Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: pmk1981 on December 06, 2010, 09:53:22 PM
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First he touches the anfield then we loose 3-0 and he waves at the kop. What a tosser. Lost all respect of what I had for him now
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Oh dear.
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He certainly disrespected us tonight, but not as much as the gutless wankers who wore the shirts...
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Maybe you're reading too much into the touching the "This is Anfield" sign. Football-folk are superstitious buggers and perhaps he remembered it used to be 'lucky' when he did it with them and thought it would have the same effect for us.
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I thought we played well! Kept the ball, kept the possession.
BUT....
Can't score, can't defend!
One plus point. Randy will have to wave the cheque book.
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Mind you, you wouldn't see a natural winner doing that.
Imagine SAF doing that ??
( Maybe the thread header needs dampening down a bit though).
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I think he was waving at our fans.
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I thought we played well! Kept the ball, kept the possession.
BUT....
Can't score, can't defend!
One plus point. Randy will have to wave the cheque book.
Damn straight. We need to buy right in Jan to stay out of a fucking full on relegation fight.
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I think he was waving at our fans.
How fucking dare he, the ******.
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Great thread title.
;D
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I don't think Houllier has brought anything to this club. No "new manager bounce". No sign of the players wanting to play for him. No glimpse of a new style of play. Just a solid defence becoming the worst since GT2, a few pissed off quality players (Ireland and Carew), injuries partly due to a new training regime, and a team facing a relegation battle unless they pick up soon.
This is the result of the senior Management failing to effectively communicate to and manage MON so he leaves rapidly. Then we end up with this shite.
We're becoming the Browns Mk 2. Still at least our balance sheet will be sorted out by the end of the season. No wonder Doug liked these guys.
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He waved to the right of the dugout. The kop is the right of the dugout
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Great thread title.
;D
No hidden messages there!
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I dont mind him touching the sign. I dont mind him waving to Liverpool fans in teh same way that I did nt mind when Graham Taylor waved to is on his return with Watford.
What I do mind is that we are appearing rapidly to be in freefall and he will not drop two centre halves and left back who are currently the worst in the League
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I think he was waving at our fans.
Was he fucking bollocks. I've defended him before tonight, but that was unacceptable. Just waiting to see what he has to say on Sky.
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Leave that French tw*t at Anfield and leave that 37 year old French poof Pires there with him........
He has more passion for them than he does with us - I said it the day we appointed him and I'll defy anyone to tell me otherwise.
Waving to the Kop and not the Villa end. Woeful.
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One thing I liked about MON is that if Villa were playing crap he'd give them a good kick up the ass at half-time getting the players motivated - I see no motivation from Houllier.
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If this form carries on over Christmas I can foresee a DOL style apocalypse for Ged.
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I think he was waving at our fans.
Was he fucking bollocks. I've defended him before tonight, but that was unacceptable. Just waiting to see what he has to say on Sky.
You will have to wait a while. He is still prancing around the Liverpool changing room in a tutu and full red lippy on.
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Did he really wave to the kop?
Come on seriously?
I will say this though, we don't seem to be showing a lot of desire at the moment
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Houllier, the overseer of the French National team debacle.
Can see the same thing coming along at the Villa.
Plenty of moaning at each other on the pitch, manager and assistant who don't seem bothered. Just sit there in their big coats.
Southgate, where art thou?
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i sugest you all let the general know how you feel about his antics tonight
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I think he was waving at our fans.
Was he fucking bollocks. I've defended him before tonight, but that was unacceptable. Just waiting to see what he has to say on Sky.
You will have to wait a while. He is still prancing around the Liverpool changing room in a tutu and full red lippy on.
Reach round from Stevie Me?
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i sugest you all let the general know how you feel about his antics tonight
Stop stirring ;)
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I just cannot see him turning this around. The sight of him on the bench tonight was to see a man devoid of answers...devoid of ideas. I'm sorry but he's got to go, he doesn't need this hassle and we can do better. Much better.
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I thought we played well! Kept the ball, kept the possession.
BUT....
Can't score, can't defend!
One plus point. Randy will have to wave the cheque book.
It's ok passing the ball around amongst the back line when your 2 and 3 nil down, they were letting us do that because we were no danger to them.
Your right about the middle part, but what worries me about the last bit is how attractive we will be to any new players.
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that was embarassing, not since DO'L have i felt so depressed, the Kop singing his name what a load of bollocks a piss take
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The Kop were singing his name for that last 5 to 10 minutes of the game, and he gave them a cursory wave when leaving the bench. Not a great move to be sure, but hardly significant in the context.
I am far more concerned that we looked a complete shambles, and Liverpool will not have an easier game for the rest of the season.
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You are fucking OUT OF ORDER pmk1981!
Houllier takes a capital letter.
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I just cannot see him turning this around. The sight of him on the bench tonight was to see a man devoid of answers...devoid of ideas. I'm sorry but he's got to go, he doesn't need this hassle and we can do better. Much better.
I agree that he looked more concerned with keeping warm than turning the teams fortunes around but he needs a bit more time. Interesting that they said before the game that Jol had left Ajax.
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Sack the wanker. This is the worst Villa team in years, worse than O'Leary's team. And for him to touch the Anfield sign is so fuckin disrespectful to Villa it's untrue!
Fuck him off!
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I thought we played well! Kept the ball, kept the possession.
BUT....
Can't score, can't defend!
One plus point. Randy will have to wave the cheque book.
It's ok passing the ball around amongst the back line when your 2 and 3 nil down, they were letting us do that because we were no danger to them.
Your right about the middle part, but what worries me about the last bit is how attractive we will be to any new players.
Signing players aint a problem when you pay them what they want. They don't give a shit as long as they get their dough! All they will do is have a ''get out '' clause if we are relegated.
Footballers = money grabbing greedy bastards
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Thanking the Liverpool fans for chanting his name.....fuck off,and don't come back.
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Thanking the Liverpool fans for chanting his name.....fuck off,and don't come back.
In fairness he was asked directly about the reaction he received from the Liverpool fans.
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Get rid, 1 win in 12 is it?
He is past it. All scouse bollocks
I dont like him , we need someone younger and hungry
Owen Coyle for me is the man
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He should just stay there if he loves it so much. Let us get a motivator, a tactician, a leader of men. Martin Jol should be our manager but instead he's off to Newcastle and we're stuck with this twot. How very, very depressing.
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Whilst I didn't mind him touching the sign/waving at fans....to thank their fans and not mention the Villa fans who have spent a lot to travel in shit weather to watch a team who are currently terrible...is utterly awful
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Sickening disresepct for our manager from some of our fans on here.
He is one of only two Liverpool managers to have won a treble and I dont begrudge him some affectionate reflections.
What does concern me is a listless, lifeless Villa. We are in trouble.
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Thanking the Liverpool fans for chanting his name.....fuck off,and don't come back.
In fairness he was asked directly about the reaction he received from the Liverpool fans.
In fairness, he could have mentioned the Villa fans who'd travelled 100 miles to stand in sub zero temperatures.
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taking the piss, sackable offence we are paying your wages you Tit!! have some respect for us and our travelling support
Off you go!
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He looked utterly deflated during the post match interview. But perked up (I am sure there was almost a tear in his eye) when the reporter mentioned the Liverpool fans.
All is not well at VP. I wont be suprised if this was his last match.
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Thanking the Liverpool fans for chanting his name.....fuck off,and don't come back.
In fairness he was asked directly about the reaction he received from the Liverpool fans.
In fairness, he could have mentioned the Villa fans who'd travelled 100 miles to stand in sub zero temperatures.
I agree he should have mentioned the Villa fans.
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He looked utterly deflated during the post match interview. But perked up (I am sure there was almost a tear in his eye) when the reporter mentioned the Liverpool fans.
All is not well at VP. I wont be suprised if this was his last match.
Lets hope so!
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I think he has pretty much talked his way out of the job in the last few days. You need to keep the fans on side when you are in a bad run of form, not piss them off.
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He looked utterly deflated during the post match interview. But perked up (I am sure there was almost a tear in his eye) when the reporter mentioned the Liverpool fans.
All is not well at VP. I wont be suprised if this was his last match.
Lets hope so!
GOOD
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Very angry with Houllier's behaviour and the team performance tonight. It'll be interesting to see how he tries to turn this around. Things will look a lot better if we beat the baggies, but the writing will be on the wall for Houllier if we lose.
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Thanking the Liverpool fans for chanting his name.....fuck off,and don't come back.
In fairness he was asked directly about the reaction he received from the Liverpool fans.
In fairness, he could have mentioned the Villa fans who'd travelled 100 miles to stand in sub zero temperatures.
This
I did nt complain when Graham Taylor waved a few times to us when we smashed Watford on his first return so I would not complain about him touching what some see as an "Iconic" sign or even waving to the fans.
But as Risso says to not mention those who have travelled a long way in crap weather spending good money to watch a poor team is bad judgement.
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100% with you son.
WBA Saturday will be a farce. We'll soon be welcoming back to the good old days when we were sh1t.
If Houllier was a car he'd be a beige Allegro, if he was food he'd be some dog sh1t on a piece of stale bread.
If he was a record he'd be something by Milli Vanilli after everybody realised that they were miming because like him they were a pair of wankers.......
Look on the bright side, he's in the North West and if he goes to see Blackpool he may get run over by a tram, like Allan Bradley did.
F*ck him
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Strachan's available..?
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Well, let's just say for arguments' sake it is his last match. Do we keep Gary Mac and Sid in the first team set-up or do you find them culpable too?
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100% with you son.
WBA Saturday will be a farce. We'll soon be welcoming back to the good old days when we were sh1t.
If Houllier was a car he'd be a beige Allegro, if he was food he'd be some dog sh1t on a piece of stale bread.
If he was a record he'd be something by Milli Vanilli after everybody realised that they were miming because like him they were a pair of wankers.......
Look on the bright side, he's in the North West and if he goes to see Blackpool he may get run over by a tram, like Allan Bradley did.
F*ck him
No need for that!! I liked Milli Vanilli!!
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Strachan's available..?
I'd take Michaela. In more ways than one. Nurse!
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Well, let's just say for arguments' sake it is his last match. Do we keep Gary Mac and Sid in the first team set-up or do you find them culpable too?
McAllister achieved nothing as a coach, so go. Cowans is one of us
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Any advance on Martin Jol?
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Any advance on Martin Jol?
He's the man for us.
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Why not get a paedo in to run things.......
Shit! We have....sorry
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Chill all, please?
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agree agree agree please go back to Liverpool France anywhere you are ruining our team!!!!!!!!!
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get that french fuck out now and get jol in
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Why not get a paedo in to run things.......
Shit! We have....sorry
What on earth are you talking about?
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On the bright side, there are LOADS of grounds in the Championship I haven't been to. Will probably be cheaper too.
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I genuinely thought Villa would never be one of those clubs where a dodgy run of form would see everyone pile in to call for the manager's head. But even though that's exactly what's happening, I don't think it's a bad idea, and that's worrying.
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just seen post match interview. the man is a fucking disgrace. avram grant has more personality. im sure he creamed himself when asked about Liverpool fans.
sack him now
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There is no way he will be sacked so soon after joining. He will get this season at least.
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2 wins- Blackpool and Wolves- one which we were lucky
Draws against Bolton, Chelsea, Man U, Fulham, shite
Losses against scousers, Arsenal, Blackburn, Spurs, Sunderland
We are seriously in the shit
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Sort it out Gerard
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There has been a subtle change to the thread title.
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There is no way he will be sacked so soon after joining. He will get this season at least.
Probably not, but the club has all of a sudden got the same feel as during the last days of Graham Turner, Billy McNeill, Graham Taylor Mk2 and DOL. With that in mind, I'd rather make the hard decision now than when we're staring relegation in the face.
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His disrespectful behaviour tonight has eroded a lot of credit he had in the bank. We've still not seen a full strength team remember but his behaviour was a joke.
Tonight was the first time that I've felt that I've missed MoN this season.
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I can't get my head around the tactics we're employing right now. Virtually every ball arrives back at the feet of one of our out-of-form defenders, who ping it forward to an isolated striker who is muscled off the ball. The alternative is to work it to a winger, who cuts inside and either runs into two defenders or puts in a ridiculous cross.
Other teams are able to work the ball across the defence and take shots. Other teams are given instructions to fall back into two banks of four when they lose possession. Other teams make short, sensible runs when a throw in is won in order to gain the ball.
It looks remarkably like Houllier earns his money by picking eleven players and then making three changes once we're losing, and nothing else.
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prefered the old thread title.
said everything i feel right now :(
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please go I have had enough - things couldnt be any worse. We dont have time to be 'in transition' playing pretty football. You and your so called team have dragged us down to a relegation battle. Please leave and take all your scourser scum with you! xx
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Co
He looked utterly deflated during the post match interview. But perked up (I am sure there was almost a tear in his eye) when the reporter mentioned the Liverpool fans.
All is not well at VP. I wont be suprised if this was his last match.
Lets hope so!
