Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: lovejoy on June 16, 2011, 07:46:42 PM
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I notice the General's threead has been locked. if there had been a lot of mindless vitriol on there I would agree but there were serious suggestion to "meet the fans" etc. For me now more than ever we need the General to explain to us what the thinking behind recent events have been and to lock the thread seems counter-intuitive. The only explanation I can think of is that the General is going to ground for a bit while the bad reaction to recent events subside. I hope this isn't the case as I always though he was one to face issues head on.
Disappointed.
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He wouldn't explain anything, he'd just tell you what you should think.
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i wish they would close the thing for good
its embarrasing, as when the shit does hit the fan, as it is now, it gets locked
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He's used Facebook to vent his anger already.
I'm still baffled by that outburst.
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What did he say?
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i wish they would close the thing for good
its embarrasing, as when the shit does hit the fan, as it is now, it gets locked
But come next season when the heat dies down, we can keep asking trivial bullshit about pies and stuff, and be told off if we ask about anything that anyone might have any interest in whatsioever.
Good on the General for trying, but they may as well have a customer service employee doing it, he's not allowed to talk about anything.
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The general has failed in his role as fan liaison. Clearly he was not able to convey the amount of grave apprehension a significant amount of the fanbase have to this appointment. When we really needed him he was found wanting.
Having said that he has achieved a great deal in his life to be proud of and to stick around here taking abuse off all and sundry for this failure just wouldn't feel right. Randy should take him out of the firing line and be man enough to take all the flak for this crazy decision.
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2 fuckinng million 4 shit
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born 2 8 scum... very clever username..
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If you're going to expect somebody who is usually 5,000 miles away to be "fan liaison", then every now and then he will not exactly have his finger on the pulse.
Thanks for all the entertainment in the past, General, but it's time for a change.
Premier League clubs need Premier League people, and I can't help thinking that we are severely lacking in that department at the moment.
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thanks to my father , and by the grace of god ( brian little)
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If you're going to expect somebody who is usually 5,000 miles away to be "fan liaison", then every now and then he will not exactly have his finger on the pulse.
What do you think he'd be doing if he was based in England, patrolling the streets conducting surveys?
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Having said that he has achieved a great deal in his life to be proud of and to stick around here taking abuse off all and sundry for this failure just wouldn't feel right. Randy should take him out of the firing line and be man enough to take all the flak for this crazy decision.
Quite how the Vietnam War can be considered to be something to be proud of is beyond me.
But on issues at hand I really think that we as a fans board should say thanks but no thanks - it's become an embarassement, especially when the General and his son get all tetchy and offended when people criticise them. Their attitude is totally patronising.
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If he was based here, maybe he, or Randy or PF, could actually listen to people, rather than having to gauge opinion based on the ramblings of a couple of hundred people, the majority of whom, are based far and wide themselves.
Don't give me the old "better fan than you" crap either - that's not what this is about.
Its about having your finger on the pulse when it matters. Clearly this hasn't been the case here.
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what did the general say on facebook by the way?
for those of us saddos that dont have it?
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He said Villa fans can butt out ...
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I would like to see it locked for good. I am sure the Official Site could have a facility for him to talk to fans. If the Facebook outburst was him then I really do not feel I want to talk to him about anything. And if it was not I still do not really think it has much benefit anymore. I really supported the board up until a week or so ago and I still do a bit, but in a puzzled, let down and not must trust kinda way.
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Having said that he has achieved a great deal in his life to be proud of and to stick around here taking abuse off all and sundry for this failure just wouldn't feel right. Randy should take him out of the firing line and be man enough to take all the flak for this crazy decision.
Quite how the Vietnam War can be considered to be something to be proud of is beyond me.
But on issues at hand I really think that we as a fans board should say thanks but no thanks - it's become an embarassement, especially when the General and his son get all tetchy and offended when people criticise them. Their attitude is totally patronising.
Think you'll find in the immediate aftermath it was a war most Americans choose to ignore as they got there arses kicked, thats the case even today with a lot of Americans, it was only the deluge of movies that came to the front decades after that gave that gung ho sense of respectability, easier for them to digest on a movie screen as opposed to the real thing.
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The general is a good well meaning man but sadly his thread isn't really in his or the clubs best interests and it may be time to call it a day as far as the thread goes.
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Wasn't the Facebook thing a fake/impostor?
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The general is a good well meaning man but sadly his thread isn't really in his or the clubs best interests and it may be time to call it a day as far as the thread goes.
They'll probably consider it, but these things aren't as simple as buying a balti pie, you know.
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The abuse is uncalled for.
I think he's only ever genuinely tried to do his best and to have that level of contact with a board member is virtually unheard of anywhere else. Not just in our league, or football for that matter. But sport in general.
That said, when I see the McLeish appointment being justified by what SirAlex says about the bloke -rather than his recent fairly dismal record- I tend to think criticism was always going to be inevitable. The butt out remarks were probably how he genuinely felt at the time too, but were obviously unhelpful.
If this does indeed go tits up and McLeish turns out to be the failure his record so far sets the scene for, I hope lessons are learned and we get people with genuine knowledge of the game in this country on senior positions in the board. That's not a dig at anyone we have presently, but a proper administrator; a David Dein or even a Peter Kenyon probably wouldn't have overseen the complete farce that was the recent selection process.
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The thread was a sham in any case. As far as I know Krulak has not posted or answered any questions for many days. The posts are mostly about the Manager. Mods pipe up now and than with comments like "This is not the thread for the Manager" and "stick to the questions to General only on here" etc. So not missing much wit it locked.
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The abuse is uncalled for.
I think he's only ever genuinely tried to do his best and to have that level of contact with a board member is virtually unheard of anywhere else. Not just in our league, or football for that matter. But sport in general.
That said, when I see the McLeish appointment being justified by what SirAlex says about the bloke -rather than his recent fairly dismal record- I tend to think criticism was always going to be inevitable. The butt out remarks were probably how he genuinely felt at the time too, but were obviously unhelpful.
If this does indeed go tits up and McLeish turns out to be the failure his record so far sets the scene for, I hope lessons are learned and we get people with genuine knowledge of the game in this country on senior positions in the board. That's not a dig at anyone we have presently, but a proper administrator; a David Dein or even a Peter Kenyon probably wouldn't have overseen the complete farce that was the recent selection process.
That's how I see it too.
The last few weeks could've been handled better but the abuse is pathetic as was the protest yesterday. A David Dein- style appointment is exactly what the Villa need right now.
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Mods pipe up now and than with comments like "This is not the thread for the Manager" and "stick to the questions to General only on here" etc. So not missing much wit it locked.
But ignore abusive posts if they are small minded enough to agree with them.
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Having said that he has achieved a great deal in his life to be proud of and to stick around here taking abuse off all and sundry for this failure just wouldn't feel right. Randy should take him out of the firing line and be man enough to take all the flak for this crazy decision.
Quite how the Vietnam War can be considered to be something to be proud of is beyond me.
But on issues at hand I really think that we as a fans board should say thanks but no thanks - it's become an embarassement, especially when the General and his son get all tetchy and offended when people criticise them. Their attitude is totally patronising.
Think you'll find in the immediate aftermath it was a war most Americans choose to ignore as they got there arses kicked, thats the case even today with a lot of Americans, it was only the deluge of movies that came to the front decades after that gave that gung ho sense of respectability, easier for them to digest on a movie screen as opposed to the real thing.
I tend to think that anyone who puts their life on the line for their country warrants respect, but maybe I'm funny that way.
The Iraq war is largely viewed now as unjust/ close to illegal based on the sham evidence compiled. But the US and British servicemen and women who saw action over there weren't responsible for that.
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The abuse is uncalled for.
I think he's only ever genuinely tried to do his best and to have that level of contact with a board member is virtually unheard of anywhere else. Not just in our league, or football for that matter. But sport in general.
That said, when I see the McLeish appointment being justified by what SirAlex says about the bloke -rather than his recent fairly dismal record- I tend to think criticism was always going to be inevitable. The butt out remarks were probably how he genuinely felt at the time too, but were obviously unhelpful.
