Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Match Threads & Player Ratings => Topic started by: Legion on October 14, 2017, 07:21:23 PM
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Outclassed and outplayed by the Dingles.
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Best team won, Hutton our best player tonight. We go again.
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Really glad I wasn't there. Bruce Out.
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Shocking away performance. Exactly what we saw last year.
Mentality was all wrong from first whistle. Yes you need to be cautious but simply refusing to cross the halfway line. Shameful.
It's not good enough considering what we have spent and have in the squad.
At least we're in the pack this season but there is a gulf between us and Wolves. They'll get automatic promotion comfortably I reckon.
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Completely predictable you just knew Bruce would set us up like that, we should have sacked that idiot when we had the chance.
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Utterly outplayed and outclassed in every department. Back to the drawing board
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The scoreline flattered us. We were yet again utter shite.
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Far better team won.... end of...
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Fair play to Hutton. Put in a good shift.
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Completely predictable you just knew Bruce would set us up like that, we should have sacked that idiot when we had the chance.
It was my biggest fear.
I said in the pre match thread I wanted us to have a go and have an attempt at controlling the game. We failed misraebly on both counts. It's simply not in Bruce's management DNA to go to a tough away ground and look to attack.
It will be the same at SHA in two weeks time.
I could cope more with losing 3-2 in an end to end game. That would show we're continuing to improve. Tonight shows we're flat track bullies at this level.
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Shocking away performance. Exactly what we saw last year.
Mentality was all wrong from first whistle. Yes you need to be cautious but simply refusing to cross the halfway line. Shameful.
It's not good enough considering what we have spent and have in the squad.
At least we're in the pack this season but there is a gulf between us and Wolves. They'll get automatic promotion comfortably I reckon.
Mind you as mich as we blame Bruce, the players need to take some stick as well. Awful
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Fucking atrocious. What a perfect comparison on the pitch, the future vs the past. You cannot consistently give up possession against good sides. The midfield was absolutely hopeless and Whelan put in the worst central midfield performance I've ever seen. No pace, no plan and frankly we were completely outclassed.
Bruce has shown tonight he will never succeed.
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Back to our August form.
Hutton, O'Hare and perhaps Onomah the only ones that seem bothered. Our forwards were shocking tonight. Bruce has to take some of the blame for that set-up.
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Clearly not any better than last year. How on earth have Wolves got so far ahead of us?
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Garbage. I’d love to know what do at BMH? It’s not training that’s for sure.
BRUCE OUT.
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To quote the Factory of Sadness video...."It's like they're playing a different sport to us".
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That was the worst performance I have seen from Kodjia, didn't look interested. At least the groundsmen won't have to roll the pitch as Cavaleiro did that throughout the first half.
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Destroyed. No bones about it, much the inferior team. Still look aimless. Came in to the game totally cold, looked two steps off the pace. Questions for Bruce to answer again.
A horrible performance inline with the 12 months we've had under him.
Very, very poor year under him. The trigger finger should still be twitchy if Xia is the ''big shot'' that he claims to be and failure isn't tolerated because he's tolerated 12 months of it now.
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They are the best team I've seen in this league so far - they look too good to be in this league. We, on the other hand, look every inch a team of 'Championship' players. Shocking performance second half.
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That was the most obvious defeat before the match on paper. Wolves have CL quality forwards, we have Alan fucking Hutton. If we want automatic, going to have to be 2nd. That's very hopeful though.
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Shocking away performance. Exactly what we saw last year.
Mentality was all wrong from first whistle. Yes you need to be cautious but simply refusing to cross the halfway line. Shameful.
It's not good enough considering what we have spent and have in the squad.
At least we're in the pack this season but there is a gulf between us and Wolves. They'll get automatic promotion comfortably I reckon.
Mind you as mich as we blame Bruce, the players need to take some stick as well. Awful
Depends what was done on the training ground this week and said in the dressing room.
If the gameplan was to defend deep and restrict Wolves the players were simply following that gameplan.
I imagine a few of them will be very frustrated with our tactics tonight. Hourihane was part of a free flowing Barnsley team. I'd imagine John Terry will be chuckling to himself at these tactics.
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It took 86 minutes before we got a corner.
This is Steve Bruces Aston Villa.
Wolves are not great just well organised with a couple of decent players.
If we were as well organised with a plan we would be able to give them a game at least.
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Our midfield still looks woefully short of players that can control a game.
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Amazing what a bit of imagination in the transfer market can do. Totally outclassed by a very decent wolves team
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Don’t get the comments about us being as poor as last year, we’re not, we were just beaten by the best team we have seen in this league since we were relegated. No need to panic. More worried about the fact their Chinese owner has made better decisions than ours
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Fair play to Hutton. Put in a good shift.
Hutton was the only player to come out with any credit, well him and O'hare.
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Clearly not any better than last year. How on earth have Wolves got so far ahead of us?
A plan. Spending wisely. Young hungry players and manager. Not signing prem cast offs. Not involving dinosaurs such as Keith Wyness, Steve Bruce, Stephen Clemence, Steve Round and Colin Calderwood is a good start
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That was the most obvious defeat before the match on paper. Wolves have CL quality forwards, we have Alan fucking Hutton. If we want automatic, going to have to be 2nd. That's very hopeful though.
Hutton was our MOTM.
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Clearly not any better than last year. How on earth have Wolves got so far ahead of us?
A better manager, employed by more savvy owners bought better players and uses them more competently than we do.
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Thought the first half was ok. By the end of it Wolves had run out of ideas. However, the first ten minutes of the second half saw us way too deep and the rest is history.
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Got to say I think Calderwood is having too big an influence on our style of play.
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Our Chinese owner is advised by old boys network,old school Wyness, it wasn't ever going to be any different.
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That was the most obvious defeat before the match on paper. Wolves have CL quality forwards, we have Alan fucking Hutton. If we want automatic, going to have to be 2nd. That's very hopeful though.
You can slag Hutton off as much as you like but he was by far our best player today.
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Got to say I think Calderwood is having too big an influence on our style of play.
It was when he arrived that the quality of the football went south.
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Got to say I think Calderwood is having too big an influence on our style of play.
Based on what?
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Our midfield still looks woefully short of players that can control a game.
Our midfield looks woefully short of players who can control the ball!
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Another lesson from a modern, forward thinking manager and team.
Like Brighton last season, wolves show how the game should be played and how you will ge5 out of this division.
Our dinosour, waving his cock because we beat Burton and Barnsley, will never,ever,ever be progressive enough to play in a way that blows teams away like we were tonight.
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Disapointed but not totally gutted. We didn't create enough though and can't complain about the result. It's how you bounce back after a defeat which is the main thing.
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That was a disgrace. But if we win the next two I can forgive. If that becomes a regular performance again then we will be down here for some time.
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Fair play to Hutton. Put in a good shift.
Hutton was the only player to come out with any credit, well him and O'hare.
Hutton defended well although it never ceases to amaze me how a pro footballer can look so right footed and reluctant to use his left
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Got to say I think Calderwood is having too big an influence on our style of play.
Based on what?
Hearsay and rumour
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That was the most obvious defeat before the match on paper. Wolves have CL quality forwards, we have Alan fucking Hutton. If we want automatic, going to have to be 2nd. That's very hopeful though.
Good job we had Alan Fucking Hutton because we'd have lost by more.
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Anyone still think we've got the best squad in the division by a country mile?
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The manager will take all the blame from me, when he plays Whelan ahead of Hourihane like that.
Scratch that. He gets the full blame when he plays Whelan at all.
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The midfield was absolutely hopeless and Whelan put in the worst central midfield performance I've ever seen.
I'm getting tired of saying it but why the hell is Whelan playing as a bloody box to box midfielder? Put him in as a defensive midfielder and he's fine. Today, yet again, he players in front of Hourihane. And as night follows day, Whelan is completely knackered after 45 minutes.
I can't even get angry anymore, today was so bloody predictable. The only thing that keeps me going is Tactics Dim will be gone by the end of the month.
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Whelan is completely shot. To do the role he's meant to you need energy.
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It's the lack of reaction that worries me. Anyone who watched the first half could see where that game was going and did Bruce do anything to change the game? No nothing.
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Anyone still think we've got the best squad in the division by a country mile?
I think it is a lot better than that performance.
The problem is the Manager, it’s been obvious for a long time.
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The midfield was absolutely hopeless and Whelan put in the worst central midfield performance I've ever seen.
I'm getting tired of saying it but why the hell is Whelan playing as a bloody box to box midfielder? Put him in as a defensive midfielder and he's fine. Today, yet again, he players in front of Hourihane. And as night follows day, Whelan is completely knackered after 45 minutes.
I can't even get angry anymore, today was so bloody predictable. The only thing that keeps me going is Tactics Dim will be gone by the end of the month.
I hope you’re right.
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We were outplayed and outscored by the better team. Wolves are the best team in this league, they will get automatic promotion.
They had a bit of luck for the first when Elmo slipped, but he had already lost his man as he was standing too far away from him when the cross came in, and was always playing catch up. What about touch tight marking!
Their second was lucky that it dropped to him from Huttons clearance, and had a hint of handball when he controlled it before scoring, but can't really complain, they dominated us and the score was a fair reflection of the game.
We look strong defensively, but lacked any real threat going forward.
We have enough to finish in the play offs though, i will take that.
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Thoroughly well beaten. The difference in pace between the two sides was really stark.
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The midfield was absolutely hopeless and Whelan put in the worst central midfield performance I've ever seen.
I'm getting tired of saying it but why the hell is Whelan playing as a bloody box to box midfielder? Put him in as a defensive midfielder and he's fine. Today, yet again, he players in front of Hourihane. And as night follows day, Whelan is completely knackered after 45 minutes.
I can't even get angry anymore, today was so bloody predictable. The only thing that keeps me going is Tactics Dim will be gone by the end of the month.
Gone by the end of the month? I'd be surprised if he's gone by the end of the season! :(
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It's the lack of reaction that worries me. Anyone who watched the first half could see where that game was going and did Bruce do anything to change the game? No nothing.
Good solid performance at half time according to a few on here though.
Most of us could see how this one would pan out given the complete lack of ambition in the first half.
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It's the lack of reaction that worries me. Anyone who watched the first half could see where that game was going and did Bruce do anything to change the game? No nothing.
Good solid performance at half time according to a few on here though.
Most of us could see how this one would pan out given the complete lack of ambition in the first half.
It was very obvious the way that game was going. 4-4-2 with our lack of pace and energy is suicide.
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The midfield was absolutely hopeless and Whelan put in the worst central midfield performance I've ever seen.
I'm getting tired of saying it but why the hell is Whelan playing as a bloody box to box midfielder? Put him in as a defensive midfielder and he's fine. Today, yet again, he players in front of Hourihane. And as night follows day, Whelan is completely knackered after 45 minutes.
I can't even get angry anymore, today was so bloody predictable. The only thing that keeps me going is Tactics Dim will be gone by the end of the month.
I didn't think that Whelan was played as a box to box midfielder at all today. Did he get into the box?
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Poor second half. We never came out. I thought we got it massively wrong with the selection and system although first half nothing of note happened.
Neves ran it for them but he was allowed to as we were so out numbered in midfield. Onomah should have started and they wouldn't have been able to ghost behind if Wehaln was just screening.
The ball was recycled too cheaply and big players like Snoddgrass and Kodjia were dire.
That second half though. Christ. The goal was coming a mile away. We just couldn't get out.
Far too much time on the ball and space...because the energy was low brought on by the system gifting them too much time and space.
We need to have been braver and changed a winning side.
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Our performance was really embarrassing. We are seventh in the League and our Manager has been in charge for a year. I would think that is a perfect position for the Board of Directors to review the Managers performance taking into account the money we have spent on Transfer Fees and wages compared with our rivals.
Is our manager capable of gaining us promotion ?
If the answer is that we think he isn't then this is the perfect time to sack him. We would be acting from a position of relative strength and giving the new Manager a chance of a run at promotion including the January window.
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The midfield was absolutely hopeless and Whelan put in the worst central midfield performance I've ever seen.
I'm getting tired of saying it but why the hell is Whelan playing as a bloody box to box midfielder? Put him in as a defensive midfielder and he's fine. Today, yet again, he players in front of Hourihane. And as night follows day, Whelan is completely knackered after 45 minutes.
I can't even get angry anymore, today was so bloody predictable. The only thing that keeps me going is Tactics Dim will be gone by the end of the month.
I didn't think that Whelan was played as a box to box midfielder at all today. Did he get into the box?
He's just getting back in to position right now for kick off after the first goal. The Slug, completely immobile.
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Not to make excuses but how many of their team were on international duty the last fortnight not many so they had two full weeks of training to get ready for one match
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If he insists on playing CH as the deep midfielder then surely he has to be paired with JO. At least he has energy and is a threat. Whelan, if he has to play has one purpose. To sit deep and pass sideways and break up play. If he's not being asked to do that then he's of no use.
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It's the lack of reaction that worries me. Anyone who watched the first half could see where that game was going and did Bruce do anything to change the game? No nothing.
Good solid performance at half time according to a few on here though.
Most of us could see how this one would pan out given the complete lack of ambition in the first half.
I was finding some of the first half comments bafffeling, it just looked like we were constantly on the back foot, the first goal was just inevitable.
As usual there was no reaction from Bruce until it was too late.
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Fuck off just fuck off.