GOOD
[/quote
We can have a go at the players but ultimately it comes down to the manager and for me he has been getting it wrong since he arrived.....no commitment and passion for this club, its just a job....tactically inept...pisses the players off and I don't think they want to play for him....and now he has pissed off quite a few supporters..... Le Coq
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His wave to the fans pissed me off tbf
Martin O'Neill would of walked right over to the fans and apologised for not giving them value for money
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Tonight was the first time that I've felt that I've missed MoN this season.
I have to agree with this. Shite football but seldom a pushover and we look a million miles to the team which won there 3-1 last year.
Houllier has not developed any kind of rapport with the fans to date - something which DOL struggled with. Both were constantly harping back to the good old days or Leeds and 'Pool. He really has got a tough job to turn this around now.
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Martin jol quit Ajax- if doug was here I'd expect him to sack houllier and get jol- I doubt Lerner will do so!
Houllier can do a job here given time and money , if the money is not there then we are in trouble and need leadership.
Stuff the browns- aston villa need a chairman totally commited to Aston villa alone- show us the money mr Lerner !
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What concerened me more tonight other than the way we played in the first half, was the sight of Houiller and McCallister both sat on the bench shivering, looking as if they wanted to be somewhere else. I want a manager with passion on the touchline screaming at his players, not trying to keep warm.
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From LFCs os;
He told his post-match press conference: "The fans were good. I appreciated the fact that they chanted my name at the end. It shows they can remember.
"There was also a banner at the start of the game. I was not emotional but I was extremely touched by that."
He added: "It's difficult to say but I prefer to lose 3-0 to Liverpool because I like Liverpool.
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I don't think the board would make a snap decision based on tonight's result - they seem to value contracts and a man's word which is to their credit.
However, for my money I'd much rather see Jol in the post than Houllier. But I don't run the club.
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Fuck me, stop digging you fuckin' pratt.
That just about puts the tin lid on the night.
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100% with you son.
WBA Saturday will be a farce. We'll soon be welcoming back to the good old days when we were sh1t.
If Houllier was a car he'd be a beige Allegro, if he was food he'd be some dog sh1t on a piece of stale bread.
If he was a record he'd be something by Milli Vanilli after everybody realised that they were miming because like him they were a pair of wankers.......
Look on the bright side, he's in the North West and if he goes to see Blackpool he may get run over by a tram, like Allan Bradley did.
F*ck him
Well that post cheered me up! :)
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That last quote is ill advised.
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He added: "It's difficult to say but I prefer to lose 3-0 to Liverpool because I like Liverpool.
The hatred I have for Liverpool was mainly based on the regular 3-0 defeats Villa suffered at their hands in the 90's. So 3-0 to Liverpool as a scoreline is not something I can laugh off.
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From LFCs os;
He told his post-match press conference: "The fans were good. I appreciated the fact that they chanted my name at the end. It shows they can remember.
"There was also a banner at the start of the game. I was not emotional but I was extremely touched by that."
He added: "It's difficult to say but I prefer to lose 3-0 to Liverpool because I like Liverpool.
Christ almighty.
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His out of order words are here;
http://www.liverpoolfc.tv/news/latest-news/houllier-touched-by-kop-tribute
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What concerened me more tonight other than the way we played in the first half, was the sight of Houiller and McCallister both sat on the bench shivering, looking as if they wanted to be somewhere else. I want a manager with passion on the touchline screaming at his players, not trying to keep warm.
Martin jol quit Ajax- if doug was here I'd expect him to sack houllier and get jol- I doubt Lerner will do so!
Houllier can do a job here given time and money , if the money is not there then we are in trouble and need leadership.
Stuff the browns- aston villa need a chairman totally commited to Aston villa alone- show us the money mr Lerner !
How much time do we give him and how much money?
Where were we after 16 matches under MON in his first season?
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From LFCs os;
He told his post-match press conference: "The fans were good. I appreciated the fact that they chanted my name at the end. It shows they can remember.
"There was also a banner at the start of the game. I was not emotional but I was extremely touched by that."
He added: "It's difficult to say but I prefer to lose 3-0 to Liverpool because I like Liverpool.
Christ almighty.
What I wouldn't give to call him into my office in the morning for a debrief. You would be scraping him off the ceiling for that....
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Won't sleep tonight after this shambles but it's sunny in Adelaide -hope we stuff it up the Aussies - something worth watching!
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MON may not have been the best manager but never once were we facing the situation we face now! :-[
3 years at 6th place knocking on the door of the top 4, we were moving in the right direction.
We've gone 100 steps backwards in 3 months! Houllier has lost the plot, the team hasn't bought into his ideas or tactics, if he has even tried implementing any.
His grudge with Carew has to end, the big man may not be in form but for heaven's sake he is better than Stephen Ireland!
Kev Mac should've been given the job, the players love him, I think most of us like him! We had one awful game but other than that looked solidly good, scoring and threatening teams.
The only 2 positives Houllier has brought is that he's given Super Marc and Barry extended runs in the squad to prove they belond. Unfortunately it doesn't mean shit without results. Oh and any praise for him by giving them a run in the squad went out the window when he signed Pires.
Houllier do the respectful thing, admit your clueless and leave. We'll cope better with the fans running the team.
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From LFCs os;
He told his post-match press conference: "The fans were good. I appreciated the fact that they chanted my name at the end. It shows they can remember.
"There was also a banner at the start of the game. I was not emotional but I was extremely touched by that."
He added: "It's difficult to say but I prefer to lose 3-0 to Liverpool because I like Liverpool.
For that, and that alone, go.
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Kev Mac should've been given the job, the players love him, I think most of us like him! We had one awful game but other than that looked solidly good, scoring and threatening teams.
No matter my anger at tonight's result, I can't agree with this. He wasn't up to the job, much as I like the fella. I know Houllier's taking the club down the shitter but I think we all thought we were getting somebody more suited to the job at the time.
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That comment is unbelievable, haven't yet had a day where i haven't wished we still have O'Neill
as gordon ramsey would say
'fuck off you french pig!'
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He also said"at 2-0 it would be difficult to come back...he had given up, the prick...
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The pass and move style houllier prefers will never work with these players - mons teams were totally different style and never the twain shall meet- he would need to build a totally new team and I do not think the money is there for that- what now mr Lerner?
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Get rid, 1 win in 12 is it?
He is past it. All scouse bollocks
I dont like him , we need someone younger and hungry
Owen Coyle for me is the man
He certainly seems to have the Midas touch but until now he's never been given any serious money to spend, so we don't really know if he could do it at a higher level.
Houllier needs to get some passion back into the team. I get the impression he's on holiday and just going through the motions of being our Manager. I can't see him lasting beyond this season unless something drastic changes. There's just no fight in the man.
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Get out now while we still have a chance of staying up. You are turning into a puss filled boil on the arse of our great football club.
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That comment is unbelievable, haven't yet had a day where i haven't wished we still have O'Neill
as gordon ramsey would say
'fuck off you french pig!'
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Kev Mac should've been given the job, the players love him, I think most of us like him! We had one awful game but other than that looked solidly good, scoring and threatening teams.
No matter my anger at tonight's result, I can't agree with this. He wasn't up to the job, much as I like the fella. I know Houllier's taking the club down the shitter but I think we all thought we were getting somebody more suited to the job at the time.
Granted but Macdonald having worked under MON would've kept similar ideals and views whilst also doing the same thing with the younger players. He would have given them runs in the side, especially when he coached them on a daily basis.
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That comment is unbelievable, haven't yet had a day where i haven't wished we still have O'Neill
as gordon ramsey would say
'fuck off you french pig!'
Take that up with him then he quit Villa the little shit, didn't have the back bone to face the music, at least the French pig does.
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Kev Mac should've been given the job, the players love him, I think most of us like him! We had one awful game but other than that looked solidly good, scoring and threatening teams.
No matter my anger at tonight's result, I can't agree with this. He wasn't up to the job, much as I like the fella. I know Houllier's taking the club down the shitter but I think we all thought we were getting somebody more suited to the job at the time.
Granted but Macdonald having worked under MON would've kept similar ideals and views whilst also doing the same thing with the younger players. He would have given them runs in the side, especially when he coached them on a daily basis.
Dream on.
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O Leary lost the fans with his constant belittling the club, mon lost many over the Moscow fiasco and tonight houllier has lost many with his disrespect and Liverpool love in- from herein the honeymoon is over mr houllier!
If Newcastle get jol then I will be pissed off. If they get o neill I won't give a toss- martin jol should have been given the job whatever it took to get him last summer!
Houllier said he saw us as a midtable club when he took the job - now that would be overachieving!
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Kev Mac should've been given the job, the players love him, I think most of us like him! We had one awful game but other than that looked solidly good, scoring and threatening teams.
No matter my anger at tonight's result, I can't agree with this. He wasn't up to the job, much as I like the fella. I know Houllier's taking the club down the shitter but I think we all thought we were getting somebody more suited to the job at the time.
Granted but Macdonald having worked under MON would've kept similar ideals and views whilst also doing the same thing with the younger players. He would have given them runs in the side, especially when he coached them on a daily basis.
Dream on.
I think we'd be in the same position under KMac as we are now, we'd just have taken a different route to get there.
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The pass and move style houllier prefers will never work with these players - mons teams were totally different style and never the twain shall meet- he would need to build a totally new team and I do not think the money is there for that- what now mr Lerner?
What players, the reserves or the has beens Mon bought at big prices and huge salaries?
It wasn't tactics or skill that was missing tonight or even recently its the desire to play at all
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Kev Mac should've been given the job, the players love him, I think most of us like him! We had one awful game but other than that looked solidly good, scoring and threatening teams.
No matter my anger at tonight's result, I can't agree with this. He wasn't up to the job, much as I like the fella. I know Houllier's taking the club down the shitter but I think we all thought we were getting somebody more suited to the job at the time.
Granted but Macdonald having worked under MON would've kept similar ideals and views whilst also doing the same thing with the younger players. He would have given them runs in the side, especially when he coached them on a daily basis.
Dream on.
One day, you might wake up from yours
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From LFCs os;
He told his post-match press conference: "The fans were good. I appreciated the fact that they chanted my name at the end. It shows they can remember.
"There was also a banner at the start of the game. I was not emotional but I was extremely touched by that."
He added: "It's difficult to say but I prefer to lose 3-0 to Liverpool because I like Liverpool.
What I hated was this line: "When you concede a goal after 12 or 13 minutes at Anfield, it's difficult to come back".
Maybe somebody should have reminded him Anfield and a Liverpool team missing a few key players is nothing to be scared of. Tonight, the team reflected the manager. Gutless.
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O Leary lost the fans with his constant belittling the club, mon lost many over the Moscow fiasco and tonight houllier has lost many with his disrespect and Liverpool love in- from herein the honeymoon is over mr houllier!
If Newcastle get jol then I will be pissed off. If they get o neill I won't give a toss- martin jol should have been given the job whatever it took to get him last summer!
Houllier said he saw us as a midtable club when he took the job - now that would be overachieving!
East, you seem to be blaming Lerner on one thread and Houiller on another. Which one is it to be?
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This has probably been said in the preceding 7 pages but most of what I have read so far is drivel. My tuppence worth:
MON's greatest attribute was to get the most out of his players, making the the teams value greater than the sum of its parts. For example it is rare that a player moves away from MON and improves (unless he's been frozen out by MON).
Houllier on the flip side lacks this motivational acumen but is a better tactician and may be better at spotting players, building a club etc.
Therefore I am not surprised to see the form of the team decrease as I think a Houllier team needs players with more finesse than a MON team. At the moment it is literally MON squad with 10 injuries.
My worry is that the Villa faithful and indeed Houllier will not have the patients to wait the required 2 transfer windows to see any improvement.
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From LFCs os;
He told his post-match press conference: "The fans were good. I appreciated the fact that they chanted my name at the end. It shows they can remember.
"There was also a banner at the start of the game. I was not emotional but I was extremely touched by that."
He added: "It's difficult to say but I prefer to lose 3-0 to Liverpool because I like Liverpool.
This and touching the Anfield sign. After tonight he will have to win the FA Cup for us to keep me on his side.
The bloke is treating us like a covenient relationship to stay in touch with his first love...more fool us or rather Randy & Co.
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This has probably been said in the preceding 7 pages but most of what I have read so far is drivel. My tuppence worth:
MON's greatest attribute was to get the most out of his players, making the the teams value greater than the sum of its parts. For example it is rare that a player moves away from MON and improves (unless he's been frozen out by MON).
Houllier on the flip side lacks this motivational acumen but is a better tactician and may be better at spotting players, building a club etc.
Therefore I am not surprised to see the form of the team decrease as I think a Houllier team needs players with more finesse than a MON team. At the moment it is literally MON squad with 10 injuries.
My worry is that the Villa faithful and indeed Houllier will not have the patients to wait the required 2 transfer windows to see any improvement.
Do we? Have you seen our injury list?
We might lack some patience though...
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Yes, this night my honey moon with GH has officially terminated.
I don't remember a poorer performance of the boys in claret and blood, we have been annihilated in every part of the pitch in every moment of the game, my mood is black like the shirt that we wore this night.
It's worse than Chelsea last year for the sensation of impotence that we demonstrated against an average team without their best players.
