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Author Topic: Bruce out?  (Read 317050 times)

Offline Newby

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Re: Bruce out
« Reply #990 on: March 01, 2017, 07:51:21 AM »
The sad thing is, we know we have the players to take any team apart, getting them pulling in the right direction all at the same time is the tricky bit. It sounds like we did this in a spell last night once Hourihane came on. More of the same is required and I think Bruce needs to be braver by pushing for that, rather than seeking a non-defeat. It will take time but our season is over, so lay the foundations now in readiness for next season.

Online Villafirst

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Re: Bruce out
« Reply #991 on: March 01, 2017, 07:55:49 AM »
Bruce has had a hard time with so many changes. A period of stability from now on. Players need time to get to know each other. Can't believe so many have voted him to go. There's no better manager to get us out of this league.

Online john e

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Re: Bruce out
« Reply #992 on: March 01, 2017, 07:57:39 AM »
I don't think his job has ever been in danger according to what Mr Wyness has said
it's good to see us picking up a few points and putting a decent gap
Between us and the bottom 3

I don't like Bruce and Mcliesh type managers i still think we could have chosen better with someone  a bit more hopefull and exciting,  but at least he's leading us to safety so that's good

Offline cdbullyweefan

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Re: Bruce out
« Reply #993 on: March 01, 2017, 08:10:47 AM »
Much better yesterday, and with survival all-but-guaranteed I think he is, and should be, safe until the end of the season.

The playoffs are too far away, but hopefully we can go on a run which builds optimism, sells season tickets and makes Bruce unsackable in the Summer. Next step forward is improving the away form and we couldn't have a better opportunity than on Saturday.

Offline mr underhill

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Re: Bruce out
« Reply #994 on: March 01, 2017, 09:12:22 AM »
we've lost over 25 points I think from winning positions this season - maxing half of them would have put us in with a shout. It was all those early draws that did for us.

Online paul_e

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Re: Bruce out
« Reply #995 on: March 01, 2017, 09:14:51 AM »
Bruce has had a hard time with so many changes. A period of stability from now on. Players need time to get to know each other. Can't believe so many have voted him to go. There's no better manager to get us out of this league.

He created that first problem for himself by making a huge number of signings and trying to throw them all in at the same time.

He also moved away from what had worked, fucked about with formations and changed the team game after game only to go back to the original formation and suddenly we're working ok again, again that's his own fault.  The whole point of there being 'no better manager to get us out of this league' is missed when, despite his experience, he hasn't had the sense to play 433 (or a slight variation of it) when it's clearly the right shape for the team.  When he did play it he completely failed to understand that for it to work you need to get a midfielder or 2 up near your striker.

Last night has given him the clearest indication he could've ever hoped for of how he should be using this squad, his career prospects for next season should hinge on his ability to follow the path that is now clearly in front of him and ignore the pull of 'playing for the draw' by keeping everyone deep.

Online passport1

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Re: Bruce out
« Reply #996 on: March 01, 2017, 04:56:28 PM »
I'm not going to pontificate on Bruces future.Lets just let this season conclude which by even our standards has been pretty disruptive and see where we are after a settled pre-season.

The club(and most rational supporters) are crying out for some stability.

Online gpbarr

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Re: Bruce out
« Reply #997 on: March 01, 2017, 07:48:21 PM »
Bruce has had a hard time with so many changes. A period of stability from now on. Players need time to get to know each other. Can't believe so many have voted him to go. There's no better manager to get us out of this league.

He created that first problem for himself by making a huge number of signings and trying to throw them all in at the same time.

He also moved away from what had worked, fucked about with formations and changed the team game after game only to go back to the original formation and suddenly we're working ok again, again that's his own fault.  The whole point of there being 'no better manager to get us out of this league' is missed when, despite his experience, he hasn't had the sense to play 433 (or a slight variation of it) when it's clearly the right shape for the team.  When he did play it he completely failed to understand that for it to work you need to get a midfielder or 2 up near your striker.

Last night has given him the clearest indication he could've ever hoped for of how he should be using this squad, his career prospects for next season should hinge on his ability to follow the path that is now clearly in front of him and ignore the pull of 'playing for the draw' by keeping everyone deep.

He didn't create the first problem for himself at all. He, along with Tony, Keith, and virtually every fan I know (and certainly the vast majority on here) saw that the squad was wholly poor, uncompetitive, and unprepared for this league (for that blame the previous incumbents, not SB) and that he had to have a go (sign a lot of players and throw them in to try and retain any hope of promotion at the first go - this was early to mid January).

Stop Monday morning quarter-backing.   

