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Author Topic: Anyone starting to get worried?  (Read 119812 times)

Online AV82EC

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #795 on: December 09, 2019, 12:08:51 PM »
Keep calm and carry on. Former Ipswich Chairman John Cavendish Cobbold was once asked if the club was in crisis. He replied "We only consider it to be a crisis when we run out of red wine in the boardroom".

Pedant alert - wasnít it white wine <winky thing>

Anyway as someone above said the template is better ball retention and Trying to get better support closer to Wesley, I donít care how he does it in terms of formation, he just needs to sort it.

Online ChicagoLion

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #796 on: December 09, 2019, 12:13:42 PM »
This 4 3 3 is really hindering us. We're carrying AEG and Trez. Leicester's diamond system ironically enough looks like it would suit us so much better.

This.

Really? 4-3-3 with Grealish in one of the front 3 positions actually had us on a nice little run before we hit the Man. City-Liverpool double trouble games.

I prefer it to early in the season when we had two out and out wingers and Grealish in the middle three and we looked very unbalanced at both ends.

My worry is in terms of major changes DS will go back to this and Sheffield United will expose the gaps between defence and midfield quite easily.

It's not really a 433 anyway, El Ghazi/Trez tend to stay fairly wide on the right but Grealish is tucked in somewhere between a left winger and a 10.  The change I'd make is to get the right winger doing the same. If it's Jota of Trez I'd want them on the ball and invovled in the build-up, if it's AEG I'd be getting him pushing into the box a lot more.

It all relies on us retaining possession better though, that's where we're losing games, we let teams recycle the ball far too easily and it means we get trapped in our own half and that's when Wesley looks terrible because he can't hold the ball up long enough to get people around him.
It also requires the midfield 3 to have some discipline and why I think that SJM is not necessarily suited to the role at this level.

Offline brontebilly

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #797 on: December 09, 2019, 12:17:57 PM »
I know that Wesley cost £20m or whatever, but Kodj wasn't exactly a snip at £12m either, and he's proved in the past that he's a much better goal scorer and all round footballer than Wesley.

That past was some time ago unfortunately. That ankle injury finished him really. Thought he was really poor in the championship in the last two seasons, particularly when he played down the middle but also his application out wide was dire (West Brom comes to mind).

At this stage, the kit man could be a better option than Wes so I'm not sure how Kodjia isn't even getting a chance. But he isn't remotely good enough to be a starting option in the prem. I'd have some hope for Davis and unfortunately he got injured at the wrong time.

Offline paul_e

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #798 on: December 09, 2019, 12:34:47 PM »
This 4 3 3 is really hindering us. We're carrying AEG and Trez. Leicester's diamond system ironically enough looks like it would suit us so much better.

This.

Really? 4-3-3 with Grealish in one of the front 3 positions actually had us on a nice little run before we hit the Man. City-Liverpool double trouble games.

I prefer it to early in the season when we had two out and out wingers and Grealish in the middle three and we looked very unbalanced at both ends.

My worry is in terms of major changes DS will go back to this and Sheffield United will expose the gaps between defence and midfield quite easily.

It's not really a 433 anyway, El Ghazi/Trez tend to stay fairly wide on the right but Grealish is tucked in somewhere between a left winger and a 10.  The change I'd make is to get the right winger doing the same. If it's Jota of Trez I'd want them on the ball and invovled in the build-up, if it's AEG I'd be getting him pushing into the box a lot more.

It all relies on us retaining possession better though, that's where we're losing games, we let teams recycle the ball far too easily and it means we get trapped in our own half and that's when Wesley looks terrible because he can't hold the ball up long enough to get people around him.
It also requires the midfield 3 to have some discipline and why I think that SJM is not necessarily suited to the role at this level.


I'd probably change the midfield around a touch and play both Luiz and Nakamba as holding players, Nakamba with the remit of breaking up play and Luiz as a deep play maker looking to move the ball a bit quicker. That way McGinn can be the one who break forward and gets to the edge of the box. We need to work on his timing though so he's arriving late. At the moment he's playing with his back to goal too often, which is a big part of why he's not been as effective.

