Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: kippaxvilla2 on May 30, 2018, 07:16:22 PM
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I know that all the Villa fans experienced a very frustrating and disappointing Play-Off Final last Saturday. After seeing many Villa supporters on Twitter hoping that I can publish a statement as soon as possible, I feel like it would be best for me to write the following words when I am relatively calm.
I care as much about this club as anyone. Even though I am back in Beijing, I still can't recover from our game at Wembley. The emotion needs time to heal. However, I know that all our management staff, coaches, players and myself need to get back on our feet and prepare to fight again. Like everyone else, I'm delighted to see that under Steve’s management this season, we demonstrated character and unity. We fought like a team. Indeed, the loss is a pity, but we know how much effort and hard work our coaching staff and players put in this season. I want to thank Steve from the bottom of my heart, particularly for his remarkable level of professional focus despite losing his parents this year. With that, I would like to say thank you to Steve and his coaching staff once again for leading the team forward wholeheartedly throughout the season.
We are all aware that we will face severe FFP challenges next season. I am an Aston Villa fan. But I am also a businessman. Under the current circumstances, I think the club needs to rethink not only the past two years but also the past ten years. Villa needs to be a sustainable football club. People join. People leave. That is the cycle of football. But the football club always remains through it all. This is the ultimate reality that cannot be changed, but I can assure you that everyone behind the scenes is working tirelessly towards achieving our ultimate goal.
We have been heavily investing for the past two seasons. However, the loss on Saturday means that we need to change a lot of things. No one wanted to see the club have to go through this, but I believe that only changes can help the club to progress towards the positive direction and this requires the joint efforts of everyone associated with this great football club. No matter what the changes will be, I sincerely hope that everyone can unite and overcome the challenges together. Our goal has not changed and as long as we believe, regardless of how tough the process will be, I am sure we will succeed in the end.
Thank you very much once again for all your support.
Chairman
Dr Tony Xia
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Your watch needs a service mate.
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Are you Steve Hollis in disguise?
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All radiators to be switched off until December?
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I read the statement as saying "I haven't got a clue what we're going to do now, but whatever it is, it'll have to cost less than a two week-old Greggs pastie".
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Goodbye Villa Park hello Marks and Spencer Knickers Fundrome.
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I read it as "All your fates are belong to Bruce."
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I might have had a smidgeon of respect for that statement if it contained some passing reference to his own culpability for allowing so much of his money to be pissed up in the air. Those responsible for failure are his employees after all.
The hole in the bottom of our boat is McCormack-Hogan shaped.
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That reads like a prelude to the manager’s departure.
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Not one mention of the Champions League.
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Sounds like thank you Steve and best of luck.
Sounds like we cut our cloth accordingly. He can't say a lot and invariably that always draws criticism which doesn't seem particularly justified.
It didn't include the Shumantie or whatever the fuck they were. So he's still living on this planet.
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What no world domination? Pffft I'm getting bedsheets ready Tony.
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Chinese domination is slowly slowly catch a monkey.
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I might have had a smidgeon of respect for that statement if it contained some passing reference to his own culpability for allowing so much of his money to be pissed up in the air. Those responsible for failure are his employees after all.
The hole in the bottom of our boat is McCormack-Hogan shaped.
Be fair Brian he is an entrepreneur who saw an opportunity and like our previous owner he has to rely on the good judgement of others. Villa now has a history of taking good players from other clubs and turning them in to shit in a short space of time, this is beyond the control of the owner all he can do is sack those he trusted and go again.
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I hope your tongue was in your cheek when you wrote that Rob.
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Have to love modern football don't you? whilst we fret and scrap around FFP watch as the Sky 4 or "Big 6" in the Prem spend hundreds of millions to move up a maximum of two places in the league.
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Chinese domination is slowly slowly catch a monkey.
I think of it as copy, copy, perfect copy, domination
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Agreeing with you to some extent he relied on the experience of others when those players were bought, the money that managers have wasted at Villa in the past few years is mind blowing, Whether Bruce is a nice bloke or not is not the point he plays negative football and has wasted the chance given to him. The point I was making is most owners are not football people.
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Agreeing with you to some extent he relied on the experience of others when those players were bought, the money that managers have wasted at Villa in the past few years is mind blowing, Whether Bruce is a nice bloke or not is not the point he plays negative football and has wasted the chance given to him. The point I was making is most owners are not football people.
Lets not forget the millions wasted ON managers Bruce himeself will be on a tidy sum
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Just when the club needs a massive dose of positivity to get everyone rallying to the cause, the good doctor drops a massive shit bomb of misery.
Thanks Tone.
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At least we know we're fucked now...
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Pretty much confirms we will be selling Grealish from that I think.
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Just when the club needs a massive dose of positivity to get everyone rallying to the cause, the good doctor drops a massive shit bomb of misery.
Thanks Tone.
Theres nothing in there that we didn't know
But it is right that they're being truthful with us.
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Dr T's morphing into Randy
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Apparently Randy had his Villa Tattoo lazered off and replaced with the words “He who forgets his history is condemned to re-live it” - which we are.
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We will be cutting it fine to get into the Champions League in Tony’s 5th year.
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Anybody else get a hint of a Dear John in that statement? A better written Dear John than Randy's parable of the Shunamite woman but a kiss off none the less.
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Just when the club needs a massive dose of positivity to get everyone rallying to the cause, the good doctor drops a massive shit bomb of misery.
Thanks Tone.
Oh well at least we've got the new kit to look forward to .....hopefully it's the right claret and blue :)
Maybe the club motto will be revamped from " Prepared" to "Uncertain"
All joking aside we should be seizing this opportunity to completely revamp the way the club approaches the playing side of things from bottom to top - and concentrate on the basics - how to take a throw in, free kick and corner would be good place to start ... along with leaving at least two players on the half way line when the opposition has a corner. All simple stuff to address but has been lacking for seasons - let's hope we bring in a coach/ manager with positive, progressive ideas about the beautiful game
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With Randy the money really did dry up
At the moment it seems like it's FFP rather than that. Remember that a) even if we lose 2-3 key players our squad should still be very competitive at this level - more than the one we started last season with and b) that it's only this tight for one year because we took such massive losses in 16/17. That won't count the season after next
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Have to love modern football don't you? whilst we fret and scrap around FFP watch as the Sky 4 or "Big 6" in the Prem spend hundreds of millions to move up a maximum of two places in the league.
Not even the big 6 now.
Those that establish themselves will benefit but there ll be an almighty scramble each season to wade off relegation.
What was interesting was all 3 promoted clubs from championship stayed up.
And all 3 that were relegated none made it back. Sunderland in fact got a double relegation. Hull struggled. And only Boro showed some competitiveness.
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Which gives me hope for next year. Not sure any of the relegated clubs will immediately be super competitive
Not sure any of the clubs that finished below us will be either
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I just hope Tony is not looking to emulate the Cardiff owner and change the kit colour to simply red .....bearing in mind that moneys too tight to mention
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Grealish certain to leave then. A real shame to see him develop elsewhere.
I worry now we’re skint. Bruce hasn’t really shown much ability to coach and improve players. There’s plenty of players with a decent pedigree at this level or above who he’s signed and has got nothing from: Bree, Taylor, Lansbury, Hogan. Without Jack we’ve still got a lot of resource for this level and on paper should be atleast play offs. I don’t see it currently, kind.
Is he any good with kids? Green and Davies could contribute a lot more next year but I’m not sure Bruce has any history of bringing young players through.
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I don't read it like that at all. Everybody will read what they want I guess.
But it's a thank you to Mr Bruce. Just before the goodbye.
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One way or another we just need to get on with things now.
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Kinda reads like Bruce staying to me, but we'll see.
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I might have had a smidgeon of respect for that statement if it contained some passing reference to his own culpability for allowing so much of his money to be pissed up in the air. Those responsible for failure are his employees after all.
The hole in the bottom of our boat is McCormack-Hogan shaped.
Most of the money spent is parachute money...
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One way or another we just need to get on with things now.
Right: what should we get for Jack, folks? :'(
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Kinda reads like Bruce staying to me, but we'll see.
please no
teaching the young players to knock the ball back to Bunn to hoof up to Hogan and hope we dont lose possession like we normally do.
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One way or another we just need to get on with things now.
Right: what should we get for Jack, folks? :'(
You do realise that out of three clubs in the city only one has failed FFP? And in case you’re too thick to realise it it begins with Small and ends in Heath.
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Give us another clue.
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Two words, each with one syllable... :D
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Give us another clue.
They're an absolute shithouse of a club.
Although on reflection that only narrows it down to two.
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One way or another we just need to get on with things now.
Right: what should we get for Jack, folks? :'(
You do realise that out of three clubs in the city only one has failed FFP? And in case you’re too thick to realise it it begins with Small and ends in Heath.
AFAIK they're Villa, so less of that please.
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That reads like a prelude to the manager’s departure.
Absolutely this.
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Okay easy to confuse at this troubled time.
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I read it as Bruce going. Thanks to steve and the players 2nd paragraph. People (players and management) come and go 3rd paragraph. Big changes (yes folks, players and management will be going just if you missed it earlier) 4th paragraph.
Obviously that's just my interpretation but y'know
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After reading it twice, I think that he’s talking about what might have wheely bin...a bin on wheels. Is it Dusty Bin? Do I win a Metro?
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I have just read it through properly for the first time and I think it's a load of shit. The only thing he really says is that he's disappointed in not going up (fuck me, really!!) and that we need to cut our cloth accordingly thanks to not going up. Crap statement that, not quite like Randy used to, but leaves me scratching my head wondering how, who and what will be in place. I have no idea whether Bruce is staying or not, frankly, I don't care, dinosaur, I do think he'll have to prune his squad of staff though with either Calderwood, Clemence or Agnew to go.
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Meaningless. Place is stinking of desperation again. Forget the manager, don't have faith in the owners.
Lots of talk about stabilisation but we look worse off than summer 2016 after reckless spending
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What should the statement have said?
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Tony is giving the perfect corporate communication strategy, namely paint the bleakest picture possible .
It might be bad but not nearly as bad as painted . Thank you Steve and coaches for your hard work which unfortunately didn’t pay off. Step forward Mr Dean Smith, you are the right man to develop our talented group of youngsters.
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Ok I read it was the old putting on record our thanks to Steve, blah, blah, blah before Bruce makes an exit.
Also the financial situation has changed, no shit, the Villa need to live within their means so all options are open, this is a mental preparation for player sales for any of Chester, Kodja and Grealish.
I of itself there was nothing in there which shocked me, it's all kind of what we know but that bullish Dr Tony has clearly been replaced with a more hard headed approach. I reckon he's looked at the figures and realised that without parachute payments its now going to need his personal investment and that wasn't really part of his masterplan. Either way, I think we are in deeper shit now than I thought this time yesterday.
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What should the statement have said?
'Boot. Face. Forever.'
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What should the statement have said?
Careful now.
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What should the statement have said?
'Boot. Face. Forever.'
Maybe he could have played the Phil Collins game?
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What should the statement have said?
It should have said “ Obviously not getting promoted wasn’t what we wanted, however we planned for both eventualities and will move forward with no fire sales and a great group of youngsters waiting in the wings to be integrated with our senior pros . We will make a formidable challenge next season”
How does that sound ?
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What should the statement have said?
Why post a statement which says nothing?
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What should the statement have said?
It should have said “ Obviously not getting promoted wasn’t what we wanted, however we planned for both eventualities and will move forward with no fire sales and a great group of youngsters waiting in the wings to be integrated with our senior pros . We will make a formidable challenge next season”
How does that sound ?
It sounds unconvincing and delusional.
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This all smacks a bit of damned if he does...
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What should the statement have said?
It should have said “ Obviously not getting promoted wasn’t what we wanted, however we planned for both eventualities and will move forward with no fire sales and a great group of youngsters waiting in the wings to be integrated with our senior pros . We will make a formidable challenge next season”
How does that sound ?
Sounds like you're addressing insecurities that are personal to you. Who says there's going to be a fire sale?
He's made a statement. Says he's gutted. Says we're going to be smothered by FFP, but this isn't a surprise. Thanks Bruce. And then again.
This isn't an A-Level English exam. There's no marks for identifying symbolism. If there's anything to read between the lines it's that Bruce and his time is up.
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Ultimately it shows that sometimes they can't win. If he hadn't said something more and more would have wanted to know why and started to give him stick. He says something and because it doesn't contain what everyone wants, he gets stick.
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What should the statement have said?
We will ride to the summit on a road of bones.
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Agreed PWS. These statements are always going to get the same reaction, no matter what is said.
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What should the statement have said?
'FFP? FFS!'
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well i would have gone with...
Hi peeps! Tony here. We don't really know much about the business of football but its a bit like them Casino's in Star City init?. we put everything on Bruceball, and whatdoyouknow it came up Pullis :0( Now we are going home without the bus fair and tomorrow we're are down cash convertors. Sorry! CIAO"
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What should the statement have said?
I said Gabby get your ass to Reading
But he said no, no
I don't think so
I said Brucie you be resigning
But he said no, no
I"ok want full compo
And kebabs to go
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What should the statement have said?
We will ride to the summit on a road of bones.
What should the statement have said?
'FFP? FFS!'
This and this. Then maybe live streamed it and he could have kicked over a speaker or something.
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What should the statement have said?
It should have said “ Obviously not getting promoted wasn’t what we wanted, however we planned for both eventualities and will move forward with no fire sales and a great group of youngsters waiting in the wings to be integrated with our senior pros . We will make a formidable challenge next season”
How does that sound ?
Sounds like you're addressing insecurities that are personal to you. Who says there's going to be a fire sale?
He's made a statement. Says he's gutted. Says we're going to be smothered by FFP, but this isn't a surprise. Thanks Bruce. And then again.
This isn't an A-Level English exam. There's no marks for identifying symbolism. If there's anything to read between the lines it's that Bruce and his time is up.
Who says there isn’t going to be a fire sale ? So I think it’s a concern I and many others have. If you want to call it a personal insecurity feel free , I call it a valid question on a forum .
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What should the statement have said?
At least he didn't mention Bannockburn.
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What should the statement have said?
It should have said “ Obviously not getting promoted wasn’t what we wanted, however we planned for both eventualities and will move forward with no fire sales and a great group of youngsters waiting in the wings to be integrated with our senior pros . We will make a formidable challenge next season”
How does that sound ?
Sounds like you're addressing insecurities that are personal to you. Who says there's going to be a fire sale?
He's made a statement. Says he's gutted. Says we're going to be smothered by FFP, but this isn't a surprise. Thanks Bruce. And then again.
This isn't an A-Level English exam. There's no marks for identifying symbolism. If there's anything to read between the lines it's that Bruce and his time is up.
Yes, and he also says:
We are all aware that we will face severe FFP challenges next season. I am an Aston Villa fan. But I am also a businessman. Under the current circumstances, I think the club needs to rethink not only the past two years but also the past ten years. Villa needs to be a sustainable football club. People join. People leave. That is the cycle of football.
There's no A Level English symbolism exercise there, it is there in black and white.
I'd have preferred him to say nothing, to be honest. At least leave us with some sort of sign of positivity, of hope, but it reads to me like a 'tighten your belts, lean times ahead' message and there is absolutely nothing there which suggests 'I'd love to invest more, but I'm stopped by FFP'
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Wynness should be the first name out. He oversaw the reckless gamble last season when we tried to buy promotion and failed miserably.
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It does read to me that financially he's bitten off far more than he can chew. All that 'I'm a businessman' stuff doesn't suggest he's being told he can't hose us down with money because of those evil overlords of the EFL.
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Yes. We're not permitted to horse cash at it, so we try something new. Hardly ground breaking is it? There will be change, but then there always is.
That to me means we are saying ta'ta to a fat squad whereby 35k a week players who don't make the 18 will be gone the sort of out a businessman can get behind.
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Wynness should be the first name out. He oversaw the reckless gamble last season when we tried to buy promotion and failed miserably.
I agree .
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This all smacks a bit of damned if he does...
Is the correct answer.
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As much as i was against employing Bruce, the feeling i got at the time of his employment, on here at least, was we had to get promoted NOW, so they weren't really going against the grain when they ditched RDM as far as a lot of us were concerned. I always thought the fans panicked and then the club followed suit, and Mr. Guaranteed Promotion turned up.
Look on the bright side, we could have gone up and been down next season with an expensively assembled collection of Bruceball merchants to get rid off. At least now we only have Richards.
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What should the statement have said?
It should have said “ Obviously not getting promoted wasn’t what we wanted, however we planned for both eventualities and will move forward with no fire sales and a great group of youngsters waiting in the wings to be integrated with our senior pros . We will make a formidable challenge next season”
How does that sound ?
Sounds like you're addressing insecurities that are personal to you. Who says there's going to be a fire sale?
He's made a statement. Says he's gutted. Says we're going to be smothered by FFP, but this isn't a surprise. Thanks Bruce. And then again.
This isn't an A-Level English exam. There's no marks for identifying symbolism. If there's anything to read between the lines it's that Bruce and his time is up.
Yes, and he also says:
We are all aware that we will face severe FFP challenges next season. I am an Aston Villa fan. But I am also a businessman. Under the current circumstances, I think the club needs to rethink not only the past two years but also the past ten years. Villa needs to be a sustainable football club. People join. People leave. That is the cycle of football.
There's no A Level English symbolism exercise there, it is there in black and white.
I'd have preferred him to say nothing, to be honest. At least leave us with some sort of sign of positivity, of hope, but it reads to me like a 'tighten your belts, lean times ahead' message and there is absolutely nothing there which suggests 'I'd love to invest more, but I'm stopped by FFP'
You mean apart from where he mentions we will face severe FFP Challenges.
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Well I’m glad he hasn’t remained silent everybody on this site predicted if we didn’t get promoted there would be consequences. So from what I hear from his statement, financial stability takes precedence and if can get promoted it’ll be a bonus. I know going up financially is huge thing but,as I remember it Randy was in line to take a huge chunk, and so where some of our non performing players in bonuses and automatic pay rises. We were always going to see a lot of change re loan players and returning loanees let’s hang on for the ride and see where it takes us with or without SB. UTV
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This all smacks a bit of damned if he does...
Is the correct answer.
This is the consequence of being a leader. He came in on a white steed giving rhetoric about top six in five years. He's as much to blame as Bruce or Wyness for allowing it to happen, I guess, hence the I'm still gutted comment. He is a little damned if he does to be fair, but, perhaps he could have said something to sell season tickets lol.
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Whatever happens the squad will be weakened this summer. I just can't see it having the quality or depth to sustain a promotion challenge. Mid table at best.
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I drafted dozens of statements like this when I worked in corporate marketing. They were all issued reluctantly by Chairmen/Managing Directors etc and were designed to say something without actually saying anything specific ( which would , in the main, have been better). Invariably this resulted in further media speculation which created even more uncertainty and further rounds of corporate speak until the real truth manifested itself. I read the Dr's words as being akin to a worldwide plea for Villa fans to rummage around the backs of their sofas to donate any money found there. We're skint, and will be taking every fiscal measure available to stop bleeding money. Once all the marketable assets have been sold, we might be able to plug a few gaps with frees and loans.So we are now Ipswich Town but with the added burden of a huge stadium and associated infra-structure. If Dean Smith wants to take that situation on, I for one will applaud him.
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Yes. We're not permitted to horse cash at it, so we try something new. Hardly ground breaking is it? There will be change, but then there always is.
That to me means we are saying ta'ta to a fat squad whereby 35k a week players who don't make the 18 will be gone the sort of out a businessman can get behind.
Who will buy the £35k a week players from us? Angela will be here till his contract runs out.
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Whatever happens the squad will be weakened this summer. I just can't see it having the quality or depth to sustain a promotion challenge. Mid table at best.
You could take a lot of players out of this squad and, on paper at least, it would still be much better than Millwall or Preston who were just outside the play offs
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I drafted dozens of statements like this when I worked in corporate marketing. They were all issued reluctantly by Chairmen/Managing Directors etc and were designed to say something without actually saying anything specific ( which would , in the main, have been better). Invariably this resulted in further media speculation which created even more uncertainty and further rounds of corporate speak until the real truth manifested itself. I read the Dr's words as being akin to a worldwide plea for Villa fans to rummage around the backs of their sofas to donate any money found there. We're skint, and will be taking every fiscal measure available to stop bleeding money. Once all the marketable assets have been sold, we might be able to plug a few gaps with frees and loans.So we are now Ipswich Town but with the added burden of a huge stadium and associated infra-structure. If Dean Smith wants to take that situation on, I for one will applaud him.
Were not skint
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I actually think we could surprise a few next season.
Our hand has now been forced to use these talented lads we have on our books, with the more exerienced players.
Get a manager in who can play them correctly and we're not going to be far off. Maybe not automatic promotion, but there or there abouts for play offs, again.
Oddly enough the perfect manager for this scenario would have been Reme Guarde!
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It's a "clear the decks" statement. Reads to me like Bruce will be leaving with a modicum of pride. I would assume there will be a cull in non playing positions too - especially Wyness and Round (for. Director of Football, there doesn't seem to be much "direction" in evidence).
I'm ok with kicking it over to start again . Do we really want a other 12 months of watching theimes of Lansbury have a good 30 minutes every 6 games and then disappear for months? Or.Hogan run around like.an ineffectual puppy for the 20 minutes he.comes.on from the bench every couple.of weeks?
I don't have a.clue who to suggest as a manager. I neither do I suspect does Xia.
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but effectively we are skint aren't we?. We have to make savings of £40m and we can't spend on new players.
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No. Skint means you have no money to invest. Tony has bundles. We are just restricted by regulations which strangle competition, designed to protect a cartel of elite European clubs who became terrified that oiks like Man City could gatecrash their Misnomer Money Making League.
It's the anthisis of articles 101 and 102.
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Whatever happens the squad will be weakened this summer. I just can't see it having the quality or depth to sustain a promotion challenge. Mid table at best.
The squad may be weakened …
but we may end with a more balanced team, supported by players with more understanding of their capabilities and limitations.
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That reads like a prelude to the manager’s departure.
That was my first thought as well.
A lot can be read into the statement, but underlying it is a change of manager, IMO
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I think as has been said before, it's deliberately vague and leaves the owner a lot of options. You can read any meaning you want into it.
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it's a work of genius to produce a statement which can be interpreted to say whatever you want it to say by numerous different people
I think George rr Martin might have been involved somewhere
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Agree with you Nigel. With my gambler's hat on (and I did write a sports betting column for 25 years) I stick to my prediction made here when Eric Black was allowing rigor mortis to set in that return to the Premiership was a 3-5 year haul.
What we lose in the upcoming season from the loss of better quality players we will make by having younger, more motivated, quicker players. There will also be the improvement of either a new manager or the old one with a squib up his arse.
Taken all round I see a marginally poorer season than the last with us getting into the bottom play off position but performing less negatively in them.
FFP will ease substantially in 19/20 and that is when we shall start to get some proper promotion momentum going. In my opinion.
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but effectively we are skint aren't we?. We have to make savings of £40m and we can't spend on new players.
£20m is the black hole. We lose half on wages of those being released and add a bit back in with Recon sponsorship. Not ideal but nowhere near the financial Armageddon about to be unleashed down the road. We will still be competitive but have to make more use of the kids as squad fillers than gubbing big money at the Whelan's and Taylor's of this world to stock it up.
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we've not really improved the playing squad over the last two seasons,
yes we went close using old established and loan players but it was all very short term and we have built nothing for the future
the loan players have returned and we are left with the shell which contains not a lot of anything to get excited about outside Grealish and Chester who both might leave anyway
the Lerner regime of Lambert/Fox was a disaster and we followed it up with the Xia regime of Bruce/Wyness which is no better
All the money has been spent, the decent loan players gone home and we are back to square one, in a worse place now than when we first dropped
we have a unenviable record of continually choosing rubbish managers who spend the money on overpriced over rated plodders and then we just do it all over again and again, we never learn
the silver lining is that the Championship is a league of poor quality football and any manager who has a clue about building a team to play football on the front foot and a clear definitive system rather than attrition and hoof ball could easily get the team into the promotion/playoff spots without spending millions
when Bruce goes either now or next year it will be a case of rebuilding again,
starting from scratch again,
it can't start until he goes whenever that happens, but then it will be time to hope again
hope for younger players busting their asses, hope for a more attacking approach to the game,
and most importantly of all hope that the a new manager can actually build something that remains solid with quality rather than something built on the short term sand
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Steer
Bree
Chester
Elphick
Taylor
Jedinak
Green
Grealish
Hourihane
Albert
Kodjia
Is probably the best side we can put out now. Left hand side of defence is not as I would like, but that's a side easily capable of top 6, so I do not agree we've been left with nothing or starting from scratch. I think there's a great deal of anxiety exaggerating the situation into the chaos of not knowing for sure quite what will happen this summer.
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we've not really improved the playing squad over the last two seasons,
yes we went close using old established and loan players but it was all very short term and we have built nothing for the future
the loan players have returned and we are left with the shell which contains not a lot of anything to get excited about outside Grealish and Chester who both might leave anyway
the Lerner regime of Lambert/Fox was a disaster and we followed it up with the Xia regime of Bruce/Wyness which is no better
All the money has been spent, the decent loan players gone home and we are back to square one, in a worse place now than when we first dropped
we have a unenviable record of continually choosing rubbish managers who spend the money on overpriced over rated plodders and then we just do it all over again and again, we never learn
the silver lining is that the Championship is a league of poor quality football and any manager who has a clue about building a team to play football on the front foot and a clear definitive system rather than attrition and hoof ball could easily get the team into the promotion/playoff spots without spending millions
when Bruce goes either now or next year it will be a case of rebuilding again,
starting from scratch again,
it can't start until he goes whenever that happens, but then it will be time to hope again
hope for younger players busting their asses, hope for a more attacking approach to the game,
and most importantly of all hope that the a new manager can actually build something that remains solid with quality rather than something built on the short term sand
100% agree.
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Steer
Bree
Chester
Elphick
Taylor
Jedinak
Green
Grealish
Hourihane
Albert
Kodjia
Is probably the best side we can put out now. Left hand side of defence is not as I would like, but that's a side easily capable of top 6, so I do not agree we've been left with nothing or starting from scratch. I think there's a great deal of anxiety exaggerating the situation into the chaos of not knowing for sure quite what will happen this summer.
if we start the season with Grealish and Chester it will be a right result
Plus there will be a few changes in playing staff depending on the managerial situation
it's not all doom and gloom in my view but we do need to start from scratch with a whole new playing philosophy, that's what I'm hoping for anyway
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Everyone is assuming we are going to get an automatic £<insert millions> from Recon sponsorship. Maybe Tony doesn't want to spunk his money away like that. Maybe he only wants to sponsor us on actual, genuine commercial terms.
I reckon I'm more of a Villa fan than he is and if I was a multi millionaire trying to become a billionaire I wouldn't just chuck my money at the club. It is valuable capital he may well need to grow his other businesses.
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Steer
Bree
Chester
Elphick
Taylor
Jedinak
Green
Grealish
Hourihane
Albert
Kodjia
Is probably the best side we can put out now. Left hand side of defence is not as I would like, but that's a side easily capable of top 6, so I do not agree we've been left with nothing or starting from scratch. I think there's a great deal of anxiety exaggerating the situation into the chaos of not knowing for sure quite what will happen this summer.
if we start the season with Grealish and Chester it will be a right result
Plus there will be a few changes in playing staff depending on the managerial situation
it's not all doom and gloom in my view but we do need to start from scratch with a whole new playing philosophy, that's what I'm hoping for anyway
I agree with your last line. A greater focus on ball retention, pace and movement in the final third.
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None of the on loan players returning to their respective clubs are good enough to hold down a spot in the Premiership Grealish was our own standout of the season. that's why I'm not totally devastated because for some time I have believed we were nowhere near structurally strong enough to face a season in the Prem. Apart from Grealish not one Villa player was good enough and that includes the likes of Terry, too old and too slow, we would have had to perform a miracle and sign almost a new team and get them gelling before the season started, impossible.
That's disastrous short term planning.
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We are all aware that we will face severe FFP challenges next season. I am an Aston Villa fan. But I am also a businessman. Under the current circumstances, I think the club needs to rethink not only the past two years but also the past ten years. Villa needs to be a sustainable football club. People join. People leave. That is the cycle of football.
There's no A Level English symbolism exercise there, it is there in black and white.
I'd have preferred him to say nothing, to be honest. At least leave us with some sort of sign of positivity, of hope, but it reads to me like a 'tighten your belts, lean times ahead' message and there is absolutely nothing there which suggests 'I'd love to invest more, but I'm stopped by FFP'
I won't quote the whole thing but the bit about needing a rethink is everything I wanted to see, our recruitment policy (for football staff and players) has been a fucking disgrace for years, we've spent huge amounts of money on players with no resale value, we've continuously created squads with over-abundance in some positions and gaps in others, we've signed young players and completely fucked things up by not training them properly. We've lurched from style to style and rarely given any manager the time needed to shape a squad suitable for his style, but in many cases that's not a bad thing because they've been so poor.
The team Ads posted is decent enough to be competitive but I think we'd need another centre half (but that could easily be Tuanzebe) and I'm very uncomfortable with Taylor being in there, if we could move him on and get a replacement without a huge outlay that would be pretty high up the list for me. I'd also like to have Bjarnason in for Jedinak for most games but I suspect that's unlikely because he's one of the few players we could make a decent profit on (if he has a decent world cup). If he does leave then I'd like someone with some legs for that role but Maybe Lyden could step up, if his injury problems are now behind him.
After that if we had anything to spend I'd like another winger with real pace, Green is still young and Adomah has shown that he blows hot and cold so having a 3rd player to compete with them would be sensible. I'm not sure that Corey Taylor is good enough and I prefer O'Hare central as cover for Jack.
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When I first read the statement, I was convinced it was purely preparing us for Jack's departure. But thinking about it, from a business point of view, it wouldn't be a particularly good idea to let the world know that you need to sell your most valuable asset. That's surely not the way to get the best price...? You say you're not going to sell or, more likely, you don't refer to it at all.
So, to my mind, we've either already agreed a deal for Jack (which I'd say is unlikely, but not impossible), or he was only talking about Bruce going and that the new guy will be making plenty of changes. Which you'd imagine. And hope for.
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hope for younger players busting their asses, hope for a more attacking approach to the game,
and most importantly of all hope that the a new manager can actually build something that remains solid with quality rather than something built on the short term sand
Well said john e. Let's grow organically. We tried the fast fix method and we have failed miserably. Let's start with a decent coach and if this rebuilding means we are in this division for a little while than so be it. There is no need to slash our wrists...............................just now :)
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There's legitimate cause to be concerned but personally I can see the opportunity in all this too. I would love to see a one-for-one squad where essentially every first teamer has an apprentice in their natural position that they're responsible for bringing along. Think the likes of Chester, Hutton, Jedinak would be great mentors and hopefully will have learned spades from Terry this season on how to encourage and improve those around them through leading by example. Might be less effective when you come to the likes of Bjarni and Kodjia who are probably too prone to a sulk to be great mentors, but in principle I think this is the direction we need to go in.
Get the likes of Sarkic, Clark, O'Hare, Green, Hepburn-Murphy involved in the first team set-up, and make sure they're looking up to the right players, in addition to getting the coaching right.
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It is a very carefully worded statement. It says people not players so that means the manager / backroom staff or even him, not just players.
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O'Hare
Green
Davies
RHM
All young and know each other's game. There's pace there too. As much as we'll miss Snodgrass's guile he will be another year older, a bit slower and less stamina. Keep Hutton for another year if we can. Make Chester our leader and get a decent big lad next to him the lad at Bristol City looked half decent.
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Exactly what does "smothered by FFP" mean?
We hear all of the talk about it but has there ever been a document that states exactly what the club can and cannot do now? For example, a fixed figure for transfer funds, the required value of wages to be cut? etc?
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According to Talk Shite's 'experts' this morning, we're going to do a Sunderland.
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According to Talk Shite's 'experts' this morning, we're going to do a Sunderland.
We already haven't.
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I don't know where to begin with that one.
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According to Talk Shite's 'experts' this morning, we're going to do a Sunderland.
Meanwhile the bookies still have us as faves to go up ...Talkshite are muppets
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Steer
Bree
Chester
Elphick
Taylor
Jedinak
Green
Grealish
Hourihane
Albert
Kodjia
Is probably the best side we can put out now. Left hand side of defence is not as I would like, but that's a side easily capable of top 6, so I do not agree we've been left with nothing or starting from scratch. I think there's a great deal of anxiety exaggerating the situation into the chaos of not knowing for sure quite what will happen this summer.
I get that you're trying to be positive but there's no way we'll start the season with that team.
All that's gone from that team are the loanees aren't they? That will gain us £10m of the £40-£50m we need to find. So we're going to have to sell some players to bridge the gap or run the risk that even if we win the league the EFL might dock us enough points to stop us going up.
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I said that's the best possible team we can put out there now. People are chucking figures around and you've mentioned £40-50m, I have not seen that anywhere else.
The two I have seen are £39 million if everything hypothetically stayed the same, and we all know many things already have or imminently will and £20 million being closer to it from Chelts.
We already are selling players and Gollini is off, Elphick is off, it seems De Laet is off and I would expect Lansbury and Thor to follow suit too. I feel positive because I think everything is an opportunity to succeed.
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I said that's the best possible team we can put out there now. People are chucking figures around and you've mentioned £40-50m, I have not seen that anywhere else.
The two I have seen are £39 million if everything hypothetically stayed the same, and we all know many things already have or imminently will and £20 million being closer to it from Chelts.
We already are selling players and Gollini is off, Elphick is off, it seems De Laet is off and I would expect Lansbury and Thor to follow suit too. I feel positive because I think everything is an opportunity to succeed.
There's a very detailed review on another Villa website which someone linked to on here that showed we needed £40m on top of the loan players wages dropping off the bill.
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I've not seen that, if you're referring to the 7500 Steps to the Holte Blog on the matter from earlier in the year. Swiss Ramble definitely stated £39 million if nothing changed, which it now has to the tune of £12 million one way and commercial revenue the other way.
-
Steer
Bree
Chester
Elphick
Taylor
Jedinak
Green
Grealish
Hourihane
Albert
Kodjia
Is probably the best side we can put out now. Left hand side of defence is not as I would like, but that's a side easily capable of top 6, so I do not agree we've been left with nothing or starting from scratch. I think there's a great deal of anxiety exaggerating the situation into the chaos of not knowing for sure quite what will happen this summer.
I get that you're trying to be positive but there's no way we'll start the season with that team.
All that's gone from that team are the loanees aren't they? That will gain us £10m of the £40-£50m we need to find. So we're going to have to sell some players to bridge the gap or run the risk that even if we win the league the EFL might dock us enough points to stop us going up.
And Terry, Hutton, Lansbury, Bjarnason, Hogan and Elmo. Not to mention People like Gil, Gollini, DeLaet, McCormack, Tishbola, etc who have been on loan and may or may not come back (Elphick should be on this list instead of in the team though).
Aside from that no one knows how much we need to find so quoting £40-50m as a definitive figure is a bit pointless, it may be true but it's impossible to verify.
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The statement is meant to prepare us for the consequences of not being promoted. But it doesn’t have to be the worst case scenario as becomes very easy to paint. It just states that obvious that a series of difficult decisions will need to take place. Selling players like Jack might would only need to happen if an outrageous bid comes in or comes at the end of trying a number of other things to meet FFP. But I am sure the club have planned for this hoping it would never come to it. How well they have planned versus the reality of it will soon become apparent.
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I've probably got more faith in Dt T planning for it than Randy planning for it
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I'm looking on the bright side, on the evidence of last season whether we have cash or not we should be able to compete. This depends on the performance of our manager. The current one doesn't play the most inspiring stuff but has an excellent record in this league and on limited resources. He may be replaced with another manager who could make a fist of it.
The ship that we all watched so forlornly sailing off into paradise on Saturday hasn't disappeared forever. It sets sail again in August and whatever the ramifications of FFP, Dr Tony's intentions, the limitations of Bruce or A. N. Other we can still climb aboard. The fine margins that saw us fail last year may fall in our favour this time around.
You never know, you know.
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As Tony says he is a fan, can he pay for his ticket like other fans. £2m per game!
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I've not seen that, if you're referring to the 7500 Steps to the Holte Blog on the matter from earlier in the year. Swiss Ramble definitely stated £39 million if nothing changed, which it now has to the tune of £12 million one way and commercial revenue the other way.
£39m is the amount we can lose over a 3 year period. The big question is how much money we need to save this coming season to stay within that £39m figure.
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I'd have to agree with others: Tony can't win.
I personally think it's refreshing to see him come out and be honest and say something, whereas under Randy we'd invariably wait months for him to come out with utter waffle.
As much as I'm no great fan of football under Bruce, it's very easy with hindsight to come out and say Bruce/Wyness has been a disaster when the reality is we were essentially one game away from actually succeeding! Again, please don't read that as me being a great fan of the style of play, it bores me to death but...
The other thing I'd say is that for years we've been crying out for football people on the board and no we have Wyness et al, suddenly we should get rid of them? And then what?
One thing's is for sure, like a few others on here, I'd love to see a footballing philosophy being built up now, start using our academy and build sustainably.
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The other day the Birmingham Mail did a wonderfully dramatic story likening us to Coventry '83 or Hull a couple of years back and practically making out there would be a mass exodus and we would struggle to put eleven players out onto the pitch next season. What I got from Dr T's statement was that Bruce would be staying on and we would be giving it our best shot again whilst accepting that the financial picture has changed for us after two seasons out of the top flight. It is also worth remembering that Bruce is right up their with the best when it comes to utilising the loan market. I don't expect Swansea, Stoke or Albion to run away with the league next season. Nor do I expect any of the rest of last season's top ten (Boro, Derby, Preston, Millwall, Brentford and Sheff U) to suddenly become world beaters.
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Steer
Bree
Chester
Elphick
Taylor
Jedinak
Green
Grealish
Hourihane
Albert
Kodjia
Is probably the best side we can put out now. Left hand side of defence is not as I would like, but that's a side easily capable of top 6, so I do not agree we've been left with nothing or starting from scratch. I think there's a great deal of anxiety exaggerating the situation into the chaos of not knowing for sure quite what will happen this summer.
Now i'm not the most optimistic person here but easily top 6? you sure? Our side finished 8 points off automatic promotion and 10 points off 7th. Now we've lost 6 1st team players from that squad. You have steer bree, elphick and taylor who have been well.... rather crap or untried and any injuries and we're down to the kids. Now you'd hope players will come in at some point by the start of the season but i'd be a bit worried if i was relying on that defence to get us promoted.
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Top six easily.
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Pretty sure loans will come in too eg tuanzebe, but there is no doubt snoddy and Terry will be missed
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Snoddy will be missed for sure. But...that absence of pace may well have been the thing that cost us awaynfeom home in particular.
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The other day the Birmingham Mail did a wonderfully dramatic story likening us to Coventry '83 or Hull a couple of years back and practically making out there would be a mass exodus and we would struggle to put eleven players out onto the pitch next season. What I got from Dr T's statement was that Bruce would be staying on and we would be giving it our best shot again whilst accepting that the financial picture has changed for us after two seasons out of the top flight. It is also worth remembering that Bruce is right up their with the best when it comes to utilising the loan market. I don't expect Swansea, Stoke or Albion to run away with the league next season. Nor do I expect any of the rest of last season's top ten (Boro, Derby, Preston, Millwall, Brentford and Sheff U) to suddenly become world beaters.
I tend to agree. As an outsider looking in, I would see our recent couple of league finishes as signs that the club is on an upward trajectory. Just because we lost the play-off final and we are bound to lose (and gain) some players this summer, it doesn't mean our objective has changed - in fact the Doc says our objective is exactly the same in his letter. It would be great if some of the hysteria and negativity from the press could be nipped in the bud as soon as possible so that we can all get on with the business of positively refocussing on next season. I think we have over 20k season tickets sold already for next season? If we can get the positivity back quickly, there is no reason why we won't shift a few thousand more and build up some real momentum for 2018-19. If we take on board some lessons learnt from the season just gone we can have a fair old crack at it again next season.
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A good start is key. Get the momentum going in August and September and you only have to look at Cardiff, the Dingles, Brighton, Huddersfield etc.
Being behind the 8 ball from game 3 makes it hard.
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At least there will be no more 8 touch ball now Gabby has gone.
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Agree re the start. Top 6 after the 5th game and you have momentum. Playing catch up is tough.
We need a lot more pace through the side.
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Being behind the 8 ball from game 3 makes it hard.
Eh?
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Google it.
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Agree re the start. Top 6 after the 5th game and you have momentum. Playing catch up is tough.
We need a lot more pace through the side.
It makes your margin for error almost non-existent. A draw down at Bristol was a poor result only because after Reading we had 1 point and not 6 or 7.
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Could Tony be having issues getting money out of China for our funding with them clamping down?
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Weren’t Fulham 17th towards Christmas? This league being as long as it is means you can have a decent run from Christmas onwards and still go up.
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true but it took a play off final against us at our worst to do it and I'm going to bet my house now that no one goes on a 23 game unbeaten run this season coming. Much better to go straight up. Cardiff went off like a train and only derailed once for a few games, but by then they had built up a big cushion. Even at our best, we were only ever playing catch up.
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It also shows that the equivalent of a couple of bad runs before Xmas, as we also had, leaves you pretty fecked. And even a run of form rarely seen isn't enough to finish top 2. W18 D5 L1 and it still wasn't enough.
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As in the final the cautious/ safety first approach cost us I feel.
Would like to see us go at side's from the off - as the Wolves game for example - most clubs have a dip at some point and others go on incredible runs like Fulham did.We had too many bad patches to be worthy of automatic promotion
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Fulham prove the issue of a bad start. They're a much better side than Cardiff, but when you're a 6th of the way there after 5 games, it's easier to have a dip at some point.
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Steer
Bree
Chester
Elphick
Taylor
Jedinak
Green
Grealish
Hourihane
Albert
Kodjia
Is probably the best side we can put out now. Left hand side of defence is not as I would like, but that's a side easily capable of top 6, so I do not agree we've been left with nothing or starting from scratch. I think there's a great deal of anxiety exaggerating the situation into the chaos of not knowing for sure quite what will happen this summer.
Sarkic over Steer any day for me , there’s one squad improvement that’s cost nothing.
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Weren’t Fulham 17th towards Christmas? This league being as long as it is means you can have a decent run from Christmas onwards and still go up.
The Fulham run wasn’t decent it was phenomenal and they still failed to make auto.
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I've not seen that, if you're referring to the 7500 Steps to the Holte Blog on the matter from earlier in the year. Swiss Ramble definitely stated £39 million if nothing changed, which it now has to the tune of £12 million one way and commercial revenue the other way.
£39m is the amount we can lose over a 3 year period. The big question is how much money we need to save this coming season to stay within that £39m figure.
Does the £39M figure change if we don’t go up next season?
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You can lose an average of £13m a year in this division, so it's always £39m over a 3 year period for us now until we either leave this division or there's a rule changes. However that's only if the owner injects £8m cash into the club each year. If he doesn't then it's a £5m a year loss, so then we could only lose £15m over 3 years.
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The thing that changes next year is that were currently have to compensate for a massive loss the first year we came down. That will drop out of the three year calculation next year
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Isn't 2 summers ago equally big though? Somewhere we need to level it out, set a base and go from there.
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Hasn't the Doc not done the same as Lerner? - gambled all on a couple of seasons of throwing money around? And, interestingly, we have - as with the post-MON years - a number of 4 or 5 year contracts to wind down.
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Tony is apparently ready to listen to offers for us now of £100m.
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He ain't going to get that for it in the championship.
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He ain't going to get that for it in the championship.
No surprise in this at all, he came, he spent, he gambled, he lost.
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If its true. Its in the star and currently sitting utter crap that's bad about villa is fair game.
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Tony is apparently ready to listen to offers for us now of £100m.
If he is, then that is very disappointing. It'd mean a departure at the first sight of a bit of difficulty. Which is something we should be very familiar with, sadly.
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https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/tony-xia-aston-villa-ffp-14717203
Make sure there are no sharp objects around while you read this.
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"Scott Hogan has been disappointing and I’ve seen his contract, and that’s eye-watering. "
heh. Seriously if we're paying an average of 30,000 a week now in the championship then certain people need to consider that running a football club isn't their forte
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https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/tony-xia-aston-villa-ffp-14717203
Make sure there are no sharp objects around while you read this.
Kieran Maguire, lecturer in football finance, has seen Hogan's contract.
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https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/tony-xia-aston-villa-ffp-14717203
Make sure there are no sharp objects around while you read this.
We've only f**king gone and done it again. We've thrown money around to achieve success and entrusted an old-school 'proper football bloke' and his wage-budget-inhaling signings to do it. GUESS WHAT!?! It didn't work. God almighty.
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I’ve got a horrible feeling Bruce will walk away mid July or something a la MON leaving us fcuk all time to find a replacement who can sort this out.
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Seems like it's a print what the fuck you like season at the moment.
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He ain't going to get that for it in the championship.
No surprise in this at all, he came, he spent, he gambled, he lost.
I wonder how much in excess of parachute payments he has spent? I dunno, just wondering? Not sure he’d get anywhere near £100 mil
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I think I saw borrowings of £49m in the accounts recently. But I might be mistaken.
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How's he managed to see the contract?
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I assumed richards was on the most at 35,000 reduced from 70,000 in the premiership. If 30,000 is the average then they must have gone mental the last two seasons
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Seems like it's a print what the fuck you like season at the moment.
And people seem to believe it as well. Are we that desperate enough to believe what the Daily Star says?
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Exactly it’s utterly made up nonsense. Football Finance Expert my arse. I remember another one coming out with the obvious a couple of years ago (when we were going down) things like ‘if villa go down they will lose a lot of money you know.’ And passing it off as some sort of investigative piece by a football finance expert.
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Bad news is easily bought.
I'm.having a hard time believing he's seen a contract to be honest. Actual eyes on. Seems like horsehit.
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Of course he could’ve rung ‘monster monster’ and said ‘any chance of seeing Hulk Hogans contract like’
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well tony himself said its severe, so depends if you think those figures are made up, or possibly can be described as "severe"
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I'm sure a lot of what that guy says is bollocks. However, you don't need his 'testimony' to be pessimistic as hell about next season.
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£100 mil sounds alot but then Forrest where brought for £50mil last season so its not totally outrageous
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That Star article is mostly a rehash of Tony Xia's statement. Considering his options (in terms of selling the club) is the most obvious thing to write given that everything has its price and he is a businessman!
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They have sensationalized the situation.
However the underlying position regarding our a Financial condition is extremely serious.
We have got to find savings or genrperate additional profit of around £40 million this Financial year.
We bet the farm, we lost.
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sending the loan players back and selling Amavi, Gollini, Elphick, De Laet etc should at least make a reasonable start on its amelioration
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sending the loan players back and selling Amavi, Gollini, Elphick, De Laet etc should at least make a reasonable start on its amelioration
The only problem is it then leaves us without a squad.
Surely amavi has gone?
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yes I was refering to the money which we get now I thought
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http://m.chinaso.com/news_article_v3.html?app=pc&nid=http://hn.chinaso.com/finance/detail/20180524/1000200032826601527130533919882031_1.html
This seems to suggest Tony isn't in great shape.
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http://m.chinaso.com/news_article_v3.html?app=pc&nid=http://hn.chinaso.com/finance/detail/20180524/1000200032826601527130533919882031_1.html
This seems to suggest Tony isn't in great shape.
The good news keeps rolling. Maybe FFP is a convenient excuse and we actually don’t have a pot to piss in
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All I get is a Chinese version of that article is there a translation? I think it mentions Lotus Health.
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It’s all clear now
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It’s all clear now
Not really. The FFP rules and whether or not the owner has any money are two separate issues. Even if we had all the money in the world we can't spend it.
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Tony may have just driven our coach over a precipice whilst whistling ‘self preservation society’
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I'll be honest that's the most heavy going article I've skim read. Yesh that's dry!
Board fighting, 15 years of losses or something.
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I need one of them string-line board thingys what they use in murder investigations to visualise who's who and what's what.
Also, why did it say "Sex." for no apparent reason about two-thirds of the way through? Diversionary tactic? Suggestion?
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All we know for a fact is that there are FFP rules which are definitely constraining us; that to date Xia has put in a ton of money, and that the amount hes put in is essentially right up to the limit of what he's allowed to do
None of this suggests he's broke. It will take more than a barely comprehensible article to convince me otherwise
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Easy I understand now.
Mr Fung Shuai synthetic
山 desires to the full story.
In took the lotus health 3 years and 5 months after the summer and usher in another great performance. The performance of the volume out, both from the continuous supervision to ask questions, as well as creditors of the parties is very tight and summer's capital, the financial pressure.
The challenges to Mr pcicb going?
In the thick of Anhui counter-attack the creditor to the Board
on the night wind, heavy rain in the morning of May 21, came to the Zhoukou City, winds accompanied by heavy rains that fell on Lianhua Road, but by the blazing a car rolled up fitful rain mist. This gives way to the lotus on the Henan Lotus health industry co., ltd. is even more obscure.
Obscure not only the rain curtain lotus in the health of the Headquarters buildings, including Lotus health prospects.
Formerly known as the Lotus Lotus health monosodium glutamate, created in 1983, and in August 1998, and listed on the Shanghai Stock Exchange. At the beginning of 2015, the core group and the primary lotus, to build the health industry ecosystem.
Time Back to the present.
On 21 May 1996 on the same day, the lotus Health Headquarters Building No. 18 conference rooms for the Company's 2017 annual meeting of stockholders. In addition to the normal work of the board of directors, board of supervisors, the concern is the consideration of the adoption of the additional directors of the motion, Mr WONG Wai-yin Fai Law and the two new faces an official presence in the lotus health board of directors.
The two new directors have attracted a lot of attention, is the background or speak with one of the new forces -- the thickness of Anhui Province.
Public information is displayed, the Yin Fai is now acting as the thickness of Anhui Capital Management Department deputy general manager. And the king of rule-six city, Anhui Province, has long been six on public security, procuratorial system, at the end of last year, were granted early retirement. The Anhui thick control Lee thick of Anhui Province and the city of six well-known entrepreneurs and their control over the main asset is the peak property group, that is, register to 6.
As the new face of the board of directors of the seat, lotus health controlling shareholders of the Company core Hong, chairman of the Board of Directors voting only Mr Kin and I, as well as chief financial officer of the army, the number of directors is the thickness in Anhui.
The thickness of the Anhui who? How to enter the lotus health board? This is a stranger to the creditor to the Board's story, the time for only a year.
The official website of Anhui thickness, the thickness of Anhui Province was founded in 2014 with a registered capital of 25 million yuan, is approved by the Anhui Provincial Government approved the establishment of, and approved by the ministry of finance for the record and China Banking Regulatory Commission approved the publication of the first batch of domestic financial assets with a negative volume acquisition of disposal of business qualified local asset management companies. The Company is a wholly owned subsidiary of the China Orient Asset Dongxing Shanghai Investment Holding Company Limited Joint Lead, Anhui liberal arts, Shenzhen Long Run, both inside and outside the enterprise resources, Anhui Province, the benefits of the establishment.
On the business side, the thick assets to finance the acquisition of disposal of bad assets business as the core, covered by the acquisition of the management of such creditors, equity, movable and immovable property and other forms of non-performing assets, debt recovery, debt restructuring, debt, corporate restructuring, asset securitization and other methods for disposal.
Lotus health and Anhui, thick, is the first intersection in 2017, June 2001.
At that time, the lotus Health Bulletin that its controlling shareholders of the Company core and investment holding company will be the Sale Shares of 1.15 billion shares (of the Company's total share capital of 10.83%) pledge to Anhui, thick, pledge for a period of one month, the pledge registration procedure has been completed. This is equivalent to a core purpose of investment in the health of the total number of shares held by the Lotus 98.94%. For the year ended on 7 February this year, the core purpose of investment has been in the lotus health of all shares pledged to Anhui, thick.
The lotus health and Anhui, thicker than the intersection between confined to the equity pledge in respect of claims which are linked.
In early February this year, the lotus health disclosure, the Company received the FUJIAN 平 million Fung-fu Investment Management Center Partnership (limited partnership) (hereinafter referred to as the Million Fung-fu) Notification of the assignment of the claim, on the basis of a feng-fu and the thickness of the Anhui signed the contract claims, Feng-fu is the law of the Company and the Sponsor's creditors and secured rights to transfer to the Anhui, thick, the Company and the Sponsor shall submit to the Anhui States fulfill their obligations under the thick repayment. Notice that the above-mentioned claims total contract amount of $2.2 billion.
Despite the fact that the Anhui thick already appears in the lotus health's board of directors which, according to its official website conversion information, it is clear that they have their own IPO plans.
Regardless, in less than a year, Anhui, thick from Lotus health strangers to the creditor, to today's principal, location, time is short, and the speed with which it was amazing.
The Executive Chairman of dense-for-blood brother exit the lotus health
newcomers to enter and exit the old face.
Concern for the long-term investors, listed companies, the Company's announcement is an important showcase listing company letter in the window. However, Lotus Health in May 2002, is the separation from the start.
On 8 May this year, Cinch Health Bulletin published
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Let's all get used to the fact that Dr tone hasn't got a pot to piss in . This club was bought for peanuts ffs even blues cost more .
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Anybody seen Simon Jordan's article .....worrying !!!
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Let's all get used to the fact that Dr tone hasn't got a pot to piss in . This club was bought for peanuts ffs even blues cost more .
I don't see how much Blues cost Carson Yeung has got to do with anything.
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I also think if we are this hard up financially, you only have to look around at other clubs to see that survival in the Championship for a few seasons, with a plan to build a side over time is not impossible.
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Let's all get used to the fact that Dr tone hasn't got a pot to piss in . This club was bought for peanuts ffs even blues cost more .
And you know that how exactly? We are bound by a stupid rule tying spending to revenues, so you have no idea if can or cannot spend beyond that.
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I like Tony but i'm still very much on the fence about how much he actually has to invest in the club, if FFP wasn't an issue obviously. Problem is there isn't much evidence to be able to sway one way or the other, we spent money the first year but a lot was parachute payments, and FFP has stopped much further investment. I guess one of the key things will be if he's injecting the £8m cash each year that allows us to lose £13m a year.
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You can lose an average of £13m a year in this division, so it's always £39m over a 3 year period for us now until we either leave this division or there's a rule changes. However that's only if the owner injects £8m cash into the club each year. If he doesn't then it's a £5m a year loss, so then we could only lose £15m over 3 years.
The trouble is that accounting years don't match up to football seasons. The first accounts we posted while in this division in 16/17 surely included our last year in the prem and the prem-level wages. As we were not subject to FFP in that time our losses in terms of FFP should not have been the same as the loss in our accounts, right?
In fact, the 14M loss we posted in Feb 2018 was to y/e 31st March 2017. Meaning the one we posted the year before was for prem season only. So while under FFP we have only reported one loss of 14M. Is the speculation that our second lot of accounts under FFP, to y/e 31st March 2019, will be a lot worse? If not, what's the problem?
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Let's all get used to the fact that Dr tone hasn't got a pot to piss in . This club was bought for peanuts ffs even blues cost more .
And you know that how exactly? We are bound by a stupid rule tying spending to revenues, so you have no idea if can or cannot spend beyond that.
and you have know idea he has got the dough have you !!!!
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Let's all get used to the fact that Dr tone hasn't got a pot to piss in . This club was bought for peanuts ffs even blues cost more .
Aaaaaaaaarrrrrggghhhhhhhh
FFP is restricting investment, it doesn’t make us ‘skint’. Xia bought the club for £57m (paid in cash), cleared £17m debt (in cash) and injected £49m cash into the club.
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You can lose an average of £13m a year in this division, so it's always £39m over a 3 year period for us now until we either leave this division or there's a rule changes. However that's only if the owner injects £8m cash into the club each year. If he doesn't then it's a £5m a year loss, so then we could only lose £15m over 3 years.
The trouble is that accounting years don't match up to football seasons. The first accounts we posted while in this division in 16/17 surely included our last year in the prem and the prem-level wages. As we were not subject to FFP in that time our losses in terms of FFP should not have been the same as the loss in our accounts, right?
In fact, the 14M loss we posted in Feb 2018 was to y/e 31st March 2017. Meaning the one we posted the year before was for prem season only. So while under FFP we have only reported one loss of 14M. Is the speculation that our second lot of accounts under FFP, to y/e 31st March 2019, will be a lot worse? If not, what's the problem?
FFP is ongoing for everyone. So the PL season does count. I do agree that it's awkward as the account years and seasons don't match, but I believe they take the last 2 published accounts and then the club issues a forecast for the third season. And i'm assuming they'll batter a club that takes the piss and says "oh we'll only lose a million this year" and then when the accounts are published it's actually a £50m loss.
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Let's all get used to the fact that Dr tone hasn't got a pot to piss in . This club was bought for peanuts ffs even blues cost more .
Aaaaaaaaarrrrrggghhhhhhhh
FFP is restricting investment, it doesn’t make us ‘skint’. Xia bought the club for £57m (paid in cash), cleared £17m debt (in cash) and injected £49m cash into the club.
The 49 mil, was this money injected by Tony or was it parachute money. That’s where I stand on this, has he injected an extra 49 mil or has he just used what was available? I am not up to speed with world football much. PSG must have smashed FFP have they lost any points?
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Just read they got a £50 mil fine. Now that’s wealthy owners!!!
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I can't say I've researched it myself but I'm told that's what companies house records say he has personally injected
When ffp restricted our ability to buy big transfers, we went out and got a load of short term players on premier league wages
I don't know how much more he's got to invest but I can't see any evidence that he's not doing as much as he is allowed to financially
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I suggest we take the PSG approach, sign a world star and self sponsor for multi millions. Claiming that the deals are financially commensurate because the player has put us on the world stage....
Unbelievable that they have got away with this. (So far)
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I don't think Dr. Xia has put much money in at all. Transfers have been funded mainly by Parachute payments. Now that is diminishing so is the owners interest. I just don't think he has the funds required. Hiding behind FFP. Time to sell up. He screwed it up with the appointment of RDM and wasted millions on mainly average players - Kodjia excepted.
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Xia stated none of the parachute money had been used for transfers.
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Xia stated none of the parachute money had been used for transfers.
Where is the parachute money then? It must have been used
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Xia stated none of the parachute money had been used for transfers.
Where is the parachute money then? It must have been used
I believe the point of them is largely to cover the wages of PL contracts.
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Where is the parachute money then?
It's still floating about in the clouds not weighty enough to make the parachute land.
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Xia stated none of the parachute money had been used for transfers.
Where is the parachute money then? It must have been used
I believe the point of them is largely to cover the wages of PL contracts.
Agreed. We came down with significant liabilities in contracts and I envisage a lot of it covered that.
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I don't think Dr. Xia has put much money in at all. Transfers have been funded mainly by Parachute payments. Now that is diminishing so is the owners interest. I just don't think he has the funds required. Hiding behind FFP. Time to sell up. He screwed it up with the appointment of RDM and wasted millions on mainly average players - Kodjia excepted.
His company put £49m in according to the last accounts.
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I don't think Dr. Xia has put much money in at all. Transfers have been funded mainly by Parachute payments. Now that is diminishing so is the owners interest. I just don't think he has the funds required. Hiding behind FFP. Time to sell up. He screwed it up with the appointment of RDM and wasted millions on mainly average players - Kodjia excepted.
His company put £49m in according to the last accounts.
I think where it gets interesting is what he does now if he manages to raise money by selling.
Sell Grealish for 30m and he might want to extract that money to cover some of his investment now we've failed to get promoted.
That's what worries me, that 'I am a Villa fan but I am also a businessman' thing.
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https://twitter.com/SwissRamble/status/1001380858983534593
Interesting read.
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https://twitter.com/SwissRamble/status/1001380858983534593
Interesting read.
I proper fancy him.
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I don't think Dr. Xia has put much money in at all. Transfers have been funded mainly by Parachute payments. Now that is diminishing so is the owners interest. I just don't think he has the funds required. Hiding behind FFP. Time to sell up. He screwed it up with the appointment of RDM and wasted millions on mainly average players - Kodjia excepted.
His company put £49m in according to the last accounts.
From memory, that was a loan though, and was due back within a year. Of course, he may have rolled it over.
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https://twitter.com/SwissRamble/status/1001380858983534593
Interesting read.
I proper fancy him.
He's a very sensitive lover, I am told.
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Very gentle for a man with such large hands.
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The shit rag are running a story that we’re in talks with a British consortium
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From yesterday, dbts. https://www.footballinsider247.com/tony-xia-makes-huge-100m-aston-villa-decision-report/
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heh, so a consortium who have the blackburn guy who oversaw their relegation to Div.1 and appointed Tony Mowbray?
NEXT!
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https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/football/6441572/consortium-set-to-launch-aston-villa-takeover-with-dr-tony-xia-ready-to-sell-after-failing-to-get-promotion/
Know it’s this rag but they are running with this
What do we say about linking to the Sun?
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Why are they using a picture of Ashley Young. Is he buying us?
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https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/football/6441572/consortium-set-to-launch-aston-villa-takeover-with-dr-tony-xia-ready-to-sell-after-failing-to-get-promotion/
Know it’s this rag but they are running with this
What do we say about linking to the Sun?
Removed the link
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Maybe Simon Jordan is part of it
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If I was Xia and could get my money back tomorrow, I'd dump it.
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Me too. The fact Xia has not rubbished any of the looking to sell stories on Twitter yet makes me think there is some truth in there too. His normal denial speed is a few hours, this has been a few days now.
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Good grief.
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Ah well. League 1 beckons. A bunch of nobodies takes us over recoups their money immediately by selling everything that moves. Goodbye millionaires row. Welcome to the Budleigh Salterton Retirement Home for the terminally short of cash.
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It took Lerner forever to find a buyer, and that's when we were still PL. Even if the interest is real I can't see them succeeding, particularly when we have additional debt to absorb.
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Budleigh Salterton? But that's in the UK. Much more likely the Panama City Virtual Bank Inc. Motto "Yow ent sin me royt".
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These stories are always going to be written when the club take the lazy option of not trying to control the message - so far in over a week we’ve had nothing but the nonsense, say nothing at all statement from Dr T - they’ve done literally nothing to reassure or show that there is a plan going forward.
Not even a ‘we go again’
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It took Lerner forever to find a buyer, and that's when we were still PL. Even if the interest is real I can't see them succeeding, particularly when we have additional debt to absorb.
Not sure we're not a better prospect actually than when Lerner sold. I mean we lost 81m in his last season compared to 14m in Tony's first. Plus the wage bill dropped by 30m. So even with no parachute payments we're a much more stable club financially. It's just mental Tony ever bought us in the first place i reckon.
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If he wants to sell, that's a pretty flaky type of buyer we attract.
All that 'OMG WE R GOING TO BUILD A SMART CITY IN ASTON11!!?1" and hinting we are getting a new North stand of exceptional beauty to "oh noes we didn't get promoted, I can't afford this, we've got to sell all the players, I'm off".
It's like that utter fucking chancer Lerner with his "we will be here thick or thin" which led to him bolting at the first sign of trouble but not before having utterly enfeebled the club.
What an absolute mess.
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If he wants to sell, that's a pretty flaky type of buyer we attract.
All that 'OMG WE R GOING TO BUILD A SMART CITY IN ASTON11!!?1" and hinting we are getting a new North stand of exceptional beauty to "oh noes we didn't get promoted, I can't afford this, we've got to sell all the players, I'm off".
It's like that utter fucking chancer Lerner with his "we will be here thick or thin" which led to him bolting at the first sign of trouble but not before having utterly enfeebled the club.
What an absolute mess.
A few people ( quite a few of us, in fact) raised concerns about Xia when he took over and were shouted down on here for daring to question him and his background.
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We're not taking an article in the Sun serious are we?
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I think I'll wait for a few better sources than a shitrag sun throwaway article before getting too worked up about this.
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It was comments from a former board member that worried me when Xia took over. I haven’t read the Sun article. I don’t read The Sun
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It seems a whole lot of conjecture from the Daily Star.
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Although this has been published in the rag, Simon Jordan hinted there are big things bubbling away behind the scenes concerning us that he could not talk about.
Over the past 6 months he has been immensely complimentary about us and has also been absolutely hammering BCFC in the public eye. I have been wondering why he had such beef with them, maybe it has a PR element about it.
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Although this has been published in the rag, Simon Jordan hinted there are big things bubbling away behind the scenes concerning us that he could not talk about.
Over the past 6 months he has been immensely complimentary about us and has also been absolutely hammering BCFC in the public eye. I have been wondering why he had such beef with them, maybe it has a PR element about it.
At least we could be sure we'd never get Trevor Francis in as manager.
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Although this has been published in the rag, Simon Jordan hinted there are big things bubbling away behind the scenes concerning us that he could not talk about.
But how the hell would that fruitcake know anything about what's going on at Villa ?
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Although this has been published in the rag, Simon Jordan hinted there are big things bubbling away behind the scenes concerning us that he could not talk about.
But how the hell would that fruitcake know anything about what's going on at Villa ?
Seems to me that most in charge of the Villa have little idea about what is going on!
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What makes you say that?
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Usually you would dismiss all this as rubbish, but Tony has been very quick on social media to put people straight. His silence on this speaks volumes.
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I think you're reading an incredible amount into him not being vocal on Twitter. He hasn't been as talkative for a while now.
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Anyone who buys a football club needs to have their business credentials questioned. As far as I can tell, the only person in history to make money out of owning a club was HDE.
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Usually you would dismiss all this as rubbish, but Tony has been very quick on social media to put people straight. His silence on this speaks volumes.
Well he's back in Beijing, presumably behind the big Chinese firewall. And as it's in The Sun, I still think it's horseshit.
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I think at this point in time, Xia does not want to get into a kick by kick account of what is going on. No doubt there are many away from the Club on holidays.
Would be interesting to know when they were all due to get together again.
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Although this has been published in the rag, Simon Jordan hinted there are big things bubbling away behind the scenes concerning us that he could not talk about.
But how the hell would that fruitcake know anything about what's going on at Villa ?
I think its more likely that he knows of something outside of Villa, through his connections within the game. Similarly, if TX was open to the possibility of offloading, someone like Jordan would come to hear of it.
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Half a day since a national newspaper (100% a rag but one that is read, lord knows why but it is), published an article that undermines the whole ownership of the football club with no response.
The management of the football club since the final whistle at Wembley has been as bad as the management that presided over that first 45 mins....guess the money in the bank from season ticket sales allows a degree of complacency when communicating with the supporter base.
A bit of bullishness wouldnt go amiss.
Holiday is no excuse, someone is in charge.....lead!
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You seriously think there should be a response for every bit of speculative garbage?
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Talksport have just been talking about the subject, also pointing out that there's been no word from Dr Tony.
Buckets to be passed round the Holte End in five years time to keep us afloat....?
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If they’d said something meaningful in the 8 days since Wembley those type of articles would have 0% credence - the radio silence makes you wonder if there is something in it, the source makes you believe there isn’t....so yes, the club needs leadership, it pays leaders very good salaries to lead so they need to manage the message.
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But there has been word. There's been a statement.
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You missed the word ‘meaningful’ out of my previous post.
Statement said nothing.
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(https://thumb.ibb.co/jVZkQ8/5_C9825_A8_50_D2_4_C9_A_B366_942_E432676_B6.jpg) (https://ibb.co/jVZkQ8)
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I find it hard to believe that he'd make a statement when he talks about getting back on our feet and trying again, only to think about selling up a few days later.
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https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/truth-behind-aston-villa-takeover-14740970
Tony Xia wants to breathe fresh life into Aston Villa and will only consider selling up as a last resort, BirminghamLive understands.
The vultures are circulating around Villa following the play-off final defeat to Fulham and potential investors believe they could purchase the club for a cut-price fee.
As many as FOUR different groups are interested in the Championship outfit, sources have told us, but Villa have received no offers at this stage.
There has also been no contact from the British-based consortium linked with a takeover bid in The Sun last night.
Meanwhile, back in China, Xia is exploring options to fund the 2018/19 campaign and help make Villa a success.
But with a limit on capital outflow, moving money out of his homeland has become increasingly difficult in recent times.
It’s one of the reasons why Villa have had to cut back in recent transfer windows.
Financial Fair Play is also another major problem. Last week we reported that Villa need to find £40million to fall in line with the regulations and it’s becoming apparent that a sale of Jack Grealish is inevitable.
The situation around Villa’s star man is sensitive.
He’s hurting as much as any fan right now after failing to win promotion back to the Premier League and faces a gut-wrenching decision about moving on.
Unusually, though, a departure might actually be the best thing for the club going forward.
Okay, so they lose their prized asset and the one die-hard fan remaining in the team.
But a transfer fee of around £30million would go some way to filling the black hole left by previous years of over-spending and the reduced parachute payments.
Villa have let John Terry and Gabby Agbonlahor go this summer and will not be able to sign any of the five loan players they had last season on permanent deals.
Xia warned of changes ahead in a carefully-worded statement last week and has since kept quiet as supporters bombard his Twitter page with questions about the future.
The Villa owner has invested around £150million in the club already following the takeover in 2016.
He considered buying other clubs in England before changing hands with Randy Lerner following relegation from the top-flight.
But it was that ‘love at first sight’ feeling that convinced him to purchase the claret and blues.
He still remains committed to Villa and wants to get the club back on the right track.
Reality has kicked in somewhat, though, following the Wembley defeat and another campaign in the Championship ahead.
That’s why potential new owners are monitoring the situation at Villa - and putting the feelers out to see whether Xia would sell.
It’s understood that selling would be an option, but only if he was able to get the money back that he paid for Villa two years ago.
For that to happen, though, Villa would need to receive a bid of around £80million and so far that hasn't been forthcoming.
Even if it was, there’s no guarantees that he would part ways after just two seasons, either.
A difficult summer lies ahead but Xia is committed to getting Villa prepared for the season ahead.
Losing Grealish - and maybe other top players - will kickstart the rebuild and then Villa can focus on what’s next.
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It's much more likely to be a few chancers who see a possibility of making a killing and floating the idea to the press, than anything else.
Come August 4th I'd expect Dr X & Bruce to still be in place but what the squad will look like is anyone's guess.
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If they’d said something meaningful in the 8 days since Wembley those type of articles would have 0% credence - the radio silence makes you wonder if there is something in it, the source makes you believe there isn’t....so yes, the club needs leadership, it pays leaders very good salaries to lead so they need to manage the message.
Out of interest, what do you mean by 'radio silence'?
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So first The Sun, now the Mail saying the opposite. You all realise this is all an exercise in sports journalists filling the requisite column inches in their respective rags, yeah?
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So first The Sun, now the Mail saying the opposite. You all realise this is all an exercise in sports journalists filling the requisite column inches in their respective rags, yeah?
And driving traffic to their click bait laden websites.
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So first The Sun, now the Mail saying the opposite. You all realise this is all an exercise in sports journalists filling the requisite column inches in their respective rags, yeah?
100% agree. We've all been following football for years and yet somehow we fall for the same bollocks every time. Or some of us do.
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God any visit to the mail's website is a truly painful experience.
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So first The Sun, now the Mail saying the opposite. You all realise this is all an exercise in sports journalists filling the requisite column inches in their respective rags, yeah?
"Journalists" Chris!
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But there has been word. There's been a statement.
Yes but some people want a statement every day, obviously if that happened then people would be moaning that an hour has gone by without a statement.
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I wonder if every set of supporters are so anxious to hear something all the time and if not, whether this all stems from the old board's early days when they seemed to have an open line to everybody with an internet connection.
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Any statement made by the Dr means we are skint/being sold/ selling all our best players. lack of a dailly statement by the Dr means we are skint/being sold selling all our best players.
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Any statement made by the Dr means we are skint/being sold/ selling all our best players. lack of a dailly statement by the Dr means we are skint/being sold selling all our best players.
Might be the case .But I demand to know how skint we are,who are we selling to and what players are being sold...now.
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I wonder if every set of supporters are so anxious to hear something all the time and if not, whether this all stems from the old board's early days when they seemed to have an open line to everybody with an internet connection.
It might have create some heightened expectations regarding communication and in turn be driving behaviour for some. Truth is it probably happens to some degree (less or more) at every club, and there is no way it will please everyone. The board says nothing cue skepticism and cynicism from some. The board says something it will prompt the same. The majority don't jump up and down, are concerned but don't hang off every word, and don't read all between the lines trying to find a hidden meaning or something that just isn't there.
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I wonder if every set of supporters are so anxious to hear something all the time and if not, whether this all stems from the old board's early days when they seemed to have an open line to everybody with an internet connection.
It might have create some heightened expectations regarding communication and in turn be driving behaviour for some. Truth is it probably happens to some degree (less or more) at every club, and there is no way it will please everyone. The board says nothing cue skepticism and cynicism from some. The board says something it will prompt the same. The majority don't jump up and down, are concerned but don't hang off every word, and don't read all between the lines trying to find a hidden meaning or something that just isn't there.
I suppose a lot of it is also down to the modern need for information to fill every gap in the internet, and to get it NOW. One story has to be credible and can be refuted. A hundred will be 99% rubbish and not worth dignifying with a reply.
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I wonder if every set of supporters are so anxious to hear something all the time and if not, whether this all stems from the old board's early days when they seemed to have an open line to everybody with an internet connection.
Of course they are. It's why owners and players have hundreds of thousands of followers on social media. People are used to minute by minute updates on everything in life, such is the information overload that is the modern world. As the saying goes, nature abhors a vacuum, and the Twitter generation abhors not being given updates every few seconds.
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So first The Sun, now the Mail saying the opposite. You all realise this is all an exercise in sports journalists filling the requisite column inches in their respective rags, yeah?
"Journalists" Chris!
What I said, ATAL.
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I wonder if every set of supporters are so anxious to hear something all the time and if not, whether this all stems from the old board's early days when they seemed to have an open line to everybody with an internet connection.
I think the last 3 years of Lerner has left deep scars and probably engendered a higher level of paranoia.
Other than Sunderland Has another high profile club recently traumatized its supporters as much as Villa have?
Add the internet era which this site is part of.
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I wonder if every set of supporters are so anxious to hear something all the time and if not, whether this all stems from the old board's early days when they seemed to have an open line to everybody with an internet connection.
I think the last 3 years of Lerner has left deep scars and probably engendered a higher level of paranoia.
Other than Sunderland Has another high profile club recently traumatized its supporters as much as Villa have?
Add the internet era which this site is part of.
Leeds, Leeds, Leeds.
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I wonder if every set of supporters are so anxious to hear something all the time and if not, whether this all stems from the old board's early days when they seemed to have an open line to everybody with an internet connection.
I think the last 3 years of Lerner has left deep scars and probably engendered a higher level of paranoia.
Other than Sunderland Has another high profile club recently traumatized its supporters as much as Villa have?
Add the internet era which this site is part of.
It’s some time since they were in the top flight but I get what you are saying.
Leeds, Leeds, Leeds.
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I wonder if every set of supporters are so anxious to hear something all the time and if not, whether this all stems from the old board's early days when they seemed to have an open line to everybody with an internet connection.
It might have create some heightened expectations regarding communication and in turn be driving behaviour for some. Truth is it probably happens to some degree (less or more) at every club, and there is no way it will please everyone. The board says nothing cue skepticism and cynicism from some. The board says something it will prompt the same. The majority don't jump up and down, are concerned but don't hang off every word, and don't read all between the lines trying to find a hidden meaning or something that just isn't there.
I suppose a lot of it is also down to the modern need for information to fill every gap in the internet, and to get it NOW. One story has to be credible and can be refuted. A hundred will be 99% rubbish and not worth dignifying with a reply.
Well that's the issue with 24 hour everything. The principle of time hasn't changed just that you can make a minute stretch for eternity when you keep clicking refresh. And the mind can play incredible tricks and take you to dark places. We're all devastated by how things transpired this season, and now with the consequences it's almost natural as football fans and especially us lot who have seen close to 10 years of decline to fear the worst. The end of Doug was meant to herald the "Bright Future". Instead "Bright Future" for us has almost come to mean almost the exact opposite of its intent or at minimum a term trampled on and treated with a degree of contempt.
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For what it’s worth the friendly Meaning Evil are now saying that the British consortium mentioned is bollocks, that Tony will only ever sell as a last resort and is now in China trying to think of ways of reenergising us.
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For what it’s worth the friendly Meaning Evil are now saying that the British consortium mentioned is bollocks, that Tony will only ever sell as a last resort and is now in China trying to think of ways of reenergising us.
I can think of a couple of ways.
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For what it’s worth the friendly Meaning Evil are now saying that the British consortium mentioned is bollocks, that Tony will only ever sell as a last resort and is now in China trying to think of ways of reenergising us.
I can think of a couple of ways.
Does one of them involve making a spectator sport out of cutting open Micah Richards and Ross McCormack in the winter and using their insides for warmth like Han Solo did to the TaunTaun in Empire?
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No point in flogging McCormack as far as FFP goes. Seen elsewhere that a 4m sale represents £166k profit.
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Plus £2m in wages at least
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Interesting little line in that article that hasn't really been picked up on here. Apparently China are stopping/limiting some of their residents moving capital out to foreign ventures so guess this is an additional problem we have on top of FFP now.
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Interesting little line in that article that hasn't really been picked up on here. Apparently China are stopping/limiting some of their residents moving capital out to foreign ventures so guess this is an additional problem we have on top of FFP now.
Depends what for. Infrastructure isn't an issue (redeveloping the local area). Pissing it away on John Terry's wages, not so much.
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Interesting little line in that article that hasn't really been picked up on here. Apparently China are stopping/limiting some of their residents moving capital out to foreign ventures so guess this is an additional problem we have on top of FFP now.
Depends what for. Infrastructure isn't an issue (redeveloping the local area). Pissing it away on John Terry's wages, not so much.
The key needs to be getting the first team competitive for another promotion push so it's obviously another barrier to that we could do without.
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Plus £2m in wages at least
The FFP profit includes that.
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Meanwhile, back in China, Xia is exploring options to fund the 2018/19 campaign and help make Villa a success.
But with a limit on capital outflow, moving money out of his homeland has become increasingly difficult in recent times.
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Millions move out of China every day. They are trying to clamp down on certain types of capital outflows,
Xia would have had approval at a pretty high level to make the initial investment so I don’t think this is a problem at this time.
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If they’d said something meaningful in the 8 days since Wembley those type of articles would have 0% credence - the radio silence makes you wonder if there is something in it, the source makes you believe there isn’t....so yes, the club needs leadership, it pays leaders very good salaries to lead so they need to manage the message.
Out of interest, what do you mean by 'radio silence'?
I don’t regard Dr T’s statement as anything of substance because it said nothing so for me radio silence is not trying to control the speculation, zero word from chief exec who is paid to lead.
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If they’d said something meaningful in the 8 days since Wembley those type of articles would have 0% credence - the radio silence makes you wonder if there is something in it, the source makes you believe there isn’t....so yes, the club needs leadership, it pays leaders very good salaries to lead so they need to manage the message.
Out of interest, what do you mean by 'radio silence'?
I don’t regard Dr T’s statement as anything of substance because it said nothing so for me radio silence is not trying to control the speculation, zero word from chief exec who is paid to lead.
That's a bit like the times when a question was asked and Doug/Mark Ansell, then Faulkner/Krulak/Fox gave the wrong answer so "They don't answer our questions". There's been one risible story about a takeover that was denied and nothing else has happened to comment on.
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If they’d said something meaningful in the 8 days since Wembley those type of articles would have 0% credence - the radio silence makes you wonder if there is something in it, the source makes you believe there isn’t....so yes, the club needs leadership, it pays leaders very good salaries to lead so they need to manage the message.
Out of interest, what do you mean by 'radio silence'?
I don’t regard Dr T’s statement as anything of substance because it said nothing so for me radio silence is not trying to control the speculation, zero word from chief exec who is paid to lead.
That's a bit like the times when a question was asked and Doug/Mark Ansell, then Faulkner/Krulak/Fox gave the wrong answer so "They don't answer our questions". There's been one risible story about a takeover that was denied and nothing else has happened to comment on.
That is true :-)
I guess what I hoped to see was the club come out on the front foot, clarify Bruce’s position either way quickly, address FFP & reassure that it wouldn’t be a fire sale of the couple of players who have enjoyed watching this season.
In hindsight maybe a touch unrealistic :-)
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They'd probably say that you can't be too specific because events can be unpredictable.
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Sure they would & there are a lot of unknowns between now and when season kicks off / transfer window closes and then the loan window closes - think I’m just getting impatient.
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And why do they need to clarify Bruce's position?
He's our manager until advised otherwise.
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And why do they need to clarify Bruce's position?
He's our manager until advised otherwise.
isn’t that the case for every manager ever at every club for all times
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And why do they need to clarify Bruce's position?
He's our manager until advised otherwise.
isn’t that the case for every manager ever at every club for all times
John I think you just opened a wormhole with that sentence
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Does anyone know if FFP also controls investment in infrastructure? Because if it doesn't I think now would be the time to show us fans and the rest of the world that Aston Villa far from being a fading has been of a club is still intent on being a major force in football. Show us the plans for the stadium. We need SOMETHING to get excited about. Show us you mean business Tony & Recon. Tell the fans they need to back the club now more than ever and get the ball rolling.
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Does anyone know if FFP also controls investment in infrastructure? Because if it doesn't I think now would be the time to show us fans and the rest of the world that Aston Villa far from being a fading has been of a club is still intent on being a major force in football. Show us the plans for the stadium. We need SOMETHING to get excited about. Show us you mean business Tony & Recon. Tell the fans they need to back the club now more than ever and get the ball rolling.
I can only speak for myself, but what point would there be in showing us plans for a new stand if it's only ever going to happen if we ever get promoted ?
I think we have far more pressing issues to deal with personally
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Because we need something to get excited about and the fans want to see it.
It's only some renders?
-
If they’d said something meaningful in the 8 days since Wembley those type of articles would have 0% credence - the radio silence makes you wonder if there is something in it, the source makes you believe there isn’t....so yes, the club needs leadership, it pays leaders very good salaries to lead so they need to manage the message.
Out of interest, what do you mean by 'radio silence'?
I don’t regard Dr T’s statement as anything of substance because it said nothing so for me radio silence is not trying to control the speculation, zero word from chief exec who is paid to lead.
That's a bit like the times when a question was asked and Doug/Mark Ansell, then Faulkner/Krulak/Fox gave the wrong answer so "They don't answer our questions". There's been one risible story about a takeover that was denied and nothing else has happened to comment on.
That is true :-)
I guess what I hoped to see was the club come out on the front foot, clarify Bruce’s position either way quickly, address FFP & reassure that it wouldn’t be a fire sale of the couple of players who have enjoyed watching this season.
In hindsight maybe a touch unrealistic :-)
No, it's what I was hoping for too.
We were hurting after the Play Off final, so if ever there was a time to galvanise the support base it was then.
Instead, Dr Ghost was straight into a spiel about operating as a sustainable football club. Well yes, absolutely. But that will be far easier in the top flight than dicking about the Championship (or lower) as per Leeds, Wednesday etc for the next few years.
Common sense tells you that we wouldn't be spending anywhere near what we did overall in 2016/17 or even last year. But perception is everything. That statement suggests the period of us actively trying to get out of this division is over and we're back in Lerner sell to buy territory (only worse). If we are rethinking the last ten years there were plenty of lessons to learn from that cack-handed approach. It wasn't a particularly clever strategy back then, I don't see why Ver 2.0 will be a whole pile better. Even if you do need to sell to buy, you don't broadcast that to the world and his wife. Driving down the value of the few saleable assets you may possess and simultaneously telling the world you are done as a competitive force.
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Because we need something to get excited about and the fans want to see it.
I don't know anyone that's aching to see it. I haven't even given it a second thought myself. It's just a stand. Seeing some elaborate plans for something we probably wont see for another five years at least wont give me a spring in the step i'm sure. Give the North Stand a jet wash by all means though.
As a supporter, i already know i need to be behind the club more than ever right now, and i'm just counting down the days til kick off so I can get back down Villa Park and get behind whatever side is on the pitch come August.
No drawings of new stands and dreams of increased capacity that we'll never need will make any difference in all honesty.
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Does anyone know if FFP also controls investment in infrastructure? Because if it doesn't I think now would be the time to show us fans and the rest of the world that Aston Villa far from being a fading has been of a club is still intent on being a major force in football. Show us the plans for the stadium. We need SOMETHING to get excited about. Show us you mean business Tony & Recon. Tell the fans they need to back the club now more than ever and get the ball rolling.
No FFP does not control investment on infrastructure.
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Absolutely KG. Could not agree more. The dog that does not bark in the night. Silences can often tell you more than the most lengthy and professionally crafted press releases can.
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We’re in a mess
(https://thumb.ibb.co/hjPkdT/FA1_EDDAF_F543_4_A11_932_B_A516355095_FF.png) (https://ibb.co/hjPkdT)
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He’s definitely been suspended. The rest who knows?
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God almighty.
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We’re is this coming from ??
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Because we need something to get excited about and the fans want to see it.
I don't know anyone that's aching to see it. I haven't even given it a second thought myself. It's just a stand. Seeing some elaborate plans for something we probably wont see for another five years at least wont give me a spring in the step i'm sure. Give the North Stand a jet wash by all means though.
As a supporter, i already know i need to be behind the club more than ever right now, and i'm just counting down the days til kick off so I can get back down Villa Park and get behind whatever side is on the pitch come August.
No drawings of new stands and dreams of increased capacity that we'll never need will make any difference in all honesty.
I merely mentioned it because the Club and fans are in need of a good news story right now. Obviously in the light of the Wyness revelations the club have more pressing problems but this does highlight my point. Were in desperate need of some positive news.
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Agree Edge.
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And why do they need to clarify Bruce's position?
He's our manager until advised otherwise.
isn’t that the case for every manager ever at every club for all times
Yes. Exactly.
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What makes you say that?
Let's call it a wild stab in the dark!
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As if things couldn't get any worse....idiots in charge of our great club. A disgrace and an embarrassment.
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What makes you say that?
Let's call it a wild stab in the dark!
I had one of those once, she was fit.
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A club with a billionaire owner (supposedly) facing a winding up order! You couldn't make it up!
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What makes you say that?
Let's call it a wild stab in the dark!
I had one of those once, she was fit.
Thank you Drummond for cheering me up in this dark hour!
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A club with a billionaire owner (supposedly) facing a winding up order! You couldn't make it up!
I've had HCE in the office of every insurer going too. They're multi billion pound institutions.
It's embarrassing for sure, but I won't panic yet. Or ever mind. Play the card you're dealt.
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What makes you say that?
Let's call it a wild stab in the dark!
I had one of those once, she was fit.
How do you know she was fit, if it was dark?
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What makes you say that?
Let's call it a wild stab in the dark!
I had one of those once, she was fit.
How do you know she was fit, if it was dark?
Could have been Brian May.
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What makes you say that?
Let's call it a wild stab in the dark!
I had one of those once, she was fit.
How do you know she was fit, if it was dark?
Could have been Brian May.
Or Theresa May.
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And I thought Lerner, Faulkner and company were incompetent!
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And I thought Lerner, Faulkner and company were incompetent!
They were. But at least Lerner had deep enough pockets to pay for it.
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Dr Tone is skint, the mask has fallen.
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Tony Xia, come on down.
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I guess on the bright side there are a few league 1, 2 and Conference grounds I have never done. I will go whatever.
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Tony Xia, come on down.
Let's hope the guy is not Hong Kong Phoney - look how we mocked Small Heath and their hairdresser owner
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We are fucked aren't we!
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We are fucked aren't we!
No, I have offered 50p for the stadium naming rights next year
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We are fucked aren't we!
No, I have offered 50p for the stadium naming rights next year
And where are you finding that?
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We are fucked aren't we!
No. Being f*cked generally involves at least a brief moment of pleasure.
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We are fucked aren't we!
No, I have offered 50p for the stadium naming rights next year
And where are you finding that?
Just sold my season ticket back :)
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Hearing from several sources now that Aston Villa's financial difficulties are serious. This could very well lead to administration unless a buyer steps in to rescue it. Whether Xia would talk sensible numbers, though, is quite another matter. #AVFC
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Hearing from several sources now that Aston Villa's financial difficulties are serious. This could very well lead to administration unless a buyer steps in to rescue it. Whether Xia would talk sensible numbers, though, is quite another matter. #AVFC
How can a buyer rescue us, serious question?
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Thank God Lerner didn't sell to Larry Ellis 😑
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Hearing from several sources now that Aston Villa's financial difficulties are serious. This could very well lead to administration unless a buyer steps in to rescue it. Whether Xia would talk sensible numbers, though, is quite another matter. #AVFC
How can a buyer rescue us, serious question?
By paying off the debts and buying us?
-
Hearing from several sources now that Aston Villa's financial difficulties are serious. This could very well lead to administration unless a buyer steps in to rescue it. Whether Xia would talk sensible numbers, though, is quite another matter. #AVFC
How can a buyer rescue us, serious question?
By paying off the debts and buying us?
If X had money, or Recon, could a subsidiary do it? How would a new owner affect FFP?
It makes my head hurt.
-
Hearing from several sources now that Aston Villa's financial difficulties are serious. This could very well lead to administration unless a buyer steps in to rescue it. Whether Xia would talk sensible numbers, though, is quite another matter. #AVFC
How can a buyer rescue us, serious question?
By paying off the debts and buying us?
If X had money, or Recon, could a subsidiary do it? How would a new owner affect FFP?
It makes my head hurt.
I think FFP is much more of a secondary issue if Tony has no money.
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The only way they could do it was paying off the debts without bank funding ie if a sugar daddy wanted to pay off and start again. By far the most sensible way of doing it would be to buy the club out of Administration and take the ten point penalty you’d start with next season.
-
Hearing from several sources now that Aston Villa's financial difficulties are serious. This could very well lead to administration unless a buyer steps in to rescue it. Whether Xia would talk sensible numbers, though, is quite another matter. #AVFC
How can a buyer rescue us, serious question?
By paying off the debts and buying us?
If X had money, or Recon, could a subsidiary do it? How would a new owner affect FFP?
It makes my head hurt.
Guess administration and a new owner might result in a CVA, new owner would agree a payment plan with HMRC and others. Really hope its not that bad, we pay what we owe and move on, it dosent look very good though
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All very worrying. Just how in the name of God has this been allowed to happen. The owner needs to make a statement ASAP, he just can't allow the situation to drift.
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All very worrying. Just how in the name of God has this been allowed to happen. The owner needs to make a statement ASAP, he just can't allow the situation to drift.
He’s probably sleeping now.
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All very worrying. Just how in the name of God has this been allowed to happen. The owner needs to make a statement ASAP, he just can't allow the situation to drift.
He’s probably sleeping now.
With the fishes
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John Percy
@JPercyTelegraph
Understand Trevor Birch - previously chief executive at #cfc and #lufc, among others - is now working closely with Aston Villa. Birch is renowned as an insolvency expert... #avfc
8:42 pm · 5 Jun 2018
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John Percy
@JPercyTelegraph
Understand Trevor Birch - previously chief executive at #cfc and #lufc, among others - is now working closely with Aston Villa. Birch is renowned as an insolvency expert... #avfc
8:42 pm · 5 Jun 2018
And may also just be there, taking over from Wyness because we don't have a CEO and Birch is one?
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John Percy
@JPercyTelegraph
Understand Trevor Birch - previously chief executive at #cfc and #lufc, among others - is now working closely with Aston Villa. Birch is renowned as an insolvency expert... #avfc
8:42 pm · 5 Jun 2018
And may also just be there, taking over from Wyness because we don't have a CEO and Birch is one?
According to Wikipedia, he oversaw (if that's the right word) a few takeovers at some clubs.
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Sold Chelsea to Roman and then went to Everton. Aided Pompey and sold Bolton on too.
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Sold Chelsea to Roman and then went to Everton. Aided Pompey and sold Bolton on too.
Interestingly he facilitated the sale of Portsmouth to the Pompey Supporters Trust which is maybe the route we'll all need to go down to shepherd our beloved Villa out of the darkness and back into the light... Or a wealthy American, there's always a wealthy American
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Yes branding him an insolvency expert seems a bit sensationalist
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He’ll be selling us at Bassetts Pole car boot on Sunday
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We are fucked aren't we!
No, I have offered 50p for the stadium naming rights next year
And where are you finding that?
Just sold my season ticket back :)
You seem to be the only one finding humour and enjoyment out of all this. I wonder why.........
-
We are fucked aren't we!
No, I have offered 50p for the stadium naming rights next year
And where are you finding that?
Just sold my season ticket back :)
You seem to be the only one finding humour and enjoyment out of all this. I wonder why.........
sometimes in adversity and all that.
-
We are fucked aren't we!
No, I have offered 50p for the stadium naming rights next year
And where are you finding that?
Just sold my season ticket back :)
You seem to be the only one finding humour and enjoyment out of all this. I wonder why.........
sometimes in adversity and all that.
Nah
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Aston Villa in turmoil after failure to pay tax bill of £5m
By Laurie Whitwell for MailOnline 21:14, 05 Jun 2018, updated 21:31, 05 Jun 2018
Aston Villa have been plunged into further uncertainty after the club suspended chief executive Keith Wyness amid a failure to pay a late tax bill just shy of £5million to HMRC.
It is understood Villa had been given until last Friday to settle the overdue sum but missed the date and were threatened with a winding up order.
The club insist the matter will be resolved inside 48 hours - with an initial payment of £2m - but Sportsmail understands there are allegations owner Dr Tony Xia has failed to put cash into the club for three months, raising huge concerns. Xia is said to have been struggling to get money out of China following a government clampdown.
Owner Dr Tony Xia has failed to put any money into Aston Villa in the past three months
It is said Wyness, in his duty to find financial alternatives, was trying to raise funds through minor investors but Xia reacted badly to advice and temporarily dismissed his top executive.
In an alternative version of events it has been claimed Wyness was attempting to bring together a consortium to buy the club without Xia's prior knowledge. The Chinese businessman then found out and acted.
Either way, Villa are left rudderless well into a vital transfer window where £40m of savings must be found to adhere to Financial Fair Play regulations. Jack Grealish could be sold for £30m, while clubs are interested in £10m-rated James Chester.
A Villa statement read: 'Aston Villa Football Club can confirm that chief executive, Keith Wyness, has been suspended by the club with immediate effect. Owner and chairman, Dr Tony Xia will assume the role until further notice. There will be no further comment from the club at this time.
Director of football Steve Round also faces an uncertain future given he was a Wyness appointment. That in turn leads to significant scrutiny on Steve Bruce's position with the manager not yet told of summer plans.
Bruce, currently on holiday, still has not received detailed communication about the impending cost-cutting or been given assurances he will lead the team into next season.
In a statement last week Xia failed to clarify whether the 57-year-old would continue following play-off final defeat.
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Aston Villa in turmoil after failure to pay tax bill of £5m
By Laurie Whitwell for MailOnline 21:14, 05 Jun 2018, updated 21:31, 05 Jun 2018
Aston Villa have been plunged into further uncertainty after the club suspended chief executive Keith Wyness amid a failure to pay a late tax bill just shy of £5million to HMRC.
It is understood Villa had been given until last Friday to settle the overdue sum but missed the date and were threatened with a winding up order.
The club insist the matter will be resolved inside 48 hours - with an initial payment of £2m - but Sportsmail understands there are allegations owner Dr Tony Xia has failed to put cash into the club for three months, raising huge concerns. Xia is said to have been struggling to get money out of China following a government clampdown.
Owner Dr Tony Xia has failed to put any money into Aston Villa in the past three months
It is said Wyness, in his duty to find financial alternatives, was trying to raise funds through minor investors but Xia reacted badly to advice and temporarily dismissed his top executive.
In an alternative version of events it has been claimed Wyness was attempting to bring together a consortium to buy the club without Xia's prior knowledge. The Chinese businessman then found out and acted.
Wanker
-
Sold Chelsea to Roman and then went to Everton. Aided Pompey and sold Bolton on too.
Interestingly he facilitated the sale of Portsmouth to the Pompey Supporters Trust which is maybe the route we'll all need to go down to shepherd our beloved Villa out of the darkness and back into the light... Or a wealthy American, there's always a wealthy American
I think perhaps we need to reign in the speculation.
