Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: pauliewalnuts on April 30, 2019, 08:28:31 PM
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Watching the Spurs match at the moment, and having seen the coverage the last few weeks of their new stadium and the food / drink / hospitality features, I can't help feel that we are woefully behind clubs like that in commercial terms and will never compete whilst we are commercially so under performing.
An example we'll all know. Last home match, I went down to try to get a couple of drinks in at half time, spent 15 minutes in a queue going absolutely nowhere, whilst a few minimum wage agency teenagers went through the motions of pretending to serve people, only to eventually give up. How many times, and for how long, have we moaned about that on here, in fan consultation groups or elsewhere on the internet?
Then there's the problem we seem to have year in, year out, in being able to buy replica shirts. They're always late in terms of availability and become nigh on impossible to get hold of during the season. I thought the Fanatics deal was supposed to be an 'innovative' way to solve this problem, but if anything it seems worse.
It is never a good thing to have people wanting to give you their money and unable to do so - people who can't get food and drink, people who can't get replica shirts, whether it's because there's no retail availability away from the ground or we just can't get the stock.
Why do we fail to address these obvious problems?
Didn't we manage to have flat commercial income, more or less, during our last decade or so in the top flight?
How on earth did we manage that in a league which has become more and more awash with money? If anything that should be impossible.
Do we need to look properly at the facilities at Villa Park and massively improve the stadium? Or move elsewhere?
What if we had the option of, for example, a new stadium with facilities like the new Spurs one, on the site of the wholesale markets in the city centre? What if we rebuilt Villa Park on the current location? The transport links to Aston are piss poor, what can be done to improve that?
I have always been firmly of the belief we should only ever play our games where we currently are, but now, if it becomes a question of competing or not, I am not too sure.
Appreciate the obvious answer to this is 'get it right on the pitch first' and that's obviously true, but we seem to remain pathetically non competitive off it, and these things go hand in hand.
*stream of consciousness ends*
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I read the title and for a moment thought it was an email from my manager.
I don't think we should countenance leaving VP, but you're right, improvements ought to be a priority.
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The catering/refreshments and replica kit/merchandise are quite literally pathetic for a club like Villa. They have been issues for years and as you quite rightly point out, the club is losing money as a result of such poor customer service and supply issues. I've given up trying to get a drink at half time and just opt for a pint and a pie before the game, and a piss at half time once the queues have died down. How strongly are these issues raised and discussed at the fan consultations group meetings?
edit: whilst we're on the subject...sort that fuckin badge out! ;D
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That’s why baseball is a better sport, the beer is brought to you in your seat during the game.
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Catering at half time is literally a joke. . The problem is the staff, half of them havent got a clue at what they are doing and look completely lost. You really have to question what training they receive if any! You can put measures in place like contact less paymenst etc to speed things up, but while the staff are as they are, nothing will change.
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Is the catering services outsourced to a third party or employed by the club? Whoever is responsible for the management of catering in the stands should be sacked for incompetence.
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Catering at half time is literally a joke. . The problem is the staff, half of them havent got a clue at what they are doing and look completely lost. You really have to question what training they receive if any! You can put measures in place like contact less paymenst etc to speed things up, but while the staff are as they are, nothing will change.
if they overhauled that, and improved the environment (ie not just cold concrete concourses), they'd get people in there eating and drinking pre-match way earlier than they currently do.
For home matches we go into the city centre and spend money on pub food and beers and go to the ground at the very last moment. There must be so many people who do similar, but if there was some better option than standing - for there are no fucking seats, FFS - in what feels like a nuclear bunker having queued for 20 minutes to get a plastic bottle of warm Carlsberg and some half cooked chips, we'd spend that money at the ground.
I haven't been in the 'new' Holte, have a ST in the Trinity, but have used both the other stands in recent years, and let's be honest, the facilities are absolutely fucking awful - they're facilities you'd expect to find in a ground in the 1990s.
The game and the people attending have changed, but we're still barely trying to adapt.
EDIT and while we're on the subject, look at the state of the fucking toilets. Rancid, in line with facilities in the 1950s.
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Is the catering services outsourced to a third party or employed by the club? Whoever is responsible for the management of catering in the stands should be sacked for incompetence.
Even if it is outsourced, that does not mean it has to be fucking awful. The club just don't seem to be able to get this sorted, though, it's laughably poor.
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For home matches we go into the city centre and spend money on pub food and beers and go to the ground at the very last moment.
I thought we didn't do this because Blues fans police the city centre and we are too frightened?
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That’s why baseball is a better sport, the beer is brought to you in your seat during the game.
Americans call it beer, everyone else calls it ice cold piss.
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That’s why baseball is a better sport, the beer is brought to you in your seat during the game.
Americans call it beer, everyone else calls it ice cold piss.
And rounders.
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Is the catering services outsourced to a third party or employed by the club? Whoever is responsible for the management of catering in the stands should be sacked for incompetence.
Even if it is outsourced, that does not mean it has to be fucking awful. The club just don't seem to be able to get this sorted, though, it's laughably poor.
It's not just the produce & products of the catering provider it's the disinterested couldn't give a fuck attitude of the employees.
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That’s why baseball is a better sport, the beer is brought to you in your seat during the game.
Americans call it beer, everyone else calls it ice cold piss.
As opposed to Carling/ Heineken/Carlsberg etc.
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That’s why baseball is a better sport, the beer is brought to you in your seat during the game.
Americans call it beer, everyone else calls it ice cold piss.
As opposed to Carling/ Heineken/Carlsberg etc.
Indeed, I guess, and I suppose their piss is at least cold.
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Is the catering services outsourced to a third party or employed by the club? Whoever is responsible for the management of catering in the stands should be sacked for incompetence.
Even if it is outsourced, that does not mean it has to be fucking awful. The club just don't seem to be able to get this sorted, though, it's laughably poor.
It's not just the produce & products of the catering provider it's the disinterested couldn't give a fuck attitude of the employees.
Indeed, it's a fucking shambles.
I bet the customer service experience is somewhat better at Milwaukee Fucks or whatever Wes's netball team is called.
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Is the catering services outsourced to a third party or employed by the club? Whoever is responsible for the management of catering in the stands should be sacked for incompetence.
Even if it is outsourced, that does not mean it has to be fucking awful. The club just don't seem to be able to get this sorted, though, it's laughably poor.
It's not just the produce & products of the catering provider it's the disinterested couldn't give a fuck attitude of the employees.
I once did that job (for one match) at Carrow Road as a student. By the time people had got through the queues they were thoroughly pissed off and half of them spoke to me in a way that minimum wage couldn't justify. I'm sure the same happens at VP.
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Is the catering services outsourced to a third party or employed by the club? Whoever is responsible for the management of catering in the stands should be sacked for incompetence.
Even if it is outsourced, that does not mean it has to be fucking awful. The club just don't seem to be able to get this sorted, though, it's laughably poor.
It's not just the produce & products of the catering provider it's the disinterested couldn't give a fuck attitude of the employees.
I once did that job (for one match) at Carrow Road as a student. By the time people had got through the queues they were thoroughly pissed off and half of them spoke to me in a way that minimum wage couldn't justify. I'm sure the same happens at VP.
Trinity Road experience goes along the lines of queue for 20 minutes for a couple of bottles of Carlsberg that is always in a fridge at the other end of the serving area, server disappears who knows where and then reappears with 2 bottles of beer that they then struggle to take the top off of whilst Trisha the catering supervisor stands at the back looking at a sheet of paper telling her what stock she has or maybe it's an email about her cats vet appointment but no way is Trisha going to serve anyone and Diane at the next till on route to the fridge gets collared by Trisha to talk about the stock email or is it her cats failing health. Who knows, they're hopeless, utterly hopeless.
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Is the catering services outsourced to a third party or employed by the club? Whoever is responsible for the management of catering in the stands should be sacked for incompetence.
Even if it is outsourced, that does not mean it has to be fucking awful. The club just don't seem to be able to get this sorted, though, it's laughably poor.
It's not just the produce & products of the catering provider it's the disinterested couldn't give a fuck attitude of the employees.
I once did that job (for one match) at Carrow Road as a student. By the time people had got through the queues they were thoroughly pissed off and half of them spoke to me in a way that minimum wage couldn't justify. I'm sure the same happens at VP.
Trinity Road experience goes along the lines of queue for 20 minutes for a couple of bottles of Carlsberg that is always in a fridge at the other end of the serving area, server disappears who knows where and then reappears with 2 bottles of beer that they then struggle to take the top off of whilst Trisha the catering supervisor stands at the back looking at a sheet of paper telling her what stock she has or maybe it's an email about her cats vet appointment but no way is Trisha going to serve anyone and Diane at the next till on route to the fridge gets collared by Trisha to talk about the stock email or is it her cats failing health. Who knows, they're hopeless, utterly hopeless.
It sounds exactly the same as Norwich! The agency tells you to turn up 5 minutes before you start. Somebody throws a t-shirt at you and doesn't tell you where anything is, or how much anything costs, but you must remember to take the lids off bottles (but not why, so you can't answer when every other person asks you). It's as if nobody gives a shit about football supporters or minimum wage workers.
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It’s never been great, probably has been subject to cuts since our decline in the PL and into the Championship and now is what it is until we go back up or at least start being financially stable. Spurs are the shiny new example of what can be achieved for a cool billion or whatever it ended up costing them. But I read an article the other day about how far Man U and Old Trafford had fallen in terms of overall service levels/quality of facility/staff/ground etc, and they’ve been a staple in the PL/CL so it’s not just us.
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It’s never been great, probably has been subject to cuts since our decline in the PL and into the Championship and now is what it is until we go back up or at least start being financially stable. Spurs are the shiny new example of what can be achieved for a cool billion or whatever it ended up costing them. But I read an article the other day about how far Man U and Old Trafford had fallen in terms of overall service levels/quality of facility/staff/ground etc, and they’ve been a staple in the PL/CL so it’s not just us.
Never being great is one thing, but at Villa it has never been good enough, let alone great.
Building the equivalent of that stadium would not cost anywhere near as much in the midlands, and we'd be investing in facilities and creating something which makes serious money.
Instead we're stuck with laughably shit 1990s facilities and lots of people trying really hard to give the club money, but unable to.
We are never going to be financially stable until we fix problems like that, but we seem utterly unable to.
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If we go up that might become a question. Do we stay at Villa Park or build a new one nearby (land availability permitting)? Because with all of these old stadiums there is only so much more you can do (granted we have lots we could still do). But the trend is new state of the art stadia and as much as we all love Villa Park it isn’t exactly very modern.
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If we go up that might become a question. Do we stay at Villa Park or build a new one nearby (land availability permitting)? Because with all of these old stadiums there is only so much more you can do (granted we have lots we could still do). But the trend is new state of the art stadia and as much as we all love Villa Park it isn’t exactly very modern.
Isn't that why we love it?!
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As a first step, I would just like us to fix some of the eminently fixable problems.
I haven't looked but i bet you what you like, if you look back to this site in late 2006 when General Krulak turned up, you'll see endless complaints on his thread about people being unable to buy food and drinks because the set up is shit and the staff don't have a clue.
That was 13 years ago - 13 years, and it still is absolutely no better.
The club is stuck in a timewarp.
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If we go up that might become a question. Do we stay at Villa Park or build a new one nearby (land availability permitting)? Because with all of these old stadiums there is only so much more you can do (granted we have lots we could still do). But the trend is new state of the art stadia and as much as we all love Villa Park it isn’t exactly very modern.
Isn't that why we love it?!
Yep there is that too. I would love a modern version with an exterior design that is nod to the past. Importantly the interior and especially the facilities are 21st century.
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If we go up that might become a question. Do we stay at Villa Park or build a new one nearby (land availability permitting)? Because with all of these old stadiums there is only so much more you can do (granted we have lots we could still do). But the trend is new state of the art stadia and as much as we all love Villa Park it isn’t exactly very modern.
Isn't that why we love it?!
The problem is that those of us of a certain age will remember Villa Park as one of the stadiums with the best facilities (till the 90s-ish).
The younger fans will only have experienced it as a place with awful, outdated facilities.
Nostalgia eventually dies off.
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Always drink and eat in town then get the train to witton just in time for kick off.
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Hasn’t the spurs stadium been built with the nfl in mind too. Facilities aimed at fans who spend 3 hours in a stadium watching the match as well spending hours there before and after the game.
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If we go up that might become a question. Do we stay at Villa Park or build a new one nearby (land availability permitting)? Because with all of these old stadiums there is only so much more you can do (granted we have lots we could still do). But the trend is new state of the art stadia and as much as we all love Villa Park it isn’t exactly very modern.
Isn't that why we love it?!
The problem is that those of us of a certain age will remember Villa Park as one of the stadiums with the best facilities (till the 90s-ish).
The younger fans will only have experienced it as a place with awful, outdated facilities.
Nostalgia eventually dies off.
I've only been able to buy things for myself and notice this stuff since the 90s. I know it's awful, but to me that's kind of what football is - a bit shit. Not that that's the right attitude, and you're right that it's criminal for the club to leave money in people's pocket when they want to give it to them.
When I think of modern grounds, however, I think of the Madejski. I got served at HT easily enough, there was a place to have a fag had I not long ago given them up. But it was shit.
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Hasn’t the spurs stadium been built with the nfl in mind too. Facilities aimed at fans who spend 3 hours in a stadium watching the match as well spending hours there before and after the game.
Because that part of London is a nightmare to get out of, they also wanted to encourage people to stay in the ground and have a couple of beers afterwards, having a brewery on site is the modern way it seems.
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If we go up that might become a question. Do we stay at Villa Park or build a new one nearby (land availability permitting)? Because with all of these old stadiums there is only so much more you can do (granted we have lots we could still do). But the trend is new state of the art stadia and as much as we all love Villa Park it isn’t exactly very modern.
Isn't that why we love it?!
The problem is that those of us of a certain age will remember Villa Park as one of the stadiums with the best facilities (till the 90s-ish).
The younger fans will only have experienced it as a place with awful, outdated facilities.
Nostalgia eventually dies off.
I've only been able to buy things for myself and notice this stuff since the 90s. I know it's awful, but to me that's kind of what football is - a bit shit. Not that that's the right attitude, and you're right that it's criminal for the club to leave money in people's pocket when they want to give it to them.
