Is Ged getting fed up?

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If we're honest we've never signed a top-line player, even if we could afford them. I think the club's philosophy now is Stars of Tomorrow. It may not be glamorous, but it's a lot more realistic than demanding big names.

It's a good philosophy.

But if you take James Milner as an example, we signed him after finishing 6th - would he have come if we had finished 14th?

Yes. He was getting fed up at Newcastle. They had already cancelled the deal once. He wanted to play for the manager and the club.

Also was it O'Neills first season when the deal was cancelled. We were 16th that season before that summer were we not?

Yes, that did happen, but I think the James Milner of summer 2006 was a lot different to the one of summer 2008 when we eventually got him.  In 2006 he'd just spent the season on loan with us and the deal was (I think) for £4m.  Two years later he's a first team regular at Newcastle and they're looking for £12m for him.

I'm not saying it makes a big difference, but I do think it has some bearing if two clubs make comparable offers and one has finished significantly higher in the league.

I see what you are saying but firstly I am not sure how much better Milner was from 2006 to 2008. He was poor for us on the right wing for a good season. It also depends how early you buy young players. I am just not sure it matters to a player whether a team is in the Europa League or not. As long as we are above 15th and not fighting relegation ( as a one off season), I think the Club will sell itself well....in addition to the wages.

[Rudy Can't Fail]

If we're honest we've never signed a top-line player, even if we could afford them. I think the club's philosophy now is Stars of Tomorrow. It may not be glamorous, but it's a lot more realistic than demanding big names.

I agree. Anyway top players always seem to disappoint IMO. Also which clubs do sign top players outside of United, Chelsea & Real Madrid?

Spurs seem the obvious team outside the Top 4. From Ardilles and Villa in 78, to Gazza, Ginola, Kilinsmann, Sheringham, Keane, Ferdinand, all top players at the time.

We on the other hand have never really entered that market.

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If we're honest we've never signed a top-line player, even if we could afford them. I think the club's philosophy now is Stars of Tomorrow. It may not be glamorous, but it's a lot more realistic than demanding big names.

I agree. Anyway top players always seem to disappoint IMO. Also which clubs do sign top players outside of United, Chelsea & Real Madrid?

Spurs seem the obvious team outside the Top 4. From Ardilles and Villa in 78, to Gazza, Ginola, Kilinsmann, Sheringham, Keane, Ferdinand, all top players at the time.

We on the other hand have never really entered that market.

Sorry I should have said recently. I disagree on Ginola, Sheringham, Keane & Ferdinand. But it is all opinion on what is a top player.
Interesting that it did not get them very far....They now sign generally youngish players with potential. Bale, Defoe, Modric, Dawson, Lennon, Huddlestone etc and they break the top 4

[Concrete John]

Interesting that it did not get them very far....They now sign generally youngish players with potential. Bale, Defoe, Dawson, Lennon, Huddlestone etc and they break the top 4

They signed the likes of Klinsmann and Ginole when they were past their prime.

What's interesting about their approach with the younger players is that they kept it despite changes in manager.  Ramos did seem to move away from it, so he went and Harry bought the players back, such as Defoe.  Does this show they were wrong to replace Jol when they did?

Anyway, back to us - Gezza seems to buy into the youth policy so I think we'll keep going, just that from now on they'll be more exotic names than Milner, Young and Delph.

[peter w]

The first quote is very Gregoryesque and a little dated to be honest, as he may be in terms of being a league manager. I may be being slightly disngenuous but he was with the French team that imploded amid a group of very unhappy players to a level not seen at that level before, especially at a major tournament. The major tournament. He's now come to Villa and we're seeing the same sort of rebellion from certain players if the stories are to be believed. Its all worrying and the vibe at Villa Park has gone from one of hope, expectation, to one of  acerbic regression  Its all very worrying.

[Eigentor]

I may be being slightly disngenuous but he was with the French team that imploded amid a group of very unhappy players to a level not seen at that level before, especially at a major tournament. The major tournament.

He held the same position in the French FA when they won the World Cup in 1998.

[sfx412]

Mons gone Houllier has arrived and does it differently.
Players and some fans need to adjust.
I think he's too negative in the way he comes across but I'm told most Liverpool fans say that's his way.
Be it right or wrong I've no idea, but I'm sure it will take at least 9 months for his efforts to have a lasting effect

[Merv]

He's in a difficult position in that it's widely accepted Villa have to trim the squad to make significant signings - perhaps the straw that broke the camel's back for O'Neill, who couldn't, or wouldn't, do that. So Houllier has inherited a squad with several senior players halfway out the door and inevitably, there are going to be some complaints from those players as they're moved on.

It might get worse before it gets better. I can see Steve Sidwell leaving and remaining fairly diplomatic but can only imagine what Carew might say...

[monkeyboy]

When he was at Liverpool ( there, I've said it) there was quite a bit of unrest at the way Houllier "spoke" to his players via the press.

Just my opinion, but some things are better kept in house than aired in public .

Couldn't agree more - we are in the press too much - and all thats reported is unrest, he seems to have rubbed everyone up the wrong way (inc us - apparently he had a Liverpool love in recently or something) and it can't be good for morale

Don't get me wrong i think MoN is a prized twat for what he did - but at least he kept things behind closed doors and the 11 players who played every week did seem to respond.

