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Author Topic: Two types of manager  (Read 7036 times)

Offline Ivo Stas

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Two types of manager
« on: October 30, 2014, 05:54:39 PM »
In an interview with Henry Winter in the Telegraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/west-ham/11186527/Sam-Allardyce-West-Hams-owners-are-best-Ive-ever-had-and-deserve-this-success-after-not-sacking-me.html), Sam Allardyce said the following...

“There are two types of coaches. There’s coaches like me who weigh up the opposition and ask the team to adjust. Fergie was similar. Jose [Mourinho] is similar. Then there’s Arsène, who won’t adjust. There’s Brendan [Rodgers], who looks like he won’t adjust. There’s Manuel Pellegrini, who looks like he won’t adjust, even in the Champions League. He seems to favour what he’s got. City are quite open.
 
“Their [Wenger/Rodgers/Pellegrini’s] philosophy is different to ours. Ours is more about who are we playing against. Their philosophy is more, ‘We always play this way’, and they won’t change, they carry doing on the same thing. That’s why you can beat them.


This got me thinking... which type of manager is Paul Lambert? I know most of you are thinking "a third type, completely useless" but at Norwich Lambert had a reputation for changing tactics and personnel during matches to good effect (so would be an Allardyce, Mourinho, Ferguson). However, with us he seems to always want to play the same players (Weimann) in the same 4-3-3 no matter what (so would be a Wengers, Rodgers, Pellegrini).

I was also wondering... which of our previous managers stood out as glaring examples of one type or another..?

Offline Tom_Mc9?

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Re: Two types of manager
« Reply #1 on: October 30, 2014, 05:59:00 PM »
I thought the two types of managers were the motivators ('Arry, Warnock, Gregory) and the tacticians (Wenger, Martinez, Pocchetino) I'm not sure many of our managers in recent history fit into either of those though.

Offline Ivo Stas

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Re: Two types of manager
« Reply #2 on: October 30, 2014, 06:16:36 PM »
I remember Ron Atkinson springing a suprise in the 1994 League Cup final win against Man Utd (Villa's best ever win, in my opinion, in the Premier League era, against a Utd team that would win the double that year) by bringing in Graham Fenton (for his debut?) to do a particular job. I can't recall now what that job was. Or who got left out (Ray Houghton perhaps?).

So that would make BFR a type 1 (Allardyce, Mourinho, Ferguson).
« Last Edit: October 30, 2014, 06:25:42 PM by Ivo Stas »

Offline frankmosswasmyuncle

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Re: Two types of manager
« Reply #3 on: October 30, 2014, 06:19:25 PM »
I  hate the idea of "types" - it immediately takes away any possibility of an individual approach, which pundits and their followers criticise with apparent ease, simply showing they're conditioned and ignorant feckers.

re: the article types, and being a total hypocrite in saying this, Lambert is type 2. Without doubt!
(but then perhaps he's just Lambert: a football manager without tactical nous or imagination?)

Offline OCD

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Re: Two types of manager
« Reply #4 on: October 30, 2014, 06:24:57 PM »
Rodgers does adjust tactics and was one of Mourinho's coaches at one point. He's known for playing 4-3-3 but he also played the diamond at times last season. Same with Lambert.

Offline eamonn

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Re: Two types of manager
« Reply #5 on: October 30, 2014, 06:29:24 PM »
Yeah, a bit surprised that someone as experienced as Allardyce would say something as general as that.

Offline Eigentor

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Re: Two types of manager
« Reply #6 on: October 30, 2014, 06:30:52 PM »
One may suspect that the motivation behind Allardyce's quotes is a desire to put himself in the same bracket as Mourinho and Ferguson, rather than to provide a particular insightful analysis of manager "types".

Offline mrastonvilla

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Re: Two types of manager
« Reply #7 on: October 30, 2014, 06:34:34 PM »
One may suspect that the motivation behind Allardyce's quotes is a desire to put himself in the same bracket as Mourinho and Ferguson, rather than to provide a particular insightful analysis of manager "types".

Or to explain the change in philosophy at West Ham being his idea rather than enforced by the board

Offline frankmosswasmyuncle

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Re: Two types of manager
« Reply #8 on: October 30, 2014, 06:36:04 PM »
One may suspect that the motivation behind Allardyce's quotes is a desire to put himself in the same bracket as Mourinho and Ferguson, rather than to provide a particular insightful analysis of manager "types".
This.

Particularly now that WHam have become "challengers" in the last 2 weeks.

Offline Ian.

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Re: Two types of manager
« Reply #9 on: October 30, 2014, 06:53:28 PM »
Fat Sam puts himself in the same category as Mourinho and Fergerson. He'd be a good candidate for the Apprentice with that sort of talk.

Offline saunders_heroes

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Re: Two types of manager
« Reply #10 on: October 30, 2014, 07:08:40 PM »
Fat Sam puts himself in the same category as Mourinho and Fergerson. He'd be a good candidate for the Apprentice with that sort of talk.

That's exactly what I thought. Talk about having a high opinion of yourself!

Offline curiousorange

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Re: Two types of manager
« Reply #11 on: October 30, 2014, 07:28:38 PM »
Yeah, all I really took from that article is Allardyce begging to be respected as a football brain because they've strung a few decent results together.

In answer to the question though, I think Lambert is what I would call 'non-reactive'. That is, he tends to need to react to circumstances when his tactics don't work, and then doesn't really do anything to change it. O'Neill was the same.

Offline OCD

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Re: Two types of manager
« Reply #12 on: October 30, 2014, 10:37:03 PM »
In answer to the question though, I think Lambert is what I would call 'non-reactive'. That is, he tends to need to react to circumstances when his tactics don't work, and then doesn't really do anything to change it. O'Neill was the same.

Saw that Monday night. A change was needed around the 60th-65th minute because nothing was happening. 70th minute and it's game over.

Offline Deano's Mullet

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Re: Two types of manager
« Reply #13 on: October 30, 2014, 10:53:25 PM »
That 94 Final was a one off really, BFR used to say he never normally worried about what other teams were doing, he liked the opposition to worry about his team. We lost the two league games vs United that season despite matching them in the home game and playing fairly ok in the away match. For the Old Trafford game he used Earl Barrett to man mark Cantona which didn't work, it had worked at Highbury when Earl marked Ian Wright. In the Old Trafford game though Cantona saw it as a challenge and raised his game scoring twice. BFR left Cantona unattended in the Final and the Frenchman did fuck all, especially after one tackle on him by Townsend. Generally BFR never really altered his style though. He did try 4-3-3 at the start of 1993-94 to accommodate Saunders, Whittingham and Dalian but it didn't work.
Brian Little never really altered his tactics once he was settled on 5-3-2. Half way through that year it was only by accident that Tommy Johnson become a dangerous striker playing in the hole behind Yorke and Savo whereas before it was a straight three man midfield with Taylor, Draper and Townsend. When BL did change it at the start of 1997-98 to accommodate Collymore with the usual pairing of Milosevic/Yorke it just didn't work.

Offline Deano's Mullet

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Re: Two types of manager
« Reply #14 on: October 30, 2014, 10:54:40 PM »
PS It would have been between Houghton and Garry Parker as to whom Fenton replaced, most likely Houghton as Parker was injured or out of favour most of that season.

 


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