Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: ACVilla on January 02, 2016, 07:36:17 PM
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I'll start
Shat Given
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Nice typo, I think you meant an I not an A.
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Nice typo, I think you meant an I not an A.
Bad Guzan?
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Barry Baddun.
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Gordon Bennett
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Fartin Carruthers.
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Joking aside.... we've let a few gooduns slip through. Was it O'Neill that shipped out Gary Cahill to Bolton and brought in Zat Knight? :o
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Liam Ridgedoesntplayfootballthatwell but better than the current shower.
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Staid Garter
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Joking aside.... we've let a few gooduns slip through. Was it O'Neill that shipped out Gary Cahill to Bolton and brought in Zat Knight? :o
Yep. And Steve Davis in favour of Sidwell and Reo Coker.
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Peter Shittingham.
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Cashly Tongue
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On a serious level, James Collins
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All of the ones doing well at the moment.
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Given
Boaz Myhill
Collins
Cahill
ridgewell
Curtis Davis
Davis
Whiting ham
Crouch
Sure there are more but fuck me how low have we sunk to even consider the above at there respective ages/career levels (Cahill the exception although Chelshea have been shit this year/Southampton too)
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Given was finished, not good enough. As scary on crosses as Guzan
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Joking aside.... we've let a few gooduns slip through. Was it O'Neill that shipped out Gary Cahill to Bolton and brought in Zat Knight? :o
Oh dear McGrath...the bi-weekly mention of Cahill being replaced by Zat Knight...
Ironically I think Zat would walk into our side now if he was still in his 20's.
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Sure there are more but fuck me how low have we sunk to even consider the above at there respective ages/career levels (Cahill the exception although Chelshea have been shit this year/Southampton too)
Was my point really, we had ideas above our current station.
Maybe O'Leary had a point.
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Sure there are more but fuck me how low have we sunk to even consider the above at there respective ages/career levels (Cahill the exception although Chelshea have been shit this year/Southampton too)
Was my point really, we had ideas above our current station.
Maybe O'Leary had a point.
About what?
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Zat Shite.
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Steven Davis , routledge albrighton
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Sugar bags?
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Fickle.
I don't really mean it and I know it's not the true definition of the word but us as fans have had ideas/expectations above our station for years. Most thought that all of the above mentioned players were not good enough but im sure most would take them all in a heartbeat now.
For example I see people suggesting that Jonathon Walters would be a good buy. Do people still really think Villa are a better choice than Stoke?
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Having ideas above our station, if you won't pay the transfer fees and wages you can't expect to try and keep up with the big boys.
I know we tried when MON was here and he mis-spent on wages mainly, but you have to just keep going if you want to compete.
If the owner is not comfortable with how to invest his money on ten playing squad then get an experienced man in (SGT/Big Ron/Sir Brian) to help guide you on who is worth what.
We haven't competed for years in all truth, the owner and board seem to have been happy with chancing a relegation scrap and just spending enough to keep us out of the bottom 3 come May, and now is the time that has come to finally bite them/Randy in the arse.
No plan, no correct planning for the future (remember the alleged 5 year plan to get into the champions league??) and no real investment in the first team has now resulted in us bombing out of the league with a whimper.
Disgrace of a club from top to bottom
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Fickle.
I don't really mean it and I know it's not the true definition of the word but us as fans have had ideas/expectations above our station for years.
It's not even close to the definition of the word.
Whether he had a point or not (and in the context he used it at the time, he definitely didn't), it's completed irrelevant when talking about what you're talking about here.
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Fickle.
I don't really mean it and I know it's not the true definition of the word but us as fans have had ideas/expectations above our station for years.
It's not even close to the definition of the word.
Whether he had a point or not (and in the context he used it at the time, he definitely didn't), it's completed irrelevant when talking about what you're talking about here.
Maybe I shouldn't have used the O'Leary reference as a point but my main position still stands, we've derided players previously who would do a very good job for us in our current predicament.
The Jonathon Walters of this world are sadly just a pipe dream.
