Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Match Threads & Player Ratings => Topic started by: Legion on April 01, 2011, 07:47:15 PM
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Available Saturday evening.
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This match has got draw written all over it!
The chances of us keeping a clean sheet are slim to none so that rules out a 1-0 victory. I can see us getting a penalty and them scoring a late equalizer.
2-2
Predictable result! On balance a point is all we deserved. Why no subs used in the last 10 for me GH has to go he is tactically inept.
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Fair result, but can't help but think it's 2 points dropped as opposed to 1 point gained.
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Expected a bottom-smacking, so I'm happy with a point. Will it be enough, though?
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A point, but we NEEDED 3, just to lift us up the league a little, it's so tight down the bottom
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Did well to come back in second half, could be a vital point.
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We are too good to go down. No way we should be where we are and I thought we were worth the three points today. Here's hoping it's enough. Sickened by the baggies and the others.
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Would have taken a point before kick off. From sounds of it we benefitted from a dubious decision and suffered from another. Good to say Bent in scoring form but defence as porous as ever. At least we've shown a bit of fight today.
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Under normal circumstances a point would be good but we need wins. Surprised Emile was not brought on earlier. Christ that 90 mins has cost me another 2 years of my life..
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I thought we'd lose. So I'm happy. However, we can't hang on to a lead for erm... toffee.
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Only two points dropped due to the referee not having the courage of his convictions though.
Everton were missing a lot of players but they're in good form and had home advantage. They missed a couple of sitters too.
Not a bad result in the scheme of things, but we're going to have to play better in the run-in.
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We have to beat Newcastle now.
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Can we for once talk about the game not the manager, Walker made a lot of mistakes today Cuellar should replace him, not a penalty but we were lucky overall, superb finishing by Bent.
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Two sloppy goals to concede, but we could have conceded more so I'll take it. Not the calmest display we'll ever see but more bottle and mental fortitude to come back in the second half.
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No idea why he kept the 4-4-2, we should have tightened it up, Makoun is an idiot
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Don't start on Houllier already please for fecks sake. Gets boring.
On balance they had enough chances to take it in open play, but to lose the points on that pen decision is sickening. The results elsewhere are bad for us, must win game next week against Newcastle. The Albion result is a particular piss take. West Ham - 2 pens, Albion - 2 pens. Villa pen against.
Wigan getting a draw - not great.
Anyhow.
Dunne and Collins did ok. Walker was very poor. Bent - brilliant finishing. Downing man of the match - great display. Makoun - would have him off on 60 minutes every week while he gets used to the speed of the game here. Carrying him from then to the end.
Gabby - pretty anonymous, but Newcastle are shit at the back, and the 2 have to start together up top next week.
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We need Arsenal to help us tonight and Fulham tomorrow
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12 West Brom 36
13 Fulham 35
14 Birmingham 34 (-12)
15 Aston Villa 34 (-14)
16 Blackburn 33 (-12)
17 Blackpool 33 (-15)
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18 West Ham 32 (-15)
19 Wolves 32 (-17)
20 Wigan 31 (-22)
Need Arsenal to win tonight and hopefully Fulham don't lose to Blackpool
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Only two points dropped due to the referee not having the courage of his convictions though.
Everton were missing a lot of players but they're in good form and had home advantage. They missed a couple of sitters too.
Not a bad result in the scheme of things, but we're going to have to play better in the run-in.
............and there lies the most frightening thing.
We aren't able to play any better than that.
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We need to win next week, but I think a point at Goodison is a good result overall.
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Draw was fair, think it was less a penalty than the ball being over the line though... Walker was a little off, ashley young was invisible, it was a point away at everton... can't complain.
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Just hope we can limp home to safety at the end of the season.
Then ideally get rid of Le Smirk and his two lickspittles and fuck Collins and Dunne off at the earliest opportunity.
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Two sloppy goals to concede, but we could have conceded more so I'll take it. Not the calmest display we'll ever see but more bottle and mental fortitude to come back in the second half.
Agreed and it will set us up nicely for the Newcastle game.
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Happy with that. Could have been 3 points if not for Makoun's stupidity, might have been 0 if not for the linesman. Some positive signs.
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I'd have taken a point before the game. Then when I saw their line-up I thought nothing but a win for us. Then with all the chances they missed I was physically shaking in extra time so a point will do for me.
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No idea why he kept the 4-4-2, we should have tightened it up, Makoun is an idiot
How is he an idiot? He never even touched Jagielka.
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We need wins and quickly. That point however may prove valuable.
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Only two points dropped due to the referee not having the courage of his convictions though.
Everton were missing a lot of players but they're in good form and had home advantage. They missed a couple of sitters too.
Not a bad result in the scheme of things, but we're going to have to play better in the run-in.
............and there lies the most frightening thing.
We aren't able to play any better than that.
You were in a coma for the Blackburn game, I presume?
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there was a bit more fight in the second half, we kept diving in and giving free kicks away, was looking for Houlier to something at 2-1 but he didnt
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Better than I expected.
We needed to beat Newcastle before this game and a draw has meant that we are heading to that crucial game with a bit less pressure.
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No idea why he kept the 4-4-2, we should have tightened it up, Makoun is an idiot
He's not an idiot, he just can't tackle.
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Everton at home hardly lose, a point more than i expected tbh.
Positives were Bents goal scoring, Downing, Makouns passing.
Not sure Gabby playing a 4-4-2 paid off tbh, especially after we went 2-1 up.Got a bit overrun in midfield, needed an extra bod.
Disappointed we did'nt win after going 2-1 up, but would have taken a point before the start of the game.Was'nt a penalty, but Beckfords shot was prob over the line.
A win next week and I think we'll be safe tbh.
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If we beat Newcastle then it will be a good point but the Noses and the Baggies both winning was not what we wanted.
Some good football today mixed in with some sloppy stuff, much like the rest of the season.
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Good point as I thought we would lose, the other results didn't go our way but the team showed more spirit. The ref was poor but they could have allowed the one off the bar, we have to beat the jawdees next week.
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I got a prediction right for a change. 10 games unbeaten against Everton i think.
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We looked short of confidence, and that's understandable, but the effort was there and that's good to see.
Downing was superb.
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Win next week and we will be OK as I don't think the 3 W's will get to 38 points.
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Makoun made a challenge about a minute before the penalty that he was lucky not to be booked for again. He is a liability with his challenges. He's decent on the ball but he is to tackling what Houllier is to Public Relations
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Take the point and move on.
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A point away at Everton is a good result most weeks, and after the way we have been this season I'm more than happy with it.
It also gives players confidence going into the Newcastle game.
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It was never a pen and it was a really bad decision by the referee. Downing was very very good.
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Win next week and we will be OK as I don't think the 3 W's will get to 38 points.
West Brom already have 36pts
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A draw at Goodison is a decent result.
Downing and Fiedel played really well today,
Walker was a liability all game, he was targeted by them. It was interesting to see the players asking the bench to do something about it.
Haven't seen their chance that may have crossed the line but thought yer man could have been booked for diving just as easily as winning a penalty.
Darren Bent does what is says on his goalscorer tin and thank fuck for that.
Gives us something to build on for when the Geordies come to town, I'm looking foward to it now.
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Probably the weakest team Everton has fielded this season
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Opportunity missed today.
Newcastle now becomes a must win, and we don't do those particularly well.
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I know theres talk of other results not going for us, but it was a good point and we showed the fight thats needed for the last 7 games.
Its about what we do, not those around us. Having said that Wolves, West Ham lost and Wigan got a home point....they are the three teams in the bottom three right now.
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Win next week and we will be OK as I don't think the 3 W's will get to 38 points.
West Brom already have 36pts
West Ham, Wolves, Wigan?
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Win next week and we will be OK as I don't think the 3 W's will get to 38 points.
West Brom already have 36pts
I think they are talking about the other 3 Ws
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Can somebody please help me out with this? The "none goal" was at least a yard offside was it not? I haven't heard any mention of that anywhere and even on the match thread everybody was saying how lucky we got so I am starting to think I've imagined it. Also, the commentator said that Friedel went the wrong way for the pen, didn't it go practically straight through him? Am I going mad or did these events happen this way? (I may actually have got it wrong so there are genuine questions).
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Hard earned draw and we battled well and showed good spirit, again we failed to hold a lead in the closing minutes and that's a worry as was the amount of chances evertons weakened side produced,still a decent point overall and we must look forward to the Newcastle game and get right behind the players.
Downing again looked very positive and bent finished well, the worry is defensively we still look far from solid and it will be a nervewracking finale to the season.
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Can somebody please help me out with this? The "none goal" was at least a yard offside was it not?
No, there was a Villa player on the far side playing him on.
Yo are right about the penalty though.
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Can somebody please help me out with this? The "none goal" was at least a yard offside was it not?
No, there was a Villa player on the far side playing him on.
Ok, thanks, didn't see that. And the pen?
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I'm pretty certain the Olbiyun, B-lose and so on can't maintain any run of form, if that's a consolation.
Wolves have (hopefully) had their little dart and now they've reverted to type, ditto West Ham.
Yes one, possibly two of that lot -or Blackburn/ Blackpool/ Wigan might put together an unbelievable run - but they won't all do it.
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Can somebody please help me out with this? The "none goal" was at least a yard offside was it not? I haven't heard any mention of that anywhere and even on the match thread everybody was saying how lucky we got so I am starting to think I've imagined it. Also, the commentator said that Friedel went the wrong way for the pen, didn't it go practically straight through him? Am I going mad or did these events happen this way? (I may actually have got it wrong so there are genuine questions).
I have just got back and I was listening to the updates on 5 LIVE and the reporter from the game said he thought Beckford was offside
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Holteender, the beckford none goal was onside, I think it was Luke at left back playing him on.
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A good point and I would have definately taken 1 point before the game. Downing was superb. We need to beat Newcastle next week. I am nervous already.
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We have to beat Newcastle now, and by the clinkers suspended from the almighty yet bedraggled ringpiece of Zeus, I think we will.
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Only two points dropped due to the referee not having the courage of his convictions though.
Everton were missing a lot of players but they're in good form and had home advantage. They missed a couple of sitters too.
Not a bad result in the scheme of things, but we're going to have to play better in the run-in.
............and there lies the most frightening thing.
We aren't able to play any better than that.
You were in a coma for the Blackburn game, I presume?
Don't think so no, but you have me thinking ....
I seem to remember how dreadful Blackburn were, was that the same game ?
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I'm pretty certain the Olbiyun, B-lose and so on can't maintain any run of form, if that's a consolation.
Wolves have (hopefully) had their little dart and now they've reverted to type, ditto West Ham.