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I viewed today as something of a test as to whether we're flat track bullies or genuine contenders. Whilst we can't judge on one game, what had gone before had left me massively unconvinced as to our credentials and our ability to actually play football. Today did nothing to change my opinion that our recent good run was despite Bruce and his tactics, not because of him. He might yet still grind his way into a promotion or play off place but it wont be anything approaching enjoyable to watch. Dreadful manager. Wolves seem to be going about things a little more progressively.
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Not to make excuses but how many of their team were on international duty the last fortnight not many so they had two full weeks of training to get ready for one match
Load of shit mate sorry.
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Got to say I think Calderwood is having too big an influence on our style of play.
Style of play? What's that?
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Hutton.. man of the match?
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The midfield was absolutely hopeless and Whelan put in the worst central midfield performance I've ever seen.
I'm getting tired of saying it but why the hell is Whelan playing as a bloody box to box midfielder? Put him in as a defensive midfielder and he's fine. Today, yet again, he players in front of Hourihane. And as night follows day, Whelan is completely knackered after 45 minutes.
I can't even get angry anymore, today was so bloody predictable. The only thing that keeps me going is Tactics Dim will be gone by the end of the month.
I didn't think that Whelan was played as a box to box midfielder at all today. Did he get into the box?
He's not allowed in there. He has to stop on the edge of the box. He even charged all the way up in the dying minutes on a very rare Villa attack.
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I viewed today as something of a test as to whether we're flat track bullies or genuine contenders. Whilst we can't judge on one game, what had gone before had left me massively unconvinced as to our credentials and our ability to actually play football. Today did nothing to change my opinion that our recent good run was despite Bruce and his tactics, not because of him. He might yet still grind his way into a promotion or play off place but it wont be anything approaching enjoyable to watch. Dreadful manager. Wolves seem to be going about things a little more progressively.
4 out of 5 wins against bottom table teams, we have failed to beat CardifF Bristol City and now Wolves.
It is obvious what our level is,the league table is a pretty good indicator.
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The midfield was absolutely hopeless and Whelan put in the worst central midfield performance I've ever seen.
I'm getting tired of saying it but why the hell is Whelan playing as a bloody box to box midfielder? Put him in as a defensive midfielder and he's fine. Today, yet again, he players in front of Hourihane. And as night follows day, Whelan is completely knackered after 45 minutes.
I can't even get angry anymore, today was so bloody predictable. The only thing that keeps me going is Tactics Dim will be gone by the end of the month.
I didn't think that Whelan was played as a box to box midfielder at all today. Did he get into the box?
He's not allowed in there. He has to stop on the edge of the box. He even charged all the way up in the dying minutes on a very rare Villa attack.
Surely Whelan is more D to edge of centre circle than box to box.
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If a manager can't get the players up for these sort of games then you've got no chance of going up.
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I viewed today as something of a test as to whether we're flat track bullies or genuine contenders. Whilst we can't judge on one game, what had gone before had left me massively unconvinced as to our credentials and our ability to actually play football. Today did nothing to change my opinion that our recent good run was despite Bruce and his tactics, not because of him. He might yet still grind his way into a promotion or play off place but it wont be anything approaching enjoyable to watch. Dreadful manager. Wolves seem to be going about things a little more progressively.
4 out of 5 wins against bottom table teams, we have failed to beat CardifF Bristol City and now Wolves.
It is obvious what our level is,the league table is a pretty good indicator.
Unfortunately, I think that is the case.
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Second best to everything tonight. Got what we deserved
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Having watched every home game this season, who seriously expected us to win this?
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We've spent far more than Wolves over 2 seasons, but you'd never know it. The money wasted on McCormack and Hogan is a joke. Dare I say it, someone like Vassell of Blues would be far more effective. Need Jedinak, Green and Grealish back fast. Drop Whelan - far too slow.
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Having watched every home game this season, who seriously expected us to win this?
I think it's more the zero idea, wrong selection, and inability to have an impact to change the game.
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We can beat the small fry but against better teams we're hopeless. I expected a defeat but its the manner of it that disappoints. Hutton aside, the team didn't look interested, Hourihane and Whelan were totally ineffectual, arguably Kodjia's worst game, Elmohaddy is a waste of space, Snodgrass at least tried but he was on his own there, it was just a matter of time before they scored and we were offering absolutely nothing. 90 mins of sheer slow torture. At least O'Hare showed some energy when he came on. We'll probably have more runs of consecutive wins but we certainly have no chance of automatic promotion even if the league position still looks healthy today after everyone elses results.
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As many of us expected, our "revival" was oversold.
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Oh dear. He's started saying, "We go again".
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Having watched every home game this season, who seriously expected us to win this?
You expected us to look like mugs and get comprehensively outplayed?
I wish you told me beforehand. I could have gone for a nice meal somewhere and not endured the load of bollocks offered up by Bruce this evening.
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Having watched every home game this season, who seriously expected us to win this?
You expected us to look like mugs and get comprehensively outplayed?
I wish you told me beforehand. I could have gone for a nice meal somewhere and not endured the load of bollocks offered up by Bruce this evening.
I expected them to beat us.
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Oh dear. He's started saying, "We go again".
Ah there goes the hope he might have learnt something from the game.
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As many of us expected, our "revival" was oversold.
Or is it one 'defeat' in 9?
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And yet I expect us to beat Fulham
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And yet I expect us to beat Fulham
How do you expect us to get on away to small heath?
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Bruce post-match interview "we go again" https://www.facebook.com/avfcofficial/videos/1707810839262978/
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On bus on way home. Full of wolves fans 🙁
Wolves were head and shoulders above us. And fair play they played some lovely football. Almost had goal of the season if it wasn’t for a great two saves.
We were very poor going forward.Everything was going down the right, where Snodgraas had zero impact.
I slated Hutton to my Wolves mate at kick off, saying they’d tear him a new one. To be fair he was head an shoulders above any of our other players.
Even my Wolves mate said “ what’s actually your plan? “ I didn’t see one throughout.
We’re not going up.
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No. It is one defeat against one of the better sides in the league. The real test was going to come. It has come and it has not gone well.
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And yet I expect us to beat Fulham
I don't, we struggle against sides with good movement who control the ball. We will do well against the Ipswich's and Qpr's.
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How on earth does Whelan get in ahead of Onomah? Please explain....
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How on earth does Whelan get in ahead of Onomah? Please explain....
It's the easy option to play the old pro who you've spent money and big wages on.
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How on earth does Whelan get in ahead of Onomah? Please explain....
Whelan can not play in a two man centre mid.
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As many of us expected, our "revival" was oversold.
Or is it one 'defeat' in 9?
When you look at the games/teams/results in that period. It's not so impressive.
The performances too - dismal.
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As many of us expected, our "revival" was oversold.
Or is it one 'defeat' in 9?
I think it's the comprehensive manner of the defeat. We were not only poor, we were set up wrong and again he failed to address it.
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No-one mentioned 'revival'. We've been on a good run, not played well tonight and lost. It's happened and it will again. Like i said, it's how you bounce back.
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Well, well, well........
Well beaten by a decent footballing side who play football on the front foot , with pace and purpose. Passed us off the park - but every team does that.
Surrounded by well pissed people - Fans fighting amongst themselves near us . The extra 2 and a half hours in the pub for a 5.30 kick meant that most the people round where I sat were shitfaced.
The unseasonly well warm weather caught a few out - B O everywhere .
Knew Bruce would go there hoping for a point - don’t remember their keeper making a save .
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No-one mentioned 'revival'. We've been on a good run, not played well tonight and lost. It's happened and it will again. Like i said, it's how you bounce back.
Play like that tonight and we will struggle to win our next three. SHA and Preston away and Fulham at home.
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How many times have you left a game thinking that Bruce affected it positively rather than negatively?
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No-one mentioned 'revival'. We've been on a good run, not played well tonight and lost. It's happened and it will again. Like i said, it's how you bounce back.
Play like that tonight and we will struggle to win our next three. SHA and Preston away and Fulham at home.
4 hard fixtures this month, including today, these are the games that will determine our finishing position, not gubbing Burton.
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No-one mentioned 'revival'. We've been on a good run, not played well tonight and lost. It's happened and it will again. Like i said, it's how you bounce back.
It was predictable, as soon as we face any one decent this is what happens.
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Even if we did go for a point it helps if the players are playing well. Our free kicks and corners tonight were diabolical.
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Even if we did go for a point it helps if the players are playing well. Our free kicks and corners tonight were diabolical.
Two weeks of fucking around again, like the last international break. We weren't geared up for tonight, we were gently bedding back in to the championship battle. Garbage Villa and Bruce.
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No-one mentioned 'revival'. We've been on a good run, not played well tonight and lost. It's happened and it will again. Like i said, it's how you bounce back.
It was predictable, as soon as we face any one decent this is what happens.
And so far, you're right. By the same token, Cardiff who were top lost to a team who lost 6-1 last time out. Defeats happen.
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Cardiff aren't going up this year.
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flat track bullies sums it up perfectly. 5 games against teams in the top half have earned us 5 points, 7 games against the bottom half have earned us 14. To get automatic promotion you need our bottom half form against everyone.
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Clearly not any better than last year. How on earth have Wolves got so far ahead of us?
A plan. Spending wisely. Young hungry players and manager. Not signing prem cast offs. Not involving dinosaurs such as Keith Wyness, Steve Bruce, Stephen Clemence, Steve Round and Colin Calderwood is a good start
Spot on
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Playing a flat back four with whelan in no man’s Land is bound to leave you with nothing. Adomah have to track back just to get the ball is wrong.
If we can see it why can’t bruce
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Somethingorotherlights (http://www.skysports.com/football/wolves-vs-a-villa/report/374762)
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I thought a Kodija looked disinterested, Whelan was over run and our shape did not help him.I was expecting the problems down our left but I thought Hutton and Albert did ok. Elmo was all over the place.
We got to half time and was hoping he would change it but hey let’s wait until they score.
They obliged.
Bringing a Hogan on is like conceding defeat.
The resources he has available are much better than that performance.
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Wolves were bad enough to finish below us last season.
Obviously they've spent big and spent it on real quality but so have we (last summer aswell).
Embarrassing how big a gulf there was in passing and vision tonight. It's game like this when SB is really shown up as being a dinosaur coach I'm afraid.
Luckily there isn't another team on Wolves level in this league (Sheffield United are more a physical high tempo team) so I suspect we'll go back to grinding results out and hovering between 4th-8th over the next few weeks.
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Well, well, well........
Well beaten by a decent footballing side who play football on the front foot , with pace and purpose. Passed us off the park - but every team does that.
Surrounded by well pissed people - Fans fighting amongst themselves near us . The extra 2 and a half hours in the pub for a 5.30 kick meant that most the people round where I sat were shitfaced.
The unseasonly well warm weather caught a few out - B O everywhere .
Knew Bruce would go there hoping for a point - don’t remember their keeper making a save .
Yep, there's a rather embarrassing video of our lot fighting amongst themselves.
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Completely predictable you just knew Bruce would set us up like that, we should have sacked that idiot when we had the chance.
It was my biggest fear.
I said in the pre match thread I wanted us to have a go and have an attempt at controlling the game. We failed misraebly on both counts. It's simply not in Bruce's management DNA to go to a tough away ground and look to attack.
It will be the same at SHA in two weeks time.
I could cope more with losing 3-2 in an end to end game. That would show we're continuing to improve. Tonight shows we're flat track bullies at this level.
That was pretty much my reaction. One shot on target.
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Beaten by a better team, but it's not the end of the world. Even Ron Saunders who won the league in 81 lost games!. It's a setback but we haven't lost much ground today. Really some people need to calm down..are we expected to go the rest of the season unbeaten?
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You look at the other terrible game today Liverpool vs Man U. Now there's a side in Man U who play awful football away, give away possession and let the opposition shoot at will, but come away with something which seems to be Bruce's plan A. Okay so it cost them 500m to do it, but then Liverpool are a bit better than Wolves. How much does it cost to park the bus in the Championship and why can't we do it?
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The Hogan substitutions are now becoming laughable. It doesn't matter if it's Hogan, a bloke in a wheelchair, Samba or a flag stuck in the pitch we'd still play the exact same way. We are inflexible under Fist face, we go out the way we do and that's that, no matter who plays.
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Beaten by a better team, but it's not the end of the world. Even Ron Saunders who won the league in 81 lost games!. It's a setback but we haven't lost much ground today. Really some people need to calm down..are we expected to go the rest of the season unbeaten?
It's not the loss.It's the abject manner of it.I want to see some form of an idea,a plan, something to look forward to in our outlook and play.But nothing.Nada.Zilch.
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Beaten by a better team, but it's not the end of the world. Even Ron Saunders who won the league in 81 lost games!. It's a setback but we haven't lost much ground today. Really some people need to calm down..are we expected to go the rest of the season unbeaten?
That’s fine if you like the second division.
Comparing Bruce with Saunders says everything.
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Yep it's very much the manner of the defeat, rather than the defeat.
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Wolves were bad enough to finish below us last season.
Obviously they've spent big and spent it on real quality but so have we (last summer aswell).
Embarrassing how big a gulf there was in passing and vision tonight. It's game like this when SB is really shown up as being a dinosaur coach I'm afraid.
Luckily there isn't another team on Wolves level in this league (Sheffield United are more a physical high tempo team) so I suspect we'll go back to grinding results out and hovering between 4th-8th over the next few weeks.