Footballers are like spoiled kids (even ours) so the manager telling the press that more or less he thinks they are whinging bastards - or just a plain cnut in Irelands case - can't be positive, and it shows on the pitch unfortunately.

Not one for knee jerk reactions (especially as we approach a window) - but if we were in a different point in the season I wouldn't be sorry to see GED sling his hook -  sorry to say it but can't see Ged getting all misty eyed when he returns to Villa Park in years to come - don't think this will end well.....

[monkeyboy]

Champions League, History, Manager are what attracts players.....oh and money of course.  We have 2 out of 3.

Our four main weapons are Champions League, History, Manager and money. Cardinal, The Rack!

Noooooobady expected the Champions league

[Edvard Remberg]

We should try get some of the young talent out in the world - many of them are really good already (Ganso from Santos to name one*).  Or maybe rejuvinile careers, like Riquelme or the like.



*The rest Blacwell will name

[Concrete John]

I may be being slightly disngenuous but he was with the French team that imploded amid a group of very unhappy players to a level not seen at that level before, especially at a major tournament. The major tournament. He's now come to Villa and we're seeing the same sort of rebellion from certain players if the stories are to be believed.

Let's be clear - he was director of football for France and no direct involvement with the players.  That's like blaming Trevor Brooking for England being shite.

[Rudy Can't Fail]

If we're honest we've never signed a top-line player, even if we could afford them. I think the club's philosophy now is Stars of Tomorrow. It may not be glamorous, but it's a lot more realistic than demanding big names.

I agree. Anyway top players always seem to disappoint IMO. Also which clubs do sign top players outside of United, Chelsea & Real Madrid?

Spurs seem the obvious team outside the Top 4. From Ardilles and Villa in 78, to Gazza, Ginola, Kilinsmann, Sheringham, Keane, Ferdinand, all top players at the time.

We on the other hand have never really entered that market.

Sorry I should have said recently. I disagree on Ginola, Sheringham, Keane & Ferdinand. But it is all opinion on what is a top player.
Interesting that it did not get them very far....

They did win a League Cup in 1999, if that counts but I guess it might have helped if they'd also invested in a defender or two to add to their attacking flair.

As for the above, Ginola whilst at Spurs won both the PFA Player of the Year Award and the Football Writers Player of the Year Award, so he couldn't have been that bad.

England international Sheringham scored 98 goals for Spurs.

Ferdinand was injured most of the time but when he did play, made up a great partnership with Klinsmann. Signing a player that scored 50 goals in 84 games at Newcastle is the type of goalscorer I'd like to see us sign.

Robbie Keane - 80 goals in 197 matches for Spurs before he moved to Liverpool. I'd have liked some of that at the time too.

Somebody mentioned Klinsmann was past it when he signed for Spurs. Maybe they were thinking of the second time he joined them, on loan. In his first spell there he scored 21 goals in 41 matches, picking up the Football Writers Player of the Year Award. He then went on to play top football for another 3 years. Hardly what I'd call past it.

The nearest we got to signing a big name player was a wave from Juninho and a press report linking us with Hans Krankl.

[Concrete John]

Somebody mentioned Klinsmann was past it when he signed for Spurs. Maybe they were thinking of the second time he joined them, on loan. In his first spell there he scored 21 goals in 41 matches, picking up the Football Writers Player of the Year Award. He then went on to play top football for another 3 years. Hardly what I'd call past it.

That was me.  He signed in 1994 after the USA world cup when in his 30s.  He looked after himself granted, but simply wasn't the player he had been.
 

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[quote author=Mark Kelly link=topic=41515.msg1651502#msg1651502 date=1292944847
They did win a League Cup in 1999, if that counts but I guess it might have helped if they'd also invested in a defender or two to add to their attacking flair.

As for the above, Ginola whilst at Spurs won both the PFA Player of the Year Award and the Football Writers Player of the Year Award, so he couldn't have been that bad.

England international Sheringham scored 98 goals for Spurs.

Ferdinand was injured most of the time but when he did play, made up a great partnership with Klinsmann. Signing a player that scored 50 goals in 84 games at Newcastle is the type of goalscorer I'd like to see us sign.

Robbie Keane - 80 goals in 197 matches for Spurs before he moved to Liverpool. I'd have liked some of that at the time too.

Somebody mentioned Klinsmann was past it when he signed for Spurs. Maybe they were thinking of the second time he joined them, on loan. In his first spell there he scored 21 goals in 41 matches, picking up the Football Writers Player of the Year Award. He then went on to play top football for another 3 years. Hardly what I'd call past it.

The nearest we got to signing a big name player was a wave from Juninho and a press report linking us with Hans Krankl.
[/quote]




Sorry I think you misunderstood me. I did not say that they good for Spurs. I just said in my opinion they were not TOP players. I will stress that is my opinion. Maldini, Baresi, Van Basten, Gullit, Ronaldo....those are/were top players on my scale. Some of the above players performed very well/ excellently for Spurs but they did not sign them as ready made/undeniable 'top players'.

We should be going after the types of players that Spurs are/were in the last couple of seasons, the likes of Modric, Bale, Lennon etc when they are young with vast potential to be successfull.