Shay Given

[ozzjim]

Soccer, we have pointed this out a number of times since his post and it has been ignored. I think that game did not happen the way we recall it.

I actually think it is a real shame Guzan will go, and I would not be shocked to see him pitch up as number 1 at Sunderland come August, and be a revelation.

[Big Dick Edwards]

In 35 yrs watching villa guzan is the worst keeper on crosses i have ever seen down here -stoke would have had a field day against him.

Does 35 years just about exclude John Burridge? He wasn't nicknamed Dracula for nothing..

[SoccerHQ]

Guzan will rightly go, I think he has the potential to become a top keeper in the mould of Freidal, and Given is blocking him now. If it were me I would sell Given and play Brad Jnr, but we won't do that, Given has a 5 year deal on 50k a week, so we have to defend in a way which makes up for his complete lack of authority on crosses.


Peter was spot on above though, we concede set piece goals in the main through an inability to get a blocker on the near post. We are a fairly little team in truth, and the 2 centre backs often end up with people having the run on them as the ball comes across. Heskey when on the field should be near post with 1 aim, but for some reason rarely is used like that. I would love a couple of our signings this summer in midfield and upfront to be 6"2 plus, to give us that extra height in there.

Under MON, Carew would always be put on the near post for Corners to flick away. It worked, we didn't concede that many when he was fit.

When McLeish brought on Heskey at 2-2 against Chelsea, I thought he'd adopt this position when they had a corner but for the 2nd Ivanovic goal he was somewhere near the back post!

[brian green]

Given does not command his area the way he should and Stoke yesterday were pushing him about like a boy during their set piece siege operations but Budgie was like one of those  football game figures that you whizz round with handles he genuinely only ever went from from side to side never forward or back.   He is in there with Kreufeld -Jacobs and Tourette as the definer of an incurable disease, in his case Budgie's Disease, to be incapable of forward or backward locomotion.

[Vegas]

Shay's excellent at the old shot stopping malarkey, which is worth something as a goalie you have to say.  As for "every goalie in the premier league should be able to do that", that's like saying "every midfielder should be able to pass" - yes clearly, but there are still better and worse examples.  Shay's right up there on shot stopping, and isn't that bad at the other stuff.

Guzan's played pretty well too, but for me is still "plucky underdog" rather than "obvious first choice premier league keeper".

If my life depended on Villa winning next week, I would choose Given. If I was picking a goalie to give a new 4 year contract to, it's Guzan.

[joe_c]

From The Fiver when he joined back in July.

ANY GIVEN MONDAY

In his increasingly rare moments of clarity, the Fiver's drink-addled, pig-toting knobbly-stick-waving Irish cousin Theme Pub O'Fiver has a theory about Shay Given from the County Donegal. To borrow a phrase from his opinionated champagne-swilling brother in arms Eamon Dunphy, Theme Pub is prepared to concede that while Shay Given from the County Donegal is a good goalkeeper, he is not a great goalkeeper. It is a point of view that has earned poor auld Theme Pub the opprobrium and slaps of many compatriots who worship at the altar of St Shay of Given and will not hear a bad word said about the goalkeeper, who hails from the County Donegal.

What Theme Pub has noticed, albeit through half-open bloodshot eyes, is that Shay Given from the County Donegal has played behind some terrible defences in his time; terrible defences starring players who became a laughing stock when they played in front of Given, but strangely went on to resurrect their careers elsewhere, lining up in back fours that played in front of goalkeepers that conspicuously weren't Shay Given from the County Donegal. Yes, Titus Bramble – the Fiver is looking at you. And you Fabricio Coloccini and Joleon Lescott … the rest of you know who you are.

But while Given has been described by Roberto Mancini as "one of the five best goalkeepers in the world", he is not the best goalkeeper at Manchester City and has subsequently been shipped out. As is customary, no club that Jamie Redknapp would describe as "top top top top" has come in for him, so instead he has been sentenced to five years at Aston Villa for a fee believed to be in the region of £4m. It's a good bit of business for Villa, who have got themselves a goalie renowned as "a great shot-stopper", but whose ability to command his six-yard box is a mite questionable.

"Aston Villa is a huge football club and I'm really excited to be joining," said Given upon inking his contract, as you do. "I'm looking forward to training and playing with the players here. They're a good bunch of lads, very talented and I know several of them already which will help." Be afraid Richard Dunne and James Collins. Be very, very afraid. For that man in green anchored to his goalline not coming for that cross is Shay Given from the County Donegal.

