Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: VillaZogmariner on June 06, 2011, 09:48:46 AM
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Seems the OS are running a list of the top 50 players to ever wear our beloved shirt.
Number 50 - John Carew
I liked Big John, but I am sure there are people more worthy of a top 50 spot than he is.
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That Times list by the bloke who sells H&V by the Holte End was a pretty good top fifty.
Linkymonkey (http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/football/premier_league/aston_villa/article6568117.ece)
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Strange one. If they're thinking more recently in their decisions, then I can see it, kind of. Though I'd find it difficult to pick between Carew and Angel, if you were including a forward from the last decade. I think they'll put McGrath or Cowens at number 1 spot.
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Number 49 - Juan Pablo Angel
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I'd rate JPA higher than Carew. People seem to forget Angel played in quite a poor villa side but was very prolific in two seasons. Imagine if we had Downing/Milner and Young feeding him crosses in his prime?
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I guess it must be top 50 Premier League players?
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Definitely. Football only starts in 1992.
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Number 48... Bosko Balaban.
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Carew rates above Angel in my eyes. Whether either are worthy of being in the top 50 is another matter entirely. With a history as rich as ours you could probably name 50 pre-war more worthy than either Big John or JPA.
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Number 47 Mark Kinsella.
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According to the Official AVFC Twitter - Danny Blanchflower, Dalian Atkinson, Earl Barrett, Paul Birch, Mark Delaney, Ugo Ehiogu. Stuart Gray, Brad Friedel and Stewart Downing were all close but didn't make the top 50.
Birch, Delaney, Ugo and possibly Atkinson all deserve to be above Carew in my opinion.
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Earl Barrett and Stuart Gray??????
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"Danny Blanchflower, Dalian Atkinson, Earl Barrett, Paul Birch, Mark Delaney, Ugo Ehiogu. Stuart Gray, Brad Friedel and Stewart Downing"
None of them should be in the top fifty, in my opinion.
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Carew scored as many goals as Saunders did for us and far more than Atkinson, Angel scored a fair few more than Carew too, although he played more games. In terms of our Prem strikers, Yorke was the stand out, but I wouldn't say there was much to choose between Carew, Dublin, Gabby and Angel, with Dalian, Vassell and Joachim in the next bracket. Nilis would have been right up there I'm sure if he stayed fit too.
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Meant to put Deano in that top bracket too.
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DOWNING???
I'd put Angel ahead of Carew. Not absolutely sure if either should be in a top 50 of our players, mind.
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"Danny Blanchflower, Dalian Atkinson, Earl Barrett, Paul Birch, Mark Delaney, Ugo Ehiogu. Stuart Gray, Brad Friedel and Stewart Downing"
None of them should be in the top fifty, in my opinion.
Norm would have one of them in the top one.
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Undoubtedly a great player, but he achieved all of his major success elsewhere.
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DOWNING???
I'd put Angel ahead of Carew. Not absolutely sure if either should be in a top 50 of our players, mind.
Is it a desperate attempt to get him to stay? Like getting a tattoo of a girlfriend then she leaves you.
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That Times list by the bloke who sells H&V by the Holte End was a pretty good top fifty.
Linkymonkey (http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/football/premier_league/aston_villa/article6568117.ece)
You're getting your Richard Whiteheads mixed up with your Steve Whitehouses mate.
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It can't be just Premier League players then if Blanchflower and Birch were considered.
I think The Times version is already better - although Tony Morley was a big omission.
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That Times list by the bloke who sells H&V by the Holte End was a pretty good top fifty.
Linkymonkey (http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/football/premier_league/aston_villa/article6568117.ece)
You're getting your Richard Whiteheads mixed up with your Steve Whitehouses mate.
Ah, sorry.
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Steve Hunt anyone?
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I've only been a Villa fan for 15 years and I'm fairly sure Downing wouldn't make the top 50 I've seen play.
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I've only been a Villa fan for 15 years and I'm fairly sure Downing wouldn't make the top 50 I've seen play.
Roughly the same for me, and certainly the same conclusion. And I'm a massive Downing fan.
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We all know McGrath will be #1 or #2 depending on how much emphasis is placed on being modern, but what about Yorkie? I found Richard Whitehead's piece incredibly informative but I thought at the time Dwight should be a little higher.
He was world class and proved it when he had the chance elsewhere. If only Randy had have turned up in 1996.
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Mortimer, Shaw, Cowans, Evans, Withe...hard for me to look past the class of 1980-82 even if I was only about 15.
Brian Little, Andy Gray, Yorke, McGrath of course, Chris Nicholl, Laursen, Deano, blimey we've had some decent players...
Alpay & Cascarino might just miss out though I feel...
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So, my old man was right after all. Billy Walker was the greatest player ever to play for the Villa.
(Come to think of it, it's not the only thing that he turned out to be right about.)
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if i had to pick a top 10 of tne last 20 years i'd have jpa in it,
1. god
2. taylor
3. merson
4. yorke
5. young
6. laurson
7. JPA
8. dublin
9. mellberg
10. townsend
barry, alan wright, staunton, ugo and milner were also possibly worthy to.
of all time top 50, they'd all get a place from me but only god yorke and taylor would be in my all time top 10
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If Brian Little isn't No.1 I'm not renewing my season ticket.
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If Brian Little isn't No.1 I'm not renewing my season ticket.
Smiles.
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The countdown (http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2372237,00.html)
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That Times list by the bloke who sells H&V by the Holte End was a pretty good top fifty.
Linkymonkey (http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/football/premier_league/aston_villa/article6568117.ece)
One of the best articles I've read on-line about our club. Percy has pointed out your error so I won't compound things by repeating it!
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So, my old man was right after all. Billy Walker was the greatest player ever to play for the Villa.
My old man would agree.
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I hope Darren Bradley gets a mention.
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If Brian Little isn't No.1 I'm not renewing my season ticket.
Gordon Cowans should be top 1, 2 and 3 with McGrath 4 and Little 5. Further down the order Lillis and Olney are battling it out for places 928 and 929.
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48 - John Deehan?????
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Maybe the main website staff are on their Summer holidays and they've left a half-arsed YTS lad in charge. He is obviously just picking random Villa players from the Who's Who.
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What about Eamon Deacy and Andy Blair!!!
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If Andrew Greaves isn't Number One then it's a fucking disgrace.
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I'm loving the last few comments on here
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I hope Ivor Linton makes the list.
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I hope Ivor Linton makes the list.
An electrician for the manager job? Well, at least he can use the knockout punch on the Chuckle Brothers.
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In at no.47 Ken McNaught
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If Ken's in you can guess 11 of the top 46.
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If Ken's in you can guess 11 of the top 46.
Not necessarily as the list seems fairly random. I expect Dennis Mortimer and Gary Shaw to be left out, while Steve Stone and Ian Ormondroyd feature in the top twenty.
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At this rate, Steve Hodge will be at number one.
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At this rate, Steve Hodge will be at number one.
Surely number 13 would be more appropriate?
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"Danny Blanchflower, Dalian Atkinson, Earl Barrett, Paul Birch, Mark Delaney, Ugo Ehiogu. Stuart Gray, Brad Friedel and Stewart Downing"
None of them should be in the top fifty, in my opinion.
I readily agree with all your picks except for Danny Blanchflower. I saw most of his games at VP and he was light years ahead of the British game at the time. Not for nothing was he twice 'Footballer of the Year'. He was a footballing genius, and I think most fans who saw him play for us would include him in any top ten Villa player list.