Those 2 central defenders are a farce - always belting the ball clear instead of trying and create from the back -, the full backs are slow and clumsy (thank you Mr O'Neill for this overpaid defence), Hogg is an holding midfielder not a play maker, Clark should play in defence with Cuellar, Albrighton wasn't fit, Downing shoved an absolute lack of pluck and committment (thank you again Mr O'Neill), and Gabby was left alone.
A real tragedy, we are in a dark tunnel.
Houllier is at the end of this carreer, to quote the great Bard of Avon, if "he has no no spur to prick the sides of his intent, but only vaulting ambition, which o'erleaps itself, and falls on the other", he could stay to winter in South France; we should sign Jol or the great Gianfranco Zola.
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If we were in the top half of the table then we could afford to be patient. Problem is we lost today from a below par lpool team and we dont look beating anyone, even blose. Houlier is not the man! Villa till i die!!
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This has probably been said in the preceding 7 pages but most of what I have read so far is drivel. My tuppence worth:
MON's greatest attribute was to get the most out of his players, making the the teams value greater than the sum of its parts. For example it is rare that a player moves away from MON and improves (unless he's been frozen out by MON).
Houllier on the flip side lacks this motivational acumen but is a better tactician and may be better at spotting players, building a club etc.
Therefore I am not surprised to see the form of the team decrease as I think a Houllier team needs players with more finesse than a MON team. At the moment it is literally MON squad with 10 injuries.
My worry is that the Villa faithful and indeed Houllier will not have the patients to wait the required 2 transfer windows to see any improvement.
Your stance on Houllier may be correct, but that to me sounds like a director of football, not a manager. MON was a manager and regardless of what many thought of him on here, at least he was a focal point of the commitment of the team. I cam rarely remember a team giving up so completely so early under O'Neill.
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Houllier's strong point is looking after Houllier.
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From LFCs os;
He added: "It's difficult to say but I prefer to lose 3-0 to Liverpool because I like Liverpool.
a sacking offence pure and simple. He has to go.
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What do people know about Gary MacAllister?
My hunch is that Houlliers "hair dryer"days are over and has adopted a more carefree management style. I do not have a problem with this as long as there is an appointed bad cop to complement Houllier's nouse and technical acumen.
Based on the fact that the whole thing seemed to be made up as we went along does anyone know whether Gary Mac has the required cajoles and therefore whether they'll be a good partnership. What was he like at Leeds/Cov?
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O Leary lost the fans with his constant belittling the club, mon lost many over the Moscow fiasco and tonight houllier has lost many with his disrespect and Liverpool love in- from herein the honeymoon is over mr houllier!
If Newcastle get jol then I will be pissed off. If they get o neill I won't give a toss- martin jol should have been given the job whatever it took to get him last summer!
Houllier said he saw us as a midtable club when he took the job - now that would be overachieving!
East, you seem to be blaming Lerner on one thread and Houiller on another. Which one is it to be?
Both maybe?
Not sure I would disagree. Looking like the 5 year plan has gone tits up as I'm sure it can't have been to end up just as shit as when they first took over, with some largely uninspiring drivel served up for much of the time in between with the exception of a couple of highlights here and there, and no actual achievements of any merit. I for one expected more from both of them, and from MON as well. A big bag of five year shite really, considering the hype at the time.
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I wasn't happy when he got the job but thought, let's wait and see......
The minute he walked in he said we were mid-table team and something like we shouldnt fool ourselves into thinking we were Liverpool. This was despite we finished ahead of them last year. Also, they are hardly hte yardstick up against who clubs should be measured against.
The interview with Sky was cringing...especially the comment about them signing his name.
DO YOU THINK THEY WOULD HAVE BEEN SINGING YOUR NAME IF YOUR TEAM HADNT ROLLED OVER AND HAD THEIR BELLIES TICKLED?????
I was a fan of MON, thought he brought us forward every year. I know many on here werent and disagree. But I think we can all say that Houllier is undoing what Mon had built. Suddenly, our defence, which was one of the best in the league last year are playing like a Titus-Bramble-calamity-moments Tribute Act.
Would MON had stood for Dunne putting on so much weight?
It makes me sick how far we done fall
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From LFCs os;
He added: "It's difficult to say but I prefer to lose 3-0 to Liverpool because I like Liverpool.
a sacking offence pure and simple. He has to go.
What the fuck was he thinking!? He has only been here a few months and his quotes have been shocking.
No passion, regular love-ins with the opposition and open criticisms about several of our players.
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Your stance on Houllier may be correct, but that to me sounds like a director of football, not a manager. MON was a manager and regardless of what many thought of him on here, at least he was a focal point of the commitment of the team. I cam rarely remember a team giving up so completely so early under O'Neill.
You're bang on there. I think there is a DoF feel about Houllier. I almost wish that he had been given that title so he could sit slightly above the frenetic life of Premiership football as an intellectual observer i.e. doing what he is good at and let a younger manager bust his balls pitch-side.
I'm not sure he has the hunger to do both roles properly and his biggest skill (for me) was never motivation or indeed being the focal point of a club.
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This has probably been said in the preceding 7 pages but most of what I have read so far is drivel. My tuppence worth:
MON's greatest attribute was to get the most out of his players, making the the teams value greater than the sum of its parts. For example it is rare that a player moves away from MON and improves (unless he's been frozen out by MON).
Houllier on the flip side lacks this motivational acumen but is a better tactician and may be better at spotting players, building a club etc.
Therefore I am not surprised to see the form of the team decrease as I think a Houllier team needs players with more finesse than a MON team. At the moment it is literally MON squad with 10 injuries.
My worry is that the Villa faithful and indeed Houllier will not have the patients to wait the required 2 transfer windows to see any improvement.
Patience is a virtue but you have to get a balance between giving a guy a fair crack of the whip and just coasting/ procrastinating for the sake of it.
Does this patience extend all the way to the Championship, is that genuinely a price worth paying to make sure the guy has two transfer windows?
I don't actually think we will go down, but the situation needs to be monitored. If there are no obvious improvements, if we're seeing the same lack of effort and nous from the senior pros a decision would have to come sooner rather than later. Rather than just fobbing it off and saying it's all down to injuries et.c. Injuries do play a part, of course. But the players who are available are capable of far better than what they've delivered to date.
We've largely had a first choice back four to pick from all season, for example.
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Would MON had stood for Dunne putting on so much weight?
It was under MoN that happened. Dunne has been overweight and ponderous from season start. Of course GHou should have handcuffed him to an exercise bike as soon as he came in IMHO.
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I've already posted that the attitude of the team, coaches etc was unacceptable but I dont want him sacked tomorrow.
We all say some fucking stupid things after a defeat like that, just look at most of the threads tonight, he should be given the chance to explain himself.
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I've already posted that the attitude of the team, coaches etc was unacceptable but I dont want him sacked tomorrow.
We all say some fucking stupid things after a defeat like that, just look at most of the threads tonight, he should be given the chance to explain himself.
He won't explain himself because I truly believe he felt his behaviour was completely acceptable.He's banged on about lplop from day one
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It is a bit galling but he has to put himself up for interviews, in those interviews the journos are going to steer him toward speaking about LFC as they sell more papers than we do. He's been very naive tonight, I hope he learns from it.
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It is a bit galling but he has to put himself up for interviews, in those interviews the journos are going to steer him toward speaking about LFC as they sell more papers than we do. He's been very naive tonight, I hope he learns from it.
The man's in his sixties. He's been a football manager for three decades. I don't give a fuck if he does a hundred interviews a day, he can't honestly always be tricked into talking about Liverpool. The reason he does is because he likes to.
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I've already posted that the attitude of the team, coaches etc was unacceptable but I dont want him sacked tomorrow.
We all say some fucking stupid things after a defeat like that, just look at most of the threads tonight, he should be given the chance to explain himself.
I can write the script " am very pleased to be the manager of Aston Villa but I am also very proud to have managed the greatest club in the world which is Liverpool Football Club"
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This has probably been said in the preceding 7 pages but most of what I have read so far is drivel. My tuppence worth:
MON's greatest attribute was to get the most out of his players, making the the teams value greater than the sum of its parts. For example it is rare that a player moves away from MON and improves (unless he's been frozen out by MON).
Houllier on the flip side lacks this motivational acumen but is a better tactician and may be better at spotting players, building a club etc.
Therefore I am not surprised to see the form of the team decrease as I think a Houllier team needs players with more finesse than a MON team. At the moment it is literally MON squad with 10 injuries.
My worry is that the Villa faithful and indeed Houllier will not have the patients to wait the required 2 transfer windows to see any improvement.
Patience is a virtue but you have to get a balance between giving a guy a fair crack of the whip and just coasting/ procrastinating for the sake of it.
Does this patience extend all the way to the Championship, is that genuinely a price worth paying to make sure the guy has two transfer windows?
I don't actually think we will go down, but the situation needs to be monitored. If there are no obvious improvements, if we're seeing the same lack of effort and nous from the senior pros a decision would have to come sooner rather than later. Rather than just fobbing it off and saying it's all down to injuries et.c. Injuries do play a part, of course. But the players who are available are capable of far better than what they've delivered to date.
We've largely had a first choice back four to pick from all season, for example.
A good manager would - in my opinion - get the whole squad in a room and deliver a few home truths to the under performing players. Get it all out in the open and start again.
I'm not sure whether Houllier has the hunger to make himself unpopular as it will/could mean that a few of the experienced players throw their toys out. IF he is in it for the long term and wanting to rebuild the club then he would do this without blinking. (Again) My hunch is that the Villa Manager position is just be an ego thing and he will let things drift.
I'm not at the Houllier out stage - far from it - but I do want to see some pro-active management.
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He has shown utter contempt to Aston Villa, I have made my feelings on this subject known to The General, if he got fired tomorrow for his actions today I would not cry one tear,
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From LFCs os;
He told his post-match press conference: "The fans were good. I appreciated the fact that they chanted my name at the end. It shows they can remember.
"There was also a banner at the start of the game. I was not emotional but I was extremely touched by that."
He added: "It's difficult to say but I prefer to lose 3-0 to Liverpool because I like Liverpool.
These comments really seem like the sort of thing the manager of a newly promoted team would say after playing title contenders. Does Houllier know that we finished above Liverpool last season?
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From LFCs os;
He told his post-match press conference: "The fans were good. I appreciated the fact that they chanted my name at the end. It shows they can remember.
"There was also a banner at the start of the game. I was not emotional but I was extremely touched by that."
He added: "It's difficult to say but I prefer to lose 3-0 to Liverpool because I like Liverpool.
These comments really seem like the sort of thing the manager of a newly promoted team would say after playing title contenders. Does Houllier know that we finished above Liverpool last season?
I'm getting angrier and angrier by the minute
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It is a bit galling but he has to put himself up for interviews, in those interviews the journos are going to steer him toward speaking about LFC as they sell more papers than we do. He's been very naive tonight, I hope he learns from it.
The man's in his sixties. He's been a football manager for three decades. I don't give a fuck if he does a hundred interviews a day, he can't honestly always be tricked into talking about Liverpool. The reason he does is because he likes to.
He's operated at the very highest level in football, he's not some wet behind the ears Johnny Foreigner who has just arrived over here, either. He speaks better English than most of us do.
I like what GH is trying to do, I thought he was a good appointment at the time, and he has been cursed by wretched injury luck. However, I can't get away from a feeling that he's not going to be here very long, that things will conspire against him.
When he says things like this, though, it is absolutely fucking infuriating.
Firstly because it is so very, very tactless (had I travelled 100 miles each way and stood in the freezing cold to watch that tonight, then got home and heard those comments, I'd be very angry indeed).
Secondly, because it is somewhat belittling to the club and it is not the first time he's done it - the 7th-12th place, not a club on the level of Liverpool stuff.
Thirdly, because he is contending with enough bad luck and factors conspiring against him at the moment that this kind of thing just needlessly adds more pressure, and that is the last thing we need right now.
It is all a bit worrying.
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I have had a go at Houllier and now i'll defend him. As someone said earlier he inherited a certain brand of defensive footballer one who plays with ruggedness but little finesse and has tried to get them playing a different style of football. That's why Carlos cannot get a look in, great defender but a hoofer. The main cause of our problems is the injury list, i cannot remember when we had so many players unavailable, does anyone believe that with a full squad to pick from we would be in this position? my main concern is how long before NRC,Heskey are ready to play.
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I agree with Paulie, we are on the back of a gut wrenching defeat from the other lot, in a precarious league position and in desperate need of points and a performance. So he treats what is a critical match as a nice day out to visit a favourite relative, and totally disrespecting his employer our club and the supporters, Sorry I find his behaviour dispicable particylarly coming on the back of the many comments he has made in the past.
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Clampy , I'm not blaming houllier as such as this is not his team but I think his style of play would mean he'd have to totally rebuild and I don't think that randy will fund the amount of spending required.
I have serious doubts now as to whether randy feels we gave gone as far as we can under him and he is cutting back on the spending- nobody could foresee man city having this money and the top 4 looks further away now than when randy arrived.
Yes houllier can improve on mon but it would take time and Lots of money- is that available? I don't think so!
