Radio 5 now !!!!

[Ian.]

He might have every reason to treat Warnock this way. We do not know what is going on there do we. How he acts in training, his influence to others. I'm guessing true but something must be wrong.

[KevinGage]

Generally when a new manager takes over there might be one or two players who immediately don't see eye to eye with the new methods, if their attitude is poor enough they might even qualify for the tag 'troublemakers.'

I don't think I've heard of a manager taking over before and having 5/6 troublemakers in the squad though.

Carew, Ireland, Warnock, Beye, Collins and Dunne.

Ireland apart, as he's always been a bit of a tit (despite his undoubted talent) none of those players had the reputation of troublemakers in the past. JC can be a bit casual, and there was Tittygate, I suppose. Dunne was a bit of a mess earlier in his career.  But they had both been big players for us in recent seasons, their conduct no better or worse than their teammates.

Generally advocating a change of manager is the soft option, it creates more problems than it can solve and I'm not a fan of it.

But in our situation we might actually have 5/6 good players back in the fold. I include JC an Ireland in that, as -if possible- I'd rather have them back here, rather than them contributing in any way, shape or form to Stoke or Newcastle pulling clear of danger. Just one goal or one created chance for their temporary side could have dire consequence for us. Plus in the shite we're in, we need as many options and as many good players as we can get.

[Chris Smith]

My guess, Kevin, is that most of the players mentioned are mates so have been seen as a clique opposed to the new methods and the action taken is to protect the younger players from their influence.

As I say that is nothing but a guess but otherwise he's cutting off his nose to spite his face and despite everything I don't think he's a stupid man.

[Toronto Villa]

They also had their places put in jeopardy by the new establishment. The new boss said we need to rotate so I can't guarantee you are going to play every week. Then he changed the training methods and level of expectations as professionals. As mates they were all very likely slagging the manager and staff off behind the scenes and the situation never improved and finally exploded. Now the same players that helped us get to 6th, are the ones who have no desire to help out the club. It almost makes you wonder if some of the goals we've let in could have been a two finger salute to the manager. It ended up being a two finger salute to us.

[5ft811st2 Durham]

They also had their places put in jeopardy by the new establishment. The new boss said we need to rotate so I can't guarantee you are going to play every week. Then he changed the training methods and level of expectations as professionals. As mates they were all very likely slagging the manager and staff off behind the scenes and the situation never improved and finally exploded. Now the same players that helped us get to 6th, are the ones who have no desire to help out the club. It almost makes you wonder if some of the goals we've let in could have been a two finger salute to the manager. It ended up being a two finger salute to us.

I think that's the source of the problem. Rotation to GH is  like a religion in the same way as  a settled side was to MON. However rotating a losing side is utterly pointless, counter productive and ultimately completely self indulgent.  Consequently the players would be justified in questioning the efficacy of such a misguided approach.

[Risso]

Pat Murphy is another Oliver Holt. Never liked us but he is quite right about "him".

I think Pat Murphy is pretty even-handed when it comes to talking about all of the Midlands clubs.   

He is??

Ever since he had his balls chewed off by Ellis he's always been anti Villa, and only comments on us if he feels he can stir it.
The guys a twank who knows his cricket and comments on football. The day I believe he has the inside at Villa, especially from forked tongue Faulkner, is a long way from arriving.

Rubbish. Pat Murphy was a big defender of Ellis, and his perceived problem with Villa has arisen due to the fact that he doesn't enjoy as close or open a relationship with Lerner as he did Ellis.

And the truth is somewhere in the middle. "I'm not a Villa supporter. I have no opinion one way or the other about Doug Ellis."

I was listening to the Villa supporters' forum he was at on Radio 5 a few years ago, and he gave quite a long and impassioned defence of Ellis back then.

[dave.woodhall]

I was listening to the Villa supporters' forum he was at on Radio 5 a few years ago, and he gave quite a long and impassioned defence of Ellis back then.

All I can say is what he told me. I remember during the Ellis wars that opinions on him varied depending on what he'd last written.