Yes one, possibly two of that lot -or Blackburn/ Blackpool/ Wigan might put together an unbelievable run - but they won't all do it.
They don't need unbelievable runs, they just need 2 or 3 points more than our run. That's the problem.
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I'm pretty certain the Olbiyun, B-lose and so on can't maintain any run of form, if that's a consolation.
Wolves have (hopefully) had their little dart and now they've reverted to type, ditto West Ham.
Yes one, possibly two of that lot -or Blackburn/ Blackpool/ Wigan might put together an unbelievable run - but they won't all do it.
Problem is though the teams around us manage to win now and again.
A point at Goodison is always respectable but with the players they had out and with our 1st 11 on the pitch AND with a 2-1 lead with 10 mins to go it doesn't seem such a good result.
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I will never understand the doom mongers. At 1 - 0 the chorus of wailing that started up meant I could hardly hear my Spanish commentator for the sound of dummies being spat.
We did OK today - not great - but a point at Goodison is a point at Goodison - many's the team who'd be glad of that. As far as our play is concerned - Gabby tried his heart out as ever - but something's not right with him. We didn't grab hold of the game as we could've done - which was odd as we used a 442.
Mak and Reo got overrun at times I thought and found it hard to hold onto the ball. Maybe if GH had taken Gab off - brought on Pet or Delph to help them and gone 433 we would have had a different result. I thought when we had Young Downing and Bent on the ball in their half they looked rocky.
It is clear to see that our backline is in need of total overhaul. Age, form, and ability are hard hurdles to overcome - next season we'll be a different proposition.
Did anyone else see our last set piece and how Howard simply came out and took the ball from the air. Now that's a goalie commanding his area. Mmm?
However, I thought we came back well - and if we can push on in training this week - maybe I'll get to see Villa play 433 - and knock six past the Geordies.
UTV
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Win next week and we will be OK as I don't think the 3 W's will get to 38 points.
West Brom already have 36pts
ha ha ...the 3 W's in bottom 3 at the moment
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2 pts dropped but fair result, ref evened up.
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Was starting to believe our fortune had changed with the non goal...the non penalty soon put that right...decent point..oh how I wish we could hang to a lead.
Nolan suspended for next week, that's a bit of a result..
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Can somebody please help me out with this? The "none goal" was at least a yard offside was it not?
No, there was a Villa player on the far side playing him on.
Ok, thanks, didn't see that. And the pen?
You are right about the penalty, Friedel went the right way.
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We have to beat Newcastle now, and by the clinkers suspended from the almighty yet bedraggled ringpiece of Zeus, I think we will.
We have to beat *insert team* now is becoming an all too regular assertion and we are running out of games. Sooner, rather than later, we will actually have to do it.
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Win next week and we will be OK as I don't think the 3 W's will get to 38 points.
West Brom already have 36pts
ha ha ...the 3 W's in bottom 3 at the moment
I dont think we can relax untill we get to 42 points
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Were at home next week against mid table nothing to play for Newcastle. Small Heath and the Baggies both away so we can put todays results right. We battled at last bit of good luck bit of bad luck..
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Not happy with Friedel again today
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Been to the game. We just can not keep a clean sheet. Its very reminisant of '87 in as much as we keep letting in what we think are unlucky goals: no they're not we're just shit\panicky at defending, just like then. On the plus side we only had 2 shots, darren Bent aint no stainrod thankfully.I think it will go to the last game or so, I have no idea with this defence if we'll have enough points.
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I still think the three remaining games against Newcastle, Stoke and Wigan at home will decide it - I think we'll get 2 wins out of those games which will put us on 40 points. So scramble a couple of draws from the other games and we'll be safe - that's my prediction. Agree?
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Only two points dropped due to the referee not having the courage of his convictions though.
Everton were missing a lot of players but they're in good form and had home advantage. They missed a couple of sitters too.
Not a bad result in the scheme of things, but we're going to have to play better in the run-in.
............and there lies the most frightening thing.
We aren't able to play any better than that.
You were in a coma for the Blackburn game, I presume?
Don't think so no, but you have me thinking ....
I seem to remember how dreadful Blackburn were, was that the same game ?
Pretty convenient that, that whenever we lose we're shit, and whenever we win the opposition is shit. They were very poor but we were also very good. It can be both.
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Yay! We got a point! I miss us getting points...
The game was alright I guess. Same old really. Lots of posession, pretty football, but lacking the final third. But I have to admit, at HT, I really tought we were going to lose Wolves style. But credit when its due, the team showed character in the 2nd half but it was not enough to get the much needed 3 points. I couldn't stop fidgeting when we were 2 goals up! Reminded me of that Old Trafford win last yr when we were parking the bus and trying to protect that 1 goal lead. I'm telling you, watching Villa is not good for my heart!
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We have to beat Newcastle now, and by the clinkers suspended from the almighty yet bedraggled ringpiece of Zeus, I think we will.
We have to beat *insert team* now is becoming an all too regular assertion and we are running out of games. Sooner, rather than later, we will actually have to do it.
And by the tagnuts of Zeus we shall.
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Not happy with Friedel again today
Good.
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I'd have taken a point before the start of the game. Obviously a win would have been better but a loss would have been really damaging. Good to see Bent earning his wages.
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3 wins from next 5 games will do it...Newcastle, Stoke, Wigan at home and West Ham and Baggies away isn't it (not in that order). need to get winning though pretty quickly. Anything less than a win next week will heap all the pressure on us...
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Not happy with Friedel again today
Never mind, perhaps your boy Beckford will find a more obliging keeper next week.
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Next weeks fixtures involving the other teams around us -
WOLVES v Everton
BLACKBURN v BIRMINGHAM
Bolton v WEST HAM
Chelsea v WIGAN
Man Utd v FULHAM
Sunderland v WEST BROM
BLACKPOOL v ARSENAL
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Yay! We got a point! I miss us getting points...
The game was alright I guess. Same old really. Lots of posession, pretty football, but lacking the final third. But I have to admit, at HT, I really tought we were going to lose Wolves style. But credit when its due, the team showed character in the 2nd half but it was not enough to get the much needed 3 points. I couldn't stop fidgeting when we were 2 goals up! Reminded me of that Old Trafford win last yr when we were parking the bus and trying to protect that 1 goal lead. I'm telling you, watching Villa is not good for my heart!
Agreed. Its all a bit of a white knuckle ride isnt it ?
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Bolton are the team to play now. Nothing in the League and one eye on the semi.
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Not happy with Friedel again today
Would that be the Freidel that made several excellent saves that kept us in the game?
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Re: The 'non goal'.
I hope he was well onside and that it's shown to be over the line. I like the idea that we may have got the biggest slice of luck imaginable and got away with daylight robbery. Further, I hope the point it gained is the difference between being relegated and us ultimately staying up.
We were on the wrong end of a similar incident at Leicester City in April 1970 and we finished up being relegated to the 3rd division. As you can gather I'm still sore about it.
Call it Karma. You can say what goes around comes around.
All I know is that after waiting 41 years, when the managers, players, TV pundits all analyse it from 20 different angles, speed it up, slow it down, use every bit of technology and then get all self righteous and pious I can say "Bollocks to the lot of ya ! Im Villa me and we're staying up ! "
I
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Not happy with Friedel again today
What?
He made three fantastic saves and neither of the goals were his fault.
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I think Wigan are doomed.
It's just a matter of who the other two are.
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3 wins from next 5 games will do it...Newcastle, Stoke, Wigan at home and West Ham and Baggies away isn't it (not in that order). need to get winning though pretty quickly. Anything less than a win next week will heap all the pressure on us...
9 or 10 points from that lot of games should see us ok,if we can't get enough points from those games then we arent good enough for this division,we owe Newcastle as well.
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The match commentator today said of Darren Bent, " he hasn't quite scored the goals for Villa that he did for Sunderland". WTF? How on earth could have scored 32 goals in 9 appearances? Twat. 5 goals in 9 is bloody good return, especially considering where we are in the table. Numpty.
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I'd have taken at point there beforehand most seasons so on balance i'm happy. Not a brilliant performance but at least a bit of spirit there compared to Wolves. Our defence though...jesus its crap.
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This just in from Twitter
KyleWalker28 Kyle Walker
That could be the worst game I have ever played.... The boys got me out the shit today I o u all a performance next weekend! :(
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How did Ashley Young play or does he only bother putting in a shift when wearing an England shirt!!
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Would have taken a point this morning. 23 or 24 points (I think?) dropped from winning positions now. That's the difference between last season and this.
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I think Wigan are doomed.
It's just a matter of who the other two are.
I think Wolves have had it now that Doyle's out for the season. Just one place left available I reckon.
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Not happy with Friedel again today
What?
He made three fantastic saves and neither of the goals were his fault.
Totally disagree I'm afraid. The first would have been saved by a better/younger/more agile keeper. The second was practically straight at him and for the (seemingly) 1,000th time in a row he failed to save a spot kick. Law of averages would suggest that he should have at least saved a couple by now. How he didn't stop that I will never know. Get rid as soon as possible, he makes some good saves occasionally (as he did today TBF) but he is not good enough to play at this level anymore IMO. He has poor command of the area and does not know when to come off his line and when to stay put. The concession of so many goals from corners cannot be ignored.
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I thought it was a good solid performance. We didn't concede from a corner & I thought Dunne, Collins & Friedel looked more solid than they have lately.
Walker was the only one who made me nervous defending, but he's been great so far.
Good performance overall. Didn't think Gabby & Young were involved as much as they should, but let's not forget that Everton have been in a great run of form lately & we matched them.
That's exactly what we bought bent for.
Happy with the point overall.
Before todays game we were 1 point above the bottom 3, now we're 2.
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I think Wigan are doomed.
It's just a matter of who the other two are.
I think Wolves have had it now that Doyle's out for the season. Just one place left available I reckon.
I dont want Wolves to go as I want all the Midlands teams to stay up but if it means that Jarvis is available.........
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How did Ashley Young play or does he only bother putting in a shift when wearing an England shirt!!
I lost the feed for a short time in the second half and I wondered if Ashley Young had been subbed. Hardly seen after touching on the ball for Bent's second.
Why oh why does Houllier not want to play Marc Albrighton? He could have replaced Makoun towards the end and maybe we could have had a repeat of the last minute Young winner two years ago.
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Wonder what THE GENERAL'S war cry for next week will be......
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Like most people, I would have taken a draw this morning. This result looks worse with Blues and Albion winning but there is pressure on Blackpool and Blackburn with their later games.
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Like most people, I would have taken a draw this morning. This result looks worse with Blues and Albion winning but there is pressure on Blackpool and Blackburn with their later games.
