making watching Spanish games impossible.
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Years ago there was a thread here entitled " two bullets, who do you shoot?" I put forward Mark Lawrenson for the first and the second one to make sure.
He is one of 4 reasons I record MOTD and don't watch it live.
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I agree that the level of punditry on the BBC is terrible. I remember listening to the Football Ramble podcast during the South Africa World Cup and they were talking about one of them (let's say it was Shearer, but I don't know for sure) having said "well, we don't know much about (say) Togo" and the FR contributor screamed "why not?! What have you been doing all day?! This is your job!", which kind of sums up the problem with them.
On another note, there is no anti-Villa agenda in the media, or anywhere else outside the Midlands. Nobody cares, that's all.
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I don't give a shit what he thinks. We're Aston Villa.
Totally agree Leeg. Who is he again??
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I thought he was nice about us and informed too last Sat after the Liverpool game but I'm quite surprised at that lazy sentence. We have little quality? I would argue that we have a lot of potentially very good quality - which the second goal last week proved and Lawrensen actually analysed. While Vlaar, Dunne, N'Zogbia, Agbonlahor and the two Benters have all pretty much proven quality. I doubt he thinks Norwich or West Brom or even Swansea have much more quality either but they all seem to be doing well. He goes for the easy/lazy one-liner to try and sum-up a club. It's usually that we're a selling club - like Arsenal then, so it's good of him to vary the critique.
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I thought he was nice about us and informed too last Sat after the Liverpool game but I'm quite surprised at that lazy sentence. We have little quality? I would argue that we have a lot of potentially very good quality - which the second goal last week proved and Lawrensen actually analysed. While Vlaar, Dunne, N'Zogbia, Agbonlahor and the two Benters have all pretty much proven quality. I doubt he thinks Norwich or West Brom or even Swansea have much more quality either but they all seem to be doing well. He goes for the easy/lazy one-liner to try and sum-up a club. It's usually that we're a selling club - like Arsenal then, so it's good of him to vary the critique.
Up until last weekend it was "they struggle to score goals". He Nice to see he has come out with a different one now.
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I used to like MOTD when it was Lynam, Hansen and Brooking.
I think it helped that we were quite good too as I recall.
"Life of Riley" by the Lightning Seeds as the tune for Goal of the Month as well.
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You guys really pay far too much attention to the BBC talking heads. They really dont matter. Outside of Garth Crooks they are not very interesting. I prefer the Guardian or even Sky's for interesting opinions.
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The man's an arse. Every Friday he looks at the fixtures. If one of the "big four" is playing someone else he makes it two nil, or if they play each other it's one all. Job done.
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Lawrenson is a typical BBC football pundit. Played for one of the top 4, Doesn't really say anything controversial and gives a safe opinion. There is no real detail in his lazy arse analysis. I don't think he hates us, I just think he isn't bothered about us because we're not Liverpool, Arsenull, Spurzz, Chelsea, or the Manc clubs.
I prefer MOTD recorded when I can skip the inane drivel spouted by him Hansen and the ever dull Shearer
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I think Lawro does have it in for the Villa. I remember watching football focus a few years back(Gregory was manager)when we had been top for a few weeks when asked can Villa win the league his reply was 'I hope not' .......
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You guys really pay far too much attention to the BBC talking heads. They really dont matter. Outside of Garth Crooks they are not very interesting. I prefer the Guardian or even Sky's for interesting opinions.
What ?
How is Garth Crooks interesting ?
Or are you saying the other pundits are interesting but only when they are inside Garth Crooks ?
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I think Lawro does have it in for the Villa. I remember watching football focus a few years back(Gregory was manager)when we had been top for a few weeks when asked can Villa win the league his reply was 'I hope not' .......
That might have been because that side was ultra dull!
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You guys really pay far too much attention to the BBC talking heads. They really dont matter. Outside of Garth Crooks they are not very interesting. I prefer the Guardian or even Sky's for interesting opinions.
What ?
How is Garth Crooks interesting ?
Or are you saying the other pundits are interesting but only when they are inside Garth Crooks ?
I presumed he meant "interesting" in a "That's interesting, is he the bastard son of Stanley Unwin?" kind of way.
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I don't normally watch MOTD but do see World Football Focus on BBC World. Often the programme is recorded outside the BBC Manchester HQ with Lawrenson so uninterested, it's beyond belief. I get the feeling he has little interest in football as it keeps him away from his golf, his only reason he bothers is to pick up his huge salary.
The same could be said for Robbie Cabbage. Neither offer anything constructive.
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Lawro - the grand pantomime dame. Widow Twanker. You can kind of understand why he's there, being an ex-player, strong Liverpool links, etc. I don't like it, but I can understand it. What I really don't understand, or like, is Colin Murray. Why is he on everything? Why?
On 5Live, the man's about as welcome in my ears as a lion's dick. I simply won't watch MOTD2. They've also got him on the darts. This is fucking sacrilege in my book. Like laying a fresh turd on the enigmatic upper lip of the Mona Lisa. Like splicing a clip from Big Mama's House 2 at a particularly poignant juncture in Akira Kurosawa's Seven Samurai. I was secretly willing the Maya to be accurate in their predictions yesterday, as at least the universe would no longer contain this utter goat's pizzle of a man.
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Lawro - the grand pantomime dame. Widow Twanker. You can kind of understand why he's there, being an ex-player, strong Liverpool links, etc. I don't like it, but I can understand it. What I really don't understand, or like, is Colin Murray. Why is he on everything? Why?
On 5Live, the man's about as welcome in my ears as a lion's dick. I simply won't watch MOTD2. They've also got him on the darts. This is fucking sacrilege in my book. Like laying a fresh turd on the enigmatic upper lip of the Mona Lisa. Like splicing a clip from Big Mama's House 2 at a particularly poignant juncture in Akira Kurosawa's Seven Samurai. I was secretly willing the Maya to be accurate in their predictions yesterday, as at least the universe would no longer contain this utter goat's pizzle of a man.
Agree wholeheartedly on the Colin Murray front. Sychopantacular he is.
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Record MOTD, then FF through the drivel between matches.
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I was surprised to read recently how much some of the MOTD presenters are paid. Isn't Hansen on something like £40,000 - £50,000 pw?
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You guys really pay far too much attention to the BBC talking heads. They really dont matter. Outside of Garth Crooks they are not very interesting. I prefer the Guardian or even Sky's for interesting opinions.
What ?
How is Garth Crooks interesting ?
Or are you saying the other pundits are interesting but only when they are inside Garth Crooks ?
Thats right.
(http://www.artistsuk.co.uk/acatalog/mini-Beano-Numskulls.JPG)
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I was surprised to read recently how much some of the MOTD presenters are paid. Isn't Hansen on something like £40,000 - £50,000 pw?
Eh?
Nowhere near that.