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Curtis Davies.
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I was thinking the other day that Whittingham might actually be a decent signing if we'd go down. Very experienced in the Championship and can at least take a decent set piece.
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Flabby Aintgonnascore.
Oops! I thought the thread title said "Players who you'd have FU**ed off.
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Given was finished, not good enough. As scary on crosses as Guzan
Given is not finished. He was one of our few players to emerge from our Cup Final appearance with any credit and would have been more competition for the goalkeepers position than anyone we currently have.
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Given was finished, not good enough. As scary on crosses as Guzan
Given is not finished. He was one of our few players to emerge from our Cup Final appearance with any credit and would have been more competition for the goalkeepers position than anyone we currently have.
I'd ask for a little more than "better competition than Mark Bunn" for my £3m per year if I were spending it.
If I were feeling greedy I might even ask for somebody who has set foot outside their six-yard box once or twice in their twenty year career.
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Given was finished, not good enough. As scary on crosses as Guzan
Given is not finished. He was one of our few players to emerge from our Cup Final appearance with any credit and would have been more competition for the goalkeepers position than anyone we currently have.
I'd ask for a little more than "better competition than Mark Bunn" for my £3m per year if I were spending it.
If I were feeling greedy I might even ask for somebody who has set foot outside their six-yard box once or twice in their twenty year career.
The thing is, you could probably get a really good player in on £3m per year but Lerner's plan was to get rid of Given and replace him with someone on a fraction of those wages, hence the squad full of shit we have right now.
The man is a genius!
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Given was finished, not good enough. As scary on crosses as Guzan
Given is not finished. He was one of our few players to emerge from our Cup Final appearance with any credit and would have been more competition for the goalkeepers position than anyone we currently have.
I'd ask for a little more than "better competition than Mark Bunn" for my £3m per year if I were spending it.
If I were feeling greedy I might even ask for somebody who has set foot outside their six-yard box once or twice in their twenty year career.
At a rough guess you'd make a fair case of around 30 keepers in this country alone that are better than Guzan, factor of in the foreign leagues then is probably closer to 100.
You'd think it would be straightforward for the club to find one that fits two criteria, first to be better than Guzan, and second be cheaper than Given.
No, fuck it, let's stick with the one that wasn't good enough before.
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I reckon the team we had in 2006 would easily beat any line-up of the past four seasons. Players like Laursen, Bouma, Mellberg, Steven Davis, Gareth Barry, Milan Baros, JPA. They achieved 42 points that year, more than we have had in five seasons.
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I agree that three million is alot for Given but its preferable to the situation we have. Who knows, if Given was putting Guzan under pressure then maybe we'd be a few points better off than we are. Admittedly there's a whole "if me nan had bollocks she'd be me grandad" about this but if we were just say five points better off then that £3m could seem cheap in the scheme of things.
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Given was finished, not good enough. As scary on crosses as Guzan
Given is not finished. He was one of our few players to emerge from our Cup Final appearance with any credit and would have been more competition for the goalkeepers position than anyone we currently have.
I'd ask for a little more than "better competition than Mark Bunn" for my £3m per year if I were spending it.
If I were feeling greedy I might even ask for somebody who has set foot outside their six-yard box once or twice in their twenty year career.
The thing is, you could probably get a really good player in on £3m per year but Lerner's plan was to get rid of Given and replace him with someone on a fraction of those wages, hence the squad full of shit we have right now.
Don't get me wrong, if we were spending Given's daft wages on goalkeepers who are better than Guzan and Bunn (and as Lee says, there are plenty of them), then that would be a much better situation than we're currently in. No doubt.
But not having a mediocre, elderly reserve goalkeeper as one of our highest paid players is on the whole a Good Thing rather than a Bad Thing.
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Given was finished, not good enough. As scary on crosses as Guzan
Given is not finished. He was one of our few players to emerge from our Cup Final appearance with any credit and would have been more competition for the goalkeepers position than anyone we currently have.
I'd ask for a little more than "better competition than Mark Bunn" for my £3m per year if I were spending it.