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When he was appointed I wanted to give him every opportunity to succeed. I simply couldn't buy into being strongly against the appointment until I saw what he had in mind. What his plans were, the results of a transfer window or two. We might not get that far given the fact that a few months in he seems to lack the passion and desire for the job. I wanted him to be angry tonight and he wasn't. I wanted him to be really disappointed that "his" team, be it suffering from injuries and illness didn't want to be there, and that they had let Villa fans down everywhere. Certainly those loyal followers who spent money to be there. Then to find out about comments he may have made, coupled with his body language. How do you defend after that?
It was always said that MON teams played above themselves for him. While his football may not have been that pretty at home, he created one of the most resolute sides on the road. Aside from a couple of instances, we saw a team that didn't know when it was beaten, and we had a remarkable record of coming back when we trailed in games. That's a great trait for any team to have. I cannot see any evidence at the moment that this team has the fight or confidence, let alone ability to dig deep and find something when the chips are down. And they needn't look to the bench for inspiration as it's not coming from there right now.
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It is a bit galling but he has to put himself up for interviews, in those interviews the journos are going to steer him toward speaking about LFC as they sell more papers than we do. He's been very naive tonight, I hope he learns from it.
The man's in his sixties. He's been a football manager for three decades. I don't give a fuck if he does a hundred interviews a day, he can't honestly always be tricked into talking about Liverpool. The reason he does is because he likes to.
He's operated at the very highest level in football, he's not some wet behind the ears Johnny Foreigner who has just arrived over here, either. He speaks better English than most of us do.
I like what GH is trying to do, I thought he was a good appointment at the time, and he has been cursed by wretched injury luck. However, I can't get away from a feeling that he's not going to be here very long, that things will conspire against him.
When he says things like this, though, it is absolutely fucking infuriating.
Firstly because it is so very, very tactless (had I travelled 100 miles each way and stood in the freezing cold to watch that tonight, then got home and heard those comments, I'd be very angry indeed).
Secondly, because it is somewhat belittling to the club and it is not the first time he's done it - the 7th-12th place, not a club on the level of Liverpool stuff.
Thirdly, because he is contending with enough bad luck and factors conspiring against him at the moment that this kind of thing just needlessly adds more pressure, and that is the last thing we need right now.
It is all a bit worrying.
I agree with this summation.
During interviews, he often gives the impression that he is dispensing pearls of wisdom like some dispassionate professor of football philosophy rather than an advocate for the club. On one occasion a while ago he even said to the assembled journos: "I know this will cause trouble because of what you will do with it ...", and then carried on regardless.
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I have a horrible feeling that his motivation in taking the job here was to try & turn round opinion of him about the job he did at liverpool. It doesn't feel like he gives a shit about us. If that's even remotely true were in big trouble.
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At Liverpool it was nice cop nasty cop with phil Thompson playing the tough strict guy, garry mac has been a flop as a coach and manager wherever he's been and was a poor choice of assistant I feel-as someone said houllier would be a good director of football with maybe martin jol as coach?
Mon had a hardworking team who played unattractive football but got results, houllier likes pass and move good football but these players are not good enough to play that way- it would need a complete rebuild!
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I think most of us appreciate the task GH has in front of him purely from a playing side of things. The fans for the most part are on his side and will give him time to make changes. What will shorten that window of opportunity considerably is how he conducts himself, and tonight has gone a long way to shortening his lifespan as Villa boss. I can deal with losing. Just don't quit on me.
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Much as I dislike Pinnochio, I do wonder whether results -and particularly defensive performances- would have been different had he taken the Assistant Manager gig.
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Much as I dislike Pinnochio, I do wonder whether results -and particularly defensive performances- would have been different had he taken the Assistant Manager gig.
It's a good question. Is GH the better man behind the scenes with Thompson the more vocal one? Either way, he isn't here, so GH has to make do. He can help himself immensely by making it apparent that this job, right now is the most important one he is doing. He's failing in that regard by what he has said tonight.
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The general saying last week that when fit our squad is capable of great things - I totally diSagree and worry that the board think we need minor tinkering- the squad needs a major overhaul , I'd like houllier to oversee things but jol as coach and houllier as director of football would be much more productive maybe!
At least we've just beat Australia in the cricket!
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I posted something similar in the General's thread but it really should go in here...
That he touched the Anfield sign: I don't care.
That he applauded the Liverpool fans: I don't care.
That he said he'd be ok losing 3-0 because he likes Liverpool: Pisses me off but I think I get what he's saying.
Let's face it, if GT had done all of the above on his return to Villa Park, if he'd said that if Watford were going to be dicked by anyone, he'd prefer it to be Villa, I wouldn't hold it against him and I don't think many here would, either.
But what has boiled my piss more than anything is this:
"The first goal stunned us and the second one was vital because it meant the game was over."
WHAT. THE. FUCK????????
Since when is a football game done and dusted at 2-0? Over the years (including this fucking horrible one), how many times have Man Fucking United come back from the dead? Did Tottingham HotCarl give up against us at 4-0 down? Did they fuck! Did we give up after being sucker-punched by Everton (there you go, Legion!)? Did we fuck!
Oooh, Liverpool are winning 1-0..whatever will we do? Ooooh, they're 2-0 up now. It's all over.
You brain-dead, fromage-munching simian of surrender! Fuck off out of Villa Park. Don't look back. Just fuck off.
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What sort of message does it give out to the players if the manager think the game is over at 2-0? It's negative and I don't want a manager who's going to install a negative mentality. However bad we were playing, if we managed to nick a goal at and make 2-1 we could of gone on a attack rampage putting lots of pressure on the defence and perhaps getting an equaliser - it's not just Man United who can do it, lots of teams can do it.
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Fuck O'Neill. Was never the man we thought he was.
As for Houllier, I supported him, I still do and think he would do an OK job given the time and resources... But that tonight is totally unforgiveable.
We're in a mess and someone needs to sort it soon.
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Comentators at 2-0 were saying how important the next goal would be. It'd either kill the game off or bring Villa back to life and really put what is a mentally fragile Liverpool under the kosh.
Of course, they weren't to know that the manager had given up all hope.
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Aye.
That wasn't a world class Liverpool side out there.
Pinching a goal either during the first half or early second would have put us right back in it. A win might have been out of the question, but a draw wouldn't have been completely unthinkable.
Similar defeatist bollocks after the Man U game "We knew they'd get a second once they got the first." We all probably felt that, but the guy in charge should be doing something to prevent it.
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It's not the performances that pissed me off. I think the positives in the performances have been there... I quite liked him until tonight, I'm astounded by his actions and I don't want him as our manager.
We're bigger and better than that.
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The game against the Baggies is huge not just for the club but also the manager, if Randy starts to believe that we are in real danger of being relegated he will take action, if just to protect his investment.
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I posted something similar in the General's thread but it really should go in here...
That he touched the Anfield sign: I don't care.
That he applauded the Liverpool fans: I don't care.
That he said he'd be ok losing 3-0 because he likes Liverpool: Pisses me off but I think I get what he's saying.
Let's face it, if GT had done all of the above on his return to Villa Park, if he'd said that if Watford were going to be dicked by anyone, he'd prefer it to be Villa, I wouldn't hold it against him and I don't think many here would, either.
But what has boiled my piss more than anything is this:
"The first goal stunned us and the second one was vital because it meant the game was over."
WHAT. THE. FUCK????????
Since when is a football game done and dusted at 2-0? Over the years (including this fucking horrible one), how many times have Man Fucking United come back from the dead? Did Tottingham HotCarl give up against us at 4-0 down? Did they fuck! Did we give up after being sucker-punched by Everton (there you go, Legion!)? Did we fuck!
Oooh, Liverpool are winning 1-0..whatever will we do? Ooooh, they're 2-0 up now. It's all over.
You brain-dead, fromage-munching simian of surrender! Fuck off out of Villa Park. Don't look back. Just fuck off.
True, but Watford fans would be pissed of by it and rightly so.
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I am eating humble pie re MON.
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I hate to say it (and I think that Villa would look bad if they did do this) BUT its a very convenient time for Jol to be looking for work.
The rumours previously suggest that Randy and the board are a fan.
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I gave the example of BFR in another thread and it's a decent enough comparison.
Everytime he returned with Cov and even much later in 1998 with an already relegated Forest he got a good reception from our lot. In particular the game in Feb 1995 v Cov just a few months after he was sacked.
You could tell he was chuffed, there is a picture of it in a match programme. But he wasn't milking the adulation, effectively mocking his current employer. We turned Cov over a few times (not in that game early in 1995 though) yet there was no "If I had to lose to anyone I'm glad it's Villa" type bollocks. Nor would we as fans of his ex club expect it.
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I hate to say it (and I think that Villa would look bad if they did do this) BUT its a very convenient time for Jol to be looking for work.
The rumours previously suggest that Randy and the board are a fan.
Could it be that GH knew something was afoot and that's why he dished out such fawning praise of our opponents tonight?
It's just about the only thing that would go some way to excusing his behaviour.
Doubt it though.
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Found this comment on the Guardian website about Houllier. It's (moderately) interesting as Houllier's comments do generally seem to undervalue what he has, for example saying Villa are a 12-7th club and not to mention what he said tonight:
"I have a lot of time for Houllier, but he didn't prepare us to be winners, and we still struggle from the after effects of that. The team that won that won the treble and the next season looked like challenging for the title had been forged as a team of underdogs. When Gerard came back from his surgery and declared the team 'ten games from greatness' the team just weren't mentally prepared for that abrupt shift from cunning underdogs to potential champions."
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When he was appointed I wanted to give him every opportunity to succeed. I simply couldn't buy into being strongly against the appointment until I saw what he had in mind. What his plans were, the results of a transfer window or two. We might not get that far given the fact that a few months in he seems to lack the passion and desire for the job. I wanted him to be angry tonight and he wasn't. I wanted him to be really disappointed that "his" team, be it suffering from injuries and illness didn't want to be there, and that they had let Villa fans down everywhere. Certainly those loyal followers who spent money to be there. Then to find out about comments he may have made, coupled with his body language. How do you defend after that?
It was always said that MON teams played above themselves for him. While his football may not have been that pretty at home, he created one of the most resolute sides on the road. Aside from a couple of instances, we saw a team that didn't know when it was beaten, and we had a remarkable record of coming back when we trailed in games. That's a great trait for any team to have. I cannot see any evidence at the moment that this team has the fight or confidence, let alone ability to dig deep and find something when the chips are down. And they needn't look to the bench for inspiration as it's not coming from there right now.
Toronto Villain,
I agree with your last paragraph and have made similar comments on another thread today. The irony is that MON would be the perfect manager for the position we are in now.
I think we still need to give Houllier time now – the man has not had a chance to sign a player of his own choosing yet.
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I am eating humble pie re MON.
I'm not, he can go and F#$@ himself with a stick of dynamite for all I care. He's one of the main reasons we're in this position now
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I am eating humble pie re MON.
I'm not, he can go and F#$@ himself with a stick of dynamite for all I care. He's one of the main reasons we're in this position now
We can't keep telling ourselves that.
Whilst he did leave us in a state leaving so close to the start of the season, 16 league games have been played since then.
Its not MON's fault that we are so poor defensively (the same defence under MON were largely excellent last season). It's not MON's fault that a no of senior players are showing such a lack of fight.
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I am eating humble pie re MON.
I'm not, he can go and F#$@ himself with a stick of dynamite for all I care. He's one of the main reasons we're in this position now
We can't keep telling ourselves that.
Whilst he did leave us in a state leaving so close to the start of the season, 16 league games have been played since then.
Its not MON's fault that we are so poor defensively (the same defence under MON were largely excellent last season). It's not MON's fault that a no of senior players are showing such a lack of fight.
I agree entirely and it's about time people started to realise that far from MON being the Villain in all this he was one of the best managers the club has had in recent years and we are not likely to get anyone remotely near to that for a long while. GH couldn't clean O'Neill's boots yet for some reason there are so many people on this site determined to denounce MON's achievements at the Villa and blame him for this mess. The board got the wrong man in GH and that is so blatantly obvious.
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He's been here 3 months tomorrow, I think his probation period has been quite revealing.
He's not the man we need.
Get on the phone to Martin Jol now Randy.
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There is a marked difference with the return of Taylor to Villa Park with Watford.
He had achieved at both clubs.
GH has achieved nothing at Villa, and after last night is not likely to.
I said after the Small Heath game that we would be in the bottom three by Christmas. I stand by that but what galls me even more is that is it plainly obvious that the manager doesn't give a fuck.
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I just cannot believe he said what he did.
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We're a few games away from "'Cherar 'Oully-eh" declaring football fans fickle. This feels like DOL mk 2. Get rid now. We all now its not going to last.
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How many times has Houllier said "we are in this together".He's comments last night just make that statement sound really hollow.
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I am eating humble pie re MON.
I'm not, he can go and F#$@ himself with a stick of dynamite for all I care. He's one of the main reasons we're in this position now
I'll hand him the lighter.
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I was optimistic with the GH appointment & have always tried to back him & stick up for him, but this morning I'm finding it difficult.
We really need to beat Wigan & WBA in our next 2 games, then Lerner & GH need to get together and work out the plan for January.
If we don't get 6 points from Wigan & WBA then maybe GH needs to go, then we need to bring the right manager and back him in January.
