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Author Topic: Anyone starting to get worried?  (Read 63694 times)

Offline sonyhill

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #645 on: December 05, 2019, 10:49:52 AM »
The only thing that really concerns me is that whilst we are scoring goals from midfield, we don't have that 15 goal a season striker that the likes of Southampton have in Ings.  If we can pick up a decent striker and another other winger in January I think we'll be ok.  We're playing decent football but just lack some quality in the final third in some of the tougher games.  Need to cut out Mings' casual mistakes as well!

Offline brontebilly

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #646 on: December 05, 2019, 10:57:09 AM »

Almost half of our fixtures so far have come against last seasons top seven, and all but one of them away from home. These fixtures have, somewhat understandable, made up the majority of our defeats.

It was disappointing that we gave up points in some Ďeasierí games at the start of the season, but I still think the team have shown enough improvement and quality since then that will we be fine.

The problem is, because other teams around us are picking up points against the bigger teams, like Norwich and Newcastle against Man City for example, just winning our easier games isnít going to work. We are pretty much the only team not to pick up any points against the higher sides and we arenít going to win every game against those around us

To be fair, the only times we have been outclassed this season are the second half last night and Man City away arguably. We probably came closer than any team this season in beating the champions elect.

Flip side of that is the plucky losers tag, like Mowbrays West Brom isn't a great one for a relegation battle. Sheff Utd for example seem far better set up to dig in and get points. Maybe we need some more pragmatic team selections at times like Hause at left back.

Offline Ketzster

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #647 on: December 05, 2019, 11:05:16 AM »

Almost half of our fixtures so far have come against last seasons top seven, and all but one of them away from home. These fixtures have, somewhat understandable, made up the majority of our defeats.

It was disappointing that we gave up points in some Ďeasierí games at the start of the season, but I still think the team have shown enough improvement and quality since then that will we be fine.

The problem is, because other teams around us are picking up points against the bigger teams, like Norwich and Newcastle against Man City for example, just winning our easier games isnít going to work. We are pretty much the only team not to pick up any points against the higher sides and we arenít going to win every game against those around us

To be fair, the only times we have been outclassed this season are the second half last night and Man City away arguably. We probably came closer than any team this season in beating the champions elect.

Flip side of that is the plucky losers tag, like Mowbrays West Brom isn't a great one for a relegation battle. Sheff Utd for example seem far better set up to dig in and get points. Maybe we need some more pragmatic team selections at times like Hause at left back.

Wolves away was diabolical and we were totally outplayed by Brighton until Mooy got sent off. Smiths lack of tactical ability was also demonstrated during that game, at Arsenal away and West Ham at home where we played against ten men for long periods.

Everybody keeps saying ĎDean should try this, try thatí, but Smith never ever does. Last season after Wigan away we said he needed to, he didnít. We said after Reading away he needed to, he didnít. The only change he made last season was picking Grealish against Derby.

All of arguments that Smith will learn, needs time with the players etc would work if it wasnít for the fact that we have the evidence from the dreadful run last season where he didnít change anything. Even during the 10 game run there was some pretty ordinary football like Rotherham away in the first half. Eventually the fact that we had better players than the other teams around us meant that we would win a few games. Unfortunately, this time, because other teams have better players we donít have that luxury and we are reliant on Smithís tactical ability. And his tactical ability and in game management isnít good enough for this level. It barely was in the championship
« Last Edit: December 05, 2019, 11:14:32 AM by Ketzster »

Offline Three Spires Villa

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #648 on: December 05, 2019, 11:22:14 AM »
20 points after the Norwich game on Boxing Day and we will be ok, if we donít get to 20, I will start to get concerned. Being 1 point of the relegation places is a worry though.

Online Bad English

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #649 on: December 05, 2019, 11:29:21 AM »
Also Brighton only need a point to go above us
That's it! I'm never commenting on points and tables again. Fucking useless!

Offline Risso

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #650 on: December 05, 2019, 11:32:54 AM »
Also Brighton only need a point to go above us
That's it! I'm never commenting on points and tables again. Fucking useless!

Thick fucker!

Offline Luke8

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #651 on: December 05, 2019, 11:46:12 AM »

Almost half of our fixtures so far have come against last seasons top seven, and all but one of them away from home. These fixtures have, somewhat understandable, made up the majority of our defeats.

It was disappointing that we gave up points in some Ďeasierí games at the start of the season, but I still think the team have shown enough improvement and quality since then that will we be fine.

The problem is, because other teams around us are picking up points against the bigger teams, like Norwich and Newcastle against Man City for example, just winning our easier games isnít going to work. We are pretty much the only team not to pick up any points against the higher sides and we arenít going to win every game against those around us

Thatís fair, although I wouldnít completely rule out us picking up some points against them in the return home fixtures. Havenít looked, but it canít be many teams that have played them all away like we have. And while part of it can definitely be put down to our naivety, we have been quite unlucky in some of those games as well.