-
Sold Chelsea to Roman and then went to Everton. Aided Pompey and sold Bolton on too.
Interestingly he facilitated the sale of Portsmouth to the Pompey Supporters Trust which is maybe the route we'll all need to go down to shepherd our beloved Villa out of the darkness and back into the light... Or a wealthy American, there's always a wealthy American
I think perhaps we need to reign in the speculation.
Rein*. Twas meant in jest Adser
-
According to somewhere else we apparently traded in further instalements on Amavi and Carlos Sanchez's transfer fees in Feburary after the window closed to an Australian bank in exchange for immediate cash to cope with cash flow issues at the time.
Looks like things have been bubbling for a while and it's all coming out now we've lost the final and our prospects look pretty bleak in the short term.
-
Adser is a new one.
-
Aston Villa in turmoil after failure to pay tax bill of £5m
By Laurie Whitwell for MailOnline 21:14, 05 Jun 2018, updated 21:31, 05 Jun 2018
Aston Villa have been plunged into further uncertainty after the club suspended chief executive Keith Wyness amid a failure to pay a late tax bill just shy of £5million to HMRC.
It is understood Villa had been given until last Friday to settle the overdue sum but missed the date and were threatened with a winding up order.
The club insist the matter will be resolved inside 48 hours - with an initial payment of £2m - but Sportsmail understands there are allegations owner Dr Tony Xia has failed to put cash into the club for three months, raising huge concerns. Xia is said to have been struggling to get money out of China following a government clampdown.
Owner Dr Tony Xia has failed to put any money into Aston Villa in the past three months
It is said Wyness, in his duty to find financial alternatives, was trying to raise funds through minor investors but Xia reacted badly to advice and temporarily dismissed his top executive.
In an alternative version of events it has been claimed Wyness was attempting to bring together a consortium to buy the club without Xia's prior knowledge. The Chinese businessman then found out and acted.
Either way, Villa are left rudderless well into a vital transfer window where £40m of savings must be found to adhere to Financial Fair Play regulations. Jack Grealish could be sold for £30m, while clubs are interested in £10m-rated James Chester.
A Villa statement read: 'Aston Villa Football Club can confirm that chief executive, Keith Wyness, has been suspended by the club with immediate effect. Owner and chairman, Dr Tony Xia will assume the role until further notice. There will be no further comment from the club at this time.
Director of football Steve Round also faces an uncertain future given he was a Wyness appointment. That in turn leads to significant scrutiny on Steve Bruce's position with the manager not yet told of summer plans.
Bruce, currently on holiday, still has not received detailed communication about the impending cost-cutting or been given assurances he will lead the team into next season.
In a statement last week Xia failed to clarify whether the 57-year-old would continue following play-off final defeat.
Interesting article. It's not often you get two versions of what has happened in the same article. Sounds like a bit of dartboard reporting.
-
We could do with one of his cryptic/complete nonsense tweets to clear things up and put our minds at rest.
-
He’ll be selling us at Bassetts Pole car boot on Sunday
With the African Car Reverser?
-
Illuminating. Could be a. Or b. Or maybe c. Or option g.
-
All very worrying. Just how in the name of God has this been allowed to happen. The owner needs to make a statement ASAP, he just can't allow the situation to drift.
Yes what we need now is another meaningless and/or embarrassing statement from clown Xia
-
All very worrying. Just how in the name of God has this been allowed to happen. The owner needs to make a statement ASAP, he just can't allow the situation to drift.
Yes what we need now is another meaningless and/or embarrassing statement from clown Xia
So with zero facts, other than the CEO being suspended, you've decided Xia is a "clown"?
On what basis?
-
All very worrying. Just how in the name of God has this been allowed to happen. The owner needs to make a statement ASAP, he just can't allow the situation to drift.
Yes what we need now is another meaningless and/or embarrassing statement from clown Xia
So with zero facts, other than the CEO being suspended, you've decided Xia is a "clown"?
On what basis?
To be fair, our inability to pay our PAYE bill is pretty embarrassing.
-
All very worrying. Just how in the name of God has this been allowed to happen. The owner needs to make a statement ASAP, he just can't allow the situation to drift.
Yes what we need now is another meaningless and/or embarrassing statement from clown Xia
So with zero facts, other than the CEO being suspended, you've decided Xia is a "clown"?
On what basis?
To be fair, our inability to pay our PAYE bill is pretty embarrassing.
Something which is more likely to be the responsibility of the CEO rather than the owner.
-
All very worrying. Just how in the name of God has this been allowed to happen. The owner needs to make a statement ASAP, he just can't allow the situation to drift.
Yes what we need now is another meaningless and/or embarrassing statement from clown Xia
So with zero facts, other than the CEO being suspended, you've decided Xia is a "clown"?
On what basis?
To be fair, our inability to pay our PAYE bill is pretty embarrassing.
Something which is more likely to be the responsibility of the CEO rather than the owner.
The owner who is incapacitated in his desire to sort the club out?
The one who used a factoring company on the Amavi transfer money?
What a mess.
It's all smelling a bit Carson Yeung. Or a bit Leeds, even worse.
-
In the back of my mind I have a vivid recollection of Dr Tony saying he'd got a 2 year plan to get back in the Premiership when he took over. No panic when Di Matteo was sacked, & no panic when we didn't go up last summer.
He didn't say what might happen if we didn't go up this year, however...
SVC on Twatter will have some credence on saying Wyness was talking to new investors / owners without Dr Tony's knowledge.
Palace in the mire for their tax affairs too - https://www.theguardian.com/football/2018/jun/05/crystal-palace-threatened-with-being-dissolved-over-late-accounts - perhaps, like some of my bills they've both missed the month end payment date...looking for positives...
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We did pretty much gamble everything on going up this year.
Nothing new there, plenty of other teams similar to us have done that down the years. Wolves would've been in major trouble if they hadn't gone up this season themselves.
Difference is they remembered to turn up and actually win their important matches during the season. We didn't and will have to face the consequences.
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I can't help but think that in his shoes, I wouldn't have suspended Wyness if I had any intentions of continuing. Given the crisis we are already in, it would be the last thing we'd want. It HAS to be that he was touting the club. Perhaps it's wishful thinking on my part but I'm hoping the suspension is the beginning of the end as it all ends in tears for the Xia era.
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In the back of my mind I have a vivid recollection of Dr Tony saying he'd got a 2 year plan to get back in the Premiership when he took over. No panic when Di Matteo was sacked, & no panic when we didn't go up last summer.
He didn't say what might happen if we didn't go up this year, however...
SVC on Twatter will have some credence on saying Wyness was talking to new investors / owners without Dr Tony's knowledge.
Palace in the mire for their tax affairs too - https://www.theguardian.com/football/2018/jun/05/crystal-palace-threatened-with-being-dissolved-over-late-accounts - perhaps, like some of my bills they've both missed the month end payment date...looking for positives...
I think Xia tweeted around the beginning of the season that they had envisaged a three year effort at most to get promoted.
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I've always believed for Tony it was a calculated gamble, spend the money get promotion then sell at a tidy profit. The gamble failed now he will do his level best to extricate himself without losing too much money. Whatever, I believe we will have a new owner or owners by the start of the new season.
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I really don't think it was his plan to get out
He might be forced to
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Dr Tony is a good man the play off final is a major set back.
I feel he has the assets and finances it just difficult at this moment. I think ceo going is good all round. Outdated and now out the door.
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All very worrying. Just how in the name of God has this been allowed to happen. The owner needs to make a statement ASAP, he just can't allow the situation to drift.
Yes what we need now is another meaningless and/or embarrassing statement from clown Xia
So with zero facts, other than the CEO being suspended, you've decided Xia is a "clown"?
On what basis?
2 yrs ago he was pledging to be in the champions league, promised ground improvements and redevelopment of Aston. Now he can't pay our tax. He ain't got a clue
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There is a distinction between cannot pay and has not paid.
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I put it to you that he has not paid it because he could not pay it.
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All very worrying. Just how in the name of God has this been allowed to happen. The owner needs to make a statement ASAP, he just can't allow the situation to drift.
Yes what we need now is another meaningless and/or embarrassing statement from clown Xia
So with zero facts, other than the CEO being suspended, you've decided Xia is a "clown"?
On what basis?
2 yrs ago he was pledging to be in the champions league, promised ground improvements and redevelopment of Aston. Now he can't pay our tax. He ain't got a clue
Crikey. You set pretty high expectations if you thought we'd be in the Champions League in a redeveloped ground by now.
Had we beat Fulham, none of this would be happening and I'm pretty confident there would already be renders of a new North Stand in the public domain.
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I put it to you that he has not paid it because he could not pay it.
And I put you to proof on the same.
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I refer the honourable gentleman to various circumstantial evidence statements that allude to the notion that the bill remains unpaid and that furthermore, statements to the effect that the club are working with the HMRC on the matter point to (at least a short term) inability to meet its liabilities as and when they fall due.
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I agree the stuff Tony was saying about competing in champions league in short term always made you worry about his grip on reality.
Howard Hodgson has posted this. He does quite like to big himself up but there does seem to be a growing consensus that this is the cause of the cashflow problems. I doubt any of us know what options he's got to get around these controls but it's hard to think they're easy. And then there is speculation that this is a smokescreen too
Our beloved #avfc is having big cash flow issues. The owner @Dr_TonyXia is doing everything he can to resolve this. It is to do with China foreign currency release hence similar issues at the Milan clubs. I am doing all I can to help him and the club. #sticktogether #avfc #utv
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I read that HH is on the case and helping out the doc, we can all breathe a sigh of relief now.
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Good God Hodgson.
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No idea who HH is.
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Is that the fella with the boat, who doesn’t like to talk about it much?
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I know a lot of people have a few opinions on HH (good and bad) but he genuinely loves the club (as we all do) and is just trying to help out as much as possible given the shit we are currently in. Fairplay!
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We could do with one of his cryptic/complete nonsense tweets to clear things up and put our minds at rest.
I’m sorry but that’s not good enough now. Powerpoint presentation, please.
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Whatever we thought about him at the time, such sloppy management would never have happened under Deadly Doug.
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Whatever we thought about him at the time, such sloppy management would never have happened under Deadly Doug.
We were in a desperate position when Doug sold the club in in 2006 due to epic financial mismanagement from September 1998 onwards.
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Whatever we thought about him at the time, such sloppy management would never have happened under Deadly Doug.
We were in a desperate position when Doug sold the club in in 2006 due to epic financial mismanagement from September 1998 onwards.
We owe HMRC over £4m, according to reports, and we need to find it fast. Micah Richards hasn't played for us for nearly 600 days but we continue to pay him £35k per week. By the time his contract expires in 12 months time, and assuming that no other club is daft enough to buy/loan him from us, we will have paid him over £4m for not playing for us. Absolute madness
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What exactly is HH doing about it?
I'm doing all I can to help too. Fuck all other than discussing it here.
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What exactly is HH doing about it?
I'm doing all I can to help too. Fuck all other than discussing it here.
He's remortgaging his boat (the one he doesn't like to talk about)
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No idea who HH is.
He is considerably richer than yow.
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What exactly is HH doing about it?
I'm doing all I can to help too. Fuck all other than discussing it here.
He's staking out a caravan park near Oswestry. Just in case, like.
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Maybe this now, will make the football authorities review there fit and proper person test's, if the potential buyer is from a country that can suddenly stop its business people from moving money around as they see fit, then surely they should not be allowed to invest in a British business, or more to the point a British football club, as most of them need capital injections a number of times a year.
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Looking back at the statement the bit about being a sustainable club was, by most, considered to be an FFP related comment but I wonder if it was actually more cashflow related now that all this news is coming out. If you add that he left the country very quickly after the final and has been unnaturally quiet on twitter I'd like to believe that he is trying to convince Chinese authorities to let him invest more money. It may well be that to do so he has to make a number of changes (which he said in the statement as well) including altering the structure/make-up of the board and a different sponsorship program (along with the expected change of relying more on youth players and coaching).
The suspension suggests something more than just Xia wanting to make board level changes but with the HMRC stuff, rumours of takeover bids and the potential disagree over Bruce it might just be a convenient way to make the changes and look to a CEO with a more suitable background, the Trevor Birch link gives that some weight, even if only as a temporary arrangement.
This is purely speculation but to me it seems as reasonable as most other suggestions I've seen.
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Just heard a rumour that Xia was banking on promotion to clear debts he has in China. No sources, and I hesitate to use the phrase "Chinese whispers"...
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I’m sorry but this made me laugh.
But there are concerns the businessman, who has turned up at the training ground previously in a Uber, simply doesn't have the resources or access to cash he suggested when he bought out Randy Lerner in 2016.
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What exactly is HH doing about it?
I'm doing all I can to help too. Fuck all other than discussing it here.
He could be helping Tony locate his missing passbook.
"When did you last make a deposit?"
"Have you looked under your bed?"
"Did you check your pockets before putting your trousers in the laundry basket?"
"It's not with the key to your money box, is it?"
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We never really knew about the reality of the Docs wealth but I read 3 articles about moving money out of China all saying the same, "China law forbids anyone from sending out of China more than USD$50,000 in any given year without government approval".
I knew there were difficulties now but only $50,000...that shocked me.
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Just heard a rumour that Xia was banking on promotion to clear debts he has in China. No sources, and I hesitate to use the phrase "Chinese whispers"...
I do wonder if they were banking on promotion to the Premier League and the revenue that brings to try and address the quite obvious financial difficulties at the club.
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What exactly is HH doing about it?
I'm doing all I can to help too. Fuck all other than discussing it here.
Hopefully he’s coming up with another insightful ‘Hodgson Report’
The last one suggested we buy better players, coach our youngsters better and score more goals. It was groundbreaking stuff.
I imagine this one will say don’t but old players and put them on massive contracts and check down the sofa for loose change.
In Hairy Hands we trust.
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What exactly is HH doing about it?
I'm doing all I can to help too. Fuck all other than discussing it here.
Hopefully he’s coming up with another insightful ‘Hodgson Report’
Perhaps he could arrange for Tony to stuff a few million in one of his coffins and stick it on a container ship bound for the UK.
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Been reported on twitter (I know !) there is a board meeting at 2pm today?
The collection plate will be passed around at then end, no doubt.
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Attendees : Dr T Xia
Apologies: Mr K Wyness
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https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/inside-story-behind-aston-villa-12655774
Aston Villa owner, Dr Tony Xia, has been bankrolling the former European Champions from the moment he set foot inside Villa Park.
Each month, money would arrive from China, into Villa's bank account to make good the shortfall in normal trading operations.
That has happened, without fail, for the past two years.
Only last month, it didn't. April's money was received. May's wasn't. There was no sign of it turning up. It still hasn't.
Incredibly, that is all it has taken to bring this great football club – this cornerstone of the English game - to its knees.
One missed monthly payment. It's a sizeable one. Aston Villa are running a £5-6m monthly deficit on their current outgoings. But still.
Tony Xia with Steve Bruce (Image: Neville Williams)
And now that has set in motion a chain of events that is likely to see the club change ownership. That is one scenario.
The other is far more unpalatable. Administration – or, if a position with HMRC is not met – a winding up order may be issued.
No more Aston Villa. Doesn't bear thinking about.
Obviously, promotion to the Premier League would have solved the on-going cash crisis.
No wonder Xia, who sat stony-faced at Wembley as Fulham cavorted around the pitch just ten days ago, was unable to show any other emotion.
His world was just about to come crashing around him.
Perhaps it was a taste of things to come. Xia did not sit with his chief executive, Keith Wyness, at the play-off final. Behind the scenes, they had been seated on separate tables.
Strange, you might think, for the two chief decision-makers not to be joined at the hip – to not share the inevitable joy or pain that was about to be inflicted upon them.
But the writing was on the wall.
A few weeks earlier, Wyness, along with director of football Steve Round, had delivered a presentation to Xia at Bodymoor Heath, outlining the two courses of action that would be taken once Villa had qualified for the end-of-season lottery English football calls the play-offs.
One was promotion to the Premier League, the other staying right where Villa were, in the Championship.
Xia received the news. Didn't blink. Didn't move a muscle. Did not utter one single word.
The three-minute silence was eventually broken by Rongtien He, Xia's eyes and ears at Villa Park.
The result of that meeting led Wyness to confess later to a high-level colleague: “Anything other than promotion is not an option.”
By the time the final whistle blew at Wembley, the chief executive knew that he had to act. He had to take action as per his fiduciary duties as a director of the club.
He knew that the money from the Far East had not been received into Villa's bank account. He had to do something. And swiftly.
Steve Bruce looks dejected (Image: Getty Images Europe)
Late last week, with the club's payroll due on Friday, Wyness was on the phone, trying to raise the cash to pay it.
Burnley were contacted. Villa were due another chunk of money from Ashley Westwood's £5m transfer later this month.
They took a hit but the money turned up and the staff were paid. Wyness knew that this could not keep going indefinitely.
Any director who has an inkling that the club is trading insolvently must take advice. That was incumbent upon him.
As a director, he could also put the club into administration. It was that which has led Xia to trashing Wyness's reputation after Villa released a statement suspending their chief executive yesterday afternoon.
The next bill was from HMRC for £4.2m. That was the lever for Xia to use to put Wyness on gardening leave.
The authorities have been as aggressive as you might expect them to be in recovering that cash.
In just over three weeks time, Villa are due to make another payroll payment.
The bills just keep coming. And the cash position is little short of horrendous.
Anyone seeking to take on Villa as a going concern will have to make good a staggering £70m shortfall during the course of the next 12 months.
Due to existing contractual commitments the budget is showing a £25m deficit for 2019-20.
That is a £100m hole that needs plugging.
The parachute payment from the Premier League has dropped to £15m. The cash call is growing, not slowing.
Anyone interested in Villa will have to show a commitment to meeting those costs.
At this rate, Xia won't be seeing much back for his £150m gamble during the past two seasons.
He will be lucky to see the club change hands for £1 because someone has got to make good on his reckless calls.
Due to the football creditors' rule, the likes of Micah Richards, Pierluigi Gollini, Ross McCormack – none of whom kicked a ball in anger last season – will all have to be paid their monstrous salaries.
Xia will be lucky if he trousers anything from this.
He could, of course, raise some cash from selling assets.
Jack Grealish is the main one. A public auction might top £30m for the playmaker who has the world at his feet.
That would meet some of the on-going costs. Buy him some time, potentially, to off-load the club to a buyer.
Villa will auction off Grealish (Image: Clive Mason)
And what of Steve Bruce, the manager who drew together a disparate dressing-room and took Villa to within 90 minutes of diverting this disaster from public attention?
His future has been a subject of debate on message boards and in social media.
He will stay put. He's a tough cookie, Bruce. And anyway, paying him off is a long way down the club's list of priorities.
For now, Xia's got bigger issues to sort out. Like keeping Aston Villa afloat.
:o
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From John Percy at the Telegraph....Understand Trevor Birch - previously chief executive at #cfc and #lufc, among others - is now working closely with Aston Villa. Birch is renowned as an insolvency expert... #avfc
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Fucking hell.
-
There is no way we can avoid Administration if that lot is true.
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Yep, if true next season is about survival and hoping the youth come good.
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Sounds like that has come directly from Wyness. Frightening stuff.
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So Wyness is blabbing away to the fucking Mirror now. I detest football sometimes.
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So Wyness has got his side of the story out to the Mirror then......
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Fucking hell.
Fucking hell.
-
He is right though. He cannot knowingly wrongfully trade as a Statutory Director.
-
So Wyness is blabbing away to the fucking Mirror now. I detest football sometimes.
Can't say I blame him if he's being used as a whipping boy for Xia's mistakes.
-
So Simon Jordan was correct.How did he know?
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what shambles we have been for a very long time
Im off to London to see The The now , with an uncertain smile ...
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So Simon Jordan was correct.How did he know?
Gossip within the game, if we’ve contacted Burnley and be prepared to take a hit for a a payment a few weeks early then that’s something worth blabbing about.
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As Yeats obviously meant to say, 'everything is fucked, fucked utterly.'
-
So Simon Jordan was correct.How did he know?
Gossip within the game, if we’ve contacted Burnley and be prepared to take a hit for a a payment a few weeks early then that’s something worth blabbing about.
We were not the only people wanting us to win the Play off Final.
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So Simon Jordan was correct.How did he know?
Seems like everyone will know soon.
-
As Yeats obviously meant to say, 'everything is fucked, fucked utterly.'
Cast a cold eye on life, shysters pass by.
-
https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/inside-story-behind-aston-villa-12655774
Aston Villa owner, Dr Tony Xia, has been bankrolling the former European Champions from the moment he set foot inside Villa Park.
Each month, money would arrive from China, into Villa's bank account to make good the shortfall in normal trading operations.
That has happened, without fail, for the past two years.
Only last month, it didn't. April's money was received. May's wasn't. There was no sign of it turning up. It still hasn't.
Incredibly, that is all it has taken to bring this great football club – this cornerstone of the English game - to its knees.
One missed monthly payment. It's a sizeable one. Aston Villa are running a £5-6m monthly deficit on their current outgoings. But still.
Tony Xia with Steve Bruce (Image: Neville Williams)
And now that has set in motion a chain of events that is likely to see the club change ownership. That is one scenario.
The other is far more unpalatable. Administration – or, if a position with HMRC is not met – a winding up order may be issued.
No more Aston Villa. Doesn't bear thinking about.
Obviously, promotion to the Premier League would have solved the on-going cash crisis.
No wonder Xia, who sat stony-faced at Wembley as Fulham cavorted around the pitch just ten days ago, was unable to show any other emotion.
His world was just about to come crashing around him.
Perhaps it was a taste of things to come. Xia did not sit with his chief executive, Keith Wyness, at the play-off final. Behind the scenes, they had been seated on separate tables.
Strange, you might think, for the two chief decision-makers not to be joined at the hip – to not share the inevitable joy or pain that was about to be inflicted upon them.
But the writing was on the wall.
A few weeks earlier, Wyness, along with director of football Steve Round, had delivered a presentation to Xia at Bodymoor Heath, outlining the two courses of action that would be taken once Villa had qualified for the end-of-season lottery English football calls the play-offs.
One was promotion to the Premier League, the other staying right where Villa were, in the Championship.
Xia received the news. Didn't blink. Didn't move a muscle. Did not utter one single word.
The three-minute silence was eventually broken by Rongtien He, Xia's eyes and ears at Villa Park.
The result of that meeting led Wyness to confess later to a high-level colleague: “Anything other than promotion is not an option.”
By the time the final whistle blew at Wembley, the chief executive knew that he had to act. He had to take action as per his fiduciary duties as a director of the club.
He knew that the money from the Far East had not been received into Villa's bank account. He had to do something. And swiftly.
Steve Bruce looks dejected (Image: Getty Images Europe)
Late last week, with the club's payroll due on Friday, Wyness was on the phone, trying to raise the cash to pay it.
Burnley were contacted. Villa were due another chunk of money from Ashley Westwood's £5m transfer later this month.
They took a hit but the money turned up and the staff were paid. Wyness knew that this could not keep going indefinitely.
Any director who has an inkling that the club is trading insolvently must take advice. That was incumbent upon him.
As a director, he could also put the club into administration. It was that which has led Xia to trashing Wyness's reputation after Villa released a statement suspending their chief executive yesterday afternoon.
The next bill was from HMRC for £4.2m. That was the lever for Xia to use to put Wyness on gardening leave.
The authorities have been as aggressive as you might expect them to be in recovering that cash.
In just over three weeks time, Villa are due to make another payroll payment.
The bills just keep coming. And the cash position is little short of horrendous.
Anyone seeking to take on Villa as a going concern will have to make good a staggering £70m shortfall during the course of the next 12 months.
Due to existing contractual commitments the budget is showing a £25m deficit for 2019-20.
That is a £100m hole that needs plugging.
The parachute payment from the Premier League has dropped to £15m. The cash call is growing, not slowing.
Anyone interested in Villa will have to show a commitment to meeting those costs.
At this rate, Xia won't be seeing much back for his £150m gamble during the past two seasons.
He will be lucky to see the club change hands for £1 because someone has got to make good on his reckless calls.
Due to the football creditors' rule, the likes of Micah Richards, Pierluigi Gollini, Ross McCormack – none of whom kicked a ball in anger last season – will all have to be paid their monstrous salaries.
Xia will be lucky if he trousers anything from this.
He could, of course, raise some cash from selling assets.
Jack Grealish is the main one. A public auction might top £30m for the playmaker who has the world at his feet.
That would meet some of the on-going costs. Buy him some time, potentially, to off-load the club to a buyer.
Villa will auction off Grealish (Image: Clive Mason)
And what of Steve Bruce, the manager who drew together a disparate dressing-room and took Villa to within 90 minutes of diverting this disaster from public attention?
His future has been a subject of debate on message boards and in social media.
He will stay put. He's a tough cookie, Bruce. And anyway, paying him off is a long way down the club's list of priorities.
For now, Xia's got bigger issues to sort out. Like keeping Aston Villa afloat.
:o
That is utterly fucking grim even if only half of it is true.
-
And today's lead football story in the Graun is the enormous record profits the Premier League clubs find themselves reaping. Everything is horrible.
-
https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/inside-story-behind-aston-villa-12655774
Aston Villa owner, Dr Tony Xia, has been bankrolling the former European Champions from the moment he set foot inside Villa Park.
Each month, money would arrive from China, into Villa's bank account to make good the shortfall in normal trading operations.
That has happened, without fail, for the past two years.
Only last month, it didn't. April's money was received. May's wasn't. There was no sign of it turning up. It still hasn't.
Incredibly, that is all it has taken to bring this great football club – this cornerstone of the English game - to its knees.
One missed monthly payment. It's a sizeable one. Aston Villa are running a £5-6m monthly deficit on their current outgoings. But still.
Tony Xia with Steve Bruce (Image: Neville Williams)
And now that has set in motion a chain of events that is likely to see the club change ownership. That is one scenario.
The other is far more unpalatable. Administration – or, if a position with HMRC is not met – a winding up order may be issued.
No more Aston Villa. Doesn't bear thinking about.
Obviously, promotion to the Premier League would have solved the on-going cash crisis.
No wonder Xia, who sat stony-faced at Wembley as Fulham cavorted around the pitch just ten days ago, was unable to show any other emotion.
His world was just about to come crashing around him.
Perhaps it was a taste of things to come. Xia did not sit with his chief executive, Keith Wyness, at the play-off final. Behind the scenes, they had been seated on separate tables.
Strange, you might think, for the two chief decision-makers not to be joined at the hip – to not share the inevitable joy or pain that was about to be inflicted upon them.
But the writing was on the wall.
A few weeks earlier, Wyness, along with director of football Steve Round, had delivered a presentation to Xia at Bodymoor Heath, outlining the two courses of action that would be taken once Villa had qualified for the end-of-season lottery English football calls the play-offs.
One was promotion to the Premier League, the other staying right where Villa were, in the Championship.
Xia received the news. Didn't blink. Didn't move a muscle. Did not utter one single word.
The three-minute silence was eventually broken by Rongtien He, Xia's eyes and ears at Villa Park.
The result of that meeting led Wyness to confess later to a high-level colleague: “Anything other than promotion is not an option.”
By the time the final whistle blew at Wembley, the chief executive knew that he had to act. He had to take action as per his fiduciary duties as a director of the club.
He knew that the money from the Far East had not been received into Villa's bank account. He had to do something. And swiftly.
Steve Bruce looks dejected (Image: Getty Images Europe)
Late last week, with the club's payroll due on Friday, Wyness was on the phone, trying to raise the cash to pay it.
Burnley were contacted. Villa were due another chunk of money from Ashley Westwood's £5m transfer later this month.
They took a hit but the money turned up and the staff were paid. Wyness knew that this could not keep going indefinitely.
Any director who has an inkling that the club is trading insolvently must take advice. That was incumbent upon him.
As a director, he could also put the club into administration. It was that which has led Xia to trashing Wyness's reputation after Villa released a statement suspending their chief executive yesterday afternoon.
The next bill was from HMRC for £4.2m. That was the lever for Xia to use to put Wyness on gardening leave.
The authorities have been as aggressive as you might expect them to be in recovering that cash.
In just over three weeks time, Villa are due to make another payroll payment.
The bills just keep coming. And the cash position is little short of horrendous.
Anyone seeking to take on Villa as a going concern will have to make good a staggering £70m shortfall during the course of the next 12 months.
Due to existing contractual commitments the budget is showing a £25m deficit for 2019-20.
That is a £100m hole that needs plugging.
The parachute payment from the Premier League has dropped to £15m. The cash call is growing, not slowing.
Anyone interested in Villa will have to show a commitment to meeting those costs.
At this rate, Xia won't be seeing much back for his £150m gamble during the past two seasons.
He will be lucky to see the club change hands for £1 because someone has got to make good on his reckless calls.
Due to the football creditors' rule, the likes of Micah Richards, Pierluigi Gollini, Ross McCormack – none of whom kicked a ball in anger last season – will all have to be paid their monstrous salaries.
Xia will be lucky if he trousers anything from this.
He could, of course, raise some cash from selling assets.
Jack Grealish is the main one. A public auction might top £30m for the playmaker who has the world at his feet.
That would meet some of the on-going costs. Buy him some time, potentially, to off-load the club to a buyer.
Villa will auction off Grealish (Image: Clive Mason)
And what of Steve Bruce, the manager who drew together a disparate dressing-room and took Villa to within 90 minutes of diverting this disaster from public attention?
His future has been a subject of debate on message boards and in social media.
He will stay put. He's a tough cookie, Bruce. And anyway, paying him off is a long way down the club's list of priorities.
For now, Xia's got bigger issues to sort out. Like keeping Aston Villa afloat.
:o
That is utterly fucking grim even if only half of it is true.
I'm less worried about it being half true and more worried by it being half the real story.
-
https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/inside-story-behind-aston-villa-12655774
Aston Villa owner, Dr Tony Xia, has been bankrolling the former European Champions from the moment he set foot inside Villa Park.
Each month, money would arrive from China, into Villa's bank account to make good the shortfall in normal trading operations.
That has happened, without fail, for the past two years.
Only last month, it didn't. April's money was received. May's wasn't. There was no sign of it turning up. It still hasn't.
Incredibly, that is all it has taken to bring this great football club – this cornerstone of the English game - to its knees.
One missed monthly payment. It's a sizeable one. Aston Villa are running a £5-6m monthly deficit on their current outgoings. But still.
Tony Xia with Steve Bruce (Image: Neville Williams)
And now that has set in motion a chain of events that is likely to see the club change ownership. That is one scenario.
The other is far more unpalatable. Administration – or, if a position with HMRC is not met – a winding up order may be issued.
No more Aston Villa. Doesn't bear thinking about.
Obviously, promotion to the Premier League would have solved the on-going cash crisis.
No wonder Xia, who sat stony-faced at Wembley as Fulham cavorted around the pitch just ten days ago, was unable to show any other emotion.
His world was just about to come crashing around him.
Perhaps it was a taste of things to come. Xia did not sit with his chief executive, Keith Wyness, at the play-off final. Behind the scenes, they had been seated on separate tables.
Strange, you might think, for the two chief decision-makers not to be joined at the hip – to not share the inevitable joy or pain that was about to be inflicted upon them.
But the writing was on the wall.
A few weeks earlier, Wyness, along with director of football Steve Round, had delivered a presentation to Xia at Bodymoor Heath, outlining the two courses of action that would be taken once Villa had qualified for the end-of-season lottery English football calls the play-offs.
One was promotion to the Premier League, the other staying right where Villa were, in the Championship.
Xia received the news. Didn't blink. Didn't move a muscle. Did not utter one single word.
The three-minute silence was eventually broken by Rongtien He, Xia's eyes and ears at Villa Park.
The result of that meeting led Wyness to confess later to a high-level colleague: “Anything other than promotion is not an option.”
By the time the final whistle blew at Wembley, the chief executive knew that he had to act. He had to take action as per his fiduciary duties as a director of the club.
He knew that the money from the Far East had not been received into Villa's bank account. He had to do something. And swiftly.
Steve Bruce looks dejected (Image: Getty Images Europe)
Late last week, with the club's payroll due on Friday, Wyness was on the phone, trying to raise the cash to pay it.
Burnley were contacted. Villa were due another chunk of money from Ashley Westwood's £5m transfer later this month.
They took a hit but the money turned up and the staff were paid. Wyness knew that this could not keep going indefinitely.
Any director who has an inkling that the club is trading insolvently must take advice. That was incumbent upon him.
As a director, he could also put the club into administration. It was that which has led Xia to trashing Wyness's reputation after Villa released a statement suspending their chief executive yesterday afternoon.
The next bill was from HMRC for £4.2m. That was the lever for Xia to use to put Wyness on gardening leave.
The authorities have been as aggressive as you might expect them to be in recovering that cash.
In just over three weeks time, Villa are due to make another payroll payment.
The bills just keep coming. And the cash position is little short of horrendous.
Anyone seeking to take on Villa as a going concern will have to make good a staggering £70m shortfall during the course of the next 12 months.
Due to existing contractual commitments the budget is showing a £25m deficit for 2019-20.
That is a £100m hole that needs plugging.
The parachute payment from the Premier League has dropped to £15m. The cash call is growing, not slowing.
Anyone interested in Villa will have to show a commitment to meeting those costs.
At this rate, Xia won't be seeing much back for his £150m gamble during the past two seasons.
He will be lucky to see the club change hands for £1 because someone has got to make good on his reckless calls.
Due to the football creditors' rule, the likes of Micah Richards, Pierluigi Gollini, Ross McCormack – none of whom kicked a ball in anger last season – will all have to be paid their monstrous salaries.
Xia will be lucky if he trousers anything from this.
He could, of course, raise some cash from selling assets.
Jack Grealish is the main one. A public auction might top £30m for the playmaker who has the world at his feet.
That would meet some of the on-going costs. Buy him some time, potentially, to off-load the club to a buyer.
Villa will auction off Grealish (Image: Clive Mason)
And what of Steve Bruce, the manager who drew together a disparate dressing-room and took Villa to within 90 minutes of diverting this disaster from public attention?
His future has been a subject of debate on message boards and in social media.
He will stay put. He's a tough cookie, Bruce. And anyway, paying him off is a long way down the club's list of priorities.
For now, Xia's got bigger issues to sort out. Like keeping Aston Villa afloat.
:o
That is utterly fucking grim even if only half of it is true.
Jesus Fucking Christ.
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Aint that the truth!!!
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It was a gamble that has gone badly wrong. Was it worth a go - given the financial pennies in the near distance perhaps yes.
What is obviously certain now is that we gambled above any sensible numbers and we never at any time had any plan B.
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It was a gamble that has gone badly wrong. Was it worth a go - given the financial pennies in the near distance perhaps yes.
What is obviously certain now is that we gambled above any sensible numbers and we never at any time had any plan B.
What was plan A apart from spunking money on any old shit?
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Not getting hysterical when we went 5 games without a win... or 7 points from 7 games... or losing to 3 teams in the bottom half of the table once you get to 2nd place...
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It was a gamble that has gone badly wrong. Was it worth a go - given the financial pennies in the near distance perhaps yes.
What is obviously certain now is that we gambled above any sensible numbers and we never at any time had any plan B.
What was plan A apart from spunking money on any old shit?
Indeed. As what now appears to have been a promotion-or-bust attempt, it was well shit. What was it, about three minutes in the automatic spots all season?
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Thinking about the wider picture in the whole of this and football in general is creating big problems for itself. The money in the Premier League is so different to the Championship that any established Premier League club that gets relegated must either get itself back up very quickly or it could go bust. Would Newcastle have been any different if they hadn't gone back up straight away? It's no wonder then that there are so many small clubs in the Premier League, who don't get hurt as much if they go back down and clubs like ourselves and Leeds.
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It was a gamble that has gone badly wrong. Was it worth a go - given the financial pennies in the near distance perhaps yes.
What is obviously certain now is that we gambled above any sensible numbers and we never at any time had any plan B.
What was plan A apart from spunking money on any old shit?
It's hard to get my head around any of this, but all of a sudden every signing we've made in the last 18 months just seems even more useless. We've overpaid for every single one, and without a clear plan of how to use most. It seemed stupid at the time, but now knowing how much was at stake, it's absolutely scandalous! I mean, that was them (Bruce, Wyness, Round, Xia(?)) really trying their absolute best to go up last season - presumably all knowing the consequences if they didn't. And it was fucking useless. When I'm close to being skint, I'm really careful with how I use it. You know, really ponder over every purchase. They seemed to be throwing it about like week-old bread to the ducks. Which, incidentally, is very bad for them!!!
Isn't there an ombudsman we can appeal to?!
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As was said many times, they bet the Farm on promotion.
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Think of all the old buggers moaning about this league and how much they hate it for the past two seasons.
Now imagine the same people if we hadn't even spent all that money trying to get out of it.
The club tried, and failed. That's ambition apparently.
Maybe, with hindsight we should've adopted a new young/fresh team approach from the minute we came down. But then again just imagine the howls of derision from the 'we must go straight back up we're Aston Villa entitled brigade' if we had.
I don't know what to think anymore.
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Think of all the old buggers moaning about this league and how much they hate it for the past two seasons.
Now imagine the same people if we hadn't even spent all that money trying to get out of it.
The club tried, and failed. That's ambition apparently.
Maybe, with hindsight we should've adopted a new young/fresh team approach from the minute we came down. But then again just imagine the howls of derision from the 'we must go straight back up we're Aston Villa entitled brigade' if we had.
I don't know what to think anymore.
Just old buggers?
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Think of all the old buggers moaning about this league and how much they hate it for the past two seasons.
Now imagine the same people if we hadn't even spent all that money trying to get out of it.
The club tried, and failed. That's ambition apparently.
Maybe, with hindsight we should've adopted a new young/fresh team approach from the minute we came down. But then again just imagine the howls of derision from the 'we must go straight back up we're Aston Villa entitled brigade' if we had.
I don't know what to think anymore.
No, "we must go up" was, from many of us, a direct result of the club deciding to back a manager whose only value was the promise of promotion and the gamble everything on him managing it. If we'd have said we're going to take a couple of years to get the finances right, build a style of play and get ourselves in position to go back up and really go for it then I suspect plenty of fans who didn't want Bruce would've accepted it. It's the ones who wanted Bruce and have backed him at every turn that were putting everything on hoofing our way back to the promised land, one clean sheet at a time.
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I have no regrets backing him. I'd have got behind whoever it was who came in. That's what supporters do.
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Think of all the old buggers moaning about this league and how much they hate it for the past two seasons.
Now imagine the same people if we hadn't even spent all that money trying to get out of it.
The club tried, and failed. That's ambition apparently.
Maybe, with hindsight we should've adopted a new young/fresh team approach from the minute we came down. But then again just imagine the howls of derision from the 'we must go straight back up we're Aston Villa entitled brigade' if we had.
I don't know what to think anymore.
It didn't have to be an all or nothing approach. There are degrees in between not spending anything and gambling everything so that if we didn't go up we're effectively bust.
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I have no regrets backing him. I'd have got behind whoever it was who came in. That's what supporters do.
Yes some see supporting the manager and the club as the same thing.
Some of us see them as separate, I only support the manager if I believe they are right for the club.
Bruce wasn’t.
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It didn't have to be an all or nothing approach. There are degrees in between not spending anything and gambling everything so that if we didn't go up we're effectively bust.
Indeed. What's happening now won't have come as a surprise to Xia or Wyness, they probably knew the outcome of failure to be promoted back in September, at the latest end of January. All our income and costs are extremely predictable and easy to forecast.
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I doubt many would have supported the Norwich City approach to relegation. They have kept the PL money and settled in to life in the championship. There would have been uproar if we did that.
We gambled and it nearly paid off, but it is now going to bite us on the arse for years to come.
Is it better to have tried and failed, or not try at all?
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I doubt many would have supported the Norwich City approach to relegation. They have kept the PL money and settled in to life in the championship. There would have been uproar if we did that.
We gambled and it nearly paid off, but it is now going to bite us on the arse for years to come.
Is it better to have tried and failed, or not try at all?
You do not put the future of the club, it’s employees and it’s supportedrs at stake let alone the millions you have invested.
It was a failed business strategy so it’s betterto try but always be in a position to come back again.
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What's all this "old buggers" moaning about being in the Championship? I posted the other day at one of the other ageists if you are happy with 4th place in the second division, enjoy. To which I would now add "And threatened with liquidation and 12 point deduction plus financial penalties - enjoy". Some of us old buggers saw this shit storm coming many many months ago.
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What's all this "old buggers" moaning about being in the Championship? I posted the other day at one of the other ageists if you are happy with 4th place in the second division, enjoy. To which I would now add "And threatened with liquidation and 12 point deduction plus financial penalties - enjoy". Some of us old buggers saw this shit storm coming many many months ago.
Well said Brian.
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So Dr X has pulled the finance, is prevented from providing the finance or doesn't have the money in the first place. Whichever one it is, the information coming out over the last 24 hours seems to indicate that we've has been scraping around for the last few months trying to get money into the club from whatever source possible, Westwood fee, sell on clauses, selling land etc....
Overdraft, season ticket money, parachute payment gone & unpaid tax bills I can't see how the blame for any of this lies anywhere else that at the feet of DrX.
Vultures will be offering less than market value for everyone.
I can't see how DrX will get us out of this mess or how any possible sale will be completed quickly. Any buyer would surely wait until things get really desperate (administration).
Even if we'd gone up, would it only have delayed the inevitable or made a bad situation worse.
UTV
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He’s going to have to sell one way or the other. How could the fans ever put any faith in his regime after this?
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What's all this "old buggers" moaning about being in the Championship? I posted the other day at one of the other ageists if you are happy with 4th place in the second division, enjoy. To which I would now add "And threatened with liquidation and 12 point deduction plus financial penalties - enjoy". Some of us old buggers saw this shit storm coming many many months ago.
as an old bugger , I d like to ask all the others old enough to remember the state of the club in 1968/69 - was it worse then compared to now? Obviously the figures now are telephone numbers compared to back then - is there a Pat Matthews or Doug Ellis out there ready to rescue the club?
Who would have thought back then that in 13/14 years we would be champions of Europe
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What's all this "old buggers" moaning about being in the Championship? I posted the other day at one of the other ageists if you are happy with 4th place in the second division, enjoy. To which I would now add "And threatened with liquidation and 12 point deduction plus financial penalties - enjoy". Some of us old buggers saw this shit storm coming many many months ago.
yep, plenty of us didn't want the Bruce "promotion or bust" gamble in any shape or form . Unfortunately Tony and the club went with it.
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I'm an old(ish) bugger and I hate being in this shit pot league with a passion, however i'd have put up with being in it for a couple of years if we'd basically ripped the club apart and started fresh and built for the long term future, main reason I wanted Bruce gone after the first season was because we still looked a disjointed mess a lot of the time, not because we finished mid-table.
Instead we repeated all the same mistakes of going short term by buying a number of overpriced players that will be hard to shift, building up an unsustainable wage bill and hired a manager that as we've seen built pretty much everything based on a one season push. So now the odds look good that we'll be stuck down here for a fair old while barring a miracle.
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I'm an old(ish) bugger and I hate being in this shit pot league with a passion, however i'd have put up with being in it for a couple of years if we'd basically ripped the club apart and started fresh and built for the long term future, main reason I wanted Bruce gone after the first season was because we still looked a disjointed mess a lot of the time, not because we finished mid-table.
Instead we repeated all the same mistakes of going short term by buying a number of overpriced players that will be hard to shift, building up an unsustainable wage bill and hired a manager that as we've seen built pretty much everything based on a one season push. So now the odds look good that we'll be stuck down here for a fair old while barring a miracle.
Basically articulates my view as well. It’s shocking how badly the club has been managed.
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Owner believes that one club employee actively pushed for administration so that person could then be a part of a consortium to buy the club again, this ensuring continued role at Villa.
Consortium. Were at NDA stage with another club, tipped off that XXFC were for sale( including intimate financial details), dropped interest in other club and "parties" made sure it was circulated around the press. Shithousery on the grandest of scales.
That's mental if true...now SVC is trying to get a fan buy-out going !
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I'm an old(ish) bugger and I hate being in this shit pot league with a passion, however i'd have put up with being in it for a couple of years if we'd basically ripped the club apart and started fresh and built for the long term future, main reason I wanted Bruce gone after the first season was because we still looked a disjointed mess a lot of the time, not because we finished mid-table.
Instead we repeated all the same mistakes of going short term by buying a number of overpriced players that will be hard to shift, building up an unsustainable wage bill and hired a manager that as we've seen built pretty much everything based on a one season push. So now the odds look good that we'll be stuck down here for a fair old while barring a miracle.
100% agree
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I'm an old(ish) bugger and I hate being in this shit pot league with a passion, however i'd have put up with being in it for a couple of years if we'd basically ripped the club apart and started fresh and built for the long term future, main reason I wanted Bruce gone after the first season was because we still looked a disjointed mess a lot of the time, not because we finished mid-table.
Instead we repeated all the same mistakes of going short term by buying a number of overpriced players that will be hard to shift, building up an unsustainable wage bill and hired a manager that as we've seen built pretty much everything based on a one season push. So now the odds look good that we'll be stuck down here for a fair old while barring a miracle.
the reality being we have no money to spend and without an inspirational managerial appointment we may struggle to make an impact next season - potentially like our latter days in the top flight only with less financial reward
Ps I didn't realise you were an old 'UN- I had you down as a youngster :)
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My first game as a nipper was around 74/75 which gives my age away a tad!
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My first game as a nipper was around 74/75 which gives my age away a tad!
I'll guess 49/50. Still a youngster !!!
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Close, 48.
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Owner believes that one club employee actively pushed for administration so that person could then be a part of a consortium to buy the club again, this ensuring continued role at Villa.
Consortium. Were at NDA stage with another club, tipped off that XXFC were for sale( including intimate financial details), dropped interest in other club and "parties" made sure it was circulated around the press. Shithousery on the grandest of scales.
That's mental if true...now SVC is trying to get a fan buy-out going !
It most certainly is a strange one. It doesn't leave much to the imagination to guess who he's talking about.
Stan has always been a big supporter of fan ownership/part ownership.
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Close, 48.
did you go to the 75 League Cup Final?
My father had to literally drag me out of bed as I was suffering from pleuresy at the time - I cheered us on from the terraces wearing my pyjamas under my Villa shirt !!
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Nope, 1977 was my first Wembley trip, on my 7th birthday.
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It didn't have to be an all or nothing approach. There are degrees in between not spending anything and gambling everything so that if we didn't go up we're effectively bust.
Isn't this exactly what we did last season though ?
Season 1 spent way too much, around 40m net
Season 2 reigned it all in and made around 20m profit on transfers
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It didn't have to be an all or nothing approach. There are degrees in between not spending anything and gambling everything so that if we didn't go up we're effectively bust.
Isn't this exactly what we did last season though ?
Season 1 spent way too much, around 40m net
Season 2 reigned it all in and made around 20m profit on transfers
We clearly spent a fortune on wages though, and it was very short term as none of the loan players would still be here in the event of failure.
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I'm an old(ish) bugger and I hate being in this shit pot league with a passion, however i'd have put up with being in it for a couple of years if we'd basically ripped the club apart and started fresh and built for the long term future, main reason I wanted Bruce gone after the first season was because we still looked a disjointed mess a lot of the time, not because we finished mid-table.
Instead we repeated all the same mistakes of going short term by buying a number of overpriced players that will be hard to shift, building up an unsustainable wage bill and hired a manager that as we've seen built pretty much everything based on a one season push. So now the odds look good that we'll be stuck down here for a fair old while barring a miracle.
I wouldn't be so sure.
A 12 point deduction and a team of kids could result in us going the way of Cov!
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After events over the past 24 hours makes you wonder why he released his statement last week. Surely if he knew the scale of the shit storm about to unfold he would have kept quiet? Just smacks of someone who doesn't have a clue what has been going on
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Think of all the old buggers moaning about this league and how much they hate it for the past two seasons.
Now imagine the same people if we hadn't even spent all that money trying to get out of it.
The club tried, and failed. That's ambition apparently.
Maybe, with hindsight we should've adopted a new young/fresh team approach from the minute we came down. But then again just imagine the howls of derision from the 'we must go straight back up we're Aston Villa entitled brigade' if we had.
I don't know what to think anymore.
It didn't have to be an all or nothing approach. There are degrees in between not spending anything and gambling everything so that if we didn't go up we're effectively bust.
There were warning signs from early days really. Newcastle funded their transfer spend through selling the likes of Sissoko to fund solid buys on the likes of Clark and Gayle.
Xia, Wyness and Round decided on a different approach entirely. We need a striker, let's buy McCormack and Kodjia for 20m combined. McCormack bombs, let's spend another 10m on Hogan about 6 months later. We need a midfielder, let's buy Lansbury and Hourihane in the space of a week. Need a right back, let's get in three.
Wyness is an utter snake. All the faffing about FFP when the solvency of the club has been at risk for months and possibly since the day Xia took over. He oversaw this from day 1, all chips thrown across the table on the 90 mins v Fulham. He should never work in business again not to mind football.
What really galls me is that we had to beg the likes of Burnley and Newcastle for cash to keep the lights on but at the same time were happy to let the likes of Richards and Gabby run down their contracts. Those two charlatans would gladly have taken an upfront cash payment to take their banter elsewhere for the last two years.
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Richards salary for the last 12 months would be quiet handy now.
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This all sounds like xia got Wyness in to look good but he wanted ultimate control. Wyness was happy to take the cash and do as he was told and tamper round the edges, now he wants to clear his name. Complete conjecture of course but when it turns to sh*t the higher levels always find their slopey shoulders so none of it is their fault and they can go on to other things. I think of all this, accountability becomes questionable - no-one in this borg will have anything stick and walk away. That is wrong. If a director of a company goes bankrupt there are at least some rules surrounding that.
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Think of all the old buggers moaning about this league and how much they hate it for the past two seasons.
Now imagine the same people if we hadn't even spent all that money trying to get out of it.
The club tried, and failed. That's ambition apparently.
Maybe, with hindsight we should've adopted a new young/fresh team approach from the minute we came down. But then again just imagine the howls of derision from the 'we must go straight back up we're Aston Villa entitled brigade' if we had.
I don't know what to think anymore.
It didn't have to be an all or nothing approach. There are degrees in between not spending anything and gambling everything so that if we didn't go up we're effectively bust.
There were warning signs from early days really. Newcastle funded their transfer spend through selling the likes of Sissoko to fund solid buys on the likes of Clark and Gayle.
Xia, Wyness and Round decided on a different approach entirely. We need a striker, let's buy McCormack and Kodjia for 20m combined. McCormack bombs, let's spend another 10m on Hogan about 6 months later. We need a midfielder, let's buy Lansbury and Hourihane in the space of a week. Need a right back, let's get in three.
Wyness is an utter snake. All the faffing about FFP when the solvency of the club has been at risk for months and possibly since the day Xia took over. He oversaw this from day 1, all chips thrown across the table on the 90 mins v Fulham. He should never work in business again not to mind football.
What really galls me is that we had to beg the likes of Burnley and Newcastle for cash to keep the lights on but at the same time were happy to let the likes of Richards and Gabby run down their contracts. Those two charlatans would gladly have taken an upfront cash payment to take their banter elsewhere for the last two years.
We bought decent championship players, for top dollar. We ended up a decent championship team.
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Stuart James, The Guardian
Alarm bells were ringing at Aston Villa long before a tax bill went unpaid last month. The first indication that all was not well came last year, when Tony Xia’s monthly payments stopped arriving with the same frequency, leaving a club that were operating way beyond their means, and are totally dependent on the owner’s financial support, scrambling around to pay the bills.
Xia, the Chinese businessman who revealed that it was his dream to turn Villa into one of the world’s top three clubs when he took over two years ago, had previously always made regular transfers to cover the outgoings, averaging around £4m a month across his first season. Yet the Guardian understands that those payments were made nothing like as consistently from as far back as 2017.
Villa, one way or another, managed to get by for the majority of last season, sometimes by asking clubs to bring forward staggered transfer fees for players that had been sold on. That practice, not uncommon in the Championship, saw Villa write off money in the long term to solve cash-flow problems in the short term.
Reality, however, was about to bite. In April and May, as the season neared the end, the money trail from China dried up completely and Villa’s financial position became critical. HM Revenue & Customs was due a payment in the region of £4m after May’s payroll and Villa, quite simply, had no way of getting their hands on the money.
The Championship play-off final was on the horizon – a get-rich-quick ticket that had the potential to put Villa’s financial worries to bed – but so was the HMRC deadline, which came 24 hours before the pivotal game against Fulham at Wembley. Villa missed the deadline and the golden ticket slipped through their fingers the following day. Suddenly it was crisis time.
Plenty of staff working within Villa Park must have seen the storm coming, including Keith Wyness, the chief executive, who felt duty-bound to act once it became clear that the club were not going to be able to pay HMRC. Wyness, who would have known the fiduciary responsibilities that come with his role on the board, is believed to have sought insolvency advice before and after the Fulham match.
Indeed, it is understood that Wyness advised Xia, who has been in Beijing since the play-off final, of the severe consequences of failing to pay HMRC, including the prospect of Villa being placed in administration and served with a winding up petition.
HMRC, which has adopted a robust approach in recent times to the football industry, was far from impressed with Villa’s inability to pay their tax bill and not minded to cut them much slack. The club were given a 10-day extension, which expired last Tuesday.
Wyness was no longer in control of the day-to-day running of the club by the time that deadline passed, after being told via a letter that he had been suspended. The reasons for that decision have not been made public but it is believed that Xia took exception to Wyness’s views on Villa’s predicament and wants the club to investigate the chief executive’s conduct in relation to the conversations that took place about insolvency.
It is all rather strange and, worryingly for Villa fans, easy to imagine things getting worse before they get better. Even if Villa come up with the money to cover May’s HMRC bill – there are suggestions an agreement will be reached by the end of the week – another payment will be due in less than three weeks’ time and then the whole episode starts again, not overlooking the fact that there will be many other creditors to satisfy. An exodus of players, including the departure of Jack Grealish, the club’s prize asset, seems inevitable.
Although complying with the Championship’s financial fair play rules threatens to be a major issue now that Villa’s three-year-loss limit has fallen to £39m, FFP is a problem for another day. The more pressing concern is the here and now, highlighted by a sobering story in the Birmingham Mail, revealing that the club are considering selling a plot of land close to Villa Park, which is used as a staff car park, to raise a few million quid.
This is the same club that embarked on an unprecedented spending spree at Championship level the season before last, when £88m was splurged on signings. Xia was effectively placing all his claret and blue chips on winning promotion with a high-risk strategy that has badly backfired and leaves the club with a huge financial void to fill next season, with or without his funding.
How much Xia is actually worth is a matter of debate and tied in with the question of why he is no longer bankrolling Villa. A key reason put forward is that the Chinese government has clamped down on capital flight, where investors send their money out of the country, although some Villa fans could be forgiven for wondering if that is a smokescreen for other issues. The club have been approached for comment.
Reports about potential takeovers continue to give those fans a glimmer of hope that there could be a resolution, although no change of ownership is anticipated in the near future. In fact, all that can be said for sure right now is that one of England’s most famous football clubs is in an awful mess.
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Looks like a pretty reasonable précis of our situation.
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https://www.expressandstar.com/sport/football/aston-villa/2018/06/06/tom-watson-calls-on-government-to-suspend-moves-that-could-push-aston-villa-into-the-abyss/
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Not sure why a retired golfer is getting involved.
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Not sure in which of 5 threads to post this, but anyway this is from The Times.
Aston Villa owe more than £11 million in transfer fees to fellow Sky Bet Championship clubs who, under the football creditors’ rule, are entitled to be paid before HM Revenue & Customs (HMRC) or other businesses, The Times has learnt.
It is understood that Villa are due to pay the final instalments in the transfer fees of Ross McCormack and James Chester this summer, with Fulham and West Bromwich Albion owed payments of £6 million and £2 million respectively, while Brentford are owed £3 million for the transfer of Scott Hogan, with the final instalment due next January.
The full scale of the financial crisis at Villa after their play-off final defeat by Fulham has emerged over the past few days, culminating in the dramatic events on Tuesday when the chief executive Keith Wyness was placed on gardening leave, with the owner Tony Xia taking full control of the club.
Ironically, having plunged Villa into turmoil by beating them 1-0 at Wembley, Fulham are one of their biggest creditors, with the £6 million balance outstanding from the £12 million McCormack transfer a larger liability than the £4.2 million tax bill for May owed to HMRC, which the club are confident of settling later this week.
Under the football creditors’ rule, clubs and players are paid in full before other creditors if a League club enters insolvency. Wyness was suspended as he was one of three directors able to put Villa into administration, along with Xia and his aide Tracy Gu, and had clashed with the owner over the best way to keep the club afloat.
The former Everton chief executive was forced to go to extraordinary lengths to ensure that Villa paid their staff’s wages last month and succeeded in bringing forward a payment owed by Burnley after the transfer of Ashley Westwood, although Villa had to accept a significant reduction to get the money early.
Villa are paying the price for lavish spending in the 2016-17 season under Xia after their relegation from the Premier League, with McCormack, Chester and Hogan the most expensive of 14 players signed during that campaign for a total of £37 million.
Xia has attracted several potential buyers for Villa, including the New York Yankees minority shareholder Peter B Freund, as The Times revealed yesterday, and have secured a £6 million loan to pay off the club’s tax debt and stave off the threat of a winding-up order from HMRC.
The crisis has led to Steve Bruce seeking urgent talks with Xia to clarify his position as manager and the plans for the squad. Xia is expected to order a fire sale of players, although Chester and Jack Grealish are the only ones likely to command significant transfer fees. Others, including Mile Jedinak, Glenn Whelan and Ahmed Elmohamady, could be sold for smaller fees.
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Have heard the tax owing is way more than £14m, hence the panic.
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It had to be fees for the absolute shittest players didn't it (apart from Chester).
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We obviously don't want to be wound up
But the HMRC threat must be one of the ways Xia will be forced out. I don't want an interminable stay of execution while we flog off all the best players, BMH and scraps of land here and there
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Tony Xia: "I'm a businessman" really??
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From here it just looks like the whole management covered their eyes when faced with the financial realities,whilst babbling "we're going up, it will be alright". Anyone with access to the figures like Wyness would have known the wages bill would catch up with us this summer as well as the transfer payments due to other clubs. And yet they were still giving out contracts to companies to dig up our pitch. It's like they all decided to suspend reality because they didn't like the look of it.
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Or maybe they were acting on the wishes of the owner?
Lest face it xia was the one saying he was a billionaire and wanted to get into europes elite in a few years and presumable behind the scenes was initially offering and delivering monthly cash flow payments.
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Or maybe they were acting on the wishes of the owner?
Lest face it xia was the one saying he was a billionaire and wanted to get into europes elite in a few years and presumable behind the scenes was initially offering and delivering monthly cash flow payments.
Well yeah, that will have to be their defence. We knew we were in deep shit with debts mounting up, but hey Tony's a billionaire. Not sure how many billionaires run their businesses hand to mouth though, because y'know billionaires don't need to.
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Or maybe they were acting on the wishes of the owner?
Lest face it xia was the one saying he was a billionaire and wanted to get into europes elite in a few years and presumable behind the scenes was initially offering and delivering monthly cash flow payments.
Well yeah, that will have to be their defence. We knew we were in deep shit with debts mounting up, but hey Tony's a billionaire. Not sure how many billionaires run their businesses hand to mouth though, because y'know billionaires don't need to.
Also not sure how many self made billionaires fail to understand the importance of cash flow.
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I'm also not sure what else they were supposed to do. It's a private company, the owner tells you your objectives and agrees the financial plan (which we assume he promised to fund).
All seemed to be going well until Xia stopped the payments. Then Wyness had to manage the situation hand-to-mouth presumably while trying to have a conversation with Xia who either wasn't listening or couldn't act.
Wyness then gets effectively sacked when the situation becomes untenable and he needs to act according to his legal responsibilities.
All supposition of course, but Wyness's position seems credible - unless you actually believe Xia is what he claims to be.
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I'm wondering if the Wyness suspension is down to Xia worrying about losing face. Wyness used as the scapegoat.
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Wyness was suspended as he was one of three directors able to put Villa into administration, along with Xia and his aide Tracy Gu, and had clashed with the owner over the best way to keep the club afloat.
Seems like the most plausible reason to me and makes the most sense.
The articles saying Wyness had done nothing wrong would bear this out. In effect, by suspending him Xia has safeguarded Wyness from any blame and responsibility, and safeguarded his own position of not wanting to go into administration.
Whether it's the right thing to do, however, we won't know for a while.
On a separate note, I notice the Recon website hasn't posted any News for 15 months.....
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Wyness was suspended as he was one of three directors able to put Villa into administration, along with Xia and his aide Tracy Gu, and had clashed with the owner over the best way to keep the club afloat.
Seems like the most plausible reason to me and makes the most sense.
The articles saying Wyness had done nothing wrong would bear this out. In effect, by suspending him Xia has safeguarded Wyness from any blame and responsibility, and safeguarded his own position of not wanting to go into administration.
Whether it's the right thing to do, however, we won't know for a while.
On a separate note, I notice the Recon website hasn't posted any News for 15 months.....
If I was Wyness I'd have copied all of my emails onto a memory stick and got my letter of resignation off to Companies House straight away. Presumably if it all goes tits up, Xia isn't going to worry unduly about being struck off as a director in the UK as he can just hide back in China and carry on selling his MSG to the catering industry. In his shit shoes, the shit-shoed bastard.
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Dr. Tony Xia
Verified account
@Dr_TonyXia
Following Following @Dr_TonyXia
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It has been very difficult 2weeks as I hinted earlier I was almost heartbroken by something.Tried my best to keep beloved AV move forward. Thanks for all ppl standing together going through the difficult time. It was all supporters’ encouraging words to keep me/us stronger. #UTV
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Dr. Tony Xia
Verified account
@Dr_TonyXia
Following Following @Dr_TonyXia
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It has been very difficult 2weeks as I hinted earlier I was almost heartbroken by something.Tried my best to keep beloved AV move forward. Thanks for all ppl standing together going through the difficult time. It was all supporters’ encouraging words to keep me/us stronger. #UTV
He's heartbroken, wtf are we!
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'Almost Heartbroken' ! only almost mind !
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DAMN IT JOHN! DAMN IT TO HELL AND BACK.
WITH AN EXTRA PORTION OF DAMN!
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It literally means nothing!
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Dr. Tony Xia
Verified account
@Dr_TonyXia
Following Following @Dr_TonyXia
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It has been very difficult 2weeks as I hinted earlier I was almost heartbroken by something.Tried my best to keep beloved AV move forward. Thanks for all ppl standing together going through the difficult time. It was all supporters’ encouraging words to keep me/us stronger. #UTV
He's heartbroken, wtf are we!
he's looking at losing 150 million pounds
I think the last owner lost a similar amount
Stability
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"Tried my best" past tense so sounds like that's a farewell to me.
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Agreed, that looks far more like a goodbye than his previous tweet suggesting Bruce might be going.
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Sounds like he’s off from reading that.
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"Tried my best" past tense so sounds like that's a farewell to me.
Thats how I read it - either sold or enter administration.....
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"Tried my best" past tense so sounds like that's a farewell to me.
Given his standard of English, trying to guess what he means is pointless. That tense thing could be wholly inaccurate.
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He should have done it with emojis.
😱😭😱💩💩💩💩✈️🤮👋
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I think the tense is wrong.
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He can go and fuck himself. He gambled our club away and now he wants our sympathy? Cry me a river you wanker. And sell up.
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Back to making monosodium glutamate and leave running football clubs to the grown ups you fucking charlatan.
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He is not blameless but it looks like he put around £150 mil in , Wyness on other hand too 300k a year in salary and mismanaged the wages to an epic degree
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He is not blameless but it looks like he put around £150 mil in , Wyness on other hand too 300k a year in salary and mismanaged the wages to an epic degree
Don't care how much he's put in, if he's not good for all the spending he promised he'd underwrite then he's fucked up immensely.
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In fairness, we really don't know the full story but suffice to say that no one comes out of this well, Xia, Wyness, Round or Bruce. They've all have been culpable in some way, it's just to what degree. The statement is impossible to really decipher as it's clearly his 2nd language. One thing I do know is that right now, yet again, we are a complete shambles.
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He knew enough English to do those deals and gamble on our very existence. He knew what he was doing.
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He is not blameless but it looks like he put around £150 mil in , Wyness on other hand too 300k a year in salary and mismanaged the wages to an epic degree
I'd have to agree with that.
Had the money that was there been spent wisely, we would be in the Premier League now and there would be a lot more in the 'incomings' column. Wyness was Steve Bruce's superior, he was supposed to have the lifetime of football administration - that's why he was brought in. It's no good playing the 'doing the best thing for the club' card now. The time for that was not signing off on tens of millions of pounds letting a squad be built which was 40% comprised of right backs and crap strikers on big money. Dr. Tony has been very naive yes, but Wyness (and Bruce) take their share of the blame so the reporters trying to paint Wyness as some kind of wannabe guardian angel battling the owner for the long term good of the Villa can fuck right off.
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He should have done it with emojis.
😱😭😱💩💩💩💩✈️🤮👋
He could have done one of his mathematical formula tweets.
However, I'm not sure what the symbols are for circling a plughole
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He is not blameless but it looks like he put around £150 mil in , Wyness on other hand too 300k a year in salary and mismanaged the wages to an epic degree
I'd have to agree with that.
Had the money that was there been spent wisely, we would be in the Premier League now and there would be a lot more in the 'incomings' column. Wyness was Steve Bruce's superior, he was supposed to have the lifetime of football administration - that's why he was brought in. It's no good playing the 'doing the best thing for the club' card now. The time for that was not signing off on tens of millions of pounds letting a squad be built which was 40% comprised of right backs and crap strikers on big money. Dr. Tony has been very naive yes, but Wyness (and Bruce) take their share of the blame so the reporters trying to paint Wyness as some kind of wannabe guardian angel battling the owner for the long term good of the Villa can fuck right off.
Good point.
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Aston Villa Football Club can confirm that an agreement has been reached with HMRC and the club will continue to fulfil its obligations.
The club can also announce that there are no insolvency practitioners or administration advisors working with the club.
Owner and Chairman Dr Tony Xia would like to take this opportunity to sincerely thank supporters during this difficult and unsettling time and reassure them plans are now being put in place to move the club forward.
Just appeared on the website
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Sorry Tone, you talk bollocks. Can't believe a word he says. He lives in cloud cuckoo land but his playing around is putting the existence of the club myself and my family going back generations at risk.
Fuck off.
Asap, please.
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Aston Villa Football Club can confirm that an agreement has been reached with HMRC and the club will continue to fulfil its obligations.
The club can also announce that there are no insolvency practitioners or administration advisors working with the club.
Owner and Chairman Dr Tony Xia would like to take this opportunity to sincerely thank supporters during this difficult and unsettling time and reassure them plans are now being put in place to move the club forward.
Just appeared on the website
Delusional.
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Aston Villa Football Club can confirm that an agreement has been reached with HMRC and the club will continue to fulfil its obligations.
The club can also announce that there are no insolvency practitioners or administration advisors working with the club.
Owner and Chairman Dr Tony Xia would like to take this opportunity to sincerely thank supporters during this difficult and unsettling time and reassure them plans are now being put in place to move the club forward.
Just appeared on the website
Delusional.
Potential sale?
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Plans are as follows
1. Fly home
2. Blame my government
3. Pretend we are fine to get a decent price
4. Stick fingers in ears, bury head in sand and prey a buyer turns up before the 30th
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Aston Villa Football Club can confirm that an agreement has been reached with HMRC and the club will continue to fulfil its obligations.
The club can also announce that there are no insolvency practitioners or administration advisors working with the club.
Owner and Chairman Dr Tony Xia would like to take this opportunity to sincerely thank supporters during this difficult and unsettling time and reassure them plans are now being put in place to move the club forward.
Just appeared on the website
Delusional.
Potential sale?
Sales don't happen overnight, we've a tax bill outstanding still with payment due next week and then there's the next salary run and associated PAYE, where's the magic money tree suddenly come from?
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Aston Villa Football Club can confirm that an agreement has been reached with HMRC and the club will continue to fulfil its obligations.
The club can also announce that there are no insolvency practitioners or administration advisors working with the club.
Owner and Chairman Dr Tony Xia would like to take this opportunity to sincerely thank supporters during this difficult and unsettling time and reassure them plans are now being put in place to move the club forward.
Just appeared on the website
Delusional.
Potential sale?
Sales don't happen overnight, we've a tax bill outstanding still with payment due next week and then there's the next salary run and associated PAYE, where's the magic money tree suddenly come from?
What have we been using for the last couple of years then?
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If he's sorted the immediate shit and decided to sell, fair play to him. At least he's not keeping us dangling for 5-6 years like that fuckwit Lerner, the real reason why we're in this state in the first place. Xia has had a go and it's not worked although we were close.
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Aston Villa Football Club can confirm that an agreement has been reached with HMRC and the club will continue to fulfil its obligations.
The club can also announce that there are no insolvency practitioners or administration advisors working with the club.
Owner and Chairman Dr Tony Xia would like to take this opportunity to sincerely thank supporters during this difficult and unsettling time and reassure them plans are now being put in place to move the club forward.
Just appeared on the website
So, our football club is not currently being declared insolvent or going into administration.
All’s fucking good then, isn’t it !
(That’s Sarcasm by the way)
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Aston Villa Football Club can confirm that an agreement has been reached with HMRC and the club will continue to fulfil its obligations.
The club can also announce that there are no insolvency practitioners or administration advisors working with the club.
Owner and Chairman Dr Tony Xia would like to take this opportunity to sincerely thank supporters during this difficult and unsettling time and reassure them plans are now being put in place to move the club forward.
Just appeared on the website
Delusional.
Potential sale?
Sales don't happen overnight, we've a tax bill outstanding still with payment due next week and then there's the next salary run and associated PAYE, where's the magic money tree suddenly come from?
What have we been using for the last couple of years then?
It's run out mate, we're overdrawn at the TSB and our cheque book has been confiscated.
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what that means is he has probably borrowed money from other people in China.
that is how people do business over here. it is probably how he bought the club in the first place.
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I couldn’t give a toss how much he’s ‘hurting.’
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Aston Villa Football Club can confirm that an agreement has been reached with HMRC and the club will continue to fulfil its obligations.
The club can also announce that there are no insolvency practitioners or administration advisors working with the club.
Owner and Chairman Dr Tony Xia would like to take this opportunity to sincerely thank supporters during this difficult and unsettling time and reassure them plans are now being put in place to move the club forward.
Just appeared on the website
Delusional.
Potential sale?
Sales don't happen overnight, we've a tax bill outstanding still with payment due next week and then there's the next salary run and associated PAYE, where's the magic money tree suddenly come from?
What have we been using for the last couple of years then?
To be fair Drummond it's being reported that he's had difficulties getting money out of China for nearly a year, its bit particularly hard lately. Probably the reason he's selling if that's his intention. It's not to say that he won't get something through in between though, if it continues to be more 'intermittent' than stopped for good. Or failing that we'll raise the money through transfers I would imagine, doesn't take that long for those to go through, or maybe this car park that's been mentioned.
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If he has sorted out the HMRC debtband is he’ll bent on keeping control, now watch the players being sold to pay the money back.
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If he has sorted out the HMRC debtband is he’ll bent on keeping control, now watch the players being sold to pay the money back.
Or the other possibility is that he would consider it to be career endingly bad for the club to go bust so he'll make sure that doesn't happen and then get out while he can, unwilling to gamble on a football club any further.
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If he has sorted out the HMRC debtband is he’ll bent on keeping control, now watch the players being sold to pay the money back.
Precisely.
The loans he has just taken need repaying, as well as the normal bills and the next tax bill.
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If he has sorted out the HMRC debtband is he’ll bent on keeping control, now watch the players being sold to pay the money back.
Or the other possibility is that he would consider it to be career endingly bad for the club to go bust so he'll make sure that doesn't happen and then get out while he can, unwilling to gamble on a football club any further.
I sincerely hope this is the case. That he is keeping it afloat for a sale and the sale happens quickly.
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He can’t stay long term. His credibility is completely shot.
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I couldn’t give a toss how much he’s ‘hurting.’
First thing I thought. What an ego-maniacal little prick.
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I must have missed the part where he apologised to the fans for landing OUR club in this mess.
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I'm an old(ish) bugger and I hate being in this shit pot league with a passion, however i'd have put up with being in it for a couple of years if we'd basically ripped the club apart and started fresh and built for the long term future, main reason I wanted Bruce gone after the first season was because we still looked a disjointed mess a lot of the time, not because we finished mid-table.
Instead we repeated all the same mistakes of going short term by buying a number of overpriced players that will be hard to shift, building up an unsustainable wage bill and hired a manager that as we've seen built pretty much everything based on a one season push. So now the odds look good that we'll be stuck down here for a fair old while barring a miracle.
100% agree.
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I couldn’t give a toss how much he’s ‘hurting.’
First thing I thought. What an ego-maniacal little prick.
Is it true he was in tears while on the conference call with the tax man?
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Fucker's no better than the hairdresser. C**t.
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Hurting. Pathetic, his ego is bruised, he's been part of the Villa tapestry and us his for barely 2 years. The Villa have been part of my life for pretty much all of it that I can remember. Child and Adulthood. The bloke has no idea what he is on about.
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Seriously, who on here would trust him staying in charge? I'll wait.
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Seriously, who on here would trust him staying in charge? I'll wait.
No one - his position is untenable. He has to sell up
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If he has sorted out the HMRC debtband is he’ll bent on keeping control, now watch the players being sold to pay the money back.
Or the other possibility is that he would consider it to be career endingly bad for the club to go bust so he'll make sure that doesn't happen and then get out while he can, unwilling to gamble on a football club any further.
Based on absolutely nothing, this is my most likely scenario too.
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His last tweet reads like a suicide note.
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Seriously, who on here would trust him staying in charge? I'll wait.
No one - his position is untenable. He has to sell up
This. There’s no coming back from this now for the Dr. The sooner he goes, the better.
And then we start the whole process again. (Sigh)
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His last tweet reads like a suicide note.
Does he have £40m in life insurance?
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His last tweet reads like a suicide note.
Does he have £40m in life insurance?
Yes but he does but forgot to pay his last premium.
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Hurrah, we are saved. At least until the end of the month.
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I probably shouldn't say this but I am beginning to feel a bit sorry for Tony. He inherited an absolute basket case which no doubt was losing money (do we know if Randy was propping us up by £4m a month before Tony took over?) and then was probably advised by KW and RDM to throw more money at it to gamble on a quick return to the PL, probably assuring him it would be a no brainer because they would get the right players (assuming Tone knows nothing about football of course!).
So he did and ended up pouring more petrol on the fire because they couldn't get rid of the wasters. Is this his fault? Bottom line now is that he is personally trying to put out the fires and sounds like he has at least saved us for now, and possibly found some new investment to boot which might be what we need rather than a complete new change of ownership. There again he could be the Crason Young-Like chancer many have made him out to be, but I have seen nothing from his statements or tweets that suggest he didn't want the best for the club. I guess it will all come out in the next few weeks if we see our best players all buggering off, but for now I am clinging to the notion that he is trying to do his best to get investment in so we can field a team that can challenge again next season - he said with every extremity tightly crossed....
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How can anyone feel sorry for Xia? He's brought nothing but shame and embarrassment on our great club. A complete amateur at running a football club. He needs to do the right thing and sell-up as soon as possible - can we trust him to find the right owner??
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I probably shouldn't say this but I am beginning to feel a bit sorry for Tony. He inherited an absolute basket case which no doubt was losing money (do we know if Randy was propping us up by £4m a month before Tony took over?) and then was probably advised by KW and RDM to throw more money at it to gamble on a quick return to the PL, probably assuring him it would be a no brainer because they would get the right players (assuming Tone knows nothing about football of course!).
So he did and ended up pouring more petrol on the fire because they couldn't get rid of the wasters. Is this his fault? Bottom line now is that he is personally trying to put out the fires and sounds like he has at least saved us for now, and possibly found some new investment to boot which might be what we need rather than a complete new change of ownership. There again he could be the Crason Young-Like chancer many have made him out to be, but I have seen nothing from his statements or tweets that suggest he didn't want the best for the club. I guess it will all come out in the next few weeks if we see our best players all buggering off, but for now I am clinging to the notion that he is trying to do his best to get investment in so we can field a team that can challenge again next season - he said with every extremity tightly crossed....
He's supposedly a billionaire businessman. He should have known exactly what it was he was getting himself into.
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We dared to believe and we could still be believing if we had won at Wembley. As it stands appears he is another football fraud. Just wish it hadn't happened to our club.
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We’ve seemed to have attracted the shittest billionaires on the planet
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Singular not pleural
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To be fair to him he has been funding a £5m a month working capital funding gap for nearly two years. That is quite a lot of dough when you think about it. Betting the house on one game though was the mistake.
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By the way I read that we shelved plans to wear play off final suits as we couldn't afford £20k on them. Whatever happened to Suits Plus - 2 for £100.
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To be fair to him he has been funding a £5m a month working capital funding gap for nearly two years. That is quite a lot of dough when you think about it. Betting the house on one game though was the mistake.
You do have to be fair to someone that has ploughed 150 million of their own cash in. He needs to accept his losses and sell up though.
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Enough people cast serious doubts about this character when he bowled up. Even the FT couldn't get a handle on him. Despite this and his bizarre tweets many fans bought into the project, illustrating the desperation of a success starved club.
Its very sad but ultimately unsurprising.
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To be fair to him he has been funding a £5m a month working capital funding gap for nearly two years. That is quite a lot of dough when you think about it. Betting the house on one game though was the mistake.
You do have to be fair to someone that has ploughed 150 million of their own cash in. He needs to accept his losses and sell up though.
Like Lerner it appears to have been a very expensive hobby - we don't need another " fan" we need a savvy sports business individual/s who can turn a profit/ break even whilst moving the club onwards
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To be fair to him he has been funding a £5m a month working capital funding gap for nearly two years. That is quite a lot of dough when you think about it. Betting the house on one game though was the mistake.
You do have to be fair to someone that has ploughed 150 million of their own cash in. He needs to accept his losses and sell up though.
Can you provide the details of the £150m cash?
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We dared to believe and we could still be believing if we had won at Wembley. As it stands appears he is another football fraud. Just wish it hadn't happened to our club.
I woulWe dared to believe and we could still be believing if we had won at Wembley. As it stands appears he is another football fraud. Just wish it hadn't happened to our club.
I wouldn't wish this on any club.
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The stuff in the press about this has almost been dictated by Wyness. There is far more to it. I am not sure who is briefing Collymore mind.
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The stuff in the press about this has almost been dictated by Wyness. There is far more to it. I am not sure who is briefing Collymore mind.
. You think someone briefs him?!
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Somebody has, yes.
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:(
Somebody has, yes.
Not seen it, what Is he saying.
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It was all the stuff yesterday about running out of cash and the fact that we’ve already borrowed against the final parachute payments.
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I have no regrets backing him. I'd have got behind whoever it was who came in. That's what supporters do.
Not this supporter. I don't blindly follow any old plank that has a claret and blue track suit on, I want what's best for the club in the long run. It was always obvious that was never going to be Bruce.
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It was all the stuff yesterday about running out of cash and the fact that we’ve already borrowed against the final parachute payments.
I saw the Macquarrie thing, any ideas who else is lending.
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So are we to conclude that he is not actually a billionaire and has ran out of cash- the charlatan option or he is a billionaire but doesn’t want to put any more money into the club- the tosser option?
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Or he wants to put more money into the club but the Chinese authorities are preventing him ?
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HSBC are the main funder.
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We all seem to be making judgements when we know very little about what is going on.
I do know that I don't trust newspaper guesswork.
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Well whichever way you look at it it’s bad.
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Or he wants to put more money into the club but the Chinese authorities are preventing him ?
Don't spoil it for him, he doesn't get to call him a 'funny' name that way.
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Or he wants to put more money into the club but the Chinese authorities are preventing him ?
Not buying this one.
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Or he wants to put more money into the club but the Chinese authorities are preventing him ?
Not buying this one.
Well there's a surprise
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Or he wants to put more money into the club but the Chinese authorities are preventing him ?
Not buying this one.
Well there's a surprise
See my post on the other thread where I explain why.
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Or he wants to put more money into the club but the Chinese authorities are preventing him ?
You're still at the denial stage. It's anger and bargaining next, then depression.
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I think its obvious what he's doing. He'll start selling individual shares for £5 a go, and then have a raffle where the winner with the lucky share gets the club. Works for those people who do it with their houses
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Just got in and playing catch up on the day. Tweeting, instead of putting out a proper statement is embarrassing and amateurish. Lead from the front, stop feeling sorry for yourself, put a proper plan in place. He won't want to sell up due to his honour but I don't see any other way unless he has some rich non-Chinese mates who can pump dosh straight in and not have it marooned in China.
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Just got in and playing catch up on the day. Tweeting, instead of putting out a proper statement is embarrassing and amateurish. Lead from the front, stop feeling sorry for yourself, put a proper plan in place. He won't want to sell up due to his honour but I don't see any other way unless he has some rich non-Chinese mates who can pump dosh straight in and not have it marooned in China.
What? You mean like this - https://www.avfc.co.uk/News/2018/06/07/club-statement-hmrc (https://www.avfc.co.uk/News/2018/06/07/club-statement-hmrc) ?
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He's been out and still catching up, don't be smart.
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So according to Collymore, Dr X has found a way to get £50m into the club.
I don't know what to think anymore.
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Well whichever way you look at it it’s bad.
Pretty much Paul. Whether he doesn’t have the money or he does and just can’t get it out of China, the result is the same really. If either scenario is true and the latter looks like it will be an ongoing situation, then a parting of the ways would be the best option.
The big concern is that if either of the above scenarios are true, he won’t let go through a sense pride or delusion and would rather run the club into the ground.
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So according to Collymore, Dr X has found a way to get £50m into the club.
I don't know what to think anymore.
Grealish £30 million
Chester £10 million
Jedinak, Adomah, Davis £10 million
Seriously though, £50 million is more or less the resale value of the club if you take the debt off it. It's a staggering amount of money. If he's been paying in around £4 million a month to keep us afloat, why the need now to throw such a large sum in? It makes no sense at all.
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We need something like that to keep us going this season, many people have reported (I've seen 65m)
If he can get this out of china either that was never the problem or they've been convinced to ease up to save face
I can't work out the connection with the apparent moves to sell shares in avfc to someone though?
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We need something like that to keep us going this season, many people have reported (I've seen 65m)
If he can get this out of china either that was never the problem or they've been convinced to ease up to save face
I can't work out the connection with the apparent moves to sell shares in avfc to someone though?
I appreciate that but surely you wouldn't throw it in, in one lump? Surely he'd only be looking to limp through the next two months and then re-assess once the transfer window shuts, knowing for certain what sums we've managed to raise and what the wage bill is going to be?
I just don't get any benefit in such a big loan at this stage, especially as there is (presumably) interest to be paid on it.
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Yeah I see the point .
But if we're living hand to mouth, taking out loans to cover debt repayments, negotiating early payments (which we already owe to pay off more debt) then we need a pretty hefty upfront sum just to keep going. We don't know that the whole 50m will be injected into villa in one go either
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Well either way, it's the first bit of good news for a while if true. I'm certainly not knocking it, just finding it hard to understand how we've gone from missing monthly payments to having 12 months worth of payments in one go.
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Well either way, it's the first bit of good news for a while if true. I'm certainly not knocking it, just finding it hard to understand how we've gone from missing monthly payments to having 12 months worth of payments in one go.
If papers are to be believed we owe about 10m in transfer fees 6m for fat mac, wage bill 5m a month and tax something similar, only buys us a 3 months max
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Well either way, it's the first bit of good news for a while if true. I'm certainly not knocking it, just finding it hard to understand how we've gone from missing monthly payments to having 12 months worth of payments in one go.
If papers are to be believed we owe about 10m in transfer fees 6m for fat mac, wage bill 5m a month and tax something similar, only buys us a 3 months max
I'd say that we probably do owe that money. The taxes are not as high as you have stated, according to Mark Ansell. If £4 million was keeping us afloat last season, the only difference this season would be the deficit in parachute money, which will presumably be funded by the Jack sale. £50 million would then be enough to get through the season.
There is of course the issue of FFP - We cannot plough another £50 million in so there is going to have to be severe adjustments to the wage bill over the next few months.
Whilst we owe money out on transfers, it is reasonable to assume that we have some to come in as well.
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Whilst we owe money out on transfers, it is reasonable to assume that we have some to come in as well.
Not sure if you have seen but there have been reports of us factoring incoming transfer fees, hopefully not all of them.
If he has had problems getting money out of China then doesn’t it make sense to get as much out as possible in one go if restrictions have been eased?
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Yes - I'd seen the report that we'd borrowed against potential transfers.
My point was that whilst we have stage payments to go out on Chester, McCormack & Hogan, it would be reasonable to assume that we have stage payments coming in on players like Baker, Gestede, Guye, Vertout, Amavi etc, etc. I wasn't referring to future transfers.
Yes, it's a valid reason to get money out while you can. It still seems a staggering amount to me.
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Amarvi was one of the transfers reported as being factored, along with Sanchez. Other one we’d had early, and presumably spent, was reportedly Westwood.
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Amarvi was one of the transfers reported as being factored, along with Sanchez. Other one we’d had early, and presumably spent, was reportedly Westwood.
Yes, some may have been factored but as you say, hopefully not all of them which means there will be some incoming income to offset against the outgoing payments.
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Personally I am not convinced that the notoriously hard nosed businessman that is Daniel Levy has suddenly turned into Father Christmas and is about to give us fifty million quid in cash up front for Jack Grealish. Which is how the media are making it sound. If anything our very public situation is a green light for people to take the piss with low offers for any of our players hoping we are desperate enough to accept.
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The reported £50m incoming loan will help in that respect, we won’t look quite as desperate for cash and likely to accept any old offer, at least for this window.
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Keeping the club out of administration will only help that. Our assets will be viewed from a purely financial perspective.
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The house looks secure for the next six months if that is correct. It still means offloading a bunch of players though. And that is before FFP rears its head again (although obviously the bigger game of remaining solvent has taken precedence this week).
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I guess this means we can't afford to sack SB as we couldn't pay him off and pay compensation for a new manager.
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i'm really not sure how long 50m is going to last. We lost 14.5m in the last accounts, that presumably including Tony's regular sub from china and the 33m parachute payment. So 18m would have to make up the shortfall in that for a start which leaves 32m. then take off the transfer fees owed and you're probably looking at limping towards September before it went tits-up again.. You'd hope the wage bill will have come down a million or so this month but we have other bills i'm guessing like paying for the pitch. Massive player firesale is the only way he's gonna do it unless he has a buyer.
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Scrambling around organising loans and staggering payments and selling off debts, it's fucking shambles.Tony is broke. The bloke is a fraud.
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i'm really not sure how long 50m is going to last. We lost 14.5m in the last accounts, that presumably including Tony's regular sub from china and the 33m parachute payment. So 18m would have to make up the shortfall in that for a start which leaves 32m. then take off the transfer fees owed and you're probably looking at limping towards September before it went tits-up again.. You'd hope the wage bill will have come down a million or so this month but we have other bills i'm guessing like paying for the pitch. Massive player firesale is the only way he's gonna do it unless he has a buyer.
Well don’t forget revenue starts up again in August.
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Scrambling around organising loans and staggering payments and selling off debts, it's fucking shambles.Tony is broke. The bloke is a fraud.
The last two sentences you've no idea about but the first is right!
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Well regardless of where it came from (read somewhere it could be as much as £65 million), and whether it's good or bad long term, he seems to have got it and that's one crisis staved off, for the moment anyway.
Now he has to address how to get £170 million in 2018/19...sort a manager out, hold onto the key players and get us playing decent, winning football again. His asset will look a lot better sitting at the top of the league and heading for the "promised land".
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Personally I am not convinced that the notoriously hard nosed businessman that is Daniel Levy has suddenly turned into Father Christmas and is about to give us fifty million quid in cash up front for Jack Grealish. Which is how the media are making it sound. If anything our very public situation is a green light for people to take the piss with low offers for any of our players hoping we are desperate enough to accept.
This was my worry. But the £50m injection may be a way of stalling the vultures and saying no fire sale, we want full value for our players.
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i'm really not sure how long 50m is going to last. We lost 14.5m in the last accounts, that presumably including Tony's regular sub from china and the 33m parachute payment. So 18m would have to make up the shortfall in that for a start which leaves 32m. then take off the transfer fees owed and you're probably looking at limping towards September before it went tits-up again.. You'd hope the wage bill will have come down a million or so this month but we have other bills i'm guessing like paying for the pitch. Massive player firesale is the only way he's gonna do it unless he has a buyer.
Well don’t forget revenue starts up again in August.
Well yeah its an admittedly simplistic view. My point is that there is the temptation to think of £50m taking us forward from now, when the reality is probably 20m of that is going straight out on existing debts. If you're not paying HMRC on time then you can bet there's a few less nasty creditors they've put off. Again being simplistic, if you add the missing funds from the parachute payments then add that to the loss last season, you're looking at 32 million so possibly 2.6m loss a month. But that figure doesn't include what tony put in so maybe 5m a loss a month? So what's that, 5 months leeway if we have 30m left?
On the plus side, as you say we have match day revenue, maybe payments from sponsership due, TV money etc... to cover immediate bills. Also the wages bill should be a good 1m a month less so maybe 4m a month to find?
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If there is £50m additional funding in place, we're fine.
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Scrambling around organising loans and staggering payments and selling off debts, it's fucking shambles.Tony is broke. The bloke is a fraud.
For someone who's net worth is £900million he seems unable to come up with the cash. If its all tied up and not liquid then he may as well be as poor as the rest of us.
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The really unfortunate thing in all this is we were within a year of finally getting a grip on the financial side. Whatever you think of the owners latest fuckup, whether he hasn't got the money, has got it but can't use it etc., he's made more headway in tackling the costs than Lerner managed in 5 years. I mean the wage bill dropped by 30m last accounts. Even with player contracts ending and the players relegation clauses kicking in, that was a staggering amount to save - about 20 well paid first team players i reckon
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But wasn't that primarily because Tom Fox did the obvious thing and negotiated relegation triggered wage reductions? (Though I was still surprised about the scale of reductions given some of the wages we seem to be paying)
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The really unfortunate thing in all this is we were within a year of finally getting a grip on the financial side.
There's little point in reducing it one year, to then go on such a spending spree the year after that you almost cripple the club for good.
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But wasn't that primarily because Tom Fox did the obvious thing and negotiated relegation triggered wage reductions? (Though I was still surprised about the scale of reductions given some of the wages we seem to be paying)
my guess is some of the newer contracts when we started looking nervously over our shoulders at relegation but certainly not across the board. And of course how much was their salaries reduced by? I doubt it was 50%
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The really unfortunate thing in all this is we were within a year of finally getting a grip on the financial side.
There's little point in reducing it one year, to then go on such a spending spree the year after that you almost cripple the club for good.
No i think those figures included all of our signings apart from elmo and whelan, and the loans and thelikes of Terry. If you take out all the players that have left this summer through one way or another, i'd say the wage bill has probably dropped at least another 12m.
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Personally I am not convinced that the notoriously hard nosed businessman that is Daniel Levy has suddenly turned into Father Christmas and is about to give us fifty million quid in cash up front for Jack Grealish. Which is how the media are making it sound. If anything our very public situation is a green light for people to take the piss with low offers for any of our players hoping we are desperate enough to accept.
This was my worry. But the £50m injection may be a way of stalling the vultures and saying no fire sale, we want full value for our players.
Well yes and no. The £50m will stave off Administration as it will cover the shortfall in operating costs presumably for next season. But it still doesn't necessarily mean we won't be prey to the Levies of this world. We simply have to sell the key players that only means we look desperate.
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Cash buys time, so it looks like we will be able to negotiate better than in Admin.
But every one knows our position and we vulnerable.
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Cash buys time, so it looks like we will be able to negotiate better than in Admin.
But every one knows our position and we vulnerable.
Everyone knows we fucked up but doesn't know our position.
If the owner has found another £50m, then there's nothing that we're aware of to stop him doing it again.
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Cash buys time, so it looks like we will be able to negotiate better than in Admin.
But every one knows our position and we vulnerable.
Everyone knows we fucked up but doesn't know our position.
If the owner has found another £50m, then there's nothing that we're aware of to stop him doing it again.
We still have FFP and cash does not solve that.
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Cash buys time, so it looks like we will be able to negotiate better than in Admin.
But every one knows our position and we vulnerable.
Everyone knows we fucked up but doesn't know our position.
If the owner has found another £50m, then there's nothing that we're aware of to stop him doing it again.
We still have FFP and cash does not solve that.
Exactly. In fact it makes it worse.
That's why we're in such a bind. Can't pay our bills, struggle to find the cash to do so, inject money into club, fall even more foul of FFP.
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It doesn't if it's a non-interest loan though does it?
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I'm struggling to reconcile the position of the accounts regarding losses and our current cashflow crisis. Something doesn't stack up. Are the accounts for the season just finished going to show something massively different to what was intimated only a few months ago.
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I'm struggling to reconcile the position of the accounts regarding losses and our current cashflow crisis. Something doesn't stack up. Are the accounts for the season just finished going to show something massively different to what was intimated only a few months ago.
Not at all. We're running at a massive loss. Have been for years. The only reason this hadn't happened sooner is because first Randy and then Tony we're putting money in to the club But as soon as that stopped, as appears to be the case now, the house of cards comes crashing down.
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I'm struggling to reconcile the position of the accounts regarding losses and our current cashflow crisis. Something doesn't stack up. Are the accounts for the season just finished going to show something massively different to what was intimated only a few months ago.
They are 2 separate items although making losses absorbs cash.
FFP is concerned with the trading position and it is projected that our losses would be culmitively 80 million which we need to get down to 39 million so we have got to generate 40 million of revenue or savings.
Our cash position has Ben subsidized heavily before by Lerner and now by Xia, the cash crisis is because there was not enough money around to settle creditors.
The FFP situation is still to be addressed and which is why selling a Jack for example because we will make a large profit on the deal seems extremely likely.
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What I don’t understand is why other teams that drop out of the PL don’t get caught by FFP such as the Baggies?!? Are they just smarter with the players contracts?!?
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I'm struggling to reconcile the position of the accounts regarding losses and our current cashflow crisis. Something doesn't stack up. Are the accounts for the season just finished going to show something massively different to what was intimated only a few months ago.
They are 2 separate items although making losses absorbs cash.
FFP is concerned with the trading position and it is projected that our losses would be culmitively 80 million which we need to get down to 39 million so we have got to generate 40 million of revenue or savings.
Our cash position has Ben subsidized heavily before by Lerner and now by Xia, the cash crisis is because there was not enough money around to settle creditors.
The FFP situation is still to be addressed and which is why selling a Jack for example because we will make a large profit on the deal seems extremely likely.
I wasn't talking about FFP as that is a separate item, although linked.
What I meant was the cash position seems to be far worse than the loss declared in the accounts and the projected accounts for this season just finished.
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I'm struggling to reconcile the position of the accounts regarding losses and our current cashflow crisis. Something doesn't stack up. Are the accounts for the season just finished going to show something massively different to what was intimated only a few months ago.
They are 2 separate items although making losses absorbs cash.
FFP is concerned with the trading position and it is projected that our losses would be culmitively 80 million which we need to get down to 39 million so we have got to generate 40 million of revenue or savings.
Our cash position has Ben subsidized heavily before by Lerner and now by Xia, the cash crisis is because there was not enough money around to settle creditors.
The FFP situation is still to be addressed and which is why selling a Jack for example because we will make a large profit on the deal seems extremely likely.
I wasn't talking about FFP as that is a separate item, although linked.
What I meant was the cash position seems to be far worse than the loss declared in the accounts and the projected accounts for this season just finished.
That is what really took me by surprise too. FFP is one thing, the lack of operating capital and rumours of unpaid wages is a real shock
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What I don’t understand is why other teams that drop out of the PL don’t get caught by FFP such as the Baggies?!? Are they just smarter with the players contracts?!?
