Who has the most power in modern day football?

[Chris Harte]

Although Sky are undoubtedly the paymasters they're only as powerful as the Premier League let them be. If they shift a game on Boxing Day it is because the PL has sold them a package that allows them to do it.

They've sold them the package following a big inducement from Sky saying, "this is how much money we'll give you to drop 'em." Its no doubt eye-bulging amounts but as an individual if someone was offered huge money by a company for agreeing to something that wouldn't particularly inconvenience them but might inconvenience others then they would more often than not take the money. So why should organisations like the PL act any differently.

We, as fans, don't care enough to try to do anything

You can speak for yourself if you like.

[Dave Cooper please]

Satan and all His minions.

Sky then.

[Phil from the upper holte]

Real madrid followed by the agents and then the players

[Chris Smith]

Although Sky are undoubtedly the paymasters they're only as powerful as the Premier League let them be. If they shift a game on Boxing Day it is because the PL has sold them a package that allows them to do it.

They've sold them the package following a big inducement from Sky saying, "this is how much money we'll give you to drop 'em." Its no doubt eye-bulging amounts but as an individual if someone was offered huge money by a company for agreeing to something that wouldn't particularly inconvenience them but might inconvenience others then they would more often than not take the money. So why should organisations like the PL act any differently.

We, as fans, don't care enough to try to do anything

You can speak for yourself if you like.

That's a weak argument, Chris. The PL take a lot of money from Sky but they decide what they sell. It is their rules that don't allow games to be televised at 3.00 on a Saturday and it is they who have gradually increased the number of televised games they sell. Sky is the punter, the Premier League is the whore.

I'm not speaking for myself, I'm speaking for all of us. The only chance we have of doing anything abbout it is by acting collectively but the attitude when I mentioned Spurs fans being inconvenienced even more than us on Boxing Day was fuck 'em.

[Chris Harte]

That's a weak argument, Chris.

Only in your opinion and that of anyone who cares to agree with you.

It is their rules that don't allow games to be televised at 3.00 on a Saturday

I understood that to be an EU regulation.

I'm not speaking for myself, I'm speaking for all of us.

You're not speaking for me. I actively do something. It's small and goes unnoticed, but at least I have the warm glow of knowing that I'm doing what I can to not contribute to Sky.

The only chance we have of doing anything abbout it is by acting collectively but the attitude when I mentioned Spurs fans being inconvenienced even more than us on Boxing Day was fuck 'em.

Who said "fuck 'em"?

[Chris Smith]

That's a weak argument, Chris.

Only in your opinion and that of anyone who cares to agree with you.

It is their rules that don't allow games to be televised at 3.00 on a Saturday

I understood that to be an EU regulation.

I'm not speaking for myself, I'm speaking for all of us.

You're not speaking for me. I actively do something. It's small and goes unnoticed, but at least I have the warm glow of knowing that I'm doing what I can to not contribute to Sky.

The only chance we have of doing anything abbout it is by acting collectively but the attitude when I mentioned Spurs fans being inconvenienced even more than us on Boxing Day was fuck 'em.

Who said "fuck 'em"?

1) The PL were set up to make more money for the biggest clubs. That's why they broke away from the Foottball League so that they don't have to share it with other clubs. If Sky could get away with giving them £20 they would, it is the greed of the PL that has created this situation.

2) No, it's a league rule. It's claimed that it is in the interests of other clubs so that fans don't stay away to watch games on TV. There's  acse going to the ECJ at the moment which is a challenge to that (here). From that article "Officially, no UK-based broadcaster can show premiership football at the traditional kick-off time of 1500. This is because the Premier League wants to encourage attendance at live games".

3) I'm talking about fans collectively. I'm not criticising you, it's admirable that you are willing to do your bit, but unless we work together you are, sadly, just pissing in the wind.

4) Several people, are you surprised?

If it wasn't Sky it would be some other brodcaster paying the money. They're just a commercial organisation trying to make as much money for their shareholders as they can. The PL should be concerened with the integrity of the game but as we see from the type of people they allow to buy clubs they look no further than the bottom line.

[Chris Harte]

1) The PL were set up to make more money for the biggest clubs. That's why they broke away from the Foottball League so that they don't have to share it with other clubs. If Sky could get away with giving them £20 they would, it is the greed of the PL that has created this situation.

When the PL started and Sky had the rights it was, IIRC, one game on Sunday afternoon and a Monday night game. Now we have Saturday 12.45, Saturday 5.30, Sunday 1.30, Sunday 4pm, Monday 8pm - all on separate contracts, and the only reason Sky can't have the lot is due to a legal ruling on Monopolies. I really can't help thinking that Sky told the PL, "if you let us do this this and this, we'll give you this." Admittedly, it might have been the other way around but let'd face it, football's rulers have long had a reputation for lacking vision.

3) I'm talking about fans collectively. I'm not criticising you, it's admirable that you are willing to do your bit, but unless we work together you are, sadly, just pissing in the wind.

I know, but I'll continue my little boycott regardless.

4) Several people, are you surprised?

Yes. Who? People on here? If so can you provide a link or tell me where?

If it wasn't Sky it would be some other brodcaster paying the money.

