Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: Legion on January 28, 2013, 12:22:22 PM
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Can we change the 'b' to an 's'? (http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/21230515)
Aston Villa manager Paul Lambert says he has received support from club owner Randy Lerner following Friday's FA Cup defeat by Championship club Millwall.
Villa, 17th in the Premier League, lost 2-1 against the Lions and were also recently knocked out of the Capital One Cup by League Two side Bradford City.
Lambert said he shared an encouraging phone call with Lerner and that his message was to "keep on fighting".
"We have an excellent relationship and talk all the time," said Lambert.
Villa are on a run of six Premier League games without a win, since their 3-1 victory against Liverpool in December.
Lambert's team, who face fellow strugglers Newcastle at Villa Park on Tuesday, are one point above the relegation zone and the Villa boss believes his side need six league wins from 15 games to stay in the top division.
After their League Cup semi-final defeat to Bradford, it was suggested that Lambert's job was safe even if his team drop into the Championship.
When asked if there was any chance he would quit, Lambert said: "No. I can only do, or try to do my best.
"There's no chance I'd walk away from it.
"You have to fight like anything to get up. You pick yourself up - there's no point in lying down and accepting it.
"I've never had a run like this as a manager or been hit from pillar to post like this. It's an experience you take on board and you use it.
"You can't have everything going your way in your managerial career every single time. You have to take the rough with the smooth and when the rough comes you take it."
Lerner, who has put more than £250m into the club in just over six years - including its purchase - is in regular contact with Lambert, 43, about possible transfers during the transfer window.
But Lerner has told the manager the amount of money available to buy players is limited.
"I have no complaints about having very little money to spend - I knew the remit when I took over," added Lambert.
"He [Lerner] hasn't washed his hands of this club but there will be no splashing out like Darren Bent two years ago [who joined Villa for £18m].
"How many players are we short? There's a few. But I knew the remit was to rebuild. To rebuild something you have to strip it right back.
"I'm pretty sure the chairman knows exactly what he is doing. It's his money and he's the man who has put x amount of money into the club over the years.
"We can only go with what we've got."
Stuck like a broken record.
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No surprise
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Its better when he does his new trick of ignoring the press.
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To rebuild something you have to strip it right back.
Is that a pre-requisite then - I suppose it is in the sense of an actual building.......
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Stuck like a broken record.
Yep, by Chumbawamba
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McLeish made similar noises before he was packed off. Not saying Lambert will be sacked, but you can't really read much into it can you? Until Lerner actually sacks him, he won't be telling Lambert anything other then he backs him etc.
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well i'm glad he's picking himself up, but not going again. I was worried he was going to lay down and go again. If he goes again and picks himself up I feel things could get back on the right track.
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Stuck like a broken record.
Yep, by Chumbawamba
Heheheheh.
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Like to see his backing should we get stuffed tomorrow night.Fans only have so much patience
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'Very little money to spend' Somebody go tell eastie.
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Roll on Thursday then we might know what the future holds.
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Can we change the 'b' to an 's'? (http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/21230515)
Aston Villa manager Paul Lambert says he has received support from club owner Randy Lerner following Friday's FA Cup defeat by Championship club Millwall.
Villa, 17th in the Premier League, lost 2-1 against the Lions and were also recently knocked out of the Capital One Cup by League Two side Bradford City.
Lambert said he shared an encouraging phone call with Lerner and that his message was to "keep on fighting".
"We have an excellent relationship and talk all the time," said Lambert.
Villa are on a run of six Premier League games without a win, since their 3-1 victory against Liverpool in December.
Lambert's team, who face fellow strugglers Newcastle at Villa Park on Tuesday, are one point above the relegation zone and the Villa boss believes his side need six league wins from 15 games to stay in the top division.
After their League Cup semi-final defeat to Bradford, it was suggested that Lambert's job was safe even if his team drop into the Championship.
When asked if there was any chance he would quit, Lambert said: "No. I can only do, or try to do my best.
"There's no chance I'd walk away from it.
"You have to fight like anything to get up. You pick yourself up - there's no point in lying down and accepting it.
"I've never had a run like this as a manager or been hit from pillar to post like this. It's an experience you take on board and you use it.
"You can't have everything going your way in your managerial career every single time. You have to take the rough with the smooth and when the rough comes you take it."
Lerner, who has put more than £250m into the club in just over six years - including its purchase - is in regular contact with Lambert, 43, about possible transfers during the transfer window.
But Lerner has told the manager the amount of money available to buy players is limited.
"I have no complaints about having very little money to spend - I knew the remit when I took over," added Lambert.
"He [Lerner] hasn't washed his hands of this club but there will be no splashing out like Darren Bent two years ago [who joined Villa for £18m].
"How many players are we short? There's a few. But I knew the remit was to rebuild. To rebuild something you have to strip it right back.
"I'm pretty sure the chairman knows exactly what he is doing. It's his money and he's the man who has put x amount of money into the club over the years.
"We can only go with what we've got."
Stuck like a broken record.
There is nothing wrong with any of his quotes there, none.
Frankly that people keep tearing his quotes apart as he repeats the thing about picking up etc is pathetic. try focussing on the issues at hand. I've put in bold what I see as the most important line in there. He's absolutely right, any time I've had problems in a team I've had to tear it apart, get rid of a lot of problem causers and those with attitude problems and had to rebuild with people that actually want it, who are hungry and want to go places. They may be raw at the beginning and you have to take a step back before you can leap forward.
I know people are hurting, justifiably, but please stop targeting the man who is trying to sort out years of short sighted and differing approaches that have won us nothing. It's hardly like the world has been rosy since we last won a trophy.
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Spot on Drummond.
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Can we change the 'b' to an 's'? (http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/21230515)
"I'm pretty sure the chairman knows exactly what he is doing. "
There is nothing wrong with any of his quotes there, none.
Oh I don't know...
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"I have no complaints about having very little money to spend" - apart from the £23 million in the summer, you mumbling incompetent? How many teams had as much as that to spend? It's nobody's fault but Lambert's that he bought entirely the wrong type of player with what was a decenttransfer pot. It's exactly the same as when his hero spunked £20m on Davies and Cuellar, only for them both to be shite, and then spending another £12m on Dunne and Collins. If you don't buy a single player with any Premier League experienc, don't be surprised when it all goes to pieces. Kids from the lower leagues were never going to be what we needed.
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Whilst I can see some of the points Drummond is making, You mumbling incompetent is still fekin funny.
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Let's look at it another way....
Were we going to win the league? No
Were we going to challenge for Champions League places? No
How about UEFA places? Highly unlikely
Mid table? Probably, if we spent a bit on some experienced players.
So, was it therefore worth spending a few million on short term options? I don't think so, not for an acceptance of mid-table mediocrity (which is what we've had for years and years)
Was it worth buying younger players and planning for the future? Risky, very risky. The manager believes we'll stay up. So far we're not in the relegation places, though we're mighty close and playing worse than anyone else. However, it's when you've played all the games, not some of them, that things are decided.
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Whilst I can see some of the points Drummond is making, You mumbling incompetent is still fekin funny.
Maybe that is the biggest problem? Many of the players have no clue what he says to them?
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Thing is Drummond it's too risky given the financial rewards of being in the Premier League next year. In any case we could have supplement those inexperienced players with a couple of experienced ones to carry us through. I would say at the moment, given our form that Lambert's risks are too great.
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Listening to 5 live on Saturday night and I actually caught myself nodding in agreement with Robbie Savage.
He was saying that the most inexcusable thing about Villa is the fact that the team seem to have learnt absolutely nothing from the experience this season . They just seem to repeat the same mistakes week after week.
Lambert's got to take the blame for sending players out who aren't prepared - mentally or physically - to do the job.
And anyone who seriously suggests that the team aren't playing well because the crowd aren't supporting them enough.....
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And anyone who seriously suggests that the team aren't playing well because the crowd aren't supporting them enough.....
Saw a fella who is a Walsall fan today. He was at the Bradford game and said it was the most exciting, fervent support he had ever witnessed. He admitted that the Saddlers may not be the most rabid of fans but he goes to several different grounds a year. He ended by saying the team don't deserve us.
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And anyone who seriously suggests that the team aren't playing well because the crowd aren't supporting them enough.....
Why is being at home generally seen as being an advantage? Mainly because of the support. If that support isn't positive and directed at the home team, it's bound to have an effect.
Culverhouse jumped off the bench on Tuesday and tried to get the crowd going when they got on Bennett's back after a poor pass. He had a point.
The fact we have emotionally vulnerable players isn't exactly ideal but it's where we're at. And before anyone says that Premier League players should be mentally stronger/better etc, remember that our current crop generally aren't so we've no option.
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Listening to 5 live on Saturday night and I actually caught myself nodding in agreement with Robbie Savage.
He was saying that the most inexcusable thing about Villa is the fact that the team seem to have learnt absolutely nothing from the experience this season . They just seem to repeat the same mistakes week after week.
Lambert's got to take the blame for sending players out who aren't prepared - mentally or physically - to do the job.
And anyone who seriously suggests that the team aren't playing well because the crowd aren't supporting them enough.....
I agree the failure to learn from mistakes is the most infuriating thing. I can accept mistakes if you learn and move on and don't repeat. I genuinely think our players need to get down the gym and do some weights, we look so physically weak next to other sides with the exception of Vlaar and Benteke.
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Culverhouse jumped off the bench on Tuesday and tried to get the crowd going when they got on Bennett's back after a poor pass. He had a point.