Because they still have significant parachute money coming through as it is their first year. If, as we have done, they gamble all that money in the first two years and don't go up then they will be in exactly the same position. We are by far the highest profile club for this to happen to since Leeds.
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What I don’t understand is why other teams that drop out of the PL don’t get caught by FFP such as the Baggies?!? Are they just smarter with the players contracts?!?
Because they still have significant parachute money coming through as it is their first year. If, as we have done, they gamble all that money in the first two years and don't go up then they will be in exactly the same position. We are by far the highest profile club for this to happen to since Leeds.
yo yo clubs are used to constructing player contracts accordingly.
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Has he gone yet?
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Really don’t think FFP rules are much to be worried about at the moment. Being a club that can actually start the first game in August is the minimum we can ask.
Clearly our owner doesn’t have or can’t get for whatever reason due to Chinese money export rules means we are in the brown stuff and are the mercy of predators picking off our good players for a song.
Either way OUR great club is yet again on the slide due to poor judgement on part of the owners.
We need a new owner that can shoulder the costs.
Or maybe, we simply slide into the abyss and rise back through the leagues aka Rangers.
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I don’t think having an owner who pumps money in to make up for shortfalls is the answer really. Creating a sustainable structure where we don’t live beyond our means and having a manager who will focus on developing our own young players would be a better way forward.
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What make me annoyed/so upset the most about all this is for the first time in a long time we are about to lose a load of players who we actually like, who care for the club and all that. It's soul destroying.
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What make me annoyed/so upset the most about all this is for the first time in a long time we are about to lose a load of players who we actually like, who care for the club and all that. It's soul destroying.
Yes. Players on loan that were good enough or thereabouts, were good characters and would die for the shirt (Terry, Snoddy), who seemed a great influence in character on the most talented and precious asset in a generation, and yes even to my surprise/conversion, so damn likeable. I hope the story of Terry giving up his final month's wages and already cult-hero Hutton willing to take a pay cut, are true.
I wish Richards and others would show some pride and follow suit. A simple statement expressing support and perhaps regret things didn't work out better from some players, along with some compromise on the amount of lifeblood they are draining from the club, would be so beautiful. If ever there was a time to show some deeper values.
Not that its players fault the club were daft enough to give them great deals, and in providing for their own families who can blame them, but, it'll mean otherwise more loss of jobs for little people at the club as belts tighten.
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I would love to see us announce that Richards had agreed to mutually end his contract the fat useless waste of fucking space. The man makes me angry, because he clearly has no professional pride. McCormack at least went and tried to get games on loan and get back, but he's not going to play while Bruce is here so Steve Round needs to do his bloody job and find a way to move him on. Someone will pay 4 million, which would also take his wages off the books. Between them that would be the best past of 4 million saved a season for people that won't even kick a ball. There must be a target for wages, say 30 million a season, that we can reach and break even at.
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I would love to see us announce that Richards had agreed to mutually end his contract the fat useless waste of fucking space. The man makes me angry, because he clearly has no professional pride. McCormack at least went and tried to get games on loan and get back, but he's not going to play while Bruce is here so Steve Round needs to do his bloody job and find a way to move him on. Someone will pay 4 million, which would also take his wages off the books. Between them that would be the best past of 4 million saved a season for people that won't even kick a ball. There must be a target for wages, say 30 million a season, that we can reach and break even at.
I wish the press would get hold of this and do a "whatever happened to...?' type article on Richards. I know they won't call him out for the worry of being sued but it might embarrass him in to leaving and doing the right thing. Absolute disgrace, wage stealing.
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I would love to see us announce that Richards had agreed to mutually end his contract the fat useless waste of fucking space. The man makes me angry, because he clearly has no professional pride. McCormack at least went and tried to get games on loan and get back, but he's not going to play while Bruce is here so Steve Round needs to do his bloody job and find a way to move him on. Someone will pay 4 million, which would also take his wages off the books. Between them that would be the best past of 4 million saved a season for people that won't even kick a ball. There must be a target for wages, say 30 million a season, that we can reach and break even at.
Easier said than done ozzjim.
Even if some club were to offer 4 million for him would they match the salary he gets here? I doubt it very much.
He and the other useless prick will see out there contracts on the salaries they now receive and become 'free agents' at the end of it.
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The Surely must come a point in the very near future where football clubs can sack players!
If I turned up and work and refused to use my computer i would be sacked within a few days. It's no diffrent to what richards and mc are doing to us. Basically refusing to stay in shape and train properly is gross misconduct and should be treated as such!
A player can refuse to play for his club to force through a transfer but the club cant do the same? Ridiculous and totally unfair to the club's and part of the reason football is fundamentally broken beyond repair
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The Surely must come a point in the very near future where football clubs can sack players!
If I turned up and work and refused to use my computer i would be sacked within a few days. It's no diffrent to what richards and mc are doing to us. Basically refusing to stay in shape and train properly is gross misconduct and should be treated as such!
A player can refuse to play for his club to force through a transfer but the club cant do the same? Ridiculous and totally unfair to the club's and part of the reason football is fundamentally broken beyond repair
You make a good point here. And I'm from a background of family and close friends who have long since fought for workers rights.
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Is Richards refusing to train? I thought the issue was that it's turned out he's monumentally shite, no? He reminded me of Holman in a "doesn't know what he's doing on a football pitch" kinda way. Perhaps he should have been the one we shipped out Down Under.
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Is Richards refusing to train? I thought the issue was that it's turned out he's monumentally shite, no? He reminded me of Holman in a "doesn't know what he's doing on a football pitch" kinda way. Perhaps he should have been the one we shipped out Down Under.
I believe that Richards problem is that he's massively overweight. He looks more like a nightclub bouncer than a footballer and clearly hasn't got 90 minutes in him.
I suspect that this is the reason why he wanted to play in the centre of defence rather than at full back, ie less running is required.
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You could have a performance related pay structure with win bonuses, bonus per game etc. but with today's squad based system, how many players would want to sign for those clubs when others offered flat rates. Also, it can lead to lack of team spirit.
I think the problems are contract length and the squad size, where players can hide in the squad and not affect the match day squad too much.
The real issue is that players have too much power. Also, there are not that many decent stand out players.
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Is Richards refusing to train? I thought the issue was that it's turned out he's monumentally shite, no? He reminded me of Holman in a "doesn't know what he's doing on a football pitch" kinda way. Perhaps he should have been the one we shipped out Down Under.
I believe that Richards problem is that he's massively overweight. He looks more like a nightclub bouncer than a footballer and clearly hasn't got 90 minutes in him.
I suspect that this is the reason why he wanted to play in the centre of defence rather than at full back, ie less running is required.
You've seen him? I was beginning to think he'd disappeared.
Has he even played in reserve/friendly games this year?
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Surley we can sack Richards for breach of contract if he is refusing to train?
If he is just injured permanently can't we get an insurance pay out?
I dont understand how he gets away with it!
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I believe the problem with richards is the knee. Can't remember the medical term but basically he can't train without aggravating it so can't get fit. Why he's hasn't been paid off is a good question. My guess is because we signed him knowing he had the problem and we can't get a pay-off
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I believe the problem with richards is the knee. Can't remember the medical term but basically he can't train without aggravating it so can't get fit. Why he's hasn't been paid off is a good question. My guess is because we signed him knowing he had the problem and we can't get a pay-off
I'd like to say I can't believe we'd do that but...
And he's still only 29. Should be at the peak of his career.
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A mate of mine who bumped into McCormack reported him looking in great shape
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If Richards has a twitter account why not just tweet him asking him what the situation is because from the outside it looks like another case of a scandalously rich player leaching from a foolish club.
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Looks like he hasn’t tweeted since October 2016, but has retweeted a few times.
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About time Xia came out with a proper statement. We need to know his intentions. Not some vague rubbish or a poorly written tweet...
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If Richards has a twitter account why not just tweet him asking him what the situation is
If anyone tweeted me asking about my work situation there is zero chance of me responding. I doubt he'll spill the beans.
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It would certainly appear to be what qualified medical specialists would diagnose as a bad case of the hump.
See Gray's Anatomy under "Hump, getting The".
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Shudder.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=k-cm2nuM9us
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Has there ever been a football club with so much potential that has been run as badly as Villa have been for the best part of thirty years? I just hope that our next owners, whoever they may be have a touch of business acumen. Deep pockets wouldn't hurt either!
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Whoever signed Richards should be shot, sacked and then kicked in the cock (or fanny if it's a lady).
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Whoever signed Richards should be shot, sacked and then kicked in the cock (or fanny if it's a lady).
That’s the nun of it, Richards is perfectly entitled to see out his contract, it was the ridiculous length of contract that is crippling us.
He was regularly on the training photos through the season so that suggests he was fit but like Gabby it seemed he was not made available to the u23 side.
You’d have thought at some point out local press might have asked the question in a weekly press conference of what was Micah’s situation.
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Has there ever been a football club with so much potential that has been run as badly as Villa have been for the best part of thirty years? I just hope that our next owners, whoever they may be have a touch of business acumen. Deep pockets wouldn't hurt either!
I think Doug got it right and spent a few quid between 1987 and 2002. SGT, BFR, Brian Little and even Gregory to an extent were all inspired appointments and he backed them with money. After that SGT and DOL had to try to do everything on the cheap. Obviously we want the next owner to have deep pockets but with FFP even that won't guarantee success.
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Whoever signed Richards should be shot, sacked and then kicked in the cock (or fanny if it's a lady).
That’s the nun of it, Richards is perfectly entitled to see out his contract, it was the ridiculous length of contract that is crippling us.
He was regularly on the training photos through the season so that suggests he was fit but like Gabby it seemed he was not made available to the u23 side.
You’d have thought at some point out local press might have asked the question in a weekly press conference of what was Micah’s situation.
got into bad habits
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Whoever signed Richards should be shot, sacked and then kicked in the cock (or fanny if it's a lady).
That’s the nun of it, Richards is perfectly entitled to see out his contract, it was the ridiculous length of contract that is crippling us.
He was regularly on the training photos through the season so that suggests he was fit but like Gabby it seemed he was not made available to the u23 side.
You’d have thought at some point out local press might have asked the question in a weekly press conference of what was Micah’s situation.
got into bad habits
I've looked for evidence to back up this claim but I've found nun.
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Has there ever been a football club with so much potential that has been run as badly as Villa have been for the best part of thirty years? I just hope that our next owners, whoever they may be have a touch of business acumen. Deep pockets wouldn't hurt either!
I think Doug got it right and spent a few quid between 1987 and 2002. SGT, BFR, Brian Little and even Gregory to an extent were all inspired appointments and he backed them with money. After that SGT and DOL had to try to do everything on the cheap. Obviously we want the next owner to have deep pockets but with FFP even that won't guarantee success.
Turner, McNeil, Relegation and Venglos to name just four of the many cock ups under Ellis.
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Please, don't let's have another Ellis debate.
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https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2018/06/09/aston-villa-face-turmoil-prospect-another-45m-bill/
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Please copy and paste the article Kippax.
John Percy in the Telegraph
Aston Villa will hold crunch talks over their financial crisis this week, with the Championship club under pressure to slash their wage bill by up to £15m.
Villa have staved off the imminent threat of administration but are still facing further turmoil as they attempt to fall in line with Financial Fair Play rules.
It can be revealed that later this month the troubled Midlanders will be hit with another £4.5m bill – comprising tax and wages - which beleaguered owner Dr Tony Xia must pay or risk the threat of another winding-up order.
Xia, the Chinese businessman, secured a number of loans late last week to save Villa from possible administration, reaching an agreement with HMRC, but the club’s financial worries are mounting.
Villa want to drastically cut their £45m wage bill this summer to avoid the prospect of a fine or even transfer embargo, increasing uncertainty over the futures of players including Jack Grealish and James Chester.
Club chiefs want it significantly lowered to around £30m and, ideally, would prefer to offload fringe players such as Micah Richards, Ross McCormack and Henri Lansbury.
Next season’s budget and the summer strategy will be discussed in a meeting on Monday with technical director Steve Round, chief commercial officer Luke Organ, director Tracy Gu and executive assistant Rongtian He.
Steve Bruce, the manager, will not be present at the summit in London as he is still on holiday but his future remains uncertain due to the club’s dire finances.
Bruce could be an option for Leeds United if they fail to lure Marcelo Bielsa, while there are many Villa supporters who believe he should be sacked after failing to reach the Premier League.
A more pressing dilemma for Xia is the £4.5m bill expected on or around June 22, though some sources insist there is now enough cash to tide the club over until next month.
It is also understood that Xia is adamant the club will not be sold, while they are adopting a hardline stance on the future of Grealish.
The homegrown attacker is on the radar of Tottenham Hotspur and Leicester City but Villa will demand a transfer fee over £30m.
Keith Wyness, the chief executive, could have his future resolved this week after he was suspended on Tuesday.
Wyness and Xia clashed over the club’s future plans and it is thought unlikely the former will be returning.
Villa are preparing for a third season in the Championship after losing to Fulham in last month’s play-off final.
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Cobbling loans together.
Just like an actual billionaire would do.
Absolute fucking chancer.
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Wyness still feeding the press then? Somebody must be.
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Sorry mate I try and copy on my phone and it keeps stalling or I miss bits off.
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It's ok, it's just to try and save everyone having to go through that "accept" crap on sites these days.
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It ain’t gonna get any better, is it?
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I don’t think having an owner who pumps money in to make up for shortfalls is the answer really. Creating a sustainable structure where we don’t live beyond our means and having a manager who will focus on developing our own young players would be a better way forward.
This for me. It may sound idealistic but fuck it we have tried the hopelessly greedy route and failed miserably.
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Cobbling loans together.
Just like an actual billionaire would do.
Absolute fucking chancer.
Careful Paulie, I got singled out for that?
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Reading this it does make you wonder how we have got ourselves into such an unsustainable situation to the point where Xia has to pump in £4m a month to make up the shortfall
http://www.uefa.com/community/news/newsid=2064391.html
Sure stupid wages is probably the biggest cause but has anyone looked at our income generation? Does it stack up with other clubs of similar size?
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Nowt about the supposed injection of £50m of new cash.
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I'd be tempted to hold fire on any quick sales. Let's just say by Xmas we're in the hunt. If we get promoted we may get hit by FFP restrictions but the likelihood is a fine at worse. As we've seen in other cases it's not a business threatening amount. The league next year does not look that strong. IF we need to sell we have January as a back up if the league form gives us no hope. I'd be more foccused at trying to shift the big earners than selling our best players for under market value.
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It would be nice to have a choice but it doesnt look like we do, we need to raise money and fast.
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But selling the best players may satisfy the FFP ruling but it doesn't solve the weekly/monthly cash flow issues. If we sold Jack for £30m it only improves the balance sheet. We'd still have a monthly tax/wage bill that seems to be the overriding issue.
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But selling the best players may satisfy the FFP ruling but it doesn't solve the weekly/monthly cash flow issues. If we sold Jack for £30m it only improves the balance sheet. We'd still have a monthly tax/wage bill that seems to be the overriding issue.
It gives you the cash to pay the bills for a few more months. And when Jack, Chester and co leave, it obviously gets their wages off the bill. We'll still be left with robbers like Richards leading the club dry of course.
The worry when we do sell players (other than it be a total sickener anyway) is that we might do it for less than their true value in order to get all of the cash in up front instead of the usual instalments. Eg selling him to Spurs for £25m cash all in one go, rather than say £30m payable in instalments.
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Imagine how the Italian or South American Ultras would react to players like McCormack and Richards stinking out their clubs. I would have expected them to have found alternative clubs by now.
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Imagine how the Italian or South American Ultras would react to players like McCormack and Richards stinking out their clubs. I would have expected them to have found alternative clubs by now.
Frank, I think you know what you need to do.
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i'm not sure i believe that Telegraph article anyway. The wage bill looks too big to me and works out at about 27k a week per player over 35 players and a good 7 of them are kids! And it's asking a lot getting 15m off the wage bill. Notwithstanding the difficulty of finding clubs for about 12 players, could we still field a side?
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I'd be tempted to hold fire on any quick sales. Let's just say by Xmas we're in the hunt. If we get promoted we may get hit by FFP restrictions but the likelihood is a fine at worse. As we've seen in other cases it's not a business threatening amount. The league next year does not look that strong. IF we need to sell we have January as a back up if the league form gives us no hope. I'd be more foccused at trying to shift the big earners than selling our best players for under market value.
Yep, trying to offload some of the bigger earners who contribute very little has to be the priority. We simply can’t have four right backs at the club, so one or two of those can be shifted. Lansbury needs to be shifted and I would also be looking to shift Hogan as I just don’t see it working out for him, and RHM and Davis need to be given a chance. Finally, wasters-in-chief Richards and McCormack really need to go, but as we have seen before, it is all easier said than done.
As it stands, if we could trim the squad a bit we’d probably be left with senior squad of something like:
GK - Steer, Sarkic, Bunn (or new keeper)
RB - De Laet / Elmohamady, Bree, Hutton (to cover left back)
CB - Chester, Elphick, Suliman
LB - Taylor
DM - Whelan, Jedinak (to cover centre half), Lyden
AM - Grealish, Hourihane, Bjarnason
WM - Adomah, Green, O’Hare
ST - Kodjia (cover out wide), Davis, RHM
That’s a squad of 23 and there are a couple of other younger players such as Clark and Doyle-Hayes who could be in contention. I think the key would be to perhaps move on the likes of Elphick and Taylor and bring in better players who are on less money.
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I think people need to get realistic on who we can sell really. There's not a hope in hell we can sell the likes of richards. He's on massive wages and even if it made sense to pay up the final year of his contract, we may not have the cash flow to do it. I'd love to see all the crap being sold but it never happens.
I see the possible sales as follows.
Players we can sell who would make a profit and clubs could afford their wages
Grealish
Adomah
Chester
Kodjia
Hourihane
Elmo
Players we could offload at a small loss or maybe persuade to leave because other clubs would offer a longer contract, if not the wages
Jedinak
Whelan
Bjarnason
Elphick
Gardner
De Laet
Not a fucking hope in hell of finding a club that can afford them
Richards
McCormack
Hogan
Taylor
Lansbury
Add to that the youth players who would probably be attractive sell as far as FFP goes.
If the firesale is on, then we're gonna have a shitty squad by the end of it.
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I think clubs would take Lansbury, Hogan and Taylor off our hands. They've still got a few years left him them at this level. Wasn't there another club interested in Lansbury before he came here?
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I think clubs would take Lansbury, Hogan and Taylor off our hands. They've still got a few years left him them at this level. Wasn't there another club interested in Lansbury before he came here?
well if the wages are correct of 30-40k week would you go to say Norwich for 15k if you were any of them? Trouble is the clubs who would want them, can't afford them.
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I think clubs would take Lansbury, Hogan and Taylor off our hands. They've still got a few years left him them at this level. Wasn't there another club interested in Lansbury before he came here?
well if the wages are correct of 30-40k week would you go to say Norwich for 15k if you were any of them? Trouble is the clubs who would want them, can't afford them.
That's if the wages are correct. You might get a Stoke or Swansea possibly willing to pay it. I can imagine Taylor being on that because he came from a Premier League club. Not sure about Lansbury or Hogan but who knows?
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I think clubs would take Lansbury, Hogan and Taylor off our hands. They've still got a few years left him them at this level. Wasn't there another club interested in Lansbury before he came here?
well if the wages are correct of 30-40k week would you go to say Norwich for 15k if you were any of them? Trouble is the clubs who would want them, can't afford them.
That's if the wages are correct. You might get a Stoke or Swansea possibly willing to pay it. I can imagine Taylor being on that because he came from a Premier League club. Not sure about Lansbury or Hogan but who knows?
well that's it really. A club like stoke and swansea who have the parachute payments are probably the only options unless some PL club fancies them. The other alternative is to knock off money from the fee and use that to subsidize their wages if thats possible.
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I think clubs would take Lansbury, Hogan and Taylor off our hands. They've still got a few years left him them at this level. Wasn't there another club interested in Lansbury before he came here?
well if the wages are correct of 30-40k week would you go to say Norwich for 15k if you were any of them? Trouble is the clubs who would want them, can't afford them.
That's if the wages are correct. You might get a Stoke or Swansea possibly willing to pay it. I can imagine Taylor being on that because he came from a Premier League club. Not sure about Lansbury or Hogan but who knows?
There was a quote the other day that Hogan's wages are "eye-watering". I'd be surprised if he was on less than £50K a week. People who go for £10m+ are rarely on less than that, and there were rumours that West Ham were sniffing around. I think we've got very little chance of getting rid of him personally.
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I think clubs would take Lansbury, Hogan and Taylor off our hands. They've still got a few years left him them at this level. Wasn't there another club interested in Lansbury before he came here?
well if the wages are correct of 30-40k week would you go to say Norwich for 15k if you were any of them? Trouble is the clubs who would want them, can't afford them.
That's if the wages are correct. You might get a Stoke or Swansea possibly willing to pay it. I can imagine Taylor being on that because he came from a Premier League club. Not sure about Lansbury or Hogan but who knows?
There was a quote the other day that Hogan's wages are "eye-watering". I'd be surprised if he was on less than £50K a week. People who go for £10m+ are rarely on less than that, and there were rumours that West Ham were sniffing around. I think we've got very little chance of getting rid of him personally.
If correct, that would have been absolute madness to pay that as he probably would have been on about £10-15k at Brentford. People wonder how we have got to where we are and panic stands out as our modus operandi over the last few seasons.
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I think clubs would take Lansbury, Hogan and Taylor off our hands. They've still got a few years left him them at this level. Wasn't there another club interested in Lansbury before he came here?
well if the wages are correct of 30-40k week would you go to say Norwich for 15k if you were any of them? Trouble is the clubs who would want them, can't afford them.
That's if the wages are correct. You might get a Stoke or Swansea possibly willing to pay it. I can imagine Taylor being on that because he came from a Premier League club. Not sure about Lansbury or Hogan but who knows?
There was a quote the other day that Hogan's wages are "eye-watering". I'd be surprised if he was on less than £50K a week. People who go for £10m+ are rarely on less than that, and there were rumours that West Ham were sniffing around. I think we've got very little chance of getting rid of him personally.
If that's true, Wyness should be sacked for that alone.
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I can't help thinking that in the new world of 2018/19 players like Hogan and Lansbury will end up being the better players in our squad and possibly the difference between staying up or not. Not a pleasant state of affairs but at least we might get some use out of them.
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I think people need to get realistic on who we can sell really. There's not a hope in hell we can sell the likes of richards. He's on massive wages and even if it made sense to pay up the final year of his contract, we may not have the cash flow to do it.
Not a fucking hope in hell of finding a club that can afford them
McCormack
Hogan
Taylor
Lansbury
I agree that we are almost certainly going to have to swallow Richards being at the club for another season. Apart from McCormack, I wouldn’t put the others in the same category in terms of attitude, but they are a problem due to their wages. Paying ridiculous wages to periphery players has been a problem since the O’Neill days and serious questions must be asked about our approach to those discussions with players. It seems we have been paying massively over the odds in terms of wages for a long time now and it has caused untold problems.
With the previous scoring records of McCormack and Hogan, there might be some interest from clubs to take them on loan and we might be able to offset some of the cost of their wages that way. Like you, I doubt however that they will be unwilling to depart the gravy train any time soon.
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Yep.End of the day our wage bill is currently between 35-45m a year if you believe the most pessimistic papers. I reckon its probably about 37m so you have so say either a)Tony has been using the wages bill to siphon off money to a chinese bank account or b) we have 1 or 2 players on 200,000 a week or more likely c) the average is around the 25,000 a week mark. Now the problem we have is if you're a lansbury on 30k a week (i really hope the fuckwits aren't paying him more than that) then if a club comes in and offers 23k a week to him then over the length of his remaining contact he's losing a cool million to leave. At 27 if i was lansbury, i'd think twice about leaving.
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Yep.End of the day our wage bill is currently between 35-45m a year if you believe the most pessimistic papers. I reckon its probably about 37m so you have so say either a)Tony has been using the wages bill to siphon off money to a chinese bank account or b) we have 1 or 2 players on 200,000 a week or more likely c) the average is around the 25,000 a week mark. Now the problem we have is if you're a lansbury on 30k a week (i really hope the fuckwits aren't paying him more than that) then if a club comes in and offers 23k a week to him then over the length of his remaining contact he's losing a cool million to leave. At 27 if i was lansbury, i'd think twice about leaving.
The season 16/17, the club wage bill totalled near as damn it £62m. I don't know why anyone imagines that it would've been a fat lot less for 17/18.
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Yep.End of the day our wage bill is currently between 35-45m a year if you believe the most pessimistic papers. I reckon its probably about 37m so you have so say either a)Tony has been using the wages bill to siphon off money to a chinese bank account or b) we have 1 or 2 players on 200,000 a week or more likely c) the average is around the 25,000 a week mark. Now the problem we have is if you're a lansbury on 30k a week (i really hope the fuckwits aren't paying him more than that) then if a club comes in and offers 23k a week to him then over the length of his remaining contact he's losing a cool million to leave. At 27 if i was lansbury, i'd think twice about leaving.
The season 16/17, the club wage bill totalled near as damn it £62m. I don't know why anyone imagines that it would've been a fat lot less for 17/18.
that was including the tax i think. It included all our signings apart from elmo and Whelan and the loans and the likes of Terry and Samba, so there was obviously people we paid with that sum that had left by the time the accounts ended like Baker. Looking at this summer we've lost Terry, Gollini, Gabby, Hutton, Samba, Bunn, Grabban, Snodgrass, Johnstone, Tuenzebe, onamah. On 20k a week on average i make that 10m recovered plus tax. plus i guess gill and some of the other garde signings if they've left as well.
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Yep.End of the day our wage bill is currently between 35-45m a year if you believe the most pessimistic papers. I reckon its probably about 37m so you have so say either a)Tony has been using the wages bill to siphon off money to a chinese bank account or b) we have 1 or 2 players on 200,000 a week or more likely c) the average is around the 25,000 a week mark. Now the problem we have is if you're a lansbury on 30k a week (i really hope the fuckwits aren't paying him more than that) then if a club comes in and offers 23k a week to him then over the length of his remaining contact he's losing a cool million to leave. At 27 if i was lansbury, i'd think twice about leaving.
The season 16/17, the club wage bill totalled near as damn it £62m. I don't know why anyone imagines that it would've been a fat lot less for 17/18.
that was including the tax i think. It included all our signings apart from elmo and Whelan and the loans and the likes of Terry and Samba, so there was obviously people we paid with that sum that had left by the time the accounts ended like Baker. Looking at this summer we've lost Terry, Gollini, Gabby, Hutton, Samba, Bunn, Grabban, Snodgrass, Johnstone, Tuenzebe, onamah. On 20k a week on average i make that 10m recovered plus tax. plus i guess gill and some of the other garde signings if they've left as well.
Some of the what now?
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Who did Garde sign?
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Who did Garde sign?
Literally no one ..we tied to get a keeper in but his permit got rejected other than that the Board seeing that relegation was inevitable gave up
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Who did Garde sign?
Literally no one ..we tied to get a keeper in but his permit got rejected other than that the Board seeing that relegation was inevitable gave up
Thanks, that’s what I thought.
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Sorry I meant the likes of Vertout, armavi who left this season. I know they aren't garde signings but i just associate them with him. 8) Its very murky with these players what actually happened so were they on loan with an agreement to buy or did we say pay their wages or part of their wages in return for the transfer fee at the end?
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The signing of Samba sums up the profligacy under Bruce for me. It was completely pointless and served us no value whatsoever. MD then you add on the whole "multiple fullbacks and centre midfielders' lunacy; the lot of them should be strung up (Xia, Wyness, Round and Bruce).
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Blimey, bit harsh.
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I wouldn’t point to Samba as a profligate signing. It was very much bolstering the squad a bit and I imagine he wasn’t paid an awful lot relatively.
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Exactly, I think he was grateful any club took him on due to him being unattached and he knew he would be back-up so he would have had little negotiating power. £10k-£15k a week tops I'd imagine, the latter for the weeks when he did play.
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I would have thought he'd have been on a pay as you play type contract too.
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I wouldn’t point to Samba as a profligate signing. It was very much bolstering the squad a bit and I imagine he wasn’t paid an awful lot relatively.
I agree.
I would say that the thing the Samba signing does show though is just how unbalanced the squad was.
Five right backs, a large number of central midfielders but we had to resort to a cheap filler signing and a central midfielder as our main back-ups at centre half. That should never have been allowed to happen.
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depending on who you believe and where you read it average Championship wages are somewhere between 4-8k a week, our average is 25-30k
anyone thinking that the likes of Hourahine, Barny, Lansbury, Taylor, Samba, Elmo, Whelan are going to get clubs to buy them then pay the big wages are living in a dream world
they were all pretty much below average to piss poor with a few bright spots here and there
no way we are getting rid of any of them
add to that the even bigger earners, Richards, Hogan, Mcormac and you see why we are in shit street, not because we have overspent but because we have overspent on absolute shit that we can't get any money back for
you probably couldn't even give any of the above away on the wages they are on
it's undefendable from Xia, Wyness and Bruce they are all culpable
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depending on who you believe and where you read it average Championship wages are somewhere between 4-8k a week, our average is 25-30k
anyone thinking that the likes of Hourahine, Barny, Lansbury, Taylor, Samba, Elmo, Whelan are going to get clubs to buy them then pay the big wages are living in a dream world
they were all pretty much below average to piss poor with a few bright spots here and there
no way we are getting rid of any of them
add to that the even bigger earners, Richards, Hogan, Mcormac and you see why we are in shit street, not because we have overspent but because we have overspent on absolute shit that we can't get any money back for
you probably couldn't even give any of the above away on the wages they are on
it's undefendable from Xia, Wyness and Bruce they are all culpable
I have no confidence in any of them, part of me wants us to go into administration and hopefully get bought out by someone with an element of competence But then It is not fair on all the staff and suppliers etc .
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In a way you'd wonder, as Bruce said himself - "the club sells itself", so why the need to offer new players huge increases on what they're on?
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Imagine how the Italian or South American Ultras would react to players like McCormack and Richards stinking out their clubs. I would have expected them to have found alternative clubs by now.
Frank. I’m sure neither of us would be happy to get involved in anything that could be described as conspiracy but, you have a birthday coming up in the next 12 months and id like to get you a present.
What size balaclava do you take?
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In a way you'd wonder, as Bruce said himself - "the club sells itself", so why the need to offer new players huge increases on what they're on?
Exactly story was Houriane was on 7k at Barnsley and gave him 30k ..I don't remember a bidding war at the time so how did we get conned Into that ..
Lansbury the same 35k ..McCormack who where we competing with to justify the wages ..
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So, a club in massive crisis, and an important meeting today....via conference call? Xia can't even be arsed to fly over to Britain to try and sort this mess out? I have zero confidence in any of the board at this club. Interestingly, not a single word from Brian Little - isn't he supposed to be advisor to the board? What advice has he given?
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He's been in hospital, having a knee op.
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In a way you'd wonder, as Bruce said himself - "the club sells itself", so why the need to offer new players huge increases on what they're on?
Exactly story was Houriane was on 7k at Barnsley and gave him 30k ..I don't remember a bidding war at the time so how did we get conned Into that ..
Lansbury the same 35k ..McCormack who where we competing with to justify the wages ..
Maybe we were just being arrogant, throwing our wealth around trying to look like the big club - we just forgot to sign better players.
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He probably can't afford the airfare as he's maxed out his credit cards.
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A big problem is that we had a splurge before we had a strategy. Hourihane I reckon we could sell on. But agree that Lansbury and Hogan look terrible signings and we're done when we supposedly had a strategy. We really couldn't afford them even if they were good. The fact they haven't been and there's no market for them is a massive problem.. I can't see how we move them on.
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then we are going to have to play them in a formation that suits. The days of the bomb squad are over or should be - it's resulted in a financial Chernobyl
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I don't know who it was who said it on here, but by far the comment I am still chuckling at in all this mess a week later is 'have they blamed anyone yet, I need to know who to tweet death threats to'.
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We really should have been signing all players post the relegation on initially a 10-20% rise on their salary at the existing club with the agreement of 50-100 % more on top again if we went up.
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Clark - couldn't agree more. It also bewilders me why players aren't paid a basic wage, plus a huge percentage if they actually play. Certainly wouldn't have left us with huge contracts to pay the likes of McCormack, Richards etc.
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It's still very much a seller's market. McCormack was in demand because in the previous 5 seasons in the Championship, in four of them he'd scored 18, 28, 17 and 21 goals. Somebody with a record like that isn't going to accept a worse deal than the one he has. It would take a collective effort from all teams to do something about salaries.
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It's still very much a seller's market. McCormack was in demand because in the previous 5 seasons in the Championship, in four of them he'd scored 18, 28, 17 and 21 goals. Somebody with a record like that isn't going to accept a worse deal than the one he has. It would take a collective effort from all teams to do something about salaries.
And there's no incentive for the likes of Man City, Man U, Liverpool, etc to do so and the resulting trickle down is why you have shit like Shelvey on a reported £80k a week.
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Shelvey, huh, isn't he the best English passer of the ball or something?
More like another former depilated Noocassil, temperamental character, that Ketsbaia chap.
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Shelvey, huh, isn't he the best English passer of the ball or something?
More like another former depilated Noocassil, temperamental character, that Ketsbaia chap.
Nah, he's miles down on accuracy (72%) and passes per game but he does get into the top 10 on average number of chances created.
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In a way you'd wonder, as Bruce said himself - "the club sells itself", so why the need to offer new players huge increases on what they're on?
Exactly story was Houriane was on 7k at Barnsley and gave him 30k ..I don't remember a bidding war at the time so how did we get conned Into that ..
Lansbury the same 35k ..McCormack who where we competing with to justify the wages ..
Lansbury and Hourihane both had 6 months in their deals so were cheap fee wise and would have been able to command big wages/signing on fees in the Summer.. Similarly you have to pay them atleast a comparable rate to the other players when you’ve got so many on Premier League money.
We have definitely over spent but a lot of it is due to the change in manager and coaching staff every 6 months, players the best manager doesn’t rate on big money and depleting value. Our scouting has been shite since 2006, we rarely find value - Benteke was the last good find I can remember.
Under MON our best players cost big fees at the time.
Before that you’re going back to DOL years and the likes of Laursen and Bouma for a period of good value in the market.
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I guess the news about that American buyer on the back page of the Times last week was bullshit?
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In a way you'd wonder, as Bruce said himself - "the club sells itself", so why the need to offer new players huge increases on what they're on?
Exactly story was Houriane was on 7k at Barnsley and gave him 30k ..I don't remember a bidding war at the time so how did we get conned Into that ..
Lansbury the same 35k ..McCormack who where we competing with to justify the wages ..
Lansbury and Hourihane both had 6 months in their deals so were cheap fee wise and would have been able to command big wages/signing on fees in the Summer.. Similarly you have to pay them atleast a comparable rate to the other players when you’ve got so many on Premier League money.
We have definitely over spent but a lot of it is due to the change in manager and coaching staff every 6 months, players the best manager doesn’t rate on big money and depleting value. Our scouting has been shite since 2006, we rarely find value - Benteke was the last good find I can remember.
Under MON our best players cost big fees at the time.
Before that you’re going back to DOL years and the likes of Laursen and Bouma for a period of good value in the market.
Wooooaaah, steady up there. That's almost like your suggesting that there's value to be had by scouting outside a 125-mile radius. It'll never catch on.
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I guess the news about that American buyer on the back page of the Times last week was bullshit?
Xia has no intention of selling up.
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I guess the news about that American buyer on the back page of the Times last week was bullshit?
Xia has no intention of selling up.
Well he needs to do a proper bloody job then.
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Agenda for tomorrow
Item 1 - 2018-19 Budgets - 5 minutes.
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I guess the news about that American buyer on the back page of the Times last week was bullshit?
Xia has no intention of selling up.
if that's the case I think we are in serious trouble - we need experienced administrators who can stabilise the club and to ensure we have a future - I'm not convinced Xia has the money or know how to get us out the mess he created - I don't care if he doesn't want to lose face - right now he is staring at a massive loss -
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Or maybe the problem is he wasn't hands on enough. Left it all to the "football" people, bought all Wyness' promises about promotion and then was left disappointed when the sure thing didn't materialise. I mean Lerner was asleep at the wheel for most of his reign and if you have no interest in your business it rarely works out well.
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In a way you'd wonder, as Bruce said himself - "the club sells itself", so why the need to offer new players huge increases on what they're on?
Exactly story was Houriane was on 7k at Barnsley and gave him 30k ..I don't remember a bidding war at the time so how did we get conned Into that ..
Lansbury the same 35k ..McCormack who where we competing with to justify the wages ..
Lansbury and Hourihane both had 6 months in their deals so were cheap fee wise and would have been able to command big wages/signing on fees in the Summer.. Similarly you have to pay them atleast a comparable rate to the other players when you’ve got so many on Premier League money.
We have definitely over spent but a lot of it is due to the change in manager and coaching staff every 6 months, players the best manager doesn’t rate on big money and depleting value. Our scouting has been shite since 2006, we rarely find value - Benteke was the last good find I can remember.
Under MON our best players cost big fees at the time.
Before that you’re going back to DOL years and the likes of Laursen and Bouma for a period of good value in the market.
Houriane and Lansbury are championship level players there is no club in this league paying them what we handed out .Even if we went up we would of had 70k plus in wages A week we would of struggled to clear , it was shocking negotiations and scouting
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Agenda for tomorrow
Item 1 - 2018-19 Budgets - 5 minutes.
That long?
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I guess the news about that American buyer on the back page of the Times last week was bullshit?
Xia has no intention of selling up.
Well he needs to do a proper bloody job then.
First thing we need is a statement telling us what the hell is going on and what they intend to do to repair the damage they have done to our 144 year old club. And can they please employ a proper interpreter who can make sure it's grammatically correct and we can make bloody sense of it!
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If he's not selling up, but is selling Chester, Grealish and Kodjia, we are fucked. Utterly fucked. The man needs to just sell. Save face my arse, he's an utter con.
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I think a statement telling us that they're thinking of the children would help.
Let's see what comes out of the wash. Whipping yourself into a frenzy doesn't help.
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Agenda for tomorrow
Item 1 - 2018-19 Budgets - 5 minutes.
That long?
Yes to allow for the delays from Beijing and Tony’s silences.
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I still like and trust Dr Tony.
And I'm just waiting to see where we go.
If I'm upset about anyone (,barring SuperRoss) it's Steve Bruce so I personally hope he goes quickly and we rebuild in a more long-term fashion.
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I still like and trust Dr Tony.
And I'm just waiting to see where we go.
If I'm upset about anyone (,barring SuperRoss) it's Steve Bruce so I personally hope he goes quickly and we rebuild in a more long-term fashion.
Dr?
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Agenda for tomorrow
Item 1 - 2018-19 Budgets - 5 minutes.
Item 2 - Any other business?
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You trust the bloke who’s put the whole future of the club at risk ? I don’t and never will again. Our only hope is there might be a buyer out there who actually has a business brain and the financially clout required
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Deep down we all must have expected this. We've lived through it under Lerner. Living beyond our means. Reckless spending, which then came back to haunt us. It's only by the grace of McGrath that Lerner didn't ruin us, and had we gone down sooner and he hadn't found a buyer, he'd have got us to this point too.
Tony's come in and done exactly the same thing and if anything, with even more reckless abandon and even less understanding of running a football club. We all buy into the vision. We get caught up in the spending sprees, the excitement of spending like we have an endless pot of cash. We questionned signing people like Curtis Davies for 10 mill, Coker for 8, during the Lerner years. I don't think we've ever spent as ludicrously as we did in the Championship, one Championship standard players. In what logical world should Ross McCormack cost as much as he did? Or Hogan?
I got excited. Many of us got excited. But whilst the majority of us probably repressed the reality to the back of our minds (I did), the crippling reality is happening now. We're now seeing just what happens if you spend like this in the Championship, firing out transfer fees and Wages that we realistically would struggle to cover with our running costs in the Premiership never mind the second tier. We gambled big on Champions League football under Lerner. We lost the gamble. We gambled again under Tony. We lost. And our approach to managerial appointments seems to be persistently aimed at short term thinking.
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Deep down we all must have expected this. We've lived through it under Lerner. Living beyond our means. Reckless spending, which then came back to haunt us. It's only by the grace of McGrath that Lerner didn't ruin us, and had we gone down sooner and he hadn't found a buyer, he'd have got us to this point too.
Tony's come in and done exactly the same thing and if anything, with even more reckless abandon and even less understanding of running a football club. We all buy into the vision. We get caught up in the spending sprees, the excitement of spending like we have an endless pot of cash. We questionned signing people like Curtis Davies for 10 mill, Coker for 8, during the Lerner years. I don't think we've ever spent as ludicrously as we did in the Championship, one Championship standard players. In what logical world should Ross McCormack cost as much as he did? Or Hogan?
I got excited. Many of us got excited. But whilst the majority of us probably repressed the reality to the back of our minds (I did), the crippling reality is happening now. We're now seeing just what happens if you spend like this in the Championship, firing out transfer fees and Wages that we realistically would struggle to cover with our running costs in the Premiership never mind the second tier. We gambled big on Champions League football under Lerner. We lost the gamble. We gambled again under Tony. We lost. And our approach to managerial appointments seems to be persistently aimed at short term thinking.
Spot on
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Deep down we all must have expected this. We've lived through it under Lerner. Living beyond our means. Reckless spending, which then came back to haunt us. It's only by the grace of McGrath that Lerner didn't ruin us, and had we gone down sooner and he hadn't found a buyer, he'd have got us to this point too.
Tony's come in and done exactly the same thing and if anything, with even more reckless abandon and even less understanding of running a football club. We all buy into the vision. We get caught up in the spending sprees, the excitement of spending like we have an endless pot of cash. We questionned signing people like Curtis Davies for 10 mill, Coker for 8, during the Lerner years. I don't think we've ever spent as ludicrously as we did in the Championship, one Championship standard players. In what logical world should Ross McCormack cost as much as he did? Or Hogan?
I got excited. Many of us got excited. But whilst the majority of us probably repressed the reality to the back of our minds (I did), the crippling reality is happening now. We're now seeing just what happens if you spend like this in the Championship, firing out transfer fees and Wages that we realistically would struggle to cover with our running costs in the Premiership never mind the second tier. We gambled big on Champions League football under Lerner. We lost the gamble. We gambled again under Tony. We lost. And our approach to managerial appointments seems to be persistently aimed at short term thinking.
So your saying.. third time lucky!? ;-)
Well summed up!!
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I still like and trust Dr Tony.
And I'm just waiting to see where we go.
If I'm upset about anyone (,barring SuperRoss) it's Steve Bruce so I personally hope he goes quickly and we rebuild in a more long-term fashion.
Are you taking the p*ss?
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Deep down we all must have expected this. We've lived through it under Lerner. Living beyond our means. Reckless spending, which then came back to haunt us. It's only by the grace of McGrath that Lerner didn't ruin us, and had we gone down sooner and he hadn't found a buyer, he'd have got us to this point too.
Tony's come in and done exactly the same thing and if anything, with even more reckless abandon and even less understanding of running a football club. We all buy into the vision. We get caught up in the spending sprees, the excitement of spending like we have an endless pot of cash. We questionned signing people like Curtis Davies for 10 mill, Coker for 8, during the Lerner years. I don't think we've ever spent as ludicrously as we did in the Championship, one Championship standard players. In what logical world should Ross McCormack cost as much as he did? Or Hogan?
I got excited. Many of us got excited. But whilst the majority of us probably repressed the reality to the back of our minds (I did), the crippling reality is happening now. We're now seeing just what happens if you spend like this in the Championship, firing out transfer fees and Wages that we realistically would struggle to cover with our running costs in the Premiership never mind the second tier. We gambled big on Champions League football under Lerner. We lost the gamble. We gambled again under Tony. We lost. And our approach to managerial appointments seems to be persistently aimed at short term thinking.
So your saying.. third time lucky!? ;-)
Well summed up!!
Got to say....I wasnt expecting this. I thought we spent a lot first year but imagined the value of the squad was going up accordingly. I also presumed the parachute payments and money from sales would more than cover this. I thought the wage bill was going to be reduced with all of the premiership players we let go and the new lads coming from the championship on lower wages. I realised we were spending alot on loan player wages but no biggy - if we dont go up we just send them back. Besides, a few of our decent earners are out on loan to offset a portion of this surely.
Even when FFP starting looming i thought surely we can offload one or two players (not our star players) and balance the books
Im completely naive but I trusted Xia and Wyness and thought for the first time in donkeys years we were being run properly. When the said they had aplan for both eventualities, i believed them.
Now that the sheer level of incompetence and fuckwittery is laid bare for us all to see, I cant believe many people can hand on heart say "i knew this would happen" even with the vocal minority airing doubts over Dr T
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To be fair he did have a plan for both eventualities. We just didn’t realise plan B was ‘flee to China, incur the ire of HMRC, impulsively sack off management and channel your breakdown through social media’.
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Deep down we all must have expected this. We've lived through it under Lerner. Living beyond our means. Reckless spending, which then came back to haunt us. It's only by the grace of McGrath that Lerner didn't ruin us, and had we gone down sooner and he hadn't found a buyer, he'd have got us to this point too.
Tony's come in and done exactly the same thing and if anything, with even more reckless abandon and even less understanding of running a football club. We all buy into the vision. We get caught up in the spending sprees, the excitement of spending like we have an endless pot of cash. We questionned signing people like Curtis Davies for 10 mill, Coker for 8, during the Lerner years. I don't think we've ever spent as ludicrously as we did in the Championship, one Championship standard players. In what logical world should Ross McCormack cost as much as he did? Or Hogan?
I got excited. Many of us got excited. But whilst the majority of us probably repressed the reality to the back of our minds (I did), the crippling reality is happening now. We're now seeing just what happens if you spend like this in the Championship, firing out transfer fees and Wages that we realistically would struggle to cover with our running costs in the Premiership never mind the second tier. We gambled big on Champions League football under Lerner. We lost the gamble. We gambled again under Tony. We lost. And our approach to managerial appointments seems to be persistently aimed at short term thinking.
So your saying.. third time lucky!? ;-)
Well summed up!!
Got to say....I wasnt expecting this. I thought we spent a lot first year but imagined the value of the squad was going up accordingly. I also presumed the parachute payments and money from sales would more than cover this. I thought the wage bill was going to be reduced with all of the premiership players we let go and the new lads coming from the championship on lower wages. I realised we were spending alot on loan player wages but no biggy - if we dont go up we just send them back. Besides, a few of our decent earners are out on loan to offset a portion of this surely.
Even when FFP starting looming i thought surely we can offload one or two players (not our star players) and balance the books
Im completely naive but I trusted Xia and Wyness and thought for the first time in donkeys years we were being run properly. When the said they had aplan for both eventualities, i believed them.
Now that the sheer level of incompetence and fuckwittery is laid bare for us all to see, I cant believe many people can hand on heart say "i knew this would happen" even with the vocal minority airing doubts over Dr T
I expect the intervention of a bluenose in this debate will be about as welcome as a bucket of cold sick, but here goes.
The one thing you can be absolutely certain about is that come what may and even in the worst case scenario there will always be an Aston Villa FC of some description. Players come and go, managers come and go and even owners come and go. The one constant at any football club is the fans, we have nowhere else to go. So even if the unthinkable was to come about then no later than the day after a new Aston Villa would rise from the ashes, maybe a long way down the ladder but the fans would still be there and behind them. So fuck the owners fuck the managers and fuck the players. KRO
Good (ish) luck
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I was talking with my daughter the other day and saying how Dr T has left us in a huge mess. She thought that he shouldn't be blamed because he couldn't have predicted that the Chinese authorities would prevent him from taking money out of the country. Must admit I was at a loss to explain why he is at fault, although I'm convinced he is and have read (I think) every post in this thread. Could someone explain it in nice simple terms for me so that I can pass it on to my daughter? Ta.
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The Chinese authorities haven't prevented him from taking his money out of the country.
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The Chinese authorities haven't prevented him from taking his money out of the country.
Oh. I thought I'd read that there was now a limit on how much money could be moved from China. Was that a false rumour?
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I know Steve Bruce has never been popular with a lot of people but how can anybody be so blinkered as to blame him and still trust a man (who, like Bruce, many of us have been wary of) who has taken the club to a real threat of administration and face selling the only good/decent players they have to survive a few more seasons outside the Big League?
This is a man who ludicrously made the claim we would be playing Champions League football and challenging to be one of the biggest clubs in Europe within 5 or 6 years.
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Puts a new statement up and the website can't handle the traffic to read it....
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The Chinese authorities haven't prevented him from taking his money out of the country.
Oh. I thought I'd read that there was now a limit on how much money could be moved from China. Was that a false rumour?
This is what I read - it's a post by Tuscans last Wednesday:
We never really knew about the reality of the Docs wealth but I read 3 articles about moving money out of China all saying the same, "China law forbids anyone from sending out of China more than USD$50,000 in any given year without government approval".
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Aston Villa Football Club can confirm that Keith Wyness has now left the Club.
The Club notes the media speculation relating to Keith’s departure and prospective legal proceedings.
The Club will be happy to defend legal proceedings if called on to do so and does not propose to comment further at this time.
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Aston Villa Football Club can confirm that Keith Wyness has now left the Club.
The Club notes the media speculation relating to Keith’s departure and prospective legal proceedings.
The Club will be happy to defend legal proceedings if called on to do so and does not propose to comment further at this time.
Noticed this is in the Keith Wyness thread so please ignore.
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Simon Jordan talking very eloquently about the mess at Villa. He's suggesting things aren't as bad as the media make out in respect to the tax bills and finding money. He thinks it will all be quite easy for a club like Villa to sort all this out.
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Simon Jordan talking a lot of sense on Talk Sport this morning, giving some perspective on the situation.
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Simon Jordan talking very eloquently about the mess at Villa. He's suggesting things aren't as bad as the media make out in respect to the tax bills and finding money. He thinks it will all be quite easy for a club like Villa to sort all this out.
Changed his tune from last week then. Wasn’t paying fears down last week
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I can’t work Simon Jordan out. On one hand he’s very pro-Villa and on social media he regularly slags our rivals off. On the other hand I wonder why he does it. He’s wealthy but does he have the kind of wealth that would enable him to become involved at Villa? Or is he another chancer, a vulture circling a carcass ready to snap us up for a pittance if the unthinkable happens?
He was pretty high profile at Palace but he strikes me as a chancer with his eye on the next opportunity.
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'How much Xia is actually worth is a matter of debate and tied in with the question of why he is no longer bankrolling Villa. A key reason put forward is that the Chinese government has clamped down on capital flight, where investors send their money out of the country...'
This from last week. So is the lack of money from Xia his fault, or the fault of the Chinese government? I do need to be able to convince my daughter - she's always managed to tie me up in knots in any discussion and I want to be clear about this!
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I don’t profess to having any itk here, but I do sit next to a guy at work from a Chinese background who has been talking about the Chinese govt limitations on capital outflows from China for months. I wouldn’t be surprised to learn that this may in some part the reason why the money has dried up. But then again, I wouldn’t exactly be surprised either if it transpired that tony doesn’t have the cash that he claimed to have when he did the takeover. We’ll see, I suppose.
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I can’t work Simon Jordan out. On one hand he’s very pro-Villa and on social media he regularly slags our rivals off. On the other hand I wonder why he does it. He’s wealthy but does he have the kind of wealth that would enable him to become involved at Villa? Or is he another chancer, a vulture circling a carcass ready to snap us up for a pittance if the unthinkable happens?
He was pretty high profile at Palace but he strikes me as a chancer with his eye on the next opportunity.
Jordan's Wikipedia page makes interesting reading, regarding his time at Crystal Palace. Cash flow problems and administration, but also securing the future of the club by arranging the purchase of the ground from the previous chairman. Amongst the highlights are overseeing Steve Bruce's 'resignation' which ended up in court
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If you get chance, read Jordan's book, its a very good read
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I can’t work Simon Jordan out. On one hand he’s very pro-Villa and on social media he regularly slags our rivals off. On the other hand I wonder why he does it. He’s wealthy but does he have the kind of wealth that would enable him to become involved at Villa? Or is he another chancer, a vulture circling a carcass ready to snap us up for a pittance if the unthinkable happens?
He was pretty high profile at Palace but he strikes me as a chancer with his eye on the next opportunity.
Jordan's Wikipedia page makes interesting reading, regarding his time at Crystal Palace. Cash flow problems and administration, but also securing the future of the club by arranging the purchase of the ground from the previous chairman. Amongst the highlights are overseeing Steve Bruce's 'resignation' which ended up in court
Strange how the cash stopped right around the play off final defeat though.....amazing how the government let the money come through for the last 2 years. Maybe there was enough for funding of the gamble, when we got defeated the gambler stopped chasing his losses?
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Wasn't Simon Jordan responsible/to blame for the Specials reforming?
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I can’t work Simon Jordan out. On one hand he’s very pro-Villa and on social media he regularly slags our rivals off. On the other hand I wonder why he does it. He’s wealthy but does he have the kind of wealth that would enable him to become involved at Villa? Or is he another chancer, a vulture circling a carcass ready to snap us up for a pittance if the unthinkable happens?
He was pretty high profile at Palace but he strikes me as a chancer with his eye on the next opportunity.
Jordan's Wikipedia page makes interesting reading, regarding his time at Crystal Palace. Cash flow problems and administration, but also securing the future of the club by arranging the purchase of the ground from the previous chairman. Amongst the highlights are overseeing Steve Bruce's 'resignation' which ended up in court
Strange how the cash stopped right around the play off final defeat though.....amazing how the government let the money come through for the last 2 years. Maybe there was enough for funding of the gamble, when we got defeated the gambler stopped chasing his losses?
There were reports, albeit seemingly leaked by Wyness, that the working capital injected by Xia had been late or not turned up at all throughout last season. The factoring to that Australian Bank of the final payments for the Amarvi and Sanchez transfers in January would seem to suggest that cashflow has been a problem since at least then.
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If Axia doesn’t have any money we will surely be granted some leeway with regards to financial penalties etc? I mean it is the responsibility of the FA to ensure that owners are ‘fit and proper’ after all?
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If Axia doesn’t have any money we will surely be granted some leeway with regards to financial penalties etc? I mean it is the responsibility of the FA to ensure that owners are ‘fit and proper’ after all?
You can take a horse to water etc. They checked him out and made sure he had funds for the following season but that was on the basis of funding the running of the club, not on going out on a shopping spree that we could not afford (as it has turned out).
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Still no proper, meaningful statement then?
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Still no proper, meaningful statement then?
[/quote
No and I don’t think there will be one
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Nice one Tony......in keeping the fans well informed, not! An absolute disgrace. Just sell-up and go!
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Whatever he says does it really matter?
Nothing would appease the fans, everything would be second guessed. He has no respect here anymore. If it wasn't so important he'd be a laughing stock.
The phoney needs to disappear but I can't see anyone coming in for us anytime soon so we are stuck with a gambler with no idea and his yes men. Oh and Steve Round and his football phillosophy, whatever the fuck that means.
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Whatever he says does it really matter?
Nothing would appease the fans, everything would be second guessed. He has no respect here anymore. If it wasn't so important he'd be a laughing stock.
The phoney needs to disappear but I can't see anyone coming in for us anytime soon so we are stuck with a gambler with no idea and his yes men. Oh and Steve Round and his football phillosophy, whatever the fuck that means.
It matters greatly AJ. I want to know if we are looking for another Manager, will we have a budget to strengthen the side, is the ambition promotion or top ten, or survival. I want to know if the club is being restructured, are people's jobs safe, is Xia selling the club or looking for major/minor investment, what is the plan, should we be as worried as the press would have us believe? I agree that he has little to no credit left but showing some leadership might regain him some. Is he reviewing Round's position? So many questions but so little leadership.
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John Percy
12 JUNE 2018 • 10:30PM
Aston Villa are set for talks with the Football League next week as fears grow over the Championship club's finances.
Shaun Harvey, the EFL’s chief executive, is scheduled to meet with Villa officials in a bid to discover the club’s future plans following failure to win promotion to the Premier League.
Villa have been struggling with financial difficulties due to the cash-flow issues of Chinese owner Dr Tony Xia, with the club also being sued for constructive dismissal by former chief executive Keith Wyness.
Last month Xia was late paying a tax bill and with the club already under huge pressure to fall in line with Financial Fair Play rules, the EFL has contacted Villa to set up a meeting.
It is understood Harvey will request a broad business plan for next season and proof the club can fulfil its financial obligations.
Villa are aiming to slash their wage bill and bring it down to around £30m and held a board meeting on Tuesday as they mapped out their summer strategy.
Steve Bruce manager of Aston Villa talks to Dr Tony Xia chairman of Aston Villa during a training session at the club's training ground at The Recon Training Complex on May 11, 2018 in Birmingham, England
Chairman Dr Tony Xia (right) and Aston Villa are in worrying times CREDIT: GETTY IMAGES
Steve Bruce, the manager, was not present at the meeting, but it is understood the financial ramifications for staying in the Championship were relayed to technical director Steve Round. Xia remains reluctant to sell up, yet there are fears he will have to cash in on at least two top players, such as Jack Grealish and James Chester.
Villa have confirmed the departure of Wyness, who has launched legal action against the club.
Wyness is suing for constructive dismissal in a claim which could cost Villa up to £6m, as revealed by Telegraph Sport.
Villa’s statement read: “Aston Villa Football Club can confirm that Keith Wyness has now left the club. The club notes the media speculation relating to Keith’s departure and prospective legal proceedings.
“The club will be happy to defend legal proceedings if called on to do so and does not propose to comment further at this time.”
Meanwhile, Villa defender Alan Hutton is in talks with Nottingham Forest. Hutton, the former Scotland international, will be a free agent next month and has been offered a two-year deal by Forest manager Aitor Karanka.
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Is Mr Harvey planning to meet with the owners of other clubs too as I understand that there are several in the same pot as Villa? I think Percy is making things up here unless this is standard practice after a play off loss.
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Is Harvey going to review their fit and proper ownership that passed Xia in the first place ?
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Whatever he says does it really matter?
Nothing would appease the fans, everything would be second guessed. He has no respect here anymore. If it wasn't so important he'd be a laughing stock.
The phoney needs to disappear but I can't see anyone coming in for us anytime soon so we are stuck with a gambler with no idea and his yes men. Oh and Steve Round and his football phillosophy, whatever the fuck that means.
It matters greatly AJ. I want to know if we are looking for another Manager, will we have a budget to strengthen the side, is the ambition promotion or top ten, or survival. I want to know if the club is being restructured, are people's jobs safe, is Xia selling the club or looking for major/minor investment, what is the plan, should we be as worried as the press would have us believe? I agree that he has little to no credit left but showing some leadership might regain him some. Is he reviewing Round's position? So many questions but so little leadership.
If he comes out and says everything if fine it's all under control wouldn't you just think it's more bullshit?
What happened to plan B? You know when they were questioned on consequences and assured everyone it was all in hand.
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The good news just keeps on coming hey. This EFL guy has overseen 3 administrations.
Fear things will get much much worse for us before they can get better.
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Percy is speculating and painting as shit a picture as possible...I thought he liked us.
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Percy is speculating and painting as shit a picture as possible...I thought he liked us.
maybe he does but the picture is that shit
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the reality is probably Armageddon.
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Good, least we can have a fight about it if it is. I'll follow us anywhere, but I'm not sure I'd fancy Syria away.
I think he's perpetuating the story the keep inches filled as people will lap up the doom, when in reality little new has emerged in a week.
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Some good news!
Steve Bruce encouraged after receiving positive news on Aston Villa's playing budget
Matt Maher1 hour ago
Steve Bruce is ready to fight on at Villa after being informed of his playing budget for next season.
The 57-year-old is understood to have received positive assurances on the troubled club’s future direction after board members held crunch talks on Tuesday.
Bruce was not present at the meeting, chaired by chief commercial officer Luke Organ, but was later informed of the surprisingly bright outlook by Steve Round, the club’s technical director.
Though the budget is reduced from last season, the cuts are not so severe as feared and both Bruce and Round are now more confident of being able to build a team that can be competitive in the Championship next term.
Some sources have even suggested Villa, who have been suffering from an acute cash crisis, are ready to fight to keep star man Jack Grealish.
Despite this development, an element of uncertainty still surrounds Bruce’s position, chiefly due to owner Tony Xia’s failure to give the manager any public backing.
Bruce had been linked with the vacant managerial job at Leeds, now set to be filled by Marcelo Bielsa. There were even reports he could walk away from the club should his budget be slashed too sharply. That scenario, at least, now seems unlikely.
News of Tuesday’s positive meeting came just a week after Villa’s very future was plunged into doubt due to a cash crisis that saw them threatened with a winding-up order by HMRC.
There remain many unanswered questions about Xia’s ability to effectively fund Villa, though sources have suggested the owner has enough resources to see the club through the next few weeks.
Yet it has emerged EFL chief executive Shaun Harvey will meet with club officials next week, in order to establish their future plans.
Keeping his promise on the playing budget will depend on Xia engineering a more dependable cashflow from China than in recent months. It has been claimed the owner, who is eager to remain in control of the club, has been seeking outside investment.
Villa have, meanwhile, vowed to defend themselves against any legal action brought by former chief executive Keith Wyness.
The 60-year-old is understood to be suing for constructive dismissal, an action which could cost Villa more than £6million.
In a statement formally confirming Wyness’s exit, Villa stated they will be “happy to defend” legal proceedings if called on to do so.
Wyness was initially suspended last week, on the same day news of the missed tax payment emerged. It is understood he and Xia had clashed over the best way to deal with Villa's financial issues.
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That's some good news and, by the sound if it, there might be a bit if cash available. Now use some of it and get rid of the manager.
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Because this time we will get it right...
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Shame we all didn’t pay attention to this article from 2016
https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/comments/4k06t8/the_new_owner_of_aston_villa_dr_tony_xia_is_an/
I searched this person ("Dr. Tony Xia", real name Xia Jiantong 夏建统) a bit. Be ware, he seems to be a known fraud. He claims to be a Harvard PhD and even "professor", and used that to obtain a lot of funding for his company. But actually he just obtained Master's degree there. His PhD career is on a permanent leave. He also claimed to be hired into a world-class company as vice president early in his career, which is nonsense (he registered the company himself). Also he's known to cheat and lie a lot to everybody around him, e.g. constantly betraying his ex wife who "cut relation with parents, had 4 abortions, and worked illegally when still a student" to support his Master's career, promising great compensations for people he hired and never fulfilling them etc. Detailed information(widely reported circa 2009) is available at http://www.xys.org/dajia/xiajt.html, for anybody who can read Chinese.
Watch out Villa fans. Although somebody who bluffs a lot is not necessarily bad businessman, this guy seems to have some fundamental moral issues and God knows what he's going to do with Villa.
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You not seen Dave's sticky?
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If there was a law of probability, yes.
In the real world, you develop a wide strategic plan for the club and the manager is only part of it. When you think like that, you are well down the path of identifying and selecting the right manager.
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You not seen Dave's sticky?
Missed it, sorry. First time I’ve seen this one.
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Percy is speculating and painting as shit a picture as possible...I thought he liked us.
He's not, he's doing his job, which is going to involve telling us things we don't like to hear from time to time.
He's also extremely credible as a source. If this story were from the likes of James Nursey or Alan Nixon, it'd be different, but it isn't, it's from someone who consistently gets Villa stories right.
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According to construction press, "O'Brien (a groundworks contractor) has started work with Aston Villa Football Club to relocate parts of their training ground to make way for HS2"
I will try and link in to the story later. Basically, they are moving 9 natural pitches and one 3G.
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So Bruce has had guarantees, well that's the Villa sorted, Xia has problems managing the finances by the sound of it week to week, so if Bruce is daft enough to believe what he has been presented on a excel spread sheet, that is probably based on Xia praying to whatever God he believes in that the fairy god mother is gonna turn up at the end of the garden and give him enough dough/ funds to go with his
(a) Can't get it out of China old pal
(b) Just a temporary blip as I've lost me bank book Guv.
(c) I havn't got a pot to piss in, but I've meet the future King of England.
We are not only owned by a looks more likely everyday charlatan but managed by a moron.
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At least we haven’t built a stand half a mile away from the pitch...
Fkn hell Villa- get your shit together!
Tony- front up, or fk off.
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What statement do we need now?
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We’ve got one. The EFL have confirmed Percy’s ‘speculation’ above.
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Link?
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EFL confirm talks with Aston Villa over club's cash crisis
Matt MaherLess than an hour ago
Villa owner Tony Xia
In a brief statement, the league confirmed they would be offering "practical assistance, where appropriate" as Villa look to fight their way through a financial storm.
A report in the Telegraph has claimed EFL chief executive Shaun Harvey is due to meet with club officials next week in order to get a clearer picture of their future plans.
The severe nature of Villa's financial plight came to light last week when it emerged they had been threatened with a winding-up order by HMRC, after missing a tax payment.
Their problems are also of huge concern to the EFL, with Villa due to pay several million pounds in transfer instalments to Championship rivals by the end of the month.
It is thought Harvey will request a business plan for next season and proof the club can fulfil its financial liabilities.
Villa's troubles, which have been caused by owner Tony Xia's struggles to effectively fund the club, came to a head after their failure to reach the Premier League.
Though Xia was able to reach agreement with HMRC to stave off the immediate threat of administration, it still remains unclear whether the club has the funds to meet its next payroll and tax payment, due on or around June 22.
In a boost, the club on Wednesday announced the extension of their sponsorship deal with the Kindred Group.
The deal will see online casino 32Red become Villa's principal partner, with Unibet continuing as their official partner.
The former, who previously sponsored the club between 2006 and 2008, will now appear on home and away shirts.
Villa’s chief commercial officer, Luke Organ, said: “We are thrilled to be partnered with Kindred Group once again this season in a wider and more targeted partnership.
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The word shit is missing between financial and storm.
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Reports yesterday said it's not that bad and that Mr Harvey will be visiting other clubs- for what end I am not entirely sure.
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Reports yesterday said it's not that bad and that Mr Harvey will be visiting other clubs- for what end I am not entirely sure.
I sincerely hope that’s true. While not wishing to minimize any of this I do also wonder how much of this has been blown up or magnified due to 24/7 media and access to information? But either way the owner not being able to cover what should be basic financial responsibilities far outside of what we consider football related business like transfers is deeply concerning.
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I 'm sure I read something recently that suggested Forest were the only Championship club not running any debt
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Reports yesterday said it's not that bad and that Mr Harvey will be visiting other clubs- for what end I am not entirely sure.
See that's what I want to read more of, a bit of stiff upper lip from us all.
I think I might explode with joy if we turn it around next season and our young lads stick all the jibes right down the throat of everyone who has been taking the piss.
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In a brief statement, the league confirmed they would be offering "practical assistance, where appropriate" as Villa look to fight their way through a financial storm.
If they want to be helpful, they can start by giving us a bye into the PL. Our fixtures for 18/19 will just be reclassified as friendlies.
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In a brief statement, the league confirmed they would be offering "practical assistance, where appropriate" as Villa look to fight their way through a financial storm.
If they want to be helpful, they can start by giving us a bye into the PL. Our fixtures for 18/19 will just be reclassified as friendlies.
Is that a proposition Joe?
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I 'm sure I read something recently that suggested Forest were the only Championship club not running any debt
Probably why they can afford 13 mill on a player! They will be strong next season.
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When are the useless cowards that run this great club going to update the fans with a proper statement?? Pathetic!
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Heads firmly in the sand I expect.
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Reports yesterday said it's not that bad and that Mr Harvey will be visiting other clubs- for what end I am not entirely sure.
See that's what I want to read more of, a bit of stiff upper lip from us all.
I think I might explode with joy if we turn it around next season and our young lads stick all the jibes right down the throat of everyone who has been taking the piss.
I think it's more to do with other Championship clubs we owe money to shitting it and asking the EFL to check everything is okay and they will get paid. Fair play to them, I'd hope we'd be doing the same if we were in their position.
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When are the useless cowards that run this great club going to update the fans with a proper statement?? Pathetic!
What do you want them to say though? For me the only statement they need to make is on the manager, but only if they've made a decision.
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When are the useless cowards that run this great club going to update the fans with a proper statement?? Pathetic!
What do you want them to say though? For me the only statement they need to make is on the manager, but only if they've made a decision.
There's seriously nothing else that you would like to know Paul? I find that very surprising as I'd like to put them under the microscope.
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When are the useless cowards that run this great club going to update the fans with a proper statement?? Pathetic!
What do you want them to say though? For me the only statement they need to make is on the manager, but only if they've made a decision.
There's seriously nothing else that you would like to know Paul? I find that very surprising as I'd like to put them under the microscope.
I'd like to put them under the fucking sea.
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When are the useless cowards that run this great club going to update the fans with a proper statement?? Pathetic!
What do you want them to say though? For me the only statement they need to make is on the manager, but only if they've made a decision.
What about the state of the finances, players for sale, next tax payment due soon, will players be paid at the end of the month.....Shall I go on?
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I would expect them to say that the Financial position of the club has been stabilized.
I can’t think why they haven’t announced this.
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When are the useless cowards that run this great club going to update the fans with a proper statement?? Pathetic!
What do you want them to say though? For me the only statement they need to make is on the manager, but only if they've made a decision.
Well, the club has been portrayed as going through a massive financial crisis.
It has been reported that we have missed paying a tax bill and face being wound up.
Our CEO or whatever his title is, has been sacked.
Our best player is courted by all and sundry.
Rather than conduct business through a few cryptic lines on social media or a couple of 2 line statements on the official site, don’t you think the owner of the club owes it to the fans to give a proper statement about the situation t(e club is in and more to the point, what is being done to rectify the situation and give us some positivity fior the coming season.
If we are all ‘part if the pride’ how about treating us as such, or is that only when it suits?
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When are the useless cowards that run this great club going to update the fans with a proper statement?? Pathetic!
What do you want them to say though? For me the only statement they need to make is on the manager, but only if they've made a decision.
...and additionally, I'm unlikely to believe a word of any statement anyway.
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I have to agree, I have zero interest in seeing a statement from the circus running the club, because I wouldn’t trust or believe a word of it. Talk is very cheap.
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But, if they put something out that explains the situation and shows that they believe they know what they are doing to get us back on track then that would be a start.
If people chose not to believe what was said, then that’s their prerogative.
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The problem with sharing a plan may be the ability of others to undermine it as soon as they see it.
Sometimes it is best to try and keep things quiet. Everyone already thinks they can sign our best players for peanuts - what else do we want to tell them?
What we know is that there is a mess they're trying to clear up - I honestly don't know what more they can say. They are currently gradually creating an aura of it being solvable, which can only be good for us, & a detailed staement could derail that in any number of ways.
Right now the not knowing is hard, but I would rather they shut up and get on with it.
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The problem with sharing a plan may be the ability of others to undermine it as soon as they see it.
Sometimes it is best to try and keep things quiet. Everyone already thinks they can sign our best players for peanuts - what else do we want to tell them?
What we know is that there is a mess they're trying to clear up - I honestly don't know what more they can say. They are currently gradually creating an aura of it being solvable, which can only be good for us, & a detailed staement could derail that in any number of ways.
Right now the not knowing is hard, but I would rather they shut up and get on with it.
Yep, this is what i was getting at yesterday, The only thing I want them to announce is something about Bruce. If he's staying then they need to come out and say as much and if he's going it needs to happen soon.
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You can guarantee if they published some sort of plan the immediate responses on here would include posts along the lines of “don’t tell me, show me”.
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I don't see the point in making a statement on Bruce's future. As we speak, he's our manager. If anything changes, we'll know about it.
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Have those filings to Companies House from last week about potential new investment been made available yet?
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I don't see the point in making a statement on Bruce's future. As we speak, he's our manager. If anything changes, we'll know about it.
The owner came out with a statement after the final with comments such as sustainable future etc. which would give rise to fans' thoughts on cost cutting and a change in strategy. The main costs are related to players and the coaching/management team, so an update on the statement to clarify the positions should be expected to stop rumours, particularly after the financial issues last week.
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I don't see the point in making a statement on Bruce's future. As we speak, he's our manager. If anything changes, we'll know about it.
The owner came out with a statement after the final with comments such as sustainable future etc. which would give rise to fans' thoughts on cost cutting and a change in strategy. The main costs are related to players and the coaching/management team, so an update on the statement to clarify the positions should be expected to stop rumours, particularly after the financial issues last week.
Some of the coaching team and players have gone anyway. If they're not making a change on the managerial front, then I don't see why they should come out and say it until the situation changes. Just my view anyway.
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I don't see the point in making a statement on Bruce's future. As we speak, he's our manager. If anything changes, we'll know about it.
The owner came out with a statement after the final with comments such as sustainable future etc. which would give rise to fans' thoughts on cost cutting and a change in strategy. The main costs are related to players and the coaching/management team, so an update on the statement to clarify the positions should be expected to stop rumours, particularly after the financial issues last week.
Some of the coaching team and players have gone anyway. If they're not making a change on the managerial front, then I don't see why they should come out and say it until the situation changes. Just my view anyway.
I did say (yesterday) that they only need to say something if they've made a decision and I stand by it, If he is going to leave they need to get on with it, if not I think it would be a good idea to come out with something because last time we had a 'will they, won't they' summer with a manager he ended up walking away 5 days before kick off. My preference doesn't really matter but with the talk about Leeds and mention that he might walk away over the budget something should be said one way or the other before long.
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I think the general sweeping statement is 'finances have been in a mess to the point of us recently struggling to pay a bill which could have led to administration, we've sorted that problem and are now looking at ways to push the club forward from here'. I too fail to see any point in elaborating further at this stage and I'm taking it that they're 'on it'. There's obviously a lot of different things going on behind the scenes which are a work in progress. I'm happy to let them get on with it.
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Tone must have found some coin behind one of the sofa's at Lee Ho Fook's as Hutton's got a new deal, so that's positive, isn't it?
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No.
John Percy
Aston Villa are under pressure to raise up to £50 million in player sales over the next two transfer windows, it can be revealed.
Villa manager Steve Bruce is facing the prospect of key stars including Jack Grealish, James Chester and Jonathan Kodjia being sold as the Championship club battle a financial crisis.
Grealish is a target for Tottenham Hotspur, as revealed by Telegraph Sport on June 7, and Mauricio Pochettino is set to test Villa’s resolve with an opening offer of £15m.
Chelsea and West Ham are also interested in the former England under-21 international, and it seems inevitable the homegrown attacker will be sold after Villa’s failure to beat Fulham in last month’s play-off final.
Despite Grealish’s reputation and undoubted ability, it is thought unlikely that Villa will get anywhere near their £40m valuation.
Steve Bruce looks down
Bruce will lose some key players this summer Credit: Getty Images
Chester, the Wales international defender, is on the radar of Brighton and Stoke and could fetch up to £10m, while Ivory Coast international Kodjia is likely to be coveted by clubs across Europe.
It is understood Villa must bring in a minimum of £40m to ease their financial worries and comply with strict Financial Fair Play regulations for next year.
Villa’s wage bill has been already lowered to around £45m – from just over £60m – after the departure of skipper John Terry and loan players including Robert Snodgrass, Sam Johnstone, Lewis Grabban and Josh Onomah.
But there is still pressure to slash it even further and Villa’s technical director Steve Round was given the news in a meeting earlier this week.
Villa’s wage bill has been already lowered after the departure of skipper John Terry Credit: Getty Images
Bruce and Round have accepted the plans and are understood to be keen to stay on and rebuild the club ahead of next season. Some sources have even insisted that the financial picture was expected to be far bleaker.
The EFL will meet with Villa officials next week to discuss their plight and how they plan to operate ahead of their third season in the Championship. Dr Tony Xia, the club’s beleaguered owner, is reluctant to sell up and is exploring ways of sourcing investment.
There was one piece of positive news for Villa on Thursday, however, with defender Alan Hutton agreeing a new 12-month deal despite strong interest from Nottingham Forest.
Hutton has taken a significant pay cut to stay on at Villa, estimated to be £15,000 a week, in a welcome boost for Bruce.
Hutton said: “I’ve definitely found it tough since the Fulham defeat and it hurt me, its taken me time to get to terms with it.
“Everybody’s aim was to get promoted last season and we just faltered at the last step. But we have to look forward now and put it behind us.
“We’re definitely a Premier League team in my eyes and we will be pushing to do that next season. I’m delighted to stay here and I’ve got a special bond with the club.”
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Kippax, quote your sources!
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So in theory ..
Xia puts 50 mil into club which we spend on players and wages
As our income is not this high this then counts as a loss so we then need to retrieve this spending by selling players ,so we bring in 50 mil from sales which has to cover to losses but Xia doesn't want it back does this mean we just sit here with 50 mil we can't spend ?
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An interesting snippet from Daniel Ivery on SHA
"Meanwhile, In China...
Tony Xia has finally relinquished control of one of his listed companies, Recon Cable - and they've almost gone bust.
[finance.sina.com.cn]
House of cards falling apart... "
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An interesting snippet from Daniel Ivery on SHA
"Meanwhile, In China...
Tony Xia has finally relinquished control of one of his listed companies, Recon Cable - and they've almost gone bust.
[finance.sina.com.cn]
House of cards falling apart... "
Not that they're in the slightest bit obsessed with us. Oh no.
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There can be no doubt about their obsession but I have tremendous respect for Dan and his ability to report things from China that have generally proved to be accurate.
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I'm in the 'don't ask me nothin' about nothin' - i might just tell you the truth' camp.
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Xia sold his stake in Recon to a family member some time back.
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The only way to start to rebuild is going to be to get free of this chancer.
He is clearly not a billionaire by any stretch of the imagination.
I trust him about as far as I can throw him.
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Why's he clearly not a billionaire?
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So Grealish, Kodjia and Chester should take care of most of that £50m. Leave the rest till Jan. Clutching at straws a bit here but Kodjia was barely involved last season, Grealish was only great from mid/end of Jan onwards. The loanees - Onomah was largely gash, Grabban only came in January, Tuenzebe hardly played, but obviously Johnstone and Snodgrass will be a miss along with Terry and Chester. I'm also thinking that the some of this £50m might be for reinvestment in new players (although probably not much), and we also have Hogan and Lansbury that we could sell. I think we'd need a GK, centre backs and a striker. Really clutching at straws but could McCormack and Richards finally start earning their money to cover 2 of those roles?
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In answer to that last point about Richards and McCormack. No
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So we are hoping that the players that have proven themselves to be shit or not give a fuck for 2 years become good and give a fuck and that Delboy Tony really is a billionaire?
Clutching at straws.
We need someone who can find a few gems, bargains and make good the youth. Sound like Steve Boof?
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The Percy article is sensationalism of the highest scale. He even tweeted after a figure of £40m and said that can be a mixture of sponsorship, saved wages, sell fee's.
Does sound as dramatic though does it. Unfortunately Villa in crisis is all they want to peddle.
We are a massive target for the media and let's be honest, not a single one of them knows sod all.
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The Percy article is sensationalism of the highest scale. He even tweeted after a figure of £40m and said that can be a mixture of sponsorship, saved wages, sell fee's.
Does sound as dramatic though does it. Unfortunately Villa in crisis is all they want to peddle.
We are a massive target for the media and let's be honest, not a single one of them knows sod all.
Typical press, smidgen of truth packed/filled with made up stuff.
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The Percy article is sensationalism of the highest scale. He even tweeted after a figure of £40m and said that can be a mixture of sponsorship, saved wages, sell fee's.
Does sound as dramatic though does it. Unfortunately Villa in crisis is all they want to peddle.
We are a massive target for the media and let's be honest, not a single one of them knows sod all.
I’m not sure that the media are having a field day, certainly not the national media. Maybe it’s the World Cup but I don’t see our plight plastered all over the media. Maybe if/when we miss another payment it might gain some momentum but I think we’ve been treated fairly leniently by the press. In fact, I’m disappointed that nobody seems to be investigating Xia’s background a bit more.
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The Percy article is sensationalism of the highest scale. He even tweeted after a figure of £40m and said that can be a mixture of sponsorship, saved wages, sell fee's.
Does sound as dramatic though does it. Unfortunately Villa in crisis is all they want to peddle.
We are a massive target for the media and let's be honest, not a single one of them knows sod all.
Of course it is, it's actually just a rehash of the £40m FFP stuff from a couple of weeks back with no extra info.
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You mean the story hasn't moved on?! Well I am shocked.
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You mean the story hasn't moved on?! Well I am shocked.
That's the thing though, the way some people (not so much on here actually) have reacted to this is as if it's something brand new and yet more bad news.
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The Percy article is sensationalism of the highest scale. He even tweeted after a figure of £40m and said that can be a mixture of sponsorship, saved wages, sell fee's.
Does sound as dramatic though does it. Unfortunately Villa in crisis is all they want to peddle.
We are a massive target for the media and let's be honest, not a single one of them knows sod all.
I’m not sure that the media are having a field day, certainly not the national media. Maybe it’s the World Cup but I don’t see our plight plastered all over the media. Maybe if/when we miss another payment it might gain some momentum but I think we’ve been treated fairly leniently by the press. In fact, I’m disappointed that nobody seems to be investigating Xia’s background a bit more.
I agree
we like to think we are still important and interesting nationaly
but in truth no one gives a flying fuck about the Villa anymore apart from the local neighbors and a few geordies
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The Percy article is sensationalism of the highest scale. He even tweeted after a figure of £40m and said that can be a mixture of sponsorship, saved wages, sell fee's.
Does sound as dramatic though does it. Unfortunately Villa in crisis is all they want to peddle.
We are a massive target for the media and let's be honest, not a single one of them knows sod all.
I’m not sure that the media are having a field day, certainly not the national media. Maybe it’s the World Cup but I don’t see our plight plastered all over the media. Maybe if/when we miss another payment it might gain some momentum but I think we’ve been treated fairly leniently by the press. In fact, I’m disappointed that nobody seems to be investigating Xia’s background a bit more.
I agree
we like to think we are still important and interesting nationaly
but in truth no one gives a flying fuck about the Villa anymore apart from the local neighbors and a few geordies
I said that when we went down. That there would be a ripple caused by the actual event and stories told of our decline. But ultimately we are but a blip on a radar dominated by the next Chelsea or Man City or Arsenal transfer or “crisis”.
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The days of newspapers is over. Radio and television is not far behind. This is where opinion is formed, evaluated and acted upon, the social media. I am a complete museum piece but even I can find out what is really happening with this thing I have between my legs.
Stop sniggering at the back. I mean my tablet. My Gary Abblett.
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Why's he clearly not a billionaire?
Because he's only got £900,000,000.*
*Birmingham Post Rich List
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Why's he clearly not a billionaire?
Because he's only got £900,000,000.*
*Birmingham Post Rich List
$
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Why's he clearly not a billionaire?
Because he's only got £900,000,000.*
*Birmingham Post Rich List
$
No, GBP. Saying that, they've listed him this year at £1bn so maybe for once Ads is right.
The Meaning Evil this week says he's only worth £990m so Ads could be back to his usual form.
What I will say is I'm still struggling to see or find any evidence to back up his wealth.
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The days of newspapers is over. Radio and television is not far behind. This is where opinion is formed, evaluated and acted upon, the social media. I am a complete museum piece but even I can find out what is really happening with this thing I have between my legs.
Stop sniggering at the back. I mean my tablet. My Gary Abblett.
Not your Farmer Giles
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Why's he clearly not a billionaire?
Because he's only got £900,000,000.*
*Birmingham Post Rich List
$
No, GBP. Saying that, they've listed him this year at £1bn so maybe for once Ads is right.
The Meaning Evil this week says he's only worth £990m so Ads could be back to his usual form.
What I will say is I'm still struggling to see or find any evidence to back up his wealth.
There was no currency defined in the original comments. He is a billionaire somewhere, even it is in yuan (God help us if it is).
PS my comment was a light-hearted response.
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Why's he clearly not a billionaire?
Because he's only got £900,000,000.*
*Birmingham Post Rich List
$
No, GBP. Saying that, they've listed him this year at £1bn so maybe for once Ads is right.
The Meaning Evil this week says he's only worth £990m so Ads could be back to his usual form.
What I will say is I'm still struggling to see or find any evidence to back up his wealth.
And you won’t, there is no disclosure requirement in China, I find it hard to understand that someone with the resources of a Billionare would allow his most High Profile business to have a winding up petition slapped on it by the UK Government.
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Why's he clearly not a billionaire?
Because he's only got £900,000,000.*
*Birmingham Post Rich List
$
No, GBP. Saying that, they've listed him this year at £1bn so maybe for once Ads is right.
The Meaning Evil this week says he's only worth £990m so Ads could be back to his usual form.
What I will say is I'm still struggling to see or find any evidence to back up his wealth.
There was no currency defined in the original comments. He is a billionaire somewhere, even it is in yuan (God help us if it is).
Fear not, I'm a multi-billionaire* and can throw a few quid at the club should Xia fall short.
* in Venezuela
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An interesting snippet from Daniel Ivery on SHA
"Meanwhile, In China...
Tony Xia has finally relinquished control of one of his listed companies, Recon Cable - and they've almost gone bust.
[finance.sina.com.cn]
House of cards falling apart... "
As the saying goes, If you want to know what's going on at Aston Villa ask a Birmingham City fan.
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Love that.
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The days of newspapers is over. Radio and television is not far behind. This is where opinion is formed, evaluated and acted upon, the social media. I am a complete museum piece but even I can find out what is really happening with this thing I have between my legs.
Stop sniggering at the back. I mean my tablet. My Gary Abblett.
I thought you were describing a dongle.
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The days of newspapers is over. Radio and television is not far behind. This is where opinion is formed, evaluated and acted upon, the social media. I am a complete museum piece but even I can find out what is really happening with this thing I have between my legs.
Stop sniggering at the back. I mean my tablet. My Gary Abblett.
I thought you were describing a dongle.
Brian is probably right but all the old twats wandering out of my local Lincolnshire village shop clutching their Daily Mails seem to have honoured the tabloid with a final devoted hurrah. Gary Ablett, a poor substitute.
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Tone is issuing new shares, right? Can we buy them, or is the idea that he buys them all?
I want Villa shares again.
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I'd have thought the daily papers still sell. Radio and TV will be around for a long time yet.
I'm surprised people still buy the likes of the Meaning Evil and Express and Star though.
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since subscribing to Netflix, Amazon and Now TV, whilst ditching Sky, I'm still quids up , have great viewing whenever I want and seldom watch BBC or ITV now. Which is an added bonus, even though I have to pay for it - the BBC that is
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I'd have thought the daily papers still sell. Radio and TV will be around for a long time yet.
I'm surprised people still buy the likes of the Meaning Evil and Express and Star though.
National papers still sell because, I think, people like artefacts. See the re-emergence of double-sleeved vinyl albums for example, or the increase in physical book sales.
With TV, however, it's on its way out. Younger members of my family don't watch tv like we did growing up - all sat around on a Sunday night watching Quantum Leap or something. They consume tv through their laptops/phones/tablets using on demand systems like Netflix, iplayer, Prime, and so on. The only time people across generations gather to watch the telly now is when there are sporting events on.
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I'd have thought the daily papers still sell. Radio and TV will be around for a long time yet.
I'm surprised people still buy the likes of the Meaning Evil and Express and Star though.
National papers still sell because, I think, people like artefacts. See the re-emergence of double-sleeved vinyl albums for example, or the increase in physical book sales.
With TV, however, it's on its way out. Younger members of my family don't watch tv like we did growing up - all sat around on a Sunday night watching Quantum Leap or something. They consume tv through their laptops/phones/tablets using on demand systems like Netflix, iplayer, Prime, and so on. The only time people across generations gather to watch the telly now is when there are sporting events on.
the problem is the kids today arnt watching enough telly
my kids spend so much time gaming and on you tube or whatever that I have to shout
‘isn’t it about time you watched a tv programme’
They don’t know ther born
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Sky Sports' Johnny Phillips: Two years on, just who is Tony Xia?
Johnny Phillips4 hours ago
Dr Tony Xia
Who is Dr Tony Xia?
There are plenty of known and assumed details about the man at the helm of this great club, but there are just as many, if not more, unknowns. Supporters are no wiser today about the man who owns Villa than they were when he purchased the club two summers ago.
Put simply, there is no way of verifying Dr Xia’s true worth or his intentions. Back in the summer of 2016 he was famously asked whether or not he was a dollar billionaire.
“I think it’s rather more than that,” was the confident reply.
Yet somehow Dr Xia had gone completely under the radar in his home country, to the extent that nobody in the Chinese business media knew who he was. It is virtually impossible for British journalists to dig into that opaque world, but even the country’s own media have struggled.
Last week SupChina, a leading Chinese business analysis website, reported that Xia has been associated with three main companies – the Shanghai-listed Lotus, which manufactures food supplement MSG, Teamax, a smart city planning and construction firm, and cable manufacturer Recon.
“Lotus has been losing money consistently for the past 15 years, with those in charge blaming old equipment and too many employees,” they reported.
“Xia sold his 18.8 per cent holding in Recon earlier this year, shortly before the stock went into freefall losing more than half its value in a number of weeks. The current boss is listed as Xia Jianjun, rumoured to be his brother, not Tony himself.
“As for Teamax, Xia said he sold it for hundreds of millions of dollars prior to buying Aston Villa in May 2016. In true China fashion, however, it’s virtually impossible to check who Xia really is and how many companies he effectively controls.”
Getting beyond such a basic analysis is difficult.
Those that suggest Dr Xia’s main problem is getting money out of the country are ignoring the fact that capital controls in China have been loosened, not tightened, in recent months. Again, SupChina confirmed this.
“Foreign exchange reserves have been increasing, so the People’s Bank of China has allowed more money to flow outside the country,” they said.
Communication is hugely important at times such as this. Dr Xia has engaged supporters via Twitter throughout his tenure.
Xia has had a big impact since coming in as owner, but promotion has eluded him and Villa.That has seen the likes of Roberto Di Matteo and Keith Wyness leave the club under the Chinese boss.
The merits of club owners using this platform can be debated, but it at least maintained a line of communication, even if most were no wiser about the man doing the tweeting. Twitter is no place to be informing fans of what is going on now, though, a more substantial presence is required.
So what are fans to make of reports that Tuesday’s meeting with senior members of the board, including chief commercial officer Luke Organ and executive assistant Rongtian He, was held via a conference call with Dr Xia?
What message does that send out, that these incredibly important talks are only worthy of a conference call?
Villa supporters have had a torrid few years, but it should never have come to this. When Dr Xia strode out across the pitch to greet the fans ahead of the Championship clash with Rotherham in August 2016 he must have realised how fortunate he was to be here.
After a hopeless attempt to avoid relegation from the Premier League that should have been enough to make even the most ardent supporter think twice about putting any more money into the club’s coffers, the fans still turned out in numbers. Well over 30,000 were prepared to give the team another chance. Against Rotherham.
Before a ball was kicked, the team was cheered to the rafters and the atmosphere inside the ground was fantastic that afternoon. Dr Xia got a rapturous reception when he took to the pitch beforehand.
The players responded too, with a superb performance that showed there was enough in the ranks, even back then, to mount a genuine promotion challenge.
Despite the last years of Randy Lerner’s ownership and the relegation, the club were still in relative good health. There was the opportunity to build on the solid foundations of a great stadium, fantastic training ground, Premier League parachute payments and a huge and loyal support. To gamble the whole future on an all-or-nothing return to the Premier League this season did not make sense. It was kid in a sweet shop stuff.
It is not too late, though. After everything that has gone on, Dr Xia still has time to turn all this around and come out on top.
Can this be the time that supporters finally get to discover who the man at the helm really is?
The EFL have met with the club to thrash out a way forward. Here is the opportunity for transparency and progress. This is not just about a missed tax payment or a one-off cash flow problem.
Supporters are concerned about the fabric of the club’s existence; how it is being run and where it is being run from.
As each day goes by fans are left wondering what bombshell they will be hit with next.
It doesn’t have to be this way and they deserve so much better. Dr Xia has one more chance to show his true colours.
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What is taking the place of mass audience newspapers and mass audience TV channels is personal connection to events through mobile electronic devices. On this forum alone there are dozens of sources of information to access as a faster and reliable alternative to books, papers or television programmes. My views, for example about Brexit have been shaped far more by H and V Off Topic than by mass media. Everything is becoming more personal.
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Newspapers still sell because they don't have a battery and you don't have to be connected to the internet to use them. They also have no glare and less intrusive adverts. I don't buy them often but if I do it tends to be the Independant or Times, in which I don't detect a clear political stance as this gets on my tits, a bit like some of the posts on here. And the tabloids that just talk about reality TV, I wouldn't wipe my arse on.
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I still like reading a quality newspaper but modern technology renders them yesterdays news.
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Can't Xia sell 30% of his ownership in the form of a share issue to the fans to raise money. I had Villa shares until that shyster Lerner bought them all up in his purchase of the club in 2006. I'd like to be a shareholder again.
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I have no faith in Xia. None whatsoever. I can't imagine he bought the club as a vanity project. So how did he think he was going to make money?
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I have no faith in Xia. None whatsoever.
It's easy to arrive at that conclusion after recent events, Ron; not many would disagree.
I can't imagine he bought the club as a vanity project.
Why not? - with vast amounts of money, or delusion, it's easy to see a football club as just another fashion accoutrement.
So how did he think he was going to make money?
Promotion before the parachute payments run out and the cash-heaven of the Prem.
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It's clear Xia is a chancer with no money left....
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It's clear Xia is a chancer with no money left....
Agree. All he’s done is forward spunk our parachute money. That’s it.
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Newspapers still sell because they don't have a battery and you don't have to be connected to the internet to use them. They also have no glare and less intrusive adverts. I don't buy them often but if I do it tends to be the Independant or Times, in which I don't detect a clear political stance as this gets on my tits, a bit like some of the posts on here. And the tabloids that just talk about reality TV, I wouldn't wipe my arse on.
You clearly don’t buy one very often. The last print edition of The Independent came out more than two years ago!
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I find it a bit funny though that had we won the game a couple of weeks ago none of these sentiments about the owner would be voiced. I put that firmly at the door of the manager who was afforded immense resources and assets, more than enough relative to the vast majority of our competition to get us promoted across two seasons and failed.
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Ive had a look around the Recon website.
I'm just going to point out some facts, no personal opinion.
The last corporate news article was 18 months ago. There was a flurry then, and then nothing for 18 months.
There are real pictures of action at Villa Park and of Dr Xia meeting other people at 3rd party events or news conferences. There are no profiles of anyone but Tony. No real pictures of anyone else on the management team and of group facilities (eg industrial facilities). There are lots of stock pictures of skyscrapers, meeting rooms and people who look like models with overtly white teeth chatting on mobile phones etc.
The company profile mentions owning 5 businesses with 35,000 employees as a 'conglomerate'. As a comparison Jaguar Land Rover has 37,000. You would expect a business of this size to have a significant 'Corporate Centre' aka head office with all that goes with running such a large enterprise.
The company address is :
Add:19F, Tower D, Vantone Center, Chaowai Avenue, Chaoyang District, Beijing
I take that as 19th Floor of that tower block.
I would be interested to know if its the whole 19th floor, or thats the floor for media comms etc of multiple floors (eg Regus temporary office space on the 26th floor). Or is it just part of the 19th floor ?
I understand the chinese system is different when it comes to Corporate transparency, but it would be helpful to know more.
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And then you read this which seems to support his claims of wealth.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.hollywoodreporter.com/amp/news/chinas-recon-group-acquires-51-percent-millennium-films-official-978969?source=images
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But then this.
https://uk.mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUKKCN1BB0KV
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And then you read this which seems to support his claims of wealth.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.hollywoodreporter.com/amp/news/chinas-recon-group-acquires-51-percent-millennium-films-official-978969?source=images
Then why were the club scraping around the back of the sofa to pay the last tax bill?
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I know I’m not saying I believe it. It’s all very odd though.
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But then this.
https://uk.mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUKKCN1BB0KV
It's even still on the Recon site that they've acquired 51% of the film company, although that could be an oversight, as it's the English edition.
The stupid tweets, running on the pitch, shit shoes, panic stricken face after the playoff final, the late tax payments, selling future transfer fees and the Wyness resignation.
If it smells dodgy, it usually is. Phoney Tony.
