Sheffield Wednesday in the brown stuff

[curiousorange]

I often used to wonder why they kept the name Hillsborough after 1989. I now get the tradition aspect and the fact that the name has no bearing of the events of the FA Cup semi, but the first thing that springs to mind even now when I hear Hillsborough is the tragedy, not the home of Wednesday.

[Andy_Lochhead_in_the_air]

Most seasons the FA cup semi-finals would be at Villa and Wednesday.

 As stadiums went during the 60s/70s, Hillsborough really was modern looking and impressive even more so when perhaps the only time during a season it was packed to capacity for a semi final.

If we were told that a few years later there would be a tragedy on such a scale and where would we think it was going to happen, very few would have thought Hillsborough.

[mrfuse]

They are heavily in debt, got relegated so will probably get lower gates yet up to last week were still signing players from Championship and Scottish Premiership sides.


Personally I think all clubs who pay out money they haven't got on wages to players should be automatically relegated two divisions if they then have their debts wiped out by going into administration. Basically it's a form of cheating, clubs who ARE paying the bills probably can't afford players on high wages and are at a disadvantage.

Crikey what a black and white world you live in obviously you have never struggled for money and must be loaded to have such an opinion.

 I think before you pass judgement on teams you really need to involved in the situation before saying that they deliberatly cheated.

Everyone of us lives beyond our means im not saying its right but thats the way it is perhaps Wednesday bought these so called big players hoping to get back to the premiership to get the big sky money to balence the books ?

Im glad you dont run the Villa as if we got in trouble instead of trying to put it right you would have us drop into the blue square league so we werent accused of "cheating"

[Lucky Eddie]

I worked in Sheffield in the early nineties and our season ticket books were printed up there. A bloke had a cardboard box full of them in the boot of his car one day and was trying to shift them for ten quid each. Having already bought mine for about a ton I told him to jog on................I was principled back then, God what I'd give for a box of ten pound season ticket now :-(

[Dave Cooper please]

Crikey what a black and white world you live in obviously you have never struggled for money and must be loaded to have such an opinion.

I have struggled for money for many years in my life, but my personal finances, or anyone else's for that matter, have bugger all to do with the running of football clubs.

 

I think before you pass judgement on teams you really need to involved in the situation before saying that they deliberatly cheated.

If they paid money for players they could not afford then they gained an advantage over clubs who were paying their bills and had to budget for lower wages. The FA agrees with me on this, hence the points deductions for teams that go into administration. I think the punishment should be harsher. Leeds, Southampton and Rotherham have all shown recently that ten points can be easily overcome when all of your debts have been wiped out and you can go back to paying high wages again.

Everyone of us lives beyond our means im not saying its right but thats the way it is perhaps Wednesday bought these so called big players hoping to get back to the premiership to get the big sky money to balence the books ?

So the best way to get out of debt is to gamble by going into even more debt? If you were £1000 in debt would you borrow another £1000 and go to the casino? Maybe you would!

Im glad you dont run the Villa as if we got in trouble instead of trying to put it right you would have us drop into the blue square league so we werent accused of "cheating"

No, I would cut the wage budget, offload expensive players, you know, cut costs, that sort of thing.
Or I would borrow cash from my multi-million pound trust like what Randy does!
I would hope that whoever owns Villa would never allow us to spiral into a Portsmouth or Leeds type scenario, but if they did then yes, I would accept that we deserved whatever punishment came our way, one things for sure, the way out of debt is not to keep borrowing more and more in the hope of a future windfall, that goes for individuals AND football clubs.

[mrfuse]

Crikey what a black and white world you live in obviously you have never struggled for money and must be loaded to have such an opinion.

I have struggled for money for many years in my life, but my personal finances, or anyone else's for that matter, have bugger all to do with the running of football clubs.

Obviously other peoples fininaces are the point thats why were talking about wednesday being in trouble

 

I think before you pass judgement on teams you really need to involved in the situation before saying that they deliberatly cheated.

If they paid money for players they could not afford then they gained an advantage over clubs who were paying their bills and had to budget for lower wages. The FA agrees with me on this, hence the points deductions for teams that go into administration. I think the punishment should be harsher. Leeds, Southampton and Rotherham have all shown recently that ten points can be easily overcome when all of your debts have been wiped out and you can go back to paying high wages again.

how do you know at the time they couldnt afford the players a bit like myself having a loanor a mortgage but getting made redundant and not being able to afford it.  i agree their has to be a point deduction but dont say that every club deliberately does it on purpose

Everyone of us lives beyond our means im not saying its right but thats the way it is perhaps Wednesday bought these so called big players hoping to get back to the premiership to get the big sky money to balence the books ?

So the best way to get out of debt is to gamble by going into even more debt? If you were £1000 in debt would you borrow another £1000 and go to the casino? Maybe you would!

no were not talking about me getting out of debt were talking about an entertainment industry thats trying supply entertainment for fans i would hardly compare buying players to going to the casino and gambling your money away. every purchase is a risk but your black and white logic is one extreme or another.