I am not convinced that Wolves are that great, well coached and organised but they did not look that special.
They did not have to do much to outplay us, we were that bad, sitting back and inviting them onto us.
We were allways outnumbered in midfield and they pushed thier full backs on to occupy our wide players and full backs.
They knew exactly how Bruce would set us up and did what was necessary.
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Beaten by a better team, but it's not the end of the world. Even Ron Saunders who won the league in 81 lost games!. It's a setback but we haven't lost much ground today. Really some people need to calm down..are we expected to go the rest of the season unbeaten?
Absolutely, or we could mention Hogan and a bloke in a wheelchair. We lost, it happens.
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First proper test for a while and we failed spectacularly. Wolves, fair play to them, they look a million miles ahead of us. Hate to say it but they're the best team we've played since we came down imo and they'll win the league. Today showed why we won't be near the top two however and the play offs is our aim.
They look so much quicker than us both in defence and attack. The concern for me is Small Heath's attack is full of pace and they'll beat us aswell, then we'll be back to square one and everyone will want Bruce Out.
It says everything when Hutton is your best player. Glenn Whelan is absolute shite, the bloke can't run ffs.
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They just have a better manager. Time to make the right decision Tone.
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Beaten by a better team, but it's not the end of the world. Even Ron Saunders who won the league in 81 lost games!. It's a setback but we haven't lost much ground today. Really some people need to calm down..are we expected to go the rest of the season unbeaten?
That’s fine if you like the second division.
Comparing Bruce with Saunders says everything.
Oh don't be ridiculous CL...im not comparing the two and you know it, just putting one defeat in prospective. We haven't lost that much ground after today's results, but sometimes you lose the odd game on the way to promotion.
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They just have a better manager. Time to make the right decision Tone.
Yes..lets sack a manager after his first defeat in 9 games.
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They just have a better manager. Time to make the right decision Tone.
Yes..lets sack a manager after his first defeat in 9 games.
Glad you agree.
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They just have a better manager. Time to make the right decision Tone.
Yes..lets sack a manager after his first defeat in 9 games.
I'm with you Wirral. We were simply beaten by a better team, at their place too. Let's untwist those knickers.
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Bottom line is we took on a manager who wouldn't ever produce a footballing side but we accepted that because he could win ugly and get us promoted. Unfortunately he seems to have even lost that asset. Who wants to lose ugly?
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and that ladies and gentlemen is exactly how good we are
Whelan in the starting eleven yet onamah sits on the bench
why does Snodgrass take the free kicks that are perfect for connor ? maybe its part of his contract
o"hare showed more energy when he came on than the entire attack showed all game .
see you all saturday
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I thought it would finish 1-1 but wasn't expecting such a stinker. Kodjia? Good god he needs to do a lot more in games. This fixture needed a different line-up to freshen things up and maybe surprise them, we played half-arsed and left with nothing, which was fully deserved.
I hate wolves but I really like their bar at the Cullis lower tier.
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Bruce promotion expert. Trouble is he won't get us promoted.
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They just have a better manager. Time to make the right decision Tone.
Yes..lets sack a manager after his first defeat in 9 games.
I'm with you Wirral. We were simply beaten by a better team, at their place too. Let's untwist those knickers.
Come on now. We should accept our status in life that Wolves are simply going to batter us? Have we really fallen so low thats what it's come to? Not for me. I think we should do something about it. And our weak link is the manager.
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I did not here Whelan's name until late second half, thought he wasn't playing.
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On bus on way home. Full of wolves fans 🙁
Wolves were head and shoulders above us. And fair play they played some lovely football. Almost had goal of the season if it wasn’t for a great two saves.
We were very poor going forward.Everything was going down the right, where Snodgraas had zero impact.
I slated Hutton to my Wolves mate at kick off, saying they’d tear him a new one. To be fair he was head an shoulders above any of our other players.
Even my Wolves mate said “ what’s actually your plan? “ I didn’t see one throughout.
O
We’re not going up.
Plan..... There ain't one... That's obvious
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How on earth does Whelan get in ahead of Onomah? Please explain....
Whelan can not play in a two man centre mid.
Have we had a midfielder in the last 5 years that can? I might have forgotten someone obvious, but I really can't think of anyone.
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Best team won, Hutton our best player tonight. We go again.
He's our only player with any pace
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I think the Villa engine needs a service.
Outclassed.
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When did Wolves get good?
They've luckily picked a (seemingly) good manager - it happens for teams every now and then.
They're clearly the best team I've seen this season, and probably an anomaly for the league. They play like that all the time they'll cruise the league.
We're miles behind them. But we're way beyond many others.
Put it behind us and move on to all the other teams we should be beating.
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Best team won, Hutton our best player tonight. We go again.
He's our only player with any pace
I thought it was clear he was a big weakness. They looked to go down his side a lot. Not a left back. Not a first 11 member.
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Best team won, Hutton our best player tonight. We go again.
He's our only player with any pace
I thought it was clear he was a big weakness. They looked to go down his side a lot. Not a left back. Not a first 11 member.
Hilarious!
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Our free kicks and corners tonight were diabolical.
I asked earlier, when was the last time we scored from a corner? Even Pullis and MON can/could manage to make them work.
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Best team won, Hutton our best player tonight. We go again.
He's our only player with any pace
I thought it was clear he was a big weakness. They looked to go down his side a lot. Not a left back. Not a first 11 member.
You were watching tonights game, right? Wolves against Villa?
Hutton was our best player, by far. I hate to think what the score would have been if he hadn't been on top form.
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Watching a bit of the PL it just becomes so depressing as to how far we are away from that level. I’m not even talking Man City, but even mid table stuff. Bruce is what Bruce is. He’s a coward and unnecessarily displays an inferiority complex when it comes to big games as a manager. Certainly with us. He waves a white flag in how he sent us out to play. Not build off our recent good form and confidence. He played into their hands and we lost. Inevitably. It’s utterly pathetic.
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I'm no big fan of Hutton but he was our best player by a mile today. Albert and him appeared to be the only players trying to track the Wolves runners.
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makes me laugh when I see Calderwood explaining to Hogan what to do on his piece of paper
what does it say
three kebabs with chilli sauce for the boss , chips and two litres of Dr Pepper
chicken nuggets and onion rings for me
and a strawberry milkshake for Stephen.
clowns all of them.
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We let Wolves play second half. First they were completely clueless in the same way a lot of sides down her are very good at retaining the ball and going nowhere.
The performance deopped off hugely second half and the amount of time and space we gave them was criminal.
Anybody, even Ashley Westwood, is going to look a world beater if you gift him 20 yards of space at a time.
It should have been 4141 or 433 to keep a triangle of three centrally. Too flat, over run and got what we deserved.
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We let Wolves play second half. First they were co.olwtwly clueless in the same way a lot of sides down her are very good at retaining the ball and going nowhere.
The performance deopped off hugely second half and the amount of time and space we gave them was criminal.
Anybody, even Ashley Westwood, is going to look a world beater if you gift him 20 yards of space at a time.
It should have been 4141 or 433 to keep a triangle of three centrally. Too flat, over run and got what we deserved.
I thought they were too cautious first half but you could see that they had the quality to give us problems. Once they realised we weren't going to lay a glove on them they committed forward much quicker and blitzed us.
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They just have a better manager. Time to make the right decision Tone.
Yes..lets sack a manager after his first defeat in 9 games.
I'm with you Wirral. We were simply beaten by a better team, at their place too. Let's untwist those knickers.
You're probably right. It's just fate that Wolves are another team on the list who have sailed effortlessly past us in terms of competence and quality.
I mean there's no way a mere football manager could try and set up a massively expensive team to do something about that.
We should just accept our lot.
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Have to say the dingles in the South Bank create a decent atmosphere, they all stand all game and get behind their team. That was a million times better than the atmosphere at VP. Amazing what happens when you're watching a team who play good football and want to win with decent style. Take note Bruce.
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I agree Dave, Wolves were just better. We have to accept it and hope our bubble hasn't popped. Some tough games coming up, more tests ahead and we have to be better than we were today. That said, I can't see us playing too many better sides than Wolves.
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Just watched the post match comments, have to say I'm bit surprised that wasn't "the worst we've played since I got here".
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They just have a better manager. Time to make the right decision Tone.
Yes..lets sack a manager after his first defeat in 9 games.
I'm with you Wirral. We were simply beaten by a better team, at their place too. Let's untwist those knickers.
You're probably right. It's just fate that Wolves are another team on the list who have sailed effortlessly past us in terms of competence and quality.
I mean there's no way a mere football manager could try and set up a massively expensive team to do something about that.
We should just accept our lot.
Was thinking that reading some of these posts Dave. In less than a decade we've gone from being told that we should accept that we can't compete with the top few teams in the country, to not being able to compete with the likes Swansea and Southampton and now its teams like Wolves in the 2nd tier.
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Have to say the dingles in the South Bank create a decent atmosphere, they all stand all game and get behind their team. That was a million times better than the atmosphere at VP. Amazing what happens when you're watching a team who play good football and want to win with decent style. Take note Bruce.
Biggest crowd since 81 and a comfortable win under the lights against a local rival to go top of the table.
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Didn't know the result, just saw the highlights, fucking destroyed by Wolves. Bruce will be found out by the end of the month and it'll all be too late. UTV.
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Didn't know the result, just saw the highlights, fucking destroyed by Wolves. Bruce will be found out by the end of the month and it'll all be too late. UTV.
Exactly.
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When we lose to Small Heath in a couple of weeks he'll be back to square one and everyone will want him out again. You can guarantee he'll adopt the same tactics there; keep it tight and terrified of losing. Then if we go 1-0 down we're fecked.
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Can you give me the scorers so I can retire off a big bet please.
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Can you give me the scorers so I can retire off a big bet please.
Vassell. He can run quite fast so he will cause us problems. We've got zero pace in our side, at the back or going forward. The pace of Wolves' attacks compared to ours today was a stark contrast.
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Bruce - the new Lambert. Seamless transition to hope then hell.
Get rid.
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Really hope I'm wrong but, can see us getting a draw against Fulham followed by 2 defeats and back to square one.
Get Onomah in place of Whelan and push Hourihane up to where he prefers to play and gives his best performances.
We keep trying this going for a 0-0 but just doesn't work. The few games when we have been on the front foot has easily seen our best performances and, gives the fans something to get excited about. Today, even when there was space in front of our midfielders, they always looked to make a back pass. It's the easy option because most of the players seem frightened to try something different.
While I'm at it, hope we lose the toss next week as then there's a better chance we will kick towards the Holte in the second half!!
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Our free kicks and corners tonight were diabolical.
I asked earlier, when was the last time we scored from a corner? Even Pullis and MON can/could manage to make them work.
We scored loads from them last season. Chester notched a couple, Gabby v SHA.
To me it's one of the areas you can say Bruce has legitimately improved us in.
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Last season? And this season?
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Our free kicks and corners tonight were diabolical.
I asked earlier, when was the last time we scored from a corner? Even Pullis and MON can/could manage to make them work.
We scored loads from them last season. Chester notched a couple, Gabby v SHA.
To me it's one of the areas you can say Bruce has legitimately improved us in.
I must be missing something. I'm struggling to see even an attempt on goal from our corners and free kicks. It's standard practice the ball gets headed away, not even reaching a Villa player.
I'd love to see the stats on number of corners/free kicks around the box we've had and nothing happens. I'm surprised Terry and Chester even bothers going up for them now.
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We hit the bar from one tonight.
Yeah this season it just hasn't happened (odd as Snodgrass has been good on corners throughout his career and Terry has scored many goals throughout his career from them) but we did score a fair amount last season which was the first time in years we've look a major threat.
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We hit the bar from one tonight.
Yeah this season it just hasn't happened (odd as Snodgrass has been good on corners throughout his career and Terry has scored many goals throughout his career from them) but we did score a fair amount last season which was the first time in years we've look a major threat.
Did we score that many, 3 for chester and 1 for Baker were from corners and then the 2 against blues were both from set pieces but I can't remember many more than that.
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We hit the bar from one tonight.
Yeah this season it just hasn't happened (odd as Snodgrass has been good on corners throughout his career and Terry has scored many goals throughout his career from them) but we did score a fair amount last season which was the first time in years we've look a major threat.
Did we score that many, 3 for chester and 1 for Baker were from corners and then the 2 against blues were both from set pieces but I can't remember many more than that.
It was still as many as we managed in about 4 seasons in the premier league. We barely threatened at them for years after the MON era when we were very strong at them.
People know the managers we need to appoint if you want to see us regularly score from them anyway.....
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We hit the bar from one tonight.
Yeah this season it just hasn't happened (odd as Snodgrass has been good on corners throughout his career and Terry has scored many goals throughout his career from them) but we did score a fair amount last season which was the first time in years we've look a major threat.
Did we score that many, 3 for chester and 1 for Baker were from corners and then the 2 against blues were both from set pieces but I can't remember many more than that.
It was still as many as we managed in about 4 seasons in the premier league. We barely threatened at them for years after the MON era when we were very strong at them.
People know the managers we need to appoint if you want to see us regularly score from them anyway.....
Again, I'm not sure that's true. We've not scored many goals for years but 4-6 from corners and a couple from free kicks have been fairly standard. I can think of 4-5 from the relegation season, and that didn't feel massively different to any point post MON. I don't know of a simple way to gather up all the stats for it but I really wouldn't be surprised if last season was no different to any season in the last 7-8.