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If Culverhouse wants the crowd to lay off his payers, then it's his job to send players out who are ready to fight. Back to my original point that Lambert should drill the basics into the team. Blaming the fans - who spend thousands and get absolutely no return for it other than merciless piss-taking from colleagues and friends - is a red herring.
Nobody thanked the Villa fans for beating Liverpool a few weeks ago...
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Culverhouse jumped off the bench on Tuesday and tried to get the crowd going when they got on Bennett's back after a poor pass. He had a point.
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If Culverhouse wants the crowd to lay off his payers, then it's his job to send players out who are ready to fight. Back to my original point that Lambert should drill the basics into the team.
Nobody thanked the Villa fans for beating Liverpool a few weeks ago...
Ok, let's say I agree. Who do we play? There are no leaders on the pitch to help and the kids' confidence is shot. Who and how?
Lambert has praised the fans repeatedly this season, saying how brilliant they've been and how great the support has been for the players.
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Ok, let's say I agree. Who do we play? There are no leaders on the pitch to help and the kids' confidence is shot. Who and how?
I have no idea. But then again, I wouldn't have adopted the "young and hungry" strategy that Lambert has. Surely he's considered the fact that a team of kids will need someone to look to for guidance?
Surely?
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You'd have thought so. Lerner wanted young players, presumably to keep the wage bill down. Lambert has worked with inexperienced players before, the momentum he built with Norwich was very impressive.
Maybe he (mistakenly) thought that the likes of Dunne, N'Zogbia, Ireland, Bent and Gabby would be those leaders, not to mention our new captain.
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Again, I can see the points Mr D is making here. However, his biggest single failure in my opinion has been a refusal to acknowledge his mistakes - he seems an overtly stubborn man (where have we seen that trait before), and this has manifested itself in the continuing alienation of the senior players in the squad. I wouldn't be at all surprised to learn of a dressing room split between experienced players and the youngsters.
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The only thing I can see is that those very same players that have been 'alienated' are the ones we all said weren't fit to wear the shirt last year.
Sometimes in management you have to be stubborn, let's hope it doesn't lead to his downfall.
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The full statement from Randy Lerner is here: http://www.expressandstar.com/sport/aston-villa-fc/2013/01/28/villa-chief-randy-lerner-breaks-silence-over-paul-lambert/ … via @ExpressAndStar #AVFC
Courtesy of Tim Abraham!
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'During January Paul and the board have discussed a variety of players although nothing has yet materialised, which I know also can be frustrating as fresh players always give at least a sense of progress and optimism.'
That suggests to me we're very much still looking.
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Good, he's supporting the manager, there are potential signings out there. it's a vision for the future.
Fingers crossed!!
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I am going to take that as a positive and we will reinforce the team before the deadline passes. If not the statement is pointless.
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Dreaded vote of confidence
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That Statement has made me feel no different whatsoever. All he has shown is his wide use of vocabulary. Nothing has changed and we are still in the dark. Well thanks Randy... NOT
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I'd say the statement indicates several things. Most importantly it looks like we're still trying to get players in.
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That Statement has made me feel no different whatsoever. All he has shown is his wide use of vocabulary. Nothing has changed and we are still in the dark. Well thanks Randy... NOT
What exactly do you want to be told?
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I've been critical of Lerner, but he couldn't have been anymore clear there.
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Here is a translation of Lerner's PR drivel for you: "The club are well and truely in the shit because I naively allowed it to get there. Lambert does want to strengthen, but we have a sell-to-buy policy. If we don't offload the players we thought we were going to, then I may sanction a desperate late flurry of signings like I did in the summer. I'm not exactly confident in Lambert's ability, but I can't be arsed to pay him off and search for a replacement. So in the meantime I will over-exaggerate my belief in him."
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Ok then, we'll see what happens between now and Thursday. As someone mentioned, if he bothers come out with a statement like that, and we see no new bodies in before the deadline, then it was just a massive waste of time. I'm willing to give the benefit of the doubt at the moment. Please don't let us down, Mr Learner!
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Lerners statement for those who cant access the link-
The Villa Park chief gave a rare statement - his last official press conference was in May 2010 - as the pressure grew on Lambert ahead of tomorrow's Premier League clash with Newcastle.
The chairman said: “In the time that I’ve come to know Paul what is clear above all else is his strength of character and belief in his approach to football. Fortunes can shift quickly in this game and a sense that one has it right can become grave doubt in a matter of a few games.
"The Villa board knew that with Paul we would begin to address the club’s multi-year lack of competitive stability by reshaping the squad with seven new signings in the summer.
"It has been rewarding at times this season although certainly frustrating as well, particularly recently. During January Paul and the board have discussed a variety of players although nothing has yet materialised, which I know also can be frustrating as fresh players always give at least a sense of progress and optimism.
"Finally, and on a very personal note, I would reiterate that Paul has achieved success at many levels of professional football and I believe, given support, he will continue to do so for us.”
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If Lerner has actually said that then I'll be shocked, looks like its been written by a secretary, probably Nicola Keye
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I find it odd where people including me slaughter Lerner for lack of communication, but then when he does communicate slaughter him for it. He said all he could say there, and two things are clear he's sticking with this manager and they are trying to get players in before the window closes.
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That Statement has made me feel no different whatsoever. All he has shown is his wide use of vocabulary. Nothing has changed and we are still in the dark. Well thanks Randy... NOT
What exactly do you want to be told?
A bit more honesty, since MON left the fans have been confused to say the least about our financial position, are we in the shit? do we still have money? Why spunk 50Million 3 summers running if you know you couldn't afford to maintain the wage structure and similar amounts of budgets in the long run? Wheres your 1Billion pounds gone from the sale of the Cleveland Browns?
If we don't have sufficient funds to buy players that are going to improve the squad, then just what money is there? Lambert signed 3-4 players in the summer for around the 3 million mark - At the time he evidently thought these players were going to improve the squad - Does he now believe that you have to spend more than that to improve the squad? Or do we just not have £3million to spend on a player anymore?
That is what i want to know.
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I would reiterate that Paul has achieved success at many levels of professional football
That line is a bit odd !
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If Lerner has actually said that then I'll be shocked, looks like its been written by a secretary, probably Nicola Keye
And this sums up the ridiculousness of the situation; people clamour to hear something or for a statement, when it arrives it's not believed.
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what the fuck does this mean ?
"The Villa board knew that with Paul we would begin to address the club’s multi-year lack of competitive stability"
what the fuck is he actually trying to say, and why the fuck can't he say it in Englsh (or American) ?
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I find it odd where people including me slaughter Lerner for lack of communication, but then when he does communicate slaughter him for it. He said all he could say there, and two things are clear he's sticking with this manager and they are trying to get players in before the window closes.
Yep agreed. He's damn if he does and damned is he doesn't
You may not like what he says, but at least he's responded.
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I think writing an unsolicited press release on behalf of your gaffer is a good way to get unjobmatized. Therefore it's pretty safe to say that its legit and Lerner's words.
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I think writing an unsolicited press release on behalf of your gaffer is a good way to get unjobmatized. Therefore it's pretty safe to say that its legit and Lerner's words.
Yes siree!
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I feel somewhat optimistic after reading that.
Maybe something will happen.
At least we know Lerner is still involved in some way. Until this statement it wasn't overtly clear if he was.
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I would reiterate that Paul has achieved success at many levels of professional football
That line is a bit odd !
Not really. His playing and managerial career prior to Villa has been fantastic.
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Sounds like generic PR guff to me
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That Statement has made me feel no different whatsoever. All he has shown is his wide use of vocabulary. Nothing has changed and we are still in the dark. Well thanks Randy... NOT
What exactly do you want to be told?
A bit more honesty, since MON left the fans have been confused to say the least about our financial position, are we in the shit? do we still have money? Why spunk 50Million 3 summers running if you know you couldn't afford to maintain the wage structure and similar amounts of budgets in the long run? Wheres your 1Billion pounds gone from the sale of the Cleveland Browns?
If we don't have sufficient funds to buy players that are going to improve the squad, then just what money is there? Lambert signed 3-4 players in the summer for around the 3 million mark - At the time he evidently thought these players were going to improve the squad - Does he now believe that you have to spend more than that to improve the squad? Or do we just not have £3million to spend on a player anymore?
That is what i want to know.
You want to know exactly what the club's financial position is, its transfer budget and what the owner intends doing with his income. Good luck on that one, here and everywhere else.
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What's he said Drummond? Fuck all, we still aint had any re-assurances about anything just a hash that looks pretty much like everything lambert has been saying for weeks
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Sounds like generic PR guff to me
Lambert is staying and he has money - pretty clear cut .
You dont identify or try to sign several targets if you have no money - now lets hope he spends it on three decent players.
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The Villa Park chief gave a rare statement - his last official press conference was in May 2010 - as the pressure grew on Lambert ahead of tomorrow's Premier League clash with Newcastle.
The chairman said: “In the time that I’ve come to know Paul what is clear above all else is his strength of character and belief in his approach to football. Fortunes can shift quickly in this game and a sense that one has it right can become grave doubt in a matter of a few games.
"The Villa board knew that with Paul we would begin to address the club’s multi-year lack of competitive stability by reshaping the squad with seven new signings in the summer.
"It has been rewarding at times this season although certainly frustrating as well, particularly recently. During January Paul and the board have discussed a variety of players although nothing has yet materialised, which I know also can be frustrating as fresh players always give at least a sense of progress and optimism.
"Finally, and on a very personal note, I would reiterate that Paul has achieved success at many levels of professional football and I believe, given support, he will continue to do so for us.”
p.s. Don't forget to grab your Newcastle tickets
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what the fuck does this mean ?