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Fair enough, as I said though, most associate him with Spurs success so I wouldn't have in my top fifty. Darren Bent was Sunderland's best player two years running but I doubt they would have in their top fifty. Not an exact analogy, but the best my manager-obsessed brain can come up with at the moment!
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Fair enough, as I said though, most associate him with Spurs success so I wouldn't have in my top fifty. Darren Bent was Sunderland's best player two years running but I doubt they would have in their top fifty. Not an exact analogy, but the best my manager-obsessed brain can come up with at the moment!
That`s a reasonable response in the circumstances but if the criterion is 'best' then Danny Boy was the best I`ve ever seen in a Villa shirt. That he went on to glory elsewhere doesn`t change that fact. Not for me anyway.
Cheers,
Norm.
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Fair enough, as I said though, most associate him with Spurs success so I wouldn't have in my top fifty. Darren Bent was Sunderland's best player two years running but I doubt they would have in their top fifty. Not an exact analogy, but the best my manager-obsessed brain can come up with at the moment!
That`s a reasonable response in the circumstances but if the criterion is 'best' then Danny Boy was the best I`ve ever seen in a Villa shirt. That he went on to glory elsewhere doesn`t change that fact. Not for me anyway.
Cheers,
Norm.
Told you.
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And I'm with Norm even though I never had the pleasure of seeing Mr Blanchflower.
A great player is a great player no matter what. I'm sure a certain Dwight Yorke will be in this top 50, but his best days, certainly if we're counting trophies, were at Man Utd.
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Maybe it's just because I hate Spurs!
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Tony Daley in at number 45.
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Tony Daley in at number 45.
...like a torpedo.
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Gary Williams was 46.
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Ashley Young is number 44...
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43 - Jackie Sewell. Norm?
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42 David Platt
41 Dean Saunders
Work that out.
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So Dalian will be in the top 40 then?
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Saunders better than Platt? In what, running around a lot and not achieving much?
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It's obviously Stupid Decisions Week at Villa Park.
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40: Olof Mellberg
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39 - Martin Laursen. This is taking the piss now.
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38 : Fabio Ferraresi
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37: Ivo Stas
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36 : Ivor Linton
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35: David Unsworth
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Hold on, this has turned into Timewasters!
I'm going to cheat and miss a few...
1 : Stephen Ireland
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34 Nii Lamptey
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Sorry.
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33. Bosko Balaban
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32. oyvind leonhardsen
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Danny Blanchflower and Peter McParland are the best players I have ever seen play for Villa
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I've got no idea how to rate all these players, especially when you go back over 'ancient' history. I do remember me old Man telling about George Cummings signed 1935 for £9,350, apparently was called the 'icicle' for his cool headed defending, he was a full back. Me Da' said that he remembered him silencing Stanley Matthews for about 89min, due to a first minute tackle, which basically said 'be afraid, be very afraid'.
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To get back to the subject, Martin Laursen was indeed a fine footballer for the short time he played for us, but David Platt is half the world-class players we've had in my lifetime.
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I assume McGrath is the other Dave but I would suggest Yorke could be classed as World class too.
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I assume McGrath is the other Dave but I would suggest Yorke could be classed as World class too.
I don't think he was when he was with us. He was good, but he moved up a gear with them.
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Laursen, McGrath, Platt and Cowans all world class. Several just below that level for me, the likes of Saunders, Withe, Morley, Mortimer, Bernie Gallagher, Brendan Ormsby, Dwight Yorke and Gareth Farrelly. Honestly!
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I was with you up until the word "Bernie".
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I was with you up until the word "Bernie".
Ha Ha, We've had our fair share of really poor players too haven't we? David Norton, Gallagher, Ormsby, Dean Glover, Gareth Farrelly, Bosco, Hadji, Kachloul, all terrible.
I wonder how thw OS has carried out this piece of work, have they had people vote or are they random selections? Martin Laursen should be up there in the top 10 I would have thought.
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I think Hadji was ok. We didn't use him enough... there was always that rumour that we would've had to give Coventry an extra twenty quid or so if he played again. Not sure if it was true.
In answer to the second part, the OS has made this up as they go along. Wouldn't be surprised if they get all the way to number one and find out they've forgotten Billy Walker. And Paul McGrath. And Dennis Mortimer, all in a desperate attempt to squeeze Stevie Stevie Stone into the top ten.
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I've got no idea how to rate all these players, especially when you go back over 'ancient' history. I do remember me old Man telling about George Cummings signed 1935 for £9,350, apparently was called the 'icicle' for his cool headed defending, he was a full back. Me Da' said that he remembered him silencing Stanley Matthews for about 89min, due to a first minute tackle, which basically said 'be afraid, be very afraid'.
My Dad told me a similar story. Apparently Sir Stan ended up in a stunned, tangled mess amongst the tea and Bovril urns at the back of the Trinity Road Enclosure as it was called then. I'm sure these stories grow in the telling but Sir Stan wouldn't touch and didn't want the ball after that. Apparently Cummings was eventually suspended - "sine die" - which meant suspended with no definite end. They didn't mess about in those days but he was allowed to play again eventually.
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38 - Dion Dublin.
What?
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37 - Gabby. They're making it up as they go along.
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Gabby has been wheeled out to coincide with his endorsement of AM. They think we're stupid.
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If Dean Saunders, Dion Dublin and Gabby are really in that list of Villa's 50 greatest ever players I'm not even going to bother looking at it. The Times list is much more realistic.
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36 - David Unsworth
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36 - David Unsworth
That's about right.
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Close - it's Bobby Thomson.
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Next up it's Harry Burrows. Smashing bloke and his piledriver was harder and more lethal than Hitz.
Harry was the replacement for Peter MacParland when he left for Wolves. He scored some great goals but the funniest was against Peterborough United in the Cup in 1961 where Harry messed up a cross and was as delighted as all of us that it scored and won the game.
Anyone who was in the Witton Lane stand watching Harry in the early 60's will probably remember how in the second half playing towards the Holte End Harry would enjoy occasional banter with the crowd especially if we were winning and he was far enough away to be spotted by Joe Mercer.
Harry was eventually sold to Stoke City where he replaced Stanley Mathews. I was disappointed when Peter Mac left but Harry soon made up for that loss. There were a couple of seasons there in the early 60's where Villa sold Gerry Hitchens and then Peter MacParland breaking up a fantastic partnership.
I always wonder "what if" when players like those two left, but Harry Burrows was the kind of player that would remind me that Aston Villa has always had the knack of finding good players to replace players who we thought were irreplaceable.
A lesson there perhaps for those of us who wonder who will replace Ashley Young.
Harry Burrows... top bloke
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Dion and Gabby join Saunders on the list of players that are better than Platt? Are they just picking names out of a hat or something?
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Today's nomination - Mark Bosnich.
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I wonder if deep down Bozzie regrets leaving us.
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Next up it's Harry Burrows. Smashing bloke and his piledriver was harder and more lethal than Hitz.
Harry was the replacement for Peter MacParland when he left for Wolves. He scored some great goals but the funniest was against Peterborough United in the Cup in 1961 where Harry messed up a cross and was as delighted as all of us that it scored and won the game.
Anyone who was in the Witton Lane stand watching Harry in the early 60's will probably remember how in the second half playing towards the Holte End Harry would enjoy occasional banter with the crowd especially if we were winning and he was far enough away to be spotted by Joe Mercer.
Harry was eventually sold to Stoke City where he replaced Stanley Mathews. I was disappointed when Peter Mac left but Harry soon made up for that loss. There were a couple of seasons there in the early 60's where Villa sold Gerry Hitchens and then Peter MacParland breaking up a fantastic partnership.
