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Author Topic: The Cricket Thread 2017  (Read 103572 times)

Offline PaulWinch again

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Re: The Cricket Thread 2017
« Reply #210 on: May 08, 2017, 06:44:41 PM »
What I really like about this ODI side is that we can put out 6 frontline bowlers and still bat down to 9 or 10. That's why I'd go with Ali and Rashid instead of 1 of them and Buttler.  The issue otherwise is that Root is the 6th bowler and whilst he is a very good part-time option I'm not sure he should be the only alternative if someone has a bad day/picks up an injury when we don't need to put ourselves in that position.

I agree Ali and Rashid play for me.

Offline tomd2103

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Re: The Cricket Thread 2017
« Reply #211 on: May 11, 2017, 12:35:01 AM »
What I really like about this ODI side is that we can put out 6 frontline bowlers and still bat down to 9 or 10. That's why I'd go with Ali and Rashid instead of 1 of them and Buttler.  The issue otherwise is that Root is the 6th bowler and whilst he is a very good part-time option I'm not sure he should be the only alternative if someone has a bad day/picks up an injury when we don't need to put ourselves in that position.

Buttler would play as a frontline batsman anyway Paul.  Top six of Hales, Roy, Root, Morgan, Buttler and Stokes is pretty settled, so I would say seven might be between Billings, Bairstow and Ali.  The only thing I would say about two spinners is that the ICC tournament is early next month and conditions won't be that spinner friendly.  We might therefore see one of Rashid or Ali and an extra seamer (Woakes and Wood probably definites so two from Willey, Finn and Ball maybe).

Offline PaulWinch again

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Re: The Cricket Thread 2017
« Reply #212 on: May 11, 2017, 07:41:33 PM »
I reckon it will be spinner friendly, it has been a very dry year.

Online paul_e

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Re: The Cricket Thread 2017
« Reply #213 on: May 11, 2017, 08:05:43 PM »
What I really like about this ODI side is that we can put out 6 frontline bowlers and still bat down to 9 or 10. That's why I'd go with Ali and Rashid instead of 1 of them and Buttler.  The issue otherwise is that Root is the 6th bowler and whilst he is a very good part-time option I'm not sure he should be the only alternative if someone has a bad day/picks up an injury when we don't need to put ourselves in that position.

Buttler would play as a frontline batsman anyway Paul.  Top six of Hales, Roy, Root, Morgan, Buttler and Stokes is pretty settled, so I would say seven might be between Billings, Bairstow and Ali.  The only thing I would say about two spinners is that the ICC tournament is early next month and conditions won't be that spinner friendly.  We might therefore see one of Rashid or Ali and an extra seamer (Woakes and Wood probably definites so two from Willey, Finn and Ball maybe).

For Buttler you can also sub in Bairstow (billings is a different case for me) so you can go with 6 frontline bowlers and Root and pick between Buttler or Bairstow or you can go with 5 frontline bowlers and Root and pick both.  My point is that I think we're a stronger, in most circumstances, with the extra bowler and if that means 3-4 of them only bowl 6-8 overs then that's ok, so long as the choices on the day are sensible.  It's not often that our ODI side sees someone like Roy, Hales or Root left hanging at one end whilst wickets fall so I'm not convinced the value of the extra batsman.  I honestly believe that the only reason there's even a discussion to be had is because leaving out one Bairstow or Buttler feels wrong.  I'd love to fit them both in but I just don't see how, if he wasn't such a good captain I'd be tempted to suggest Bairstow at 4 ahead of Morgan but even that means leaving out a very good ODI batsman.

Offline peter w

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Re: The Cricket Thread 2017
« Reply #214 on: May 11, 2017, 08:09:05 PM »
The temptation of that extra bat is that nowadays 350 is a score that is gettable. Therefore, batting deep is more desirable than playing bowlers that are good with the bat. Depends on the conditions on the day of course but the thought of getting up to 400 is no longer a pipe dream for many teams which is why I concentrate on the batting side first and filling the bowlers next.

Online paul_e

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Re: The Cricket Thread 2017
« Reply #215 on: May 11, 2017, 08:46:32 PM »
I think think the team I suggested is easily capable of 350+ that's the point really, I don't think we lose as many runs as we gain by being able to mix up the bowling a little more if someone is struggling.

Offline peter w

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Re: The Cricket Thread 2017
« Reply #216 on: May 11, 2017, 08:58:58 PM »
And given how shite Villa and Warwickshire are how refreshing it is to see England having problems like whether to be happy with 350 or 400+ in 50 over games.

Offline simboy

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Re: The Cricket Thread 2017
« Reply #217 on: May 11, 2017, 09:11:15 PM »
To be a little controversial I would drop Morgan and bat Bairstowe at four. I would rather have Bairstowe coming in at 13/2 than Morgan Buttler  or Stokes. I think Billings is suited at 7.