"The Villa board knew that with Paul we would begin to address the club’s multi-year lack of competitive stability"
what the fuck is he actually trying to say, and why the fuck can't he say it in Englsh (or American) ?
It means exactly what it says... Even if "multi-year" is not an expression I've heard before.
I think the statement is not a bad sign, at least. The mere fact he felt it necessary to release it must mean he's not completely turned into Howard Hughes...yet.
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"Finally, and on a very personal note, I would reiterate that Paul has achieved success at many levels of professional football and I believe, given support, he will continue to do so for us.”
Does anybody else get that? He is either admitting that PL hasn't received adequete support. Or he has, and has already acheived success with us which will be 'continued'.
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I feel somewhat optimistic after reading that.
Maybe something will happen.
At least we know Lerner is still involved in some way. Until this statement it wasn't overtly clear if he was.
His involvement goes as far as his sunny balcony looking over a picturesque beach in America...
Everything else goes through fatboy Faulkner who 'didn't like football' until he landed the job at Villa, he was just a shrewd businessman who happened to know that Soccer is actually called Football and that was enough for Lerner, a bit like Alex Mcleish was enough for Lerner because he won the League cup on the back of The Arsenal goalkeeper dropping the ball in the back of the net to hand Small Heath their most famous victory. wanker
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The very fact that he's finally made a statement is a positive in itself. Our discontent has not fallen upon deaf ears. Over to you take action now Randy.
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What's he said Drummond? Fuck all, we still aint had any re-assurances about anything just a hash that looks pretty much like everything lambert has been saying for weeks
What reassurance do you want? Everything is rosy, we're going to be fine, we're sacking the manager, getting Mourinho in and signing Messi and Ronaldo?
Get real. He's said he supports the manager, the strategy is to back him, manage the money and try and sign players. And he's confirmed that in essence we've spunked a load of cash and won fuck all over the past few years. He ain't wrong.
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What's he said Drummond? Fuck all, we still aint had any re-assurances about anything just a hash that looks pretty much like everything lambert has been saying for weeks
Well he's answered one question, it's quite clear that we have been and are still looking to bring players in. He clearly wants us to sign players.
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Nothing wrong with that statement, and it does at least clarify that Randy is prepared to approve signings, it's just that for whatever reason the players haven't signed on the dotted line. That, and Lambert's acknowledgment earlier that we are short a few players, shows that they understand the problem.
Now the question is, can they sort it out?
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"I've never had a run like this as a manager or been hit from pillar to post like this. It's an experience you take on board and you use it.
"You can't have everything going your way in your managerial career every single time. You have to take the rough with the smooth and when the rough comes you take it."
I was only thinking this last night. Up until now, his managerial record has only been one of success. The problem being is now he doesn't know how to respond with "the rough". Like most of our squad, he doesn't have the experience and continues to make the same mistakes, week in, week out, trusting the same methods that brought him success rather than makes the necessary changes to deal with "the rough".
I do wonder how crap things have to get before he decides to change things.
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The very fact that he's finally made a statement is a positive in itself. Our discontent has not fallen upon deaf ears. Over to you take action now Randy.
I hope that he's made a statement because he knows of the unrest over here with the fans etc. Which might lead him to do anything.
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It's a statement which was very much needed. Now let's see what happens over the next few days.
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It's a statement which was very much needed. Now let's see what happens over the next few days.
I think that's the point. People wanted communication from the top, we have that now. People also want action with regards the transfer market, we'll see if that part comes in the next couple of days.
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What's he said Drummond? Fuck all, we still aint had any re-assurances about anything just a hash that looks pretty much like everything lambert has been saying for weeks
What reassurance do you want? Everything is rosy, we're going to be fine, we're sacking the manager, getting Mourinho in and signing Messi and Ronaldo?
Get real. He's said he supports the manager, the strategy is to back him, manage the money and try and sign players. And he's confirmed that in essence we've spunked a load of cash and won fuck all over the past few years. He ain't wrong.
I think something suggesting that he himself is at the club for the long term would help.
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"Finally, and on a very personal note, I would reiterate that Paul has achieved success at many levels of professional football and I believe, given support, he will continue to do so for us.”
Does anybody else get that? He is either admitting that PL hasn't received adequete support. Or he has, and has already acheived success with us which will be 'continued'.
Sounds like he is having a veiled dig at the supporters to me.
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He's made a statement and that is a very positive step forward. The first test comes with any last minute signings or not. The more I see what has unfolded and the noises coming out of the club, I am convinced they had set themselves up for being lower mid table this season with a commitment to push on next season with these players having a years experience. It has proved a much bigger gamble than first anticipated and he is probably panicking a little now.
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I'm OK with what both PL and RL have said here. Everything that they have tried this year at least made sense in that it looked like a plan. Results aren't anything but appalling and could spell the start of a longer term decline-but that didn't begin with Lambert or Lerner.
Long term I think PL will come good-we just need to lengthen our time scales.
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I'm sorry, it doesn't even come across as if it was written by someone who is supposed to be a fan. No passion or emotion in it. The final paragraph starts with 'On a personal note...' but what exactly was personal about it? It sounded as formal as the rest of the statement. It sounds no different to a statement that would be released by someone like McDonalds if they were found guilty of food poisoning. It is just a damage limitation exercise with Lerner knowing that a loss against Newcastle will mean the he will permenantly lose the vast majority of fans. This is just an attempt to nip some of this unrest in the bud. Well Mr Lerner, you may subdue some with this hollow statement, but you don't fool me!
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The above is a bit absurd if that isn't an oxymoron. I think he has been forced to issue this statement and we should praise ourselves partly for that because our voice has at least been heard to that extent.
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I'm sorry, it doesn't even come across as if it was written by someone who is supposed to be a fan. No passion or emotion in it. The final paragraph starts with 'On a personal note...' but what exactly was personal about it? It sounded as formal as the rest of the statement. It sounds no different to a statement that would be released by someone like McDonalds if they were found guilty of food poisoning. It is just a damage limitation exercise with Lerner knowing that a loss against Newcastle will mean the he will permenantly lose the vast majority of fans. This is just an attempt to nip some of this unrest in the bud. Well Mr Lerner, you may subdue some with this hollow statement, but you don't fool me!
What do you want - an ending of SOTC? Of course it's formal; it's a professional business statement. It's not a Facebook status.
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"I've never had a run like this as a manager or been hit from pillar to post like this. It's an experience you take on board and you use it.
"You can't have everything going your way in your managerial career every single time. You have to take the rough with the smooth and when the rough comes you take it."
I was only thinking this last night. Up until now, his managerial record has only been one of success. The problem being is now he doesn't know how to respond with "the rough". Like most of our squad, he doesn't have the experience and continues to make the same mistakes, week in, week out, trusting the same methods that brought him success rather than makes the necessary changes to deal with "the rough".
I do wonder how crap things have to get before he decides to change things.
I don't want to appear petty, but Norwich apart, I wouldn't really call his managerial career a success. I agree with the other points in the post though.
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What's he said Drummond? Fuck all, we still aint had any re-assurances about anything just a hash that looks pretty much like everything lambert has been saying for weeks
What reassurance do you want? Everything is rosy, we're going to be fine, we're sacking the manager, getting Mourinho in and signing Messi and Ronaldo?
Get real. He's said he supports the manager, the strategy is to back him, manage the money and try and sign players. And he's confirmed that in essence we've spunked a load of cash and won fuck all over the past few years. He ain't wrong.
I think something suggesting that he himself is at the club for the long term would help.
Whatever he says will be wrong, or disbelieved.
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I knew this would happen. I even said it on the transfer thread last week.
Constant whinging asking for the chairman to speak and tell he's still interested and wants us to improve. He speaks and tells us there's money available and they want to back the manager and still most people are moaning that he's not told us anything. I don't get it, far too many grown men with their knickers in a twist over this.
He's said, effectively, he backs the manager to turn it around and that he will support him, with signings, to do just that. There's no need to read more into or bitch that it's lies, etc. Wait until Thursday if nothing has happened then we can dissect the statement and point fingers at Lerner for lying or Lambert for not spending but today we've had a clear message that money is there and they want players to come in.
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Indeed I think the statement is fine and he couldn't have said much more, it's the action that follows it now that's important.
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Indeed I think the statement is fine and he couldn't have said much more, it's the action that follows it now that's important.
Totally agree with you.
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A similar statement was released this time last year, if i remember rightly it was a letter backing McLeish and stating a similar vision...
He was then sacked at the end of the season - and people wonder why we don't believe what Lerner is saying?
hmm...
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I knew this would happen. I even said it on the transfer thread last week.
Constant whinging asking for the chairman to speak and tell he's still interested and wants us to improve. He speaks and tells us there's money available and they want to back the manager and still most people are moaning that he's not told us anything. I don't get it, far too many grown men with their knickers in a twist over this.
He's said, effectively, he backs the manager to turn it around and that he will support him, with signings, to do just that. There's no need to read more into or bitch that it's lies, etc. Wait until Thursday if nothing has happened then we can dissect the statement and point fingers at Lerner for lying or Lambert for not spending but today we've had a clear message that money is there and they want players to come in.
Spot on paul.
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A similar statement was released this time last year, if i remember rightly it was a letter backing McLeish and stating a similar vision...
He was then sacked at the end of the season - and people wonder why we don't believe what Lerner is saying?
hmm...
So would you rather he said nothing?
Or that he said we have £Xm and £Xk for wages and we're talking to these players? Oh and we bid for a, b and c but they got offered more money elsewhere?