If I were feeling greedy I might even ask for somebody who has set foot outside their six-yard box once or twice in their twenty year career.
The thing is, you could probably get a really good player in on £3m per year but Lerner's plan was to get rid of Given and replace him with someone on a fraction of those wages, hence the squad full of shit we have right now.
Don't get me wrong, if we were spending Given's daft wages on goalkeepers who are better than Guzan and Bunn (and as Lee says, there are plenty of them), then that would be a much better situation than we're currently in. No doubt.
But not having a mediocre, elderly reserve goalkeeper as one of our highest paid players is on the whole a Good Thing rather than a Bad Thing.
But getting rid of the wasters (like Given) was to free up wages for better players who were at the top of their game. How did that work out then?
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Given was finished, not good enough. As scary on crosses as Guzan
Given is not finished. He was one of our few players to emerge from our Cup Final appearance with any credit and would have been more competition for the goalkeepers position than anyone we currently have.
I'd ask for a little more than "better competition than Mark Bunn" for my £3m per year if I were spending it.
If I were feeling greedy I might even ask for somebody who has set foot outside their six-yard box once or twice in their twenty year career.
The thing is, you could probably get a really good player in on £3m per year but Lerner's plan was to get rid of Given and replace him with someone on a fraction of those wages, hence the squad full of shit we have right now.
Don't get me wrong, if we were spending Given's daft wages on goalkeepers who are better than Guzan and Bunn (and as Lee says, there are plenty of them), then that would be a much better situation than we're currently in. No doubt.
But not having a mediocre, elderly reserve goalkeeper as one of our highest paid players is on the whole a Good Thing rather than a Bad Thing.
But getting rid of the wasters (like Given) was to free up wages for better players who were at the top of their game. How did that work out then?
Nowhere near as well as any of us would have liked. But I don't think I've suggested otherwise.
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Given was finished, not good enough. As scary on crosses as Guzan
Given is not finished. He was one of our few players to emerge from our Cup Final appearance with any credit and would have been more competition for the goalkeepers position than anyone we currently have.
I'd ask for a little more than "better competition than Mark Bunn" for my £3m per year if I were spending it.
If I were feeling greedy I might even ask for somebody who has set foot outside their six-yard box once or twice in their twenty year career.
The thing is, you could probably get a really good player in on £3m per year but Lerner's plan was to get rid of Given and replace him with someone on a fraction of those wages, hence the squad full of shit we have right now.
Don't get me wrong, if we were spending Given's daft wages on goalkeepers who are better than Guzan and Bunn (and as Lee says, there are plenty of them), then that would be a much better situation than we're currently in. No doubt.
But not having a mediocre, elderly reserve goalkeeper as one of our highest paid players is on the whole a Good Thing rather than a Bad Thing.
But getting rid of the wasters (like Given) was to free up wages for better players who were at the top of their game. How did that work out then?
Nowhere near as well as any of us would have liked. But I don't think I've suggested otherwise.
No because the replacements turned out to be rubbish on a fraction of those wages.
You pay peanuts you get monkeys, etc.
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I agree that three million is alot for Given but its preferable to the situation we have. Who knows, if Given was putting Guzan under pressure then maybe we'd be a few points better off than we are. Admittedly there's a whole "if me nan had bollocks she'd be me grandad" about this but if we were just say five points better off then that £3m could seem cheap in the scheme of things.
As SH says, maybe if we'd spent even half of the money we were wasting on Given's contract on a better goalkeeper than either of them, then Guzan could currently be putting that better keeper than him under pressure rather than one mediocre goalkeeper pushing another mediocre goalkeeper into being a bit better?
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I agree that three million is alot for Given but its preferable to the situation we have. Who knows, if Given was putting Guzan under pressure then maybe we'd be a few points better off than we are. Admittedly there's a whole "if me nan had bollocks she'd be me grandad" about this but if we were just say five points better off then that £3m could seem cheap in the scheme of things.