Also, the other teams seem to be losing or dropping points more regularly to other teams around them (hence being below or on similar points to us still despite these Ďbigí wins) whereas our more recent form against similar teams has been pretty good.

Offline Ad@m

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #652 on: December 05, 2019, 12:44:41 PM »

Almost half of our fixtures so far have come against last seasons top seven, and all but one of them away from home. These fixtures have, somewhat understandable, made up the majority of our defeats.

It was disappointing that we gave up points in some Ďeasierí games at the start of the season, but I still think the team have shown enough improvement and quality since then that will we be fine.

The problem is, because other teams around us are picking up points against the bigger teams, like Norwich and Newcastle against Man City for example, just winning our easier games isnít going to work. We are pretty much the only team not to pick up any points against the higher sides and we arenít going to win every game against those around us

Thatís fair, although I wouldnít completely rule out us picking up some points against them in the return home fixtures. Havenít looked, but it canít be many teams that have played them all away like we have. And while part of it can definitely be put down to our naivety, we have been quite unlucky in some of those games as well.

Also, the other teams seem to be losing or dropping points more regularly to other teams around them (hence being below or on similar points to us still despite these Ďbigí wins) whereas our more recent form against similar teams has been pretty good.

How we do against the Champions League challengers is not going to define our season.  If we can pick up 30 points at home, we'll stay up - so far we've got 11 from 7 games which is pretty much bang on target.  With Southampton and Norwich two of our next three home games I'm expecting a minimum of 6 points which leaves us on 17 points from 10 games, putting us ahead of target.

Offline supertom

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #653 on: December 05, 2019, 01:23:01 PM »
I think Jack is hitting form at a good time. Trezeguet is playing well. Mings is all about simple concentration and just being given a tougher time by the coaching staff. Someone needs to roast him for these silly errors, but he's a quality player. Cut the nonsense and he'll be top drawer. I'd give McGinn a rest against Sheff Utd too. He's just looking a bit jaded. We have to remember he is actually human. He's dropping below par at the minute. AEG has goals in him.

January is coming. 2-3 in (a striker is a must).

With how our midfield is coming along and the potential of hopefully another striking option (which in the end I think will actually benefit Wesley, rather than being a death knell), I think we'll finish quite strongly. We have to look at it too, because we've had a fucking horrible run of games recently too. City, Liverpool, Wolves (A), Utd, Chelsea. Newcastle was surprisingly comfortable, but thankfully that was a must win. Have we done worse than expected over that run? I'd have probably expected a point at Wolves and the atypical loss at Utd (so it's a switheroo on that) but that aside everything as is. I think Leicester will beat us. If we get a point we've done very well. They're ruthless. Sheff Utd is a big, big game. We need to take something from it.

It's the next three after that. Southampton, Norwich and Watford. We need to take 6 points minimum. Bare minimum from that. By the end of December if we've taken 7 points we'll be on 22 points and probably on course to be safe at 38-40 points at the end. Those latter 3 games also give us a chance to just kick em below us a bit and keep distance.  If we've got 9-10 points by the end of the month that'll be more comfortable and it's not out of the realms of possibility.

Offline rougegorge

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #654 on: December 05, 2019, 01:34:51 PM »

Almost half of our fixtures so far have come against last seasons top seven, and all but one of them away from home. These fixtures have, somewhat understandable, made up the majority of our defeats.

It was disappointing that we gave up points in some Ďeasierí games at the start of the season, but I still think the team have shown enough improvement and quality since then that will we be fine.

The problem is, because other teams around us are picking up points against the bigger teams, like Norwich and Newcastle against Man City for example, just winning our easier games isnít going to work. We are pretty much the only team not to pick up any points against the higher sides and we arenít going to win every game against those around us

Thatís fair, although I wouldnít completely rule out us picking up some points against them in the return home fixtures. Havenít looked, but it canít be many teams that have played them all away like we have. And while part of it can definitely be put down to our naivety, we have been quite unlucky in some of those games as well.

Also, the other teams seem to be losing or dropping points more regularly to other teams around them (hence being below or on similar points to us still despite these Ďbigí wins) whereas our more recent form against similar teams has been pretty good.

How we do against the Champions League challengers is not going to define our season.  If we can pick up 30 points at home, we'll stay up - so far we've got 11 from 7 games which is pretty much bang on target.  With Southampton and Norwich two of our next three home games I'm expecting a minimum of 6 points which leaves us on 17 points from 10 games, putting us ahead of target.
I get this, but it does put more pressure on the games against the lower teams. We mustn't just write off matches against the top teams which unfortunately is what has happened far too regaularly in the past. E.g. from the BBC:
"Aston Villa have picked up just one point from their last 42 available in away games against sides starting the day in the top four".