If this does indeed go tits up and McLeish turns out to be the failure his record so far sets the scene for, I hope lessons are learned and we get people with genuine knowledge of the game in this country on senior positions in the board. That's not a dig at anyone we have presently, but a proper administrator; a David Dein or even a Peter Kenyon probably wouldn't have overseen the complete farce that was the recent selection process.
good post Kev but are we not supposed to have learned a lot of lessons already from august last year?
these past rake of weeks have been hard
GH having to get paid off - MON settling out of court against us and now a 2 million compensation for a manager, i would say 50% of people dont want
we need a footballing guy in here and quick
the general thread has to go, i really dont want to know what time it is in america, what the weather is like or how many pancakes he is having for breakfast
do you think the mods on here would say thanks general but no thanks anymore?
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Having said that he has achieved a great deal in his life to be proud of and to stick around here taking abuse off all and sundry for this failure just wouldn't feel right. Randy should take him out of the firing line and be man enough to take all the flak for this crazy decision.
Quite how the Vietnam War can be considered to be something to be proud of is beyond me.
But on issues at hand I really think that we as a fans board should say thanks but no thanks - it's become an embarassement, especially when the General and his son get all tetchy and offended when people criticise them. Their attitude is totally patronising.
Think you'll find in the immediate aftermath it was a war most Americans choose to ignore as they got there arses kicked, thats the case even today with a lot of Americans, it was only the deluge of movies that came to the front decades after that gave that gung ho sense of respectability, easier for them to digest on a movie screen as opposed to the real thing.
I tend to think that anyone who puts their life on the line for their country warrants respect, but maybe I'm funny that way.
The Iraq war is largely viewed now as unjust/ close to illegal based on the sham evidence compiled. But the US and British servicemen and women who saw action over there weren't responsible for that.
Agree, the average serviceman is doing what he is supposed to do and fair play to them.
The point I was making is the very loyalty that you are reffering to was not what Mr average USA shown vets coming back from the war, they where isolated and wanted to be forgotton about, as dramatic as it is the film First Blood was in fact a good representation of that kind of feeling, lot of vets totally dropped out of society because they couldn't handle the rejection, thinking they where coming home as heroes.
Correct me if I'm wrong on this point but it was some time after that they allowed servicemens name to go up the Wall of Memory that where involved in Vietnam, it wasn't immediate and it was nothing like Wotton Bassett.
It was only later that it gained a certain respectability. Thats my point.
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He said Villa fans can butt out ...
Is that true?
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I agree that in its current format its probably run its course. There is a lot of repetition on there and when things arent going so well The General wont say much ( his perogative)
At work we have a " link" where people can post questions to senior management. These go to an inbox, the nwhoever moderates it will post the necessary ones on an open forum with the answer. Its not possible to post on these
Could we evolve the Generals thread to something similar? We send messages to an inbox and they can get posted with the generals reply? It would cut out repetition and all the comments that normally require a " questions only for the general please" cooment off a mod
I know this will probably create some work for the mods but we will still have a link to the general which has mostly been useful these past few years?
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To be fair, I've never been a regular contributor to his thread, but felt that it served a decent purpose if not a bit of "arse-lickey" a good proportion of the time. I heard some peoples views that this was undermining the Independent nature of this site and thought that perhaps they were being too hard.
However, his attitude has stunk over the last few days with the outbursts that he has been prone to. I hope he never comes back - the dissenters were right. The Board really have lost the plot and it will all end in tears.
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The thread was a sham in any case. As far as I know Krulak has not posted or answered any questions for many days. The posts are mostly about the Manager. Mods pipe up now and than with comments like "This is not the thread for the Manager" and "stick to the questions to General only on here" etc. So not missing much wit it locked.
The so called moderators, hypocritically. joined in the claptrap that was going on there,the past few days.
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The thread was a sham in any case. As far as I know Krulak has not posted or answered any questions for many days. The posts are mostly about the Manager. Mods pipe up now and than with comments like "This is not the thread for the Manager" and "stick to the questions to General only on here" etc. So not missing much wit it locked.
The so called moderators, hypocritically. joined in the claptrap that was going on there,the past few days.
How can we be 'so called' moderators? Either we are, or we aren't.
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To be fair to the Mods, they did not have much choice, it was getting out of controll once they decided that questions about the manager were out of order.
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To be fair to the Mods, they did not have much choice, it was getting out of controll once they decided that questions about the manager were out of order.
Let's hope he broadens his thread viewing then. Either that or he can use his alter ego Pelty to say what he REALLY wants.
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I think a lot of people are a bit unsure about the terms of reference on the General thread.
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The bottom line is I still feel someone from the club needs to explain to me how we end up with him as manager with all the other options available - we deserve at least that don't we?
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The thread was a sham in any case. As far as I know Krulak has not posted or answered any questions for many days. The posts are mostly about the Manager. Mods pipe up now and than with comments like "This is not the thread for the Manager" and "stick to the questions to General only on here" etc. So not missing much wit it locked.
The so called moderators, hypocritically. joined in the claptrap that was going on there,the past few days.
How can we be 'so called' moderators? Either we are, or we aren't.
Because sometimes you seem to choose to be moderators when it suits you.
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The bottom line is I still feel someone from the club needs to explain to me how we end up with him as manager with all the other options available - we deserve at least that don't we?
It won't happen. Krulak's outburst the other night proves the fact that they really couldn't give a flying fuck.
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The bottom line is I still feel someone from the club needs to explain to me how we end up with him as manager with all the other options available - we deserve at least that don't we?
agree, but i am not sure you will like the answer
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The abuse is uncalled for.
I think he's only ever genuinely tried to do his best and to have that level of contact with a board member is virtually unheard of anywhere else. Not just in our league, or football for that matter. But sport in general.
That said, when I see the McLeish appointment being justified by what SirAlex says about the bloke -rather than his recent fairly dismal record- I tend to think criticism was always going to be inevitable. The butt out remarks were probably how he genuinely felt at the time too, but were obviously unhelpful.
If this does indeed go tits up and McLeish turns out to be the failure his record so far sets the scene for, I hope lessons are learned and we get people with genuine knowledge of the game in this country on senior positions in the board. That's not a dig at anyone we have presently, but a proper administrator; a David Dein or even a Peter Kenyon probably wouldn't have overseen the complete farce that was the recent selection process.
hear hear.
I'd like to think the General will soon be back and will try to answer some of the points put across in his thread over the last few days.
I also think the thread serves a valuable purpose, and it would be a pity to see it closed for good.
The relationship between fans and board over the last few years has been brilliant, and General K has in my opinion played a significant role in that. One might argue that it's only the board themselves that have jeopardized this, but even despite their actions over the last week it'd be a real shame to see it break down completely.
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The thread was a sham in any case. As far as I know Krulak has not posted or answered any questions for many days. The posts are mostly about the Manager. Mods pipe up now and than with comments like "This is not the thread for the Manager" and "stick to the questions to General only on here" etc. So not missing much wit it locked.
The so called moderators, hypocritically. joined in the claptrap that was going on there,the past few days.
How can we be 'so called' moderators? Either we are, or we aren't.
Because sometimes you seem to choose to be moderators when it suits you.
I'm sorry. Unfortunately there isn't a moderator school we can go to. We have to make it up as we go along.
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The thread was a sham in any case. As far as I know Krulak has not posted or answered any questions for many days. The posts are mostly about the Manager. Mods pipe up now and than with comments like "This is not the thread for the Manager" and "stick to the questions to General only on here" etc. So not missing much wit it locked.
The so called moderators, hypocritically. joined in the claptrap that was going on there,the past few days.
How can we be 'so called' moderators? Either we are, or we aren't.
Because sometimes you seem to choose to be moderators when it suits you.
I'm sorry. Unfortunately there isn't a moderator school we can go to. We have to make it up as we go along.
How about doing something about " Tigerwogs" username.
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The abuse is uncalled for.
I think he's only ever genuinely tried to do his best and to have that level of contact with a board member is virtually unheard of anywhere else. Not just in our league, or football for that matter. But sport in general.
That said, when I see the McLeish appointment being justified by what SirAlex says about the bloke -rather than his recent fairly dismal record- I tend to think criticism was always going to be inevitable. The butt out remarks were probably how he genuinely felt at the time too, but were obviously unhelpful.
If this does indeed go tits up and McLeish turns out to be the failure his record so far sets the scene for, I hope lessons are learned and we get people with genuine knowledge of the game in this country on senior positions in the board. That's not a dig at anyone we have presently, but a proper administrator; a David Dein or even a Peter Kenyon probably wouldn't have overseen the complete farce that was the recent selection process.
hear hear.
I'd like to think the General will soon be back and will try to answer some of the points put across in his thread over the last few days.