When I think of modern grounds, however, I think of the Madejski. I got served at HT easily enough, there was a place to have a fag had I not long ago given them up. But it was shit.
I think I'll retire from this debate as I seem to be simultaneously arguing for and against the idea of football being shit.
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But i agree about the crap service and general chaos in the catering kiosks at Villa Park.
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It's pretty similar at big concerts, other sporting meetings (Cheltenham being a prime example) and such like. Minimum wage, minimum training = minumum effort apart from the odd exception.
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5live reported Spurs made 800k from food and drink alone at their home game against Palace. Someone needs to be looking at these figures at VP
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5live reported Spurs made 800k from food and drink alone at their home game against Palace. Someone needs to be looking at these figures at VP
At London prices that probably means they only sold two pints, a cheeseburger and a packet of crisps.
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I've tried and failed to get something at HT. Seemingly the only way is to miss the last ten minutes of the first half and start queuing.
Maybe the space means it's not practical but a set up like McDonald's or Argos would improve things. You order/pay in one area then go and collect it.
Even a set up where you can place orders ready for HT would be good. If you limited it to bottled drinks only it would still cater to everyone who just wants a beer.
Smarter people than me work for the club but I'm with the op there's got to be some things they can do.
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With the closure of so many pubs around the ground the must surely be a opportunity for a well thought out fan park type thing. Sky sports, decent beers, family zones, more ‘lively’ zones, food, seating etc etc
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I think I'll retire from this debate as I seem to be simultaneously arguing for and against the idea of football being shit.
Once again I am in complete agreement with your post😊
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I think I'll retire from this debate as I seem to be simultaneously arguing for and against the idea of football being shit.
Once again I am in complete agreement with your post😊
Ha! I am, if nothing else, mercurial.
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With the closure of so many pubs around the ground the must surely be a opportunity for a well thought out fan park type thing. Sky sports, decent beers, family zones, more ‘lively’ zones, food, seating etc etc
You mean like the Holte pub?
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I think I'll retire from this debate as I seem to be simultaneously arguing for and against the idea of football being shit.
Once again I am in complete agreement with your post😊
Ha! I am, if nothing else, mercurial.
Loads of love😘
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I think I'll retire from this debate as I seem to be simultaneously arguing for and against the idea of football being shit.
Once again I am in complete agreement with your post😊
Ha! I am, if nothing else, mercurial.
Loads of love😘
x
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Brighton had it right a couple of years ago - good service, plenty of space and they kept the bars open after the game so you could have a pint before queueing for the phantom Southern train service. I’m amazed we just turf people out within 2 minutes of the final whistle.
Fulham also used to have those roving bottle sellers with backpacks who looked like wannabe ghostbusters.
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The problem with football grounds was always that they are only used 20-odd days a year and spend the rest of the time empty. Champions League football means Spurs are using their new stadium more frequently than this, and then it will be hosting regular rugby as well as the NFL games. As has been mentioned previously, they have created an environment to entertain people for extended periods before and after games as well.
Villa Park should be developed as the preeminent sport and entertainment venue in the region. I have never considered leaving the site of the current ground, but there are serious drawbacks in terms of access and transport links. Spurs is fairly similar, but Tottenham is the subject of enormous regeneration, bringing higher population density, and all of the infrastructure and amenities that come hand in hand. The master plan for Aston on the other hand is light industrial units and logistics as far as I can see. I wonder whether it would ever be possible to regenerate the area sufficiently, and if the only way to improve the situation would be to move closer to the city centre.
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I think we are in limbo at the moment re ground redevelopment, but how long will it before one of our midland neighbours has the foresight to provide a ground with facilities the Midlands deserves?
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Add me to the list of punters who drink and eat in town pre match, queue for a drink on 40 mins, and stay in the Holte Suite after the game while the traffic goes, only to be asked to leave after an hour (because they want to close up not my behaviour!).
There are so many ways in which Villa could massively increase their matchday revenue, most mentioned in these three pages...but I honestly believe the club don’t give a shit. How can they? I mean, if whoever is responsible for matchday commercial activity believes they are doing a good job, and cannot see how easy it is to hugely improve it then there’s no hope at all. It’s hopeless.
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Great thread.
One of the inherent problems with football is the rules to do with alcohol. At rugby matches, you can buy a drink at any point, then take it to your seat and drink it there. At football matches, this is obviously completely prohibited. You therefore get everybody wanting to be served in the same 10-15 minutes at half time, and if they manage it, everybody is then forced to stand in the same unwelcoming concrete box. At Northampton rugby ground, there's a big outside area designated as a "fans' village", where there's a wide variety of different beers and and foods, and it's all very nice. (Obviously it doesn't make up for the shit, middle class tedium of watching rugby, but still.). They have something similar in one of the stands at Leeds United.
It would be hard to do that at Villa Park, because it's got main roads on two sides, and car parks at either end. This might be heresy, but when we go back up, I'd love to see us build a new 50,000+ stadium somewhere that's much easier to get to. The facilities are crap at Villa, the roads are a nightmare afterwards, and the public transport options are rubbish too. Make the most of the Commonwealth Games opportunity and get us somewhere purpose built that is a pleasure to visit. Let's face it, Villa isn't what it once was, especially since Ellis destroyed the Trinity. That stand is just a modern stand that could be anywhere else, the North Stand is a disgusting concrete eyesore, and the Witton is rubbish. The Holte End looks quite nice from outside, but that's about it.
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I remember the Villa Vitality idea of decent, healthy food being sold when lerner took over.
I remember the immediate response of "Too many wankers at football now. All lads wants is pies and burgers".
And that's one of the problems. Our fanbase isn't all that arsed about paying ten quid for a water buffalo brisket on foccacia. Yes, the service for what we've got is shite but widening the range is a non-starter.
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There's that roast pork place in the Holte isn't there?
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My own experience is that our facilities are very good.
The upper Holte had a number of bars over two floors and bundles of space to mill about in.
The food is poor, but then I'm a fitness Nazi and it seems the convenience option generally dire in the UK.
I'm sick of looking at the North and hearing how cramped and poor the Witton is.
Villa Park desperately needs an upgrade. If we can sell out every week for two months solid in the Chanpionship then we can do the same with 50k in the top flight. The facilities ought to match the grandiose setting that is the home of football.
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When a minimum wage worker is employed to serve for a 15 minute slot at HT, (s)he will never satisfy everyone in the queue.
I fail to see how this is a commercial failing and other than opening 50 more kiosks around the ground, I don't see what the answer is?
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You could increase the rate of pouring with those fancy bottom up pints. Beer bottle vending machines? But I suspect the upper Holte is the only part of the ground genuinely modern in the floor space.
The Emirates has its choke points in the away end. The Amex was surprisingly spacious and of course Wembley is huge.
If we were to move, then it ought to be city centre and 60,000. It's probably not feasible, but the site near the BT tower off Snow Hill. Stick the Queens Way under ground like Boston, flatten the hostels and the like and build over the car park that's there now. Probably not doable due to the gradient, but the BT Tower would be claret and blue and we'd be well stocked for quality pubs.
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We do not fill a 43000 stadium with regularity. We struggle to sell season tickets for a few hundred quid, even with "Early Bird" offers. A friend of mine down here is about 70000th on the waiting list for a season ticket at White Hart Lane. That's the reality.
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I remember the Villa Vitality idea of decent, healthy food being sold when lerner took over.
I remember the immediate response of "Too many wankers at football now. All lads wants is pies and burgers".
And that's one of the problems. Our fanbase isn't all that arsed about paying ten quid for a water buffalo brisket on foccacia. Yes, the service for what we've got is shite but widening the range is a non-starter.
You don't have to go all the way though to the water buffalo brisket or prawn sandwiches (TM Roy Keane). There's lots more to offer than just pie and chips. Some of the food on offer at US sports events is outstanding and doesn't cost the earth. One of the issues (or non issues) is that that HT is so short so there is limited scope for finer cuisine, but it can be done if planned well. But the pre-match experience needs to be better and stadia like Spurs will cater to not only a football crowd but a growing demand for NFL. British football stadiums are cramped and poorly lit with sub-standard facilities. The new stadiums are a step in the right direction on many of the issues being discussed on this thread that should have been fixed ages ago.
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I agree with TV there. In the Upper North Stand, the only hot food options are vile hot dogs or pies that are so hot they take an hour to reduce to a temperature that won’t burn you mouth. That’s it.
I don’t want / expect healthy or vegan options but the lack of choice is appalling.
We could get left behind if things don’t improve. I’ve heard that the new stand at Bristol City has a fanzone outside with food stalls, bars and live bands playing.
It could be worse though. Whilst we’re stuck in the 90s, Leeds and Sheffield Wednesday are still in the 80s. At Hillsborough the other week, one of the kiosks had the old fashioned serving hatch with a price list hand written on a scrap of paper and stuck on the wall with blue tack!
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I remember the Villa Vitality idea of decent, healthy food being sold when lerner took over.
I remember the immediate response of "Too many wankers at football now. All lads wants is pies and burgers".
And that's one of the problems. Our fanbase isn't all that arsed about paying ten quid for a water buffalo brisket on foccacia. Yes, the service for what we've got is shite but widening the range is a non-starter.
That's because we're operating on a definition of football fan which is decades out of date.
Even if we are not going to improve the range of food available, we should at least be making it easier to buy the slop we currently serve up.
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When a minimum wage worker is employed to serve for a 15 minute slot at HT, (s)he will never satisfy everyone in the queue.
I fail to see how this is a commercial failing and other than opening 50 more kiosks around the ground, I don't see what the answer is?
Lots of customers unable to give you their money for something which they are trying to sell you is the very definition of a commercial failing.
How about improve the method of delivery so it doesn't involve a teenager sloping off down the other end of the bar every time someone fancies a beer?
I am sure other grounds employ agency staff on minimum wage to do this work as well, but most of them seem better at it than we are. Which is probably why our commercial income managed to barely improve all through the latter premier league years.
Maybe the answer is, as you said, opening more kiosks? Maybe it is redeveloping the ground? Maybe it is moving to a new ground?
Whatever it is, we need to find the answer, because we're just going to fall further and further behind.
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I remember the Villa Vitality idea of decent, healthy food being sold when lerner took over.
I remember the immediate response of "Too many wankers at football now. All lads wants is pies and burgers".
And that's one of the problems. Our fanbase isn't all that arsed about paying ten quid for a water buffalo brisket on foccacia. Yes, the service for what we've got is shite but widening the range is a non-starter.
That's because we're operating on a definition of football fan which is decades out of date.
Even if we are not going to improve the range of food available, we should at least be making it easier to buy the slop we currently serve up.
Or maybe us on here aren't typical. If there was a market it would be catered for by others, yet what's sold outside now is virtually identical to thirty years ago. It might be different in London but our support is still inherently small c conservative.
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Great thread I know in the Holte Lower in the concourse they have those beer machines that pump beer from the bottom but the staff serving them are imbeciles I was buying beer there because it was new and there were people waiting they poured them and left them on the side of the trolly people were taking them without paying I didn't say anything I picked two up and they charged my friend for one but being honest he paid for two they need proper training so Villa don't lose money also Fanatics need to sort out the shop so we don't have a situation were we have to wait ages for the kits to be restocked when we sell out.
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I remember the Villa Vitality idea of decent, healthy food being sold when lerner took over.
I remember the immediate response of "Too many wankers at football now. All lads wants is pies and burgers".
And that's one of the problems. Our fanbase isn't all that arsed about paying ten quid for a water buffalo brisket on foccacia. Yes, the service for what we've got is shite but widening the range is a non-starter.
That's because we're operating on a definition of football fan which is decades out of date.
Even if we are not going to improve the range of food available, we should at least be making it easier to buy the slop we currently serve up.
Or maybe us on here aren't typical. If there was a market it would be catered for by others, yet what's sold outside now is virtually identical to thirty years ago. It might be different in London but our support is still inherently small c conservative.
There's a market for beer on match days, but there aren't many places outside the ground catering for it. That's obviously because for them, it does not make economic sense to run pubs 7 days a week for a community which largely is abstinent.
The club, however, needs to maximise its commercial revenue on the days it is active - both in terms of flogging people food and drink and replica shirts (and probably lots of other things we haven't even mentioned).
If tastes havent changed, for example, then we can stick with beers, chips and whatever, but we at least need to find a way to actually let people buy it easily.
I recall General Krulak talking about trialling some of those incredibly fast beer pouring things, and that was at least ten years ago. Nothing seems to have changed in the meantime.
Other clubs have the same problems we do around there being 23 (or 19) home matches a year, yet they seem to manage to make considerably more money out of it than we do, and we seem to be talking about the same problems and failings we were talking about a decade ago.
If we are going to have to be self sufficient, this sort of revenue is going to be vital, yet it is beset by problems that never get fixed.
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There's a market for beer on match days, but there aren't many places outside the ground catering for it. That's obviously because for them, it does not make economic sense to run pubs 7 days a week for a community which largely is abstinent.
The club, however, needs to maximise its commercial revenue on the days it is active - both in terms of flogging people food and drink and replica shirts (and probably lots of other things we haven't even mentioned).
If tastes havent changed, for example, then we can stick with beers, chips and whatever, but we at least need to find a way to actually let people buy it easily.
I recall General Krulak talking about trialling some of those incredibly fast beer pouring things, and that was at least ten years ago. Nothing seems to have changed in the meantime.
Other clubs have the same problems we do around there being 23 (or 19) home matches a year, yet they seem to manage to make considerably more money out of it than we do, and we seem to be talking about the same problems and failings we were talking about a decade ago.
If we are going to have to be self sufficient, this sort of revenue is going to be vital, yet it is beset by problems that never get fixed.
Pubs are permanent structures; food outlets aren't. If there was a call for certain products (and I'm not entirely certain that beer is as in demand as we might think) then someone would roll up and start selling them; a wider choice has been tried before and it's not been a success.
As I said before, I agree that the service is awful, but then again it probably is at just about every other football ground. I don't know how much revenue they make on matchdays but I do think it's unfair to compare the most modern, money no object, ground in the world with a place where much of the infrastructure has been basically unchanged for over a century. I'm sure we'd love to be able to get served as quickly as at Spurs and have a matchday set-up as lucrative as theirs although I doubt if our supporters would be willing to pay what they do.