I always wonder "what if" when players like those two left, but Harry Burrows was the kind of player that would remind me that Aston Villa has always had the knack of finding good players to replace players who we thought were irreplaceable.
A lesson there perhaps for those of us who wonder who will replace Ashley Young.
Harry Burrows... top bloke
Seconded.
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I wonder if deep down Bozzie regrets leaving us.
Best keeper we've ever had?
His kicking was shite, but for a time I think he was one of the few genuine world class players we've had over the last 25 years. I'll never forget that Sunderland game up at Roker Park. Fantastic night and best goalkeeping display I've ever seen.
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43 - Jackie Sewell. Norm?
Jackie was a great player but his best days were at Sheffield Wednesday. He would certainly make their top ten list.
I enjoyed remembering Harry Burrows through Ondaholt`s musings. It`s a toss up between Harry, Stan Lynn and Eric Houghton as to whose shot was hardest.
I assume Houghton is high up on the Villa list.
Norm.
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Eric Houghton is likely towards the top end of the Fab 50.
They say his was the hardest shot of his era. I don't know, I was too young to have ever seen him play.
I recall him as Villa's manager for the 1957 FA Cup winning team and later as a Director.
I did see both Stan the Wham's shot and Harry Burrow's and on it's day Stan's was harder. I still duck just thinking of his penalty kicks taken at the Holte End. As Nippers we were at the front of the Holte End right behind the goal. You wouldn't want to get in the way of any of those shots because you have to remember that the football back then was a leather weight.
I wonder what Stan and Harry would do with a Jabulani ball ?
Stan Lynn disgraced himself, for me, because he joined sha and was on "that team" that beat us in the '63 League Cup Final!
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33 - Ray Graydon. A good player but better than David Platt?
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In with a bullet at 32 - Les Smith.
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31: Harry Parkes.
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At least he's someone you could call a Villa great.
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30: George Cummings
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29: Jimmy Dugdale
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Next up it's Harry Burrows. Smashing bloke and his piledriver was harder and more lethal than Hitz.
Harry was the replacement for Peter MacParland when he left for Wolves. He scored some great goals but the funniest was against Peterborough United in the Cup in 1961 where Harry messed up a cross and was as delighted as all of us that it scored and won the game.
Anyone who was in the Witton Lane stand watching Harry in the early 60's will probably remember how in the second half playing towards the Holte End Harry would enjoy occasional banter with the crowd especially if we were winning and he was far enough away to be spotted by Joe Mercer.
Harry was eventually sold to Stoke City where he replaced Stanley Mathews. I was disappointed when Peter Mac left but Harry soon made up for that loss. There were a couple of seasons there in the early 60's where Villa sold Gerry Hitchens and then Peter MacParland breaking up a fantastic partnership.
I always wonder "what if" when players like those two left, but Harry Burrows was the kind of player that would remind me that Aston Villa has always had the knack of finding good players to replace players who we thought were irreplaceable.
A lesson there perhaps for those of us who wonder who will replace Ashley Young.
Harry Burrows... top bloke
First game I can recall Harry Burrows scored the only goal of the game against Leyton Orient. That was a cross from the left wing too.
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28: Chris Nicholl
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...27 Phil King
For that penalty.
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There are only 27 better players in the club's history than Chris Nicholl? I don't think he was THAT good.
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...27 Phil King
For that penalty.
As opposed to being for the three other appearances he made for us. There's a feature this week on avtv about Phil and the boozer he owns in Swindon.
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Is the 50 supposed to be in order or is it just 50 players who were great (ie does number 1 have more gravitas than number 50). Sorry if this has already been discussed.
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There are only 27 better players in the club's history than Chris Nicholl? I don't think he was THAT good.
Well one of them is ALAN WRIGHT!!!
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Dear Lord. Carlton Palmer will be in there soon.
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Is there an Alan Wright from the 1950s or something that I don't know about because it surely can't be the Alan Wright I watched in the 1990s that is amongst our 30 greatest ever players.
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Well it was a good goal up at Boro.
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Is there an Alan Wright from the 1950s or something that I don't know about because it surely can't be the Alan Wright I watched in the 1990s that is amongst our 30 greatest ever players.
I'm afraid there isn't. Alan Wright was a decent and under-rated player in a successful Villa side and deserves credit for the number of games he played in a comparatively short time, but 27?
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I know its a strange thing to have to ask in what should be a list in order - but just that are these supposed to be in some kind of order and who decided that order because some of these are random in terms of them being higher than others ??
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Blimey Alan Wright, inch for inch our best ever player.
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I know its a strange thing to have to ask in what should be a list in order - but just that are these supposed to be in some kind of order and who decided that order because some of these are random in terms of them being higher than others ??
I thought that when Platt appeared so far down the list. Alan Wright and Phil King, FFS!
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I have it on "good authority" (same good authority gregnash uses by the way) that Bernie Gallacher is 13, Ian Olney is 9 and Gary Penrice is at 7.
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Alan Wright was fucking brilliant.
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Stan Staunton was better than Wrightie, but I wouldn't have him in our all time top 26 players. Wright better than Laursen and Mellberg to name but 2, no way.
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Has anyone contacted the club just to check whether this is just the top 50 players but in no order.
It has to be surely.
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Has anyone contacted the club just to check whether this is just the top 50 players but in no order.
It has to be surely.
I have. It isn't. They're in order.
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I liked him. Not 27th best ever player liked but I thought he was decent enough.
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Looking forward to seeing where Steve Stone, Alan Thompson and George Boateng feature in the top 26, maybe 1,2 and 3?
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ooh we've yet to have Savo' The Flobber' Milosevic . Better than Withe,Hitchens and Gray ? he's already better than Deano,Platt and Gabby.
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In fact is Rob Bishop only 25 or something !
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In fact is Rob Bishop only 25 or something !
He's not doing it.
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I'd love to know what criteria they're using to decide these placings. I've stopped getting wound up by it now and can't wait to see what further delights await us.
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It's becoming comical.
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wheres Hassan Kachloul ?
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It's becoming comical.
If they had entitled the theme "50 players we have randomly pulled out of a hat" it would be a lot easier to fathom.
Fortunately the get-out for Villa's Fab 50 editors lies in the meaning of the word Fab or fabulous as it used to be known. My dictionary interprets the word as meaning barely credible, astonishing, mythical. like a fable etc. and meaning no disrespect to any on the list, one or two are astonishing.
I agree Legion. It is comical.
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Richard's Times article is far better.
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I hear Heskey has stumbled into the top 20.
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It's becoming comical.
I'd agree, I had to laugh when I saw AW smiling at me on the OS
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26 Jimmy Rimmer
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I take it it's not supposed to be in any particular order?
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Yes it is in order.
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Random?
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I liked AW and felt his role as fan scapegoat to be very harsh on him. But #27? Better than Platt, Mellberg etc? In 137 years there's only been 26 better players than Alan Wright play for us? Fuck off. They'll have John Fashanu in the top 10 at this rate.
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Predicted top 10?
Little, Shaw, Cowans, McGrath, Hitchens, Waring, Yorke, Morley, Platt, Southgate?
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Predicted top 10?
Little, Shaw, Cowans, McGrath, Hitchens, Waring, Yorke, Morley, Platt, Southgate?
Where's Ireland?
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In fact little seems to be 25, just slightly better than Alan wright! What on earth!?
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Sir Brian is only number 25?
That's about 20 places too low in my opinion.
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I intend to ask Nicola Keyes some searching questions here.