I also think the thread serves a valuable purpose, and it would be a pity to see it closed for good.
The relationship between fans and board over the last few years has been brilliant, and General K has in my opinion played a significant role in that. One might argue that it's only the board themselves that have jeopardized this, but even despite their actions over the last week it'd be a real shame to see it break down completely.
bottom line is that The General is here to put a spin on events, he has not been able to cope with the reaction to recent events.
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The board seemed to have made things up as they've gone along.
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The thread was a sham in any case. As far as I know Krulak has not posted or answered any questions for many days. The posts are mostly about the Manager. Mods pipe up now and than with comments like "This is not the thread for the Manager" and "stick to the questions to General only on here" etc. So not missing much wit it locked.
The so called moderators, hypocritically. joined in the claptrap that was going on there,the past few days.
How can we be 'so called' moderators? Either we are, or we aren't.
Because sometimes you seem to choose to be moderators when it suits you.
I'm sorry. Unfortunately there isn't a moderator school we can go to. We have to make it up as we go along.
How about doing something about " Tigerwogs" username.
He's banned.
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The thread was a sham in any case. As far as I know Krulak has not posted or answered any questions for many days. The posts are mostly about the Manager. Mods pipe up now and than with comments like "This is not the thread for the Manager" and "stick to the questions to General only on here" etc. So not missing much wit it locked.
The so called moderators, hypocritically. joined in the claptrap that was going on there,the past few days.
How can we be 'so called' moderators? Either we are, or we aren't.
Because sometimes you seem to choose to be moderators when it suits you.
I'm sorry. Unfortunately there isn't a moderator school we can go to. We have to make it up as we go along.
How about doing something about " Tigerwogs" username.
He's banned.
Good.
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The thread was a sham in any case. As far as I know Krulak has not posted or answered any questions for many days. The posts are mostly about the Manager. Mods pipe up now and than with comments like "This is not the thread for the Manager" and "stick to the questions to General only on here" etc. So not missing much wit it locked.
The so called moderators, hypocritically. joined in the claptrap that was going on there,the past few days.
How can we be 'so called' moderators? Either we are, or we aren't.
Because sometimes you seem to choose to be moderators when it suits you.
I'm sorry. Unfortunately there isn't a moderator school we can go to. We have to make it up as we go along.
well maybe you could just let it go and filter out the stupid and abusive stuff
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The thread was a sham in any case. As far as I know Krulak has not posted or answered any questions for many days. The posts are mostly about the Manager. Mods pipe up now and than with comments like "This is not the thread for the Manager" and "stick to the questions to General only on here" etc. So not missing much wit it locked.
The so called moderators, hypocritically. joined in the claptrap that was going on there,the past few days.
How can we be 'so called' moderators? Either we are, or we aren't.
Because sometimes you seem to choose to be moderators when it suits you.
I'm sorry. Unfortunately there isn't a moderator school we can go to. We have to make it up as we go along.
well maybe you could just let it go and filter out the stupid and abusive stuff
There'd be nothing left.
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you see what happens when your club appoints a disaster in waiting of a manager
everybody ends up at each others throats, people slabbering about mods, mods no doubt suspending the people slabbering at them etc etc
the general should have sat randy down at a computer and said "for fucks sake have a word with yourself, and look what you are doing to these good Aston Villa supporting people"
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The thread was a sham in any case. As far as I know Krulak has not posted or answered any questions for many days. The posts are mostly about the Manager. Mods pipe up now and than with comments like "This is not the thread for the Manager" and "stick to the questions to General only on here" etc. So not missing much wit it locked.
The so called moderators, hypocritically. joined in the claptrap that was going on there,the past few days.
How can we be 'so called' moderators? Either we are, or we aren't.
Because sometimes you seem to choose to be moderators when it suits you.
I'm sorry. Unfortunately there isn't a moderator school we can go to. We have to make it up as we go along.
well maybe you could just let it go and filter out the stupid and abusive stuff
There'd be nothing left.
Thanks for the humour, we need it right now
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everybody ends up at each others throats, people slabbering about mods, mods no doubt suspending the people slabbering at them etc etc
I only come on for all that
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THIS IS WHY WE CAN'T HAVE NICE THINGS.
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I much prefer the mods on here compared to that lot on villatalk. As for the generals thread, I feel it ran is course after the first year or so as initially it was a way of building bridges with the fans and trying to show the fans they weren't like the glazers. After 18 months or so it just seemed to be the same cycle of questions and answer. Fair play to him for posting all these years but I did feel he tended to shy away for difficult questions or would become very defensive.
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Msg to Dave or whoever is in charge of H&V....do you think it is time to say thanks but no thanks to the general? Surely the point of a board member on here is to convey the fans msg to randy and pf? I'm not as anti mcleish as alot of fans but the feelings against this appointment have been monumental and thus largely ignored with the appointment. On top of which, when the general has been required on here most over the last couple of weeks he has gone to ground and left everyone guessing. We don't need an official on here towing the line and giving it all the p.r. If he is found wanting when needed the most. Only my view but I'd like to see ties cut with the board, at least till faith and trust has been restored between the board and the fans
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I much prefer the mods on here compared to that lot on villatalk. As for the generals thread, I feel it ran is course after the first year or so as initially it was a way of building bridges with the fans and trying to show the fans they weren't like the glazers. After 18 months or so it just seemed to be the same cycle of questions and answer. Fair play to him for posting all these years but I did feel he tended to shy away for difficult questions or would become very defensive.
Please stop PFE. Let the mods do the moderating. Yellow card.
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*Wonders what PFE is but is too embarrassed to ask*
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*Wonders what PFE is but is too embarrassed to ask*
"Posting for effect".
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I much prefer the mods on here compared to that lot on villatalk. As for the generals thread, I feel it ran is course after the first year or so as initially it was a way of building bridges with the fans and trying to show the fans they weren't like the glazers. After 18 months or so it just seemed to be the same cycle of questions and answer. Fair play to him for posting all these years but I did feel he tended to shy away for difficult questions or would become very defensive.
Please stop PFE. Let the mods do the moderating. Yellow card.
Exactly like that. Banned me for calling someone pathetic, quite pathetic really.
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Thanks Paulie, i'd never have worked that one out so embarrassment factor is diminishing.
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Pissing Fucking Eck
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I much prefer the mods on here compared to that lot on villatalk. As for the generals thread, I feel it ran is course after the first year or so as initially it was a way of building bridges with the fans and trying to show the fans they weren't like the glazers. After 18 months or so it just seemed to be the same cycle of questions and answer. Fair play to him for posting all these years but I did feel he tended to shy away for difficult questions or would become very defensive.
Please stop PFE. Let the mods do the moderating. Yellow card.
Exactly like that. Banned me for calling someone pathetic, quite pathetic really.
I got banned for telling someone to get a life in a sarky way.
I won't name names though, they know who they are...
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Can someone say what was said on facebook by the General?
we don't all have access...
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Can someone say what was said on facebook by the General?
we don't all have access...
was a big rant but was very quickly deleted. Probably in the
Managers thread. Think it may of been Sunday. Basically defended mcleish before it became common knowledge we were in talks.
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it was on earlier that he had told villa fasn to butt out
its my birthday tomorrow
what a present :'(
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I don't actually think that was really the General.
The problem for them being they couldn't really issue a denial then go out and appoint McLeish as they have.
As for the thread I don't really see the use anymore.
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I don't actually think that was really the General.
The problem for them being they couldn't really issue a denial then go out and appoint McLeish as they have.
As for the thread I don't really see the use anymore.
From the moment they issued that rather pointless, odd statement about being determined to interview AM, it was obvious he'd got the job.
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Despite us all defending them from the press, the club made a bit of a mess of it in the end did'nt they?
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Despite us all defending them from the press, the club made a bit of a mess of it in the end did'nt they?
Yes everything that turned up in the media turned out to be true so they might as well have made official statements
Nothing was said today and with Mclaren admitting we called off a meeting with no reason we contined to look incompentant.
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His thread was a nonsense and will not be missed.
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Let's be honest, Randy's strategy was to try and buy us into 4th place to get the Champions League place knowing at the time 4th was a possibility with investment. Sadly, Man City came into the equation and then Spurzzzz sneaked the 4th place.
Our strategy had gone at this point and since then our board haven't had a clear enough strategy. In light of this General Krulak hasn't really told us anything of note in his thread for a good while. To be honest whilst i'm not ever going to question his integrity and honesty, I really wonder how much he truely understands about this sport and what it means to us.