Yes, there are a lot of things that could be improved and it's disappointing/unforgivable that we're still stuck in the old days of having to choose between not getting served at half-time and missing part of the match. That's undeniable. What the people who turn up regularly at Villa Park actually want to buy, though, is a different matter.
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One of the big impacts of all of this is the ground half emptying on 35 mins. I don't buy any drinks or food on match day because I can't be arsed to queue and I don't want to miss any of the game. If I could be sure I could get served in the 15mins I probably would.
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It's not a science. I remember being at Derby away, JPA was playing so that gives you a clue how long ago it was. At half time the kiosk had pre-poured pints with lids on, and they were banging them out ten to the dozen without any issue. Other clubs have bottle bars doing likewise. We don't need a Steve Jobs to get this set up FFS. The staff in the Holte Suite look like rabbits in headlights after the game, as if they weren't expecting hundreds of people wanting a drink.
One last thing, why don't we just serve bottles in the stands? You have to go some to get a pint down you in 15 mins, so a bottle is plenty, and takes a fraction of the time to serve too.
Rant now over.
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You have to go some to get a pint down you in 15 mins, so a bottle is plenty
What prawn sandwich brigadery is this?! Do you sip it with your little finger elegantly sticking out?!
A pint in 15 minutes beyond you? Deary me Des!
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Catering at half time is literally a joke. . The problem is the staff, half of them havent got a clue at what they are doing and look completely lost. You really have to question what training they receive if any! You can put measures in place like contact less paymenst etc to speed things up, but while the staff are as they are, nothing will change.
Not just the staff.
The environment, queuing facilities, leadership, staff training, better payment systems ...
And, whilst I'm at it, the toiet facilities are poor too: queuing; people smoking, snorting; poor tpas / basins; etc
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Another thing has always irked me: why do they not use some of the space at ground level in the Holte to put mini merchandise vending units? - scarves, hats, flags, etc. They'd sell stuff each week.
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With the closure of so many pubs around the ground the must surely be a opportunity for a well thought out fan park type thing. Sky sports, decent beers, family zones, more ‘lively’ zones, food, seating etc etc
You mean like the Holte pub?
No not at all like the Holte Pub. Service is terrible in there but to even so it's always packed. I'm thinking more like the facilities that spring up at racecourses and festivals. There would be no reason why you couldn't have a large marquee with screens, tables and chairs, food at both the Holte End and North Stand end of the ground.
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You have to go some to get a pint down you in 15 mins, so a bottle is plenty
What prawn sandwich brigadery is this?! Do you sip it with your little finger elegantly sticking out?!
A pint in 15 minutes beyond you? Deary me Des!
I'm with Risso here. Whenever I'm confronted by a choice of only bottles I feel like my human rights have been infringed upon.
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When a minimum wage worker is employed to serve for a 15 minute slot at HT, (s)he will never satisfy everyone in the queue.
I fail to see how this is a commercial failing and other than opening 50 more kiosks around the ground, I don't see what the answer is?
Lots of customers unable to give you their money for something which they are trying to sell you is the very definition of a commercial failing.
How about improve the method of delivery so it doesn't involve a teenager sloping off down the other end of the bar every time someone fancies a beer?
I am sure other grounds employ agency staff on minimum wage to do this work as well, but most of them seem better at it than we are. Which is probably why our commercial income managed to barely improve all through the latter premier league years.
Maybe the answer is, as you said, opening more kiosks? Maybe it is redeveloping the ground? Maybe it is moving to a new ground?
Whatever it is, we need to find the answer, because we're just going to fall further and further behind.
200 kids serving 20,000 people in a 20 minute slot? Do the maths. It’s 100 customers per bar person or 5 customers per minute. It’s impossible.
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Right then Risso, Sexual I'm taking this as a challenge. You can pair up, and you can bring your fackin' dinner with you as well....
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I’ve often felt that the Car Park behind the Holte is a massive missed opportunity for generating income. If it had temp bars and food outlets (with some cover in case it rains) I would go earlier to have food/drink.
The whole stadium is in need of a massive upgrade. All 3 stands were done in a rush to satisfy the Taylor report and are now massively inadequate for what we need if we are to compete at the highest level. I think our match day income for a full house is probably about a third if not lower of what the likes of Arsenal and others generate. That’s just not good enough.
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I don’t eat or drink at Villa Park and won’t until the quality/price ratio improves.
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I agree on the Holte End car park - I don't know who parks there but it can't be a massive issue to close that off before games to create a fanzone with different food and drink stalls. Yes there will be people with disabled passes who park there but I'm sure we could find some space out the back of the Witton End.
As for half time, I'm another who would almost certainly spend money at half time at every game but refuse to miss any of the match and know that there's zero chance of getting served if I head down on the ref's whistle.
The staff efficiency and effectiveness is definitely an issue but that's always going to be a challenge with 18 year old kids on minimum wage employed for a few hours every fortnight. Instead the club should be changing the process - as others have said, lets have tills dedicated to taking money and then a separate area for collection. You could even largely do away with the tills and have an app to place orders in advance, if we had a closed wifi network in the ground to run it on.
This has been talked about many times before, even in Fan Consultation Groups I believe, and the pushback from the club was always the cost of the infrastructure needed and an inability to make a business case out of it. I get that in the short term, but now we have considerably richer owners than yow surely they can afford to spend a bit on faster pouring pint machines in the hope that it generally drives up the fan experience and brings more people to the club in the longer term?
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Another thing has always irked me: why do they not use some of the space at ground level in the Holte to put mini merchandise vending units? - scarves, hats, flags, etc. They'd sell stuff each week.
You can't obstruct potential exitways.
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Out of the 15 homes I've been to this season in L3, only twice has there been a burger ready to serve. I've tried different times, way before kick-off. The straw that broke the back was when it took nearly half an hour to make one.
Sort it out Villa, that's another £50 that could have paid for several second's of a first-teamer's wages.
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We could take a look at how they do things at Edgbaston. Yes it's roughly half the capacity of Villa Park but on major match days such as an Ashes test or T20 Finals day they have a food court with various food outlets and different bars. They also have servers walking around with beer tanks on their backs serving beer to glasses that are part of the beer tank so they serve two at once.
All of this is before you get into the stands. Stick some kind of roof over the car parks at the back of the Holte and also the back of the North Stand and let people buy food and drink before they enter the ground. They control access egress at half time and you should have a much smoother operation.
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Around 10 years ago we were challenging for the Champions League positions and the sky was seemingly the limit
Around 10 years ago Tottenham panic appointed Harry Redknapp whilst in the relegation positions
Look where they are now and look at their stadium and facilities
So many missed opportunity's over the years to be a force both on and off the pitch
If you keep missing opportunity's in life it eventually bites you in the ass (see the last 9 years)
We got 1 more chance to win the play offs get back up to the big time, and with the current set up/owners we can get to where Tottenham have found themselves believe it or not ON and OFF the pitch
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Nightmare getting out of and away from the Spurs ground last night apparently. Trains/buses overwhelmed etc. Oh and they still haven’t won anything of note in those 10 years.
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It was a nightmare at WHL when the capacity was 34k. I refuse to accept that they can possibly make things any easier with 61k in there. Then again, I couldn't give a toss, fcuk 'em
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Appalled by the idea of not playing at Villa Park.
I cannot understand anyone who would support moving away from our Home.
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Appalled by the idea of not playing at Villa Park.
I cannot understand anyone who would support moving away from our Home.
I’m not sure I’m appalled at the idea, I would admit to not being keen though. I can understand some though who would prefer a more accessible, modern ground if you like that soulless edge of a retail park experience.
If they bought in safe standing I could quite easily see the issue going away for Villa though as you could redevelop and increase capacity to a reasonable level. I’m definitely in the prefer to stay camp.
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Appalled by the idea of not playing at Villa Park.
I cannot understand anyone who would support moving away from our Home.
I’m not sure I’m appalled at the idea, I would admit to not being keen though. I can understand some though who would prefer a more accessible, modern ground if you like that soulless edge of a retail park experience.
If they bought in safe standing I could quite easily see the issue going away for Villa though as you could redevelop and increase capacity to a reasonable level. I’m definitely in the prefer to stay camp.
Prefer to stay camp?
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Chortle...
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You have to go some to get a pint down you in 15 mins, so a bottle is plenty
What prawn sandwich brigadery is this?! Do you sip it with your little finger elegantly sticking out?!
A pint in 15 minutes beyond you? Deary me Des!
The only reasons I can think of for struggling to down a pint in fifteen minutes all involve medical conditions!
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When a minimum wage worker is employed to serve for a 15 minute slot at HT, (s)he will never satisfy everyone in the queue.
I fail to see how this is a commercial failing and other than opening 50 more kiosks around the ground, I don't see what the answer is?
Lots of customers unable to give you their money for something which they are trying to sell you is the very definition of a commercial failing.
How about improve the method of delivery so it doesn't involve a teenager sloping off down the other end of the bar every time someone fancies a beer?
I am sure other grounds employ agency staff on minimum wage to do this work as well, but most of them seem better at it than we are. Which is probably why our commercial income managed to barely improve all through the latter premier league years.
Maybe the answer is, as you said, opening more kiosks? Maybe it is redeveloping the ground? Maybe it is moving to a new ground?
Whatever it is, we need to find the answer, because we're just going to fall further and further behind.
200 kids serving 20,000 people in a 20 minute slot? Do the maths. It’s 100 customers per bar person or 5 customers per minute. It’s impossible.
What on earth are you talking about? 200 kids? 20,000 people?
You're genuinely suggesting it is not possible to serve people considerably faster by either changing the way we serve, the number of serving points, or the facilities available at the ground?
What about this sort of measure?
It's not a science. I remember being at Derby away, JPA was playing so that gives you a clue how long ago it was. At half time the kiosk had pre-poured pints with lids on, and they were banging them out ten to the dozen without any issue. Other clubs have bottle bars doing likewise. We don't need a Steve Jobs to get this set up FFS. The staff in the Holte Suite look like rabbits in headlights after the game, as if they weren't expecting hundreds of people wanting a drink.
One last thing, why don't we just serve bottles in the stands? You have to go some to get a pint down you in 15 mins, so a bottle is plenty, and takes a fraction of the time to serve too.
Rant now over.
Why can't we look at things like that?
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There is a limited supply of people over the age of 18 who want to work once a fortnight for about £30.
It’s not that appealing to anyone other than students who don’t suffer any knock on effects on their other income. There’s lots of students, but even they have better options. If you’re going to do some bar work for a bit of extra money, do it in a pub or club that’ll give you a few more hours and is a more fun and sociable environment to work in.
I did it for a while whilst I was a student & for me it was great to get out and watch the last bit of the game that I couldn’t have otherwise afforded to see - but the job itself was absolutely shit.
So you can make a lot of logistical improvements, but when these aren’t desirable jobs, you are gong to end up recruiting people who aren’t that good at it, as well as probably never quite enough of them!
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The facilities are appalling and for that reason I don't use them. It's a pain taking the top off my lad's bottle on the way in and hoping he doesn't spill it until I'm out of sight and can put the spare lid on! I bring in sandwiches and snacks for us. However, I'd prefer to not come with a rucksack and spend a few pounds at Villa Park if 1) I could get served in time (I'm another who won't leave his seat before the half time whistle) and 2) it wasn't generally a bit shit. It would be part of the match day experience, but the first time we went to a match, we spent 10 minutes getting even close to the concourse, let alone in the queue and to his credit (he was only 6) when I said 'do you want your pop enough to miss a couple of minutes of the match,' he said 'no.'
When I used to go to Gloucester Rugby, they had some great food and drink on sale with, admittedly, much fewer people to deal with plus the fact that because it's rugby, there was a bloke walking around with a barrel on his back dispensing beer to you (upon payment) as you stood in The Shed, so there was no mad dash for beer at half time.
My question would be, are other clubs doing it better and if so why aren't we learning from them. Do Liverpool fans moan the same as us, for instance? They've got a relatively dated stadium and big crowds so it would be interesting to know. Is it a Villa problem or a problem to all clubs with big capacity stadiums? If it's just us then there is absolutely no excuse.
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Interesting debate and the powers that be should be made aware of this type of discussion and points raised.
Agree with DW that we can't be comparing Villa Park to the most modern £billion stadium in the country, however I would refer to the match day experience at the Etihad a few seasons ago where they have a large concourse with pre-match entertainment, bars and food outlets selling quality food...I enjoyed a pint, pie and a foot long proper quality hotdog. My point being that these kind of services could be provided on a smaller scale at either end of the ground, providing a much improved match day experience for thousands at the expense of a few hundred who use the space for car parking.
In terms of inside the ground, it simply needs better management, logistics, staff training, and serving facilities...its not hard to implement those things at minimal cost to the club to yield greater profit.
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I may be mistaken, however I’m sure that the mobile backpack beer on the concourse thing was vetoed by the council of all people a few years ago. Is that right or am I mistaken? Shame if so, as the whole contactless payment nowadays would make it ideal.
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My point being that these kind of services could be provided on a smaller scale at either end of the ground, providing a much improved match day experience for thousands at the expense of a few hundred who use the space for car parking.
The trouble there is that i) those few hundred who use the car parks pay a fortune for the privilege and ii) car parks are the sort of thing that's sacrosanct in planning.
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Just pre-pour the pints and stop taking cash.
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When a minimum wage worker is employed to serve for a 15 minute slot at HT, (s)he will never satisfy everyone in the queue.
I fail to see how this is a commercial failing and other than opening 50 more kiosks around the ground, I don't see what the answer is?
Lots of customers unable to give you their money for something which they are trying to sell you is the very definition of a commercial failing.
How about improve the method of delivery so it doesn't involve a teenager sloping off down the other end of the bar every time someone fancies a beer?
I am sure other grounds employ agency staff on minimum wage to do this work as well, but most of them seem better at it than we are. Which is probably why our commercial income managed to barely improve all through the latter premier league years.
Maybe the answer is, as you said, opening more kiosks? Maybe it is redeveloping the ground? Maybe it is moving to a new ground?
Whatever it is, we need to find the answer, because we're just going to fall further and further behind.
200 kids serving 20,000 people in a 20 minute slot? Do the maths. It’s 100 customers per bar person or 5 customers per minute. It’s impossible.