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When did Wolves get good?
They've luckily picked a (seemingly) good manager - it happens for teams every now and then.
They're clearly the best team I've seen this season, and probably an anomaly for the league. They play like that all the time they'll cruise the league.
We're miles behind them. But we're way beyond many others.
Put it behind us and move on to all the other teams we should be beating.
With the money we've spent we should be beating Wolves never mind the other Teams. I didn't think Wolves were that good, we just made them look half decent. If you sit off teams that can finish and let them play you get punished. We got away with it on our recent run because none of those teams actually did anything with the ball.
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Plain and simple, boo.
Most of us knew that Bruce wouldn't actually try and win-which is very sad considering the players he has at his disposal.
I thought it would still be a decent game, and hoped my prediction of an exhilarating 3-3 draw would come to fruition. Even if I was secretly hoping for a win, deep down in my heart. Somewhere. Hope often trumps common sense when it comes to my emotions for Villa.
In the end, after a long day at work, and getting home at around midnight, I simply decided, 'no, I'm not going to stay up/get up and watch it. I'll only get irritated. And the football will be dreadful. And Bruce won't look as if he has a clue'.
And so common sense eventually trumped hope.
The highlights, match reports and comments on here suggested we weren't very good. Did we have any chances besides Snodgrass hitting the crossbar?
Very very tired of having Bruce as manager. I don't like him.
We go again? Oh no.
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Just watched the post match comments, have to say I'm bit surprised that wasn't "the worst we've played since I got here".
I've decided to avoid listening to anything he has to say. I so wish I didn't care and could simply walk away. But as we all know, we were here before him and we'll be here long after he's gone. The David Davis of football management.
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Awful display, but at least my day wasn't totally spoiled as I then saw a brilliant performance by Dua Lipa (my 2nd this week) at the O2 Academy.
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:(
Well, there you go.
So many acute people, saying they 'expected' the result, because of Steve's football DNA.
I'm inclined to agree with them - I expected it as well.
But witnessing it is sad beyond belief. It's like you sigh and hold your breath when the opposition have the ball, then become ecstatic if one of ours body-blocks or clears it to Row Z.
Small pleasures in an avalanche of despair.
:(
I've never been a Terry-Lover, but tried to follow his movements today.
Pretty shocking.
He can't run but stands-Up very bravely in close quarters.imo
2/3 times I noticed that instead of closing down he struggled back to his centre goal position, allowing a continued free run from a player he could have stopped.
He seems intelligent enough to know his limitations, and it may be that intelligence that is allowing him 90 minutes every 7 days...midweeks not included.
But speed, turning... non-existant. We saw him today to actually allow a Wolves player a run into the box, rather than tackle/block, even, foul.... he just stepped aside and walked.
Walked after him.
Although Steve enjoyed a good Holiday with his son, seducing Terry, on Xia's dosh no doubt, and XIA agreeing a wage package that blew SHA out of the water.
It's another few millions down the drain from the amateurish, NO-IDEA
Mr. Xia.
Steve must be held responsible for his cowardice and lack of confidence....really, our squad is second only to Wolves. In fees / money for players.
Mr Xia was right, September was crucial for us. And it solidified Steve's position. :D
The rest of the season may matter more.
Teams from Man Utd to Derby all play the counter-attack, Lambert did it, defend, absorb- spring out.
Steve doesn't seem to have got over the first 2 principles. Unless a desperate hoofball is the 'spring-out' tactic.
Hutton started at last, and his performance, to me was 100% vindication that Steve does have some kind of brain cell...just not many more.
:(
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The counter attacking point is spot on. The way he sets us up away from home means we need to be able to counter attack, the trouble is there's zero pace in our team. Our counter attack was smash it up to Davis and hope he holds it up. Wolves attacked with pace, cohesion, passing and movement whereas we genuinely couldn't string three passes together. For the money we've spent the football should be much, much better.
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normal service resumed.
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People seem shocked that Wolves are good. They bloody well should be. We may have spent a lot but they have shelled out massive amounts on the Jorge Mendes backdoor project, manager and half the team are essentially champioons league quality and it showed. An agent is in bed with the owners and taking players there that I doubt even knew who wolves were before being told to go there. I expected the result because they have done nothing to try and comply with FFP while we scratched about trying to all summer. The big tests for us are Fulham and Blues. I will wait till after those games before deciding the last 6 weeks were a blip from the norm.
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Wolves were the best team. However they are no world beaters but the way we play makes them look better than they are. We didn't pressure them and gave their players time and space so was no wonder that they improved as the game went on. It's like a boxer standing there and just taking punches but throwing any himself eventually there is only going to be one result.
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That was the most obvious defeat before the match on paper. Wolves have CL quality forwards, we have Alan fucking Hutton. If we want automatic, going to have to be 2nd. That's very hopeful though.
I think That's unfair to Hutton. He was easily our best player in this one.
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A disappointing, but sadly predictable result yesterday. However it's losses like this that compounds our poor start to the season and lost opportunities against the likes of Hull, Brentford and Borough at home and abject displays like Reading and Bristol away. Of course we'll lose games (losing to probably the eventual champions being the point in case) but failing to win games that we should take all 3 points from is what's going to cost us.
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Good post alftitmus.
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Good post alftitmus.
You don't read that very often. Rare as white dog shit.
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Snodgrass and Elmohamady combined didn't make the attacking equivalent of one player, or when defending the equivalent of one player.
add this to a midfield two against their four and we were under equipped to deal with their breaks,
then add a slow responding middle pair of defenders and what do you get?
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Disappointed, yes. Surprised, no. Bruce has spent our millions very poorly trying to buy the best players from club's, but not really thinking how he was going to use them. Nuno on the other hand has used his Portuguese connections and George Mendes to uncover these gems. Maybe our scouts need to look further afeild.
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hate say it but they ripped us apart and 2-0 was a blessing
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The counter attacking point is spot on. The way he sets us up away from home means we need to be able to counter attack, the trouble is there's zero pace in our team. Our counter attack was smash it up to Davis and hope he holds it up. Wolves attacked with pace, cohesion, passing and movement whereas we genuinely couldn't string three passes together. For the money we've spent the football should be much, much better.
We do have pace in the team, with Adomah, Snod and Elmo. We just use it very well.
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Disappointed, yes. Surprised, no. Bruce has spent our millions very poorly trying to buy the best players from club's, but not really thinking how he was going to use them. Nuno on the other hand has used his Portuguese connections and George Mendes to uncover these gems. Maybe our scouts need to look further afeild.
I know they've got those contacts and are maybe bending the rules a bit but it is laughable that they can sign all these bright young talents full of energy and pace. Who do we sign? Glenn fecking Whelan. A bloke who can't run or pass forwards.
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When I saw Hutton in the team I was worried but he proved to be as solid as I have seen him but yet again he conceded so much space. The thing that really riled me was every time Hourianne received the ball he was facing the wrong way meaning he had to take a touch then turn. Each time one of thier players were on him
Johnstone thought he made a meal of the sàve he made yet positioning was awful for both goals
.
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I thought we were ok up to half time, not brilliant but dealt with most things. Once they scored though and we had to go chasing it they were able to pick us off. They are a good team, better than I was expecting, and are set up in a way that looks to exploit their speed and ability on the break.
Other results yesterday (and on Friday) demonstrated the nature of this league, it’s a long hard slog and even their manager said that positions in the table are meaningless at this point.
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Whelan is simply hopeless.
We should play one of the kids in that holding position - Lyden or Lloyd-Hayes perhaps. The role requires dynamism and stamina.
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I thought we were ok up to half time, not brilliant but dealt with most things. Once they scored though and we had to go chasing it they were able to pick us off. They are a good team, better than I was expecting, and are set up in a way that looks to exploit their speed and ability on the break.
Other results yesterday (and on Friday) demonstrated the nature of this league, it’s a long hard slog and even their manager said that positions in the table are meaningless at this point.
Exactly how I saw it. We looked comfortable in the first half and we restricted them to mainly long range efforts. The 1st goal was a poor goal to give away and after that we were always going to be caught on the break with those quick forwards of theirs. If I was to offer one criticism, is I would play In Onamah over Whelean any day..at least he would offer the pace we lack in midfield.
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When are we going to see a Villa team that has movement, believe to pass and pass quickly 90% of the time forward, has pace and guile, it was a good job Wolves do not have a top class finisher, or that could have been embarrassing yesterday. Best team we have come up against in the last 2 seasons, the worry I have they may not go up as champions and if they came 3rd, we may kop the bastards in the playoffs if we make them of course.
Also highlights the fact you do not need to kick your way out of this division, you can play football and get results, but you have to ensure you have players that are comfortable doing that, a position we are not in.
Lets not have they have spent loads and they have their Portugal guy/ agent doing the deals, we have spent plenty just not as well.
Welcome to football in 2017 Mr. Bruce.
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Thought the goalie should've saved the second.
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Sadly not entirely surprised by our performance, have watched all the home games and the away ones on TV, and have only seen us play well once that was the Norwich game. Wolves were superb today, totally outclassing us in midfield and are the best team in the league by a mile. Only plus was Hutton and O'Hare, who in the 10 minutes or so he was on the pitch, did more than some players, who played the full 90.
Can't wait to see all the Wolves fans this week at my local!
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Got to say though, the one who scored their first goal was superb, full of running all game. Miranda for them kept falling over.
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Thought the goalie should've saved the second.
Absolutely. Getting done at your near post is unforgivable.
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When did Wolves get good?
They've luckily picked a (seemingly) good manager - it happens for teams every now and then.
They're clearly the best team I've seen this season, and probably an anomaly for the league. They play like that all the time they'll cruise the league.
We're miles behind them. But we're way beyond many others.
Put it behind us and move on to all the other teams we should be beating.
It wasn't luck picking a new manager. They did their homework and didn't go "old school" and it looks like it's paying off. Same as Huddersfield and Bournemouth, to name but two.
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Where to start? I was never going to enjoy the performance or result from any seat in the ground - but being in the Steve Bull Upper with a Wolves mate and sat in front of an exceptionally gobby twat was not great.
Hutton did well playing out of position and Albert offered good support to him as a result we were not as exposed as I thought would happen but it meant we offered nothing going forward down the left - except for one Hutton trademark gallop into their half when he passed the ball straight out (standard).
A squad of our size and with the money spent means we should have competent back up option at fullback when we lose our first choices - people filling in can work against Burton and Bolton but against a good side, in a local derby and in front of their biggest crowd for 36 years, then that won't do.
I think Whelan gets more stick than is merited - if we set up to let the opposition have the ball and with a defence that back peddles at the rate that Terry does, then if we expect one player to cover that they would need the energy, pace and strength that would embarrass Clark Kent.
I see a bloke who doesn't hide, puts in a shift, links play with simple passes when in possession and encourages (or digs out) those around him. He twice applauded/encouraged the energy and movement of O'Hare when he came on.
He is poorly served by how we set up, but so is Hourihane - a player who is instrumental in a side that wants to be on the front foot, imposing itself on the opposition with energy, pace and a commitment to attack.
I'm also uncertain about Kodjia and Davis as a pair - I rate them both but as a pair they both look to go it alone and are looking for different service into them. Neither looks to find the other in my view - early days and I hope I am wrong, but that might prompt a big decision, and that is something I think Bruce is poorly equipped to do.
I'll finish with a word on Bruce. It can be easy to slate managers when disappointed by results, but the squad assembled, how we set up, decisions to pick players in roles they are not suited for (or not supported by the players around them is down to him).
It feels like there is no plan - he stumbled upon Davis and he was great for a few games, then Kodjia comes back and he can't work out how to organise the side.
Here's a clue Steve - it's not as simple as saying 'let's go 4-4-2' it is who you pick throughout the team and how you ask them to approach the game that determines what happens at the top end of the pitch. It also means we are less likely to get exposed at the back.
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People seem shocked that Wolves are good. They bloody well should be. We may have spent a lot but they have shelled out massive amounts on the Jorge Mendes backdoor project, manager and half the team are essentially champioons league quality and it showed. An agent is in bed with the owners and taking players there that I doubt even knew who wolves were before being told to go there. I expected the result because they have done nothing to try and comply with FFP while we scratched about trying to all summer. The big tests for us are Fulham and Blues. I will wait till after those games before deciding the last 6 weeks were a blip from the norm.
That's a good point about ffp. They've just gone for it and will worry about the consequences after they have been promoted to the Premier league. Meanwhile we seem to be the only club who even try to adhere to it.
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Agree with all, Big Nose.
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People seem shocked that Wolves are good. They bloody well should be. We may have spent a lot but they have shelled out massive amounts on the Jorge Mendes backdoor project, manager and half the team are essentially champioons league quality and it showed. An agent is in bed with the owners and taking players there that I doubt even knew who wolves were before being told to go there. I expected the result because they have done nothing to try and comply with FFP while we scratched about trying to all summer. The big tests for us are Fulham and Blues. I will wait till after those games before deciding the last 6 weeks were a blip from the norm.
That's a good point about ffp. They've just gone for it and will worry about the consequences after they have been promoted to the Premier league. Meanwhile we seem to be the only club who even try to adhere to it.
Well Wolves are where we were last season, they basically have two years of spending before having to sort themselves out a bit financially if they don't go up. They'll look at the football they're playing, the results they're getting and probably spend some more because they look much more a sure fire thing than we do.