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The General's thread seemed like an excellent P.R. exercise when Randy took over, and actually proved to be just that, but has recently become nothing short of an uncomfortable liability. Although this access is probably unique in sport, we have become accustomed to communicating with a board member and have taken this privilege as a right. This was probably inevitable and understandable, but now this right has now morphed into a sense of outright entitlement to abuse a board member at will without recourse, both on his thread and others.
It would be easy to blame the moderators, but that would be like blaming the police because there had been a riot (probably a bad analogy, but there you are) It's each individual's responsibility to behave in a civilised way and I'm really pissed off that this forum has degenerated so badly.
So you're angry. Grow a up, go kick the cat if you have to, but stop squealing like 14 year olds who've just been grounded.
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The General's thread seemed like an excellent P.R. exercise when Randy took over, and actually proved to be just that, but has recently become nothing short of an uncomfortable liability. Although this access is probably unique in sport, we have become accustomed to communicating with a board member and have taken this privilege as a right. This was probably inevitable and understandable, but now this right has now morphed into a sense of outright entitlement to abuse a board member at will without recourse, both on his thread and others.
It would be easy to blame the moderators, but that would be like blaming the police because there had been a riot (probably a bad analogy, but there you are) It's each individual's responsibility to behave in a civilised way and I'm really pissed off that this forum has degenerated so badly.
So you're angry. Grow a up, go kick the cat if you have to, but stop squealing like 14 year olds who've just been grounded.
I agree with you.
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act a grown up
but kick a cat ::)
a 14 year old would have came out with that
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*Wonders what PFE is but is too embarrassed to ask*
"Posting for effect".
Or in simple terms - "Stop being a twat".
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Our Mods on this site do NOT need the sort of vitriol aimed at them and certainly not in this thread, and neither does the General. The General's thread has been one of the things we have boasted about for a few years now, no other club had such a close rapport, now a minority want to destroy that. As a serviceman myself I find it absolutely disgusting the Generals credentials are called into doubt. Also our Mods on this site, they have worked hard to keep this site up and running beyond just the paper version sold at VP, the last thing they need is criticism from the doom mongers.
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Our Mods on this site do NOT need the sort of vitriol aimed at them and certainly not in this thread, and neither does the General. The General's thread has been one of the things we have boasted about for a few years now, no other club had such a close rapport, now a minority want to destroy that. As a serviceman myself I find it absolutely disgusting the Generals credentials are called into doubt. Also our Mods on this site, they have worked hard to keep this site up and running beyond just the paper version sold at VP, the last thing they need is criticism from the doom mongers.
Who you kidding ? Our mods love the abuse surely ? Please don't make us stop
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the general thread is pointless now, the awe shown by others on this thread towards him was embarrassing anyway.
fixing issues with the ticket office in Villa Park dont really matter a f*ck after appointing Alex McLeish.
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After the events of the last few weeks and its outcome i dont think there will be to many fans asking the General anything as it seems he does not answer when the going gets tough and as a poster earlier said goes to ground.
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Personally I hope he carries on. Some people here seem to think AVFC is some sort of democracy. It isn't. Randy owns the club and makes the decisions and whether you like it or not its what we've got. Just because the General posts on here doesn't mean he's going to listen and anyone who thinks he is, is naïve in the extreme.
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*Wonders what PFE is but is too embarrassed to ask*
Piss Fart Everall
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However, his attitude has stunk over the last few days with the outbursts that he has been prone to. I hope he never comes back - the dissenters were right. The Board really have lost the plot and it will all end in tears.
Correct Lee.
It seems to me that they now have nothing but contempt for the supporters.
I really don't want to hear his views on the appointment anyway, he'd only try and spin it like Shane Warne.
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After the events of the last few weeks and its outcome i dont think there will be to many fans asking the General anything as it seems he does not answer when the going gets tough and as a poster earlier said goes to ground.
Exactly. I'm sure he's shown a lot of bravery and leadership in his military career - but thats not extended out to effective communication with the troops/fans when life is tough. Disappearing when the troops are restless is hardly an act of good leadership or bravery.
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After the events of the last few weeks and its outcome i dont think there will be to many fans asking the General anything as it seems he does not answer when the going gets tough and as a poster earlier said goes to ground.
Exactly. I'm sure he's shown a lot of bravery and leadership in his military career - but thats not extended out to effective communication with the troops/fans when life is tough. Disappearing when the troops are restless is hardly an act of good leadership or bravery.
Thing is, his past has no relevance to the present - this is not a life or death situation for your country, it's just a job in a sport that he appears to have little knowledge of. I do a job that is alright but I don't care enough about it to take abuse for something the director has done... I too would dodge it or get argumentative.
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the general thread is pointless now, the awe shown by others on this thread towards him was embarrassing anyway.
fixing issues with the ticket office in Villa Park dont really matter a f*ck after appointing Alex McLeish.
Sorry, but I'm in awe of anyone who has put their life on the line in the service of their country. If you've met the General you will also find him to be an extremely polite and humble man who wants to do everything he can for fellow Villa fans. I remember ManUre fans threatening to send back season tickets when they signed Cantona from Leeds. That worked out ok. Not saying that McLeish is the right man because personally I don't think he is, but it's time to stand together and support him and our club, and not abuse either a member of the board or the mods on this site. If you don't like what the Mods say or the decisions they make then try VillaTalk.
I hope the General returns, and wish him well.
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Buying Cantona and appointing McLeish are two entirely different things - surely you can see that?
Also whilst I admire the General's intentions and the time he's given to the site, I am not sure what fighting in a war does to train you to appoint a good manager of a Premier League football team.
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was there any point in the general replying to the comments? Too many had made their minds up with their vitriolic mindless comments, and nothing he was going to say would make them think otherwise!
Ok, AM wasnt our 1st choice, but, many better judges then us in the game, rate him highly, and think working for an owner who believes in him, and backs him then he will do well. That seems to be who Randy has taken notice off, and not those who maybe dont know as much as professional football people.
He has shown guts to leave that other lot, to join us, and unlike others, he obviously wants to manage us.
Lets get behind him now, show our support and see what he can do. Judge him on results, nothing more, nothing less!
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Ultimately, after appointing Alex Mcleish, what else was the subject going to be about on his thread? It would be nice if the General was allowed to make at least one response to all of the points that have been made, however similar many of them have been. But I supose he could always do it through Facebook.
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He has here (http://www.heroesandvillains.info/forumv3/index.php?topic=43875.0)
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He makes it sound like he and the board have been betrayed.
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What did he say?
Phone Nick Keyes?
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He makes it sound like he and the board have been betrayed.
He just doesn't get it, does he? Football that is.
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Spin, Spin and more Spin
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The problem is that while it's quite easy and justified for the board to protest about outright abuse and the kind of mindless vandalism we saw at Bodymoor Heath earlier this week - I think the majority of us would agree that's totally out of order and helps nothing - it's not so easy for them to explain, for footballing reasons, why the recruitment process for a new manager - with several seemingly outstanding candidates readily available - has ended with the appointment of Alex McLeish. I don't think they can truthfully explain that, so I'd expect them to cease any of these kind of communications for a while yet.
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He has here (http://www.heroesandvillains.info/forumv3/index.php?topic=43875.0)
Meh.
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I don't disagree with him that some of the responses have been out of order but what has he said beyond that? Nothing.
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He's put out a bit of spin which has no bearing or substance to what the questions the fans have been asking. It is a bit of spin, making the board look like the victims.
Don't ever question our support of our team - you have been here for a short period in our history and you will be remembered as such. Us fans will be here whether we are winning the league or getting relegated from league 2. So don't patronise us, we have valid and grave concerns and they should be answered and not discarded by a reply that has been dressed up as a guilt trip.
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My initial reaction when he first began posting on message boards was one of trepidation. It seemed likely that someday, somehow, something would happen to make it turn sour.
I hoped that they would fulfil all their promises and it could continue, or that eventually all questions would be pretty much answered as the club were doing everything right and everyone knew what was going on.
It's kind of a mixture as it turns out. It was decent overall, but it seems like it can't, or shouldn't continue. I rarely went into the thread so I don't know for sure, but I suspect most questions over the last couple of years have mostly been about prices of things, tickets, availability of merchandise (hence the running Nicola Keye gag).