What on earth are you talking about? 200 kids? 20,000 people?
You're genuinely suggesting it is not possible to serve people considerably faster by either changing the way we serve, the number of serving points, or the facilities available at the ground?
What about this sort of measure?
It's not a science. I remember being at Derby away, JPA was playing so that gives you a clue how long ago it was. At half time the kiosk had pre-poured pints with lids on, and they were banging them out ten to the dozen without any issue. Other clubs have bottle bars doing likewise. We don't need a Steve Jobs to get this set up FFS. The staff in the Holte Suite look like rabbits in headlights after the game, as if they weren't expecting hundreds of people wanting a drink.
One last thing, why don't we just serve bottles in the stands? You have to go some to get a pint down you in 15 mins, so a bottle is plenty, and takes a fraction of the time to serve too.
Rant now over.
Why can't we look at things like that?
Oh great - All hail the saving grace: The pre-poured pint. That will elevate us into the multi - Billions league.
Not sure if you just want quicker service or greater revenue. Either/or, it will always be a bun fight when everyone wants stuff at the same time.
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What if we had the option of, for example, a new stadium with facilities like the new Spurs one, on the site of the wholesale markets in the city centre? What if we rebuilt Villa Park on the current location? The transport links to Aston are piss poor, what can be done to improve that?
Transport links are better than what Spurs have, two train stations within 5-10 minutes walk, Spurs would kill for that.
Take your point over the catering.
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When a minimum wage worker is employed to serve for a 15 minute slot at HT, (s)he will never satisfy everyone in the queue.
I fail to see how this is a commercial failing and other than opening 50 more kiosks around the ground, I don't see what the answer is?
Lots of customers unable to give you their money for something which they are trying to sell you is the very definition of a commercial failing.
How about improve the method of delivery so it doesn't involve a teenager sloping off down the other end of the bar every time someone fancies a beer?
I am sure other grounds employ agency staff on minimum wage to do this work as well, but most of them seem better at it than we are. Which is probably why our commercial income managed to barely improve all through the latter premier league years.
Maybe the answer is, as you said, opening more kiosks? Maybe it is redeveloping the ground? Maybe it is moving to a new ground?
Whatever it is, we need to find the answer, because we're just going to fall further and further behind.
200 kids serving 20,000 people in a 20 minute slot? Do the maths. It’s 100 customers per bar person or 5 customers per minute. It’s impossible.
What on earth are you talking about? 200 kids? 20,000 people?
You're genuinely suggesting it is not possible to serve people considerably faster by either changing the way we serve, the number of serving points, or the facilities available at the ground?
What about this sort of measure?
It's not a science. I remember being at Derby away, JPA was playing so that gives you a clue how long ago it was. At half time the kiosk had pre-poured pints with lids on, and they were banging them out ten to the dozen without any issue. Other clubs have bottle bars doing likewise. We don't need a Steve Jobs to get this set up FFS. The staff in the Holte Suite look like rabbits in headlights after the game, as if they weren't expecting hundreds of people wanting a drink.
One last thing, why don't we just serve bottles in the stands? You have to go some to get a pint down you in 15 mins, so a bottle is plenty, and takes a fraction of the time to serve too.
Rant now over.
Why can't we look at things like that?
Oh great - All hail the saving grace: The pre-poured pint. That will elevate us into the multi - Billions league.
Not sure if you just want quicker service or greater revenue. Either/or, it will always be a bun fight when everyone wants stuff at the same time.
Yes, because that's exactly what I am saying, isn't it, pre-poured pints will elevate us into the world of Man City.
Quicker service equals greater revenue - more people getting to buy what they want to buy, more money for the club. We've got to be self sufficient, so these things matter.
The fact that our commercial income remained static for so many years in the top flight tells you there was something wrong. People being unable to buy replica shirts tells you something is wrong as well.
If you think everything's cool and there's no point trying to improve things, then come out and say it.
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Was just thinking so not really sure how feasible but given they open the exits at half time so people can wander out to have a fag/vape......would it not be possible to have a food stall/van out on the car parks by the Holte/North so people could get their refreshments from there instead of all queueing at the same points and creating bottlenecks.
Maybe clear out an underused hospitality room/space in the stands and get something going in there.
I would say aswell if the half time entertainment was more interesting then you'd get a few more people staying in their seats.
I'm surprised we don't get more former players back and on the pitch for interviews, Spurs had Van Der Vaart at half time last night. Everyone saw the reception Laursen and KPA got at the Blackburn game and the stands were pretty full for that so sounds a straightforward move.
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Is the catering services outsourced to a third party or employed by the club? Whoever is responsible for the management of catering in the stands should be sacked for incompetence.
Even if it is outsourced, that does not mean it has to be fucking awful. The club just don't seem to be able to get this sorted, though, it's laughably poor.
It's not just the produce & products of the catering provider it's the disinterested couldn't give a fuck attitude of the employees.
I once did that job (for one match) at Carrow Road as a student. By the time people had got through the queues they were thoroughly pissed off and half of them spoke to me in a way that minimum wage couldn't justify. I'm sure the same happens at VP.
Trinity Road experience goes along the lines of queue for 20 minutes for a couple of bottles of Carlsberg that is always in a fridge at the other end of the serving area, server disappears who knows where and then reappears with 2 bottles of beer that they then struggle to take the top off of whilst Trisha the catering supervisor stands at the back looking at a sheet of paper telling her what stock she has or maybe it's an email about her cats vet appointment but no way is Trisha going to serve anyone and Diane at the next till on route to the fridge gets collared by Trisha to talk about the stock email or is it her cats failing health. Who knows, they're hopeless, utterly hopeless.
Have to say for a relative new build the Trinity upper is nearly as bad as the North for bottleneck queues. Partly the way they designed it with a tight concourse which is a nightmare for sell outs like Sunday's game.
Edit: Simple thing is to go up, stay up and eventually challenge for europe again. That happens and the North would certainly be redeveloped this time so that should be a world class stand and we could improve a fair few things e.g. club museum, underground car parks, new club shop which would give a bit more flexibility.
I honestly think if we were to ever move it would be out by the NEC which would obviously be a very diverse move.
Interesting debate though, perception from neutrals seems to be Villa Park remains one of the top grounds in the country. I'm imagining plenty of championship fans who've come here in last 3 years would've thought that with what they're used to down here.
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The Trinity is significantly worse than the Holte for getting served...before the game is bad enough with queues forming all over the place, but half time is a joke and the queues in the narrow concourse also hinder any movement along towards the toilets. Such a piss poor design.
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The Trinity is significantly worse than the Holte for getting served...before the game is bad enough with queues forming all over the place, but half time is a joke and the queues in the narrow concourse also hinder any movement along towards the toilets. Such a piss poor design.
Not as anti Trinty stand as many but it's really poor, the stairs taking up half of the space is a big problem. Would've been better just to build a few more lifts and push it back like they do at the Emirates for anyone who's been to a game there and sat in the Upper tiers.
Witton has the excuse it was built in the 90s and has space restrictions due to the housing so ultimately that was a two tier stand that had to be crammed in, no such excuse for the Trinty.
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We do not fill a 43000 stadium with regularity. We struggle to sell season tickets for a few hundred quid, even with "Early Bird" offers. A friend of mine down here is about 70000th on the waiting list for a season ticket at White Hart Lane. That's the reality.
I'm 91,000th - apparently.
You get automatically added to the waiting list if you're a 'One Hotspur' member.
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As someone said earlier, much of the problem is down to the fact that the 1993-2001 redevelopment was done on the cheap.
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As someone said earlier, much of the problem is down to the fact that the 1993-2001 redevelopment was done on the cheap.
Cheers Doug.
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It wasn't just about money, either. There was a real arrogance about the Villa where the community was concerned back then, a belief that Aston was our private kingdom and we could do whatever we liked, and if we're being honest a lot of supporters felt that way as well. Naturally the local people objected to this, the council equally understandably sympathised with them, there was mutual distrust where there should have been co- operation and we ended up having to argue all the time when with a bit of understanding we could have worked with all concerned for a much better end result. However badly the Lerner years ended they set in motion the fostering of better community relations that has continued under subsequent owners.
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As someone said earlier, much of the problem is down to the fact that the 1993-2001 redevelopment was done on the cheap.
For a while the Holte looked like the outside of a cheap home improvement store. Wasn't it like a brown and red corrugate monstrosity?
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Fans often say what a great stadium VP is and that's somewhat true of the pitch facing side of the stands. Underneath I'd agree with Dave, Ellis produced stands with incredibly cramped space and shit facilities inside the Witton Lane stand and the North Stand. And the outsides were pure DIY superstore style.
The Trinity isn't much better. At the Blackburn game I had to battle through massive queues and crowds that were borderline dangerous at half time to take my daughter to the toilets, which had been conveniently located right behind the queuing area.
As well as Ellis penny pinching we seem to have had a succession of gobshite eejits as CEOs and Commercial Managers over the years. Tom Fox was commercial director at Arsenal I believe but you wouldn't have know it after he moved to Villa.
A lot of it is fixable, and some of it could be via quick wins. The club don't seem interested though.
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Even with all the other problems I think larger concourses with some natural light would help massively, I only get to 3-4 games a season but it's over a decade since I last used the concourse for anything other than getting in and out of the ground.
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Football grounds like many other sporting venues have started to evolve from simply being functional to being much more customer focused. While traditional customers remain what used to suffice as a facility geared to providing a quick pie, pint and a piss won’t be sufficient in years to come. The next generation of stadia is starting to address that, however most existing stadia, and I would include Villa Park in that need to find a way to get with the times through an increased and improved mix of products and services.
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Can’t argue with that TV. The matchday “experience” at Villa Park could be and should be significantly improved to be more than just come and watch the game, and the club could and should embrace, implement, encourage, and profit from that way of thinking. As you rightly mentioned previously, attending a sports game in America has a large social aspect to it which is partly due to the format and time, however there’s still opportunities before, during and after a football game here that could be capitalised upon.
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When a minimum wage worker is employed to serve for a 15 minute slot at HT, (s)he will never satisfy everyone in the queue.
I fail to see how this is a commercial failing and other than opening 50 more kiosks around the ground, I don't see what the answer is?
Lots of customers unable to give you their money for something which they are trying to sell you is the very definition of a commercial failing.
How about improve the method of delivery so it doesn't involve a teenager sloping off down the other end of the bar every time someone fancies a beer?
I am sure other grounds employ agency staff on minimum wage to do this work as well, but most of them seem better at it than we are. Which is probably why our commercial income managed to barely improve all through the latter premier league years.
Maybe the answer is, as you said, opening more kiosks? Maybe it is redeveloping the ground? Maybe it is moving to a new ground?
Whatever it is, we need to find the answer, because we're just going to fall further and further behind.
200 kids serving 20,000 people in a 20 minute slot? Do the maths. It’s 100 customers per bar person or 5 customers per minute. It’s impossible.
What on earth are you talking about? 200 kids? 20,000 people?
You're genuinely suggesting it is not possible to serve people considerably faster by either changing the way we serve, the number of serving points, or the facilities available at the ground?
What about this sort of measure?
It's not a science. I remember being at Derby away, JPA was playing so that gives you a clue how long ago it was. At half time the kiosk had pre-poured pints with lids on, and they were banging them out ten to the dozen without any issue. Other clubs have bottle bars doing likewise. We don't need a Steve Jobs to get this set up FFS. The staff in the Holte Suite look like rabbits in headlights after the game, as if they weren't expecting hundreds of people wanting a drink.
One last thing, why don't we just serve bottles in the stands? You have to go some to get a pint down you in 15 mins, so a bottle is plenty, and takes a fraction of the time to serve too.
Rant now over.
Why can't we look at things like that?
Oh great - All hail the saving grace: The pre-poured pint. That will elevate us into the multi - Billions league.
Not sure if you just want quicker service or greater revenue. Either/or, it will always be a bun fight when everyone wants stuff at the same time.
I’d like to be the first to take part in any pre-poured pint trial. I’m sure I can improve sales !!
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Anyone who can drink more than 1 pint of that gassy garbage they call draught beer at VP, the Holte Suite or Holte pub deserves a medal. It makes me feel sick.
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Was talking to a mate today who loves his NFL.
He said he went a while back when they held a match at Twickenham and he couldn't get over the total lack of infastructure. This is 80k stadium and one of the iconic stadiums in the U.K.
He's been to watch a few of the games in America and so used to barbecues in the car park and all that.
Would also be interested if anyone's been to the Olympic stadium as a neutral and how that is behind the scenes. I know when the Olympics were on it was pretty much just a shell and West Ham actually had to spend a fair bit to bring the stadium up to standard beyond the pitch.
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I've only been to the Olympic stadium for a concert (Rolling Stones) and can confirm that the place is huge. Haven't been there on a match day but there is plenty space for pre-game entertainment and catering options outside the ground, and the concourse areas inside are also very wide, plenty of space to move and very good toilet facilities. The queues were quite long for drinks/food but service was quite fast and organised compared to what we're used to at VP.
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The olympic stadium has very open concourses, more like edgbaston than a football stadium and is in a glorified retail/office park. Wrong shape for a football stadium too.
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When the Holte was renovated and the plans for the theme park/tailgating area in the car park were released, there was a general feeling that this is England and don't come here with your fancy American ways. Maybe they were just a decade and a bit ahead of their time.
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Anyone who can drink more than 1 pint of that gassy garbage they call draught beer at VP, the Holte Suite or Holte pub deserves a medal. It makes me feel sick.
I'd suggest not drinking it if it makes you feel sick.
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When the Holte was renovated and the plans for the theme park/tailgating area in the car park were released, there was a general feeling that this is England and don't come here with your fancy American ways. Maybe they were just a decade and a bit ahead of their time.
Things are certainly evolving from a pre-match point of view. Sitting in a pub with your mates used to be the standard pre-match warm up but with the paucity of pubs local to the ground it's harder and harder to do that. Fan parks and getting to the ground much earlier do appear to be the way forward but the limitations at our ground make significantly improving the facilities tricky and without large scale re-development of three sides of Villa park there is unlikely to be much change.
As for moving, I'd be happy to put up with sub standard facilities in order to stay where we are. I'd rather have the thrill of walking up, and into, Villa Park than get a pint quickly or be offered a wider range of food. However, I accept it will change as things do, but I hope it's not any time soon.