At least Wolves & West Ham lost & wigan didn't win.
Come on Le Arse.
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This just in from Twitter
KyleWalker28 Kyle Walker
That could be the worst game I have ever played.... The boys got me out the shit today I o u all a performance next weekend! :(
A reasonable assessment. Fair play to him for holding his hands up.
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Blackburn will lose at Arsenal. I still think we'll be okay. Can see Blackburn, Wigan and Wolves dropping. Why the f*** does Houllier drop Cuellar and Albrighton from the starting line-up? He's just hopeless at selection and tactics!!
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Blackburn will lose at Arsenal. I still think we'll be okay. Can see Blackburn, Wigan and Wolves dropping. Why the f*** does Houllier drop Cuellar and Albrighton from the starting line-up? He's just hopeless at selection and tactics!!
Obviously got it all wrong today, terrible point.
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Not happy with Friedel again today
What?
He made three fantastic saves and neither of the goals were his fault.
Totally disagree I'm afraid. The first would have been saved by a better/younger/more agile keeper. The second was practically straight at him and for the (seemingly) 1,000th time in a row he failed to save a spot kick. Law of averages would suggest that he should have at least saved a couple by now. How he didn't stop that I will never know. Get rid as soon as possible, he makes some good saves occasionally (as he did today TBF) but he is not good enough to play at this level anymore IMO. He has poor command of the area and does not know when to come off his line and when to stay put. The concession of so many goals from corners cannot be ignored.
Just like the younger, more agile Howard got down to save Bent's? However I do agree that a lot of this seasons poor defensive record is down to Friedels inability to control his box, but that wasn't the reason we conceeded two goals today.
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Thought Friedel was superb for much of the game. Maybe could have done better with the first but that is life.
The none penalty was a shocking decision though I have to say. The line over/ not was really really tight. Albion and West Ham were given 2 pens in the same game today. Madness. Things are going against us big time.
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Good to see Bents goals haven't dried up.
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JPA is tweeting about the game too!
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Re: The 'non goal'.
I hope he was well onside and that it's shown to be over the line. I like the idea that we may have got the biggest slice of luck imaginable and got away with daylight robbery. Further, I hope the point it gained is the difference between being relegated and us ultimately staying up.
We were on the wrong end of a similar incident at Leicester City in April 1970 and we finished up being relegated to the 3rd division. As you can gather I'm still sore about it.
Call it Karma. You can say what goes around comes around.
All I know is that after waiting 41 years, when the managers, players, TV pundits all analyse it from 20 different angles, speed it up, slow it down, use every bit of technology and then get all self righteous and pious I can say "Bollocks to the lot of ya ! Im Villa me and we're staying up ! "
Yes I remember it, wasn't it a Pat MacMahon blaster that hit the goal stanchion?
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This just in from Twitter
KyleWalker28 Kyle Walker
That could be the worst game I have ever played.... The boys got me out the shit today I o u all a performance next weekend! :(
A footballer swearing in public. Controversial. Seriously though, comes across very well in the interviews I've seen on avtv. He even did co-punditry with Marky Marc for the youth team's FA Cup semi-final suggesting he already has an afinity with the place.
I wonder, like Glen Johnson, would he be better deployed as a winger/wide midfielder than full-back. Both seem to be better going forward, wing-back would probably suit them best. Born a bit too late for the 3-5-2 craze.
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How did Ashley Young play or does he only bother putting in a shift when wearing an England shirt!!
Is the correct answer
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Decent game, that. Thought we looked decent most of the time (well, not so much Walker, of course...) and could have won it really, especially given that the two we conceded were pretty soft.
Downing in particular was very good, and I thought Luke Young had a good game too.
Darren Bent did what Darren Bent does. God bless him.
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Blackburn will lose at Arsenal. I still think we'll be okay. Can see Blackburn, Wigan and Wolves dropping. Why the f*** does Houllier drop Cuellar and Albrighton from the starting line-up? He's just hopeless at selection and tactics!!
Obviously got it all wrong today, terrible point.
Even more terrible was the fact we lost two points, mainly due to the officials' ineptitude in not spotting a blatant dive by Jagielka but also to the lack of fresh legs towards the end. Stewart Downing was causing havoc but also did more than his fair share of defending covering Walker who looked unfit. The addition of Albrighton to run at a tiring Everton defence may have provided another goal and even prevented Jagielka getting that far up the pitch to dive in the area.
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Agree we need a keeper who can command the 18
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This just in from Twitter
KyleWalker28 Kyle Walker
That could be the worst game I have ever played.... The boys got me out the shit today I o u all a performance next weekend! :(
Disarming honesty. Preferable to saying he performed like a pub player.
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BRMB Wowing about the phenomonal away support.Well done to all concerned including my other half.Also mentioned the Bring A Scarf campaign.We,the fans will get us through this I'm sure
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Downing was exceptional today as was Bent
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Friedel has been a super goal keeper - anyone who nay says that hasn't got all their teeth and probably has 'bosko' tattooed on their neck.
But his strength has always been as a net minder - staying on his line - getting his angles right - and forcing the striker to beat him. For this to work he needs good defenders in front of him - if they lose their form and fitness - he is exposed. Hence - we are the league's worst at defending aerial attacks.
No point in moaning now - let's get this awful season over with first - then get a whole new back line.
Too many people like pointing the finger IMHO - it's a team sport - can we stop looking for someone to blame? - and look forward to roaring the lads on against Newcastle next week.
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Not happy with Friedel again today
What?
He made three fantastic saves and neither of the goals were his fault.
Totally disagree I'm afraid. The first would have been saved by a better/younger/more agile keeper. The second was practically straight at him and for the (seemingly) 1,000th time in a row he failed to save a spot kick. Law of averages would suggest that he should have at least saved a couple by now. How he didn't stop that I will never know. Get rid as soon as possible, he makes some good saves occasionally (as he did today TBF) but he is not good enough to play at this level anymore IMO. He has poor command of the area and does not know when to come off his line and when to stay put. The concession of so many goals from corners cannot be ignored.
Just like the younger, more agile Howard got down to save Bent's?
Bent's goal was hit with pace and from a slightly different angle from what I remember. There is no doubt in my mind that Friedel should have saved both goals. He normally gets nowhere near penalties and the fact that it was so close to him for once and he still didn't save it has pissed me off more. He did make a couple of good stops during the game so I won't be too hard on him but that doesn't change my view on the 2 he didn't save.
Imagine if we'd scored our last pen (at Bolton for a 3-1 lead) and saved this one today. We'd have 5 more points at least as we would've been a different team against Wolves had we won at Bolton.
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This just in from Twitter
KyleWalker28 Kyle Walker
That could be the worst game I have ever played.... The boys got me out the shit today I o u all a performance next weekend! :(
Disarming honesty. Preferable to saying he performed like a pub player.
Aye. bet the last player to say that didn't realise he'd actually end up one
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Can I just say a few words about Bent's superb goals today.
They were superb.
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Downing was superb, as was Bent after his couldn't be arsed performance against Wolves.
Midfield a tad shaky, defence a pile of shit as usual.
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Some utter tw@t has just rang 606 on 5 live as a Villa fan to talk about Rooney!! The presenter said "I'd have thought you'd be more concerned with events at Goodison rather than Wayne Rooney", the "Villa fan" responded "well a points a point but anyway, I wanna talk about Rooney. WTF?
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Some utter tw@t has just rang 606 on 5 live as a Villa fan to talk about Rooney!! The presenter said "I'd have thought you'd be more concerned with events at Goodison rather than Wayne Rooney", the "Villa fan" responded "well a points a point but anyway, I wanna talk about Rooney. WTF?
Sounds like the Father and son who used to sit next to me in the Upper Trinity.
Always left 15-20 minutes early and never shut up talking about Rooney, Lampard and Gerrard.
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I'm pretty certain the Olbiyun, B-lose and so on can't maintain any run of form, if that's a consolation.
Wolves have (hopefully) had their little dart and now they've reverted to type, ditto West Ham.
Yes one, possibly two of that lot -or Blackburn/ Blackpool/ Wigan might put together an unbelievable run - but they won't all do it.
They don't need unbelievable runs, they just need 2 or 3 points more than our run. That's the problem.
To qualify that: If we need to win a minimum of 2 games between now and the end of the season, they need to win 3, possibly 4. Effectively almost half of their remaining games. Some of those sides only have 6/7 wins on the board all season. To expect them to manage half of that again in their remaining games would be outstanding - for them.
We're well and truly in the shit, I don't think anyone would seriously argue against that. But we have to believe we have enough quality to get the two wins we need facing the likes of Newcastle, Stoke and Wigan at home (Olbiyun, West Ham away) whilst at the same time other sides around us don't turn in the kind of form that would be more in keeping with a side challenging for Europe, or higher. I don't think either of those scenarios are flights of fantasy.
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That effort from Beckford on the crossbar that was offside eh? And penalty wasn't one i think.. Guess its ok to get a point eh?
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Sorry, I know it equates to being a traitorous dog on here, but I still think we're down.
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You treacherous, pusillanimous, vile cur.
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nah. it will be close but we'll survive
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If we lose to Newcastle Fletch, I might start flirting with the idea myself.
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You treacherous, pusillanimous, vile cur.
I shouldn't have opened my mouth.
It's akin to wiping my cock on the statue of McGregor.
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For us to even be facing the scenario this far into the season is little short of disgraceful.
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If we lose to Newcastle Fletch, I might start flirting with the idea myself.
Thing is Kevin, Newcastle only have that galloping donkey Ameobi as their only recognised striker (I won't count Loverpants) yet they still managed to put 3 past Wolves, the team that beat us with ease.
Maybe we should paraphrase that old song
'If Dunne and Collins can play for Villa, so can I.'
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I'd probably have taken a point before the game, but another two goals conceded, deary me. I think we'll probably just about be OK as there are three other teams worse than us, but it's going to be squeaky bum time all the way to the last game I reckon.
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They won 4-1.
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wolves was more to do with what was going on off the pitch than on it. we would have lost to a conference side that day.
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They won 4-1.
Crikey, yes.
It's going to be very, very tough.
Another team that are better than us.
Please, please, please Le smirky twat, get Cuellar back in.
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wolves was more to do with what was going on off the pitch than on it. we would have lost to a conference side that day.
And what has changed 'off the pitch' since then?
We still can't defend for shit.
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It would be nice if we had a few teams deliver the same gutless display as Blackburn did a few weeks back (the same we've managed a fair few times ourselves this season, truth be told) to absolutely make sure, but I reckon we'll be OK regardless.
