Bruce Sacked at last (now official)

[olaftab]

It might be harsh but I'm very unsure he's the right man for whichever job is required next season. Ship steadied, a season this club should regard as a bare minimum achieved, some positives on the players such as Jack, but the style definitely still has a muddle-along feel, and I think we'll need much more coherence and identity next year - either to kick on in the Premier League, or to get promotion without spending what we have so far.

Yes indeed.

[Clampy]

He has given youth players a go at other clubs....when SHA went up in 2002 an 18 year old scored the winning penalty.

As said before he played Henderson at Sunderland when he was 19.

Issue here is the short term nature of it. He knew when he was appointed he had 18 months to get us up and has signed accordingly, going for tried and tested players he's worked with before like AEM and Snodgrass.

If he knew he had 3-4 years like he did at SHA and Hull I'm sure he'd have signed differently.

Well, not really, no. In Bruce's first window he splurged on Taylor, Hogan, Lansbury, Hourihane, Thor - none of whom he'd ever worked with before. You couldn't call any of them spring chickens but they aren't pensioners either... So the truth of it is he came in, spent a fortune on distinctly average players somewhere in the middle of their careers, and then when they'd failed to help him achieve promotion and we'd run afoul of FFP rules, he had to resort to signing the likes that you've mentioned.

Spent a fortune when he came in? Apart from Hogan, who cost a 'fortune'?

Also, those players you mentioned are still part of the squad. They were all involved on Saturday so I'm not sure what your point is.

[garyshawsknee]

I agree Monty, it  would seem unfair if we went up, but I wouldn't want him spending a fortune to rebuild the team for a top flight return and if we don't go up and our cloth is cut, he's not the man to get the best out of young inexperienced players. He's in the Pulis,Parew,Big Sam category of managers who now are getting found out in the Premiership.

[Monty]

I would back him to keep us up next season if we're promoted, but I don't think the football or the season would be all that much fun and it's up to every fan to make up their own minds as to whether that's good enough - short or long term. For me, I don't think it would be. Boring our way to the top of the table is great, but to 10th-14th just makes the whole thing seem kind of lifeless.

[olaftab]

I think finish anywhere up to 7th is no big deal in PL. Everton are 8th after a terrible season. We should, initially, have a team capable of doing that and playing with some sort of style that we can keep and add to in follow on seasons.

[Monty]

And obviously this all sounds massively ungrateful and presumptuous, but that's just how I see it. And failure to get us up, with what we know is coming should that happen, IMO must mean replacing Bruce. I never feel like we play as more than the sum of our parts under him, just sometimes like good footballers being as good as they ought to be, and next season in the Championship we'd need to start playing above ourselves a bit more.

[Drummond]

If we finished 17th next season it would be a good result. I'll qualify that by saying that by saying with this or a similar squad.

I know we should aim higher and hopefully the owner will invest.

[Dave]

If we finished 17th next season it would be a good result. I'll qualify that by saying that by saying with this or a similar squad.

Can we qualify it further by saying that it's only a good result if we're in the division above our current one?

(wink face)

[chrisw1]

I agree Monty, it  would seem unfair if we went up, but I wouldn't want him spending a fortune to rebuild the team for a top flight return and if we don't go up and our cloth is cut, he's not the man to get the best out of young inexperienced players. He's in the Pulis,Parew,Big Sam category of managers who now are getting found out in the Premiership.

Yep Allardyce has really been found out.  He took over the progressive Ronald Koeman's free flowing total football team then bought tried and tested past it cloggers like Tosun & Walcott in January and has only managed to take them from a relegation battle to 8th in the league (and 6th in the form league since he joined).  What a chancer, no wonder they hate him up there.

I imagine Palace & Sunderland hate him for being found out at there places too.

[passport1]

He was definitely found out when he was England manager.

[Monty]

Allardyce does the job he does. It's uninspiring but it works - and anyway, he's nothing like as much of an old-school clogger in the Bruce mould, his dullness is actually the result of pretty meticulous planning. It's fine if you're aiming for 17th (Everton this season notwithstanding).

However, if as Drummond says the owner would invest following a promotion, I'd hope to be aiming for a bit better than that, and certainly (sorry Steve) a bit more inspiring than Bruce.

[garyshawsknee]

I agree Monty, it  would seem unfair if we went up, but I wouldn't want him spending a fortune to rebuild the team for a top flight return and if we don't go up and our cloth is cut, he's not the man to get the best out of young inexperienced players. He's in the Pulis,Parew,Big Sam category of managers who now are getting found out in the Premiership.

Yep Allardyce has really been found out.  He took over the progressive Ronald Koeman's free flowing total football team then bought tried and tested past it cloggers like Tosun & Walcott in January and has only managed to take them from a relegation battle to 8th in the league (and 6th in the form league since he joined).  What a chancer, no wonder they hate him up there.

I imagine Palace & Sunderland hate him for being found out at there places too.

Ask the Everton fans what they think.

[Tony Erdington]

With the money spent and the opposition with had, is it fair to say Steve has done alright?

Imo we are forth in spite of Steve not because of him, I don't see it "if" (joke that its "if") we get promoted that we thank him for his efforts and wish him well.

I stated my opinion earlier get Rafa.

[Allan C]

I agree Monty, it  would seem unfair if we went up, but I wouldn't want him spending a fortune to rebuild the team for a top flight return and if we don't go up and our cloth is cut, he's not the man to get the best out of young inexperienced players. He's in the Pulis,Parew,Big Sam category of managers who now are getting found out in the Premiership.

Precisely this  he was the wrong man then and the wrong man now

[garyshawsknee]

You're probably right Tony, his record shows that the top flight is just beyond his reach though, taking teams down or getting sacked before he does. Maybe he'll get offered the Miami job under Beckham and everyone's happy!!