Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Villa Memories => Topic started by: Rip Van We Go Again on July 11, 2011, 04:39:56 PM
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What a day.
I went with my Nan's next door neighbour, as we passed the Holte pub we got spat on by Rangers supporters sitting on the wall, lots of 'English bastards' comments.
Got into the ground, when we went 2-0 up I thought
'Sod this, i'm off home'
Coming out the ground I got chased by 3 blokes, If I wasn't so fleet of foot they'd have kicked seven shades of shit out of me (I was 10 at the time)
It felt like i'd been beamed to another planet.
Anybody else attend it and if so, what are your memories?
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I was a bout 2 at the time but i've heard so many stories about this game. The book 'Children of the revolution' had a part on it. Sounded like they were a different bred.
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I was a cocky 14 year old.My dad had come back from work about 1 o'clock, and asked me if i was going the game, i saiI said yeah why?...he said there were about 2 or 3 Rangers fans throwing empty beer cans/bottles at the cars as they were driving past 6 ways Aston.I said i'll give it a miss.My mates went, and had similar experiences to yourself.
The funniest story i heard was from the bloke who used to sit in front of me.He took a girl on a blind date to that game.What a 1st date.Said he had parked his car down Electric Avenue but could'nt get to it until about 9 o'clock at night because there were still gangs of Jocks roaming around looking for trouble.
Those were the good old days.
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I remember there were coaches of Rangers fans cropping up all over the place on the Friday night, we used to drink at the Bagot & I,m sure they had a few visitors.
On the day of the match, we took my mates girlfriends brother with us for his very 1st Villa match, as it was a friendly !!!
I remember we were directed into the Trinty rd enclosure, but after about 20 mins moved to the Witton end, then eventually over the back of the Witton & out when it got a bit silly.
This poor kid we had with us, would have been about 8 at the time , was probably put off football for life after that.
I can remember the Evening Mail carried a picture of fans in the Witton End, with 1 smart chap standing with a crash helmet on, a good choice that day.
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I remember that match with amazement now, but I was stunned at the time. I lived then near the Scott Arms, Great Barr and I remember seeing double decker buses travelling along the Walsall Road, having just come off the M6, fullof Rangers fans. I next remember the Witton Lane being lined by Rangers fans who were sat on the ground completely smashed - a long journey from Glasgow to B'ham. I later heard that a lot of these guys got beaten up; unable to defend themselves. I went into the Witton End. The Holte was full of Rangers. I think the police simply let them in for safety reasons. At one point there was a surge in the Holte. I think some Villa got in and had a go at getting in back. I don't know what happened to them! In the Witton the atmosphere was strange. Personally I think we were nuts for being there. It was not safe. The Witton Lane seats had Rangers in them and they spent the match singing their songs. They clearly saw us as Celtic supporters. I got hit by a piece of flying glass in the face. They hurtled bottles at us for fun. When John Deehan scored our second goal I couldn't believe it. I wanted him to miss or fall over ... anything but score. The match was abandoned. I do remember some fighting in the Witton. The Argus had a headline about a knife being used I think. On the way home - we ran down Witton Lane - there were some guys with an Irish tricolour trying to rally Villa on the island by the Witton Arms. I don't think many stayed. Quite a day! The match was in the papers for a couple of days and all over TV. I never saw anything like it again. Sheffield Weds, Arsenal, Liverpool, Man Utd were all nothing in comparison.
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I was 15 at the time, and have certainly never been so frightened at a football game as I was on that day. Total mayhem all around.
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Got into town on the bus on my own, bumped into a group of about ten of them pissed as farts, got chased all the way up Hill Street. Went towards Colmore Row and there were loads more of them. Got back on the bus and went home.
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I'm still baffled to this day that 3 adults were more than happy to beat up a terrified 10 year old.
Such hard men these Rangers fans.