I don't care how we do it, whether the opposition just turn up and go through the motions or not, so long as we get the points on the board.
I could see us doing something really stupid like losing at home to Wigan, so hopefully Newcastle or Stoke -with little to play for themselves, oblige. We could possibly even afford to draw one of them if we get a good result away at West Ham or the Olbiyun.
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Somebody call a tumbril for fletcher
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Somebody call a tumbril for fletcher
Had to look that up to see what it meant, you educated tnuc.
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well hopefully some of the gits in the squad have started to realise they won't exactly benefit from relegation if they continue stirring it. I agree the defence is shit but i still think ability wise we're better than at least 3 of the other relegation candidates
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Like Mark I'm still worried.
Three points next week might stop that.
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Sorry, I know it equates to being a traitorous dog on here, but I still think we're down.
You disgust me.
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I think it's more a 'cry for help' thing
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Sorry, I know it equates to being a traitorous dog on here, but I still think we're down.
You disgust me.
Me too, he should be relegated for it, to wipethatsnot.com.
RIP Rip.
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well hopefully some of the gits in the squad have started to realise they won't exactly benefit from relegation if they continue stirring it. I agree the defence is shit but i still think ability wise we're better than at least 3 of the other relegation candidates
I get sick to the back teeth of the media continuously telling us how fantastic our players are and how we're in a false position.
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Sorry, I know it equates to being a traitorous dog on here, but I still think we're down.
You disgust me.
So do I, especially post wank, when I catch a glimpse of myself in the bathroom mirror.
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Three points next week might stop that.
Agree.
A comfortable win and things might look a lot different.
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We are 2 points above the drop zone now, it was 1 this morning. If we go down from this position we deserve to . We might not like it but that's the fact.
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If Blackburn hold on, we've dropped 2 places.
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If Blackburn hold on, we've dropped 2 places.
If can hold on for a clean sheet with 10 men why can't we with 11.
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Blackburn will lose at Arsenal. I still think we'll be okay. Can see Blackburn, Wigan and Wolves dropping. Why the f*** does Houllier drop Cuellar and Albrighton from the starting line-up? He's just hopeless at selection and tactics!!
Hmmmm....
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If Blackburn hold on, we've dropped 2 places.
If can hold on for a clean sheet with 10 men why can't we with 11.
Can you imagine us going to the Emirates (or fucking anywhere) and keeping a clean sheet?
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I wouldn't be at all surprised if Blackpool get 3 points at Fulham.
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We are in it until the last game because we are incapable of keeping a clean sheet.
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If Blackburn hold on, we've dropped 2 places.
If can hold on for a clean sheet with 10 men why can't we with 11.
Can you imagine us going to the Emirates (or fucking anywhere) and keeping a clean sheet?
No!
A point away at Everton has to be seen as a positive but we really could have done without the Blose/Olbiyun/Blackburn results to be honest...
Still very worried about relegation but pleased with the effort shown today
Up The Villa
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Efforts all very well Pinchy, but it's 3 points we need.
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Efforts all very well Pinchy, but it's 3 points we need.
Agreed, will keep my pincers crossed it comes next Saturday...
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Wonder what THE GENERAL'S war cry for next week will be......
Something like.....
Keep the faith, all the troops can play a part in this and your club KNOWS WHAT NEEDS TO BE DONE, Randy and the playing staff are working night and day to get things right, WE KNOW WHAT NEEDS TO BE DONE, believe me, we feel a defeat just as much as you do, but we will get it right as WE KNOW WHAT NEEDS TO BE DONE. It was never going to be easy but Randy is in it for the long haul and it upsets me when his integrity is called into question, because HE KNOWS WHAT NEEDS TO BE DONE. An army marches on it's stomach and our stomach is strong and we've been well fed, we'll get it right just as long as we all pull together.
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I'd pinch them Sunday as well if I were you.
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If Blackburn hold on, we've dropped 2 places.
If can hold on for a clean sheet with 10 men why can't we with 11.
Can you imagine us going to the Emirates (or fucking anywhere) and keeping a clean sheet?
To be fair Arsenal bottled it. As they do everytime they have a chance of winning anything. They can play the best football in the land when they want to but Man Utd have the winning mentality and this Arsenal side have always struggled with it. I still fancy Blackburn to go down, Arsenal were probably one of the best sides in the league they could have played at the moment
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A point is a point. Could be the point that keeps us up. See my point?
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I'd pinch them Sunday as well if I were you.
Good point! Will keep them pinched from 3pm Saturday until 6pm Sunday in the vain hope we win and all our 'rivals' get stuffed!
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A lot of people seem to forget that we've also got Liverpool at home yet too. That one is as winnable as the other 3 home games are.
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A lot of people seem to forget that we've also got Liverpool at home yet too. That one is as winnable as the other 3 home games are.
and as loseable
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A lot of people seem to forget that we've also got Liverpool at home yet too. That one is as winnable as the other 3 home games are.
and as loseable
(http://www.mspmentor.net/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/glass-half-full.jpg)
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If we're relying on the last game of the season then I'm siding with Mark.
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They was huge booing at the end of the game. Was it comng from the Villa or Everton fans?
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Do i not like the thought of having to rely on pts vs Arsenal & Lpool
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A lot of people seem to forget that we've also got Liverpool at home yet too. That one is as winnable as the other 3 home games are.
and as loseable
(http://www.mspmentor.net/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/glass-half-full.jpg)
While we have a defence that you could drive a Libyan tank convoy through, our glass will always be half full.
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Do i not like the thought of having to rely on pts vs Arsenal & Lpool
Wasn't your old signature in your former life something similar to that, highlighting Sir Graham's time as England boss?
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I think we will be ok although today made me hate West Brom like Saddam Hussein hates Americans. I never liked them anyway but today took the biscuit. Horrible, fucking, window licking, arse munching, ball polishing, car washing, monkey felching, backwards, fucking bunch of anti Villa, inbred, shitty, Tesco carrier Sandwell branch, incapable of talking, boinging, tossy, Zeberdee, fucking ******.
Have I missed owt? Oh yes, Jeff Astle, Frank Skinner and that cunty, arsehole Chiles. I hate the fucking lot of you.
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A win against Newcastle and then a point at West Ham will probably see us safe, however we ideally need another 9 points to guarantee it. I think we'll beat both Stoke and Wigan too.
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I think we will be ok although today made me hate West Brom like Saddam Hussein hates Americans. I never liked them anyway but today took the biscuit. Horrible, fucking, window licking, arse munching, ball polishing, car washing, monkey felching, backwards, fucking bunch of anti Villa, inbred, shitty, Tesco carrier Sandwell branch, incapable of talking, boinging, tossy, Zeberdee, fucking c***s.
Have I missed owt? Oh yes, Jeff Astle, Frank Skinner and that cunty, arsehole Chiles. I hate the fucking lot of you.
Tsk tsk.
We're all fans together, don't you know.
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A lot of argy bargy in the away end in the second half. I think a Villa fan had thrown a coin and an Everton hard returned it and then the stewards and police moved in, but nobody was going very quietly.
They're easily the worst supporters in the league. No songs, just constant whinging and moaning.
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A win against Newcastle and then a point at West Ham will probably see us safe, however we ideally need another 9 points to guarantee it. I think we'll beat both Stoke and Wigan too.
I honestly can't see us beating Stoke.
I really can't see our back 4 repelling their aerial onslaught.
As for Wigan, I could see N'Zogbia running us ragged.
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A win against Newcastle and then a point at West Ham will probably see us safe, however we ideally need another 9 points to guarantee it. I think we'll beat both Stoke and Wigan too.
I honestly can't see us beating Stoke.
I really can't see our back 4 repelling their aerial onslaught.
As for Wigan, I could see N'Zogbia running us ragged.
You are badly in need of the old one game at a time approach.
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the last 7 games won 1 drawn 3 lost 3 = 6 points
anny one think that form will keep us up
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I disagree. I think they're both poor sides and I think we'll beat both of them.
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I disagree. I think they're both poor sides and I think we'll beat both of them.
They were unlucky not to beat Chelski.
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And so were we. Twice.
Back to the game, I thought Friedel has once agian cost us. Wanted shooting for that first.
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I disagree. I think they're both poor sides and I think we'll beat both of them.
like all thse other poor sides we keep beating
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Back to the game, I thought Friedel has once agian cost us. Wanted shooting for that first.
I think he's got to go at the end of the season.
Yet another of our positions that needs sorting.
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Also, Jagielka wants banning for the rest of the season the cheating bastard.
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I disagree. I think they're both poor sides and I think we'll beat both of them.
like all thse other poor sides we keep beating
Whether we beat them or not is down to us. The fact is Stoke are a poor side and Wigan are shite.
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The fact that Smethwick are two points above us with all the quality players we have in the squad at this stage of the season says all you need to know about this season and the current manager.
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Here's how I experienced the match.
Saw the weather was lovely, so decided to take the hint and go out for the day, avoiding all thoughts of football. Went to Stow on the Wold. Soon after arrival, bottled it, and had quick peak at West Ham score, they were winning 2-0. Felt a churning sensation in the pit of my stomach. Decided not to look again.
After a while, decided to go to Bourton on the Water. Went wrong way, ended up in Broadway. Bought some nice chutneys, and some strange dandelion and burdock sweets. Weather was still lovely. Mood was excellent, despite presence of lots of Japanese tourists and local Range Rover driving, fox hunting, Tory voting idiots.
At that point, bottled it again, and switched Footmob (football alerts thing) on on my phone. Shortly after, whilst driving between Broadway and Stratford, feel phone buzz to tell me there's been a goal in the match. Ignore it. Drive on. Phone buzzes again. Two goals now. Ignore it.
Then I bottled it, and turned radio on at the precise minute the kerfuffle over the goal that wasn't was ruled out, only to hear "oh, and Villa have gone up the other end and scored! They lead 2-1". At this point I punched the air, shouted at the Mrs to change the radio to another station and decide to just ignore the rest of the match.
Then, a while after, my phone buzzed again, and, having mentally calculated that it was between 80 and 90 minutes, I didn't need to check who had scored. I just KNEW. This season in a nutshell.
I have no idea how well we played, but I'd have snapped your hand off for a point this morning. But then I see Blackburn getting a point at Arsenal, Wigan getting a point at Spurs, Blues and Albion getting three points, and there we are, 16th position and two points off the drop zone.
When you get a decent result, but very nearly everything else goes against you, maybe things are destined to end badly. Despite having got more than i expected from Goodison Park, this evening I am far more pessimistic about our prospects than I was last night, and have gone from thinking relegation is a strong possibility to thinking it will actually happen.