Can you ever forsee a situation where Sky want PL matches but don't have them? A time when they'll be outbid for all packages? Me neither, because no-one will pay as much as Sky, not in the long term anyway, IMO.

[LeeS]

Although Sky are undoubtedly the paymasters they're only as powerful as the Premier League let them be. If they shift a game on Boxing Day it is because the PL has sold them a package that allows them to do it.

They've sold them the package following a big inducement from Sky saying, "this is how much money we'll give you to drop 'em." Its no doubt eye-bulging amounts but as an individual if someone was offered huge money by a company for agreeing to something that wouldn't particularly inconvenience them but might inconvenience others then they would more often than not take the money. So why should organisations like the PL act any differently.

We, as fans, don't care enough to try to do anything

You can speak for yourself if you like.

I vote with my wallet and my feet. I refuse to pay for Sky or Virgin on principle. If everone did that we might see them disappear into the hole they crawled out of.

I also turned down 2 free tickets to the Emirates last night on pure principle. In my view, the Champions League is anti-football. It sums up all that is wrong about the modern game and I have no interest in watching it whatsoever.

[ktvillan]

I agree with Mr Smith to an extent.  Ultimately it is the clubs who have effectively formed cartels - e.g the so-called G14 and the PL clubs - who put the Sky shilling ahead of genuine competition and the fans, and have sold the soul of the game out of pure greed.  They fixed the distribution of prize  and TV money to maximise their own chances of staying in the club.   The PL and the Clubs are now run by people who talk in terms of global brands and maximising revenues rather than real football people.  People like Gill, that twat at Man Citeh (Johnson is it?), Scudamore at the PL. The FA , UEFA, etc. have just bent over and let themselves be rogered up the rear by these clubs.

I'm not sure what the fans can do though.  If they stay away they harm their own club.  If everyone refuses to subscribe to Sky it could help, apart from that, I suppose protest is an option.
   

[Woofles The Wonder Dog]

Sky needed PL football to sell subscriptions and get people hooked. The PL saw this and sold them a bunch of fixtures. The PL then saw that if they made more matches available then Sky would buy them to keep as much of a monopoly as they could. So the PL did just that. Again and again.

Of course, Murdoch is the person people are supposed to hate (even if they don't really  know why) so Sky (only 33% owned by News Int.) is to blame and not the PL.  If Sky didn't exist it would be ESPN or Virgin pushing the matches around.

It'll be interesting to see what happens next time round though. Sky have grown to the point where they aren't pushing for extra subscibers so much as cross-selling to other services (for example they've just doubled the number of 3D matches they show), so they may not be quite so rabidly keen to hoover up many more matches if the PL try and grab more cash from them. That will probably (in my opinion) result in the PL resurrecting the 39th game to raise more cash from abroad.

But of course, that will be Sky's fault too, for not giving the PL more cash to forestall that. :-)

[Hookeysmith]

2) No, it's a league rule. It's claimed that it is in the interests of other clubs so that fans don't stay away to watch games on TV. There's  acse going to the ECJ at the moment which is a challenge to that (here). From that article "Officially, no UK-based broadcaster can show premiership football at the traditional kick-off time of 1500. This is because the Premier League wants to encourage attendance at live games".

Although i agree with your factual comments i have never understood it

"I know i will not attend the villa game on saturday as i would rather watch superdupamegaborefest between Man U and Chelsea"

How the hell do they come to that conclusion.

I certainly blame the media

Look how they court Man City now (More column inches dedicated to them than Arsenal etc) only because they have all the money - this in turn means they will be making big signing and in turn feeds their 24hr day news channels

[dave.woodhall]

2) No, it's a league rule. It's claimed that it is in the interests of other clubs so that fans don't stay away to watch games on TV. There's  acse going to the ECJ at the moment which is a challenge to that (here). From that article "Officially, no UK-based broadcaster can show premiership football at the traditional kick-off time of 1500. This is because the Premier League wants to encourage attendance at live games".

Although i agree with your factual comments i have never understood it

"I know i will not attend the villa game on saturday as i would rather watch superdupamegaborefest between Man U and Chelsea"

How the hell do they come to that conclusion.

Villa losing out - not likely. Non-league club who needs every supporter they can get losing out - very likely indeed.

[john e]

do other countries ie Spain,Italy have SKY as well then,

 there leagues might not pay to the same levels as ours across the board, but they arn't far behind,

is it SKY money thats paying Ronaldo, Messi and Kaka, or is it just another media organization,
 if so its football that sold its soul, thats who's to blame not the media, they are just cashing in

[Holtenderinthesky]

Wayne Rooney's agent.

[greenwichvilla]

do other countries ie Spain,Italy have SKY as well then,

 there leagues might not pay to the same levels as ours across the board, but they arn't far behind,

is it SKY money thats paying Ronaldo, Messi and Kaka, or is it just another media organization,
 if so its football that sold its soul, thats who's to blame not the media, they are just cashing in

There's Sky in Italy, but the money is nowhere near what it is here.

In Spain the clubs are allowed to sell their own rights. I think I'm right in saying that La Liga as a whole sells abroad. But in Spain the clubs do it themselves. Which is why Madrid and Barca are so far away from the rest.