Which of those would you be happier with?
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A similar statement was released this time last year, if i remember rightly it was a letter backing McLeish and stating a similar vision...
He was then sacked at the end of the season - and people wonder why we don't believe what Lerner is saying?
hmm...
'We' don't seem to be agreeing with you on this one.
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A similar statement was released this time last year, if i remember rightly it was a letter backing McLeish and stating a similar vision..
He was then sacked at the end of the season - and people wonder why we don't believe what Lerner is saying?
hmm...
Didn't the article mention this was the first public communication from RL since 2010? If this is true then he must not have said the same last season.
I will have a dig around when i get time to see.
May be an interesting end to the week; transfer day on Thur and hearing the new Depeche Mode single on Friday
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The statement hopefully unites us a bit and gives us a lift - lets get behind the players tomorrow and hope for a change of luck.
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Last year's statement from Lerner and Faulkner
http://www.birminghampost.net/midlands-birmingham-sport/west-midlands-sports/aston-villa-fc/2012/04/25/aston-villa-randy-lerner-and-paul-faulkner-issue-club-statement-97319-30841181/
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Fair enough we are all entitled to our own opinion, and opinions will very much be varied when the club is in this position...
However this statement has left me more confused than i was before. Lambert clearly stated at lunchtime that there is no money to spend on players...
So where's this money come from in the last 3 hours? ermm
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Fair enough we are all entitled to our own opinion, and opinions will very much be varied when the club is in this position...
However this statement has left me more confused than i was before. Lambert clearly stated at lunchtime that there is no money to spend on players...
So where's this money come from in the last 3 hours? ermm
No he didn't, the press and some fans may have read it that way but in no way did he say, 'we have no money'.
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Fair enough we are all entitled to our own opinion, and opinions will very much be varied when the club is in this position...
However this statement has left me more confused than i was before. Lambert clearly stated at lunchtime that there is no money to spend on players...
So where's this money come from in the last 3 hours? ermm
The money was always there , hes said theyve been in for players already , lambert is being cagey and people are hanging on his every word.
All will become clear on thursday .
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Fair enough we are all entitled to our own opinion, and opinions will very much be varied when the club is in this position...
However this statement has left me more confused than i was before. Lambert clearly stated at lunchtime that there is no money to spend on players...
So where's this money come from in the last 3 hours? ermm
The money was always there , hes said theyve been in for players already , lambert is being cagey and people are hanging on his every word.
All will become clear on thursday .
I think it has got to do with the'merry go round' of players in a chain.
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I'm sorry, it doesn't even come across as if it was written by someone who is supposed to be a fan. No passion or emotion in it. The final paragraph starts with 'On a personal note...' but what exactly was personal about it? It sounded as formal as the rest of the statement. It sounds no different to a statement that would be released by someone like McDonalds if they were found guilty of food poisoning. It is just a damage limitation exercise with Lerner knowing that a loss against Newcastle will mean the he will permenantly lose the vast majority of fans. This is just an attempt to nip some of this unrest in the bud. Well Mr Lerner, you may subdue some with this hollow statement, but you don't fool me!
What do you want - an ending of SOTC? Of course it's formal; it's a professional business statement. It's not a Facebook status.
Like
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Why isn't this "statement" on the official site? Where has it come from? Just trying to catch up
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A similar statement was released this time last year, if i remember rightly it was a letter backing McLeish and stating a similar vision..
He was then sacked at the end of the season - and people wonder why we don't believe what Lerner is saying?
hmm...
Didn't the article mention this was the first public communication from RL since 2010? If this is true then he must not have said the same last season.
I will have a dig around when i get time to see.
May be an interesting end to the week; transfer day on Thur and hearing the new Depeche Mode single on Friday
You just can't get enough, can you?
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Fair enough we are all entitled to our own opinion, and opinions will very much be varied when the club is in this position...
However this statement has left me more confused than i was before. Lambert clearly stated at lunchtime that there is no money to spend on players...
So where's this money come from in the last 3 hours? ermm
The money was always there , hes said theyve been in for players already , lambert is being cagey and people are hanging on his every word.
All will become clear on thursday .
It doesn't seem that way to me. He's basically said that we've not got a substantial amount and we're looking for cheap options who will improve what we currently have. Trying to do this in the january transfer window and for inflated prices has led to us currently signing no one and this would all point to what we've already been told- that it's "unlikely" that any new signings will arrive. I suppose it comes down to how much faith you put in your ITK info.
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Fair enough we are all entitled to our own opinion, and opinions will very much be varied when the club is in this position...
However this statement has left me more confused than i was before. Lambert clearly stated at lunchtime that there is no money to spend on players...
So where's this money come from in the last 3 hours? ermm
No he didn't, the press and some fans may have read it that way but in no way did he say, 'we have no money'.
I hope i'm wrong i really do, but you could also say that the fans have read the Lerner statement in a way that makes them believe that sufficient funds available, when the players we've looked at may not have been worth much at all...
IMO the most effective bits of business we can do now are loan deals for experienced Premier league players i.e Heitinga
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A similar statement was released this time last year, if i remember rightly it was a letter backing McLeish and stating a similar vision..
He was then sacked at the end of the season - and people wonder why we don't believe what Lerner is saying?
hmm...
Didn't the article mention this was the first public communication from RL since 2010? If this is true then he must not have said the same last season.
I will have a dig around when i get time to see.
May be an interesting end to the week; transfer day on Thur and hearing the new Depeche Mode single on Friday
You just can't get enough, can you?
I prefer it when Lerner says nothing, i enjoy the silence.
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A similar statement was released this time last year, if i remember rightly it was a letter backing McLeish and stating a similar vision..
He was then sacked at the end of the season - and people wonder why we don't believe what Lerner is saying?
hmm...
Didn't the article mention this was the first public communication from RL since 2010? If this is true then he must not have said the same last season.
I will have a dig around when i get time to see.
May be an interesting end to the week; transfer day on Thur and hearing the new Depeche Mode single on Friday
You just can't get enough, can you?
He must be the only one enjoying the silence coming out of VP
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I prefer it when Lerner says nothing, i enjoy the silence
We are desperate for some signings though, to breathe New Life into the side
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Some hilarious reactions to this but... people are people.
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Sounds like the dreaded vote of confidence to me. I can see him being sacked if we lose to Newcastle
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I don't want to start any blasphemous rumours, but I think that Lerner has a sick sense of humour, and when we go down I expect to find him laughing.
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Sounds like the dreaded vote of confidence to me. I can see him being sacked if we lose to Newcastle
is that an album track?
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I'm sorry, it doesn't even come across as if it was written by someone who is supposed to be a fan. No passion or emotion in it. The final paragraph starts with 'On a personal note...' but what exactly was personal about it? It sounded as formal as the rest of the statement. It sounds no different to a statement that would be released by someone like McDonalds if they were found guilty of food poisoning. It is just a damage limitation exercise with Lerner knowing that a loss against Newcastle will mean the he will permenantly lose the vast majority of fans. This is just an attempt to nip some of this unrest in the bud. Well Mr Lerner, you may subdue some with this hollow statement, but you don't fool me!
What do you want - an ending of SOTC? Of course it's formal; it's a professional business statement. It's not a Facebook status.
Like
I think the use of "professional business" in conjunction with something from Randy Lerner was a bit of a surprise.
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Were that a b-side by the Basildon bankers?
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I don't want to start any blasphemous rumours, but I think that Lerner has a sick sense of humour, and when we go down I expect to find him laughing.
While stroking his pussy?
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Cat, obviously.
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So he is gonna back him but not if it costs anything....
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I would reiterate that Paul has achieved success at many levels of professional football
That line is a bit odd !
yes i thought so as well
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Why is that odd?! He was successful in Scotland, In Germany, in the Champions League, in various leagues in England.
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I'm sorry, it doesn't even come across as if it was written by someone who is supposed to be a fan. No passion or emotion in it. The final paragraph starts with 'On a personal note...' but what exactly was personal about it? It sounded as formal as the rest of the statement. It sounds no different to a statement that would be released by someone like McDonalds if they were found guilty of food poisoning. It is just a damage limitation exercise with Lerner knowing that a loss against Newcastle will mean the he will permenantly lose the vast majority of fans. This is just an attempt to nip some of this unrest in the bud. Well Mr Lerner, you may subdue some with this hollow statement, but you don't fool me!
What do you want - an ending of SOTC? Of course it's formal; it's a professional business statement. It's not a Facebook status.
It wouldn't have done any harm :) In all seriousness though, after waiting so long to even hear from the owner of the club, I expected more then the usual vote of confidence guff. Firsty, I expected an admission of just how bad the current situation is. Then I expected a clear plan outlined as to how we can turn it around. What did we learn from the statement? We are keeping the same clueless manager who has presided over the worst 5 weeks in a generation (if not in our entire history!) and he may be backed with a couple of deadline day signings which will be too little, too late. Lerner is just playing Russian Roulette with our top-flight status and that is quite simply unacceptable. A little honesty wouldn't go amiss either. 'Players have been discussed but nothing has materialised.' Do they expect us to swallow that whole? Lambert may be useless but he knows his way around the market. I don't believe for a second he wouldn't have been able to pull at least one deal off by now if he had money. I think we have gone back to the sell-to-buy policy (remember Vlaar being messed around until we had sold Collins?) and they expected Bent to have gone by now. Some people seem to be suggesting that we should be grateful that he has released this statement. But our gripe is he doesn't communicate enough. This one-off statement doesn't change that.