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I was optimistic with the GH appointment & have always tried to back him & stick up for him, but this morning I'm finding it difficult.
We really need to beat Wigan & WBA in our next 2 games, then Lerner & GH need to get together and work out the plan for January.
If we don't get 6 points from Wigan & WBA then maybe GH needs to go, then we need to bring the right manager and back him in January.
I have to agree that his next two games are likely to make or break things for him. With games against Spurs, Man City and Chelsea to follow, we will be in the bottom three in the new year without a couple of wins to lift the club.
He has had terrible luck with injuries but the team seems to have taken on the personality of the manager - downbeat, hesitant and uninspiring.
Even ignoring the comments he's made after the game, there is a lack of organisation, spirit and togetherness that suggests all is not well behind the scenes.
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I think we're missing some key players that we've been too quick to criticise in the past, Heskey, Petrov & NRC. (no.... not you Sidwell you mother fucker).
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I just cannot believe he said what he did.
I'm not in a position to look at the video on BBC's site at the moment so can someone provide a link to the text of it or paste the transcript here please?
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I don't think many Villa fans were convinced by Houlliers appointment, his performance so far has done nohing to convince anyone since.
As the man to bring on a squad able to finish 6th he had possibilities but as the man to deal with a back to the wall relegation fight he's a no hope.
Problem is Randy Lerner is not going to admit his error and replace him, is he even though its very possible Houllier, by his actions re his love for Liverpool, has made his position nigh on untenable.
A brave owner would cut his losses, swallow his pride and find a manager full of motivation, who believes in Villa and who has something to prove.
Is Randy that owner. Doubt it very much.
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Let's not start doubting Randy, he's done nothing wrong since the day he walked in IMO.
The fact is, we don't know what Randy is going to do.
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Randy's single mistake, in my opinion, is not hiring a real football man at the top. He himself has been most benevolent and quite in sync with the Villa fans. But, he'll need to be in this game for a few years yet before he knows it from the inside. Hiring the ginger who looks like a school kid was never going to cut it.
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Let's not start doubting Randy, he's done nothing wrong since the day he walked in IMO.
The fact is, we don't know what Randy is going to do.
He appointed Houllier. That's a big fat something wrong.
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To think how we played against ManU to last night. Something clearly is not right. Yes we can pass the ball and keep the ball but it counts for nothing if we dont get it to our strikers. Don't forget only Heskey is out the other 3 are available. And the defence is virtually at full strength. I expect that GH could bring in some players and improve things but without the passion and desire we wont win anything. He has the bits that MON lacked buts lacks the positives of MON. Between them you might get a winning manager.
If Jol or Coyle want the job - then now is the time.
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I can't believe some of the comments on here, yes last night's, dare I call it performance, was terrible, yes recent results have been bad and our league position is bad, yet Houllier has come in when the season is already under way, adopted a squad not of his choosing, and had to contend with a massive injury and illness list.
Let's get a few things out of the way.
Of course Houllier cares and gives a damn, but if your expecting him to get angry and start jumping up and down, you'll be waiting a long time, that's just not his style.
Yes Houllier has an obvious affection for Liverpool, and has made some ill judged comments and gestures regarding this, but remember again most of his comments have been made in response to questions put to him by the media and he is just replying honestly. You would think an intelligent person like him would possibly be a little more candid but he certainly doesn't intend any disrespect to our club in doing so.
By most peoples' opinions we had a squad at the start of the season that was capable of between 10th and 6th, this is still the case. If we had to put the squad out we did last night for every game, then yes we would be almost certain relegation fodder, but we don't. The team is missing it's heart at the moment, not in terms of motivation and commitment, but in terms of midfield injuries. Our midfield wasn't strong enough anyway, with injuries it is now weak and inexperienced, skilled yes, but without the toughness or nous needed at this level. We had a central defender playing there last night, another player that has only played a few premier league games in his life, a useless Ireland and two skilful but lightweight midfielders. Reo Coker, Petrov and Young all have their detractors but they would have made a big difference last night. Even Bannan would have made a difference.
That said I do have my concerns, mostly centred around the type of football he has us playing with the players we have available.
When we are in a position as we are now, with a lot of injuries and low down the table, the first thing we need to be doing is making ourselves hard to beat and keeping clean sheets. In our last 5 games we have conceded 3, 2, 4, 2 & 2 goals, that's 13 goals in 5 games, we now have the 4th worst goal difference on -10, and that is a very worrying sign. We need to be playing a compact midfield in front of the back four to protect them and play on the break. After all, this is the style of football many of the players we have are best at playing. Sorry but I don't want to see Dunne and Colins playing tippy tappy on the edge of our area for half the game.
Those calling for Jol to take over, remember, he was axed at Tottenham when they were in a similar position at a similar time of year, without half the injury problems we now have. Most people thought that was a ridiculous act, which it was. I'm sure Houllier will come good eventually, but he has certainly had a quick wake up call as to exactly how tough the Premier League is these days.
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To think how we played against ManU to last night. Something clearly is not right....
We did to Man Utd what Liverpool did to us.
The BIG difference is that one manager saw the game as over, the other got his team to grow some nuts and salvaged something from it.
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I agree entirely and it's about time people started to realise that far from MON being the Villain in all this he was one of the best managers the club has had in recent years and we are not likely to get anyone remotely near to that for a long while. GH couldn't clean O'Neill's boots yet for some reason there are so many people on this site determined to denounce MON's achievements at the Villa and blame him for this mess. The board got the wrong man in GH and that is so blatantly obvious.
Whilst the injuries don't help, MON spent a load of money on tat and left us with a squad so thin that we are having to play the kids while in a very precarious situation. That's MON's legacy and its criminal.
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I can't believe some of the comments on here, yes last night's, dare I call it performance, was terrible, yes recent results have been bad and our league position is bad, yet Houllier has come in when the season is already under way, adopted a squad not of his choosing, and had to contend with a massive injury and illness list.
Let's get a few things out of the way.
Of course Houllier cares and gives a damn, but if your expecting him to get angry and start jumping up and down, you'll be waiting a long time, that's just not his style.
Yes Houllier has an obvious affection for Liverpool, and has made some ill judged comments and gestures regarding this, but remember again most of his comments have been made in response to questions put to him by the media and he is just replying honestly. You would think an intelligent person like him would possibly be a little more candid but he certainly doesn't intend any disrespect to our club in doing so.
By most peoples' opinions we had a squad at the start of the season that was capable of between 10th and 6th, this is still the case. If we had to put the squad out we did last night for every game, then yes we would be almost certain relegation fodder, but we don't. The team is missing it's heart at the moment, not in terms of motivation and commitment, but in terms of midfield injuries. Our midfield wasn't strong enough anyway, with injuries it is now weak and inexperienced, skilled yes, but without the toughness or nous needed at this level. We had a central defender playing there last night, another player that has only played a few premier league games in his life, a useless Ireland and two skilful but lightweight midfielders. Reo Coker, Petrov and Young all have their detractors but they would have made a big difference last night. Even Bannan would have made a difference.
That said I do have my concerns, mostly centred around the type of football he has us playing with the players we have available.
When we are in a position as we are now, with a lot of injuries and low down the table, the first thing we need to be doing is making ourselves hard to beat and keeping clean sheets. In our last 5 games we have conceded 3, 2, 4, 2 & 2 goals, that's 13 goals in 5 games, we now have the 4th worst goal difference on -10, and that is a very worrying sign. We need to be playing a compact midfield in front of the back four to protect them and play on the break. After all, this is the style of football many of the players we have are best at playing. Sorry but I don't want to see Dunne and Colins playing tippy tappy on the edge of our area for half the game.
Those calling for Jol to take over, remember, he was axed at Tottenham when they were in a similar position at a similar time of year, without half the injury problems we now have. Most people thought that was a ridiculous act, which it was. I'm sure Houllier will come good eventually, but he has certainly had a quick wake up call as to exactly how tough the Premier League is these days.
Some good points and well made.
Care to explain why though at 2-0 down with at least 45 mins of football to play, he thought we were dead and buried? Sorry, but I can gloss over the other stuff. Not that.
Every time we go behind now, I'll be deeply concerned about the mind-set of the manager as, by extension, his players.
What a pussy!
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Okay, folks. I can take the hint. I'll find the quote myself.
But if it really was along the lines of "I'd rather we lost like that to Liverpool" and nothing else then I think there's been a serious over-reaction here. Yes, it's bad, but not on the scale of D'ohleary's constant drip-feed of belittling of the club.
And while pissed off at any 3-0 defeat, the injury list is surely a huge mitigating circumstance.
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Randy's single mistake, in my opinion, is not hiring a real football man at the top. He himself has been most benevolent and quite in sync with the Villa fans. But, he'll need to be in this game for a few years yet before he knows it from the inside. Hiring the ginger who looks like a school kid was never going to cut it.
Can't disagree with this Troy, I feel the same.
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Having slept on it I have woken up even angrier.Have just watched him on SSN pre match being shown around as if he was on a stadium tour.He used this match as a chance to reminisce on days gone by.He's lost it and he doesn't care so how can you expect the players to care
The 2-0 comment was unforgivable.He has turned us into a laughing stock
Please leave now..
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Care to explain why though at 2-0 down with at least 45 mins of football to play, he thought we were dead and buried? Sorry, but I can gloss over the other stuff. Not that.
Every time we go behind now, I'll be deeply concerned about the mind-set of the manager as, by extension, his players.
What a pussy!
Well from the quotes i have heard and read, his words weren't exactly contentious, it is always going to be hard to come back from 2 - 0 down after 20 minutes against any team. Yes it's possible, yes we should aim to come back, but it still doesn't mean it is easy. Especially with an injury striken young squad that is no doubt a little fragile on confidence.
My main concern, as said above, are not Houllier's comments, but our defence, he needs to address that now, we're being cut apart like butter far far too often.
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To think how we played against ManU to last night. Something clearly is not right....
We did to Man Utd what Liverpool did to us.
The BIG difference is that one manager saw the game as over, the other got his team to grow some nuts and salvaged something from it.
I like a lot of what Houlier's been trying to do, and think it could work eventually, if we are not relegated in the meantime. But at the end of the day you need to have some fight, passion and belief. If the manager is effectively surrendering after 15 or 16 minutes of a game, you've got no chance. There's no excuse for that kind of attitude. Couple that with his ill judged fawning over Liverpool and Í find myself supporting GH a lot les than I did a week ago.
You are also spot on about the lack of a Board Member with genuine football background and knowldege Troy, I've been saying it for ages.
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Okay, folks. I can take the hint. I'll find the quote myself.
But if it really was along the lines of "I'd rather we lost like that to Liverpool" and nothing else then I think there's been a serious over-reaction here. Yes, it's bad, but not on the scale of D'ohleary's constant drip-feed of belittling of the club.
And while pissed off at any 3-0 defeat, the injury list is surely a huge mitigating circumstance.
Chris, I suspect he was TRYING to say that, if we had to get dicked 3-0 by someone, he'd have preferred it to be Liverpool. And I can understand that. Just maybe poorly translated. And very poorly advised.
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Okay, folks. I can take the hint. I'll find the quote myself.
But if it really was along the lines of "I'd rather we lost like that to Liverpool" and nothing else then I think there's been a serious over-reaction here. Yes, it's bad, but not on the scale of D'ohleary's constant drip-feed of belittling of the club.
And while pissed off at any 3-0 defeat, the injury list is surely a huge mitigating circumstance.
Chris, I suspect he was TRYING to say that, if we had to get dicked 3-0 by someone, he'd have preferred it to be Liverpool. And I can understand that. Just maybe poorly translated. And very poorly advised.
That's what I think it was.
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Okay, folks. I can take the hint. I'll find the quote myself.
But if it really was along the lines of "I'd rather we lost like that to Liverpool" and nothing else then I think there's been a serious over-reaction here. Yes, it's bad, but not on the scale of D'ohleary's constant drip-feed of belittling of the club.
And while pissed off at any 3-0 defeat, the injury list is surely a huge mitigating circumstance.
Chris, I suspect he was TRYING to say that, if we had to get dicked 3-0 by someone, he'd have preferred it to be Liverpool. And I can understand that. Just maybe poorly translated. And very poorly advised.
That's what I think it was.
Normally I wouuld go along with this completely but it was all the other shite.The out of it at 2-0 comment was unforgivable as was the lack of acknowledgement of our fans.As somebody said it felt like watching a testimonal.He's not up to it
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I've not seen any of the game, but I'd imagine that at 2-0 down we were out of it.
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Not sure where to post this,but i'd be interested to hear what other people think if Sid has any power in GH thoughts,as he knows the strengths and limitations of the team better than anyone in the set up.Sid's a footballing genius,and if we all can see Dunne's lack of form,then so can Sid,and he will know what Carlos is capable of at centreback. I wonder if its a case og GH not taking Sid's views on board??
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I've not seen any of the game, but I'd imagine that at 2-0 down we were out of it.
[/quote
According to our manager...yes
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I posted something similar in the General's thread but it really should go in here...
That he touched the Anfield sign: I don't care.
That he applauded the Liverpool fans: I don't care.
