Our new style of play

[pauliewalnuts]

The problem with Lambert's interpretation of a passing / possession game is that he doesn't seem to understand that that doesn't just mean passing to players who remaining mostly rooted to a particular spot, it also means movement off the ball to open up options to the man in possession.

This has been a failing of ours for several years now, but it is currently pretty chronic.

I am glad we're having more possession, but he has got to realise, it isn't just about stats (and, it is interesting, i have to say, that after spending so long telling us he doesn't pay much attention to stats, now the possession ones look better, he seems to have started to pay attention)

[Toronto Villa]

Part of the issue right now is that many of the players Lambert has signed to date were signed to play previously employed systems. Now, if he really wants this new system to work then he will need to go a different route in his player acquisition strategy. It also begs the question, had he played this system all along would Benteke even have been signed in the first place?

[RussellC]

I am glad we're having more possession, but he has got to realise, it isn't just about stats (and, it is interesting, i have to say, that after spending so long telling us he doesn't pay much attention to stats, now the possession ones look better, he seems to have started to pay attention)

I noticed that too. For me, contradicting himself like that it just another sign that he's lost grip of the wheel.

[papa lazarou]

Our build up through wing-backs is too laboured and predictable, so easy to defend.
Our build up through the middle usually results in running into a wall of defenders, so we pass it back and do exactly the same thing again.

This is where I see the problem. All of the managers have had a look at us and plan their approach appropriately. Swansea scored, we had most of the possession but they were happy in absorbing the pressure knowing that we were unlikely to hurt them while boring the pants off everybody. Similarly with Sunderland and Palace except that neither of them were good enough to score. We eventually broke through yesterday but that might not have happened against a better side.
The tactics may one day prove effective, with some change in personnel.
The fact remains though that he's had quite a long time to establish a style of play and using this system isn't going to be the answer.

[nigel]

Passing the ball to a players feet is easy. Passing a ball into space encouraging movement is what Swansea, and othe good footballing teams play. We don't do that. That's the problem

Agree.
Three or four times yesterday stand out for me:
Twice Sanchez, once or twice Cole, they played a great ball into space, but the runner was too slow off the mark, only to be left with the "Crap pass" ringing from the fans.

[Walmley_Villa]

The key for the possession game to work is for me good movement. Weimann for all his critics does move and makes himself available. Gabby on the other hand moves behind defenders making it impossible to find him with a pass as opposed to moving into space. I would love to know what has happened to Sissoko's crossing? First few games of the season without Benteke he delivered some peach crosses for a decent CF, now he barely beats the first man. If we had two good overlapping fullbacks that could deliver decent crosses that would be a bonus. In addition we need a midfielder to ghost into the box as Ian Taylor used to. That is my biggest criticism of our midfielders and something I had hoped Cleverley would bring to the table as he used to get a few goals when at Watford on loan.   

[tomd2103]

The key for the possession game to work is for me good movement. Weimann for all his critics does move and makes himself available. Gabby on the other hand moves behind defenders making it impossible to find him with a pass as opposed to moving into space. I would love to know what has happened to Sissoko's crossing? First few games of the season without Benteke he delivered some peach crosses for a decent CF, now he barely beats the first man. If we had two good overlapping fullbacks that could deliver decent crosses that would be a bonus. In addition we need a midfielder to ghost into the box as Ian Taylor used to. That is my biggest criticism of our midfielders and something I had hoped Cleverley would bring to the table as he used to get a few goals when at Watford on loan.

I'm sorry, but sitting in the North Stand, it quite plain to see that the movement of those two is minimal.  On the rare occasions Weimann drops off, his first touch is always backwards and he ends up playing the ball back in to midfield.  I'm not sure if it is down to them not seeing the runs they should be making or the fact that they can't be bothered to make them.   

