Is this the season... (Poll reset after Albion double)

[Damo70]

Sooner or later our luck was going trun out, and with each passing week it looks like this will be the year.  The legacy of Lerner and his poor decisions are coming home to roost.

Ian Holloway got loads of stick when he called us a half arsed place which used to be famous, but the truth is he was 100% correct.  We are no longer a big club, we're a joke looked upon with contempt as more progressive clubs like Swansea, Southampton and even West Brom leave us trailing in their wake.

When Albion are struggling they are a joke club whose chairman changes managers every five minutes and even then has another bloke telling the manager what to do. When they are doing (relatively) well they are 'progressive'. Personally I rate Pulis because he gets results but if we had appointed him I wonder how many posts would have used the word 'progressive' to describe his appointment?

[Monty]

Sooner or later our luck was going trun out, and with each passing week it looks like this will be the year.  The legacy of Lerner and his poor decisions are coming home to roost.

Ian Holloway got loads of stick when he called us a half arsed place which used to be famous, but the truth is he was 100% correct.  We are no longer a big club, we're a joke looked upon with contempt as more progressive clubs like Swansea, Southampton and even West Brom leave us trailing in their wake.

When Albion are struggling they are a joke club whose chairman changes managers every five minutes and even then has another bloke telling the manager what to do. When they are doing (relatively) well they are 'progressive'. Personally I rate Pulis because he gets results but if we had appointed him I wonder how many posts would have used the word 'progressive' to describe his appointment?

It would have been a Red Adair appointment. I would have been a little disappointed but I'd have understood the logic.

[pauliewalnuts]

Sooner or later our luck was going trun out, and with each passing week it looks like this will be the year.  The legacy of Lerner and his poor decisions are coming home to roost.

Ian Holloway got loads of stick when he called us a half arsed place which used to be famous, but the truth is he was 100% correct.  We are no longer a big club, we're a joke looked upon with contempt as more progressive clubs like Swansea, Southampton and even West Brom leave us trailing in their wake.

When Albion are struggling they are a joke club whose chairman changes managers every five minutes and even then has another bloke telling the manager what to do. When they are doing (relatively) well they are 'progressive'. Personally I rate Pulis because he gets results but if we had appointed him I wonder how many posts would have used the word 'progressive' to describe his appointment?

It would have been a Red Adair appointment. I would have been a little disappointed but I'd have understood the logic.

The clever (or obvious, even) thing to do would have been to make an appointment which could be considered progressive and something to work long term with, but *also* highly likely to keep us up.

That opportunity disappeared, though, because Lerner and Fox spent far too long just watching Lambert fuck it up week after week, they left it far too late to have any hope of that sort of appointment.

It's not even as if they'd not seen numerous extended spells of awfulness over more than two seasons (for which Lerner was here - at least in spirit and able to write emails - even if Fox wasn't) which would have had pretty much every other club making a change.

Instead, it took a run of five consecutive defeats, of 11 hours without scoring a single goal, and well into February, with us in the bottom three until they finally did something about it.

And even then they managed to appoint a manager who doesn't look particularly well qualified in either of those camps (progressive or "will keep us up), and has a management CV which not only consists of just 20 odd matches, but all at a team in the European places rather than one struggling for its life.

I don't like the Sherwood appointment, but if we do go down, I won't apportion any of the blame to him.

That has to go to Lerner and Fox whose management of the club has not only got us into this pathetic state in the first place, but also allowed it to go on for so long it'd take some sort of magician to keep us up.

Truly unforgivable.

We've had plenty of evidence of Lerner's total inability to run a sporting institution already, but I'd never have thought he could manage to be quite so inept as to bring about this situation.

[Monty]

You can't apportion *none* of the blame to a man in charge of a third of the league games. If we continue to be as bad as we were last week and yesterday then some responsibility will absolutely go to him, just as credit will go to him if we somehow turn it around. No doubt, however, that the malaise at the club runs a lot deeper than him, and even a lot deeper than Lambert.

[pauliewalnuts]

You can't apportion *none* of the blame to a man in charge of a third of the league games. If we continue to be as bad as we were last week and yesterday then some responsibility will absolutely go to him, just as credit will go to him if we somehow turn it around. No doubt, however, that the malaise at the club runs a lot deeper than him, and even a lot deeper than Lambert.

Well, if some blame, not a great deal.

it's also not as simple as "in charge of a third of the league games", either, as these 12 games don't just start on a clean slate as if it were the start of the season.

He's come in to a club which is basically a juggernaut of grimness heading straight toward a cliff edge. He's lost his first two league matches, but what about the five consecutive games before that? Or the entire season of shitness in which we'd managed to score a total of 12 goals?

It was all so late that really, it'd take something pretty spectacular to stop it going totally to shit.

[Monty]

True, but if he makes mistakes in his team preparation/tactics/selections etc that's no-one's fault but his. He can't take the blame for the poor bunch at his disposal, but Cleverley as a wide midfielder? Gabby for so long in both matches? N'Zogbia coming on instead of Gil? He could have helped those. I'm not sure how much difference other decisions would have made, but we might have had a better chance.

But again, obviously, not all his fault. I just want to ascribe the blame where it's due. Lack of confidence and misery? Lambert. Cheap as shit squad? Lerner. Seasons of stagnation? Lerner. Poor appointment/timing of sacking? Fox. Poor tactics last two games? Sherwood.

[Ad@m]

We're definitely going down.

