Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: Holtenderinthesky on October 22, 2011, 05:08:01 PM
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If a player is sent off and the red card is then rescinded retrospectively how on earth can the result of the match stand? The officials have mad an horrendous error that will surely be overturned by the FA but what good is it going to do us? Is it time for the rules to be changed and if so, how?
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Well yeh that's a big point about today, the result may well have been different if it weren't for a error, but there's nothing you can do about it.
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I want NFL red rag challenge referee option for manager 2 each half for both side. If get two wrong in first half should lose challenge in second half. But how can that work as it got to cater all level from Red Lions V King Arthur Pub league match to Barcelona V Real Madrid.
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Well yeh that's a big point about today, the result may well have been different if it weren't for a error, but there's nothing you can do about it.
Well, yeah, that's the whole point of the post. Is there a way that a team can be compensated for a decision that is subsequently adjudged to be wrong by the games governing body? I know there is nothing we can do about it NOW but is there a way we can avoid such situations in the future? (Other than sacking Phil Dowd)
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Well yeh that's a big point about today, the result may well have been different if it weren't for a error, but there's nothing you can do about it.
Well, yeah, that's the whole point of the post. Is there a way that a team can be compensated for a decision that is subsequently adjudged to be wrong by the games governing body? I know there is nothing we can do about it NOW but is there a way we can avoid such situations in the future? (Other than sacking Phil Dowd)
But wasnt it the linesmans decision? (don`t know his name - lets just call him c*nt)
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Well yeh that's a big point about today, the result may well have been different if it weren't for a error, but there's nothing you can do about it.
I don't get the relevance of who's decision it was. IF the card is rescinded then it doesn't matter who called it, the point still stands does it not?
Well, yeah, that's the whole point of the post. Is there a way that a team can be compensated for a decision that is subsequently adjudged to be wrong by the games governing body? I know there is nothing we can do about it NOW but is there a way we can avoid such situations in the future? (Other than sacking Phil Dowd)
But wasnt it the linesmans decision? (don`t know his name - lets just call him c*nt)
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If a player is sent off and the red card is then rescinded retrospectively how on earth can the result of the match stand? The officials have mad an horrendous error that will surely be overturned by the FA but what good is it going to do us? Is it time for the rules to be changed and if so, how?
Its difficult though. I agree to a certain extent, but how about if Herd wasn't sent off, and we go on to win the game.
Surely Albion would have just a big a grievance as Hutton should have been sent off, and they would have had the advantage of playing against 10 men for 75 minutes.
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Well yeh that's a big point about today, the result may well have been different if it weren't for a error, but there's nothing you can do about it.
Well, yeah, that's the whole point of the post. Is there a way that a team can be compensated for a decision that is subsequently adjudged to be wrong by the games governing body? I know there is nothing we can do about it NOW but is there a way we can avoid such situations in the future? (Other than sacking Phil Dowd)
But wasnt it the linesmans decision? (don`t know his name - lets just call him c*nt)
Darren Cann.
As an aside. Why on earth are referees demoted for a week or two then promoted straight back up to the Premiership after a bad call? Surely, with the number of times that Dowd has made bad calls they should have worked out he was a dire ref. I also don't agree with how lower league teams are made to suffer shit refs like him every other week but that is by-the-by.
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Herd should have said his name was Vidic.
Fat fucking ****** Dowd.
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Sorry guys but the decision was spot on ...... sat in Trinity Rd roughly in line with edge of area and it was clear that Herd made an attempted stamp in player
Linesman saw it flagged penalty and sending off ....not Dowds fault this time and no I cant stand the guy
We are quick enough to complain when things go against us but this one was correct
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Sorry guys but the decision was spot on ...... sat in Trinity Rd roughly in line with edge of area and it was clear that Herd made an attempted stamp in player
Linesman saw it flagged penalty and sending off ....not Dowds fault this time and no I cant stand the guy
We are quick enough to complain when things go against us but this one was correct
Any idea why there was absolutely no reaction from Olsson then?
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Sorry guys but the decision was spot on ...... sat in Trinity Rd roughly in line with edge of area and it was clear that Herd made an attempted stamp in player
Linesman saw it flagged penalty and sending off ....not Dowds fault this time and no I cant stand the guy
We are quick enough to complain when things go against us but this one was correct
Any idea why there was absolutely no reaction from Olsson then?