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The early Forbes article on the possible takeover is worth reading:
https://www.forbes.com/sites/mikeozanian/2016/05/24/aston-villa-and-tony-xia-are-looking-like-ac-milan-with-mr-bee/#3e0315bc59dd
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Billionaires do not fail to make month-end PAYE payments.
Then there's this article, which points out that Chinese currency controls are getting loser, not tighter.
https://supchina.com/2018/06/09/the-decline-of-aston-villa-under-its-enigmatic-chinese-owner/
There were those of us who were suspicious of his wealth when he rocked up, and unfortunately, it's hard to see how, with the club linked with threats of winding up orders, he can possibly have the wealth he claims he has.
We are in financial meltdown, if Xia was anywhere near as wealthy as some seem to think he is, we wouldn't have got anywhere near this utter mess.
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Billionaires do not fail to make month-end PAYE payments.
Then there's this article, which points out that Chinese currency controls are getting loser, not tighter.
https://supchina.com/2018/06/09/the-decline-of-aston-villa-under-its-enigmatic-chinese-owner/
There were those of us who were suspicious of his wealth when he rocked up, and unfortunately, it's hard to see how, with the club linked with threats of winding up orders, he can possibly have the wealth he claims he has.
We are in financial meltdown, if Xia was anywhere near as wealthy as some seem to think he is, we wouldn't have got anywhere near this utter mess.
Spot on. He is an absolute fraud. A billionaire with shit shoes, suits that don’t fit and using Uber..... 🤔
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Only we could out Carson Carson.
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Only we could out Carson Carson.
Did I miss Xia going to jail for criminal activity? Because if he’s a free man we haven’t come close to having an owner like that lot.
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Only we could out Carson Carson.
Bizarre comment, really.
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The company address is :
Add:19F, Tower D, Vantone Center, Chaowai Avenue, Chaoyang District, Beijing
I take that as 19th Floor of that tower block.
I would be interested to know if its the whole 19th floor, or thats the floor for media comms etc of multiple floors (eg Regus temporary office space on the 26th floor). Or is it just part of the 19th floor ?
It appears they share the 19th Floor with others. The SMI Corporation Ltd also use it as their address, at least since 2014. They are listed as 'privately owned film producers (partial) and mention The Last Supper and The Guillotines as 'Representative Films Co-produced'.
There's a lot of Regus type office space for rent in the building but that's pretty much as you'd expect.
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From the Mail on Sunday 22 May 2016:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3602825/Saviour-dreamer-Sportsmail-talks-Aston-Villa-s-owner-waiting-Dr-Tony-Xia.html
The long-term plan include a football museum and theme park to attract football tourists from China and India, and the recruitment of young Chinese players to Villa’s academy, if not as formal scholars then on exchange programmes.
'I appreciate it’s a big deal for Villa fans,’ he says. ‘But actually in pure business terms, I’m working on acquisitions much bigger than this.’ He says, for example, that within months he will complete a $3.5bn takeover of a US logistics firm.
Xia says he will spend a lot of time in Birmingham over the next year, buying a house for himself and his wife Sally and daughter Charlotte [...]
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An interesting snippet from Daniel Ivery on SHA
"Meanwhile, In China...
Tony Xia has finally relinquished control of one of his listed companies, Recon Cable - and they've almost gone bust.
[finance.sina.com.cn]
House of cards falling apart... "
As the saying goes, If you want to know what's going on at Aston Villa ask a Birmingham City fan.
Nice. I'll be using that
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From the Mail on Sunday 22 May 2016:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3602825/Saviour-dreamer-Sportsmail-talks-Aston-Villa-s-owner-waiting-Dr-Tony-Xia.html
The long-term plan include a football museum and theme park to attract football tourists from China and India, and the recruitment of young Chinese players to Villa’s academy, if not as formal scholars then on exchange programmes.
'I appreciate it’s a big deal for Villa fans,’ he says. ‘But actually in pure business terms, I’m working on acquisitions much bigger than this.’ He says, for example, that within months he will complete a $3.5bn takeover of a US logistics firm.
Xia says he will spend a lot of time in Birmingham over the next year, buying a house for himself and his wife Sally and daughter Charlotte [...]
Blimey, that's unfortunate. I hope he has pet names for them.
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From the Mail on Sunday 22 May 2016:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3602825/Saviour-dreamer-Sportsmail-talks-Aston-Villa-s-owner-waiting-Dr-Tony-Xia.html
The long-term plan include a football museum and theme park to attract football tourists from China and India, and the recruitment of young Chinese players to Villa’s academy, if not as formal scholars then on exchange programmes.
'I appreciate it’s a big deal for Villa fans,’ he says. ‘But actually in pure business terms, I’m working on acquisitions much bigger than this.’ He says, for example, that within months he will complete a $3.5bn takeover of a US logistics firm.
Xia says he will spend a lot of time in Birmingham over the next year, buying a house for himself and his wife Sally and daughter Charlotte [...]
And how have Sally and Charlotte settled in?
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The company address is :
Add:19F, Tower D, Vantone Center, Chaowai Avenue, Chaoyang District, Beijing
I take that as 19th Floor of that tower block.
I would be interested to know if its the whole 19th floor, or thats the floor for media comms etc of multiple floors (eg Regus temporary office space on the 26th floor). Or is it just part of the 19th floor ?
It appears they share the 19th Floor with others. The SMI Corporation Ltd also use it as their address, at least since 2014. They are listed as 'privately owned film producers (partial) and mention The Last Supper and The Guillotines as 'Representative Films Co-produced'.
There's a lot of Regus type office space for rent in the building but that's pretty much as you'd expect.
The description of Recon as a 'conglomerate' with 5 businesses and 35,000 employees doesnt ring true. In fact, I think the FT reported at the time of the takeover that the description had removed the reference to 5 businesses. It feels at best that Recon looks like a holding company or investment vehicle to manage investments in a business or businesses that run themselves. I dont think there is any doubt that Xia has considerable experience in property development and real estate - that is what his background is, but I just dont see the 'synergy' of a conglomerate that does that, owns Aston Villa, does or doesnt own part of a film company, and owns a manufacturer of mono-sodium glutemate. Again, it would be good to have more public knowledge of where Villa fits into an overall strategy for his firm or his portfolio of holdings.
I wouldnt even mind if Xia came out and said, I bought it to return it to the Premier League, sell it and make a bucket. Fair play, and we couldnt moan as we as fans would get what we want.
I cant fault what Xia has done in the 2 years he has owned our club, he has bought in a European Cup winning manager, poured millions on his recommendation into buying a mix of young players with potential and proven championship scorers, then invested again with a new manager with an excellent promotion record in older proven players and leadership. He cannot be criticised for not backing his managers, but has the funding of all this now become more difficult.
The final thing I would like to know, why did Mervyn King and David Bernstein resign from the Villa board on April 18th 2016 only a few weeks before Xia took over the club ?
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The company address is :
Add:19F, Tower D, Vantone Center, Chaowai Avenue, Chaoyang District, Beijing
I take that as 19th Floor of that tower block.
I would be interested to know if its the whole 19th floor, or thats the floor for media comms etc of multiple floors (eg Regus temporary office space on the 26th floor). Or is it just part of the 19th floor ?
It appears they share the 19th Floor with others. The SMI Corporation Ltd also use it as their address, at least since 2014. They are listed as 'privately owned film producers (partial) and mention The Last Supper and The Guillotines as 'Representative Films Co-produced'.
There's a lot of Regus type office space for rent in the building but that's pretty much as you'd expect.
The description of Recon as a 'conglomerate' with 5 businesses and 35,000 employees doesnt ring true. In fact, I think the FT reported at the time of the takeover that the description had removed the reference to 5 businesses. It feels at best that Recon looks like a holding company or investment vehicle to manage investments in a business or businesses that run themselves. I dont think there is any doubt that Xia has considerable experience in property development and real estate - that is what his background is, but I just dont see the 'synergy' of a conglomerate that does that, owns Aston Villa, does or doesnt own part of a film company, and owns a manufacturer of mono-sodium glutemate. Again, it would be good to have more public knowledge of where Villa fits into an overall strategy for his firm or his portfolio of holdings.
I wouldnt even mind if Xia came out and said, I bought it to return it to the Premier League, sell it and make a bucket. Fair play, and we couldnt moan as we as fans would get what we want.
I cant fault what Xia has done in the 2 years he has owned our club, he has bought in a European Cup winning manager, poured millions on his recommendation into buying a mix of young players with potential and proven championship scorers, then invested again with a new manager with an excellent promotion record in older proven players and leadership. He cannot be criticised for not backing his managers, but has the funding of all this now become more difficult.
The final thing I would like to know, why did Mervyn King and David Bernstein resign from the Villa board on April 18th 2016 only a few weeks before Xia took over the club ?
It’s been widely speculated that King and Bernstein did not want the association to Samuelson, Bamfil, Wyness and Xia
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Speculated wildly and inaccurately. They did one as Randy got hammered and insulted them.
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The final thing I would like to know, why did Mervyn King and David Bernstein resign from the Villa board on April 18th 2016 only a few weeks before Xia took over the club ?
Funny, that thought came to me the other day.
They certainly made themselves scarce and have been pretty quiet since.
At the time, I thought their association presaged the arrival of a secure and respectable owner that would be the start of a new era. So did they 'do one' because of the old owner's behaviour or the new one's lack of substance?
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Speculated wildly and inaccurately. They did one as Randy got hammered and insulted them.
Was that the final straw? Apologies if it’s been covered but what exactly did Randy do?
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Got inebriated and insulted them over the phone.
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Got inebriated and insulted them over the phone.
Is this how it ends with Billionaire owners?
Hope so.
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Got inebriated and insulted them over the phone.
Can't believe it was that, just say 'silly twat' and put the phone down!
Wish King and Bernstein would come back, probably too honest for our lot!
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That's what King said was the reason.
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Xia has obviously had access to some decent money, he's spent between £100-150m on us, I don't know many chancers/shysters that have that kind of cash. When using those terms I think of someone like Knighton when he wanted to buy Man Utd and it turned out he could only afford Carlisle. Where the Xia money came from, and if there's any left, is another matter.
As an aside, it's some achievement that between Lerner and Xia are two to three hundred million out of pocket from owning Villa, and ave somehow turned us into a second division side that apparently can't pay it's bills on time. It's almost impressive in its levels of incompetence.
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Xia has obviously had access to some decent money, he's spent between £100-150m on us, I don't know many chancers/shysters that have that kind of cash. When using those terms I think of someone like Knighton when he wanted to buy Man Utd and it turned out he could only afford Carlisle. Where the Xia money came from, and if there's any left, is another matter.
As an aside, it's some achievement that between Lerner and Xia are two to three hundred million out of pocket from owning Villa, and ave somehow turned us into a second division side that apparently can't pay it's bills on time. It's almost impressive in its levels of incompetence.
Sorry, just had to correct that!
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We are actually ahead of Blues in the betting to get relegated next season. I really hope we find a way through all this and ram it down everyone’s throats.
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We are actually ahead of Blues in the betting to get relegated next season. I really hope we find a way through all this and ram it down everyone’s throats.
I think this might work to our advantage. Less pressure and expectation.
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We are actually ahead of Blues in the betting to get relegated next season. I really hope we find a way through all this and ram it down everyone’s throats.
I think this might work to our advantage. Less pressure and expectation.
Cardiff were one of the favourites to go down going into last season
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The amounts we have wasted in the ownership of the last two owners set beside the position in which we now find ourselves is unbelievable until you put it in the context of the cast list. Lerner, Krulak, MON, Houllier, Faulkner, McLeish, Lambert, Fox, Sherwood, Garde, Black, KMac, Xia, Xia's faceless boardroom cronies, Wyness, Round, RDM and Bruce.
Feast your eyes on that list of men with their own agendas and it is all in the words of Basil, blindingly bleeding obvious.
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The amounts we have wasted in the ownership of the last two owners set beside the position in which we now find ourselves is unbelievable until you put it in the context of the cast list. Lerner, Krulak, MON, Houllier, Faulkner, McLeish, Lambert, Fox, Sherwood, Garde, Black, KMac, Xia, Xia's faceless boardroom cronies, Wyness, Round, RDM and Bruce.
Feast your eyes on that list of men with their own agendas and it is all in the words of Basil, blindingly bleeding obvious.
it is a list of bad
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And that’s before you get started on some of the players that’s stolen a living off us.
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The amounts we have wasted in the ownership of the last two owners set beside the position in which we now find ourselves is unbelievable until you put it in the context of the cast list. Lerner, Krulak, MON, Houllier, Faulkner, McLeish, Lambert, Fox, Sherwood, Garde, Black, KMac, Xia, Xia's faceless boardroom cronies, Wyness, Round, RDM and Bruce.
Feast your eyes on that list of men with their own agendas and it is all in the words of Basil, blindingly bleeding obvious.
it is a list of bad
I'm not too sure if i'd put Houiller in that list to be honest.
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And that’s before you get started on some of the players that’s stolen a living off us.
And continue to steal
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The amounts we have wasted in the ownership of the last two owners set beside the position in which we now find ourselves is unbelievable until you put it in the context of the cast list. Lerner, Krulak, MON, Houllier, Faulkner, McLeish, Lambert, Fox, Sherwood, Garde, Black, KMac, Xia, Xia's faceless boardroom cronies, Wyness, Round, RDM and Bruce.
Feast your eyes on that list of men with their own agendas and it is all in the words of Basil, blindingly bleeding obvious.
it is a list of bad
I'm not too sure if i'd put Houiller in that list to be honest.
I kind of agree with the Houillier bit as he was ok, except for the Liverpool love in and his initial comments about Villa. The rest of them belong in the pit of misery thread. An absolute shambles of a club and fully deserves to be where it is. Unfortunately, we as fans, are the ones paying the price. Sod Xia and Lerner, I have no sympathy for their wallets. Do your homework, appoint sensibly and they wouldn't have been so badly out of pocket. Shambles.
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The amounts we have wasted in the ownership of the last two owners set beside the position in which we now find ourselves is unbelievable until you put it in the context of the cast list. Lerner, Krulak, MON, Houllier, Faulkner, McLeish, Lambert, Fox, Sherwood, Garde, Black, KMac, Xia, Xia's faceless boardroom cronies, Wyness, Round, RDM and Bruce.
Feast your eyes on that list of men with their own agendas and it is all in the words of Basil, blindingly bleeding obvious.
it is a list of bad
I'm not too sure if i'd put Houiller in that list to be honest.
true, scrub Houlier from that list
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Not a well translated piece but from this and something I read on the Recon site, some shit hit the fan for Xia in November 2017. (I'll dig the other articles let out later)
http://westdollar.com/sbdm/finance/news/1354,20171213812260434.html
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The amounts we have wasted in the ownership of the last two owners set beside the position in which we now find ourselves is unbelievable until you put it in the context of the cast list. Lerner, Krulak, MON, Houllier, Faulkner, McLeish, Lambert, Fox, Sherwood, Garde, Black, KMac, Xia, Xia's faceless boardroom cronies, Wyness, Round, RDM and Bruce.
Feast your eyes on that list of men with their own agendas and it is all in the words of Basil, blindingly bleeding obvious.
it is a list of bad
I'm not too sure if i'd put Houiller in that list to be honest.
Nah. Houllier is the first manager in my lifetime who genuinely thought he was doing us a favour just by breezing in and turning up each day. He didn't get the club one iota.
Even Pigface O'Leary sounded enthusiastic about the club initially. It was only when the financial limitations extended into the second year that we were treated to the 'honest bunch of lads/can't compete with the Boltons and Charltons' vomit.
Hard as it seems to believe now but O'Neill leaving was actually an opportunity for us. A younger, committed manager with fresh ideas could have still built a formidable team with the players we had available in 2010. Instead that period marks the start of our decline. And Houllier was a key part of that. We looked better with Gary Mac in charge.
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Houllier was dreadful. A PR disaster and lumbered us with Darren Bent.
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The amounts we have wasted in the ownership of the last two owners set beside the position in which we now find ourselves is unbelievable until you put it in the context of the cast list. Lerner, Krulak, MON, Houllier, Faulkner, McLeish, Lambert, Fox, Sherwood, Garde, Black, KMac, Xia, Xia's faceless boardroom cronies, Wyness, Round, RDM and Bruce.
Feast your eyes on that list of men with their own agendas and it is all in the words of Basil, blindingly bleeding obvious.
It's been like having a burst pipe and trying to mop up the water without turning off the stoptap. Unbelievably, we continue to ignore turning off the stoptap.
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Houllier only opened his mouth to change the foot he put in it but at least he had us playing football and heading in the right direction towards the end of that season. It was all downhill after that. I think Garde deserves a free pass as he took on a poisoned chalice which Lerner and Fox then promptly shat in by not backing him in the transfer market.
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Not a well translated piece but from this and something I read on the Recon site, some shit hit the fan for Xia in November 2017. (I'll dig the other articles let out later)
http://westdollar.com/sbdm/finance/news/1354,20171213812260434.html
I'd suggest not clicking on that, it just opened about 30 new tabs on my iPad. Having finally closed them all, I thought I'd post the text....
United Rui Kang Xiajian: "Three flash crushing more and more outrageous, do not return home all think I can not back!
December 13, 2017 at 21:51source: Securities Times
B
In the absence of obvious negative conditions, shortly before Ruikang associated three shares suffered a flash collapse.
Coincidentally, when Xia Ruikang, head of the joint Ruikang, was in a foreign country for a time, he rumored directly on him. Subsequently, Xia construction in urgentWeiboClarified and temporarily redirected to return home, the public opinion turmoil gradually subsided.
Recently, the Securities Times · e company interviewed an interview with the chairman and CEO of Ruikang Group, Harvard University Design Dr. Xia Jian Tong, the three flashbacks,Lotus healthAsset sales mystery, the acquisition of veteran football clubs in Britain, "youngest professor" misunderstanding and other matters one by one responded, and a detailed account of Rui Kang Department in the wisdom of the global layout of the city.
Trials flashback impact
A shares and Ruikang associated thereRui Kang shares, Lotus health,Tianxia wisdom, Xia Jiantong actual control of the first two listed companies, at the same time as Tianxia wisdom chairman.
At 10:00 on November 20 before and after the sudden collapse of the three collective flash collapse to limit. For a time, the market rumors everywhere, are pointing to the joint Ruikang head Xia Jiatong. In the afternoon, Xia Jiantong released a response to the Weibo announcement that everything was fine in the UK and was busy expanding businesses such as Smart City. The next day, three stocks are still sharply lower.
In an interview with Securities Times and e-Company reporters, Xia said that when the itinerary was for the United Kingdom to go to Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, Saudi Arabia and Kuwait, the government was also going to invite him to participate in the construction project of many smart cities because of this Things have to be temporarily diverted to return home.
Xia Jiantong did not immediately return because in England on November 22, Prince William and Kate came to Villa Park, Xia Jianting to Aston Villa Football Club, the identity of the reception, the British media also reported. At the same time, three flash floods triggered rumors also spread to Britain, the British media also reported on the matter, causing great pressure on Xia Jianting.
"There is no concept of a limit to the UK media, which states that the stock of a company has been halted suspended, understood to be even more outrageous, and it is hard for me to explain to the British the matter of a lower limit." Mr Xia told reporters at Securities Times Said.
The impact of rumors far exceeded the imagination, and slowly evolved into his return home, resulting in three flash flash collapse, microblogging to clarify the power is not enough. To make Xia Jiantong even more surprised that one thing he did not think was made wild. "Because more and more outrageous, do not come back and think I can not go back." Xia Jiantong said, "rumors affect the company a lot of things, some of the original normal cooperationbankFinancial institutions and cooperative departments have taken a wait-and-see attitude to wait until I come back to start doing business again. "After Xia Jianto returned to China, all work including bank and business cooperation gradually returned to normal.
Shortly after returning home, Xia Jiantong attended a media forum and delivered a keynote speech. "In principle, I am not invited to these activities in these years because I am not involved in these activities because I am too busy." Xia Jiantong said: "It is too costly to pass rumor now. I can only do this to make it clear that I have already returned."
Xia Jiantong psychological contradictions of the media from 10 years ago, "the youngest professor at Harvard" misunderstanding, and thus disputes with Fang. Xia Jiantong to Securities Times · e company reporter explained this past, when the doctoral dissertation completed, but has not yet formally graduated, at the same time is a postgraduate teaching assistants identity back to do the project planning of the West Lake, the media mouth of the students "teacher "Said directly as a" professor ", after being Fang" crackdown ", said Xia Jian Tong declared" professor. "
"Actually, it is a matter that I can not beat with my eight poles, and they (the media) toss each other." Xia Jiantong said: "In the same year, he negotiated with Fang once again and thought he really did some" crackdown " Things may not be the case now. "Maybe by" the youngest professor at Harvard "incident, Xiajian not long after this media interview.
In accordance with the understanding of Xia Jiantong, honestly doing things like, time can prove everything. "It is hard to say what he is pretending to be, and it is the best way to prove yourself if a person persists in life for a long time even to do one thing." Xia Jiantong said this remark.
Lotus health increased by the doldrums
In addition to the three flashbacks, which attracted the attention of the market and regulators, there was also a sale of Lotus Health Assets. It was questioned that the related party transactions should be related and Xiajian made a direct response.
On September 29 this year, Lotus Health Bulletin, transfer of Xiangcheng City, Henan ProvinceCanonThermal Power Co., Ltd. (Canon Thermal Power) 100% stake in Henan Lotus Sugar Co., Ltd. (Lotus Sugar) 43% stake, the transaction price was 244 million yuan, 66 million yuan, the transferee for the Horgos Zhongxin Yun Investment Venture Capital Co., Ltd. (hereinafter referred to as "new cloud vote").
The transfer, Lotus Health intends to divest the loss of assets, the funds used to solve the problems left over by history, and promote the development of the company. However, this issue triggered a chain reaction. Two exchanges of inquiry were issued on the SSE. One was to ask whether there was any trading motivation for manipulating profits through asset disposal to prevent the company from losing its annual net assets. Another issue involved the subject The second transfer of assets, to the new cloud investment shortly after the change to Xiajian company name, triggering the related party transactions to the question.
In this regard, Xia Jian Tong Securities Times told e Times reporter, not only the assets of the plant (referring to Canon Thermal Power), lot lot of land in the city center facilities have been relatively old, have been released in accordance with the plan to move to a new Industrial Park, and similar assets before the land handling several times, the transfer is a process of asset clean-up, and involves many problems left over by history.
"Due to government demands and historical reasons, I consider temporarily holding this asset and waiting for the settlement of the problems that have been promised by employees in previous history when the assets have been disposed of." Xia Jiantong said: "If I take it for myself This asset, it is good to direct announcement to assess the valuation are normal, there is no need to avoid what.
In response to the Shanghai Stock Exchange, Xia Jiantong also said that after the completion of the industrial and commercial change by Canon Power Generation, the workers had great opinions and kept petitions. After coordination, the subsidiaries and the Zhongyun Cloud Investment Co., Ltd. signed an agreement on behalf of the shareholders. Lotus Health explained that Canon employees at Lotus have been working for many years, out of a strong sense of belonging and trust in the Lotus brand, requiring termination of the transaction and requiring the transfer of Canon Power to the name of the former shareholder.
In the end, Lotus Health or canceled these two transactions, the announcement said out of caution.
Lotus Health that is the original Lotus MSG is Rui Kang Department of the first actual control of A-share listed companies, the time is the end of 2014.
That Xia Jiantong took over a mess at that time is not excessive, and debt-ridden. Ruikang investment after the admission, planning non-public offering, prompting Lotus Gourmet Powder to enterWisdom agricultureAnd big health field, later company name changed to lotus health.
Lotus healthy non-public offering, from September 2015 already started planning, regulatory authorities have long been accepted, during which they have undergone a suspension and the number of draft, but has not yet been adopted. Under the program, Lotus Health intends to not more than 527 million shares of non-public offering, raised 3.113 billion yuan of funds does not exceed, Rui Kang subscribe for more than 2.3 billion investment.
Raised funds will be used green health, intellectual agriculture and other projects, there is a considerable part of the repayment of borrowings and capital investment in the controlling lease. Another significant move is to consolidate the controlling stake in Ruikang Investment, which will increase its stake to 31.28% after the implementation.
Xiajian Tong attached great importance to this increase, but he did not get a headache. "After we took over Lotus, we have borrowed billions of dollars at no expense and devoted more than 2 billion to the overall problem, in order to solve the problems left over by history and to clear the obstacles for the increase." Xia Jiantong said: "After a definite increase, we can solve a lot of historical burdens , To promote listed companies on the right track. "
According to the introduction of Xia Jiantong, the Henan Provincial Government, Zhoukou and Xiangcheng Municipal Government recently held a symposium to support Ruikang in solving all problems of Lotus as soon as possible and to pass it as soon as possible. "We have worked very hard in recent years and have turned losses on our main business, except for the impact of historical burden, assets impairment and debt provision, and the financial statements are not good looking," said Xia Jiantong.
The market has the view that Lotus Health is a shell company, which Xiajian think "engage in capital." According to Xia Jian Tong revealed that he took over the lotus health from now until now, often people ask whether to sell the shell. "If I could make a fortune in order to make a fortune, I could already resell it and would I put so much money into saving it?" Xia Jiantong said: "I can not ignore these 20,000 people. Fortunately, these three years have basically figured out that now To the last step, how do I have to persevere, I hope no one to trouble and toss up. "
Vera help business development
In fact, one of the most watched events of Xia Jianto in recent years is that in the summer of 2016, the Aston Villa Football Club of England (hereinafter referred to as "Villa") was fully acquired with a transaction price of 75 million pounds if Vera rose to the Premier League, but also to pay 40 million pounds. Xia Jiantong is a football fan in itself, and now serves as chairman of Villa Club.
Vera was founded in 1874 at the Villa Park in Birmingham. His history is excellent, but relegated from the Premier League to the English Champions League due to poor performance in the 2015/16 season. Thanks to his excellent early records and long history, Vera has accumulated a large number of fans, including Prince William of the future king of Britain and former Prime Minister Cameron. They also have a very strong fan base around the world.
In the UK, wanting to buy a football club is not an easy task. Xia Jiantong said he was the first Chinese to pass the Premier League and FA Premier qualification and many people followed up to acquire foreign football teams. "At that time, investing in Villa was very rational, not only because he was a soccer fan." Xia Jian Tong told the Securities Times · e company reporter.
Xia Jiantong introduction, the acquisition of Vera for three reasons, one around Rui Kang intelligent life platform to create services for sports enthusiasts in the vertical field platform, Vera is a specific football content; two is optimistic about the assets owned by Vera, in Birmingham, etc. To carry out smart city has a foundation; Third, Vera in the world has many special fans in the background, to carry out a global business has played a bridge role.
"We hope Vera will return to the Premiership as soon as possible and if successful, the investment will surely be a success." Xiaji told Security Times reporter, "Even if Vera did not return to the Premiership, it was a good asset from the point of view Of investment, is completely rational business practices. "Xia also added that it is because they are fans, the understanding of the industry is very clear.
Xia Jiantong learned two professions, one related to urbanization, one related to information technology. Rui Kang Although there are many business sectors, but also around this, smart city is a specific entry point. Xia Jiantong introduced in the future slowly enter an era of all things, the company's aim is for everyone in this era to create a better life, to create a Zhaopin platform covering the production side, the demand side, to meet the more intelligent resource acquisition process.
Xia Jiantong hopes this "Zhaopin" platform will not only be in China, but Vera will play a key role in the global layout of these businesses. Many princes from Saudi Arabia, India and Indonesia are fans of Vera, and Vera is like A bond.
According to Xia Jiantong, Rui Kang currently carries out smart city project specific locations, including the Birmingham and London Olympic region in Britain, Saudi Arabia's Riyadh, Kuwait's two cities, India's New Delhi core area and two other cities in Indonesia Bandung and Jakarta Satellite City. The expansion of business in these regions can not be separated from the ability of Vera to extend this platform.
In accordance with the planning of Xia construction, but also busy for 5 years. Xia Jiantong hopes that under his efforts, a platform for global resource sharing will emerge in five years. Xia Jiantong is now involved in many concrete projects around the world. He hopes to be able to train a core team of hundreds of people to replace himself within five years and will not spend so much time in specific affairs after five years.
At the end of the interview, Xia Jiantong told the Securities Times · e company reporter said that from the time he completed his studies to now he does not pursue how much money, how much wealth, but requires that he can honestly behave, this is Harvard years of education to his greatest Guidelines. "How many media interviews I received and how many exposures did not materially affect me." Xia Jiantong said, "I told my partners, although some misunderstand the storm, so long as they do well, just like that."
(Editor: DF134)
I lasted a paragraph, if anyone wants to make some sense of it, thank you.
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Vera? Really?
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Vera? Really?
I didn't even spot that.
Well didn't some call Bruce 'Nan's hair'?!
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Well that clears that up.
Were the Vera were the Vera.
Vera Vera Vera.
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Might as well have left it in the original Chinese for all the sense that it made.
Up the Vera!
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Any news from the fucking fake yet? Or is it sit tight and wait for the next winding up order?
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Vera, Vera
What has become of you
Does anybody else in here
Feel the way I do?
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My only hope is that we are working flat out to find a buyer, so that this useless little arsehole gets as far away from our club quick sharp.
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I get that horrible sinking feeling that the new investor/ source of funds is just not going to happen. I don’t want us to fail, but to be honest if it’s inevitable, the sooner they get on with putting us into Administration and out of our current misery the better. At least everyone concerned will know what they are up against and hopefully from the shattered wreckage some sort of future viable set-up can emerge. In the old cliche , it’s the hope that kills you ...
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Don't know about anyone else but I get the sense it's going to get a lot worse before it gets better. Judging by the silence I'd guess people are trying to unpick and fathom out just how deep the shit is that we're in before they let on, I'd rather have all the bad news at once rather than be drip fed it.
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I'm going the other way to be honest, In my opinion there have been 2 stories, 1 is the tax bill and the other is FFP. The latter is something we knew was a problem (if we didn't go up) months ago so the only 'new' information in the last month was HMRC. Now that's clearly not a good situation to be in but it's been resolved and the underlying problem will be resolved if/when we fix the FFP issue. The way we have to do that is to sell some players and start using our youth team more effectively, something I thought we should've started doing 2 1/2 years ago when relegation was a certainty so i'm struggling to be all that upset by the prospect.
If things come out that add to the problems then obviously my position will change but I just can't get myself all that worked up about the whole thing right now. I guess that's why I don't really get what people want from a statement, what exactly can be said that will help anyone right now?
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hat we've been taken over by Sheikh Yer Booty?
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Don't know about anyone else but I get the sense it's going to get a lot worse before it gets better. Judging by the silence I'd guess people are trying to unpick and fathom out just how deep the shit is that we're in before they let on, I'd rather have all the bad news at once rather than be drip fed it.
Agree, sadly.
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I'm going the other way to be honest, In my opinion there have been 2 stories, 1 is the tax bill and the other is FFP. The latter is something we knew was a problem (if we didn't go up) months ago so the only 'new' information in the last month was HMRC. Now that's clearly not a good situation to be in but it's been resolved and the underlying problem will be resolved if/when we fix the FFP issue. The way we have to do that is to sell some players and start using our youth team more effectively, something I thought we should've started doing 2 1/2 years ago when relegation was a certainty so i'm struggling to be all that upset by the prospect.
If things come out that add to the problems then obviously my position will change but I just can't get myself all that worked up about the whole thing right now. I guess that's why I don't really get what people want from a statement, what exactly can be said that will help anyone right now?
The suspicion is that the cash flow issue is ongoing and the settlement with HMRC was s first installment only.
There is presumably a need for cash each month, so for it all to be sorted Xia must have found a way of borrowing against assets, finding extra investment or moving funds from China. Are any of these likely?
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If he's loaned £50 million, then presumably he's given himself 12 months, if the level of equity needed last season was £4m a month.
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Would you lend him money with his track record?
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I'm going the other way to be honest, In my opinion there have been 2 stories, 1 is the tax bill and the other is FFP. The latter is something we knew was a problem (if we didn't go up) months ago so the only 'new' information in the last month was HMRC. Now that's clearly not a good situation to be in but it's been resolved and the underlying problem will be resolved if/when we fix the FFP issue. The way we have to do that is to sell some players and start using our youth team more effectively, something I thought we should've started doing 2 1/2 years ago when relegation was a certainty so i'm struggling to be all that upset by the prospect.
If things come out that add to the problems then obviously my position will change but I just can't get myself all that worked up about the whole thing right now. I guess that's why I don't really get what people want from a statement, what exactly can be said that will help anyone right now?
The suspicion is that the cash flow issue is ongoing and the settlement with HMRC was s first installment only.
There is presumably a need for cash each month, so for it all to be sorted Xia must have found a way of borrowing against assets, finding extra investment or moving funds from China. Are any of these likely?
Indeed, but it's only a suspicion and I doubt they'd have been meeting to discuss the budget and agreeing to resign Hutton if there was a realistic chance that we won't be able to pay players wages in the next fortnight.
As Ads said, the rumours were that he'd arranged £50m of credit, if that's the case then, as I said, it's a case of sorting out things we need to fix for FFP anyway and then reviewing things next summer. On evidence I see no reason to fear a winding-up order anytime soon and if that threat isn't there then we're really no worse off than many expected we'd be if we missed promotion. I said a number of times that Bruce's approach was short term shit or bust and we're just seeing how true that was really.
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Would you lend him money with his track record?
I wouldn't give him a quid to go to the shop. I have lost all faith in the bloke.
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Meaning Evil.
Revealed: Tony Xia is running out of time to save Aston Villa
The AVFC owner is now desperately seeking outside investment as the bills continue to add up
12:35, 18 JUN 2018Updated15:09, 18 JUN 2018
Tony Xia is facing a race against time to source funds for cash-strapped Aston Villa.
The Chinese owner is currently exploring various investment proposals after accepting that a change at the top is needed.
Xia wants to stay on board as Villa chairman but is seeking outside investment of around £30million before the end of the month.
At worst he wants to remain a shareholder but is now seriously considering selling up as groups continue to show an interest in the club.
He will not sell Villa on the cheap, though.
Although he does admit that change is needed to get Villa going again after two seasons of disappointment in the Championship.
BirminghamLive understands that he also has some regret at not spending more time in England since taking over.
With CEO Keith Wyness now out the door and suing Villa for constructive dismissal, the club are short on key decision-makers.
It can be revealed that Xia sent a management troubleshooter over to Villa Park recently to help pick up the pieces.
Everything you need to know about Aston Villa target Samuel Yohou
His expert feedback - from years working in high-profile businesses outside of football - is now being considered.
But the most pressing concern is sorting out the on-going cash-flow issue.
Villa have another stack of bills due at the end of the month and Xia is close to exhausting his loan options.
He sourced £2million to cover last month's outstanding tax bill and it’s understood that money has even been borrowed against July’s parachute payment which weakens the owner’s hand in times ahead.
As reported last week, the second half of this month really is a crunch time for the club as Villa owe around £11million to other clubs for player transfers.
On top of that there will be another tax bill, the ongoing payroll commitments and other running costs that need addresing.
Huge investment in player wages and more than £70million in transfers in just two seasons left the club facing an HMRC winding-up order last month and similar issues could arise if the next payments are not made.
Player sales are inevitable with Jack Grealish and James Chester expected to fetch the highest fees.
But slashing the £45m wage bill is going to be difficult as there has been little interest in some of Villa's high-earning fringe players.
The next ten days are crucial.
Simon Jordan explains why it's not all doom and gloom at Aston Villa
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I see there was some open space that needed to be filled with a lot of "I heard..." type stuff.
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Silence from the owner says it all really. I am prepared for the worst and expect it.
Hopefully he sells up to someone with some acumen.
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Oh good all sounds positive then...
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All sounds highly speculative. Why would you sack Wyness for reasons of seeking outside investment only to seem that a good idea a week later.
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Muddled thinking, foolish pride?
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Until Xia makes a statement that the future Financial position of the club is secure then these story’s will continue to circulate and with good reason.
If Xia could make that statement he would do so.
I do not see the outside investment story as either credible or likely considering the time line.
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Do you think he’s planning more ‘sitting with Xia’ competitions anytime soon so we can find what the bloody hell is going on?
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But slashing the £45m wage bill is going to be difficult as there has been little interest in some of Villa's high-earning fringe players.
So why re-sign Hutton? When we already have Bree, D'Laet, Emo and youth all on the books that can play FB.
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But slashing the £45m wage bill is going to be difficult as there has been little interest in some of Villa's high-earning fringe players.
So why re-sign Hutton? When we already have Bree, D'Laet, Emo and youth all on the books that can play FB.
Maybe he thinks he needs some protection next time he's over, I wouldn't argue with Al.
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I'm hoping he's being quiet because he's in discussions with either investors or buyers and they've told him to shut the fk up until there's something to say. Unlikely I know.
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Do you think he’s planning more ‘sitting with Xia’ competitions anytime soon so we can find what the bloody hell is going on?
I'm told there will be, but it'll cost you £50M
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Would you lend him money with his track record?
I wouldn't give him a quid to go to the shop. I have lost all faith in the bloke.
Absolutely , I am pleased we didn't go up can you imagine the mess we would have been in in if they had the premiership money ??
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I'm assuming that even if we had gone up we still wouldn't have magically had the HMRC cash? As such the crisis would still have hit?
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I'm assuming that even if we had gone up we still wouldn't have magically had the HMRC cash? As such the crisis would still have hit?
Would have thought borrowing against the expected Prem cash would have been a lot easier than the final parachute payment though - he doesn’t strike me as the type who would have used the Prem cash to steady the ship for the long term tho if it had happened
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I think it's fair to assume that no one really knows what this chap would have done with the additional revenue that promotion would have brought in.
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I think it's fair to assume that no one really knows what this chap would have done with the additional revenue that promotion would have brought in.
The same but with a lot more of it
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Watched the Simpsons episode Marge vs the monorail last night, if anyone remembers that. All felt strangely familiar.
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With the fixture list coming out on Thursday and millions due to be paid the week afterwards to various sources, does anyone know what would happen if we start the season and then go into liquidation ( heaven forbid) half way through? I can't find any reference to this scenario on the EFL website.
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With the fixture list coming out on Thursday and millions due to be paid the week afterwards to various sources, does anyone know what would happen if we start the season and then go into liquidation ( heaven forbid) half way through? I can't find any reference to this scenario on the EFL website.
We will not go straight into liquidation. The most likely insolvency scenario would be entering Administration a process that protects the company from being attacked by its creditors (the people it owes money to) to allow it time to restructure or sell it on or indeed ultimately liquidate as you suggest. When entering Administration, we will immediately start next season with a 12 point deduction. The same if we entered Administration during the season. The preferred outcome of the Administration will be a sale to a new owner which rids us of all unsecured debt but not football creditors such as players transfer fees.
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I think that’s why the league official was supposed to be having a meeting at VP this week to see evidence that we could complete our fixtures next season. Don’t know what happens if they conclude we can’t but I would think Administration would then be inevitable in fairly short order with liquidation and being thrown out of the league to follow if the administrator couldn’t restructure and sell the club as a going concern. It’s being so cheerful that keeps me going...Grim times and I hate it but we may as well face up to what could happen.
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This is all well and good, but can we have the round badge back?
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This is all well and good, but can we have the round badge back?
When FC Aston Villa is formed and we pay the Administrator a premium for it - yes.
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This is all well and good, but can we have the round badge back?
[/quote
Yes please !
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My emotions about what is happening to our beloved club are all over the place. One minute I’m down about t, then positive and hoping for a brighter future. Today and the last few I am firmly in the pissed off/curious/anger phase with Dr Phony.
He HAS to sell us as I don’t think anyone will accept him anymore
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This is all well and good, but can we have the round badge back?
What about the orange dot?
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This is all well and good, but can we have the round badge back?
What about the orange dot?
Have you seen the price of orange dots these days?
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This is all well and good, but can we have the round badge back?
Yes, but we have to change the motto to "There, or thereabouts"
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With a 'That's the Championship' badge on the sleeve.
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Sponsored by Hysterical.
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This is all well and good, but can we have the round badge back?
Think the make up of the badge is the least of our worries.
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I apologise. The badge change suggestion was a tongue in cheek/ironic/shit attempt at gallows humour. Lesson learned!
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I think everyone except WW picked that up Des! I thought it was funny.
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I think we should ditch 'Prepared' and use something more realistic.
"Fucking hell!" or maybe just "FFS"
Or just a question mark.
Or, to be more up to date:
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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We should rename the club as "Why didn't Barry FC"
Agreed, I think the badge is the least of our worries but maybe the Meaning Evil wripped one on the new Luke kit would be apt with an Orange dot replacing the star?
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I apologise. The badge change suggestion was a tongue in cheek/ironic/shit attempt at gallows humour. Lesson learned!
Made me smile 😊 but enough of the badge talk, I won’t rest until VAR has investigated Barry & that penalty!
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‘Stability’ where prepared used to be
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The recent turmoil has made me realise just how much Villa are a constant in my life, it is ghastly imagining a world without them. I dpn't think I could bring myself to ever support another team if the club disappeared.
Surely with a club as large, old and famous as the Villa someone will pitch up and take it off Tony's hands. I hope so, as I have zero confidence in him to get us through this. When Man City had issues wioth their dodgy Thai owner (Taksim Shinawatra?) they managed to pull a rabbit out of the hat by finding very wealthy new owners. Villa are far bigger than Man City were at the time, lets hope this ends well.
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The recent turmoil has made me realise just how much Villa are a constant in my life, it is ghastly imagining a world without them. I dpn't think I could bring myself to ever support another team if the club disappeared.
Surely with a club as large, old and famous as the Villa someone will pitch up and take it off Tony's hands. I hope so, as I have zero confidence in him to get us through this. When Man City had issues wioth their dodgy Thai owner (Taksim Shinawatra?) they managed to pull a rabbit out of the hat by finding very wealthy new owners. Villa are far bigger than Man City were at the time, lets hope this ends well.
We are still a bigger club than Man City.
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The recent turmoil has made me realise just how much Villa are a constant in my life, it is ghastly imagining a world without them. I dpn't think I could bring myself to ever support another team if the club disappeared.
Surely with a club as large, old and famous as the Villa someone will pitch up and take it off Tony's hands. I hope so, as I have zero confidence in him to get us through this. When Man City had issues wioth their dodgy Thai owner (Taksim Shinawatra?) they managed to pull a rabbit out of the hat by finding very wealthy new owners. Villa are far bigger than Man City were at the time, lets hope this ends well.
We are still a bigger club than Man City.
I agree. It is a shitty state of affairs when pisspot teams like City and Chelsea have managed to spend their way big, but rules stop larger clubs like Villa from doing the same. I don't see what is fair about FFP, load of old bollocks.
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I know nothing of how financing businesses works but if he is speaking with people / organisations regarding investment or ideally a takeover would that all be subject to non disclosure agreements hence nothing out of the club other than the one line statements about Wyness etc?
Also seen administration mentioned a few times - seem to remember when Portsmouth for one we’re going through admin that the theory was admin made them more attractive to buyers because of the writing down of debts, the players were seen as special so were paid but the big losers were the local businesses who dealt with the club - is that the case? Would hope on a class and dignity level that if that is right admin is avoided.
Seems mad that less than a month ago we were panicking over FFP and now who knows (& I suspect the press know little more than we do) what is going on.
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Gareth, yes any sale or investment negotiations would be kept secret, although I think investment leaving Tony in control is extremely unlikely.
Portsmouth had built up a huge HMRC debt and one of the reasons why HMRC are less lenient with Football Clubs.
Yes all non Secured and non Football Creditors can get wiped.
The sale of the club will take time, probably several weeks.
If there is a genuine sale process in place it is often the case that HMRC will hold off.
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The recent turmoil has made me realise just how much Villa are a constant in my life, it is ghastly imagining a world without them. I dpn't think I could bring myself to ever support another team if the club disappeared.
Surely with a club as large, old and famous as the Villa someone will pitch up and take it off Tony's hands. I hope so, as I have zero confidence in him to get us through this. When Man City had issues wioth their dodgy Thai owner (Taksim Shinawatra?) they managed to pull a rabbit out of the hat by finding very wealthy new owners. Villa are far bigger than Man City were at the time, lets hope this ends well.
I was thinking and saying similar when Randy was selling the Club. For us to get the kind of owners we want and need to make us competitive at the very top end of football again we need a whole lot lobbying to be going on behind the scenes at both business and political levels. It's been discussed on here before how George Osborne guided Man City's present owners to Manchester on the back of the "Northern Powerhouse" project and I was hoping similar big hitters would be nudged towards Randy (assuming such big hitters are out there, of course). Instead, four Chinese groups were circling ourselves, Wolves, West Brom and Bham City and we seem to have been landed with worst of the lot - and that is despite having the likes of Hollis and Mervyn King on board! I'm not sure what conclusions to draw from it all.
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What will make Football Clubs more attractive to investors is when they kill off relegation, because that allows for the creation of franchises with even more predictable income streams.
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Manchester City were taken over in 2008, when George Osborne was still in opposition.
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Man. City were in lots of mess before Dubai took over. Didn't Thaksin have his cash frozen in Thailand due to some corruption investigation? There was talk of administration there for a while and then within a few days they were signing Robinho for 32m.
Not really sure how Dubai came in for them.
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I still can't fathom how Villa aren't up there with the most successful clubs.
We're the biggest club in England's second city, great infrastructure, lovely stadium, distinctive brand, illustrious history, former
European champions, excellent, loyal fan base and potential for a frankly huge following across the West Mids conurbation and beyond.
The potential is massive. It's a tragedy that for so long we've been run by people lacking the vision and judgment needed to fulfill it.
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The recent turmoil has made me realise just how much Villa are a constant in my life, it is ghastly imagining a world without them. I dpn't think I could bring myself to ever support another team if the club disappeared.
Surely with a club as large, old and famous as the Villa someone will pitch up and take it off Tony's hands. I hope so, as I have zero confidence in him to get us through this. When Man City had issues wioth their dodgy Thai owner (Taksim Shinawatra?) they managed to pull a rabbit out of the hat by finding very wealthy new owners. Villa are far bigger than Man City were at the time, lets hope this ends well.
We are still a bigger club than Man City.
We simply aren't though any more, as rose tinted as we'd all like to look at it. City, Chelsea, Spurs they are all bigger clubs than us now sadly and the gap is growing at an alarming rate!
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Manchester City were taken over in 2008, when George Osborne was still in opposition.
Yep, you're right, I was mixing it up with when Osborne guided the Chinese President to Manchester instead of Birmingham back in 2015. The political and economic process of lobbying for huge investment in Manchester was certainly in full swing in 2008, though, and Osborne was right behind it before, during and after being in government. Without similar behind the scenes influence and movement, we might well be snookered.
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The recent turmoil has made me realise just how much Villa are a constant in my life, it is ghastly imagining a world without them. I dpn't think I could bring myself to ever support another team if the club disappeared.
Surely with a club as large, old and famous as the Villa someone will pitch up and take it off Tony's hands. I hope so, as I have zero confidence in him to get us through this. When Man City had issues wioth their dodgy Thai owner (Taksim Shinawatra?) they managed to pull a rabbit out of the hat by finding very wealthy new owners. Villa are far bigger than Man City were at the time, lets hope this ends well.
We are still a bigger club than Man City.
We simply aren't though any more, as rose tinted as we'd all like to look at it. City, Chelsea, Spurs they are all bigger clubs than us now sadly and the gap is growing at an alarming rate!
That's because they all have wealthy, savvy, credible owners. Give us an ambitious owners of a similar scale and we would soon be back on track.
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Manchester City were taken over in 2008, when George Osborne was still in opposition.
Yep, you're right, I was mixing it up with when Osborne guided the Chinese President to Manchester instead of Birmingham back in 2015. The political and economic process of lobbying for huge investment in Manchester was certainly in full swing in 2008, though, and Osborne was right behind it before, during and after being in government. Without similar behind the scenes influence and movement, we might well be snookered.
I would think none of that had much to do with it though. Manchester City had a shiny new stadium that didn't even need to be bought, and the Arab purchasers of City probably considered that a Manchester based football club would be easier to get going again and market worldwide than a Birmingham one.
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Manchester City were taken over in 2008, when George Osborne was still in opposition.
Yep, you're right, I was mixing it up with when Osborne guided the Chinese President to Manchester instead of Birmingham back in 2015. The political and economic process of lobbying for huge investment in Manchester was certainly in full swing in 2008, though, and Osborne was right behind it before, during and after being in government. Without similar behind the scenes influence and movement, we might well be snookered.
I would think none of that had much to do with it though. Manchester City had a shiny new stadium that didn't even need to be bought, and the Arab purchasers of City probably considered that a Manchester based football club would be easier to get going again and market worldwide than a Birmingham one.
This is true, we are the Second City reaally in name only now. The media (Beeb especially) and Government bias towards Manchester as the only other place worth talking about than London now is overwhelming!
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This is true, we are the Second City reaally in name only now. The media (Beeb especially) and Government bias towards Manchester as the only other place worth talking about than London now is overwhelming!
It is not even the biggest city in its own region, Liverpool is larger. Birmingham is bigger and better in every metric, except in marketing itself.
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Leeds and Bristol have higher populations as well and Sheffield is only just behind. They cheat with all that Greater Manchester guff.
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It's the Greater Manchester thing isn't it. Manchester itself isn't huge, but tag on Oldham, Salford, Trafford, Bolton, etc and it soon mounts up.
According to the ONS, 2016 population figures.
Manchester - 549k
Leeds - 500k
Liverpool - 572k
Sheffield - 542k
Newcastle - 282k
Birmingham - 1,141k
London - 8,476k
Birmingham is at least twice the size of anything other than London.
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I tend to think of everything inside the M60 as Manchester, even if it actually isn't, like Salford. Everything outside it like Bolton and Bury is very much "Greater" Manchester. I can't think of anywhere else in the UK off the top of my head where you've got two cities separated by about a 5 metre width of river.
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I tend to think of everything inside the M60 as Manchester, even if it actually isn't, like Salford. Everything outside it like Bolton and Bury is very much "Greater" Manchester. I can't think of anywhere else in the UK off the top of my head where you've got two cities separated by about a 5 metre width of river.
Technically London and Westminster but that really just proves your point. I'd largely agree with you.
However, by the same criteria I'd argue that Sandwell and Solihull are part of Birmingham. In both of those cases it's literally a case of crossing a road in a number of places.
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Sandwell definitely, as an example Bearwood is Sandwell despite being a lot closer to the city center than most Birmingham suburbs.
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Sandwell definitely, as an example Bearwood is Sandwell despite being a lot closer to the city center than most Birmingham suburbs.
Yeah Bearwood is silly but i you look at the solihull council border map around places like Marston Green, Castle Brom and Kingshurst (https://mapit.mysociety.org/area/2538.html) it's clearly 1 place.
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It just shows what positive media spin can do though doesn't it. I mean watching the Beeb you'd think Salford (not even in Manchester according to the above) was the centre of the universe
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Sandwell definitely, as an example Bearwood is Sandwell despite being a lot closer to the city center than most Birmingham suburbs.
Yeah Bearwood is silly but i you look at the solihull council border map around places like Marston Green, Castle Brom and Kingshurst (https://mapit.mysociety.org/area/2538.html) it's clearly 1 place.
I’ve spent most of my life living in Castle Bromwich, it’s in Solihull by name only. I’ve always written my address with ‘Birmingham’ in, and if I go into ‘town’ that means Birmingham, and the same goes for everyone I grew up with.
And quite besides, Solihull is shit.
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I still can't fathom how Villa aren't up there with the most successful clubs.
We're the biggest club in England's second city, great infrastructure, lovely stadium, distinctive brand, illustrious history, former
European champions, excellent, loyal fan base and potential for a frankly huge following across the West Mids conurbation and beyond.
The potential is massive. It's a tragedy that for so long we've been run by people lacking the vision and judgment needed to fulfill it.
Over last 20 years we've developed the unwelcome habit of freezing/bottling big chances.
It started in 2000 with how negative we were in the FA cup final. We had a good team in those days but losing that mean likes of Boateng, Ugo, Southgate and David James all wanted to leave and they all did within the next 18 months.
Win that cup and I Imagine they'd have all been happy to stay and we could've kicked on from there.
Lean few years and then Lerner took over. We built up with money to be 7 points clear of Arsenal in February 2009. If we'd kept going we'd have been able to keep Barry (Man. City weren't in CL either when he joined them) and had scope to offer likes of Young and Milner new long term deals.
We then went into decline but there was still a slight chink of light when we reached the cup final in 2015. Let's say we'd have turned in a Liverpool performance and won that and qualified for europa league, maybe likes of Benteke and Delph would've given us one more year and so we could've still been a premier league club when Lerner sold up. That's probably most unlikely of the scenarios though.
We now come to the most obvious one of not winning the 150m game and all the carnage it's now causing.
Fact is in modern football you don't win big games or look like you're a forward thinking progressive club in the league, you're going to lose key players and all the problem that causes.
We just don't tend to be a club that seizes chances to improve our fortunes anymore I'm afraid with hopeless performances in those games so can't complain when those results cause us massive issues as a club.
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Over last 20 years we've developed the unwelcome habit of freezing/bottling big chances.
It started in 2000 with how negative we were in the FA cup final
It started WAY before then.
Doug failed to take the risk/plunge numerous times when we had greatness within touching distance.
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Before we start beating ourselves up again, I wonder how many clubs' last six Wembley appearances have all been against clubs above them in the league? We never seem to get a good cup run in a year when the top teams go out early.
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The recent turmoil has made me realise just how much Villa are a constant in my life, it is ghastly imagining a world without them. I dpn't think I could bring myself to ever support another team if the club disappeared.
Surely with a club as large, old and famous as the Villa someone will pitch up and take it off Tony's hands. I hope so, as I have zero confidence in him to get us through this. When Man City had issues wioth their dodgy Thai owner (Taksim Shinawatra?) they managed to pull a rabbit out of the hat by finding very wealthy new owners. Villa are far bigger than Man City were at the time, lets hope this ends well.
We are still a bigger club than Man City.
I agree. It is a shitty state of affairs when pisspot teams like City and Chelsea have managed to spend their way big, but rules stop larger clubs like Villa from doing the same. I don't see what is fair about FFP, load of old bollocks.
We did spend big though and still achieved nothing.
Have to say spending 50m and not even being able to get promoted from the flipping championship has to be worse than what we failed to achieve under Lerner.
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Over last 20 years we've developed the unwelcome habit of freezing/bottling big chances.
It started in 2000 with how negative we were in the FA cup final
It started WAY before then.
Doug failed to take the risk/plunge numerous times when we had greatness within touching distance.
[/quote]
90s were still a relatively golden period for us though. 92-93 we finished 2nd, 95-96 we were 4th. I also remember a 5th place season in 96/97 being described as underachievement on thr VHS season review of that year.
We also won two major trophies in that time.
Think of how many times in that era we qualified for euro through the league or winning the cup. Think of how many times since 2002 we've qualfied for europe directly through league position (Intertoto dosen't count).
That's what progressive clubs do most seasons and we were doing it in the 90s. 2000 cup final changed the mentality and we've never got it back bar the first few Lerner years where we still fell short of our goals although we tried hard.
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We also nearly got relegated twice in the 90s, I remember it as a period of if onlys.
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It's interesting in that when we last finished in the top four, only the top three teams could qualify for the Champs League (they extended it to four the following year, I think). Likewise, when we were consistently finishing top six under O'Neill, the only thing the press talked about was the "Top Four"...and now, when we are nowhere near the top six of the Premier League, the "Top Six" has become the place to be for an "elite" club.
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I'd say I could write the book on our failure to take the final step so often during that period, but I have. Several times.
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We also nearly got relegated twice in the 90s, I remember it as a period of if onlys.
As well as winning the League, European Cup and Super Cup and getting relegated and promoted in the eighties we also nearly got relegated on two other occasions in that decade. In the eighties we had only three mid table seasons. Other than that it was feast or famine.
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We also nearly got relegated twice in the 90s, I remember it as a period of if onlys.
As well as winning the League, European Cup and Super Cup and getting relegated and promoted in the eighties we also nearly got relegated on two other occasions in that decade. In the eighties we had only three mid table seasons. Other than that it was feast or famine.
Feast or famine has a good ring to it for a club motto.
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Gareth, yes any sale or investment negotiations would be kept secret, although I think investment leaving Tony in control is extremely unlikely.
Portsmouth had built up a huge HMRC debt and one of the reasons why HMRC are less lenient with Football Clubs.
Yes all non Secured and non Football Creditors can get wiped.
The sale of the club will take time, probably several weeks.
If there is a genuine sale process in place it is often the case that HMRC will hold off.
All of which has flipped me from being one of the first calling for a statement from the top in the days after Wembley to reassure - now wanting the silence to be worth something in terms of new ownership.
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It's interesting in that when we last finished in the top four, only the top three teams could qualify for the Champs League (they extended it to four the following year, I think). Likewise, when we were consistently finishing top six under O'Neill, the only thing the press talked about was the "Top Four"...and now, when we are nowhere near the top six of the Premier League, the "Top Six" has become the place to be for an "elite" club.
It was only the top 2 that qualified for the Champions League when we last came 4th (95/96). Not that that nullifies your broader point, I'm just a pedantic git.
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We have paid the tax bill in full and have enough working capital to last until Christmas. Doesn't mean our position financially is still not perilous mind
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We have paid the tax bill in full and have enough working capital to last until Christmas. Doesn't mean our position financially is still not perilous mind
Yaaaaay
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We have paid the tax bill in full and have enough working capital to last until Christmas. Doesn't mean our position financially is still not perilous mind
I may have missed something, but do we definitely know this as fact ?
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We have paid the tax bill in full and have enough working capital to last until Christmas. Doesn't mean our position financially is still not perilous mind
Was it more than one month's PAYE we owed then? What's the plan for after Christmas then, I assume desperately trying to sell the club?
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We have paid the tax bill in full and have enough working capital to last until Christmas. Doesn't mean our position financially is still not perilous mind
Was it more than one month's PAYE we owed then? What's the plan for after Christmas then, I assume desperately trying to sell the club?
(https://thumb.ibb.co/cOC1h8/CD9215_elf_christmas_card.jpg) (https://ibb.co/cOC1h8)
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We have paid the tax bill in full and have enough working capital to last until Christmas. Doesn't mean our position financially is still not perilous mind
Was it more than one month's PAYE we owed then? What's the plan for after Christmas then, I assume desperately trying to sell the club?
The worry is, what has he done to get the money.
Sold future transfer payments, future revenue streams?
Hope it’s not a Glasgow Rangers situation.
Oh dear
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According to The Telegraph today:
Villa are facing another £5million bill in the latest challenge for owner Dr Tony Xia. Villa have this month's pay-roll and tax to fund by the end of June and are under pressure to find the amount having recently settled a dispute with HMRC to avoid the threat of a winding-up order.
It just goes on and on and on.
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We have paid the tax bill in full and have enough working capital to last until Christmas. Doesn't mean our position financially is still not perilous mind
Was it more than one month's PAYE we owed then? What's the plan for after Christmas then, I assume desperately trying to sell the club?
A Christmas miracle.
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Merry Christmas, one and all!
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We have paid the tax bill in full and have enough working capital to last until Christmas. Doesn't mean our position financially is still not perilous mind
Was it more than one month's PAYE we owed then? What's the plan for after Christmas then, I assume desperately trying to sell the club?
There has been more than one issue with HMRC. Essentially £50m has been carted in from China so we can pay the bills for the next few months. What the plan is after that I.e. what are we looking to slash the wage bill to or bring in on sales I have no idea. He doesn't appear keen on selling up though.
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I do wonder if the initial shortfall was a deliberate slap to Wyness who had promised him promotion with Bruce and then when we missed out requested more funds. Whatever it was, there appeared to be a massive breakdown in communication between the two.
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John Percy
21 JUNE 2018 • 5:31PM
Aston Villa are set to avoid the threat of another financial crisis after owner Dr Tony Xia assured the Championship club around £5m in funds.
Villa are confident of paying this month’s pay-roll and tax bill on time, as it emerged talks were held this week with the Football League over their future plans.
Shaun Harvey, the EFL’s chief executive, has met with Villa officials and is understood to have received assurances that Xia is working hard to source outside investment and meet the club’s financial obligations.
Xia has been struggling with cash-flow issues in China and was late making a payment to HMRC in May, but has since provided the money to keep the club running for at least another month. It is understood the first round of June’s payments are due on Friday.
Though Villa’s problems are far from over, it suggests Xia remains determined to solve their financial worries and avert the nightmare scenario of administration.
Villa remain under pressure to raise over £40million over the next two transfer windows to comply with Financial Fair Play regulations, with the future of Jack Grealish still uncertain.
Grealish is a target for Tottenham Hotspur, as revealed by Telegraph Sport, and Mauricio Pochettino is set to test Villa’s resolve with an opening offer of £15m.
Chelsea and West Ham are also interested in the England Under-21 international, and it seems inevitable the homegrown attacker will be sold after Villa’s failure to beat Fulham in last month’s play-off final.
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According to The Telegraph today:
Villa are facing another £5million bill in the latest challenge for owner Dr Tony Xia. Villa have this month's pay-roll and tax to fund by the end of June and are under pressure to find the amount having recently settled a dispute with HMRC to avoid the threat of a winding-up order.
It just goes on and on and on.
It's not really a story is it. Breaking news Ads will have to meet a tax liability next Thursday when he's paid!
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According to The Telegraph today:
Villa are facing another £5million bill in the latest challenge for owner Dr Tony Xia. Villa have this month's pay-roll and tax to fund by the end of June and are under pressure to find the amount having recently settled a dispute with HMRC to avoid the threat of a winding-up order.
It just goes on and on and on.
It's not really a story is it. Breaking news Ads will have to meet a tax liability next Thursday when he's paid!
You're being ripped off Ads. The true HMRC deadline is 19 July!
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Every club in the country have bills to pay so a story that Villa can pay them is a bit of a non-story.
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According to The Telegraph today:
Villa are facing another £5million bill in the latest challenge for owner Dr Tony Xia. Villa have this month's pay-roll and tax to fund by the end of June and are under pressure to find the amount having recently settled a dispute with HMRC to avoid the threat of a winding-up order.
It just goes on and on and on.
It's not really a story is it. Breaking news Ads will have to meet a tax liability next Thursday when he's paid!
You're being ripped off Ads. The true HMRC deadline is 19 July!
I can always tell the deadline for that as we get harried about clearing account balances for our bonus!
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In other news I paid my corporation tax yesterday, in full and early I’ll have you know.
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In other news I paid my corporation tax yesterday, in full and early I’ll have you know.
I won second prize in a beauty contest and d collected £25
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I gave Alan Hutton another year’s contract, do you think I’d do that if I had no money ?
Yours,
Dr Tony
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yes but who leveraged the money?
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In other news I paid my corporation tax yesterday, in full and early I’ll have you know.
I won second prize in a beauty contest and d collected £25
You have got enough there for almost a 50% deposit on one of the cheapest roads in London, Whitechapel Road or Old Kent Road.
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Dull isn't it? Nearly three weeks since the play off final and nothing positive to report at all. Hopefully things start to move forward next week with Bruce back at work. At least he might confirm if we have any budget for incoming players, who is leaving etc. Not a single peep from Tony.
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At what point am I going to stop clicking on Evening Mail headlines, finally realising that they never actually report anything that hasn't been reported elsewhere or is just clickbait due to a trivial Instagram update?
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At what point am I going to stop clicking on Evening Mail headlines, finally realising that they never actually report anything that hasn't been reported elsewhere or is just clickbait due to a trivial Instagram update?
I'm considering putting a block against it on my computer. Not to mention the fact have sections advertised for Liverpool and Man united - all for the clicks I know. Pure garbage.
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At what point am I going to stop clicking on Evening Mail headlines, finally realising that they never actually report anything that hasn't been reported elsewhere or is just clickbait due to a trivial Instagram update?
I haven't bothered with the Evening Mail for a few years now except on the odd occasions my parents pass one on to me. When I was a kid I used to wait for it to be delivered so I could read the football pages. Mind you, as a kid I used to read Mr Men books too and I have outgrown them as well.
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And still Xia remains in China with no sign of him returning to sort this mess out or any statement to us mugs as fans. I really feel like returning my ST and getting a refund......
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Because the chairman hasn't released a statement?
The club have said bills are paid. The manager has a contract. There isn't much that could be said that wouldn't be picked apart, questioned and ripped to pieces.
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In other news I paid my corporation tax yesterday, in full and early I’ll have you know.
I won second prize in a beauty contest and d collected £25
I was named Miss Tetra Packaging 1987.
It was a grim year in more ways than one.
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And still Xia remains in China with no sign of him returning to sort this mess out or any statement to us mugs as fans. I really feel like returning my ST and getting a refund......
Really?
After Wembley I initially wanted a statement of reassurance but since the proverbial hit the fan with HMRC you have to assume discussions are ongoing with investors or buyers that are subject to non-disclosure. No point in any statement now until something actually to announce, be it new owners, new cash, administration etc etc
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the meeting with the league would have imposed a date concerning the club being able to provide proof of funds to meet ongoing working capital needs.
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Do we have to give assurances that we can funfill our fixture list this season?
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In other news I paid my corporation tax yesterday, in full and early I’ll have you know.
I won second prize in a beauty contest and d collected £25
It must have been tough coming second to Erdington High Street.
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*whisper* There were only two entries.
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*whisper* There were only two entries.
A very old joke:
A bloke goes into his local to hear that he'd won second prize in the pub raffle. 'Great' he says. 'What is it?' A night in bed with the barmaid he's told. 'Brilliant' says the man, and out of interest what was first prize?' His mate tells him 'five bob!'
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At what point am I going to stop clicking on Evening Mail headlines, finally realising that they never actually report anything that hasn't been reported elsewhere or is just clickbait due to a trivial Instagram update?
I've stopped. I ain't supporting click bait.
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https://twitter.com/thatcherlover/status/1011167226567843840 (https://twitter.com/thatcherlover/status/1011167226567843840)
Suggesting we are selling off future transfer fees
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That's not embarrassing at all. We're effectively going to Cash Convertors and telling all our mates we're skint.
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And telling potential N'Zogbias, Agbonlahors, Richardss, McCormacks and Lescotts to fuck off and find somebody else to rob.
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That's not embarrassing at all. We're effectively going to Cash Convertors and telling all our mates we're skint.
Oh oh but Dr Tony is a gazillionaire!
This humiliation won't end until these fucking clueless chancers move on
Talking of clueless - big up Lerner having us pay for his brainlessness even now that he's gone.
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It's quite an achievement that Lerner may have out-Douged Doug and found an even bigger idiot than himself to sell the club to. Who next, Forrest Gump? Trump? Forrest Trump?
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That's not embarrassing at all. We're effectively going to Cash Convertors and telling all our mates we're skint.
Oh oh but Dr Tony is a gazillionaire!
This humiliation won't end until these fucking clueless chancers move on
Talking of clueless - big up Lerner having us pay for his brainlessness even now that he's gone.
Yup it’s hideous.
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I'm not going to get all hot and bothered about Risso's tweet unless he can back it up with evidence.
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The website is down. This is the beginning of the end....
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The date of the Assignment confirms that the cash flow issue is historic, which supports the suggestion that Xia has had problems getting funds out of China for at least 12 months. It doesn't discredit the idea that the volume of funds are not as large as suggested, but given the amount he has injected suggests there is or has been a large enough well to draw from. The reluctance to sell could be of course holding out for the best price as far as he is concerned.
Its very difficult to draw any conclusions as the information we have is little and less. We know as much now as we did when he bought the club, i.e., not a lot. We know there have been cashflow problems and we've resorted to factoring income which poses several questions; i.e. has this been resolved? If so with what and for how long? Rumours of a £50m loan would be more than enough to cover the injections of cash Xia had been giving.
I wonder if there was a reason an Aussie bank was used beyond rates?
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Caution....This is from The Mirror....
Aston Villa takeover latest: Prospective buyers circle crisis club - but Dr Tony Xia wants to stay
Championship Villa are in the grip of a major crisis after missing out on the Premier League in the play-off final
Prospective buyers continue to eye crisis-hit Aston Villa despite embattled owner Dr Tony Xia insisting he doesn't want to sell.
Championship Villa are in the grip of a major crisis after missing out on the Premier League in the play-off final.
Chairman Xia is trying to remain in charge but has been unable to source substantial cash from his native China since last August.
The club were late paying a tax bill last month and CEO Keith Wyness has left and is suing for constructive dismissal.
Xia is now relying on loans to limp on as he searches for other stakeholders to join but allow him to retain control.
Xia insists he does not want to sell the club (Image: Birmingham Mail)
Villa are in financial despair after the playoff final defeat (Image: Action Images via Reuters)
Yet Mirror Sport understands there are serious buyers interested in owning Villa outright who believe Xia will have to listen if the club is on the brink of going under.
They feel they will get a chance if Xia has no other option but to put the club into administration, which would incur a 12-point penalty.
That was among the advice from Wyness,60, which drew him into conflict with Xia after the devastating play-off loss to Fulham.
Wyness maintains he was fulfilling his obligations to creditors as a director to look at getting money in to avoid being insolvent.
Under the guidance of blue chip advisors, Wyness explored both administration and selling up.
Keith Wyness has departed the club (Image: REUTERS)
But Xia objected and suspended Wyness before he walked away earlier this month and has since started legal proceedings which could cost Villa up to £6million.
Boss Steve Bruce's squad return for pre-season next Wednesday on July 4 before travelling to Portugal on July 5.
Player sales are expected with Tottenham chasing Jack Grealish and James Chester also likely to attract bids.
Xia has previously blamed Villa's “severe” problems on Financial Fair Play rules and claimed he cannot get his cash out of China.
But there are concerns the self-styled tycoon, who has turned up at the training ground in a Uber, simply doesn't have the funds he pledged when he bought out Randy Lerner in 2016.
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That's not embarrassing at all. We're effectively going to Cash Convertors and telling all our mates we're skint.
Oh oh but Dr Tony is a gazillionaire!
This humiliation won't end until these fucking clueless chancers move on
Talking of clueless - big up Lerner having us pay for his brainlessness even now that he's gone.
Remember all those times in the past couple of seasons when we mentioned that all things might not be as we were led to believe about Xia
and we got shouted down every time for shit stirring and doomongering
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We have paid the tax bill in full and have enough working capital to last until Christmas. Doesn't mean our position financially is still not perilous mind
Was it more than one month's PAYE we owed then? What's the plan for after Christmas then, I assume desperately trying to sell the club?
The worry is, what has he done to get the money.
Sold future transfer
Hope it’s not a Glasgow Rangers situation.
Oh dear
This could get ugly
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The website is down. This is the beginning of the end....
Someone twittered recently that this was on the cards.
Surely it’s ‘just’ a maintenance issue?..............surely?
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We have paid the tax bill in full and have enough working capital to last until Christmas. Doesn't mean our position financially is still not perilous mind
Was it more than one month's PAYE we owed then? What's the plan for after Christmas then, I assume desperately trying to sell the club?
The worry is, what has he done to get the money.
Sold future transfer
Hope it’s not a Glasgow Rangers situation.
Oh dear
This could get ugly
Get ugly? Right now it's pretty similar to a 6 pint darling at 11pm in Sam Wellers
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If we had have beaten Fulham, would the financial problems have shown themselves in some guise?
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That Mirror article just regurgitates the same old shit that has been in every other article since the news originally broke.
There is just speculation and nothing particularly scary. The other issue is around this factoring thing, it isn't anything new is it? Isn't it just the old stuff being brought more formally to light?
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That Mirror article just regurgitates the same old shit that has been in every other article since the news originally broke.
There is just speculation and nothing particularly scary. The other issue is around this factoring thing, it isn't anything new is it? Isn't it just the old stuff being brought more formally to light?
if we were on the Titanic you would be the one playing the violin saying 'it's just a drop of water'
i would be the guy dressing up as a woman to get on the lifeboats
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If we had have beaten Fulham, would the financial problems have shown themselves in some guise?
Impossible to tell.
The short term borrowing would eventually be repaid from the PL bonanza maybe there was significant investment lined up for the club and those other projects.
On the other hand perhaps the wreck less approach to the way the club was run continued.
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It’s not what most people recognize as Factoring.
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That Mirror article just regurgitates the same old shit that has been in every other article since the news originally broke.
There is just speculation and nothing particularly scary. The other issue is around this factoring thing, it isn't anything new is it? Isn't it just the old stuff being brought more formally to light?
if we were on the Titanic you would be the one playing the violin saying 'it's just a drop of water'
i would be the guy dressing up as a woman to get on the lifeboats
Any excuse ;)
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That Mirror article just regurgitates the same old shit that has been in every other article since the news originally broke.
There is just speculation and nothing particularly scary. The other issue is around this factoring thing, it isn't anything new is it? Isn't it just the old stuff being brought more formally to light?
if we were on the Titanic you would be the one playing the violin saying 'it's just a drop of water'
i would be the guy dressing up as a woman to get on the lifeboats
I'd be the officer, telling the women and children to stay calm and that we'd get them in a boat.
You'd be the one clambering to the highest point in order to be the last one in the water, then chucking yourself in when it's at it's highest point thus killing yourself with the impact from the fall rather than waiting for it to sink and hoping you'd get picked up.
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That Mirror article just regurgitates the same old shit that has been in every other article since the news originally broke.
There is just speculation and nothing particularly scary. The other issue is around this factoring thing, it isn't anything new is it? Isn't it just the old stuff being brought more formally to light?
if we were on the Titanic you would be the one playing the violin saying 'it's just a drop of water'
i would be the guy dressing up as a woman to get on the lifeboats
Any excuse ;)
only at weekends
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Just get KPMG to look at the books. Hey Presto! We're the richest club in the country.
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I don’t really see how he can hang onto power. If he has no money he’s got nowhere to go but out.
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We will be fine. Most self made billionaires take advances on transfer fees from Australian high interest lenders. It’s completely normal.
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That Mirror article just regurgitates the same old shit that has been in every other article since the news originally broke.
There is just speculation and nothing particularly scary. The other issue is around this factoring thing, it isn't anything new is it? Isn't it just the old stuff being brought more formally to light?
if we were on the Titanic you would be the one playing the violin saying 'it's just a drop of water'
i would be the guy dressing up as a woman to get on the lifeboats
Any excuse ;)
only at weekends
thankyou for making me laugh at this dark time
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There's only one way to save us now.....call International Rescue ( cue Thunderbirds music).
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I'm not sure Fuzzbox can save us.
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I'm not sure Fuzzbox can save us.
Looks a more credible alternative than Tony's approach
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There's only one way to save us now.....call International Rescue ( cue Thunderbirds music).
Perhaps Parker can put Lady Penelope's pink Rolls next to Doug's in the Villa car park then!
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There's only one way to save us now.....call International Rescue ( cue Thunderbirds music).
Only Flash Gordon can save us now.
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There's only one way to save us now.....call International Rescue ( cue Thunderbirds music).
Only Flash Gordon can save us now.
Gordon's alive!!!
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There's only one way to save us now.....call International Rescue ( cue Thunderbirds music).
Only Flash Gordon can save us now.
Gordon's alive!!!
(https://thumb.ibb.co/kw8uS8/5_AA8774_E_D15_C_419_A_9567_D0_C443320_A90.jpg) (https://ibb.co/kw8uS8)
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There's only one way to save us now.....call International Rescue ( cue Thunderbirds music).
Perhaps Parker can put Lady Penelope's pink Rolls next to Doug's in the Villa car park then!
Some twat from marketing will thinks it’s claret and that will be another shit shirt for a season.
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Do we have to give assurances that we can funfill our fixture list this season?
I don’t think we have fun filled our fixtures in years
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We are still massively in the shit, really hope this investor or sale can get sorted before the season starts.
The fact we’ve needed to set up a loan against the £1m Sanchez sale, scheduled for us to receive on July 6th and get the cash early mid June speaks volumes
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Any news from this dickhead today? He's very quiet on twatter all of a sudden.
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We are still massively in the shit, really hope this investor or sale can get sorted before the season starts.
The fact we’ve needed to set up a loan against the £1m Sanchez sale, scheduled for us to receive on July 6th and get the cash early mid June speaks volumes
Is that actually true?
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We are still massively in the shit, really hope this investor or sale can get sorted before the season starts.
The fact we’ve needed to set up a loan against the £1m Sanchez sale, scheduled for us to receive on July 6th and get the cash early mid June speaks volumes
Is that actually true?
Yes, you can see the documents on companies house. We taken out a loan against the £1.7m still owed to us from Fiorentina
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We are still massively in the shit, really hope this investor or sale can get sorted before the season starts.
The fact we’ve needed to set up a loan against the £1m Sanchez sale, scheduled for us to receive on July 6th and get the cash early mid June speaks volumes
Is that actually true?
Yes, you can see the documents on companies house. We taken out a loan against the £1.7m still owed to us from Fiorentina
Referred to in the link I embedded in an earlier post (yesterday). I'm guessing ti help fill the gap when the bills are due at the end of the week.
I just worry this is going to get worse before it gets better.
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I worry that our plight seems to be mirroring political churning. It cannot be coincidence that the Trump provoked trade war with China has resulted in the clamping down of Chinese capital movements. We are as bad scalded as burnt as the old Birmingham saying goes. We either have an owner who has no money or an owner who has money but cannot move it.
If we get out of this without liquidation, administration, relegation or points deduction I will consider it the dodging of at salvo of bullets. Bit like the end of Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid.
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I worry that our plight seems to be mirroring political churning. It cannot be coincidence that the Trump provoked trade war with China has resulted in the clamping down of Chinese capital movements. We are as bad scalded as burnt as the old Birmingham saying goes. We either have an owner who has no money or an owner who has money but cannot move it.
If we get out of this without liquidation, administration, relegation or points deduction I will consider it the dodging of at salvo of bullets. Bit like the end of Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid.
The Chinese capital controls go back a lot further than the Trump issue Brian.
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Yes I realize Trump is blamed for just about everything negative in the world but I honestly think on this occasion he's not guilty.
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I've read and seen many a report that says recently the cash restrictions on getting out of China has become easier not harder!?
To echo Walmley_Villa - i too fear this is going to get uglier before i can become better.
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Surely a ‘so called billionaire’ needing to take a loan (for such a small amount in football terms) against a pending payment is akin to someone ‘normal’ looking down the the back of the settee for quid to buy a pint of milk.
These financial shenanigans really don’t look very good.
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Movement at companies house this morning with shares being issued in Villa and also Recon
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what does that mean in plain English?
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From Carl Palmer who I follow on Twitter... Further development at Companies House for #AVFC - The arrival of £142,061,725 capital has just been notified for Aston Villa Football Club
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I’m re-reading the FT article on Xia from May 2016, questioning his, background, credentials, lies etc. The clues were all there in the article.
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Saying 57 million £1 shares just been made available, which at £120M Valuation of the club is 49% stake of the club....someone investing?
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Hold on...£142 MILLION ??
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Something's afoot.
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From Carl Palmer who I follow on Twitter... Further development at Companies House for #AVFC - The arrival of £142,061,725 capital has just been notified for Aston Villa Football Club
I think they misunderstand what the form explains.
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(https://thumb.ibb.co/nQmNh8/Dgn_Dpo_NX0_AAhsa_C_jpg_large.jpg) (https://ibb.co/nQmNh8)
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Possibly Gar, way above my head.
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From Carl Palmer who I follow on Twitter... Further development at Companies House for #AVFC - The arrival of £142,061,725 capital has just been notified for Aston Villa Football Club
Yes, just read his tweets made today. He also says this:
57 Million Pounds worth of £1 shares just made available in #AVFC ... If @Dr_TonyXia is selling a 49% minority share, then this looks like it's getting closer. All lining up with his estimated valuation of £120M for the club.
Not sure what the £142,061,725 figure is all about though? Perhaps someone more informed and clued up than myself would care to explain what this could mean?
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From Carl Palmer who I follow on Twitter... Further development at Companies House for #AVFC - The arrival of £142,061,725 capital has just been notified for Aston Villa Football Club
Yes, just read his tweets made today. He also says this:
57 Million Pounds worth of £1 shares just made available in #AVFC ... If @Dr_TonyXia is selling a 49% minority share, then this looks like it's getting closer. All lining up with his estimated valuation of £120M for the club.
Not sure what the £142,061,725 figure is all about though? Perhaps someone more informed and clued up than myself would care to explain what this could mean?
Recon UK has issued shares too
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My reading would have been that £142m shares have been issued by Tony. He can then sell a proportion to some mug in the hope that he can keep control and get some cash injected.
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The big question is.....if XX number have shares have been issued, has someone bought them?
Wouldn’t a purchaser be listed on the companies house entry?
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So does this mean any one can buy shares in the club?
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So does this mean any one can buy shares in the club?
As they don’t seem to be publicly listed, no. But if you wrote to the owner and offered to buy a few million I’m sure he’d oblige. Don’t expect a say in the way things are run though.
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Jack posted a picture of himself last night with the label ‘good times’. Does he know something?
#puttingtwoandtwotogetherandcomingupwithamillion
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The total share capital is now £142m.
Increased due to the issuance of 57m more for £1 each.
Identity of the purchaser isn’t disclosed though. Xia could of converted debt to equity which means nothing really in terms of new investment.
If he’s looking to sell shares though it means someone can’t buy the club and run it without his control.
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It was also done on 25th May so isn’t a recent development per se but only being reported now.
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There was a £50m loan due back to the parent company. I wonder if it is swapping debt for equity if it includes that, or if it's a new injection of cash altogether?
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I’m re-reading the FT article on Xia from May 2016, questioning his, background, credentials, lies etc. The clues were all there in the article.
The "Champions League in 5 years" bollocks, or whatever it was, was all I needed to hear to set major alarm bells ringing.
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Whatever the final outcome of all this, Tony Xia should hang his head in shame that an institution like Aston Villa should ever get into the mess that it currently is.
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There was a £50m loan due back to the parent company. I wonder if it is swapping debt for equity if it includes that, or if it's a new injection of cash altogether?
I see it as a conversion given it’s both back dated and not being widely reported that we are more stable financially.
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I’m re-reading the FT article on Xia from May 2016, questioning his, background, credentials, lies etc. The clues were all there in the article.
The "Champions League in 5 years" bollocks, or whatever it was, was all I needed to hear to set major alarm bells ringing.
And that he controlled 5 publicity listed companies. And that he helped build the Bird’s Nest stadium. Both of which claims were shrugged off as “miscommunication”. Or “bullshit” as we like to call it. I wonder what other miscommunications he’s made?
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Unpaid shares showing as 0. Therefore, this is either debt for equity or new funds.
I suspect the former
Link (https://document-api-images-prod.s3.eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/docs/p0KSMx2tsHYJWBTvEcax92XrgiH4hmUFeuH6kXrmChg/application-pdf?X-Amz-Algorithm=AWS4-HMAC-SHA256&X-Amz-Content-Sha256=UNSIGNED-PAYLOAD&X-Amz-Credential=ASIAIGJYJC5YBXCAXZDQ%2F20180626%2Feu-west-1%2Fs3%2Faws4_request&X-Amz-Date=20180626T115718Z&X-Amz-Expires=60&X-Amz-Security-Token=FQoDYXdzEKT%2F%2F%2F%2F%2F%2F%2F%2F%2F%2FwEaDD%2F3fgLfRALRcRCjmSK3A8z1wB25NwS0%2BPWmzO8%2FBKURVrrk%2FCPLTyglHJ1OtARGM3nBO%2BFOSPYdZ6kA35D4HMXu0jO4BFgIn6rfJvOzUlzekOs%2B93KRooON4xTcZvgxPIZ%2B9fyg0B4wpzLGeY8pIGZoiFYOxtL2aZjtvYejwhHIfwjykN%2BC5BSeHqHwExZd%2B%2B7GMY0b2jrBNx45u%2BgI%2BmkDLyXY03uYqycstSML50vuwFh0bEZp2Mr5JDJ3hpS204OlsNJmnoaQgr0mqnGosE9du1l%2BlF4Nsil4gCuC6Tch5ltt989Si8ukNQZqfB8RnjQXMke4bxLBhfbYh1%2FceSLXKPz2LezLrX%2FO7TvNLYozVITawf0yJGyaWXkTSegGUgDZw5BjNWRt1q3LOOBrYEsIogaDqxyxaNb4wE9d2LFETk5ZaXjJJAt7qfuf4UDOWQvmRjSqaguanygscfkwMN1FMNjD8qbB1KsCAGdr0iQ53uQ46XwgyZLPBkjdAHOchiMjR2UV9c1aycoiciHYMXMCy60i1uLw402xWUEwfwKooFglBRjWg9E0tvq3WlplLSRvUcVJ1br4YeiY7Q4wiOPUq3EHU5AojcHI2QU%3D&X-Amz-SignedHeaders=host&X-Amz-Signature=321f19dd8b1d02c1be177d5900ab68928fa609bc703c964f80a2f7f29890ba50)
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Excuse my ignorance but how can you convert debt to equity?
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Excuse my ignorance but how can you convert debt to equity?
Companies are either funded by debt or equity (or a combination of both)
So if you can have a company worth £50 that is backed by 50 shares with a value of £1 each or a loan of £50 from an individual or company to the company of £50.
Given Xia is the owner of the club entirely then it makes little difference whether he funds it entirely with debt to him personally or puts the same money into the club and issues shares that he owns.
Except now he’s looking for investment it would be easier to sell the shares rather than the debt as the owner of the shares and not the debt ultimately decide how the company is run.
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Excuse my ignorance but how can you convert debt to equity?
Wiki
In a debt-for-equity swap, a company's creditors generally agree to cancel some or all of the debt in exchange for equity in the company.
Debt for equity deals often occur when large companies run into serious financial trouble, and often result in these companies being taken over by their principal creditors. This is because both the debt and the remaining assets in these companies are so large that there is no advantage for the creditors to drive the company into bankruptcy. Instead the creditors prefer to take control of the business as a going concern. As a consequence, the original shareholders' stake in the company is generally significantly diluted in these deals and may be entirely eliminated
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Cheers for those explanations.
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A slight problem with the above explanation.
Not all Debt Equity swaps result in the creditors gaining control of the company
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must be the heat because I don't get this - Tone owns the club debt and equity so who are the creditors other than HSBC?
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Can we make this like Janet & John please? Are we looking safe from admin or not?
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Can we make this like Janet & John please? Are we looking safe from admin or not?
Amen brother, the fact that something happened on the 25th May before we failed to reach the land of Milk and Honey leaves me even more confused.
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We don’t know who the real sources of the funds that have leant to and purchased the club.
Because there is no way of establishing sources of capital in relation to Chines Individuals or entities.
These filings as far as I understand represent changes to the share structures only, this may be the precursor to new capital being introduced and or a change in ownership of shares but we don’t know that.
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The most logical conclusion is that the loan owed to one of his companies £50m has been converted to equity. The rest is to create room for new investor(s) who could be anyone knowing this fella it’s probably another one in his great, vast empire.
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A slight problem with the above explanation.
Not all Debt Equity swaps result in the creditors gaining control of the company
Agreed. Given Xia is both equity and debt holder I don’t see there being any change in ownership or control yet.
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I don’t live to far away from Bletchley
I’ll pop up to Bletchley Park and nab the codebreaker might help to sort out Xia’s financial situation
the blokes his own Enigma
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He's his own worst enema.
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It looks like something’s being set up for a change, though the proliferation of various Recon and Aston Villa companies looks a bit smelly. What I think (and who knows) is the parent company in the UK, Recon Group UK Ltd, has issued 69.5m £1 shares, as well as one of the Aston Villa entities creating the aforementioned 142m.
So in short, something is happening, either legit, shady, or just plain obfuscating. Whatever, we hang by a thread I suspect.
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If New owners Investors had been found then of course it would be usual to change the share structure, complete contracts and make an announcement simultaneously.
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TEAMAX made a £60 odd million profit last year which doesn't sound like enough funds for our Tone to go mental with a football club. Enough to be as rich as Woodhall mind.
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TEAMAX made a £60 odd million profit last year which doesn't sound like enough funds for our Tone to go mental with a football club. Enough to be as rich as Woodhall mind.
Though he'll do what he can to limit profits to limit tax.
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Do we have to give assurances that we can funfill our fixture list this season?
I don’t think we have fun filled our fixtures in years
You set em up son an I'll knock em in
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TEAMAX made a £60 odd million profit last year which doesn't sound like enough funds for our Tone to go mental with a football club. Enough to be as rich as Woodhall mind.
He sold Teamax for $430 million before he bought Villa.
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didn't he tweet a picture or something of his paying in slip which showed an HSBC deposit of that sort of money just after buying the club?
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Teamax Smart City (down 45.97% ytd) of which the Doctor is Chairman lists its holders by size and I can't see the Doctor as one of them. There is a holding of 7.31% by a company called Softto, which looks as though it is another name for the Teamax company. This 7.31% holding is worth around £57m.
Lotus Health (-36.93% ytd) of which he is the Non Exec Chairman also doesn't have him listed as a shareholder that i can see.
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Meaning Evil reporting Dr Tony rejected investment from Europe and is in talk with 2 buyers for outright purchase
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https://twitter.com/avfc_news/status/1011882799899529216?s=12
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Let's hope dickhead sells up sharpish.
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Let's hope dickhead sells up sharpish.
This with bells on. Sell up and go ASAP
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Let's hope dickhead sells up sharpish.
Only problem is I don’t think we can trust him to sell to anyone any better
This with bells on. Sell up and go ASAP
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Confused myself there😳
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This will delay all transfers and throw confusion on who is doing the buying.
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This will delay all transfers and throw confusion on who is doing the buying.
I'd have thought that's the least of our worries, finding out how deep the shit is may be further up the list as well as who owes who and how much and by when.
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This will delay all transfers and throw confusion on who is doing the buying.
Better that than administration!
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What buying is that then?
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So he's desperate for money but is rejecting buy-out bids.
Interpreting that for a second it looks more like he's determined to hold on to the club and seek investment (49% or less) rather than sell outright.
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So he's desperate for money but is rejecting buy-out bids.
Interpreting that for a second it looks more like he's determined to hold on to the club and seek investment (49% or less) rather than sell outright.
Or losing control = embarrassment, so sale the only option?
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His reputation is already on it's arse. He just needs to sell up and do one.
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Suppose the good thing about new ownership is we will still be restricted by FFP so any new ownership won't come in and waste 50m straightaway. We will need to develop a long term plan. Whether likes of Steve Round and Bruce are in that plan remains to be seen.
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Suppose the good thing about new ownership is we will still be restricted by FFP so any new ownership won't come in and waste 50m straightaway. We will need to develop a long term plan. Whether likes of Steve Round and Bruce are in that plan remains to be seen.
Aren't new owners given a little bit of slack in terms of FFP?
Plus the Grealish money could possibly be used as a transfer kitty.
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Suppose the good thing about new ownership is we will still be restricted by FFP so any new ownership won't come in and waste 50m straightaway. We will need to develop a long term plan. Whether likes of Steve Round and Bruce are in that plan remains to be seen.
Aren't new owners given a little bit of slack in terms of FFP?
Plus the Grealish money could possibly be used as a transfer kitty.
I don't really know chap but I doubt the 40m we have to make up for overspending last year is going to magically disappear.
We've failed anyway with our short term boom and bust policy so next ownership needs to give funds for promising young players from lower leagues, insist on more under 23 players promoted into 18 and keep a few older heads for experience.
Think that's our best chance of developing more sustainable team not just for this level but the premier league.
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Suppose the good thing about new ownership is we will still be restricted by FFP so any new ownership won't come in and waste 50m straightaway. We will need to develop a long term plan. Whether likes of Steve Round and Bruce are in that plan remains to be seen.
Aren't new owners given a little bit of slack in terms of FFP?
Plus the Grealish money could possibly be used as a transfer kitty.
I don't really know chap but I doubt the 40m we have to make up for overspending last year is going to magically disappear.
We've failed anyway with our short term boom and bust policy so next ownership needs to give funds for promising young players from lower leagues, insist on more under 23 players promoted into 18 and keep a few older heads for experience.
Think that's our best chance of developing more sustainable team not just for this level but the premier league.
Probably not the right thread for this but my argument for keeping Bruce is that we have a good spirit at the club (at team level) If we keep the nucleus of the squad together, I think we should be OK. Central defence is a problem and we need to bring someone in, also possibly an experienced GK. Other than that, I think we're OK with what we have and if and when Grealish goes, we have an ideal opportunity to revert back to 433 which I think works well and suits our players. If I was being greedy, Grabban on loan for another season would be nice, with Albert & Kodjia either side of him.
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Suppose the good thing about new ownership is we will still be restricted by FFP so any new ownership won't come in and waste 50m straightaway. We will need to develop a long term plan. Whether likes of Steve Round and Bruce are in that plan remains to be seen.
Aren't new owners given a little bit of slack in terms of FFP?
Plus the Grealish money could possibly be used as a transfer kitty.
I can't find anything to confirm this. But then it is quite hard to sift through the reams without my eyes glazing over.
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If, and it’s a massive if, he is talking to interested parties, the fact that he appears to have rejected a bid(s) should not be too disheartening.
I would expect he is holding out for the best price he can get, he isn’t going to give it up for cheap.
That said, he hadn’t better scare off potential buyers.
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If this latest bid from a European bidder met his requirements he should have accepted it, not knock it back, the sooner decision are made, the club sold, plans put in place, we can move on make plans for the coming season and hopefully turn around a dreadful summer of negativity, new buyers in place, new manager in place, much needed new players, might keep Jack but even if that wasn't the case, useful money or we could loan him back as part the deal. he should get on with it.
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If this latest bid from a European bidder met his requirements he should have accepted it, not knock it back, the sooner decision are made, the club sold, plans put in place, we can move on make plans for the coming season and hopefully turn around a dreadful summer of negativity, new buyers in place, new manager in place, much needed new players, might keep Jack but even if that wasn't the case, useful money or we could loan him back as part the deal. he should get on with it.
Given that he knocked it back, maybe it didn't meet his requirements?
Also raises an interesting question - do we want him to sell out to the first person to race with the cash around, or to wait till he gets an offer from someone who knows what they're doing?
Do we even have the luxury of time?
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Also raises an interesting question - do we want him to sell out to the first person to race with the cash around, or to wait till he gets an offer from someone who knows what they're doing?
The very last thing we need right now is another clueless owner.
And even if we do get one, we're still hampered by FFP and have bills to pay right ?
They're not going to make everything better and mean we don't need to sell Jack surely ?
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No.
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Fulham got bought out by a proper billionaire but he made it clear they weren’t going to spend their way out of the division. It’s taken them four years but it worked. Their key was holding onto Cairney. I fear for us if we don’t hold onto Grealish.
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If this latest bid from a European bidder met his requirements he should have accepted it, not knock it back, the sooner decision are made, the club sold, plans put in place, we can move on make plans for the coming season and hopefully turn around a dreadful summer of negativity, new buyers in place, new manager in place, much needed new players, might keep Jack but even if that wasn't the case, useful money or we could loan him back as part the deal. he should get on with it.
Given that he knocked it back, maybe it didn't meet his requirements?
Also raises an interesting question - do we want him to sell out to the first person to race with the cash around, or to wait till he gets an offer from someone who knows what they're doing?
Do we even have the luxury of time?
Interesting points, of course that's the risk, he claims other interested parties, he's now considering, 'Do we have the luxury of time' this is the nub of the matter, is it a case of act in haste, repent at our leisure, or should Xia, consider this point in the season and go with the realisation that we need to hit the ground running, get our campaign started, try and get out of the Championship, starting now.
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Fulham got bought out by a proper billionaire but he made it clear they weren’t going to spend their way out of the division. It’s taken them four years but it worked. Their key was holding onto Cairney. I fear for us if we don’t hold onto Grealish.
We won't hold onto Grealish mate. We have to re-think how we set up in his absence. I believe that is 433.
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I don't really think Xia gives a toss who he sells too as long as they have the money and he can control the club (i.e. 51%).
That is the crux of the matter.
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...and that’s about as likely to happen as Jacob Rees-Moggs vision of a successful Hard Brexit
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I should say he's just trying to get the best deal if there are several interested parties. I would hope that new owners would mean selling Grealish to balance the books and then raising more money from other sales for new players, Hogan and Lansbury immediately spring to mind.