We will not spend in January because promotion for us looks a small chance and we will have to deal with the repercussions next year. Wolves probably won't. I'm afraid we spunked our free hit on a pisshead, a kid from Reading who had hardly played football, an Italian keeper who looked dodgy even on youtube and Scott Hogan who had played 30 games in the Championship. Hindsight is a great thing but £30m+ is a real pants pulled down job.
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Why do we only have a small chance of promotion?
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Why do we only have a small chance of promotion?
Because we play shit football and haven't been in the top six at all since we came down nearly 60 games ago.
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Where to start? I was never going to enjoy the performance or result from any seat in the ground - but being in the Steve Bull Upper with a Wolves mate and sat in front of an exceptionally gobby twat was not great.
Hutton did well playing out of position and Albert offered good support to him as a result we were not as exposed as I thought would happen but it meant we offered nothing going forward down the left - except for one Hutton trademark gallop into their half when he passed the ball straight out (standard).
A squad of our size and with the money spent means we should have competent back up option at fullback when we lose our first choices - people filling in can work against Burton and Bolton but against a good side, in a local derby and in front of their biggest crowd for 36 years, then that won't do.
I think Whelan gets more stick than is merited - if we set up to let the opposition have the ball and with a defence that back peddles at the rate that Terry does, then if we expect one player to cover that they would need the energy, pace and strength that would embarrass Clark Kent.
I see a bloke who doesn't hide, puts in a shift, links play with simple passes when in possession and encourages (or digs out) those around him. He twice applauded/encouraged the energy and movement of O'Hare when he came on.
He is poorly served by how we set up, but so is Hourihane - a player who is instrumental in a side that wants to be on the front foot, imposing itself on the opposition with energy, pace and a commitment to attack.
I'm also uncertain about Kodjia and Davis as a pair - I rate them both but as a pair they both look to go it alone and are looking for different service into them. Neither looks to find the other in my view - early days and I hope I am wrong, but that might prompt a big decision, and that is something I think Bruce is poorly equipped to do.
I'll finish with a word on Bruce. It can be easy to slate managers when disappointed by results, but the squad assembled, how we set up, decisions to pick players in roles they are not suited for (or not supported by the players around them is down to him).
It feels like there is no plan - he stumbled upon Davis and he was great for a few games, then Kodjia comes back and he can't work out how to organise the side.
Here's a clue Steve - it's not as simple as saying 'let's go 4-4-2' it is who you pick throughout the team and how you ask them to approach the game that determines what happens at the top end of the pitch. It also means we are less likely to get exposed at the back.
Great post, it’s not like we were playing Real Madrid.
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Why do we only have a small chance of promotion?
Because we play shit football and haven't been in the top six at all since we came down nearly 60 games ago.
So being 7th in October means we only have a small chance of promotion? Really?
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I don't get the criticism 'we only beat teams near the bottom of the table.' Who cares? That's who our fixture list dictated we played. I still think we'll get a decent amount of points from the next three games. Seven should be the target, nine great, anything less an opportunity missed. We should be up there at the end of the season and I think we will.
Wolves are fortunate to have such a luxury of talent who have integrated so well. Of course it would be good if we had something similar, but Bruce's pragmatism isn't nearly as bad as some suggest. It's not as easy on the eye but we'll get there.
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Why do we only have a small chance of promotion?
Because we play shit football and haven't been in the top six at all since we came down nearly 60 games ago.
So being 7th in October means we only have a small chance of promotion? Really?
We've played 7 of the bottom 10 and still aren't in the play off zone. Yes really.
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I don't get the criticism 'we only beat teams near the bottom of the table.' Who cares? That's who our fixture list dictated we played. I still think we'll get a decent amount of points from the next three games. Seven should be the target, nine great, anything less an opportunity missed. We should be up there at the end of the season and I think we will.
Wolves are fortunate to have such a luxury of talent who have integrated so well. Of course it would be good if we had something similar, but Bruce's pragmatism isn't nearly as bad as some suggest. It's not as easy on the eye but we'll get there.
The fixture list also gave us Bristol City Cardiff and Wolves, how many of those did we win?
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People seem shocked that Wolves are good. They bloody well should be. We may have spent a lot but they have shelled out massive amounts on the Jorge Mendes backdoor project, manager and half the team are essentially champioons league quality and it showed. An agent is in bed with the owners and taking players there that I doubt even knew who wolves were before being told to go there. I expected the result because they have done nothing to try and comply with FFP while we scratched about trying to all summer. The big tests for us are Fulham and Blues. I will wait till after those games before deciding the last 6 weeks were a blip from the norm.
That's a good point about ffp. They've just gone for it and will worry about the consequences after they have been promoted to the Premier league. Meanwhile we seem to be the only club who even try to adhere to it.
Yet we've still spunked the kind of dosh that many clubs in the Prem wouldn't be able or willing to: and what have we got to show for it? If I was the person who'd pumped a small fortune into the club & witnessed the kind of shite that was served up yesterday, I'd be spitting feathers & asking serious questions. I never expected us to take the Championship by storm & make a quicksicks return to the top flight, but certainly thought we'd be genuinely challenging at the sharp end by now. What I witnessed yesterday should be viewed as being completely unacceptable - and woefully short of the the standards we should be attaining and demanding.
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Why do we only have a small chance of promotion?
Because every season everything is set in stone by the second week in October. All our games are against shit teams if we win and if we lose it is nothing to do with who we played it is because we are shit.
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Why do we only have a small chance of promotion?
Because we play shit football and haven't been in the top six at all since we came down nearly 60 games ago.
So being 7th in October means we only have a small chance of promotion? Really?
We've played 7 of the bottom 10 and still aren't in the play off zone. Yes really.
Case dismissed then, let's give up now. I mean, that point off the play off's and 5 points off second is far too much ground to make up clearly.
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I don't get the criticism 'we only beat teams near the bottom of the table.' Who cares? That's who our fixture list dictated we played. I still think we'll get a decent amount of points from the next three games. Seven should be the target, nine great, anything less an opportunity missed. We should be up there at the end of the season and I think we will.
Wolves are fortunate to have such a luxury of talent who have integrated so well. Of course it would be good if we had something similar, but Bruce's pragmatism isn't nearly as bad as some suggest. It's not as easy on the eye but we'll get there.
The fixture list also gave us Bristol City Cardiff and Wolves, how many of those did we win?
The next excuse is that they were all away from home.
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Why do we only have a small chance of promotion?
Because every season everything is set in stone by the second week in October. All our games are against shit teams if we win and if we lose it is nothing to do with who we played it is because we are shit.
I can't believe we've had the audacity to lose to a team 2nd in the table away from home. How far have we fallen?
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Why do we only have a small chance of promotion?
Because we play shit football and haven't been in the top six at all since we came down nearly 60 games ago.
So being 7th in October means we only have a small chance of promotion? Really?
We've played 7 of the bottom 10 and still aren't in the play off zone. Yes really.
Case dismissed then, let's give up now. I mean, that point off the play off's and 5 points off second is far too much ground to make up clearly.
Who said give up? Who said it won't happen? Realistically, looking at how we play, looking at the results we've had and who we've played, looking at how our manager has performed over 12 months, we have a small chance of getting promoted.
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Why do we only have a small chance of promotion?
Because we play shit football and haven't been in the top six at all since we came down nearly 60 games ago.
So being 7th in October means we only have a small chance of promotion? Really?
We've played 7 of the bottom 10 and still aren't in the play off zone. Yes really.
Case dismissed then, let's give up now. I mean, that point off the play off's and 5 points off second is far too much ground to make up clearly.
Who said give up? Who said it won't happen? Realistically, looking at how we play, looking at the results we've had and who we've played, looking at how our manager has performed over 12 months, we have a small chance of getting promoted.
In your opinion. I'm still optimistic.
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I'm not worried there's a long way to go and we have just played one of the best sides in this division we wasn't going to win every game but I think we will be there or close come the end of the season.
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Good, I'll get no satisfaction if I turn out to be right. I want us to be promoted. I want to believe, a few good performances against sides challenging up there will do the trick.
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your always going to win games and lose games but we should always be capable of competing and we didn’t yesterday
we played Wolves who’s manager has been there all of 5 minutes, spent a load of money on a few players no ones ever heard of and they tore us apart and and took the piss out of us all over the park in every department
the whole thing was a joke of a performance a humiliation against a local rival
it was like watching a plucky lower league team like Yeovil in the FA cup playing against Man Utd seeing how long they could last out before the inevitable
apart from its a Bruce team costing millions in signings and wages who can’t even give Wolverhampton fucking Wanderers a proper game
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Good, I'll get no satisfaction if I turn out to be right. I want us to be promoted. I want to believe, a few good performances against sides challenging up there will do the trick.
Same, I want us to be performing and achieving something near the level that this squad is capable of.
We are no where near that.
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Good, I'll get no satisfaction if I turn out to be right. I want us to be promoted. I want to believe, a few good performances against sides challenging up there will do the trick.
Same, I want us to be performing and achieving something near the level that this squad is capable of.
We are no where near that.
Going by yesterday's abject display, I'm starting to think the squad are as capable as they actually are under Bruce.
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Good, I'll get no satisfaction if I turn out to be right. I want us to be promoted. I want to believe, a few good performances against sides challenging up there will do the trick.
Same, I want us to be performing and achieving something near the level that this squad is capable of.
We are no where near that.
Going by yesterday's abject display, I'm starting to think the squad are as capable as they actually are under Bruce.
There were some poor performances out there, how much was down to the wAy we were set up and how much down to off days ?
I thought Kodija looked out of sorts, I also thought that Wolves had us pinned back tactically and Bruce as usual did nothing about it.
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I think yesterday was a mixture of us not being at our best and them just being a better side than us at the moment. As others have said there's no need to hit the panic button just yet. We've still got some very good players for this level, let's see how the next couple of months play out.
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Good, I'll get no satisfaction if I turn out to be right. I want us to be promoted. I want to believe, a few good performances against sides challenging up there will do the trick.
Same, I want us to be performing and achieving something near the level that this squad is capable of.
We are no where near that.
Going by yesterday's abject display, I'm starting to think the squad are as capable as they actually are under Bruce.
There were some poor performances out there, how much was down to the wAy we were set up and how much down to off days ?
I thought Kodija looked out of sorts, I also thought that Wolves had us pinned back tactically and Bruce as usual did nothing about it.
While the players were abysmal, in the final analysis, the manager set the team up, the style of play and the tactics.
He was totally out thought by the Wolves manager and players gave ours the run around.
We might be promoted, but this squad will be straight back down should we get in the premiership unless we have a modern manager and they are allowed to spend again, hopefully not on past their best has beens
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I think yesterday was a mixture of us not being at our best and them just being a better side than us at the moment. As others have said there's no need to hit the panic button just yet. We've still got some very good players for this level, let's see how the next couple of months play out.
Agree totally.
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The only Wolves player I was familiar with was Ruddy, they look miles ahead of Villa with young, exciting players comfortable with the ball at their feet and playing some really nice football. Villa looked like a team of journeymen cobbled together hoping to get a 0-0. Kodjia doesn’t half get on my nerves with his theatrics and Bruce really doesn’t look healthy. Alan Hutton was easily our best player which says it all really.
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I think yesterday was a mixture of us not being at our best and them just being a better side than us at the moment. As others have said there's no need to hit the panic button just yet. We've still got some very good players for this level, let's see how the next couple of months play out.
Agree totally.
Alternatively you could view it, as I do, as the inevitable outcome of playing very poor football in a negative style. Maybe what we saw yesterday is our "best", a best that might be sufficient to grind out wins against poor opposition but will always come unstuck when up against any kind of quality. We simply don't look as if we can actually play football most of the time.
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I think yesterday was a mixture of us not being at our best and them just being a better side than us at the moment. As others have said there's no need to hit the panic button just yet. We've still got some very good players for this level, let's see how the next couple of months play out.
Agree totally.
Alternatively you could view it, as I do, as the inevitable outcome of playing very poor football in a negative style. Maybe what we saw yesterday is our "best", a best that might be sufficient to grind out wins against poor opposition but will always come unstuck when up against any kind of quality. We simply don't look as if we can actually play football most of the time.
Absoloutely.
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I don't get the criticism 'we only beat teams near the bottom of the table.' Who cares? That's who our fixture list dictated we played. I still think we'll get a decent amount of points from the next three games. Seven should be the target, nine great, anything less an opportunity missed. We should be up there at the end of the season and I think we will.
Wolves are fortunate to have such a luxury of talent who have integrated so well. Of course it would be good if we had something similar, but Bruce's pragmatism isn't nearly as bad as some suggest. It's not as easy on the eye but we'll get there.
The better sides expose our failings - which in my view is the balance of a big squad (no adequate cover across the back four); the mismatch between approach and personnel (concede possession/defend deep exposing a thirtysomething defensive centre-mid - be it Whelan or Jedi); too cautious an approach; no clear plan A for how we create chances (and then a plan B); and poor tactical decisions in games (use of subs).
Wolves are a good side but they are not "fortunate to have such a luxury of talent" they have made good decisions on transfers, presumably based on a clear view of what they want and how they want to play and they have a new manager who has worked out good combinations around the pitch and as a whole and he has them motivated.
