Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: Toronto Villa on July 08, 2012, 01:48:18 AM
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Jean II was not in any of the pictures from training. I thought he was back with the club now and was being a fresh crack at things. It seems weird that nobody has heard from him or seen him. So where is our famous jumper wearer? I hope his apparent absence is nothing at all and he will resume his career with us. I think he has a lot to prove and a potentially a lot to offer.
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Although the 'Squad' page on the Official Site does not include the two newest signings, there is no mention of him at all.
Strange!
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Maybe he's in negotiations?
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Is he still injured??
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Maybe he was just a figment of our imagination, like Mathieu Berson
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or even like Václav Drobný.
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Or even Salifou
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He is next to Wally if you look carefully!
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He is next to Wally if you look carefully!
Where's Wally?
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Hopefully J2M is the makeweight in a deal for another player from France. Given we've been linked with two players in the last few days?
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Il est dans le ciel, avec les Holtenders.
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Due back in training on Thursday apparently having had extended leave for personal reasons.
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Good news for JDII fans
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Hope he does impress Lambert when he returns, he's got a lot of experience and we paid good money for him.
Fook knows why TSM sent him out on loan last season when our midfield was short on experience, especially once Stan took ill, not like the Greek league would of improved his knowledge of English football - nearly a year down the drain really as far as experience of the Prem goes.
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Good news for JDII fans
I'm one of them! I don't think he's a tackler by any stretch of the imagination, but he certainly looked to me a player who's capable of playing possession football. Alongside an all-action, tough-tackling type (which I hope/think El Ahmadi is) he could be a real asset. At least worth another try anyway, I'd say.
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He's a Cameroon international with Champs League experience. There's definitely a decent player there somewhere. Hopefully we'll give him a chance and he'll intergrate with the squad better. He was unlucky last season with injuries when on loan so didn't play as much as he/we'd have liked, but hopefully he gets a shot this time round. Lambert will pick whoever impresses him most. Makoun's good on the ball so we'll see.
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He's a Cameroon international with Champs League experience. There's definitely a decent player there somewhere. Hopefully we'll give him a chance and he'll intergrate with the squad better. He was unlucky last season with injuries when on loan so didn't play as much as he/we'd have liked, but hopefully he gets a shot this time round. Lambert will pick whoever impresses him most. Makoun's good on the ball so we'll see.
Eric Djemba-Djemba was a Cameroon international with Champions League experience. I just don't think that Makoun has the physical capabilities to be a successful central midfielder in the Premier League. He's slow and can't tackle, and he must weigh about 6 stone wet through.
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He's a Cameroon international with Champs League experience. There's definitely a decent player there somewhere. Hopefully we'll give him a chance and he'll intergrate with the squad better. He was unlucky last season with injuries when on loan so didn't play as much as he/we'd have liked, but hopefully he gets a shot this time round. Lambert will pick whoever impresses him most. Makoun's good on the ball so we'll see.
Eric Djemba-Djemba was a Cameroon international with Champions League experience. I just don't think that Makoun has the physical capabilities to be a successful central midfielder in the Premier League. He's slow and can't tackle, and he must weigh about 6 stone wet through.
The problem with Eric was that he was twins, but he only ever sent the shit Eric twin out on the pitch. I've seen more ability from Makoun so far than Djemba and Djemba for that matter.
I hope he gets a shot. My gut feeling is like yours though, I think Lambert will move him on. As others have said, if we're sniffing round the French league he'll probably end up a makeweight.
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He's a Cameroon international with Champs League experience. There's definitely a decent player there somewhere. Hopefully we'll give him a chance and he'll intergrate with the squad better. He was unlucky last season with injuries when on loan so didn't play as much as he/we'd have liked, but hopefully he gets a shot this time round. Lambert will pick whoever impresses him most. Makoun's good on the ball so we'll see.
Eric Djemba-Djemba was a Cameroon international with Champions League experience. I just don't think that Makoun has the physical capabilities to be a successful central midfielder in the Premier League. He's slow and can't tackle, and he must weigh about 6 stone wet through.
The Djemba twins had a total of 21 mins of Chumps League experience between them. Makoun has appeared in more than 50 matches on his own. Some players take more time to settle into the English game, he's hardly been given an extended run in the team. Worth another chance.
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I'm happy for him to come back and let Bertie decide.
If he thinks he's worth a shot then fair enough, but if not then we have say that'd be 3 (4 if you include Gary Mac) managers who didn't seem to rate him enough to play him, including the bloke who signed him!
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It doesn't seem to me that he has had much of a fair crack yet.
I liked the little that I saw, since he seemed quite able to control the ball and pass to a team mate without much difficulty.
Probably why TSM got shot of him.
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I'm happy for him to come back and let Bertie decide.
If he thinks he's worth a shot then fair enough, but if not then we have say that'd be 3 (4 if you include Gary Mac) managers who didn't seem to rate him enough to play him, including the bloke who signed him!
That's a touch unfair, Houllier played him a fair few times, but a ban then houllier being ill restricted the chances for him to pick him. Didn't he have an injury as well?
Aside from that signings from abroad in January rarely set the league alight, he needed games at the start of last season to be judged on, but tsm didn't fancy him so he never got the chance.
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He's a Cameroon international with Champs League experience. There's definitely a decent player there somewhere. Hopefully we'll give him a chance and he'll intergrate with the squad better. He was unlucky last season with injuries when on loan so didn't play as much as he/we'd have liked, but hopefully he gets a shot this time round. Lambert will pick whoever impresses him most. Makoun's good on the ball so we'll see.
Eric Djemba-Djemba was a Cameroon international with Champions League experience. I just don't think that Makoun has the physical capabilities to be a successful central midfielder in the Premier League. He's slow and can't tackle, and he must weigh about 6 stone wet through.
I think we had this debate before, the fact he didn't make many tackles doesn't mean he can't, it might just mean he prefers to intercept, stay on his feet, put the player under pressure etc. He's got more physical presence than Modric and Silva, for example, and they used to say Le Tissier and Hoddle were slow and couldn't tackle. If he turns out half as good as any of them he'll be worth it. I thought he looked good and I think if Lambert is planning a pass and move philosophy (God I hope so) then he'll fit in nicely.
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Le Tissier and Hoddle couldn't tackle, but they weren't far short of being world class at other areas of the game.
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I hope he does well, I like the style of play we'll adopt if he succeeds. I doubt it though.