I watched the game on Villastreams and the Norwegian presenters (one of which was Oyvind Leonhardsen) replayed the incident from every angle possible and they were actually laughing in the studio as not one of them could see why he was sent off indicating that if anything it was a foul ON Herd. I have seen it from maybe 6 or 7 angles and I concur with them 100%. It was NEVER, EVER a foul and in my opinion it was one of the worst red card decisions I have seen in 30 years of watching football.
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Sorry guys but the decision was spot on ...... sat in Trinity Rd roughly in line with edge of area and it was clear that Herd made an attempted stamp in player
Linesman saw it flagged penalty and sending off ....not Dowds fault this time and no I cant stand the guy
We are quick enough to complain when things go against us but this one was correct
I'm sorry but you've made the same mistake the linesman made, and demonstrated why.
What you (or the linesman) couldn't see was that when Ollson fell over, Herd tried to walk away and Ollson grabbed his leg and pulled it down. You, and the linesman, interpreted that as Herd stamping because Olsson was facing away from you and you couldn't see he had hold of Herd's leg. I had a perfect view from the middle of the lower tier of the Holte.
The decision was a shocker and the linesman shouldn't be giving decisions like that unless he can see everything.
As to the OP. Agree there should be some kind of action the FA take. We looked comfortable before the sending off. Just like in plenty of other sports, decisions like that should be passed to someone watching the game on TV. In today's case they would've seen the actual correct decision was a freekick to us and the game could've carried on from there.
As for Blatter's insistence that the game should be the same at the top as it is at the bottom. What a load of shite. Both because it's already not the case and because it's irrelevant. Rugby, tennis, and cricket cope with using technology, why not football?
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Herd should have said his name was Vidic.
Fat fucking c*** Dowd.
Dowd was just backing up the Lino. It was the latter that deemed that an offence had been committed and then did some of the most over the top flag waving seen this side if Iwo Jima.
I know that the Ref and Lino are linked up but it would have been nice to see Dowd go over and speak to the Lino
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Lets not bleat about it too much as that's the type of thing those smethwick pricks are famous for.
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So modern technology has no place in football according to Sepp Blatter, well the same goes for Phil Dowd but that doesn't stop that clown turning up week in week out and ruining games
So angry at today's decision and the games refusal to even look into video replays etc another reason why people are falling out of love with the game...
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This has the challenge on it.
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Dowd had a better view than his linesman, so what does that say about him as a referee? If he doesn't trust his own judgement why the hell should anyone else? I would like an apology at the very least.
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Sorry guys but the decision was spot on ...... sat in Trinity Rd roughly in line with edge of area and it was clear that Herd made an attempted stamp in player
Linesman saw it flagged penalty and sending off ....not Dowds fault this time and no I cant stand the guy
We are quick enough to complain when things go against us but this one was correct
Sorry LV. You are wrong. I was standing near you and couldn't see a thing wrong, except that Olsson seemed to be holding Herd's foot. Have since watched loads of replays. Herd makes no downward "stamp" at all. He just tries to get his foot away from Olsson who makes no appeal/complaint at all at apparently being "stamped on"!!!! Linesman got it wrong and Dowd was verging on incompetent today.
Really glad you not a ref mate!
Owd Woy got his nickers in a twist over the Hutton thing and made the most ridiculous statements I've heard on MOTD since Wenger's last whinge. Hutton went in hard to win the ball and won the ball. Since when has that been a sending off offence? Long got injured in the process. End of...
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Hutton went in hard to win the ball and won the ball. Since when has that been a sending off offence?
Since you ask, 2005. When FIFA decided that it didn't matter what happened to the ball and what mattered was the effect that your tackle might have on the body of your opponent. And rightly so.
As for the original post, it's a nice idea in theory but I'd be interested to hear what you would suggest changing the rules to.
Replay the match? Not really feasible.
Change the result? Not really feasible.
I'm not sure what other options would be available.
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Hutton went in hard to win the ball and won the ball. Since when has that been a sending off offence?
Since you ask, 2005. When FIFA decided that it didn't matter what happened to the ball and what mattered was the effect that your tackle might have on the body of your opponent. And rightly so.
As for the original post, it's a nice idea in theory but I'd be interested to hear what you would suggest changing the rules to.
Replay the match? Not really feasible.