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Good, but he has to back him in the "hand in pocket, fetching wallet" style, too.
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what the fuck does this mean ?
"The Villa board knew that with Paul we would begin to address the club’s multi-year lack of competitive stability"
what the fuck is he actually trying to say, and why the fuck can't he say it in Englsh (or American) ?
I take it to mean that unlike previous years, we have to spend within our means and not have to rely on him to continually pump in millions of his own money in. Fair enough I suppose, especially as there are a number of clubs currently above us in the table who seem to be doing that (including one just down the road as much as it pains me to say).
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I think he's just saying what everyone else has for a while. We've spent a shedload of cash to get precisely nowhere. We're probably at the bottom of a value for money table.
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I think he's just saying what everyone else has for a while. We've spent a shedload of cash to get precisely nowhere. We're probably at the bottom of a value for money table.
Especially this season. £23m to be much worse than McLeish, jesus h christ.
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I would reiterate that Paul has achieved success at many levels of professional football
That line is a bit odd !
yes i thought so as well
You are both far more clever than me, if you read something else into what is a factual statement about Lambert's career.
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I'm sorry, it doesn't even come across as if it was written by someone who is supposed to be a fan. No passion or emotion in it. The final paragraph starts with 'On a personal note...' but what exactly was personal about it? It sounded as formal as the rest of the statement. It sounds no different to a statement that would be released by someone like McDonalds if they were found guilty of food poisoning. It is just a damage limitation exercise with Lerner knowing that a loss against Newcastle will mean the he will permenantly lose the vast majority of fans. This is just an attempt to nip some of this unrest in the bud. Well Mr Lerner, you may subdue some with this hollow statement, but you don't fool me!
What do you want - an ending of SOTC? Of course it's formal; it's a professional business statement. It's not a Facebook status.
It wouldn't have done any harm :) In all seriousness though, after waiting so long to even hear from the owner of the club, I expected more then the usual vote of confidence guff. Firsty, I expected an admission of just how bad the current situation is. Then I expected a clear plan outlined as to how we can turn it around. What did we learn from the statement? We are keeping the same clueless manager who has presided over the worst 5 weeks in a generation (if not in our entire history!) and he may be backed with a couple of deadline day signings which will be too little, too late. Lerner is just playing Russian Roulette with our top-flight status and that is quite simply unacceptable. A little honesty wouldn't go amiss either. 'Players have been discussed but nothing has materialised.' Do they expect us to swallow that whole? Lambert may be useless but he knows his way around the market. I don't believe for a second he wouldn't have been able to pull at least one deal off by now if he had money. I think we have gone back to the sell-to-buy policy (remember Vlaar being messed around until we had sold Collins?) and they expected Bent to have gone by now. Some people seem to be suggesting that we should be grateful that he has released this statement. But our gripe is he doesn't communicate enough. This one-off statement doesn't change that.
You wanted them to say things are as bad as you think they are, then sack the manager and sign new players? Then because this didn't happen they're telling fibs. Still, as you said earlier and while we're quoting eighties musical icons, there ain't no fooling you.
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What's notable there is Lambert saying 'the squad is good enough to stay up' and 'we need a few more players in'. There are two things this could mean, as far as I can see:
1) that he wants to keep up the morale of the players we have in case we don't sign anyone, while trying to get a message to Lerner that we actually do need bodies in;
or 2) that we have enough to stay up, but in order to achieve our higher ambitions we need to add more players.
I hope he means the former, and I hope Lerner heeds the message (which presumably he'd be telling him in person as well), because there's no way anyone can be certain that this squad is definitely good enough to stay up.
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I really don't think, from the way both have talked about each other, that he needs to be sending veiled messages through quotes to the press.
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I really don't think, from the way both have talked about each other, that he needs to be sending veiled messages through quotes to the press.
I agree. I just hope he is, because the alternative shows a worrying and bewildering blindness.
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I think he's just saying what everyone else has for a while. We've spent a shedload of cash to get precisely nowhere. We're probably at the bottom of a value for money table.
Especially this season. £23m to be much worse than McLeish, jesus h christ.
At this point, yes. However, McLeish had started to drop like a stone right about now.....
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I'm sorry, it doesn't even come across as if it was written by someone who is supposed to be a fan. No passion or emotion in it. The final paragraph starts with 'On a personal note...' but what exactly was personal about it? It sounded as formal as the rest of the statement. It sounds no different to a statement that would be released by someone like McDonalds if they were found guilty of food poisoning. It is just a damage limitation exercise with Lerner knowing that a loss against Newcastle will mean the he will permenantly lose the vast majority of fans. This is just an attempt to nip some of this unrest in the bud. Well Mr Lerner, you may subdue some with this hollow statement, but you don't fool me!
What do you want - an ending of SOTC? Of course it's formal; it's a professional business statement. It's not a Facebook status.
To be fair, the end of SOTC was really really depressing.
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I stopped believing when I got to this bit:
""It has been rewarding at times this season although certainly frustrating as well, particularly recently"
Rewarding? when exactly?
Frustrating? Losing 8 -0, losing at home to Southampton and Wigan, then being dumped out of two cups by lower league opposition - thats just frustrating? Lerner and his muppet or puppet are spouting so much bollocks its untrue.
Lambert is another failure in the long list of failures our owner has presided over.
I really fail to see how buying a clutch of players "who are not yet ready for the Premier League" and playing them to the detriment of their progression is helping the club or the players concerned.
A few on here are being taken in by the rhetoric of "buying young hungry players for the future" rubbish - unless we loan or buy experienced Premiership players over the next few days there will be no Bright Future - the ship will have sailed Mr Lerner.
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It wouldn't have done any harm :) In all seriousness though, after waiting so long to even hear from the owner of the club, I expected more then the usual vote of confidence guff. Firsty, I expected an admission of just how bad the current situation is. Then I expected a clear plan outlined as to how we can turn it around. What did we learn from the statement? We are keeping the same clueless manager who has presided over the worst 5 weeks in a generation (if not in our entire history!) and he may be backed with a couple of deadline day signings which will be too little, too late. Lerner is just playing Russian Roulette with our top-flight status and that is quite simply unacceptable. A little honesty wouldn't go amiss either. 'Players have been discussed but nothing has materialised.' Do they expect us to swallow that whole? Lambert may be useless but he knows his way around the market. I don't believe for a second he wouldn't have been able to pull at least one deal off by now if he had money. I think we have gone back to the sell-to-buy policy (remember Vlaar being messed around until we had sold Collins?) and they expected Bent to have gone by now. Some people seem to be suggesting that we should be grateful that he has released this statement. But our gripe is he doesn't communicate enough. This one-off statement doesn't change that.
You wanted them to say things are as bad as you think they are, then sack the manager and sign new players? Then because this didn't happen they're telling fibs. Still, as you said earlier and while we're quoting eighties musical icons, there ain't no fooling you.
As bad as I think they are?! I don't think you will find anybody who would claim our predicament is anything other then dire. As for the manager, he should have been backed or sacked. If Lerner believes in him so strongly, he should have given him the funding needed at the beginning of the window. Instead, Lambert has been left in limbo really. And yes they are lying. When Lambert says in an interview a while ago that he will strengthen in January and now he says he doesn't think there will be any signings, then clearly he doesn't have any funding. When we are into the last few days of the window and we haven't so much as bid for anyone, then again it is clear there is no funding. As you rightly point out- there is no fooling me.
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Beating Liverpool 1-3, Man City 2-4, Norwich........ They were all rewarding, unless your wants are becoming too high.
Reaching a Cup Semi, that was rewarding (until we got there).
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This is the league in 2010/11 compared with this season.
We've less points, less wins and worse GD, but, when you compare, we're further from the foot this season, it's similarly as close, yet the doom and gloom that consumes many didn't happen then. Why would that be, relatively we're probably better off, perhaps that's why he's getting support from the owner.
POS LP CLUB P W D L GF GA GD PTS
15 (15) West Bromwich Albion 23 7 4 12 29 43 -14 25
16 (16) Aston Villa 23 6 7 10 25 39 -14 25
17 (17) Birmingham City 22 4 11 7 21 31 -10 23
18 (18) Wigan Athletic 23 4 10 9 19 37 -18 22
19 (19) Wolves 23 6 3 14 24 41 -17 21
20 (20) West Ham United 24 4 9 11 24 43 -19 21
15 (15) Southampton 23 5 8 10 30 40 -10 23
16 (16) Newcastle United 23 5 6 12 28 41 -13 21
17 (17) Aston Villa 23 4 8 11 19 44 -25 20
18 (18) Reading 23 4 7 12 28 43 -15 19
19 (19) Wigan Athletic 23 5 4 14 25 43 -18 19
20 (20) Queens Park Rangers 23 2 9 12 18 37 -19 15
POS LP CLUB P W D L GF GA GD PTS
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I appreciate Lerners comments. They answer a lot of my questions and seem crystal clear to me. I still think we are going down but his comments do reassure me about his commitment to the club and lambert.
Lets hope it pays off.
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Beating Liverpool 1-3, Man City (Reserves) 2-4, Norwich........ They were all rewarding, unless your wants are becoming too high.
Reaching a Cup Semi, that was rewarding (until we got there).
Fixed.
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But in 10/11 it was clearly a mad false position whereas this time we thoroughly deserve it. 10/11 for us was like Newcastle this season - nobody seriously expects Cabaye, Sissoko etc to go down, just like Young, Downing et al weren't going down - whereas we look absolutely terrible this time around, and the clubs below us look like they're hitting form just as we're dropping like a stone.