We have almost certainly invested more (don't have the stats to hand) but we've made poor decisions for at least 5/6 years and we have an experienced manager being outwitted by managers with fewer resources and less experience. We might well scramble a playoff place and I hope we do that (or better) but I can't see any assessment for the current regime other than C-, must do better (or get someone who can).
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I don't get the criticism 'we only beat teams near the bottom of the table.' Who cares? That's who our fixture list dictated we played. I still think we'll get a decent amount of points from the next three games. Seven should be the target, nine great, anything less an opportunity missed. We should be up there at the end of the season and I think we will.
Wolves are fortunate to have such a luxury of talent who have integrated so well. Of course it would be good if we had something similar, but Bruce's pragmatism isn't nearly as bad as some suggest. It's not as easy on the eye but we'll get there.
The better sides expose our failings - which in my view is the balance of a big squad (no adequate cover across the back four); the mismatch between approach and personnel (concede possession/defend deep exposing a thirtysomething defensive centre-mid - be it Whelan or Jedi); too cautious an approach; no clear plan A for how we create chances (and then a plan B); and poor tactical decisions in games (use of subs).
Wolves are a good side but they are not "fortunate to have such a luxury of talent" they have made good decisions on transfers, presumably based on a clear view of what they want and how they want to play and they have a new manager who has worked out good combinations around the pitch and as a whole and he has them motivated.
We have almost certainly invested more (don't have the stats to hand) but we've made poor decisions for at least 5/6 years and we have an experienced manager being outwitted by managers with fewer resources and less experience. We might well scramble a playoff place and I hope we do that (or better) but I can't see any assessment for the current regime other than C-, must do better (or get someone who can).
We've repeated the Lerner process sans limited success.
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I think yesterday was a mixture of us not being at our best and them just being a better side than us at the moment. As others have said there's no need to hit the panic button just yet. We've still got some very good players for this level, let's see how the next couple of months play out.
Agree totally.
Alternatively you could view it, as I do, as the inevitable outcome of playing very poor football in a negative style. Maybe what we saw yesterday is our "best", a best that might be sufficient to grind out wins against poor opposition but will always come unstuck when up against any kind of quality. We simply don't look as if we can actually play football most of the time.
I'm in agreement with your summery there too, KT. I was flabbergasted by our players inability to do the basics yesterday, but I live in hope that we all witness the necessary improvements during the next game.
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I don't get the criticism 'we only beat teams near the bottom of the table.' Who cares? That's who our fixture list dictated we played. I still think we'll get a decent amount of points from the next three games. Seven should be the target, nine great, anything less an opportunity missed. We should be up there at the end of the season and I think we will.
Wolves are fortunate to have such a luxury of talent who have integrated so well. Of course it would be good if we had something similar, but Bruce's pragmatism isn't nearly as bad as some suggest. It's not as easy on the eye but we'll get there.
The fixture list also gave us Bristol City Cardiff and Wolves, how many of those did we win?
The next excuse is that they were all away from home.
I don't know why it's got to be so inflammatory. It's not an 'excuse,' it's just how different people see the game. I think it's clear that the likes of you and ChicagoLion are more pessimistic and the likes of Clampy and myself are more optimistic. Good. Fine. I think the more pessimistic folk have been a lot more correct in recent years - the club has been shit. However, I am allowed to think that winning four in a row and losing one in nine is not the worst form in the world and I am also allowed to think that being seventh is grounds for optimism. I could point out that even if those wins were against lower positioned teams in the league it may be a springboard for us and build confidence. It's like banging your head against a brick wall though if people just see wins as 'it was only against (insert shit team) so it doesn't count.' You probably think that when I say that we're not as bad as you think though!
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Embarrassing to see the video of our fans fighting each other doing the rounds. I know it's a Derby, late KO etc which means everyone drinks too much, but it does appear we have a problem with this.
I've seen it loads of times at away games over the years including Cardiff this season.
It really pisses me off to be honest.
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I was convinced we would concede a goal by the time I got back from popping to the shop at half time. I was right. We were very much second best but we will see out the month with two wins from our next two games.
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Why do we only have a small chance of promotion?
Because we play shit football and haven't been in the top six at all since we came down nearly 60 games ago.
We're a point off them. 5 points off 2nd. There's a greater chance we will be in them next weekend than out.
You're talking as if we're 18th.
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Kodjia's unwillingness to press as he casually strolled around the centre circle was Gabby-esque. No idea what was up with him yesterday.
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Kodjia's unwillingness to press as he casually strolled around the centre circle was Gabby-esque. No idea what was up with him yesterday.
Yes I noticed this, he looked completely disinterested.
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Why do we only have a small chance of promotion?
Because every season everything is set in stone by the second week in October. All our games are against shit teams if we win and if we lose it is nothing to do with who we played it is because we are shit.
I can't believe we've had the audacity to lose to a team 2nd in the table away from home. How far have we fallen?
They were second in the division in which we are supposed to be aiming to finish in the top two. They absolutely battered us. I think that's why people are a bit miffed. If Wolves are the standard of team that is likely to get promoted, we look nowhere near that level. That's fairly depressing.
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We were beaten by a better team. It happens .
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We were beaten by a better team. It happens .
I think people are fucked off that Wolves are a better team, considering where both clubs have spent the last 30 or so years.
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Well, quite. It was bad enough turning up to Man United and Chelsea knowing that we'd lost before a ball was kicked. Now defeats against shite like fucking Wolves are to be met with a resigned shrug of the shoulders?
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Embarrassing to see the video of our fans fighting each other doing the rounds. I know it's a Derby, late KO etc which means everyone drinks too much, but it does appear we have a problem with this.
I've seen it loads of times at away games over the years including Cardiff this season.
It really pisses me off to be honest.
Facebook Video (https://www.facebook.com/1FootballAwayDays/videos/501766760187532/?hc_ref=ARSt0V4GvltkTcWjo0797aKbBOy8ipidVWLg2of95mHki918SEdwjVLrOLOjnu7aKUo)
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Why do we only have a small chance of promotion?
Because every season everything is set in stone by the second week in October. All our games are against shit teams if we win and if we lose it is nothing to do with who we played it is because we are shit.
I can't believe we've had the audacity to lose to a team 2nd in the table away from home. How far have we fallen?
They were second in the division in which we are supposed to be aiming to finish in the top two. They absolutely battered us. I think that's why people are a bit miffed. If Wolves are the standard of team that is likely to get promoted, we look nowhere near that level. That's fairly depressing.
No one could have predicted that as soon as Bruce comes up against a half decent team we look like we are playing a different sport.
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Well, quite. It was bad enough turning up to Man United and Chelsea knowing that we'd lost before a ball was kicked. Now defeats against shite like fucking Wolves are to be met with a resigned shrug of the shoulders?
That’s what fucks me off the most. Bruce played not to lose at Wolves. Fucking Wolves, not Man U or Man City. And even then I got pissed off when we did it against those sides. We’ve been on a good run so why not try to take the game to them. I’ve seen other teams come to Villa Park over the years and do it to us. He set up with a negative attitude and it always brings with it the inevitable. Wolves are confident and soon as they realized we weren’t up for it they took advantage. It’s been typical of Bruce since he arrived. Absolutely hate it.
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Why do we only have a small chance of promotion?
Because every season everything is set in stone by the second week in October. All our games are against shit teams if we win and if we lose it is nothing to do with who we played it is because we are shit.
I can't believe we've had the audacity to lose to a team 2nd in the table away from home. How far have we fallen?
They were second in the division in which we are supposed to be aiming to finish in the top two. They absolutely battered us. I think that's why people are a bit miffed. If Wolves are the standard of team that is likely to get promoted, we look nowhere near that level. That's fairly depressing.
No one could have predicted that as soon as Bruce comes up against a half decent team we look like we are playing a different sport.
Luckily there aren't too many half decent teams in this league. We've lost one in nine. I will start worrying if we look that shit against Fulham next week
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Why do we only have a small chance of promotion?
Because every season everything is set in stone by the second week in October. All our games are against shit teams if we win and if we lose it is nothing to do with who we played it is because we are shit.
I can't believe we've had the audacity to lose to a team 2nd in the table away from home. How far have we fallen?
They were second in the division in which we are supposed to be aiming to finish in the top two. They absolutely battered us. I think that's why people are a bit miffed. If Wolves are the standard of team that is likely to get promoted, we look nowhere near that level. That's fairly depressing.
No one could have predicted that as soon as Bruce comes up against a half decent team we look like we are playing a different sport.
Luckily there aren't too many half decent teams in this league. We've lost one in nine. I will start worrying if we look that shit against Fulham next week
We will. Fulham play football, which we don't deal with very well. Ever.
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I don't get the criticism 'we only beat teams near the bottom of the table.' Who cares? That's who our fixture list dictated we played. I still think we'll get a decent amount of points from the next three games. Seven should be the target, nine great, anything less an opportunity missed. We should be up there at the end of the season and I think we will.
Wolves are fortunate to have such a luxury of talent who have integrated so well. Of course it would be good if we had something similar, but Bruce's pragmatism isn't nearly as bad as some suggest. It's not as easy on the eye but we'll get there.
The fixture list also gave us Bristol City Cardiff and Wolves, how many of those did we win?
The next excuse is that they were all away from home.
I don't know why it's got to be so inflammatory. It's not an 'excuse,' it's just how different people see the game. I think it's clear that the likes of you and ChicagoLion are more pessimistic and the likes of Clampy and myself are more optimistic. Good. Fine. I think the more pessimistic folk have been a lot more correct in recent years - the club has been shit. However, I am allowed to think that winning four in a row and losing one in nine is not the worst form in the world and I am also allowed to think that being seventh is grounds for optimism. I could point out that even if those wins were against lower positioned teams in the league it may be a springboard for us and build confidence. It's like banging your head against a brick wall though if people just see wins as 'it was only against (insert shit team) so it doesn't count.' You probably think that when I say that we're not as bad as you think though!
I think your argument is over simplistic. It's not just slagging off wins because they were against poor to middling teams, it's about the level of performance and quality, whether we've won or lost. The fact is we've ground out most of those wins playing some god-awful football despite the lack of quality in the opposition. I can kind of see why some are happy to take the results on face value and enjoy them while they can, but I think others are able to see the bigger picture and put those results into context. In how many games have we actually looked like a quality team? Hardly any. It really should not be difficult to look decent and competent in this division, especially with the money we've spent. Bruce is making us look way less than the sum of our parts.
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Why do we only have a small chance of promotion?
Because every season everything is set in stone by the second week in October. All our games are against shit teams if we win and if we lose it is nothing to do with who we played it is because we are shit.
I can't believe we've had the audacity to lose to a team 2nd in the table away from home. How far have we fallen?
They were second in the division in which we are supposed to be aiming to finish in the top two. They absolutely battered us. I think that's why people are a bit miffed. If Wolves are the standard of team that is likely to get promoted, we look nowhere near that level. That's fairly depressing.
No one could have predicted that as soon as Bruce comes up against a half decent team we look like we are playing a different sport.
Luckily there aren't too many half decent teams in this league. We've lost one in nine. I will start worrying if we look that shit against Fulham next week
But we've looked shit against plenty of teams this season, and last. Why are you waiting for the Fulham game before you start worrying?
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It’s also why he’s never made it in the PL. You can get away with it in the Championship simply because the overall quality is so poor. We won’t face many really good sides so he’ll grind out results against the majority and find a way to get teams into a promotion challenging spot. But you can’t do that in the PL and he gets found out every time.
The football right now is dreadful for the most part but he’s playing the odds that he’ll get enough decent results across 46 games to get us up. But it will be murder all the way and ultimately won’t last.
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It’s also why he’s never made it in the PL. You can get away with it in the Championship simply because the overall quality is so poor. We won’t face many really good sides so he’ll grind out results against the majority and find a way to get teams into a promotion challenging spot. But you can’t do that in the PL and he gets found out every time.
The football right now is dreadful for the most part but he’s playing the odds that he’ll get enough decent results across 46 games to get us up. But it will be murder all the way and ultimately won’t last.
He can't even get use in the top 6, once, after 46 games. What makes you think he'll do enough to get us up after another 34?
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It’s also why he’s never made it in the PL. You can get away with it in the Championship simply because the overall quality is so poor. We won’t face many really good sides so he’ll grind out results against the majority and find a way to get teams into a promotion challenging spot. But you can’t do that in the PL and he gets found out every time.
The football right now is dreadful for the most part but he’s playing the odds that he’ll get enough decent results across 46 games to get us up. But it will be murder all the way and ultimately won’t last.
He can't even get use in the top 6, once, after 46 games. What makes you think he'll do enough to get us up after another 34?
Err because we're 7th and one point off the top 6. With a home game coming up against a team below us
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Well, quite. It was bad enough turning up to Man United and Chelsea knowing that we'd lost before a ball was kicked. Now defeats against shite like fucking Wolves are to be met with a resigned shrug of the shoulders?
That’s what fucks me off the most. Bruce played not to lose at Wolves. Fucking Wolves, not Man U or Man City. And even then I got pissed off when we did it against those sides. We’ve been on a good run so why not try to take the game to them. I’ve seen other teams come to Villa Park over the years and do it to us. He set up with a negative attitude and it always brings with it the inevitable. Wolves are confident and soon as they realized we weren’t up for it they took advantage. It’s been typical of Bruce since he arrived. Absolutely hate it.
His mentality is any point away is a good one regardless of opposition. He said as much in one of his early interviews.
