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Author Topic: Why do we need British?  (Read 10912 times)

Offline olaftab

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Re: Why do we need British?
« Reply #30 on: April 23, 2014, 02:00:52 PM »
The fact that McLeish was in the top 20 paid managers in the world when he was with us makes me think that there are plenty of managers on the continent that would be more than happy to come to us should any vacancy arise.
This.

Offline olaftab

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Re: Why do we need British?
« Reply #31 on: April 23, 2014, 02:02:39 PM »
While I enjoy beans on toast, a bit of bangers and mash and a nice cuppa, I find myself yearning for Poule au Pot Henri IV, tagliatelle all'etrusca and a a bottle of Côte Rôtie.
Some very bad spelling of English words and funny letters used in this post.

Offline Monty

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Re: Why do we need British?
« Reply #32 on: April 23, 2014, 02:05:40 PM »
It is the case that most British managers come from 20th century British football culture, which is by and large a direct, percentages style, with all the virtues of determination and organisation and all the vices of rigidity and unsophistication. You get the odd exception like Rodgers, but for the most part they're all pretty much the same.

As for Moyes, he is, I have to say, the absolute zenith of the type of manager we do not need. He's good at reactive tactics, defence-building, that sort of thing, but what we need is someone with stylistic vision, someone who'll use the youth system (which by all accounts Moyes failed to do), someone who will above all drag this club kicking and screaming into this century. Nothing against Moyes, or indeed against Lambert, but they're just the opposite of what we need right now.

Offline NeilH

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Re: Why do we need British?
« Reply #33 on: April 23, 2014, 02:10:32 PM »
De Boer really has done an excellent job. When he arrived, Ajax had not won the league for around 6 or so seasons and had even struggled to make the UEFA spot. He turned the team around and they have not only won it three seasons in a row, but this year they will do done so with arguably their weakest squad for a number of years. Having now achieved all he can here, he would certainly be looking for a new challenge, but I reckon he’s almost nailed on to go to The Spuds, now that Van Gaal seems destined for Manure.

For anyone who thinks that Koeman is a good idea, well whilst Ajax will once more win the title, Feyenoord will once more be the bridesmaid, despite having a far superior squad this season. Whilst Ajax has ground out results, Feyenoord have been tactically out-maneuvered by such giants of football as Heracles and RFC Waalwijk. Whilst Feyenoorders will be sad to see him go, it is not a great reflection on his coaching that they have effectively blown a title they really should have nailed this season.

Offline Toronto Villa

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Re: Why do we need British?
« Reply #34 on: April 23, 2014, 02:11:48 PM »
Given some of the things that are being revealed about Moyes an his management style, tactics, training methods etc, and knowing that all PL players will be reading all of this, he'll be better off getting away from the game for a bit, and resurfacing when things have cooled down a lot. He might have been a good appointment post MON, maybe even post TSM, but certainly not now.

Offline Jarpie

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Re: Why do we need British?
« Reply #35 on: April 23, 2014, 02:19:40 PM »
It is the case that most British managers come from 20th century British football culture, which is by and large a direct, percentages style, with all the virtues of determination and organisation and all the vices of rigidity and unsophistication. You get the odd exception like Rodgers, but for the most part they're all pretty much the same.

As for Moyes, he is, I have to say, the absolute zenith of the type of manager we do not need. He's good at reactive tactics, defence-building, that sort of thing, but what we need is someone with stylistic vision, someone who'll use the youth system (which by all accounts Moyes failed to do), someone who will above all drag this club kicking and screaming into this century. Nothing against Moyes, or indeed against Lambert, but they're just the opposite of what we need right now.

This I was trying to get at with my posting, but Monty was better at paraphrasing it.

Crystal Palace has been much better than expected under Pulis and Stoke was consistent with him but his managing style and ability will get teams only so far. Highest where Stoke finished with Pulis was 11th, and they spent a lot of money on players.

Brendan Rodgers might be or might become one of the best british managers but time will tell. They do play very good football, and what I've seen it looks to be at least a bit of combination of higher tempo more direct british style and continental, more passing football.

When you look at how well british managers have fared in the premier league and if you count scottish managers too, only two managers from british isles have won the league (Ferguson and Dalglish), and only four managers from BI have gotten second place: Dalglish, Ferguson, BFR and Keegan. For some reason managers from BI by large has been unable to break through to the top 4-5, and this has become even more evident in the last 6-7 years as last english manager who managed to break to the top 4 was Harry Redknap twice with Tottenham.