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Well the other 24 must be from the Golden Victorian era and a few from 1980-82 then. Early punt on the number 1 anyone ?
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It's post-war which makes no. 25 all the more ridiculous.
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Well the other 24 must be from the Golden Victorian era and a few from 1980-82 then. Early punt on the number 1 anyone ?
At this rate Bernie bloody Gallacher. Bless his backward running, pubic headed little cotton socks.
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Sir Brian No25 ?? ffs at this rate Hodge will be in the top 5 !!
in my eyes Brian you will always be No1
UTV
The Doc
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It's getting to the point where we need to storm the gates in protest........oh we've done that already this summer.
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I am telling you if we have had 24 better players than Brian Little than I must have been watching a differant team over the years - utter madness and getting beyond silly now
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Brian Little was the first poster I had on my wall and I haven't had many since . This says it all to me .
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Brian Little was the first poster I had on my wall and I haven't had many since . This says it all to me .
That explains your Juan Pablo username.
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25??? Fucking 25???!!!!!
I'd return my season ticket if I had one I tell ya.
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I've binned it - I'll wait til they've finished this load of old tosh before I click like again.
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I reckon to pick this fab 50 they had Paul Faulker drunk on whiskey, blind folded, spun round 10 times and then played pin the photo of random Villa player.
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I've just finished reading the Times article linked here, wonderful, misty eyed memories. The way the game is now I suspect we'll never see such endearing times as the early 80's and the GT, BFR, BL mangement years again.
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Oh blimey Sir Brian in at 25, it has confirmed it for me that this top 50 is a load of old tosh.
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24 - Gerry Hitchins.
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Gerry Hitchens - Along with Alfredo di Stefano my favourite Centre Forwards of all time. I recall as a kid my Dad telling me that The Villa Board had sold Gerry to Inter Milan for 85,000 in the Summer of 62 and I couldn't believe it.
Next thing you knew they sold Peter MacParland to Wolves and IMHO the future for Villa didn't look good and it wasn't.
When they sold him, Hitchens had broken into the England team and was scoring goals freely which is why Inter wanted him. Villa needed the money very badly.
The move ended Hitchens England career with Alf Ramsey wanting locally available players to train with the England squad. Had Hitchens stayed I believe that Villa would have had an opportunity to thrive in the First Division instead of struggling and ending up on the spiral down to Division 3.
While with Villa, Hitchens scored a remarkable 78 goals in 132 games. Hitchens was good in the air and with the ball at his feet and always gave 100% in the games. With Peter Mac on the left wing and Hitchens at CF our attack was exciting.
The thing about Gerry was that he was always focussed on the game and was always on the prowl for goals. He worked the channels and found the gaps and openings for his wngers and inside forwards to work with.
In fact Hitchens availability made it possible for Peter MacParland to score so many of his legendary goals because with Gerry in the middle teams would often not only have a Centre Half on him but sometimes would also have a Full Back or Wing Half as extra cover.
Many of Peter's goals were scored with Peter feinting a cross and then dragging the ball inside with his left foot and lashing out with his deadly shot.
After Gerry left, Villa had a few Centre Fowards, Doogan, Hateley, and Rioch, who while useful just weren't anywhere near as good as Gerry.
Hitchens was the ultimate proof for any manager worth a grain of salt, that you have to have a deadly striker/centre forward. (The current ownership should take note. Keep Bent at the club scoring goals.) Without Hitchens, Joe Mercer's teams struggled and for us nippers behind the goal at the Holte End, life just wasn't the same.
The day Gerry Hitchens left the Villa thousands of us Holte Enders felt our hearts sink.
Lee Child, Villa supporter, author, last summer asked how many Aston Villa supporters were in an audience. He said the thing about Aston Villa is that though it is a great club, it occasionally lets you down. I think he must have been one of us Holte Enders that saw Hitchens leave for Inter Milan.
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23. Peter Aldis
That's a decent inclusion?
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I'm guessing Najwan Ghrayib at number one.
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Sir Brian at 25? I was half-expecting him to turn up at 9 or 10, something daft like that, but 25? Wow.
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22: Tony Hateley.
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22: Tony Hateley.
I'm expecting Martin Kemp crooning Chant No. 1 soon.
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21: Tony Morley
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22: Tony Hateley.
Better than Hitchens?
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I really don't know why we bother with stuff like this. It's all a bit 'best ever album'
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20: Gary Shaw
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Shaw and Little both lower than they should have been. I was hoping to see Merse in the 50, but he should not be higher than those 2. I really hope Southgate, Yorke and I Taylor aren't in above those guys as well. Who else is there to come, McGrath, Gray, Withe, Cowans, Mortimer, Spink maybe?
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Taylor will probably be #1 given the utter drivel they've put up so far.
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Shaw and Little both lower than they should have been. I was hoping to see Merse in the 50, but he should not be higher than those 2. I really hope Southgate, Yorke and I Taylor aren't in above those guys as well. Who else is there to come, McGrath, Gray, Withe, Cowans, Mortimer, Spink maybe?
The way it has gone, I assume you mean Suart Gray, Dean Spink and Paul Mortimer?
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22: Tony Hateley.
Better than Hitchens?
no Dave, not a chance
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19: Steve Staunton :o
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Staunton top 20, ahead of Shaw, Morley and Little, what??
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I am not about to go and check, but I assume Staunton played more games than Shaw, Morley and Little.
Is there any link to this in the order so far?
Barry and Hendrie in the top 10 then!
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18: Ian Taylor
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Well the other 24 must be from the Golden Victorian era and a few from 1980-82 then. Early punt on the number 1 anyone ?
Tommy Johnson.
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Well the other 24 must be from the Golden Victorian era and a few from 1980-82 then. Early punt on the number 1 anyone ?
Tommy Johnson.
My guess is Scott Murray.
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Neil Tarrant I reckon.
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Gary Penrice to be in the top 3
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If Andrew Greaves isn't Number One then there will have to be a full inquiry into this list.
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Has Juan Pablo Angel been yet?
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I'm worried that Nigel Callaghan hasn't appeared in the list yet.
They wouldn't, would they?
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Has Juan Pablo Angel been yet?
49.
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17: Dwight Yorke
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Sasa Curcic for number one :D
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Neil Tarrant I reckon.
Good god, that's a name from the past. Was'nt he Scottish?
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Didn't he form the Pet Shop Boys?
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John Inglis to be in the top 10
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Neil Tarrant I reckon.
Good god, that's a name from the past. Was'nt he Scottish?
Yes, we signed him from Ross County where he had scored loads, albeit in the Scottish third division. I don't think he played a first team game but I did see him score in a friendly at Tamworth. Last seen trundling around the north-east non league scene.
*EDIT* According to his Wiki entry he's not Scottish, he's from Darlington.
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I remember him, he seemed quite chuffed to be here.
I wonder if Gareth Williams will be in there?
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Didn't he form the Pet Shop Boys?
Nah, but he was good on Who Wants to be a Millionaire.
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Neil Tarrant I reckon.
Good god, that's a name from the past. Was'nt he Scottish?
Yes, we signed him from Ross County where he had scored loads, albeit in the Scottish third division. I don't think he played a first team game but I did see him score in a friendly at Tamworth. Last seen trundling around the north-east non league scene.
*EDIT* According to his Wiki entry he's not Scottish, he's from Darlington.
Played for Scotland under-21s though so at least a bit Scottish. He's had nearly as many clubs as John Burridge.
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16: Des Bremner
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Yorkie should have been higher.
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Yorkie should have been higher.