Change the result? Not really feasible.
I'm not sure what other options would be available.
Come on Dave. Be fair!
What the f**k do FIFA know about football;-)
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If a player is sent off and the red card is then rescinded retrospectively how on earth can the result of the match stand? The officials have mad an horrendous error that will surely be overturned by the FA but what good is it going to do us? Is it time for the rules to be changed and if so, how?
Time was a decision went against you and all you could do was sulk about it for a bit and then console yourself that things would balance out over the season. Now it's all WAH! WAH! S'NOT FAIR! WOULD'VE WON BUT FOR THAT! WAH! WAH! Why is a referee's mistake worse than a mistake by a player? Serious question. Your goalkeeper is beaten at his near post, your left back woefully underhits a backpass into the , your centre back slices a clearance into the top corner of his own net. All game altering mistakes but no-one would dream of demanding a replay under those circumstances and yet a match official cocks up and it's flaming torches and pitchforks all round. I'm not defending Phil Dowd, God forbid, the man's ineptitude can be seen from space and I sincerely hope he never officiates a game we're involved in again but he and his colleagues have cost us fewer matches in the last few years than Messrs Dunne and Warnock. I think the main issue is that people are labouring under the misapprehension that football is important. It's not. Honestly, it isn't. It's a game, that's all. It's just a game.
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99% of players If they had been stamped on would be rolling round doing their oscar nomination , 1 % would have shouted at the ref with his hands waving in the air . Olsson did nothing , just ran back into play . It was never a foul .
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Sorry guys but the decision was spot on ...... sat in Trinity Rd roughly in line with edge of area and it was clear that Herd made an attempted stamp in player
Linesman saw it flagged penalty and sending off ....not Dowds fault this time and no I cant stand the guy
We are quick enough to complain when things go against us but this one was correct
What a load of fucking bollocks this was the same that was said on WM "the intent was their " if we were going on that principle their wouldnt be a player left on the pitch and id be locked up in jail never heard such absolute crap!
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If a player is sent off and the red card is then rescinded retrospectively how on earth can the result of the match stand? The officials have mad an horrendous error that will surely be overturned by the FA but what good is it going to do us? Is it time for the rules to be changed and if so, how?
Too many sour grapes there mate.
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It was definately the Assistant's decision but what amazed me was that at no stage (as far as I could see on TV) did Dowd go to him to consult or even ask about what he had seen.
Surely on such a big 'call' (Penalty/Red Card) that's the least he should have done?
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I want NFL red rag challenge referee option for manager 2 each half for both side. If get two wrong in first half should lose challenge in second half. But how can that work as it got to cater all level from Red Lions V King Arthur Pub league match to Barcelona V Real Madrid.
Tradition is good - but we need to join the 21st century. Hers'a red card was total bullshit.
Well yeh that's a big point about today, the result may well have been different if it weren't for a error, but there's nothing you can do about it.
Well, yeah, that's the whole point of the post. Is there a way that a team can be compensated for a decision that is subsequently adjudged to be wrong by the games governing body? I know there is nothing we can do about it NOW but is there a way we can avoid such situations in the future? (Other than sacking Phil Dowd)
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No way it was ever a stamping incident.
Thing which truly amazes me is the numbers flocking on here whether at the game or not, actually defending the decision and knocking other fans for not swallowing it like good boys taking some nasty medicine.
However I do not think it will be rescinded because turkeys do not vote for Christmas.
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Why is a referee's mistake worse than a mistake by a player? Serious question. Your goalkeeper is beaten at his near post, your left back woefully underhits a backpass into the , your centre back slices a clearance into the top corner of his own net. All game altering mistakes but no-one would dream of demanding a replay under those circumstances and yet a match official cocks up and it's flaming torches and pitchforks all round.
Because the referee's sole role is to ensure the rules of the game are followed. In an ideal world, the referee wouldn't even be there. Even the laws of the game describe the referee as 'footballing furniture'!
So a game-changing error on his part is of course much worse than one by a player who is part of the game.
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Sorry guys but the decision was spot on ...... sat in Trinity Rd roughly in line with edge of area and it was clear that Herd made an attempted stamp in player
Linesman saw it flagged penalty and sending off ....not Dowds fault this time and no I cant stand the guy
We are quick enough to complain when things go against us but this one was correct
I was in block K of The Holte and watched those two as the corner came in as the ref had a word with them with Herd complaining about an arm swing, Herd was fouled, I didn't see the rest of the incident but when the linesman was flagging I thought he was calling it back for the foul on Herd.
