.....,and Martinez turned us down!

[adrenachrome]

I doubt anyone expected us to struggle in 2010/11.

We re talking about 2011/2112 are we not?  He "turned us down" in June 2011.

Did anyone expect the central defensive pairing of Dunne and Collins who were in open open rebellion against GH's defensive methods and had broken disciplinary codes to stay?  Did anybody think that Downing and Young would be around much longer and that the funds raised would be used to replace their quality?

The writing was on the wall. It will remain on the wall until RL has sold us off, and quite possibly a lot longer.

[PeterWithesShin]

I doubt anyone expected us to struggle in 2010/11.

We re talking about 2011/2112 are we not?  He "turned us down" in June 2011.

I see what you mean in that we rallied at the end of the season, but from my viewpoint this was the first of of 5 years of not unexpected relegation struggle.   

5 seasons ago was 2010/11.

[adrenachrome]

I doubt anyone expected us to struggle in 2010/11.

We re talking about 2011/2112 are we not?  He "turned us down" in June 2011.

I see what you mean in that we rallied at the end of the season, but from my viewpoint this was the first of of 5 years of not unexpected relegation struggle.   

5 seasons ago was 2010/11.

Yes, and my original comment was

I see what you mean in that we rallied at the end of the season, but from my viewpoint this was the first of of 5 years of not unexpected relegation struggle.

Ok. In the season 2010/2011 under GH,  we were still not mathematically safe with 2 games to go. I count this as a relegation struggle.

We approached Wigan to speak to Martinez and he politely declined. 

2011/12 Relegation struggle culminating in revolt against McLeish.

2012/13 Relegation struggle under PL.

2013/14 Relegation struggle under PL.

2014/15 Relegation struggle under PL with Timeh (please  God) to the rescue.

So, at the time we approached Wigan for RM, we had just completed what would be the first of five relegation struggles.

[Percy McCarthy]

He can get a side playing good football. What he's always failed to do is organise and build a good defence. Last season it was alright, mainly by virtue of inheriting a very organised group from Moyes. Baines and Jagielka played very well and Distin still had something left in the tank.
This season has been different. Baines has been woeful and so has Jagielka. Distin's legs have gone. Martinez's defensive signings have been poor. They were poor at Wigan too and it's been no different at Everton.

That will always be his achilles heel. If he signs a couple of good players in the summer, for the backline, then I wouldn't envision more struggle.

They're not going down this season.

Well, as the only club to have played in the top flight more often than us, fingers crossed for next season then.

[rob_bridge]

I thought it was pretty much accepted that we asked permission to speak to him, were given it, but he said he didn't want to talk to us.

Yes. So he did in fact turn us down in one sense, but not in the sense that he had been offered the job. Semantics, if we are honest.

The rationale to save our face at the time was that he was in a comfort zone and we were a a zone of great distress.

We'd just finished ninth and were playing well.

I see what you mean in that we rallied at the end of the season, but from my viewpoint this was the first of of 5 years of not unexpected relegation struggle.

Agree on this - we got an initial bounce form the Bent signing and then won one game in 7 during Feb and March including 0-1 v Wolves at home which put us in the bottom 3.

We then rallied well in April and May.

[Monty]

He's a very good manager, but he's having a stinker of a season. It happens, like it can happen to players. They'll be fine.

[Clampy]

He's a very good manager, but he's having a stinker of a season. It happens, like it can happen to players. They'll be fine.

I'm not sure about 'very good'. Besides, you could argue he had a stinker every season with Wigan.

[Chris Smith]

He's a very good manager, but he's having a stinker of a season. It happens, like it can happen to players. They'll be fine.

I think the jury is still out but one poor season that might be partly attributed to the demands of Europa League football should not be taken as final proof.

[rob_bridge]

Oh and I certainly would have had him ahead of the person we did end up with in 2011.

[passitsideways]

You do have to wonder about the defensive issues though. He never resolved them at Wigan; but maybe excusable because of his focus on playing attacking football coupled with a lack of money. A lot of people predicted that they would deteriorate on the defensive side of things as they moved further away from Moyes and the way he got that team organised. I don't know how much of it comes down to age apparently rapidly catching up to their defensive spine (Jagielka/Distin/Garry Barry), but watching them on MOTD they've looked shocking at the back pretty much all season.

[Nev]

Caution is advisable here.

The season is far from over. I don't really want them to go down but have had my beady eye on them for some time as the team to sink like a stone and end up below us. If it's a case of us or them the answer is obvious and as for someone turning the chance to manage Aston Villa down, it is always their loss and never the clubs.

[Lastfootstamper]

I thought it was pretty much accepted that we asked permission to speak to him, were given it, but he said he didn't want to talk to us.

Yes. So he did in fact turn us down in one sense, but not in the sense that he had been offered the job. Semantics, if we are honest.

The rationale to save our face at the time was that he was in a comfort zone and we were a a zone of great distress.

We'd just finished ninth and were playing well.

I see what you mean in that we rallied at the end of the season, but from my viewpoint this was the first of of 5 years of not unexpected relegation struggle.

Agree on this - we got an initial bounce form the Bent signing and then won one game in 7 during Feb and March including 0-1 v Wolves at home which put us in the bottom 3.

We then rallied well in April and May.

I know you finish where you deserve to after 38 games, but seeing the results over those final two weekends was like witnessing cosmic alignment.

[Chris Smith]

They have had a bad run but they did win 3-0 at the weekend. I think they are in a similar situation to us in previous seasons, looking in danger but just about keeping their head above water.

[PeterWithesShin]

Ok. In the season 2010/2011 under GH,  we were still not mathematically safe with 2 games to go. I count this as a relegation struggle.

I said 2010/11 wasn't expected because of "but from my viewpoint this was the first of of 5 years of not unexpected relegation struggle." I don't remember anyone thinking we'd have a relegation worry that season.

[Monty]

He's a very good manager, but he's having a stinker of a season. It happens, like it can happen to players. They'll be fine.

I'm not sure about 'very good'. Besides, you could argue he had a stinker every season with Wigan.

Fair enough, we disagree on that, but I think he did a really good job at Wigan. Yes it was always a relegation fight, but you could argue they had no business staying up year on year like they did.