As SH says, maybe if we'd spent even half of the money we were wasting on Given's contract on a better goalkeeper than either of them, then Guzan could currently be putting that better keeper than him under pressure rather than one mediocre goalkeeper pushing another mediocre goalkeeper into being a bit better?
Weren't we supposed to have bid for the Stoke keeper who ended up at Chelsea? The bid failed yet there was no apparent fall back option. If we needed a keeper, why no fall back?
Another example of incompetence at the club?
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I dont think the fans have ideas above their station. Its just the club have ideas below theirs.
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I reckon the team we had in 2006 would easily beat any line-up of the past four seasons. Players like Laursen, Bouma, Mellberg, Steven Davis, Gareth Barry, Milan Baros, JPA. They achieved 42 points that year, more than we have had in five seasons.
You often hear it said that that team was nailed on to go down, yet the above lot were comfortably top 6/8 standard. I would include Sorenson in that too.
Difference then was we just had a numpty for a manager. Now it's wall to wall numpties.
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What we've give for Mellberg & Laursen now rather than the over excited Labrador that is Richards and the cumbersome Lescott.
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James Collins and and NRC were discarded but they'd easily improve this team. And they're average at their best.
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Marc Albrighton seems to be doing well at Leicester and Gary Cahill I wish we still had these players on the books.
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Ivo Stash
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Yacouba sylla and carlos cuellar are two of the worst footballers I have seen in my time at the villa in 35 years!! Yet I would put them straight into today's team!!! Jesus wept how bad things are!!
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Jordan Graham, Daniel Johnson and Harry Forrester.
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Jordan Graham, Daniel Johnson and Harry Forrester.
I agree. Give them a chance, either in the Villa first team or out on loan somewhere for a full season (like Gary Cahill did at Burnley), before selling them off cheap to clubs that can't believe their luck.
Also, Albrighton was our best player when we gave him to Leicester.
I don't miss any of the players we bought that we've since given away.
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Jordan Graham, Daniel Johnson and Harry Forrester.
I agree. Give them a chance, either in the Villa first team or out on loan somewhere for a full season (like Gary Cahill did at Burnley), before selling them off cheap to clubs that can't believe their luck.
Also, Albrighton was our best player when we gave him to Leicester.
I don't miss any of the players we bought that we've since given away.
Albrighton was the best player in a side that included Benteke and Delph - really? Harry Forrester has just gone on loan from Doncaster to Rangers. Daniel Johnson is in the bottom half of the Championship and Jordan Graham has been with Wolves for five minutes.
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Albrighton was the best player in a side that included Benteke and Delph - really?
Benteke was out long-term with his Achilles injury during the last days of Albrighton. Delph I'll give you...
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Daniel Johnson is in the bottom half of the Championship.
According to Wikipedia, Daniel Johnson has got 14 goals in 36 games (in a poor team).
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Daniel Johnson is in the bottom half of the Championship.
According to Wikipedia, Daniel Johnson has got 14 goals in 36 games (in a poor team).
Let's see where he ends up before self-immolating.
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Albrighton was the best player in a side that included Benteke and Delph - really?
Benteke was out long-term with his Achilles injury during the last days of Albrighton. Delph I'll give you...
Are you serious?
Best player in our side at the time he left?
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This thread makes about as much sense as a list of former lovers drafted by some poor chap suffering from Alzheimer's.
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Albrighton was the best player in a side that included Benteke and Delph - really?
Benteke was out long-term with his Achilles injury during the last days of Albrighton. Delph I'll give you...
Are you serious?
Best player in our side at the time he left?
Here is the team (and subs bench) from one of Albrighton's last games. (Other than Delph then), how many of these were playing better than him at the time..?
Aston Villa 0 Southampton 0 (19th April 2014)
01 Guzan
07 Bacuna
23 Bertrand
15 Westwood
04 Vlaar
02 Baker
08 El Ahmadi (Holt - 80' )
16 Delph
11 Agbonlahor
12 Albrighton
10 Weimann (Robinson - 85' )
Substitutes
06 Clark
13 Steer
18 Sylla
24 Tonev
29 Holt
34 Lowton
37 Robinson
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Well, from what I recall of that match, Vlaar played very well, and Bertrand was decent.
