Ball possession

[PeterWithesShin]

Arsenal had a total pass tally of 814, while Villa managed 312.

[manic-road]

Arsenal had a total pass tally of 814, while Villa managed 312.

Well they will pass the ball more often if they have a lot more possession.

[Stu]

We're playing the same kind of football as we always have under Lambert; pressing, counter-attacking stuff that doesn't necessarily rely on possession, but we have players that are able to put it to greater effect now. When we get everyone fit again we'll be ok I think. Defence had a good, old-fashioned brainfart today but we have been unlucky with injury/illness in this area (and midfield) today.

Lambert and Keane have to make sure their heads don't drop though because we've got another few weeks of very tough matches to go.

[PaulWinch again]

Counter attacking teams who don't have much possession will only ever get so far, just look at us under O'Neill.

[KevinGage]

Possession football is only one facet of the issue -albeit it's a pretty significant one. 

We also need to stop being so one paced. 

Although the style of play isn't identical, it's a similar problem to the English national side.  They go gung-ho high tempo out of the traps, but if they don't score within the first 15-20 minutes, they don't have another gear to go to.

The better sides can switch it up. Yes, look for the early goal by all means.  But if it isn't on, take the sting out of the game and keep possession for a while -even if it in non threatening areas.  That gives you the chance to pace yourself and come again. Not many teams can play a relentless attacking style for 90 minutes, even the moneybags clubs.

As a counter attacking side, we do need to draw the opposition in. So you do have to strike that balance between risk and reward.  But keeping the ball at times doesn't run contrary to that.  The Arsenal side of the early noughties with Henry and Pires were one of the finest counter attacking sides I have seen, springing at pace and making teams even wary of winning a corner.  Before that, Brian Clough's Forest of the late 80's-90's were excellent on the counter too.  But they would have struggled to have much success with 30% possession in most games.

[supertom]

It's tough really. We regularly finished second even under O Neill and three 6th placed finishes. It's been ingrained in our style of play for years now. We don't have a side full of technicians. We tend to go for big at the back, pace on the flanks, big man up front. With a few variations in between.

We've got a better standard of players now than we've had for a while. We should see our possession stats improve in the games from the middle of Oct through to November. The likes of Cleverley and Westwood are good on the ball. Benteke is. Grealish looks very composed on the ball too. If anyone in our side looked like a proper footballer today it was Jack. There's also Joe Cole to come in for a handful of games.

Come through the next 3 games relatively un-fucked and we can then look to express ourselves on the ball a bit more. We can do it. We were very good in the first half against Hull. We went two up and then took our foot off the gas and sat on that lead. Consequently they overtook us on possession.

[Stu]

Counter attacking teams who don't have much possession will only ever get so far, just look at us under O'Neill.

We are where we are. If it's getting us points then we have to be pragmatic. We're a good couple of seasons short of the experience and quality of the MON teams as well (not to mention about a £50m spend on players), so hopefully this is just a time of consolidation before, by 2018, we win at home against the bloody Arsenal.

[PaulWinch again]

I agree we are where we are, but that doesn't mean we can't aspire to be better and getting more possession of the ball is part of that.

[supertom]

In pre-season we tried a number of formations. With the personnel involved I don't see why we can't adopt a 4-2-3-1 in home games and make use of our better footballers. Certainly against bottom 12 opposition we have the quality to play better football.
Against Arsenal? No chance, we're not going to out-pass them, particularly not with such a lethargic side like we had today due to the virus.

Play Cole or Grealish off Benteke. Two of Richardson, Gabby or Zogbia on the wings, and then two holding players in the middle, with Delph being the box-to-box player.

Our possession will almost certainly improve with Benteke too, as the ball sticks to him and he can bring others into play.

[SoccerHQ]

We play the game at 100 miles an hour which is great to watch when those counter attacking moves work but won't mean consistant possession like a Swansea.

Our movement off the ball was been rubbish in most villa teams I've watched aswell, a player on the move will always beat someone static so explains why we seem always to lose second balls against the better teams as they're always anticipating and we're always reacting.

We still don't have a great amount of creativity in the squad so inveriably we lose the ball in tight areas.

[N'ZMAV]

Guzan must have Bosnich's boots on recently...

[Salsa Party Animal]

I think we should look at european football and play 4-2-3-1 or 4-1-4-1 formation with Benteke upfront on his own. We need to look at Real Madrid and see how to play.

[Dante Lavelli]

Counter attacking teams who don't have much possession will only ever get so far, just look at us under O'Neill.

That's the problem in a nutshell.  There is a glass ceiling to how far a team can get when their sole tactic is counter attacking.  At some point we need to develop a Plan B, particularly for home matches.

[Toronto Villa]

The only thing that annoys me about possession stats is not that we don't play that way. It's knowing that we can and don't try and do it more often.

[pauliewalnuts]

The only thing that annoys me about possession stats is not that we don't play that way. It's knowing that we can and don't try and do it more often.

I think that's a fair comment.

Also, if you look at Lambert's first season, we scored some of the best goals I've seen us score in years and years, and most of them came about as a result of possession football.

Frequently, we'll play poorly in a game, then put together even a short period of possession, and we'll get something out of it.

I just don't get how, for years, we have shown that ability but constantly end up the 18th (or so) lowest possession team in the league.

I think the points made above by those talking about MON are absolutely spot on, too. That was always our weakness, even when we had a good period. Lethal on the road when counter attacking, truly clueless at home when faced with the need to take control of the game.

It's like some sort of defective gene passed down from year to year, because we have been like this for almost the entirety of the last decade (at least) and don't seem to be improving (in that sense) at all.