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I genuinely think when PL gets Makoun back in training he is going to be very happy. Makoun has vast experience (scoring a goal that helped put Real Madrid out the champions league) He has hardly any chance to find some confidence at Villa and the first time he did against Man Utd he was world class. Lambert will be on his wave length and Makoun will give him a great option when he wants to change strategies .......
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Makoun plays the way Lambert wants to play. That's a great start. If he comes back and finds a manager that is willing to believe in him then he'll flourish. I suppose looking back the writing was on the wall for all of us when TSM shipped him out immediately. In hindsight it gave us all the info we needed as to how the season was likely going to play out.
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I liked what I saw when he came. Looked comfortable of the ball, could pick a pass and had good positional awareness. Accept what has been said about pace and tackling, but whether those are necessesities depends on who he is paired with. I'd be happy to see him given a second chance.
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I liked what I saw when he came. Looked comfortable of the ball, could pick a pass and had good positional awareness. Accept what has been said about pace and tackling, but whether those are necessesities depends on who he is paired with. I'd be happy to see him given a second chance.
I really think you've hit the nail on the head there. He can pass and works hard, so Lambert will like him. Certainly deserves a second chance.
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I liked what I saw when he came. Looked comfortable of the ball, could pick a pass and had good positional awareness. Accept what has been said about pace and tackling, but whether those are necessesities depends on who he is paired with. I'd be happy to see him given a second chance.
I really think you've hit the nail on the head there. He can pass and works hard, so Lambert will like him. Certainly deserves a second chance.
In what way does he work hard?
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How many appearances does he have for Villa? Fair to say he needs a few more before he's written off.
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How many appearances does he have for Villa? Fair to say he needs a few more before he's written off.
7 and agreed, I think he deserves a chance.
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I liked what I saw when he came. Looked comfortable of the ball, could pick a pass and had good positional awareness. Accept what has been said about pace and tackling, but whether those are necessesities depends on who he is paired with. I'd be happy to see him given a second chance.
I really think you've hit the nail on the head there. He can pass and works hard, so Lambert will like him. Certainly deserves a second chance.
In what way does he work hard?
In the sense that from the limited time I saw him in a Villa shirt I thought that without "putting himself about" (his "tackle" at Blackpool notwithstanding) his receive, hold, release style of play required him to be constantly looking for the space in midfield to fulfill that role.
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I don't see from his time at Villa how anyone can say he either definitely will succeed or definitely will fail, he hasn't had anywhere near enough opportunity. So by that definition he deserves a chance to give it a go at Villa.
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Agreed. It amazes me how posters can have such faith in their opinions about things nobody really knows yet. They're like Evangalists, some of them.
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Good news for JDII fans
I'm one of them! I don't think he's a tackler by any stretch of the imagination, but he certainly looked to me a player who's capable of playing possession football. Alongside an all-action, tough-tackling type (which I hope/think El Ahmadi is) he could be a real asset. At least worth another try anyway, I'd say.
I agree completely, I think KEA, Makoun and Ireland would be a midfield full of energy and the ability to knock the ball around at pace with excellent movement off the ball. When Makoun last played for us I think he was seeing passes that were on should the other players have had the initiative to move off the ball. I remember him playing for Lyon and absolutely destroying Man Utd in one Champions League game. I think he's worth a sustained look at and if he's still not delivered much by January then see if there are any takers in the January window. He's been given up on way too soon imo.
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Thing is Perce, that works both ways. i'm not a fan from what i've seen of him and think he's lightweight, can't tackle and cannot impose himself on a game, or be a vital cog in the midfield engine room. Basically, not good enough. Thos ethat think tehr eis something there are just espousing their opinions also based on the same 7 games that I'm commenting on and think he could be a player.
i'll bet I'm right though.
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Thing is Perce, that works both ways. i'm not a fan from what i've seen of him and think he's lightweight, can't tackle and cannot impose himself on a game, or be a vital cog in the midfield engine room. Basically, not good enough. Thos ethat think tehr eis something there are just espousing their opinions also based on the same 7 games that I'm commenting on and think he could be a player.
i'll bet I'm right though.
Except that you're wilfully ignoring the "give him a chance to prove himself" argument that is entirely valid as he's only played 7 games. He looked very good at Old Trafford, but that wouldn't be enough for me to say with certainty that he should be a starter, no more than his performances in a limited number of games are enough to convince you that he's crap.
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very good - Old Trafford
Okay to average - everywhere else.
Its seems impossible for those bigging him up (or just wanting to give him a chance) cannot say anything other than he played well at Man U as the reason for thinking he is good enough. Crawley played well at old Trafford. Exeter played well at Old Trafford, as did Dennis Bailey. Just because players can raise their games for one of games at the biggest stages it doesn't mean a great deal. He was seen in training by managers, on the pitch, and he didn't look good enough to them, or to some fans.
He may come good. Clearly I hope he does. But I don't think he will and would cut him loose ratehr than waste wages on a player who i don't think is good enough.
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His passing is an upgrade on Petrov's, especially the tempo, he needs to improve on his ability to win the ball back imo.
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Anyone know if he was back for pre-season today as planned?
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very good - Old Trafford
Okay to average - everywhere else.
Its seems impossible for those bigging him up (or just wanting to give him a chance) cannot say anything other than he played well at Man U as the reason for thinking he is good enough. Crawley played well at old Trafford. Exeter played well at Old Trafford, as did Dennis Bailey. Just because players can raise their games for one of games at the biggest stages it doesn't mean a great deal. He was seen in training by managers, on the pitch, and he didn't look good enough to them, or to some fans.
He may come good. Clearly I hope he does. But I don't think he will and would cut him loose ratehr than waste wages on a player who i don't think is good enough.
So are you advocating getting rid of any footballer who doesn't play consistently well in their first half a dozen games at the club?
There are a number of potential reasons why he may not have performed brilliantly for us so far.
1. Playing in a struggling team that was not geared to the sort of possession football that I imagine would suit him.
2. Injury and his family being involved in a car crash curtailing the end of his first season.
3. TSM being his manager last year.
I don't buy your analogy with Exeter or Crawley. This is someone who regularly played in the Champions League, not some lower league clogger. Performances like that are often based on them defending bravely and then possibly nicking a chance if it comes their way. His passing and movement was superb throughout the game.
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Anyone know if he was back for pre-season today as planned?
Dunno, haven't seen anything saying he is back - it seems Matt C has the inside info on this.