What I absolutely don't recall back then is anyone suggesting Albrighton was the best player in our side, certainly not for any period of time. I do recall him getting slated for a long while about poor decision making and his crosses being plentiful but wayward.
I honestly don't get it.
There are tens of things to legitimately complain about at the moment, so why the massive revisionism
"Albrighton was our best player when we gave him to Leicester".
How many of us would have agreed with that at the time?
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Daniel Johnson is in the bottom half of the Championship.
According to Wikipedia, Daniel Johnson has got 14 goals in 36 games (in a poor team).
Let's see where he ends up before self-immolating.
I'd still rather play him than Idrissa Gana.
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That Gana Gueye is a disappointment, isn't he? All those You Tube videos hailing his Lion spirit and he's anonymous.
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This thread makes about as much sense as a list of former lovers drafted by some poor chap suffering from Alzheimer's.
Nurse!
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I'd certainly take Albrighton back but I think his improvement came about because of his move. I don't think he would have developed the way he has if he'd stayed at Villa.
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That Gana Gueye is a disappointment, isn't he? All those You Tube videos hailing his Lion spirit and he's anonymous.
He's another one that came in, looked technically good and then had it coached out of him at the Villa.
What the fuck goes on on that training pitch?
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That Gana Gueye is a disappointment, isn't he? All those You Tube videos hailing his Lion spirit and he's anonymous.
He's another one that came in, looked technically good and then had it coached out of him at the Villa.
What the fuck goes on on that training pitch?
For years and years our throw ins have been absolutely abysmal. The latest pathetic effort from Bacuna on Saturday. I really do wonder what goes on in training.
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That Gana Gueye is a disappointment, isn't he? All those You Tube videos hailing his Lion spirit and he's anonymous.
He's another one that came in, looked technically good and then had it coached out of him at the Villa.
What the fuck goes on on that training pitch?
Probably never that good in the first place in reality.
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That Gana Gueye is a disappointment, isn't he? All those You Tube videos hailing his Lion spirit and he's anonymous.
He's another one that came in, looked technically good and then had it coached out of him at the Villa.
What the fuck goes on on that training pitch?
For years and years our throw ins have been absolutely abysmal. The latest pathetic effort from Bacuna on Saturday. I really do wonder what goes on in training.
I genuinly don't know how he managed it, he managed to hit the only player in red and white within throwable distance when it was easier not too, the mind boggles.
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Perhaps they do it on purpose? For a laugh, like?
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Don't say that even in jest Lee.
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Probably spot-fixing.
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Don't Lee, please. It makes me think of Bruce Grobbelar.
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Chap near where I sit shouts out "Stewards' enquiry!" after our more dismal throw-ins.
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That Gana Gueye is a disappointment, isn't he? All those You Tube videos hailing his Lion spirit and he's anonymous.
He's another one that came in, looked technically good and then had it coached out of him at the Villa.
What the fuck goes on on that training pitch?
For years and years our throw ins have been absolutely abysmal. The latest pathetic effort from Bacuna on Saturday. I really do wonder what goes on in training.
I genuinly don't know how he managed it, he managed to hit the only player in red and white within throwable distance when it was easier not too, the mind boggles.
It was just utterly atrocious. You' almost question if he has good eyesight. Since at least Lambert's first season throw ins awarded to us have made me nervous. The other team usually ends up with an advantage. Remember also the 'Cornalty' period when we almost always conceded from corners?
Johnny Giles used to always say that there is something very fundamentally wrong about a team that cannot get set-pieces right. Every team knows that it will be awarded a set piece and that their opponent will also. Therefore these are the one situation that a team can replicate and practice on the training ground to ensure they can at least offer a threat when they have one and can at least be organised and drilled for situations when the opposing team has one. For all his faults this was something MON understood and it won us points. These days I am sick to death of us screwing up these basic aspects of the game.