It was a good idea, and served it's purpose well in the beginning. Lately it went tits up. I'm not sure the Facebook message was him, but if it was it was a big mistake. Finally, having Pelty come on separately and hint and suggest and argue with people felt very unprofessional. I guess it's up to him if he wants to come on here, but why were we left clinging to his clandestine titbits as a source of information? I wish they'd just be more honest and upfront with us.
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In fairness to Pelty - what would you do if your father was being attacked?
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In fairness to Pelty - what would you do if your father was being attacked?
It's been disasterous and downright embarrasing, this good cop, bad cop that they've both induldged in.
The only ones who have really benefitted from it are the media.
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He makes it sound like he and the board have been betrayed.
He makes it sound like some very insulting things have been said on here and he has a point. I sometimes think this obsession with the Rags has started to drag us down to their level. It never used to be like this, we've always hated them but since 2003 things have gone a bit silly.
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In fairness to Pelty - what would you do if your father was being attacked?
If my father was some sort of customer liaison spokesman (which in fact he is for one of the rail companies and is therefore all too used to getting stick from customers) I'd keep my nose out of things that didn't concern me, in case I made things even worse for the organisation concerned.
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In fairness to Pelty - what would you do if your father was being attacked?
If my father was some sort of customer liaison spokesman (which in fact he is for one of the rail companies and is therefore all too used to getting stick from customers) I'd keep my nose out of things that didn't concern me, in case I made things even worse for the organisation concerned.
Pelty doesn't work for the club. As a Villa fan he's got as much right as anyone to come on here and voice his opinions, and be treated like any other poster.
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The thread was a sham in any case. As far as I know Krulak has not posted or answered any questions for many days. The posts are mostly about the Manager. Mods pipe up now and than with comments like "This is not the thread for the Manager" and "stick to the questions to General only on here" etc. So not missing much wit it locked.
The so called moderators, hypocritically. joined in the claptrap that was going on there,the past few days.
How can we be 'so called' moderators? Either we are, or we aren't.
Because sometimes you seem to choose to be moderators when it suits you.
I'm sorry. Unfortunately there isn't a moderator school we can go to. We have to make it up as we go along.
well maybe you could just let it go and filter out the stupid and abusive stuff
There'd be nothing left.
True, it would knock my post count down to about 7...
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That high?
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I think the abuse was totally out of order. It's just a shame it's all ended up like this.
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In fairness to Pelty - what would you do if your father was being attacked?
If my father was some sort of customer liaison spokesman (which in fact he is for one of the rail companies and is therefore all too used to getting stick from customers) I'd keep my nose out of things that didn't concern me, in case I made things even worse for the organisation concerned.
Risso that makes as much sense as saying you should keep your nose out of things in case you made things worse for Villa. Even if you actually felt that way, you aren't doing it now so it makes your comment a bit off.
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In fairness to Pelty - what would you do if your father was being attacked?
If my father was some sort of customer liaison spokesman (which in fact he is for one of the rail companies and is therefore all too used to getting stick from customers) I'd keep my nose out of things that didn't concern me, in case I made things even worse for the organisation concerned.
Pelty doesn't work for the club. As a Villa fan he's got as much right as anyone to come on here and voice his opinions, and be treated like any other poster.
I didn't say he did work for the club. And his opinions AREN'T the same as any other fan, because people on here put a lot more store by them. See the time he came on here with his dad to launch a concerted attack on Martin O'Neill, which I'm sure didn't help relations between the manager and board. And whether he's a fan or not, anybody with an ounce of common sense wouldn't do anything to cause trouble for an organisation that his father IS an official part of.
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Didn't pelty come out with the 'go support someone else' line when somebody dare to come out with some perceived slight?
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The problem is that while it's quite easy and justified for the board to protest about outright abuse and the kind of mindless vandalism we saw at Bodymoor Heath earlier this week - I think the majority of us would agree that's totally out of order and helps nothing - it's not so easy for them to explain, for footballing reasons, why the recruitment process for a new manager - with several seemingly outstanding candidates readily available - has ended with the appointment of Alex McLeish. I don't think they can truthfully explain that, so I'd expect them to cease any of these kind of communications for a while yet.
The announcement on the official website says it all - they are trying to sell it to the fans on the basis of the advice from Alex Ferguson. Unfortunately it looks like a truthful explanation of the situation might be along the lines of:
"We hadn't really got a clue how to go about finding a new manager so we fannied about for a few weeks scratching our testicles. A quick look at available managers revealed there were a few who would clearly expect funding for a shot at the CL places. So we quickly eliminated them from consideration. Finally in desperation, we asked Alex Ferguson for his advice and he recommended his bestest mate ever, McLeish. And with SAF being the greatest manager ever, and as honest as the day is long at the north pole in mid-winter, and with no vested interest whatsoever, that surely overrides the fans feelings and the fact that Mcleish's PL record is undeniably pants. And anyway we own the club anb we can do what we like so there."
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In fairness to Pelty - what would you do if your father was being attacked?
If my father was some sort of customer liaison spokesman (which in fact he is for one of the rail companies and is therefore all too used to getting stick from customers) I'd keep my nose out of things that didn't concern me, in case I made things even worse for the organisation concerned.
Pelty doesn't work for the club. As a Villa fan he's got as much right as anyone to come on here and voice his opinions, and be treated like any other poster.
I didn't say he did work for the club. And his opinions AREN'T the same as any other fan, because people on here put a lot more store by them. See the time he came on here with his dad to launch a concerted attack on Martin O'Neill, which I'm sure didn't help relations between the manager and board. And whether he's a fan or not, anybody with an ounce of common sense wouldn't do anything to cause trouble for an organisation that his father IS an official part of.
As far as this board is concerned, his opinions ARE the same as any other fan. I don't remember reading the site rules including a hierarchy of who is and isnt allowed to use it, or whose opinions are more or less valid. The fact his father works for the club does not mean he should be treated any differently from any other poster either in terms of his posts, or the way he is treated by other posters. Your last sentence is your own opinion and you are entitled to it, but it bears no relevance to his use of the board.
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Pelty, via his old man, possibly has access to sensitive information that could damage his old man's standing and the club's reputation, if it gets out. Thus he perhaps has a greater responsibility than the average poster not to get involved in heated debates and diatribes.
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Pelty, via his old man, possibly has access to sensitive information that could damage his old man's standing and the club's reputation, if it gets out. Thus he perhaps has a greater responsibility than the average poster not to get involved in heated debates and diatribes.
Pelty, via his old man, possibly has access to sensitive information that could damage his old man's standing and the club's reputation, if it gets out. Thus he perhaps has a greater responsibility than the average poster not to get involved in heated debates and diatribes.
kt, I disagree. His greater responsibility is to keep things that he may have access to off the boards...but nothing should preclude him from being able to state his opinion just like everyone else. This board, and it's moderators, often stated that everyone has a right to be heard within the rules.
And yes, I know you and I are both just stating opinion on the fact too so I am not saying you have no right to be involved in the discussion. :)
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There's always been an air of inevitability floating about the Generals thread. Its the kind of thing that only ever works during the good times. Which is a shame, because it's during times of controversy such as this, that people want and deserve answers.
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That high?
Thanks...
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Ive been disgusted with some of the absue the General has had and have said so, mainly on other sites it has to be said.
However, we need some questions answered now, and somebody to answer them. The communication is worse than its ever been between fans and board.
There are some legitmate concerns we need to address and a means to air them.
I hope when the general returns we can arrange that with him.
I have no confidence in Paul "Invisible man" Faulkner at all.
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The general is a good well meaning man but sadly his thread isn't really in his or the clubs best interests and it may be time to call it a day as far as the thread goes.
They'll probably consider it, but these things aren't as simple as buying a balti pie, you know.
still can't find them in m&s
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There's always been an air of inevitability floating about the Generals thread. Its the kind of thing that only ever works during the good times. Which is a shame, because it's during times of controversy such as this, that people want and deserve answers.
That's not true though mr woo. After Moscowgate, the Anfield debacle and Man City in the cup the General didn't hide, he was there to take the flak.
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Well he's sort of back. Sadly trotting out the usual guff. Time for a new tune General.
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There's always been an air of inevitability floating about the Generals thread. Its the kind of thing that only ever works during the good times. Which is a shame, because it's during times of controversy such as this, that people want and deserve answers.
That's not true though mr woo. After Moscowgate, the Anfield debacle and Man City in the cup the General didn't hide, he was there to take the flak.