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Its seems impossible for those bigging him up (or just wanting to give him a chance) cannot say anything other than he played well at Man U as the reason for thinking he is good enough. Crawley played well at old Trafford. Exeter played well at Old Trafford, as did Dennis Bailey. Just because players can raise their games for one of games at the biggest stages it doesn't mean a great deal.
How about the fact that he has played in more Champions League games than the rest of our squad combined?
He's not Salifou, he's not been plucked from obscurity and hasn't made the grade - he's an experienced player and just the sort of player who you wouldn't expect to flourish under last season's style of football.
He might not work out, but getting rid of him after seven games just to take a punt on a less experienced player from the same league (which seems to be the most likely suggested replacement) would be ridiculous.
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Personally I havent seen anything from him to impress me or think hes good enough for Premier League...despite showing a few good touches, he always looked lost out on the pitch and couldnt tackle. A liability we cant afford to carry in a tough season.
It would be extremely naive to right him off though and not give him a chance, and I would expect the management team to be able to identify this in training with the rest of the squad. If he can prove himself to be a player then I'll be delighted as it will be like having a new player in the team which needs investment in other areas now.
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The reference to the Djemba twins got me thinking. If the one Makoun we have caught glimpses of is Jean II Makoun (as we are led to believe) is there a Jean I Makoun who did the business for Cameroon and in the Champions League and we have got a doppelganger?
Was there ever a Didier Six or were there two Didier Trois?
And the mysterious non playing Ivo Stas. Did Josef Venglos buy IIvo?
There is a theme here. There may be manager for us lurking somewhere in the corridors of time called Ale XI
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Its seems impossible for those bigging him up (or just wanting to give him a chance) cannot say anything other than he played well at Man U as the reason for thinking he is good enough. Crawley played well at old Trafford. Exeter played well at Old Trafford, as did Dennis Bailey. Just because players can raise their games for one of games at the biggest stages it doesn't mean a great deal.
How about the fact that he has played in more Champions League games than the rest of our squad combined?
He's not Salifou, he's not been plucked from obscurity and hasn't made the grade - he's an experienced player and just the sort of player who you wouldn't expect to flourish under last season's style of football.
He might not work out, but getting rid of him after seven games just to take a punt on a less experienced player from the same league (which seems to be the most likely suggested replacement) would be ridiculous.
Bosko balaban played regularly and scored in the Champions League. That in itself doesn't mean a great deal.
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I certainly hope that El-Ahmadi hits the ground running if 7 games is all you get to prove yourself. I just think we should give Makoun a chance.
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He didn't really. He played ten times across a fifteen year career.
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I like Jean Makoun II and hope that he will be in the Villa squad come August, whatever the knits.
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Well its still ten time more than any other of our players.
Not saying you're using it as a yardstick but just because someone has played in the CL doesn't mean we should be moving heaven and earth to finding an opening for him in the team.
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I certainly hope that El-Ahmadi hits the ground running if 7 games is all you get to prove yourself. I just think we should give Makoun a chance.
Yep,you can't run the rule over someone after 7 games,in a league he's never played in before.
I trust PL to decide if he's good enough. The difference was that last summer,a lot of folk were saying he looked impressive in the friendlies,but was then shipped out to get in Jenas,which was down to TSM.
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Well its still ten time more than any other of our players.
Not saying you're using it as a yardstick but just because someone has played in the CL doesn't mean we should be moving heaven and earth to finding an opening for him in the team.
You're just on the windup now, aren't you?
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Well its still ten time more than any other of our players.
Not saying you're using it as a yardstick but just because someone has played in the CL doesn't mean we should be moving heaven and earth to finding an opening for him in the team.
You're just on the windup now, aren't you?
Why? Because I don't rate him?
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Well its still ten time more than any other of our players.
Not saying you're using it as a yardstick but just because someone has played in the CL doesn't mean we should be moving heaven and earth to finding an opening for him in the team.
No it's not. Given's played just as many. As has Petrov.
And again, you're imagining people saying things when they're not. Nobody is saying that we should build the team around him or that he is one of our best players.
But when we don't really have many central midfielders, ditching the one that we have with the most pedigree just for the hell of it seems a bit fucking stupid.
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JMII deserves a chance to make his mark. Just saying. PL is not TSM and so can include him, hopefully.
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Well its still ten time more than any other of our players.
Not saying you're using it as a yardstick but just because someone has played in the CL doesn't mean we should be moving heaven and earth to finding an opening for him in the team.
You're just on the windup now, aren't you?
Why? Because I don't rate him?
No, because you're wilfully twisting other people's arguments with your "moving heaven and earth to find an opening for him in the team" nonsense. Nobody's saying that, from what I can see.
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Well its still ten time more than any other of our players.
Not saying you're using it as a yardstick but just because someone has played in the CL doesn't mean we should be moving heaven and earth to finding an opening for him in the team.
No it's not. Given's played just as many. As has Petrov.
And again, you're imagining people saying things when they're not. Nobody is saying that we should build the team around him or that he is one of our best players.
But when we don't really have many central midfielders, ditching the one that we have with the most pedigree just for the hell of it seems a bit fucking stupid.
Okay, for 'any' read 'many'.
not sure where I've said I'd sell for the hell of it but more because the manager that bought him then dropped him. he looked poor in the tackle, a bit lightweight and not blessed with pace. What type of midfielder do we want him to be if he can't tackle and doesn't appear to be that creative?
If Lambert looks at him and thinks there's a player there then great lets see where he can fit in and what he can do. But if not then good i don't think he's good enough anyway. We need a better box-to-box central midfielder/creative midfielder than we currently have (Makoun argument aside) and if we have to sell Makoun to get that player then I can handle his departure and just file under Djemba-djemba and Berson.
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I think with PL we will all find out for sure what this Jean fella is really like. It's a strange one as he has never had the opportunity to settle in. I'm guessing GH was not that impressed with both his performances on the pitch and on the training ground.
I'd love him to be this great player from overseas who can open up defenses and hold the midfield together. Somehow though I do get the impression he isn't all that by the amount of managers who have overlooked him.
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We should see johhny Deux soon, probs with work permit, but once sorted he will be back training
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From the Birmingham Mail
FORGOTTEN man Jean Makoun must wait until a slight complication with his work permit is resolved before he can attempt to kickstart his Villa career.
Makoun has been unable to take part in Paul Lambert’s pre-season training regime so far because he is still awaiting international clearance.
It is not known when the Cameroon midfielder’s paperwork will finally go through, but he is unlikely to join the club’s tour to America next week.
The delay is not thought to be serious and has only arisen because extra documentation is required following his year with Olympiakos in Greece.