Amazed he's got so many teams promoted treating away games like that.
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It’s also why he’s never made it in the PL. You can get away with it in the Championship simply because the overall quality is so poor. We won’t face many really good sides so he’ll grind out results against the majority and find a way to get teams into a promotion challenging spot. But you can’t do that in the PL and he gets found out every time.
The football right now is dreadful for the most part but he’s playing the odds that he’ll get enough decent results across 46 games to get us up. But it will be murder all the way and ultimately won’t last.
He can't even get use in the top 6, once, after 46 games. What makes you think he'll do enough to get us up after another 34?
Absolutely nothing. He was such an uninspiring and unimaginative appointment and you just knew Villa would be behind the curve yet again in appointing him. Bournemouth showed that you don't have to hoof your way out of this league the season before we went down, clearly nobody at Villa Park was paying attention.
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If we're in the top six next weekend what then?
Seeing as we're at home, very strong and favourites to win and given our form a win is most likely.
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If we're in the top six next weekend what then?
Seeing as we're at home, very strong and favourites to win and given our form a win is most likely.
It won't count because Fulham are below us
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Why do we only have a small chance of promotion?
Because every season everything is set in stone by the second week in October. All our games are against shit teams if we win and if we lose it is nothing to do with who we played it is because we are shit.
I can't believe we've had the audacity to lose to a team 2nd in the table away from home. How far have we fallen?
They were second in the division in which we are supposed to be aiming to finish in the top two. They absolutely battered us. I think that's why people are a bit miffed. If Wolves are the standard of team that is likely to get promoted, we look nowhere near that level. That's fairly depressing.
No one could have predicted that as soon as Bruce comes up against a half decent team we look like we are playing a different sport.
Luckily there aren't too many half decent teams in this league. We've lost one in nine. I will start worrying if we look that shit against Fulham next week
So even if we accept the (depressing) decision that the limit of our ambitions is not to lose against decent Championship sides, how easy do you imagine it is change the mindset, tactics and personnel from yesterday to next Saturday?
I don't think that is simple at all - and if that is the plan we will most likely look disjointed to begin with versus Fulham. Also, I don't think we have in Bruce a manager capable of getting the same group to play in two different ways - from what I see, he finds it difficult enough to get them to consistently play in one way.
Perhaps most of all I think that if we try to win whoever we play, both home and away with a consistent approach to games (both a plan A and a plan B) that we will assemble more points at the end of the season and enjoy what we see more often.
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It's simple, if you cannot keep possession, or work as a unit, you don't stand a chance.
We haven't shown any consistent sign of doing this, always allowing the opposition (even those going down...i'm thinking Wigan away last year), to have the ball.
Bruce is my least favourite manager since O'Leary. I have to switch over if i see him talking, it's that bad.
Anybody thinking we are going anywhere with that clown is mistaken (in my opinion of course).
I noticed God himself made a critical tweet about the lack of pressing by the team...It's clear as day!
Nick
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I think your argument is over simplistic. It's not just slagging off wins because they were against poor to middling teams, it's about the level of performance and quality, whether we've won or lost. The fact is we've ground out most of those wins playing some god-awful football despite the lack of quality in the opposition. I can kind of see why some are happy to take the results on face value and enjoy them while they can, but I think others are able to see the bigger picture and put those results into context. In how many games have we actually looked like a quality team? Hardly any. It really should not be difficult to look decent and competent in this division, especially with the money we've spent. Bruce is making us look way less than the sum of our parts.
For what it's worth I agree that the style of football is not good enough for the players we have, but I think we lost all chance of us playing attractively when we appointed Bruce. With the fact that you can't teach an old dog new tricks and leopards don't change their spots (etc etc), Bruce will not change and thus we ultimately have to go on results. Results - currently - are improving and we should be looking to be comfortably in a play off spot by Christmas. I don't want Bruce long term, but he's what we've got so right now results, more so than performances, are the priority.
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If we're in the top six next weekend what then?
Seeing as we're at home, very strong and favourites to win and given our form a win is most likely.
It's possible. But other teams, above us, might be playing and winning, as well.
I'm hoping Ipswich don't win their game in hand and become yet another team to go above us.
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The biggest think pissing me off is the accusation of how far we have fallen behind Wolves. Well were a division behind the likes of Palace, Bournemouth and Swansea. It is what it is, and how this club has been neglected by the previous regime. Blaming Bruce for our current standing in the football hierarchy is disingenuous. Im no fan of Bruce and his football, but he has nowhere done enough to be sacked and therefore we should see how far he can get us without this pathetic outcry everytime we don't get a result.
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The biggest think pissing me off is the accusation of how far we have fallen behind Wolves. Well were a division behind the likes of Palace, Bournemouth and Swansea. It is what it is, and how this club has been neglected by the previous regime. Blaming Bruce for our current standing in the football hierarchy is disingenuous. Im no fan of Bruce and his football, but he has nowhere done enough to be sacked and therefore we should see how far he can get us without this pathetic outcry everytime we don't get a result.
He isn't responsible for us being in this league, that's true, but he's not doing enough to get us out of it either. Many people said, before a ball was kicked, that automatic promotion means 2 points per game and that was clearly also the target for the season. After 12 games we're 5 points short of that target. How far short do we have to get before he's seen as failing? He had us 7 points short in early September and it was 'hysterical' to be worried about it so how difficult does the job need to be for his replacement before we accept the fact that he's shit?
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I think your argument is over simplistic. It's not just slagging off wins because they were against poor to middling teams, it's about the level of performance and quality, whether we've won or lost. The fact is we've ground out most of those wins playing some god-awful football despite the lack of quality in the opposition. I can kind of see why some are happy to take the results on face value and enjoy them while they can, but I think others are able to see the bigger picture and put those results into context. In how many games have we actually looked like a quality team? Hardly any. It really should not be difficult to look decent and competent in this division, especially with the money we've spent. Bruce is making us look way less than the sum of our parts.
For what it's worth I agree that the style of football is not good enough for the players we have, but I think we lost all chance of us playing attractively when we appointed Bruce. With the fact that you can't teach an old dog new tricks and leopards don't change their spots (etc etc), Bruce will not change and thus we ultimately have to go on results. Results - currently - are improving and we should be looking to be comfortably in a play off spot by Christmas. I don't want Bruce long term, but he's what we've got so right now results, more so than performances, are the priority.
But I think you are missing the point again - in the longer term there is almost bound to be a correlation between results and performance. Personally I think we've had some good fortune with a few of our recent wins and draws, in the longer term we're just as likely to lose the draws and draw the wins because of our lack of quality. The recent results may indicate that a play off place or promotion are feasible, the performances, in my view, tell a very different story. It's not about attractive football necessarilly either, it's about quality, doing the basics. Some of Mourinho's teams for example aren't particularly good to watch but they do have quality and look as if they know what they are doing. We seldom do.
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So you don't think wanting a manager out after suffering his 1st defeat in 9 matches and 4 wins on the trot is hysterical? Villa were 14th in Division 2 heading into 1975...its a good job Ron Saunders wasn't around now.
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ktvillan - that's where I disagree with you. I think we'll get scrappy wins where fans think we didn't deserve it - like Bruce's teams always have done. Only time will tell. I can see where you're coming from as we're the antithesis of Barcelona - of course I can - but I do think we'll pick up points more often than not.
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Match verdict after a 24 hour cool down. We were very poor.
Most wanted us to keep the same winning team and formation, we did. Of course we then had some claim we shouldn't have. Standard
So many players were below par yesterday it was hard to fathom. It wasn't due to some Wolves magic either, they just looked very lethargic and clueless where in previous weeks they've looked decent. Kodjia, Davis, Snodgrass, Adomah, Hourianne, Elmo ... the list is endless. I'd love to know why
The Madrid of the Black Country played well. But some of the talk since about them being amazing is frankly hilarious. They didn't have to get out of third gear to beat our lot yesterday and it still took them 36 minutes to register a pot shot on target.
What puzzles me now is do we stick with the winning formation/team or try freshening things up on Saturday ? O'Hare could be a decent punt for me
Oh, and about Hutton. I can't stand him. But fair play for the 2/3 tackles, they were excellent. Perfectly balanced out by his 2/3 awful moments going forward of course but that's the bloke all over
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So you don't think wanting a manager out after suffering his 1st defeat in 9 matches and 4 wins on the trot is hysterical? Villa were 14th in Division 2 heading into 1975...its a good job Ron Saunders wasn't around now.
I don't think being unsure about a manager who was hired to get promotion, finished 13th and is outside the play offs again is hysterical.
Yet again it's all about expectations and targets, in march Wyness said:
We can't get away from that at all. We want to do everything we can next season to go up. It will be an important season, we have got a great squad, there will be no excuses for us not to go up.
In July you had this from Xia:
"One particular task this season is to dramatically improve our away results.
"Hope the new away kit brings luck to us, 15+away wins! UTV!"
Right now, even with 4 wins on the bounce, we're not looking like meeting either of those targets. We may beat Fulham and Blues and be right in the mix for the top 2 by the end of the month, or we might struggle to a point in both of them and be midtable, I think both of those are likely as the other based on what we've seen under Bruce, and that's why people aren't happy.
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So you don't think wanting a manager out after suffering his 1st defeat in 9 matches and 4 wins on the trot is hysterical? Villa were 14th in Division 2 heading into 1975...its a good job Ron Saunders wasn't around now.
I don't think being unsure about a manager who was hired to get promotion, finished 13th and is outside the play offs again is hysterical.
Yet again it's all about expectations and targets, in march Wyness said:
We can't get away from that at all. We want to do everything we can next season to go up. It will be an important season, we have got a great squad, there will be no excuses for us not to go up.
In July you had this from Xia:
"One particular task this season is to dramatically improve our away results.
"Hope the new away kit brings luck to us, 15+away wins! UTV!"
Right now, even with 4 wins on the bounce, we're not looking like meeting either of those targets. We may beat Fulham and Blues and be right in the mix for the top 2 by the end of the month, or we might struggle to a point in both of them and be midtable, I think both of those are likely as the other based on what we've seen under Bruce, and that's why people aren't happy.
Being unsure is one thing..being hysterical is another. Id rather give someone time and given the benefit of the doubt rather than than wripping everything up and starting again....when we are a point of the play offs and 5 points of automatic.
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"Hystericals" vs "Happy Clappers"
Might make for a decent 5 a side game :)
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"Hystericals" vs "Happy Clappers"
Might make for a decent 5 a side game :)
Not sure I fancy that..one missed pass and id be sacked😂
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"We'll dust ourselves down and go again."
Sounds familiar...
Actually I don't think this is the time to sack Bruce, not whilst we are still in touch with the play off places at least.
I do hope we do some business in January though. There is deadwood there that needs clearing. See if we can get permanent transfers out for any of our on loans as well to build a decent transfer kitty (we got a tidy sum for Amavi apparently so there's something in it already at least).
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So you don't think wanting a manager out after suffering his 1st defeat in 9 matches and 4 wins on the trot is hysterical? Villa were 14th in Division 2 heading into 1975...its a good job Ron Saunders wasn't around now.
I don't think being unsure about a manager who was hired to get promotion, finished 13th and is outside the play offs again is hysterical.
Yet again it's all about expectations and targets, in march Wyness said:
We can't get away from that at all. We want to do everything we can next season to go up. It will be an important season, we have got a great squad, there will be no excuses for us not to go up.
In July you had this from Xia:
"One particular task this season is to dramatically improve our away results.
"Hope the new away kit brings luck to us, 15+away wins! UTV!"
Right now, even with 4 wins on the bounce, we're not looking like meeting either of those targets. We may beat Fulham and Blues and be right in the mix for the top 2 by the end of the month, or we might struggle to a point in both of them and be midtable, I think both of those are likely as the other based on what we've seen under Bruce, and that's why people aren't happy.
Being unsure is one thing..being hysterical is another. Id rather give someone time and given the benefit of the doubt rather than than wripping everything up and starting again....when we are a point of the play offs and 5 points of automatic.
the bold bit is exactly right but it's not me you need to tell that, I'm not remotely hysterical and never have been, I had clear targets for what I'd see as acceptable for him to deliver and he's missed all of them so far and is short of the current ones as well. I don't think we can sack him right now and I certainly won't be tweeting anyone demanding it but I also think it's inevitable that he'll fall short again and be sacked. On that basis my concern has always been about giving the next guy the best possible chance. If we're 12-13th in the league at the start of December then that might be too big a gap for a new manager to make up, but if we're 7th-8th it might not be enough to sack him. I hope I'm wrong, I hope we win 6-7 on the bounce and are in the automatic spots coming up to the window, but I just can't see it.
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Bruce got his tactics wrong yesterday. We couldn't afford to play a right-sided midfielder at right back against a team with a dangerous front 3, just as we couldn't afford to only deploy a midfield 2 against their 3. I would rather we had played De Laet at right back, even if there was a risk that he wouldn't last the 90 and played Onomah instead of Kodjia.
One of Bruce's biggest failings must be that despite re-shaping the whole squad, he's only comfortable playing the same 11 each week. He should be able to make tactical changes and rotational changes to keep everyone fresh but doesn't look like he can. We were crap in the first match after the last international break and Bruce held his hands up and said he should have freshened things up yet did exactly the same thing again. Einstein's definition of insanity is to repeat the same actions and expect different results.