That he said he'd be ok losing 3-0 because he likes Liverpool: Pisses me off but I think I get what he's saying.
Let's face it, if GT had done all of the above on his return to Villa Park, if he'd said that if Watford were going to be dicked by anyone, he'd prefer it to be Villa, I wouldn't hold it against him and I don't think many here would, either.
But what has boiled my piss more than anything is this:
"The first goal stunned us and the second one was vital because it meant the game was over."
WHAT. THE. FUCK????????
Since when is a football game done and dusted at 2-0? Over the years (including this fucking horrible one), how many times have Man Fucking United come back from the dead? Did Tottingham HotCarl give up against us at 4-0 down? Did they fuck! Did we give up after being sucker-punched by Everton (there you go, Legion!)? Did we fuck!
Oooh, Liverpool are winning 1-0..whatever will we do? Ooooh, they're 2-0 up now. It's all over.
You brain-dead, fromage-munching simian of surrender! Fuck off out of Villa Park. Don't look back. Just fuck off.
After the Man U home game the other week, I remember in the post match interview GH saying "Once they'd pulled one back, I just knew they'd get another".
I remember thinking at the time WTF?!?
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I knew they'd get another.
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While I might like what Houllier is trying to do on the football side there's a lot I dislike on his management of the players. He seems to have instilled his personality into them. Witness our current captain laughing and joking with the opposition after we've been dicked 4 - 2 at home to Arsenal. Witness our players in the tunnel prior to the recent Blues game...laughing and joking with the opposition. As much as we might dislike the Gary Neville and Roy Keane type characters I'd rather that sort of character representing us coming out of the tunnel leading the team than the current lot.
We lack fight. Our will to win mirrors the motivation that is coming from the top. Getting beaten 3 - 0 against Liverpool is not the worst result in the world, the manner of the result is what concerns, no fight, no leadership, no one seeming too bothered, no players locked in the dressing room for an hour to get the hairdryer treatment for such an inept woeful display.
We can see what is going wrong I'm sure Lerner and Co can too. Time to act I'm afraid, before it's too late.
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all i am going to say is....
after Baggies and Wigan our games are.....
Spurs (H)
Man City (A)
Chelsea (A)
Sunderland (H)
Brum (A)
Man City (H)
Man United (A)
I'm fooking shitting myself!!! OK we then have 8 games all winnable after this but could we pick ourselves up if we do lose all but 1 of these games?????
West Brom and Wigan are must must must win games!!!!!!! we have to win or i think we may be screwed!
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I've not seen any of the game, but I'd imagine that at 2-0 down we were out of it.
According to our manager...yes
Sorry but can you point me to where he said this? From what i have seen and read in one interview he said that after the third goal, it was "difficult", and he later said that conceeding the first goal so early was "difficult".
In another interview he was asked:
"Gerard you know more than anyone else how difficult it is at Anfield to concede two goals and come out with anything at all."
To which he replied it affected us but he thought we started well in the second half, but when we conceded the third goal the game was over.
So either you have watched or read an interview i havent or you are making this up.
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Ah, i found it on the OS! Still taken in context i still think it's been blown all out of proportion.
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I've not seen any of the game, but I'd imagine that at 2-0 down we were out of it.
According to our manager...yes
Sorry but can you point me to where he said this? From what i have seen and read in one interview he said that after the third goal, it was "difficult", and he later said that conceeding the first goal so early was "difficult".
In another interview he was asked:
"Gerard you know more than anyone else how difficult it is at Anfield to concede two goals and come out with anything at all."
To which he replied it affected us but he thought we started well in the second half, but when we conceded the third goal the game was over.
So either you have watched or read an interview i havent or you are making this up.
Apologies have watched again was watching through alcohol fuzz last night and that mixed with comments on here may have misconstrued what he said.Hasn't really changed things in my mind though I still found him completely disrespectful
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The team mirrors the manager... that is why the team is so utterly spineless and totally devoid of any passion!
The players are NOT bad players!
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I've not seen any of the game, but I'd imagine that at 2-0 down we were out of it.
No. If Villa had hit back before half-time, Liverpool would not have been able to cruise the way they did.
Even the commentators said that a Villa goal would really put the pressure on. This is basic football...get a goal back, momentum swings your way, the psychological factors are huge! I remember when Blues got their goal during our 5-1 win, I was mentally working out how many goals per minute they'd need to get back into it. I think we all knew when Man Utd pulled on back against us recently that there was a MASSIVE psychological shift in the game. Last nights match was no different.
Except in Houllier's mind.
3-0, I'll accept that, baring a miracle, we're fucked. But 2-0 with an awful lot of the game to play for....??
I just hope this attitude only extends to his beloved Liverpool, because if we go two down against the Boggies and he gives up, I can see Mr. Woodhall knocking on his door wearing a suit made of semtex.
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Its far to early to be thinking about sacking houllier, we cant judge him on MON's players, he has got a squad of players that are either under perfoming and/or dont want to be here and it will be hard for him to motivate them if they dont want to be here.
i think we should at least give him till march and see how the players he brings in perform. the only mistake he has made is not changing the back 4 after THEY have cost us so many points.
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I've not seen any of the game, but I'd imagine that at 2-0 down we were out of it.
According to our manager...yes
Sorry but can you point me to where he said this? From what i have seen and read in one interview he said that after the third goal, it was "difficult", and he later said that conceeding the first goal so early was "difficult".
In another interview he was asked:
"Gerard you know more than anyone else how difficult it is at Anfield to concede two goals and come out with anything at all."
To which he replied it affected us but he thought we started well in the second half, but when we conceded the third goal the game was over.
So either you have watched or read an interview i havent or you are making this up.
Apologies have watched again was watching through alcohol fuzz last night and that mixed with comments on here may have misconstrued what he said.Hasn't really changed things in my mind though I still found him completely disrespectful
No need to apologise as i found the quote on the OS. So sorry for casting aspersions.
"The second goal was offside but it was a vital goal because it means that the game is over.
"After that we took some time to get back into the game really and start playing."
Though there he seems to go on and contradict himself.
"...we conceded a third goal on the break and I think that was it."
Then he says:
"I knew at 2-0 up it would be difficult to come back. Had we scored maybe it would have been different because the confidence would have been changed."
So he said it, but whatever you think of Houllier though, i still think it is unfair to say he had given up after the second goal.
To be honest though, with the team we had out, how many of us really thought we would come back after the second goal?
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I'm sensing anger here guys.
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I'm sensing anger here guys.
You are some kind of sorcerer. ;)
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I'm sensing anger here guys.
mixed with a dollop of humilliation
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The team mirrors the manager... that is why the team is so utterly spineless and totally devoid of any passion!
The players are NOT bad players!
I cannot for the life of me understand that the manager is responsible for some of the School Boy defending that Dunne, Collins and Warnock have been guilty of lately. They don't exactly give us any kind of springboard in games. That alone puts us on the back foot. Until they get their act together, then we struggle to stamp anything on the games that we are playing recently.
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Houllier's conduct was a disgrace last night especially with the team just rolling over.
i expect better from him over these next two games.
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Time to show us he has balls by dropping warnock, Collins and dunne!
Friedal
lichaj Cuellar. Clark. L young
Downing. Bannan. Hogg. Albrighton
A young. Agbonlahor
That's how I'd play on saturday!
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The team mirrors the manager... that is why the team is so utterly spineless and totally devoid of any passion!
The players are NOT bad players!
I cannot for the life of me understand that the manager is responsible for some of the School Boy defending that Dunne, Collins and Warnock have been guilty of lately. They don't exactly give us any kind of springboard in games. That alone puts us on the back foot. Until they get their act together, then we struggle to stamp anything on the games that we are playing recently.
Well surely some of the blame can be levelled at Houllier and the coaches for how they are set up and the kind of protection they are getting? It would appear that our defensive tactics have changed and it's not working, maybe coupled with injured out of form players and little protection in front of them. Something has got to be done though. A clean sheet against the baggies is of upmost importance.
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The team mirrors the manager... that is why the team is so utterly spineless and totally devoid of any passion!
The players are NOT bad players!
I cannot for the life of me understand that the manager is responsible for some of the School Boy defending that Dunne, Collins and Warnock have been guilty of lately. They don't exactly give us any kind of springboard in games. That alone puts us on the back foot. Until they get their act together, then we struggle to stamp anything on the games that we are playing recently.
Well surely some of the blame can be levelled at Houllier and the coaches for how they are set up and the kind of protection they are getting? It would appear that our defensive tactics have changed and it's not working, maybe coupled with injured out of form players and little protection in front of them. Something has got to be done though. A clean sheet against the baggies is of upmost importance.
That maybe the case and to agree perhaps he has not got a grip of the situation
But I was cringing at some of the play from those 3 last night. These are not "freshmen" so to speak, but seasoned Pros and Internationals. Warnock went in for one tackle where he went to ground and was 70/30 in favour of getting the ball.. he then went half hearted at it and the Liverpool Player just walked through it. If I had done that in Sunday Football a few years ago, I would have had my arse kicked by the Captain.
The 3 of them are guilty of some shocking defending lately, that is just unacceptable. These are the players that I would be expecting to stand up and be counted in the situ that we find ourselves in
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Its far to early to be thinking about sacking houllier, we cant judge him on MON's players, he has got a squad of players that are either under perfoming and/or dont want to be here and it will be hard for him to motivate them if they dont want to be here.
i think we should at least give him till march and see how the players he brings in perform. the only mistake he has made is not changing the back 4 after THEY have cost us so many points.
Can we afford to wait ?
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My worry is why Dunne and Collins are so poor this season (They were excellent last), Warnock is having a nightmare as well and i am not sure why we can only ever play for 45 mins. I would give the manager until the end of Jan (See what he does with the window) but we may have to sever ties if we are staring down the barrel of relegation come the end of Feb.Somebody did say to me last night that if we went down we would probaly win the Championship and it is a trophy after all.
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Its far to early to be thinking about sacking houllier, we cant judge him on MON's players, he has got a squad of players that are either under perfoming and/or dont want to be here and it will be hard for him to motivate them if they dont want to be here.
i think we should at least give him till march and see how the players he brings in perform. the only mistake he has made is not changing the back 4 after THEY have cost us so many points.
Can we afford to wait ?
can we afford to rock the ship anymore, we need stability. we havent had it with the starting line up with so many injuries, i think houllier will come good once january has come and gone, and when we get the likes of NRC, heskey and delph back fit
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It's got worse since Emile was injured, more onus on the defence to play their way out of trouble, with no option to go long as it doesn't stick without Heskey. I didn't think M'ON was getting the best of of the players, but looking where we are now, maybe he was, 6th 3 yrs in a row, if Houllier gets close to that I'd be amazed. Can't just keep blaming M'ON for bad timing in leaving, he left GH with a far stronger squad than he inherited. This season shouldn't have been a transition, we should have maintained our top 6/7 place and kicked on again next yr.
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If the board are having doubts then there is point giving him money in jan only to sack him in feb- jol is available now!
If the board have no doubts then they must back him to the hilt and give him time and lots of money to rebuild his squad- it's their call!
As I said on another thread I would see houllier succeeding but oy given huge amounts to rebuild with- if they are thinking £20m will do it then there is no chance, I think he would be ideal to keep as a director of football to build scouting and other parts of the club and get jol team manager- if they can't get jol then keep houllier.
Pedro, the squad left wasn't that great , take milner out of last seasons team and I doubt we would have finished higher than 10th.how many of our players would get into a top 5 team?
It is rare for someone of jols quality to be available do if they want him they would have to act fast.
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No excuses for last night but I still think he should be judged when he's got something like a full strength squad to choose from and when he's had a chance to spend some money.
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No excuses for last night but I still think he should be judged when he's got something like a full strength squad to choose from and when he's had a chance to spend some money.
two 1st team players were missing !! from the starting 11. cant use the "injured players" crap now
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He deserves the window so we can see what he can do, i just worry what he will do. According to Alan Brazil on talksport this morning MON is ready to come back to football in the new year.
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He deserves the window so we can see what he can do, i just worry what he will do. According to Alan Brazil on talksport this morning MON is ready to come back to football in the new year.
worried what he can do ?? he has been linked with juninho.. jesus christ !!
and dont get me started on his pires signing !! its like watching your dad having a kick about, the bloke is crocked !!
i am terrified as to what shite he is going to buy in the window !!
Michael Owen and Juninho are my bets !!
great !!
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No excuses for last night but I still think he should be judged when he's got something like a full strength squad to choose from and when he's had a chance to spend some money.
two 1st team players were missing !! from the starting 11. cant use the "injured players" crap now
Young, Heskey, Reo Coker, Petrov, Bannan. That's more than two.
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No excuses for last night but I still think he should be judged when he's got something like a full strength squad to choose from and when he's had a chance to spend some money.
two 1st team players were missing !! from the starting 11. cant use the "injured players" crap now
Heskey, NRC, Petrov, Ashley Young and Possibly Barry Bannan for me. That's not 2, that's half a team.
Heskey is a curveball in that list I have to admit but with a barely fit Gabby we'd need him to start.