He was Bren, fair play to the guy, and I didn't intend my post to sound like I was suggesting the General was shirking his duties. I was rather pointing out I felt from the beginning that this sort of open dialogue with fans wouldn't last long before degenerating into a slanging match and one party or the other deciding to call time on it.
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Frankly, my view is that the General has no place on this site. It was all likely to end in tears with him being on here, you can't please all the people all the time, despite a great 5 year honeymoon period. The board have acted as is their right, however for the general and his son to chirp in on independent messageboards toeing the company line etc isn't warranted or needed. Let us voice our own opinions unhindered, it's therapeutic.
It's unprofessional on the boards behalf to be doing his anyway, and if they spent as much time and effort in finding us a new manager as they do in monitoring these boards and trying to pacify everyone we probably wouldn't be in this mess.
Ban the general and pelty, and if they have a problem, tell them to email Nicky keye, thats the usual answer isn't it?
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Frankly, my view is that the General has no place on this site. It was all likely to end in tears with him being on here, you can't please all the people all the time, despite a great 5 year honeymoon period. The board have acted as is their right, however for the general and his son to chirp in on independent messageboards toeing the company line etc isn't warranted or needed. Let us voice our own opinions unhindered, it's therapeutic.
It's unprofessional on the boards behalf to be doing his anyway, and if they spent as much time and effort in finding us a new manager as they do in monitoring these boards and trying to pacify everyone we probably wouldn't be in this mess.
Ban the general and pelty, and if they have a problem, tell them to email Nicky keye, thats the usual answer isn't it?
I like the cut of your jib. You seem....familiar, somehow.
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Just watching David Gold on SSN, he's got a helicopter on his lawn, a helicopter I tells ya.
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And I hear David Sullivan has a little chopper too.
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Just watching David Gold on SSN, he's got a helicopter on his lawn, a helicopter I tells ya.
He takes every opportunity available to let us all know too!
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Familiar eh Risso? I'm sure as a mod you know who I am.
It's been a while but given recent events a comeback maybe on the cards...
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Frankly, my view is that the General has no place on this site. It was all likely to end in tears with him being on here, you can't please all the people all the time, despite a great 5 year honeymoon period. The board have acted as is their right, however for the general and his son to chirp in on independent messageboards toeing the company line etc isn't warranted or needed. Let us voice our own opinions unhindered, it's therapeutic.
It's unprofessional on the boards behalf to be doing his anyway, and if they spent as much time and effort in finding us a new manager as they do in monitoring these boards and trying to pacify everyone we probably wouldn't be in this mess.
Ban the general and pelty, and if they have a problem, tell them to email Nicky keye, thats the usual answer isn't it?
We can still voice our own opinions unhindered with the General on here.
Given that our board never talk to the media, having a point of contact on here that we can directly engage is absolutely vital.
And the sarcastic comments are unnecessary.
By the by, I don't think I've seen a positive comment from Risso on here for... at least 3 years. Miserable bastard.
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We can still voice our own opinions unhindered with the General on here.
Given that our board never talk to the media, having a point of contact on here that we can directly engage is absolutely vital.
And the sarcastic comments are unnecessary.
By the by, I don't think I've seen a positive comment from Risso on here for... at least 3 years. Miserable bastard.
1_Pablo, what value do you think the General adds by being on here or any Social media sites? Yes it was exciting at first, another example of what great new owners we have etc. But now his answers are just a general selection of a stock he has, unless something annoys him, or a criticicm is posted of the board when he goes completely over the top and ends up getting quoted in the papers. Naive in the extreme and the papers just lap it up
Other teams don't have a cheerleader for the chairman acting in this way and they all appear to be better run than us presently. Until I'm proved wrong then the running of our club seems pretty amateurish at the moment from Randy down.
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I've seen enough of Davies as a Villa Fan.
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We can still voice our own opinions unhindered with the General on here.
Given that our board never talk to the media, having a point of contact on here that we can directly engage is absolutely vital.
And the sarcastic comments are unnecessary.
By the by, I don't think I've seen a positive comment from Risso on here for... at least 3 years. Miserable bastard.
1_Pablo, what value do you think the General adds by being on here or any Social media sites? Yes it was exciting at first, another example of what great new owners we have etc. But now his answers are just a general selection of a stock he has, unless something annoys him, or a criticicm is posted of the board when he goes completely over the top and ends up getting quoted in the papers. Naive in the extreme and the papers just lap it up
Other teams don't have a cheerleader for the chairman acting in this way and they all appear to be better run than us presently. Until I'm proved wrong then the running of our club seems pretty amateurish at the moment from Randy down.
Now that everyone's pissed off with the board I want him to come on here and front up to the concerns. It might go some way to alleviating the disconnect, and discontent, lots of Villa fans are feeling at the moment.
The alternative is for the club to embark on a new era of openness and cooperation with the press, and I don't see that happening anytime soon.
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Perhaps it's time to invite Nicola Keye to have a thread on these boards and let her deal directly with the customer related issues.
It doesn't make sense to have a non-Executive Director doing some of her job and taking away from his valuable time which could be spent trying to gain a more informed understanding of English football culture that would allow the Board to make more sensitive decisions.
On the other hand perhaps all the Board need to attend the next Dale Carnegie course of "How to Win Friends and Influence People."
Dale Carnegie Course: Effective Communications & Human Relations/Skills For Success
You'll learn to strengthen interpersonal relationships, manage stress and handle fast-changing workplace conditions. You'll be better equipped to perform as a persuasive communicator, problem-solver and focused leader. And you'll develop a take-charge attitude initiated with confidence and enthusiasm.
To save the General trouble in finding this course here is the Link (http://www.dalecarnegie.com/events/)
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A bit odd that those who are slagging the General/saying he serves no purpose on the site also, I suspect, comprise many of those who use his thread to ask questions. Be honest, it's the thread most of us check first when we see he's posted on it.
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A bit odd that those who are slagging the General/saying he serves no purpose on the site also, I suspect, comprise many of those who use his thread to ask questions. Be honest, it's the thread most of us check first when we see he's posted on it.
I am not sure if you are referring to me eamonn, but I am not slagging the General. I do think that the board need to be more sensitive to what the paying customers think however.
I can easily understand how the General may find posting on these boards to be a thankless task. There is no doubt that some posters are extremely rude. They were that way even before the McLeish story broke.
To be honest, I may be an exception but visiting the General's thread is not something I do on a regular basis because I find many of the posts to the General to be offensive, but that's just my take on it.
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What happened with regards to The General's thread is exactly what I predicted, everyone was happy to ask questions and have banter with him when things were going well but as soon as the board did a few things the genral support didn't agree with, rather than carry on the respectful dialogue it descended into abuse. And then when he didn't immediately appear to answer your abuse he got even more with some people even branding him, a highly decorated Vietnam veteran Marine Corp Officer, a coward!
We had something almost unique in football, certainly unique in The Premier League, an insight into the workings of the board and a conduit to senior figures in the club, and you abused it and have now lost it - as predicted.
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I would like to ask the general what his initial thoughts were when someone mentioned McLeish when talking about new managers.
Doubt I'd get the honest answer.
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I for one hope he comes back and keeps the thread alive. You can question the relevancy of it all you like but its not something to be taken for granted and its not something that any other PL club enjoys as far as I know.
It's naive to expect sensitive inside info or anything other than pro-Randy and positive language. That's the nature of the man and it's genuine.
But it's still a line of communication to the powers that be and seeing as every other line is lacking, a welcome one in my opinion.
Aside from all that, I admire him greatly and I appreciate him taking his time to speak to us. He doesn't have to.
I'm with everybody else who disagrees with the McLeish appointment but this board and the General in particular are very much in credit with me and some of the stick they've had over the last week or so has made me cringe.
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What happened with regards to The General's thread is exactly what I predicted, everyone was happy to ask questions and have banter with him when things were going well but as soon as the board did a few things the genral support didn't agree with, rather than carry on the respectful dialogue it descended into abuse. And then when he didn't immediately appear to answer your abuse he got even more with some people even branding him, a highly decorated Vietnam veteran Marine Corp Officer, a coward!
We had something almost unique in football, certainly unique in The Premier League, an insight into the workings of the board and a conduit to senior figures in the club, and you abused it and have now lost it - as predicted.
That's just as I see it.