Makoun still has two years left to run on his Villa contract and Lambert is keen to sit down with the £5 million player to discuss his future.
Olympiakos were initially interested in making his loan move permanent, but Greek sources suggest they would be unable to afford his probable transfer fee.
Makoun has struggled to settle at Villa and has experienced a frustrating time since former boss Gerard Houllier signed him from Lyon 18 months ago.
His bright start in claret and blue was undermined by a sending off at Blackpool and since then his first team opportunities have been limited.
Makoun missed the end of the 2010-11 campaign and returned to Cameroon compassionate leave after relatives were hurt in a road accident back home.
Last summer, after Alex McLeish deemed him surplus to requirements, he was sent for a season-long loan at Olympiakos, helping them to the Greek title.
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We send a player on loan when we are struggling and he helps his loan team win the title
What a wanker TSM was
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JDII is being linked with a move to Rennes this morning in the French press, with us getting Brahimi/Doumbia in return
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JDII is being linked with a move to Rennes this morning in the French press, with us getting Brahimi/Doumbia in return
2+2=5
Wouldn't mind either of them though tbh. Or both.
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We send a player on loan when we are struggling and he helps his loan team win the title
What a wanker TSM was
Yes. A fantastic judge of a footballer.
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He couldn't have done that much as he was injured but yes TSM was a wanker
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We send a player on loan when we are struggling and he helps his loan team win the title
What a wanker TSM was
Why would he not at least give the bloke a chance? It was almost his first act as Villa manager to get rid of a player that can actually trap and pass a football. All of the wankers under GH got a second chance and Makoun was ditched. And then TSM brings in Hutton. What a sorry chapter of our great history last year proved to be.
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I guess he was ditched in the hope that Jenas would come good. him being injured the whole time he was here didn't help but he took the gamble that he would be fit. Probably 'Arry passed on some dodgy medical notes. But at the start of the season a fit midfield of Petrov/Jenas/Albrighton/NZogbia/Ireland/Bannan/Delph was probably seen as good enough. it was a fair call if Lambert had have made it but McLeish was such a poor manager that they looked as if they'd never met each other. If makoun had have stayed here I don't think McLeish would have helped him look any more of a footballer than his detractors (me) think of him now. Maybe Lambert can.
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I think he'll be off.
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Another glitch in the JDII saga...he doesnt seem to have much luck with Villa does he.
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Well its still ten time more than any other of our players.
Not saying you're using it as a yardstick but just because someone has played in the CL doesn't mean we should be moving heaven and earth to finding an opening for him in the team.
No it's not. Given's played just as many. As has Petrov.
And again, you're imagining people saying things when they're not. Nobody is saying that we should build the team around him or that he is one of our best players.
But when we don't really have many central midfielders, ditching the one that we have with the most pedigree just for the hell of it seems a bit fucking stupid.
His pedigree isn't in the Premier League though, and it shows. I just don't think he's up to it. A view seemingly shared by all of his Villa managers to date, and the other Premier League managers who should surely have been queuing up for such a Champions League regular. If he was any good. Which he isn't.
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So are you advocating selling off any player that doesn't do well in their first half a dozen games at the club?
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So are you advocating selling off any player that doesn't do well in their first half a dozen games at the club?
I'd advocate selling a player who doesnt impresss the management in training let alone half a dozen games.
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So are you advocating selling off any player that doesn't do well in their first half a dozen games at the club?
I'd advocate selling a player who doesnt impresss the management in training let alone half a dozen games.
Or to rephrase "a player that Gary McAllister and Alex McLeish don't want to be in the team".
I'd consider that more of a positive than a negative.
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I'm sure PL and the new management team will give him a fair chance and draw their own conclusions on whether or not they think JDII is good enough. This can be identified in training and pre-season games with the rest of the squad. Thats all we can ask of them.
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Quite agree.
If someone as obviously competent as Lambert doesn't want to play him then I'd fully agree that it's time to move him on.
Personally I'd be surprised if that happened though.
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I'm sure PL and the new management team will give him a fair chance and draw their own conclusions on whether or not they think JDII is good enough. This can be identified in training and pre-season games with the rest of the squad. Thats all we can ask of them.
And nobody is asking for anything more. All some of us are saying is to give him a chance rather than flog him at the next available opportunity, which is what some on here have the horn for.
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According to the Mirror
Jean Makoun's Aston Villa career is in jeopardy - because he has not learned to speak English.
Cameroon midfielder Makoun was signed by Gerard Houllier from Lyon in January 2011 for £6million.
But he was loaned out to Greek side Olympiacos for last season by Houllier's successor Alex McLeish.
Makoun has been told he would be considered again this season under Villa's new boss, Paul Lambert, but the 29-year-old has not yet returned to England because of work permit complications.
And MirrorFootball understands one of those complications is his inability to pass the English language test, after he discontinued lessons while he was living in Greece.
Makoun may now be part of Lambert's shake-up as the Scot seeks to wheel and deal.
Lambert plans to offload three or four players to free up funds to bring in Feyenoord defender Ron Vlaar and Leeds midfielder Robert Snodgrass.
Meanwhile, Lambert reckons Villa fans have stopped moaning and will back the side now McLeish has left.
Many Villa fans were on McLeish's case last term from day one after he crossed the Second City from arch-rivals Birmingham.
But successor Lambert has been warmly welcomed after he left Norwich to succeed his fellow Scot.
His first pre-season friendly, a 2-1 win at League Two Burton, was attended by 2,500 Villans - to the delight of Lambert.
"What happened last season has totally gone. We don't look back," he said.
"At Burton, the crowd were with the team, which was really important - you need the crowd to go with you rather than against you.
"I thought the crowd were brilliant at Burton - non-stop. If they continue to get behind us, we will do OK."
Villa fans moaned at McLeish's side's lack of creativity last term as they scored just 37 League goals.
Lambert insists: "We'll try and play football - I don't like long ball."
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It looks increasingly likely that Makoun will be put in the same file as the likes of Balaban and Berson. I think he hasn't been given a fair chance but he's 18 months into his villa career now and he isn't making any progress. In football, 18 months is a long time to be out in the wilderness.
He could end up being known as the man who signed amid lots of fanfare and expectation (that jumper!) but ultimately never made it. At 29, it's hard to see how we can recoup much for him.
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Irrespective of his ability, none of us know what his attitude has been like at the club. The fact that he seemingly hasn't made much effort to learn the language despite being paid a shitload of money isn't particularly impressive. If he mopes around the place sulking and feeling sorry for himself then there's not much point in hanging on to him.