Really? I'd say top 20 is about right for him to be honest.
He certainly should not have been higher than Sir Brian.
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He certainly should not have been higher than Sir Brian.
You wait til they reach #8 and wheel Ian Olney out.
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He certainly should not have been higher than Sir Brian.
You wait til they reach #8 and wheel Ian Olney out.
Didn't know he is that old, 64 this year?
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Michael Boulding
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15. Gareth Southgate.
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Southgate was class for us. Shame he wanted bigger things then fucked off to Boro. I think Paul Scholes was talking about Southgate in his interview the other day.
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I liked Southgate - but as long as my arse points downwards he is not in the top 15 players to pull on a Villa shirt. And most fucking definitely he should not be higher of Dwight Yorke, let alone Sir Brian.
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14. Stuart Ritchie
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14: Nigel Sims (http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2390409,00.html)
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There probably wasn't a Villa supporter born that didn't like "Nige". Great goalkeeper who helped Villa win the FA Cup in 1957 and the first ever League Cup in 1960-1 3-2 on aggregate over Rotheram United.
He won the first supporters award that I can recall and rightly so. He was burly and held his weight quite well iirc until he quit smoking and as a nipper I recall the Holte End kidding him about quitting smoking in his last few seasons whenever he let a goal in.
At the international level I think he was underrated and represented the Football League. I think he could have easily played for England. Having watched both Ron Springett and Nigel Sims I would say that Nige was more reliable but Springett made every ball that came his way look like a fancy save.
I think the fact that Sheffield Wednesday paid QPR 10K for Springett helped him get the caps, whereas Nigel simply, arrived at Villa after being understudy to Bert Williams at Wolves.
Nigel had an innate sense of positioning and in those days goalkeepers were prey to bullying centre forwards like John Charles. But not our Nige; Safe hands, came off his line when necessary and was strong on crosses from set pieces and gave forwards as good as they gave with change.
In fact most corner takers should have just kicked the ball to Nige because Nige was going to get it anyway.
Others may not agree but I think his weight gain in his last few seasons seemed to be an issue and ultimately he left Villa for Peterborough United. In his heyday Nigel was imho one of the greatest goalkeepers over the last 50 years which undoubtedly is why he is ranked in the Top 20. Top Bloke, great goalie.
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Misread no.14 at first and thought they had come up with Steve Sims! Doh!
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Misread no.14 at first and thought they had come up with Steve Sims! Doh!
Me too, sounds like the kind of keeper we need today.
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I thought of steve sims too. I was a little surprised!
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13: Andy Gray (http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2390890,00.html)
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13: Andy Gray (http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2390890,00.html)
Tbh i think he is the most exciting player I've ever seen in a Villa shirt!
He scared defences shitless and was so confident that he was gonna score and did!
I used to love driving home after the game with my mate Dave and Villa fan after Villa fan phoning up Tony Butler and crooning to him: "Hey Tone, what about the Villa? Andy Gray's great" and Butler simply had no response, week after week. We had the best striker in the league and everybody knew it! The good old days!
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Paul Mcgrath, Ian Taylor & Dwight Yorke should be top 3.They've never been replaced!
Never saw him play but ive been told Gary Shaw aswell.
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Gary Shaw was my boyhood hero/idol.
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Regardless, here is a far better summation:
Richard Whitehead in The Times (http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/football/premier_league/aston_villa/article6568117.ece)
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Paul Mcgrath, Ian Taylor & Dwight Yorke should be top 3.They've never been replaced!
Never saw him play but ive been told Gary Shaw aswell.
You need to look deeper into our history.
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yea maybe but they are 3 top candidates!
Cant think of many better defenders? Yorkie is still the leading prem goalscorer and Ian Taylor is just Ian Taylor - legend!
Each to his own, i can only comment on what i think
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Paul Mcgrath, Ian Taylor & Dwight Yorke should be top 3.They've never been replaced!
Never saw him play but ive been told Gary Shaw aswell.
Ian Taylor, one of our top three players of all time?! Good grief!
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Sid should be in the top 5!
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12: Gareth Barry
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13: Andy Gray (http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2390890,00.html)
Tbh i think he is the most exciting player I've ever seen in a Villa shirt!
He scared defences shitless and was so confident that he was gonna score and did!
I used to love driving home after the game with my mate Dave and Villa fan after Villa fan phoning up Tony Butler and crooning to him: "Hey Tone, what about the Villa? Andy Gray's great" and Butler simply had no response, week after week. We had the best striker in the league and everybody knew it! The good old days!
You could argue we have the best striker in the league now, well not far off surely. Ian Taylor was a workhorse, but top 3 of all time, no where near. Barry at 12 is a disgrace.
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They didn“t include Nigel Sims“ nickname. Cant think why.
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Barry at 12 - Sir Brian at 25.
Enough said.
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BARRY??? Our twelfth greatest player ever?
Christ on a fucking bike.
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Barry at 12 - Sir Brian at 25.
Enough said.
Exactly Dave, who is coming up with this!
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11: Stan Lynn (http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2392449,00.html)
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I'm still reeling from Brian Little being at number 25. Steve Staunton was better? Really? Little is up there with the McGrath's of the Villa world. throw in the odd Devey, Athersmith, Bache etc if you will, but number 25?
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My Grandad was always banging on about Stan Lynn. I struggle to think of anyone who was ever so popular with both sets of fans. Charlie Athersmith maybe?
Dave... what was Sims' nickname? From your post I'm assuming it is something that would now be considered hugely offensive.
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I bet Stan The Man makes the top 10.
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Have we had Ashley Young yet?
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This list has got to be a piss take surely?
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10: Charlie Aitken (http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2393282,00.html)
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My Grandad was always banging on about Stan Lynn. I struggle to think of anyone who was ever so popular with both sets of fans. Charlie Athersmith maybe?
Dave... what was Sims' nickname? From your post I'm assuming it is something that would now be considered hugely offensive.
Think of his first name, and especially the first four letters.
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Nige?
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Acronym?
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My Grandad was always banging on about Stan Lynn. I struggle to think of anyone who was ever so popular with both sets of fans. Charlie Athersmith maybe?
Dave... what was Sims' nickname? From your post I'm assuming it is something that would now be considered hugely offensive.
Think of his first name, and especially the first four letters.
Ah, God it cheers. Oh dear.
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So who will be the rest of the top 10 then? I can think of the following who haven't appeared yet. Hampton, Withe, Walker, Cowans, God, Athersmith, Devey, McParland, Mortimer, Pongo, Barson, James Cowan, Hunter, Spencer.
Unless i've missed something or miscounted, I make it that at least 4 of these aren't better than Alan Wright according to Villa.
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I think the list is just Post-WW2 players so discount most of them.
I fully expect Ashley Young, Ian Taylor and Dwight Yorke to be the top three.
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9: Nigel Spink (http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2393296,00.html)
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I've given up being surprised by this.
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Brian Little at 25? The compiler of this nonsense should be named and shamed.
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Brian Little at 25? The compiler of this nonsense should be named and shamed.
I don't remember Brian in his playing days unfortunatley, but given the high esteem that he's held in even to this day, No.25 does sound a bit ridiculous.
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It's post-war which makes no. 25 all the more ridiculous.
Falklands or Gulf?
An excercise in total futility. Our best teams played before any of us were born; Our most successful post-war team contained hardly anyone who could objectively be considered great.
Blanchflower and Mcgrath were great players who played for the Villa. Dwight won the European Cup - though he was substituted for either Sheringham or Solskjaer (I forget which) because he was playing shit and had zero impact on the final.