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I appreciate Lerners comments. They answer a lot of my questions and seem crystal clear to me. I still think we are going down but his comments do reassure me about his commitment to the club and lambert.
Lets hope it pays off.
No owner who is willing to let Aston Villa get relegated has my confidence.
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Nurseys interesting take -
Villa owner Randy Lerner continues to stand by Paul Lambert but fans are starting to rapidly lose faith in their boss.
Lambert’s reign is certainly not going according to plan following Tuesday night’s embarrassing Capital One Cup semi-final exit to League Two Bradford.
It was humiliating, depressing and worrying for the future of Villa.
I personally remain a Lambert admirer.
I saw how he turned around my boyhood club Norwich City from a mess in League One.
You certainly don’t become a bad manager in the space of six months.
He was successful for three successive seasons as he enjoyed back-to-back promotions and then kept the Canaries in the top-flight.
Lambert and his side acquitted themselves very well at every fresh challenge and Villa looked to have snapped up one of the brightest managerial talents around last summer.
But the supporters who acclaimed Lambert’s appointment have a rather different view now.
And I must admit the characteristics that made Norwich so successful under Lambert are hard to spot right now at Villa.
At Norwich, Lambert’s side won promotion to the Premier League with an incredible number of dramatic late goals.
But this Villa side seem more likely to concede a late goal than score.
Lambert’s Canaries had indefatigable energy and a will to win which kept them going until the final whistle.
But against both West Brom and Bradford, in crunch games, Villa have badly lost their way in the second half.
At Carrow Road, when Lambert’s side’s were losing, he would often show his gamblers’ streak by making a double or even triple substitution.
But his same methods just don’t seem to be working at Villa.
His subs against Bradford – throwing Darren Bent and Andreas Weimann up front alongside Gabriel Agbonlahor and Cristian Benteke – arguably backfired.
Bradford manager Phil Parkinson readily admitted post-match it just created more space for them to exploit.
Norwich players I spoke to under Lambert paid tribute to his motivational skills.
And just last weekend Grant Holt tweeted he was confident Villa would survive under Lambert.
But most - and this applied under Gerard Houllier and Alex McLeish previously too - of Villa's players are under-achieving and struggling for consistency.
I certainly don’t remember Norwich conceding numerous goals from set-pieces under Lambert like this Villa side.
What the Canaries had under Lambert were determined, decent characters in the dressing room like Holt, John Ruddy and Russell Martin.
They were grounded, likeable individuals who had worked their way up the leagues the hard way, were determined to make the most of every opportunity and were fighters when the going got tough.
And that’s my biggest concern now as Villa face a tense relegation run-in.
I do not doubt Lambert’s own bottle or qualities, but that of the players.
Playing well for 45 minutes like against West Brom or Bradford is not enough.
They seem to do well when the team is playing confidently at the start of games, but when they need to dig out a result some are more than likely to go missing.
It is very worrying ahead of next Tuesday’s vital Premier League home game with Newcastle.
Just staying up is now the only thing that matters for Villa.
They have avoided the drop the last two seasons but perhaps it will be third time unlucky?
Villa certainly seem to be a massive container-ship of mediocrity heading towards the rocks.
The club have been drifting for two seasons now trying to stay afloat in choppy waters amid a new financial policy.
But at what cost? For a relegation shipwreck may leave Villa marooned in the Championship.
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This is the league in 2010/11 compared with this season.
We've less points, less wins and worse GD, but, when you compare, we're further from the foot this season, it's similarly as close, yet the doom and gloom that consumes many didn't happen then. Why would that be, relatively we're probably better off, perhaps that's why he's getting support from the owner.
I find it bizarre that you consider us to be relatively better off, just because we're a point further away from rock bottom. The number of points we are from 20th is irrelevant, the number of points and relative position to 18th is the only thing that matters. In this respect, and every other point you care to name, we're worse off.
In addition to the general doom and gloom due to how poor we look this season, I think it's inevitable that people become more resigned to relegation when it's not just a single poor season.
We briefly flirted with the foot of the table in Houllier's season, but turned things around towards the end of the season. Last year was worse, and now this season we're even closer to the drop. Of course people are going to be more negative.
Another point is that even last season, when things looked their worst, I think most people thought that we had a pretty decent team, being dragged down by a very poor, negative manager. This season, we can't even cling on to that, it just seems our squad is very shit.
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Lerner a fucking fool and makes Doug look like Steve Jobs
We stuck in a lay bye , with a broken metro and no fucking money to repair it
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Lerner a fucking fool and makes Doug look like Steve Jobs
Erm..Steve Jobs is dead.
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Lerner a fucking fool and makes Doug look like Steve Jobs
Erm..Steve Jobs is dead.
When he was a live!
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Lerner a fucking fool and makes Doug look like Steve Jobs
Erm..Steve Jobs is dead.
When he was a live!
He makes Doug look like a bald American who is CEO of a tech company?
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Doug still has hair, and is much more rotund. They don't look alike even if you squint.
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I would reiterate that Paul has achieved success at many levels of professional football
That line is a bit odd !
yes i thought so as well
You are both far more clever than me, if you read something else into what is a factual statement about Lambert's career.
My two pence worth...
After having calmed down over the weekend watching other premier leagues teams be embarrassed I have had time to think about our plight. I don't have a problem with the plan, I don't have a problem with the rebuild and as Lambert said earlier, the stripping back to allow such a rebuild to go ahead. I also don't have a problem with our current league position as it reflects our level so far this term and should be viewed positively in light of the fact there are three teams in a position less favourable than ourselves.
What I do have a problem with...
Is the apparent lack of growth within our young squad of players, as many have already pointed out, we are just not learning from our mistakes quickly enough. Defending from corners, Midfield weaknesses, "Hollywood" passes going astray, Inability to hold a lead. These are all things we as fans know, that if they continue much longer will take us into the dark depths of the Championship of which there is no easy escape in this day and age.
Another thing is the petulance of the manager in certain situations, from kicking over a water cooler when West Brom equalised to Blanking questions from local media outlets. Lets be clear, He is the Manager, he should be leading by example, he should be standing tall in the face of adversity and be a Leader. Im not sure it is within PL's character to be a Leader and that is worrying.
These problems all lie squarely at the feet of the Manager.
With regard to the above line, My initial take on it is, PL has had many successes, yes in terms of getting a team into the premier league, I would imagine that this means if we go down, PL is the right man to get us back.... Read into it what you will and it might be an innocent mis-worded comment, but I feel there is a message there for all of us. I hope I am wrong.
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Some very good points there.
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Beating Liverpool 1-3, Man City 2-4, Norwich........ They were all rewarding, unless your wants are becoming too high.
Reaching a Cup Semi, that was rewarding (until we got there).
All went swimmingly well in the League Cup until we came across a "big team" eh?
Liverpool was a fluke and you know it - we were battered for most of the game - and anyway they can`t even beat third Division sides :)
Whilst the games at Citeh and Norwich were much welcomed they pale into insignificance when measured against Southampton (home and away) Wigan, Spurs home - notwithstanding the drubbing at Chelsea. This manager has been a huge let down and fails to address the most basic recurring errors - wow he succeeeded at Colchester and Norwich - this is Aston Villa - if he ain`t up to it he should follow the last manager out the door.
Lots of us, me included were willing to give him a break however his mumblings and ramblings over the last few weeks indicate to me he is not the man for the job, however he may be the manager to rebuild a new side and mould into one that can get promotion from the Championship,however this is not the year to be contemplating that scenario.
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Beating Liverpool 1-3, Man City 2-4, Norwich........ They were all rewarding, unless your wants are becoming too high.
Reaching a Cup Semi, that was rewarding (until we got there).
All went swimmingly well in the League Cup until we came across a "big team" eh?
Liverpool was a fluke and you know it - we were battered for most of the game - and anyway they can`t even beat third Division sides :)
Whilst the games at Citeh and Norwich were much welcomed they pale into insignificance when measured against Southampton (home and away) Wigan, Spurs home - notwithstanding the drubbing at Chelsea. This manager has been a huge let down and fails to address the most basic recurring errors - wow he succeeeded at Colchester and Norwich - this is Aston Villa - if he ain`t up to it he should follow the last manager out the door.
Lots of us, me included were willing to give him a break however his mumblings and ramblings over the last few weeks indicate to me he is not the man for the job, however he may be the manager to rebuild a new side and mould into one that can get promotion from the Championship,however this is not the year to be contemplating that scenario.
See that thing, right over there, that's the point that you've missed spectacularly.
Taken as individual events, weimann's goal against liverpool, the man city cup game, the first half vs united, are all very rewarding and serve as hints of what we could be. They're few amidst a season of failure but you can't say nothing good has happened all season, those sparks are what Lerner is referring too and he is right.
That said you are right that the context of the season they're not enough but that wasn't the point Drummond was making in the slightest.
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What's he said Drummond? Fuck all, we still aint had any re-assurances about anything just a hash that looks pretty much like everything lambert has been saying for weeks
What reassurance do you want? Everything is rosy, we're going to be fine, we're sacking the manager, getting Mourinho in and signing Messi and Ronaldo?
Get real. He's said he supports the manager, the strategy is to back him, manage the money and try and sign players. And he's confirmed that in essence we've spunked a load of cash and won fuck all over the past few years. He ain't wrong.
Only he hasn't really backed him, he's had a moderate amount of money vs the amount of players he's had to buy and were still a small squad
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Also if he's saying there is money why is Lambert saying there isn't?