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Well if he was in Greece for the year it makes sense that he should be studying Greek moreso/rather than English. Though I suppose he should still have made an effort..wasn't Mellberg his team-mate out there? Surely he would have helped him. I dunno, it's all Greek to me.
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I'm calling a bullshit strike on that article. So he's gone backwards in his English because seemingly it was good enough when he joined the club?
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He had a French manager.
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you've lost me Perce. What's that got to do with his ability to attain a permit?
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Ah got ya. I thought maybe the suggestion was his English wasn't good enough for Lambert.
Carry on.
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How did he get a work permit in the first place then? Would he not have had to take a test then? I thought language tests would have been for things like citizenship not work permits. There's plenty of people working legally in this country who can't speak a word of English so I don't see the problem with Jean 2. Seems like a horseshit, guess of an article. There's a lot of foreign players at big clubs in this country who still can't speak much English at all. They've not had permit problems. Would it not be more down to the fact he's not played in this country for a year, nor been selected for many internationals?
That said. my gut feeling is that we'll never see Jean play for us again and he'll take his lovely jumpers away to a new club for a fraction of what we paid for him.
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I won't lose any sleep if he goes.
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I may be wrong here but I believe in the last year or so the government have stepped up the efforts in putting tighter controls on allowing foreigners in to the country to live and part of that is trying to cut down on the amount of people coming here to work/live but can't speak our language properly.
This is taken from work permit website and is part of the rules for requirements to gain visa for the UK
To gain entry into the UK under all categories * of Tier 2 it is necessary to fulfill the English Language Requirement. This is intended to demonstrate an applicant's ability to succeed in his or her new job and to successfully integrate into UK society.
Applicants must be able to speak English at a level that shows familiarity with everyday expressions and basic phrases. They must be able to introduce themselves to others and answer basic personal questions about themselves.
An applicant can demonstrate the necessary competence in English in one of three ways.
By being a national of a majority English-speaking country
By successfully completing a degree equivalent to a UK Bachelors degree taught in English
By passing an acceptable English language test
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I can almost hear the "he hasn't had a full pre-season" excuses when he turns out to not be very good again.
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I may be wrong here but I believe in the last year or so the government have stepped up the efforts in putting tighter controls on allowing foreigners in to the country to live and part of that is trying to cut down on the amount of people coming here to work/live but can't speak our language properly.
This is taken from work permit website and is part of the rules for requirements to gain visa for the UK
To gain entry into the UK under all categories * of Tier 2 it is necessary to fulfill the English Language Requirement. This is intended to demonstrate an applicant's ability to succeed in his or her new job and to successfully integrate into UK society.
Applicants must be able to speak English at a level that shows familiarity with everyday expressions and basic phrases. They must be able to introduce themselves to others and answer basic personal questions about themselves.
An applicant can demonstrate the necessary competence in English in one of three ways.
By being a national of a majority English-speaking country
By successfully completing a degree equivalent to a UK Bachelors degree taught in English
By passing an acceptable English language test
Let's hope that works after seeing the results of the 2011 Census yesterday - highest immigration ever. Take a walk round Villa Park (I mean outside) and you will hear very little English!
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Having foreign rather than British signings has imo become an obsession at Villa for the fans.If Makoun was a Brit signed from an English club I don't think we'd see much of a fuss about him being sold as he hasn't shown himself to be much of a footballer.
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Let's hope that works after seeing the results of the 2011 Census yesterday - highest immigration ever. Take a walk round Villa Park (I mean outside) and you will hear very little English!
But nearly all of them can speak English, they just choose to use their native language when talking to each other. Just like English immigrants in, say, Spain do.
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I'd wager that the Spanish of English immigrants in Spain's is a lot worse on average than a typical East European working in the UK.
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And I think you'd win. But I don't want to get in over my head discussing it with that well-known authority on everyday Astonian folk, SURREY villain.
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I doubt his English is that much worse than in 2010. The level A1is very basic so I think this is a story that has been twisted from out of context phrases. You know, "is he definitely coming back"?
"well as long as he passes his English
"surely that's a formality"
"you never know"
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I don't see where the 'three managers wouldn't pick him' comes from. Houllier did pick him; he then got a ban followed by an injury and then was reported to have been given compassionate leave to return to Africa.
McAllister didn't have the option of picking him.
'I can manage people me' McL. certainly had an issue with him, and seemingly wrote him off without ever watching him play a first team game.
The same manager thought loaning Jenas was a good idea, and thought it a good idea to spending 4 mill on his pal. So who knows?
The Makoun I saw briefly was very comfortable on the ball, had no problem receiving it when under pressure and was adept at keeping possession when he moved it on - without unduly slowing the game.
He also appeared to struggle a bit with the pace of the PL. Something which may or may not have been an interim state of affairs.
If he doesn't make it at VP it will be because he either cannot adjust to PL football or just plain can't settle in England. He's certainly given enough indication that he is a good enough footballer.
I'd rather give him a chance to fail rather than no chance to succeed.
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good points Steve. I also think Houllier had he stayed would have purchased players to work alongside Makoun. You put an El Ahmadi for example next to Makoun that compliments his style and passing ability you get the best out of him. At the time, we didn't have those players. We do now or will do in the near future.
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That last game against Hereford he looked a million miles off the pace and should've seen red for a horrendous tackle.
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Can't see him playing for us again. Sorry.
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That last game against Hereford he looked a million miles off the pace and should've seen red for a horrendous tackle.
But conversely at Mold Trafford he was probably MOTM so its a tough one - as for the pace of the prem, he is not the first and wont be the last player from abroad to have to come here and struggled with it in their first year
At the end of the day it is down to the guys who work and train with him every day - the actual game time is only a snapshot of what a players does all week
I would like to think that during training he could show his worth - the problem is he aint even training at the moment so you cannot pin much hope on that
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Who wasn't poor against Hereford, it took us 82 minutes to score against a team relegated to the conference ffs.
I do think this disrupted pre season will go against Makoun so he'll be well down the midfield order and will probably be moved on.
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Think Johnnie Deux could add some midfield guile and a bit of jolie je ne sais quoi to a midfield and attack who got a bit constipated (if you ask me) going up the middle all the time against the Philadelphia Union.
Please keep him PL! A touch of class with El Ahmadi.
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Can't see him playing for us again. Sorry.
Agree Paul. I just think it has gone a bit too far and I can see him being sold or used in an exchange deal to bring another player in before the transfer window closes.