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No excuses for last night but I still think he should be judged when he's got something like a full strength squad to choose from and when he's had a chance to spend some money.
two 1st team players were missing !! from the starting 11. cant use the "injured players" crap now
It's not 'crap' it just doesn't suit your one eyed argument.
Petrov, Young, Reo Coker, Heskey, Sidwell, Bannan and Delph are all further up the pecking order than some who played last night.
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1) young was only suspended last night so that dont count for the previous games
2) heskey wont start with gabby fit
3) bannan wont start
4) so that means 2 1st teamers ( petrov and reo coker )
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1) young was only suspended last night so that dont count for the previous games
2) heskey wont start with gabby fit
3) bannan wont start
4) so that means 2 1st teamers ( petrov and reo coker )
That don't count? I think you will find you mean doesn't or does not.
You're moving the goalposts here. You said 'no excuses for last night' meaning not the season so far but our game against Liverpool. Without any of our key attacking midfield players (Young, Downing and Albrighton) we've looked crap and for much of this run we have been missing at least one.
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1) young was only suspended last night so that dont count for the previous games
2) heskey wont start with gabby fit
3) bannan wont start
4) so that means 2 1st teamers ( petrov and reo coker )
1) You were talking about last night.
2) He may, or
3) He could have been used as a sub.
4) So that means five players who could have played a role in last night's game were out, before talking about others who may have been involved.
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1) young was only suspended last night so that dont count for the previous games
2) heskey wont start with gabby fit
3) bannan wont start
4) so that means 2 1st teamers ( petrov and reo coker )
As I said a full squad. He's not been able to pick the same side two games running, he's got few options to change things if players are struggling.
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Dave, Who would you rather have as Aston Villa manager. The club you pay money to go and see
Martin Jol ( possibly )
Gerald Houllier
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Dave, Who would you rather have as Aston Villa manager. The club you pay money to go and see
Martin Jol ( possibly )
Gerald Houllier
I'd rather keep Houllier at the moment, because getting rid of him after three months would be ridiculous. I'd also like to know when Martin Jol became the next Clough and why he would join us.
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Well he's currently out of work, and if we aren't a bigger attraction than Newcastle, then that's a fairly serious indictment of Randy's ownership.
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Well he's currently out of work, and if we aren't a bigger attraction than Newcastle, then that's a fairly serious indictment of Randy's ownership.
But that presupposes that we don't have a Manager. Whether we like it or not we do and to change at this point despite everythuing done and said in the last 24 hours would be panicking of the highest order.
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Well, TalkSport are taking Villa and Houllier from 4pm.
I don't like the show, but I'll give it a listen.
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Dave, Who would you rather have as Aston Villa manager. The club you pay money to go and see
Martin Jol ( possibly )
Gerald Houllier
There are two issues from last night, and they are seperate ones.
1. The piss poor performance of the team. Given the fact he hasn't been here long, given the fact we have crippling injury issues, given the fact that that would test even a manager who has been in situ a long time, let alone a relatively new one, he's still got a long way to go before we should start demanding his removal.
2. The comments after the match. These worried me. I thought they were disrespectful, ill thought out, and totally avoidable. They've really just added to the pressure around the club, and give the impression he's a bloke who doesn't really "get" the club.
I think he should be told in no uncertain terms that that sort of thing is really unacceptable.
Do I think he should lose his job over it? No. Do I think he should stop this kind of thing toute de suite? Yes.
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Dave, Who would you rather have as Aston Villa manager. The club you pay money to go and see
Martin Jol ( possibly )
Gerald Houllier
I'd rather keep Houllier at the moment, because getting rid of him after three months would be ridiculous. I'd also like to know when Martin Jol became the next Clough and why he would join us.
Houllier for me to,
you cant just keep changing the manager just because we have hit a bad patch,
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Get him out now, i genuinely believe he could take us down. It smacks of Albion under Mowbray to me, trying to play passing football but not having the players to do it and failing spectacularly and not changing the style of play.
Go and get Coyle from Bolton, he'd do well here.
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Get him out now, i genuinely believe he could take us down. It smacks of Albion under Mowbray to me, trying to play passing football but not having the players to do it and failing spectacularly and not changing the style of play.
Go and get Coyle from Bolton, he'd do well here.
apart from the fact that Coyle plays exactly the same type of passing game you say we cant play,
great manager though, but he would still need to change a few players, as will Houllier
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Get him out now, i genuinely believe he could take us down. It smacks of Albion under Mowbray to me, trying to play passing football but not having the players to do it and failing spectacularly and not changing the style of play.
Go and get Coyle from Bolton, he'd do well here.
apart from the fact that Coyle plays exactly the same type of passing game you say we cant play,
great manager though, but he would still need to change a few players, as will Houllier
But the fact is Houllier can't get us doing it right, Coyle can. Bolton played like Stoke before he got there and they've got average players on paper but he's got them playing like Barcelona (sort of).
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But the fact is Houllier can't get us doing it right, Coyle can
But it took Coyle 2 months to win his first league game for Bolton. He'd have been hounded out of Villa park if he'd made a similar start here
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Dave, Who would you rather have as Aston Villa manager. The club you pay money to go and see
Martin Jol ( possibly )
Gerald Houllier
I'd rather keep Houllier at the moment, because getting rid of him after three months would be ridiculous. I'd also like to know when Martin Jol became the next Clough and why he would join us.
Houllier for me to,
you cant just keep changing the manager just because we have hit a bad patch,
Is there a huge bout of amnesia sweeping the midlands at the moment, or are we just not caring that we have an injury list as long as my wife's shopping list?
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What did talksport have to say, i'm sure it wasn't very groundbreaking but if there was anything can anyone share it with us?
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Dave, Who would you rather have as Aston Villa manager. The club you pay money to go and see
Martin Jol ( possibly )
Gerald Houllier
I'd rather keep Houllier at the moment, because getting rid of him after three months would be ridiculous. I'd also like to know when Martin Jol became the next Clough and why he would join us.
Houllier for me to,
you cant just keep changing the manager just because we have hit a bad patch,
Is there a huge bout of amnesia sweeping the midlands at the moment, or are we just not caring that we have an injury list as long as my wife's shopping list?
We do have injuries but we also only have 17 points. If this situation continues over Christmas they will have absolutely no choice but to sack the manager which is a shame, but I'd rather they did that than us get relegated. If there is no positive reaction this weekend from the players he should walk as the display last night (despite the injuries) was abject and his attitude, however well intentioned and respectful to his old club, alienated him from a lot of Villa fans and we all know what happens next.
As daft as it sounds, if we lose against the baggies he'll go and I can't see many being overly concerned.
One thing, people seem to forget that these kids that we have that are so exciting will still be here after Houllier. They are products of the club, not GH. He has had to play them is all.
Hopefully we stuff the stripey filth and the players show they are still playing for the bloke.
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People keep banging on about these injuries, the fact is most if not all of the players who are missing are either average or shit and wouldn't make any difference. We had our first team against Newcastle and still showed no fight and lost 6-0, and it's our first choice keeper and defence that have been playing and they're the main culprits.
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People keep banging on about these injuries, the fact is most if not all of the players who are missing are either average or shit and wouldn't make any difference. We had our first team against Newcastle and still showed no fight and lost 6-0, and it's our first choice keeper and defence that have been playing and they're the main culprits.
This is true, it's not the kids letting us down, it's the seniors.
I think much of the shit defending is though due to the fact we're trying to retain the ball when we should be clearing our lines, and Cuellar's absence would back that up. The decision making from the back five has been atrocious.
I'd say we just spend the next week in training throwing balls at the lot of 'em, with the instructions of kicking it as far as possible, first time. Give Dunny a mars bar every time he clears the penalty area, for example, and we'd probably shatter the premiership clean sheet record.
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People keep banging on about these injuries, the fact is most if not all of the players who are missing are either average or shit and wouldn't make any difference.
The fact is that is an opinion, not a fact.
Until he's had the opportunity to pick the team he wants and to stick with it for a couple of games I don't think we're in a position to properly judge him.
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People keep banging on about these injuries, the fact is most if not all of the players who are missing are either average or shit and wouldn't make any difference.
So, if everybody was fit, your first choice midfield pairing last night would have been an 18 year old and a center back?
Thank God you aren't anywhere near the coaching staff.
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The defence has been woeful, but let's be honest, they get very little protection from a baby faced central midfield.
Roll on Petrov and NRC's return.
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He's clarified his comments, I think we should move on. He did not intend any offence.
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Hopefully his Lpool love in is over now, a bit embarassing, and humiliating tbh.
Regardless of your views about MON, i don't think that set of players would have put such a lacklustre, spiritless performance as the team did last night.I think that raises questions about GHs motivational skills, as someone suggested earlier.MON organized teams, i'm not sure yet what GH does.
Reincarnation of Venglos?
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We will have Ashley, Bannan, a fit Albrighton and probably Heskey for Saturday. Give the bloke a chance. MON never had injuries like this and Houllier has not even seen Gary Gardner and Delph play yet. He has got to get the January window right with players of high quality .......
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Reincarnation of Venglos?
That thought has crossed by mind more than once today. Possibly the right man, but at the wrong time. Venglos also inherited a team that was built to do the job that his predecessor wanted it to do, but never managed to get it to change to play the way he wanted it to. It also seemed to lose the battling qualities it had had.
We just need a Gary Prenrice-esque signing in January to complete the analogy.
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Not seen Gary Gardner play yet, so what nor have any of us, don't even think he has a squad no., he's a kid from the youth team, missing him can hardly be an excuse for our pathetic form.
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I'm never a pannicker or a negative Villa fan, but the current run of forms tearing the life out of me.
Our injury reccord has been catastrophic, but in the long run I can't see GH taking us forward as a club. I think the only solution is to act fast and get a forward thinking manager in. I.E Di Matteo, Coyle.
Thanks Houllier, but he's clearly not at the races anymore.
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I'm never a pannicker or a negative Villa fan, but the current run of forms tearing the life out of me.
Our injury reccord has been catastrophic, but in the long run I can't see GH taking us forward as a club. I think the only solution is to act fast and get a forward thinking manager in. I.E Di Matteo, Coyle.
Thanks Houllier, but he's clearly not at the races anymore.
So which non-injured players would you have picked over the last few weeks instead of the ones Houllier has?
I understand that we are all pissed off with the run of results, but what exactly could be done by a manager who hasn't had the opportunity to buy anyone yet and has 12 first team players injured?
Ah I see, the answer is Owen Coyle. Right.
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Regardless of your views about MON, i don't think that set of players would have put such a lacklustre, spiritless performance as the team did last night
Well this set of players (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/eng_prem/7937107.stm) put in a pretty shocking performance on the same ground only a year and a half ago.
Why didn't MON motivate them?
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Short memories, was it only a few months back when we lost 7 goals to Chelsea?
And by the way I was very much in MON for camp.
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With Petrov and NRC in the squad, you have two players that, even though they're no the most dynamic getting forward, will break opposition momentum. When teams run at us, like Liverpool did, they look like they'll score every time. When teams have to try to 'pick the lock', our defence is a little sturdier.
Only a little, mind. :(
I do think there's been some kind of shift in the methodology of defending. And I don't mean the emphasis and trying to walk the ball out. I suspect there's a new style of defending being employed in regard to positioning and marking and I think Collins/Dunne are really struggling to change their natural game.
And, perhaps Houllier won't give up on them any more than he'd give up on a midfield that's been asked to pass the ball about rather than hoof. He'll persevere until the players 'get it' and can play in a way that he expects them to play.
Maybe. Perhaps. Who knows?
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I don't think he's anytihng special as a player, but the one thing we get back when Petrov returns, which we desperately need in the middle, is experience - and tons of it. You could say we have that with Pires, but he's not a viable option to play anything like 90 minutes.
The defence are all over the shop at the moment, but their frailty is being exposed by an inexperienced / lightweight central midfield. Clark and Hogg are players we'd barely seen before this season, but we've played them centrally against teams like Man United and Arsenal. Not just inexperienced, but one of them is also playing out of position. Barry Bannan has done very well, but he too is incredibly inexperienced.
In an ideal situation, there is absolutely no way we'd be relying so heavily on such inexperienced players while we're struggling for form so badly.
That more than anything is what we'll benefit from when we have players like Petrov back. Reo-Coker as well. It's almost enough to make you pine for Sidwell.
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The perfect summation, Paulie.
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Reincarnation of Venglos?
That thought has crossed by mind more than once today. Possibly the right man, but at the wrong time. Venglos also inherited a team that was built to do the job that his predecessor wanted it to do, but never managed to get it to change to play the way he wanted it to. It also seemed to lose the battling qualities it had had.
It's not the worst comparison in the world. Was that side containing Mountfield, Price and er, Gage a bad one? Probably not. But what suited GT and was effective enough to get us to 2nd wasn't flexible enough for someone like Venglos. The players used to laugh and take the piss at all the warm down routines and all the other things he tried to introduce, things that are quite normal now.
I do think this side is a bit more flexible, has more pluses to it than just being able to battle (though it's not even showing that at the moment). The thing that impressed me last year was some of the long accurate passes Collins would hit. Richard Dunne was also surprisingly quick over short distances and and had decent control. None of that is on show at the moment. Confidence/ form can be so elusive and good players can look bad when they lack it.