Maybe next summer there would be a bit more to spend.
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Fulham got bought out by a proper billionaire but he made it clear they weren’t going to spend their way out of the division. It’s taken them four years but it worked. Their key was holding onto Cairney. I fear for us if we don’t hold onto Grealish.
We won't hold onto Grealish mate. We have to re-think how we set up in his absence. I believe that is 433.
I think I've said this before, but surely the only way a new owner is going to make any money out of this deal is if they get us promoted, and the sooner the better. With that in mind, surely our best hope is to keep Jack (assuming he'll give us another year), and build a young team around him. I wouldn't have thought any business will be conducted before a sale goes through, so that buys us(/Steve Round) a bit of time to come up with a proper plan for next season. A system, a style, a plan. And a plan b for if things aren't working.
This could be a massive opportunity to start getting things right. I really hope we take this one.
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So is there any hard evidence that he is in discussions and why would you start messing around with the share structures if you were negotiating a sale.
None of this makes sense.
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How is it even possible we've ended up with an even more clueless charlatan than Lerner? I have absolute zero confidence in Xia making the right choices for the good of Aston Villa in the short, medium or long term, what a fine mess you've gotten us into Tony.
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Didn’t Lerner wax lyrical about him when he sold up.
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Didn’t Lerner wax lyrical about him when he sold up.
So long and the giant man baby got whatever money he wanted I think he’d have said anything.
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Aston Villa sale to Tony Xia is Randy Lerner's last chance to save risible legacy
Aston Villa sale to Tony Xia is Randy Lerner's last chance to save risible legacy
Lerner has finally sold Aston Villa Credit: PA
It was with a final message on Aston Villa’s website that Randy Lerner’s ownership of the club ended this week, a quirky farewell which read, it should be said, like a valedictory email from a colourful colleague leaving under a cloud, cc’d to all at an unusually late hour.
“In being sadly more than tone deaf,” Lerner wrote, “I'll not weakly risk trying to sound any positive notes.” And commendable though it is that the Holte Pub has been restored on his watch as a club banqueting suite, him listing it among his achievements only conspired to make the legacy sound that bit more risible.
Aston Villa supporters are seen on the stand prior to the Barclays Premier League match between Aston Villa and Newcastle United at Villa Park
It has been an unhappy season at Villa Park Credit: GETTY IMAGES
The fact that fans can choose from a range of beers in a relaxing environment while marvelling at the Holte’s three stylish function suites might soften the blow for some, but on the whole one suspects their preoccupation will be this: Aston Villa are in the Championship.
Yet every owner, no matter how unpopular, has one final task before they do what the banners and the phone-ins demand - that is to ensure their successor is not likely to make an even worse job of it. One wonders, for instance how often each day David Moores reflects on selling Liverpool in 2007 to Tom Hicks and George Gillett.
Club statement: Sale confirmed. The very latest news: http://bit.ly/22gi9Zj #AVFC
— Aston Villa FC (@AVFCOfficial) 6:33 PM - May 18, 2016
Although the track record of those two is far removed from their compatriot Stan Kroenke, the former Arsenal shareholder Nina Bracewell-Smith has expressed regrets at selling to the American. Likewise, what to make of Terry Brown’s sale of West Ham to the Icelandics who almost bankrupted the club?
Lerner has selected the Chinese businessman Dr Tony Xia, described by the American as “hugely successful” as well as “passionate about architecture, site design and planning”. Indeed, there was considerably more in Lerner’s farewell about the new owner redeveloping Villa Park than there was about him redeveloping the team’s defence, midfield and attack.
Yet, the latest disclosure that the Premier League and Football League both have serious doubts about Xia’s suitability suggest that whatever mistakes Lerner has made at Villa up until now, he cannot afford for his last to be his greatest.
The little known Chinese businessman Recon Group CEO Xia Jiantong during an interview about buying the British soccer club Aston Villa,
Xia has bought Aston Villa Credit: AP
The first Chinese takeover of a significant British football club has been long-anticipated, and regarded as a potential game-changer even in these days of fossil-fuel billionaire owners. Xia might yet turn out to be a shrewd and resourceful owner of Villa in the mould of Leicester City’s Thai Srivaddhanaprabha family, but at first glance he is not nearly so wealthy.
The Sunday Telegraph’s Beijing correspondent Neil Connor has discovered that the biggest company in Xia’s Recon Group empire appears to be Shanghai-based Lotus Health Group, which made a net loss in of 508.5 million yuan [£53.3 million] on revenues of 1.7 billion yuan [£180 million] last year. That is compared with a net profit of 23.9 million yuan [£2.5 million] the previous year.
Xia bought the company in March last year, and in December there was surprise in the Chinese business community when it emerged the cousin of President Xi Jinping had been elected to its board of governors. The decision to elect Xi Yinping was reversed a day later.
Villa Park
Villa hope to make a swift return to the Premier League Credit: PA
The new Villa owner also has further investment aside from Lotus, a food additive company. His Recon Group also has interests in small loans, IT and urban design. He studied design and landscape architecture at Harvard. Historically he has claimed on Weibo, the Chinese Twitter equivalent, that he is a Villa fan – one stunt Lerner conspicuously avoided when he arrived ten years ago.
Yet in the Chinese equivalent of the Forbes rich list – the Hurun List – Xia is nowhere to be seen. In a country where plenty claim to be billionaires, and there is even less transparency about personal wealth, that is nevertheless confusing given the bold promises made this week that Xia will turn Villa into one of the world’s best known clubs in less than ten years.
My colleague Connor did ask Xia’s alma mater Harvard for the new Villa owner’s academic record but he appears to have opted to block all public access to it. Either way, the evidence suggests Xia is not currently at the level where he has limitless funds capable of solving any problem.
If Xia cannot change Villa by sheer virtue of his wealth, and that would be hard to do overnight given the Football League’s financial fair play rules, then it will be intriguing to see his strategy. Traditionally the major Chinese investors have not sought to buy European clubs, on the basis that making profit from the game is so difficult with wages spiraling ever upwards.
Investment in Chinese football has attracted some big names Credit: AFP
At the behest of President Xi, who has made football a part of state policy, major business figures have got involved. Jack Ma, billionaire founder of the internet Alibaba Group, has pumped money into the Chinese Super League club Guangzhou Evergrande, current holders of the Asian Champions League, but he has resisted making a big investment in Europe.
Wang Jianlin, one of the country’s richest men, bought 20 per cent of Atletico Madrid for £34 million last season, which would have barely caused a ripple on the surface of his resources. The CMC Chinese consortium that bought a 13 per cent stake for £265 million in the City Football Group who own Manchester City, were brought in primarily by Sheikh Mansour’s executives to give City a way into the Chinese media market.
In all instances investment has been regarded in China as fulfilling the wishes of President Xi and forging bonds with clubs that will allow top Chinese players a chance to develop in an elite environment and eventually benefit the woefully underachieving national team. As for Xia, he is not nearly as wealthy as the aforementioned, but the first to put himself directly in the firing line.
The bad old days of the last five years at Villa will eventually fade, but if Lerner sells to the wrong man, he may find himself in the unhappy position of being caught unwittingly in a whole fresh era of pain.
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"The bad old days of the last five years at Villa will eventually fade, but if Lerner sells to the wrong man, he may find himself in the unhappy position of being caught unwittingly in a whole fresh era of pain."
Good Lord. How prescient is that.
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spooky perspicacity
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I see Tony has just tweeted something I dont do twatter
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Took lots of time to rethink about what we did, right or wrong things. Didn’t read any news about us which surely were with many rumors. I will keep doing my best to support our beloved AV. Keep stronger! #UTV
tony Xia's latest tweet
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Incoherent nonsense.
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Took lots of time to rethink about what we did, right or wrong things. Didn’t read any news about us which surely were with many rumors. I will keep doing my best to support our beloved AV. Keep stronger! #UTV
tony Xia's latest tweet
I preferred the emoji thing myself.
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You’d think a man of his means in his position he’d have someone write something insightful and meaningful instead of more absolute guff.
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Took lots of time to rethink about what we did, right or wrong things. Didn’t read any news about us which surely were with many rumors. I will keep doing my best to support our beloved AV. Keep stronger! #UTV
tony Xia's latest tweet
So basically he’s trying to figure out how he cocked up, refuses to listen to press speculation, and tells us the fans he’s sorting it all out. Sounds excellent 😳
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You’d think a man of his means in his position he’d have someone write something insightful and meaningful instead of more absolute guff.
Indeed, a billionaire who doesn't think it's worth employing someone to knock this shit up into something resembling a coherent statement before splurging it out.
And that's not racist before anyone dives in, because Randy Lerner, whose first language one presumes is English, had a similar problem.
Although at least he was verifiably rich.
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What he means in emojis.
💳 maxxed 💰 spent and I haven’t got a 🏺 to take a piss in.
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Worryingly it doesn’t tell me he’s off anytime soon.
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You’d think a man of his means in his position he’d have someone write something insightful and meaningful instead of more absolute guff.
Indeed, a billionaire who doesn't think it's worth employing someone to knock this shit up into something resembling a coherent statement before splurging it out.
And that's not racist before anyone dives in, because Randy Lerner, whose first language one presumes is English, had a similar problem.
Although at least he was verifiably rich.
It's all a bit, well, Donald Trump.
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He is better off posting nothing, rather than something that says nothing.
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Perhaps the Mail could actually do a proper job and get in touch with him to ask him for some proper news. I see the Mirror have posted the same stuff as last week about transfers being on hold. You would like to think that some journalist might want to do a proper job and ask some questions of him, now he’s got pissed, had a good old think, sobered up and bothered to tweet the world again. Yet again, more unfathomable shit.
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Took lots of time to rethink about what we did, right or wrong things. Didn’t read any news about us which surely were with many rumors. I will keep doing my best to support our beloved AV. Keep stronger! #UTV
tony Xia's latest tweet
I preferred the emoji thing myself.
They made more sense!
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Is it even worth reporters contacting him though as he will more than likely lie and spin more walter mitty bollocks about being insanely rich and rebuilding a run down area in to a smart city hub, whilst selling off next seasons season ticket money to pay the water bill.
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It's not unfathomable in the slightest.
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It's not unfathomable in the slightest.
Just not very good England
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Fulham got bought out by a proper billionaire but he made it clear they weren’t going to spend their way out of the division. It’s taken them four years but it worked. Their key was holding onto Cairney. I fear for us if we don’t hold onto Grealish.
The key was selling a past it McCormack to us.
They've done it the way I want us to do it. Promoted youngsters to the squad like Sessegnon, signed good value players from other championship clubs Cairney (Blackburn) McDonald (Wolves) and used the loan market very well as doubt they'd have made it without Mitrovic's goals.
They now have a team good enough to stay in premier league.
With the next ownership we have to go down the sustainable route.
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Fulham got bought out by a proper billionaire but he made it clear they weren’t going to spend their way out of the division. It’s taken them four years but it worked. Their key was holding onto Cairney. I fear for us if we don’t hold onto Grealish.
The key was selling a past it McCormack to us.
They've done it the way I want us to do it. Promoted youngsters to the squad like Sessegnon, signed good value players from other championship clubs Cairney (Blackburn) McDonald (Wolves) and used the loan market very well as doubt they'd have made it without Mitrovic's goals.
They now have a team good enough to stay in premier league.
With the next ownership we have to go down the sustainable route.
Which brings us neatly back to the question of Steve Bruce. Is he capable of doing what Jokanovic achieved at Fulham? Personally I think the answer is no.
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It's not unfathomable in the slightest.
Just not very good England
No it's not the best, but it's perfectly understandable.
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I kinda want him to turn this around. His Witton regeneration plans and all that jazz which made Brucey swoon, which other owner will try something like that?
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I kinda want him to turn this around. His Witton regeneration plans and all that jazz which made Brucey swoon, which other owner will try something like that?
One that actually plans to do it?
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What an utter load of cobblers and I guess he’ll be moving into one of the Witton affordable new builds with wife ‘Sally’.
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I wonder what sort of reception he'll get if he rocks up at VP early season? It would certainly require a big pair of balls
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You’d think a man of his means in his position he’d have someone write something insightful and meaningful instead of more absolute guff.
Indeed, a billionaire who doesn't think it's worth employing someone to knock this shit up into something resembling a coherent statement before splurging it out.
And that's not racist before anyone dives in, because Randy Lerner, whose first language one presumes is English, had a similar problem.
Oh you’re alright with that like, ‘cause it’s a race of people, and it’s a food.
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It's not unfathomable in the slightest.
Just not very good England
No it's not the best, but it's perfectly understandable.
I guess there's no room for a bit of humour in these dark days
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My mind auto corrected that. Didn't notice, but good effort.
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I know fuck all about business, so apologies for missing something but which person with half a brain and a load of money would pump it into us, whilst Xia is in charge? You’d be be better off going all KLF and burning it.
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What a load of bollocks that statement was! Crap grammar and spelling that basically said nothing!
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Ads fully understood it. Hopefully he can translate it from complete bollocks to something that resembles a plan.
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Then it wasn't unfathomable. I'm not sure why there was a parade of people suggesting it was.
I've done a bit of soul searching about how and why we failed.
I've ignored the press, no doubt full of rumour.
I'm going to do my best.
Yes, it doesn't really say a lot, but then it's Twitter which is glib in any event. There's just enough space for people to be vile and not a lot else.
The Quest for the True Statement is this forums' McGuffin.
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I wonder what sort of reception he'll get if he rocks up at VP early season? It would certainly require a big pair of balls
Not a chance, we’ve seen the last of this charlatan.
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Fulham got bought out by a proper billionaire but he made it clear they weren’t going to spend their way out of the division. It’s taken them four years but it worked. Their key was holding onto Cairney. I fear for us if we don’t hold onto Grealish.
The key was selling a past it McCormack to us.
They've done it the way I want us to do it. Promoted youngsters to the squad like Sessegnon, signed good value players from other championship clubs Cairney (Blackburn) McDonald (Wolves) and used the loan market very well as doubt they'd have made it without Mitrovic's goals.
They now have a team good enough to stay in premier league.
With the next ownership we have to go down the sustainable route.
Which brings us neatly back to the question of Steve Bruce. Is he capable of doing what Jokanovic achieved at Fulham? Personally I think the answer is no.
Agreed, that scenario is beyond Bruce's imagination
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I think one word sums up the situaiton perfectly "Help"!
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"I need somebody. Anybody."
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I wonder what sort of reception he'll get if he rocks up at VP early season? It would certainly require a big pair of balls
Not a chance, we’ve seen the last of this charlatan.
Does this mean we wont be doing "Sitting With Xia" next season?
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I wonder what sort of reception he'll get if he rocks up at VP early season? It would certainly require a big pair of balls
Not a chance, we’ve seen the last of this charlatan.
Does this mean we wont be doing "Sitting With Xia" next season?
Change of format coming up, 'Counting with Xia' or 'Stringing people along with Xia' or my personal favourite 'Fiscal fuck ups with Xia'
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The most worrying issue for me isn't about him trying to sell up, it's the thought of him selling the club to someone even worse. He'll want as much of his money back as possible and let's be honest the decision making he has made has put the club on it's arse. Why will he suddenly be able to make good decisions. Worrying times, as anyone with any kind of business interest will aim to buy the club at a later date when the club is neck deep in the crap rather than now where it's merely waist high in crap.
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The most worrying issue for me isn't about him trying to sell up, it's the thought of him selling the club to someone even worse. He'll want as much of his money back as possible and let's be honest the decision making he has made has put the club on it's arse. Why will he suddenly be able to make good decisions. Worrying times, as anyone with any kind of business interest will aim to buy the club at a later date when the club is neck deep in the crap rather than now where it's merely waist high in crap.
Why make that assumption? A decent owner, with a good manager, could have us back in the prem in 2-3 years. We'll almost certainly have to take a hit this year and let a few of the more valuable players go to 'fix' our FFP status but if we take that as an opportunity to do a proper 'root and branch' fix I can see us being in a much stronger position next summer.
If you wait for us to be in administration (or at least days from it) with players already sold and things falling apart around us it could take years to get that cleanup work completed and get us in a position to start looking up rather than down.
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There is the old saying about a fool and his money being soon parted. I hope we don't get a hat trick of fools.
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I wonder what sort of reception he'll get if he rocks up at VP early season? It would certainly require a big pair of balls
Not a chance, we’ve seen the last of this charlatan.
Does this mean we wont be doing "Sitting With Xia" next season?
Change of format coming up, 'Counting with Xia' or 'Stringing people along with Xia' or my personal favourite 'Fiscal fuck ups with Xia'
Shitting It with Xia.
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Invest with Xia. For £40m you get to sit next to the Chinese billionaire but you will have no overall control of the seat and could be removed from your seat at half time.
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Depends if the investor has a spot on the board and what the quorum is at any given meeting as to how much control over the business they have.
If you've got 40m worth of shares then, you will certainly have enough to stop Xia extordinary resolutions when it comes to shareholder votes.
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Invest with Xia. For £40m you get to sit next to the Chinese billionaire but you will have no overall control of the seat and could be removed from your seat at half time.
An offer you can refuse.
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The most worrying issue for me isn't about him trying to sell up, it's the thought of him selling the club to someone even worse. He'll want as much of his money back as possible and let's be honest the decision making he has made has put the club on it's arse. Why will he suddenly be able to make good decisions. Worrying times, as anyone with any kind of business interest will aim to buy the club at a later date when the club is neck deep in the crap rather than now where it's merely waist high in crap.
Surely not. Buy the club now and it's still rescuable. Wait until it's completely submerged in crap and it'll cost a hell of a lot more to winch it out, hose it down and get it smelling nice again.
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For Dr Tone:
Or else:
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I note with interest that Wanda - who are advertising incessantly on the electronic hoardings at every World Cup game don’t appear to be having many difficulties shifting their capital out of China.
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Sold their stake in Atletico for that very reason to an Israeli.
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Chill out Ads was only a pretend conspiracy theory.
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Is it still the Wanda Metropolitano?
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Who IN their right mind would pay 40million without taking a controlling interest?
If it did happen it would be a “ related party transaction”.
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XIA GONE FROM VP !
The man is a fraud.
The man has lost face in the UK, and more importantly in China.
His Fall-from-Grace can affect his struggling Companies, because no investor wants to support an apparent LOSER.
Lotus has nose-dived.... Recon is subject to SE investigation now....there is a Time-Limit on delaying posting RESULTS and Xia has pushed it too far with RECON.
He will not show his face at VP ... EVER AGAIN.
Basically because he is a COWARD.... imo
A Con-Man and a Gambler, whose ego outweighed his actual skill.
A One-Man-Band of self hype who presumably believed his hype because he was in an environment where sudden Entrepreneurs were treated as 'Gods' ... from a Culture that never knew nor experienced Lies and Deceit for Personal Gain.
Xia is a Coward, and will not show his face at VP. . . . EVER AGAIN .... Our reaction would crucify him. Especially in China.
HE IS GONE
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Bit early to be on the gin?
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I was hoping Alf's predilection for capitals and bold type might have ended.
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The louder you shout, the less you get heard?
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I think people lose sight of how much money the owner has put into the club. As it has turned out, it has firstly not been enough and secondly not been used wisely.
It would appear that he has put in somewhere between £100m and £150m, it could be more. This is not the same as a guy trying to impress a woman by pretending to be somebody else to get her into bed on a Saturday night.
I am not saying he has not pulled the wool over our eyes with his supposed wealth and he has not turned out to be what most thought but it is still a sizeable amount of money that he has acquired somehow. Through his inexperience he may well lose the lot. His motives for buying the club are still unclear to me but I do not believe it was to make money in the short term as nobody makes money in football quickly, if at all. If we had been promoted, the value of the club may have gone up to £125m. Still less than his investment.
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I think people lose sight of how much money the owner has put into the club. As it has turned out, it has firstly not been enough and secondly not been used wisely.
It would appear that he has put in somewhere between £100m and £150m, it could be more. This is not the same as a guy trying to impress a woman by pretending to be somebody else to get her into bed on a Saturday night.
I am not saying he has not pulled the wool over our eyes with his supposed wealth and he has not turned out to be what most thought but it is still a sizeable amount of money that he has acquired somehow. Through his inexperience he may well lose the lot. His motives for buying the club are still unclear to me but I do not believe it was to make money in the short term as nobody makes money in football quickly, if at all. If we had been promoted, the value of the club may have gone up to £125m. Still less than his investment.
Pretty clear now that his resources could stretch as far as two shots at getting into the Premier League and that was about it. The fact that he has spent the kind of sums mentioned above and we rarely threatened to go up automatically just goes to show how wasteful the club have been since we came down.
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XIA GONE FROM VP !
The man is a fraud.
The man has lost face in the UK, and more importantly in China.
His Fall-from-Grace can affect his struggling Companies, because no investor wants to support an apparent LOSER.
Lotus has nose-dived.... Recon is subject to SE investigation now....there is a Time-Limit on delaying posting RESULTS and Xia has pushed it too far with RECON.
He will not show his face at VP ... EVER AGAIN.
Basically because he is a COWARD.... imo
A Con-Man and a Gambler, whose ego outweighed his actual skill.
A One-Man-Band of self hype who presumably believed his hype because he was in an environment where sudden Entrepreneurs were treated as 'Gods' ... from a Culture that never knew nor experienced Lies and Deceit for Personal Gain.
Xia is a Coward, and will not show his face at VP. . . . EVER AGAIN .... Our reaction would crucify him. Especially in China.
HE IS GONE
Reads like 'satire' from an issue of H&V.
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NO! I DO'nt Do SAtirE ME
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I think people lose sight of how much money the owner has put into the club. As it has turned out, it has firstly not been enough and secondly not been used wisely.
Talking of this.
Taking into account all the clubs income since he took over, and ins and outs player wise what has he actually PUT IN himself and not just as a loan which he wants back ?
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I think people lose sight of how much money the owner has put into the club. As it has turned out, it has firstly not been enough and secondly not been used wisely.
Talking of this.
Taking into account all the clubs income since he took over, and ins and outs player wise what has he actually PUT IN himself and not just as a loan which he wants back ?
Purchase cost and the first year running costs (talked about as being about £50m from memory).
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I note with interest that Wanda - who are advertising incessantly on the electronic hoardings at every World Cup game don’t appear to be having many difficulties shifting their capital out of China.
'Wanda' sounds a bit fishy to me.
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I note with interest that Wanda - who are advertising incessantly on the electronic hoardings at every World Cup game don’t appear to be having many difficulties shifting their capital out of China.
'Wanda' sounds a bit fishy to me.
Baddumtish!
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I note with interest that Wanda - who are advertising incessantly on the electronic hoardings at every World Cup game don’t appear to be having many difficulties shifting their capital out of China.
'Wanda' sounds a bit fishy to me.
Like it Damo.
Wanda are absolutely massive - one of the biggest names in China
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I read alfititmus posts in the style of Mark E Smith (RIP’uh).
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The Mirror....again.
Aston Villa financial crisis so bad Steve Bruce told they cannot even afford FREE transfers
Dr Tony Xia is trying to find new investment or a new owner for Villa after they failed to return to the Premier League
19:31, 29 JUN 2018Updated19:36, 29 JUN 2018
Steve Bruce has been told Aston Villa can’t even afford free transfers while they are in financial crisis.
Embattled Chinese owner Dr Tony Xia is trying to find new investment or a new owner for Championship Villa after their play-off final loss.
It means boss Bruce is still yet to get any spending on new players signed off this summer.
He has identified free agent Robert Huth, available after leaving Leicester, to replace John Terry.
Bruce is struggling to recruit players this summer (Image: Getty)
Huth is one of the players targeted on a free transfer (Image: REUTERS)
Villa are resigned to losing Grealish this summer (Image: Action Images via Reuters)
Read More
Transfer latest
Transfer news LIVE
Arsenal 'hold Banega talks'
United vs City for Boateng?
But Villa officials cannot currently finalise the contract leaving Bruce with major woes ahead of the club’s return to pre-season training next week.
The club are resigned to selling Jack Grealish with Spurs keen on the midfielder but Tottenham chairman Daniel Levy is being patient to drive down the price.
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Was this not the paper who was reporting Bruce to be pleasantly surprised?
There's so much speculative bollocks at the moment. The Levy-ism in full affect. Those Jews ah? Mirror scrotes.
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The most concerning thing about that article is being interested in Huth.
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The most concerning thing about that article is being interested in Huth.
If it's true, it seems Bruce has learned fucking nothing.
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Was this not the paper who was reporting Bruce to be pleasantly surprised?
There's so much speculative bollocks at the moment. The Levy-ism in full affect. Those Jews ah? Mirror scrotes.
You think there is a Jewish effort to get Grealish to Spurs on the cheap?
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if that was some sort of implied antisemitism Ads can you stop it immediately please
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Ad's post to me was just sarcastic if anything.
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I just put that headline down as the most shit stirring, shit for brains headline i've seen so far in this whole sorry saga. Whoever put that up is a proper c*** in my book. The truth is either that we're not concluding the business because the club is in the process of being sold or we are not concluding it because we need to offload first to balance the wage books, but in itself to not afford something that is free is a contradiction. I suppose it sounds good to the hoards of shit for brains Small Heath, Dog Heads and Olbyiun though.
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They aren't free as you pay a signing on fee and wages. Huth for 2 years as an example, would most likely be £2-3m, not much in football terms, but a fair chunk for a second division club with little spare cash. Doesn't mean the headline is true mind.
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(https://scontent-lht6-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/36420391_1952799688083888_1066147866554138624_n.jpg?_nc_cat=0&oh=6327c7a30fb2601007c09685ba05c4c9&oe=5BAB6899)
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An 'executive board' addressing a letter as 'Dear Tony'. It's all a bit informal.
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(https://scontent-lht6-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/36420391_1952799688083888_1066147866554138624_n.jpg?_nc_cat=0&oh=6327c7a30fb2601007c09685ba05c4c9&oe=5BAB6899)
Rightly so, good questions.
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An 'executive board' addressing a letter as 'Dear Tony'. It's all a bit informal.
That jumped out to me.
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They aren't free as you pay a signing on fee and wages. Huth for 2 years as an example, would most likely be £2-3m, not much in football terms, but a fair chunk for a second division club with little spare cash. Doesn't mean the headline is true mind.
Huth - who did he actually play last season for Leicester as he was always injured?
would be a typical Bruce signing and not what we need .. have we not learned ?
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No one foresaw it? Plenty on here did. I could quote loads of example from different folks in addition to this 11 months ago.
Well there's only 3 new players, plus every side has new players to bed in. I've said I think we'll struggle to be promoted but we really do need to go up this season. Parachute money is peanuts next year, I think we're in deep shit if we are stuck in this division for another year.
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An 'executive board' addressing a letter as 'Dear Tony'. It's all a bit informal.
I like the way they’ve left the green underlining on for grammar errors. Classy.
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No one foresaw it? Plenty on here did. I could quote loads of example from different folks in addition to this 11 months ago.
Well there's only 3 new players, plus every side has new players to bed in. I've said I think we'll struggle to be promoted but we really do need to go up this season. Parachute money is peanuts next year, I think we're in deep shit if we are stuck in this division for another year.
You're right plenty, including myself, thought we'd struggle if we didn't get promoted due to reduced parachute money.
I think, if we're honest, the 'Deep shit' would have been having to cut back slightly, offloading aging players and not being able to just buy who we wanted to, but, I doubt very much anyone foresaw the magnitude of financial trouble we'd gotten ourselves into.
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Sorry Nigel disagree. Plenty of us suspected that we were seriously overstretched financially.
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An 'executive board' addressing a letter as 'Dear Tony'. It's all a bit informal.
That jumped out to me.
Yes "Tone Mate" would have been more suitable.
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Was this not the paper who was reporting Bruce to be pleasantly surprised?
There's so much speculative bollocks at the moment. The Levy-ism in full affect. Those Jews ah? Mirror scrotes.
You think there is a Jewish effort to get Grealish to Spurs on the cheap?
No, I'm suggesting the Mirror is using Jewish stereotypes. Why is it only Levy, a Jew, is seen as some arch negotiator or tight when Spurs waste as much money as their contempories.
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It was such a big gamble.
I don't think anyone envisaged we'd be struggling to pay tax bills though, more just having to sell a few players.
All feels up in the air. Are the players back for pre season next week? Will surely be some more clarity on the situation if only because SB will have to answer some questions on the state of play at the club.
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It was such a big gamble.
I don't think anyone envisaged we'd be struggling to pay tax bills though, more just having to sell a few players.
All feels up in the air. Are the players back for pre season next week? Will surely be some more clarity on the situation if only because SB will have to answer some questions on the state of play at the club.
I think they are back in next week and fly out to Portugal to a training camp.
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Nope, deep shit meant deep shit. Although even then I didn't envisage it being so bad we'd be doing things like taking reduced transfer fee payments.
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deleted because I can't be arsed getting drawn into a row ;)
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It was such a big gamble.
I don't think anyone envisaged we'd be struggling to pay tax bills though, more just having to sell a few players.
All feels up in the air. Are the players back for pre season next week? Will surely be some more clarity on the situation if only because SB will have to answer some questions on the state of play at the club.
I think they are back in next week and fly out to Portugal to a training camp.
Easyjet, Flybe or Ryanair?
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An 'executive board' addressing a letter as 'Dear Tony'. It's all a bit informal.
That jumped out to me.
Yes "Tone Mate" would have been more suitable.
Or 'Dear Fascist Bully Boy' and ended with 'Boomshanka'.
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Was this not the paper who was reporting Bruce to be pleasantly surprised?
There's so much speculative bollocks at the moment. The Levy-ism in full affect. Those Jews ah? Mirror scrotes.
You think there is a Jewish effort to get Grealish to Spurs on the cheap?
No, I'm suggesting the Mirror is using Jewish stereotypes. Why is it only Levy, a Jew, is seen as some arch negotiator or tight when Spurs waste as much money as their contempories.
I've mentioned this before, and what you say rings true to me.
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The owners right hand man Rongtan is at it with the cryptic messages now.
"At the stage of work stress, I really want to do good and good.
"Since I didn't plan to come to this city to study and work life five years ago, even if I lost everything I got in the future, I will miss it." #stayhungry #cityview # Fridayvibes
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That is not cryptic. That is gibberish.
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The tweet was written in Chinese which is maybe why it does not come across very well perhaps
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It was such a big gamble.
I don't think anyone envisaged we'd be struggling to pay tax bills though, more just having to sell a few players.
All feels up in the air. Are the players back for pre season next week? Will surely be some more clarity on the situation if only because SB will have to answer some questions on the state of play at the club.
I think they are back in next week and fly out to Portugal to a training camp.
How are they going to pay for that?
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It was such a big gamble.
I don't think anyone envisaged we'd be struggling to pay tax bills though, more just having to sell a few players.
All feels up in the air. Are the players back for pre season next week? Will surely be some more clarity on the situation if only because SB will have to answer some questions on the state of play at the club.
I think they are back in next week and fly out to Portugal to a training camp.
How are they going to pay for that?
Air miles
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From all our European exploits over the past few seasons...?
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No one foresaw it? Plenty on here did. I could quote loads of example from different folks in addition to this 11 months ago.
Well there's only 3 new players, plus every side has new players to bed in. I've said I think we'll struggle to be promoted but we really do need to go up this season. Parachute money is peanuts next year, I think we're in deep shit if we are stuck in this division for another year.
You're right plenty, including myself, thought we'd struggle if we didn't get promoted due to reduced parachute money.
I think, if we're honest, the 'Deep shit' would have been having to cut back slightly, offloading aging players and not being able to just buy who we wanted to, but, I doubt very much anyone foresaw the magnitude of financial trouble we'd gotten ourselves into.
I pretty much agree.
I suspected it'd mean selling Grealish and working on the wage bill.
Failing to meet the monthly PAYE bill and actual discussion of administration as a possibility is not what I foresaw, this is a whole different level of shit.
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It was such a big gamble.
I don't think anyone envisaged we'd be struggling to pay tax bills though, more just having to sell a few players.
All feels up in the air. Are the players back for pre season next week? Will surely be some more clarity on the situation if only because SB will have to answer some questions on the state of play at the club.
I think they are back in next week and fly out to Portugal to a training camp.
How are they going to pay for that?
Air miles
Tone has been busy claiming flight delayed vouchers from Air China redeemable at EasyJet.
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I suspect Ho is trying to be cheerful and all fighty. Sadly, I think it gets lost in translation and comes out as yet more drudge that we just cannot understand. Still No meaningful statement from the club four weeks on from the play off final. Shameful management and I include Bruce in this too as he must be back at the range by now.
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Takes me me back to the Lerner "Not in front of the children" communication policy.
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Bruce will be ready with a fist bigger than his fist face full of excuses dont you worry.
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No one foresaw it? Plenty on here did. I could quote loads of example from different folks in addition to this 11 months ago.
Well there's only 3 new players, plus every side has new players to bed in. I've said I think we'll struggle to be promoted but we really do need to go up this season. Parachute money is peanuts next year, I think we're in deep shit if we are stuck in this division for another year.
You're right plenty, including myself, thought we'd struggle if we didn't get promoted due to reduced parachute money.
I think, if we're honest, the 'Deep shit' would have been having to cut back slightly, offloading aging players and not being able to just buy who we wanted to, but, I doubt very much anyone foresaw the magnitude of financial trouble we'd gotten ourselves into.
I pretty much agree.
I suspected it'd mean selling Grealish and working on the wage bill.
Failing to meet the monthly PAYE bill and actual discussion of administration as a possibility is not what I foresaw, this is a whole different level of shit.
I thought deep shit was where we are now without the drama.
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(https://scontent-lht6-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/36420391_1952799688083888_1066147866554138624_n.jpg?_nc_cat=0&oh=6327c7a30fb2601007c09685ba05c4c9&oe=5BAB6899)
I bet Tony had his PA busy arranging urgent travel and a meeting having received such a stern letter.
:o
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I bet Tony had his PA busy arranging urgent travel and a meeting having received such a stern letter.
:o
What else can they do though apart from nothing
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They NEED to make themselves available.
Bloody hell.
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I know John e but its a poorly written letter.
It could have been condensed into a few sentences and I am not sure “ what further action we should take” is going to do the trick.
I think it’s futile and that says more about our absentee owner than the well meaning AVST.
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What’s all this no money stuff anyway? We’ve just signed Sam Johnstones replacement 16 year old goalkeeper. Viljami Sinisalo.
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Was this not the paper who was reporting Bruce to be pleasantly surprised?
There's so much speculative bollocks at the moment. The Levy-ism in full affect. Those Jews ah? Mirror scrotes.
You think there is a Jewish effort to get Grealish to Spurs on the cheap?
No, I'm suggesting the Mirror is using Jewish stereotypes. Why is it only Levy, a Jew, is seen as some arch negotiator or tight when Spurs waste as much money as their contempories.
Another piece of proof that the written word is oft mistaken.
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(https://scontent-lht6-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/36420391_1952799688083888_1066147866554138624_n.jpg?_nc_cat=0&oh=6327c7a30fb2601007c09685ba05c4c9&oe=5BAB6899)
I bet Tony had his PA busy arranging urgent travel and a meeting having received such a stern letter.
:o
What else can they do though apart from nothing
I think they are asking exactly what we want to know regardless of whether it could have been shortened.
I remember looking up at the Chinese flag on the Witton Lane Stand two seasons ago thinking that it was bad enough getting an American to listen to our dissatisfaction but that we’d have no chance getting our voices heard in the free democracy that is China should we ever need to.
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I bet Tony had his PA busy arranging urgent travel and a meeting having received such a stern letter.
:o
You old cynic you. Wtf should they be doing if not requesting clarity from the club? We have little enough voice as it is. Might as well let the Trust represent fans' interests insofar as possible (sorry if your individual needs aren't met).
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The Trust need someone on board who can improve communications like this. It's poorly written, and though heartfelt is amateurish in execution. The tone is wrong too, it needs to be far less demanding, which does nothing but wind people up, and more questioning and collaboration.
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Latest shambles
https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/aston-villas-new-management-structure-12825416
Aston Villa's new management structure being probed by the Football League — for not knowing enough about the game
EXCLUSIVE: Committee running crisis club since chief exec Keith Wyness' removal yet to give Steve Bruce a transfer budget
Aston Villa is now being run on a day-to-day basis by a committee of four — and the Football League are looking into the management structure.
Bosses at the EFL have held two meetings with the new top brass at Villa Park, and have voiced concerns at the lack of football knowledge.
The quartet consists of chief commercial officer Luke Organ, finance director Ian Hopson, lawyer Victoria Wilkes and Xia’s eyes and ears at Villa Park, Rongtien He.
Since chief executive Keith Wyness was kicked out of office, those four are responsible for day-to-day affairs. But the EFL are taking some convincing they have the necessary credentials to run Villa in its current state.
The crisis-hit Birmingham club managed to pay the wages this month as rumours over its financial future continue to swirl. Players and staff were remunerated on Friday as the club fulfilled its immediate financial obligations.
Rumours of a takeover continue to circulate - the latest is that two Americans were being shown around the club’s training base at Bodymoor Heath earlier in the week.
Meanwhile, manager Steve Bruce remains in the dark over transfers with the players returning to pre-season training this Wednesday.
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I believe we’re not in the healthiest position right now. However I wouldn’t believe the Mirror and their need for hyperbole if it told me Aston Villa was based in Aston, Birmingham.
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Yes Moxley is clearly a fan/mate of Bruce
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Someone very underhand trying to further undermine Xia's stewardship in order to force through an aggressive takeover? Clearly someone is feeding that rag.
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The Mirror are as bad as The S*n. They can all fuck off, offensive rags.
As a general rule of thumb, if it appears in one of those two, it's likely total bollocks.
When it appears in the "broadsheets", I *might* start giving it some credence.
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Again, whilst they can't and shouldn't comment on every piece of rag shit, an interview with Xia, or with Bruce to clear things up, wouldn't go amiss. I would really like them to show some bite. Don't tweet, make a proper statement.
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I believe we’re not in the healthiest position right now. However I wouldn’t believe the Mirror and their need for hyperbole if it told me Aston Villa was based in Aston, Birmingham.
Neither would I.
Keep the faith :)
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Mirror or not, it would take someone leaking information to be as precise as the league getting interested in the current management structure. My bet is on Wyness and/or Round.
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I notice the article finishes with letting us know the squad is jetting off to Portugal for pre season training.
I suppose the costs of that are minor compared to everything else but you’d think our players retained a degree of fitness in the last month or so to enable our training facility to top em up but what do I know.
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The EFL is going to come in and ask them all to explain the offside rule?
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The Trust need someone on board who can improve communications like this. It's poorly written, and though heartfelt is amateurish in execution. The tone is wrong too, it needs to be far less demanding, which does nothing but wind people up, and more questioning and collaboration.
It is deliberately antagonistic. I think this needs to be seen through the prism of the relationship between the Trust and the club.
Wyness did a Q+A at the Trust AGM just a matter of months ago where he told everyone that everything was hunky dory financially and we had a robust Plan B if we were not promoted. So that was clearly bollocks.
The Trust are also the club's preferred conduit of sharing information with supporters. That goes two ways though. You can't use them to organise the SCG's or be the club's "right to reply" to issues raised in the media, and then go mute when the club is falling apart in front of our eyes.
Wanting to know who the Senior Executive is surely isn't such a challenging question to answer? When our very solvency and existence is in question, how hard can it be to say who is in charge after they binned the CEO? Particularly as the question was first asked when Wyness was put on gardening leave, we still don't know the answer and the nearest we got to one was "it might be Tommy Jordan but he is on holiday". That is a terrifying response on many levels.
Just look at the shit this week with the away scheme and Claret members. Nobody has a clue to whom questions should be addressed and, if the Lions Clubs want a meeting to disagree with it, who is in charge of convening it.
Not a word has officially come out about our financial situation either. One brief statement saying "we hope to cut a deal" with HMRC and then another saying "we can pay the bills this month". But nothing to confirm finances are in place to stop us living hand to mouth or that we now do have a plan in place to avoid Administration and start living within our means.
We aren't daft enough to expect them to say every player is available for sale for a pound or to expect detailed information about a forthcoming sale of the club. But the not knowing the most minimal information about the state if the club is ridiculous.
The indications are that Xia is not a fan of Bruce and doesn't want to sell up. So how does that work? The players are back in next week but we don't know how many we might have to flog. There is a world cup on and the transfer window shuts a month earlier than normal. How competitive can we expect to be?
The Trust can't hold a gun to the owners head and force him to sell but they can try to coordinate pressing the club into giving some meaningful answers to its fans rather than just getting an occasional statement that says nothing or gobbledygook tweet from Xia.
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Xia is a twat, we won't be getting anything that remotely smells of the truth or makes any sense out of him. I wouldn't be surprised if we start getting some Lerner style ramblings from him soon just to top things off.
He can call an uber and feck off as far as I'm concerned and take his Aston regeneration cloud cuckoo land bollocks with him. He couldn't run a piss up in a brewery.
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All the leaks about budgets for playing squad etc are blatantly coming from Bruce’s camp. Goes hand in hand as why none of them have questioned his poor use of our squad/budgets and promotion failure.
He’s feeding them so when he does walk away/gets the chop the myth of Steve Bruce can continue
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All the leaks about budgets for playing squad etc are blatantly coming from Bruce’s camp. Goes hand in hand as why none of them have questioned his poor use of our squad/budgets and promotion failure.
He’s feeding them so when he does walk away/gets the chop the myth of Steve Bruce can continue
You don't really have any evidence of that though. The only thing we've heard about budgets is some paper saying Bruce will be pleasantly surprised and that's it.
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I’m putting off getting my lad a Cubs membership until I’m sure the club can honour it. They need to create a bit more confidence than that amongst fans and indeed other parties.
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Chelts, I don’t think anybody would dispute anything you say, the main issue though is that the trust statement is just badly written.
Why not put in an explanation of the Trust’s relationship with the club as you describe? That would have given the statement more authority. Eg something along the lines of “the club has chosen the Trust as its preferred means of disseminating information to fans, so we now feel it is incumbent on us to try to find out....”
Just a suggestion.
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It's out there now so I can't change it. It is supposed to be dovetailed with a bit of media coverage though should no response be received early next week so the notion was to get the explanations in there.
I think we were caught between two stools of not wanting to ramble on too much but also you might lose a bit of gravitas by not giving the full back story.
The club won't respond anyway, I am pretty confident of that. The only person you can get hold of is Lee Preece and he went on holiday on Friday.
Next steps were always to try to squeeze the media into actually investigating the matter rather than running sensational stuff being briefed to them by Wyness and Bruce.
We will do our best to get the message over a little better this week but I am struggling to wrap my head round the fact that we seem to be being run by an average press officer (Who is currently holidaying himself) or the work experience kid from China.
I was expecting my summer to be complaining about Bruce and moaning about signings. The fact we can't get a straight answer on remaining solvent? Not so much!
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It's all a bit of a mess, really, isn't it?
The most frightening thing is that nobody seems to know who is running the club right now. For the only statement out of them to be the usual meaningless Engrish tweet from the chairman is unforgiveable.
I am not expecting them to come out and tell us precisely what the financial situation is, and I am not a fan of the saying something for the sake of it thing, but what would inspire a bit of confidence right now would be for something to be said about who is running the club, because just now it all looks like a knackered old trawler heading straight for the rocks.
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maybe that's your answer - I don't want it to be that, but we have to accept that it might well be.
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I am not expecting them to come out and tell us precisely what the financial situation is, and I am not a fan of the saying something for the sake of it thing, but what would inspire a bit of confidence right now would be for something to be said about who is running the club, because just now it all looks like a knackered old trawler heading straight for the rocks.
HMT Aston Villa (http://www.heroesandvillains.info/forumv3/index.php?topic=45226.0)
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I am not expecting them to come out and tell us precisely what the financial situation is, and I am not a fan of the saying something for the sake of it thing, but what would inspire a bit of confidence right now would be for something to be said about who is running the club, because just now it all looks like a knackered old trawler heading straight for the rocks.
HMT Aston Villa (http://www.heroesandvillains.info/forumv3/index.php?topic=45226.0)
Very interesting reading that again and well worth bumping. As an aside, two things sprang to mind, firstly: there is a post on there from The Laughing Policeman which reminded me that I haven't seen him posting for a while. I hope he is ok, anyone know?
Secondly: Seeing as the trawler was built in Middlesborough maybe we might cut them some slack when taking the piss. May I suggest a fortnight?
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I saw he turned down 30 mill from American group for 30% of the club - that would have only kept us a float for 6 mths I suppose
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I saw he turned down 30 mill from American group for 30% of the club - that would have only kept us a float for 6 mths I suppose
Or 20 minutes if Brucey wants to spunk it all on Huth and other has beens.
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Surely there must be something more interesting going on if he turned that sort of money down? Is the man a complete tool? Unless something behind the deal wasn't right.
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Surely there must be something more interesting going on if he turned that sort of money down? Is the man a complete tool? Unless something behind the deal wasn't right.
I’m increasingly coming round to the ‘the man is a complete tool’ point of view personally.
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A sort of Swiss Army Knife but less useful.
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Not sure if this has been picked up earlier, but the Express and Star are reporting that Tone has been 'publicly rebuked' by the Shanghai stock exchange for allegedly concealing information while chairman of Lotus Health , one of his former vast array of stellar performing global powerhouses. According to the report this public shaming will make it even more difficult to persuade Chinese investors to join him in investing in the best business opportunity since , er, Delboy's cushy Peckham Spring Water. Surely the bell tolls for our Tone , but as long as he persists in the delusion that he can cling on to a controlling interest and thrashes around desperately trying to defy the financial ,commercial and footballing laws of gravity, the greater the risk that he will drag our beloved club down in flames with him. Please Tone , accept the inevitable and give us a chance of survival.
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The Mirror...where else...
Aston Villa owner Dr Tony Xia stuns club officials by claiming he does not want to sell to Americans
Villa are in financial crisis and Xia is looking for either new investment or owners to take the club forward
Aston Villa's Chinese owner Dr Tony Xia has stunned club officials by admitting he doesn't want to sell to Americans.
Championship Villa are in financial crisis after missing out on promotion to the Premier League in the play-off final.
Xia is now trying to sell a stake in the club to bring in vital investment or potentially even sell up outright.
An American group are interested and are believed to have visited Villa Park for talks.
The deal has been teed up by members of Villa's UK-based hierarchy but China-based Xia has so far been unwilling to sanction it.
His reluctance to personally deal with Americans reflects international tensions between the two superpowers.
US president Donald Trump has imposed taxes on imports from China - sparking fears of an all-out trade war.
The first tariffs are due to come into effect this month to protect US jobs as part of his 'America first' policy.
Now incredibly the repercussions of tensions between the two nations has stretched as far as Villa Park.
Villa have an uncertain future (Image: REUT
It is another headache for the staff on the ground at Villa Park, where chief executive Keith Wyness has left and is suing for constructive dismissal.
In Wyness' absence, chief commercial officer Luke Organ, finance director Ian Hopson, lawyer Victoria Wilkes and Xia’s executive assistant, Rongtian He, are running things.
He ,29, reports back to Xia and disseminates his instructions to staff including Villa boss Steve Bruce and director of football Steve Round with the first team squad due back on Wednesday for pre-season.
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this is now getting very worrying
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He tells She (Victoria) and he (steve Bruce) what to do.
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He's refusing to sell to American's because of Trump's tariff policy? That's sounds ludicrous even by James Nursey's standards.
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He's refusing to sell to American's because of Trump's tariff policy? That's sounds ludicrous even by James Nursey's standards.
'Ludicrous' is becoming par for the course here.
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If we were Man Utd or someone else fashionable, do you reckon our Government would intervene if this is true?
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If we were Man Utd or someone else fashionable, do you reckon our Government would intervene if this is true?
They could relaunch HMS Aston Villa and head to the Pacific
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If we were Man Utd or someone else fashionable, do you reckon our Government would intervene if this is true?
No.
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He's refusing to sell to American's because of Trump's tariff policy? That's sounds ludicrous even by James Nursey's standards.
Losing face in China by selling to the Yanks, doesn’t seem that far fetched. His masters won’t like that.
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Well he’s not exactly flavour of the month over here either.
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He's refusing to sell to American's because of Trump's tariff policy? That's sounds ludicrous even by James Nursey's standards.
Losing face in China by selling to the Yanks, doesn’t seem that far fetched. His masters won’t like that.
His masters? What, is he a slave FFS?
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He's refusing to sell to American's because of Trump's tariff policy? That's sounds ludicrous even by James Nursey's standards.
Losing face in China by selling to the Yanks, doesn’t seem that far fetched. His masters won’t like that.
His masters? What, is he a slave FFS?
Tongue in cheek. Keep your hair on
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Losing face. Probably good for a H&V drinking game.
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The only stake any one is going to pay that sort of money for is a controlling stake.
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He's refusing to sell to American's because of Trump's tariff policy? That's sounds ludicrous even by James Nursey's standards.
Losing face in China by selling to the Yanks, doesn’t seem that far fetched. His masters won’t like that.
I agree with Clampy on this
I've got no problem blaming Trump for all the trouble he causes but to try and implicate him in Villa's downfall is just rediculous
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Agree. The financial screws were going on in China before Trump kicked off his trade war.
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Agree. The financial screws were going on in China before Trump kicked off his trade war.
There is absolute no evidence to suggest that China capital controls have anything whatsoever to do with our current predicament.
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Nor is there any evidence that they do not.
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Nor is there any evidence that they do not.
In fact Brian we are pretty short of evidence or facts.
All that we do know is that the CEO has gone and we failed to make an HMRC payment which led the the threat of Winding up.
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By the lack of transparancy from Xia or from the club, my personal take on it is that our state of affairs has little to do with the Peoples Republic of China but only at the doorstep of Xia.
We gambled and we lost - simple as that. It's how we recover that is now the concern.
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By the lack of transparancy from Xia or from the club, my personal take on it is that our state of affairs has little to do with the Peoples Republic of China but only at the doorstep of Xia.
We gambled and we lost - simple as that. It's how we recover that is now the concern.
As they say the silence is deafening, if Xia had something good or reassuring to say he would say it as it would be in his interest to do so.
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By the lack of transparancy from Xia or from the club, my personal take on it is that our state of affairs has little to do with the Peoples Republic of China but only at the doorstep of Xia.
We gambled and we lost - simple as that. It's how we recover that is now the concern.
As they say the silence is deafening, if Xia had something good or reassuring to say he would say it as it would be in his interest to do so.
Not really, all he would get is a load of "You're lying" and "Don't tell us, show us".
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By the lack of transparancy from Xia or from the club, my personal take on it is that our state of affairs has little to do with the Peoples Republic of China but only at the doorstep of Xia.
We gambled and we lost - simple as that. It's how we recover that is now the concern.
As they say the silence is deafening, if Xia had something good or reassuring to say he would say it as it would be in his interest to do so.
Not really, all he would get is a load of "You're lying" and "Don't tell us, show us".
Of course it is, you have the creditors not giving credit and trying to collect debt, you have reluctance to buy season tickets and pretty much anything else.
The speculation will be driving down value.
If he was in a position to say he has secured enough capital to continue operations and that the financial position has been stabilized he would say it.
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Whose reluctant to buy season tickets? We've sold over 20,000.
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but have we? Or is it more Tone speak
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Absolute nonsense to imagine he's making a business decision of this magnitude because he thinks his country has fallen out with Trump, goodness sake this time next week they'll be best buddes, Aston Villa have got nothing to do with trade tariffs or deals, in fact you could legitimately make the case for resolving this between all countries in the true spirit of sport, so are China saying if there were an olympic games next week, they would refuse to go because of trade tariffs, denying all there athletes the chance to compete. get the club sold for goodness sake so we can concentrate on the coming season.
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I saw he turned down 30 mill from American group for 30% of the club - that would have only kept us a float for 6 mths I suppose
where did you see that ?
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Saw that on BBC Sport gossip linked to the Mirror.
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Correct me if I'm wrong but wouldn't that £30m have gone to Tone and not the club itself. No guarantee he'd put that back into the club, but I suppose it would depend how much investment the new part owners would want to stick into the club. Probably not a lot if Tone still owns 70% of it. I think there is always going to be a lot of bullshit and misinformation around in these times, it's difficult to know what to believe.
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but have we? Or is it more Tone speak
Maybe this isn't the hobby for you.
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By the lack of transparancy from Xia or from the club, my personal take on it is that our state of affairs has little to do with the Peoples Republic of China but only at the doorstep of Xia.
We gambled and we lost - simple as that. It's how we recover that is now the concern.
As they say the silence is deafening, if Xia had something good or reassuring to say he would say it as it would be in his interest to do so.
If as is normal it would be a load of gibbering man baby twitter nonsense about doing our best UTV, by the way happy birthday Jimmy I would rather hear nothing at all.
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Correct me if I'm wrong but wouldn't that £30m have gone to Tone and not the club itself. No guarantee he'd put that back into the club, but I suppose it would depend how much investment the new part owners would want to stick into the club. Probably not a lot if Tone still owns 70% of it. I think there is always going to be a lot of bullshit and misinformation around in these times, it's difficult to know what to believe.
The Mail have embellished this old news today with more details of the American bid. Apparently they wanted to sell Jack for £40m minimum and use that money as working capital.
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Glad he's knocked them back.
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Correct me if I'm wrong but wouldn't that £30m have gone to Tone and not the club itself. No guarantee he'd put that back into the club, but I suppose it would depend how much investment the new part owners would want to stick into the club. Probably not a lot if Tone still owns 70% of it. I think there is always going to be a lot of bullshit and misinformation around in these times, it's difficult to know what to believe.
The Mail have embellished this old news today with more details of the American bid. Apparently they wanted to sell Jack for £40m minimum and use that money as working capital.
Sounds quite sensible under the circumstances, apart from the fact that we won't get £40m for Jack. Maybe £30m if there is enough interest.
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Glad he's knocked them back.
I'd like to see us in a healthy financial position preferably with new owners and being able to hang on to Kodjia and Chester and with the money to buy Johnstone personally. This potential continuous scratching around to pay tax bills and wages malarkey doesn't really sit well.
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We've secured a £50m loan which is enough to keep us going for 12 months or while we try and sell the club.
I would rather keep Jack as I think we're far more likely to be promoted than not with him in the side.
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I'd definately rather keep him but without knowing the full extent of what's going on I'm hoping that it wouldn't be another gamble at going up this year. As you say, the £50m is a loan.
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Correct me if I'm wrong but wouldn't that £30m have gone to Tone and not the club itself. No guarantee he'd put that back into the club, but I suppose it would depend how much investment the new part owners would want to stick into the club. Probably not a lot if Tone still owns 70% of it. I think there is always going to be a lot of bullshit and misinformation around in these times, it's difficult to know what to believe.
The Mail have embellished this old news today with more details of the American bid. Apparently they wanted to sell Jack for £40m minimum and use that money as working capital.
Sounds quite sensible under the circumstances, apart from the fact that we won't get £40m for Jack. Maybe £30m if there is enough interest.
The story I read suggested that they didn't want to sell Jack, so were thinking of setting the price at £40m and wouldn't sell for less. Which strikes me as quite sensible.
How people know this is another question, of course. As is whether anyone will get a chance to implement such a plan. But it gave me a bit of hope. The same story suggested that there were two other parties interested in buying the club, both of whom have money to invest.
If any of this is true, things could look very positive quite quickly. The lack of any noise coming out of Villa seems to suggest that something could be quite close. Or that there's no one left at the club and everything is utterly hopeless... I'm going to choose to believe the more positive outlook at the moment. Will make for a more pleasant summer, I reckon.
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Correct me if I'm wrong but wouldn't that £30m have gone to Tone and not the club itself. No guarantee he'd put that back into the club, but I suppose it would depend how much investment the new part owners would want to stick into the club. Probably not a lot if Tone still owns 70% of it. I think there is always going to be a lot of bullshit and misinformation around in these times, it's difficult to know what to believe.
The Mail have embellished this old news today with more details of the American bid. Apparently they wanted to sell Jack for £40m minimum and use that money as working capital.
Sounds quite sensible under the circumstances, apart from the fact that we won't get £40m for Jack. Maybe £30m if there is enough interest.
The story I read suggested that they didn't want to sell Jack, so were thinking of setting the price at £40m and wouldn't sell for less. Which strikes me as quite sensible.
If true, and if they would be wealthy enough and willing to invest so that we don't need to sell Jack it would be both sensible and very exciting for us fans. I hope it turns out to be right.
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but have we? Or is it more Tone speak
Why would they lie about how many season tickets they have sold?
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Correct me if I'm wrong but wouldn't that £30m have gone to Tone and not the club itself. No guarantee he'd put that back into the club, but I suppose it would depend how much investment the new part owners would want to stick into the club. Probably not a lot if Tone still owns 70% of it. I think there is always going to be a lot of bullshit and misinformation around in these times, it's difficult to know what to believe.
The Mail have embellished this old news today with more details of the American bid. Apparently they wanted to sell Jack for £40m minimum and use that money as working capital.
Sounds quite sensible under the circumstances, apart from the fact that we won't get £40m for Jack. Maybe £30m if there is enough interest.
The story I read suggested that they didn't want to sell Jack, so were thinking of setting the price at £40m and wouldn't sell for less. Which strikes me as quite sensible.
If true, and if they would be wealthy enough and willing to invest so that we don't need to sell Jack it would be both sensible and very exciting for us fans. I hope it turns out to be right.
Agreed. I'm (choosing to be) actually quite positive about next season. I don't think our squad, as it stands, is any worse than it was last year, although we need a centre back to play next to Chester. Get someone with some pace and height and we'll be set out better than last year, in my opinion. A bit of pace to replace Snodgrass on the wing (Green?), and more chance for players like RHM, Lyden, O'Hare and we look alright. With Jack and Kodjia fit from the start of the season, playing a bit more positively, I'm not sure we'll be scared about playing anyone in the league.
Of course, everything could go to shit before then. No one knows. The vacuum of information means we get to come up with our own version of what might happen. This is mine.
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It's similar to what I've been saying most of the time, although I did envisage having to sell Grealish no matter what. If it turns out that we don't, our financial position will have taken a hell of a turn for the better. With new owners I suppose anything is possible.
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There is a lot about the sorry state of affairs, now and recent years, that I am bemused by.
The latest bit of which is that football (and the Villa) has got into the position where Jack Grealish is (perhaps) worth 40% of the total value of Aston Villa FC.
He's a great player and has the potential to become an outstanding player, but the World has to be more than a bit fucked up if that is true.
What a time to be alive. UTV.
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It's similar to what I've been saying most of the time, although I did envisage having to sell Grealish no matter what. If it turns out that we don't, our financial position will have taken a hell of a turn for the better. With new owners I suppose anything is possible.
Wouldn't new owners still be hampered by the FFP situation though and not able to invest even if the money was there?
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It's similar to what I've been saying most of the time, although I did envisage having to sell Grealish no matter what. If it turns out that we don't, our financial position will have taken a hell of a turn for the better. With new owners I suppose anything is possible.
Wouldn't new owners still be hampered by the FFP situation though and not able to invest even if the money was there?
I'd have thought so
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My thoughts exactly. Presumably we still have to balance the books due to Financial Unfair (unless you have already acquired the big bucks) Play. Surely there could be a middle way to ensure ongoing steady gradual outside investment and to reduce boom & bust spending? Less likelihood of pushing that legally once we leave the EU?
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Correct me if I'm wrong but wouldn't that £30m have gone to Tone and not the club itself. No guarantee he'd put that back into the club, but I suppose it would depend how much investment the new part owners would want to stick into the club. Probably not a lot if Tone still owns 70% of it. I think there is always going to be a lot of bullshit and misinformation around in these times, it's difficult to know what to believe.
The Mail have embellished this old news today with more details of the American bid. Apparently they wanted to sell Jack for £40m minimum and use that money as working capital.
Sounds quite sensible under the circumstances, apart from the fact that we won't get £40m for Jack. Maybe £30m if there is enough interest.
The story I read suggested that they didn't want to sell Jack, so were thinking of setting the price at £40m and wouldn't sell for less. Which strikes me as quite sensible.
How people know this is another question, of course. As is whether anyone will get a chance to implement such a plan. But it gave me a bit of hope. The same story suggested that there were two other parties interested in buying the club, both of whom have money to invest.
If any of this is true, things could look very positive quite quickly. The lack of any noise coming out of Villa seems to suggest that something could be quite close. Or that there's no one left at the club and everything is utterly hopeless... I'm going to choose to believe the more positive outlook at the moment. Will make for a more pleasant summer, I reckon.
I have a worrying suspicion the latter is correct Boozey. Business as usual on flogging tickets and the like but bugger all proper Executive direction.
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I can’t imagine how anyone is managing the club from a footballing point of view. The Manager will not know who is in his first team, or second for that matter. The players must be deeply unsettled.
And as for us...
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Mushroom syndrome?
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We've secured a £50m loan which is enough to keep us going for 12 months or while we try and sell the club.
I would rather keep Jack as I think we're far more likely to be promoted than not with him in the side.
How much of that 50m loan is going to reduce the FFP deficit?
Glad this World cup is on as rather not think about next season tbh. Understatement to say we're not in great shape for it.
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None. I would imagine the £50m is just to keep the lights on for a few months.
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We're back to where we were under Lerner with no direction coming from the top down. Brilliant. Dr Del Boy is out of his depth.
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and one day he's going to be a millionaire
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Jim White just said there's some statement from us imminently.
After the Tom Hanks debacle it's probably just him discovering the Xia tweet from last week.
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Jim White just said there's some statement from us imminently.
After the Tom Hanks debacle it's probably just him discovering the Xia tweet from last week.
Probably Prince William coming in on trial
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Steve Round has left the club. Fuck who is running the place?
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"A change of personal at the top of the club".
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Steve Round left the building.
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Steve Round has left the club. Fuck who is running the place?
That’s not a good sign, can’t blame him though if he’s decided to desert a sinking ship! Bruce next?
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Sorry Toronto, didn't see that.
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Bruce next surely.
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Haven't the playing staff returned to work today?
Round going weakens Bruce's position imo.
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Xia is just going to appoint another Chinese stooge to that role now isn't he....
Would imagine Round was on a fair whack so can see this being another cost cutting move. Villa Engine is properly broken again.
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It great this isn’t it. Not that I am expecting them to keep Everybody up to date with the nuances of what’s going on at Villa, but an actual statement of facts would be most welcome. Not a tweet, not a hint an actual broad summary of the situation and their plans to sort it out. Embarrassing is what I would use to describe this.
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Will the last person to leave VP please turn off the lights.
Seriously, turn them off, do you think we're made of money!
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Some good comments from Simon Jordan. It dosen't have to be a financial apocalypse if we make some brave calls. Oh and change ownership.
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Jim White just said there's some statement from us imminently.
After the Tom Hanks debacle it's probably just him discovering the Xia tweet from last week.
Am I hearing things? Did White, in that statement, say it was big "financial news"?
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Some good comments from Simon Jordan. It dosen't have to be a financial apocalypse if we make some brave calls. Oh and change ownership.
He has strongly hinted in the past that he already has some insider knowledge of what goes on at Villa. He has just gone a step further and said that whilst he has no wish to ever own a club again after his experiences at Palace, there is a possibility he "may have some involvement in a takeover of Villa".
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I reckon Tony is clearing the decks of anyone linked to Wyness.
E&S write Matt Maher states Tony decided to sack him and it happened when he tuned up this morning for work.
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Some good comments from Simon Jordan. It dosen't have to be a financial apocalypse if we make some brave calls. Oh and change ownership.
He has strongly hinted in the past that he already has some insider knowledge of what goes on at Villa. He has just gone a step further and said that whilst he has no wish to ever own a club again after his experiences at Palace, there is a possibility he "may have some involvement in a takeover of Villa".
I have never quite understand his apparent affinity towards us. He always speaks very highly of us whilst often ridiculing our neighbours, .
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Some good comments from Simon Jordan. It dosen't have to be a financial apocalypse if we make some brave calls. Oh and change ownership.
He has strongly hinted in the past that he already has some insider knowledge of what goes on at Villa. He has just gone a step further and said that whilst he has no wish to ever own a club again after his experiences at Palace, there is a possibility he "may have some involvement in a takeover of Villa".
I have never quite understand his apparent affinity towards us. He always speaks very highly of us whilst often ridiculing our neighbours, .
I think most of it is do with his loathing of the Dildo Brothers.
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Its making for sorry reading isn't it. Americans who were looking to bid had Round as their main point of contact and were impressed by him. Shambles.
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I reckon Tony is clearing the decks of anyone linked to Wyness.
E&S write Matt Maher states Tony decided to sack him and it happened when he tuned up this morning for work.
Wouldn't it be for any new owners to decide who and who not to keep? I don't know, I'm just guessing like everyone else.
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This just gets messier and messier, Dr. No might have his reasons and linking Round with Wyness is not a hard link to go together, but we are 4 weeks away from kicking off and no real Senior Management on both the business side and the football side, if Bruce left now( and I was all for him going after Fulham) but feel we are just not in a position to replace him, who would source the candidates, the fucking tea lady.
Dr. No also needs to realise sales of football clubs do not happen overnight, but it is becoming apparent by the hour, whatever business money this chancer has made must have come from Jack's magic beans. If this was happening down the Sty oh what fun we would be having.
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Is Simon Jordan implying that there is a consortium which he may or may not be part of close to buying the club?
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It seemed that way, yes
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Jesus Christ, see you, you are a fucking omni-shambles, that's what you are. You're like that coffee machine, you know, "From bean to cup, you fuck up."
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Any links to the Jordan stuff? I can't see anything on talksport.
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All I want is Tony to sell up and fuck off. That's all.
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To be honest n our present straightened circumstances, could we really afford or justify Round?
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Is Simon Jordan implying that there is a consortium which he may or may not be part of close to buying the club?
I think being 'close to buying the club' would possibly be an exaggeration, but he has declared a (possible) interest in being involved with any consortium that may be interested in doing so and has strongly hinted that he is aware that there are interested parties. Which suggests to me that he has been in some kind of contact with those interested parties and both desires and thinks he can be a part of the process. My summing up of the information he has 'drip fed' over several weeks via his role on Talksport is that he thinks the Villa financial situation is tricky but solvable and that a takeover will happen sooner rather than later and (I am reading between the lines here) that he knows those who are interested and may himself be involved.
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thanks for that. My opinion of Jordan has changed quite a bit recently - he does seem to have a genuine regard for Villa although I guess you could argue that another failed owner is the last thing we need.
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thanks for that. My opinion of Jordan has changed quite a bit recently - he does seem to have a genuine regard for Villa although I guess you could argue that another failed owner is the last thing we need.
I read his autobiography a few years back. Self made millionaire who got in at the start of the mobile phone boom and doesn't suffer fools gladly. I am guessing he is 'Marmite' and you like him or not but personally I like the guy.
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Any links to the Jordan stuff? I can't see anything on talksport.
I think if you go on the Talksport website you can replay any of the shows from earlier today. He was talking to Jim White I think but you might have to listen to the whole show to hear the Villa bit.
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Some good comments from Simon Jordan. It dosen't have to be a financial apocalypse if we make some brave calls. Oh and change ownership.
He has strongly hinted in the past that he already has some insider knowledge of what goes on at Villa. He has just gone a step further and said that whilst he has no wish to ever own a club again after his experiences at Palace, there is a possibility he "may have some involvement in a takeover of Villa".
I have never quite understand his apparent affinity towards us. He always speaks very highly of us whilst often ridiculing our neighbours, .
I think most of it is do with his loathing of the Dildo Brothers.
He has openly admitted that he was pissed off at them poaching Bruce and has also openly admitted that by appointing Francis (who the dildo brothers had just sacked and replaced with Bruce) was an attempt to get one over on them that backfired. Bruce got promoted, Francis got fired.
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I reckon Tony is clearing the decks of anyone linked to Wyness.
E&S write Matt Maher states Tony decided to sack him and it happened when he tuned up this morning for work.
Wouldn't it be for any new owners to decide who and who not to keep? I don't know, I'm just guessing like everyone else.
It doesn't matter who is your boss next week, if I am your boss today I can sack you.
Which reminds me of a situation about twenty years ago when the pub I was bar manager of was sold by Allied Domecq to a private landlord. I received redundancy money from the brewery and was then reinstated (with a wage rise) the next day by the new landlord. I used the redundancy money to swap my Nissan Micra for a nice Audi GT Coupe.
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Delboy will fill the role with some other laughable character who watched some villa game in China 10 years ago as a ten year old and became in love with us. We are fast approaching the point where Paul Lambert was basically running the club a few years ago because everyone else had fucked off.
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Is there any chance of anyone at the club communicating with the fanbase? Or do we have to wait for another borat style tweet.
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Who is running things now then?
Is it that Chinese student who wrote in that he was a big Villa fan and then got appointed assistant to the chairman? Mr Ho or whatever his name is?
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Who is running things now then?
Is it that Chinese student who wrote in that he was a big Villa fan and then got appointed assistant to the chairman? Mr Ho or whatever his name is?
Organ Hoppes Wilkes.
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Lew Corgan is handy in a crisis. He sorted out Wasps.
If there are any nests at BH or VP, he will be the main man.
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Who is running things now then?
Is it that Chinese student who wrote in that he was a big Villa fan and then got appointed assistant to the chairman? Mr Ho or whatever his name is?
Rongtian He. Yes. He. Is.
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In the words of the late,great Tony Hancock. (Or Galton and Simpson)
“This is getting farcical”
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From the Meaning Evil.
Steve Bruce to hold crunch talks with Tony Xia's advisors
The latest update on the AVFC boss
Steve Bruce is set for crunch talks with senior officials over his Aston Villa future in the next 24 hours.
Owner Tony Xia has told his assistant Rongtian He to fly over to Portugal and speak with the manager who is preparing a summer training camp for his senior stars.
Chief commercial officer Luke Organ is expected to join him after the pair delivered the news of Steve Round’s sacking this morning.
He, also known as ‘Ho’ has taken a hands-on role this summer and could partly fill the role left behind by Round.
Villa will not be announcing an official replacement - as the position is now deemed vacant - but extra responsibility will be handed to Xia’s right-hand man, who acts as the owner’s eyes and ears in the Midlands.
Addressing the manager in the hours ahead also shows a sign of how prominent his role is right now.
(Image: @VillansHo/Twitter)
The agenda, though, is not yet clear.
It’s normal for senior officials to meet with the management team ahead of pre-season - but after a summer of chaos it’s difficult to predict what happens next at Villa.
Xia has already fallen out with former CEO Keith Wyness who left last month - and sacked his close ally, Round, just two days after he returned to Bodymoor Heath ahead of the 2018/19 campaign.
Chief scout Tony Coton has also left so the football department is currently low on experienced ‘football men’.
BirminghamLive understands that Bruce will not walk away from his role and is ready to start preparing the claret and blues for their third season in the Championship.
Whether his outlook changes in the weeks ahead remains to be seen.
Villa are expected to lose Jack Grealish this summer as Tottenham remain keen on the 22-year-old ace. John Terry has already left, the loan players from last season will not be returning and James Chester is also attracting interest.
If Villa are unable to top-up their squad with quality replacements, Bruce might start to consider his future.
Of course a decision may have already been made by then and much will depend on the outcome of tomorrow’s talks.
As for Round, his dismissal certainly came as a shock.
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Good Lord
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This looks absolutely fucking shambolic. Is there anybody who knows anything about football left at the club? I'm more worried about our future now than I've ever been
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good news Ted ? :-\
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A post match interview somewhere around October 2018.
Commenting on the 6-1 reverse at QPR, Manager Luke Organ said ‘I thought we were unlucky to lose the game. Perhaps I should have bought Rongtian on earlier as he looked excellent and gave us a threat up front. I’m pleased with the way the new away shirts are holding up. We pick ourselves up and go again next week.’
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A post match interview somewhere around October 2018.
Commenting on the 6-1 reverse at QPR, Manager Luke Organ said ‘I thought we were unlucky to lose the game. Perhaps I should have bought Rongtian on earlier as he looked excellent and gave us a threat up front. I’m pleased with the way the new away shirts are holding up. We pick ourselves up and go again next week.’
October sounds positive
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"He, also known as Ho?!"
Was He given the responsibility of sacking Round? How did that go?
He: Hi Steve.
SR: Hi He.
He: Ho.
SR: Oh. Hi Ho.
He: Hi. We're giving you the heave ho.
SR: The heave ho? Who?
He: You.
SR: Me? The heave ho? Ha! Hey ho.
He: What?
SR: Nothing. Just "hey ho".
He: What?
SR: Never mind. (Collects belongings and flees madhouse)
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"He, also known as Ho?!"
Was He given the responsibility of sacking Round? How did that go?
He: Hi Steve.
SR: Hi He.
He: Ho.
SR: Oh. Hi Ho.
He: Hi. We're giving you the heave ho.
SR: The heave ho? Who?
He: You.
SR: Me? The heave ho? Ha! Hey ho.
He: What?
SR: Nothing. Just "hey ho".
He: What?
SR: Never mind. (Collects belongings and flees madhouse)
proper tickled me
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And still no proper statement. What a complete fucking joke.
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John Percy.
Aston Villa sack director of football Steve Round as club is plunged into more turmoil.
The Football League have also demanded clarification over proof of funding, with the club's finances under fresh scrutiny.
Aston Villa have been plunged into fresh turmoil after the sacking of director of football Steve Round.
And the cash-strapped Championship club's finances are under more scrutiny after the Football League demanded clarification over proof of funding.
Round, a key ally of manager Steve Bruce, was dismissed by owner Dr Tony Xia on Wednesday morning in a shock end to his two-year tenure with the club.
It now leaves Bruce facing the task of negotiating the bulk of transfer deals on his own after the departure of chief executive Keith Wyness last month. Telegraph Sport understands Bruce has no intention of quitting the club after today's surpise news and is determined to rebuild his squad. Xia made the decision to sack Round but has no plans to jettison Bruce.
Chief commercial officer Luke Organ and Xia's executive assistant Rongtian He are understood to be flying out to Portugal today, where Villa's squad are based for a training camp, for talks with Bruce over the club's immediate future.
Bruce is facing the sale of Jack Grealish and restricted to signing only free agents and low-cost loan signings.
Jack Grealish looks to be on his way from Aston Villa this summer
Villa have also been asked by the EFL to provide evidence they have the cash to continue operating for the forthcoming Championship season, as the pressure grows on Xia.
Last month Xia secured around £5m to ensure the club was able to pay wages and their tax bill for June, but the short-term situation is a concern for the governing body.
The EFL has written to Villa for a response on whether the club can meet its financial obligations and remain competitive for the campaign, which starts in a month's time. Villa and the EFL have declined to comment.
Xia has this week rejected a £30 million offer from an American consortium for a 30 per cent share and is thought to be desperate to retain full control.
Bruce and Xia will be monitoring the future of Middlesbrough winger Adama Traore, who left Villa in August 2016, in the hope of landing a welcome cash injection.
It is understood Villa inserted a 20 per cent sell-on into the deal, so could land around £3.5m if a Premier League club triggers Traore's £18m release clause this summer.
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Fucking hell it’s embarrassing.
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On the plus side Adama Traore might finally make an assist for us.
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"He, also known as Ho?!"
Was He given the responsibility of sacking Round? How did that go?
He: Hi Steve.
SR: Hi He.
He: Ho.
SR: Oh. Hi Ho.
He: Hi. We're giving you the heave ho.
SR: The heave ho? Who?
He: You.
SR: Me? The heave ho? Ha! Hey ho.
He: What?
SR: Nothing. Just "hey ho".
He: What?
SR: Never mind. (Collects belongings and flees madhouse)
proper tickled me
Hi Ho but no Silver Lining...
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"He, also known as Ho?!"
Was He given the responsibility of sacking Round? How did that go?
He: Hi Steve.
SR: Hi He.
He: Ho.
SR: Oh. Hi Ho.
He: Hi. We're giving you the heave ho.
SR: The heave ho? Who?
He: You.
SR: Me? The heave ho? Ha! Hey ho.
He: What?
SR: Nothing. Just "hey ho".
He: What?
SR: Never mind. (Collects belongings and flees madhouse)
proper tickled me
Hi Ho but no Silver Lining...
I'm worried that it will be a case of Hi Ho Silver Lining....And Away We Go.
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has Simon Jordan issued an update today?
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On the plus side Adama Traore might finally make an assist for us.
Quality ......that brought a smile to my face
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Maybe Putin with all his Rubles he's got hidden around Russia could buy us it can't be any worse than it is now.
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Surely we’ve got to have a proper statement soon from him!? The anger towards him is growing by the second and when Jack is sold people will really ramp it up.
Surely a blanket statement of ‘in talks about ‘x’ or I’m not selling and we’re going to crack on with a new philosophy isn’t too much to ask.
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he's still working on the best hieroglyphics
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Xia will be desperate to sell Grealish as this seems the only way that we will stay out of administration. Once we are there, the person overseeing the process will have to listen to sensible offers for all players and any offers for the club. Perhaps this is what any potential buyer is waiting for. Therefore, selling Grealish is likely to see us keeping Xia and Bruce, because we currently can't afford to sack him. If we sack him after Grealish is sold, it will leave us with way too little time to recruit a decent Manager and subsequently buy players. This is a conspiracy theory of course but I wouldn't trust Xia now, particularly as there are literally no football minded people on his operational board.
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The current uncertainty surrounding the club takes me back to the state we were in back in 1968 where an ageing board lacked the financial clout and modern thinking to stop us from plummeting down the league's and almost obscurity
We were almost broke and heading for bankruptcy before the likes of Matthews and Ellis took an interest
I think the stakes are potentially higher this time around due the the apparent volumes of debt - foreign ownership has done us little or no favours with the lack of transparency about the current owner - I do hope that the mutterings about Xia not wishing to sell to an American buyer are unfounded - we need the options to include all legitimate, interested parties.
I'm not sure if a statement from Xia will be of much credence bearing in mind his history of spouting utter pie in the sky nonsense - unless of course it's to say he has sold us to a credible buyer or consortium. Like many on here I really fear for the club's short and long term future on and off the park - we require strong leadership and clarity now more than any other time in our recent history if not ever. Let's hope there is an astute benefactor out there with a realistic vision for the future
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The current uncertainty surrounding the club takes me back to the state we were in back in 1968 where an ageing board lacked the financial clout and modern thinking to stop us from plummeting down the league's and almost obscurity
We were almost broke and heading for bankruptcy before the likes of Matthews and Ellis took an interest
I think the stakes are potentially higher this time around due the the apparent volumes of debt - foreign ownership has done us little or no favours with the lack of transparency about the current owner - I do hope that the mutterings about Xia not wishing to sell to an American buyer are unfounded - we need the options to include all legitimate, interested parties.
I'm not sure if a statement from Xia will be of much credence bearing in mind his history of spouting utter pie in the sky nonsense - unless of course it's to say he has sold us to a credible buyer or consortium. Like many on here I really fear for the club's short and long term future on and off the park - we require strong leadership and clarity now more than any other time in our recent history if not ever. Let's hope there is an astute benefactor out there with a realistic vision for the future
Have to agree. The lack of leadership is pretty astounding at the moment, even for us.
I'll be visiting Liverpool on Saturday by the way, any tips on somewhere decent to go for a drink?
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The current uncertainty surrounding the club takes me back to the state we were in back in 1968 where an ageing board lacked the financial clout and modern thinking to stop us from plummeting down the league's and almost obscurity
We were almost broke and heading for bankruptcy before the likes of Matthews and Ellis took an interest
I think the stakes are potentially higher this time around due the the apparent volumes of debt - foreign ownership has done us little or no favours with the lack of transparency about the current owner - I do hope that the mutterings about Xia not wishing to sell to an American buyer are unfounded - we need the options to include all legitimate, interested parties.
I'm not sure if a statement from Xia will be of much credence bearing in mind his history of spouting utter pie in the sky nonsense - unless of course it's to say he has sold us to a credible buyer or consortium. Like many on here I really fear for the club's short and long term future on and off the park - we require strong leadership and clarity now more than any other time in our recent history if not ever. Let's hope there is an astute benefactor out there with a realistic vision for the future
Have to agree. The lack of leadership is pretty astounding at the moment, even for us.
I'll be visiting Liverpool on Saturday by the way, any tips on somewhere decent to go for a drink?
Lots bars round Concert square. The area round Mathews St has some good boozers. There's a fan park for the world cup. Not sure where though. Probably down by the Albert dock.
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Anywhere in the City is fine - it's an eclectic mix of venues where people of all ages seem to mix happily without any edginess
Hope you have a brilliant day
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Thanks VCTM and The Edge. Looking forward to it! Been over 30 times to Liverpool and Everton but never seen the City Centre!
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he's still working on the best hieroglyphics
Let him be specific.
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he's still working on the best hieroglyphics
His mom has locked him in his bedroom with no tea and cut off the internet, blokes an imbecile.
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Xia will be desperate to sell Grealish as this seems the only way that we will stay out of administration. Once we are there, the person overseeing the process will have to listen to sensible offers for all players and any offers for the club. Perhaps this is what any potential buyer is waiting for. Therefore, selling Grealish is likely to see us keeping Xia and Bruce, because we currently can't afford to sack him. If we sack him after Grealish is sold, it will leave us with way too little time to recruit a decent Manager and subsequently buy players. This is a conspiracy theory of course but I wouldn't trust Xia now, particularly as there are literally no football minded people on his operational board.
Surely if he was desperate to sell Grealish wouldn't we have accepted an offer already?
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Pretty sure no one has made one yet, which makes accepting one pretty difficult ;)
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Just journo's trying to fill space, no-one has made a bid. The irony of the situation is that in the past we have seen great players manoeuvre their way out of Villa Park for money or glory, here we have a player that desperately wants to stay with the club he loves and through no fault of his or the supporters is being used to compensate for the worst management I have seen at Villa. I just hope that an investor can be found to allow Grealish to stay.
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each morning I wake up hoping that the last six weeks or so have been a Bobby Ewing-type dream in the shower episode and that the reality is we are back in the PL with not a care in the world.
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The shower episode,ha,still ongoing. :(
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My take for what it's worth is that any potential buyer will now back off in the hope that we slip into administration and they can pick up the club on the cheap. Why oh why do we never get a break. If Xia trying to save face is at the bottom of this then he is beneath contemp.
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I’d have thought that if Xia wants to save any face then he’d flog us in the middle of a World Cup when nobody else is looking. Bury bad news and all that. Instead he’s doing a Howard Hughes impression which makes me hate him even more.
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Save face or not, I suggest he doesn't show his around B6 any time soon.
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Thanks VCTM and The Edge. Looking forward to it! Been over 30 times to Liverpool and Everton but never seen the City Centre!
I've worked in the NW a lot while contracting and I have to say that imo Manchester is hugely overhyped for some reason. Liverpool knocks spots off it and I'm a proud Brummie.
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I don't know why anyone with the money would think that waiting for a club to go tits up before then buying it "on the cheap" is a good idea. Unless you're planning on some real estate killing, if you're looking to buy it as a going concern you'd want it as fit and healthy as possible. Surely?
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I don't know why anyone with the money would think that waiting for a club to go tits up before then buying it "on the cheap" is a good idea. Unless you're planning on some real estate killing, if you're looking to buy it as a going concern you'd want it as fit and healthy as possible. Surely?
And way more expensive.
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It’s ALWAYS about the bottom line.
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I think this ‘saving face’ business is overplayed. There’s very little face left to save. He’s fucked up from every angle. In retrospect, I think his face disappeared when he released a brief bio when he was buying us that stated he used to play football ‘in the Messi position*’.
If he wants to save Face he should fuck off to the A-Team.
*There are puns there. Lots of them.
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If someone thinks that waiting for the club to go into adminstration to buy us is a good idea then they're probably not someone we want to be sold to because it's dangerously short-sighted.
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Thanks VCTM and The Edge. Looking forward to it! Been over 30 times to Liverpool and Everton but never seen the City Centre!
The Philharmonic is a good pub.
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Thanks VCTM and The Edge. Looking forward to it! Been over 30 times to Liverpool and Everton but never seen the City Centre!
The Philharmonic is a good pub.
Is is - on Hardman St. Few good pubs around that area - Fly in the Loaf, The Grapes & The Caledonia are all pretty good too, only a short walk from the Philharmonic.
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It’s ALWAYS about the bottom line.
Then find a better vehicle for your investment than a football club that's already in the shit, otherwise you ain't ever seeing a penny coming back.
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It’s ALWAYS about the bottom line.
Then find a better vehicle for your investment than a football club that's already in the shit, otherwise you ain't ever seeing a penny coming back.
and surely be run as a cooperative ?
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This has to be the most depressing and demoralizing summer in living memory and mine goes back to the 70's. I've never known things to be so downbeat and the total silence and anything resembling good news from the club is a disgusting way to treat the masses of loyal fans. (Just had to get that off my chest lol)
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Buying a football club must be much the same thought process as buying a Range Rover V8 petrol
‘ ooooh i like that and want one, bet it goes well fast’
Yeah but it will cost you a bucket load of cash to buy,
the depreciation will be horrendous in a very short time
You’ll never get your money back
it will spend more time not working than working
and when it is it will cost you a fucking shit load in running costs
‘Yeah think I’ll get one ‘
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Re Liverpool - Ye Cracke, The Belvedere Arms and The Blackburne (nice food) are also not far from the Philharmonic. Top day out, have fun!
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Thanks VCTM and The Edge. Looking forward to it! Been over 30 times to Liverpool and Everton but never seen the City Centre!
The Philharmonic is a good pub.
Is is - on Hardman St. Few good pubs around that area - Fly in the Loaf, The Grapes & The Caledonia are all pretty good too, only a short walk from the Philharmonic.
The Philharmonic and the Grapes are my favourites on that list. Also in the same area is Ye Cracke. Little back street boozer. It's where John Lennon and Stu Sutcliffe drank when they were at art college. It also has a beer garden.
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Thanks VCTM and The Edge. Looking forward to it! Been over 30 times to Liverpool and Everton but never seen the City Centre!
Town will be buzzing tomorrow mate - there is an Irish Feish on - Water front with 3 stages - Van Morrison headlines at about 8pm - I would be there myself but it coincides with the Southport Airshow - I live close to Woodvale airfield and will be watching the vintage planes coming and going - I'm getting old !!!! Have a great weekend buddy
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I used to go to Liverpool a lot on business years ago and have very fond memories of some wild city nights at the Philharmonic and some very dodgy clubs near the cathedral. We went on the Beatles National Trust tour in March and it was a brilliant two days - a lot of the streets near Lime Street seem to have been pedestrianized since I was last there but the King's Dock area was a great improvement since I was last there
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Thanks VCTM and The Edge. Looking forward to it! Been over 30 times to Liverpool and Everton but never seen the City Centre!
Town will be buzzing tomorrow mate - there is an Irish Feish on - Water front with 3 stages - Van Morrison headlines at about 8pm - I would be there myself but it coincides with the Southport Airshow - I live close to Woodvale airfield and will be watching the vintage planes coming and going - I'm getting old !!!! Have a great weekend buddy
Great stuff. Wouldn't mind watching the planes myself but we're going to see Myles Kennedy at the 02 in the evening. Hopefully be there by 9am tomorrow, so an early start!
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Perhaps all 20,000 ST holders should ask for a refund. Disgusting treatment of the fans by these clowns running the club.
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Chester and Albert seem to be missing from the Portugal snaps on the website.
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Perhaps all 20,000 ST holders should ask for a refund. Disgusting treatment of the fans by these clowns running the club.
No thanks, i'll keep mine.
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Chester and Albert seem to be missing from the Portugal snaps on the website.
Maybe they were taking the photos.
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Does anyone know any billionaire MLS franchise owners?
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Does anyone know any billionaire MLS franchise owners?
The blokes who own New York City FC seem to have a decent handle on things...
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Open letter on Twitter just posted - can’t open it assume it’s cos many others are trying...
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Dear supporter,
Firstly, I would like to thank you for your patience during what has been an uncertain period on and off the pitch for the club. Losing out on promotion to the Premier League was a disappointment to us all – not least you, the fans, whose support took us to the brink of promotion.
I would like to apologise for the lack of communication in recent weeks. This has been largely as a consequence of the many business decisions that have been required to be taken as the implications of losing the play-off final become a reality that we must face.
I am now in a position to provide a comprehensive update on the club’s situation in the hope that we can continue our preparation for the season ahead with renewed focus and determination.
For the avoidance of doubt, I remain a proud and committed owner of this football club and with that accept and embrace the responsibilities to the fans, players and staff.
In recent weeks there have been changes at senior management level and these changes have been made with the intention of establishing a focused, calculated approach.
Of course, given the financial realities, it would be prudent of us to be open and receptive to any potential minority strategic investment that would aid our objectives to consolidate after a tumultuous summer and ultimately achieve our ambition of returning to the Premier League. We will be very selective in any discussions to ensure that the club’s best interests remain the focal point.
Having assumed the role of acting CEO, I have been working closely with the senior management team to improve efficiency and effectiveness. A more measured approach will enable us to overcome the implications of Financial Fair Play after two years of significant investment in the football department. We need to generate sufficient revenue to ensure the smooth-running of the club without compromising the standards of this great institution.
With that comes a reality check over performance and expectation for the season ahead but also the opportunity to work smartly in the transfer market, bring through young talent and draw on the experience of our manager.
I have had numerous conversations with Steve Bruce in recent weeks, which only reinforced how fortunate we are to have someone of his experience and standing in the game. His leadership will be important for us on the field, as a club and as a community and I thank him for his loyalty.
These qualities will be essential as we begin a new season with the fresh hope and expectation it inevitably brings. While we would never want to compromise our ambitions, we must however be prepared to do so in a measured and realistic manner, hence the necessary business decisions I have outlined.
Lastly, I am aware that there are a number of stories being written about the club and to be definitive I would like it to be known that:
1. I have not put the club up for sale
2. I would consider minority investment stakes that bring strategic value to the club to help us achieve our goals but this will be considered extremely carefully
3. I have not received an offer of 51%
4. I have received an offer of 30% but we did not believe there was strategic value and we did not know the source of the money
5. We have been approached numerous times and we have turned away numerous approaches
6. FFP is a burden and we need to work within the defined parameters over the course of the next 12 months and beyond and as we have done in the previous 12 months
7. To be clear, to meet FFP we need to player trade. No shareholding sale of any size will contribute to meeting FFP. We must reduce costs and increase revenue
8. Selling any size of shareholding in the club will not aid in respect to FFP
9. Steve Bruce remains in charge with my support
10. There is significant football experience within our playing department and our football administration team who will be supported by the club admin team
11. I have made significant investments into the club and all loans provided up to 31st May have now been converted into equity as part of the club’s compliance with FFP rules
12. We are bank loan free but continue to evaluate opportunities to create sensible solutions with regards to financing as is common in most business practises
13. The EFL have shown no concern over the ‘lack of football experience within the club’
14. Work continues at pace at the Recon Training Complex as a result of the HS2 project
15. Work continues on the pitch at Villa Park and is on schedule
I would like to once again thank you for all your support.
Dr Tony Xia
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The open letter that won't open.
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Open letter from who?
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Open letter from who?
Tony.
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Not very inspiring.
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Open letter from who?
The Government. The other day.
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Well that's pretty clear to be fair. Bit depressing, but clear enough.
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Open letter from who?
Tony.
Yes, sorry, I must have posted that exactly as the letter appeared. I was expecting it to be some pompous unhelpful plea to Tony from some fan.
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Apparently Bolton’s players have gone on strike because they haven’t been paid, so we might have a chance of at least finishing above them.
And any document containing the phrase ‘for the avoidance of doubt’ has been drafted by bloody lawyers.
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Also, no crying laughing emojis.
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Not very inspiring.
I didn’t expect it to be, but he does address some of the rumours. It’s quite candid, not necessarily bleak, but pragmatic. We’re not utterly fucked but we need to make some sound decisions very quickly. Players will leave some may arrive, and Bruce is manager.
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Well people wanted clarification on a number of things and that's what they've got. It'll be interesting to see what happens on the transfer front though.
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Thanks VCTM and The Edge. Looking forward to it! Been over 30 times to Liverpool and Everton but never seen the City Centre!
The Philharmonic is a good pub.
Is is - on Hardman St. Few good pubs around that area - Fly in the Loaf, The Grapes & The Caledonia are all pretty good too, only a short walk from the Philharmonic.
Depends what sort of pub you want but I like a traditional boozer with good real ale. So my suggestions (roughly in walking order :
Start at the Philharmonic as suggested above, (architecture bit like the Bartons, but with famous toilets !)
Ye Cracke on Rice Street , then the Pilgrim just over the road
Down Hardman Street towards town - find the Roscoe Head just off it on the right (not the Roscoe Arms, thats a different story entirely)
Cross over the road at the bombed out church, head down Wood Street to the Swan - great rock music jukebox
Halfway down Wood Street there are a variety of modern bars that the more youthful might rate
The Beehive in Liverpool One, if its a nice day The Pump House at Albert Dock
By then you'll be so pissed you can go anywhere but Mathew street is where the inebriated tend to end up.
Then finish off with fish and chips from the Lobster Pot opposite Central Station.
Thats what I'd do anyway haha
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https://www.avfc.co.uk/News/2018/07/06/open-letter-dr-tony-xia
Dear supporter,
Firstly, I would like to thank you for your patience during what has been an uncertain period on and off the pitch for the club. Losing out on promotion to the Premier League was a disappointment to us all – not least you, the fans, whose support took us to the brink of promotion.
I would like to apologise for the lack of communication in recent weeks. This has been largely as a consequence of the many business decisions that have been required to be taken as the implications of losing the play-off final become a reality that we must face.
I am now in a position to provide a comprehensive update on the club’s situation in the hope that we can continue our preparation for the season ahead with renewed focus and determination.
For the avoidance of doubt, I remain a proud and committed owner of this football club and with that accept and embrace the responsibilities to the fans, players and staff.
In recent weeks there have been changes at senior management level and these changes have been made with the intention of establishing a focused, calculated approach.
Of course, given the financial realities, it would be prudent of us to be open and receptive to any potential minority strategic investment that would aid our objectives to consolidate after a tumultuous summer and ultimately achieve our ambition of returning to the Premier League. We will be very selective in any discussions to ensure that the club’s best interests remain the focal point.
Having assumed the role of acting CEO, I have been working closely with the senior management team to improve efficiency and effectiveness. A more measured approach will enable us to overcome the implications of Financial Fair Play after two years of significant investment in the football department. We need to generate sufficient revenue to ensure the smooth-running of the club without compromising the standards of this great institution.
With that comes a reality check over performance and expectation for the season ahead but also the opportunity to work smartly in the transfer market, bring through young talent and draw on the experience of our manager.
I have had numerous conversations with Steve Bruce in recent weeks, which only reinforced how fortunate we are to have someone of his experience and standing in the game. His leadership will be important for us on the field, as a club and as a community and I thank him for his loyalty.
These qualities will be essential as we begin a new season with the fresh hope and expectation it inevitably brings. While we would never want to compromise our ambitions, we must however be prepared to do so in a measured and realistic manner, hence the necessary business decisions I have outlined.
Lastly, I am aware that there are a number of stories being written about the club and to be definitive I would like it to be known that:
1. I have not put the club up for sale
2. I would consider minority investment stakes that bring strategic value to the club to help us achieve our goals but this will be considered extremely carefully
3. I have not received an offer of 51%
4. I have received an offer of 30% but we did not believe there was strategic value and we did not know the source of the money
5. We have been approached numerous times and we have turned away numerous approaches
6. FFP is a burden and we need to work within the defined parameters over the course of the next 12 months and beyond and as we have done in the previous 12 months
7. To be clear, to meet FFP we need to player trade. No shareholding sale of any size will contribute to meeting FFP. We must reduce costs and increase revenue
8. Selling any size of shareholding in the club will not aid in respect to FFP
9. Steve Bruce remains in charge with my support
10. There is significant football experience within our playing department and our football administration team who will be supported by the club admin team
11. I have made significant investments into the club and all loans provided up to 31st May have now been converted into equity as part of the club’s compliance with FFP rules
12. We are bank loan free but continue to evaluate opportunities to create sensible solutions with regards to financing as is common in most business practises
13. The EFL have shown no concern over the ‘lack of football experience within the club’
14. Work continues at pace at the Recon Training Complex as a result of the HS2 project
15. Work continues on the pitch at Villa Park and is on schedule
I would like to once again thank you for all your support.