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Was talking to a mate today who loves his NFL.
He said he went a while back when they held a match at Twickenham and he couldn't get over the total lack of infastructure. This is 80k stadium and one of the iconic stadiums in the U.K.
He's been to watch a few of the games in America and so used to barbecues in the car park and all that.
Would also be interested if anyone's been to the Olympic stadium as a neutral and how that is behind the scenes. I know when the Olympics were on it was pretty much just a shell and West Ham actually had to spend a fair bit to bring the stadium up to standard beyond the pitch.
To be fair it would be near impossible to replicate what they can do with stadiums in America.
America is huge, so they can plonk an 80K stadium anywhere without any problem.
My mate was saying when the NY Giants built their stadium the stadium was built first then everything else (roads etc) was built after. The UK haven't got that luxury.
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There is loads of space around the ground that could be used more imaginatively.
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Anyone who can drink more than 1 pint of that gassy garbage they call draught beer at VP, the Holte Suite or Holte pub deserves a medal. It makes me feel sick.
I'd suggest not drinking it if it makes you feel sick.
Naturally, I don’t. I buy those small bottles of wine instead. I wouldn’t drink that pitiful excuse for beer if you paid me.
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On the Trinity side I'd imagine it would be pretty easy to simply move the turnstiles to the fence, move in some portable bars and covers etc and have a large outdoor fan area. More difficult on the other three sides.
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Anyone who can drink more than 1 pint of that gassy garbage they call draught beer at VP, the Holte Suite or Holte pub deserves a medal. It makes me feel sick.
I'd suggest not drinking it if it makes you feel sick.
Naturally, I don’t. I buy those small bottles of wine instead. I wouldn’t drink that pitiful excuse for beer if you paid me.
Nobody is likely to offer to pay you so that's another of your conundra solved.
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Anyone who can drink more than 1 pint of that gassy garbage they call draught beer at VP, the Holte Suite or Holte pub deserves a medal. It makes me feel sick.
I'd suggest not drinking it if it makes you feel sick.
Where is the fun in that?
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On the Trinity side I'd imagine it would be pretty easy to simply move the turnstiles to the fence, move in some portable bars and covers etc and have a large outdoor fan area. More difficult on the other three sides.
The logistics of installing a load of turnstiles aside, you'd be restricting access to the North Stand and Witton Lane, making evacuation harder and it would mean the only unrestricted area outside the ground would be a narrow footpath,
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Anyone who can drink more than 1 pint of that gassy garbage they call draught beer at VP, the Holte Suite or Holte pub deserves a medal. It makes me feel sick.
I'd suggest not drinking it if it makes you feel sick.
I tried the IPA in the Holte Pub before Millwall. Man alive, how can you cock IPA up?!
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We're in Division 2. We expect low prices.
However, our owners aren't averse to making a few quid and the management team being built at a senior level have experience. Gut feeling is that when we're promoted again we'll see far better offers.
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A few years back we were in the Holte and they were trialling a pint pouring device which had about 36 nozzles which descended into pint glasses arranged on a plastic mat so all the glasses were in the right place - it poured the pints all at once in about 3 seconds. Whatever happened to that? Maybe I'd had 1 too many before the game.
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I don't go to away matches anymore, how do we compare to other big grounds?
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The best grounds for getting served relatively quickly, with a big away support, are Cardiff and Fulham. Much better than Villa.
Wednesday and Forest are worse than Villa and if you want a drink at half-time at Burnley you need to start queuing before the first half kicks off.
That's off the top of my head.
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The thing with Twickenham is that everything is a card payment rather than cash. And whilst the infrastructure around the ground isn't great, they do free shuttle buses in from Richmond and there are loads of them. There are bars and food areas all over the shop inside the ground as well so service is very quick.
If you fancy warming up during the winter in the Lower Holte then the Holte Suite is your only option. But you wont get in there if you dont leave five minutes before half time and the service is painfully slow if you want food or drink.
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The thing with Twickenham is that everything is a card payment rather than cash. And whilst the infrastructure around the ground isn't great, they do free shuttle buses in from Richmond and there are loads of them. There are bars and food areas all over the shop inside the ground as well so service is very quick.
If you fancy warming up during the winter in the Lower Holte then the Holte Suite is your only option. But you wont get in there if you dont leave five minutes before half time and the service is painfully slow if you want food or drink.
I remember going to Twickenham years ago and there was one beer on sale which was pre-poured Guinness which cost £3 a pint. I don't especially like Guinness and at the time that was an outrageous price. However, the combo of no choice plus a round sum plus a shitload of pre-poured beer meant I was comfortably served in a packed stadium during half time. I was quite happy with not my favourite beer and paying 50p extra.
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The thing with Twickenham is that everything is a card payment rather than cash. And whilst the infrastructure around the ground isn't great, they do free shuttle buses in from Richmond and there are loads of them. There are bars and food areas all over the shop inside the ground as well so service is very quick.
If you fancy warming up during the winter in the Lower Holte then the Holte Suite is your only option. But you wont get in there if you dont leave five minutes before half time and the service is painfully slow if you want food or drink.
There's also a pre payment and pre ordering app for Twickenham, order, pay, walk up to the chosen outlet and pick up your beers avoiding the queue. It's really not hard in this digital age.
There's also roving beer sellers, the RFU really are way ahead in this respect.
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I recall there were roving beer sellers at VP a few years ago. I definitely bought a beer from one in the Lower North.
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That wasn’t beer my friend!
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The thing with Twickenham is that everything is a card payment rather than cash. And whilst the infrastructure around the ground isn't great, they do free shuttle buses in from Richmond and there are loads of them. There are bars and food areas all over the shop inside the ground as well so service is very quick.
If you fancy warming up during the winter in the Lower Holte then the Holte Suite is your only option. But you wont get in there if you dont leave five minutes before half time and the service is painfully slow if you want food or drink.
There's also a pre payment and pre ordering app for Twickenham, order, pay, walk up to the chosen outlet and pick up your beers avoiding the queue. It's really not hard in this digital age.
There's also roving beer sellers, the RFU really are way ahead in this respect.
Of course the licensing laws are different at rugny.though.
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Take the play off tickets fiasco - hard to spend money
Take the replica kits current fiasco - hard to spend money
Take the phone lines for tickets - hard to spend money
Take the season tickets currently off sale - impossible to spend money
Take the catering - a sad joke, hard to spend money
Take the beer - a sad joke, hard to spend money
Take the bogs - disgraceful, unpleasant to spend a penny and God forbid if you've got a sudden evacuation of your bowels moment
Take the programme - smaller than ever, way overpriced - hard to spend money
Take the outside catering (that the clubs facilitates) - dire, hard to spend money
Take the parking - what parking?
Take the replica kit debacle EVERY close season - impossible to spend money
THE CLUB IS RUN AS A SHAMBLES. It needs to change.
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Take the play off tickets fiasco - hard to spend money
Take the replica kits current fiasco - hard to spend money
Take the phone lines for tickets - hard to spend money
Take the season tickets currently off sale - impossible to spend money
Take the catering - a sad joke, hard to spend money
Take the beer - a sad joke, hard to spend money
Take the bogs - disgraceful, unpleasant to spend a penny and God forbid if you've got a sudden evacuation of your bowels moment
Take the programme - smaller than ever, way overpriced - hard to spend money
Take the outside catering (that the clubs facilitates) - dire, hard to spend money
Take the parking - what parking?
Take the replica kit debacle EVERY close season - impossible to spend money
THE CLUB IS RUN AS A SHAMBLES. It needs to change.
But apart from that, you're quite happy.
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Am I on the 'everything's great' thread? ;)
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Am I on the 'everything's great' thread? ;)
Ah, that old chestnut. I wondered how long it would take.
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Play-off tickets 'fiasco' (because I for one didn't have a problem buying mine and I don't suppose I'm in the minority), the above are a random list of complaints that could apply to virtually every club in the league.
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suppose so. you just feel it more at your own club, don't you?
fiasco because they went on sale, then stopped, then started again, now you've got people not knowing they're back on sale. Hardly organised is it?
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The general sense is that the club is belatedly dragging itself where it should be. It certainly is on the playing side, so one would imagine that the owners will also get the right people to sort the commercial side. That will certainly be so if come the next Bank Holiday Monday we're once again a Premier League club.
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They stopped when the available stock ran out, then started again when the unclaimed season ticket ones became available.
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Yesterday I took my own and sat on the Holte steps to have a drink. The current places to drink on my way to the ground are;
The Aston Tavern, £3 in and normally packed, difficult to get served.
Holte pub, I'm not a member of the Lions club.
The Holte Suite, by the time I arrive normally a queue.
The Ground, standing inside for an hour before kick off isn't of great appeal.
I think the club are missing a trick, alongside the burger wagon on the Holte car park, why not have a pop up beer wagon, selling just beer by the bottle.
The club could even put some seats around the perimeter of the car park.
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I think the club are missing a trick, alongside the burger wagon on the Holte car park, why not have a pop up beer wagon, selling just beer by the bottle.
The club could even put some seats around the perimeter of the car park.
Fine yesterday. Not so good in January.
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The inside the ground thing is a weird one. They could make the concourses - particularly the Holte and the Trinity a lot more inviting. Tables, stools (these could be bolted down) more screens, better service, music... create a "pub/bar" environment within certain sections of the concourses.
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There's also presumably licensing issues with selling booze outside the ground.
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They seem to have started with that magic fill from the bottom pint thing, in the Lower Holte at least.
That should, hopefully, speed up service a bit.
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I think the club could look into finding another space for the Lions club members. That way, any season ticket holders who turn up and can't get in the Holte Suite could at least have the chance to go over the road to the Holte Pub.
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The inside the ground thing is a weird one. They could make the concourses - particularly the Holte and the Trinity a lot more inviting. Tables, stools (these could be bolted down) more screens, better service, music... create a "pub/bar" environment within certain sections of the concourses.
You can't obstruct potential evacuation routes.
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I think the club are missing a trick, alongside the burger wagon on the Holte car park, why not have a pop up beer wagon, selling just beer by the bottle.
The club could even put some seats around the perimeter of the car park.
Fine yesterday. Not so good in January.
Plenty of pubs have "temporary" structures outside with heaters. It certainly wouldn't be everyone's idea of fun, but I think there would be a market for it.
I'd certainly consider it. For years we have drunk in pubs a couple of miles away from the ground then parked-up and got into our seats about a minute before kick-off. However, parking has become so difficult that you have to arrive at least an hour before the kick-off to get a space. Which means a lot of hanging around, neither the Holte Suite or the Holte Pub are great, but if you could go inside the ground and have a decent experience then we'd do it. And spend money with the club.
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The inside the ground thing is a weird one. They could make the concourses - particularly the Holte and the Trinity a lot more inviting. Tables, stools (these could be bolted down) more screens, better service, music... create a "pub/bar" environment within certain sections of the concourses.
You can't obstruct potential evacuation routes.
In the away end at Leeds, they have a pub style room. I'm not sure that would work in the Holte the way it's laid out though.
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I think the club are missing a trick, alongside the burger wagon on the Holte car park, why not have a pop up beer wagon, selling just beer by the bottle.
The club could even put some seats around the perimeter of the car park.
Fine yesterday. Not so good in January.
Plenty of pubs have "temporary" structures outside with heaters. It certainly wouldn't be everyone's idea of fun, but I think there would be a market for it.
I'd certainly consider it. For years we have drunk in pubs a couple of miles away from the ground then parked-up and got into our seats about a minute before kick-off. However, parking has become so difficult that you have to arrive at least an hour before the kick-off to get a space. Which means a lot of hanging around, neither the Holte Suite or the Holte Pub are great, but if you could go inside the ground and have a decent experience then we'd do it. And spend money with the club.
It's a car park. It's needed for corporates and as I said last week, parking is one of the biggest problems we have and the council aren't going to let us lose a single space.
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The inside the ground thing is a weird one. They could make the concourses - particularly the Holte and the Trinity a lot more inviting. Tables, stools (these could be bolted down) more screens, better service, music... create a "pub/bar" environment within certain sections of the concourses.
You can't obstruct potential evacuation routes.
Indeed, it would need to be designed well, but plenty of places manage with much smaller exits than the doors at Villa Park, such as gig venues, big night clubs let alone the big American stadiums etc etc.
Even Warwickshire have tried it - the one areas has a stage, live music, standing tables etc...
I agree the club are missing a trick and there must be some suitable ideas trial.
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There's also a bar in the old Stumps (or there used to be). I'm not sure if you need to be a season ticket holder to get into there though.
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The inside the ground thing is a weird one. They could make the concourses - particularly the Holte and the Trinity a lot more inviting. Tables, stools (these could be bolted down) more screens, better service, music... create a "pub/bar" environment within certain sections of the concourses.
You can't obstruct potential evacuation routes.
Indeed, it would need to be designed well, but plenty of places manage with much smaller exits than the doors at Villa Park, such as gig venues, big night clubs let alone the big American stadiums etc etc.
Even Warwickshire have tried it - the one areas has a stage, live music, standing tables etc...
I agree the club are missing a trick and there must be some suitable ideas trial.
It's not the doors that's the problem, it's the stuff between your seat and getting out. You can guarantee that every one of the places you mention will have unimpeded access from the viewing areas to the exits. The big problem, as we've been saying for a long while, is that the concourse areas are too cramped and there's not much room for expansion.
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I think the club are missing a trick, alongside the burger wagon on the Holte car park, why not have a pop up beer wagon, selling just beer by the bottle.
The club could even put some seats around the perimeter of the car park.
Fine yesterday. Not so good in January.
point taken
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The Ramsay's bar in the upper Holte maybe could have something done to it to make it appealing for people to pop into the ground for a pre-match beer.
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The inside the ground thing is a weird one. They could make the concourses - particularly the Holte and the Trinity a lot more inviting. Tables, stools (these could be bolted down) more screens, better service, music... create a "pub/bar" environment within certain sections of the concourses.
You can't obstruct potential evacuation routes.
Indeed, it would need to be designed well, but plenty of places manage with much smaller exits than the doors at Villa Park, such as gig venues, big night clubs let alone the big American stadiums etc etc.
Even Warwickshire have tried it - the one areas has a stage, live music, standing tables etc...