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Dreadful, dreadful day and night. Thousands of drunken racist bigots attacking Asians in Aston, assaulting men, women and children, stopping cars and dragging Villa fans out for a kicking, and giving the old trusty anti-papist canon a vigorous airing-friend of mine (non-footballing) was told in town to take his crucifix off otherwise he'd be going home in a coffin. Couple of us went in the Holte thinking our lot were just a bit late and couldn't believe it was packed with 'em. Kept a low profile until one of them drained the dregs from his whiskey bottle and cracked the empty over the head of an OAP wearing a Villa scarf-had a bit of a stand off with the culprit and then fled as the realisation that the heroic Sons of William were about to do the same to the pair of us. This wasn't just the old 'mindless minority'-from what I saw it was the great majority and it was the most nauseating display I have ever witnessed at a football match and I've seen a few. How any Villa fan from that era could harbour anything but loathing for them is beyond me.
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As someone who didnt know much about this game until recent years, i'm amazed that fans of a football club could go around beating up anyone who wasn't scottish, which seems to include, kids, OAPs, women, young men and anyone of ethnic origin outside their own. At least most football hooligans fought against like minded people and some code of honour. That bunch of Rangers fans are to me the lowest type of scum that can exist.
No wonder when they played at Old Trafford last season the police escourted them in from Wigan.
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As someone who didnt know much about this game until recent years, i'm amazed that fans of a football club could go around beating up anyone who wasn't scottish, which seems to include, kids, OAPs, women, young men and anyone of ethnic origin outside their own. At least most football hooligans fought against like minded people and some code of honour. That bunch of Rangers fans are to me the lowest type of scum that can exist.
No wonder when they played at Old Trafford last season the police escourted them in from Wigan.
It was a terrible, terrible day. I've looked up the match using a Google search. There are some pieces that capture just how awful it was.
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I believe this video is relating to said game
http://www.macearchive.org/archive.html?Title=25663
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Good find! Found this on there too:
Benny meets Ron Saunders (http://www.macearchive.org/Archive/Title/atv-today-06051980-benny-at-villa-park/MediaEntry/32975.html)
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As someone who didnt know much about this game until recent years, i'm amazed that fans of a football club could go around beating up anyone who wasn't scottish, which seems to include, kids, OAPs, women, young men and anyone of ethnic origin outside their own.
That's what made them lower than low.
They were looking to hit anybody, young or old.
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Good find! Found this on there too:
Benny meets Ron Saunders (http://www.macearchive.org/Archive/Title/atv-today-06051980-benny-at-villa-park/MediaEntry/32975.html)
Great find. Never seen that before.
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I went to this with my mate Gareth. At that time
Good find! Found this on there too:
Benny meets Ron Saunders (http://www.macearchive.org/Archive/Title/atv-today-06051980-benny-at-villa-park/MediaEntry/32975.html)
Great find. Never seen that before.
John Swallow was always entertaining on ATV.
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I went to the game with my mate Gareth. My Dad had a car park ticket in the official car park at that time, luckily as he wasnt going we drove down and used his pass.
As usual we were going to stand on the Holte, as we drove down Trinity Road quite early there were crowds of Rangers trying to get into the Holte. I said to my mate Gareth, I think we will go in the seats today, his response was `why ?'. Anyway we took our places in the `blue seats' (lower trinity). It was hard to see the pitch at first, Villa fans were entering the Holte End and then coming straight onto the track and being taken down to the Witton end. As the match progressed the chant I remember to this day was "Fuck the Pope and the IRA...Fuck the Pope and the IRA" over and over again. Villa went 1-0 up which provoked a pitch invasion of sorts and a short stoppage but the police got it cleared and we carried on. When Villa went 2-0 up on about the hour (was it Morty who scored?) there was a mass pitch invasion, players went off and things were now out of control. Waves of drunken Rangers fans rushing towards the Witton, police reinforcements with dogs trying to repel them. It seemed to be about 3 to 4 reduced waves of fans across the pitch, until the police finally got them back. Leaving us looking on bemused at the playing field, police with dogs and a mess of flags and other assorted items strewn around a handful of semi conscious people lying on the pitch. I turned to my mate Gareth and said "come on I think we should go" to which his response was "why?". After convincing him that there wasnt going to be any more football today, we legged it out the ground through the little gate down the side of the old supporters club to the car park, in the car, drove out turned right, immediate right again down Nelson Road, and took a left at the bottom (even though we lived in Erdington) and got as much distance between us and Villa Park as quickly as possible.