Online Chris Smith

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #799 on: December 09, 2019, 01:04:05 PM »
I know that Wesley cost £20m or whatever, but Kodj wasn't exactly a snip at £12m either, and he's proved in the past that he's a much better goal scorer and all round footballer than Wesley.

Against Championship defenders so difficult to make an informed comparison. We do need a different option but I donít think heís it.

Online tomd2103

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #800 on: December 09, 2019, 01:13:57 PM »
There full backs were excellent, especially Pereira. They knew exactly when to go and when to stay. I like both Guilbert and Targett but they dont have the same disciplined approach.

Chilwell was the standout for me.  I was sat on his side in the North Stand and he just kept motoring up and down that flank until he went off.  He blew past Elmo on a number of occasions and his delivery into the box was very good.

With him and Alexander-Arnold on the other side, England look pretty strong in the full-back area. 

Online ChicagoLion

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #801 on: December 09, 2019, 01:29:36 PM »
This 4 3 3 is really hindering us. We're carrying AEG and Trez. Leicester's diamond system ironically enough looks like it would suit us so much better.

This.

Really? 4-3-3 with Grealish in one of the front 3 positions actually had us on a nice little run before we hit the Man. City-Liverpool double trouble games.

I prefer it to early in the season when we had two out and out wingers and Grealish in the middle three and we looked very unbalanced at both ends.

My worry is in terms of major changes DS will go back to this and Sheffield United will expose the gaps between defence and midfield quite easily.

It's not really a 433 anyway, El Ghazi/Trez tend to stay fairly wide on the right but Grealish is tucked in somewhere between a left winger and a 10.  The change I'd make is to get the right winger doing the same. If it's Jota of Trez I'd want them on the ball and invovled in the build-up, if it's AEG I'd be getting him pushing into the box a lot more.

It all relies on us retaining possession better though, that's where we're losing games, we let teams recycle the ball far too easily and it means we get trapped in our own half and that's when Wesley looks terrible because he can't hold the ball up long enough to get people around him.
It also requires the midfield 3 to have some discipline and why I think that SJM is not necessarily suited to the role at this level.


I'd probably change the midfield around a touch and play both Luiz and Nakamba as holding players, Nakamba with the remit of breaking up play and Luiz as a deep play maker looking to move the ball a bit quicker. That way McGinn can be the one who break forward and gets to the edge of the box. We need to work on his timing though so he's arriving late. At the moment he's playing with his back to goal too often, which is a big part of why he's not been as effective.
agree, but that is a change of system and Smith seems stuck on a flat 3 across the middle.

Offline peckvillajunior

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #802 on: December 09, 2019, 01:31:54 PM »
Still pretty confident. We need to be more conservative against the top 8 or so teams but our record against the poorer sides should see us alright

Offline Villafirst

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #803 on: December 09, 2019, 02:39:04 PM »
There full backs were excellent, especially Pereira. They knew exactly when to go and when to stay. I like both Guilbert and Targett but they dont have the same disciplined approach.

Chilwell was the standout for me.  I was sat on his side in the North Stand and he just kept motoring up and down that flank until he went off.  He blew past Elmo on a number of occasions and his delivery into the box was very good.

With him and Alexander-Arnold on the other side, England look pretty strong in the full-back area. 

Poor selection by Smith. No way Elmo should start ahead of Guilbert.

Offline Neil Hawkes

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #804 on: December 09, 2019, 03:06:36 PM »
Vardy has proven time & again he can leave many defences bamboozled, with the gift of hindsight I would have sacrificed Luiz from the starting line-up and would have had Guilbert man-marking Vardy throughout the game, (leaving the other 4 defenders as they were).

A rigid formation only works when you are one of the top teams in the division.