Also the teams around us will be targeting points against us in just the same way.

If we hadn't just been promoted, then I think a lot of fans would be worried to be just a point above the relegation zone.

We have generally been competitive as Dean keeps saying, but we have thrown in some poor performances as well whether in games as a whole or for parts of matches: Palace, Arsenal - the last half an hour versus 10, Wolves, yesterday, and the inability to impose ourselves against the 10 men of West Ham and Brighton (apart from a last kick winner). 

I just hope they have a decent striker lined up for January; and at the start not a January 31st panic buy. 

Offline PeterWithesShin

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #655 on: December 05, 2019, 03:00:39 PM »
We've taken 11 points from our last 10 games which is the ratio you need to pass the magic 40 points. And that 10 game run has included Arsenal, Chelsea, Man City, Wolves, Man Utd away plus Liverpool at home.

After Leicester we have a run of 9 games where the only 'top' side we play are Spurs, I reckon that's the run that will show if it should be time to worry, not during the run of fixtures we're in.

Offline usav

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #656 on: December 05, 2019, 03:05:15 PM »
From another thread, this was my prediction which is still stand by:

Quote
Man U A - D
Chelsea A - L
Leicester H - D
Sheff Utd A - D
Soton H - W
Norwich H - W

9 points.  You heard it here first.

Online Pat McMahon

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #657 on: December 05, 2019, 07:07:46 PM »
Lots of comments on the site about Wesley but I am just as concerned at our defensive frailties - collective rather than individual.

Sheffield United - with a more settled team who have been together for a while - seem to be able to hunt down the opposition and limit space and chances. They also seem to have a mental toughness to come back and secure points against some of the better team like Chelsea, Spurs and Man U. For certain away games I would be much happier if we had played a tighter formation 4-5-1 and limited space. This would be easier if we had genuine pace as an outlet though.

I think we really need a signature win against a team well above us in the table to give the players more belief. A point at Manyoo was a step in the right direction but only our 4th away point. The real missed opportunity for me was Arsenal, where we were very good for an hour, albeit against 10 men for a chunk of that.

Offline SoccerHQ

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #658 on: December 05, 2019, 08:07:02 PM »
I'm starting to worry a bit now - the points are beginning to look harder to pick up - giving Smith a contract extension at this stage of the season was a strange one - I'm finding it hard to comprehend that we are currently looking to play catch  up with the likes of Brighton, (should read Palace) Burnley and Bournemouth - I guess that demonstrates just how low we fell. Trying to find a decent available striker in January may prove difficult - Wesley  isn't exactly setting the place on fire is he? At the moment he looks a poor signing .......I was becoming confident of us staying up, now I'm having doubts - those doubts centre around Smith's apparent  inability to make timely substitutions or changes of set up to counter act the opposition and the lack of a prolific striker .....there is a long way to go and it may just go to the wire
Not sure my nerves will take it ..........still we've got the right manager in place for the Championship :(

Cheer up clive.

We are the grand of no points behind Brighton (pending Arsenal gifting them points as CDBW says)1 point behind Bournemouth (and they have some of the fixtures we've had recently coming up) and 3 behind Burnley who have Spurs away on Saturday. Do your Everton friends take such offence at being behind all these apparent minnows?

The crucial part of the season was always going to be Southampton-Norwich-Watford- Burnley over 10 days at the end of the year. It's important we don't mess that part up as 7-9 points from those four games will massively change things. We could well be in the top half and looking up and looking forward to the January transfer window.


Offline SoccerHQ

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Re: Anyone starting to get worried?
« Reply #659 on: December 05, 2019, 08:10:46 PM »

Almost half of our fixtures so far have come against last seasons top seven, and all but one of them away from home. These fixtures have, somewhat understandable, made up the majority of our defeats.

It was disappointing that we gave up points in some Ďeasierí games at the start of the season, but I still think the team have shown enough improvement and quality since then that will we be fine.

The problem is, because other teams around us are picking up points against the bigger teams, like Norwich and Newcastle against Man City for example, just winning our easier games isnít going to work. We are pretty much the only team not to pick up any points against the higher sides and we arenít going to win every game against those around us

It's worked so far, we're above the bottom 3. With our very decent GD we're pretty much got 40% of the points we need already to stay from a pretty tough first 15 games on the fixture list.

Things will get easier on paper from this point on. I know the home games will get tougher but given how we've played in some of the away games I reckon we can get 2 wins and the odd draw when Arsenal, Man. United, Chelsea and Spurs all come to VP after xmas.

Of course a Grealish injury would be a major issue but we have January transfer window to do something about that.