My mate Gareth never had a clue at football games in the 70s, its a wonder we survived. From not shutting up at Spurs when we were 4-1 up and surrounded by cockneys to throwing a bacon sandwich back at an Everton fan after a Brian Little wonder goal at Goodison. Gareths response to the scouser when he asked him out was " I dont want sauce on my jacket but I'm not looking for a fight either, I'd rather watch the match". His best one was at Villa Park though, we stood about half way up the Holte and an egg landed on his head. He went to the back to try and find who had thrown it ! We told him, any one of about 10,000 ! Not surprisingly, he didnt find the phantom egg flinger.
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One that also sticks in my mind is us beating Man Utd 2-1 in season 75/76 (the season where we didn't win an away game) The Manure fans charged down Yew Tree Road and smashed every other window in.
Luckily we got away with it.
Their fans had a fierce reputation back in those days.
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One that also sticks in my mind is us beating Man Utd 2-1 in season 75/76 (the season where we didn't win an away game) The Manure fans charged down Yew Tree Road and smashed every other window in.
Luckily we got away with it.
Their fans had a fierce reputation back in those days.
They were bastards, going to Old Trafford in the 1970s was throughly unpleasant and the sheer numbers of them travelling away with pay at the gate and no controlled ticket allocation meant riots. e.g Norwich 1975.
&feature=related
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Was that the one where those two lads on the roof went crashing through?
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I have tried to blot out the events at the Rangers "friendly" over the years! Their so called fans made some of the firms from London look like a kids party!
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This was the programme for the Villa v Glasgow Rangers friendly.
Look at the balloons. Look at the lovely images of family friendly football in the 1970s being promoted.
(http://www.footballzone.co.uk/images/i-3000/03235.jpg)
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Thanks for sharing those accounts!
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I also went to the game got to witton station about 1 did not feel safe so I went a little walk along the track and found myself walking along the cut. I eventually found my way on to Aston lane and walking down every bin you passed was full to overflowing. Found my way to the serpentine car park and coaches where still arriving at half past two. When I eventually got into Villa park it was 2:45 got into the holte about ten minutes before kick-off. Had a look round all you could see was Rangers fans so I quickly decided that it was not safe and evacuated myself to the witton end. When we got our second the pitch invasion by rangers soon followed. I did stay till the game was abandoned and when it was I moved at a far rate of knots back to witton station.
But I do not care that some of you hate rangers I have problems with a club a lot closer than rangers.(tesco-bags) I AM A RANGERS FAN THAT USED TO GO. WATP
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what sort of attendance was it that day?
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about 17,000 about 9,000 of them where Rangers
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The attendance was recorded as 17,000, which looking at the photos of the game in the next match programme looked about right. My guess would be that there were about 6,000 Villa and 11,000 Rangers. Strange thing was, despite being played against the vilest of atmospheres, the game itself was actually pretty good. Frank Carrodus scored Villa's second goal that then led to the pitch invasion.
Elaine Mills - if you're reading this, I'm really sorry I legged it out the ground so fast, leaving you and your mum behind.
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My Dad, a Dubliner, wouldn't let me go to that game alone as a 13 year old, and he said there was no way he would have gone even if he hadn't been working on the building site that day. I went down to our nan's in Newtown and I remember Rangers fans by the Crown & Cushion in Perry Barr lobbing stuff on to cars in the underpass. My mom and sisters were shopping in town and said the anti English stuff and abuse aimed at women from pissed Scots was pretty intense.
A couple of my school mates went and everything that people have said above sounds in line with what they recounted. One of my memories of the papers that weekend was that there were a couple of stabbings at the game and the Mirror / Sunday Mirror ran a headline "The Day the Villa Ran Wild", which seemed faintly ironic.
Oft overlooked is that Blues played a friendly with Celtic the year before to celebrate their centenary and had a fair bit of trouble too. As it was a midweek game the numbers of Celtic fans were much lower, but they had plenty of problems nonetheless. I think those 2 games contributed to many Villa fans of my age preferring Celtic to Rangers, and Blues siding more with Rangers, regardless of religion.
I met some Celtic fans on their way to the UEFA final in Seville in 2003 and they confirmed that in Glasgow Villa are seen as a pro Celtic club. Then again, Celtic fans seem to have a perception of every club in England being pro Rangers or pro Celtic - Simon Kuiper mentioned this in his excellent book Football Against the Enemy.