Dr Tony Xia
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Finally got a PR person to write a release.
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The one thing that would have been a tiny bit reassuring and more specific to Jack is that while it’s pretty clear we’ll be selling him and others, for Xia to have said we’re not just going to accept any old offers. That we will sell players at their proper market value.
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Yes, there is now a solicitor on the crisis board.
The crucial paragraph is where they mention bringing through youth talent and relying on SBs expertise in the transfer market.
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Reading into that statement it looks like they will consider sensible offers for any player.
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Well that's pretty clear to be fair. Bit depressing, but clear enough.
This.
Answers all the questions i had, whether i like the answers is neither here nor there.
Tells me clearly we have to sell a few names to sort out the FFP. We knew that
Tells me he has been in contact with the manager, and that some of the tabloid stuff was bullshit
And confirms he's open to investment if a sensible deal is presented.
Now can we get on with just supporting the team again and not going round in daily circles over the same old shit?
You'd think this kind of summer would bring everyone closer together behind the club they love not the total opposite
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That's the coming season mapped out then, obviously Steve Bruce is in charge, looks like we've got a fun packed season ahead of us.
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Well people wanted clarification on a number of things and that's what they've got. It'll be interesting to see what happens on the transfer front though.
It will be really interesting on the transfer front?! I'd imagine Di Matteo's decent signings will be gone and our best local player for fifty years too.
Bruce's signings? We'll be stuck with them or paying a percentage of their wages until their contract expires.
I'll give Xia the benefit of the doubt for now, but Bruce gets no such pass, he's had every advantage a manager could hope for.
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The one thing that would have been a tiny bit reassuring and more specific to Jack is that while it’s pretty clear we’ll be selling him and others, for Xia to have said we’re not just going to accept any old offers. That we will sell players at their proper market value.
Hence the reason we haven't accepted 'any old offer'. Xia might have gambled and lost but he's not completely bereft of negotiation skills.
The statement is pretty clear. Sell to buy and lower the wage bill. Bruce stays but cut anything that isn't tied down.
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We have a number of very talented kids and not all of the experienced players will leave. We now have a full season to integrate these kids as opposed to just chucking them in. This is a massive test for Bruce, but he has got promoted with less talent. As shit as this is, compared to a lot of sides in the division we will still be much better off. Warnock got Cardiff up with less than Bruce will start off with. His attitude in trying to win every single game from day one will be crucial. Bleak but not the end of the world.
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Well to be honest I found that quite therapeutic. Sure Jack is going and we are going to have to wheel and deal, but we still have a club and sounds like he’s up for a fight. We all think our great club is one of the top 6 in the country but we all know we have had our ups and downs. And it’s fucking annoying our neighbours can afford our second rate goalkeeper but hey ho we are Aston Villa and they fucking know it!
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It will be really interesting on the transfer front?! I'd imagine Di Matteo's decent signings will be gone and our best local player for fifty years too.
Bruce's signings? We'll be stuck with them or paying a percentage of their wages until their contract expires.
Gary Shaw says hello.
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It will be really interesting on the transfer front?! I'd imagine Di Matteo's decent signings will be gone and our best local player for fifty years too.
Bruce's signings? We'll be stuck with them or paying a percentage of their wages until their contract expires.
Gary Shaw says hello.
Mark Walters would like a word, as well.
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We have a number of very talented kids and not all of the experienced players will leave. We now have a full season to integrate these kids as opposed to just chucking them in. This is a massive test for Bruce, but he has got promoted with less talent. As shit as this is, compared to a lot of sides in the division we will still be much better off. Warnock got Cardiff up with less than Bruce will start off with. His attitude in trying to win every single game from day one will be crucial. Bleak but not the end of the world.
Not picking a fight, TV, because I generally like the cut of your jib, but the bit that troubles me is that I agree that Warnick (spit) got a shower of shit promoted, but I’m not sure I trust Bruce to do 5he same precisely because he lost out to said shower of shit with quite a good squad.
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It will be really interesting on the transfer front?! I'd imagine Di Matteo's decent signings will be gone and our best local player for fifty years too.
Bruce's signings? We'll be stuck with them or paying a percentage of their wages until their contract expires.
Gary Shaw says hello.
He's probably right to say hello.
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Is it He he's looking for?
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It will be really interesting on the transfer front?! I'd imagine Di Matteo's decent signings will be gone and our best local player for fifty years too.
Bruce's signings? We'll be stuck with them or paying a percentage of their wages until their contract expires.
Gary Shaw says hello.
Mark Walters would like a word, as well.
Mark Walters and his step over trick.. nah.
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Bruce in charge for the foreseeable, with vastly lowered expectations. Bright future.
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Bruce in charge for the foreseeable, with vastly lowered expectations. Bright future.
It's not Bright Future. It's The Pride. Where have you been?
I'm not sure if The Engine is before or after.
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Well that’s the softening up letter to get you already for the Grealish sale.
Steve Bruce as our manager because he can’t afford the FFP hit.
High on rhetoric, low on detail and nothing on the future Financial stability of the club or how we will deal with FFP.
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Well that’s the softening up letter to get you already for the Grealish sale.
Steve Bruce as our manager because he can’t afford the FFP hit.
High on rhetoric, low on detail and nothing on the future Financial stability of the club or how we will deal with FFP.
Selling players, lowering costs, raising revenue. Perhaps not the massive detail, but it's what he said.
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It will be really interesting on the transfer front?! I'd imagine Di Matteo's decent signings will be gone and our best local player for fifty years too.
Bruce's signings? We'll be stuck with them or paying a percentage of their wages until their contract expires.
Gary Shaw says hello.
Mark Walters would like a word, as well.
Mark Walters and his step over trick.. nah.
Tony Daley would be a better shout than Walters I reckon.
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Well that’s the softening up letter to get you already for the Grealish sale.
Steve Bruce as our manager because he can’t afford the FFP hit.
High on rhetoric, low on detail and nothing on the future Financial stability of the club or how we will deal with FFP.
I got from that we’re selling to buy and nurturing youngsters as a way of dealing with our FFP restrictions.
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Well that’s the softening up letter to get you already for the Grealish sale.
Steve Bruce as our manager because he can’t afford the FFP hit.
High on rhetoric, low on detail and nothing on the future Financial stability of the club or how we will deal with FFP.
Selling players, lowering costs, raising revenue. Perhaps not the massive detail, but it's what he said.
Lowering costs and increasing revenue, genius.
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Fans wanted him to clarify some points and he has. It might not be what people wanted to hear and for some it won't be enough. Let's just see how things pan out.
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Apparently Bolton’s players have gone on strike because they haven’t been paid, so we might have a chance of at least finishing above them.
And any document containing the phrase ‘for the avoidance of doubt’ has been drafted by bloody lawyers.
Ha! Was thinking the same thing.
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Well that’s the softening up letter to get you already for the Grealish sale.
Steve Bruce as our manager because he can’t afford the FFP hit.
High on rhetoric, low on detail and nothing on the future Financial stability of the club or how we will deal with FFP.
Selling players, lowering costs, raising revenue. Perhaps not the massive detail, but it's what he said.
Lowering costs and increasing revenue, genius.
He, er, doesn't really do detail does he?
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Well to be honest I found that quite therapeutic. Sure Jack is going and we are going to have to wheel and deal, but we still have a club and sounds like he’s up for a fight. We all think our great club is one of the top 6 in the country but we all know we have had our ups and downs. And it’s fucking annoying our neighbours can afford our second rate goalkeeper but hey ho we are Aston Villa and they fucking know it!
Well to be honest I think the opposite, I found it very depressing.
It feels like were a sinking ship and we are throwing everything overboard to stay afloat including our prize treasure.
Whats the point of bringing through young talent if we have to flog them at the first sign of them looking decent?
Yeah sure teams like Crewe have thrived on doing that but for a club like ourselves I find it embarrassing and depressing.
I wouldn't mind selling players like Jack if it would mean investment in players, but it doesn't look like were going to see that money.
Bruce is probably the best Manager available at keeping us up but Its going to be mid table at best unless a decent offer comes in. Our youth players like look very encouraging, but Someone like Bruce isint the manager to bring them through and give us entertaining football.
All the blame on FFP seems to be an excuse to me, I'm not saying its not part of it but If we had the money we could find the loopholes that other Clubs have been able to use.
Not being able to compete in the championship makes for a very dull season indeed.
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How about
“I can confirm that I have made sure that there is enough money to fund ongoing working capital requirements”
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It will be really interesting on the transfer front?! I'd imagine Di Matteo's decent signings will be gone and our best local player for fifty years too.
Bruce's signings? We'll be stuck with them or paying a percentage of their wages until their contract expires.
Gary Shaw says hello.
Mark Walters would like a word, as well.
Mark Walters and his step over trick.. nah.
Tony Daley would be a better shout than Walters I reckon.
Daley was probably my favourite player, when I was a boy. Perhaps I should have said a villa fan too - I know Daley is still close to villa but was he a fan?
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Daley is one of my all time favourite players, Walters was a better player though.
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Well to be honest I found that quite therapeutic. Sure Jack is going and we are going to have to wheel and deal, but we still have a club and sounds like he’s up for a fight. We all think our great club is one of the top 6 in the country but we all know we have had our ups and downs. And it’s fucking annoying our neighbours can afford our second rate goalkeeper but hey ho we are Aston Villa and they fucking know it!
Well to be honest I think the opposite, I found it very depressing.
It feels like were a sinking ship and we are throwing everything overboard to stay afloat including our prize treasure.
Whats the point of bringing through young talent if we have to flog them at the first sign of them looking decent?
Yeah sure teams like Crewe have thrived on doing that but for a club like ourselves I find it embarrassing and depressing.
I wouldn't mind selling players like Jack if it would mean investment in players, but it doesn't look like were going to see that money.
Bruce is probably the best Manager available at keeping us up but Its going to be mid table at best unless a decent offer comes in. Our youth players like look very encouraging, but Someone like Bruce isint the manager to bring them through and give us entertaining football.
All the blame on FFP seems to be an excuse to me, I'm not saying its not part of it but If we had the money we could find the loopholes that other Clubs have been able to use.
Not being able to compete in the championship makes for a very dull season indeed.
I hate em with a passion, but Spurs have been doing that sell to buy thing for 20 years now and they’ll do it again when they sell Kane and Ali. The only FFP loophole is promotion quickly after relegation and we didn’t do it.
Now we’ve got to do it by another way other than just throwing our money away.
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Well to be honest I found that quite therapeutic. Sure Jack is going and we are going to have to wheel and deal, but we still have a club and sounds like he’s up for a fight. We all think our great club is one of the top 6 in the country but we all know we have had our ups and downs. And it’s fucking annoying our neighbours can afford our second rate goalkeeper but hey ho we are Aston Villa and they fucking know it!
Well to be honest I think the opposite, I found it very depressing.
It feels like were a sinking ship and we are throwing everything overboard to stay afloat including our prize treasure.
Whats the point of bringing through young talent if we have to flog them at the first sign of them looking decent?
Yeah sure teams like Crewe have thrived on doing that but for a club like ourselves I find it embarrassing and depressing.
I wouldn't mind selling players like Jack if it would mean investment in players, but it doesn't look like were going to see that money.
Bruce is probably the best Manager available at keeping us up but Its going to be mid table at best unless a decent offer comes in. Our youth players like look very encouraging, but Someone like Bruce isint the manager to bring them through and give us entertaining football.
All the blame on FFP seems to be an excuse to me, I'm not saying its not part of it but If we had the money we could find the loopholes that other Clubs have been able to use.
Not being able to compete in the championship makes for a very dull season indeed.
I hate em with a passion, but Spurs have been doing that sell to buy thing for 20 years now and they’ll do it again when they sell Kane and Ali. The only FFP loophole is promotion quickly after relegation and we didn’t do it.
Now we’ve got to do it by another way other than just throwing our money away.
The difference is Spurs sell and try to buy better or invest in more players which is fine, we are not going to be able to do the same I'm afraid.
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who would buy a minority share with him at the helm? so far he has brought in a failed CEO technical director and manager
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Daley is one of my all time favourite players, Walters was a better player though.
Agreed. I love Daley but I was mortified when Walters left.
And yeah, Daley is a Villa fan.
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Daley is one of my all time favourite players, Walters was a better player though.
Agreed. I love Daley but I was mortified when Walters left.
And yeah, Daley is a Villa fan.
Some years ago there was an interview on SSN with some Villa fans before or after a game, can't remember which one, one of them was Tony and Sky didn't have a clue it was him and just lumped him in with the other fans, twats.
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Daley is one of my all time favourite players, Walters was a better player though.
Agreed. I love Daley but I was mortified when Walters left.
And yeah, Daley is a Villa fan.
Some years ago there was an interview on SSN with some Villa fans before or after a game, can't remember which one, one of them was Tony and Sky didn't have a clue it was him and just lumped him in with the other fans, twats.
Wasn't that Tony Morley?
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I know all Tonys look alike but it was definitely Daley.
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In fact it was Swiss Tony.
Winning a football game is very much like making love to a beautiful woman.
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On second thoughts Morley was the one they totally ignored when he walked past a camera crew looking for facepainted idiots.
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It was TD.
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Open letter from who?
The Government. The other day.
Well I liked it.
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Back to the statement. It doesn't paint a very good future picture. But, as far back as I can remember it is probably the most candid statement I have read from an owner that stops short of saying we are bankrupt - but at least it is honest....? He has set us up for short bids on our best players with the statement. People asked for a statement and here it is. I say well done the PR Team for at least getting something resembling sense out there. Way I read it is, expect nothing for a couple of seasons then hopefully the loyal Mr Bruce will produce a blend of upcoming youth and freebies to do a Huddersfield whilst Forest, Albion, Stoke and all of them crash and burn....
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Xia has always been bullish in his previous statements so this is a reality check if ever we needed one. He's basically admitting that players will be sold and we are playing the kids with one or 2 older heads. I'm expecting Grealish, Kodja, El Ham, Chester and Albert to all leave now and we'll do our best with not much coming in. If the kids hit their straps we could be a surprise package, look at Cardiff, Huddersfield and Bournemouth. If not we could be lower mid table. Either way when an owner like Dr X openly talks about reassessing our expectations you know they are in consolidation mode.
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As we should be - for more than a season too. 12 months from now we wont have MR's contract to worry about- thats a start
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In reality, nothing has changed since the day before the play off final.
We knew (the fans) that if we didn’t get promoted it would be tough, mainly because of FFP.
we knew we would probably lose Jack and maybe one or two others, and knew the loanees would go back.
The only real question was whether Bruce would survive which, unfortunately, he has.
Everything that has transpired since, seems based on heresay, scaremongering, bullshit and tabloid bollox.
We are no different from every other club who has to operate within their means and make the best of what they have.
The only mistake, for me, is that we are keeping Bruce, but I see the sense and benefit in keeping the continuity that brings, given all the other upheaval going on behind the scenes.
The long and the short of it is this.
We are now an established championship club and have to operate as such. We gave it a fucking good go for 2 years, failed, and are now paying the consequences.
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Open letter from who?
The Government. The other day.
Well I liked it.
I didn't. When I opened and read it, it said they were suckers.
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100% agree andyh. Needs saying loud and clear.
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100% agree andyh. Needs saying loud and clear.
Yep, agreed. It's the stark reality of where we are. Now we have go hope that Bruce can do what he's done with clubs in that position and get us up.
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I actually think the statement has been reassuring. We knew we had gambled and lost and the financial implications would be big. There has been unbelievable shit promoted in the press, most worryingly by our own local rag, so at least now we have saw sense and we have heard it from the horses mouth. And fair play on having a PR company draft it rather than Dr Tony doing it in cryptic pigeon English.
I think a large part of us stabilising a wretched bunch of players is down to Bruce but equally our failure to get promoted also falls at his door for regular bouts of boring negative football.
We know players will be sold, and before we get all upperty about it bigger and financially better off teams have had thier best players picked off - just ask Arsenal, Liverpool et al.
It is interesting to see that with about 15 images of the training camp in Portugal and Jack and Albert do not appear on any of them.
Whether it is a siege mentality or the blitz spirit I am back to actually looking forward to the season again. I actually think we can use this adversity to our favour and as others have said even without some of our better players still think we could make it.
Utv
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where does it say we are selling Jack ?
I doubt if his wages are that big a burden. OK we could spend the money we get, but lets wait and see.
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I quite like the statement, it gives facts, it’s realistic and it’s hopefully a wake up call to those fans who act like heroin addicts for big transfers and splashing cash around.
He’s doubled down on Bruce in my opinion who is as culpable as Wyness/Round for the failures of the last two seasons but he’s obviously decided and Bruce has agreed to follow through on this strategy, I think that will end up being a mistake.
Can’t say I’m looking forward to the season ahead, Bruce with a lesser squad doesn’t fill me with inspiration. It’s got mid table written all over it.
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Why does a cash-strapped club have to have a training camp in Portugal? I presume the squad didn't fly on Ryan Air with the boots and training kit in a cabin bag, and are not sleeping on a sofa bed provided by some local via airbnb. We've got a perfectly adequate training ground at Bodymoor Heath that means we don't have to fork out unnecessary travel and accommodation costs. It's also currently offering warm weather training.
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It's to acclimatise them to the sweltering Mediterranean heat they'll be playing in this November in Aston.
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Xia forgot to include the most revealing bullet point going forwards...
16. We need to sell our better players (Grealish, Chester etc) so we can continue to pay the likes of Richards and a failing manager.
While this scenario exists we will continue on the road to nowhere.
For me Xia's statement is negative and implies we're not even going to be competitive in the f-cking championship. It deliberately downplays our expectations and I'm fed up of owners and managers downplaying our expectations. We're Aston Villa and we should always be aiming for best of everything! For me,whatever the rhetoric Xia, Bruce and the likes of Richards can f-ck off!
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Xia forgot to include the most revealing bullet point going forwards...
16. We need to sell our better players (Grealish, Chester etc) so we can continue to pay the likes of Richards and a failing manager.
While this scenario exists we will continue on the road to nowhere.
For me Xia's statement is negative and implies we're not even going to be competitive in the f-cking championship. It deliberately downplays our expectations and I'm fed up of owners and managers downplaying our expectations. We're Aston Villa and we should always be aiming for best of everything! For me,whatever the rhetoric Xia, Bruce and the likes of Richards can f-ck off!
Yep we are Aston Villa but you need to give your head a wobble.
We are in trouble with FFP.
We didn’t get promoted.
We will need to sell players.
We do need to balance our books.
No amount of shouting about how big we are, or how many trophies we’ve won or what we expect is going to change a damn thing. Our club has been run really badly for the last 20 years, and every single one of the jam tomorrow shit decisions we’ve made is now coming home to roost here and now. We don’t have any money and roughly £30m FFP Grealish sized hole to fill.
Suck it up because this is where we are.
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Why does a cash-strapped club have to have a training camp in Portugal? I presume the squad didn't fly on Ryan Air with the boots and training kit in a cabin bag, and are not sleeping on a sofa bed provided by some local via airbnb. We've got a perfectly adequate training ground at Bodymoor Heath that means we don't have to fork out unnecessary travel and accommodation costs. It's also currently offering warm weather training.
By the same reasoning, why are we having a new pitch? The old one had grass on it, didn’t it?
Who has said we are cash strapped?
I am sure normal operating costs will be covered in a business as usual manner..
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In reality, nothing has changed since the day before the play off final.
We knew (the fans) that if we didn’t get promoted it would be tough, mainly because of FFP.
we knew we would probably lose Jack and maybe one or two others, and knew the loanees would go back.
The only real question was whether Bruce would survive which, unfortunately, he has.
Everything that has transpired since, seems based on heresay, scaremongering, bullshit and tabloid bollox.
We are no different from every other club who has to operate within their means and make the best of what they have.
The only mistake, for me, is that we are keeping Bruce, but I see the sense and benefit in keeping the continuity that brings, given all the other upheaval going on behind the scenes.
The long and the short of it is this.
We are now an established championship club and have to operate as such. We gave it a fucking good go for 2 years, failed, and are now paying the consequences.
Correct.
We are exactly where we were when the whistle went at Wembley.
Subsequently the guys in charge of the strategy to get us promoted have been sacked and the owner has provided further funds to keep us going day to day.
The rules of the competition we’re in prevent us from having further owner donation (however he raises it) to buy players, so we have to produce our own and then sell em to buy more.
We go again....
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In reality, nothing has changed since the day before the play off final.
Spot on. The only facts since we lost at Wembley are: all loanees returned as we knew; Terry gone but we had the one good season left in him anyway; couldn't afford to sign Johnstone and Snodgrass as we knew [Johnstone the real loss]; two highly paid top brass gone [cost-cutting]; Jack, Chester going which we knew was highly likely, painful though it is; no money because of FFP. The 'buy-our-way-straight-back' strategy was foolhardy [by one goal]. We want to be the Manchester United of the division, have become another Leeds for now and need to be a Burnley - [how it hurts to say that].
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So how did Wolves manage to spend big after they had been down so long with FFP?
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So how did Wolves manage to spend big after they had been down so long with FFP?
Same as Forest are currently doing, they didn't have any debt to begin with, I guess.
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I quite like the statement, it gives facts, it’s realistic and it’s hopefully a wake up call to those fans who act like heroin addicts for big transfers and splashing cash around.
He’s doubled down on Bruce in my opinion who is as culpable as Wyness/Round for the failures of the last two seasons but he’s obviously decided and Bruce has agreed to follow through on this strategy, I think that will end up being a mistake.
Can’t say I’m looking forward to the season ahead, Bruce with a lesser squad doesn’t fill me with inspiration. It’s got mid table written all over it.
At least it provides some much needed clarity. What concerns me though is that it is obvious the club needs some extra investment, yet Xia seems determined to stay on no matter what. I'm not sure how realistic that is and how many people there are out there who would be willing to invest significant amounts of money for no overall control of the club. I think I would have been more reassured if he had something along the lines of he was considering all options, including relinquishing control of the club should the right offer come along.
My other real concern is that with Wyness and particularly Round gone, the whole thing seems a bit directionless. He talks about moving towards a new model where the promotion of the club's young players is a key element, but who is going to oversee the implementation of such a model?
As for the playing side and FFP, I still feel there is enough 'fat' in the squad that could trimmed and enable us to keep our better players. Yes, getting rid of those players is going to be tough as we have seen previously, but hopefully it can be done even if it means easing the burden if their wages by sending them out on loan. What our situation means is that we might still be able to have a string core of players, but it will be a reduced one and will have to be supported by the young players at the club, which isn't a bad thing for me.
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We are lucky we have a Grealish to sell. We would be in a lot more trouble if we didn’t.
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So how did Wolves manage to spend big after they had been down so long with FFP?
Same as Forest are currently doing, they didn't have any debt to begin with, I guess.
You'd think Forest would have learnt.
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So how did Wolves manage to spend big after they had been down so long with FFP?
Isn’t there a rule about new owners and being allowed to spend more for short period of time?
Or is that an urban myth?
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Yep, it's a really good letter as far as i'm concerned. It puts us all in the picture and it dismisses a lot of the shite from scumbag rag papers like the Birmingham Mail. Some say it's not good reading but at least it appears to be saying that whilst we're not awash with money, we're on an even keel and it's actually FFP which is going to be the main hindrance in the transfer market. Again, we knew this 12 months ago. Personally, i don't understand the figures involved, but if selling Grealish and maybe Kodjia levels it up and gives us a few million to spend ourselves then so be it. We'd need to replace Kodjia with a cheaper option and get a couple of centre backs and maybe a goalkeeper in but that should just about do it.
And Bruce is staying, which i'm not fussed either way on, although if we had still had pretty much all the squad together from last season i would have definately wanted.
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So how did Wolves manage to spend big after they had been down so long with FFP?
Isn’t there a rule about new owners and being allowed to spend more for short period of time?
Or is that an urban myth?
It’s a UEFA rule for teams in Europe. The same rule doesn’t apply in the EFL.
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So with Dr Del Boy saying he would welcome carefully scrutinised strategic investment is everyone ready to rule him out being a genuine billionaire as he wouldn't need any kind of investment if he had any cash himself.
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In reality, nothing has changed since the day before the play off final.
We knew (the fans) that if we didn’t get promoted it would be tough, mainly because of FFP.
we knew we would probably lose Jack and maybe one or two others, and knew the loanees would go back.
The only real question was whether Bruce would survive which, unfortunately, he has.
Everything that has transpired since, seems based on heresay, scaremongering, bullshit and tabloid bollox.
We are no different from every other club who has to operate within their means and make the best of what they have.
The only mistake, for me, is that we are keeping Bruce, but I see the sense and benefit in keeping the continuity that brings, given all the other upheaval going on behind the scenes.
The long and the short of it is this.
We are now an established championship club and have to operate as such. We gave it a fucking good go for 2 years, failed, and are now paying the consequences.
I don't think anyone thought it would be this bad to be honest, I certainly didn't envisage a winding up order.
If that was a fucking good go for 2 years, God knows what it would have been like if we hadn't.
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I get all the level headed responses, I really do. But what really bugs me is how flippant people are with the realisation we are going to sell our best players. 3 names mentioned in the last 2 pages - Grealish, Chester, Kodjia. How many points have they won us on their own over the last two seasons? A bucket load. It’s been proven time and time again, a team of good players will only excel with 2 or 3 stars that add the X factor. There is nobody else that can carry us. They go, we stay down for the foreseeable future. Our kids won’t fill the gaps and keep us at the same level as last season.
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Basically mismanagement on such a scale that we won't be competing at Championship top level and have to go down the route of selling anyone any good and replacing with kids and nobodies.
And the manager and owner who have led us to this pile of shit will still be making the decisions.
Brilliant.
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the statement itself is actually quite impressive, lots of information and detail, can’t complain about that
what it actually says is less so, most importantly Bruce staying is still the biggest mistake Xia will make, but if you keep going with the same manager you will keep going round in circles
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But it's all not so bad as at least we wont be going bust. Or so says confirmed liar Dr Del.
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An example; he has basically said Spurs will sign Grealish and it will most likely be for 20m a Levy will have his pants down. I’m sure that if we had someone like Levy in charge, 20m could be raised through the sale of others - Lansbury 4-5m, hogan 5m, McCormack 2m, let Richards go on a free,Elmohammady 2m, De Laet 1m, Whelan 1m, Adomah 4m. But we won’t do that as we are not smart enough, we will take the easy money on our best players and condemn ourselves to the next few years down here
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Didn’t really say anything of substance in his latest brief. These are worrying times with tom dick and Harry knowing we are having a fire sale. Look at the squad that is in pre season camp and it hits you like a brick. What is annoying though are cheap efforts by the club to involve supporters with the much maligned new away scheme and major change to becoming a mascot. The club loses respect with such stupidity
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I get all the level headed responses, I really do. But what really bugs me is how flippant people are with the realisation we are going to sell our best players. 3 names mentioned in the last 2 pages - Grealish, Chester, Kodjia. How many points have they won us on their own over the last two seasons? A bucket load. It’s been proven time and time again, a team of good players will only excel with 2 or 3 stars that add the X factor. There is nobody else that can carry us. They go, we stay down for the foreseeable future. Our kids won’t fill the gaps and keep us at the same level as last season.
I totally agree.
I wish I could give a level headed response and put a brave face on, I'm certainly old enough too.
Unfortunately I'm fuming.
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I get all the level headed responses, I really do. But what really bugs me is how flippant people are with the realisation we are going to sell our best players. 3 names mentioned in the last 2 pages - Grealish, Chester, Kodjia. How many points have they won us on their own over the last two seasons? A bucket load. It’s been proven time and time again, a team of good players will only excel with 2 or 3 stars that add the X factor. There is nobody else that can carry us. They go, we stay down for the foreseeable future. Our kids won’t fill the gaps and keep us at the same level as last season.
I totally agree.
I wish I could give a level headed response and put a brave face on, I'm certainly old enough too.
Unfortunately I'm fuming.
Yep, a bland statement and people are rolling over to have their tummy tickled, it’s a disgrace and Xia and Bruce, the architects of this clusterfuck and are still here.
God help us.
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I get all the level headed responses, I really do. But what really bugs me is how flippant people are with the realisation we are going to sell our best players. 3 names mentioned in the last 2 pages - Grealish, Chester, Kodjia. How many points have they won us on their own over the last two seasons? A bucket load. It’s been proven time and time again, a team of good players will only excel with 2 or 3 stars that add the X factor. There is nobody else that can carry us. They go, we stay down for the foreseeable future. Our kids won’t fill the gaps and keep us at the same level as last season.
I totally agree.
I wish I could give a level headed response and put a brave face on, I'm certainly old enough too.
Unfortunately I'm fuming.
Yep, a bland statement and people are rolling over to have their tummy tickled, it’s a disgrace and Xia and Bruce, the architects of this clusterfuck and are still here.
God help us.
What are you suggesting these people who you say are 'having their tummy tickled' do then?
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An example; he has basically said Spurs will sign Grealish and it will most likely be for 20m a Levy will have his pants down. I’m sure that if we had someone like Levy in charge, 20m could be raised through the sale of others - Lansbury 4-5m, hogan 5m, McCormack 2m, let Richards go on a free,Elmohammady 2m, De Laet 1m, Whelan 1m, Adomah 4m. But we won’t do that as we are not smart enough, we will take the easy money on our best players and condemn ourselves to the next few years down here
At the risk of getting the life and soul party accountants out of bed, pretty sure it was explained it's not as simple of meeting the defecit by selling likes of McCormack and Hogan for knock down fees as it will still be counted as losses in accounts and so wouldn't meet the 40m needed for FFP.
Could be wrong though!
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I get all the level headed responses, I really do. But what really bugs me is how flippant people are with the realisation we are going to sell our best players. 3 names mentioned in the last 2 pages - Grealish, Chester, Kodjia. How many points have they won us on their own over the last two seasons? A bucket load. It’s been proven time and time again, a team of good players will only excel with 2 or 3 stars that add the X factor. There is nobody else that can carry us. They go, we stay down for the foreseeable future. Our kids won’t fill the gaps and keep us at the same level as last season.
I totally agree.
I wish I could give a level headed response and put a brave face on, I'm certainly old enough too.
Unfortunately I'm fuming.
Yep, a bland statement and people are rolling over to have their tummy tickled, it’s a disgrace and Xia and Bruce, the architects of this clusterfuck and are still here.
God help us.
What are you suggesting these people who you say are 'having their tummy tickled' do then?
Right on cue, ding dong.
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I get all the level headed responses, I really do. But what really bugs me is how flippant people are with the realisation we are going to sell our best players. 3 names mentioned in the last 2 pages - Grealish, Chester, Kodjia. How many points have they won us on their own over the last two seasons? A bucket load. It’s been proven time and time again, a team of good players will only excel with 2 or 3 stars that add the X factor. There is nobody else that can carry us. They go, we stay down for the foreseeable future. Our kids won’t fill the gaps and keep us at the same level as last season.
I totally agree.
I wish I could give a level headed response and put a brave face on, I'm certainly old enough too.
Unfortunately I'm fuming.
Yep, a bland statement and people are rolling over to have their tummy tickled, it’s a disgrace and Xia and Bruce, the architects of this clusterfuck and are still here.
God help us.
What are you suggesting these people who you say are 'having their tummy tickled' do then?
Right on cue, ding dong.
If you're going to post opinions, people are going to reply. It's the way a forum works. It was a clever way of wriggling out of the question though, i'll give you that.
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Yeah, let's get angry on the Internet. That'll show we mean business.
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It's about as detailed a statement as I've seen a club produce.
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(https://pics.me.me/i-am-so-angry-i-made-sign-me-irl-3688461.png)
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The problem is some posters here since we lost the play offs final ( by one goal) and paid a tax bill late want our owner to be outed as Carsonlite. He clearly isn’t that man and is again throwing millions in the club to keep it going.
His choice of manager is open to debate, but I think the money he puts in is not.
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“Reduce costs and increase revenue”
Good luck with that one, Tone.
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It's hard to give much credence to anything he says.
“My ambition is to bring Villa to the top six in less than five years and I hope it can be [one of] the top three in the world – even the best well known in the world – in less than 10 years,” Xia said in one of his first interviews since the deal became public.
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/may/19/tony-xia-revamp-aston-villa-top-three-world-owner
Is it possible Our Tone borrowed the money to buy the club or that he's the front man for a group of investors? That might explain his reluctance to leave the table.
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I get all the level headed responses, I really do. But what really bugs me is how flippant people are with the realisation we are going to sell our best players. 3 names mentioned in the last 2 pages - Grealish, Chester, Kodjia. How many points have they won us on their own over the last two seasons? A bucket load. It’s been proven time and time again, a team of good players will only excel with 2 or 3 stars that add the X factor. There is nobody else that can carry us. They go, we stay down for the foreseeable future. Our kids won’t fill the gaps and keep us at the same level as last season.
I totally agree.
I wish I could give a level headed response and put a brave face on, I'm certainly old enough too.
Unfortunately I'm fuming.
Yep, a bland statement and people are rolling over to have their tummy tickled, it’s a disgrace and Xia and Bruce, the architects of this clusterfuck and are still here.
God help us.
Well, it’s a detailed, not ‘bland’ statement.
I really interested in what you think any alternative solution is?
What EXACTLY has Xia done wrong (other than not sack Bruce.. (and I was/am still in favour of that)? What should he have done differently?
Rather than raging like you seem to be, or tying to accept the reality, like many others seem to be doing, please tell what other options are available to us?
I’m not having a pop at you, just interested to know your thoughts.
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Yep, a bland statement and people are rolling over to have their tummy tickled, it’s a disgrace and Xia and Bruce, the architects of this clusterfuck and are still here.
God help us.
Well, it’s a detailed, not ‘bland’ statement.
I really interested in what you think any alternative solution is?
[/quote]
He doesn't have one. Just another excuse to moan.
Wanted a statement, we got the most honest/long statement we've ever had from a chairman.
Still not good enough.
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Yep, a bland statement and people are rolling over to have their tummy tickled, it’s a disgrace and Xia and Bruce, the architects of this clusterfuck and are still here.
God help us.
Well, it’s a detailed, not ‘bland’ statement.
I really interested in what you think any alternative solution is?
He doesn't have one. Just another excuse to moan.
Wanted a statement, we got the most honest/long statement we've ever had from a chairman.
Still not good enough.
[/quote]
I think people have a right to be upset with how the club has been run.
Shit or bust is a bad business model.
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I think people have a right to be upset with how the club has been run.
Shit or bust is a bad business model.
Absolutely! and now we're going to have to put up with the repercussions of it. We've just been told that, loud and clear. And also that we know we fucked up and have a more cautious sensible period ahead of us.
So do we carry on moaning about it, which will achieve absolutely nothing or do we take it on the chin, except we've been told the situation and get on with our job which is to turn up and support the team on the pitch ?
Nobody is happy with what's happened. But it's happened. Nothing is going to change it.
It's just this groundhog day style groaning over the same things over and over that wear me out.
Buy a ticket, turn up and support the team/club, it's the only one we've got after all.
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If Tony appoints a top class CEO with vision, drive and a will to win, all could be saved. This is the most crucial, fundamental decision he has to make.
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... It’s been proven time and time again, a team of good players will only excel with 2 or 3 stars that add the X factor.
who were Cardiff’s 2 or 3 stars? Or Newcastle’s or ‘uddersfield’s the season before?
The second tier is about good management making the very best of the resources available to them, IMHO.
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I don’t think the Financial drama is over yet.
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If Tony appoints a top class CEO with vision, drive and a will to win, all could be saved. This is the most crucial, fundamental decision he has to make.
If he can find one on YTS wages then great. Otherwise it’ll be his little mate.
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I don’t think the Financial drama is over yet.
Because?
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I think people have a right to be upset with how the club has been run.
Shit or bust is a bad business model.
Thank you Sir Lord Baltimore you have put together our way forward, get behind the team & give them your support 👍
Absolutely! and now we're going to have to put up with the repercussions of it. We've just been told that, loud and clear. And also that we know we fucked up and have a more cautious sensible period ahead of us.
So do we carry on moaning about it, which will achieve absolutely nothing or do we take it on the chin, except we've been told the situation and get on with our job which is to turn up and support the team on the pitch ?
Nobody is happy with what's happened. But it's happened. Nothing is going to change it.
It's just this groundhog day style groaning over the same things over and over that wear me out.
Buy a ticket, turn up and support the team/club, it's the only one we've got after all.
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I take it we’re back to the young and hungry model again?
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I don’t think the Financial drama is over yet.
Me neither. Aston Villa this decade always seem to take "it can't get any worse" as a challenge.
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I take it we’re back to the young and hungry model again?
It's seen as a dirty phrase on here but buying players with the potential to improve and selling them at a profit is how the majority of sports teams in the world operate. If the result of this is that Xia puts a 'rule' in place that we don't sign anyone over 27 for a fee then we're instantly in a much better position than we have been for years because we've been, in my opinion, the most wasteful side in English football. For years we've relied on spending a huge amount of our budget on guys who are a few years from retirement and have no resale value and our younger players have been sidelined to make room for them time after time.
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19th May 2016:
The situation at Aston Villa “could not be worse,” Xia said.
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/may/19/tony-xia-revamp-aston-villa-top-three-world-owner
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19th May 2016:
The situation at Aston Villa “could not be worse,” Xia said.
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/may/19/tony-xia-revamp-aston-villa-top-three-world-owner
You have to laugh.
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I take it we’re back to the young and hungry model again?
AKA cheap n' cheerful (or not so cheerful as we proved under Lambert).
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I take it we’re back to the young and hungry model again?
Young and talented would be good
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I take it we’re back to the young and hungry model again?
Yeah, as long as they're not too hungry.
Food's not cheap, after all.
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At least the pride awards haven’t been tampered with to date
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More like young or hungry. Fat Micah and RM in the hungry set.
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19th May 2016:
The situation at Aston Villa “could not be worse,” Xia said.
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/may/19/tony-xia-revamp-aston-villa-top-three-world-owner
You have to laugh.
No it’s all fine, he has just issued a statement, it looks a little different to that one but hey ho.
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No one within the Management framework should get away with the total shambles the club has become, Bruce, Wyness, Round, Dr No, Dr. No's little poodle Ho, Hey or Wey.
The first three for going on a shit or bust programe that failed, the fourth one for buying into the bullshit given him by the first 3 and his poodle for being his poodle.
If Dr No had such an interest in us prior to purchase, he would have seen the way the American man child handled us and made sure we did not let it happen again, but no, lets go and buy or loan expensive misfits ( and the rare good loan), no resale value, leeches bleeding the club dry, (Richards and for his 2 years while Dr. No has been here Gabby), let the manager form another squad on wages in this division other teams can only dream about, when one of them can't even figure how to get out of his gated mansion.
His statement should have been about his pursuit to selling the club to a suitable buyer as soon as possible, but I have a terrible suspicion that the club is not the Dr's to sell, he is just a face for other people and their money, that they now don't want to sell for some unknown reason or have seen Dr No allow to be pissed up the wall and now put the brakes on the second man child in a row to be steering the good ship Aston Villa.
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So, he recieved an offer of 30%” but did not know where the money was coming from”!
Maybe The reason why he has not sold the club or (received an investment) is because no one is prepared to pay the amount which will recover his full exposure ( or whoever put the money up in the first place).
This was the same as the Lerner situation until he swallowed the reality burger.
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However it’s analysed, we are in the worst state that we have ever been in. The question is therefore whether Xia is the man to get us out of it. Sadly, I fear he isn’t, and is too stubborn to admit it; heaven only knows how the support will react if and when he shows his face at a home game again.
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I just wish the clown Tony Xia would sell-up and fuck off. A complete muppet in charge of this club! A businessman? A joke more like!
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Agreed that it is a proper mess right now and to a great extent the culmination of poor decisions and mismanagement over a long time.
But we are where we are.
If there is a 30% stake available for c.£30m to an investor(s) with the right intentions, is it time for a consortium of fans?
Not lead by someone intent of grabbing their 15 minutes in the limelight, but a democratic group that would properly represent the interests of fans - both those in the consortium and the wider fanbase.
You would need 8,000 people to invest £5,000 each to reach £40m covering the cost of buying a stake and a modest capital injection (in football terms) plus cover some of the professional fees. Obviously there are other permutations though I would be in favour of no-one being able to invest too much and then dominating the group.
I know not every fan has £5,000 (or whatever) to spare, but many do. There are Villa fans that are respected people in required professions - corporate finance, governance and legal issues, organisational change management, etc. that could provide guidance.
There are now lots of crowdfunding vehicles and services to support the process.
A representative group that would be recognised as being credible would also 'test' the current owners claim that he will only sell a stake to those with the right intentions.
Plus to me, exploring whether it is a viable option feels a better bet than expressing frustration at the current situation. UTV.
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If Tony appoints a top class CEO with vision, drive and a will to win, all could be saved.
They’ve been chatting up Mark Ashton
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If Tony appoints a top class CEO with vision, drive and a will to win, all could be saved.
They’ve been chatting up Mark Ashton
I seem to remember he was dead popular at Watford - or maybe not!!!
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If Tony appoints a top class CEO with vision, drive and a will to win, all could be saved.
They’ve been chatting up Mark Ashton
I now live in Bristol and had a season as a volunteer coach with the Bristol City Academy, 3-4 years back. It is an excellent set-up and Mark Ashton pushed for the set-up at SGS/Wise Academy, Filton that is where a big chunk of the academy is based. It was a significant investment as they were League 1 at the time.
As well as the coaching they put a lot into the behaviours and character they expect from players - and from what I saw they are doing more than paying lip service to it. Gary Probert now heads the academy (ex Gloucestershire FA) and he has a good approach from what I saw/know.
By contrast, Bristol Rovers train at the ground of the club I play for (Vets now) and they look as if they are not really looking to instill values into their players with anything like the same intent, i.e. a few things pinned up in changing rooms, where at Bristol City it informs all areas of operation.
If Mark Ashton were to come to Villa, for me it would be a step in the right direction.
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However it’s analysed, we are in the worst state that we have ever been in. The question is therefore whether Xia is the man to get us out of it. Sadly, I fear he isn’t, and is too stubborn to admit it; heaven only knows how the support will react if and when he shows his face at a home game again.
I am also concerned that he would rather hang on and do irrevocable damage to the club in a bid to try and save face than admit his failings and let it go.
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I don’t think it is just about losing Face, he will lose a shit load of money aswell if he sold up now.
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I'm thinking we should call him Xia Xia Binks such is his effectiveness.
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I don’t think it is just about losing Face, he will lose a shit load of money aswell if he sold up now.
He has lost out whenever he sells because he is still probably going to have to plough in the maximum permitted under FFP for every subsequent year that he remains in charge.
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I'm thinking we should call him Xia Xia Binks such is his effectiveness.
You're hilarious!
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His thinking will be that if he sells now, he'll take a substantial loss; whereas if he can attract some inward investment and then somehow still get us promoted in the next couple of years, it'll be win win all round. However, he doesn't seem to have realised that people buying minority shares in football clubs isn't exactly the norm in England these days, and especially when the current owner has clearly made such a huge mess of things. Not exactly going to inspire people to part with tens of millions.
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His thinking will be that if he sells now, he'll take a substantial loss; whereas if he can attract some inward investment and then somehow still get us promoted in the next couple of years, it'll be win win all round. However, he doesn't seem to have realised that people buying minority shares in football clubs isn't exactly the norm in England these days, and especially when the current owner has clearly made such a huge mess of things. Not exactly going to inspire people to part with tens of millions.
I was actually pretty optimistic about the season when I thought we up for sale. Since our imbecile owner declared he only wants to bring in minority investment I have rather less grounds for optimism. Nobody in their right mind would put a brass farthing into the club while he is at the helm.
I am still hopeful he will have to give up and sell before the season starts, and we manage to sack Bruce and appoint someone competent.
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After careful consideration of all the circumstances surrounding our owner I have come to the conclusion he's a chancer without a pot to piss in.
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His thinking will be that if he sells now, he'll take a substantial loss; whereas if he can attract some inward investment and then somehow still get us promoted in the next couple of years, it'll be win win all round. However, he doesn't seem to have realised that people buying minority shares in football clubs isn't exactly the norm in England these days, and especially when the current owner has clearly made such a huge mess of things. Not exactly going to inspire people to part with tens of millions.
Exactly he is deluded if he thinks anyone will invest and leave him as the decision maker
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How many seconds do you think it would take any corporate advisor or Investment Banker to tell him to fuck off if he came up with the idea of raising £30 to £ 40 million for a minority interest.
So we can take this part of the story as total horse shit.
Then you have to take into account everything else that has been said.
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If Tony appoints a top class CEO with vision, drive and a will to win, all could be saved.
They’ve been chatting up Mark Ashton
I seem to remember he was dead popular at Watford - or maybe not!!!
Yeah doesn't seem well regarded there but seems to have done ok at Oxford and then Bristol
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I'm thinking we should call him Xia Xia Binks such is his effectiveness.
Do you mean Jar Jar Binks? If so, if so unfortunately there appears to be no money in the jar jar or in the binks (sorry, banks). ;)
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How many seconds do you think it would take any corporate advisor or Investment Banker to tell him to fuck off if he came up with the idea of raising £30 to £ 40 million for a minority interest.
So we can take this part of the story as total horse shit.
Then you have to take into account everything else that has been said.
You're saying he's made it up? That there was no investment offer batted away?
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I think there was offers but probably the conditions placed on the investment were not to his liking.
The way things are going administration can't be far off.
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I'm thinking we should call him Xia Xia Binks such is his effectiveness.
You're hilarious!
Thanks sweetie.
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I'm thinking we should call him Xia Xia Binks such is his effectiveness.
You're hilarious!
I used to work with a woman that looked like Jar Jar Binks, she really did it was uncanny. Now that was hilarious.
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How many seconds do you think it would take any corporate advisor or Investment Banker to tell him to fuck off if he came up with the idea of raising £30 to £ 40 million for a minority interest.
So we can take this part of the story as total horse shit.
Then you have to take into account everything else that has been said.
You're saying he's made it up? That there was no investment offer batted away?
I think his statement said there was an offer but they did not know where the money was coming from( sort of ironic).
I am suggesting that raising 10 s of millions for a minority stake in Aston Villa is fanciful in the extreme.
There are situations where minority holdings are taken under these circumstances with caveats leading to changes in controll or ownership.
But a minority position without controll ? unless of course it’s some sort of ( related party transaction) see above.
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There's potentially a case for minority investment if they feel they will get their money back. i.e. promotion. Someone who is a pure investor may just feel it's worth a shot, with a view that promotion would double their investment.
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There's potentially a case for minority investment if they feel they will get their money back. i.e. promotion. Someone who is a pure investor may just feel it's worth a shot, with a view that promotion would double their investment.
If they fancy that sort of gamble we were 7:1 to be promoted so they’d get seven times back.
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There's potentially a case for minority investment if they feel they will get their money back. i.e. promotion. Someone who is a pure investor may just feel it's worth a shot, with a view that promotion would double their investment.
If they fancy that sort of gamble we were 7:1 to be promoted so they’d get seven times back.
Exactly, there are investments and gambles.
Any one putting up that sort of money would have a strategic objective, and it’s pretty difficult to work out how that is accommodated as a minority shareholder.
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There's potentially a case for minority investment if they feel they will get their money back. i.e. promotion. Someone who is a pure investor may just feel it's worth a shot, with a view that promotion would double their investment.
If they fancy that sort of gamble we were 7:1 to be promoted so they’d get seven times back.
Exactly, there are investments and gambles.
Any one putting up that sort of money would have a strategic objective, and it’s pretty difficult to work out how that is accommodated as a minority shareholder.
If we’re successful they make money, if not and we are sold they are well placed to buy out the rest of the club or they sell their shares to the next buyer. It seems unlikely but not as far fetched as some of you seem to think.
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There's potentially a case for minority investment if they feel they will get their money back. i.e. promotion. Someone who is a pure investor may just feel it's worth a shot, with a view that promotion would double their investment.
I think we would need to employ a decent CEO at this point to sell that investment opportunity to someone .I can't see why anyone with millions of pounds to invest would trust anything Xia would say
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How many seconds do you think it would take any corporate advisor or Investment Banker to tell him to fuck off if he came up with the idea of raising £30 to £ 40 million for a minority interest.
So we can take this part of the story as total horse shit.
Then you have to take into account everything else that has been said.
You're saying he's made it up? That there was no investment offer batted away?
I think his statement said there was an offer but they did not know where the money was coming from( sort of ironic).
I am suggesting that raising 10 s of millions for a minority stake in Aston Villa is fanciful in the extreme.
There are situations where minority holdings are taken under these circumstances with caveats leading to changes in controll or ownership.
But a minority position without controll ? unless of course it’s some sort of ( related party transaction) see above.
I'm confused by your position. There was an offer of investment which makes the notion of minority investment fanciful?
There's a difference between ownership and control of a company as well.
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How many seconds do you think it would take any corporate advisor or Investment Banker to tell him to fuck off if he came up with the idea of raising £30 to £ 40 million for a minority interest.
So we can take this part of the story as total horse shit.
Then you have to take into account everything else that has been said.
You're saying he's made it up? That there was no investment offer batted away?
I think his statement said there was an offer but they did not know where the money was coming from( sort of ironic).
I am suggesting that raising 10 s of millions for a minority stake in Aston Villa is fanciful in the extreme.
There are situations where minority holdings are taken under these circumstances with caveats leading to changes in controll or ownership.
But a minority position without controll ? unless of course it’s some sort of ( related party transaction) see above.
I'm confused by your position. There was an offer of investment which makes the notion of minority investment fanciful?
There's a difference between ownership and control of a company as well.
Nothing confusing at all and I think I know the difference between ownership and controll.
Which is why I used the word “ or”.
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There's potentially a case for minority investment if they feel they will get their money back. i.e. promotion. Someone who is a pure investor may just feel it's worth a shot, with a view that promotion would double their investment.
If they fancy that sort of gamble we were 7:1 to be promoted so they’d get seven times back.
Exactly, there are investments and gambles.
Any one putting up that sort of money would have a strategic objective, and it’s pretty difficult to work out how that is accommodated as a minority shareholder.
If we’re successful they make money, if not and we are sold they are well placed to buy out the rest of the club or they sell their shares to the next buyer. It seems unlikely but not as far fetched as some of you seem to think.
As I said, buying a minority stake with the possibility of taking a majority or controlling position is possible, the chances that someone will chuck 30 million+ Without that would be pretty unusual.
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How do you reconcile the position then? Somebody offered circa 30%, this is a minority stake, yet you state this is fanciful. I asked if you meant he was making it up and you said no. So I remain confused by what you mean.
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Pointless.
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The latest rumour I've heard is that Hull away tickets aren't yet on sale because Hull want paying up front and we can't afford it.
It may be bullshit as it's only circa £100k but the reality is that anything is believable right now.
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Hull tickets are going on sale next week
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https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/exclusive-milan-mandaric-interested-taking-14907227
Milan Mandaric is interested in taking over at Aston Villa and has already seen an offer knocked back, it can be revealed.
BirminghamLive has been told that the former Portsmouth, Leicester City and Sheffield Wednesday owner registered his interest last month and followed it up soon after with a bid.
It’s our understanding that Tony Xia spurned those advances in the hope of finding another way out of the financial mess that Villa currently find themselves in.
A Mandaric-led consortium wanted 51 per-cent of control and were prepared to meet Xia’s financial demands.
But they’re yet to make a breakthrough and are now understood to be weighing up the next move.
Mandaric has taken over struggling football clubs in the past, earning him the nickname, Mr Fixit.
At 79 years of age, he’s vastly experienced and is still involved in football as the president of Slovenian outfit Olimpija Ljubljana
Reasons for the latest rejection are yet to be revealed.
Meanwhile, there has also been plenty of other interest in the club.
As reported exclusively by BirminghamLive earlier this month, a blue-chip American firm saw a £30m bid for 30 per-cent of control knocked back.
These figures also matched Xia’s financial demands and were only submitted after extensive research into what the owner was prepared to sacrifice.
A takeover offer from the same group was also under consideration but never got to that stage due to the initial rejection.
So why was it dismissed?
Well, Xia claims in his statement that he didn’t know the ‘source of the money’ - yet it’s our understanding that it would have been made clear, had he asked.
On top of that, finance experts have told BirminghamLive that regulations are put in place to prevent money laundering when dealing with high-profile exchanges of ownership and control.
Therefore, any money that comes through the formal banking system, which these funds would have been, have to be vouched for by the bank that is sending it.
So those claims in his statement remain a mystery.
Another side to the story is that Xia would prefer to source investment from his homeland.
His priority appears to holding onto the club, though, and finding a funding solution himself
Local media doing some decent digging here
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Milan Mandaric and Doug Ellis joint bid ? Can't be any worse than the state we are in right now :(
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Milan Mandaric really would be the final straw.
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Why would mandaric be bad?
I thought he saved Wednesday and left when the time was right.
He knows the English game and must have contacts.
He can’t be as bad as the nightmare we have now?
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He appointed Gary Megson...
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Why would mandaric be bad?
I thought he saved Wednesday and left when the time was right.
He knows the English game and must have contacts.
He can’t be as bad as the nightmare we have now?
Step aside Brucie its time for Milan’s dodgy pal ‘arry to take charge :-(
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Why would mandaric be bad?
I thought he saved Wednesday and left when the time was right.
He knows the English game and must have contacts.
He can’t be as bad as the nightmare we have now?
Step aside Brucie its time for Milan’s dodgy pal ‘arry to take charge :-(
Triffic
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Mandric and Arry
Or
Tony and Bruce.
Tough call.
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Well, it wouldn’t be fucking ‘arry would it?
I don’t think we are in a position to turn our noses up at a rescue from the mad doctor if there is one in the offing.
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Brought Leicester for 6MIL sold them for £40mil
Brought Shef Wed for £1 sold for £37.5mil
Sold for more as left them in a far better position then when he took over.He is no mythical billionaire going to turn us into the next Man City but he knows the game and how to turn clubs around
Good read here
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/31897956
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Quite apart from anything I just cannot believe the mass revisionism when it comes to the doctor who has now turned into the biggest pariah to ever own the club from mass messiah type recognition and woe betide anyone who went against him or had the timerity to question who the fcuk he was in 2016. Just sayin’ like.
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Quite apart from anything I just cannot believe the mass revisionism when it comes to the doctor who has now turned into the biggest pariah to ever own the club from mass messiah type recognition and woe betide anyone who went against him or had the timerity to question who the fcuk he was in 2016. Just sayin’ like.
Who’s given him the messiah treatment? I think plenty of people have been sceptical of his motives/source of money but were willing to give him a chance. That he’s proven to have been a charlatan, failure and poor custodian though doesn’t prove anyone wrong or right.
What is with people wanting to prove themselves right about Tony Xia, look at me look at me I said he was a wrong ‘un and I’ve been vindicated. Well done you and your Nostradamus nose for the truth.
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A number of things don’t add up what so ever with regards potential investment. It’s been reported that Xia has turned down offers that actually met his valuation. Seems odd to go those lengths of discussion to then turn the offers down.
On the other hand we have had long term rumours that Xia is simply the ‘front’ to who actually owns us and a few articles suggesting his investors are the ones not willing to sell without a significant ROI.
Fear the latter secenario/coupled with Xia trying to not lose faith will mean things get significantly worse for us before it can get better.
He is in the process of borrowing against every asset we currently have/cashing in on transfer fees in advance etc. This strategy will run out very quickly, then what!? It’s clear he does NOT have the cash flow to keep us up and running without beg/borrowing/stealing.
Another worry is us selling for FFP. I am not confident that funds from Jacks sale etc will be used for anything except running costs of the club. Again, what happens when we’ve cashed in on all our assets.
IMO -Xia will not be in charge by end of the season (at the very latest) regardless now. Either he does the sensible thing and sells up very shortly or at somepoint we will fall into administration and he will be forced out.
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The whole future of the club seems to depend on selling Jack to keep the wolf from the door. One mistimed tackle, or studs caught in the turf as he turns, and the whole club disintegrates. That’s not a business plan.
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Quite apart from anything I just cannot believe the mass revisionism when it comes to the doctor who has now turned into the biggest pariah to ever own the club from mass messiah type recognition and woe betide anyone who went against him or had the timerity to question who the fcuk he was in 2016. Just sayin’ like.
Who’s given him the messiah treatment? I think plenty of people have been sceptical of his motives/source of money but were willing to give him a chance. That he’s proven to have been a charlatan, failure and poor custodian though doesn’t prove anyone wrong or right.
What is with people wanting to prove themselves right about Tony Xia, look at me look at me I said he was a wrong ‘un and I’ve been vindicated. Well done you and your Nostradamus nose for the truth.
I'm applauding this! My pal at work is a Jehovah's witness and revels in things like the threat of nuclear Armageddon. terrorism, etc. When the madman who runs North Korea was pissing off Trump with his weapons testing he had a smile from ear to ear "see I told you Armageddon was going to happen. We were right all along." Happens to be a villa fan too.
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Absolutely true.
Same goes for managerial appointments.
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The whole future of the club seems to depend on selling Jack to keep the wolf from the door. One mistimed tackle, or studs caught in the turf as he turns, and the whole club disintegrates. That’s not a business plan.
A bit sobering alright.
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I thought he was the one that Bolloxed Pompey....?
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Wasn't it more the Chief executive Storrie and Arry?
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Surely he would be suitably insured from a club’s perspective
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I thought he was the one that Bolloxed Pompey....?
Franco-Russian arms dealer Gaydamack.
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Milan Mandaric? Jeez.
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Is this the consortium Simon Jordan may or may not be part of?
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Looks like it.
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All for some owners who have some knowledge and have done it before
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Be interesting if some of the players are ‘injured’ today and left out.
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5m bid from Stoke for Chester is beyond ridiculous. Cnuts.
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A number of things don’t add up what so ever with regards potential investment. It’s been reported that Xia has turned down offers that actually met his valuation. Seems odd to go those lengths of discussion to then turn the offers down.
On the other hand we have had long term rumours that Xia is simply the ‘front’ to who actually owns us and a few articles suggesting his investors are the ones not willing to sell without a significant ROI.
Fear the latter secenario/coupled with Xia trying to not lose faith will mean things get significantly worse for us before it can get better.
He is in the process of borrowing against every asset we currently have/cashing in on transfer fees in advance etc. This strategy will run out very quickly, then what!? It’s clear he does NOT have the cash flow to keep us up and running without beg/borrowing/stealing.
Another worry is us selling for FFP. I am not confident that funds from Jacks sale etc will be used for anything except running costs of the club. Again, what happens when we’ve cashed in on all our assets.
IMO -Xia will not be in charge by end of the season (at the very latest) regardless now. Either he does the sensible thing and sells up very shortly or at somepoint we will fall into administration and he will be forced out.
If we are selling Grealish in order to get FFP compliant then of course we won't be spending it on new players.
That'd be like selling your watch to pay your rent but then immediately spending it on a new telly instead.
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And that’s why inward minority investment is so unlikely. New money wouldn’t be spent on new players to boost our promotion chances, but on paying the window cleaning bill. Who on earth would waste money on that?
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I reckon there's a strong likelihood of Xia doing a Lerner and going into hiding next season.
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I reckon there's a strong likelihood of Xia doing a Lerner and going into hiding next season.
I was looking forward to the next episode of #sittingwithxia as well!
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Xia in the country according to Gregg Evans on Twitter.
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A number of things don’t add up what so ever with regards potential investment. It’s been reported that Xia has turned down offers that actually met his valuation. Seems odd to go those lengths of discussion to then turn the offers down.
On the other hand we have had long term rumours that Xia is simply the ‘front’ to who actually owns us and a few articles suggesting his investors are the ones not willing to sell without a significant ROI.
Fear the latter secenario/coupled with Xia trying to not lose faith will mean things get significantly worse for us before it can get better.
He is in the process of borrowing against every asset we currently have/cashing in on transfer fees in advance etc. This strategy will run out very quickly, then what!? It’s clear he does NOT have the cash flow to keep us up and running without beg/borrowing/stealing.
Another worry is us selling for FFP. I am not confident that funds from Jacks sale etc will be used for anything except running costs of the club. Again, what happens when we’ve cashed in on all our assets.
IMO -Xia will not be in charge by end of the season (at the very latest) regardless now. Either he does the sensible thing and sells up very shortly or at somepoint we will fall into administration and he will be forced out.
If we are selling Grealish in order to get FFP compliant then of course we won't be spending it on new players.
That'd be like selling your watch to pay your rent but then immediately spending it on a new telly instead.
Didn’t mean it like that. Just meant it will be eaten up to pay off loans etc
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Hopefully, Xia jetting in means that he'll be negotiating deals for investment and transfers. We could certainly do with some positive news.
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Hopefully, Xia jetting in means that he'll be negotiating deals for investment and transfers. We could certainly do with some positive news.
I'm afraid it won't be great news - most of the negotiations will be outward bound players in a mass fire sale.
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Yes mate, most likely, but if we can bring in one or two to keep us competitive, that at least is a positive.
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Yes mate, most likely, but if we can bring in one or two to keep us competitive, that at least is a positive.
What about holding on to our better players, that would be positive.
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I would expect a few high profile exits and a couple of loans deals in before the deadline.
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Yes mate, most likely, but if we can bring in one or two to keep us competitive, that at least is a positive.
What about holding on to our better players, that would be positive.
Sounds great, but we're basically screwed by FFP according to our "expert" financial savvy bods on the board. Next months VAT and PAYE needs to be paid from player sales. A shocking mess is the reality...
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Maybe he’s realised the only way to get money out of China is to bring it with him in a suitcase!
And yes Chicago, that would be a positive. Keep our fingers crossed eh? If we had to sell them it would be great to get top dollar so we CAN replace some of them. Doubt it though.
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Chester is worth every penny of £12 million. Most consistent defender in the Championship for 2 seasons and in his prime. Stoke offering 5 is insulting, but something we have to sadly expect. I am fairly sure they will cough up about £8 million and he will be gone. Grealish I accept can go on and do much better things at a side like Spurs than we can give him in the next few years sadly, but losing Chester to Stoke for much less than he is worth will be a total kick in the nads. Xia needs to sell the place quickly.
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Maybe he’s realised the only way to get money out of China is to bring it with him in a suitcase!
And yes Chicago, that would be a positive. Keep our fingers crossed eh? If we had to sell them it would be great to get top dollar so we CAN replace some of them. Doubt it though.
He'll probably end up on one of those "Border Patrol" programmes.
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Absolutely true.
Same goes for managerial appointments.
so if we appoint a manager, get a new owner, sign a player that we don't think is any good, a shyster or just plain old rubbish it's best not to mention it at the time in case it turns out to be true
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Maybe he’s realised the only way to get money out of China is to bring it with him in a suitcase!
And yes Chicago, that would be a positive. Keep our fingers crossed eh? If we had to sell them it would be great to get top dollar so we CAN replace some of them. Doubt it though.
Yes mate, most likely, but if we can bring in one or two to keep us competitive, that at least is a positive.
What about holding on to our better players, that would be positive.
Sounds great, but we're basically screwed by FFP according to our "expert" financial savvy bods on the board. Next months VAT and PAYE needs to be paid from player sales. A shocking mess is the reality...
I thought we’d established we are in breach of or will be in breach of FFP rules unless we sell, ideally, a home grown player for profit. I think it’s logical that any money from a sale would go into the clubs coffers and used to pay the on going costs of the business. Where else does the money come from?
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Stokes offer for Chester will be the start of many derisory offers for our players, no one is going to offer market value when our manager has already stated that we do not expect market value, because we are in the shit. Top class that Brucie.
The same with the Davis rumour, if we had to sell him it has to be for cash, no good swapping for the other guy, who is probably on more per month than Davis anyhow.
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Oh goody, our chancer of an owner is here, what’s he doing this week, remortgaging another car park?
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Bruce saying we are in the shit is meaningless in terms of Stoke's bid for Chester - everyone knew we were in the shit long before that which in itself, would result in derisory offers for players.
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I know this is a false hope, but I wouldlike to think his first task would be to find a solution to the problems ,and their cost to the club of M Richards and R McCormack, if the both have serious personal issues these have to resolved. Fingers crossed
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Bruce saying we are in the shit is meaningless in terms of Stoke's bid for Chester - everyone knew we were in the shit long before that which in itself, would result in derisory offers for players.
Offers that have been rebuffed.
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Oh goody, our chancer of an owner is here, what’s he doing this week, remortgaging another car park?
I’ve just seen him playing roulette in Billy Hill’s
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Stokes offer for Chester will be the start of many derisory offers for our players, no one is going to offer market value when our manager has already stated that we do not expect market value, because we are in the shit. Top class that Brucie.
The low bids would have come in whether Bruce had said anything or not. Everyone in football knows we need the money, it wasn't exactly a closely guarded secret.
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Alan Nixon running a story on Villa today? Anyone seen it?
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Alan Nixon running a story on Villa today? Anyone seen it?
The only thing I’ve seen is Nixon’s Twitter where he says Bruce is turning to his old mate Stan Ternent for cheap players. Not sure what this means as Ternent doesn’t seem to have a job at the moment. Cheapo scout I guess.
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Is Mandaric assisting a British consortium with Simon Jordan involved ? - Hence Xia in the UK?
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Seems as though MM has come out and said he's not in a position to be involved with a takeover himself but he has been asked to help by a consortium who are interested
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MM...I thought you meant MysteryMan, the poster with insider info for a sec.
If more than one club want Chester, Grealish etc. the price will be driven up as they seek to outbid each other so it might not be too bad in terms of the final fees that they are eventually sold for.
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I think the situation gets exaggerated in the media .there is an FFP situation granted but way over the top
.
Also the squad is highly impressive so it's just getting the play right and recognise we likely to now go with out Johnstone ,snoddy ,JT and Grealish and Chester . Maybe Jedinak and Kodija.
So several loans and deals needed but also replace from within.
I think have enough to be competitive .And teams and squads who struggle recently shown they can survive and get promoted . Look at Bolton they got promotion 16/17 and were in a mess still are yet stayed up and they were struggling off the pitch.
Coventry achieved promotion too 17/18 so just because team struggle financially doesn't mean there is no hope as we have a villa squad who is capable and competitive just need to concentrate on football side of things
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The situation is not exaggerated, unfortunately.
We have a problem with FFP but much more serious than that, Xia does not have the wealth to keep the club running.
That is evident from his statement - he is looking for investment, which he admitted has nothing to do with FFP.
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Stokes offer for Chester will be the start of many derisory offers for our players, no one is going to offer market value when our manager has already stated that we do not expect market value, because we are in the shit. Top class that Brucie.
The low bids would have come in whether Bruce had said anything or not. Everyone in football knows we need the money, it wasn't exactly a closely guarded secret.
The important, and encouraging, thing, is that it was knocked back.
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Stokes offer for Chester will be the start of many derisory offers for our players, no one is going to offer market value when our manager has already stated that we do not expect market value, because we are in the shit. Top class that Brucie.
The low bids would have come in whether Bruce had said anything or not. Everyone in football knows we need the money, it wasn't exactly a closely guarded secret.
The important, and encouraging, thing, is that it was knocked back.
Yes, but for how long?
I fully expect to see below market value being offered for our players with the inclusion of add ons being paid for one thing or another.
We will definately get shafted on price unless there are more than a couple of clubs interested in any one player.
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Xia does not have the wealth to keep the club running.
He shouldn't need to. Isn't that the whole point of FFP in the first place ?
Clubs shouldn't need extra non generated cash pumping into them to pay the bills
Hence the right old mess we're in
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Xia does not have the wealth to keep the club running.
He shouldn't need to. Isn't that the whole point of FFP in the first place ?
Clubs shouldn't need extra non generated cash pumping into them to pay the bills
Hence the right old mess we're in
I don't disagree but that's the reality of it.
I'm hoping he sells up.
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Xia does not have the wealth to keep the club running.
He shouldn't need to. Isn't that the whole point of FFP in the first place ?
Clubs shouldn't need extra non generated cash pumping into them to pay the bills
Hence the right old mess we're in
Not so. FFP limits the losses to several million a year so we could be entirely compliant with FFP and still need investment to keep the lights on.
As it turns out though we're well on the path to being non-compliant with FFP so money is needed from somewhere or we'll definitely run out.
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I think the situation gets exaggerated in the media .there is an FFP situation granted but way over the top
.
Also the squad is highly impressive so it's just getting the play right and recognise we likely to now go with out Johnstone ,snoddy ,JT and Grealish and Chester . Maybe Jedinak and Kodija.
So several loans and deals needed but also replace from within.
I think have enough to be competitive .And teams and squads who struggle recently shown they can survive and get promoted . Look at Bolton they got promotion 16/17 and were in a mess still are yet stayed up and they were struggling off the pitch.
Coventry achieved promotion too 17/18 so just because team struggle financially doesn't mean there is no hope as we have a villa squad who is capable and competitive just need to concentrate on football side of things
If only this was the case, we have no idea what the squad will look like by the time they have sold all the players they can make a profit on and to keep the lights on.
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I would have more faith in a decimated senior squad being fleshed out with youth / academy players if I had faith in the Manager and coaching team to get them to actually play.
Older, experienced players using dinosaur tactics might see you through if you are lucky but younger raw talent with dinosaur tactics is a recipe for disaster.
God I hope I am proved wrong
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Do we actually have a pitch to play on yet?
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I think the situation gets exaggerated in the media .there is an FFP situation granted but way over the top
.
Also the squad is highly impressive so it's just getting the play right and recognise we likely to now go with out Johnstone ,snoddy ,JT and Grealish and Chester . Maybe Jedinak and Kodija.
So several loans and deals needed but also replace from within.
I think have enough to be competitive .And teams and squads who struggle recently shown they can survive and get promoted . Look at Bolton they got promotion 16/17 and were in a mess still are yet stayed up and they were struggling off the pitch.
Coventry achieved promotion too 17/18 so just because team struggle financially doesn't mean there is no hope as we have a villa squad who is capable and competitive just need to concentrate on football side of things
If only this was the case, we have no idea what the squad will look like by the time they have sold all the players they can make a profit on and to keep the lights on.
My lad asked me who will be our captain this season. He's 7 and I had to tell him we don't know who will be in the fucking squad yet. After the world cup, its only personal loyalty to me that keeps him on the straight and narrow.
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I hope you paraphrased the 'who will be in the fucking squad yet' for the poor little chap??
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https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/revealed-how-aston-villas-cash-14915250
BirminghamLive understands that the American group who wanted to invest in the club set out strict guidelines to Xia when they submitted a formal offer last month.
One of those was to set a fixed price tag of £40m on Grealish to act as a disincentive to sell.
They also wanted that money to be used as working capital if he did leave, but Xia rejected the approach.
Despite having takeover plans in place, too, it’s now unlikely that particular group will return.
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I hope you paraphrased the 'who will be in the fucking squad yet' for the poor little chap??
;D
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https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/revealed-how-aston-villas-cash-14915250
BirminghamLive understands that the American group who wanted to invest in the club set out strict guidelines to Xia when they submitted a formal offer last month.
One of those was to set a fixed price tag of £40m on Grealish to act as a disincentive to sell.
They also wanted that money to be used as working capital if he did leave, but Xia rejected the approach.
Despite having takeover plans in place, too, it’s now unlikely that particular group will return.
A lot of that article (including this bit) is re-hashes of stuff they put out early-mid late last week which I mentioned on here. The really are scraping round trying to make new headlines out of re-hashed article, and almost seem to be willing us to sell everyone!!
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https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/revealed-how-aston-villas-cash-14915250
BirminghamLive understands that the American group who wanted to invest in the club set out strict guidelines to Xia when they submitted a formal offer last month.
One of those was to set a fixed price tag of £40m on Grealish to act as a disincentive to sell.
They also wanted that money to be used as working capital if he did leave, but Xia rejected the approach.
Despite having takeover plans in place, too, it’s now unlikely that particular group will return.
Just what is Xia hanging on for?? If he takes us any further towards the financial abyss he will come out with nothing.
I fail to believe he is waiting for the right buyer for the club ....we have certainly been hoodwinked by Lerner and now Xia. There needs to be revolutionary change in the way the club is run -the money that has been squandered is scandalous. Furthermore we need a progressive manager pretty sharpish as for me Bruce has clearly had his day.....let's hope the right person or consortium is out there and that the current owner sells up - some investigative journalism from the Birmingham Mail would be a change - to ascertain just why Xia is over here and has he shown his face at B6
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I get the impression that the Doctor wants the 'investment' money to help prop up his other interests as I cannot see anything wrong with the 'strict guidelines' imposed by the American Group.
I believe the good Doctor is down in London today for eight hours of 'talks', goodness knows what about, satisfying the EFL that we can fulfill the season fixtures perhaps?
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I get the impression that the Doctor wants the 'investment' money to help prop up his other interests as I cannot see anything wrong with the 'strict guidelines' imposed by the American Group.
I believe the good Doctor is down in London today for eight hours of 'talks', goodness knows what about, satisfying the EFL that we can fulfill the season fixtures perhaps?
Can't see anything wrong with them? I think putting a price tag like that on Grealish, which would almost certainly block his sale and make it very difficult to pass FFP would be a problem unless it comes with a whole host of other plans on how to make up the difference if he isn't sold.
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https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/revealed-how-aston-villas-cash-14915250
BirminghamLive understands that the American group who wanted to invest in the club set out strict guidelines to Xia when they submitted a formal offer last month.
One of those was to set a fixed price tag of £40m on Grealish to act as a disincentive to sell.
They also wanted that money to be used as working capital if he did leave, but Xia rejected the approach.
Despite having takeover plans in place, too, it’s now unlikely that particular group will return.
Just what is Xia hanging on for?? If he takes us any further towards the financial abyss he will come out with nothing.
I fail to believe he is waiting for the right buyer for the club ....we have certainly been hoodwinked by Lerner and now Xia. There needs to be revolutionary change in the way the club is run -the money that has been squandered is scandalous. Furthermore we need a progressive manager pretty sharpish as for me Bruce has clearly had his day.....let's hope the right person or consortium is out there and that the current owner sells up - some investigative journalism from the Birmingham Mail would be a change - to ascertain just why Xia is over here and has he shown his face at B6
I am certainly no fan of Lerner but I don't think he 'hoodwinked' us. He had passion and was prepared to throw money around regarding the ground, the training ground, transfers and wages. I think a combination of his personal circumstances with his marriage breaking up and the club becoming less successful by the season when his original plan was for us to be successful meant he lost interest in general and certainly lost interest in throwing around any more money. If he was trying to hide his lack of interest, lack of enthusiasm and lack of desire to carry on heavily spending he didn't do it very well. As for Xia, as it stands he appears to be a chancer who gambled heavily, rolled the dice, lost and is now screwed.
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That sounds about fair.
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£40m for Jack? He’s proven to be an exceptional Championship player for 6 months. That valuation shows a worrying lack of knowledge or an understanding of our FFP issue.
Jack is a special player for Div 2 Villa I get that, but maybe a 30 goal striker might fetch that out of this league but not a midfielder.
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I think we can file the Mirror story as bollocks. £40m minimum or we won't buy the club? Right you are.
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Lerner definitely tried to hoodwink the fans in my opinion. People on here were questioning the big year-on-year losses and were told not to worry our pretty little heads about it, that it was all part of the plan.
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Lerner definitely tried to hoodwink the fans in my opinion. People on here were questioning the big year-on-year losses and were told not to worry our pretty little heads about it, that it was all part of the plan.
Lerner did haemorrhage cash at a staggering rate to have a go at cracking the Champions League in all fairness.
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Lerner's judgement of people was far more of a problem than his financial management and I don't think he could even try to hoodwink anyone over that, he just had an uncanny knack of bringing in exactly the wrong person for the job he needed doing.
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At least we knew that Lerner had money.
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That sounds yabout fair.
Seconded..I'd like to add that Lerners dick is responsible for a lot of our problems!
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I don't think Lerner tried to hoodwink us either. Like Damo said, for one reason or another, he lost interest. He always seemed to find funds for manager's in fairness too. .
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Do we actually have a pitch to play on yet?
Yes. The pitch has been lowered by nearly three feet. New drainage, under soil heating and water sprinklers have been laid. A red 4G AstroTurf has been laid between the pitch and Stands.
The pitch looked lush this afternoon. I would post a couple of pictures taken this afternoon if i knew how to, but i don't.
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That sounds yabout fair.
Seconded..I'd like to add that Lerners dick is responsible for a lot of our problems!
The dick that ent by the name of Martin O’neil.
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I standby my terminology as I feel I was fooled into thinking Lerner was in it for the long term and that he also had substantial business acumen - he seemed a " nice guy" but was easily parted with his money by those more financially astute - ergo Mrs Lerner
If your assertion is accurate and he became bored with it all it kind of mirrors his commitment and experience at the Browns .
Maybe he was naive and trusted in the wrong guys - I think Krulak was a friend of his father's' and he therefore trusted his loyalty to the family. I agree some of his deeds at the Villa were positive, as were his charitable donations to several worthwhile causes - he was pseudo reclusive so we never got to hear his voice much - if at all. Shame it didn't work as it started so promising - I still cherish the free scarf as well as a Villa/Browns half and half scarf - even though I'm a Dolphins fan :)
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I think we were all romantically nourished when Randy first arrived. Sadly, we were rather flaccid at the end.
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Lest we forget the final act of the Lerner regime was to sell to Dr Tony, what a parting gift that was.
Oh for competent owners who have some cash.
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Lest we forget the final act of the Lerner regime was to sell to Dr Tony, what a parting gift that was.
Oh for competent owners who have some cash.
I dread to think who was advising Lerner at that time - probably Donald Trump !!
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I think we can file the Mirror story as bollocks. £40m minimum or we won't buy the club? Right you are.
Not only that but it's £40m for working capital and £40m to put off potential suitors. What kind of feckin financial astuteness is that?!
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Actually I don’t have a problem with a buyer insisting that a targets prime assets are not sold under value.
Maybe the investment strategy was to build a team around Grealish, ok the 40 mil may seem far fetched but the practice of making a contingent offer under these circumstances is not unusual.
There would have been a boat load of other terms as well, if the interest was real of course.
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That sounds yabout fair.
Seconded..I'd like to add that Lerners dick is responsible for a lot of our problems!
Sorry Cheltenham. I cocked that up!
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Did Randy have an affair?
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Actually I don’t have a problem with a buyer insisting that a targets prime assets are not sold under value.
Maybe the investment strategy was to build a team around Grealish, ok the 40 mil may seem far fetched but the practice of making a contingent offer under these circumstances is not unusual.
There would have been a boat load of other terms as well, if the interest was real of course.
There might well be a buyer out there but we still have to live within our means. I don't think we have any choice but to sell Jack just to keep the show running.
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Just sell our club, Jiantong.
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Administration is a real possibility imo unless he accepts its the end of the road for his ownership.
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Lest we forget the final act of the Lerner regime was to sell to Dr Tony, what a parting gift that was.
Oh for competent owners who have some cash.
There was a fair bit of talk at the time about trusting Lerner to sell to a decent custodian of the club. The truth was that he accepted money from the first chancer who coughed up the cash.
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Lest we forget the final act of the Lerner regime was to sell to Dr Tony, what a parting gift that was.
Oh for competent owners who have some cash.
There was a fair bit of talk at the time about trusting Lerner to sell to a decent custodian of the club. The truth was that he accepted money from the first chancer who coughed up the cash.
I seem to remember there were 2 or 3 offers on the table (one of whom was supposedly that ultra rich American whose name I forget, the 8th richest bloke in the world or something like that) however Randy chose to sell to the Dr due to his impressive plans for VP and Aston.
You have to laugh or else you’d cry.
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Larry Ellison
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Lest we forget the final act of the Lerner regime was to sell to Dr Tony, what a parting gift that was.
Oh for competent owners who have some cash.
There was a fair bit of talk at the time about trusting Lerner to sell to a decent custodian of the club. The truth was that he accepted money from the first chancer who coughed up the cash.
Yep.
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Lest we forget the final act of the Lerner regime was to sell to Dr Tony, what a parting gift that was.
Oh for competent owners who have some cash.
I dread to think who was advising Lerner at that time - probably Donald Trump !!
Hollis? Mervyn King?
The thing is, FOSUN were obviously floating around the West Midlands looking for a club, too, and I find it hard to believe they wouldn't have been looking at us too? The decision to go with Tony (a guy with no credible backstory and links to people like the discredited Samuelson) as opposed to all other potential suitors is baffling. I'd love to hear Mervyn King's take on it all.
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Lest we forget the final act of the Lerner regime was to sell to Dr Tony, what a parting gift that was.
Oh for competent owners who have some cash.
I dread to think who was advising Lerner at that time - probably Donald Trump !!
Hollis? Mervyn King?
The thing is, FOSUN were obviously floating around the West Midlands looking for a club, too, and I find it hard to believe they wouldn't have been looking at us too? The decision to go with Tony (a guy with no credible backstory and links to people like the discredited Samuelson) as opposed to all other potential suitors is baffling. I'd love to hear Mervyn King's take on it all.
Mervyn King was long gone by then.
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From a very reliable 3rd party, who actually spoke to him about it, I have heard King’s take on Xia but there’s absolute no chance of getting away with posting it on here.
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From a very reliable 3rd party, who actually spoke to him about it, I have heard King’s take on Xia but there’s absolute no chance of getting away with posting it on here.
PM? :-)
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I would be interested to know just what questions are raised when looking to establish if a prospective buyer fulfils the "fit and proper person" criteria
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There was another Xia interested in the club before Fake Tone. A lawyer from Hong Kong who came to work with our group on the IOM had introduced him to Bank of America, but nothing came of it. Might be a very common Chinese name for all I know.
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I would be interested to know just what questions are raised when looking to establish if a prospective buyer fulfils the "fit and proper person" criteria
I would imagine that there's not much more to it than some sort of solvency test, and no outstanding war crimes tribunals at The Hague.
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I would be interested to know just what questions are raised when looking to establish if a prospective buyer fulfils the "fit and proper person" criteria
I would imagine that there's not much more to it than some sort of solvency test, and no outstanding war crimes tribunals at The Hague.
I don't think they set the bar that high. Honestly, give a dog a bad name....
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The E&S are reporting that a takeover could happen as early as this week.
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I hope you paraphrased the 'who will be in the fucking squad yet' for the poor little chap??
;D
I did but it’s getting harder not to just let loose with a torrent of abuse and foul language every time the club is mentioned. I told him that some of the England players used to play for Villa and that Gareth Southgate was a Villa player so he said, ‘did we used to be good then, dad?’ ‘Yes, son.’ Long pause, ‘was it a LONG time ago... was it the Middle Ages.’ Out of the mouths of babes and sucklings.
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From a very reliable 3rd party, who actually spoke to him about it, I have heard King’s take on Xia but there’s absolute no chance of getting away with posting it on here.
I thought at the time his and Berstein's swift departures may have been something to do with Randy's choice of successor, but then we heard the stories about him insulting them when pissed. I wonder if that was the start of the conversation though? Guess we'll never know.
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From a very reliable 3rd party, who actually spoke to him about it, I have heard King’s take on Xia but there’s absolute no chance of getting away with posting it on here.
I thought at the time his and Berstein's swift departures may have been something to do with Randy's choice of successor, but then we heard the stories about him insulting them when pissed. I wonder if that was the start of the conversation though? Guess we'll never know.
It probably went something like:
King : Randy, I really don't think we should be selling up to this Xia guy, he's a complete charlatan.
Randy : (slurring) Fuck you ass hole, I'll shlell to whoever has got the money, baaaarp. Who the fuck are you anyway?
And the rest is history
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Does anybody with even the vaguest of ITK links think we'll honestly get taken over this summer ?
I'm praying so but i refuse to let myself get too excited
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Does anybody with even the vaguest of ITK links think we'll honestly get taken over this summer ?
I'm praying so but i refuse to let myself get too excited
The club is being heavily pushed for sale. It's almost a case of having to, to be honest, as the alternatives don't really bear thinking about.
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I thought Dr Death didn't want to sell?
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From a very reliable 3rd party, who actually spoke to him about it, I have heard King’s take on Xia but there’s absolute no chance of getting away with posting it on here.
PM? I Won't share further....
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Does anybody with even the vaguest of ITK links think we'll honestly get taken over this summer ?
I'm praying so but i refuse to let myself get too excited
The club is being heavily pushed for sale. It's almost a case of having to, to be honest, as the alternatives don't really bear thinking about.
If they start trading for cash then the FFP situation will get even worse and where ADmin and the points deduction looks like a soft landing.
The worse case scenario is where they trade for cash and go into Admin, then we are in scorched earth territory.
As Risso says it does not bear thinking about.
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I haven't looked at the FFP at all, but could you in theory pawn the Stadium? Have a buy back option and lease it for 5-10 years?
I realise it a bonkers idea, and it would need a big incentive for the investor.
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I thought Dr Death didn't want to sell?
I could see him on one of these channel 4 programmes in the future, countdown of the worlds most heinous doctors, Dr Crippen, Dr Shipman, Dr Xia, etc...
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can someone explain in layman's terms this doomsday trading for cash scenario?
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I've just read that Bournemouth are planning to spend £57M on two players. I'm close to tears.
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I've just read that Bournemouth are planning to spend £57M on two players. I'm close to tears.
Fingers crossed it's Jedi and Birkir
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Does anybody with even the vaguest of ITK links think we'll honestly get taken over this summer ?
I'm praying so but i refuse to let myself get too excited
Yes.
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Am I the only person thinking that Simon Jordan's unusual twitter silence is a sign of something possibly happening? And I don't mean his phone is broken.
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Am I the only person thinking that Simon Jordan's unusual twitter silence is a sign of something possibly happening? And I don't mean his phone is broken.
Either that or he’s on holiday. Brean Sands Pontins would be my guess.
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I would be interested to know just what questions are raised when looking to establish if a prospective buyer fulfils the "fit and proper person" criteria
I would imagine that there's not much more to it than some sort of solvency test, and no outstanding war crimes tribunals at The Hague.
I don't think they set the bar that high. Honestly, give a dog a bad name....
He had to demonstrate that he could cover the operating costs for two seasons. Which he did.
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Am I the only person thinking that Simon Jordan's unusual twitter silence is a sign of something possibly happening? And I don't mean his phone is broken.
Either that or he’s on holiday. Brean Sands Pontins would be my guess.
I popped in there last year for a quick look round for the first time in years. It was horrendous.
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Am I the only person thinking that Simon Jordan's unusual twitter silence is a sign of something possibly happening? And I don't mean his phone is broken.
Either that or he’s on holiday. Brean Sands Pontins would be my guess.
I popped in there last year for a quick look round for the first time in years. It was horrendous.
We did the same a few weeks back as our van is down the road in Burnham. They have smartened it up a bit.
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On twitter from someone called derek o’leary An independent football reporter.
Hearing nothing from the #AVFC end unfortunately. Transfer interests are playing second fiddle to investor negotiations, but hearing that situation should be settled by Friday. Major board meeting with Xia scheduled tomorrow AM.
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Am I the only person thinking that Simon Jordan's unusual twitter silence is a sign of something possibly happening? And I don't mean his phone is broken.
Either that or he’s on holiday. Brean Sands Pontins would be my guess.
I popped in there last year for a quick look round for the first time in years. It was horrendous.
It is, he'd be mad to go there. He'll have gone to the one at Prestatyn.
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Does anybody with even the vaguest of ITK links think we'll honestly get taken over this summer ?
I'm praying so but i refuse to let myself get too excited
Yes.
Confidence level?
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I struggle to keep occasionally, but where did all that parachute payment money go?
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If you think Pontins Brean Sands and Prestatyn are bad you should have a dekko at Pontins Pakefield. Illegal immigrants pay extra not to be dropped there.
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I struggle to keep occasionally, but where did all that parachute payment money go?
our wage bill 2016/7 was 60m so mainly on that
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Does anybody with even the vaguest of ITK links think we'll honestly get taken over this summer ?
I'm praying so but i refuse to let myself get too excited
Yes.
Confidence level?
Extreme.
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Sounds promising, saying that the way things have gone down over the last few years it’ll probably be Sascha Gaydamak.
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Sounds promising, saying that the way things have gone down over the last few years it’ll probably be Sascha Gaydamak.
It's me. Xia swapped it for my caravan in Burnham.
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You were done!
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Sounds promising, saying that the way things have gone down over the last few years it’ll probably be Sascha Gaydamak.
It's me. Xia swapped it for my caravan in Burnham.
I'm suspicious.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/ex-owner-of-doncaster-rovers-jailed-for-arson-plot-1078635.html
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Does anybody with even the vaguest of ITK links think we'll honestly get taken over this summer ?
I'm praying so but i refuse to let myself get too excited
Yes.
Confidence level?
Extreme.
Not too doubt you as you're normally bang on the money but I recall you saying that Bruce resigned earlier this summer! Was it rejected??
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Am I the only person thinking that Simon Jordan's unusual twitter silence is a sign of something possibly happening? And I don't mean his phone is broken.
Either that or he’s on holiday. Brean Sands Pontins would be my guess.
I popped in there last year for a quick look round for the first time in years. It was horrendous.
It is, he'd be mad to go there. He'll have gone to the one at Prestatyn.
I was there last weekend....With the delights of the England game followed by the Vamps(Daughters christmas present)...The horror on every level.
The Vamps actually didn't deserve the grimness of the whole site...I know how Putin spent his formulative summer months now.
As for Dr Tone.... Imagine a scenario where Jack( and his family) call him out and inform him how much they enjoy Solihull and the surrounding areas...and they're quite content to see his contract out!
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Does anybody with even the vaguest of ITK links think we'll honestly get taken over this summer ?
I'm praying so but i refuse to let myself get too excited
Yes.
Confidence level?
Extreme.
Not too doubt you as you're normally bang on the money but I recall you saying that Bruce resigned earlier this summer! Was it rejected??
Eh? Bruce has never resigned or even tried to. I was pretty confident his arse was going to be shown the door rapidly post Wembley defeat until our finances started to resemble Enron.
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Also, don't get excited about a sale. It won't be to a philanthropic zillionaire if that is what people are hoping for.
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It’s all relative. Anybody with some competence would be a step up at the moment.
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Does anybody with even the vaguest of ITK links think we'll honestly get taken over this summer ?
I'm praying so but i refuse to let myself get too excited
Yes.
Confidence level?
Extreme.
Not too doubt you as you're normally bang on the money but I recall you saying that Bruce resigned earlier this summer! Was it rejected??
Eh? Bruce has never resigned or even tried to. I was pretty confident his arse was going to be shown the door rapidly post Wembley defeat until our finances started to resemble Enron.
Does anybody with even the vaguest of ITK links think we'll honestly get taken over this summer ?
I'm praying so but i refuse to let myself get too excited
Yes.
Confidence level?
Extreme.
Not too doubt you as you're normally bang on the money but I recall you saying that Bruce resigned earlier this summer! Was it rejected??
Eh? Bruce has never resigned or even tried to. I was pretty confident his arse was going to be shown the door rapidly post Wembley defeat until our finances started to resemble Enron.
Apologies Chelten, it wasn't you who claimed that towards the end of May in the Bruce Out thread.
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I standby my terminology as I feel I was fooled into thinking Lerner was in it for the long term and that he also had substantial business acumen - he seemed a " nice guy" but was easily parted with his money by those more financially astute - ergo Mrs Lerner
If your assertion is accurate and he became bored with it all it kind of mirrors his commitment and experience at the Browns .
Maybe he was naive and trusted in the wrong guys - I think Krulak was a friend of his father's' and he therefore trusted his loyalty to the family. I agree some of his deeds at the Villa were positive, as were his charitable donations to several worthwhile causes - he was pseudo reclusive so we never got to hear his voice much - if at all. Shame it didn't work as it started so promising - I still cherish the free scarf as well as a Villa/Browns half and half scarf - even though I'm a Dolphins fan :)
I don't think Lerner had any business acumen or good judgement when it came to key appointments. He was clearly very well educated and had a law degree but I think the business brain of the family was his late father.
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Sounds promising, saying that the way things have gone down over the last few years it’ll probably be Sascha Gaydamak.
Or we will be taken over in a spoof publicity stunt by Sacha Baron Cohen.
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and be forced to play in claret and blue mankinis
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If you think Pontins Brean Sands and Prestatyn are bad you should have a dekko at Pontins Pakefield. Illegal immigrants pay extra not to be dropped there.
I have fond memories of my one and only visit to Pontins Brean Sands in 2002. My son had just started walking and whilst trying to enjoy a drink and the entertainment in the family bar my wife and I had to constantly take turns to go after him on his many excursions out to the amusement arcade next to the bar as he was fascinated by all the flashing lights. We used to go to a cafe opposite the camp every morning for breakfast. My wife used to have the king size breakfast every morning and I used to have a fantastic beef madras they used to make!
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Also, don't get excited about a sale. It won't be to a philanthropic zillionaire if that is what people are hoping for.
I don't want someone loaded right now, someone who can run the club properly and stop us from cycling through wasting money before being reduced to digging down the back of the sofa and being sold. Once the club is running properly and we have a decent structure in place then I'll happily take someone with the wealth to build on it but we need to learn how to act like a proper football club because our fucking ridiculous management has been embarrassing for years.
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Also, don't get excited about a sale. It won't be to a philanthropic zillionaire if that is what people are hoping for.
I don't want someone loaded right now, someone who can run the club properly and stop us from cycling through wasting money before being reduced to digging down the back of the sofa and being sold. Once the club is running properly and we have a decent structure in place then I'll happily take someone with the wealth to build on it but we need to learn how to act like a proper football club because our fucking ridiculous management has been embarrassing for years.
I'll take somebody who can manipulate the shitty rules.
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and be forced to play in claret and blue mankinis
At least there won't be any arguments about the colour of the sleeves.
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and be forced to play in claret and blue mankinis
Already bought mine for my holidays.
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Also, don't get excited about a sale. It won't be to a philanthropic zillionaire if that is what people are hoping for.
I don't want someone loaded right now, someone who can run the club properly and stop us from cycling through wasting money before being reduced to digging down the back of the sofa and being sold. Once the club is running properly and we have a decent structure in place then I'll happily take someone with the wealth to build on it but we need to learn how to act like a proper football club because our fucking ridiculous management has been embarrassing for years.
I'll take somebody who can manipulate the shitty rules.
What you’d hope for is someone who is savvy in English Football administration and be able to hold a sensible conversation with the EFL saying “we’ve stopped the club going into administration (thus avoiding not/under paying creditors and staff) but we cannot carry the can for the chancer who has not only driven a massive hole into the FFP position but has also forward sold much of our 1819 cash flow at a hugely discounted rate. Thus, in the unlikely event we were to get promoted please take all this into account and apply some leniency”. Beyond this present a sensible and balanced business plan for the season. This may or may not reduce the risk of having to sell all of our major playing assets at a low end price, or at all.
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and be forced to play in claret and blue mankinis
Already bought mine for my holidays.
Is nice? You like?
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Does anybody with even the vaguest of ITK links think we'll honestly get taken over this summer ?
I'm praying so but i refuse to let myself get too excited
Yes.
Confidence level?
Extreme.
Not too doubt you as you're normally bang on the money but I recall you saying that Bruce resigned earlier this summer! Was it rejected??
Eh? Bruce has never resigned or even tried to. I was pretty confident his arse was going to be shown the door rapidly post Wembley defeat until our finances started to resemble Enron.
Does anybody with even the vaguest of ITK links think we'll honestly get taken over this summer ?
I'm praying so but i refuse to let myself get too excited
Yes.
Confidence level?
Extreme.
Not too doubt you as you're normally bang on the money but I recall you saying that Bruce resigned earlier this summer! Was it rejected??
Eh? Bruce has never resigned or even tried to. I was pretty confident his arse was going to be shown the door rapidly post Wembley defeat until our finances started to resemble Enron.
Apologies Chelten, it wasn't you who claimed that towards the end of May in the Bruce Out thread.
I would hope not (unless a post got misconstrued or piss taking). Because that is otherwise a load of bollocks I typed!
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Also, don't get excited about a sale. It won't be to a philanthropic zillionaire if that is what people are hoping for.
OK but how about a complete absent minded fool with buckets and buckets of cash?