Little was God. End of.
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So who will be the rest of the top 10 then? I can think of the following who haven't appeared yet. Hampton, Withe, Walker, Cowans, God, Athersmith, Devey, McParland, Mortimer, Pongo, Barson, James Cowan, Hunter, Spencer.
Unless i've missed something or miscounted, I make it that at least 4 of these aren't better than Alan Wright according to Villa.
Make that at least 5 who aren't better than Wright, Spink etc. That list is a complete joke.
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8: Allan Evans (http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2393303,00.html)
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8: Allan Evans (http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2393303,00.html)
I'm not going to argue with that one. Not while he's around, anyway.
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7: Peter Withe (http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2395817,00.html)
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I know he's coming up in the list soon, and I acknowledge his legend status, but I never really got Dennis Mortimer at the time. Of the Famous 14 from '81/82 I would say he was not really in the top 6 of that group but I know I will be in a very small minority......as the arguements I've had with mates at away games over the past 25 years or so show.
Mind you its getting to the time in life when I can be nostalgic, so I should say that my memory of him is improving with age and I would, of course, give a lot for 2011-2013 to mirror that period !
I will be staggered if he is above Sid and Macca.
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I know he's coming up in the list soon, and I acknowledge his legend status, but I never really got Dennis Mortimer at the time. Of the Famous 14 from '81/82 I would say he was not really in the top 6 of that group but I know I will be in a very small minority......as the arguements I've had with mates at away games over the past 25 years or so show.
I can comfortably put 5 ahead of him, and all the rest each have a reasonably valid claim for 6th spot in my view.
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7: Peter Withe (http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2395817,00.html)
I love Withey and he is rightly a Villa legend, but 7th in the list of all time Villa players? He'd probably struggle to be 7th in all time list of Villa strikers.
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The history books suggest the majority of our greatest ever players were serving us 100 years ago but for what it's worth, the top 12 greatest Villa players of my lifetime (in no particular order) are Rioch, Gidman, Little, Gray, Rimmer, Morley, Cowans, Shaw, Withe, McGrath, Yorke and Platt.
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The history books suggest the majority of our greatest ever players were serving us 100 years ago but for what it's worth, the top 12 greatest Villa players of my lifetime (in no particular order) are Rioch, Gidman, Little, Gray, Rimmer, Morley, Cowans, Shaw, Withe, McGrath, Yorke and Platt.
Saunders for Rioch.
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Peter McParland (http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2397052,00.html)
Villa's Fab 50
6: Peter McParland
Career: 1952-1962
Appearances: 341
Goals: 121
Whenever the 1957 FA Cup final is mentioned, one name immediately comes to mind.
Peter McParland is the man most responsible for Villa's famous Wembley victory over hot favourites Manchester United, scoring two second half goals to give his team a 2-1 verdict.
The Northern Ireland international is also remembered, of course, for his unfortunate collision with Ray Wood, which left United's goalkeeper with a fractured jaw and the Manchester club down to 10 men for long periods.
But McParland's contribution to the Villa cause extended far beyond his predatory instincts on that glorious May afternoon.
He scored a total of seven FA Cup goals that season, and his winners' medal certainly wasn't the only one the free-scoring winger collected during a decade in claret and blue.
He also helped Villa to the Second Division title in 1959-60 - and scored the extra-time winner which secured a 3-2 aggregate victory over Rotherham United in the inaugural League Cup final in 1961.
That goal gave him the distinction of being the first player to score in both an FA Cup and League Cup final.
McParland joined Villa from Irish club Dundalk in 1952 and even the man who signed him - manager George Martin - could not have envisaged the impact he would make at Villa Park.
Such was the impression he made that he won the first of his 34 international caps while still a teenager, scoring twice on his debut against Wales in 1954.
He also represented his country at the 1958 World Cup finals in Sweden.
Equally at home at centre-forward as he was on the left wing, McParland was a prolific scorer, hitting the target 121 times for Villa, including 25 league and cup goals during the 1959-60 campaign.
After nearly 10 years with the club, he moved across the West Midlands to join Wolves for £35,000 in January 1962.
All profiles courtesy of Rob Bishop and Frank Holt's comprehensive book: Aston Villa - The Complete Record.
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5: Trevor Ford (http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2397709,00.html)
Villa's Fab 50
5: Trevor Ford
Career: 1947-1950
Appearances: 128
Goals: 61
If there was a half chance of a goal - or possibly even less - Trevor Ford was willing to throw himself in where it hurt.
Strong and courageous, he simply revelled in battles against opposition centre-halves, and loved the business of scoring.
You only have to look at his statistics to realise that.
During his time with Villa he established himself as one of the most prolific marksmen in the club's history, falling only marginally short of a goal every two games.
Originally a full-back, Ford began his professional career with his hometown club Swansea immediately after the war before joining Villa for £12,000 in January 1947.
A week after his first game, a 2-0 win against Arsenal at Highbury, he marked his home debut with Villa's goal in a 1-1 draw with Blackpool, and by the end of that season he had hit the target nine times in as many games.
For the next three seasons, he was in double figures, heading Villa's goal chart on each occasion as his reputation as a fearless centre-forward grew.
He was a player who could shoot powerfully with either foot, and Villa fans really took him to their hearts.
Indeed, he was described by Charlton Athletic defender Derek Ufton as "the most complete centre-forward I have played against."
His value certainly increased during his spell at Villa Park.
The club's outlay for him was no mean figure in those days but it proved to be a wise investment - they received £30,000 from Sunderland when he moved to Roker Park in October 1950.
Ford, who subsequently spent three years with Dutch club PSV Eindhoven, won 39 Welsh caps and became the first player to score more than 30 goals for that country.
All profiles courtesy of Rob Bishop and Frank Holt's comprehensive book: Aston Villa - The Complete Record.
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Pongo Waring should be in the list as our greatest ever goal scorer.
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Pongo Waring should be in the list as our greatest ever goal scorer.
Billy Walker and Harry Hampton are our greatest ever goal scorers.
Pongo holds the record for most goals in one season.
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The history books suggest the majority of our greatest ever players were serving us 100 years ago but for what it's worth, the top 12 greatest Villa players of my lifetime (in no particular order) are Rioch, Gidman, Little, Gray, Rimmer, Morley, Cowans, Shaw, Withe, McGrath, Yorke and Platt.
I think my lifetime is the same as yours BDE. I would have Mortimer for Morley, otherwise agree with your list. I would think if you went back a generation, Hitchens, McParland and maybe Johnny Dixon would be the main players challenging your top 12 (those are my Dad's favourites).
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Pongo Waring should be in the list as our greatest ever goal scorer.
It's post-war. And Trevor Ford should be nowhere near number five.
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Trevor who?
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Pongo Waring should be in the list as our greatest ever goal scorer.
Billy Walker and Harry Hampton are our greatest ever goal scorers.
Pongo holds the record for most goals in one season.
I was going off goals per game ratio. Waring scored a goal every 1.35, which is even better than Hampton's record.
I didn't realise it was post-war only.
I know it was a different era, style and so forth, but it makes you wonder what sort of fees these players would command today.
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Trevor who?
A big thug of a journeyman centre-forward who played for the Villa for 3 seasons after the war. Was suspended later in his career for accepting illegal payments.
What on earth are the criteria for this list - will Messrs Bishop and Holt like to fill us all in one day? It has got to be done statistically somehow - but I cannot work it out.
If Mortimer, as I expect, is number one - that will be the icing on the cake. I hope Cowans and Bremner got extra points for doing all his running and tackling.