Having seen MOTD, there was no stamp, if anything the fouling on Herd continues with the guy holding his foot.
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He truly is a dreadful ref. He denied Wolves a clear penalty a few weeks back. He was given a lower league game the week after but it dose'nt seem to have made him any better. It's time he found a new proffession that he's actually good at.
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I want NFL red rag challenge referee option for manager 2 each half for both side. If get two wrong in first half should lose challenge in second half. But how can that work as it got to cater all level from Red Lions V King Arthur Pub league match to Barcelona V Real Madrid.
Why? They say they want the game the same at all levels but I'm sure the teams don't have to go and clear dog shit and glass off the pitch before the game in the top leagues (apart from at St Andrews) and I have never seen a professional team have to supply linesmen from the crowd since Chinny Hill did it.
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He truly is a dreadful ref. He denied Wolves a clear penalty a few weeks back. He was given a lower league game the week after but it dose'nt seem to have made him any better. It's time he found a new proffession that he's actually good at.
The sad thing is he is one of the top refs and gets Cup finals and International stuff. The lino yesterday is one of ours sent to World Cups and the like.
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I think Leicester v Villa in April 1970 needs a replay.
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I want NFL red rag challenge referee option for manager 2 each half for both side. If get two wrong in first half should lose challenge in second half. But how can that work as it got to cater all level from Red Lions V King Arthur Pub league match to Barcelona V Real Madrid.
Why? They say they want the game the same at all levels but I'm sure the teams don't have to go and clear dog shit and glass off the pitch before the game in the top leagues (apart from at St Andrews) and I have never seen a professional team have to supply linesmen from the crowd since Chinny Hill did it.
Exactly. It's a nonsense.
The trouble is Blatter's view that controversy is good. Think about it, people carry on talking about refereeing mistakes days after the game has finished. Blatter sees that as a good thing because people are still talking about football. He's wrong of course, but until he's gone and someone less mental and corrupt is installed at the head of FIFA then it's not going to change. Unfortunately the most likely successor is Platini and his view on technology in football is possibly even more extreme than Blatter's.
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The sad thing is he is one of the top refs and gets Cup finals and International stuff. The lino yesterday is one of ours sent to World Cups and the like.
It's worse than just 'sent to World Cups' - he ran the line in the 2010 World Cup Final!!!!
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It was a shit decision but was made by the linesman.
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Been reading McCleish's comments on the OS. He said that the linesman told him that it was a stamp or it looked like a stamp. Not good enough is it really?
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I want NFL red rag challenge referee option for manager 2 each half for both side. If get two wrong in first half should lose challenge in second half. But how can that work as it got to cater all level from Red Lions V King Arthur Pub league match to Barcelona V Real Madrid.
Why? They say they want the game the same at all levels but I'm sure the teams don't have to go and clear dog shit and glass off the pitch before the game in the top leagues (apart from at St Andrews) and I have never seen a professional team have to supply linesmen from the crowd since Chinny Hill did it.
Yet in European competitions they've been experimenting with extra officials. Blatter and co make it up as they go along.
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I want NFL red rag challenge referee option for manager 2 each half for both side. If get two wrong in first half should lose challenge in second half. But how can that work as it got to cater all level from Red Lions V King Arthur Pub league match to Barcelona V Real Madrid.
Why? They say they want the game the same at all levels but I'm sure the teams don't have to go and clear dog shit and glass off the pitch before the game in the top leagues (apart from at St Andrews) and I have never seen a professional team have to supply linesmen from the crowd since Chinny Hill did it.
Yet in European competitions they've been experimenting with extra officials. Blatter and co make it up as they go along.
Which doesn't seem to make any difference as I have not seen them give anything the ref hasn't already called. And if they brought it in at all levels, it will mean a job for two more passers by on the local rec.
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Sorry LV, if thats a penalty/sending off, then there would be 10 every game.
A little kick out by Herd, after being smacked in the face, no penalty claims, indeed Olson gets up to challenge for the ball, and then thinks the foul is against him.
The ref over reacted to a wannabee linesman.We was in control up until that point, his sending off should be rescinded.