Online paul_e

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Re: Bruce out
« Reply #998 on: March 01, 2017, 07:57:40 PM »
Bruce has had a hard time with so many changes. A period of stability from now on. Players need time to get to know each other. Can't believe so many have voted him to go. There's no better manager to get us out of this league.

He created that first problem for himself by making a huge number of signings and trying to throw them all in at the same time.

He also moved away from what had worked, fucked about with formations and changed the team game after game only to go back to the original formation and suddenly we're working ok again, again that's his own fault.  The whole point of there being 'no better manager to get us out of this league' is missed when, despite his experience, he hasn't had the sense to play 433 (or a slight variation of it) when it's clearly the right shape for the team.  When he did play it he completely failed to understand that for it to work you need to get a midfielder or 2 up near your striker.

Last night has given him the clearest indication he could've ever hoped for of how he should be using this squad, his career prospects for next season should hinge on his ability to follow the path that is now clearly in front of him and ignore the pull of 'playing for the draw' by keeping everyone deep.

He didn't create the first problem for himself at all. He, along with Tony, Keith, and virtually every fan I know (and certainly the vast majority on here) saw that the squad was wholly poor, uncompetitive, and unprepared for this league (for that blame the previous incumbents, not SB) and that he had to have a go (sign a lot of players and throw them in to try and retain any hope of promotion at the first go - this was early to mid January).

Stop Monday morning quarter-backing.   

Stop creating excuses that Bruce himself doesn't agree with.  He has outright said that he made too many changes so yes he did create that problem.

Offline Ian J

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Re: Bruce out
« Reply #999 on: March 01, 2017, 08:09:50 PM »
I wouldn't say he created it, maybe he added to it, but even that was not helped by Kodjia's absence.

Online paul_e

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Re: Bruce out
« Reply #1000 on: March 01, 2017, 10:41:43 PM »
I'm talking specifically about the 'so many changes'.  No one else takes responsibility for that, he decided to buy a third of a squad in the January window so saying he's had a hard time because of all the changes in the squad is outright saying that created himself short term problems.  I don't disagree that some of those changes were needed and I'm not saying the players are bad (although I think Johnstone was an awful choice for what we needed) but I'm saying he created that situation where there were lots of new faces getting used to the club right in the middle of the season.

I don't even accept the absence of Kodjia as an excuse, he made a choice to sell Gestede early and not replace him for about 3 weeks, he made a choice to let RM go out on loan after publicly shaming him (that's not absolving RM of anything, he acted like a dick and can't have any complaints about being called out), he made the choice to let Ayew go to bring in competition at left back.  Those choices are on him and shouldn't be used as excuses for any problems over the last 2 months.  The alternative to all of those decisions may have been far worse, we have no way to know but his job is to make those choices and then live with the consequences.  The only manager we've had in the last 6 years who can legitimately make excuses of being made responsible for other peoples choices was Garde who, I'd hope, knew the problems he had and didn't get the backing to fix them.

Offline Ian J

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Re: Bruce out
« Reply #1001 on: March 02, 2017, 06:52:54 AM »
Those changes have been and will be absolute necessary and given time will bed in. Maybe in that first match we should not have thrown them all in at once. However everyone seemed well pleased he did and was excited at the new look side at the time. Hindsight eh?

As for Gestede, he's been awful, smashing bloke and professional but useless on the pitch. I can't believe we got that sum for him and I reckon Bruce and the bosses couldn't either. I liked Ayew but he hasn't looked right all season, something had changed with him. Gabby got injured and we had the gate episode, which I think he's done the right thing with removing him from the squad.

Offline Clampy

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Re: Bruce out
« Reply #1002 on: March 02, 2017, 07:07:42 AM »
Hopefully this will help buy some time. I'd like him to get a run and a chance to really put some foundations in place.

That's pretty much where I am with it as well.

Offline Ian J

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Re: Bruce out
« Reply #1003 on: March 02, 2017, 07:22:27 AM »
Hopefully this will help buy some time. I'd like him to get a run and a chance to really put some foundations in place.

That's pretty much where I am with it as well.
Me too, January and February couldn't have got any worse but hopefully we've turned a corner. His time with the players from now through pre-season is essential for our future.

Offline old man villa fan

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Re: Bruce out
« Reply #1004 on: March 02, 2017, 08:03:36 AM »
Hopefully this will help buy some time. I'd like him to get a run and a chance to really put some foundations in place.

That's pretty much where I am with it as well.
Me too, January and February couldn't have got any worse but hopefully we've turned a corner. His time with the players from now through pre-season is essential for our future.

I don't get this 'and pre-season' that people talk about.  If he is given pre-season, it has to include next season as well.  If he cannot show that he is good enough and has the right ideas between now and the end of the season, a new manager has to be given pre-season.  We can't have a half way house.