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Author Topic: Bruce out?  (Read 317049 times)

Offline Clampy

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Re: Bruce out?
« Reply #2985 on: July 20, 2017, 07:51:58 AM »
So when does this free hit that Bruce seems to have inherited actually end? First it was that he'd inherited RDM's mess (even though RDM inherited a bigger mess), then it was that we couldn't expect to see any progress during the actual season and it was about putting foundations in place, then it was that we'd see the benefits after a pre-season, now its that pre-season is irrelevant. What next?

I'm sure he'll get the boot if things don't go well next season and so he should, because they're his players now and he won't have any excuses. I'm happy to give him the chance to fail.

Online Chris Smith

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Re: Bruce out?
« Reply #2986 on: July 20, 2017, 07:52:23 AM »
Keep it up Paul.   Bruce needs to be held to account.

He isn't' being held to account by posts on a message board read by a couple of hundred people though is he. This is just a few people arguing the toss and has no more bearing on the situation than a few blokes arguing in the pub. That's not to criticise anyone but just a reminder not to take ourselves too seriously.

As ever it will be results that decide the future of the manager.

Offline brian green

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Re: Bruce out?
« Reply #2987 on: July 20, 2017, 07:54:03 AM »
I agree with you Paul.  The central issue is that Bruce achieved promotion with other clubs but has shown no evidence whatsoever that he can do it for us.

Offline saunders_heroes

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Re: Bruce out?
« Reply #2988 on: July 20, 2017, 07:56:14 AM »
I agree with you Paul.  The central issue is that Bruce achieved promotion with other clubs but has shown no evidence whatsoever that he can do it for us.

He hasn't even had a full season yet. Give him a chance!

Offline cdbullyweefan

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Re: Bruce out?
« Reply #2989 on: July 20, 2017, 07:59:52 AM »
Should we have held on to Di Matteo, then, on the same basis?

I bet Small Heath are gutted they didn't stick with Zola so he could finish the job. Actually, I am.

Offline brian green

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Re: Bruce out?
« Reply #2990 on: July 20, 2017, 08:01:09 AM »
As you say Chris it is results that will decide what happens.  I am not arguing with anybody I am trying to make the point that in my opinion  we are in the place we are because we have, for years now, been retroactive when we need to be proactive.  What happened in the past with other clubs is insignificant campared with what is happening today and tomorrow.

Offline AV5nobs

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Re: Bruce out?
« Reply #2991 on: July 20, 2017, 08:02:07 AM »
Clampy and CS basically just nailed it, if after 10-13 games we are not at least within 3-5 points of automatic I will be eating humble pie and seriously questioning Bruce, but surely he deserves that chance given the support and money he has had, first pre season with the squad etc.

Calling for his head now is pure lunacy.

The scary thing is, if SB does take us up this season certain posters on here will not give him any credit due to the "money and wages he's had at his disposal" and if truth be known they simply are stuck in the past of Villa being too big for Bruce.

Online paul_e

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Re: Bruce out?
« Reply #2992 on: July 20, 2017, 08:02:27 AM »
I agree with you Paul.  The central issue is that Bruce achieved promotion with other clubs but has shown no evidence whatsoever that he can do it for us.

He hasn't even had a full season yet. Give him a chance!

Nor did the 3 managers before him and they were all sacked for missing their performance targets.

Offline Clampy

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Re: Bruce out?
« Reply #2993 on: July 20, 2017, 08:05:55 AM »
Should we have held on to Di Matteo, then, on the same basis?

I bet Small Heath are gutted they didn't stick with Zola so he could finish the job. Actually, I am.

I thought we got rid of RDM a bit too early as well and that's coming from soneone who watched the shambles at Preston. I think he might have gone for other reasons than results though.
« Last Edit: July 20, 2017, 08:07:41 AM by Clampy »

Offline AV5nobs

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Re: Bruce out?
« Reply #2994 on: July 20, 2017, 08:07:25 AM »
I agree with you Paul.  The central issue is that Bruce achieved promotion with other clubs but has shown no evidence whatsoever that he can do it for us.

He hasn't even had a full season yet. Give him a chance!