Troy is also probably right inso far as we're defending differently to last year (by not defending at all you might say). Andy Gray flagged that up last night in between playing with his machines, that we've gone from man marking at set pieces to the more continental zonal marking. I'd be inclined to say if it ain't broke don't fix it. Man for man marking seemed to work for us last year and the players were comfortable with it, so why change. Some of the other modifications may be more beneficial to us long term but anything that weakens the defence obviously isn't.
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You could say we have that with Pires, but he's not a viable option to play anything like 90 minutes.
From what I've seen Paulie, I don't think he could do 10 minutes.
He looks like a fan has wondered on the pitch, staring at all the players in amazement as the game passes him by.
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Regardless of your views about MON, i don't think that set of players would have put such a lacklustre, spiritless performance as the team did last night
Well this set of players (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/eng_prem/7937107.stm) put in a pretty shocking performance on the same ground only a year and a half ago.
Why didn't MON motivate them?
Still, that was against (probably) the best Liverpool team of the last decade. Monday's performance was against the worst.
However, as pointed out earlier in this thread, if Sidwell had been fit on Monday, he would have started the match. That says something about the depth of our injury crisis (particular in central midfield).
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But the fact is Houllier can't get us doing it right, Coyle can
But it took Coyle 2 months to win his first league game for Bolton. He'd have been hounded out of Villa park if he'd made a similar start here
The cries would have been, "he ain't big enough for the Villa .. go get someone like Jol or Houllier"
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Dave, Who would you rather have as Aston Villa manager. The club you pay money to go and see
Martin Jol ( possibly )
Gerald Houllier
Are you Jol's Agent or something?
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Is Houllier the right man ? I don't know yet, nobody does.
Should we stick with him and support him ? Abso- bloody - lutly.
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This (http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/3264947/Gerard-Houllier-branded-a-disgrace-by-fans.html), in my opinion, makes us all as fans look absolutely small-time.
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This (http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/3264947/Gerard-Houllier-branded-a-disgrace-by-fans.html), in my opinion, makes us all as fans look absolutely small-time.
I saw that and thought exactly the same. However I put it down to about 2 or 3 comments that have been sensationalised by The Sun. Hard to believe I know.
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Troy is also probably right inso far as we're defending differently to last year (by not defending at all you might say). Andy Gray flagged that up last night in between playing with his machines, that we've gone from man marking at set pieces to the more continental zonal marking. I'd be inclined to say if it ain't broke don't fix it. Man for man marking seemed to work for us last year and the players were comfortable with it, so why change. Some of the other modifications may be more beneficial to us long term but anything that weakens the defence obviously isn't.
Whatever system we play if you give their centre half a free header at the back post like Ciaran Clark did then we're in trouble, and if Collins stands and watches the 2nd ball we'll concede a lot more.
The trouble with zonal marking is it gives the attacker a run on you, but if I'm honest I've not noticed we've gone zonal, I'll pay close attention on saturday.
We are missing Emile at the front post on corners as well.
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This (http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/3264947/Gerard-Houllier-branded-a-disgrace-by-fans.html), in my opinion, makes us all as fans look absolutely small-time.
That's what you get when dickheads decide we're speaking with ONE CLEAR VOICE.
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agree with most of what has been posted not happy with his statement or actions but what i take out of all this debacle is that all the kids are gaining lots of experience and next season that will only good for aston villa
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This (http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/3264947/Gerard-Houllier-branded-a-disgrace-by-fans.html), in my opinion, makes us all as fans look absolutely small-time.
Whilst I think we should draw a line under this and move on, I disagree that this makes us look small time.
We're the ones who pay hundreds (thousands in some cases) of pounds a year to watch this stuff. If the club don't like reading this kind of thing, then don't allow situations like this to develop in the first place. Expecting people to keep shtum about it and keep forking out the dosh, when they get so publically affronted as that is not on.
If I'd travelled up to Liverpool on Monday night, I'd have been fucking fuming.
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This (http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/3264947/Gerard-Houllier-branded-a-disgrace-by-fans.html), in my opinion, makes us all as fans look absolutely small-time.
I saw that and thought exactly the same. However I put it down to about 2 or 3 comments that have been sensationalised by The Sun. Hard to believe I know.
.. and copied from sites that are syndicated on Newsnow. This Internet is indeed a dangerous thing
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Things are bad if we're hailing Petrov as a saviour when he returns, i'll give it 2 weeks after he's back before people are slagging him off and saying he should be subbed, and rightly so. He's a fuckin crab who does nothing defenively or offensively and he's knackered after an hour. Get NRC back in alongside Bannan is what i want to see, Ireland can do one.
Heskey has had 5 good games in about 50 and is a big lummox, he doesn't like Cuellar, Sidwell is a ginger Ireland. Theres noone to come back to improve the keeper or defence and they're a shambles.
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This (http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/3264947/Gerard-Houllier-branded-a-disgrace-by-fans.html), in my opinion, makes us all as fans look absolutely small-time.
Whilst I think we should draw a line under this and move on, I disagree that this makes us look small time.
We're the ones who pay hundreds (thousands in some cases) of pounds a year to watch this stuff. If the club don't like reading this kind of thing, then don't allow situations like this to develop in the first place. Expecting people to keep shtum about it and keep forking out the dosh, when they get so publically affronted as that is not on.
If I'd travelled up to Liverpool on Monday night, I'd have been fucking fuming.
Couldn't agree more. Before we tear ourselves up, or indeed The Sun or the internet, there is only one person responsible for this due to his behaviour which is well below that I would expect of any Villa manager.
Following Villa I don't expect to always win but I do expect all the emloyees to maximise their efforts in the cause of the team, on and off the pitch, and that is not happening and thats why my anger remains.
The statement was a step in the right direction but never should've been required in the first place.
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Things are bad if we're hailing Petrov as a saviour when he returns, i'll give it 2 weeks after he's back before people are slagging him off and saying he should be subbed, and rightly so. He's a fuckin crab who does nothing defenively or offensively and he's knackered after an hour. Get NRC back in alongside Bannan is what i want to see, Ireland can do one.
Heskey has had 5 good games in about 50 and is a big lummox, he doesn't like Cuellar, Sidwell is a ginger Ireland. Theres noone to come back to improve the keeper or defence and they're a shambles.
We all have our own opinions about players but that's not really the point. It's about the manager having options, about him having the ability to change players if it isn't working or stick with them when they're going well. As it is, the selection has been almost forced on him every week due to injuries, illness and suspension. When h's got players to choose from and decisions to make we'll see what he's made of but at the moment he's just fire fighting.
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Things are bad if we're hailing Petrov as a saviour when he returns, i'll give it 2 weeks after he's back before people are slagging him off and saying he should be subbed, and rightly so. He's a fuckin crab who does nothing defenively or offensively and he's knackered after an hour. Get NRC back in alongside Bannan is what i want to see, Ireland can do one.
Heskey has had 5 good games in about 50 and is a big lummox, he doesn't like Cuellar, Sidwell is a ginger Ireland. Theres noone to come back to improve the keeper or defence and they're a shambles.
We all have our own opinions about players but that's not really the point. It's about the manager having options, about him having the ability to change players if it isn't working or stick with them when they're going well. As it is, the selection has been almost forced on him every week due to injuries, illness and suspension. When h's got players to choose from and decisions to make we'll see what he's made of but at the moment he's just fire fighting.
Exactly
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agree with most of what has been posted not happy with his statement or actions but what i take out of all this debacle is that all the kids are gaining lots of experience and next season that will only good for aston villa
What in The Championship ?
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We have only really been missing Petrov from our 1st 11, as Ireland was signed as Milner's replacement and started the season ahead of NRC in the pecking order playing alongside Stan. Ireland's poor form and NRC's good form meant NRC became the more viable option in the middle. Even so a lack of goals from both, mobility from Stan, NRC's poor passing and various other complaints of both meant that these 2 positions were seen by most fans as the 1st to be replaced when the window opens. Bannan has come in and looked accomplished, so I think most fans would probably just bring back one of NRC or Stan to play alongside Bannan. Sidwell, Heskey, Beye, Gardner, Delph, Weiman etc are all either subs or youngsters so whilst not ideal and reducing the manager's options we should have been able to cope much much better. Albrighton, Clark, Bannan, Hogg, Herd, Sailfou, Lichaj, Lowry and Osbourne are inexperienced, but they're not exactly kids, I don't think any 1 of them are under 21, so it's not like we are turning to a bunch of 16 yr olds.
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Petrov is a good clubman, decent captain and canny footballer.
We miss him and he will make a difference when he comes back.
I can accept- to a degree- the arguments that he's not one for the future and were we looking to improve on 6th longterm, he's not the solution.
But in the short > medium term he'll have a big role to play for us.
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Petrov is a good clubman, decent captain and canny footballer.
We miss him and he will make a difference when he comes back.
I can accept- to a degree- the arguments that he's not one for the future and were we looking to improve on 6th longterm, he's not the solution.
But in the short > medium term he'll have a big role to play for us.
Delph will be his long term replacement, and all being well should be an improvement on him long term. I'd like our very own Patrick Viera to play along side him though, with Bannan as a third midfielder if we stick with 3 in the middle.
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Petrov is a good clubman, decent captain and canny footballer.
We miss him and he will make a difference when he comes back.
I can accept- to a degree- the arguments that he's not one for the future and were we looking to improve on 6th longterm, he's not the solution.
But in the short > medium term he'll have a big role to play for us.
yup
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Petrov is a very intelligent footballer, and we have missed him providing guidance and leadership. Where Petrov is a liability is when he is played in every minute of every game and by the end of the season he is simply knackered. Pretty much like most players would be. We'll appreciate him a lot more when he returns and is played sparingly.
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Petrov is a very intelligent footballer, and we have missed him providing guidance and leadership. Where Petrov is a liability is when he is played in every minute of every game and by the end of the season he is simply knackered. Pretty much like most players would be. We'll appreciate him a lot more when he returns and is played sparingly.
I agree, Mr Toronto. And he has this strange ability of controlling the ball and passing it to a bloke in the same team. On the ground.
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Petrov is a very intelligent footballer, and we have missed him providing guidance and leadership. Where Petrov is a liability is when he is played in every minute of every game and by the end of the season he is simply knackered. Pretty much like most players would be. We'll appreciate him a lot more when he returns and is played sparingly.
Nail Head, please meet Hammer.
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Yeah, can't really argue with that and the proof is there for all to see.
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First comment from me on all of this...I think it was what we needed. Monday has been a wake up call for everyone in so many ways. Firstly the result, simply not good enough and the players will know it from the half-time reaction and the chants from the crowd.
More importantly a big wake up call for GH. The honeymoon period is over. This will translate to the players and he will now be working them hard and focussing them like never before so their honeymoon with him will be over (apart from Carew, who never had one). This will have snapped him out of that nice and happy mode he has been in since his job at the French FA. Also we will hear less about his Liverpool glory and he knows his reputation in England rests now on his performance for Aston Villa.
All this needed to happen. Instead of it happening over a couple of months it should now happen in a week. I will say I think Houllier is a good manager (better than MON in MY opinion) and I think he will now prove it. His pride will have been dented and I am sure he will come out fighting.
Now I am expecting a powerful performance on Saturday. I think the lion on our crest will start to roar again!
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First comment from me on all of this...I think it was what we needed. Monday has been a wake up call for everyone in so many ways. Firstly the result, simply not good enough and the players will know it from the half-time reaction and the chants from the crowd.
More importantly a big wake up call for GH. The honeymoon period is over. This will translate to the players and he will now be working them hard and focussing them like never before so their honeymoon with him will be over (apart from Carew, who never had one). This will have snapped him out of that nice and happy mode he has been in since his job at the French FA. Also we will hear less about his Liverpool glory and he knows his reputation in England rests now on his performance for Aston Villa.
All this needed to happen. Instead of it happening over a couple of months it should now happen in a week. I will say I think Houllier is a good manager (better than MON in MY opinion) and I think he will now prove it. His pride will have been dented and I am sure he will come out fighting.
Now I am expecting a powerful performance on Saturday. I think the lion on our crest will start to roar again!
Thats the spirit, we need to come out fighting.
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Has GH been sacked?
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I wish!!
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I picked the wrong week to quit freebasing
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First comment from me on all of this...I think it was what we needed. Monday has been a wake up call for everyone in so many ways. Firstly the result, simply not good enough and the players will know it from the half-time reaction and the chants from the crowd.
More importantly a big wake up call for GH. The honeymoon period is over. This will translate to the players and he will now be working them hard and focussing them like never before so their honeymoon with him will be over (apart from Carew, who never had one). This will have snapped him out of that nice and happy mode he has been in since his job at the French FA. Also we will hear less about his Liverpool glory and he knows his reputation in England rests now on his performance for Aston Villa.
All this needed to happen. Instead of it happening over a couple of months it should now happen in a week. I will say I think Houllier is a good manager (better than MON in MY opinion) and I think he will now prove it. His pride will have been dented and I am sure he will come out fighting.
Now I am expecting a powerful performance on Saturday. I think the lion on our crest will start to roar again!
Thats the spirit, we need to come out fighting.
Bloody Optimists :)