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He also appeared to struggle a bit with the pace of the PL. Something which may or may not have been an interim state of affairs.
Agreed.
He's not the only player who struggles to adapt to the pace of the PL. Petrov, when he came here, seemed to struggle and took a second too long to do anything, and he was like that for the best part of his first season.
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Time to say goodbye. There's always the possibility that given time he might work out but I'd rather PL get his own men and if we try again with Makoun then it's one less chance for Bannan.
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I feel sure that team selection will be a meritocracy, and whoever proves in training that they're worthy of a starting place will get one. Then it's up to them.
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I don't think Makoun and Bannan are similar enough to take each others first team chances. More likely it's Ireland v Bannan and Makoun v Herd/Gardner as the squad currently stands.
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He also appeared to struggle a bit with the pace of the PL. Something which may or may not have been an interim state of affairs.
Agreed.
He's not the only player who struggles to adapt to the pace of the PL. Petrov, when he came here, seemed to struggle and took a second too long to do anything, and he was like that for the best part of his first season.
Petrov was played out of position a lot of the time though. He was an attacking midfield in a much weaker Scottish league, and was then played out wide and as a defensive midfielder.
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I don't think Makoun and Bannan are similar enough to take each others first team chances. More likely it's Ireland v Bannan and Makoun v Herd/Gardner as the squad currently stands.
I just used Bannan as an example. We all know that balancing the books is an issue that a manager has to work with, each salary paid is money not available to spend on anyone else. There are going to have to be outs as well as ins and Makoun seems to me one we could unload without losing too much. I'd rather that Bannan and Herd, for example, be given the chance to prove their worth than him. That's just me though and I fully understand that others might have seen something in JM that they think is worth persevering with.
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Can't see him playing for us again. Sorry.
Agree Paul. I just think it has gone a bit too far and I can see him being sold or used in an exchange deal to bring another player in before the transfer window closes.
I have to agree with you both. We're turning into Spurs the way we're collecting midfielders. How many do we currently have?
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How many good ones?
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I'd say most of them have their uses.
In the days that Spurs were collecting midfielders, most of theirs weren't going to be challenging for titles either.
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our midfielders would be good If we could play 7 in the team , not the TSM way but with a team of 14 players ;)
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How many good ones?
That's possible the biggest problem Lambert has. They are all potentially very good, but none are proven (in the PL) to the extent that I'd put money on any single individual consistently delivering that potential.
In Ireland, El Ahmadi, Delph, Bannan, Herd, Johnson, Gardner, Carruthers and Makoun we have nine central midfielders contesting two,three or four places depending upon formation.
We all have out 'get rid's and most likely tos amongst that lot, but we have the luxury of being able to blame the manager come next January.
What Lambert has to wrestle with is either :
a) letting our season hinge hinge upon at least three of those being better than the opposition more often than they are not.
b) Getting more players in and deciding which of the above is not going to get any games .. and possibly cost us dear because we end up letting good players go elsewhere.
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How many good ones?
That's possible the biggest problem Lambert has. They are all potentially very good, but none are proven (in the PL) to the extent that I'd put money on any single individual consistently delivering that potential.
In Ireland, El Ahmadi, Delph, Bannan, Herd, Johnson, Gardner, Carruthers and Makoun we have nine central midfielders contesting two,three or four places depending upon formation.
We all have out 'get rid's and most likely tos amongst that lot, but we have the luxury of being able to blame the manager come next January.
What Lambert has to wrestle with is either :
a) letting our season hinge hinge upon at least three of those being better than the opposition more often than they are not.
b) Getting more players in and deciding which of the above is not going to get any games .. and possibly cost us dear because we end up letting good players go elsewhere.
I really don't think we can afford to go down the route of option a) again as central midfield is such a key area and one in which we have struggled in the last couple of seasons. I would much prefer us to bring in at least one more established option in there and maybe allow a couple of the younger players go out on loan. I am relatively hopeful that the fact that he was a central midfielder himself will mean that Lambert will really sort out that area of the team.
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I think a lot hinges on Makoun. If Bertie has a look at him and decides to give him a go, then no more signings in that position. If not, then he'll look to move him on and buy a new midfielder to play with KEA. Either way there'll be a couple of loan deals available for one or two of our youngsters.
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I don't think Makoun and Bannan are similar enough to take each others first team chances. More likely it's Ireland v Bannan and Makoun v Herd/Gardner as the squad currently stands.
I just used Bannan as an example. We all know that balancing the books is an issue that a manager has to work with, each salary paid is money not available to spend on anyone else. There are going to have to be outs as well as ins and Makoun seems to me one we could unload without losing too much. I'd rather that Bannan and Herd, for example, be given the chance to prove their worth than him. That's just me though and I fully understand that others might have seen something in JM that they think is worth persevering with.
Tend to agree with this, Chris.
J2M is somewhat unproven in the EPL, in the same way that GG, BB, Carruthers and Johnson are (Herd, Delph and Albie have had enough 1st team football for the new manager to take a view on their long-term potential), and he might be the best option to let go (presumably 'cos he's on higher wages and perhaps more marketable).
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i think one more midfielder , a creative one is vital. but, you don't know how they're looking on the training ground with the new set-up. because its been a very long time since we had a team set-up to try and pass to win games.
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So where is he? - is he still with us?
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If he leaves I would expect a replacement to come in, otherwise we are ok for centre mids. I think one more forward player would be useful, to take Heskey's place in the squad and defensively it will be one out one in, hopefully 3 out, 3 in.
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I have no issue with us having depth in midfield. The last thing we want is a squad that should there be injuries the quality dips significantly. We'll have a 25 man limit and we need solid cover everywhere.
3 keepers
8 or 9 defenders
8 or 9 midfielders
5 forwards
Also when you have players like Holman or Clark in the squad they are versatile enough to play in others areas of the pitch than they are officially designated to play. In recent years we've been burnt out or suffered key injuries and the players coming in were too green or the quality was much lower than 1st team level. What will make us successful is the strength of our bench as much as the strength of our starting XI which under Lambert will likely vary reasonably often during the season.
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I know he hardly shone for us in the brief glimpses we saw of him, but I'm beginning to think that we may have missed a trick not signing Michael Bradley last summer. He'd have certainly helped last season and probably would have fitted in well with Lambert's style of play. With him in there, we would have been set for central midfielders, but as it is I still think we need one more.
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Are the players back training in UK?
Is JIIM training with them?