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What's he said Drummond? Fuck all, we still aint had any re-assurances about anything just a hash that looks pretty much like everything lambert has been saying for weeks
What reassurance do you want? Everything is rosy, we're going to be fine, we're sacking the manager, getting Mourinho in and signing Messi and Ronaldo?
Get real. He's said he supports the manager, the strategy is to back him, manage the money and try and sign players. And he's confirmed that in essence we've spunked a load of cash and won fuck all over the past few years. He ain't wrong.
Only he hasn't really backed him, he's had a moderate amount of money vs the amount of players he's had to buy and were still a small squad
That's just not true, we're actually one of the few clubs who registered a full squad of 25 in the summer. The problem is to do with the amount of those players who are 22-23 and have only played a handful (or less) of premier league games in their career.
If you don't believe me - click here (http://www.premierleague.com/content/dam/premierleague/site-content/News/publications/squad-lists/Squad-Lists-September-2012.pdf)
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Also if he's saying there is money why is Lambert saying there isn't?
To get us on side, Lerner is now trying to make out there was money available all along.
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If Lerner has actually said that then I'll be shocked, looks like its been written by a secretary, probably Nicola Keye
How dare you call Ms Keye a secretary? She is an Executive Officer.
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Also if he's saying there is money why is Lambert saying there isn't?
Because he is Scottish?
Oops I noticed that I have quoted you twice...I am not stalking your posts ...honest
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Also if he's saying there is money why is Lambert saying there isn't?
Par for the course - typical shit PR once again from the club. How pathetic is RL?
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Also if he's saying there is money why is Lambert saying there isn't?
Thats what i'm wondering.
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May be an interesting end to the week; transfer day on Thur and hearing the new Depeche Mode single on Friday
i heard it a little while back and it's bostin. Not quite MFTM, i'd say nearer the Exciter/Playing The Angel sound. As for transfers, could do with re-signing Alan Wilder
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Also if he's saying there is money why is Lambert saying there isn't?
Thats what i'm wondering.
Because Lambert has never said there's no money, he's said there a little bit but not enough to sign Bent and Makoun, so effectively we have some amount of money between nothing and about 25m (probably a lot nearer the former) if you check back on everything Lambert has said. Papers and fans have twisted that to there being no money but there have never been quotes to say we have no money, just "we don't have that sort of money".
What may have changed is how much Lerner was willing to add to the wages, but anything relating to the wage bill is guess work because the fans don't even know what the wages are currently, all we have to go on are figures that are well out of date now.
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We can all speculate and argue as that's what we do, we've got 3 days of the window left and come the end we'll actually see who's right and who's wrong but I'm not holding my breath
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What's he said Drummond? Fuck all, we still aint had any re-assurances about anything just a hash that looks pretty much like everything lambert has been saying for weeks
What reassurance do you want? Everything is rosy, we're going to be fine, we're sacking the manager, getting Mourinho in and signing Messi and Ronaldo?
Get real. He's said he supports the manager, the strategy is to back him, manage the money and try and sign players. And he's confirmed that in essence we've spunked a load of cash and won fuck all over the past few years. He ain't wrong.
Only he hasn't really backed him, he's had a moderate amount of money vs the amount of players he's had to buy and were still a small squad
That's just not true, we're actually one of the few clubs who registered a full squad of 25 in the summer. The problem is to do with the amount of those players who are 22-23 and have only played a handful (or less) of premier league games in their career.
If you don't believe me - click here (http://www.premierleague.com/content/dam/premierleague/site-content/News/publications/squad-lists/Squad-Lists-September-2012.pdf)
But look at us, look at the subs bench, most of the the time It's weak, midfield in particular is chronic
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I think he's just saying what everyone else has for a while. We've spent a shedload of cash to get precisely nowhere. We're probably at the bottom of a value for money table.
Especially this season. £23m to be much worse than McLeish, jesus h christ.
Riss, you don't think much of Lambert do you? I just wish you would get off the fence and just once in one of your posts just tell us what you really think of him. :)
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Also Hutton, warnock, Dunne, not even featured
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I'm sorry, it doesn't even come across as if it was written by someone who is supposed to be a fan. No passion or emotion in it. The final paragraph starts with 'On a personal note...' but what exactly was personal about it? It sounded as formal as the rest of the statement. It sounds no different to a statement that would be released by someone like McDonalds if they were found guilty of food poisoning. It is just a damage limitation exercise with Lerner knowing that a loss against Newcastle will mean the he will permenantly lose the vast majority of fans. This is just an attempt to nip some of this unrest in the bud. Well Mr Lerner, you may subdue some with this hollow statement, but you don't fool me!
What do you want - an ending of SOTC? Of course it's formal; it's a professional business statement. It's not a Facebook status.
It wouldn't have done any harm :) In all seriousness though, after waiting so long to even hear from the owner of the club, I expected more then the usual vote of confidence guff. Firsty, I expected an admission of just how bad the current situation is. Then I expected a clear plan outlined as to how we can turn it around. What did we learn from the statement? We are keeping the same clueless manager who has presided over the worst 5 weeks in a generation (if not in our entire history!) and he may be backed with a couple of deadline day signings which will be too little, too late. Lerner is just playing Russian Roulette with our top-flight status and that is quite simply unacceptable. A little honesty wouldn't go amiss either. 'Players have been discussed but nothing has materialised.' Do they expect us to swallow that whole? Lambert may be useless but he knows his way around the market. I don't believe for a second he wouldn't have been able to pull at least one deal off by now if he had money. I think we have gone back to the sell-to-buy policy (remember Vlaar being messed around until we had sold Collins?) and they expected Bent to have gone by now. Some people seem to be suggesting that we should be grateful that he has released this statement. But our gripe is he doesn't communicate enough. This one-off statement doesn't change that.
You wanted them to say things are as bad as you think they are, then sack the manager and sign new players? Then because this didn't happen they're telling fibs. Still, as you said earlier and while we're quoting eighties musical icons, there ain't no fooling you.
Dave, I can't work out if you are pro or anti Lerner or pro or anti the manager, which is it?
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That it should come to this, our chairman deigns to issue the hoi polloi one of his annual statements and we're all stood here with our tongues hanging out, lapping it up. Nice of him to get in touch and all that but it's an absolute insult that he has the nerve to send a letter from America while we're living and breathing this fiasco day after day at the sharp end. Be a man, get over here, speak to the media, let us hear your voice and see the whites of your eyes. If I want to feed off scraps from a table I'll go down the Harvester on a Sunday lunchtime. I'm sick of this.
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Is it not possible to comment on each situation as and when it occurs?
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But Phil, what you're saying there is that the quality of the squad is the problem, as evidenced in the link, the quantity is there.
This is the point I was trying to make, the numbers are there but the experienced guys on the list are either shit, out of form or injured, meaning we're relying on the ones who should've been playing the odd game here and there, not starting regularly.
It comes back to the same mistakes being made repeatedly. Every experienced player we've signed since Milner has been a disappointment in the long run, be it due to injuries, loss of form or general shitness; that's a spectacular run of poor choices and bad luck. Most of those senior players have ended up hanging around taking wages out of the club whilst offering very little back, no club could sustain it and it's only because of Lerner paying our running costs that we've coped to the extent we have.
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Is it not possible to comment on each situation as and when it occurs?
It is but that's not what I asked.
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Well for better or probably worse at least we know where things stand now.
Get behind the team and pray for the miracle us actually winning a league game again one day.
Actually that's a good heartbreaking bet, anyone know the odds on us not winning another game all season?
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Dead-cert?
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Well for better or probably worse at least we know where things stand now.
Get behind the team and pray for the miracle us actually winning a league game again one day.
Actually that's a good heartbreaking bet, anyone know the odds on us not winning another game all season?
Thats all we can do now, i wanted lambert fired but it aint gonna happen so just have to back him and hope he turns it around.
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Also Hutton, warnock, Dunne, not even featured
Every cloud has a silver lining.
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Lambo should learn some new pick ourselves up lines.
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"We pick ourselves up and carry on regardless."
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One thing Nursey said which i think is bang on and our biggest weakness is that we have no Characters in the side,no hard men to keep the team focused when things go wrong, go through the team and you be hard pressed to come up with a player you could deem to be a fighter, the nearest i can get is Weiman.
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A fighter? Hutton. Oh...
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One thing Nursey said which i think is bang on and our biggest weakness is that we have no Characters in the side,no hard men to keep the team focused when things go wrong, go through the team and you be hard pressed to come up with a player you could deem to be a fighter, the nearest i can get is Weiman.
Very true - no leadership .
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One thing Nursey said which i think is bang on and our biggest weakness is that we have no Characters in the side,no hard men to keep the team focused when things go wrong, go through the team and you be hard pressed to come up with a player you could deem to be a fighter, the nearest i can get is Weiman.
Very true - no leadership .
Don't need fighters, need leaders. Players who can react to what they see happening on the pitch without waiting for instructions from the bench. Still can't believe the 5 up front debacle last week but couldn't the infamous 5 see it wasn't likely to work and react?
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Why do I get this sneaking feeling that if we go down the fans will be blamed for this because we didn't support the manager enough?
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They can give it a try, but for the fans to change anything this season, we'd all need to run on to the pitch and line up on the goal line for every corner.
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One thing Nursey said which i think is bang on and our biggest weakness is that we have no Characters in the side,no hard men to keep the team focused when things go wrong
I think that's been obvious for a while to be honest.
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But Phil, what you're saying there is that the quality of the squad is the problem, as evidenced in the link, the quantity is there.