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I disagree. I think they're both poor sides and I think we'll beat both of them.
like all thse other poor sides we keep beating
Whether we beat them or not is down to us. The fact is Stoke are a poor side and Wigan are shite.
I agree that Wigan are piss poor, but Stoke have proved to be a better team than us this season.
The media keep saying how good our team are 'on paper' but it's utterly meaningless.
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I disagree. I think they're both poor sides and I think we'll beat both of them.
like all thse other poor sides we keep beating
Whether we beat them or not is down to us. The fact is Stoke are a poor side and Wigan are shite.
I have been hearing all season about the next winnable games and its like a bad tune stuck on a loop and the tape is running out, and we are down to the last 7 and we have won one of the last 7
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I disagree. I think they're both poor sides and I think we'll beat both of them.
like all thse other poor sides we keep beating
Whether we beat them or not is down to us. The fact is Stoke are a poor side and Wigan are shite.
I have been hearing all season about the next winnable games and its like a bad tune stuck on a loop and the tape is running out, and we are down to the last 7 and we have won one of the last 7
Quite.
Newcastle have a striker crisis but still managed to dispatch Wolves 4-1.
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I disagree. I think they're both poor sides and I think we'll beat both of them.
like all thse other poor sides we keep beating
Whether we beat them or not is down to us. The fact is Stoke are a poor side and Wigan are shite.
I have been hearing all season about the next winnable games and its like a bad tune stuck on a loop and the tape is running out, and we are down to the last 7 and we have won one of the last 7
Yep, at the start of the year it was "we've had our run of tough matches, we're now at the start of a run of winnable matches". Except we won next to none of them.
And here we are again, just seven matches left, and I wonder how many of this new "winnable run' we'll win. Not many, I suspect.
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Enough.
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Paulie next time try the snowshill arms-snowshill
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Fletch, I know what will cheer you up. I've got an AA gun mounted on the back of my pickup. Let's go out into the desert and hose a few hundred rounds into the sky
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Fletch, I know what will cheer you up. I've got an AA gun mounted on the back of my pickup. Let's go out into the desert and hose a few hundred rounds into the sky
How's your party going?
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So that means Stoke are Argentina and Wigan are Brazil?
No. They're both shite and we have a much better chance of beating them than the sides at the top. As I said, whether we beat them is down to us. How we got on against Blackburn and Bolton doesn't mean a thing for those games, so yes, our recent results have been poor, with performances up and down.
Today was a good point, probably should have been all three but for Jagielka being a diving ******, but there you go. I fully expect us to beat Newcastle, get a point at West Ham and then beat the Albion and Wigan. You don’t. So we’ll wait and see.
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My view is that if we do not win our next game we will go down.
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They was huge booing at the end of the game. Was it comng from the Villa or Everton fans?
Certainly not from our fans. Our support was excellent and the team deserved it
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My view is that if we do not win our next game we will go down.
I think (hope?) we'll win it.
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My view is that if we do not win our next game we will go down.
No we will not. We need no more than 4 points from the remaining 7 games and we will get them. This theory about 42 points this year is bunk. Teams relegated will accumulate less than 38 points.
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They was huge booing at the end of the game. Was it comng from the Villa or Everton fans?
Certainly not from our fans. Our support was excellent and the team deserved it
I didn't hear any booing either, and Frank is right about our support, we really got behind the team and they played pretty well in the most part (except Walker, I'm sure his performance was a one off).
Maybe there was a bit of booing of the referee?
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Kyle Walker has already accepted that he was awful this afternoon. See a Twitter feed somewhere.
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They was huge booing at the end of the game. Was it comng from the Villa or Everton fans?
Certainly not from our fans. Our support was excellent and the team deserved it
It was the Everton fans booing Ashley Young.
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My view is that if we do not win our next game we will go down.
No we will not. We need no more than 4 points from the remaining 7 games and we will get them. This theory about 42 points this year is bunk. Teams relegated will accumulate less than 38 points.
my worry is that there is going to be a big show with scarves and banners, the bells are ringing is going to be played, can you imagine the reaction if we get turned over, i take your point about the points tally i think 39 or 40 points will be safe
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My view is that if we do not win our next game we will go down.
No we will not. We need no more than 4 points from the remaining 7 games and we will get them. This theory about 42 points this year is bunk. Teams relegated will accumulate less than 38 points.
Why do you think it is bunk? I think the notion that we only need 4 more points is unlikely to be true.
The current bottom 3 already have 95 points between them, that's more than you would expect the bottom 3 to have at the end of a typical season, let alone with 7 games to play.
I'm not even confident that 42 points will be enough.
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thing is Villadawg, all the bottom teams have lots of games against each other, so the points will get shared out, 42 points will definately be enough, 2 wins should see us safe
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Re: The 'non goal'.
I hope he was well onside and that it's shown to be over the line. I like the idea that we may have got the biggest slice of luck imaginable and got away with daylight robbery. Further, I hope the point it gained is the difference between being relegated and us ultimately staying up.
We were on the wrong end of a similar incident at Leicester City in April 1970 and we finished up being relegated to the 3rd division. As you can gather I'm still sore about it.
Call it Karma. You can say what goes around comes around.
All I know is that after waiting 41 years, when the managers, players, TV pundits all analyse it from 20 different angles, speed it up, slow it down, use every bit of technology and then get all self righteous and pious I can say "Bollocks to the lot of ya ! Im Villa me and we're staying up ! "
Bloody Hell that game takes me back
I was a kid (6) and my dad took me to all games home and away
The ball hit the back metal loop for the nets and bounced out
We were right behind it
The old man still moans about it today..................
Great days though..............
I
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I'm pleased as we did better then I thought we would have...
Celebrating a draw with Everton reserves...Whoopi do!
Well done Ged! Now do fuck off.
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My view is that if we do not win our next game we will go down.
No we will not. We need no more than 4 points from the remaining 7 games and we will get them. This theory about 42 points this year is bunk. Teams relegated will accumulate less than 38 points.
We need at least 6 points I reckon, especially after the results today. Good point today in my opinion - didn't see it but sounded like Everton missed a few decent chances.
I feared a heavy defeat today, especially after all the bad press - sounds like all the mutiny stuff is a load of bollocks. We'll do the Geordies - keep the faith.
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I'm pleased as we did better then I thought we would have...
Celebrating a draw with Everton reserves...Whoopi do!
Well done Ged! Now do fuck off.
After all the shit in the press this week,this was a a good result.The most important thing is we showed spirit and some fight, so we need to keep positive going into the next match.It's all about survival now I couldn't have cared if it was the under 11's we drew with today a points a point
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Think we still need 6-8 points to be safe. Play like we did today and we should get them.
Well done RAF!!
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Think we still need 6-8 points to be safe. Play like we did today and we should get them.
Well done RAF!!
I agree, but quite what the no-fly zone above Libya has to do with it I don't know.
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thing is Villadawg, all the bottom teams have lots of games against each other, so the points will get shared out, 42 points will definately be enough, 2 wins should see us safe
I hope you're right but I doubt it. I would not have expected Blues, Baggies, Wigan, Wolves and West Ham to all take more points than we have from the last 6 games - our "easy run" games.
We're in this relegation battle to the death now, there's very little prospect of us being in the clear before the Arsenal game.
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My view is that if we do not win our next game we will go down.
No we will not. We need no more than 4 points from the remaining 7 games and we will get them. This theory about 42 points this year is bunk. Teams relegated will accumulate less than 38 points.
Why do you think it is bunk? I think the notion that we only need 4 more points is unlikely to be true.
The current bottom 3 already have 95 points between them, that's more than you would expect the bottom 3 to have at the end of a typical season, let alone with 7 games to play.
I'm not even confident that 42 points will be enough.
You have answered the question yourself by pointing out the fact that bottom 3 have accumulated 95 points. They have taken points from teams in mid table and above to do that. This means that from now on all bottom 7 or 8 will take points off each other. So they can not all get to 41.
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My view is that if we do not win our next game we will go down.
No we will not. We need no more than 4 points from the remaining 7 games and we will get them. This theory about 42 points this year is bunk. Teams relegated will accumulate less than 38 points.
Why do you think it is bunk? I think the notion that we only need 4 more points is unlikely to be true.
The current bottom 3 already have 95 points between them, that's more than you would expect the bottom 3 to have at the end of a typical season, let alone with 7 games to play.
I'm not even confident that 42 points will be enough.
You have answered the question yourself by pointing out the fact that bottom 3 have accumulated 95 points. They have taken points from teams in mid table and above to do that. This means that from now on all bottom 7 or 8 will take points off each other. So they can not all get to 41.
I'm not sure I understand the logic.
Every team in the bottom half has an even split of 3 or 4 games left to play against bottom half and top half teams, except for Blackpool who have only 2 bottom half games and Sunderland who have only 2 top half games,
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We just need to beat Newcastle.
Blackpool are yet to play Fulham. After that they have Fulham and SHA have Blackburn.
If we beat Newcastle we'll be 2/3 points clear of 2 teams + the drop zone.
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We showed character today and though we had some escapes that was much better. Now let's carry the improvement through to Newcastle.
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Just see motd, 2 good goals by Bent, some more crap defending & that was never a pen
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I did predict 2 things correct, which was not hard. A late goal conceded in both halves but I also said 3-2 to us, not quite right.
Good finishes from Bent and another assist from Downing. Good result when you weigh it all up.
I'm happy with a point from this one.
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Just see motd, 2 good goals by Bent, some more crap defending & that was never a pen
Worryingly, Wigan and West Ham were unlucky and looked decent, only Wolves out of the bottom lot were truly shite.
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Just see motd, 2 good goals by Bent, some more crap defending & that was never a pen
Worryingly, Wigan and West Ham were unlucky and looked decent, only Wolves out of the bottom lot were truly shite.
Do you think West Ham were unlucky? I thought they capitulated big style
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Jagielka made the most of it but you always risk giving a pen the way Makoun dived in.
He's by no means the worst player in the world, but his sending off meant we had to hold on versus Blackpool (whereas with 11 we could have pushed for the win) and today it's resulted in us letting a winning position slip.
He has a decent range of passing, but as one of GH's big signings you're looking for a more telling contribution from him. Well I suppose it has been telling, but for all the wrong reasons thus far.
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To be fair to Makoun, he has had to hit the ground running as it were. I think he's looked pretty good.
Maybe he needs to adapt to the change in pace. No doubt the tackles look winnable to him, but he always seems to get there a little later than he expects.
The booking was a bit of a joke, and I thought he managed to pull away from Jagielka, who promptly hung a leg out and conned the ref.