Get down the bookies then - you'll make a fortune.

You would have to have a fortune to make a fortune. We are odds on to go down with most bookies. Only BetFred Fred and Billy Hill at 11/10 think we will stay up at the expense of Burnley, Leicester and QPR.

11/10 is pretty spectacular odds for something that is 'definitely' going to happen.

[tomd2103]

Sooner or later our luck was going trun out, and with each passing week it looks like this will be the year.  The legacy of Lerner and his poor decisions are coming home to roost.

Ian Holloway got loads of stick when he called us a half arsed place which used to be famous, but the truth is he was 100% correct.  We are no longer a big club, we're a joke looked upon with contempt as more progressive clubs like Swansea, Southampton and even West Brom leave us trailing in their wake.

When Albion are struggling they are a joke club whose chairman changes managers every five minutes and even then has another bloke telling the manager what to do. When they are doing (relatively) well they are 'progressive'. Personally I rate Pulis because he gets results but if we had appointed him I wonder how many posts would have used the word 'progressive' to describe his appointment?

It would have been a Red Adair appointment. I would have been a little disappointed but I'd have understood the logic.

The clever (or obvious, even) thing to do would have been to make an appointment which could be considered progressive and something to work long term with, but *also* highly likely to keep us up

That opportunity disappeared, though, because Lerner and Fox spent far too long just watching Lambert fuck it up week after week, they left it far too late to have any hope of that sort of appointment.

In our current situation (up for sale and massive new TV deal on its way) we didn't even need that.  We just needed someone who was going to keep us up.  You're right about leaving it so late though - it was going to be difficult for anyone coming in at that stage.

[Dave]

He could have helped those. I'm not sure how much difference other decisions would have made, but we might have had a better chance.

The strong second half against Leicester was attributed to his tactics and motivation. So rather than build on that confidence and that result he decides to change half the team.

It's all just a bit odd.

[Toronto Villa]

I don't want to sound like some sort of apologist for Sherwood because believe me it is the last thing I want to come across as. But to think he was going to come in a fix things this quickly isn't realistic. I think there is a rot that will take a lot more time to get out, but short term the players need to follow basic instruction which they seem incapable of doing. Listen to what he said yesterday how they reverted to something that he and the coaches didn't ask them to do. There is only so much he can do from the touchline. What we saw was the spectre of Lambert's Villa fighting to stay alive. That's the problem. The negativity is so ingrained the players fall back on it like comfort food.

He might not be the answer as manager long term but he's got an uphill battle trying to rid the malaise while at the same time providing enough instruction to get that all important first win.

[Damo70]

I think a manager more experienced in successful relegation battles would have had a plan for a quick fix that was enough to keep us up (here is that name again...Pulis did it with a Palace side that looked dead certs for relegation even halfway through the season they were so poor) and a longer term plan for the future. To be honest, even without the second you can worry about that when you have succeeded in the first plan.

[claret and blue blood]

He's done ok in the two matches but luck deserted him against Stoke when Richardson went off just before their equaliser and Vlaar's gift at the end.we go 1-0 up against the Geordies and we would have won yesterday but we didn't then Okore misses the ball and that's it.I think Gil isn't fully fit  plus he's give. The senior players first stab at sorting it but he must know now how poor we really are.Give him a break.

[Louzie0]

Maybe the timing is significant for instant recovery or 'the bounce' to take effect, whoever takes over.
Like, it would be more likely to happen before or just after Christmas, rather than in February.

He is having some effect, now we just need some luck as well.

[Rudy Can't Fail]

He's done ok in the two matches but luck deserted him against Stoke when Richardson went off just before their equaliser and Vlaar's gift at the end.we go 1-0 up against the Geordies and we would have won yesterday but we didn't then Okore misses the ball and that's it.I think Gil isn't fully fit  plus he's give. The senior players first stab at sorting it but he must know now how poor we really are.Give him a break.

He was fully responsible for the Stoke game, it was his pathetic instruction to hoof it up to Benteke. It wasn't working and he had no Plan B to change it and the players looked lost and confused. That was irresponsible especially as the points were there for the taking. Yesterday was exactly what I hoped he'd have approached the Stoke game. There was urgency to our play, we passed it around but with speed, the obvious ingredient Lambert's 'new style' missed. Yes, we went long ball in the last few minutes but we were desperate.

I agree a win can change so much for us and despite losing yesterday, I really hope Sherwood can give the lads the confidence to go out and keep improving. We're running out of games but if we are to start picking up points it won't be by hoofing it. Benteke looked far happier than he has in ages as he was finally getting some service. If we can build on that we're still in with a chance.

Sherwood needs to do just three things now; keep heads and confidence up, get them believing they can do it, not mess about tactically. All three are within his capability.

[Dave]

I agree a win can change so much for us and despite losing yesterday, I really hope Sherwood can give the lads the confidence to go out and keep improving. We're running out of games but if we are to start picking up points it won't be by hoofing it. Benteke looked far happier than he has in ages as he was finally getting some service. If we can build on that we're still in with a chance.

Sherwood needs to do just three things now; keep heads and confidence up, get them believing they can do it, not mess about tactically. All three are within his capability.

I agree. Had we won 4-2 yesterday then it wouldn't have been an unfair scoreline.

It doesn't help how the table looks, but I'd rather yesterday's 1-0 defeat than the 1-0 defeat that we would have had yes there yesterday under Lambert.