[kippaxvilla2]

Pat Murphy is about as fair minded a reporter on all things Villa as you are likely to get.  He defended Doug when he thought it was the correct thing to do, he is rightfully having a go at the current predicament of the club.  I mean if you look at this whole sorry episode it is even more galling given that, finally, after all the years of financial shackling of Doug, we had a man in Mr Lerner who in relative terms has decided to well and truly open his wallet and for what, a club a point from the relegation zone facing utter financial ruin should they be relegated with a manager who so befits the Clousseau stereotype you'd think that he was acting like it to wind us all up.

Whatever you think of MO'N and I agree the timing of his exit was shall we say suspicious, do you not think that if he had had the £30m to spend, we would not be anywhere near the predicament we are in now, however bizarre his ransfer methodology appeared to be at times

[PeterWithesShin]

Generally when a new manager takes over there might be one or two players who immediately don't see eye to eye with the new methods, if their attitude is poor enough they might even qualify for the tag 'troublemakers.'

I don't think I've heard of a manager taking over before and having 5/6 troublemakers in the squad though.

Carew, Ireland, Warnock, Beye, Collins and Dunne.

Ireland apart, as he's always been a bit of a tit (despite his undoubted talent) none of those players had the reputation of troublemakers in the past. JC can be a bit casual, and there was Tittygate, I suppose. Dunne was a bit of a mess earlier in his career.  But they had both been big players for us in recent seasons, their conduct no better or worse than their teammates.

Could Warnock have had any previous with GH at Liverpool and it's carried over to now? Carew obviously does from their Lyon days, although if I was swapped for Milan Baros I wouldn't be too happy with the manager either.

Ireland is obviously insane and would probably have fallen out with whoever was Villa manager.

Dunne looked fat and out of shape pre-season, long before GH was a twinkling in the eye of RL. So he was already showing signs of being unprofessional, something which would I would hope would cause words however was manager.

Collins and Beye are the ones that surprise me more as I can't recall ever hearing of any previous at their other clubs.

Not defending GH, but just wondering if it's less of a surprise that some of them have fallen out with him (or him with them) given previous and mental state/professionalism.

[London Villan]

There was talk about Warnock not liking GH when he was appointed. Warnock was sold to Blackburn by GH too.

[Chris Jameson]

Pat Murphy is about as fair minded a reporter on all things Villa as you are likely to get. 

I've always liked Pat Murphy, never seen him as pro or anti Villa just impartial.

The fact he seems to upset Malcolm makes me like him even more.

[PeterWithesShin]

There was talk about Warnock not liking GH when he was appointed. Warnock was sold to Blackburn by GH too.

I thought Warnock joined Blackburn a couple of years after GH had left the dippers?

[bob]

There was talk about Warnock not liking GH when he was appointed. Warnock was sold to Blackburn by GH too.

Benitez sold Warnock. He wasn't getting in the team for Houllier though.

[pauliewalnuts]

Whatever you think of MO'N and I agree the timing of his exit was shall we say suspicious, do you not think that if he had had the £30m to spend, we would not be anywhere near the predicament we are in now, however bizarre his ransfer methodology appeared to be at times

I'd say we wouldn't be in the top six right now, but we also wouldn't be anywhere near the bottom six, either.

MON dropped us in the shit. I'm not going to change my mind on that. However, since his appointment, Houllier has been one managerial disaster after another.

It's so fucking annoying, because I can see sometimes the way he's trying to get us to play, but he just fucks it all up elsewhere, so in the end, the positives count for nothing.

If he got Patrice Bergues in in the summer to work on the defence, I'd be happier about him getting more time, but quite clearly, whatever we do with them now, is not working.

[Dr Butler]

Whatever you think of MO'N and I agree the timing of his exit was shall we say suspicious, do you not think that if he had had the £30m to spend, we would not be anywhere near the predicament we are in now, however bizarre his ransfer methodology appeared to be at times

I'd say we wouldn't be in the top six right now, but we also wouldn't be anywhere near the bottom six, either.

MON dropped us in the shit. I'm not going to change my mind on that. However, since his appointment, Houllier has been one managerial disaster after another.

It's so fucking annoying, because I can see sometimes the way he's trying to get us to play, but he just fucks it all up elsewhere, so in the end, the positives count for nothing.

If he got Patrice Bergues in in the summer to work on the defence, I'd be happier about him getting more time, but quite clearly, whatever we do with them now, is not working.

or Phil Thompson.....yeah! there-I said it,so....