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Hard to know for certain whether the ref was absolutely convinced it was a stonewall at the time, or whether he wanted to give them the benefit of the doubt after the circumstances that led to our second. Best not to give him the opportunity.
How often have we seen in the past a ref sending a player off, taking dogs abuse for it and then evening things up with another red card. It's a curious industry that thinks making one mistake can only be corrected by making another.
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Jagielka made the most of it but you always risk giving a pen the way Makoun dived in.
He's by no means the worst player in the world, but his sending off meant we had to hold on versus Blackpool (whereas with 11 we could have pushed for the win) and today it's resulted in us letting a winning position slip.
He has a decent range of passing, but as one of GH's big signings you're looking for a more telling contribution from him. Well I suppose it has been telling, but for all the wrong reasons thus far.
Same price as Sidwell though. A miles better player for me already
Did we play 4-4-2 today?
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Well done Ged! Now do fuck off.
You first.
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How often have we seen in the past a ref sending a player off, taking dogs abuse for it and then evening things up with another red card. It's a curious industry that thinks making one mistake can only be corrected by making another.
Yeah, I feared as much when we went in front.
When the radio said there was a penalty at Goodison with seven minutes left I felt like throwing the laptop out the window.
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1 point above the relegation zone this time yesterday, 2 points above it at the moment. Progress. Slowly but surely.
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What has happened to all the Wallies who wanted Friedel's head on a platter only a short time ago?
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I was trying to stay positive even id we had have lost as they were on a food run and losing at Goodison is no disgrace. But with other scores and conceding so late its difficult not to see it as another wasted opportunity and dropped points rather than a good one. One which I would have taken at the start of the game.
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would of took a draw before the game,shame about the penalty late on! Newcastle is a massive game!!
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got to view the game in isolation really. Anything at Goodison is a decent result wherever you are in the league. with the bottom half of the league so tight and teams moving up 3 or 4 places after a win its easy to get a distorted view. we may just be very glad of this point come May
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Come on now, a point at Goodison is usually acceptable, let's accentuate the positives and take it into the Newcastle game and give them a big serve of whup ass
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Yesterday the team can not be blamed for losing points from a winning position. It was never a penalty and the ref got conned. As someone said in positional terms we look worse after the games but we are actually 100% better points wise as we are 2 above drop zone rather than 1. I honestly think another 4/5 would be enough.
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Yesterday the team can not be blamed for losing points from a winning position. It was never a penalty and the ref got conned. As someone said in positional terms we look worse after the games but we are actually 100% better points wise as we are 2 above drop zone rather than 1. I honestly think another 4/5 would be enough.
That's sort of irrelevant though - we're not aiming for a set points total, we're aiming to be above at least three other teams by the end of the season. The more teams that move above us the less likely that's going to happen.
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I'd have taken the point yesterday morning, so not too disappointed. Their non-goal was probably over the line, their penalty was probably a dive. Swings and roundabouts - and in fact I'd rather is was that way round: I wouldn't have fancied us going after a second equalizer.
Downing was excellent and good to see Bent get a couple. We need a return from him of at least a goal every other game between now and the end of the season. Walker had the poorest game I've seen from him in a Villa shirt.
Away support excellent. That now needs to be replicated at Villa Park between how and the end of the season. We still need three wins, and the home games against Newcastle, Stoke and Wigan are where we can get them.
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the last 7 games won 1 drawn 3 lost 3 = 6 points
anny one think that form will keep us up
This is what worries me the most.
Even knowing we are deep in the shit, we do not appear to be improving. This summary does not even tell the whole story. 6 points from 21 - mainly against teams that are in around us.
Too many other clubs are showing some form and ability to get out of it.
http://www.premierleague.com/page/FormGuide
Bloody hell, I am really starting to fear the worst.
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I must admit i was disappointed to come away with only a single point i thought three would have been what we should have had Baines clearly dived to win there penalty so we were cheated out of three points.
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If we beat Newcastle this will have been a good point, if we lose it'll have been another two points dropped from a winning position.
What's not in question is that we showed a good deal more fight than we did against Wolves, which afterwards I did wonder where our next point was coming from - that in itself in a welcome improvement - massive game next week, and then the week after, and week after, hopefully we'll hasve done enough to be safe by then.
This is so tireing though - 2am finish last night and another 45 minutes of getting over the game mentally means i'm absolutley knackered today - I just want us to make ourselves safe so I can stop worrying about the bastards into the early hours each weekend. Our season is usually over by this point. Quire frankly, I'm exhausted.
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Time to drop Makoun for Stan and drop Friedel too
Bents goals should just keep us up
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Well i'm not sure i'd want to drop Freidel at this point of the season.
Our defence has looked confused enough already this season. I don't think introducing another keeper whose command of the back four has always looked questionable would be a particularly bright move right now.
If we've stuck with Houllier this far into the season, he should damn well stick with Freidel too.
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why is Friedel untouchable
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why is Friedel untouchable
He's not, we need to find a replacement in the Summer, but right now we don't have an option that will improve the side imo.
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Cuellar has to come in at right back for me. We need to be as solid as possible at the back. Young is a decent left back, and Cuellar a solid right. Delph and Petrov for Makoun and Gabby on 60 if we are winning the game should be a must too. Think not changing Makoun when he had clearly tired cost us dear - the old manager had that issue with Petrov. I hope Houllier doesn't do the same with Makoun.
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why is Friedel untouchable
He's not, we need to find a replacement in the Summer, but right now we don't have an option that will improve the side imo.
Agreed Oz.........Bringing in Marshall or recalling Brad Jnr from Hull would be a huge risk and I cant see GED doing it, it cant help Friedal that the the defence keeps changing every week. Cuellar in for Walker and stick with that defence for the next 7 games
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Cuellar has to come in at right back for me.
Agree, but at centre back..
How Collins and Dunne get the nod over him is beyond me.
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The fact is we will have to play much better than this to even draw with Newcastle. On form, they will beat us.
I am now at the stage when I am lost for things to say because we have enough talent in the team but it just ain't working.
I will say this though, if we do get relegated it will make little difference to my support-I might even be tempted to go more if it means a return to showing a bit of passion on the pitch.
When I don't go to the Villa I occasionally go and see lower league stuff at random. I usually enjoy this more than going to see the Villa which just seems to jar my nerves for 90 minutes.
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Just see motd, 2 good goals by Bent, some more crap defending & that was never a pen
Worryingly, Wigan and West Ham were unlucky and looked decent, only Wolves out of the bottom lot were truly shite.
.....and they beat us !
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We played well at times yesterday. The formation looked more comfortable for the personel too, although I think Heskey would be better with Bent than Gabby.
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Yeah it was a decent performance and reult. As has been said 100 times in this thread, we have to follow that up with a win over Newcastle and I think we will.
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Friedel's never saved a penalty in a competitive game for us. That does annoy me.
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decent game, generally all round good performance, most all did a shift.
Very, very disappointed with the result but to go to Everton even if they had their reserves, out and not lose was great.
Shows just how bad the loss against Wolves and Bolton were.
Thing is on present form we'll allow Newcastle to slaughter us
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Of course we will Malcolm.
We've been leaky at the back all season, but the defending and goalkeeping form Dinglemapton yesterday was ridiculous.
They’re another poor side, one we should beat and this time I think we will.
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Just watching Goals on Sunday. They are saying that Jagielka was clever to win the penalty - what a crock of shit. If he was (insert name of a foreigner here) they'd be saying how much of a diver he is. ******.
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80% of todays Sunday Supplement was devoted again to Jack Wilshire
WTF !!
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the last 7 games won 1 drawn 3 lost 3 = 6 points
anny one think that form will keep us up
This is what worries me the most.
Even knowing we are deep in the shit, we do not appear to be improving. This summary does not even tell the whole story. 6 points from 21 - mainly against teams that are in around us.
Too many other clubs are showing some form and ability to get out of it.
http://www.premierleague.com/page/FormGuide
Bloody hell, I am really starting to fear the worst.
That form alone will not keep us up, only other teams can do that for us!
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Yesterday was a good solid battling point
Its the home games vs the likes of Wolves, Fulham, Sunderland that have killed us
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got to view the game in isolation really. Anything at Goodison is a decent result wherever you are in the league. with the bottom half of the league so tight and teams moving up 3 or 4 places after a win its easy to get a distorted view. we may just be very glad of this point come May
Agreed Greg.
Time to drop Makoun for Stan and drop Friedel too
Bents goals should just keep us up
Wouldn't necessarily drop Makoun, but would like to see Petrov come off the bench in the latter stages to help close a game out. He's not a match winner, but has decent composure, will play the simple ball and can generally calm things down.
He is a leader as well, not necessarily in a John Terry fist-pumping OTT way, but the players respect and listen to him.
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Just watching Goals on Sunday. They are saying that Jagielka was clever to win the penalty - what a crock of shit. If he was (insert name of a foreigner here) they'd be saying how much of a diver he is. c***s.
Alan Shearer called it right, no penalty, he also said
'The kindest thing I can say is that he went down very easy, let's leave it at that.'
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He should know
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I was stood in line with corner flag, and granted I'd had a couple of pops pre-match
the ball was NOT over the line, so Everton can have no complaints they were denied a valid score.
Couldn't comment on penalty decision, it being the other side of area but motd seem to confirm
Jagielka conned the referee-
Performance wise ...........obviously improvement on Wolves, and the 4-4-2 formation was
welcomed by majority in my earshot, BUT why can't we defend a lead or control a game
longer then a few minutes ?
Despite Everton having a much weakened team and subs bench of in-experience, they
still played the more controlled football and made the better chances from which they
should have secured the win -
Shouldn't complain it's a point towards survival in the mini-league ..........seems obvious
but our destiny lies at how we do in matches at Villa Park between now and 23 May
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Went as my first away game of the season. Better than I expected, Houllier made the right decision in playing 2 up front and putting Young back on the wing, credit to him for that, let's hope he sticks with it for Newcastle.
The major problem still remains, too many mistakes and a note to Mr Freidel. Your full back has just ballsed up when you rolled the ball too him, so why keep rolling it to him, he doesn't want it! Kick it, I don't care if you spoon it into touch near half way, they can't score from there! (b4 anybody says Stoke... yes I know but we aren't playing them).
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(http://img685.imageshack.us/img685/5057/evertonft.jpg) (http://img685.imageshack.us/i/evertonft.jpg/)
My Windows/NVidia/Pentium goal line technology, "Print screen of internet feed" shows that it was over.
So, to all Everton fans HA! HA! HA!
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Went as my first away game of the season. Better than I expected, Houllier made the right decision in playing 2 up front and putting Young back on the wing, credit to him for that, let's hope he sticks with it for Newcastle.