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IF the club is sold imminently, as reports suggest we will be, then surely the incoming new owners would not want one of their first acts to be the sale of Kodija/Chester and homegrown wonderkid Grealish?
You would think they would want to come in on an charm offensive, not bash us over the head!
again, IF the club is sold, presumably all of the current and pending financial concerns will be gone and we will be back on an even keel, negating the immediate need to raise funds to pay for the day to day running of the club?
The only (!) issue then is the impending FFP situation, which doesn't hit us until March 2019 (?). Would the new board take the view of seeing where we are in January and in the meantime continue to negotiate with the EFL, as has been mentioned in a previous post, to minimize the potential punishments handed down.
If we are doing well in the league come Jan, then we could take a view on it.
A few 'IFS' in the above
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Nah. If it gets flogged then it is to people that will run as a business and not a rich blokes new toy. Might save us from getting our pants pulled down on sales but won't prevent the sales from happening. We are too far gone financially for that.
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Unless the owner was phenomninally rich, whereby perhaps some accord could be reached with the EFL over FFP...
The reality is if the owners are stupidly rich or have enough to keep injecting capital to keep us going without having to put a lien over the Trinity Road crockery to pay a tax bill, the problem they face is the same; a deficit in FFP that cannot be legitimately bridged without sales.
But what they can do is have a Spurs Lite policy. Spurs have become a relevant club after 10 years of flogging their best players, to a point where Walker could be sold for £50m and Trippier already be at the club
If anything has been learnt since 2006, and by us and not our owners, its that €£¥$ is less critical in many respects than the accumen we desperately need to use whatever money we have, wisely.
A transfer policy of flipping over young players and selling at a high profit is the only real way, sort of some third world human rights abusing hydrocarbon multi billionaires buying us, to get ahead.
Invest in scouting, youth and coaching; no more Ross McCormack. £12m of his fee spread across 2 or 3 youngsters, whose talent could be realised and being sold on up the chain at a high premium, would give us the money for a promotion push.
We tried it in 2013/14. Ashely Westwood (spits) bought for £1m and sold for £6m, but didn't buy enough quality, had a poor manager and the whole demeanour and nature of our struggles proved too much. Doesn't mean it was the wrong plan, just the wrong people implementing it lead to too much bilge being signed.
I'll suffer another year down here, we may have no choice, but I think some genuine upper echeclon leadership, regardless of how rich they are, might finally be the tonic for us.
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The only way to maximise income through selling home grown talent is to get a manager who invests in playing them, nurturing them, coaching them. Is that Steve Bruce? No.
Good post Ads, other than what I have written above. Bruce will not, in my view, nurture the young talent we have, enough for them to earn us our fortune. We only have to look at Keinan Davis to see that. Arguably, Bruce was given one last crack at buying our way to promotion but with no money might change tact and prove me wrong. Will be an interesting season.
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There were two England world cup players and a champions league final player who were given their chance by Bruce
I reckon that with less pressure on promotion at all costs we will see more of the kids this year
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Only because he has to. It will not be from choice.
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Also, don't get excited about a sale. It won't be to a philanthropic zillionaire if that is what people are hoping for.
That sounds to me like a good thing.
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Also, don't get excited about a sale. It won't be to a philanthropic zillionaire if that is what people are hoping for.
That sounds to me like a good thing.
It does. I desperately want us run as a proper business.
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Also, don't get excited about a sale. It won't be to a philanthropic zillionaire if that is what people are hoping for.
That sounds to me like a good thing.
It does. I desperately want us run as a proper business.
I'm a little lost tracing these posts back to origin - chelts are you saying you've got ITK on takeover prospects?
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Villa need to follow the Monaco model.
They got relegated, were bought by a billionaire who pumped in cash but then had terrible FFP problems, as basically the club had no fan base and very limited commercial income. They also had a big dispute with the LFP over tax (on player salaries). Then the billionaire's wife sued him for half his wealth, and the cash dried up.
So they started investing more in their academy and, instead of making expensive big name signings, scouted the best young talent in Europe, which they were able to attract on the basis that the kids got playing time and were never ignored in favour of ageing has-beens. The spine of their team is experienced, but the rest is "young and hungry". The result is that they now have a solid reputation as a club where young players can make the step up, so they never have any trouble convincing their targets to join them, and they've made an absolute shitload of money from selling on players.
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They never have any problem convincing their signings to join them as they're exempt from tax so have a massive unfair advantage over the rest of the league.
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They never have any problem convincing their signings to join them as they're exempt from tax so have a massive unfair advantage over the rest of the league.
So your suggestion is if we manage a peaceful yet powerful revolution, a successful self determination referendum without overspending, and then the Independent republic of Aston sets a very low tax rate, then we might have a Bright Future?
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Sounds a bit right-wing to me. I'd like to see a leftist coup, with the Army and the Secret Police relocated to somewhere nice and near the middle of the country, say Aston. Then arrange it so that the local team, which just so happens to be us, gets all the best players, and if anyone tries to beat them their players get shot.
Sensible policies for a happier Britain.
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We certainly should be going down the young players route once our ownership is sorted out.
The tried and tested method failed us big time at the crunch last season.
Only issue I can see is like anything it only takes a few defeats and suddenly young and hungry is cheap method and there's lack of ambition etc.
I didn't mind when we switched to it from 2012 onwards, trouble was our implementation was wrong. Signing likes of Lowton, Bennett and Westwood and immediately making them first team regulars when any other top level club would've had them learning from the bench or even getting loaned out as you see with how Spurs do it.
So all three were playing 30 + times and inevitably they all struggled particularly as the quality in our first team had badly declined at
that point.
Would've worked much better if we'd signed those types when likes of Young, Downing, Milner and Carew were all still at the club but instead had manager back then who'd rather sign Beye and Sidwell to warm the bench.
Other thing with young players is people constantly yearn for them to get a chance and then slag them off if they're not the new Rooney/Mbappe within ten games.
We saw it years ago with Cahill and Steven Davis who've both had brilliant careers, Albrighton was getting flak aswell for a period, Lowton got plenty and has proved himself as a reliable top 10 premier league player and now Davis and Andre Green are getting it.
Even Jack was getting plenty of criticism this time last year.
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We certainly should be going down the young players route once our ownership is sorted out.
The tried and tested method failed us big time at the crunch last season.
Only issue I can see is like anything it only takes a few defeats and suddenly young and hungry is cheap method and there's lack of ambition etc.
I didn't mind when we switched to it from 2012 onwards, trouble was our implementation was wrong. Signing likes of Lowton, Bennett and Westwood and immediately making them first team regulars when any other top level club would've had them learning from the bench or even getting loaned out as you see with how Spurs do it.
So all three were playing 30 + times and inevitably they all struggled particularly as the quality in our first team had badly declined at
that point.
Would've worked much better if we'd signed those types when likes of Young, Downing, Milner and Carew were all still at the club but instead had manager back then who'd rather sign Beye and Sidwell to warm the bench.
Other thing with young players is people constantly yearn for them to get a chance and then slag them off if they're not the new Rooney/Mbappe within ten games.
We saw it years ago with Cahill and Steven Davis who've both had brilliant careers, Albrighton was getting flak aswell for a period, Lowton got plenty and has proved himself as a reliable top 10 premier league player and now Davis and Andre Green are getting it.
Even Jack was getting plenty of criticism this time last year.
The development of a great academy should be a no-brainer - doing it properly will almost always bear plenty of fruit as long as we hire the best possible people to oversee it and run it. All too often, however, clubs hire the wrong people in their academy or simply do not give it enough attention (my son worked at the Leeds academy for two years and saw at first hand what happens when mates-of-mates and inarticulate ex-pros come into the academy).
The drafting-in of youngsters and the link between academy and first team are almost-entirely dependent on having the 'right' management and coaching team. Since Lerner came in - and perhaps before - our first-team managers / coaches do not seem to have had a great focus on youth development.
If our circumstances mean that we have to go more purposefully down this route, I'd urge the new owners to do the best possible job of having the right people in the first-team set-up and the Academy set-up. Hire the best available coaches and spend what funds we have to develop a sustainable pipeline of young talent.
Even Citeh - who have bought their way to the top - have invested strongly in their academy.
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We certainly should be going down the young players route once our ownership is sorted out.
The tried and tested method failed us big time at the crunch last season.
Only issue I can see is like anything it only takes a few defeats and suddenly young and hungry is cheap method and there's lack of ambition etc.
I didn't mind when we switched to it from 2012 onwards, trouble was our implementation was wrong. Signing likes of Lowton, Bennett and Westwood and immediately making them first team regulars when any other top level club would've had them learning from the bench or even getting loaned out as you see with how Spurs do it.
So all three were playing 30 + times and inevitably they all struggled particularly as the quality in our first team had badly declined at
that point.
Would've worked much better if we'd signed those types when likes of Young, Downing, Milner and Carew were all still at the club but instead had manager back then who'd rather sign Beye and Sidwell to warm the bench.
Other thing with young players is people constantly yearn for them to get a chance and then slag them off if they're not the new Rooney/Mbappe within ten games.
We saw it years ago with Cahill and Steven Davis who've both had brilliant careers, Albrighton was getting flak aswell for a period, Lowton got plenty and has proved himself as a reliable top 10 premier league player and now Davis and Andre Green are getting it.
Even Jack was getting plenty of criticism this time last year.
I agree on the bottom few lines, it happens far too often, I'm fairly sure there were a fair few wanting us to sell Jack last summer because at 21 he wasn't dominating games for a side that looked completely lost.
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Also, don't get excited about a sale. It won't be to a philanthropic zillionaire if that is what people are hoping for.
That sounds to me like a good thing.
It does. I desperately want us run as a proper business.
I'm a little lost tracing these posts back to origin - chelts are you saying you've got ITK on takeover prospects?
I wanted to ask the same.
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They never have any problem convincing their signings to join them as they're exempt from tax so have a massive unfair advantage over the rest of the league.
True, but I'm not convinced tax bills are a huge factor for teenagers when deciding what club to join. The club's focus on bringing through young talent is hugely attractive. They also bought a feeder club which has now just been promoted to the Belgian top flight. The whole setup is sensible, notwithstanding the tax advantages.
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and be forced to play in claret and blue mankinis
Already bought mine for my holidays.
Is nice? You like?
Yessy match
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It’s all well and good saying we need a different strategy that encourages scouting and player development.
This football philosophy has to be led from the top of the playing side of the club and Steve Bruce is about as poor a choice as you could make in this regard.
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It’s all well and good saying we need a different strategy that encourages scouting and player development.
This football philosophy has to be led from the top of the playing side of the club and Steve Bruce is about as poor a choice as you could make in this regard.
Agreed. His approach for us has been mainly tried and tested old stalwarts, young loanees from clubs he's friendly with, and a scatter gun approach to lifting the seemingly better players from other clubs at our level, without much of a clue as to how to use them or whether they fit the style we're trying to play.
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It’s all well and good saying we need a different strategy that encourages scouting and player development.
This football philosophy has to be led from the top of the playing side of the club and Steve Bruce is about as poor a choice as you could make in this regard.
Agreed. His approach for us has been mainly tried and tested old stalwarts, young loanees from clubs he's friendly with, and a scatter gun approach to lifting the seemingly better players from other clubs at our level, without much of a clue as to how to use them or whether they fit the style we're trying to play.
It's typical Bruce, he just brings in as many players as can and then works out what to do with them later. If you go through his record the number of players he's signed only to abandon them after 6 months or so is incredible.
Doing that when you're skint and don't have a huge amount of expectation is one thing, doing it at a club which has more money than it's competitors and who expected to win the league has shown it up for the brainless strategy it really is. It feeds into the idea that he never even considers anything after the next game or 2, young players are used where he has to but never nurtured into the side, injured players that he can't live without are rushed back and overplayed and often end up with further issues, backup players can go months without a look in. These are all things he did last season but that my Sunderland supporting family warned me of when he arrived.
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They never have any problem convincing their signings to join them as they're exempt from tax so have a massive unfair advantage over the rest of the league.
True, but I'm not convinced tax bills are a huge factor for teenagers when deciding what club to join. The club's focus on bringing through young talent is hugely attractive. They also bought a feeder club which has now just been promoted to the Belgian top flight. The whole setup is sensible, notwithstanding the tax advantages.
Also, the actual location is attractive, not exactly B6 :(
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I can pretty much guarantee that zero Villa players live in the B6 postal region.
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Mirror again.
Aston Villa need to find £9MILLION by end of this month to stave off another cash crisis
More huge bills are hurtling towards the Birmingham club – and officials are working frantically behind the scenes
Aston Villa will have to find over £9m by the end of the month to stave off another cash crisis at Villa Park.
More huge bills are hurtling towards the Birmingham club – and officials are working frantically behind the scenes to ensure they are met.
Wage payments to staff, tax commitments and money owed to other clubs for transfers have all contributed to the latest call on owner Dr Tony Xia.
And that means all avenues are currently being explored to ensure that Villa are not facing cashflow problems once more.
It is just two months since the problem first surfaced.
Villa are facing another cash crisis - unless they can find £9million (Image: REUTERS)
But no long-term solutions have been found and Xia appears unwilling to relinquish control with the latest £9m a minor inconvenience compared to the £75m black hole that needs filling during the next 12 months.
It appears that one route down which Villa are to progress is to raise money via mortgages secured against an estimated 25 acres of freehold property the club owns.
One of those sites is near Villa Park at Brookvale.
It is understood that Sir John Beckwith is the man who has handed over the money to set a charge against a piece of land that is used as the staff's matchday car park.
The seasoned property specialist is a former employer of Villa's chief commercial officer Luke Organ and has provided the funding.
Villa chairman Dr Tony Xia (Image: Birmingham Mail)
Beckwith has stepped in and now has legal right to around half of the land Villa own on the 12-acre site around the corner from Villa Park.
However, according to one insider that might not be the end of Beckwith's dealings with the club.
He said: “It's unlikely that it would just be one deal over the car park – there is other land which he will also take an interest in.”
Beckwith, a property mogul who is the father of socialite Tamara, knows Organ after he employed the former Wasps commercial director ten years ago.
Organ worked for a company called Frontiers that was owned by Beckwith and it was to him that he turned to raise cash.
Villa lost the Championship Play-Off final to Fulham (Image: Action Images via Reuters)
The 32-year-old is working to keep the wolves from the door and appears to be managing this in the first instance by mortgaging the club's land bank.
Xia has returned to the UK from China – and remains determined not to lose faith and see this out to the end, despite interest from potential purchasers.
One was for a minority shareholding - £30m for a 30 per cent stake – that would have almost certainly involved a right-to-buy if Xia hit further problems.
But Xia, in a statement to supporters, remains insistent that he does not want to sell the club, although with financial problems that continue to blight his running of Villa has his work cut out to keep the ship afloat financially.
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Better sell up quick to someone who knows what they're doing then Tone?
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The Dr's intransigence is steering us onto the rocks of administration. Sell up Tone or the good ship Villa's going under.
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Why is the money we supposedly need to find more this month than it was last time?
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Don’t know but I read somewhere they need to pay outstanding transfer fees for McCormack and Chester.
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Why is the money we supposedly need to find more this month than it was last time?
If the article has any basis in fact it seems that this month as well as wages and tax / ni we also have to find money to cover instalments due on transfer fees.
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Why is the money we supposedly need to find more this month than it was last time?
The shortfall last time might have not represented 100% of what was payable (ie we might have paid some of it). Or it might be something which is due quarterly. Lots of possible reasons.
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I mean it’s very apparent that we desperately need him to sell.
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Why is the money we supposedly need to find more this month than it was last time?
The shortfall last time might have not represented 100% of what was payable (ie we might have paid some of it). Or it might be something which is due quarterly. Lots of possible reasons.
I was going to simply equate it with household bills. If I currently owe a thousand quid in mortgage, gas, electric, water, telephone etc. and pay little or none of it off then I will owe more than a grand next month.
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I’d take admin now if it meant we get rid of this utter fraud
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I mean it’s very apparent that we desperately need him to sell.
That is incredibly polite.
I would have put it in different words !
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Ok, let's say we throw in the towel and go into administration. What actually happens ?
I know we get a 12 point deduction (?) and a transfer ban (like we're going to buy anyone anyway) but what else ?
I assume the FFP black hole doesn't then disappear and is still there needing to be corrected, so does someone then come in and sell off all the family silver instead of the club itself ?
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Ok, let's say we throw in the towel and go into administration. What actually happens ?
I know we get a 12 point deduction (?) and a transfer ban (like we're going to buy anyone anyway) but what else ?
I assume the FFP black hole doesn't then disappear and is still there needing to be corrected, so does someone then come in and sell off all the family silver instead of the club itself ?
certain suppliers would probably not get their money . I believe debt owed to players and other clubs still stand
so we would still have to pay messers McCormack and Richards so not very satisfactory
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Ok, let's say we throw in the towel and go into administration. What actually happens ?
I know we get a 12 point deduction (?) and a transfer ban (like we're going to buy anyone anyway) but what else ?
I assume the FFP black hole doesn't then disappear and is still there needing to be corrected, so does someone then come in and sell off all the family silver instead of the club itself ?
certain suppliers would probably not get their money . I believe debt owed to players and other clubs still stand
so we would still have to pay messers McCormack and Richards so not very satisfactory
Just sack the bastards and let them fight their own corner?
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Ok, let's say we throw in the towel and go into administration. What actually happens ?
I know we get a 12 point deduction (?) and a transfer ban (like we're going to buy anyone anyway) but what else ?
I assume the FFP black hole doesn't then disappear and is still there needing to be corrected, so does someone then come in and sell off all the family silver instead of the club itself ?
certain suppliers would probably not get their money . I believe debt owed to players and other clubs still stand
so we would still have to pay messers McCormack and Richards so not very satisfactory
Suppliers would only not get their money if they agreed to a CVA or if the club was wound up.
Administration is the process before either of those where an outside party comes in to run the club solely for the benefit of the creditors. Imagine a scenario where someone will sell whatever they can to make sure we pay Micah Richards wages - that's administration.
It really should be a last resort.
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being a villa fan for 50 years I never ever thought we would go down the same way as bham under the carson set up ffs.
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Or we could carry on spending and get this:
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2017/10/24/qpr-ordered-pay-world-record-40million-ffp-fine-losing-three/amp/
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We couldn’t, because it’s pretty evident we have no money.
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Going down the young and develop route with Bruce in charge! Sacking Round now sounds like a stupid idea as he has more about him than Bruce when it comes to developing younger players. I know it's down to money but it sounds like another poor Xia decision at this point in time.
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Harry McGuire didn't do too badly when he was younger and plucked from Sheffield United by some dinosaur.
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Just been reminded on Twitter that only 8 years ago Liverpool nearly went into administration. Living up there I remember it as real, not a false headline. Slightly different circumstances but their idiotic owners simply couldn’t magic up any more money to pay the stifling interest on their own loans. With more new owners with business acumen they got out at the 11th hour. Our starting positions differ but there is hope that by pulling the plug on the idiot in charge it doesn’t have to be a world that Pompey have occupied over a similar period
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Maguire only blossomed at Hull after Bruce had gone. Before that he was sent out on loan to Wigan and the next season started about 15 league games under Bruce in the Championship.
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Wow what a legacy, Randy left us with a pub and Xia will be leaving us hopefully very shortly without a pot to piss in and sold off the best thing to come out of B6 since HP Sauce. Well done everyone.
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I wonder how many other clubs have had 2 owners spunk well over £200m, if not nearer 250-300m, on it and it somehow ends up in one of the worst states it's ever been in. In some ways it's highly impressive to 'achieve' that.
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Indeed PWS, were a bit like a PCP on a Ford Granada, a deposit was paid, monthly payments agreed and then we got to the end of the term and realised the car wasn’t worth the outstanding finance and had to hand the keys back, except somehow we managed to do it twice.
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It’s no Ford Granada, Jon...it’s the Villa Engine.
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I’d take admin now if it meant we get rid of this utter fraud
This 100% get it all out in the open : Xia , Round, Wyness and Bruce all gone and everyone aware of what went on.
Rebuild the great club that is Aston Villa FC. Prepared.
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Harry McGuire didn't do too badly when he was younger and plucked from Sheffield United by some dinosaur.
How many more can you name? Great player, now. Bruce didn't develop him though did he?
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I would hope he will sell to someone that can at the minimum safeguard us getting totally shafted on the fees for players. 8 million for the best centre half in the championship by a street while Albion are getting 20 million for Dawson is utter madness.
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I’d take admin now if it meant we get rid of this utter fraud
This 100% get it all out in the open : Xia , Round, Wyness and Bruce all gone and everyone aware of what went on.
Rebuild the great club that is Aston Villa FC. Prepared.
This is like saying; we need to get relegated to clear all the shit out. Look what happens. It's a ridiculous notion to go into administration. 12 points worse off and the admin guy will sell anything at all to pay off creditors. Yes, that may also mean the club changes hands, but we are way over our heads in debt to keep some of these players as FFP has well and truly bitten. We will be worse off in administration.
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Harry McGuire didn't do too badly when he was younger and plucked from Sheffield United by some dinosaur.
How many more can you name? Great player, now. Bruce didn't develop him though did he?
Robertson.
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Harry McGuire didn't do too badly when he was younger and plucked from Sheffield United by some dinosaur.
How many more can you name? Great player, now. Bruce didn't develop him though did he?
Robertson.
Give up Ads :-), that barrel is being well and truly scraped.
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By a player plucked from Dundee by Bruce whose last competitive game was in the European Cup final against Real Madrid?
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By a player plucked from Dundee by Bruce whose last competitive game was in the European Cup final against Real Madrid?
And that's Steve Bruce's doing? Er, no. Bruce may have purchased him but Liverpool nurtured the talent. Yeah, give Bruce some credit for listening to one of his scouts, Robertson did really well in the Championship for Hull, fair play, but you are stretching it beyond all imagination by suggesting that Bruce is responsible for Robertson playing in the Champs League Final.
Equally, we are talking about Villa, not the teams that Bruce used ti manage, you know, those will far less resources and who really had to pick up youngsters. He tried to buy promotion and fucked it up. I hope he proves me wrong and starts having more faith in the kids. I doubt it though.
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Harry McGuire didn't do too badly when he was younger and plucked from Sheffield United by some dinosaur.
How many more can you name? Great player, now. Bruce didn't develop him though did he?
Robertson.
Here's the full list (although there's loads of villa signings missing), I'd say significantly more bad than good - https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/steve-bruce/spielertransfers/trainer/447/plus/1?station_id= (https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/steve-bruce/spielertransfers/trainer/447/plus/1?station_id=)
Robertson and McGuire are proven to have been his best 2 in recent years though.
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I’d take admin now if it meant we get rid of this utter fraud
This 100% get it all out in the open : Xia , Round, Wyness and Bruce all gone and everyone aware of what went on.
Rebuild the great club that is Aston Villa FC. Prepared.
This is like saying; we need to get relegated to clear all the shit out. Look what happens. It's a ridiculous notion to go into administration. 12 points worse off and the admin guy will sell anything at all to pay off creditors. Yes, that may also mean the club changes hands, but we are way over our heads in debt to keep some of these players as FFP has well and truly bitten. We will be worse off in administration.
Not necessarily , we need to clear our club from top to bottom. No new investment will be forthcoming to own a minority stake whilst we have a clown in the chair.
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Robertson and Maguire may have been spotted and bought by Bruce and he did well with them in their early days, but Bruce cannot possibly take any credit for their successes more recently, surely?
Some of those signings are dreadful. He really is hit and miss, not too many young players on that list either. Can this leopard change his spots?
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I’d take admin now if it meant we get rid of this utter fraud
This 100% get it all out in the open : Xia , Round, Wyness and Bruce all gone and everyone aware of what went on.
Rebuild the great club that is Aston Villa FC. Prepared.
This is like saying; we need to get relegated to clear all the shit out. Look what happens. It's a ridiculous notion to go into administration. 12 points worse off and the admin guy will sell anything at all to pay off creditors. Yes, that may also mean the club changes hands, but we are way over our heads in debt to keep some of these players as FFP has well and truly bitten. We will be worse off in administration.
Not necessarily , we need to clear our club from top to bottom. No new investment will be forthcoming to own a minority stake whilst we have a clown in the chair.
The club will be emptied full stop. And afterwards, due to ffp, there will be no money to buy players, fans will have walked away, no real income, lack of sponsors etc. This can only happen during a transfer window of course, but, administration will be catastrophic, we will lose every single player of value for practically nothing, leaving behind a bunch of kids facing relegation. Only McCormack and Richards will be left!! That's sobering enough. It will be a long way back, probably from the third tier of football. Do we, as fans, really deserve that?
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Robertson and Maguire may have been spotted and bought by Bruce and he did well with them in their early days, but Bruce cannot possibly take any credit for their successes more recently, surely?
Some of those signings are dreadful. He really is hit and miss, not too many young players on that list either. Can this leopard change his spots?
I don't think that's fair. Bruce has signed a few very good players when they were unknowns and given them their first big break, he's also given debuts to some players who've gone on to have very good careers but he's been a manager for 20 years, it would be ridiculous to think he wouldn't have some successes in that time. The issue for me is that they're surrounded by some awful signings, lets not forget this is a guy who paid £6 for Lee Cattermole and £8m for Connor Wickham, even at current prices they seem absurd, 10 years ago that was pretty much the entire summer budget for Sunderland.
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i couldn't care less who he's bought in the past and if he did or not develop them
i'm more concerned with the 23.9 million (+ the Taylor the free gift) he has spent on a lot of players on big wages and wonder whether they will earn there corn next season in getting out of this league
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i couldn't care less who he's bought in the past and if he did or not develop them
i'm more concerned with the 23.9 million (+ the Taylor the free gift) he has spent on a lot of players on big wages and wonder whether they will earn there corn next season in getting out of this league
it is relevant though because his signings with us pretty much reflect the way he's always approached the market
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By a player plucked from Dundee by Bruce whose last competitive game was in the European Cup final against Real Madrid?
And that's Steve Bruce's doing? Er, no. Bruce may have purchased him but Liverpool nurtured the talent. Yeah, give Bruce some credit for listening to one of his scouts, Robertson did really well in the Championship for Hull, fair play, but you are stretching it beyond all imagination by suggesting that Bruce is responsible for Robertson playing in the Champs League Final.
Equally, we are talking about Villa, not the teams that Bruce used ti manage, you know, those will far less resources and who really had to pick up youngsters. He tried to buy promotion and fucked it up. I hope he proves me wrong and starts having more faith in the kids. I doubt it though.
Would say Sam Clucas was his best find in recent years. At Chesterfield and played key role when Hull were promoted. Hull then sold him to Swansea for 15m.
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We certainly should be going down the young players route once our ownership is sorted out.
The tried and tested method failed us big time at the crunch last season.
Only issue I can see is like anything it only takes a few defeats and suddenly young and hungry is cheap method and there's lack of ambition etc.
I didn't mind when we switched to it from 2012 onwards, trouble was our implementation was wrong. Signing likes of Lowton, Bennett and Westwood and immediately making them first team regulars when any other top level club would've had them learning from the bench or even getting loaned out as you see with how Spurs do it.
So all three were playing 30 + times and inevitably they all struggled particularly as the quality in our first team had badly declined at
that point.
Would've worked much better if we'd signed those types when likes of Young, Downing, Milner and Carew were all still at the club but instead had manager back then who'd rather sign Beye and Sidwell to warm the bench.
Other thing with young players is people constantly yearn for them to get a chance and then slag them off if they're not the new Rooney/Mbappe within ten games.
We saw it years ago with Cahill and Steven Davis who've both had brilliant careers, Albrighton was getting flak aswell for a period, Lowton got plenty and has proved himself as a reliable top 10 premier league player and now Davis and Andre Green are getting it.
Even Jack was getting plenty of criticism this time last year.
The development of a great academy should be a no-brainer - doing it properly will almost always bear plenty of fruit as long as we hire the best possible people to oversee it and run it. All too often, however, clubs hire the wrong people in their academy or simply do not give it enough attention (my son worked at the Leeds academy for two years and saw at first hand what happens when mates-of-mates and inarticulate ex-pros come into the academy).
The drafting-in of youngsters and the link between academy and first team are almost-entirely dependent on having the 'right' management and coaching team. Since Lerner came in - and perhaps before - our first-team managers / coaches do not seem to have had a great focus on youth development.
If our circumstances mean that we have to go more purposefully down this route, I'd urge the new owners to do the best possible job of having the right people in the first-team set-up and the Academy set-up. Hire the best available coaches and spend what funds we have to develop a sustainable pipeline of young talent.
Even Citeh - who have bought their way to the top - have invested strongly in their academy.
To have that kind of set up, it is vital to not only have a Director of Football with the vision and experience to oversee the entire structure, but also a manager who fully buys into that philosophy. We don't have either.
I see our old mate Gregg Evans was at it again in the Birmingham Mail with a big headline and two page spread that we have hit a new low because we can't bring any players in at the minute (even on loan) and probably won't be able to do so until the end of the window when some players have gone. I wouldn't have thought something that was pretty obvious to anyone who has been following what's going on would have required such sensationalism, but there you go.
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Every manager makes bad signings. I give you the Djemba twins.
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Don't look back in anger......
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Every manager makes bad signings. I give you the Djemba twins.
Of course they do, Ferguson made plenty of dodgy signings, as did Wenger. If you're 50/50 or better most people forget the poor ones but if the good signings are 1 in 4/5 then it suggests problems. If that pattern exists across multiple clubs with vastly different scouting systems then it points at the manager. At Villa I think our scouting structure has been a big part of the problem for a number of years, even back in the 90s we seemed to regularly buy players because they'd been good against us.
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A very simple, cheap, easy thing Villa could do is get some acknowledgement postcards printed. Like a number of supporters over the years I have written to the club to suggest they look at promising young players. The most recent was Ollie Watkins at Exeter. I have never ever received a word of reply. I suspect our scouting set up, like many other clubs, is like what they call the 'canteen culture' in the police. A culture of hanging about windswept remote football pitches, pubs and greasy spoon motorway service area cafes. Needs bringing into the 21st century I suggest.
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By a player plucked from Dundee by Bruce whose last competitive game was in the European Cup final against Real Madrid?
And that's Steve Bruce's doing? Er, no. Bruce may have purchased him but Liverpool nurtured the talent. Yeah, give Bruce some credit for listening to one of his scouts, Robertson did really well in the Championship for Hull, fair play, but you are stretching it beyond all imagination by suggesting that Bruce is responsible for Robertson playing in the Champs League Final.
Equally, we are talking about Villa, not the teams that Bruce used ti manage, you know, those will far less resources and who really had to pick up youngsters. He tried to buy promotion and fucked it up. I hope he proves me wrong and starts having more faith in the kids. I doubt it though.
I'll concede I cannot win with such myopia. I'll.not mention Clucas.
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Does anyone know if we really do have obligations to pay £9m over to various sources tomorrow? And, just as importantly if we stand any chance of going into the new season - the most crucial now in recent history imo - without going into administration?
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By a player plucked from Dundee by Bruce whose last competitive game was in the European Cup final against Real Madrid?
And that's Steve Bruce's doing? Er, no. Bruce may have purchased him but Liverpool nurtured the talent. Yeah, give Bruce some credit for listening to one of his scouts, Robertson did really well in the Championship for Hull, fair play, but you are stretching it beyond all imagination by suggesting that Bruce is responsible for Robertson playing in the Champs League Final.
Equally, we are talking about Villa, not the teams that Bruce used ti manage, you know, those will far less resources and who really had to pick up youngsters. He tried to buy promotion and fucked it up. I hope he proves me wrong and starts having more faith in the kids. I doubt it though.
Would say Sam Clucas was his best find in recent years. At Chesterfield and played key role when Hull were promoted. Hull then sold him to Swansea for 15m.
We both, at differing times, mentioned then need to sign quality younger players and turn then on for a profit, as Spurs have.
When asked to demonstrate Bruce doing so;
McGuire - signed for £2.5m from Sheffield United and sold for £17m
Robertson - signed from Dundee for £2.85m and sold to Liverpool for £10m
Clucas - signed from Chesterfield for £1.3m and sold to Swansea for £15m
Its all somebody else's doing. It's not solely how Bruce operates, but he does have a record for signing good young players and putting his neck on the line to play them. There's no reason to assume he couldn't find and do the same here.
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I hope you’re right Ads. It’s a longer term strategy I guess and one which tells me we’re in this division for a while. Hopefully Stan Ternent has a few of those types of player up his sleeve, not as if we can afford them.
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Does anyone know if we really do have obligations to pay £9m over to various sources tomorrow? And, just as importantly if we stand any chance of going into the new season - the most crucial now in recent history imo - without going into administration?
He is kicking the can down the road in terms of player sales by securing loans against various assets. He hopes to repay these and get us the right side of FFP with player sales.
The problem is the longer sales don’t happen then the more of a funding gap he has to find which on the face of it he is now struggling to do.
I think we will somehow make it to the start of the season without going into Administration but I would standby for one of our more horrific transfer deadline days. Unless of course we get bought out.
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We’re going to lose Grealish, Chester and Kodja and several others, possibly to teams in our Division, during the last few days of the window.
That’s just the way it is.
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We’re going to lose Grealish, Chester and Kodja and several others, possibly to teams in our Division, during the last few days of the window.
That’s just the way it is.
At ridiculously low prices.
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Maybe, but it's only the intense media speculation that we're going off together with Bruce's comments which were not definitive. I find it strange that on the 19th July in a year that the transfer window closes a lot earlier we still haven't bought or sold anyone. The last time it was like this was when Lerner took over. We've still been playing the players that are supposedly on their way in the pre season games. If there is a buyout it could change things dramatically. Or it might not, but at the moment it's very much a 'believe it when I see it' with most of this 'news'.
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I would expect the reason no one has left yet is purely because the players are assets, and will be classed as such by any accountant dealing with our sale. As soon as we have been sold, then we'll see the exodus begin.
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I think you're right but it'll depend who buys us and depend on the FFP situation as to what exactly happens. I wouldn't take anything as a certainty, even Grealish going.
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I know Bruce can do no right in some people's eyes and I'm now of the opinion he's not the right man but suggesting the development of Robertson is purely down to Liverpool is incredibly myopic and the reluctance to give him any credit in the improvement shown by Jack too.
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i couldn't care less who he's bought in the past and if he did or not develop them
i'm more concerned with the 23.9 million (+ the Taylor the free gift) he has spent on a lot of players on big wages and wonder whether they will earn there corn next season in getting out of this league
There's no bigger indictment of Bruces scattergun approach to squad building than Scott Hogan. 9 million quid (I think) on a player previously pretty successful at finding the net with apparently not a single thought put into how he would integrate into the team. I wouldn't allow him to spend a penny more in the transfer market. A moot point I know right now but you get my drift?
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Bruce can very possibly take some credit for the maturing of Jack Grealish but against that has to be set the stalling of the careers of Green, Davis, Hepburn-Murphy, Suliman and O'Hare. I do not hold the view that Bruce can do nothing right only that it is too little.
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How do you consider he's stifled their careers?
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I would expect the reason no one has left yet is purely because the players are assets, and will be classed as such by any accountant dealing with our sale. As soon as we have been sold, then we'll see the exodus begin.
Cash is an asset too, with the added advantage that it can't pick up a career-ending (and therefore value-destroying) injury in the next training session.
The only reason player sales might not be happening because of a sale process going on would be because the people involved in the sale of the club just don't have the time to negotiate a player sale too.
Failing that, if we got a decent offer for any of our players they'd be sold, club sale or not.
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I know Bruce can do no right in some people's eyes and I'm now of the opinion he's not the right man but suggesting the development of Robertson is purely down to Liverpool is incredibly myopic and the reluctance to give him any credit in the improvement shown by Jack too.
To balance it out, the same people probably will give Bruce all the credit for developing Grealish into the player he's transformed into this last 2 years i'm sure
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Not everything Bruce has done is wrong, and of course there have been high points over the last two seasons, especially the last one. He brought in players like Terry, Snodgrass and Grabban, and sorted Jack out so that he now looks like a potential world beater. However, it was a shit or bust approach with few lasting benefits, and overall his standard of football and tactics, which most people thought wouldn't be good enough, weren't good enough. Half time at Wembley for the play off final was the most dejected I've felt about football in a long time. It was clear as day that Bruce had got everything wrong that day and we weren't going up, and were probably bollocksed as a result.
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Not everything Bruce has done is wrong, and of course there have been high points over the last two seasons, especially the last one. He brought in players like Terry, Snodgrass and Grabban, and sorted Jack out so that he now looks like a potential world beater. However, it was a shit or bust approach with few lasting benefits, and overall his standard of football and tactics, which most people thought wouldn't be good enough, weren't good enough. Half time at Wembley for the play off final was the most dejected I've felt about football in a long time. It was clear as day that Bruce had got everything wrong that day and we weren't going up, and were probably bollocksed as a result.
Beaten by a better team. Happens.
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It is HMRC time again and not only do we have to pay the usual monthly tax / NI payment by tomorrow - we also have to pay the annul payment of Class 1a payment which for Villa my be quite an amount due (Company cars / Private medical payments etc...)
If none of our players get sold - how do we afford the £40 million that we need?? - administration surely would be the only option??
With regards to any sale of the club don't these usually get announced that we are in negotiation to sell, I cannot remember that being mentioned by the club. And if Dr Tony companies are on the Chinese stock exchange, would it not have to be announced on there.
For me any sale of the club is weeks away, as no one is going to buy without doing a proper audit of the clubs finances.
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It is HMRC time again and not only do we have to pay the usual monthly tax / NI payment by tomorrow - we also have to pay the annul payment of Class 1a payment which for Villa my be quite an amount due (Company cars / Private medical payments etc...)
If none of our players get sold - how do we afford the £40 million that we need?? - administration surely would be the only option??
With regards to any sale of the club don't these usually get announced that we are in negotiation to sell, I cannot remember that being mentioned by the club. And if Dr Tony companies are on the Chinese stock exchange, would it not have to be announced on there.
For me any sale of the club is weeks away, as no one is going to buy without doing a proper audit of the clubs finances.
How do we know this hasn't already been done?
Simon Jordan on Talksport, for example, advising he was part of something trying to 'do something' with regards to the club. Surely they would have access to everything before saying that?
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I would expect the reason no one has left yet is purely because the players are assets, and will be classed as such by any accountant dealing with our sale. As soon as we have been sold, then we'll see the exodus begin.
Cash is an asset too, with the added advantage that it can't pick up a career-ending (and therefore value-destroying) injury in the next training session.
The only reason player sales might not be happening because of a sale process going on would be because the people involved in the sale of the club just don't have the time to negotiate a player sale too.
Failing that, if we got a decent offer for any of our players they'd be sold, club sale or not.
It’s not unusual if a sale is in advanced stage ( heads of terms) that both parties agree that no significant financial transactions would be undertaken within a given time frame.
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https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/aston-villa-owner-tony-xia-14927992
Thatcherlover on Twitter saying ’Villa are saved’ has been on ball before.
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That sounds positive. What would be really positive is that we don’t have to sell Jack or Chester.
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Twitter saying Middle East investment and no incomings or OUTGOINGS !! Tied to that.
Now, wouldn’t that be lovely?
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Bruce can very possibly take some credit for the maturing of Jack Grealish but against that has to be set the stalling of the careers of Green, Davis, Hepburn-Murphy, Suliman and O'Hare. I do not hold the view that Bruce can do nothing right only that it is too little.
I don't see how he has stalled the careers of Davis, gave him first team experience and rightly took him out when his form dropped. RHM has largely been injured and Suliman struggled to get into a poor Cheltenham side playing only 9 times for them as he was so poor when played.
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Twitter saying Middle East investment and no incomings or OUTGOINGS !! Tied to that.
Now, wouldn’t that be lovely?
If true, excellent
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I for one welcome our new ant overlords
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What Twitter account is that? If it was this one I think you mis-read it as it was saying the fact there has not been any incomings or outgoings yet means that talks are / were ongoing.
Hold tight #avfc fans. Nothing concrete, but all the evidence suggests a deal is being worked upon and close. No incomings or outgoings is a big one. Any change in this area will effect sale price and value of club, so makes sense everything is on hold. Deal or Admin #XiaOut
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Not everything Bruce has done is wrong, and of course there have been high points over the last two seasons, especially the last one. He brought in players like Terry, Snodgrass and Grabban, and sorted Jack out so that he now looks like a potential world beater. However, it was a shit or bust approach with few lasting benefits, and overall his standard of football and tactics, which most people thought wouldn't be good enough, weren't good enough. Half time at Wembley for the play off final was the most dejected I've felt about football in a long time. It was clear as day that Bruce had got everything wrong that day and we weren't going up, and were probably bollocksed as a result.
Beaten by a better team. Happens.
But they weren't a better team. I didn't see anything from Fulham last season that came close to our destructions of Wolves and Bristol City.
Better organised, sure. Better coached and managed, very probably. But I would argue that only 3 of their players that started at Wembley would get into our side that did.
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Gregg Evans will be crying himself to sleep on his 3XL sized pillow, if that is true.
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I tweeted earlier: Never going to happen but wouldn’t it be amazing if the Middle Eastern investors turn out to be richer than Mansour and Fosun put together. Shut a few piss takers up. Bound to be be some tin-pot outfit though knowing our luck.
Then I’ve just read this:
Majid Al Futtaim is a name mentioned on Twitter. As of March 2017, Al Futtaim's net worth is estimated by Forbes at US$10.9 billion, the second richest individual in the Middle East.
We’re not that lucky are we?
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Beaten by a better team. Happens.
But they weren't a better team. I didn't see anything from Fulham last season that came close to our destructions of Wolves and Bristol City.
All about opinions of course. For me Fulham were the best team i saw last season
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If it's him, his group is worth £9bn and makes £600m a year.
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Sir Michael Rake, Chairman of the group, is from Warwickshire. So naturally must be Villa not being from Brum.
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I tweeted earlier: Never going to happen but wouldn’t it be amazing if the Middle Eastern investors turn out to be richer than Mansour and Fosun put together. Shut a few piss takers up. Bound to be be some tin-pot outfit though knowing our luck.
Then I’ve just read this:
Majid Al Futtaim is a name mentioned on Twitter. As of March 2017, Al Futtaim's net worth is estimated by Forbes at US$10.9 billion, the second richest individual in the Middle East.
We’re not that lucky are we?
I'll save you the heartache later, no we are not.
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Could be something in it then? Come on let us have some hope, even if it’s for a few hours:(
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Beaten by a better team. Happens.
But they weren't a better team. I didn't see anything from Fulham last season that came close to our destructions of Wolves and Bristol City.
All about opinions of course. For me Fulham were the best team i saw last season
In terms of consistency and organisation I agree. Well, 2nd behind Wolves. My point is that was only because of the manger, who made the team greater than he collective sum of its parts.
I also agree that "it happens". I would argue, however that with the tools at Bruce's disposal, it shouldn't have come down to a one-game playoff.
Anyway, bigger things to worry about now!
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Could be something in it then? Come on let us have some hope, even if it’s for a few hours:(
Agreed, let’s dream and hope.
We are bloody used to crashing down afterwards.
We never learn do we ?
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If it's him, his group is worth £9bn and makes £600m a year.
Ha! We'd soon change those statistics.
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Latest tweet from Gregg Evans
Understand that the Middle East group have lodged a two-stage offer. First for majority control, then a potential takeover in the future. Up to Tony Xia now, it seems. #avfc
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If that’s right and the stuff about Xia needing to keep some involvement because of debt to his backers, then this latest rumour seems to answer those problems, doesn’t it?
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It will probably turn out to be true but then will most likely turn out to measured in Iranian Rial. 9Billion Iranian Rial = £158876, enough to pay Richards for 3 weeks or so.
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Club renamed Al Aston Villa?
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We always do this when there is anybody linked in buying us they have Billions we are going to be the next Man City but the truth is we end up in the shite so as for the next Mansour taking us over or whatever it is I will just watch this space of emptyness.
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Its like England in the World Cup, we all knew it wouldn't happen but we all dreamt it would for a few weeks. Same with this.
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Club renamed Al Aston Villa?
I've always referred to Villa Park as Mecca. When I say always I mean once or twice.
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Even if this crowd were oil-rich with a bottomless pit of money and willing to splurge it all on a struggling football club, they wouldn't be able to. So it's a moot point.
What we really want, as others have said, is a consortium of very good business-people to come in and run the club in the vein of a - for example - Tottenham Hotspur.
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Club renamed Al Aston Villa?
I've always referred to Villa Park as Mecca. When I say always I mean once or twice.
You've got more chance of a full house
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Even if this crowd were oil-rich with a bottomless pit of money and willing to splurge it all on a struggling football club, they wouldn't be able to. So it's a moot point.
What we really want, as others have said, is a consortium of very good business-people to come in and run the club in the vein of a - for example - Tottenham Hotspur.
They could "splurge" to their hearts content. Take the punishment, and carry on.
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Even if this crowd were oil-rich with a bottomless pit of money and willing to splurge it all on a struggling football club, they wouldn't be able to. So it's a moot point.
What we really want, as others have said, is a consortium of very good business-people to come in and run the club in the vein of a - for example - Tottenham Hotspur.
They could "splurge" to their hearts content. Take the punishment, and carry on.
That's great except the punishments now include points deductions, so how does that behaviour serve the club exactly?
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Even if this crowd were oil-rich with a bottomless pit of money and willing to splurge it all on a struggling football club, they wouldn't be able to. So it's a moot point.
What we really want, as others have said, is a consortium of very good business-people to come in and run the club in the vein of a - for example - Tottenham Hotspur.
They could "splurge" to their hearts content. Take the punishment, and carry on.
That's great except the punishments now include points deductions, so how does that behaviour serve the club exactly?
Don’t be so bloody miserable. 😉
When we are winning the European cup again we won’t care about the punishments.
We’re gonna be rich I tell ya*
*we’re not, of course.
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Ive heard its Sheik Muhand and Muhat Mucoat.
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I haven't been this excited since I heard a Chinese billionaire was taking us over. This time next year....
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Even if this crowd were oil-rich with a bottomless pit of money and willing to splurge it all on a struggling football club, they wouldn't be able to. So it's a moot point.
What we really want, as others have said, is a consortium of very good business-people to come in and run the club in the vein of a - for example - Tottenham Hotspur.
They could "splurge" to their hearts content. Take the punishment, and carry on.
That's great except the punishments now include points deductions, so how does that behaviour serve the club exactly?
Don’t be so bloody miserable.
When we are winning the European cup again we won’t care about the punishments.
We’re gonna be rich I tell ya*
*we’re not, of course.
There's a joke in there somewhere about rolling in the green stuff and enrichment but I dare not make it from a work computer
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Oh no, please, no.............
I can't take the hope of Jack not going and then going!!!!!
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I haven't been this excited since I heard a Chinese billionaire was taking us over. This time next year....
Yep, can't get my hopes built up too much to be honest after seeing how the last two billionaire owners panned out. Will wait with caution to see how this unfolds.
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I know we should never of let him get us in this shitty mess in the first place (and lots of very wealthy people have taken huge risks in the past - it is what sets them aside from us normal folk and why we never attain their riches) but if he manages to pull a deal off with someone that not only keeps the wolves from the door but also starts to turn us back a round then I for one will be eternally grateful to his skill and judgement*
* I obviously reserve the right to state he is a complete and utter ball sack if he doesnt
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It's understood that a two-stage deal has been proposed consisting of majority control for the new party with the option of a potential takeover.
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Latest tweet from Gregg Evans
Understand that the Middle East group have lodged a two-stage offer. First for majority control, then a potential takeover in the future. Up to Tony Xia now, it seems. #avfc
Which is ideal for Xia , someone comes in sorts us out we get promoted and then he sells his remaing share and gets some return
On that subject does anyone recall whats owed to Randy , as I recall he was due more cash if we were promoted but I think it may have been limited to going up in 2 season ...
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Latest tweet from Gregg Evans
Understand that the Middle East group have lodged a two-stage offer. First for majority control, then a potential takeover in the future. Up to Tony Xia now, it seems. #avfc
Which is ideal for Xia , someone comes in sorts us out we get promoted and then he sells his remaing share and gets some return
On that subject does anyone recall whats owed to Randy , as I recall he was due more cash if we were promoted but I think it may have been limited to going up in 2 season ...
Think it was a free unicorn and a Micah Richards match worn shirt.
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I don't ever want to see Xia's face again after this summer. He's got to sell up.
By all means they can agree a clause whereby he can get XXXXX if we get promoted any time soon, just as Randy did (and got fuck all) but i don't want him hanging around clinging on as he'll never set foot in Villa Park again without getting dogs abuse for what's happened, and rightly so
His ownership needs terminating.
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Even if this crowd were oil-rich with a bottomless pit of money and willing to splurge it all on a struggling football club, they wouldn't be able to. So it's a moot point.
What we really want, as others have said, is a consortium of very good business-people to come in and run the club in the vein of a - for example - Tottenham Hotspur.
They could "splurge" to their hearts content. Take the punishment, and carry on.
That's great except the punishments now include points deductions, so how does that behaviour serve the club exactly?
Well it depends if he can spend enough to get us to win the league by 13 clear points!
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I know Bruce can do no right in some people's eyes and I'm now of the opinion he's not the right man but suggesting the development of Robertson is purely down to Liverpool is incredibly myopic and the reluctance to give him any credit in the improvement shown by Jack too.
I agree on Robertson (and said as much) but I'm not sure how the credit for Jack should be shared. This is a kid who we all knew could be great and last season was when that step up happened, is it because of something Bruce did or is a natural part of him maturing? It's probably a mix of both (and many other things as well) but I suspect Jack would've turned out as a top player regardless of who was manager because he's he's just too talented not to, it just might've taken a little more or less time if things at the club had been different in the last 3-4 seasons. I'm not giving him no credit, I just don't know how much he deserves.
I'd say similar with Maguire as well because whilst he signed him he never showed any great faith in him and when Bruce left Hull Maguire was far from being even a first team regular let alone a £17m player. Maybe he had the potential and needed to be coaxed along slowly to become who he is or maybe he needed to be trusted more earlier on and he only shone once he was given that trust. I honestly don't know the answer and either way I wouldn't use it as a stick to beat him with when there are other, more obvious, flaws to his management.
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I won't be happy until I see a Chinese flag for sale on EBay, collection from Birmingham B6
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Crikey, just had a look on Twitter - that place is amaxing for people getting their hopes up.....apparently they are coming in, scaking Bruce and appointing Terry Henry!!
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Crikey, just had a look on Twitter - that place is amaxing for people getting their hopes up.....apparently they are coming in, scaking Bruce and appointing Terry Henry!!
LOL. There's getting your hopes up and sheer, painful delusion.
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There were some Thierry Henry to Villa rumours on Twitter the other day, from a French website. I just ignored it.
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I'd be disappointed if we sacked Bruce and brought in Henry.
He's as thick as a house brick.
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Sir Michael Rake, Chairman of the group, is from Warwickshire. So naturally must be Villa not being from Brum.
He used to be the Chairman at the firm I worked for. I sat in his office chair once and span around on it like a kid.
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Even if this crowd were oil-rich with a bottomless pit of money and willing to splurge it all on a struggling football club, they wouldn't be able to. So it's a moot point.
I'm speaking with no expertise at all, but if we look like we are at least trying to comply with FFP, I don't think the penalty would be as grim as some make out.
The punishments range anywhere from the minuscule fines Leicester and Bournemouth have received (though I understand no other sides will get away that lightly again), to QPR sized fines to points deductions. But seeing as most of the division seem to be in breach of FFP now, actually enforcing that might be tricky.
If there were any truth in this latest update (and it sounds like good news so -where Villa are concerned, it must be shite) I would be made up just to keep Jack and Chester and move the likes of Lansbury and Thor on to free up some space for canny loans.
If any side were operating like we were in 16/7, buying All The Captains and All the Forwards -and doing that over a number of years- then aye, throw the book at 'em.
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I wonder what TBAR is saying...
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If they are then it will be to
themselves himself.
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I wonder what TBAR is saying...
Larry Ellison in the Middle East?
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Well Al Futtaim Group are one of my company's customers. Own lots of hotels and car franchises in Dubai. Interesting.
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Al Fontaine, not much on google about him.
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I'd be disappointed if we sacked Bruce and brought in Henry.
He's as thick as a house brick.
and I bet Bobby Pires would be his number 2....:(
UTV
The Doc
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I've just heard that the upcoming third kit features a Keffiyeh. 100% gospel
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All this talk of Middle East buyers reminds me of that time years ago when there was some excitement on here as someone had seen some "Arab looking people" getting "the treeatment" in the corporate facilities on a match day, only for them to turn out to be some blokes who owned a curry house in Sutton Coldfield.
Brilliant stuff. Like a story line for an episode of Only Fools and Horses.
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Knowing our luck it’l be Al an Brah Zil.
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Knowing our luck it’l be Al an Brah Zil.
I heard two versions
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All this talk of Middle East buyers reminds me of that time years ago when there was some excitement on here as someone had seen some "Arab looking people" getting "the treeatment" in the corporate facilities on a match day, only for them to turn out to be some blokes who owned a curry house in Sutton Coldfield.
Brilliant stuff. Like a story line for an episode of Only Fools and Horses.
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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If this does turn out to be a Middle Eastern buyer we only need a Russian next time to have had the full house of the current likely locations for overseas investors.
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If this does turn out to be a Middle Eastern buyer we only need a Russian next time to have had the full house of the current likely locations for overseas investors.
Or, Al Hussain Hakabollokov.
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Well Al Futtaim Group are one of my company's customers. Own lots of hotels and car franchises in Dubai. Interesting.
Can you give them a ring and ask them?
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Even if this crowd were oil-rich with a bottomless pit of money and willing to splurge it all on a struggling football club, they wouldn't be able to. So it's a moot point.
I'm speaking with no expertise at all, but if we look like we are at least trying to comply with FFP, I don't think the penalty would be as grim as some make out.
The punishments range anywhere from the minuscule fines Leicester and Bournemouth have received (though I understand no other sides will get away that lightly again), to QPR sized fines to points deductions. But seeing as most of the division seem to be in breach of FFP now, actually enforcing that might be tricky.
If there were any truth in this latest update (and it sounds like good news so -where Villa are concerned, it must be shite) I would be made up just to keep Jack and Chester and move the likes of Lansbury and Thor on to free up some space for canny loans.
If any side were operating like we were in 16/7, buying All The Captains and All the Forwards -and doing that over a number of years- then aye, throw the book at 'em.
The point is Leicester and Bournemouth's punishement was so light as since they got promoted the EFL can not do much more to them , it's why they changed the rules so they check earlier so they can apply points deductions before you get promoted and out of their hands ..
My argument is we are where we are due to mismanagement from an owner they did the checks on and cleared to take us over , shouldn't they also be held accountable ?
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I'd be disappointed if we sacked Bruce and brought in Henry.
He's as thick as a house brick.
I have met him and he is actually rather well spoken and intelligent.
Nothing like the character he played in Crossroads.
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I'd be disappointed if we sacked Bruce and brought in Henry.
He's as thick as a house brick.
I have met him and he is actually rather well spoken and intelligent.
Nothing like the character he played in Crossroads.
That would explain why everyone keeps going on about Stan Tennant in this thread.
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Anyone on the lookout at Birmingham Airport?
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I tweeted earlier: Never going to happen but wouldn’t it be amazing if the Middle Eastern investors turn out to be richer than Mansour and Fosun put together. Shut a few piss takers up. Bound to be be some tin-pot outfit though knowing our luck.
Then I’ve just read this:
Majid Al Futtaim is a name mentioned on Twitter. As of March 2017, Al Futtaim's net worth is estimated by Forbes at US$10.9 billion, the second richest individual in the Middle East.
We’re not that lucky are we?
Nope.
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I’m known more for my legendary good looks than my brains so can somebody tell me if this would have any positive effect on FFP? For example, could they sponsor the Holte End lavs for 80m quid? Obviously this is all hypothetical and inevitably won’t happen.
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I’m known more for my legendary good looks than my brains so can somebody tell me if this would have any positive effect on FFP? For example, could they sponsor the Holte End lavs for 80m quid? Obviously this is all hypothetical and inevitably won’t happen.
Only if it’s considered fair market value.
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Even if this crowd were oil-rich with a bottomless pit of money and willing to splurge it all on a struggling football club, they wouldn't be able to. So it's a moot point.
What we really want, as others have said, is a consortium of very good business-people to come in and run the club in the vein of a - for example - Tottenham Hotspur.
Whilst I agree we need people with business acumen a la Spurs, people with bottom less pits can get round the spending piece- They sponsor stadium naming rights for example .I believe Man City’s stadium was being bank rolled to the tune of over £ 40m per year which means the club can then spend 70% of this on players and wages.
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Anyone on the lookout at Birmingham Airport?
Just saw Randy’s plane
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I’m known more for my legendary good looks than my brains so can somebody tell me if this would have any positive effect on FFP? For example, could they sponsor the Holte End lavs for 80m quid? Obviously this is all hypothetical and inevitably won’t happen.
Interestingly, I was told today that although BCFC have sold the naming rights to the "ground" it has little to no impact on FFP, and they still do not know what to do with Pederson who has been signed whilst in a transfer embargo.
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Anyone on the lookout at Birmingham Airport?
Only a 40 year old bloke with BO who lives with his parents and spends his evenings playing Fortnite.
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We're not really allowing ourselves to believe this right ???
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Anyone on the lookout at Birmingham Airport?
Just saw Randy’s plane
There he is!
(https://media.giphy.com/media/ukH2KaVFiwwSI/giphy.gif)
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We're not really allowing ourselves to believe this right ???
Why not?! What’s the alternative? Planning for 3 centre halves from Hutton, Mad Tommy, Micah Richards et al. At least a few days away from reality would be nice.
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Planespotting at Brum airport for Villa dignitaries is the preserve of that Trees bloke on VillaTalk. Haven't browsed there in at least a year, dunno if he's active still.
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Hope our new owner doesn’t have Twitter
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We're not really allowing ourselves to believe this right ???
Absolutely not. I always spend my Thursday nights cartwheeling around the garden.
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We're not really allowing ourselves to believe this right ???
Absolutely not. I always spend my Thursday nights cartwheeling around the garden.
I spend it watching love island. Anything to take my mind off the Villa
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Planespotting at Brum airport for Villa dignitaries is the preserve of that Trees bloke on VillaTalk. Haven't browsed there in at least a year, dunno if he's active still.
I’ll only start believing once I see a £100m super yacht moored at gas street canal basin.
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Not been online tonight, do I take it the Champions League dream is well and truly back on? Still got four years to do it.
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Not been online tonight, do I take it the Champions League dream is well and truly back on? Still got four years to do it.
Correct. ECL sleeve patches on sale at the Villa Store tomorrow
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Next season’s Guess The Crowd includes who’s sitting next to Tony ;)
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Next season’s Guess The Crowd includes who’s sitting next to Tony ;)
Mr Xia-child-progidy-Olympic-designer-multi-billionaire-Harvard Graduate in Gardening- allegedly- owner of failed Companies - rebuked by China Stock Exchange - Lost Face/ Lost Trust- at Home
Mr Xia..... Chinese CON MAN
This Guy.... will NEVER show his Face at Villa ever again....
His seat is EMPTY
HE IS A COWARD.. A LIAR
OK ?
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No, I dont think you are.
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I see the heat's well and truly got to Alf. Anyway the one sign I want from any new owner is common sense - and that includes the only sensible thing Tony ever did which was turning up to BH in a taxi. Prudence. No flashy suits or motors.
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None of the credible nationals have picked up on this so I’m remaining in the this is Gregg Evans’ YTS assignment thesis’ camp.
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Apparently now the middle East investment is now Egyptian
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A good point made elsewhere.
We don’t necessarily need billions, we need brains.
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Next season’s Guess The Crowd includes who’s sitting next to Tony ;)
Mr Xia-child-progidy-Olympic-designer-multi-billionaire-Harvard Graduate in Gardening- allegedly- owner of failed Companies - rebuked by China Stock Exchange - Lost Face/ Lost Trust- at Home
Mr Xia..... Chinese CON MAN
This Guy.... will NEVER show his Face at Villa ever again....
His seat is EMPTY
HE IS A COWARD.. A LIAR
OK ?
Nurse! He’s out of bed again.
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I see the heat's well and truly got to Alf. Anyway the one sign I want from any new owner is common sense - and that includes the only sensible thing Tony ever did which was turning up to BH in a taxi. Prudence. No flashy suits or motors.
Middle East guys won’t have flashy suits, but I would be seriously disappointed if they don’t roll up in Golden Ferraris.
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With bumper stickers reading. 'Ferrari Hourly Rentals R Us'.
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As seen on Twitter (usual disclaimer)
Villa investment could be complete as early as next week. Group from the Middle East are extremely wealthy so I'm told. May not be as financially crippled as you were fearing! The next question would be whether they trust Steve Bruce to take you up (I doubt it)
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As seen on Twitter (usual disclaimer)
Villa investment could be complete as early as next week. Group from the Middle East are extremely wealthy so I'm told. May not be as financially crippled as you were fearing! The next question would be whether they trust Steve Bruce to take you up (I doubt it)
Which Twatter account is this from?
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Even if we are bought out by billionaires, and history tells us it would be foolish to raise our hopes, we are still fucked due to FFP, aren't we? If Bill Gates, the bloke who owns Ikea and Dave Woodhall launch a joint bid, we would still have to sell Grealish (at least) just to avoid a points administration. Isn't that the case?
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Would Bill and Dave see eye to eye anyway?
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As seen on Twitter (usual disclaimer)
Villa investment could be complete as early as next week. Group from the Middle East are extremely wealthy so I'm told. May not be as financially crippled as you were fearing! The next question would be whether they trust Steve Bruce to take you up (I doubt it)
Which Twatter account is this from?
Agent Dave
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...If Bill Gates, the bloke who owns Ikea and Dave Woodhall...
Wait, what?
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So if the takeover / investment happens, is it possible that we might keep Jack, Chester, etc. Even if we start the season with the squad we have now I would feel quite good, especially after the last few weeks. FFP would still be an issue, or did i read that it gets re-set with new owners? That cant be true, anyway maybe a few additions in January, then really look forward to next season
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Blimey, feels like Groundhog Day. Another cycle. Hope this one ends with promotion though!
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Like a few others, I'm not getting my hopes up on this one. It's wise not to really.
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I'm with you on that Clampy - speculation and rumour was bad enough back in the day of the Sports Argus/Sunday Mercury / BRMB/Radio WM.Fast forward 25 years and Social Media adds a whole different angle .........mostly nonsense !
It's all very messy and I think unprofessional - almost makes Ellis look like an alternative option ...... I did say almost :)
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I dont think takeover or not there is a chance that Jack stays, the question is more about ensuring there is someone competent in place to negotiate the deal with Spurs so that we don’t forego sell ons, performance incentives, loan options in order to take an extra £10 up front.
Chester on the other hand is a very good championship player who would be ok not excellent in premier so if a takeover happens we might have a chance of retaining
-
Stoke Sentinel (linked from Beeb gossip) seems to be thinking Chester to them is more or less done, sadly.
-
Is there anything stipulating how many points you get deducted for failing FFP. There is a defined number for going into Administration but I have not seen anything regarding FFP.
-
Stoke Sentinel (linked from Beeb gossip) seems to be thinking Chester to them is more or less done, sadly.
But likewise in this one someone competent will be looking and saying that Stoke & WBA will be favourites for those top 2 places so any deal should include incentives if they get promoted, anyone any confidence that that any deals will be anything other than the up front fee?
-
Stoke Sentinel (linked from Beeb gossip) seems to be thinking Chester to them is more or less done, sadly.
Local newspapers tend to run positive stories about their clubs.
-
Losing Chester IMO is the worst thing that could happen for the short term i.e. next season. Fucking hell.
-
Although the FFP is still active even if we are taken over, if we are taken over and the new owners put in a future plan that satisfies the EFL then I think the EFL would look favourably on us! Hopefully common sense would prevail in those circumstances.
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Losing Chester IMO is the worst thing that could happen for the short term i.e. next season. Fucking hell.
Under Bruceball, the one thing that I look forward to every game is knowing that I'll be watching Jack show his class. The one thing that entertains me whilst watching Bruceball is whenever Jack is on the ball.
Personally, this loss is probably going to hit me harder than any other because not only is he so pleasing on the eye to watch but he is one of us and was brought up watching Villa in much the same way that we brought our own kids up.
Selfishly, they can all go before Jack as far as I'm concerned.
For the good of the team though, you're probably right.
The harsh truth is that both are likely to go, making the choice hypothetical in any case.
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I actually think Chester is emotionally connected to us too and will be genuinely upset at leaving. Chester has been outstanding for us since joining, bar one or two expected off games, and the first few matches last year when adjusting to playing with Terry. He will be sorely missed should he go.
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My overriding hope is that with these developments someone in the background is saying no to any outgoings and we can keep everyone. To me that would be like a bunch of new signings!!
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We’re very close to being sold to Egyptians. Now being reported.
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Gregg Evans "An Egyptian group are close to securing a deal to take a majority control of #avfc Still a little bit of work to be done, but looks like Tony Xia is close to accepting a deal."
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Stoke Sentinel (linked from Beeb gossip) seems to be thinking Chester to them is more or less done, sadly.
Local newspapers tend to run positive stories about their clubs.
Ha! What a crazy idea! Thank goodness that never caught on round here.
-
So it's not the Iranian bloke worth 10 gazillions of your preferred monetary unit then.
-
We’re very close to being sold to Egyptians. Now being reported.
First signing..... Mo Salah?
-
Gregg Evans "An Egyptian group are close to securing a deal to take a majority control of #avfc Still a little bit of work to be done, but looks like Tony Xia is close to accepting a deal."
Worried it might be a Pyramid scheme.
-
Jackson statue next to our McGregor?
-
Gregg Evans "An Egyptian group are close to securing a deal to take a majority control of #avfc Still a little bit of work to be done, but looks like Tony Xia is close to accepting a deal."
Worried it might be a Pyramid scheme.
Aargh! You beat me to it! It's not pharaoh!
-
First signing Nile Ranger?
-
Nigel Sphinx lined up as the new manager.
-
We’re very close to being sold to Egyptians. Now being reported.
I am now trying to work out if running out next season to The Bangles Walk Like An Egyptian would come across as a nice touch or just plain racist.
-
Nigel Sphinx lined up as the new manager.
Arf,
-
We’re very close to being sold to Egyptians. Now being reported.
I am now trying to work out if running out next season to The Bangles Walk Like An Egyptian would come across as a nice touch or just plain racist.
Night Boat to Cairo would be better I think.
-
These rumours aren't worth the Papyri they're written on.
-
To be honest I think all these Egyptian puns are rather Cleopatranising.
I might have to desert this thread.
-
Nigel Sphinx lined up as the new manager.
Or Al Ahly MacLeod.
-
John Percy tweeting...He's normally an excellent source...like the Nile.
-
I can only see this ending badly, with us sliding further down the pyramid.
-
I'm hesitant, we've been Delta bad hand before.
-
We might yet have the Luxor-y of keeping hold of Jack
-
We might yet have the Luxor-y of keeping hold of Jack
Yeah we need to keep that Giza
-
The excitement of seeing 2 pages added quickly on the thread only to find a pun-a-thon has broken out.
-
negotiations need to be completed with the Thutmose urgency
-
The excitement of seeing 2 pages added quickly on the thread only to find a pun-a-thon has broken out.
Dreadful ain't it? All I've done is 'king tut at everbody's efforts.
-
We might yet have the Luxor-y of keeping hold of Jack
Yeah we need to keep that Giza
<applause>
-
Losing Chester IMO is the worst thing that could happen for the short term i.e. next season. Fucking hell.
Chester and Grealish are the only ones I would be bitterly disappointed to see leave this summer. If Chester goes to another Championship club for well under £10m it would be a real kick in the teeth.
-
Losing Chester IMO is the worst thing that could happen for the short term i.e. next season. Fucking hell.
Chester and Grealish are the only ones I would be bitterly disappointed to see leave this summer. If Chester goes to another Championship club for well under £10m it would be a real kick in the teeth.
Indeed, although maybe the new investors will Hathor cunning plan up their sleeves?
-
Losing Chester IMO is the worst thing that could happen for the short term i.e. next season. Fucking hell.
Chester and Grealish are the only ones I would be bitterly disappointed to see leave this summer. If Chester goes to another Championship club for well under £10m it would be a real kick in the teeth.
Indeed, although maybe the new investors will Hathor cunning plan up their sleeves?
The one thing that might work in our favour is that neither player is seemingly desperate to leave the club.
-
Losing Chester IMO is the worst thing that could happen for the short term i.e. next season. Fucking hell.
Chester and Grealish are the only ones I would be bitterly disappointed to see leave this summer. If Chester goes to another Championship club for well under £10m it would be a real kick in the teeth.
Indeed, although maybe the new investors will Hathor cunning plan up their sleeves?
The one thing that might work in our favour is that neither player is seemingly desperate to leave the club.
But why would they stay?
If we don't sell them we'll definitely breach FFP. Doesn't matter how rich any potential new owner is - the cost base is just too high.
So if we keep them and win the league but breach FFP the league will just refuse us promotion, as they can under the current rules. So Grealish and Chester literally have no possibility of getting promoted with the Villa. So why bother?
Them going helps us and them. There's no way it won't happen.
-
Is Mohammed Al-Fayed still about ?
-
Losing Chester IMO is the worst thing that could happen for the short term i.e. next season. Fucking hell.
Chester and Grealish are the only ones I would be bitterly disappointed to see leave this summer. If Chester goes to another Championship club for well under £10m it would be a real kick in the teeth.
Indeed, although maybe the new investors will Hathor cunning plan up their sleeves?
The one thing that might work in our favour is that neither player is seemingly desperate to leave the club.
you can't blame Chester if he doesn't want a move to Stoke
even in the state we are in that's a downward move imo
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Just curious why sky are not reporting the take over on the sky sports app.
Everyone knows it's nonsense untill sky reports it lol
-
Is Mohammed Al-Fayed still about ?
Please don't.
-
Is he the one who's son Died On Dashboard Impact?
-
Too soon.
-
Come back Doug.
-
I’m in my office at the minute literally walking like one...
-
Liking the puns everyone
-
These are a RA of sunshine today
-
Losing Chester IMO is the worst thing that could happen for the short term i.e. next season. Fucking hell.
Chester and Grealish are the only ones I would be bitterly disappointed to see leave this summer. If Chester goes to another Championship club for well under £10m it would be a real kick in the teeth.
Indeed, although maybe the new investors will Hathor cunning plan up their sleeves?
The one thing that might work in our favour is that neither player is seemingly desperate to leave the club.
you can't blame Chester if he doesn't want a move to Stoke
even in the state we are in that's a downward move imo
As in he expression
Well I Gu ta Stoke.
Any one else use that expression.?
-
Liking the puns everyone
I thought I'd missed out but we appear to have started a new Set.
I hope this takeover does happen now, I think it's Bes Horus all if it goes through quickly.
-
Of course if the deal is completed, we'll still have to worry about the EFL in depth fit and proper tests.................
-
Liking the puns everyone
I thought I'd missed out but we appear to have started a new Set.
I hope this takeover does happen now, I think it's Bes Horus all if it goes through quickly.
It's high time we had some news that'll put a smile on our Cheops. ;)
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If it doesn't take place it'll be another kick in the Asp.
-
Of course if the deal is completed, we'll still have to worry about the EFL in depth fit and proper tests.................
Because they did such a sterling job last time around.
-
Absolutely.
-
How did they come to find out about us?
Were we hawked in the Old Bazaar in Cairo?
-
If it doesn't take place it'll be another kick in the Asp.
My Mummy liked that one
-
All this talk of Middle East buyers reminds me of that time years ago when there was some excitement on here as someone had seen some "Arab looking people" getting "the treeatment" in the corporate facilities on a match day, only for them to turn out to be some blokes who owned a curry house in Sutton Coldfield.
Brilliant stuff. Like a story line for an episode of Only Fools and Horses.
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
They'd probably have done a better job than Xia.
-
Just in from Rongtian He on Twitter
No one is bigger than the club. From the first day on, we just want to do the best we can for the club. #UTV #VTID
Is a deal close?
-
Do we know ANYTHING about this group, except they are connected to Egypt somehow? Sorry for the lack of puns.
-
There's now a statement on the OS.
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Statement is on the official site but crashing due to demand
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Dr Tony Xia and Aston Villa Football Club (“the Club”) announce that NSWE, a company that is jointly owned and controlled by businessman Nassef Sawiris’ group NNS and businessman Wes Edens, will immediately inject significant investment capital into the Club. At the same time, Dr Tony Xia will become Co-Chairman and remain on the board.
The capital injection and transaction have been approved by the EFL and the parties will work through all confirmatory approvals required by the EFL as soon as possible.
The Club’s management remain focused on strengthening the squad and are fully aligned with the new investors who are supportive of their ambitions.
Dr Tony Xia and the Club are energised and excited about their interactions with Nassef and Wes and their teams and are confident that as strategic partners they bring exceptional business, sport and leisure expertise that will enhance the Club’s future prospects. The parties look forward to working in partnership to drive Aston Villa forward to success.
Dr Tony Xia commented: “I am extremely pleased to have formed a strategic partnership with Nassef and Wes. We have a common goal of delivering future success for Aston Villa and I look forward to working together to achieve this aim.
“To have come so close to achieving promotion last season was a humbling experience. In finding such strong partners as Nassef and Wes we’re gearing up to fight again and bring back the success that this Club deserves and we all so want to provide it with.
“The future is exciting on a number of fronts and I look forward to exploring further business collaborations.”
Nassef Sawiris and Wes Edens commented: “As lifelong football fans, we are excited and privileged to have become part of this great Club. We believe that together we bring business and sports experience that will help strengthen the Club to ensure Aston Villa can return to its rightful place in the upper echelons of English football.
“Our goal is to bring sustainable success to the Club, building on its rich history while respecting its loyal fan base and unique culture. We understand that we are stewards of Aston Villa on behalf of the fans and we take that responsibility seriously.
“We look forward to working with Dr Tony to undertake a thorough assessment and evaluation of the Club in the coming weeks and our priority is to strengthen the squads and structures ahead of the upcoming season and beyond.”
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Dr Tony Xia and Aston Villa Football Club (“the Club”) announce that NSWE, a company that is jointly owned and controlled by businessman Nassef Sawiris’ group NNS and businessman Wes Edens, will immediately inject significant investment capital into the Club. At the same time, Dr Tony Xia will become Co-Chairman and remain on the board.
The capital injection and transaction have been approved by the EFL and the parties will work through all confirmatory approvals required by the EFL as soon as possible.
The Club’s management remain focused on strengthening the squad and are fully aligned with the new investors who are supportive of their ambitions.
Dr Tony Xia and the Club are energised and excited about their interactions with Nassef and Wes and their teams and are confident that as strategic partners they bring exceptional business, sport and leisure expertise that will enhance the Club’s future prospects. The parties look forward to working in partnership to drive Aston Villa forward to success.
Dr Tony Xia commented: “I am extremely pleased to have formed a strategic partnership with Nassef and Wes. We have a common goal of delivering future success for Aston Villa and I look forward to working together to achieve this aim.
“To have come so close to achieving promotion last season was a humbling experience. In finding such strong partners as Nassef and Wes we’re gearing up to fight again and bring back the success that this Club deserves and we all so want to provide it with.
“The future is exciting on a number of fronts and I look forward to exploring further business collaborations.”
Nassef Sawiris and Wes Edens commented: “As lifelong football fans, we are excited and privileged to have become part of this great Club. We believe that together we bring business and sports experience that will help strengthen the Club to ensure Aston Villa can return to its rightful place in the upper echelons of English football.
“Our goal is to bring sustainable success to the Club, building on its rich history while respecting its loyal fan base and unique culture. We understand that we are stewards of Aston Villa on behalf of the fans and we take that responsibility seriously.
“We look forward to working with Dr Tony to undertake a thorough assessment and evaluation of the Club in the coming weeks and our priority is to strengthen the squads and structures ahead of the upcoming season and beyond.”
New co-owners
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wes_Edens
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nassef_Sawiris
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Wes Edens and Nassif Sawiris involved.
Never heard of either but both seem to have significant wealth. Lets hope there is some nous there as well.
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Nassif - Wiki says: "As of September 2016, his net worth was estimated to be $5.3 billion"
I'm sure we can whittle that down...
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Back from the brink!!!
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Finally some positive news, hopefully leading to a takeover and forward thinking football people at the club.
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Nassif - Wiki says: "As of September 2016, his net worth was estimated to be $5.3 billion"
I'm sure we can whittle that down...
And Wes is no. 369 on the Forbes list with a mere $2.5 billion
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Finally some positive news, hopefully leading to a takeover and forward thinking football people at the club.
Indeed, what a nice start to the weekend.
Jack in the team tomorrow and going no-where would be too much to ask surely??!!!
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Nassif - Wiki says: "As of September 2016, his net worth was estimated to be $5.3 billion"
I'm sure we can whittle that down...
$7 billion according to the link above!
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Good news - a UK-based gazillionaire should put to bed any further issues around paying tax bills and administration.
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To me this last paragraph....
“We look forward to working with Dr Tony to undertake a thorough assessment and evaluation of the Club in the coming weeks and our priority is to strengthen the squads and structures ahead of the upcoming season and beyond.”
Suggests only a matter of time before they take over completely
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Sounds like they have a decent pedigree and you can actually find out some information about their backgrounds... but who knows?
Welcome to the best club in the World...
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Daniel Levy you can suck my balls if you still think you're getting Jack on the cheap!
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I think that is about as good as we could hope for. Fantastic news.
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Nassif - Wiki says: "As of September 2016, his net worth was estimated to be $5.3 billion"
I'm sure we can whittle that down...
And Wes is no. 369 on the Forbes list with a mere $2.5 billion
pah, a mere peasant!
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I am quite tearful . All I can say is thank fuck !
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Welcome to our Club gentlemen
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Good news - a UK-based gazillionaire should put to bed any further issues around paying tax bills and administration.
A reputable H&V bean counter’s approval is the best validation we can get of this new found wealth. Just need Risso to second the motion.
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Potentially.... amazing news. I mean it's the hope that kills you.... but it's the hope that makes being a fan exciting isn't it? I'm happy to start dreaming big again. No point them as billionaires getting involved unless they plan to properly get involved, invest, and get us some big players and get back in the big league....
What happens next with FFP? Anyone know for sure?
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Hopefully just FFP to overcome now. If we can work our way round that then
job number one, work out a way to keep hold of Jack.
job no two, cheerio Steve.
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Wes Eden founded Fotress, an investment fund.
Has he has invested, or is it Fortress?
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Trying not to get too excited, but it does look like great news.
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It's bloody good news all round considering what might have happened but I hope it's a lesson learned.
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Feck me they’re seriously rich.
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But the clown Xia remains on the scene - let's see how it pans out over the coming weeks and months
TX >DH@SPB= AVFC+TX +NSWE
Club continues to trade and pay monthly bills - good news
Bull shitting owner continues to proffer said bullshit and remain in charge of rudderless ship - bad news
We need experienced seasoned football administrators in charge not well meaning mega rich football fans - maybe the money will buy the experience - hopefully someone in the mould of Stride or Dein or dare I say Levy
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If we can't get excited on the day two billionaires invest in our club then we never will! As a Wolves fan said to me just though "Hope they are better than the American and Chinese Billionaires you had before"
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Isn't it Chinese "Billionaire"...?
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Daniel Levy you can suck my balls if you still think you're getting Jack on the cheap!
Lol. Brilliant!
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At last some good news, these two have serious money plus business and sports acumen.
I really hope the good doctor has played a blinder here.
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Praise the Lord and pass the ammunition.
So that puts our financial backing at £7 billion + £2.5 billion. That's £9.5 billion plus whatever is left down the back of Tony's Ma's sofa. That will buy a few McCormacks, Hogans and Richards.
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So they have bought 55% between them.
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But the clown Xia remains on the scene - let's see how it pans out over the coming weeks and months
TX >DH@SPB= AVFC+TX +NSWE
[/quoteBut the clown Xia remains on the scene - let's see how it pans out over the coming weeks and months
TX >DH@SPB= AVFC+TX +NSWE
Xia remains..but not for long I suspect
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If we can't get excited on the day two billionaires invest in our club then we never will! As a Wolves fan said to me just though "Hope they are better than the American and Chinese Billionaires you had before"
Good old Wolves fans. They'll be gutted bless them
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FFP remains. Will it be a case of cutting the costs this season and then going for it next?
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I can imagine seeing a few half built cardboard claret and blue coffins being taken down the local Small Heath tip now!! :)
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I might have missed something but I'm wondering why 2 apparently unconnected tycoons are joining forces? Each could afford to buy the club according to reports. Not looking for negatives. It's really exciting and if they're serious it's up to us to fill the ground to the rafters and roar them back to the prem.
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Bloody hell. Not much more to add right now but bloody hell. Well done all that brought this deal together so quickly.
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I might have missed something but I'm wondering why 2 apparently unconnected tycoons are joining forces? Each could afford to buy the club according to reports. Not looking for negatives. It's really exciting and if they're serious it's up to us to fill the ground to the rafters and roar them back to the prem.
Erm, we did that last season home and away.
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If we can't get excited on the day two billionaires invest in our club then we never will! As a Wolves fan said to me just though "Hope they are better than the American and Chinese Billionaires you had before"
He’s right to suggest caution. Of course it means we can keep the lights on and pay the tax bill but after what we have been through over recent years I will be reserving judgement for a while yet.
Be interesting to see if they look to fill the holes left by the sackings over the summer.
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Where have they been all our lives!
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Woz sorry to correct you but Small Heath does not have a tip. It is a tip.
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Glad financial ruin is staved off for now. I'm still reluctant to get too excited as FFP is still the elephant in the room so I can't see this resulting in us keeping the likes of Grealish, or being able to spend real money in the transfer market again. Xia also remains and his nominal title as 'co-Chairman' irks me greatly as we'll still have to put up with his smug little face about the place.
BUT onwards and upwards. Thank God we've survived and administration is no longer an immediate concern.
UTV!
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Bloody hell. Not much more to add right now but bloody hell. Well done all that brought this deal together so quickly.
As much as Dr Xia played his part in getting us into this mess, hats off to him for playing his part in getting in this investment. Not saying it's Shinawatra handing it off to the Mansour's but given where we were just 24 hours ago, it feels like it.
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Bloody hell. Not much more to add right now but bloody hell. Well done all that brought this deal together so quickly.
I was just thinking about how quick it's happened and although he got us into the mess, Tony got his arse into gear and tried to sort it, although he needed to.
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Woz sorry to correct you but Small Heath does not have a tip. It is a tip.
Hahaha
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Hate to sound negative but after all the fawning over the last 2 billionaire shysters who eventually brought us to our knees, I’ll reserve judgement on the latest set of billionaires until we’re in the clear. Once bitten and all that shit....
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These chaps sound legit from a quick glance on the internet, there’s no question that they have some money.
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As always let's see them in action before we cast a judgement. Edens is involved with an NBA team, so will have some knowledge of the corporate sporting world... hopefully.
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I might have missed something but I'm wondering why 2 apparently unconnected tycoons are joining forces? Each could afford to buy the club according to reports. Not looking for negatives. It's really exciting and if they're serious it's up to us to fill the ground to the rafters and roar them back to the prem.
Maybe Xia was reluctant to sell a majority stake to one party so the only way acceptable was separate investors to come on-board with an understanding that they buy enough of the club between them and can then work together to have the biggest say in the club's decisions.
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Good news - a UK-based gazillionaire should put to bed any further issues around paying tax bills and administration.
A reputable H&V bean counter’s approval is the best validation we can get of this new found wealth. Just need Risso to second the motion.
I’m in Bristol getting pissed so will defer to Adam’s considerable expertise.
Looks like good news though. First half of the problem in cash flow sorted, the second in FFP looks a bit harder to circumvent.
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I might have missed something but I'm wondering why 2 apparently unconnected tycoons are joining forces? Each could afford to buy the club according to reports. Not looking for negatives. It's really exciting and if they're serious it's up to us to fill the ground to the rafters and roar them back to the prem.
Erm, we did that last season home and away.
Erm no we didn't. Away was great and I was there for most of them. There was an average of 10.000 empty seats at home. I know we had the highest average home attendance and I hate to admit it but Newcastle filled their ground every game when they won the league.We need our fans to get off their arses and get down to villa park.
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All they need to do to make me happy is :
Get us promoted
Get us a progressive Manager
Appoint first class football administrators
Have a cohesive plan to promote our own young players
Restore our pride
Play attractive football
Get rid of Xia asap
Have progressive plans to develop VP when we are back in the top flight
No pressure there :)
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Yeah the Bendalls and Ellis worked well together......
At least we didn't get bought out by a Putin puppet...
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Things seem a little brighter at last but having seen previous billionaires leave as millionaires I suppose we'll all be a little cynical and suspicious until we see how this goes. However, I'm still struggling to understand why new owners/investors are prevented from injecting their funds into the business they now part own and the biggest assets of the club i.e. the best players must still be sold to pay for the sins of others. Presumably these guys want us as a big force in the Premiership but this just makes it more difficult to achieve that goal.
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It’s a positive development and one which hopefully starts us on the road back to the PL. I also think that Dr Tony’s days are numbered as these guys will seek to buy him out within a year.
It’s a relief to finally feel good about the Villa again. Although our experience with Lerner and Xia do make hope that this is third time lucky.
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you can only welcome this - administration would have been the least of it if Dr X hadn't pulled this deal off. i still don't fancy his chances at the first home game if he pops in. He certainly won't be doing a perimeter walk round.
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Bit more about him here... the adidas link is interesting too.
https://www.bloomberg.com/billionaires/profiles/nassef-o-sawiris/
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Yah he's twice as wealthy as Donald Trump!!
for what that's worth
https://www.egypttoday.com/Article/3/44664/Nassef-Sawiris-Egypt’s-richest-businessman
but nowhere near Putin's wealth
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Hate to sound negative but after all the fawning over the last 2 billionaire shysters who eventually brought us to our knees, I’ll reserve judgement on the latest set of billionaires until we’re in the clear. Once bitten and all that shit....
Seconded. Please don't let this pair be charlatans, incompetents, fools, asset-strippers or general knobs in the manner of most football club owners. Competence and class will do for now.
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Hate to sound negative but after all the fawning over the last 2 billionaire shysters who eventually brought us to our knees, I’ll reserve judgement on the latest set of billionaires until we’re in the clear. Once bitten and all that shit....
Make that twice bitten...I'm reserving judgement too.
In the meantime, we've got a football club to support again! :D
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If you fancy a laugh, look at that lot.com's (massive) Villa thread, loads of bantz about how we're going tits up, penniless, followed by a serious hush as they all realise we're getting billionaire owners.
It's a bit like this:
(https://i.imgur.com/FFVl02S.gif)
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I've just emailed one of my friends in Milwaukee to see what we can expect from Wes, eg how hand on will he be
Another friend is a basketball analyst, so hopefully he'll have some insight as well
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Great news. First few jobs....Keep Jack and Chester and ignore FFP.
Pitch is coming on nicely
(https://mail.google.com/mail/u/0/?ui=2&ik=c2348ed245&view=att&th=164b7919b23f10cf&attid=0.1&disp=safe&zw)
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We always had a football club to support. Just saying.
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I can’t imagine Wyness having the contacts to arrange this deal. Maybe that was what pissed Xia off originally,
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These chaps sound legit from a quick glance on the internet, there’s no question that they have some money.
The fact that it took just a few seconds to find extensive online info on both certainly looks better than trying to dig out details on Tone. That was like cracking the genome
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Good news - a UK-based gazillionaire should put to bed any further issues around paying tax bills and administration.
A reputable H&V bean counter’s approval is the best validation we can get of this new found wealth. Just need Risso to second the motion.
I’m in Bristol getting pissed so will defer to Adam’s considerable expertise.
Looks like good news though. First half of the problem in cash flow sorted, the second in FFP looks a bit harder to circumvent.
That's good enough for me. As you were.
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I'm so fed up of effin billionaires, why can't we get a trillionaire? Third time's a charm eh?
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Woz sorry to correct you but Small Heath does not have a tip. It is a tip.
Brilliant
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These chaps sound legit from a quick glance on the internet, there’s no question that they have some money.
The fact that it took just a few seconds to find extensive online info on both certainly looks better than trying to dig out details on Tone. That was like cracking the genome
Quite.
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Fair play to Dr T for appearing to have dug us out of the hole he had got us into. On face value they seem solid, reliable and rich blokes. It appears Edens is or was joint owner of the Milwaukee Bucks, so we should be able to dig out some information as to how they have fared under his control.
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Losing Chester IMO is the worst thing that could happen for the short term i.e. next season. Fucking hell.
Chester and Grealish are the only ones I would be bitterly disappointed to see leave this summer. If Chester goes to another Championship club for well under £10m it would be a real kick in the teeth.
Indeed, although maybe the new investors will Hathor cunning plan up their sleeves?
The one thing that might work in our favour is that neither player is seemingly desperate to leave the club.
But why would they stay?
If we don't sell them we'll definitely breach FFP. Doesn't matter how rich any potential new owner is - the cost base is just too high.
So if we keep them and win the league but breach FFP the league will just refuse us promotion, as they can under the current rules. So Grealish and Chester literally have no possibility of getting promoted with the Villa. So why bother?
Them going helps us and them. There's no way it won't happen.
What if one of our new investors bought/ordered replica shirts to the tune of 40m profit, as "gifts". Is commercial revenue "pure" in terms of FFP?
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Should we have a new thread? NSWE Investment?
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Fair play to Dr T for appearing to have dug us out of the hole he had got us into. On face value they seem solid, reliable and rich blokes. It appears Edens is or was joint owner of the Milwaukee Bucks, so we should be able to dig out some information as to how they have fared under his control.
I've asked a lawyer turned journalist in Milwaukee for some info too.
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Crivens! It looks like the cavalry have arrived just in time. Here's to the new guys sorting out the financial mess quicksticks; and setting us up for a positive season on the pitch.
Marvelous scenes
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Should we have a new thread? NSWE Investment?
Aye, would make sense. With the club statement this looks solid.
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Nassef Sawiris owns 5 percent of Adidas, spread the word to all the Bluenoses that every time they buy a kit they are literally supporting Aston Villa 😎😏😂
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Woz sorry to correct you but Small Heath does not have a tip. It is a tip.
Now now, I lived in small Heath for a good 6 months......
It's worse than a tip
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Edens seems to have made a lot of his fortune on subprime mortgages. Are ethical billionaires an oxymoron?
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Should we have a new thread? NSWE Investment?
Aye, would make sense. With the club statement this looks solid.
Not safe for work.
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Fair play to Dr T for appearing to have dug us out of the hole he had got us into. On face value they seem solid, reliable and rich blokes. It appears Edens is or was joint owner of the Milwaukee Bucks, so we should be able to dig out some information as to how they have fared under his control.
I've asked a lawyer turned journalist in Milwaukee for some info too.
Lets hope what made him famous in Milwaukee doesn't make a loser out of us :)
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Fair play to Dr T for appearing to have dug us out of the hole he had got us into. On face value they seem solid, reliable and rich blokes. It appears Edens is or was joint owner of the Milwaukee Bucks, so we should be able to dig out some information as to how they have fared under his control.
I've asked a lawyer turned journalist in Milwaukee for some info too.
You'll probably get better info than me. My contact in Milwaukee is a retired school librarian :)
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Nassef Sawiris owns 5 percent of Adidas, spread the word to all the Bluenoses that every time they buy a kit they are literally supporting Aston Villa 😎😏😂
Priceless, as they say
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Already had a bit of a dig around:
https://www.brewhoop.com/2018/1/25/16932480/three-strikes-the-struggles-of-milwaukee-bucks-ownership-triumvirate-edens-lasry-dinan
To sum up, done a brilliant job on the business side but, for some people, the way they've handled the head coach and general manager hiring and firing has been a bit unprofessional.
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Investment from Milwaukee....Happy Days are here again
(https://media3.giphy.com/media/jtHt7SGfIYqWc/200.gif)
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Does this mean a guaranteed starting role and captaincy for our Ahmed?
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More importantly has Tony Xia told Daniel Levy to fuck off yet?
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Nassef Sawiris owns 5 percent of Adidas, spread the word to all the Bluenoses that every time they buy a kit they are literally supporting Aston Villa 😎😏😂
Priceless, as they say
Oh my!!!! Ha ha ha
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More importantly has Tony Xia told Daniel Levy to fuck off yet?
I think the fact that Jack is still with us suggests he's been telling him to fuck off for a while already.
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Hopefully Wes will send his daughter over to look after his interests?
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2729964-bucks-co-owner-wes-edens-daughter-mallory-tells-tmz-she-wants-to-buy-knicks
https://www.instagram.com/mallory_edens/?hl=en
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If you fancy a laugh, look at that lot.com's (massive) Villa thread, loads of bantz about how we're going tits up, penniless, followed by a serious hush as they all realise we're getting billionaire owners.
It's a bit like this:
(https://i.imgur.com/FFVl02S.gif)
Love that thread!
“Great the vile will be fine and soon be laughing at us again so normal service will be resumed.
I said people were getting to ahead of themselves, but nobody listened.
Out of the teams in Birmingham, it's gonna be the lot from the City that are going to struggle.
May as well close the threads now.
Funs over.”
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Anyone heard from that twat Matt Law yet, I bet he is as gutted as the Small Heath fans are.
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Hopefully Wes will send his daughter over to look after his interests?
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2729964-bucks-co-owner-wes-edens-daughter-mallory-tells-tmz-she-wants-to-buy-knicks
https://www.instagram.com/mallory_edens/?hl=en
Mallory will have a mountain to climb in turning round Villa :)
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just to remind people out there,
'Form is temporary, class is permanent.'
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Hopefully Wes will send his daughter over to look after his interests?
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2729964-bucks-co-owner-wes-edens-daughter-mallory-tells-tmz-she-wants-to-buy-knicks
https://www.instagram.com/mallory_edens/?hl=en
I would imagine I am not the only one on here who would happily 'liaise' with her.
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Nassef Sawiris owns 5 percent of Adidas, spread the word to all the Bluenoses that every time they buy a kit they are literally supporting Aston Villa 😎😏😂
Priceless, as they say
We can tell the noses that Adidas now stands for A Dime In the Dollar goes to Aston Villa.
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If she needs help climbing a mountain I will be more than happy to hold her rope.
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Mallory died in the effort. We need that kind of dedication to climb our mountain.
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Nassef Sawiris owns 5 percent of Adidas, spread the word to all the Bluenoses that every time they buy a kit they are literally supporting Aston Villa 😎😏😂
Priceless, as they say
We can tell the noses that Adidas now stands for A Dime In the Dollar goes to Aston Villa.
ADIDAV?
You were so close.
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Nassef Sawiris owns 5 percent of Adidas, spread the word to all the Bluenoses that every time they buy a kit they are literally supporting Aston Villa 😎😏😂
Priceless, as they say
We can tell the noses that Adidas now stands for A Dime In the Dollar goes to Aston Villa.
;D
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If you fancy a laugh, look at that lot.com's (massive) Villa thread, loads of bantz about how we're going tits up, penniless, followed by a serious hush as they all realise we're getting billionaire owners.
It's a bit like this:
(https://i.imgur.com/FFVl02S.gif)
I could watch this all day
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Sounds positive, I shall reserve judgement for the time being though and see what happens.
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It’s a positive development and one which hopefully starts us on the road back to the PL. I also think that Dr Tony’s days are numbered as these guys will seek to buy him out within a year.
It’s a relief to finally feel good about the Villa again. Although our experience with Lerner and Xia do make hope that this is third time lucky.
I've heard it's 55% now up to 100% within 5 years
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I like..
NNS Group, a prominent investment company focused on building long term equity stakes in high growth, sector leading companies
bring it on!!
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Nassef Sawiris owns 5 percent of Adidas, spread the word to all the Bluenoses that every time they buy a kit they are literally supporting Aston Villa 😎😏😂
I’m suddenly no longer outraged by the price of the new Man U kit.
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Nassef Sawiris owns 5 percent of Adidas, spread the word to all the Bluenoses that every time they buy a kit they are literally supporting Aston Villa 😎😏😂
Ha ha. Hilarious
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could mean we have an Adidas kit next season
Start designing...