Offline Oscar Arce

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #805 on: December 09, 2019, 04:33:46 PM »
We're never going to win a game conceding 26 shots at goal.
Sometimes our midfield looks empty, and the defence worries me with a mish mash of zonal and man marking, which is a pet hate of mine.
Mings, who likes to be spare from corners and free kicks, alarmingly does not attack the ball, which surely he is supposed to do.
Next five will decide if we're in a shitfight until the end of the season or can look towards the sunny uplands of mid-table.
Personally, I would change it a bit to three at the back, we have a good lefty (Hause), a good spare (Mings) and a good righty (Engels), allowing our full backs Guilbert and Targett to use the width and make us more solid when we don't have the ball.
It would also allow us to play two up top, I doubt very much this will happen.

Online danno

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #806 on: December 09, 2019, 04:38:48 PM »
Personally, I would change it a bit to three at the back, we have a good lefty (Hause), a good spare (Mings) and a good righty (Engels), allowing our full backs Guilbert and Targett to use the width and make us more solid when we don't have the ball. It would also allow us to play two up top, I doubt very much this will happen.

You're right it probably won't, but who would your three in midfield be?

Offline brontebilly

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #807 on: December 09, 2019, 04:46:32 PM »
We're never going to win a game conceding 26 shots at goal.
Sometimes our midfield looks empty, and the defence worries me with a mish mash of zonal and man marking, which is a pet hate of mine.
Mings, who likes to be spare from corners and free kicks, alarmingly does not attack the ball, which surely he is supposed to do.
Next five will decide if we're in a shitfight until the end of the season or can look towards the sunny uplands of mid-table.
Personally, I would change it a bit to three at the back, we have a good lefty (Hause), a good spare (Mings) and a good righty (Engels), allowing our full backs Guilbert and Targett to use the width and make us more solid when we don't have the ball.
It would also allow us to play two up top, I doubt very much this will happen.

Sky have an article today that refers mainly to Arsenal but does making passing reference that only Norwich and us allow more shots on goal than Arsenal. We urgently need to change tactically to stop that continuing, otherwise we will be going down with Norwich. Arsenal at least have the forwards to keep them out of trouble, we don't.

I'm not usually a fan of three at the back but it could be worth trying at Sheff Utd to match them. Depending on how fit Mings is I guess, as Konsa urgently needs to come out I think. Alternatively, Hause to come in at left back to improve the balance of the defence physically with Targett dropping out. No matter what combination we try in midfield we still look too open. Just think Hause's presence can help us a lot at set piece time alone.

Online AV82EC

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #808 on: December 09, 2019, 04:49:19 PM »
Iíd agree on Hause but if Mings isnít fit as left CB in my view. If Mings is fit then Targett hasnt done enough to keep the shirt.

Offline paul_e

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #809 on: December 09, 2019, 04:58:18 PM »
We're never going to win a game conceding 26 shots at goal.
Sometimes our midfield looks empty, and the defence worries me with a mish mash of zonal and man marking, which is a pet hate of mine.
Mings, who likes to be spare from corners and free kicks, alarmingly does not attack the ball, which surely he is supposed to do.
Next five will decide if we're in a shitfight until the end of the season or can look towards the sunny uplands of mid-table.
Personally, I would change it a bit to three at the back, we have a good lefty (Hause), a good spare (Mings) and a good righty (Engels), allowing our full backs Guilbert and Targett to use the width and make us more solid when we don't have the ball.
It would also allow us to play two up top, I doubt very much this will happen.

Sky have an article today that refers mainly to Arsenal but does making passing reference that only Norwich and us allow more shots on goal than Arsenal. We urgently need to change tactically to stop that continuing, otherwise we will be going down with Norwich. Arsenal at least have the forwards to keep them out of trouble, we don't.

I'm not usually a fan of three at the back but it could be worth trying at Sheff Utd to match them. Depending on how fit Mings is I guess, as Konsa urgently needs to come out I think. Alternatively, Hause to come in at left back to improve the balance of the defence physically with Targett dropping out. No matter what combination we try in midfield we still look too open. Just think Hause's presence can help us a lot at set piece time alone.

All of this is why all the focus on blaming Wesley and calling for a replacement in January is ignoring the real problem. As I said earlier, we need to hold onto the ball better and not let clubs have 10-15minute spells where they get 7-8 attempts in and we barely cross halfway.

 


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