The major problem still remains, too many mistakes and a note to Mr Freidel. Your full back has just ballsed up when you rolled the ball too him, so why keep rolling it to him, he doesn't want it! Kick it, I don't care if you spoon it into touch near half way, they can't score from there! (b4 anybody says Stoke... yes I know but we aren't playing them).
I would guess that he is under instructions to do this as part of our new style of play.
I would further guess that Carlos is not in the side because of his aversion or inability to adapt to this style.
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My Windows/NVidia/Pentium goal line technology, "Print screen of internet feed" shows that it was over.
So, to all Everton fans HA! HA! HA!
Still doesn't look like it to me. there's certainly more of the ball over the line than not, but is the whole ball over it?
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The whole of my balls are in their mouth, for sure
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Tagged, tea-bagged and good to go.
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Carlos cant pass, that may be his achilles heel under GH
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My Windows/NVidia/Pentium goal line technology, "Print screen of internet feed" shows that it was over.
So, to all Everton fans HA! HA! HA!
Still doesn't look like it to me. there's certainly more of the ball over the line than not, but is the whole ball over it?
NVIDIA graphics are not to be trusted. We use them at work and they are shit.
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Plenty of commitment yesterday, we just look very brittle when the pressure is on. None more so than Collins. Cuellar should be in the side in his place. He's not as good a header of the ball but his anticipation and nous would have been invaluable yesterday.
Newcastle at home is a harder fixture than Everton away? If we cut donw on the mistakes at the back and play the majority of game in their half - as we should - we're a good bet for the points.
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Plenty of commitment yesterday, we just look very brittle when the pressure is on. None more so than Collins. Cuellar should be in the side in his place. He's not as good a header of the ball but his anticipation and nous would have been invaluable yesterday.
Collins looked like someone who has spun around on the spot twenty times and then tried to stand still as Osman ran at him for the goal. Really piss poor defending.
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Plenty of commitment yesterday, we just look very brittle when the pressure is on. None more so than Collins. Cuellar should be in the side in his place. He's not as good a header of the ball but his anticipation and nous would have been invaluable yesterday.
Collins looked like someone who has spun around on the spot twenty times and then tried to stand still as Osman ran at him for the goal. Really piss poor defending.
Agree.
Once again he played like somebody who simply doesn't give a shit.
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My Windows/NVidia/Pentium goal line technology, "Print screen of internet feed" shows that it was over.
So, to all Everton fans HA! HA! HA!
Still doesn't look like it to me. there's certainly more of the ball over the line than not, but is the whole ball over it?
No goal!!! For the whole ball to be over the line, it needs to bounce further behind the line...Its amazing how people can say thats a goal because the bottom of the ball has bounced behind the line!!!!
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I always said Beckford was rubbish.
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Plenty of commitment yesterday, we just look very brittle when the pressure is on. None more so than Collins. Cuellar should be in the side in his place. He's not as good a header of the ball but his anticipation and nous would have been invaluable yesterday.
Collins looked like someone who has spun around on the spot twenty times and then tried to stand still as Osman ran at him for the goal. Really piss poor defending.
Agree.
Once again he played like somebody who simply doesn't give a shit.
I'd say he's playing like someone who is out of form/not as good as we thought rather than him not caring.
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My Windows/NVidia/Pentium goal line technology, "Print screen of internet feed" shows that it was over.
So, to all Everton fans HA! HA! HA!
Still doesn't look like it to me. there's certainly more of the ball over the line than not, but is the whole ball over it?
No goal!!! For the whole ball to be over the line, it needs to bounce further behind the line...Its amazing how people can say thats a goal because the bottom of the ball has bounced behind the line!!!!
Look! I WANT it to have been over the line. It's more fun that way. Leave me alone!
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I am still dissapointed that we went from a winning position, to conceding 2 points.
I would expect that a decent manager would have been able to work out how to see the game off.
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I am still dissapointed that we went from a winning position, to conceding 2 points.
I would expect that a decent manager would have been able to work out how to see the game off.
So one of their guys cons the ref in the box, and its the fault of the manager?????
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I am still dissapointed that we went from a winning position, to conceding 2 points.
I would expect that a decent manager would have been able to work out how to see the game off.
Move on, a point is decent against the Toffees.I'm confident we'll get 3 against the jawdees
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I've been chatting to a few Villans here in Spain today & most are behind GH, survive and most think he's a good long term manager. Must admit, I'm arriving at the same place. He's getting into the role now IMLO
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Just see motd, 2 good goals by Bent, some more crap defending & that was never a pen
Worryingly, Wigan and West Ham were unlucky and looked decent, only Wolves out of the bottom lot were truly shite.
Do you think West Ham were unlucky? I thought they capitulated big style
They did. However, they were unlucky that Vidic wasn't sent off when they were 2-0 up.
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Just see motd, 2 good goals by Bent, some more crap defending & that was never a pen
Worryingly, Wigan and West Ham were unlucky and looked decent, only Wolves out of the bottom lot were truly shite.
Do you think West Ham were unlucky? I thought they capitulated big style
They did. However, they were unlucky that Vidic wasn't sent off when they were 2-0 up.
I agree Vidic should have walked,but conceding 4 goals in 45 mins from a 2-0 advantage 11v11 aint unlucky
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Plenty of commitment yesterday, we just look very brittle when the pressure is on. None more so than Collins. Cuellar should be in the side in his place. He's not as good a header of the ball but his anticipation and nous would have been invaluable yesterday.
Collins looked like someone who has spun around on the spot twenty times and then tried to stand still as Osman ran at him for the goal. Really piss poor defending.
Agreed, it was very poor defending, should never have allowed him to run that far with the ball unchallenged. You can't be allowing players to get hold of the ball 45 yards out and only go to them to challenge when they are about to pull the trigger from 12 yards.
it was a piss poor goal allround and a sign of a players very low on confidence with their defensive decision making.
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Plenty of commitment yesterday, we just look very brittle when the pressure is on. None more so than Collins. Cuellar should be in the side in his place. He's not as good a header of the ball but his anticipation and nous would have been invaluable yesterday.
Collins looked like someone who has spun around on the spot twenty times and then tried to stand still as Osman ran at him for the goal. Really piss poor defending.
Agree.
Once again he played like somebody who simply doesn't give a shit.
I'd say he's playing like someone who is out of form/not as good as we thought rather than him not caring.
he has been equally shite for wales, so at least it's not personal!
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Never rated Collins at West Ham tbh
I think he arrived here and played off the adrenalin of being at a big club, and rode the momentum of the whole side for a while
He's now reverted to his natural state which is a very average footballer
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As a comedy aside, i heard Collins was recently surprised naked by a young member of staff whilst changing. She found the experience so traumatic she ran off screaming and had to be persuaded to come out of the room she hid in.
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I disagree. I think they're both poor sides and I think we'll beat both of them.
like all thse other poor sides we keep beating
Whether we beat them or not is down to us. The fact is Stoke are a poor side and Wigan are shite.
I have been hearing all season about the next winnable games and its like a bad tune stuck on a loop and the tape is running out, and we are down to the last 7 and we have won one of the last 7
precisely
magically we are going to win 3 games out of 7 when weve managed what 5 in 26?
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I am still dissapointed that we went from a winning position, to conceding 2 points.
I would expect that a decent manager would have been able to work out how to see the game off.
We came from a goal down away from home against a a side in winning form and all you can do is criticise a manager because they were given a dodgy penalty ?
We aren't in a good position true but again they gave a promising performance. It may not be enough in the long term but it was far better than the previous 2 results
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Plenty of commitment yesterday, we just look very brittle when the pressure is on. None more so than Collins. Cuellar should be in the side in his place. He's not as good a header of the ball but his anticipation and nous would have been invaluable yesterday.
Collins looked like someone who has spun around on the spot twenty times and then tried to stand still as Osman ran at him for the goal. Really piss poor defending.
Agree.
Once again he played like somebody who simply doesn't give a shit.
I'd say he's playing like someone who is out of form/not as good as we thought rather than him not caring.
I have a theory about Collins and our defending in general.
Under the previous manager we tried to play on the break as we all know. What that meant is that the midfield were quite deep and gave good protection to the back 4. Teams tended to play infront of us and rarely did we get someone running at the defence as a midfielder was there to stop that run happening in the first place. So normally they needed to play the ball into the box as opposed to run with it, which our big back 4 dealt with very well, hence our strong defence in 09/10.
The change in formation and the greater emphasis on us trying to control the game further up the pitch has meant we're getting more exposed at the back and this is highlighting some technical faults in the likes of Collins, where simply being big and strong isn't enough anymore.
Normally this defensive frailty would be balanced out by us scoring more goals, but that simply hasn't been the case. The solution is to either go back to playing the midfield deeper, which isn't going to happen under Gezza, or buy better defenders, which isn't going to happen until the summer.
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http://theexecutionersbong.wordpress.com/
Good summary of the game from an Everton fan, with some interesting statistics.
Whilst the game was an exciting one, the quality was quite poor in terms of passing. Villa had more of the ball in terms of passes made (413 v 344) but Everton had a better pass completion (64% v 59%) This was still our lowest pass completion figure of the season and the lowest amount of successful passes we have completed in a home game this season. Villa’s pass completion of 59% was the second lowest of our opponents this season, with only the route one Stoke having recorded a lower figure.
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That's what I think, anyway:
www.thebirminghampress.com/2011/04/04/goodison-gaffes/
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That's what I think, anyway:
www.thebirminghampress.com/2011/04/04/goodison-gaffes/
Dave wrote :
Why was it yet again cheaper to buy two singles than a return, and first class to Lime Street cost less than standard? To the train manager on the way home – if the toilets not working is so rare, how come it’s happened on four of the last six times I’ve been travelling between Birmingham and Liverpool?
Not sure how much your ticket was Dave but my husband somehow managed to get a return for £14.50 from Lichfield but could still catch the train from Chester Rd to B'ham as it was on the same line.It would have been 30 odd quid otherwise.Mad !
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Just read that we've now dropped 23 points from winning positions this season. If we'd held on in all of those games we'd now be third.
On the face of it that's a damning statistic but it does give some cause for optimism. It shows that we can give teams a game, we can put ourselves in a position to win but struggle to see it out.
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Just read that we've now dropped 23 points from winning positions this season. If we'd held on in all of those games we'd now be third.
On the face of it that's a damning statistic but it does give some cause for optimism. It shows that we can give teams a game, we can put ourselves in a position to win but struggle to see it out.
Every team loses points from winning positions so it would be unrealistic to presume we would never do so and be third. Might be a better comparison to presume only half those 23 would normally be lost and see where that leaves us.