Is there any feedback on his fitness / what PL think about the situation?
very quiet at the moment
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Squad numbers released today, and no sign of Makoun.
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Squad numbers released today, and no sign of Makoun.
That is not good
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He is number 17 and is awaiting international clearence. (from the club)
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He is number 17 and is awaiting international clearence. (from the club)
the OS has updated the current squad list to now include Makoun at 17
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He is number 17 and is awaiting international clearence. (from the club)
the OS has updated the current squad list to now include Makoun at 17
Don't think it has, still no number against him when i just looked?
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As soon as the international clearance comes through, I'd sell him.
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Sell the midfielder who has the ability to make the quickest decisions with the ball before making a pass, in this new system we are playing?
That would be ridiculous. Makoun is the best midfielder we have by some distance imho.
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He is number 17 and is awaiting international clearence. (from the club)
the OS has updated the current squad list to now include Makoun at 17
Don't think it has, still no number against him when i just looked?
Makoun at 17 (http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2868101,00.html)
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Well, I don't rate him, but I wouldn't be so quick to write him off now we've got a good manager.
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Sell the midfielder who has the ability to make the quickest decisions with the ball before making a pass, in this new system we are playing?
That would be ridiculous. Makoun is the best midfielder we have by some distance imho.
Not seen him play enough games to make that kinda call.
If Lambert wants to get rid and bring in his own players, then I'll support that.
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I have seen him play maybe 25 times, and for me he is a champions league quality midfielder so surely he is good enough for our midfield. Certainly more technically gifted, and more importantly his football brain is far sharper than everyone with the possible exception of Irelend and KEA.
As long as he lerns he cannot make rash tackles in England he will be valuable to us.
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Sell the midfielder who has the ability to make the quickest decisions with the ball before making a pass, in this new system we are playing?
That would be ridiculous. Makoun is the best midfielder we have by some distance imho.
Not seen him play enough games to make that kinda call.
If Lambert wants to get rid and bring in his own players, then I'll support that.
yep completely agree. He came to the club at the worst possible time. Look at the way things have settled down at the club and the style of football we are trying to play. If he fails now then it was never meant to be. I'm certainly not going to write him off based on Houllier's short era and the disaster of TSM who never even gave him a chance.
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Sell the midfielder who has the ability to make the quickest decisions with the ball before making a pass, in this new system we are playing?
That would be ridiculous. Makoun is the best midfielder we have by some distance imho.
Not seen him play enough games to make that kinda call.
If Lambert wants to get rid and bring in his own players, then I'll support that.
But you just said you'd get rid of him. Without seeing him play enough to make that kind of call.
That's completely different to saying you'll support the manager if he decides to let him go.
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Sell the midfielder who has the ability to make the quickest decisions with the ball before making a pass, in this new system we are playing?
That would be ridiculous. Makoun is the best midfielder we have by some distance imho.
Not seen him play enough games to make that kinda call.
If Lambert wants to get rid and bring in his own players, then I'll support that.
yep completely agree. He came to the club at the worst possible time. Look at the way things have settled down at the club and the style of football we are trying to play. If he fails now then it was never meant to be. I'm certainly not going to write him off based on Houllier's short era and the disaster of TSM who never even gave him a chance.
Agreed, signings from abroad in january rarely have a massive impact in the first few months. After the summer would have been the time to judge him, but that never happened thanks to TSM shipping him out at the first opportunity.
So now it's up to Lambert, once things get cleared and he gets over with us PL will have to make the call of whether to try to make the signing s success after a messy 18months or whether to ship him out and get a replacement.
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Sell the midfielder who has the ability to make the quickest decisions with the ball before making a pass, in this new system we are playing?
That would be ridiculous. Makoun is the best midfielder we have by some distance imho.
Not seen him play enough games to make that kinda call.
If Lambert wants to get rid and bring in his own players, then I'll support that.
But you just said you'd get rid of him. Without seeing him play enough to make that kind of call.
That's completely different to saying you'll support the manager if he decides to let him go.
I said if Lambert wants to get rid of him, then I'd support that. ;D
I'd also support Lambert if he decided to give him a run of games.
It's been messy, so Lambert might have another target in mind and want to cut his losses with Makoun.
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No you didn't, you said that as soon as his clearance came through then you would sell him.
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Cut him some slack, he's just had to deal with a doggie death.
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As soon as the international clearance comes through, I'd sell him.
Sorry Paul but you did say you would sell him in a post BEFORE you said
If Lambert wants to get rid of him, then I'd support that
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I wouldn't lame Jean II for wanting out. He arrives under a manager who clearly rated him, was fuc*ed off, by a manager that clearly had no concept of passing football, to Greece. Only to return to questions over his work permit. The poor guy's biggest impression to date was that, admittedly, misguided jumper.
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Even the manager who 'clearly rated him', bought him even, stopped picking him. At the time I thought that was (yet another) bad decision, but it turned out okay and NRC did well those last few games.
Still, like others, I'm happy for Lambert to make the decision based on much more info and insight than any of us.
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I wouldn't lame Jean II for wanting out. He arrives under a manager who clearly rated him, was fuc*ed off, by a manager that clearly had no concept of passing football, to Greece. Only to return to questions over his work permit. The poor guy's biggest impression to date was that, admittedly, misguided jumper.
Having got back a week ago I really wish my boss would fuck me off (back) to Greece !
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Even the manager who 'clearly rated him', bought him even, stopped picking him. At the time I thought that was (yet another) bad decision, but it turned out okay and NRC did well those last few games.
That's not quite right is it?
He was picked all the way through until his red card against Blackpool, was suspended for three matches, came straight back in, played for three more games then McCallister took over and promptly dropped him.
Unless my memory is playing tricks on me I don't think there was more than a game or so that Houllier didn't choose him for.
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Even the manager who 'clearly rated him', bought him even, stopped picking him. At the time I thought that was (yet another) bad decision, but it turned out okay and NRC did well those last few games.
That's not quite right is it?
He was picked all the way through until his red card against Blackpool, was suspended for three matches, came straight back in, played for three more games then McCallister took over and promptly dropped him.
Unless my memory is playing tricks on me I don't think there was more than a game or so that Houllier didn't choose him for.
and I would add to that by saying that Houllier didn't just buy him for that season. He would have bought him with an eye to playing a certain way, and would likely have bought other players to compliment Makoun's style. Houllier identified Makoun very quickly when he arrived so I'm sure he had a plan for him. The real criminal in all of this is TSM who dumped him by the end of August. That was the first red flag to how he planned on approaching the season and the style in which he wanted to play.