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There was plenty of talk the week before the game about the extent of trouble there would be. We weren't wrong. It put me off attending so I opted to go into town instead on the bus. Every pub on the Lichfield Rd and there were far more of them then was littered with Rangers fans. Drunken fans were everywhere, I seen kids no more than 13 or 14 swigging from bottles of Whiskey. Fans poking up all over the place, It was as though for one day law and order didn't matter.
Then we had the stories of those who did attend.
Rangers should never be forgiven for what happened that day and it's one of the reasons I despise that club as much as I do. A lot was said about how sorry they were the way it turned out but nothing was done about it. They didn't give a shit really. In fact, if I remember correctly some of the blame was laid at our door.
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One that also sticks in my mind is us beating Man Utd 2-1 in season 75/76 (the season where we didn't win an away game) The Manure fans charged down Yew Tree Road and smashed every other window in.
Luckily we got away with it.
Their fans had a fierce reputation back in those days.
Is that the match they assaulted the Villa chaplain? Revenge was taken later in the season when they visited another local team as I recall...
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I remember there was one photo of Villa fans laying into a Rangers fan that made the front page of all the national papers the following day, which kind of distorted the story. It was of a Rangers fan diving into a Villa section after running onto the pitch and getting well and truly twatted.
I went on my own that day and as soon as I went through the turnstiles at the Holte was directed by stewards or police down to the front and then walked across the front of the Holte to the Witton Lane Stand and up to the Witton End. I was on the bank at the back of the Witton watching when what seemed like the entire Holte End emptied onto the pitch and came running our way when we scored the second goal.
If there was a way of capturing an image from my head of that scene it would make quite a picture!
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Over the many years i have been watching the villa i have been in a few scary situations with the likes of Small Heath, West Ham,Chelsea .Millwall and Man Utd fans causing aggro in and around Villa Park but i have never been as terrified as i was that day against Rangers. On the way to the ground i can remember coming across scores of drunken Rangers fans sitting on the wall of Aston church daring each other to stroke the police dogs and giving abuse to anyone walking past who happened to be wearing villa colours.Walked on past the trinity stand to the shop on the corner of Nelson rd just in time to see scores more of their fans getting off the special buses that had come from the city centre, most of them had smashed windows.
I was close to turning around and going home but thought hey,if i can go to the Den and survive i can go my own ground even if there is lots of rangers fans in there. When i got to the Holte end turnstiles in Trinity rd a couple of coppers barred us from going in and said in the interests of safety they were sending the villa fans down to the Witton end.So off we went to the Witton end.
I remember us taking the lead and there being a small pitch invasion .All around me fellow villa fans were probably thinking the same as me ,which was i hope to god we don 't score again.Of course,that 's exactly what we did. Another pitch invasion followed only much bigger this time .It took what seemed ages to clear the pitch but from where we were stood in the Witton end you could see loads more Rangers fans coming down from the back of the Holte to try and get on the pitch.Can't remember if it was the ref or the police who decided to abandon the game but that was the signal for thousands of them to storm onto the pitch.They had just one thing in mind,to get us in the Witton end.I don 't mind admitting i was scared shitless as i watched them running across the pitch towards us.The only thing that saved us was the police dogs,they had got as far as the Witton end penalty area before the dogs started to drive them back.
Someone mentioned earlier that someone had told them a story that they had parked in Electric Avenue and could not get their car as it was not safe to return to it. Could have been us, we were parked in one of the roads off Electric Avenue but was unable to get to our car untill around 7 30. I remember we got on the number 11 and went to Erdington for a drink for a couple of hours.While in Erdington we met a few non football friends who had just come from the city centre and they told us it was full of drunken football fans and not a safe place at all. Sorry if i have gone on but this was one friendly i will never forget,for all the wrong reasons
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It was a surreal and unforgettable day.
I was a 15, and my usual route to Villa Park was on the bus, either the number 11 outer circle or the 38 into town and out on a Villa Park special.
I walked to the top of my road in Billesley and there was a drunken Scotsman with a Rangers scarf on slumped outside the newsagents swigging from a scotch bottle at 10 am, and I knew this game was going to be a little bit different !
Getting on the bus, and god knows where they had come from, were a group of about ten completely hammered Jocks, causing havoc with old ladies and women trying to go shopping, throughput the journey into Brum the bus was picking up Rangers fans at every stop, where the hell they all came from I'll never know to this day.