But the bigger question is the 'why' of failing to hold onto leads?
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Just read that we've now dropped 23 points from winning positions this season. If we'd held on in all of those games we'd now be third.
On the face of it that's a damning statistic but it does give some cause for optimism. It shows that we can give teams a game, we can put ourselves in a position to win but struggle to see it out.
Every team loses points from winning positions so it would be unrealistic to presume we would never do so and be third. Might be a better comparison to presume only half those 23 would normally be lost and see where that leaves us.
But the bigger question is the 'why' of failing to hold onto leads?
And an even bigger question is 'Can' we stop giving leads away?
It seems unlikely at this stage that we'll suddenly spurn our bad habits.
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Just read that we've now dropped 23 points from winning positions this season. If we'd held on in all of those games we'd now be third.
On the face of it that's a damning statistic but it does give some cause for optimism. It shows that we can give teams a game, we can put ourselves in a position to win but struggle to see it out.
Every team loses points from winning positions so it would be unrealistic to presume we would never do so and be third. Might be a better comparison to presume only half those 23 would normally be lost and see where that leaves us.
But the bigger question is the 'why' of failing to hold onto leads?
Of course I wouldn't expect us to hold on to all of those leads although we were very good at it under the previous manager. I just used it as an illustration.
It says to me that we are doing a lot right, playing the sort of football that gives us a chance of winning games. You're right we do need to sort out why we can't hold on but at the same time not lose focus on the things that are putting us in that position in the fisrt place. I think what I'm saying is that we're not quite as bad as some people are suggesting.
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Just read that we've now dropped 23 points from winning positions this season. If we'd held on in all of those games we'd now be third.
On the face of it that's a damning statistic but it does give some cause for optimism. It shows that we can give teams a game, we can put ourselves in a position to win but struggle to see it out.
Every team loses points from winning positions so it would be unrealistic to presume we would never do so and be third. Might be a better comparison to presume only half those 23 would normally be lost and see where that leaves us.
But the bigger question is the 'why' of failing to hold onto leads?
Of course I wouldn't expect us to hold on to all of those leads although we were very good at it under the previous manager. I just used it as an illustration.
It says to me that we are doing a lot right, playing the sort of football that gives us a chance of winning games. You're right we do need to sort out why we can't hold on but at the same time not lose focus on the things that are putting us in that position in the fisrt place. I think what I'm saying is that we're not quite as bad as some people are suggesting.
We are certainly capable of better - the team sheet alone tells us that!
To me it's just another way to illustrate the defensive frailties we have. We take the kead by scoring, which we know we're capable of doing, and then lose it by letting goals in, which we know is a problem. I'm not sure the timing of when the goals come is all that significant.
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All it shows is that we score some goals, not as many as a lot of teams, and then concede a whole lot more. We always used to hear these sorts of arguments under O'Neill. "If we can turn some draws into wins, we'll definitely finish top 4 next season." It never happened. We're undoubtedly in for a lot of comings and goings player wise at the end of this season, so it's just not possible to say what shape the team will be in. We may well improve the defence, but then players like Ashley Young will move on, weakening us up front.
The only stat that matters right now is the one that shows us two points ahead of the relegation places. That's got to improve.
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I think what I'm saying is that we're not quite as bad as some people are suggesting.
The table doesn't lie.
Somebody told me that if we'd won all our games, we'd be top by now.
Food for thought.
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I think what I'm saying is that we're not quite as bad as some people are suggesting.
The table doesn't lie.
Somebody told me that if we'd won all our games, we'd be top by now.
Food for thought.
Well done for that useful and insightful contribution, I'm glad to see you're not letting your standards slip.
The point is that we've dropped more points in this way than anyone else, which is what makes it significant. I'm not trying to make excuses or claim that we're anything that we're not. I just thought what with this being a discussion board it was something worth discussing.
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More worryingly is that we've only won 3 points from a losing position this season (all draws). Only team worse than that is Blackburn.
Compare that to WBA who have won 19 points.
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My Two Penneth, we have defensive frailties no doubt but my concern with this squad is our inability to see off games. It's almost a given that we will concede a goal in every game. With that in mind why don't we try and win games by a heftier margin? We have more ability in our attack than in defense so play to our strengths.
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I think what I'm saying is that we're not quite as bad as some people are suggesting.
The table doesn't lie.
Somebody told me that if we'd won all our games, we'd be top by now.
Food for thought.
Well done for that useful and insightful contribution, I'm glad to see you're not letting your standards slip.
The point is that we've dropped more points in this way than anyone else, which is what makes it significant. I'm not trying to make excuses or claim that we're anything that we're not. I just thought what with this being a discussion board it was something worth discussing.
I know we've dropped more points than anybody else in this way, point is, little or nothing is being done about it and the side collectively shit themselves when they take the lead.
But to say that we could have been third if we'd hung onto all those leads is meaningless and you've been pedalling that line since the days of O'Leary.
Such as
'If we'd drawn at Arsenal and turned 3 of our home draws into wins, we'd be in the top 10 by now.'
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My Two Penneth, we have defensive frailties no doubt but my concern with this squad is our inability to see off games. It's almost a given that we will concede a goal in every game. With that in mind why don't we try and win games by a heftier margin? We have more ability in our attack than in defense so play to our strengths.
I think we do that but we aren't clinical enough. Sunderland away, sunderland at home , fulham away, Man U at home, bolton away all games where we could potentially have won by 3 clear goals using our attacking talent but didn't stick the bloody ball in the onion bag. Frustrating isn't the word....
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But to say that we could have been third if we'd hung onto all those leads
I have already explained, I just used is an illustration. I don't really think we could be third but it is a massive amount of points to be dropped and that is the reason we're near the bottom of the league rather than comfortably in mid table. I read on here all the time criticism of Young, Downing etc and how attacking players are out of position when it is clear as day that is not where the problems lie.
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If we'd have scored 4 goals in the FA cup tie against Man City, we'd have gone through to the next round.
The anti-Houllier lot always seem to overlook that.
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If we'd have scored 4 goals in the FA cup tie against Man City, we'd have gone through to the next round.
The anti-Houllier lot always seem to overlook that.
I remember when you used to be funny.
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But to say that we could have been third if we'd hung onto all those leads
I have already explained, I just used is an illustration. I don't really think we could be third but it is a massive amount of points to be dropped and that is the reason we're near the bottom of the league rather than comfortably in mid table. I read on here all the time criticism of Young, Downing etc and how attacking players are out of position when it is clear as day that is not where the problems lie.
It's not the main problem, agreed, but goal scoring has still not been great this year.
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If we'd have scored 4 goals in the FA cup tie against Man City, we'd have gone through to the next round.
The anti-Houllier lot always seem to overlook that.
I remember when you used to be funny.
A bit like Viz.
Don't go into your 'I know you're only 12, Clearly you haven't been down Villa Park this season etc etc' haughty reply mode.
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It is an interesting stat and certainly confirms what I was thinking over the weekend - we can't hold onto a lead or close out games. We've really lost our way on that - this goes back all the way to the game at Stoke in September but really kicked in around Fulham away, Man Utd at home. Even our last two away games - really should have beaten both Bolton and Everton. Those extra five points and we'd be 10th and laughing now.
As it stands, we're in trouble, and I've so little faith in us to actually finish games off that I can't view any of our remaining seven matches with any level of optimism. Arsenal, Liverpool - sure, always tough games. But West Ham, West Brom away? We've got the losing habit now and it's hard to shake off.
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Not read all of the thread yet. Thought we showed some spirit in coming from behind, which was nice to see. Thought the 442 worked ok. We scored goals and looked threatening, but never looked like controlling the game (however, i struggle to think of a point this season we have). Didnt keep the ball well enough. The two weak links for me were Walker and Makoun. The former gave the ball away on numerous occasions, missed a sitter, and his suicidal header to let in Beckford in the first half should have been punished. The latter was pretty much anonymous for most of the game, lunges in a lot, but perhaps was unlucky for the pen. Bents goals were a massive plus, more of the same please, and Downing and Young did well too.
Friedel 5 Should have done better with the first maybe, one good save comes to mind
Walker 4 Not his best game at all, riddled with mistakes. Better going forward.
L Young 6 Didnt do too badly all round
Dunne 6 Dealt ok with what was thrown at him
Collins 5 Turned inside out for the first goal, but not terrible.
Downing 8 Always looked lively, part of everything good about us
A Young 8 Was going to be a 7, as all round worked hard and was decent, but the pass for Bents second was sublime.
Reo-Coker 6 Both centre midfielders were pretty anonymous, he had a blocked shot.
Makoun 4 Again, pretty anonymous apart from another lunge and giving the pen away (Harshly)
Agbonlahor 6 Worked Hard. I think Bent benefitted from some support. Went missing a bit in second half
Bent 9 Two chances, two great finishes. Great to have a clinical finisher in the team. We need to keep giving him chances and cut the silly mistakes out at the other end.
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More worryingly is that we've only won 3 points from a losing position this season (all draws). Only team worse than that is Blackburn.
If we can't keep leads and struggle to come from behind, it suggests a real isue with team spirit to me!
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If we'd have scored 4 goals in the FA cup tie against Man City, we'd have gone through to the next round.
The anti-Houllier lot always seem to overlook that.
I remember when you used to be funny.
A bit like Viz.
Don't go into your 'I know you're only 12, Clearly you haven't been down Villa Park this season etc etc' haughty reply mode.
But it's what I do best, being sneeringly dismissive is something I've had to work at and I'm not going to give it all up now.
I agree with what Bren says, that it's unlikely we're going to solve our defensive issue at this stage of the season so we should concentrate on the other end of the pitch; score enough to make conceding late irrelevant.
On Saturday my PC crashed when we were 2-1 up and I just know that by the time I got the stream back they'd have equalised.
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My Two Penneth, we have defensive frailties no doubt but my concern with this squad is our inability to see off games. It's almost a given that we will concede a goal in every game. With that in mind why don't we try and win games by a heftier margin? We have more ability in our attack than in defense so play to our strengths.
Pretty much.
Self-destruction in the last 10 minutes has been quite a big part of why we're in the position we're in at the moment.
In previous seasons we'd close out games with ease because we knew our defence was solid and wouldn't break down mentally - it's the complete opposite this season.
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Feels as though We've been giving late goals away since the year dot
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So did Saturday's game as losing points from leading positions or gaining one? Cos you could argue for both.
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So did Saturday's game as losing points from leading positions or gaining one? Cos you could argue for both.
As far as Im concerned its a point gained, one of our tougher away games has gone and lets move onto Sunday