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I'd assume McGrath will be number 1 (unless he's been already).
He's certainly my favourite player, not just because he was unbelievable, but because he was far from perfect. Much like Botham, I think we quite like our heroes in this country to be a little mad.
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I'd assume McGrath will be number 1 (unless he's been already).
4 left. Cowans, McGrath, Dixon, Mortimer
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Trevor who?
A big thug of a journeyman centre-forward who played for the Villa for 3 seasons after the war. Was suspended later in his career for accepting illegal payments.
Last season I was talking to two supporters from that era and when his name came up they went apoplectic over some allegedly deliberately-missed penalty against a club he was linked with.
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I reckon number one will be Sid.
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I reckon number one will be Sid.
He should be.
I can't believe Dennis is in the Top 4. Very decent player, scored a couple of vital goals and a great captain in a team of captains. But Top 4, never.
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The history books suggest the majority of our greatest ever players were serving us 100 years ago but for what it's worth, the top 12 greatest Villa players of my lifetime (in no particular order) are Rioch, Gidman, Little, Gray, Rimmer, Morley, Cowans, Shaw, Withe, McGrath, Yorke and Platt.
I think my lifetime is the same as yours BDE. I would have Mortimer for Morley, otherwise agree with your list. I would think if you went back a generation, Hitchens, McParland and maybe Johnny Dixon would be the main players challenging your top 12 (those are my Dad's favourites).
Mortimer would have been next on my list, followed closely by Cropley.
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I reckon number one will be Sid.
I'd never have Cowans down as our best player. McGrath for me. I don't think I ever saw him have a bad game for us.
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Sid by a mile.
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God by a furlong.
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I reckon:
1. McGrath
2. Cowans
3. Mortimer
4. Dixon.
I'd go:
1. McGrath
2. McParland
3. Mortimer
4. Platt
5. Cowans
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Macca is only number 4. Tony Dorigo no 1?
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4: Paul McGrath (http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2398895,00.html)
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Villa's Fab 50
4: Paul McGrath
Career: 1989-1996
Appearances: 323
Goals: 9
Not only is he the most revered Villa star of the modern era, Paul McGrath is also regarded as one of the greatest players in the club's history.
Yet the man who conjured up pure genius and turned the business of defending into an art form hardly made the most impressive of starts in claret and blue.
Signed by Graham Taylor in the summer of 1989, the Republic of Ireland international cost £425,000 from Manchester United and it seemed the investment was doomed to failure when his first few months at Villa Park were blighted by his much-publicised off-the-field problems.
By the end of that season, though, it was clear the money had been well spent.
With McGrath operating alongside Derek Mountfield and Kent Nielsen in a three-man defence, Villa finished runners-up to Liverpool and were back in Europe following a five-year ban on English clubs.
By 1993, Macca had been voted the club's Player of the Year for the fourth consecutive season and he was also voted PFA Footballer of the Year as Villa were second again, this time to Manchester United in the inaugural Premier League campaign.
There was better to follow, too.
The following year, despite needing pain-killing injections in a frozen shoulder, he helped Villa to League Cup glory with a 3-1 final victory over his former club United; two years after that, he was back at Wembley for an emphatic 3-0 victory over Leeds in the 1996 final.
He also won 51 of his 83 Irish caps while at Villa Park and although he had been a key player for United, he undoubtedly played the best football of his career in claret and blue.
He left Villa for Derby County in 1996.
All profiles courtesy of Rob Bishop and Frank Holt's comprehensive book: Aston Villa - The Complete Record.
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WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAATTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT?
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Can't wait to see the top 3!
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3: Ian Olney.
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I dont use this very often but... lolz!
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Mortimer better than Macca then.
Wow
You could make a case for Sid being better, I know I would, but Mortimer better than Macca ? I would say I saw virtually all of Paul McGrath's Villa games and about half of Dennis Mortimers to judge them.
If being fortunate enough to be captain of a trophy winning side makes you a great then I suppose Dixon is coming up, I didn't see him play but that side seemed to flirt with relegation a lot in that era unlike McGrath's era.
My 'who I've seen in the flesh' top 5 would be:
1.Sid
2.Little
3.McGrath
4.Platt
5.Yorke
My Favourite Player Top 5 would be:
1. Andy Gray
2.Dean Saunders
3.Rambo
4. Gabby (I dunno why, derby goals, man u away, goals in big games, I suppose)
5. Gary Shaw
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Mad-men.
One of the greatest centre halves to play the game of football. 4th in our all time list.
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I'm sorry, but as I remember God was fucking brilliant from the moment he walked through the door.
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McGrath is number one by a mile. It is not even close. He could have played for Milan at the time he was that good. Name one Villa player who could have got into a World 11 at anytime. Very Good as some of them were, none on this list were as good as he. Then again the list is wrong - Little at 20-odd. Must be Dixon, Mortimer and Cowans as the Top 3.
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In an era when the criteria for being Player of the Year is playing for Man u or in London, Macca won it. Mortimer* or Dixon* never even played for their country.
*not slagging em I know they're legends in their own right
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Wow, we've had three better post-war players than Paul McGrath?
-
JESUS WEPT.
Oh well, at least they put him above Trevor Ford.
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I'd assume McGrath will be number 1 (unless he's been already).
He's certainly my favourite player, not just because he was unbelievable, but because he was far from perfect. Much like Botham, I think we quite like our heroes in this country to be a little mad.
There's hope for Stephen Ireland then.
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Mortimer better than Macca then.
Wow
You could make a case for Sid being better, I know I would, but Mortimer better than Macca ? I would say I saw virtually all of Paul McGrath's Villa games and about half of Dennis Mortimers to judge them.
If being fortunate enough to be captain of a trophy winning side makes you a great then I suppose Dixon is coming up, I didn't see him play but that side seemed to flirt with relegation a lot in that era unlike McGrath's era.
My 'who I've seen in the flesh' top 5 would be:
1.Sid
2.Little
3.McGrath
4.Platt
5.Yorke
My Favourite Player Top 5 would be:
1. Andy Gray
2.Dean Saunders
3.Rambo
4. Gabby (I dunno why, derby goals, man u away, goals in big games, I suppose)
5. Gary Shaw
mine would be
1. Sid
2. Little
3. Eddie
4. Large
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Who ever compiled this list is smoking some grade a shit.
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That would be the work experience student doing the photocopying and drawing names out of a snood.
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the top 3 must be all players before 1958. I aint seen any player in Claret and blue as good as God. Sid was damn close, but by God that man was good
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I love the reaction I get when people ask me the best player I've ever seen (ever, not just Villa).
Answer is always McGrath. If I see better in my lifetime then I'll be lucky.
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3: Johnny Dixon (http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2399588,00.html)
Villa's Fab 50
3: Johnny Dixon
Career: 1944-1961
Appearances: 430
Goals: 144
The biggest tragedy of Johnny Dixon's later life was that he couldn't remember his greatest triumph.
Dixon suffered from Alzheimer's disease before his death in January 2009 at the age of 85, and had no recollection of the glorious day at Wembley half a century earlier when he proudly held the FA Cup aloft at Wembley.
Thankfully, the occasion will always be cherished by Villa folk.
Although it was the club's seventh Cup triumph, it was their first at Wembley - and their last of the 20th century.
A few years before his death, the popular Geordie described just how much it meant to him, describing how he was almost in tears a few minutes before the final whistle when he imagined the feeling of being presented with the trophy.