I agree the club are missing a trick and there must be some suitable ideas trial.
It's not the doors that's the problem, it's the stuff between your seat and getting out. You can guarantee that every one of the places you mention will have unimpeded access from the viewing areas to the exits. The big problem, as we've been saying for a long while, is that the concourse areas are too cramped and there's not much room for expansion.
How do Leeds get away with it, 10 minutes queuing to leave my seat to get out of the stand, same last year as well, if something happened it would be carnage
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How do Leeds get away with it, 10 minutes queuing to leave my seat to get out of the stand, same last year as well, if something happened it would be carnage
Without having been there lately I don't know, but I would guess that evacuating onto the pitch is an option and they may have extra emergency doors.
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The inside the ground thing is a weird one. They could make the concourses - particularly the Holte and the Trinity a lot more inviting. Tables, stools (these could be bolted down) more screens, better service, music... create a "pub/bar" environment within certain sections of the concourses.
You can't obstruct potential evacuation routes.
Indeed, it would need to be designed well, but plenty of places manage with much smaller exits than the doors at Villa Park, such as gig venues, big night clubs let alone the big American stadiums etc etc.
Even Warwickshire have tried it - the one areas has a stage, live music, standing tables etc...
I agree the club are missing a trick and there must be some suitable ideas trial.
It's not the doors that's the problem, it's the stuff between your seat and getting out. You can guarantee that every one of the places you mention will have unimpeded access from the viewing areas to the exits. The big problem, as we've been saying for a long while, is that the concourse areas are too cramped and there's not much room for expansion.
I'm sure something could be done in the Holte and pathways to the doors could be kept free. The outside marquee could be an option on the other side of the ground.
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I'd forgotten about the "Peaky Blinders" bar at the NIA too. Admittedly it's small, but very much the pub type bar, within a bland concert venue.
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There's no room inside the stands to do anything other than what's already there. Tables and chairs? If you're in even the smallest of groups, it's hard to find somewhere to stand as it is. UT yesterday, looking around in the concourse it was impossible to discern between people who had been served, people waiting to be served, and people waiting for someone else to come back from being served. The only way to get any elbow room is to stand around the top the stairs. And to achieve this level of comfort and space, they had to build literally over a road.
It's not that much better in the lower Holte, you've still got the refreshment kiosks right by the toilets right by the stand access points. As for outside, as dw says, the weather is likely to be cold and/or wet for a good two-thirds of a football season. Even yesterday, I wouldn't have bet against it pissing down at a moment's notice.
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Yesterday I took my own and sat on the Holte steps to have a drink. The current places to drink on my way to the ground are;
The Aston Tavern, £3 in and normally packed, difficult to get served.
Holte pub, I'm not a member of the Lions club.
The Holte Suite, by the time I arrive normally a queue.
The Ground, standing inside for an hour before kick off isn't of great appeal.
I think the club are missing a trick, alongside the burger wagon on the Holte car park, why not have a pop up beer wagon, selling just beer by the bottle.
The club could even put some seats around the perimeter of the car park.
There's also the Aston Social. I've not been in there for years so I've no idea what it's like on a match day now. You also have a Wetherspoons in Perry Barr which is a 2 minute train journey away or get there a bit earlier if possible and avoid the queue for the Holte Suite.
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I think the club are missing a trick, alongside the burger wagon on the Holte car park, why not have a pop up beer wagon, selling just beer by the bottle.
The club could even put some seats around the perimeter of the car park.
Fine yesterday. Not so good in January.
Plenty of pubs have "temporary" structures outside with heaters. It certainly wouldn't be everyone's idea of fun, but I think there would be a market for it.
I'd certainly consider it. For years we have drunk in pubs a couple of miles away from the ground then parked-up and got into our seats about a minute before kick-off. However, parking has become so difficult that you have to arrive at least an hour before the kick-off to get a space. Which means a lot of hanging around, neither the Holte Suite or the Holte Pub are great, but if you could go inside the ground and have a decent experience then we'd do it. And spend money with the club.
It's a car park. It's needed for corporates and as I said last week, parking is one of the biggest problems we have and the council aren't going to let us lose a single space.
With way Holte is raised from ground level an underground car park would've made sense just beyond the Holte Pub. Would've given more space for a fan zone in the area where the car park is.
If/when North is finally done I'm sure that will be part of the design as it is at likes of Chelsea, Arsenal and I presume Spurs.
Was in the Upper Trinity yesterday right at the top. No problem with the sightlines but again ridiculous queues at half time and with it being a sell out it felt pretty cramped as the leg room isn't great.
North Stand has excuse it's 40 years old, from not being fussed about New Trinity it really should've been built better and that's without the obvious of the beautiful facade just being destroyed.
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I'm sure something could be done in the Holte and pathways to the doors could be kept free. The outside marquee could be an option on the other side of the ground.
The whole area is a route to the exits. They had the same problem a few years ago when they wanted to put temporary food outlets in the Trinity Lower.
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With some thought (and maybe some investment in layout and facilities) I'm pretty confident that there are ways the experience inside the ground could be improved and ultimately earn the club more money. There are lots of examples at other sports and venues stadiums that have the same safety issues as Villa Park.
I think we are missing a trick, it just requires some initiative.
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What would Frederick Rinder do?
Quite possibly the same as Spurs and rebuild Villa Park as the greatest football stadium on the planet.
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What is the deal with the Holte Pub now. Is it open on match days? Over 20 years as a ST holder and not had a single invite to see it. I think they used to invite ST holders?
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What is the deal with the Holte Pub now. Is it open on match days? Over 20 years as a ST holder and not had a single invite to see it. I think they used to invite ST holders?
It's for Lions Club members now. You can normally walk in after the game though.
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I think the club are missing a trick, alongside the burger wagon on the Holte car park, why not have a pop up beer wagon, selling just beer by the bottle.
The club could even put some seats around the perimeter of the car park.
Fine yesterday. Not so good in January.
Plenty of pubs have "temporary" structures outside with heaters. It certainly wouldn't be everyone's idea of fun, but I think there would be a market for it.
I'd certainly consider it. For years we have drunk in pubs a couple of miles away from the ground then parked-up and got into our seats about a minute before kick-off. However, parking has become so difficult that you have to arrive at least an hour before the kick-off to get a space. Which means a lot of hanging around, neither the Holte Suite or the Holte Pub are great, but if you could go inside the ground and have a decent experience then we'd do it. And spend money with the club.
It's a car park. It's needed for corporates and as I said last week, parking is one of the biggest problems we have and the council aren't going to let us lose a single space.
There's a movement towards specifying a maximum number of car parking spaces allowed, rather than minimum, certainly over here so probably similar in the uk, so in the long run this might not be a problem long term.
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What is the deal with the Holte Pub now. Is it open on match days? Over 20 years as a ST holder and not had a single invite to see it. I think they used to invite ST holders?
It's for Lions Club members now. You can normally walk in after the game though.
What happened to the David Targett Suite Lions used to have?
Edit: https://www.avfc.co.uk/News/2018/09/19/community-project-to-transform-villa-park-suite
Sounds great, but not the best use of space at the ground surely?
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What if we had the option of, for example, a new stadium with facilities like the new Spurs one, on the site of the wholesale markets in the city centre? What if we rebuilt Villa Park on the current location? The transport links to Aston are piss poor, what can be done to improve that?
I have always been firmly of the belief we should only ever play our games where we currently are, but now, if it becomes a question of competing or not, I am not too sure.
At the mo, the ground is in the narrow end of the Trinity Road/Witton Lane "wedge". As it's not my money, how's about, flatten the lot. Everything from The Holte beer garden to the back of the shop, Academy shed, the lot. Then, move the pitch 100 yards towards Witton, and rebuild round that. Stick the club shop and ticket office Holte end instead.
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...
What if we had the option of, for example, a new stadium with facilities like the new Spurs one, on the site of the wholesale markets in the city centre? What if we rebuilt Villa Park on the current location? The transport links to Aston are piss poor, what can be done to improve that?
I have always been firmly of the belief we should only ever play our games where we currently are, but now, if it becomes a question of competing or not, I am not too sure.
At the mo, the ground is in the narrow end of the Trinity Road/Witton Lane "wedge". As it's not my money, how's about, flatten the lot. Everything from The Holte beer garden to the back of the shop, Academy shed, the lot. Then, move the pitch 100 yards towards Witton, and rebuild round that. Stick the club shop and ticket office Holte end instead.
This made sense to me until I looked at Google maps - it would still be incredibly tight.
What also stands out is just how small a space they managed to squeeze the Witton stand into. Obviously it pays for it with ridiculously poor facilities and an upper concourse tighter than a gnats chuff, but they did well to get that many seats in such a tight spot.
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How do Leeds get away with it, 10 minutes queuing to leave my seat to get out of the stand, same last year as well, if something happened it would be carnage
Without having been there lately I don't know, but I would guess that evacuating onto the pitch is an option and they may have extra emergency doors.
They have outside catering areas, so the concourses at half time aren't nearly as crowded. Obviously Elland Road isn't in the middle of a residential area, so they're a lot less constrained than we are. I've been there twice this season in the home end, and both times getting served at half time was an absolute breeze. There's also the fact there though, that three of the stands are small and shit, so it's only the big one that they need to worry about, and as I say, that's helped by having the outside areas.
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What would Frederick Rinder do?
Quite possibly the same as Spurs and rebuild Villa Park as the greatest football stadium on the planet.
This is the way to approach things.
I hate the thought of ever leaving Villa Park, but if it hampers ambition then the club back then wouldn't have thought twice.
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Tales from the Upper Trinity today...
Pre-match, in the queue. Shuffling along, get to the counter.
"Two coffees, a Coke and a Heineken, please.
"Sorry, we've got no hot water. You'll have to go to the other counter".
Honestly, a handwritten piece of A4 sellotaped on the front above the queueing masses informing people of this would've sufficed.
Half time, my brother takes his boy down to get chips. Queues up again, missed the first ten minutes of the second half. Orders the chips. "Cash only, the card machines aren't working". Again, absolutely fuck all to let you know of this til you're actually being served.
And while I'm venting, have this an' all. When he went to get our tickets for today, he came out through the club shop. There, on racks, were these tee-shirts they've had made for the play-offs.
"How much are these, mate?
"They're not for sale. They're not officially launched til tomorrow.
"But I'm here now. I have money.
"Sorry, you'll have to come back."
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Sounds about right.
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Shocking stuff - no way to run a business
I am Sure the owners would be less than pleased if they were made aware of such abysmal " customer service"
The bit about not selling t shirts today was ridiculous
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Hopefully given time it will improve. The service for me is just too slow and contributes to the lack of space in the concourse.
I’m in the Witton Lane but at half time it’s near impossible to get anything and get back for the 2nd half to your seat so even if you don’t want an alcoholic drink it’s a non starter unless you leave your seat on 40 minutes.
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Massive queues to get in as well today. No idea what caused the holdup.
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Massive queues to get in as well today. No idea what caused the holdup.
Extra searches and routing fans around certain roads?
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Please write to the owners/ CEO
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Massive queues to get in as well today. No idea what caused the holdup.
They've been frisking everyone before they get to the turnstiles at the Trinity Road for the last several months.
They're the world's least convincing security guards - I have never, ever seen any asked what something is. I take a bottle of water (with top on which is a no-no) every week, and have never been asked what it is during the pointless frisk.
The queue to get through was massive today.
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Was it this fella?
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Was it this fella?
Pretty similar!
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Cash only in the Holte Suite. Welcome to the 1960s here at Villa Park.
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Massive queues to get in as well today. No idea what caused the holdup.
They've been frisking everyone before they get to the turnstiles at the Trinity Road for the last several months.
They're the world's least convincing security guards - I have never, ever seen any asked what something is. I take a bottle of water (with top on which is a no-no) every week, and have never been asked what it is during the pointless frisk.
The queue to get through was massive today.
Truly pointless innit. I had a bag, opened to top zip to reveal my jacket, he didn't even have the slightest rummage. I'm not the most naturally suspicious looking character but I could have had anything in there.
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The searches are totally pointless. As for taking bottle tops off 6 years olds...
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Cash only in the Holte Suite. Welcome to the 1960s here at Villa Park.
Card only at Edgbaston apart from the members' areas. Don't know which is is worse, to be honest.
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I must admit to laughing while queuing to get in. The bloke in front of me said who is going to give the steward the biggest hug?
Then as he stood there with his arms spread waiting to be frisked he threw them around the steward and hugged the bloke for dear life.
The steward hugged him back while pissing himself laughing.
Little things make life better.
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I must admit to laughing while queuing to get in. The bloke in front of me said who is going to give the steward the biggest hug?
Then as he stood there with his arms spread waiting to be frisked he threw them around the steward and hugged the bloke for dear life.
The steward hugged him back while pissing himself laughing.
Little things make life better.
I knew a chap that pulled a stunt like that on the Northern Line just south of Highgate. Prosecuted for frottage and sent to Belmarsh.
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Cash only in the Holte Suite. Welcome to the 1960s here at Villa Park.
Same in the Holte pub after. There was a homemade A4 note by the door advising of this but not everyone noticed this. The young couple in front of me queued for ages before ordering 4 pints between them, only to discover it was cash only, when they needed to pay by card.
A very generous man next to them overheard and paid for their drinks too!
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I'm not sure why some people take just their card out with them. Surely its best to carry cash and use your card if you run out?
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As for taking bottle tops off 6 years olds...
This has been a bugbear of mine for sometime now, however we’ve now cracked it. The stewards don’t frisk children so my lad removes his bottle top, puts it in his pocket and carries the drink in through the turnstiles. Once through, he puts the lid back on the bottle. We then walk up the steps, high fiving each other.
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I'm not sure why some people take just their card out with them. Surely its best to carry cash and use your card if you run out?
Card much faster though for all concerned surely. No messing with change and having to count it!
I rarely carry cash these days anymore.
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I'm not sure why some people take just their card out with them. Surely its best to carry cash and use your card if you run out?
Card much faster though for all concerned surely. No messing with change and having to count it!
I rarely carry cash these days anymore.
aye. I go places that don’t take cash anymore. Know folk who just carry their phone with a payment system.
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I'm not sure why some people take just their card out with them. Surely its best to carry cash and use your card if you run out?