I would play Willey come what may, he's left handed and swings the white ball regularly, something none of the right handed seamers do in a regular basis

So

Hales
Roy
Root
Bairstowe
Stokes
Buttler
Billings/Rashid (Rashid bats at 8 and Ali at 7)
Ali
Woakes
Wiley
Wood

Online Villan For Life

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Re: The Cricket Thread 2017
« Reply #218 on: May 11, 2017, 09:48:14 PM »
To be a little controversial I would drop Morgan and bat Bairstowe at four. I would rather have Bairstowe coming in at 13/2 than Morgan Buttler  or Stokes. I think Billings is suited at 7.

I would play Willey come what may, he's left handed and swings the white ball regularly, something none of the right handed seamers do in a regular basis

So

Hales
Roy
Root
Bairstowe
Stokes
Buttler
Billings/Rashid (Rashid bats at 8 and Ali at 7)
Ali
Woakes
Wiley
Wood

So who is your Captain?

I think Morgan is a great one day Captain and leads his team well. He has that quality that Vaughan had in that he makes things happen with intelligent field placings and sensible bowling changes. He is also one of our most reliable nurdlers. For all of your big hitters, you need a reliable batsman to score ugly runs. Particularly at 13-2.

Bairstow is a great player but maybe we need to give him a rest from some Cricket, I can see the same happening with Root.

Offline tomd2103

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Re: The Cricket Thread 2017
« Reply #219 on: May 11, 2017, 10:55:28 PM »
All about opinions of course, but for me Morgan and Buttler are cemented in at four and five in the side.  For me, it comes to the choice of whether we go with two spinners or not really.  Ali at seven is a good option, so it's probably down to whether Rashid plays as well. 

Offline simboy

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Re: The Cricket Thread 2017
« Reply #220 on: May 12, 2017, 06:31:13 AM »
To be a little controversial I would drop Morgan and bat Bairstowe at four. I would rather have Bairstowe coming in at 13/2 than Morgan Buttler  or Stokes. I think Billings is suited at 7.

I would play Willey come what may, he's left handed and swings the white ball regularly, something none of the right handed seamers do in a regular basis

So

Hales
Roy
Root
Bairstowe
Stokes
Buttler
Billings/Rashid (Rashid bats at 8 and Ali at 7)
Ali
Woakes
Wiley
Wood

So who is your Captain?

I think Morgan is a great one day Captain and leads his team well. He has that quality that Vaughan had in that he makes things happen with intelligent field placings and sensible bowling changes. He is also one of our most reliable nurdlers. For all of your big hitters, you need a reliable batsman to score ugly runs. Particularly at 13-2.

Bairstow is a great player but maybe we need to give him a rest from some Cricket, I can see the same happening with Root.



Simple answer to the captaincy question is Buttler. Of course he captained the side with some success in Bangladesh. We have the England test captain and vice captain in the side for insurance purposes.

As for Morgan steadying the ship and scoring ugly runs before his 100 in January of this year in the last 20 ODI innings proir to that he'd got past 50 twice coming in at 283/3 and 35/2 respectively.


It's all about opinions as has been said, and in my opinion Morgan is the weakest link in a strong batting line up. Whilst a decent on the field captain he is not irreplaceable. He has done more off the field by the change in mind set and approach to the game by an England team. That approach has been established now.

Nice problems to have though.

Offline PaulWinch again

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Re: The Cricket Thread 2017
« Reply #221 on: May 12, 2017, 08:03:04 AM »
Morgan should stay he's in form and he's been a key figure in England's turnaround.

Offline simboy

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Re: The Cricket Thread 2017
« Reply #222 on: May 12, 2017, 08:15:10 AM »
I think there is little doubt Morgan will stay for the tournament. However I don't think that he figures in our strongest line up in my view.

I agree he's been instrumental in the turn around both on and off the pitch. However i just think he takes the place of a better batsman in the team. Bairstowe should be in there but as we stand at the moment he cannot be squeezed into the side if Morgan plays.





Online Villan For Life

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Re: The Cricket Thread 2017
« Reply #223 on: May 12, 2017, 11:33:39 AM »
I think there is little doubt Morgan will stay for the tournament. However I don't think that he figures in our strongest line up in my view.

I agree he's been instrumental in the turn around both on and off the pitch. However i just think he takes the place of a better batsman in the team. Bairstowe should be in there but as we stand at the moment he cannot be squeezed into the side if Morgan plays.


I think the team would be weaker without Morgan's leadership. He kept the captaincy after choosing not to tour Bangladesh and I think he will lead us in to the next 50 over World Cup in 2019. He's an intelligent Captain and appears to know what makes the individuals tick. You could select another hitter at the top of the order but a nurdler like Morgan is vital to the success of the side in all conditions. Sometimes it's the ugly runs that win games not the power shots from the likes Hales, Roy and Buttler.

Offline Woofles The Wonder Dog

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Re: The Cricket Thread 2017
« Reply #224 on: May 14, 2017, 10:59:31 PM »
Amazingly tense end to the Windies Pakistan test. Pakistan win with one over to go. Misbah and Younus bow out with a win. An incredibly stupid thrash  by Gabriel at Yasir's last ball to play on.
« Last Edit: May 14, 2017, 11:01:26 PM by Woofles The Wonder Dog »