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To me this last paragraph....
“We look forward to working with Dr Tony to undertake a thorough assessment and evaluation of the Club in the coming weeks and our priority is to strengthen the squads and structures ahead of the upcoming season and beyond.”
Suggests only a matter of time before they take over completely
Not necessarily. I would think they all see each party bringing a different range of skills and experiences to the table.
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To me this last paragraph....
“We look forward to working with Dr Tony to undertake a thorough assessment and evaluation of the Club in the coming weeks and our priority is to strengthen the squads and structures ahead of the upcoming season and beyond.”
Suggests only a matter of time before they take over completely
Not necessarily. I would think they all see each party bringing a different range of skills and experiences to the table.
Tony’s bringing the flags
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To me this last paragraph....
“We look forward to working with Dr Tony to undertake a thorough assessment and evaluation of the Club in the coming weeks and our priority is to strengthen the squads and structures ahead of the upcoming season and beyond.”
Suggests only a matter of time before they take over completely
Not necessarily. I would think they all see each party bringing a different range of skills and experiences to the table.
Tony’s bringing the flags
Haha. I still hope in a way that the talk at the time of Xia taking over around local investment still stands.
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Well done Dr Xia for sorting this.
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To me this last paragraph....
“We look forward to working with Dr Tony to undertake a thorough assessment and evaluation of the Club in the coming weeks and our priority is to strengthen the squads and structures ahead of the upcoming season and beyond.”
Suggests only a matter of time before they take over completely
Personally, I think Tony will be gone between Christmas and New Year, allows him to save face, and hand over properly. Onward and upwards, I hope!!
Not necessarily. I would think they all see each party bringing a different range of skills and experiences to the table.
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Today suddenly got a whole lot better
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Next season’s Guess The Crowd includes who’s sitting next to Tony ;)
Mr Xia-child-progidy-Olympic-designer-multi-billionaire-Harvard Graduate in Gardening- allegedly- owner of failed Companies - rebuked by China Stock Exchange - Lost Face/ Lost Trust- at Home
Mr Xia..... Chinese CON MAN
This Guy.... will NEVER show his Face at Villa ever again....
His seat is EMPTY
HE IS A COWARD.. A LIAR
OK ?
That’s er, quite a response to a mildly amusing quip about Tony Xia.
Who, it turns out, has managed to find a couple of billionaires to sit next to him, next season, focused on getting Villa out of trouble. Class.
UTV, Tone!
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Briatore, Ecclestone and Mittal had a ton of money at QPR and made a complete fucking mess of it, let’s not get too carried away just yet eh?
As for Xia doing the right thing, it was the absolute least he could have done.
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If they can run the club correctly, I am very happy. Next season might be consolidation, thats ok
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Briatore, Ecclestone and Mittal had a ton of money at QPR and made a complete fucking mess of it, let’s not get too carried away just yet eh?
As for Xia doing the right thing, it was the absolute least he could have done.
What would have to happen to make you not get carried away? A 20 point head start due to us being unfortunate last time around?
This time yesterday it was "The target is to stay in the division by playing the youth team", today it is " our priority is to strengthen the squads and structures".
Come on, let your hair down and enjoy the moment. We've had 4 or 5 weeks of sheer hell.
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Today is a belter.
Finished on site for the last time, starting a perfect new job on Monday, in Hotel Du Vin now waiting for my wife to go and celebrate her 40th, and then this drops.
This has bookended a truly shit 12 months personally, I'm absolutely made up.
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Once the cloak of the WC fell, it was back to the reality of Villa. We've been living in fear of going bump anytime since May. That's gone for the time being so I'm going to enjoy this weekend. Fuck it.
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Today is a belter.
Finished on site for the last time, starting a perfect new job on Monday, in Hotel Du Vin now waiting for my wife to go and celebrate her 40th, and then this drops.
This has bookended a truly shit 12 months personally, I'm absolutely made up.
Congratulations, and yes seems good!
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Briatore, Ecclestone and Mittal had a ton of money at QPR and made a complete fucking mess of it, let’s not get too carried away just yet eh?
As for Xia doing the right thing, it was the absolute least he could have done.
What would have to happen to make you not get carried away? A 20 point head start due to us being unfortunate last time around?
This time yesterday it was "The target is to stay in the division by playing the youth team", today it is " our priority is to strengthen the squads and structures".
Come on, let your hair down and enjoy the moment. We've had 4 or 5 weeks of sheer hell.
You’ll forgive my pessimism given the last 2 clowns we’ve had as owners, this isn’t some brilliant businessman who’s pulled off some coup, this is a man who’s run the club into the ground almost and has had to mortgage a car park to pay the bills. Time will tell whether this is a good deal or not.
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I knew this was going to be a good week when I got my driving licence back. Poop Poop said Toad.
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Can we now just employ some PROPER football people, alongside business principles and run the club how it should be run!
Oh, and get rid of Steve Bruce as a start!
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Briatore, Ecclestone and Mittal had a ton of money at QPR and made a complete fucking mess of it, let’s not get too carried away just yet eh?
As for Xia doing the right thing, it was the absolute least he could have done.
What would have to happen to make you not get carried away? A 20 point head start due to us being unfortunate last time around?
This time yesterday it was "The target is to stay in the division by playing the youth team", today it is " our priority is to strengthen the squads and structures".
Come on, let your hair down and enjoy the moment. We've had 4 or 5 weeks of sheer hell.
You’ll forgive my pessimism given the last 2 clowns we’ve had as owners, this isn’t some brilliant businessman who’s pulled off some coup, this is a man who’s run the club into the ground almost and has had to mortgage a car park to pay the bills. Time will tell whether this is a good deal or not.
How could it possibly not be a good deal?
The alternative was administration, a points deduction and almost certain relegation. The new owners/future owners are seriously wealthy and have a vast amount of experience. They are everything that Xia is not.
Carry on beating yourself up for "beating yourself up" sake if you wish but don't expect anyone else to join in with your suicide theme.
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Today is a belter.
Finished on site for the last time, starting a perfect new job on Monday, in Hotel Du Vin now waiting for my wife to go and celebrate her 40th, and then this drops.
This has bookended a truly shit 12 months personally, I'm absolutely made up.
Congratulations, and yes seems good!
Cheers mate, I love being a jammy Villa bastard again.
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Briatore, Ecclestone and Mittal had a ton of money at QPR and made a complete fucking mess of it, let’s not get too carried away just yet eh?
As for Xia doing the right thing, it was the absolute least he could have done.
What would have to happen to make you not get carried away? A 20 point head start due to us being unfortunate last time around?
This time yesterday it was "The target is to stay in the division by playing the youth team", today it is " our priority is to strengthen the squads and structures".
Come on, let your hair down and enjoy the moment. We've had 4 or 5 weeks of sheer hell.
You’ll forgive my pessimism given the last 2 clowns we’ve had as owners, this isn’t some brilliant businessman who’s pulled off some coup, this is a man who’s run the club into the ground almost and has had to mortgage a car park to pay the bills. Time will tell whether this is a good deal or not.
How could it possibly not be a good deal?
The alternative was administration, a points deduction and almost certain relegation. The new owners/future owners are seriously wealthy and have a vast amount of experience. They are everything that Xia is not.
Carry on beating yourself up for "beating yourself up" sake if you wish but don't expect anyone else to join in with your suicide theme.
How could it possibly not be a good deal? Well there’s about a million reasons why not and nobody outside of the Villa boardroom knows the fine print.
I’m happy Xia has found a backer, but I’m not getting carried away just yet, there’s no magic cure for us and it will take time.
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Briatore, Ecclestone and Mittal had a ton of money at QPR and made a complete fucking mess of it, let’s not get too carried away just yet eh?
As for Xia doing the right thing, it was the absolute least he could have done.
I can confirm that i (Ecclestone) have never had a ton of money,
and if I did it would be spent on a holiday home somewhere near Antibes and not on QPR
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Briatore, Ecclestone and Mittal had a ton of money at QPR and made a complete fucking mess of it, let’s not get too carried away just yet eh?
As for Xia doing the right thing, it was the absolute least he could have done.
What would have to happen to make you not get carried away? A 20 point head start due to us being unfortunate last time around?
This time yesterday it was "The target is to stay in the division by playing the youth team", today it is " our priority is to strengthen the squads and structures".
Come on, let your hair down and enjoy the moment. We've had 4 or 5 weeks of sheer hell.
You’ll forgive my pessimism given the last 2 clowns we’ve had as owners, this isn’t some brilliant businessman who’s pulled off some coup, this is a man who’s run the club into the ground almost and has had to mortgage a car park to pay the bills. Time will tell whether this is a good deal or not.
How could it possibly not be a good deal?
The alternative was administration, a points deduction and almost certain relegation. The new owners/future owners are seriously wealthy and have a vast amount of experience. They are everything that Xia is not.
Carry on beating yourself up for "beating yourself up" sake if you wish but don't expect anyone else to join in with your suicide theme.
How could it possibly not be a good deal? Well there’s about a million reasons why not and nobody outside of the Villa boardroom knows the fine print.
I’m happy Xia has found a backer, but I’m not getting carried away just yet, there’s no magic cure for us and it will take time.
And there's a million, million reasons why it could be a good deal - So chill out and enjoy your evening.
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Fuck it Jon, wallow in it till the facade comes down.
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Our situation today is far far better than it was 2 days ago. I'm not sure how that's anything but something to enjoy for the next few days.
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Ahhhhh fuck it, I’ve had a couple of gins now and all is good in the world, fuck off Daniel Levy as well.
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Today is a belter.
Finished on site for the last time, starting a perfect new job on Monday, in Hotel Du Vin now waiting for my wife to go and celebrate her 40th, and then this drops.
This has bookended a truly shit 12 months personally, I'm absolutely made up.
bet your on a promise as well mate
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Ahhhhh fuck it, I’ve had a couple of gins now and all is good in the world, fuck off Daniel Levy as well.
That's the spirit Jon
UTFV
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Today is a belter.
Finished on site for the last time, starting a perfect new job on Monday, in Hotel Du Vin now waiting for my wife to go and celebrate her 40th, and then this drops.
This has bookended a truly shit 12 months personally, I'm absolutely made up.
bet your on a promise as well mate
You better believe it mate, she looks a million dollars as well.
The best investment I've ever made.
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Ahhhhh fuck it, I’ve had a couple of gins now and all is good in the world, fuck off Daniel Levy as well.
You bastards and your time zone. I'm still at work and have to wait a few hours to have a pop or 7
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this has made my week too - and I'm not on a promise, sadly.
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This is great news, real money with a guy with experience in turning around sports businesses.
I cheered when I saw the announcement come up on Bloomberg.
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From the Doc
It’s been very very tough two months. Nothing changed my love and commitment to AV even the Chinese economy policy made things of the most difficulty. Hope new partnership with Naseef and Wes, we can continue our efforts to bring Villa to where it belongs.
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Told ya we would be reet this week. It's a decent deal and plenty to spend WHEN we go up. Don't expect zillions chucked at it now though.
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this has made my week too - and I'm not on a promise, sadly.
sex and new owners / you don't want much :D
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Crivens! It looks like the cavalry have arrived just in time. Here's to the new guys sorting out the financial mess quicksticks; and setting us up for a positive season on the pitch.
Marvelous scenes
Crivens and quicksticks in one post, fantastic!
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Told ya we would be reet this week. It's a decent deal and plenty to spend WHEN we go up. Don't expect zillions chucked at it now though.
You did indeed Chelts.
Have you shifted from seeing us as too far gone to be able to keep Jack?
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Told ya we would be reet this week. It's a decent deal and plenty to spend WHEN we go up. Don't expect zillions chucked at it now though.
You did indeed Chelts.
Have you shifted from seeing us as too far gone to be able to keep Jack?
No. He is still getting sold but at least we get to keep our trousers on whilst negotiating it.
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Told ya we would be reet this week. It's a decent deal and plenty to spend WHEN we go up. Don't expect zillions chucked at it now though.
You did indeed Chelts.
Have you shifted from seeing us as too far gone to be able to keep Jack?
No. He is still getting sold but at least we get to keep our trousers on whilst negotiating it.
Any potential to invest something in our playing squad now?
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Told ya we would be reet this week. It's a decent deal and plenty to spend WHEN we go up. Don't expect zillions chucked at it now though.
You did indeed Chelts.
Have you shifted from seeing us as too far gone to be able to keep Jack?
No. He is still getting sold but at least we get to keep our trousers on whilst negotiating it.
Any potential to invest something in our playing squad now?
Yes.
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Surely it's merely a matter of calling our ground - The NSWE Park of Villa they then give us a load of dough for the privilege and then Bruce gets millions to buy the next Ross McCormack and Micah Richards?
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Surely it's merely a matter of calling our ground - The NSWE Park of Villa they then give us a load of dough for the privilege and then Bruce gets millions to buy the next Ross McCormack and Micah Richards?
I've heard McCormack and Richards are quite tasty at American football. 40 million Is my estimate. ;)
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Surely it's merely a matter of calling our ground - The NSWE Park of Villa they then give us a load of dough for the privilege and then Bruce gets millions to buy the next Ross McCormack and Micah Richards?
I've heard McCormack and Richards are quite tasty at American football. 40 million Is my estimate. ;)
I think Eden’s is a basket ball man and Mcormack is a excellent jumperr :o
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Surely it's merely a matter of calling our ground - The NSWE Park of Villa they then give us a load of dough for the privilege and then Bruce gets millions to buy the next Ross McCormack and Micah Richards?
I've heard McCormack and Richards are quite tasty at Basketbal. 40 million Is my estimate. ;)
I think Eden’s is a basket ball man and Mcormack is a excellent jumperr :o
Altered, but you know where I'm coming from.
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Told ya we would be reet this week. It's a decent deal and plenty to spend WHEN we go up. Don't expect zillions chucked at it now though.
You did indeed Chelts.
Have you shifted from seeing us as too far gone to be able to keep Jack?
No. He is still getting sold but at least we get to keep our trousers on whilst negotiating it.
Any potential to invest something in our playing squad now?
Yes.
Cheers that’s positive.
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Told ya we would be reet this week. It's a decent deal and plenty to spend WHEN we go up. Don't expect zillions chucked at it now though.
You did indeed Chelts.
Have you shifted from seeing us as too far gone to be able to keep Jack?
No. He is still getting sold but at least we get to keep our trousers on whilst negotiating it.
Do you have inside knowledge on this? How can you be so sure? The potential sales of Chester, Kodja, Jedinak and Bjarnanson could almost equate to the figure we’d get for Jack? Whilst knocking a helluva lot more off the wage bill.
Having Jack in our side will keep us so much more competitive that we just have to look a every viable option to keep him at the club.
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Don't get too excited, the investment is a new contract for Gabby.
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Just like London buses, so in theory, Xia questionable, it looks like we have 3 billionaires in charge at Villa, on the surface it doesn't get any better, dreading this season, now really looking forward to the next campaign, perhaps Jack can give us another season, see how all this pans out, get some real football people at the club, new management would seem an excellent starting place to me, and quickly, here we go, it's coming home.
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I hate to rain on the undoubtedly great parade but I really don’t think this makes a difference to FFP. Selling Jack and Chester still must be on the cards but what it does mean is that Bruce (or Henry) will have a bit more money to bring replacements in. I hope they are going to adopt the Fulham model of getting us up.
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Told ya we would be reet this week. It's a decent deal and plenty to spend WHEN we go up. Don't expect zillions chucked at it now though.
You did indeed Chelts.
Have you shifted from seeing us as too far gone to be able to keep Jack?
No. He is still getting sold but at least we get to keep our trousers on whilst negotiating it.
Do you have inside knowledge on this? How can you be so sure? The potential sales of Chester, Kodja, Jedinak and Bjarnanson could almost equate to the figure we’d get for Jack? Whilst knocking a helluva lot more off the wage bill.
Having Jack in our side will keep us so much more competitive that we just have to look a every viable option to keep him at the club.
Yes to your first question.
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Don't get too excited, the investment is a new contract for Gabby.
with extensions for Richards and Ross. First new signing; Stephen Ireland
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Told ya we would be reet this week. It's a decent deal and plenty to spend WHEN we go up. Don't expect zillions chucked at it now though.
You did indeed Chelts.
Have you shifted from seeing us as too far gone to be able to keep Jack?
No. He is still getting sold but at least we get to keep our trousers on whilst negotiating it.
Do you have inside knowledge on this? How can you be so sure? The potential sales of Chester, Kodja, Jedinak and Bjarnanson could almost equate to the figure we’d get for Jack? Whilst knocking a helluva lot more off the wage bill.
Having Jack in our side will keep us so much more competitive that we just have to look a every viable option to keep him at the club.
Yes to your first question.
Care to elaborate?
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So-
(Please anyone correct/improve/update this)
We seem to have a clear summary of:
New Rich majority owners.
No immediate plans to jettison Bruce
Jack still needs to be sold to balance the FFP books (as youth product he is pure profit compared to someone we bought, so his £ go further re: FFP)
There is £ to invest now on the playing side.
Finally, penalties of failing to balance the FFP books are *not* just a fine that rich owners can pay, it can include transfer embargo and significant points deductions, so we cannot just ignore it, and time to stop naively hoping we can.
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Told ya we would be reet this week. It's a decent deal and plenty to spend WHEN we go up. Don't expect zillions chucked at it now though.
You did indeed Chelts.
Have you shifted from seeing us as too far gone to be able to keep Jack?
No. He is still getting sold but at least we get to keep our trousers on whilst negotiating it.
Any potential to invest something in our playing squad now?
Yes.
Can we buy Grealish back from Spurs?
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Told ya we would be reet this week. It's a decent deal and plenty to spend WHEN we go up. Don't expect zillions chucked at it now though.
You did indeed Chelts.
Have you shifted from seeing us as too far gone to be able to keep Jack?
No. He is still getting sold but at least we get to keep our trousers on whilst negotiating it.
Any potential to invest something in our playing squad now?
Yes.
Can we buy Grealish back from Spurs?
If we get promoted next week.....
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Told ya we would be reet this week. It's a decent deal and plenty to spend WHEN we go up. Don't expect zillions chucked at it now though.
You did indeed Chelts.
Have you shifted from seeing us as too far gone to be able to keep Jack?
No. He is still getting sold but at least we get to keep our trousers on whilst negotiating it.
Do you have inside knowledge on this? How can you be so sure? The potential sales of Chester, Kodja, Jedinak and Bjarnanson could almost equate to the figure we’d get for Jack? Whilst knocking a helluva lot more off the wage bill.
Having Jack in our side will keep us so much more competitive that we just have to look a every viable option to keep him at the club.
Yes to your first question.
Care to elaborate?
Not really.
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I hate to rain on the undoubtedly great parade but I really don’t think this makes a difference to FFP. Selling Jack and Chester still must be on the cards but what it does mean is that Bruce (or Henry) will have a bit more money to bring replacements in. I hope they are going to adopt the Fulham model of getting us up.
If the Fulham model means getting a tactically-canny management team, bring it on.
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Told ya we would be reet this week. It's a decent deal and plenty to spend WHEN we go up. Don't expect zillions chucked at it now though.
You did indeed Chelts.
Have you shifted from seeing us as too far gone to be able to keep Jack?
No. He is still getting sold but at least we get to keep our trousers on whilst negotiating it.
Do you have inside knowledge on this? How can you be so sure? The potential sales of Chester, Kodja, Jedinak and Bjarnanson could almost equate to the figure we’d get for Jack? Whilst knocking a helluva lot more off the wage bill.
Having Jack in our side will keep us so much more competitive that we just have to look a every viable option to keep him at the club.
Yes to your first question.
Care to elaborate?
Not really.
Fair enough. And there was me thinking you'd just got off the blower with the new owners.
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Co chairmen is a face saver it never works in practice, the majority shareholder will call the shots. All I could ask for now is for Steve Stride to be re-employed now that would set the tone of how the club would be run in future.
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Told ya we would be reet this week. It's a decent deal and plenty to spend WHEN we go up. Don't expect zillions chucked at it now though.
You did indeed Chelts.
Have you shifted from seeing us as too far gone to be able to keep Jack?
No. He is still getting sold but at least we get to keep our trousers on whilst negotiating it.
Do you have inside knowledge on this? How can you be so sure? The potential sales of Chester, Kodja, Jedinak and Bjarnanson could almost equate to the figure we’d get for Jack? Whilst knocking a helluva lot more off the wage bill.
Having Jack in our side will keep us so much more competitive that we just have to look a every viable option to keep him at the club.
Yes to your first question.
Care to elaborate?
Not really.
Fair enough. And there was me thinking you'd just got off the blower with the new owners.
Nobody on a fans message board will have insider knowledge of a takeover involving an American, an Egyptian and a Chinaman, all of whom are billionaires.
Stating that we won't be spending vast amounts is not insider info - It is stating the obvious as we are already heavily foul of FFP.
I heard that Spurs were in for Grealish around the time of Wolves at home and that his dad had said at that time that it was likely that he'd join them. That is not insider info but came from a mate who drinks with Kevin Grealish. If I heard this, then obviously others would have done so as well. I'm personally not as convinced as many that Jack is as keen to stay as others have suggested. Who can blame him? A 5 year contract worth £15 million plus, CL football, PL football, playing with players who are equal to him in terms of ability and getting into the England squad. He didn't turn Ireland down so that he could play for Villa in the 2nd tier.
Nobody knows for sure whether Spurs are going to come back if "our trousers haven't been pulled down" unless they have insider info at Spurs as well as Villa.
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Stride has got to be pushing on 70 now, we don't need him back, we need to, finally, replace him.
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Co chairmen is a face saver it never works in practice, the majority shareholder will call the shots. All I could ask for now is for Steve Stride to be re-employed now that would set the tone of how the club would be run in future.
The fact that Sawiris is now listed as Executive Chairman on the website, with Edens and Xia simply as Co-Chairmen suggests where the new power really lies
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Co chairmen is a face saver it never works in practice, the majority shareholder will call the shots. All I could ask for now is for Steve Stride to be re-employed now that would set the tone of how the club would be run in future.
The fact that Sawiris is now listed as Executive Chairman on the website, with Edens and Xia simply as Co-Chairmen suggests where the new power really lies
Sawiris is running the show.
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Egypt’s richest family owns Aston Villa I’m fcukin still pinching myself. He’s worth more than the Glazer bloke.
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We're still running, that's the main thing here. FFP still fucks us up a bit and limits what we can do so let's not get carried away.
One thing about investors is always that they'll pull the plug if they don't see a return coming. So let's hope they make their investment work.
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More than ever we need a highly competent chief executive to run this club. I'd like to see us target Nicola Cortese and pay him what he wants.
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More than ever we need a highly competent chief executive to run this club. I'd like to see us target Nicola Cortese and pay him what he wants.
In an interview with The Times in March 2010, Cortese discussed his approach to running a football club.
Clubs spend money they do not have; they spend next year’s income. They spend money that will not arrive for two years and say, "But we'll have some success and bring in more cash to cover the shortfall". It cannot be sustained. In good times you need to be saving money for the bad times. If we reach the Premier League, I would like to be in a position where we did not need parachute payments. In good years you should put money away for the bad years.[2]
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More than ever we need a highly competent chief executive to run this club. I'd like to see us target Nicola Cortese and pay him what he wants.
In an interview with The Times in March 2010, Cortese discussed his approach to running a football club.
Clubs spend money they do not have; they spend next year’s income. They spend money that will not arrive for two years and say, "But we'll have some success and bring in more cash to cover the shortfall". It cannot be sustained. In good times you need to be saving money for the bad times. If we reach the Premier League, I would like to be in a position where we did not need parachute payments. In good years you should put money away for the bad years.[2]
Like in life generally: put money away if you can for a rainy day. Common sense is what's needed to run the club now & not the bullshit and reckless spending we've been subjected to in recent years (The Villa Engine: phhrtt!).
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I'd love it if cortese came in
I'm fully signed up for medium term plan, sustainability, no quick fixes, even with these new sugar daddies
Let's face it if they wanted to chuck gazillions at success there's easier ways to get there than starting with villa at the moment
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We're still running, that's the main thing here. FFP still fucks us up a bit and limits what we can do so let's not get carried away.
One thing about investors is always that they'll pull the plug if they don't see a return coming. So let's hope they make their investment work.
My thoughts exactly. I hope it all works out and we've set such a low standard with owners, that barring them moving the club to Cairo i can't see how they can fuck us up more, but i'm ignoring it for the time being so if it is the start of a successful professionally run club for a change then i'll be pleasantly surprised
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Egypt’s richest family owns Aston Villa I’m fcukin still pinching myself. He’s worth more than the Glazer bloke.
I don't think Glazer is that rich apart from some royalties from reruns/repeats of Starsky and Hutch.
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More than ever we need a highly competent chief executive to run this club. I'd like to see us target Nicola Cortese and pay him what he wants.
I’d like to see us target Nicola key
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At least she used to reply to my emails
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We’re like the candle that you blow out, yet it comes back alight!
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More than ever we need a highly competent chief executive to run this club. I'd like to see us target Nicola Cortese and pay him what he wants.
Did he appoint Les Reed as director of football at Southampton ? If so can we target both please 👍
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We’re like the candle that you blow out, yet it comes back alight!
Yes, that's frustrated the fuck out of the SHA fans....
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Question marks over the Doc’s decisions but he came in, livened things up, loved the club, was desperate to win, ultimately failed but then sold on quickly to extremely rich owners (despite all the stuff about selling a majority share being too humiliating). Plenty worse out there.
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Question marks over the Doc’s decisions but he came in, livened things up, loved the club, was desperate to win, ultimately failed but then sold on quickly to extremely rich owners (despite all the stuff about selling a majority share being too humiliating). Plenty worse out there.
Have to agree, at least he lives in the modern world. If this was plan B then I guess he has done what he said he would. Time will tell.
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Just shows how pathetic Randy Lerner was. Took him and god knows how many lawyers and banks etc forever to find investment or new ownership.
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Question marks over the Doc’s decisions but he came in, livened things up, loved the club, was desperate to win, ultimately failed but then sold on quickly to extremely rich owners (despite all the stuff about selling a majority share being too humiliating). Plenty worse out there.
Have to agree, at least he lives in the modern world. If this was plan B then I guess he has done what he said he would. Time will tell.
I agree too and as I said before the doom mongering local rag predicted a long and ruinous takeover period. Fair play to the Doc for getting things sorted and appearing to have done it all by himself
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In his statement about no players being for sale, Bruce said Dr T "did what he could". Past tense. Think its pretty clear a full sale is just a matter of time and he will no longer have any part.
My only regret is we'll probably never see Tony's plans for Villa Park, the ones that Bruce said were unbelievable, or something like that.
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I'm pretty sure Xia will share his vision with the new owners if Bruce has already seen it...it just may be that Xia wont be around to see it.
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The plans belong to the club, just as the people that worked on them were, I assume, working for the club. It’s more whether those plans make good sense from a business perspective as far as the 2 new guys are concerned.
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I really wish that some of us ... UNDERSTOOD.
Mr Xia was seeeking investments internally in China... the mainland, not HK.... for his other busineses for over 12 months..... as reported in the SC News.
This Spin about him being unable to fund us, because of Mainland restrictions on the export of Capital..... he's never mentioned himself.
Because it isn't true.
Yes, there wereCapital-Outflow-Restrictions placed by the Mainland Govt.... BUT.... they did not prevent nor curtail Chinese involvment and investment in Germany/Spain/Italy... even the West Midlands, where Wolves have left Mr Xia in their dust....
It is even now being spun, that Wyness brought the US investor to us... and he got sacked for that...if that's true, he's won his case and is £6mill better-off :D
I really wish that some of us ... UNDERSTOOD. ;D
The new owners
CANNOT BUY players.
CANNOT increase contract values to retain players
CANNOT spend a penny / cent / old aliminium coins
Because of FFP
They are the new guardians of us, and seem the most sensible in decades, business-wise. Would be great if they could throw millions at us.... BUT...THEY CAN'T
Because of FFP
The 'Benefactor-Model' can't work now. Thanks to Mr Xia.
WE have to equate our incomings with our outgoings ..
More than EQUATE....bloody reduce it.... and we have little time to do that..... We can't rename everything...except VP... to earn income.... but that will be for next season, as will player-sales.
This season.... we can't buy without selling... we can't invest even with 2 very rich owners....
WHICH......
THANK YOU Mr TONY...you've put us here and basically frozen us for a year or more.... through your TOTAL INCOMPETENCE
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Keep taking the pills
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Keep taking the pills
Kepp hiding behind Bullshite.... ;D ;D
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Gotta love Gin and TOnIC
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they'RE COminG To TAKE me AwaY Ha HA!!
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I really wish that some of us ... UNDERSTOOD.
Mr Xia was seeeking investments internally in China... the mainland, not HK.... for his other busineses for over 12 months..... as reported in the SC News.
This Spin about him being unable to fund us, because of Mainland restrictions on the export of Capital..... he's never mentioned himself.
Because it isn't true.
Yes, there wereCapital-Outflow-Restrictions placed by the Mainland Govt.... BUT.... they did not prevent nor curtail Chinese involvment and investment in Germany/Spain/Italy... even the West Midlands, where Wolves have left Mr Xia in their dust....
It is even now being spun, that Wyness brought the US investor to us... and he got sacked for that...if that's true, he's won his case and is £6mill better-off :D
I really wish that some of us ... UNDERSTOOD. ;D
The new owners
CANNOT BUY players.
CANNOT increase contract values to retain players
CANNOT spend a penny / cent / old aliminium coins
Because of FFP
They are the new guardians of us, and seem the most sensible in decades, business-wise. Would be great if they could throw millions at us.... BUT...THEY CAN'T
Because of FFP
The 'Benefactor-Model' can't work now. Thanks to Mr Xia.
WE have to equate our incomings with our outgoings ..
More than EQUATE....bloody reduce it.... and we have little time to do that..... We can't rename everything...except VP... to earn income.... but that will be for next season, as will player-sales.
This season.... we can't buy without selling... we can't invest even with 2 very rich owners....
WHICH......
THANK YOU Mr TONY...you've put us here and basically frozen us for a year or more.... through your TOTAL INCOMPETENCE
Always nice to get B.S Johnson’s take on events.
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Alfititmus where have you been? If I am the new billionaire owner I can rename the Ticket Office car park as “Olaf’s allotment” and pay £50M a year for it through one of my off shoot concerns somewhere in the world. Billionaires usually have more than a corner shop they look after. Nothing to stop me if that is what I wanted to do.
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Crikey.
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Alfititmus where have you been? If I am the new billionaire owner I can rename the Ticket Office car park as “Olaf’s allotment” and pay £50M a year for it through one of my off shoot concerns somewhere in the world. Billionaires usually have more than a corner shop they look after. Nothing to stop me if that is what I wanted to do.
No there’s nothing to stop you. But it wouldn’t help FFP as it’s clearly not fair market value for the sponsorship so the funding would be excluded from any FPP calculation
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What I like about this site is the diversity of opinion and presentation style of posters.
I think.
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Question marks over the Doc’s decisions but he came in, livened things up, loved the club, was desperate to win, ultimately failed but then sold on quickly to extremely rich owners (despite all the stuff about selling a majority share being too humiliating). Plenty worse out there.
Deserves some credit for seeing the error of his ways and arranging a quick sale, but it is now clear that he was only really interested in getting a seat at the big table of the Premier League and that is as far as his plans went.
Something didn't sit right with me after I was told during our first season I the Championship that I couldn't buy a season ticket for the next season at the back of the lower North Stand as work was being done that summer to make it an area for disabled supporters. Come the new season and nothing had been done at all.
As I said, I think it is clear that any plans were reliant in us going up and even then I suspect it would have been a case of us just simply surviving while those in charge looked at opportunities around visits from the likes of the Manchester clubs and Liverpool.
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I believe the main financial motivation is to build infrastructure around the location of a football club. Particularly to Chinese and Middle Eastern investors who want to invest large scale to diversify assets. It is not the Glazier model but is the Man City one. Tony's tactics look very similar and he may well stick around to achieve this. I hope he does and the two new guys get to enjoy the glory and kudos of a successful premier league club.
I can hope - can't I?
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of course - but it 'll kill ya.
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Although I am not saying that Xia didn't add to our financial problems but he inherited a financial time bomb of existing players' contracts. I think this gets forgotten with what has gone on since.
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Although I am not saying that Xia didn't add to our financial problems but he inherited a financial time bomb of existing players' contracts. I think this gets forgotten with what has gone on since.
Agreed. He also provided more than enough resources to get us back up. Hiring RDM was a risk, but not a massive one. He got Albion promoted so even if you dismiss his CL win as coach the promotion record can't be questioned. Bruce was an even safer appointment given his record and Xia trusted him to do the job. I don't clear Xia of fault in all of this but he did do a lot of what we would expect of an owner. He should also be given immense credit for selling a major portion of a Championship club in financial turmoil to two incredibly wealthy men in the space of a few weeks. Something Lerner couldn't do with a PL team for the better part of 2 years.
I believe Xia cares about the club. He's made mistakes, one of which is in trusting Wyness as much as he did and not putting in a proper management infrastructure at the club. But not all he's done has been bad even if it ultimately turned out that way because on the pitch we couldn't get it done.
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Although I am not saying that Xia didn't add to our financial problems but he inherited a financial time bomb of existing players' contracts. I think this gets forgotten with what has gone on since.
It's not forgotten, but Xia bought the club, and when you do, you buy all of the assets and liabilities that it has. He'd have done his due diligence so none of it should have been a surprise.
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Although I am not saying that Xia didn't add to our financial problems but he inherited a financial time bomb of existing players' contracts. I think this gets forgotten with what has gone on since.
It's not forgotten, but Xia bought the club, and when you do, you buy all of the assets and liabilities that it has. He'd have done his due diligence so none of it should have been a surprise.
That's true so none of it should have been a surprise. But the approach he took was to invest to get us out as opposed to a more conservative approach. Which could have been the way to go. No doubt there was naivety in a number of his decisions along with mistakes.
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He'd also have known back in January the financial impact of not getting promotion.
If we're going to thank anybody for bringing in NSWE I'd start with Vladimir Putin.
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I'd actually start with the two guys who bought the controlling share.
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Alfititmus where have you been? If I am the new billionaire owner I can rename the Ticket Office car park as “Olaf’s allotment” and pay £50M a year for it through one of my off shoot concerns somewhere in the world. Billionaires usually have more than a corner shop they look after. Nothing to stop me if that is what I wanted to do.
Mr. Aftab, the sky is the limit for you, and I for one am 110% behind your initiatives and ventures.
Control the corners, and you control the trade: see the follow up telly-visi-on program to "The Wire" for evidence.
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Haha...I am going to turn the car park into a million cabbage plots charging customers £100 each per annum. Job done.
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Haha...I am going to turn the car park into a million cabbage plots charging customers £100 each per annum. Job done.
Innovative thinking yet again.
This is the NHS hospital strategy writ large.
We shall rip the customers a new one, and laugh all the way to the bank. And claim a subsidy for the green cabbages. Onions and garlic would be good as well, as they ward off mozzies, vampires and Moss type fungi.
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Although I am not saying that Xia didn't add to our financial problems but he inherited a financial time bomb of existing players' contracts. I think this gets forgotten with what has gone on since.
It's not forgotten, but Xia bought the club, and when you do, you buy all of the assets and liabilities that it has. He'd have done his due diligence so none of it should have been a surprise.
That's true so none of it should have been a surprise. But the approach he took was to invest to get us out as opposed to a more conservative approach. Which could have been the way to go. No doubt there was naivety in a number of his decisions along with mistakes.
Was he naïve? Or did he entrust the available funds to people who spent it on the wrong players in the wrong system? - maybe that was his naivety (answering my own question!).
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Anyone read the FT article on why the Chinese owners are having difficulty? It's behind a paywall so I can't get back on again, though you may be able to first time.
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Anyone read the FT article on why the Chinese owners are having difficulty? It's behind a paywall so I can't get back on again, though you may be able to first time.
I did. Can’t post the link or even paste the article. FT are paranoid about their content being shared. Xia is mentioned but the article stresses that very little is known about his background or finances.
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Although I am not saying that Xia didn't add to our financial problems but he inherited a financial time bomb of existing players' contracts. I think this gets forgotten with what has gone on since.
It's not forgotten, but Xia bought the club, and when you do, you buy all of the assets and liabilities that it has. He'd have done his due diligence so none of it should have been a surprise.
That's true so none of it should have been a surprise. But the approach he took was to invest to get us out as opposed to a more conservative approach. Which could have been the way to go. No doubt there was naivety in a number of his decisions along with mistakes.
Was he naïve? Or did he entrust the available funds to people who spent it on the wrong players in the wrong system? - maybe that was his naivety (answering my own question!).
The problem was that the funds that he said were available, and signed off the annual accounts to this effect, actually weren't.
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Tony was full of shady shit but deserves a modicum of thanks for getting two genuinely minted people n board to save the club from oblivion. I wouldn't bet on seeing him inside VP again, mind.
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Although I am not saying that Xia didn't add to our financial problems but he inherited a financial time bomb of existing players' contracts. I think this gets forgotten with what has gone on since.
It's not forgotten, but Xia bought the club, and when you do, you buy all of the assets and liabilities that it has. He'd have done his due diligence so none of it should have been a surprise.
That's true so none of it should have been a surprise. But the approach he took was to invest to get us out as opposed to a more conservative approach. Which could have been the way to go. No doubt there was naivety in a number of his decisions along with mistakes.
Was he naïve? Or did he entrust the available funds to people who spent it on the wrong players in the wrong system? - maybe that was his naivety (answering my own question!).
The problem was that the funds that he said were available, and signed off the annual accounts to this effect, actually weren't.
Or were when he signed them and subsequently became unavailable.
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Or were when he signed them and subsequently became unavailable.
Quite possibly. The end result is the same though, money that he promised to keep the club going wasn't available.
As for thanking Xia (comment before yours) for getting new investors in, I think I'll wait and see how it pans out. The same was said about Ellis and Lerner, and neither of the new owners exactly worked out that well.
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Tony was full of shady shit but deserves a modicum of thanks for getting two genuinely minted people n board to save the club from oblivion. I wouldn't bet on seeing him inside VP again, mind.
You’re not for one minute suggesting that a seat next to Tony comp has finished !?
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Tony was full of shady shit but deserves a modicum of thanks for getting two genuinely minted people n board to save the club from oblivion. I wouldn't bet on seeing him inside VP again, mind.
You’re not for one minute suggesting that a seat next to Tony comp has finished !?
what would you ask him if said competition was still on ?
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It would be great to see what happens if it is still on and aLF TiTiMUs gets to SIT NEXt TO HiM ::)
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It would be great to see what happens if it is still on and aLF TiTiMUs gets to SIT NEXt TO HiM ::)
That would probably remove Tone from the Board, quick-like.
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How do your words and sentences sound in conversation when the letters are a mix of capitals and lower case sprinkled with emoji's?
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It would be great to see what happens if it is still on and aLF TiTiMUs gets to SIT NEXt TO HiM ::)
Both have unusual ways of typing, never been seen together :o
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I don't think Xia has any power any more and will shuffle off into the sunset in the next 6-12 months.
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Do you see a valedictory appearance at VP, Chelts?
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Do you see a valedictory appearance at VP, Chelts?
I have a suspicion he might surface for a game because he really didn't want to flog it. Our financial position forced his hand on that.
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How do your words and sentences sound in conversation when the letters are a mix of capitals and lower case sprinkled with emoji's?
Just checking - you do realise I was being ironic don't you ?
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That question also applies to Chicago Lion
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Fred these foreigners don't get irony.
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Fred these foreigners don't get irony.
Lol - reminds me of the Blackadder scene where he says to Baldrick " You really don't understand irony do you Baldrick ?"
Baldrick replies : " Oh yes I do my lord. It's like Goldy and Silvery only less valuable !"
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That question also applies to Chicago Lion
Hey Fred I was referring to Mr TiiTmUs :D,,,,
I used to know a Jeff Crump also Villa.
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Hi CL , phew, thanks , that’s a relief, didn’t want to be compared to Egregious Alf ! Sadly I’m not related to your Mr Crump, I took my moniker from the bloke who I think used to deliver my school’s dinners who was also the Nuneaton Borough Goalie about 150 years ago ! ( well, 1967 anyway.) Oh, the glamour of the old Southern League !
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es when AP Leamington ruled!
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Tony wanted by Police
https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/arrest-warrant-issued-former-aston-20648242.amp
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Dr Tony went to jail
In a Chinese police van
He claimed to be a billionaire
Turns out he was a con man
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es when AP Leamington ruled!
The Brakes
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You wear bad shoes, you pay the price.
No surprise here, the guys a total fraud.
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My guess is that he won’t see a court room.
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(https://i.ibb.co/C5kczkp/Screenshot-2019-10-18-at-13-34-52.png) (https://ibb.co/C5kczkp)
What a great wanted poster, actually looks like it should be nailed to a tree in the Wild West.
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He claimed upon taking over Villa to be a billionaire but he was actually a frontman for other investors' cash
I remember expressing that opinion and being ‘corrected’,
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You wear bad shoes, you pay the price.
No surprise here, the guys a total fraud.
The shit shoed barsteward.
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You wear bad shoes, you pay the price.
No surprise here, the guys a total fraud.
The shit shoed barsteward.
Lesbian Fruit?
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No, it's just the cut of these trousers.
Etc.
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You wear bad shoes, you pay the price.
No surprise here, the guys a total fraud.
The shit shoed barsteward.
My favourite comedy line, ever . Love Paul and Pauline.
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0💲+ 🤫🤑🤑🏐➡️🛫🇨🇳(🕜🕜🧱👮♂️) =😬
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You wear bad shoes, you pay the price.
No surprise here, the guys a total fraud.
The shit shoed barsteward.
Lesbian Fruit?
You calling my car a queer?
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You wear bad shoes, you pay the price.
No surprise here, the guys a total fraud.
The shit shoed barsteward.
Lesbian Fruit?
You calling my car a queer?
"What does that even mean?"
"P**f's car. Car for p**fs. P**fmobile."
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And he passes the fit and proper owners test how exactly? Christ what a lucky escape we had. Thank God for Wes and Nassef.
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He claimed upon taking over Villa to be a billionaire but he was actually a frontman for other investors' cash
I remember expressing that opinion and being ‘corrected’,
I remember several of us pointing out the lack of clarity around his wealth and getting told we were miserablists 'making stuff up'
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Tony Xia + Premier League money = shit creek - paddle.
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That play off final defeat to Fulham is literally one of the best results in our history.
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That play off final defeat to Fulham is literally one of the best results in our history.
You're right. Certainly didn't feel like it though!
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You wear bad shoes, you pay the price.
I always wondered what happened to that lad that kept banging on about Jeffery West shoes.
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And he passes the fit and proper owners test how exactly? Christ what a lucky escape we had. Thank God for Wes and Nassef.
In the last few years I have become convinced that the fit and proper persons test is something they let the new office trainee deal with if they can't find enough filing to keep them busy. You could turn up for a meeting wearing handcuffs and a suit with arrows on and still be allowed to take over a football club.
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It worked for SHA.
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You wear bad shoes, you pay the price.
I always wondered what happened to that lad that kept banging on about Jeffery West shoes.
Ha!
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To paraphrase Norman Stanley Fletcher.
"Are you now or have you ever been a practicing homosexual"?
Dr Tony - "What, in these shoes"?
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Keith Wyness just tweeted “Karma is a bitch”
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Keith Wyness just tweeted “Karma is a bitch”
Keith Wyness strikes me as the kind of neighbour who'd lose his garden shears after lending them to you one time and then tell the rest of the neighbours never to lend you anything because you'll just keep it
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http://finance.sina.com.cn/chanjing/cyxw/2019-10-17/doc-iicezzrr2930952.shtml
At present, Xia Jiantong has been included in the list of untrustworthy executors and is restricted from leaving the country.
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Could have joined Jesse Pinkman on the run in El Camino to liven it up a bit.
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On the run my lord on the run.
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I bet he's shit at hide and seek as well.
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Bloody hell we were lucky to escape.
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Seems like he duped everyone! A total fraud. How did he pass the fit and proper test ?
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He says it's all bollocks on Twitter.
That wanted poster is one pirate ship away from looking shopped to be fair.
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He says it's all bollocks on Twitter.
That wanted poster is one pirate ship away from looking shopped to be fair.
😂 yes that picture looks not in place.
He is hitting back that wyness wanted to take us into administration
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He says it's all bollocks on Twitter.
That wanted poster is one pirate ship away from looking shopped to be fair.
Oh ok, un-cuff the gentleman, he says he isn't a criminal.
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From the doctor:
Ironical experience as I was trapped by competitor while I been away China.I haven’t been arrested as born out by being able to send this tweet. I am not in hiding. The claims are false &been created by a local competitor attempting to cause damage to me. Legal action to follow.
Also very FUNNY how some people talk when they wanted to take Villa into administration which would have meant -12 points &a very bleak future, but asking for extra payment for himself. I NEVER regretful for what I tried for beloved AV including the best exit in circumstances!
I took only one word ‘ VERITAS’with me when I completed my education at Harvard and followed it since then. Though there are very different in many ways in my home country but you can never hate your mother for anything you disagree or dislike. Was hoping sports can embrace ALL!
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Good grief.
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A chancer, a fraudster and a shyster walk into a bar.
"Hello, Dr Xia, what can I get you to drink?"
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A chancer, a fraudster and a shyster walk into a bar.
"Hello, Dr Xia, what can I get you to drink?"
Combined with Keith...
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Nah, he must have been legit for our previous careful custodian to have sold the club to him.
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Someone take Twitter off him and fatty Wyness.
Shaun Teale making some interesting comments re FPA on Wyness’ Twitter feed.
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To be fair to Wyness when Tony says ‘wanted to take us into administration’ I do suspect that Wyness was carrying out his statutory duties given we couldn’t pay our bills and were begging Fcukin Burnley for the balance of the Westwood transfer money.
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The reality is, their aren't many billionaires that Google doesn't know about, he wasn't an anomaly.
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From the doctor:
Ironical experience as I was trapped by competitor while I been away China.I haven’t been arrested as born out by being able to send this tweet. I am not in hiding. The claims are false &been created by a local competitor attempting to cause damage to me. Legal action to follow.
Also very FUNNY how some people talk when they wanted to take Villa into administration which would have meant -12 points &a very bleak future, but asking for extra payment for himself. I NEVER regretful for what I tried for beloved AV including the best exit in circumstances!
I took only one word ‘ VERITAS’with me when I completed my education at Harvard and followed it since then. Though there are very different in many ways in my home country but you can never hate your mother for anything you disagree or dislike. Was hoping sports can embrace ALL!
Has Lerner hijacked his twitter account? It's the sort of incoherent shit he used to come out with.
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Shumanites!
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So Doug unearthed the biggest richest fuckwit in America to sell to, who in turn unearthed a dodgy booted Chinese bulshitting Del Boy to sell to. It woudln't surprise me now to find that NSWE are really a couple of Z list Autralian radio show hosts on an elaborate prank.
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So Doug unearthed the biggest richest fuckwit in America to sell to, who in turn unearthed a dodgy booted Chinese bulshitting Del Boy to sell to. It woudln't surprise me now to find that NSWE are really a couple of Z list Autralian radio show hosts on an elaborate prank.
...who then sell us to Michael Knighton, who in turn appoints Ali Dia as player manager.
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Then we ground-share with WestBarcelonaAlbiyun as SHA are spoken for.
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And he passes the fit and proper owners test how exactly? Christ what a lucky escape we had. Thank God for Wes and Nassef.
There was actually a delay wasn't there? I remember it took about six weeks to pass as it cut into our summer transfer dealings so guess FL had some issues but guess cash being deposited allayed those fears.
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That play off final defeat to Fulham is literally one of the best results in our history.
Spot on with regards to our most recent history.
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So Doug unearthed the biggest richest fuckwit in America to sell to, who in turn unearthed a dodgy booted Chinese bulshitting Del Boy to sell to. It woudln't surprise me now to find that NSWE are really a couple of Z list Autralian radio show hosts on an elaborate prank.
Who was that guy we briefly appointed as chairman in the relegation season primarily to find a buyer, I forget his name but he basically sourced Xia.
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Richard Fitzgerald?
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So Doug unearthed the biggest richest fuckwit in America to sell to, who in turn unearthed a dodgy booted Chinese bulshitting Del Boy to sell to. It woudln't surprise me now to find that NSWE are really a couple of Z list Autralian radio show hosts on an elaborate prank.
Who was that guy we briefly appointed as chairman in the relegation season primarily to find a buyer, I forget his name but he basically sourced Xia.
Steve Hollis?
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So Doug unearthed the biggest richest fuckwit in America to sell to, who in turn unearthed a dodgy booted Chinese bulshitting Del Boy to sell to. It woudln't surprise me now to find that NSWE are really a couple of Z list Autralian radio show hosts on an elaborate prank.
Who was that guy we briefly appointed as chairman in the relegation season primarily to find a buyer, I forget his name but he basically sourced Xia.
Steve Hollis?
Ah that's him. I read he's involved with HS2 so still prominent around Birmingham business. Wonder if anyone has come across in last year and asked him about selling to Xia. Guess he had little choice.
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Memory might be off on this but wasn't Hollis supposed to have done sterling work, making us a half-decent proposition to take on after Merv King, David Bernstein and Brian Little reacted badly to Randy's pissed-up tirade about them?
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Hollis did okay really. Everyone praised him at the time.
-
he certainly seemed to know what he was doing, which made him unique at the time.
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That play off final defeat to Fulham is literally one of the best results in our history.
Spot on with regards to our most recent history.
It really did hurt very bad that day.
I often refer to the wisdom of Mick n’ Keef, given enough perspective and all that.
#You can't always get what you want
But if you try sometimes you just might find
You get what you need#
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So Doug unearthed the biggest richest fuckwit in America to sell to, who in turn unearthed a dodgy booted Chinese bulshitting Del Boy to sell to. It woudln't surprise me now to find that NSWE are really a couple of Z list Autralian radio show hosts on an elaborate prank.
Who was that guy we briefly appointed as chairman in the relegation season primarily to find a buyer, I forget his name but he basically sourced Xia.
Steve Hollis?
Ah that's him. I read he's involved with HS2 so still prominent around Birmingham business. Wonder if anyone has come across in last year and asked him about selling to Xia. Guess he had little choice.
He lives behind my sister. I've caught his rueful gaze for being a ruddy oik trespassing on his land a good few years before his involvement with us.
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So Doug unearthed the biggest richest fuckwit in America to sell to, who in turn unearthed a dodgy booted Chinese bulshitting Del Boy to sell to. It woudln't surprise me now to find that NSWE are really a couple of Z list Autralian radio show hosts on an elaborate prank.
Who was that guy we briefly appointed as chairman in the relegation season primarily to find a buyer, I forget his name but he basically sourced Xia.
Steve Hollis?
Ah that's him. I read he's involved with HS2 so still prominent around Birmingham business. Wonder if anyone has come across in last year and asked him about selling to Xia. Guess he had little choice.
He lives behind my sister. I've caught his rueful gaze for being a ruddy oik trespassing on his land a good few years before his involvement with us.
It’s a sad state of affairs when you can’t climb over someone’s garden fence in the dead of night carrying a crowbar and wearing a balaclava without them giving you filthy looks.
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Exactly. He didn't even have a fence, it was practically an invitation to come in, make myself at home. Use the tennis court.
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From the doctor:
Ironical experience as I was trapped by competitor while I been away China.I haven’t been arrested as born out by being able to send this tweet. I am not in hiding. The claims are false &been created by a local competitor attempting to cause damage to me. Legal action to follow.
Also very FUNNY how some people talk when they wanted to take Villa into administration which would have meant -12 points &a very bleak future, but asking for extra payment for himself. I NEVER regretful for what I tried for beloved AV including the best exit in circumstances!
I took only one word ‘ VERITAS’with me when I completed my education at Harvard and followed it since then. Though there are very different in many ways in my home country but you can never hate your mother for anything you disagree or dislike. Was hoping sports can embrace ALL!
It’s...............................Rebekah Vardy would have ended this better.
-
From the doctor:
Ironical experience as I was trapped by competitor while I been away China.I haven’t been arrested as born out by being able to send this tweet. I am not in hiding. The claims are false &been created by a local competitor attempting to cause damage to me. Legal action to follow.
Also very FUNNY how some people talk when they wanted to take Villa into administration which would have meant -12 points &a very bleak future, but asking for extra payment for himself. I NEVER regretful for what I tried for beloved AV including the best exit in circumstances!
I took only one word ‘ VERITAS’with me when I completed my education at Harvard and followed it since then. Though there are very different in many ways in my home country but you can never hate your mother for anything you disagree or dislike. Was hoping sports can embrace ALL!
It’s...............................Rebekah Vardy would have ended this better.
Harvard no doubt will be very disappointed that only one word 'landed' for one of their 'cum laude' graduates.
-
From the doctor:
Ironical experience as I was trapped by competitor while I been away China.I haven’t been arrested as born out by being able to send this tweet. I am not in hiding. The claims are false &been created by a local competitor attempting to cause damage to me. Legal action to follow.
Also very FUNNY how some people talk when they wanted to take Villa into administration which would have meant -12 points &a very bleak future, but asking for extra payment for himself. I NEVER regretful for what I tried for beloved AV including the best exit in circumstances!
I took only one word ‘ VERITAS’with me when I completed my education at Harvard and followed it since then. Though there are very different in many ways in my home country but you can never hate your mother for anything you disagree or dislike. Was hoping sports can embrace ALL!
Well I’m glad this misunderstanding has been cleared up
-
From the doctor:
Ironical experience as I was trapped by competitor while I been away China.I haven’t been arrested as born out by being able to send this tweet. I am not in hiding. The claims are false &been created by a local competitor attempting to cause damage to me. Legal action to follow.
Also very FUNNY how some people talk when they wanted to take Villa into administration which would have meant -12 points &a very bleak future, but asking for extra payment for himself. I NEVER regretful for what I tried for beloved AV including the best exit in circumstances!
I took only one word ‘ VERITAS’with me when I completed my education at Harvard and followed it since then. Though there are very different in many ways in my home country but you can never hate your mother for anything you disagree or dislike. Was hoping sports can embrace ALL!
It’s...............................Rebekah Vardy would have ended this better.
Harvard no doubt will be very disappointed that only one word 'landed' for one of their 'cum laude' graduates.
I seem to remember nobody was ever able to find his student records at Harvard either.
-
From the doctor:
Ironical experience as I was trapped by competitor while I been away China.I haven’t been arrested as born out by being able to send this tweet. I am not in hiding. The claims are false &been created by a local competitor attempting to cause damage to me. Legal action to follow.
Also very FUNNY how some people talk when they wanted to take Villa into administration which would have meant -12 points &a very bleak future, but asking for extra payment for himself. I NEVER regretful for what I tried for beloved AV including the best exit in circumstances!
I took only one word ‘ VERITAS’with me when I completed my education at Harvard and followed it since then. Though there are very different in many ways in my home country but you can never hate your mother for anything you disagree or dislike. Was hoping sports can embrace ALL!
It’s...............................Rebekah Vardy would have ended this better.
Harvard no doubt will be very disappointed that only one word 'landed' for one of their 'cum laude' graduates.
I thought 'Veritas' was that clinic in Switzerland.
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And Kilroy's political party. Poor Roy.
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Well, I said I doubt he will see the inside of a court room, looks like I was right.
embarrassed thingy
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Interesting how people jumped in with the warrant for arrest line and thought it was true yet don't have decency to hold hands up and admit they cast stones without knowing full story.
Xia speaks out and none of those people who criticize him from such news then don't come back here and say anything after its branded fake news.
Wish people could learn a bit more from things as there hardly any attempt to debate more just quick to judgement or ignore what's been said as it doesn't fit criteria in confirmation bias of thinking .
Embrassing really.
I imagine no-one but Tony knows the truth.
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Yes, fair play, those tweets have cleared everything up in a really transparent manner. I now feel suitably chastened.
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#doingbirdwithxia
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Tony Xia on Twitter.
One maybe the most important ⚽️this season. UTV.
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Twitter still seems to be the Tony Xia Fan Club.
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Twitter still seems to be the Tony Xia Fan Club.
I would expect better of Twitter. I would have thought Facebook would be the place for Tony Xia fans.
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Someone take Twitter off him and fatty Wyness.
Shaun Teale making some interesting comments re FPA on Wyness’ Twitter feed.
Wyness was an absolute toad. Everton and Aberdeen fans were quick to warn us when he rocked up in B6. Talks a good game, but clearly knows nothing about running a football club.
The fact that he had an Alexa on his desk shows how unprofessional this pillock was. I doubt very much Purslow has anything like that anywhere near his office
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Interesting how people jumped in with the warrant for arrest line and thought it was true yet don't have decency to hold hands up and admit they cast stones without knowing full story.
Xia speaks out and none of those people who criticize him from such news then don't come back here and say anything after its branded fake news.
Wish people could learn a bit more from things as there hardly any attempt to debate more just quick to judgement or ignore what's been said as it doesn't fit criteria in confirmation bias of thinking .
Embrassing really.
Bizarre use of English, baffling defence of Xia, constant streams of nonsense...
Anybody seen Dr Tony and Vill I An in the same room?
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Interesting how people jumped in with the warrant for arrest line and thought it was true yet don't have decency to hold hands up and admit they cast stones without knowing full story.
Xia speaks out and none of those people who criticize him from such news then don't come back here and say anything after its branded fake news.
Wish people could learn a bit more from things as there hardly any attempt to debate more just quick to judgement or ignore what's been said as it doesn't fit criteria in confirmation bias of thinking .
Embrassing really.
Bizarre use of English, baffling defence of Xia, constant streams of nonsense...
Anybody seen Dr Tony and Vill I An in the same room?
I did that a few pages back, plagiarist :)
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Apologies CL! Great minds...
Anyway if we can check his location from his ip, we can split the reward.
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Apologies CL! Great minds...
Anyway if we can check his location from his ip, we can split the reward.
Narrowed it down to some Payless shoe manufacturers in China.
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Interesting how people jumped in with the warrant for arrest line and thought it was true yet don't have decency to hold hands up and admit they cast stones without knowing full story.
Xia speaks out and none of those people who criticize him from such news then don't come back here and say anything after its branded fake news.
Wish people could learn a bit more from things as there hardly any attempt to debate more just quick to judgement or ignore what's been said as it doesn't fit criteria in confirmation bias of thinking .
Embrassing really.
Christ almighty, where do you start with this?
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Interesting how people jumped in with the warrant for arrest line and thought it was true yet don't have decency to hold hands up and admit they cast stones without knowing full story.
Xia speaks out and none of those people who criticize him from such news then don't come back here and say anything after its branded fake news.
Wish people could learn a bit more from things as there hardly any attempt to debate more just quick to judgement or ignore what's been said as it doesn't fit criteria in confirmation bias of thinking .
Embrassing really.
Christ almighty, where do you start with this?
Google translate?
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Babelfish?
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Babelfish?
Anyone got a spare?
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Babelfish?
Anyone got a spare?
Is it on the red button?
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Here is the Harvard graduate himself. Along with his Regus temporary hired office space.
https://youtu.be/9imEr-aJmEE
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Babelfish?
Anyone got a spare?
Is it on the red button?
It's on the later channels on SKY. Apparently.
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FootySkillz lives!!
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Babelfish?
Anyone got a spare?
Any one got any Veras?
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Who knew he was a Classroom Assistant?
CAIXIN
Ex-England soccer club chief spends months in China detention centers
Relatives say Xia Jiantong was detained prior to his formal arrest
Xia Jiantong, who also goes by Tony Xie, closed the deal to buy the U.K.’s Aston Villa Football Club on June 15, 2016. © AP
SHAN YUXIAO and MATTHEW WALSH, Caixin
February 6, 2021 12:47 JST
The Chinese former chairman of one of England's big soccer clubs spent six months in a shadowy network of detention centers prior to his formal arrest last month on suspicion of harming the interests of a Shenzhen-listed manufacturing company, Caixin has learned.
Xia Jiantong, the erstwhile chairman of Birmingham-based Aston Villa F.C. also known as Tony Xia, was subject to "residential surveillance at a designated location," a form of extralegal detention used by Chinese authorities, from July 17 last year to his arrest on Jan. 15, according to two family members with direct knowledge of his situation.
Xia is being held at a detention center in the eastern Chinese city of Yixing pending the outcome of a police investigation, official documents show. His family said the case was an "economic dispute" over unpaid debts of about 200 million yuan ($30.92 million) during Xia's time in charge of Yuancheng Cable Co. Ltd., a Shenzhen-listed cable products manufacturer.
Xia's family said the loans involving Yuancheng do not meet the legal standard for criminal activity, adding that in many cases the company was neither the sole guarantor nor the sole borrower.
Chinese media previously reported a Yuancheng stock market filing on Jan. 20 that said an arrest warrant had been issued for Xia, but his stint in detention and details of his alleged crime were previously unknown.
A Yuancheng spokesperson declined to comment on the case, saying the company's position was clear from its public filings.
Xia is a multimillionaire investor as well as the chairman and CEO of Chinese-headquartered conglomerate Recon Group Ltd. He was in charge of Yuancheng from late 2016 to March 2018, when the company announced a new controller.
The dispute, according to the family members, appears to center on joint loans by Yuancheng, taken out during Xia's tenure, in which the company provided guarantees for another firm Xia controlled, Hangzhou Ruikang Sport & Cultural Co. Ltd.
After some of the money was not repaid, a court ordered Yuancheng to assume part of the debt obligations. Yuancheng reported Xia to the authorities in February, claiming he arranged the loans in bad faith.
Recon Group CEO Xia Jiantong, right, poses with a soccer ball as he attends a news conference for Recon Group's acquisition of Aston Villa in Beijing in July 2016. © AP
China's criminal law states that directors, supervisors and senior managers of listed companies may face up to seven years in jail if they cause "significant losses" to the company by using their position to force it into providing guarantees for entities that are manifestly unable to pay off their debts, or into providing guarantees for "illegitimate reasons."
Family members said Xia bears no "subjective malice" that would lead him to harm the interests of the listed company, and borrowers other than Yuancheng had repaid most of the joint debts mentioned in the legal cases. "Some of the cases are still under trial and cannot be considered actual losses," one family member said. "Therefore, this case is an economic dispute and cannot be defined as a criminal suit."
Despite denying any criminality, the family said it had spoken to Yuancheng several times about reimbursement for the forced payments, but had failed to reach an agreement.
Documents sent to Caixin by Xia's family show that the dispute revolves around four separate payments by Yuancheng totaling 193.59 million yuan:
-- A loan of 60 million yuan to Ruikang Sport, for which Yuancheng and Xia are listed as two of five guarantors. Yuancheng was forced to repay 58 million yuan;
-- A loan of 10 million yuan to Ruikang Sport, for which Yuancheng and Xia are listed as two of six guarantors. Yuancheng was forced to repay 7.42 million yuan and has filed a lawsuit to claim compensation;
-- A loan of 30 million yuan to Ruikang Sport, Yuancheng and two other companies, for which Xia and his brother, former Yuancheng chairman Xia Jianjun, are listed as guarantors. Yuancheng was forced to repay 10.17 million yuan and is claiming compensation;
-- A loan of 190 million yuan to Ruikang Sport, for which Yuancheng provided guarantees. Yuancheng was forced to repay 118 million yuan and is claiming compensation.
Civil litigation documents sent to Caixin also show open cases involving five further loans for which Yuancheng may be partly liable for a total of 144 million yuan. In each of these cases, the borrowers include Ruikang Sports and the two Xia brothers.
One case involves a joint loan obtained by Yuancheng and other parties in September 2018, when Xia Jiantong was no longer the company's actual controller, according to his family.
In another case, a court ruled that Yuancheng did not need to assume obligation for a debt for which it acted as a guarantor.
According to a January earnings report, Yuancheng posted expected net losses of between 108 million and 132 million yuan last year, largely due to more than 140 million yuan set aside as a result of two court cases.
Xia, 46, from the city of Quzhou in East China's Zhejiang province, rose to prominence in the middle of the last decade with a series of acquisitions at several Chinese listed companies, including a Shanghai-listed condiments producer and a Shenzhen-listed technology firm.
He bought Aston Villa for a stated 75 million pounds ($103 million) in June 2016, succeeding American chairman Randy Lerner soon after the club was relegated from the Premier League.
But Xia lost control of the team in 2019 amid widely reported cash flow problems and after failing to repay a loan. During his tenure, Villa came close to falling into administration. The team returned to top tier of English soccer the same year.
Xia also courted controversy when an anti-fraud campaigner accused him of exaggerating his credentials by claiming to have worked as a professor at Harvard. Xia responded that the media had incorrectly reported his actual role of teaching assistant.
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Christ, he really was Randy's last big F U.
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I remember Randy saying what safe hands he was leaving us in. How the hell did this chancer pull the wool over so many peoples eyes?
Thank God we have the real deal now in all areas of the club.
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Crooked chancer. Could have ruined us.
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We should have held the 30 million back after what he sold us to
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Lerner was totally convinced he was the real deal.
Which should have been warning enough.
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Who knew he was a Classroom Assistant?
CAIXIN
Ex-England soccer club chief spends months in China detention centers
Who knew he was an Uyghur?
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He nearly destroyed us thank god we have our current owners Nassef and Wes.
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In short he’s a failed gambler. Nothing more nothing less
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Lerner was totally convinced he was the real deal.
Which should have been warning enough.
Was Lerner convinced? Maybe once he had a get out and knew he could walk away with his cut he didn't care. He didn't care much in the last couple of years of owning us so why would he care about who he sold us to.
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Lerner was totally convinced he was the real deal.
Which should have been warning enough.
Was Lerner convinced? Maybe once he had a get out and knew he could walk away with his cut he didn't care. He didn't care much in the last couple of years of owning us so why would he care about who he sold us to.
We wanted him to sell for long enough; it's a bit much to expect him to bother about who he sold to.
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Lerner was totally convinced he was the real deal.
Which should have been warning enough.
Was Lerner convinced? Maybe once he had a get out and knew he could walk away with his cut he didn't care. He didn't care much in the last couple of years of owning us so why would he care about who he sold us to.
We wanted him to sell for long enough; it's a bit much to expect him to bother about who he sold to.
Idealistic I know but I would hope he had some sense of 'duty of care' as to who he sold us to. Some club owners have been decent enough to act like that. Although admittedly many haven't.
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Well according to Randolph's statement on leaving in 2016, he held off on other deals because they weren't the right custodians to continue his legacy.
Xia's grandiose plans - which envisioned revitalising the club as of part turning Aston and Lozells into Mar-a-Lago or summat - made him the preferred bidder.
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Well Tone certainly found the right owners so thanks for that!
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Judge a man by the shoes he wears say I. How could anybody not be a chancer who wears trainers with a cheap three piece suit? And Poundstretcher recycled pop bottle socks in all probability.
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Certainly a chancer, but had we gone up it might well have worked out. Can't help liking the bloke and hope he gets out in one piece.
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Certainly a chancer, but had we gone up it might well have worked out. Can't help liking the bloke and hope he gets out in one piece.
A con man who took the Villa within hours of administration. What would he have to do for you not to like him?
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Certainly a chancer, but had we gone up it might well have worked out. Can't help liking the bloke and hope he gets out in one piece.
A con man who took the Villa within hours of administration. What would he have to do for you not to like him?
Absolutely, a fraud of an owner.
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Certainly a chancer, but had we gone up it might well have worked out. Can't help liking the bloke and hope he gets out in one piece.
A con man who took the Villa within hours of administration. What would he have to do for you not to like him?
Not sold us on.
Oh don't get me wrong, he was an awful owner and I'd far rather who we have now! I am very grateful for the current ownership. I just can't summon up any great personal animosity towards him, and in his way he was quite likeable for a while. In any case I wouldn't wish Chinese prison on anyone.
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The ageing board of the 1960s were outdated, misguided, which over a number of years culminated in nearly sending us under.
Ellis spent decades on and off missing the big boat, interfering too much with a corner shop mentality instead of rolling the dice more.
The Bendalls were hands off, put the money in and we got some fantastic success. You can debate the financial state we were in when they went.
Ellis at least when he left seemed to have put us into good hands with Lerner coming in.
Lerner failed but we had some half decent times for a while until he was shown to have lost the plot.
Xia put all the chips on red and it came up black. He managed in a very short time to do what the old directors of the 1960s took many years to do.
Without doubt he was the very worst to run the show.
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Lerner was totally convinced he was the real deal.
Which should have been warning enough.
Lerner didn't give a stuff. Just wanted to recoup as much lost cash as possible.
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Well according to Randolph's statement on leaving in 2016, he held off on other deals because they weren't the right custodians to continue his legacy.
Xia's grandiose plans - which envisioned revitalising the club as of part turning Aston and Lozells into Mar-a-Lago or summat - made him the preferred bidder.
Tone may have had good intentions but always better to have a billionaire in charge.
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With xia in charge we were 24hrs away from administration and oblivion. Id love to know how he managed to pay lerner anything.
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Lozells twinned with Mar A Lago, can you imagine?!
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Lozells twinned with Mar A Lago, can you imagine?!
Just googled Mar A lago , posh init 🤔😀
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Lerner's biggest achievement (if you can call it that) was finding an even bigger useless twat than himself to sell to. I wouldn't have thought it possible but he pulled it off.
Was Randy's planned sale to Xia anything to do with Bernstein and King walking out?
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Lerner's biggest achievement (if you can call it that) was finding an even bigger useless twat than himself to sell to. I wouldn't have thought it possible but he pulled it off.
Was Randy's planned sale to Xia anything to do with Bernstein and King walking out?
Wasn't the whole point of bringing in Steve Hollis to find a credible buyer. Doubt Lerner was involved that much in the sale process except being told he'd get the money he was asking in.
Hollis is still around Birmingham business world I think so surprised he hasn't done an interview in last year explaining his role unless he just wants to airbrush himself out of our history given he was only here a brief time and seems to have done the trick.
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Having done business in China, I have to say it is very difficult to get any reliable information about who you are dealing with and who owns what. It's a nebulous and constantly moving platform there. Dr Tony might well have had access to funds one minute and none the next, happens all the time as people go out of favour with the government there. Guess we will never know.
I also take a more kindly view of Randy. He toasted a huge amount of money on Villa, had second thoughts and messed up when tightening the purse strings. But how many of us would have burned the level of cash he did without getting twitchy in the end? He did well first few years and I am glad for that, just wish he had sold quicker and not to Dr Tony!
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The sale was being handled by Bank of America, whose only remit was to find somebody with the cash. A lawyer I worked with had acted for a couple of interested parties from Hong Kong and China, and he let me have sight of the sales particulars etc.
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Lerner's biggest achievement (if you can call it that) was finding an even bigger useless twat than himself to sell to. I wouldn't have thought it possible but he pulled it off.
Was Randy's planned sale to Xia anything to do with Bernstein and King walking out?
Wasn't the whole point of bringing in Steve Hollis to find a credible buyer. Doubt Lerner was involved that much in the sale process except being told he'd get the money he was asking in.
Hollis is still around Birmingham business world I think so surprised he hasn't done an interview in last year explaining his role unless he just wants to airbrush himself out of our history given he was only here a brief time and seems to have done the trick.
Not sure if the link below works
https://open.spotify.com/episode/4RztWl1NNLWFFSq1MSSo4h?si=rUAp-Zz-TaK3qcBrM7QWFg&utm_source=copy-link
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I cant believe Xia would have passed any due diligence worth its salt, which probably means Lerner was just desperate to get rid...as his recent interview seems to show.
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Thanks for that podcast link. Very interesting. Biggest thing, which I didn't realise (or forgot), is that Nigel Pearson was being lined-up as our next manager if Randy had failed to sell. Pearson even flew out to America to meet him and hold talks.
Hollis also highlighted the "civic values" held by Lerner and "shown" by Xia re his regeneration plans for the area around Villa Park which apparently helped pave the way for the sale to Xia. The lack of a salary cap put off the American investors accustomed to NFL rules but I wonder of the remaining interested parties, all Chinese according to Hollis (there was no interest from "high net-worth British individuals"), how wary/or not were Hollis/Lerner about who they sold to? Hollis seems fairly sure in his convictions - Xia passed the fit and proper owners test and once that was cleared, it wasn't Hollis or Randy's problem anymore.
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Thanks for that podcast link. Very interesting. Biggest thing, which I didn't realise (or forgot), is that Nigel Pearson was being lined-up as our next manager if Randy had failed to sell. Pearson even flew out to America to meet him and hold talks.
Hollis also highlighted the "civic values" held by Lerner and "shown" by Xia re his regeneration plans for the area around Villa Park which apparently helped pave the way for the sale to Xia. The lack of a salary cap put off the American investors accustomed to NFL rules but I wonder of the remaining interested parties, all Chinese according to Hollis (there was no interest from "high net-worth British individuals"), how wary/or not were Hollis/Lerner about who they sold to? Hollis seems fairly sure in his convictions - Xia passed the fit and proper owners test and once that was cleared, it wasn't Hollis or Randy's problem anymore.
The lad I mentioned above said that it was only Chinese investors interested apparently, including another, different bloke called Xia.
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The ageing board of the 1960s were outdated, misguided, which over a number of years culminated in nearly sending us under.
Ellis spent decades on and off missing the big boat, interfering too much with a corner shop mentality instead of rolling the dice more.
The Bendalls were hands off, put the money in and we got some fantastic success. You can debate the financial state we were in when they went.
Ellis at least when he left seemed to have put us into good hands with Lerner coming in.
Lerner failed but we had some half decent times for a while until he was shown to have lost the plot.
Xia put all the chips on red and it came up black. He managed in a very short time to do what the old directors of the 1960s took many years to do.
Without doubt he was the very worst to run the show.
Ellis left us in a right state too. His last season with DOL at the helm and bed sheets hanging from the Holte End was an incredibly grim one. Made a decent chunk of change when he sold the club too. Unlike Lerner who lost a fortune a bit like his compatriot at Sunderland, Ellis Short. Lerner's biggest failing was not putting in place a competent management team to run the club for him. Xia was just a fraudster.
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Thanks for that podcast link. Very interesting. Biggest thing, which I didn't realise (or forgot), is that Nigel Pearson was being lined-up as our next manager if Randy had failed to sell. Pearson even flew out to America to meet him and hold talks.
Hollis also highlighted the "civic values" held by Lerner and "shown" by Xia re his regeneration plans for the area around Villa Park which apparently helped pave the way for the sale to Xia. The lack of a salary cap put off the American investors accustomed to NFL rules but I wonder of the remaining interested parties, all Chinese according to Hollis (there was no interest from "high net-worth British individuals"), how wary/or not were Hollis/Lerner about who they sold to? Hollis seems fairly sure in his convictions - Xia passed the fit and proper owners test and once that was cleared, it wasn't Hollis or Randy's problem anymore.
The lad I mentioned above said that it was only Chinese investors interested apparently, including another, different bloke called Xia.
Its one of those situations where the I.M. Introductory Memorandum had been pushed around for so long, the "deal" hung around like a bad smell.
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Apologies if already mentioned elsewhere, but there’s a programme on Al Jazeera tonight at 9pm “The men who sell football”.
I’m hearing Xia is in it and doesn’t come out well. We shall see!
Channel 513 on SKY.
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Apologies if already mentioned elsewhere, but there’s a programme on Al Jazeera tonight at 9pm “The men who sell football”.
I’m hearing Xia is in it and doesn’t come out well. We shall see!
Channel 513 on SKY.
Beat you by one second (on a less relevant thread). Call it a draw!
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Apologies if already mentioned elsewhere, but there’s a programme on Al Jazeera tonight at 9pm “The men who sell football”.
I’m hearing Xia is in it and doesn’t come out well. We shall see!
Will it also cover the purchase of PSG?
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Apologies if already mentioned elsewhere, but there’s a programme on Al Jazeera tonight at 9pm “The men who sell football”.
I’m hearing Xia is in it and doesn’t come out well. We shall see!
Will it also cover the purchase of PSG?
I doubt whether Chris Samuelson woud've had his beak in that one.
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There seems to be a podcast version so will listen to that while "working" tomorrow.
At the bottom of this page if that's of interest to anyone.
https://www.ajiunit.com/investigation/the-men-who-sell-football-corruption/
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The preview said that Xia is in jail - is that true?
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This is pretty grim viewing so far. None of it is a surprise, but it's shocking to see how easy it all is. The rich in this country can simply be a mafia if they choose to, and the law doesn't care.
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This is pretty grim viewing so far. None of it is a surprise, but it's shocking to see how easy it all is. The rich in this country can simply be a mafia if they choose to, and the law doesn't care.
Isn’t it ever? It’s a never ending trail of deceit.
They’ve basically said we will never know where the money came from to buy Aston Villa.
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The preview said that Xia is in jail - is that true?
Crimes against shoes and emojis 🦾🫁👩🏻🎤🤳🏼🪖🙉
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The preview said that Xia is in jail - is that true?
Seems like he did six months but isn't now, though I can't find anything definitive. He hasn't Tweeted for over a year...
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The Villa sale looks to have been one of the most egregious. I'd strongly recommend watching it if it's available on catch-up/YouTube etc. This Samuelson appears to be either a crook, a liar or both (it can't be neither). I think this was hinted at when his involvement was mentioned at the time.
That we got ourselves into such a mess leaves big questions for the likes of the Shunammite, Wyness et al. I'm almost starting to warm to Jack Grealish again after all that.
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It also possibly explains Mervyn King's and that other bloke's sudden departures (my timelines maybe a little fucked here though).
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Christ, that was a worrying watch - definitely worth catching up on if you haven’t seen it. The levels of deceit that these lot went to in order to bend the rules is staggering. Hopefully they’ll never get near another club again. Shocking.
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Thank you Nas and Wes.
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what about the fucker who sourced this deal with Uncle Tony and got paid for it ??? christ on a bike
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It makes a mockery of the so called fit & proper ownership checks. As in most walks of life, if you grease enough palms they all look the other way.
We are so lucky that our club wasn’t destroyed by these people & that we came out of it with the owners we now have.
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Apologies if already mentioned elsewhere, but there’s a programme on Al Jazeera tonight at 9pm “The men who sell football”.
I’m hearing Xia is in it and doesn’t come out well. We shall see!
Channel 513 on SKY.
Thanks for the heads up on this. Got it recorded on Sky and sounds like essential viewing.
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what about the fucker who sourced this deal with Uncle Tony and got paid for it ??? christ on a bike
Paid £3m I’ve just read...
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Randy Lerner was an absolute sack of crap to even put the club at risk like that. Sad excuse for a man.
The “fit and proper” test is a complete sham, and there needs to be more accountability at the higher levels for letting these things occur.
F Tony.
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Randy Lerner was an absolute sack of crap to even put the club at risk like that. Sad excuse for a man.
The “fit and proper” test is a complete sham, and there needs to be more accountability at the higher levels for letting these things occur.
F Tony.
I wonder if Lerner still has that tattoo
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Can someone posts the keys facts on here?
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Can someone posts the keys facts on here?
Going off the podcast version:
Some investigative journalists as representatives of 3 wealthy Chinese businessmen. Approached a chap called Samuelson, who's a type of fixer for buying football clubs and has been since the early 80s. The conversation went roughly along the lines of:
"I want to buy a football club"
"OK, I can sort that out. What about Derby County for £160m"
"Yeah, that sounds good. The thing is I'm on the run from the Chinese government and want to launder a load of dirty money"
"No probs, if your 2 mates are clean then they can hold it in a trust fund so they'll have to pass the fit & proper persons test but you'll avoid it."
"They might be escaping the law too"
"Oh, well that's fine we'll just set up 20 trust funds each holding 5% of the shares, and so nobody will have a holding big enough to be assessed anyway"
"OK, cool"
I paraphrase a lot there, but you get the idea. They very blatantly said that the guy was a criminal planning to use the club to launder money, and he didn't bat an eyelid. In fact offered some of his other services in making that money a bit harder to trace ...
Then went on to say, in other words, that Dr Tony Shitshoes was probably just a front man and the money came from elsewhere. Samuelson was involved in that deal too. He's also involved with some pretty shady characters, incl. various Russian oligarchs and some serious gangster types down in That London.
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Here's a link chaps:
Click (https://youtu.be/ldgTCXpDEgk)
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I've always been in the blame Lerner camp. End of the day you have to be desperate enough to entertain these sort of people to sell to them and he was absolutely clueless about running a football club and not realising for most owners its a money pit. He acted like he was doing a football version of Brewster's millions basically handing out unbelievable contracts to all sort of bobbins and by the time he got rid of us he'd probably have sold to me if i'd turned up with a postal order. Bottom line is he's proof that even billionaires have fuckwits for children
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Tony was a frontman, really I would never of guessed.
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Built up shoes
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I miss those fireworks before a game.
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I've always been in the blame Lerner camp. End of the day you have to be desperate enough to entertain these sort of people to sell to them and he was absolutely clueless about running a football club and not realising for most owners its a money pit. He acted like he was doing a football version of Brewster's millions basically handing out unbelievable contracts to all sort of bobbins and by the time he got rid of us he'd probably have sold to me if i'd turned up with a postal order. Bottom line is he's proof that even billionaires have fuckwits for children
See Trump, Fred.
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Scary how close we came to being trapped in the lower leagues forever with all the other shitmuncher teams.
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Here's a link chaps:
Click (https://youtu.be/ldgTCXpDEgk)
Bloody hell, that's a thorough piece of work from Al Jazeera. I imagine Mr Samuelson has had some explaining to do to clients, and a lot of them will be the sort of people who are very unhappy at being named in stuff like that.
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I wonder who the real owners of Villa were? We’ll never know
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I wonder what this means for the three minor clubs in the West Midlands
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Here's a link chaps:
Click (https://youtu.be/ldgTCXpDEgk)
Bloody hell, that's a thorough piece of work from Al Jazeera. I imagine Mr Samuelson has had some explaining to do to clients, and a lot of them will be the sort of people who are very unhappy at being named in stuff like that.
He'll be looking over his shoulder for a long time to come after this.
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I wonder who the real owners of Villa were? We’ll never know
Considering how badly it nearly went, my thinking is that the real owner was............Legion ;) :)
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There's only been snippets in the news but IF they're correct and IF he's guilty then he wasn't a front man for other people. The money came from someone else's company that he was a custodian of. Obviously that's speculation unless he's convicted.
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Should add the irony of AJ running this, when they're the propaganda organ for Qatar and all the MB nonsense they spread in the Middle East and of course, their own corrupt involvement in football.
Nonetheless, eye opening.
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It seems that Cypriot passports are the way to go for corrupt businessmen these days.
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Should add the irony of AJ running this, when they're the propaganda organ for Qatar and all the MB nonsense they spread in the Middle East and of course, their own corrupt involvement in football.
Nonetheless, eye opening.
Never had a problem with Al Jazeera and never noticed any bias in their reporting, quite the opposite in fact. Their documentaries are generally superb. That dodgy real estate couple in Cyprus have appeared in another documentary sting where the government minister friend was not only named but filmed selling dodgy passports to Russian mobsters etc..
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It seems that Cypriot passports are the way to go for corrupt businessmen these days.
Yep, I mentioned them in the Brexit thread. There and Malta. Few hundred grand, job done.
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Should add the irony of AJ running this, when they're the propaganda organ for Qatar and all the MB nonsense they spread in the Middle East and of course, their own corrupt involvement in football.
Nonetheless, eye opening.
Never had a problem with Al Jazeera and never noticed any bias in their reporting, quite the opposite in fact. Their documentaries are generally superb. That dodgy real estate couple in Cyprus have appeared in another documentary sting where the government minister friend was not only named but filmed selling dodgy passports to Russian mobsters etc..
It's the propaganda arm of the Qataris. It's the same as RT, but it's focus is more on stirring the pot in its own backyard as they scrap it out with the Hause of Saud for pre-eminence.
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Should add the irony of AJ running this, when they're the propaganda organ for Qatar and all the MB nonsense they spread in the Middle East and of course, their own corrupt involvement in football.
Nonetheless, eye opening.
Never had a problem with Al Jazeera and never noticed any bias in their reporting, quite the opposite in fact. Their documentaries are generally superb. That dodgy real estate couple in Cyprus have appeared in another documentary sting where the government minister friend was not only named but filmed selling dodgy passports to Russian mobsters etc..
It's the propaganda arm of the Qataris. It's the same as RT, but it's focus is more on stirring the pot in its own backyard as they scrap it out with the Hause of Saud for pre-eminence.
Maybe the Arabic version but the English version of Al Jazeera is excellent. To compare it to RT is ridiculous, have you ever seen RT? It's almost a parody of a propaganda news channel. Mentalists!
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OK.
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Chelsea were lucky, it could easily have been Spurs
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Was it Steve Hollis who found Xia on behalf of Lerner? For a man of his qualifications and experience in business, surely that reflects badly on him.
'Happier Times' (Xia and Mark Regan)
A football club owner and a local journalist...five years later a convict and a football club employee:
(https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/onesport/cps/800/cpsprodpb/D668/production/_89988845_xmr.jpg)
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It seems that Cypriot passports are the way to go for corrupt businessmen these days.
Yep, I mentioned them in the Brexit thread. There and Malta. Few hundred grand, job done.
Didn't Mark Steel, when he was In Town in Malta, find 5 Russians using the same garage as their Maltese address?
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The alarm bells were ringing when he turned up to Bodymoor in an Uber - and in those shoes too.
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Very good documentary - it should have some consequences?
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The alarm bells were ringing when he turned up to Bodymoor in an Uber - and in those shoes too.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing. For the numbers who were questioning the deal, there were many more shouting the doubters down and telling them to stop being negative. Their attitude seemed to be "the louder I shout, the righter I am"
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Given that nobody knew, there's no point taking any solace from guessing correctly. It's why the coin toss isn't an Olympic sport.
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He was very plausible though. Tayls had his number early doors though.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/football/2016/may/19/tony-xia-revamp-aston-villa-top-three-world-owner
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What exactly is the fit and proper test? Do we know? I know what it's supposed to be, but in practice.
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They have to have proof of last month's leccy bill. Photocopy should be fine.
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If I recall correctly he had to prove he had the cash to fund the operating costs for two seasons. He did that but widely rumoured to be purely based on the parachute money.
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If I recall correctly he had to prove he had the cash to fund the operating costs for two seasons. He did that but widely rumoured to be purely based on the parachute money.
In which case, I think I could probably do that. And I have better shoes.
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Just watched the documentary. Fascinating stuff
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Just watched the documentary. Fascinating stuff
which documentary?
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Yes Rory, the Poundstretcher shoes and the cardboard belt should have alerted us.
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Just watched the documentary. Fascinating stuff
which documentary?
got a link please?
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Just watched the documentary. Fascinating stuff
which documentary?
got a link please?
See page 161 of this thread.
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Yes Rory, the Poundstretcher shoes and the cardboard belt should have alerted us.
Can't believe I missed the cardboard belt, Brian! Gah, what was I thinking.
But seriously, I was so demoralised at the time, I didn't have a clue.
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The trouble is, and as the documentary showed, with overseas cash it's incredibly easy to disguise its source, and therefore also very difficult for authorities to do proper due diligence. I deal a lot with offshore structures, and until there's a global standard for company and ultimate beneficial owner information, stuff like this will always happen, and not just with football, obviously.
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The trouble is, and as the documentary showed, with overseas cash it's incredibly easy to disguise its source, and therefore also very difficult for authorities to do proper due diligence. I deal a lot with offshore structures, and until there's a global standard for company and ultimate beneficial owner information, stuff like this will always happen, and not just with football, obviously.
I'm probably being naive here but I don't understand why onshore states that like to collect taxes allow these offshore operations to continue. Is it just that the people in charge also want to hide their money there?
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The trouble is, and as the documentary showed, with overseas cash it's incredibly easy to disguise its source, and therefore also very difficult for authorities to do proper due diligence. I deal a lot with offshore structures, and until there's a global standard for company and ultimate beneficial owner information, stuff like this will always happen, and not just with football, obviously.
I'm probably being naive here but I don't understand why onshore states that like to collect taxes allow these offshore operations to continue. Is it just that the people in charge also want to hide their money there?
Well, there's a move now for a minimum global company tax rate of at least 10%. The theory at the moment is though, that a country is free to set its own tax rate. So the UK is lower than France, Ireland and Malta are lower than the UK and so on. Usually it's a balance between attracting companies to operate in your country, and actually needing to raise money through taxation. Offshore places like the IOM, Gibraltar, Jersey and BVI etc don't really have anything else much they can offer, so they set out to attract companies there with a 0% rate. The IOM's biggest industry is online gaming, and although they don't get any company tax, the thousands of people employed all pay income tax and buy houses etc. There are also a lot of funds and pesnions based in such places, as you don't really want people's pensions being whittled away by tax.
There's also the fact that a lot of places offshore are a lot less transparent in terms of information, as to who shareholders are, and having to publicly lodge accounts. As I say though, there's a huge amount of pressure to move away from both the low tax and secrecy aspects. Ireland in particular, isn't keen on the low tax thing being abolished.
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Tony Xia is one of the great Villa stories. It is only a matter of time before somebody points out that you have never seen him and the African Car Reverser in the same photograph.
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The trouble is, and as the documentary showed, with overseas cash it's incredibly easy to disguise its source, and therefore also very difficult for authorities to do proper due diligence. I deal a lot with offshore structures, and until there's a global standard for company and ultimate beneficial owner information, stuff like this will always happen, and not just with football, obviously.
I'm probably being naive here but I don't understand why onshore states that like to collect taxes allow these offshore operations to continue. Is it just that the people in charge also want to hide their money there?
Well, there's a move now for a minimum global company tax rate of at least 10%. The theory at the moment is though, that a country is free to set its own tax rate. So the UK is lower than France, Ireland and Malta are lower than the UK and so on. Usually it's a balance between attracting companies to operate in your country, and actually needing to raise money through taxation. Offshore places like the IOM, Gibraltar, Jersey and BVI etc don't really have anything else much they can offer, so they set out to attract companies there with a 0% rate. The IOM's biggest industry is online gaming, and although they don't get any company tax, the thousands of people employed all pay income tax and buy houses etc. There are also a lot of funds and pesnions based in such places, as you don't really want people's pensions being whittled away by tax.
There's also the fact that a lot of places offshore are a lot less transparent in terms of information, as to who shareholders are, and having to publicly lodge accounts. As I say though, there's a huge amount of pressure to move away from both the low tax and secrecy aspects. Ireland in particular, isn't keen on the low tax thing being abolished.
Thanks for the info. I get the corporation tax thing, it's the secrecy bit that baffles me.
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The trouble is, and as the documentary showed, with overseas cash it's incredibly easy to disguise its source, and therefore also very difficult for authorities to do proper due diligence. I deal a lot with offshore structures, and until there's a global standard for company and ultimate beneficial owner information, stuff like this will always happen, and not just with football, obviously.
I'm probably being naive here but I don't understand why onshore states that like to collect taxes allow these offshore operations to continue. Is it just that the people in charge also want to hide their money there?
Well, there's a move now for a minimum global company tax rate of at least 10%. The theory at the moment is though, that a country is free to set its own tax rate. So the UK is lower than France, Ireland and Malta are lower than the UK and so on. Usually it's a balance between attracting companies to operate in your country, and actually needing to raise money through taxation. Offshore places like the IOM, Gibraltar, Jersey and BVI etc don't really have anything else much they can offer, so they set out to attract companies there with a 0% rate. The IOM's biggest industry is online gaming, and although they don't get any company tax, the thousands of people employed all pay income tax and buy houses etc. There are also a lot of funds and pesnions based in such places, as you don't really want people's pensions being whittled away by tax.
There's also the fact that a lot of places offshore are a lot less transparent in terms of information, as to who shareholders are, and having to publicly lodge accounts. As I say though, there's a huge amount of pressure to move away from both the low tax and secrecy aspects. Ireland in particular, isn't keen on the low tax thing being abolished.
Thanks for the info. I get the corporation tax thing, it's the secrecy bit that baffles me.
The worst culprits are the US (especially Delaware), so until they get their act together, there's no absolutely chance of getting the smaller jurisdictions into line.
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Tony Xia is one of the great Villa stories. It is only a matter of time before somebody points out that you have never seen him and the African Car Reverser in the same photograph.
Brian I expected better of you than conspiracy theories.
I think we all know odds are it was his Uber driver. Obviously visiting in his fan days three years before ownership. And a couple of years before Uber came to Brum. So when you think about it that’s quite some getaway preparation on all parts, it definitely smells of prophecy and the supernatural. No wonder he could evade the fit and proper test eh?
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What I want to know is why doesn't anybody ever mention that Tony's trainers had elevator soles? That for some probably nefarious reason he wanted to look taller than he in fact was? We could see the grey holes in his brown cardboard belt. We could see the elastic holding his tie in place. But of the fact that a five foot three inches tall man was trying to pass himself off as five foot five one - not a dicky bird. The one shot we have of the African Car Reverser shows him looking through not over his steering wheel. What is referred to in car insurance circles as a short arse driver. We have to decide whether the African Car Reverser passes himself off as Dr Tony Xia or does Tone pretend to be the ACR? Who knows? Who cares?
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The trouble is, and as the documentary showed, with overseas cash it's incredibly easy to disguise its source, and therefore also very difficult for authorities to do proper due diligence. I deal a lot with offshore structures, and until there's a global standard for company and ultimate beneficial owner information, stuff like this will always happen, and not just with football, obviously.
I'm probably being naive here but I don't understand why onshore states that like to collect taxes allow these offshore operations to continue. Is it just that the people in charge also want to hide their money there?
Well, there's a move now for a minimum global company tax rate of at least 10%. The theory at the moment is though, that a country is free to set its own tax rate. So the UK is lower than France, Ireland and Malta are lower than the UK and so on. Usually it's a balance between attracting companies to operate in your country, and actually needing to raise money through taxation. Offshore places like the IOM, Gibraltar, Jersey and BVI etc don't really have anything else much they can offer, so they set out to attract companies there with a 0% rate. The IOM's biggest industry is online gaming, and although they don't get any company tax, the thousands of people employed all pay income tax and buy houses etc. There are also a lot of funds and pesnions based in such places, as you don't really want people's pensions being whittled away by tax.
There's also the fact that a lot of places offshore are a lot less transparent in terms of information, as to who shareholders are, and having to publicly lodge accounts. As I say though, there's a huge amount of pressure to move away from both the low tax and secrecy aspects. Ireland in particular, isn't keen on the low tax thing being abolished.
Do Ireland still have that ridiculous zero taxation for 'artists' that seemed to allow people like Damon Hill to live tax free on the Emerald Isle?
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Just watched the documentary. Fascinating stuff
which documentary?
got a link please?
See page 161 of this thread.
Page 161? - I'm only on p.49!
Can someone re-post the link - perleasssse?
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Will any of these snakes face criminal prosecutions as a result of the documentary or will they just flash some back handers and slither away free to do it all again using one of their many schemes to hide their involvement?
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Just watched the documentary. Fascinating stuff
which documentary?
got a link please?
See page 161 of this thread.
Page 161? - I'm only on p.49!
Can someone re-post the link - perleasssse?
It’s on Al Jazeerah and it’s called The men who sell football.
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Yeah, thanks. Just watched it, thanks.
Not a good look, but hopefully all in the past.
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This is a very long, but eye-opening piece on how the IOM deals with dodgy Asian betting companies to facilitate PL sponsorship (including ours).
http://josimarfootball.com/the-trillion-dollar-gambling-game/
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Just watched the documentary. Fascinating stuff
which documentary?
got a link please?
See page 161 of this thread.
Page 161? - I'm only on p.49!
Can someone re-post the link - perleasssse?
https://youtu.be/ldgTCXpDEgk
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This is a very long, but eye-opening piece on how the IOM deals with dodgy Asian betting companies to facilitate PL sponsorship (including ours).
http://josimarfootball.com/the-trillion-dollar-gambling-game/
Ooh, I know two of the people in that article quite well.
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I thought you might! Got to be a small world over there, right?
I used to deal with lawyers all over the world, and used to hate it when I was given Hong Kong because you couldn't play them off against each other because they all socialised with each other on a seemingly nightly basis.