Finally made it into town, it was carnage, it's the only game I've ever been to when I seriously thought about turning back because I was that scared, they were everywhere, and all completely pissed to a man !
At Villa Park two hours before kick off they had taken over the Holte, viewed the game, what there was of it, from The Witton, no Villa fans could get in The Holte End.
The shameful scenes of violence live with me to this day, saw plenty of Villa fans in a lot of trouble and was just glad to get out of there after the game was abandoned.
Can't remember either of the goals, the game was played in a strange atmosphere of just looking at what was going off in the crowd.
Still hate Rangers to this day because of it.
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I've heard countless tales about this game, I wasn't there.
One questions to those of you that were in attendance, why were we playing a friendly on a Saturday in October?
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Villan for life - I wasn't there myself fortunately, but the reason the match was on a Saturday in October was due to World Cup qualifiers being played (I think on the following Wednesday night ?).
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Villan for life - I wasn't there myself fortunately, but the reason the match was on a Saturday in October was due to World Cup qualifiers being played (I think on the following Wednesday night ?).
I wondered that but wasn't aware of the Saturday postponements. What is the norm now must have been a one-off or a season long experiment back then.
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It was the only home game I missed that season, I didn't go because it was only a 'friendly'. had no idea there was going to be trouble of any sort. in fact I felt quite guilty I wasn't there as all my mates went and got mixed up in the mayhem. We never believed anyone would ever take the Holte and my young masculine pride took a hell of a knock that day.
It happened during the period when Scotland fans would completely take over Wembley during the home internationals as well if I'm not mistaken.
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I remeber we had a previous thread about this game a few years ago. I went to the game with my old man who comes from Glasgow, but is on the other side of the divide. It was a very scary atmosphere and when the Rangers fans ran on the pitch and at the Villa fans after the second goal, all I remember is that the old man wanted to fight them all and was going mental. He had to be restrained from having a go at them by himself.
It's the only time I saw him like that when I was a kid, but he grew up with that hate, coming from a very poor part of Glasgow andd he hates Rangers with a passion.
The game is a bit of a blur, but I remeber the very bad vibes in and around the ground both before, during and after.
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Can someone help me on this one? I remember it all very well up to the second goal going in and me and my mates deciding we didn't want to end up in hospital so we tried to get out of The Witton End. We ended up climbing over the wall at the back to get out. My memory says the gates were locked, but maybe we were just in a blind panic to get away. Does anyone else know if the Witton End gates were locked?
The other image I have is of the players and officials legging it to the tunnel and some of them grabbing some young kids at the front of the Trinity and taking them down the tunnel with them.
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It happened during the period when Scotland fans would completely take over Wembley during the home internationals as well if I'm not mistaken.
Like this you mean?
(http://img.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2007/11_02/087scotland_468x291.jpg)
Incidentally, it was reported last year that the young gentleman who broke the crossbar at Wembley passed away last year.
Scotland fan who broke Wembley crossbar during pitch invasion dies aged 54
Sep 21 2010 By Craig McDonald
THE man who famously broke the crossbar at Wembley Stadium in 1977 has died.
Alex Torrance passed away aged just 54, after a long battle with alcoholism.
As a 21-year-old, Alex hit the headlines by climbing on to the crossbar at Wembley after Scotland's 2-1 victory against England.
The bar snapped between Alex's legs - and pictures of him cheering defiantly after crashing to the turf made the front pages across Europe the following day.
Speaking about the incident, Alex once said: "Those were Bay City Roller days and I'm sorry to say that I was wearing a tartan shirt, brown flares and platform shoes.
"I didn't hear the final whistle, I just saw the Scotland players jumping up and down.
"I was next to my brother and started running towards the posts.
"Scots were climbing all over it, and I tried climbing up - but it was difficult because of my platforms.
"I was pulled up and was about to swing my legs over it when it snapped. I landed on my a**e then stood up and saluted the crowd. It was ecstasy.
"I then started digging up the Wembley turf. I handed out hundreds of bits and kept some for myself."
His brother David said last night: "No matter what Alex did, he was always known as the man who broke the bar at Wembley."