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What happened with regards to The General's thread is exactly what I predicted, everyone was happy to ask questions and have banter with him when things were going well but as soon as the board did a few things the genral support didn't agree with, rather than carry on the respectful dialogue it descended into abuse. And then when he didn't immediately appear to answer your abuse he got even more with some people even branding him, a highly decorated Vietnam veteran Marine Corp Officer, a coward!
We had something almost unique in football, certainly unique in The Premier League, an insight into the workings of the board and a conduit to senior figures in the club, and you abused it and have now lost it - as predicted.
It is as ridiculous to call the General a coward as it is to call McLeish brave for moving from the 2nd division Blues to Premier League Aston Villa, with the cushion of a 150% pay rise.
I disagree that the General's thread provides any particular insight into the workings of the club beyond seeing at first hand what the board would like the supporters to think. He was responsive to sycophantic posts but ignores questions that required a higher level of openness and transparency than you can get from any PL football club. I might change my mind on that if anyone can point to examples where he divulged genuine information.
It's interesting that you describe the problem as posters being abusive. This forum is generally very firm in dealing with that type of behaviour. Other people had predicted that the experiment would fail when the going got tough and the questions more pointed. I think that is a better description of what has happened.
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What happened with regards to The General's thread is exactly what I predicted, everyone was happy to ask questions and have banter with him when things were going well but as soon as the board did a few things the genral support didn't agree with, rather than carry on the respectful dialogue it descended into abuse. And then when he didn't immediately appear to answer your abuse he got even more with some people even branding him, a highly decorated Vietnam veteran Marine Corp Officer, a coward!
We had something almost unique in football, certainly unique in The Premier League, an insight into the workings of the board and a conduit to senior figures in the club, and you abused it and have now lost it - as predicted.
It is as ridiculous to call the General a coward as it is to call McLeish brave for moving from the 2nd division Blues to Premier League Aston Villa, with the cushion of a 150% pay rise.
I disagree that the General's thread provides any particular insight into the workings of the club beyond seeing at first hand what the board would like the supporters to think. He was responsive to sycophantic posts but ignores questions that required a higher level of openness and transparency than you can get from any PL football club. I might change my mind on that if anyone can point to examples where he divulged genuine information.
It's interesting that you describe the problem as posters being abusive. This forum is generally very firm in dealing with that type of behaviour. Other people had predicted that the experiment would fail when the going got tough and the questions more pointed. I think that is a better description of what has happened.
Have to agree with every word of this.
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Nice idea, rotten in practice. With the best will in the world, the poor guy can't answer any real questions because it will be in the press a day later. So you're left with the non-football related questions which could be answered by anyone at the club. i made the decision to avoid the thread a long time back because while its tempting to go on and shout the odds at him when things aren't right in your opinion it just kicks off a big arguement normally
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What happened with regards to The General's thread is exactly what I predicted, everyone was happy to ask questions and have banter with him when things were going well but as soon as the board did a few things the genral support didn't agree with, rather than carry on the respectful dialogue it descended into abuse. And then when he didn't immediately appear to answer your abuse he got even more with some people even branding him, a highly decorated Vietnam veteran Marine Corp Officer, a coward!
We had something almost unique in football, certainly unique in The Premier League, an insight into the workings of the board and a conduit to senior figures in the club, and you abused it and have now lost it - as predicted.
It is as ridiculous to call the General a coward as it is to call McLeish brave for moving from the 2nd division Blues to Premier League Aston Villa, with the cushion of a 150% pay rise.
I disagree that the General's thread provides any particular insight into the workings of the club beyond seeing at first hand what the board would like the supporters to think. He was responsive to sycophantic posts but ignores questions that required a higher level of openness and transparency than you can get from any PL football club. I might change my mind on that if anyone can point to examples where he divulged genuine information.
It's interesting that you describe the problem as posters being abusive. This forum is generally very firm in dealing with that type of behaviour. Other people had predicted that the experiment would fail when the going got tough and the questions more pointed. I think that is a better description of what has happened.
Have to agree with every word of this.
Me too.
I'm off for a lie down.
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It's interesting that you describe the problem as posters being abusive. This forum is generally very firm in dealing with that type of behaviour. Other people had predicted that the experiment would fail when the going got tough and the questions more pointed. I think that is a better description of what has happened.
This forum was certainly better than certain others in snuffing out the abuse, but it was there, and it was unwarranted and disgraceful.
Look, I don't know what you or anyone else expected from General K, we were never going to get anything truly insightful and he was only ever a club PR machine, but I think it did give a little glimpse into the very private way in which Randy runs the club, people did get queries answered (ask Nicky Keye) and some people were genuinely helped.
Okay so it was nothing they couldn't have got done simply by ringing the club but there you go!
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Okay so it was nothing they couldn't have got done simply by ringing the club but there you go!
That sums it up for me. I think the board got far more out of it than we as supporters did, and we lost a lot, ie that independent spirit. In the beginning it was genuinely interesting to see a board member posting on a fan site, but the last year or two has just seen lots of "yee haw, we're all in it together" type comments, lots of cap doffing and lots of ill advised comments that have ended up dragging down the name of the club in the press. In short it's had the exact opposite effect to that which was originally intended, and is now more trouble than its worth to be honest.
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This forum was certainly better than certain others in snuffing out the abuse, but it was there, and it was unwarranted and disgraceful.
Where was this disgraceful abuse, Dave?
I understand people were angry when we appointed this manager, but "disgraceful abuse"? Really?
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What happened with regards to The General's thread is exactly what I predicted, everyone was happy to ask questions and have banter with him when things were going well but as soon as the board did a few things the genral support didn't agree with, rather than carry on the respectful dialogue it descended into abuse. And then when he didn't immediately appear to answer your abuse he got even more with some people even branding him, a highly decorated Vietnam veteran Marine Corp Officer, a coward!
We had something almost unique in football, certainly unique in The Premier League, an insight into the workings of the board and a conduit to senior figures in the club, and you abused it and have now lost it - as predicted.
It is as ridiculous to call the General a coward as it is to call McLeish brave for moving from the 2nd division Blues to Premier League Aston Villa, with the cushion of a 150% pay rise.
I disagree that the General's thread provides any particular insight into the workings of the club beyond seeing at first hand what the board would like the supporters to think. He was responsive to sycophantic posts but ignores questions that required a higher level of openness and transparency than you can get from any PL football club. I might change my mind on that if anyone can point to examples where he divulged genuine information.
It's interesting that you describe the problem as posters being abusive. This forum is generally very firm in dealing with that type of behaviour. Other people had predicted that the experiment would fail when the going got tough and the questions more pointed. I think that is a better description of what has happened.
Have to agree with every word of this.
Me too.
I'm off for a lie down.
You've changed ;-)
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This forum was certainly better than certain others in snuffing out the abuse, but it was there, and it was unwarranted and disgraceful.
Where was this disgraceful abuse, Dave?
I understand people were angry when we appointed this manager, but "disgraceful abuse"? Really?
Well, maybe I dreamed it or was getting confused with another site or some of the bile and vitriol on other threads. It all seemed so totally over the top to me.
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This forum was certainly better than certain others in snuffing out the abuse, but it was there, and it was unwarranted and disgraceful.
Where was this disgraceful abuse, Dave?
I understand people were angry when we appointed this manager, but "disgraceful abuse"? Really?
Calling him a coward and a liar is well over the top.
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This forum was certainly better than certain others in snuffing out the abuse, but it was there, and it was unwarranted and disgraceful.
Where was this disgraceful abuse, Dave?
I understand people were angry when we appointed this manager, but "disgraceful abuse"? Really?
Calling him a coward and a liar is well over the top.
Did someone on here do that?
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This forum was certainly better than certain others in snuffing out the abuse, but it was there, and it was unwarranted and disgraceful.
Where was this disgraceful abuse, Dave?
I understand people were angry when we appointed this manager, but "disgraceful abuse"? Really?
Calling him a coward and a liar is well over the top.
Did someone on here do that?
More than once.
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Calling him a coward is indeed out of order as that is certainly not the case.
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Well he's back on Villa talk. Any plans to unlock the subforum on here?
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Well he's back on Villa talk. Any plans to unlock the subforum on here?
Can we have a vote?
Put me down for a big fat fucking no.
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I'll add a poll.
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will the options be:
yes
a big fat fucking no
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See above...
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Hell Yeah for me!
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No for me.
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Let's just have our General thread back and then all the people who consider it a waste of time can quite easily avoid it.