One could make a point that the big clubs haven't been willing to give chance for managers from BI as they're not enough high profile but I don't think it's just that.

Offline dave.woodhall

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Re: Why do we need British?
« Reply #36 on: April 23, 2014, 02:20:27 PM »
How many British managers (Rednose excepted) have won a trophy or finished top four in the past ten years?

Offline glasses

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Re: Why do we need British?
« Reply #37 on: April 23, 2014, 02:23:03 PM »
How many British managers (Rednose excepted) have won a trophy or finished top four in the past ten years?
Harry Redknapp and Steve Mclaren

Offline Monty

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Re: Why do we need British?
« Reply #38 on: April 23, 2014, 02:23:20 PM »
How many British managers (Rednose excepted) have won a trophy or finished top four in the past ten years?

Exactly. This is why it makes me laugh when people say 'well Venglos and Houllier didn't work, so no foreign managers at the Villa please': firstly, that the whole area of Foreignia, a bit bigger than Britain at last check, is written off because two weren't particularly good for us over a total of two seasons of our 140-years history; secondly, over that history, we've had an almost unbroken run of British/Irish managers, not many of whom have been unmitigated successes.

Offline dave.woodhall

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Re: Why do we need British?
« Reply #39 on: April 23, 2014, 02:24:25 PM »
How many British managers (Rednose excepted) have won a trophy or finished top four in the past ten years?
Harry Redknapp and Steve Mclaren

You've missed at least one, but the point stands.

Offline Monty

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Re: Why do we need British?
« Reply #40 on: April 23, 2014, 02:24:59 PM »
How many British managers (Rednose excepted) have won a trophy or finished top four in the past ten years?
Harry Redknapp and Steve Mclaren

You've missed at least one, but the point stands.

Moyes and now Rodgers are the other two (if you count NI).

Offline dave.woodhall

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Re: Why do we need British?
« Reply #41 on: April 23, 2014, 02:28:14 PM »
How many British managers (Rednose excepted) have won a trophy or finished top four in the past ten years?
Harry Redknapp and Steve Mclaren

You've missed at least one, but the point stands.

Moyes and now Rodgers are the other two (if you count NI).

You surely haven't forgotten the other one?

Offline Rudy Can't Fail

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Re: Why do we need British?
« Reply #42 on: April 23, 2014, 02:29:27 PM »
It is the case that most British managers come from 20th century British football culture, which is by and large a direct, percentages style, with all the virtues of determination and organisation and all the vices of rigidity and unsophistication. You get the odd exception like Rodgers, but for the most part they're all pretty much the same.

As for Moyes, he is, I have to say, the absolute zenith of the type of manager we do not need. He's good at reactive tactics, defence-building, that sort of thing, but what we need is someone with stylistic vision, someone who'll use the youth system (which by all accounts Moyes failed to do), someone who will above all drag this club kicking and screaming into this century. Nothing against Moyes, or indeed against Lambert, but they're just the opposite of what we need right now.

Agree wholeheartedly, Monty.

As Dave pointed out, we pay top wages to managers and it's about time we started seeing somebody actually earn them. There are plenty of good options out there, we just need to make sure this time we choose the right one, not so much to win us instant success but more to point us in the right direction. Once we're there, it should be a lot easier attracting the right managers because right now, unless something changes over the summer, we're hardly the most attractive club for any manager worth his salt and it's about time we ended the cycle of being the PL's easiest managerial pension donators, where failure is rewarded and compensation paid out on leaving the cushy number.

Offline LeeB

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Re: Why do we need British?
« Reply #43 on: April 23, 2014, 02:29:40 PM »
How many British managers (Rednose excepted) have won a trophy or finished top four in the past ten years?
Harry Redknapp and Steve Mclaren

You've missed at least one, but the point stands.

Moyes and now Rodgers are the other two (if you count NI).

You surely haven't forgotten the other one?

Robert O'Dimatteo?

Offline Monty

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Re: Why do we need British?
« Reply #44 on: April 23, 2014, 02:30:43 PM »
How many British managers (Rednose excepted) have won a trophy or finished top four in the past ten years?
Harry Redknapp and Steve Mclaren

You've missed at least one, but the point stands.

Moyes and now Rodgers are the other two (if you count NI).

You surely haven't forgotten the other one?

Top four or trophy? I've drawn a total blank. Did Dalglish win a trophy?

 


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