Im glad you dont run the Villa as if we got in trouble instead of trying to put it right you would have us drop into the blue square league so we werent accused of "cheating"

No, I would cut the wage budget, offload expensive players, you know, cut costs, that sort of thing.
Or I would borrow cash from my multi-million pound trust like what Randy does!
I would hope that whoever owns Villa would never allow us to spiral into a Portsmouth or Leeds type scenario, but if they did then yes, I would accept that we deserved whatever punishment came our way, one things for sure, the way out of debt is not to keep borrowing more and more in the hope of a future windfall, that goes for individuals AND football clubs.

once again your talking about an extreme scenerio you cant compare the money Leeds and Portsmouth spent to Wednesday.

No the best way to get out of debt is not to keep borrowing but everybody has too borrow some money. its all or nothing with your comments their is a middle ground and in a perfect world it would all be smooth like your suggestions but that is never ever going to happen.


Were going to have agree to disagree on this, I feel sorry for Wednesday you dont but people make mistakes and maybe the people in charge had the their best interests at heart but it went wrong.

What i hate more than this is Teams like Man city ruining the game and i best go and tell my family to go and support rotherham and not cheating wednesday.

[Dave Cooper please]

[
once again your talking about an extreme scenerio you cant compare the money Leeds and Portsmouth spent to Wednesday.

In the context that they spent money they haven't got and now cannot afford to pay the bills, yes I can.
You are seeing this from the viewpoint of someone who has some emotional attachment via your family, step back and see what's happening. They are a big, professional club who employ hundreds of staff, including I assume, accountants. Any business that owes HMRC over half a million quid will be in serious danger of administration, football clubs shouldn't be any different.

I say again, if they owe HMRC this much, how much do they owe to probably dozens of local businesses who supply them with all sorts and can't afford to be owed money?

I also say again that I, as always, have every sympathy with the fans, they have no real say in who is running their club badly, but their anger should be directed at the owners, other clubs in their league last season, with much lower fanbases, have managed to stay in the Championship and pay the bills.

[mrfuse]

Bored now as im sure everyone else is, nothing to see lets move on

[BC54 VFC]

A bit surprised at all the sympathy, after all the £550K owed to HMRC is effectively owed to all of us as taxpayers, and it is pleasing that HMRC is now taking a harder line on overdue PAYE/NIC and quarterly VAT taking account of the present level of national debt.

I'm even more surprised that SWFC's bankers, Co-Op, have expressed 'disappointment' at HMRC's stance; this is rather unprofessional, but probably par for the course for the bank that has been mug enough to take on the banking arrangements for the majority of professional football clubs in England.

[dave.woodhall]

once again your talking about an extreme scenerio you cant compare the money Leeds and Portsmouth spent to Wednesday.

You can because their problems started a decade or so ago when they were paying ridiculous wages to the likes of Carbone & di Canio. That landed them into debt and a perilous situation they've never been able to throw off.

[adrenachrome]

once again your talking about an extreme scenerio you cant compare the money Leeds and Portsmouth spent to Wednesday.

You can because their problems started a decade or so ago when they were paying ridiculous wages to the likes of Carbone & di Canio. That landed them into debt and a perilous situation they've never been able to throw off.

Sadly true.

It is though they thought that, based on past glories, they would somehow get wafted back to their rightful position in the scheme of things if they just spent some wedge.

Some people, including the often exulted Nigel Kennedy, give praise to HDE for our avoiding this fate.

What say you, Dee Dubya?

[Dave Cooper please]

Bored now as im sure everyone else is, nothing to see lets move on

I win, I win, ha ha ha ha!!!

[dave.woodhall]

Sadly true.

It is though they thought that, based on past glories, they would somehow get wafted back to their rightful position in the scheme of things if they just spent some wedge.

Some people, including the often exulted Nigel Kennedy, give praise to HDE for our avoiding this fate.

What say you, Dee Dubya?

I honestly don't know. I think clubs got on some great merry-go-round of spending ever-increasing sums in order to stay where they were and were unable to stop spending because they'd fall off.

I always said throughout the footballing boom years of the period 1996-2002 that we should spend more and gamble. Then you look at the clubs who spent money they didn't have - Leeds, Wednesday, Forest, Coventry to name a few - and wonder if Doug wasn't right all along.

[adrenachrome]

Sadly true.

It is though they thought that, based on past glories, they would somehow get wafted back to their rightful position in the scheme of things if they just spent some wedge.

Some people, including the often exulted Nigel Kennedy, give praise to HDE for our avoiding this fate.

What say you, Dee Dubya?

I honestly don't know. I think clubs got on some great merry-go-round of spending ever-increasing sums in order to stay where they were and were unable to stop spending because they'd fall off.

I always said throughout the footballing boom years of the period 1996-2002 that we should spend more and gamble. Then you look at the clubs who spent money they didn't have - Leeds, Wednesday, Forest, Coventry to name a few - and wonder if Doug wasn't right all along.

I wonder as well, and I was among his most vitriolic critics.

[dave.woodhall]

I wonder as well, and I was among his most vitriolic critics.

Ain't hindsight grand? But I also wonder how many more Balabans we could have afforded before we were in trouble.