McLeish wants confidence

[eamonn]

In the all time premier league we are 5th - it's odd that people at the club seem to need reminding of this, it should be something they are very aware of. 

That doesn't quite tell the whole story though. It would if the same teams had been in the league all that time. But take Newcastle for instance. They've spent two seasons less than us in the Premier League and yet have more points thanks to a few 2nd-4th placed positions.
We've generally been steady eddies, a fair few 6ths, one 5th and 4th each, and then then midtable and below.

[Rioch is King]

The story it tells is that Newcastle have been relegated from the premier and we haven't and that we have won more points than them... both in the all time premier league and in the all time 1st division and Premier league combined. Why try and knock us back?

[timeoutbigbar]

The story it tells is that Newcastle have been relegated from the premier and we haven't and that we have won more points than them... both in the all time premier league and in the all time 1st division and Premier league combined. Why try and knock us back?

Do we get a trophy then? You can make up a statistic to prove anything you want.  It doesn't mean in some cases you aren't clutching at straws.  Now the European Cup, judging by the current situation, we'll be able to brag about for a long time yet.

[Rioch is King]

Ok - but I'm taking those statistics in holding on to them  - and I can't think of other clubs as being superior to us. Even in the 3rd division I couldn't accept that other teams were 'bigger' than us, they were just having a better run. We don't need to brag about it, we just stand our ground.

[hawkeye]

We have been punching below our weight, the biggest team in the second largest city in the UK should be mixing it with the top 6 clubs. As others have said we somehow fall into the trap of undermining our potential and this starts from inside The Club. We have gone from Managers talking about us as sleeping giants and the potential to take this club to its rightfull position to suggesting that we are outside the "elite" or " big clubs" its infuriating. It started with Houlier and Mcliesh has taken us down another notch. If the people in charge of the club start with an inferiority complex then it becomes a self fullfilling prophecy.

[Greg N'Ash]

not sure what people want really. we're not far off where we finished last season despite a much weaker team and the fact remains, whether Liverpool are the elite or not they've spent nett about 35m pounds while in the same period we've spent -15m. We're not competing with Liverpool, we're barely competing with Wigan spending power wise

[hawkeye]

not sure what people want really. we're not far off where we finished last season despite a much weaker team and the fact remains, whether Liverpool are the elite or not they've spent nett about 35m pounds while in the same period we've spent -15m. We're not competing with Liverpool, we're barely competing with Wigan spending power wise

i think it is pretty obvious what people want, they want to believe that the club is doing everything it can to be successful with the resources it has.

[Greg N'Ash]

with the resources we've got -i.e. no money, a load of rubbish players we can't get shot off, and inconsistent kids, we're about where we should be. Only thing that will change that long term is spending power unless Mcleish is a master whealer dealer in the transfer market. i'm not hopeful

[hawkeye]

i think the dice has allready been cast, they took a massive gamble with Mcleish and it has not worked. The only thing that might change things is a very poor take up of STs. The club looks rudderless, i think most people accept that a clearing of the legacy issues that MON created have to be dealt with, but very few think that RL PF and AM are the right people to do it.

[timeoutbigbar]

with the resources we've got -i.e. no money, a load of rubbish players we can't get shot off, and inconsistent kids, we're about where we should be. Only thing that will change that long term is spending power unless Mcleish is a master whealer dealer in the transfer market. i'm not hopeful

I don't agree.  Purely based on squad comparison we should comfortably be in the top 10.  I wouldn't swap too many players with Swansea or Sunderland, currently sat in 8th and 9th respectively.  We're a long way off challenging for Europe again, but we do have a squad capable of more than the manager is currently achieving.

[Greg N'Ash]

I just find it depressingly like last year. If someone can name a  realistic football genius who can get us higher up the table and playing better football than Mcleish or Houllier before him on the same non-existent budget and with the same current personnel then bring him on. Unfortuntely all i see is the likes of Curbishley waiting in the wings

[Monty]

I just find it depressingly like last year. If someone can name a  realistic football genius who can get us higher up the table and playing better football than Mcleish or Houllier before him on the same non-existent budget and with the same current personnel then bring him on. Unfortuntely all i see is the likes of Curbishley waiting in the wings

At least Curbishley's Premier League record is actually half-decent. With Charlton, anyway.

[Greg N'Ash]

with the resources we've got -i.e. no money, a load of rubbish players we can't get shot off, and inconsistent kids, we're about where we should be. Only thing that will change that long term is spending power unless Mcleish is a master whealer dealer in the transfer market. i'm not hopeful

I don't agree.  Purely based on squad comparison we should comfortably be in the top 10.  I wouldn't swap too many players with Swansea or Sunderland, currently sat in 8th and 9th respectively.  We're a long way off challenging for Europe again, but we do have a squad capable of more than the manager is currently achieving.

yeh but we're 4 points off sunderland who seem to be suffering from pube-head's magic touch wearing off and who says swansea will finish 8th?. Given, in real terms we've spent far less than any team round us or indeed the league, would you be happy with lower than last season?

[timeoutbigbar]

with the resources we've got -i.e. no money, a load of rubbish players we can't get shot off, and inconsistent kids, we're about where we should be. Only thing that will change that long term is spending power unless Mcleish is a master whealer dealer in the transfer market. i'm not hopeful

I don't agree.  Purely based on squad comparison we should comfortably be in the top 10.  I wouldn't swap too many players with Swansea or Sunderland, currently sat in 8th and 9th respectively.  We're a long way off challenging for Europe again, but we do have a squad capable of more than the manager is currently achieving.

yeh but we're 4 points off sunderland who seem to be suffering from pube-head's magic touch wearing off and who says swansea will finish 8th?. Given, in real terms we've spent far less than any team round us or indeed the league, would you be happy with lower than last season?

Not really no.  Mind you, I'm not really happy with much of what is happening at VP these days.

[Greg N'Ash]

with the resources we've got -i.e. no money, a load of rubbish players we can't get shot off, and inconsistent kids, we're about where we should be. Only thing that will change that long term is spending power unless Mcleish is a master whealer dealer in the transfer market. i'm not hopeful

I don't agree.  Purely based on squad comparison we should comfortably be in the top 10.  I wouldn't swap too many players with Swansea or Sunderland, currently sat in 8th and 9th respectively.  We're a long way off challenging for Europe again, but we do have a squad capable of more than the manager is currently achieving.

yeh but we're 4 points off sunderland who seem to be suffering from pube-head's magic touch wearing off and who says swansea will finish 8th?. Given, in real terms we've spent far less than any team round us or indeed the league, would you be happy with lower than last season?

Not really no.  Mind you, I'm not really happy with much of what is happening at VP these days.

you and me both, but you can't have ambitions for the top of the table if you're transfer budget is non-existant. Unless we get a manager who's a miracle worker i can't see much changing. another guy may finish higher than Mcliesh but not by much. and as for this playing entertaining football lark, MON couldn't manage it that often even with the keys to Lerner's wallet. To be fair to MON he's hardly been the only manager who'd had a fair wedge and still served up shite