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Could be my memory playing tricks then. I seem to recall not agreeing with Houllier dropping him, and thinking it was also a bit strange and/or damning, considering he bought him.
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Having looked it up, by my reckoning he played all but one league game under Houllier apart from when he was suspended. The game he wasn't picked was West Ham where he was an used sub. A few days later Houllier was taken ill and Makoun didn't play again that season he was an unused sub in the first game after GH was ill. The last 4 games he wasn't even on the bench.
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Can't sell him making an impact now.
Not playing in any pre season games puts him way down the pecking order now I'd imagine.
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Ta PWS. GMac never rated him then, assuming GH had no input into team selection after being taken ill.
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Ta PWS. GMac never rated him then, assuming GH had no input into team selection after being taken ill.
Wouldn't have been allowed any input for, as they call it, medical reasons.
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As soon as the international clearance comes through, I'd sell him.
Sorry Paul but you did say you would sell him in a post BEFORE you said
If Lambert wants to get rid of him, then I'd support that
Correct. Would have helped if that one poster quoted this then, and not my other one ;D
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Doubt he'll play for us again. Money down the drain.
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PAUL Lambert admitted he doesn’t know if forgotten man Jean Makoun will be part of his Villa plans because he has yet to see him in action.
The Cameroon midfielder has not kicked a ball under the watchful eye of the new manager and his absence shows no immediate signs of coming to an end due to an ongoing work permit problem.
Whether £5 million Makoun will become part of Lambert’s plans is simply unknown at this stage because the Scot has no first-hand knowledge of what the 29-year-old is capable of producing.
Some of the confusion surrounding his unknown squad number was cleared up this week when Villa issued him the No.17 shirt but it is still not clear when his paperwork will finally go through.
When asked why Makoun hasn’t been around since his arrival Lambert said: “It is because of the work permit.
“He has not been with us since I’ve been here so we’ll have to wait on that.
“Will he be part of my plans? I haven’t seen him yet. I’ll have to wait and see.
“I know the work permit is a big thing here and the group at the minute is very good.
“I am trying to build the squad and we will see what happens.
“The group are coming along nicely and that is all you can ask for.”
The extra documentation is required following Makoun’s year-long loan spell with Olympiakos in Greece.
Part of the complications appear to be his inability to pass an English language test as his lessons ended when he temporarily moved away from the Midlands last season. Initially, the delay was not thought to be serious but just two weeks remain until the first game of the season and Makoun could potentially make a difference to Villa’s Premier League campaign.
Missing almost the entire pre-season programme will, of course, leave him weeks behind his team-mates in terms of fitness if he was to return and feature.
Last season the £5 million signing was deemed surplus to requirements by ex-boss Alex McLeish and spent the season helping Olympiakos win the league.
Lambert does have plenty of options available to him in midfield but Makoun has the experience that could help Villa’s youngsters flourish.
One man who is showing great promise is Brett Holman.
The versatile attacker scored his second goal of pre-season against Peterborough on Wednesday and may get a start in today’s pre-seaqson friendly at Nottingham Forest.
“Brett has looked like a very clever player so far,” said Lambert.
“He is a smart player who has impressed me and I’ve seen a few things in him that proves he is a very talented player.
“He is a player that I am looking forward to watching when it starts for real as I am the rest of the lads.
“I am sure the guys who are new are excited about the start of the season.
“I think Brett is a player who can be both a provider of goals and someone who can score them as well.
“If he can contribute to the team that is the most important thing because as I’ve said before we’re a team not a group of individuals.”
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We should find a good striker from French League and buy him with JMII plus cash. It will solve both problems.
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Is he still unable to play tomorrow? I'm surprised PL hasn't maneuvered him back to France by now.
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Would be very surprised to see him play for us again.
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Nice long holiday? (http://www.cameroononline.org/2012/08/07/jean-ii-makoun-savours-holiday-at-home/)
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That can't be for real surely? I like how the article uses the word "permits" several times! Ha ha. Really if the situation isn't gonna be resolved before December, we need to shift him on. If that is true, it seems like he's not in any great rush to sort his English out.
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Are we paying him during this time?
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Nice work if you can get it!
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Johnny Deaux 11 OFF TO RENNES.
what a loss of money, but maybe best for Lambert to have a clear out and make room for his choice to come in!
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Are we paying him during this time?
Can't see how we wouldn't be.
He's contracted to us and has put himself at the club's disposal. Even if we can't actually do anything with him at the moment.
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Season long loan to Rennes:
http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2885961,00.html
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Hmmm wonder if there is a agreed fee at the end of the season, I think we paid about 8 million for him didn't we?
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Well they will, like Olympiakos, be paying a loan fee of upwards of 500k or so and covering the wages, so not too bad. Would have liked the midfielder we were linked with coming the other way, but at least it frees up some wages surely?
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Hmmm wonder if there is a agreed fee at the end of the season, I think we paid about 8 million for him didn't we?
About 4.5 I seem to recall as Houllier said it was not an expensive deal for a player of his ability and experience.
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There were stories of anything from £3.75m up to £6m.
So probably somewhere in the middle of all that.
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maybe he is here
http://www.booking.com/hotel/ca/aston-villa-motel.html?utm_medium=SPPC&utm_term=hotel-264366&checkin=&checkout=&label=hotel-264366_hotelfull-_availability-&aid=332143
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maybe he is here
http://www.booking.com/hotel/ca/aston-villa-motel.html?utm_medium=SPPC&utm_term=hotel-264366&checkin=&checkout=&label=hotel-264366_hotelfull-_availability-&aid=332143
Its only got a review of 5.6 . Maybe Heskey owns it.
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This thread is lingering around like fart in a spacesuit. He's not coming back!
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There were stories of anything from £3.75m up to £6m.
So probably somewhere in the middle of all that.
I remember Houllier saying that the amount quoted in the press at the time was in euros. So if it was five or six million euro it was likely less than £4m. Or about 50p with the current FX rates.
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On the OS
Jean Makoun has moved on a season-long loan to French side Rennes with a view to a permanent deal.
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season loan , I wish we would just bloody sell him . oh well
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I imagine we would have if we could.
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au revoir, Johnny Deux
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au revoir, Johnny Deux
again...
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Jean Deux est dans l'arbre
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I'm not sure when Ligue 1 started but it will be interesting to see how he plays back in France.
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Johnny Deux porte le chapeau et petit pull, la combination trop, trop bizarre.