A TV show of 100 Greatest Sporting Moments once placed the incident at No57 - beating Henry Cooper flooring Cassius Clay into 58th.
David, 49, said: "Alex travelled to Wembley with his younger brother Jim. I showed my mum the front page the next day, with Alex on the crossbar, and she couldn't believe it."
Alex, of Govan, Glasgow, worked as a head waiter in Ibrox Stadium's Argyle Suite for about 12 years.
He died in Glasgow's Southern General Hospital on Sunday. He is survived by wife Nessie, two children and four grandchildren.
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Yes, England playing at Wembley and not a single George cross or England fan in sight. Bizarre...
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I was at the Witton end that day and i am pretty sure the gates were indeed locked for quite a while after the game was abandoned.It was'nt to stop us getting out but more like to stop the Rangers thugs getting in. I am not joking when i say when everyone did finally get out into Witton lane nobody turned right. I remember at Witton island a couple of hundred villa fans were forming to try and defend themselves, however when they saw how many of them were coming down Witton lane towards us,they soon legged it. My friend and i had to get to our car just off Electric Avenue,so we thought we would go down Brookvale rd and Tame rd way. That's what we thought! We got part way up Tame rd and there was yet more of them looking for aggro so we just turned around and went into Erdington for a few hours.
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But I do not care that some of you hate rangers I have problems with a club a lot closer than rangers.(tesco-bags) I AM A RANGERS FAN THAT USED TO GO. WATP
I'm trying to work out how someone who witnessed those scenes then decided that Rangers were a club that you'd like to support. Not having a go, but genuinely puzzled. If it was me, it'd turn me off the club for life (as it appears to have done to a number of the contributors on this thread).
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But I do not care that some of you hate rangers I have problems with a club a lot closer than rangers.(tesco-bags) I AM A RANGERS FAN THAT USED TO GO. WATP
I'm trying to work out how someone who witnessed those scenes then decided that Rangers were a club that you'd like to support. Not having a go, but genuinely puzzled. If it was me, it'd turn me off the club for life (as it appears to have done to a number of the contributors on this thread).
Look at like this you are a Villa fan what would it take for you to tern your back on the Villa.
I know that for me will never happen. I will add that if rangers become part of our prem that would be an end to my support there is only room for one prem team in my life and that will always be the Villa.
VTID
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Look at like this you are a Villa fan what would it take for you to tern your back on the Villa.
I know that for me will never happen. I will add that if rangers become part of our prem that would be an end to my support there is only room for one prem team in my life and that will always be the Villa.
VTID
Apologies, I was under the impression that this happened prior to you starting to support Rangers, obviously got the wrong end of the stick.
I'd agree that it would take something truly astonishing from the fans for me to stop supporting the villa, but on the flipside, say if villa had played a friendly here before I had started following them, and fans caused havoc, then I doubt that I would have started supporting them.
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My father is Glaswegian and came down to Brum in the early seventies.
When he tried to get back into the Villa end for the second half he had this conversation:-
Steward: You can't come in this end.
Dad: I'm a Villa fan.
Steward: Not with that accent you're not.
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Anyway - bloody buggers Rangers.
Supporting The Bully Wee Clyde is the way to go.
No sectarian bollocks for us (as we haven't got any fans).
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My father is Glaswegian and came down to Brum in the early seventies.
When he tried to get back into the Villa end for the second half he had this conversation:-
Steward: You can't come in this end.
Dad: I'm a Villa fan.
Steward: Not with that accent you're not.
A few years back the VP ticket office refused to sell seats to my mate for a Villa v Leeds game because his card was Yorkshire Bank.
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Villan for life - I wasn't there myself fortunately, but the reason the match was on a Saturday in October was due to World Cup qualifiers being played (I think on the following Wednesday night ?).
I wondered that but wasn't aware of the Saturday postponements. What is the norm now must have been a one-off or a season long experiment back then.
There was a normal Saturday programme but clubs could have games called off if players were called up for internationals.
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That day was quite an experience for a 14 year old schoolboy such as myself. I've never seen anything like it since. I went out to the match quite early and saw loads of Rangers fans in drunken stupors lying in the subways and High Street in Birmingham City Centre at 10 in the morning! Days like that, and the West Ham away FA Cup quarter final in 1980 make you grow up quickly. I've hated Rangers ever since.