"It was fantastic when I went up to collect the Cup," he said. "The Queen handed me the Cup and I turned away from her to hold it up. To do something like that just once in a lifetime is tremendous and I will always be grateful for that."
Dixon's Villa career had begun a decade earlier when he wrote for a trial because he liked the club's name.
He arrived during the war, in August 1944, and 20 months later he scored on his debut against Derby County in the Football League (South).
After scoring three goals in five games, he established himself as a regular in the Villa line-up when league football resumed in 1946-47, going on to make an impressive 430 appearances before his retirement in 1961.
He also scored 144 goals, including five during the 1957 Cup run, and was on target in a 4-1 victory over Sheffield Wednesday in his farewell game - on the day Charlie Aitken made his debut.
A classy inside forward, he was Villa's leading scorer on four occasions, including the 1951-52 campaign, when he hit a personal best 28.
Dixon also helped Villa to regain top flight status by winning the Second Division title in 1959-60 after they had been relegated the previous season for only the second time in the club's history. Following his retirement, he coached the club's youngsters for six years.
All profiles courtesy of Rob Bishop and Frank Holt's comprehensive book: Aston Villa - The Complete Record.
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Who ever compiled this list is smoking some grade a shit.
I was just looking through the list on the OS. Gabby better than Platt? I hardly think so.
I met Johnny Dixon outside Wembley in 2000 before the Chelsea final and he signed my shirt. He seem genuinely humbled by the amount of people gathered round him wanting to say hello. Before my time, but a true legend.
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1. McGrath
2. Sid
3. Dixon
4. Mortimer
That is how I'd have the top 4.
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I'm still amazed McGrath wasn't 1.
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Unbelievable. I know these sort of lists throw up a few strange choices, but McGrath is one of the greatest players to have played the game, for anyone. It's actually pissed me off, quite a lot.
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AVFC.co.uk's (strangely assembled) fab 50 leaves in my opinion:
Pong Wearing
Dennis Mortimer
considering he didnt ever train, Paul McGrath has surely got to be the best player to play for Villa.
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Post-war only. Sorry Pongo fans.
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Mortimer and Cowans?
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Must be. Cowans number 1?
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My 'who I've seen in the flesh' top 5 would be:
1.Sid
2.Little
3.McGrath
4.Platt
5.Yorke
McGrath
Platt
Yorke
Staunton
Cowans
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Post-war only. Sorry Pongo fans.
George Cummings made the list.
Surely a 'fab 50' must include the guy who holds the club single season scoring record...
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He was Villa's skipper from 1945 to 1949. He played 237 times for Villa between 1935 and his retirement in 1949.
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I agree, I would do an all-time list. But the list is only post-War. George Cumming was a Villa player from 1935-49 so some of his career was post-War.
EDIT: Legion checked Wkipedia more quickly than me!
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2: Dennis Mortimer (http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2399733,00.html)
Villa's Fab 50
2: Dennis Mortimer
Career: 1975-1985
Appearances: 406
Goals: 36
The image is one which remains etched on the mind of any Villa supporter, even those too young to remember it.
Dennis Mortimer stood proudly at the Feyenoord Stadium in Rotterdam on the night of May 26 1982, holding aloft the European Cup, football's most prestigious club trophy.
Mortimer was captain of the team which achieved a feat that even the most ardent Villa supporter could not have envisaged.
He was also skipper of the side who, 12 months earlier, had become Football League champions for the first time since 1910.
Those achievements alone make him one of the greatest players in Villa history, although he served the club for rather longer than two glorious seasons, having made more than 400 appearances during a decade in claret and blue.
Signed from Coventry City for £175,000 on Christmas Eve 1975, the forceful midfield made an immediate impact on his debut against West Ham on Boxing Day, helping Villa to a 4-1 victory over West Ham.
Over the course of the following two seasons, the midfielder played more than 100 games, and was a member of the Villa team who beat Everton in the marathon League Cup final of 1977.
And although Jimmy Rimmer and Peter Withe were older, Morty was also the father figure of the team who were crowned champions and European Cup winners in consecutive seasons at the dawn of the 1980s.
He was the longest-serving member of that all-conquering team and was the undisputed driving force, making great demands on himself and his colleagues as well as producing powerful runs which struck fear into the hearts of opposition defences.
Surprisingly, he never played for the full England team, having to settle for youth, U23 and B caps.
Mortimer left Villa to join Brighton in 1985 and by the time he retired two years later he had amassed more than 700 appearances for his various clubs.
All profiles courtesy of Rob Bishop and Frank Holt's comprehensive book: Aston Villa - The Complete Record.
Cowans at Number 1?
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Surely Syd n.1.
But what I can't understand is that players like Ford and Dixon are in the top five and Billy Walker, Hampton and Pongo Waring are out of the top 50, whereas reading every historical book you realize that they would have deserved the top five.
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It's because it is post-war only.
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Aaaah, now I have understood. Thank you mate....
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1. Cowans
2. McGrath
3. Little
4. Yorke
5. Platt
6. Gray
7. Rimmer
8. Gidman
9. Withe
10.Shaw
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Is Mark Walters on the list?
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No.
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Was Gareth Barry on the list?
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No Mark Walters? I'm disappointed.
Think Gareth B was in there a few numbers ago.
It just confirms my suspicion that the list is being put together by somebody under 21 - like a work experience lad or girl let loose on the office computer.
I'm used to visiting work experience students, but one lad still sticks in my memory.
He managed to wipe all of the databases off the computers in a betting shop.
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1: Gordon Cowans (http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2399746,00.html)
Villa's Fab 50
1: Gordon Cowans
Career: 1974-1985, 1988-1991, 1993-1994
Appearances: 527
Goals: 59
Few players throughout Villa's history can match the sheer quality of passing displayed by midfield ace Gordon Cowans.
Over 15 yards or 50, the midfielder's delivery of a football oozed poise and precision, and invariably set a dangerous attack in motion.
Indeed, David Platt went on record as saying he wouldn't have been the player he was without the immaculate service he received from the man popularly known as Sid.
Gordon Sidney Cowans will also be remembered as Villa's Prodigal Son.
He left the club three times - and on each occasion he returned, latterly as a youth coach and then first team coach.
He was always destined to wear claret and blue, having been on schoolboy forms at Villa Park from the age of 12, which probably explains why he was always tempted back.
On leaving school, he graduated through Villa's youth and reserve teams before being handed his first taste of senior football in 1976, when he went on as a substitute against Manchester City at Maine Road.
By the end of the following season he was a first team regular as well as winning a League Cup medal following a dramatic victory over Everton in the second replay of a marathon 1977 final.
Between 1979 and 1983, he didn't miss a single match as he became an integral figure in the most successful period of the club's history, adding league championship, European Cup and European Super Cup medals to his collection.
His long unbroken appearance run came to an end when he broke his leg in a pre-season friendly, causing him to miss the whole of the 1983-84 campaign.
In 1985 he joined Italian club Bari, but was brought back to Villa Park by Graham Taylor three years later.
Once again, he excelled, helping Villa to finish runners-up to Liverpool in 1990.
Later that year Taylor, having been appointed England manager, handed Cowans his 10th and final cap, but in 1991 the midfield man was sold to Blackburn Rovers.
In 1993 he returned for a third spell before joining Derby County.
He is now first team coach to Alex McLeish, having come into the fold under previous manager Gerard Houllier.
All profiles courtesy of Rob Bishop and Frank Holt's comprehensive book: Aston Villa - The Complete Record.
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It's all in the name:-)
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Not only the greatest passer of a ball ever to where the Villa shirt, he was probably the greatest tackler too. A true Villa legend.