[frankmosswasmyuncle]

Your points about Weimann, Gabby and Cissokho are absolutely spot on W_V. Weimann does move, but as tom says his first touch is usually poor. I'm staggered at how often Gabby doesn't move that bit more - he has the experience and pace to know that this is an effective part of a player's game - yet he rarely makes himself available. In the first 20 minutes v Stoke away Cissokho had put in 2 or 3 really good crosses and I thought - "at last, some danger from an overlapping full-back who can cross a ball". I can only assume he's done it less and less since because he's been instructed to do so.
We do START to create some promising openings but the poor movement of our players off the ball and the "safety first" play exemplified by Cissokho's not crossing but passing it back and inside 25 yards to Cleverley/Westwood/Sanchez to start the process all over again, means that the opposition have flooded defence and any advantage is lost.

[andyh]

Ahhh, the much vaunted 'new style of play'

A serious question, if Lambert hadn't spent the last few weeks telling us he has instigated 'a new style of play' would we really know ?
We might not smash the ball up field as much as we did a few games ago, but is that really new way of playing ? 

It just sounds and looks to me like soundbites and he thinks the Villa fans are stupid or thick enough to just lap it up.


   

[London Villan]

Pass and move... Not pass and stand still.

Pass and move at pace seems light years away from the pedestrian football we currently play.

[frankmosswasmyuncle]

The passing/possession game is what Lambert started us with two and a half seasons ago.
Remember seeing it at Burton in pre-season and thinking - I can see what he's trying to do here.
First game of that season at WHam was as frustrating as some of our recent games - we had the ball for what seemed like hours but didn't do anything with it.
It didn't work.
We didn't win.

We now need to build on USING the possession, not just HAVING it.

[SamTheMouse]

In addition we need a midfielder to ghost into the box as Ian Taylor used to. That is my biggest criticism of our midfielders and something I had hoped Cleverley would bring to the table as he used to get a few goals when at Watford on loan.

This has been one of our biggest problems for years now. It was a failing under MON too, until he moved Milner into the middle.

Frustratingly, just before he fell ill, Stan had started playing a more 'Lampard-esque' role and was getting forward a lot more to good effect, and he'd started contributing goals. We never found a replacement for him, unfortunately.

[Monty]

I agree with Paulie and the others. The hard thing, the actual 'Barca' thing, is not passing the ball to feet but moving well off it. When Cesc went there, he described how the style had moved on since his day and how all their movement had to be so precise and yet considered, like improvised clockwork. Which is, obviously, nearly impossible, but at its best it's virtually unbeatable (though having Messi helps). Lambert might have had an epiphany about how long-ball is lumping AND losing it, but it doesn't seem to have made him a more nuanced thinker about the game.

Still, it is better than before, because it's more defensively solid (oh no not again), and we're much less likely to go down now. Which, I suppose, is the ultimate objective unless/until we get a genius as manager or a new owner.

[ciggiesnbeer]

Lambert in his first season experimented a lot with different styles, this maybe him just returning to form.

It is an improvement and what I have wanted for a while. It should be noted that keeping the ball is incredibly helpful defensively , even if you are not creating chances the opposition isn't when you are tapping it about.

What I find remarkable (not entirely linked to the latest style) is we have gone from having the worst defence in the league that did not get relegated to the 4th best. I don't say that implying Lambert is a miracle worker or that we have had some blind luck, it is just , well .... worth remarking upon

[aj2k77]

Part of the issue right now is that many of the players Lambert has signed to date were signed to play previously employed systems. Now, if he really wants this new system to work then he will need to go a different route in his player acquisition strategy. It also begs the question, had he played this system all along would Benteke even have been signed in the first place?

Not sure I agree with this.

Take a look at Westwood, Bennett, Lowton, Cole etc. Would they be better employed playing as we currently do ie slow passing, relying on the fullbacks to get forward or long ball bypassing the team and getting players around Benteke.

I'd say it's how we are playing now, which makes why he bought them in the first place and then played a system that doesn't suit all the more baffling to me. That leads me to think he's just throwing mud at the wall and seeing what sticks. Nothing is planned.