[ozzjim]

Guzan will rightly go, I think he has the potential to become a top keeper in the mould of Freidal, and Given is blocking him now. If it were me I would sell Given and play Brad Jnr, but we won't do that, Given has a 5 year deal on 50k a week, so we have to defend in a way which makes up for his complete lack of authority on crosses.


Peter was spot on above though, we concede set piece goals in the main through an inability to get a blocker on the near post. We are a fairly little team in truth, and the 2 centre backs often end up with people having the run on them as the ball comes across. Heskey when on the field should be near post with 1 aim, but for some reason rarely is used like that. I would love a couple of our signings this summer in midfield and upfront to be 6"2 plus, to give us that extra height in there.

Under MON, Carew would always be put on the near post for Corners to flick away. It worked, we didn't concede that many when he was fit.

When McLeish brought on Heskey at 2-2 against Chelsea, I thought he'd adopt this position when they had a corner but for the 2nd Ivanovic goal he was somewhere near the back post!

Said the same in the match thread at the time, why on earth you bring Heskey on and then don't plant him front post to clear out the ball is beyond me.

[Dave]

I'd very much like to think Joe that you have a database of Fivers arranged by subject ready to bring out a little vignette whenever the situation called for it.

If you've not, I might start one.

[Oscar Arce]

I said when we signed Given that he really wasn't very good, a statement that got a reaction of 'you don't know what you're talking about' from most people.
As a shot-stopper he is excellent, his saves look great on the highlights on Match of the Day, and this is how he's built his reputation.
If you look at old videos of him for Newcastle and Eire, you will see that they all defend very deep, and concede a lot of ground further up the pitch, and are usually always under pressure.
He simply won't come for a cross, and what defenders want is for a keeper to be positive and come and take pressure off them, it gives them and the team confidence...look at what happened against Stoke when he came for one, he dropped it at the Holte End.
He also doesn't seem to communicate with defenders well, again look at the top keepers, they are always organising, I'm afraid Shay doesn't do this well enough.
It's no coincidence that Spurs look far more solid with Friedel, and I think we will always be under pressure with Given in our goal.

[Percy McCarthy]

It continues to amaze me that there has been a fundamental change in how we defend set-pieces that has seen us fall from the best team in the country at it to the worst, and people still blame the players. Friedel never came off his line either.

Seriously, you might as well blame the tea lady.

[Rip Van We Go Again]

It continues to amaze me that there has been a fundamental change in how we defend set-pieces that has seen us fall from the best team in the country at it to the worst, and people still blame the players. Friedel never came off his line either.

Seriously, you might as well blame the tea lady.

Do clubs still have tea ladies?

I always wonder as every time a club is in crisis the media inevitably say.

'No one is safe from redundancy, from the Manager right down to the tea lady.'

[dave.woodhall]

It continues to amaze me that there has been a fundamental change in how we defend set-pieces that has seen us fall from the best team in the country at it to the worst, and people still blame the players. Friedel never came off his line either.

Seriously, you might as well blame the tea lady.

Do clubs still have tea ladies?

I always wonder as every time a club is in crisis the media inevitably say.

'No one is safe from redundancy, from the Manager right down to the tea lady.'

They still pay weekly wages, so why not?

[ktvillan]

I always liked Given as a keeper and I think he is one of the best shot stoppers around, better than Friedel or Guzan.  But he is weaker at coming for crosses than I thought.  Having said that Friedel often didn't come for them either, and when he did he had a tendency to flap like a big girl's blouse at quite a few of them.  Guzan came for several crosses in the FA Cup game agains Blackburn a couple of seasons ago and pretty much fumbled or dropped every one of them.  It was a horror show, and he did likewise in a couple of other appearances. He seems to have improved in that respect, but I'm still not convinced he would "command the area" any better than the other two.   If Given is to blame for our poor defending of corners, what was the defence's excuse last season when we were just as bad?  I still reckon we should have gone for Ben Foster.

[N'ZMAV]

Glued to his line.

[SoccerHQ]

Command of your area is something that should improve with age. I remember when Joe Hart first play for Man. City he was flapping at pretty much every corner. That loan spell at SHA did the trick and he's one of the best around. De Gea is slowing improving his command at Manure.

If a Keeper gets to his late 20s and still can't do it, that suggests to me he just wants to leave it to his defenders in the six yard box so don't expect any change from Given, too set in his ways.