Card much faster though for all concerned surely. No messing with change and having to count it!
I rarely carry cash these days anymore.
aye. I go places that don’t take cash anymore. Know folk who just carry their phone with a payment system.
Me. I carry an emergency card if I remember, cos there's always somewhere that still thinks it's 2015.
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Once the cashless society is fully in place the handcuffs are on all of us.:-(
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If the cylons start getting their act together, I'll have a rethink.
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As for taking bottle tops off 6 years olds...
This has been a bugbear of mine for sometime now, however we’ve now cracked it. The stewards don’t frisk children so my lad removes his bottle top, puts it in his pocket and carries the drink in through the turnstiles. Once through, he puts the lid back on the bottle. We then walk up the steps, high fiving each other.
And that just shows how pointless the searches are. I also think it’s a sales ploy, at wembley they made us empty out the bottles too.
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Can't remember the last time I went to a cash machine.
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Same here. I can't understand why - for example - my mate who runs a micropub, doesn't have a card machine.
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Pravda has just announced Purity Brewing as official supplier (https://www.avfc.co.uk/News/2019/08/14/purity-brewing-announced-as-official-supplier?view=amp&__twitter_impression=true)
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“Working with Aston Villa & Villa Park is testament to the ongoing success of our original mission when we started, which is to brew great beer without prejudice, with a conscience and with a consistency and an attention to detail, which is second to none.”
Beer without prejudice and with a conscience? I really have got to read more company mission statements as I was totally unaware such magic existed.
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“Working with Aston Villa & Villa Park is testament to the ongoing success of our original mission when we started, which is to brew great beer without prejudice, with a conscience and with a consistency and an attention to detail, which is second to none.”
Beer without prejudice and with a conscience? I really have got to read more company mission statements as I was totally unaware such magic existed.
Yes it’s total bollocks
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Interesting the accounts I've read of fans who went to Spurs new ground, obviously one of the best stadiums around now but seems concourses are still tight and queues to get served at half time.
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As for taking bottle tops off 6 years olds...
This has been a bugbear of mine for sometime now, however we’ve now cracked it. The stewards don’t frisk children so my lad removes his bottle top, puts it in his pocket and carries the drink in through the turnstiles. Once through, he puts the lid back on the bottle. We then walk up the steps, high fiving each other.
And that just shows how pointless the searches are. I also think it’s a sales ploy, at wembley they made us empty out the bottles too.
My understanding of the bottle tips having spoken with someone in H&S for the FA is to eliminate trip hazards in an emergency situation. I.e. if dropped in a rush to get out the ground they are crushed underfoot rather than hazard on stairs that could lead to a fall and further crushing
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Interesting the accounts I've read of fans who went to Spurs new ground, obviously one of the best stadiums around now but seems concourses are still tight and queues to get served at half time.
Away fans always get the worst facilities because no clubs give a shit about them. Although I didn’t think Spurs was bad last week, I’d imagine that home fans enjoy a much better “match day experience “
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Purity have also commissioned an exclusive Pale Ale to mark the club’s return to the Premier League, which fans will also be able to enjoy at Villa Park.
"Pint of 'Pale ale allez allez!' please mate!"
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“Working with Aston Villa & Villa Park is testament to the ongoing success of our original mission when we started, which is to brew great beer without prejudice, with a conscience and with a consistency and an attention to detail, which is second to none.”
Beer without prejudice and with a conscience? I really have got to read more company mission statements as I was totally unaware such magic existed.
Yes it’s total bollocks
It's good bollocks. I always look for a beer with a conscience, a beer with it's own mind, a living beer, a beer for the many not the few....
Then I look at the purity website and I think "Oh do fuck off"
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“Working with Aston Villa & Villa Park is testament to the ongoing success of our original mission when we started, which is to brew great beer without prejudice, with a conscience and with a consistency and an attention to detail, which is second to none.”
Beer without prejudice and with a conscience? I really have got to read more company mission statements as I was totally unaware such magic existed.
Yes it’s total bollocks
It's good bollocks. I always look for a beer with a conscience, a beer with it's own mind, a living beer, a beer for the many not the few....
Then I look at the purity website and I think "Oh do fuck off"
Quite, but they do sell some decent beer which will be the first time in living memory at Villa Park.
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I'll definitely give that pale ale a whirl on Saturday.
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Pleased about this. Their Session IPA is my beer of choice at the moment. More than £6/ pint in my local mind, so my consumption has gone down.
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“Working with Aston Villa & Villa Park is testament to the ongoing success of our original mission when we started, which is to brew great beer without prejudice, with a conscience and with a consistency and an attention to detail, which is second to none.”
Beer without prejudice and with a conscience? I really have got to read more company mission statements as I was totally unaware such magic existed.
Yes it’s total bollocks
It's good bollocks. I always look for a beer with a conscience, a beer with it's own mind, a living beer, a beer for the many not the few....
Then I look at the purity website and I think "Oh do fuck off"
Quite, but they do sell some decent beer which will be the first time in living memory at Villa Park.
I'm with you on that Chris. Decent beer is exactly what it is.
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Do they not know that no Villa fan drinks lager. Having travelled a long way from our stately homes in the shires to get to Villa Park we like a good malt whisky or glass of port pre match and at half time.
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But can they get it out quickly enough??
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It’s good news. Notwithstanding the marketing mumbo jumbo they are a very decent brewery. Hopefully they’ll have the Lawless larger on which is good too.
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Who the hell suggested having no cash options earlier?! Sacrilege.
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As for taking bottle tops off 6 years olds...
This has been a bugbear of mine for sometime now, however we’ve now cracked it. The stewards don’t frisk children so my lad removes his bottle top, puts it in his pocket and carries the drink in through the turnstiles. Once through, he puts the lid back on the bottle. We then walk up the steps, high fiving each other.
And that just shows how pointless the searches are. I also think it’s a sales ploy, at wembley they made us empty out the bottles too.
My understanding of the bottle tips having spoken with someone in H&S for the FA is to eliminate trip hazards in an emergency situation. I.e. if dropped in a rush to get out the ground they are crushed underfoot rather than hazard on stairs that could lead to a fall and further crushing
I always thought it was to stop fans filling them with water then putting the top on and throwing it at the away fans
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As for taking bottle tops off 6 years olds...
This has been a bugbear of mine for sometime now, however we’ve now cracked it. The stewards don’t frisk children so my lad removes his bottle top, puts it in his pocket and carries the drink in through the turnstiles. Once through, he puts the lid back on the bottle. We then walk up the steps, high fiving each other.
And that just shows how pointless the searches are. I also think it’s a sales ploy, at wembley they made us empty out the bottles too.
My understanding of the bottle tips having spoken with someone in H&S for the FA is to eliminate trip hazards in an emergency situation. I.e. if dropped in a rush to get out the ground they are crushed underfoot rather than hazard on stairs that could lead to a fall and further crushing
I always thought it was to stop fans filling them with water then putting the top on and throwing it at the away fans
You don't need the top on for that.
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“Working with Aston Villa & Villa Park is testament to the ongoing success of our original mission when we started, which is to brew great beer without prejudice, with a conscience and with a consistency and an attention to detail, which is second to none.”
Beer without prejudice and with a conscience? I really have got to read more company mission statements as I was totally unaware such magic existed.
Yes it’s total bollocks
It's good bollocks. I always look for a beer with a conscience, a beer with it's own mind, a living beer, a beer for the many not the few....
Then I look at the purity website and I think "Oh do fuck off"
My only question is
"How many of these do I need to fall over"
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Great to see us supporting a local company in Purity.
Very expensive in City Centre so be interesting to see what prices will be in the ground.
I'll probably stick to Piss Water AKA Fosters
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For what it’s worth, having looked them up, I think they walk their talk, which is important to me as a consumer. Chief question for me is are they vegan (in output not byproduct use), I simply haven’t bought Isinglass refined stuff for years which is a pain but use barnivore.com to check stuff - I’ve emailed them to check if all their products are, certainly a lot are I’m sure all bottled/canned but it’s draft that’s usually the challenge, I think they are though.
More significantly re: their spiel
https://puritybrewing.com/pure-eco/?v=79cba1185463
Sustainability and brewing with a conscience is at the heart of our business.
At Purity we take our responsibility to our environment and local community very seriously. We’ve made some huge strides for a small company but we are determined to continue to make a difference.
Our brewery uses the latest heat exchange and steam recapture technology to reduce our energy consumption.
Our spent grain goes to the Longhorn Cattle on the farm as well as going to Brewers Goose. The spent yeast goes to the local pigs and the used hops are used as fertiliser on the farm.
We recycle our waste water by using a natural wetland system. Creating a unique and thriving ecosystem ensuring pure water is going back into the water system.
Canning our beer on site with our own line allows us to reduce beer miles and less fuel being used.
Our testament to sustainability was rewarded on a national level as we won the Insider Made in the UK Sustainable Manufacturer of the Year in 2015 and again in 2016 as Midland’s Sustainable Manufacturer
.
So it’s a big commercial success (rather than failings thread) for me.
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Great to see us supporting a local company in Purity.
Very expensive in City Centre so be interesting to see what prices will be in the ground.
I'll probably stick to Piss Water AKA Fosters
Indeed if I did ever choose to get ripped off, I’d prefer a premium product which from the reviews here at least it is. We are quick to complain about Budweiser etc.
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I think their beer is great (for all that that might be worth), they do genuinely invest to make a positive difference and, if you need another reason, their Founder/MD is a Villa fan.
He also likes egg-chasing, hence previous tie-ups, special beers with/for Wasps. I will be delighted to quaff a few of their beers on Saturday. UTV.
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For what it’s worth, having looked them up, I think they walk their talk, which is important to me as a consumer. Chief question for me is are they vegan (in output not byproduct use), I simply haven’t bought Isinglass refined stuff for years which is a pain but use barnivore.com to check stuff - I’ve emailed them to check if all their products are, certainly a lot are I’m sure all bottled/canned but it’s draft that’s usually the challenge, I think they are though.
More significantly re: their spiel
https://puritybrewing.com/pure-eco/?v=79cba1185463
Sustainability and brewing with a conscience is at the heart of our business.
At Purity we take our responsibility to our environment and local community very seriously. We’ve made some huge strides for a small company but we are determined to continue to make a difference.
Our brewery uses the latest heat exchange and steam recapture technology to reduce our energy consumption.
Our spent grain goes to the Longhorn Cattle on the farm as well as going to Brewers Goose. The spent yeast goes to the local pigs and the used hops are used as fertiliser on the farm.
We recycle our waste water by using a natural wetland system. Creating a unique and thriving ecosystem ensuring pure water is going back into the water system.
Canning our beer on site with our own line allows us to reduce beer miles and less fuel being used.
Our testament to sustainability was rewarded on a national level as we won the Insider Made in the UK Sustainable Manufacturer of the Year in 2015 and again in 2016 as Midland’s Sustainable Manufacturer
.
So it’s a big commercial success (rather than failings thread) for me.
Don't the vast majority of ales/bitters/milds use isinglass?
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Yes, although it's much less common than it used to be with the smaller brewers and craft breweries. But I suspect Purity use in in their main ales.
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For what it’s worth, having looked them up, I think they walk their talk, which is important to me as a consumer. Chief question for me is are they vegan (in output not byproduct use), I simply haven’t bought Isinglass refined stuff for years which is a pain but use barnivore.com to check stuff - I’ve emailed them to check if all their products are, certainly a lot are I’m sure all bottled/canned but it’s draft that’s usually the challenge, I think they are though.
More significantly re: their spiel
https://puritybrewing.com/pure-eco/?v=79cba1185463
Sustainability and brewing with a conscience is at the heart of our business.
At Purity we take our responsibility to our environment and local community very seriously. We’ve made some huge strides for a small company but we are determined to continue to make a difference.
Our brewery uses the latest heat exchange and steam recapture technology to reduce our energy consumption.
Our spent grain goes to the Longhorn Cattle on the farm as well as going to Brewers Goose. The spent yeast goes to the local pigs and the used hops are used as fertiliser on the farm.
We recycle our waste water by using a natural wetland system. Creating a unique and thriving ecosystem ensuring pure water is going back into the water system.
Canning our beer on site with our own line allows us to reduce beer miles and less fuel being used.
Our testament to sustainability was rewarded on a national level as we won the Insider Made in the UK Sustainable Manufacturer of the Year in 2015 and again in 2016 as Midland’s Sustainable Manufacturer
.
So it’s a big commercial success (rather than failings thread) for me.
Don't the vast majority of ales/bitters/milds use isinglass?
I know home brewers use Irish Moss, also known as Whirlfloc or Protofloc, which is made from seaweed. The biggest problem to veggies/vegans would be the use of gelatine which is added post fermentation to ensure absolute clarity. It would make everything easier and cheaper if we could all accept that it makes no difference whatsoever to the taste or safety of beer. Wheat beer is usually not fined, hence some of your Christmas market beers are will be hazy but taste fine and the latest craft trend is for New England IPA which is deliberately very hazy. Beer that is cloudy because it has gone off is another matter, but one sip of that and you'll know.
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“Working with Aston Villa & Villa Park is testament to the ongoing success of our original mission when we started, which is to brew great beer without prejudice, with a conscience and with a consistency and an attention to detail, which is second to none.”
Beer without prejudice and with a conscience? I really have got to read more company mission statements as I was totally unaware such magic existed.
Yes it’s total bollocks
It's good bollocks. I always look for a beer with a conscience, a beer with it's own mind, a living beer, a beer for the many not the few....
Then I look at the purity website and I think "Oh do fuck off"
Quite, but they do sell some decent beer which will be the first time in living memory at Villa Park.
I'm with you on that Chris. Decent beer is exactly what it is.
I've been racking my brains thinking about their mission statement and it's come to me where I've heard similar before..
'The Heartbreak Kid'..... "There is no deceit in the cauliflower" 5 minutes in. Added bonus, it features Cybil Shepard in her prime.
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Happy with this, like a few others I'm a fan of their beers. I've been to wasps a couple of times in the last year or 2 and they have a few purity bars (I've got one of their plastic glasses on my desk right now) which do much better beer than most stadiums.
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https://mobile.twitter.com/robbigee/status/1161584264921735168
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I did the Purity tour on Saturday with my Dad and it was very good. The brewery is by Alcester which about 5 mile away from me in Redditch and it worth a few hours of your time. Especially as you get loads of samples during the day. Their lighter stuff is very nice indeed.