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Bruce got his tactics wrong yesterday. We couldn't afford to play a right-sided midfielder at right back against a team with a dangerous front 3, just as we couldn't afford to only deploy a midfield 2 against their 3. I would rather we had played De Laet at right back, even if there was a risk that he wouldn't last the 90 and played Onomah instead of Kodjia.
One of Bruce's biggest failings must be that despite re-shaping the whole squad, he's only comfortable playing the same 11 each week. He should be able to make tactical changes and rotational changes to keep everyone fresh but doesn't look like he can. We were crap in the first match after the last international break and Bruce held his hands up and said he should have freshened things up yet did exactly the same thing again. Einstein's definition of insanity is to repeat the same actions and expect different results.
For the 2nd paragraph I suspect that's because his approach is to tinker about until something works and then flog it to death until it doesn't. His signings don't suggest a plan, his tactics don't suggest a plan, it's all down to if you throw enough quality on the pitch they'll work it out for themselves. I might be wrong but I just don't see how the signings he's made fit into any sort of master plan to turn us into something else, it was all about getting as many options as he could handle and then seeing what happens.
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So you don't think wanting a manager out after suffering his 1st defeat in 9 matches and 4 wins on the trot is hysterical? Villa were 14th in Division 2 heading into 1975...its a good job Ron Saunders wasn't around now.
I don't think being unsure about a manager who was hired to get promotion, finished 13th and is outside the play offs again is hysterical.
Yet again it's all about expectations and targets, in march Wyness said:
We can't get away from that at all. We want to do everything we can next season to go up. It will be an important season, we have got a great squad, there will be no excuses for us not to go up.
In July you had this from Xia:
"One particular task this season is to dramatically improve our away results.
"Hope the new away kit brings luck to us, 15+away wins! UTV!"
Right now, even with 4 wins on the bounce, we're not looking like meeting either of those targets. We may beat Fulham and Blues and be right in the mix for the top 2 by the end of the month, or we might struggle to a point in both of them and be midtable, I think both of those are likely as the other based on what we've seen under Bruce, and that's why people aren't happy.
Being unsure is one thing..being hysterical is another. Id rather give someone time and given the benefit of the doubt rather than than wripping everything up and starting again....when we are a point of the play offs and 5 points of automatic.
the bold bit is exactly right but it's not me you need to tell that, I'm not remotely hysterical and never have been, I had clear targets for what I'd see as acceptable for him to deliver and he's missed all of them so far and is short of the current ones as well. I don't think we can sack him right now and I certainly won't be tweeting anyone demanding it but I also think it's inevitable that he'll fall short again and be sacked. On that basis my concern has always been about giving the next guy the best possible chance. If we're 12-13th in the league at the start of December then that might be too big a gap for a new manager to make up, but if we're 7th-8th it might not be enough to sack him. I hope I'm wrong, I hope we win 6-7 on the bounce and are in the automatic spots coming up to the window, but I just can't see it.
We're in a bit of a difficult situation Paul. To sack Bruce now would be harsh, but a run of bad results over the kind of timeframe when serious questions would start being asked would probably see us out of promotion contention anyway. I honestly think we are now stuck with him until the point (it might not come) when we have such a poor run that promotion begins to look unlikely. I can't see him going anywhere if we are in touching distance of the play offs or better.
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"Hystericals" vs "Happy Clappers"
Might make for a decent 5 a side game :)
We should make it a 4-team tournament by including The Bedwetters & Delusionals. ;)
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We're in a bit of a difficult situation Paul. To sack Bruce now would be harsh, but a run of bad results over the kind of timeframe when serious questions would start being asked would probably see us out of promotion contention anyway. I honestly think we are now stuck with him until the point (it might not come) when we have such a poor run that promotion begins to look unlikely. I can't see him going anywhere if we are in touching distance of the play offs or better.
I agree totally, that's why I'm worried. Before the start of the season I predicted something between 5th and 8th and I stand by that, he might get us into the playoffs and from there might get us promoted but it's going to be uncomfortable and if all that does happen there's no chance he'd be sacked without getting a run at the premier league so we'll lose that summer and part of the first season back as well before we can even think of hiring someone who will actually be able to turn us in to something more than a yo-yo side at best.
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Anyone still think we've got the best squad in the division by a country mile?
Yes. But not the best manager or coaching team
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My impressions from the game
1)Bruce wanted to keep a winning team , I understand that however it was clear early on we were struggling and again he sat on his hands and did nothing . 2 up top is no good when the opposition have 3 cbs marking them leaving one spare and a midfielder who are miles away from supporting the top 2
2)2 up front looks attacking on paper but if those 2 attackers are not getting on the ball it quickly becomes a defensive formation where they are just there to try and hold up long balls whilst the rest of the team sit deep
3)Wingers on opposites sides ..I know Snoddgrass wants to play on the right but when you have 2 strikers one of which is in the team as a target man you really need to have wingers who get to the byline and cross first time ..with Taylor out we have 3 of the 4 wide players all playing on the ''wrong'' side so all of them had to cut inside it slows the game down and allows the opposition to get back
4) CM against the better teams a CM of Whelan and Houriane are going to be exposed with their lack of pace.Both play tidy pass's but go no where with the ball , Wolves on the other hand were spraying pass's , spreading the play and finding gaps .For me Whelan like Jedinek is a holding MF with 2 infront of him.Houriane I want to see further foward ready to get the ball and take shots in dangerous areas no playing sideways pass's in his own half
5)Kodjia and Davis where both poor and should of been subbed early or moved around , I would have dropped Kodjia out to the left side , moved Adomah right wing and brough Snodgrass more central to pack midfield to try and get some on the ball
Overall Wolves were pretty good and have got some very decent players and I can see them winning the league but we played into their hands as once again Bruce was left clueless on how to adapt.
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My impressions from the game
1)Bruce wanted to keep a winning team , I understand that however it was clear early on we were struggling and again he sat on his hands and did nothing . 2 up top is no good when the opposition have 3 cbs marking them leaving one spare and a midfielder who are miles away from supporting the top 2
2)2 up front looks attacking on paper but if those 2 attackers are not getting on the ball it quickly becomes a defensive formation where they are just there to try and hold up long balls whilst the rest of the team sit deep
3)Wingers on opposites sides ..I know Snoddgrass wants to play on the right but when you have 2 strikers one of which is in the team as a target man you really need to have wingers who get to the byline and cross first time ..with Taylor out we have 3 of the 4 wide players all playing on the ''wrong'' side so all of them had to cut inside it slows the game down and allows the opposition to get back
4) CM against the better teams a CM of Whelan and Houriane are going to be exposed with their lack of pace.Both play tidy pass's but go no where with the ball , Wolves on the other hand were spraying pass's , spreading the play and finding gaps .For me Whelan like Jedinek is a holding MF with 2 infront of him.Houriane I want to see further foward ready to get the ball and take shots in dangerous areas no playing sideways pass's in his own half
5)Kodjia and Davis where both poor and should of been subbed early or moved around , I would have dropped Kodjia out to the left side , moved Adomah right wing and brough Snodgrass more central to pack midfield to try and get some on the ball
Overall Wolves were pretty good and have got some very decent players and I can see them winning the league but we played into their hands as once again Bruce was left clueless on how to adapt.
This has been the main concern over the past few weeks for me. If you are going to play a two in midfield they have to be mobile and able to cover a lot of ground. I don't think either Whelan or Hourihane fall into that category.
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Disappointed but not that surprised that we lost. I thought we might make a game of it and expected a point.
The team needs to provide a response against Fulham. We were comprehensively outclassed by Wolves from most of the reports and comments that I’ve read. Have to do better against Fulham. Beat them and a point at least against the filth, with two decent performances and I’ll be reasonably happy.
Four points from the next two matches should keep us on track.
The only reason I’m saying I’d be happy with a point against the dogshitters is that we’ve often failed to beat them even when there was a big gulf in class in our favour.
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Hourihane's booking in the first half really annoyed me. It was a moment that seemed to epitomise everything that has frustrated me about the whole club over the last few years. The slightest hint of trouble and he resorted to the easiest, witless solution, to face the consequences immediately afterwards. No guile or energy to rectify the situation, just trip him up off the ball. Done. Oh, now I'm booked and we have to defend a free kick.
It also made me realise that I don't really like many of our players. It's was cynical and snide, much like Lansbury when he got sent off. Kodjia up front was sulky, too easy to go to ground and generally not interested. Then there's Lansbury's mysterious sense of self worth. Taylor was missing for his second straight red tackle since he joined us, the other breaking a poor blokes leg. Then you've got Richards and Gabby. John Terry is our captain. The manager setting out to grind out victories (or just a draw if they're in the top half) with mind numbing football, and then snipping at any fan that dares criticise him. Two of our board members have been fined by the FA for comments on social media. We're by far the biggest club in the league, and have most expensively assembled squad, but haven't yet made it into the playoff spots in the 6 months* we've been down here.
I'll be there on Saturday because I love this club, but Christ we're difficult to like at the moment.
*Stat provided by Steve Bruce
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Bruce got his tactics wrong yesterday. We couldn't afford to play a right-sided midfielder at right back against a team with a dangerous front 3, just as we couldn't afford to only deploy a midfield 2 against their 3. I would rather we had played De Laet at right back, even if there was a risk that he wouldn't last the 90 and played Onomah instead of Kodjia.
One of Bruce's biggest failings must be that despite re-shaping the whole squad, he's only comfortable playing the same 11 each week. He should be able to make tactical changes and rotational changes to keep everyone fresh but doesn't look like he can. We were crap in the first match after the last international break and Bruce held his hands up and said he should have freshened things up yet did exactly the same thing again. Einstein's definition of insanity is to repeat the same actions and expect different results.
For the 2nd paragraph I suspect that's because his approach is to tinker about until something works and then flog it to death until it doesn't. His signings don't suggest a plan, his tactics don't suggest a plan, it's all down to if you throw enough quality on the pitch they'll work it out for themselves. I might be wrong but I just don't see how the signings he's made fit into any sort of master plan to turn us into something else, it was all about getting as many options as he could handle and then seeing what happens.
I think you've hit the nail on the head.
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Disappointed but not that surprised that we lost. I thought we might make a game of it and expected a point.
The team needs to provide a response against Fulham. We were comprehensively outclassed by Wolves from most of the reports and comments that I’ve read. Have to do better against Fulham. Beat them and a point at least against the filth, with two decent performances and I’ll be reasonably happy.
Four points from the next two matches should keep us on track.
The only reason I’m saying I’d be happy with a point against the dogshitters is that we’ve often failed to beat them even when there was a big gulf in class in our favour.
Should be looking at 6 points from the next 2, and 10 from the next 4, IMO. That's if we wanna go anywhere.
Hourihane's booking in the first half really annoyed me. It was a moment that seemed to epitomise everything that has frustrated me about the whole club over the last few years. The slightest hint of trouble and he resorted to the easiest, witless solution, to face the consequences immediately afterwards. No guile or energy to rectify the situation, just trip him up off the ball. Done. Oh, now I'm booked and we have to defend a free kick.
It also made me realise that I don't really like many of our players. It's was cynical and snide, much like Lansbury when he got sent off. Kodjia up front was sulky, too easy to go to ground and generally not interested. Then there's Lansbury's mysterious sense of self worth. Taylor was missing for his second straight red tackle since he joined us, the other breaking a poor blokes leg. Then you've got Richards and Gabby. John Terry is our captain. The manager setting out to grind out victories (or just a draw if they're in the top half) with mind numbing football, and then snipping at any fan that dares criticise him. Two of our board members have been fined by the FA for comments on social media. We're by far the biggest club in the league, and have most expensively assembled squad, but haven't yet made it into the playoff spots in the 6 months* we've been down here.
I'll be there on Saturday because I love this club, but Christ we're difficult to like at the moment.
*Stat provided by Steve Bruce
Can understand the bloke getting frustrated. One of the best passers of the ball we have, with good vision and an eye for goal. Forced to sit deep and watch as Glenn "The Slug" Whealan gets to play in the position that would suit Hourihane and AV down to the ground.
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Bruce got his tactics wrong yesterday. We couldn't afford to play a right-sided midfielder at right back against a team with a dangerous front 3, just as we couldn't afford to only deploy a midfield 2 against their 3. I would rather we had played De Laet at right back, even if there was a risk that he wouldn't last the 90 and played Onomah instead of Kodjia.
One of Bruce's biggest failings must be that despite re-shaping the whole squad, he's only comfortable playing the same 11 each week. He should be able to make tactical changes and rotational changes to keep everyone fresh but doesn't look like he can. We were crap in the first match after the last international break and Bruce held his hands up and said he should have freshened things up yet did exactly the same thing again. Einstein's definition of insanity is to repeat the same actions and expect different results.
For the 2nd paragraph I suspect that's because his approach is to tinker about until something works and then flog it to death until it doesn't. His signings don't suggest a plan, his tactics don't suggest a plan, it's all down to if you throw enough quality on the pitch they'll work it out for themselves. I might be wrong but I just don't see how the signings he's made fit into any sort of master plan to turn us into something else, it was all about getting as many options as he could handle and then seeing what happens.
I think you've hit the nail on the head.
Sums things up perfectly for me!
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Once again, Bruce made his changes too late.
You could see the improvement that Onomah and O'Hare brought for the last twenty minutes.
Why not bring them when it's apparent to all that we posed no threat to the home defence?