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That Gana Gueye is a disappointment, isn't he? All those You Tube videos hailing his Lion spirit and he's anonymous.
He's another one that came in, looked technically good and then had it coached out of him at the Villa.
What the fuck goes on on that training pitch?
For years and years our throw ins have been absolutely abysmal. The latest pathetic effort from Bacuna on Saturday. I really do wonder what goes on in training.
I genuinly don't know how he managed it, he managed to hit the only player in red and white within throwable distance when it was easier not too, the mind boggles.
It was just utterly atrocious. You' almost question if he has good eyesight. Since at least Lambert's first season throw ins awarded to us have made me nervous. The other team usually ends up with an advantage. Remember also the 'Cornalty' period when we almost always conceded from corners?
Johnny Giles used to always say that there is something very fundamentally wrong about a team that cannot get set-pieces right. Every team knows that it will be awarded a set piece and that their opponent will also. Therefore these are the one situation that a team can replicate and practice on the training ground to ensure they can at least offer a threat when they have one and can at least be organised and drilled for situations when the opposing team has one. For all his faults this was something MON understood and it won us points. These days I am sick to death of us screwing up these basic aspects of the game.
It's staggering!
The vast majority of our set pieces create no problems at all for the opposition; throw-ins usually end up with the opposition within two moves and we can't defend set pieces for fu*k - eg: Newcastle's goal and Sunderland's 3rd...basic marking and defending tactics.
And these fu*kers are professionals! It's what they are "expert" at! It's their job! And they are consistently shite at it!
Compare to Stoke and Everton a few seasons ago and - the Delap/Crouch thing and Cahill always caused chaos in the oppo defence and scored a ridiculous number of goals - usually against us! We just don't/can't do it.
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Only Veretout can take a proper inswinging corner. That we never try a routine other than crossing the ball has. Always baffled me.
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That Gana Gueye is a disappointment, isn't he? All those You Tube videos hailing his Lion spirit and he's anonymous.
He's another one that came in, looked technically good and then had it coached out of him at the Villa.
What the fuck goes on on that training pitch?
Probably never that good in the first place in reality.
Of course not. Maybe we should pay him a bit more to make sure that it's at least the going rate and everything will be hunky dory again.
Or maybe we didn't pay enough for him which proves he must be shit. Oh, hang on, that doesn't quite work in this case.
Maybe, just maybe we've brought in a decent player that's going through a tough patch. Christ it took slither boy the best part of 5 years to start looking like a professional footballer. But he was signed buy by the blessed saint Martin so there was never any question of him being shit was there?
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Plus the fact that El Vipero in the course of making good with us was always a red card waiting to happen. His five year gestation period with us never included a time when he was a rock of dependability.
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That Gana Gueye is a disappointment, isn't he? All those You Tube videos hailing his Lion spirit and he's anonymous.
He's another one that came in, looked technically good and then had it coached out of him at the Villa.
What the fuck goes on on that training pitch?
Probably never that good in the first place in reality.
Of course not. Maybe we should pay him a bit more to make sure that it's at least the going rate and everything will be hunky dory again.
Or maybe we didn't pay enough for him which proves he must be shit. Oh, hang on, that doesn't quite work in this case.
Maybe, just maybe we've brought in a decent player that's going through a tough patch. Christ it took slither boy the best part of 5 years to start looking like a professional footballer. But he was signed buy by the blessed saint Martin so there was never any question of him being shit was there?
Sometimes you have to give foreign players a while to settle. Midfielders seem to take a bit longer than others. He started well enough but like VID says, maybe he's going through a rough patch and lacking in confidence. It would hardly be a surprise the way the season has gone.
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which, given his reputation before joining, makes Ayew's contribution and all round commitment to the cause, all the more commendable.
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Gareth Barry
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Gary Cahill
Craig Gardner
Shaun Maloney
Peter Crouch
Peter Whittingham
Marc Albrighton
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Sign him up (http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/35273660)
(15 seconds into the BBC video)