Nor did the 3 managers before him and they were all sacked for missing their performance targets.

So his remit in October was to promote the 3rd worst squad in Prem history, more toxic than the beer in Peaky Blinders, key injuries?

This site has imploded on the back of two practice games, or people are using the fact that they don't like him as a catalyst.
« Last Edit: July 20, 2017, 08:13:53 AM by AV5nobs »

Offline Ads

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Re: Bruce out?
« Reply #2995 on: July 20, 2017, 08:18:59 AM »
In the context of what went before Bruce, 14 wins in the previous 86 games, in which we had been beaten 50 times, despite hopes to the contrary, perhaps turning round the avalanche of our descent wasn't such an easy task.

While mid-table in the 2nd Division is not acceptable, it has provided respite. Let's see what a pre-season brings in August. If we're not challenging he will be failing. I don't think he will fail.

Offline peter w

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Re: Bruce out?
« Reply #2996 on: July 20, 2017, 08:21:11 AM »
Keep it up Paul.   Bruce needs to be held to account.

Of course he needs to be held to account, but not in the off season.

Online Dave

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Re: Bruce out?
« Reply #2997 on: July 20, 2017, 08:21:58 AM »
I agree with you Paul.  The central issue is that Bruce achieved promotion with other clubs but has shown no evidence whatsoever that he can do it for us.

He hasn't even had a full season yet. Give him a chance!

Nor did the 3 managers before him and they were all sacked for missing their performance targets.

So his remit in October was to promote the 3rd worst squad in Prem history, more toxic than the beer in Peaky Blinders, key injuries?

Well...yes. it wasn't to keep us hanging around mid-table.

The second worst squad (Sunderland 06-07) lost their first four matches the following season, brought in a new manager and went and won the league. And unless Steve Bruce is a worse manager than Roy Keane, then it shouldn't have been an impossible task.

Offline AV5nobs

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Re: Bruce out?
« Reply #2998 on: July 20, 2017, 08:28:17 AM »
I agree with you Paul.  The central issue is that Bruce achieved promotion with other clubs but has shown no evidence whatsoever that he can do it for us.

He hasn't even had a full season yet. Give him a chance!

Nor did the 3 managers before him and they were all sacked for missing their performance targets.

So his remit in October was to promote the 3rd worst squad in Prem history, more toxic than the beer in Peaky Blinders, key injuries?

Well...yes. it wasn't to keep us hanging around mid-table.

The second worst squad (Sunderland 06-07) lost their first four matches the following season, brought in a new manager and went and won the league. And unless Steve Bruce is a worse manager than Roy Keane, then it shouldn't have been an impossible task.

Look a where Sunderland were at the exact same time as when Bruce took over?

As I've said before no squad that has gone down has had the toxicity as ours, so that has to be taken into account, and whilst you're right not impossible, who actually hand on heart would have been happy long term to have snuck through the back door last season?

Online Chris Smith

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Re: Bruce out?
« Reply #2999 on: July 20, 2017, 08:37:46 AM »
I agree with you Paul.  The central issue is that Bruce achieved promotion with other clubs but has shown no evidence whatsoever that he can do it for us.

He hasn't even had a full season yet. Give him a chance!

Nor did the 3 managers before him and they were all sacked for missing their performance targets.

So his remit in October was to promote the 3rd worst squad in Prem history, more toxic than the beer in Peaky Blinders, key injuries?

Well...yes. it wasn't to keep us hanging around mid-table.

The second worst squad (Sunderland 06-07) lost their first four matches the following season, brought in a new manager and went and won the league. And unless Steve Bruce is a worse manager than Roy Keane, then it shouldn't have been an impossible task.

I think the number of variables make such comparisons fairly meaningless. The particular set of circumstances created by Lerner's erratic ownership and several disfunctional managers had put us into a position that required more work than was initially apparent. In hindsight RDM was the wrong man for the job in hand and he just added to our troubles. To me, Bruce is a pragmatist and that is why he has had previous success in this league and why he is a good bet to do the same for us. His buys this summer, experience and leadership, allied to what we have already gives us a squad well placed to deal with the grind of a Championship season, allowing some rotation without significantly weakening the team.