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Let's just have our General thread back and then all the people who consider it a waste of time can quite easily avoid it.
This
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Reopen it, regardless of any abuse he night get etc I personally like being able to see what he has to say but I have absolutely no interest in going on to any other boards to do so. This place is where I belong, now lets get it back to normal service.
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Let's just have our General thread back and then all the people who consider it a waste of time can quite easily avoid it.
Let's have our site back instead.
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Let's just have our General thread back and then all the people who consider it a waste of time can quite easily avoid it.
Let's have our site back instead.
Why is this not the case?
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Just read the VT thread from when the General returned and I cringed alot while reading the messages. As much the Generals posts as the comments and questions flying his way. I am no fan of him being on the fan sites but if others feel it is good I can stay away from it.
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Got to be honest I thought that the VT thread was pretty reserved,
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Let's just have our General thread back and then all the people who consider it a waste of time can quite easily avoid it.
Let's have our site back instead.
Why is this not the case?
Because he's an official club spokesman here to spread the party line, and fear of saying something that'll upset the him stops people discussing things as openly as they might otherwise do. If the club want a channel for two way interaction with the fans, they've got their own website where they could do it.
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Let's just have our General thread back and then all the people who consider it a waste of time can quite easily avoid it.
Let's have our site back instead.
Why is this not the case?
Because he's an official club spokesman here to spread the party line, and fear of saying something that'll upset the him stops people discussing things as openly as they might otherwise do. If the club want a channel for two way interaction with the fans, they've got their own website where they could do it.
I dont see any difference in H&V pre or post General Krulak having a thread here.
I can't believe anybody would fear speaking their mind (in a civilised manner) at the risk of upsetting him. I doubt he'd even want that at all.
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How about a compromise?
Re-open the thread, but restrict it to non Villa related topics. I'm only half joking. As others have mentioned, he'll only ever trot out the party line on thorny issues re playing matters, and he's not a huge help on consumer issues if the solution doesn't somehow involve Nicky Keye.
But the older threads that tended to drift off topic were some of the best stuff on here, covering US foreign policy, military matters and all the rest of it. Whatever your politics, it's good to get the opinion of a guy who might actually have a degree of insight into those matters.
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if people want to read it and speak to the General then let 'em. Not going to make me mind my P's and Q's just because the General may be reading. its not on the main forum anyway, so people like me who find it a bit banal and pointless can ignore it as indeed i have been doing.
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I don't see the point of getting rid of his forum because there are people who'd like to have it on here.
It's quite simple, if you don't want to talk to the General or read what he says... DISABLE HIS FORUM!!!
It's great to have regular communication with someone on the board.
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But the older threads that tended to drift off topic were some of the best stuff on here, covering US foreign policy, military matters and all the rest of it. Whatever your politics, it's good to get the opinion of a guy who might actually have a degree of insight into those matters.
I agree. Those topics were far more interesting than the, naturally, very restricted Villa sound bites.
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While I don't always agree with the General's thoughts, or decisions, with approximately 50% of the members wanting the thread to be re-opened, I can't see that there should be a problem.
If the General wishes to spend his valuable time reading through the threads and responding then I say fair play.
I only occasionally check the thread by speeding through his posts. There is no doubt that he is a forthright straight up bloke and I even have a couple of Amercan friends who served under him and they rated him highly, and his father even more so.
As for his "party line", no one is standing behind us making us read the thread. If we don't agree with what he has to say we can "discuss" it with him. Alternatively If we really don't agree with his contributions the solution is simple, don't bother reading the threads.
He has a thankless job and thread does present a line of communication that was unthinkable in the dark ages of Deadly.
It's a free gift. I say take it and if you don't enjoy it, ignore it.
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I don't see the point of getting rid of his forum because there are people who'd like to have it on here.
It's quite simple, if you don't want to talk to the General or read what he says... DISABLE HIS FORUM!!!
It's great to have regular communication with someone on the board.
This.
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But the older threads that tended to drift off topic were some of the best stuff on here, covering US foreign policy, military matters and all the rest of it. Whatever your politics, it's good to get the opinion of a guy who might actually have a degree of insight into those matters.
I agree. Those topics were far more interesting than the, naturally, very restricted Villa sound bites.
Did the general explain why the US invaded Iraq?
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I don't see the point of getting rid of his forum because there are people who'd like to have it on here.
It's quite simple, if you don't want to talk to the General or read what he says... DISABLE HIS FORUM!!!
It's great to have regular communication with someone on the board.
See I used to watch from afar, taking out the banal stuff to see if there is anything that interested me. I was fine with that. But with his reactions of the last week or so, it just shows the contempt that he seems to hold the Villa Support at the minute. Therefore, as far as I I'm concerned, he really has bugger all to say.
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To be fair, i'm still baffled by his very strangely timed outburst on Facebook.
Fair enough if it was after we'd officially announced Big Eck as manager, but a few days before at the time when it was just still a rumour.
Talk about the board not wanting to do their buisness in the media...
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Was it him?
Why suddenly choose a website to commuinicate where his credentials could not be easily examined to prove authenticity?
I leave it up to you....
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Although that General Krulak Twitter account is definitely him. 110% FACT :rolls eyes:
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yeah but that just demonstrate the problems with the thread and the position he's in. Maybe he think's Mcliesh is rubbish but he can't say that because he knows Lerner wants him, and also Mcliesh will think "whats going on here?". The Facebook thing was off the record as far as he was concerned and maybe he thinks Mcliesh is brilliant but I'm sure he gets frustrated by all the gossip and ill-informed media crap. He doesn't strike me as a naturally diplomatic person anyway or someone used to biting his tongue. *cough*
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Having not seen the comment I don't know what was said, but it's hardly nonattributable if it's from him is it?
Was it from Charles Krulak? Chuck Krulak? General Krulak? Or are they all him?
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Having not seen the comment I don't know what was said, but it's hardly nonattributable if it's from him is it?
well it made the press, so they must of checked, you'd hope. Otherwise he may be picking up a bit of cash this summer
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Having not seen the comment I don't know what was said, but it's hardly nonattributable if it's from him is it?
Was it from Charles Krulak? Chuck Krulak? General Krulak? Or are they all him?
The Chuck Krulak account (the one the message came from) includes at least one family member in his friends list, various military personnel and plenty of friends from the States.
If it is a fake, it's a very good one. The message read like something that would be found in the GK thread too. He was asked about it and hasn't denied it.
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I don't think there's any doubt it was him. Having said that, I don't think there was anything wrong with what he said, it was just the shock of realisation that they were going to appointed AM.
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I think it was him.
Someone from Vital Villa who has him as a friend on Facebook confirmed it was him. It was a wall conversation but was deleted quite soon after because the General was getting some abuse I think.
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But it's 'Chuck' Krulak and has a fairly old picture of him wearing a viking helmet doing '5-1'.
It's about as real as that picture of Downing IMO.
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Might well be and we might have been trolled the whole time.
The General could just come out and say it isn't him...
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Wouldn't miss the General's thread if it doesn't come back tbh. He couldn't comment on the real meaty matters we're interested in hearing about from the board - i.e. anything to do with playing or managerial matters - for fear that the press pick it up. Anything to do with ticketing got the auto-response of 'contact Nicky Keye'.
Nice idea in principle for a link between fans and the board but for me never really valuable in practice.
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The General could just come out and say it isn't him...
He could do, or he could just ignore it as he has done the fake Twitter one.
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Hasn't it been confirmed by Vital that the Facebook post was him?.
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The FB post was NOT him. It came from the Chuck Krulak account, not the General Charles Krulak one.
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I do wish General K sues that loser who's impostering him on Twitter.
The tweets aren't even funny, just monotonous. The parody has been killed.
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Hasn't it been confirmed by Vital that the Facebook post was him?.
If someone on Vital told me my name was Dave I'd check my birth certificate.
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Hasn't it been confirmed by Vital that the Facebook post was him?.
If someone on Vital told me my name was Dave I'd check my birth certificate.
I agree with Brian here.
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The FB post was NOT him. It came from the Chuck Krulak account, not the General Charles Krulak one.
It looks to me as though the General Charles Krulak account is a generated account.
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how about if we set up a thread call ' Not the general's thread', so we can put questions on there that you would like to ask the general, but obviously can't as there is no thread to do so.....
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There's one already.
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Here (http://www.heroesandvillains.info/forumv3/index.php?topic=41377.0)