This is the point I was trying to make, the numbers are there but the experienced guys on the list are either shit, out of form or injured, meaning we're relying on the ones who should've been playing the odd game here and there, not starting regularly.
It comes back to the same mistakes being made repeatedly. Every experienced player we've signed since Milner has been a disappointment in the long run, be it due to injuries, loss of form or general shitness; that's a spectacular run of poor choices and bad luck. Most of those senior players have ended up hanging around taking wages out of the club whilst offering very little back, no club could sustain it and it's only because of Lerner paying our running costs that we've coped to the extent we have.
The problem for me, Paul, is that we've all seen the potential at some stage or other of the players, they're not all bad. What's happening though is instead of one or two players having a bad run, it's almost every single one of them at the same time, week in, week out and Lambert has done nothing to address the problem.
I'm more than aware Lambert is still learning his trade as a manager but it's bloody frustrating he' fails to see the elephant in the room. Tactically, he just picks himself up and goes again with the same system that isn't right for now.
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Why do I get this sneaking feeling that if we go down the fans will be blamed for this because we didn't support the manager enough?
I think up until now he's had tremendous support
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Lerner a fucking fool and makes Doug look like Steve Jobs
Erm..Steve Jobs is dead.
When he was a live!
When he was a live what?
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Why do I get this sneaking feeling that if we go down the fans will be blamed for this because we didn't support the manager enough?
And if we stay up it will be a successful season.
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Words are lovely. Deeds are better. Do or Do not. There is no try.
He can say what he likes to try and placate the fans and media. Ultimately he should be judged on outcomes. And he's taken our club down to 1 spot from the relegation spots with the worse goal difference in the league. It may be the manager and players who are delivering that, buts its Lerner who's taken us there.
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Why do I get this sneaking feeling that if we go down the fans will be blamed for this because we didn't support the manager enough?
They won't be able to peddle that one this time. Never seen a managers name being chanted by our lot after being battered by the likes of Wigan at home.
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Why do I get this sneaking feeling that if we go down the fans will be blamed for this because we didn't support the manager enough?
And if we stay up it will be a successful season.
Yes - the "plan" will have worked...
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Why do I get this sneaking feeling that if we go down the fans will be blamed for this because we didn't support the manager enough?
They won't be able to peddle that one this time. Never seen a managers name being chanted by our lot after being battered by the likes of Wigan at home.
Wasn't true last season either - TSM only got 9 minutes of ragging!
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I wonder whether the timing of this has anything to do with the imminent departures of Hutton and Warnock. That could free up 80k/week for two new players. If we're speculating that the wages have been the problem and we've now got some room to manoeuvre, it MAY all fall into place - if the right player(s) out there.
I still think one proper midfield leader would be enough, not ideal but it's what we need more than anything else.
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Wouldn't it have been amusing if Randy had put the words 'we pick ourselves up and go again' somewhere in his statement.
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One thing Nursey said which i think is bang on and our biggest weakness is that we have no Characters in the side,no hard men to keep the team focused when things go wrong, go through the team and you be hard pressed to come up with a player you could deem to be a fighter, the nearest i can get is Weiman.
Very true - no leadership .
Don't need fighters, need leaders. Players who can react to what they see happening on the pitch without waiting for instructions from the bench. Still can't believe the 5 up front debacle last week but couldn't the infamous 5 see it wasn't likely to work and react?
You do what the manager tells you to do, otherwise he won't pick you again.
If he tells you to get in the 6 yard box, thats what you do its irrelevant whether the ball is going to get to you or not, thats not your problem!
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One thing Nursey said which i think is bang on and our biggest weakness is that we have no Characters in the side,no hard men to keep the team focused when things go wrong, go through the team and you be hard pressed to come up with a player you could deem to be a fighter, the nearest i can get is Weiman.
Very true - no leadership .
Don't need fighters, need leaders. Players who can react to what they see happening on the pitch without waiting for instructions from the bench. Still can't believe the 5 up front debacle last week but couldn't the infamous 5 see it wasn't likely to work and react?
You do what the manager tells you to do, otherwise he won't pick you again.
If he tells you to get in the 6 yard box, thats what you do its irrelevant whether the ball is going to get to you or not, thats not your problem!
Well if Bennett bombs forward I would hope that one of his team mates is aware of the risk of the move breaking down and can cover. Not just think its not my problem but read the bloody game.
I agree though, thats sadly not how it works.
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Lerner a fucking fool and makes Doug look like Steve Jobs
Erm..Steve Jobs is dead.
They tuk urrr jerbs!
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Well if Bennett bombs forward I would hope that one of his team mates is aware of the risk of the move breaking down and can cover. Not just think its not my problem but read the bloody game.
I agree though, thats sadly not how it works.
Wasn't that how bradford's goal at our place came about, he got isolated 25 yards inside their half, nobody helped, nobody covered? Mayhem ensued, cornalty, bye-bye wembley.
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Lambo should learn some new pick ourselves up lines.
I am only going to get worried if I hear Lambert start saying "we pick ourselves up and keep going until its mathematically impossible"
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But Phil, what you're saying there is that the quality of the squad is the problem, as evidenced in the link, the quantity is there.
This is the point I was trying to make, the numbers are there but the experienced guys on the list are either shit, out of form or injured, meaning we're relying on the ones who should've been playing the odd game here and there, not starting regularly.
It comes back to the same mistakes being made repeatedly. Every experienced player we've signed since Milner has been a disappointment in the long run, be it due to injuries, loss of form or general shitness; that's a spectacular run of poor choices and bad luck. Most of those senior players have ended up hanging around taking wages out of the club whilst offering very little back, no club could sustain it and it's only because of Lerner paying our running costs that we've coped to the extent we have.
The problem for me, Paul, is that we've all seen the potential at some stage or other of the players, they're not all bad. What's happening though is instead of one or two players having a bad run, it's almost every single one of them at the same time, week in, week out and Lambert has done nothing to address the problem.
I'm more than aware Lambert is still learning his trade as a manager but it's bloody frustrating he' fails to see the elephant in the room. Tactically, he just picks himself up and goes again with the same system that isn't right for now.
I agree totally, that's why I still have my vote on the in or out thread set to out.
We need players but no amount of new players, who are realistically available to us, are going to solve things if he continues to make the rank decisions with tactics and subs that have happened in the last month. It also doesn't change the fact that he can't seem to get the players believing in themselves again after things go wrong.
I do think though that if he stumbles onto something that works we're a much better squad than we look at the minute, I just haven't got the guts for the risk of keeping him and hoping that happens. Irrelevant anyway because I doubt he's going anywhere but I still think there are better options out there.
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Lerner a fucking fool and makes Doug look like Steve Jobs
Erm..Steve Jobs is dead.
They tuk urrr jerbs!
Dey drrkk urrr drrrr.
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Lerner's statement reads eerily like an old 70's This is your Life when someone like Bernard Bresslaw was on and they dug out some hollywood star he once worked with to give the show a bit of glamour, with a tapped video message of him relaxing by a pool
"Hi Paul, I'm sorry i can't be with you tonight but i'm currently playing golf. I still remember that day we spent together back in 2012 and you teaching me to mumble in Scotchese. Your probably the greatest manager of your generation, my bestest Brit pal, and the next time i'm in Birmingham, we must meet up to discuss old times and the multi-year lack of competitive stability"
*screen fades to black, faint echo of "who is he again?*
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GregNAsh - Brilliant.
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Cap doffed to the Nasher.
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Is "the club’s multi-year lack of competitive stability" management speak for "we've been shit for ages"?
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Lerner a fucking fool and makes Doug look like Steve Jobs
Erm..Steve Jobs is dead.
They tuk urrr jerbs!
Dey drrkk urrr drrrr.
A duppa durrrr.
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Cap doffed to the Nasher.
Seconded, best laugh of the month so far.
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Is "the club’s multi-year lack of competitive stability" management speak for "we've been shit for ages"?
Yep. And we have, so it's a true statement.
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Cap doffed to the Nasher.
Seconded, best laugh of the month so far.
Nothing better than a rampant on form gnasher!
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Did you get an answer to your question, Fergal?
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Especially this season. £23m to be much worse than McLeish, jesus h christ.
I still think you're being far too harsh and missing the bigger picture. Look at the players that played some part last season that haven't for some reason or another been utilised by Lambert this season:
Hutton, Warnock, Collins, Cuellar, Petrov, Gardner, Heskey.
After what Hutton said in September about the reason he was being frozen out was to do with finances and nothing to do with his footballing ability then I think it's a pretty logical theory to assume he wasn't the only player this applied to. I'd wager Warnock, Collins and the out of contract Heskey and Cuellar were the same. Losing all of these including our captain and best central midfielder by a mile in Petrov his has clearly left us with a fairly big hole to plug in the squad to which we spent as you say roughly £23m addressing. When you consider that a fair chunk of these players formed part of the side that finished 6th then £23m on 8 players isn't really going to rectify this is it? It would sit more with the plan that we've already been told several times that the club is building for the future with younger players on lower wages. Whether this is the correct strategy in the current climate I would probably question but consistently slagging the manager as if he inherited a decent squad and spent £23m going nowhere seems a very simplistic view in my opinion. His hands have been tied by the finances, but he has arguably performed a solid job in getting some good talent in with the money available and players which are probably yet to reach their full potential.
Regardless of what happened in the semi final we did actually reach the latter stages of the League cup which we didn't do under TSM (and beat 2 Premier league sides away on the way) and we're one place below where we finished last season. Taking into account the change in the squad and the money we've used to replace good players I think you can make a pretty good case for Lambert actually doing a fairly decent job.