They said on Saturday that they were making a special announcement on Wednesday but I never thought it'll involve the Villa.
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“Working with Aston Villa & Villa Park is testament to the ongoing success of our original mission when we started, which is to brew great beer without prejudice, with a conscience and with a consistency and an attention to detail, which is second to none.”
Beer without prejudice and with a conscience? I really have got to read more company mission statements as I was totally unaware such magic existed.
Theres a movement amongst ale prodicers to stop the sale of sexist based products in pubs and bars. Perhaps a reference to that?
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Forgot that we did the Purity brewery tour a good few years back now, suspect more to it now ! But anyhow this is fine news ! Good beer at VP maybe anything is possible !
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(https://i.ibb.co/Trz70DT/EB60t09-XUAAmc-Q.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Trz70DT)
private image upload (https://imgbb.com/)
bottles are quite popular on twitter...
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Do they do a lager too or just ales?
I wonder if we’ll see pop up stands on the concourses to assist with the queues at usual outlets.
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Do they do a lager too or just ales?
I wonder if we’ll see pop up stands on the concourses to assist with the queues at usual outlets.
They do a lager called lawless and it's pretty good. I think I've seen another one as well but can't remember the name and haven't tried it. Their Mad Goose and Pure Ubu are lovely ales though, and well worth a try.
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Do they do a lager too or just ales?
I wonder if we’ll see pop up stands on the concourses to assist with the queues at usual outlets.
That would be good. Fulham used to have people walking around behind the away end with backpacks like astronauts. They only sold bottled Carlsberg, mind.
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Lawless is very drinkable ( Lot's of the newer " Lagers" are) Pure Helles is a German style Lager they ( Purity) do but I haven't tried that.
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I like a pint of Ubu myself.
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I’d be up for trying either of those lagers...has to be better than the Fosters or Heineken piss they have on tap.
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Oh for the good old days of Ansells Bitter, Mild and Davenports delivered to your door :)
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Oh for the good old days of Ansells Bitter, Mild and Davenports delivered to your door :)
Or if you were younger, you could also get pop delivered.
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Oh for the good old days of Ansells Bitter, Mild and Davenports delivered to your door :)
Or if you were younger, you could also get pop delivered.
Corona or Alpine pop if I remember
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I remember Corona, Alpine sounds familiar. Not a dyed in the wool things were better in the old days advocate by any means, it feels like we did more recycling back then, ie, refundable deposits for bottles.
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I remember Corona, Alpine sounds familiar. Not a dyed in the wool things were better in the old days advocate by any means, it feels like we did more recycling back then, ie, refundable deposits for bottles.
Masons pop on a Friday. Horse of the year followed by Budgie and a bottle of dandelion and burdock, or American Cream Soda.
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I remember Corona, Alpine sounds familiar. Not a dyed in the wool things were better in the old days advocate by any means, it feels like we did more recycling back then, ie, refundable deposits for bottles.
Horse of the year followed by Budgie and a bottle of dandelion and burdock
Somewhere Pete Doherty is drooling about a cocktail like that.
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Ifor the bread man, sliced white, the only options being thickness.
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I remember Corona, Alpine sounds familiar. Not a dyed in the wool things were better in the old days advocate by any means, it feels like we did more recycling back then, ie, refundable deposits for bottles.
Horse of the year followed by Budgie and a bottle of dandelion and burdock
Somewhere Pete Doherty is drooling about a cocktail like that.
Last night, he was playing in Torreilles, a village not far from me.
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I remember Corona, Alpine sounds familiar. Not a dyed in the wool things were better in the old days advocate by any means, it feels like we did more recycling back then, ie, refundable deposits for bottles.
Horse of the year followed by Budgie and a bottle of dandelion and burdock
Somewhere Pete Doherty is drooling about a cocktail like that.
hahaha
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Beer at home means Davenports,
That’s the beer, lots of cheer.
The finest malts with hops and yeast,
Turns a snack into a feast.
Straight from brewery to your home,
Why collect, we’ll deliver,
Soon you’ll know why folks all say,
Beer at home means Davenports.
For those of a certain age- that’s today’s musical ear worm for you.
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Beer at home means Davenports,
That’s the beer, lots of cheer.
The finest malts with hops and yeast,
Turns a snack into a feast.
Straight from brewery to your home,
Why collect, we’ll deliver,
Soon you’ll know why folks all say,
Beer at home means Davenports.
For those of a certain age- that’s today’s musical ear worm for you.
Ha, I remember those adverts, here are a few more, knock yourselves out http://www.davenports.co.uk/about-us/vintage-tv-ads/
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Beer at home means Davenports,
That’s the beer, lots of cheer.
The finest malts with hops and yeast,
Turns a snack into a feast.
Straight from brewery to your home,
Why collect, we’ll deliver,
Soon you’ll know why folks all say,
Beer at home means Davenports.
For those of a certain age- that’s today’s musical ear worm for you.
I remember the first "interactive" TV advert being a Davenports ad which was an old fella jumping up and down and yelling "THATS IT! IT'S OVER! WE'VE DONE IT!!!" and running into the pub. At least I *think* it was a Davenports ad - Like the old fella in the advert I was kind of distracted celebrating our European Cup win at the time :D
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From what I remember he was sat in an armchair with a dog lying on the floor next to him and then he says that and also something like "let's go to the pub" and him and the dog stand up. Been a long time since i've seen but we taped the final and so whenever I used to watch it I watched the advert as well.
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The Bulls head at the top of Bishopsgate street is an old Davenports pub and it still has several old adverts around the place. Great food and really nice pub away from the madness of Broad street
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Beer at home means Davenports,
That’s the beer, lots of cheer.
The finest malts with hops and yeast,
Turns a snack into a feast.
Straight from brewery to your home,
Why collect, we’ll deliver,
Soon you’ll know why folks all say,
Beer at home means Davenports.
For those of a certain age- that’s today’s musical ear worm for you.
Spring, Spring, Spring, Spring,
Spring, Spring, Spring, Spring,
Oh lovely Springfield, what a wonderful brew
A pint for me, a pint for you...
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Beer at home means Davenports,
That’s the beer, lots of cheer.
The finest malts with hops and yeast,
Turns a snack into a feast.
Straight from brewery to your home,
Why collect, we’ll deliver,
Soon you’ll know why folks all say,
Beer at home means Davenports.
For those of a certain age- that’s today’s musical ear worm for you.
I remember the first "interactive" TV advert being a Davenports ad which was an old fella jumping up and down and yelling "THATS IT! IT'S OVER! WE'VE DONE IT!!!" and running into the pub. At least I *think* it was a Davenports ad - Like the old fella in the advert I was kind of distracted celebrating our European Cup win at the time :D
In my mind it was just that he got up, turned off the telly, said ‘come on boy’ or something like that and they walked to the pub. The writing then came up, ‘Well done Villa’ I think. I also thought it was M&B.
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I thought it was Ansells.
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Does anybody has constantly have to keep requesting a new password to log in to the website?
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He definitely said something like "we've done it"
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Does anybody has constantly have to keep requesting a new password to log in to the website?
No. Although it does ask if I'm over 18 the whole bloody time.
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I thought it was Ansells.
I think you are right Dave - "Ansells bittermen - you can't beat em "
I'm sure that tag line was used in the advert too
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I imagine Purslows has had a fairly high work load over the summer, but as CEO do we know if all the commercial failings (including merchandise and catering issues) are on his agenda to be addressed? He doesn’t strike me as someone who would let a stone go unturned and wouldn’t turn a blind eye to areas that are costing the club revenue.
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Haven't seen it mentioned on here but we've done a deal with Virgin trains which gets season ticket holders and members 20% off.
Granted it only makes them expensive rather than bend-over-son-and-take-it expensive but still...
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We started that last year I think, although no one knows if it will remain when Virgin stops.
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Do they do a lager too or just ales?
I wonder if we’ll see pop up stands on the concourses to assist with the queues at usual outlets.
That would be good. Fulham used to have people walking around behind the away end with backpacks like astronauts. They only sold bottled Carlsberg, mind.
I have seen that done at Villa Park in/under the North Stand a few years ago.
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Haven't seen it mentioned on here but we've done a deal with Virgin trains which gets season ticket holders and members 20% off.
Granted it only makes them expensive rather than bend-over-son-and-take-it expensive but still...
That’s a great deal :)
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Includes the link you need to use to get the discount
Not sure if this has been posted before or not
https://www.virgintrains.co.uk/avfc
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This one ?
(https://i.ibb.co/ryJcQb1/IMG-1016.jpg) (https://ibb.co/ryJcQb1)
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This one ?
(https://i.ibb.co/ryJcQb1/IMG-1016.jpg) (https://ibb.co/ryJcQb1)
No, that wasn’t the post-European Cup final one.
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Includes the link you need to use to get the discount
Not sure if this has been posted before or not
https://www.virgintrains.co.uk/avfc
that's great. What other offers are there through Pride Membership? I'm trying to log in but it's being a pain in the arse
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Here is another nice old advert.
(https://i.ibb.co/0tjLDcz/Villa.jpg)
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Looks like the catering has been upgraded for this season.
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Here is another nice old advert.
(https://i.ibb.co/0tjLDcz/Villa.jpg)
One of my favourite ads of all time. Looks contemporary.
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I think this was for the Super Cup game.
(https://i.ibb.co/txnHXFh/01a.jpg)
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Looks like all the kiosks have been rebranded, hope the service is better too.
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Out of interest, what time does the ground actually 'open'?
I will be there earlier than usual tomorrow. Tempted to actually try to eat / drink some of this improved fayre.
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Usually around half one i think
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That Nike ad was so evocative, just as they had started to get into football.
Love the type face of the numbers on that shirt.
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Found this earlier and had forgotten how Hummel used the same few templates for teams and just changed the colours.
(https://gotnotgot.files.wordpress.com/2012/04/hummel-kids.jpg)
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Upper shitting Trinity. 35 gone, need the big boys' room anyway, people going out, I join them. Not driving, so decide to get a beer while I'm down there. As my drink finally reaches my hand, the music announcing the return of the players strikes up. I would say it was unbelievable, but it wasn't. Just same old, same old.
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The staffing levels in the Witton are criminally low.
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What happened to the new big screens?
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I can’t be bothered to relay the whole story of what I thought of the “supporter offer” from yesterday but suffice it to say we’ve got a looooong journey to sort out the issues at the club. It’s quite frankly amateurish.
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It really does seem like the experience is down to where you are in the ground. I thought the service in the Holte Lower was absolutely fine, managed to get food and beer with no problem 30 mins before kick off, and then another beer at halftime without having to leave my seat early. Also thought the Pale Ale was a vast improvement on what we’ve had before, had one bottle and one on draft and both were fine!
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Upper shitting Trinity. 35 gone, need the big boys' room anyway, people going out, I join them. Not driving, so decide to get a beer while I'm down there. As my drink finally reaches my hand, the music announcing the return of the players strikes up. I would say it was unbelievable, but it wasn't. Just same old, same old.
It's just terribly designed, just not sure what can be done.
North and Witton have excuses they're older stands and hemmed in. Holte has much more space on concourse. Poor for Upper Trinity though with the stairs up taking half of the space and so it feels very congested when there's a full house up there which will be most games this season.
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The bottle bar in the UT is as big on its own as the rest of the refreshment counters combined.
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What's this card only bollocks in the Witton Upper? Short queues in 4 or 5 lanes for card only, then a long snaking queue for cash payment. Plus, the staff were as slow as ever, so none of the changes made it any different. Still, they now call now call it 'The Founders Bar', so I guess it all great for the brain stormers who came up with that one.
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Lower Holte here: I was quite excited reading about the new catering: turns out you're virtually snookered if you don't want a meat pie, hot dog, unappetizing looking chips, fizzy drinks, Cadbury's chocolate bars (horrible since they sold up) or a bottle of beer.
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35 min wait in the queue for a pint upstairs in Holte Suite post match.
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More beer taps and more staff and they'd double the beer sales. It's money just waiting to be spent.
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Lower Holte here: I was quite excited reading about the new catering: turns out you're virtually snookered if you don't want a meat pie, hot dog, unappetizing looking chips, fizzy drinks, Cadbury's chocolate bars (horrible since they sold up) or a bottle of beer.
Or if you actually do want a bottle of beer as they only had cider left when I queued.
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It's been a couple of months since anyone posted on this. How's things going for people around the ground?
Prior to Saturday (Brighton), the UT concourse had been the same old, same old; chaotic queueing, no organisation, game time missed.
But on Saturday, it was different. Nothing unusual about my timing, got in just after 2.30. However, I was confronted by servers actively asking people if they required serving, then taking their order and payment before handing over their purchase in an expedient manner. It's almost making me consider turning up earlier next time, and not because of the old reason of that's how ridiculously long it takes to get a coffee.
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I went to the Club Shop on Saturday and I've never seen anywhere so busy. They must make thousands on match days, absolutely eye opening.
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Where is my Welcome Pack?
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That Chicken Shack thing is such an expensive thing. I had a halloumi wrap and a bag of crisps - £7.50 for goodness sake. What a rip.
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That Chicken Shack thing is such an expensive thing. I had a halloumi wrap and a bag of crisps - £7.50 for goodness sake. What a rip.
That's the one concern I have - once the novelty wears off are enough people going to want to spent the best part of ten quid to stand on Trinity Road every match?
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You're right. For all the different (but not that different really) options and the piss that is Purity, you go forwards extorting money from your customers, you lose them.
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You're right. For all the different (but not that different really) options and the piss that is Purity, you go forwards extorting money from your customers, you lose them.
Purity isn't piss, though. Certainly not by comparison with what we've had before.
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I had a pint of Purity pre match, it had improved immeasurably to be drinkable
Progress
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Have we changed our Pie suppliers? I had a Chicken & Mushroom today and it was awful
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Wes made them.
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You're right. For all the different (but not that different really) options and the piss that is Purity, you go forwards extorting money from your customers, you lose them.
Purity isn't piss, though. Certainly not by comparison with what we've had before.
It was when I tried it at the Bournemouth and Burnley games, if it's improved I'll give it another go as in a decent pub it's a lovely drop.